Housing & Redevelopment Authority - Regular Meeting

Thank you. Thank you.

All please.

Bowie? Here. Coleman? Here. Jost? Here. Kim? Naker? Here. Yang? Chair Johnson? Here. Five present, two absent. That being Commissioner Yang and Commissioner Kim. And Commissioner Kim is excused. Item number one is a public hearing. RESPH 26-254, resolution approving amendments to and authorizing the reissuance of conduit multifamily housing revenue bonds and authorizing the preparation of necessary documents and materials in connection with said amendments. 801 Mount Curve Boulevard, 2265 Hillcrest Avenue and 2285 Hillcrest Avenue. Emma Norton, Restoring Waters and Ellie Francis Court Projects, District 15, Ward 3.

Thank you so much for getting through that resolution title. This is a public hearing where we have an opportunity to come in and have the public give comment. Each person gets two minutes at a time. So at this time, I will look to anyone who is here to give public comment. As everyone is rushing to the podium, no, just kidding, we will take a motion from Vice Chair Jost to close the public hearing and approve. All those in favor? Aye. All opposed?

Six in favor, zero opposed. The public hearing is closed. The resolution is adopted. Item number two is a staff report, SR26-190, Presentation on Downtown Vitality Fund Economic Development Recommendations.

Well, I'm personally really excited about this milestone. I know that there's been a lot of communication in the community as well, and a lot of hard work that has been on the back end of the Downtown Vitality Fund. And so I'm just excited about the staff report that we have coming in. This will be the recommendations the allocation and also the feedback that has been given from the application review process. So I wanted to be able to hand it over to Deputy, excuse me, Director McMahon, and then you can pass the baton over.

Sure. Chair, Commissioners, I'm also very excited for this one and happy to welcome Nick Wolfe from the Economic Development Team here to present an update on the Downtown Vitality Fund, as well as information on proposed action that will be before you at your next HRA meeting in two weeks. So this is an effort that's had a pretty quick turnaround with a lot of behind-the-scenes work, and I appreciate everything the team has done to move it forward. We know that vibrant downtowns provide economic benefits citywide. Investing in them helps all of our residents in our city, not just by providing a strong tax base, but also opportunities for residents to live and dynamic places to gather and engage. So I'm very excited for this presentation, and thank you, Mr. Wolf. Thank you.

Good afternoon, Commissioners. My name is Nick Wolf. I'm a project manager in the Economic Development Division of PED. and i will uh as director mcmahon mentioned i'll be presenting funding recommendations for the economic development portion of the downtown vitality fund okay so Here's the program background, kind of a reminder of how we got here. Back in February, this body approved the Downtown Vitality Fund. There were $2 million allocated for economic development projects, $3 million for housing. And we are funding recommended, recommending funding projects that reflect the stated goals. filling vacant commercial storefronts, investing in businesses looking to grow in downtown St. Paul, activating street-level spaces, all adding vibrancy and investment in our downtown. Okay, these economic development dollars are utilized for three large buckets. There's building capital improvements, equipment purchases, and public realm improvements. Again, all with a focus on activating commercial spaces in our downtown. As far as the breakdown of the projects and funding amounts go, under $100,000 awards are structured as reimbursable grants, which is similar to our STAR program. Over $100,000 is structured as a forgivable loan, which I can get into a bit more later in the presentation. And those over $500,000, also structured as a forgivable loan, need HRA approval, which is why I'm here today. Okay, so here's a list of the 10 projects that were approved administratively for economic development. In addition, there is funding for the Alliance Bank Center Skyway. So we received 60 interest forms yielding $35,000. eligible economic development projects, and 15 applications were received, totaling over $4 million in asks. These recommendations that you see support downtown businesses at various sizes, ownership structures, and investment levels to maximize the fund's impact and encompass the full $2 million. Well, actually, let me, one more point. Note, all of these projects here are under $100,000, with the exception of Ram Mitt, which will be structured as a forgivable loan. Okay. Projects requesting $500,000 or more. The Endicott Arcade at 134 5th Street East was recommended to the St. Paul Downtown Development Corporation. And 428 Minnesota Street was recommended to With Love Minnesota. And I believe the awardees are with us today. So I see the With Love team for sure. Thanks for coming. All right. Oh, and Dave as well. Thank you guys. The next slide is kind of a visual representation of the project locations. There's, I think, a nice distribution of funding throughout the Downtown Improvement District, which was the downtown funding geography that we used for this program. The Endicott Arcade. Led by the Downtown Development Corporation, we recommended $799,800 for facade improvements, critical building repairs, and stabilization to prepare this property for the restoration and return to market. This is a one-story commercial building that has been vacant for several years now, and its restoration, the preservation of the interior, ground floor, commercial opportunity will be a key contributor to our downtown revitalization. 428 Minnesota Street, led by With Love Minnesota team. We've recommended $682,200 for renovation and activation of over 11,000 square feet of previously vacant first floor retail space at 428 Minnesota Street. With Love is a nonprofit social enterprise engaged in economic development. They'll be renovating the existing vacant ground floor space into a fully activated civic destination. The project will activate a vacant corridor, generate street-level foot traffic, support local employment, and contribute to the long-term vitality of downtown St. Paul. OK, as far as terms go, these are the projects receiving over $100,000 will be a deferred forgivable loan Loans will be forgiven, assuming the awardees maintain operations in downtown St. Paul through the life of the loan and provide us an annual report at the end of every year. And we will be securing these loans through a mortgage or UCC collateral filing on the property for the life of the loan. Again, in closing, we're seeking HRA approval for the two downtown vitality fund recommendations outlined in the presentation. And I understand formal approval will be coming at your next meeting on September 23rd. So thank you for your time. Available to answer questions.

Thank you, Mr. Wolf. I will look to Commissioner Naker for her first question.

Thanks, Chair Johnson. This is really exciting. I want to thank you, Mr. Wolf, and the entire team for your hard work on this. Downtown needs this kind of infusion. And I think what sometimes happens is governments announce programs with lots of dollar signs and zeros behind the numbers. And then the dollars never actually move out the door. And what's happening here is that we announced this program. few months later, we are getting these dollars out the door to the businesses that need them. So I think that's really noteworthy. I also want to thank the Downtown Development Corporation, and in particular, Mr. Higgins, because when we first conceived of the Downtown Vitality Fund, I remember giving him a call and saying, hey, we're thinking about this program for downtown development. What would you recommend? And at the time, we were thinking of it as exclusively a housing program. And we ended up making it a $3 million housing program, a $2 million business program. But that business component was only because Mr. Higgins said, you know, I think it would be great to have some business funding as well. And I even would guess that the business dollars will go out the door more quickly than the housing dollars. And as it turns out, we have flown through the business dollars, and I think we are still working on the housing dollars. So that recommendation was really Wise and well taken, and I appreciate it. I was curious if you could speak to two questions. One, how many of the projects that are being recommended for funding, one of the goals was to fill vacant spaces downtown. There were also other goals like revitalizing vibrancy, et cetera, for existing businesses, but how many of these are filling a formerly vacant space? And then secondly, is there an expectation or an agreement as to when the work has to actually take place? Or once the dollars are out the door, is that timeline somewhat not defined?

Yeah, thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Naker. Great question. Your first question regarding which one of these projects are going to be filling currently a space that is vacant. I think... The one example that I'm here today presenting is the 428 Minnesota Street. I mean, that is kind of the penultimate 11,000 square feet activation that we're excited about here. Some of these other, as I'm just quickly kind of reviewing the list here, One of them in the Market House building, that Owls Eye Art Collective, that's a business that's relocating in downtown to a new space that is currently vacant. Another one is going to be for the indoor farmers market for the St. Paul Growers Association. There's also an expansion of ROM-MID is gonna be expanding into adjacent space. So those are the ones that are sort of jumping off this list immediately. We're also supporting the Avalon, which I don't believe yet has opened. And that is a new operator in downtown as well. As far as the timeline to finish these projects, when we evaluated some of these, that was really one of the criteria. One thing we heard from leadership is that we want projects that can get done, that fit within the timeframe, that have more of a near-term timeframe. I think once we get these agreements executed, I think we can get under contract relatively soon. I think within the next three to six months would be reasonable, conservatively speaking. And a lot of these projects have timelines that are either late 2026 or like Q1, Q2 2027. Thank you. That was a consideration of ours.

All right. Thank you, Mr. Wolf, on that clarification and also just that added context. Along that vein, could you also talk about the large projects that were funded, I believe, at a 90% threshold and just how you came to that calculation and just overall how you were recommending the total amount that we see here versus maybe what they might have applied for?

Yeah. Thank you, Chair Johnson. Yeah. We were working within the constraints of the $2 million allocated and had over $4 million in ask. So we were not able to fund all of these projects at their preferred maximum ask amount. It took a lot of looking at the budget, looking at scopes of work, and really looking hard at our eligibility criteria. You know, we program alignment. evaluated projects based on, does it activate the street level? Does it support downtown vibrancy? Does it fill a vacancy? Is there a public realm contribution? And I think by funding at around a large percentage of the project, we're able to sort of leverage some private dollars as well and maybe make that two million that was allocated for economic development go a bit further. So instead of six or seven projects funded at 100%, you know, we did a couple of the larger ones at 90% with the hopes that some of these larger projects could leverage some private investment to get these done. Thank you. And I'd be happy to go over project by project, too, in the future to get that information over to you.

Thank you, Mr. Wolf. Commissioner Yang, and then we'll go Commissioner Coleman as well.

Thanks, Chair Johnson. I echo your sentiments on the excitement here, Commissioner Naker. This is a very great list of projects. I was wondering, Dr. McMahon, can you clarify? I see here the project's over $500,000. We required an HRA approval. And then for the other two, do we need to vote on that in a couple of weeks, too?

Chair, commissioners, yes, projects over $500,000 do need HRA approval, so those two larger projects that Mr. Wolf has gone through, the With Love and Downtown Development Corporation, will be back before you for action in two weeks. The other projects are administratively approved at those lower levels.

Okay, great. That sounds good. Thank you. I'm supportive of them. I wanted to have a question about the 100,000 plus loans that are structured as a forgivable loan. Can you, maybe to our speaker or Director McMahon, can you explain the logic behind having it be a forgivable loan? I'm thinking back to our neighborhood star where we used to have a loan route and also a grant route. And with the loan, we basically eliminated that because of how labor intensive it was to keep tracking and trying to get collections on that, too. And so I'm just wondering, how did you all decide you wanted to do this again?

Sure. Chair, commissioners, along the similar lines, actually, with the star amounts being smaller dollar amounts, wanting to ensure there wasn't that administrative burden. Similarly, this was under $100,000 for those smaller amounts to try and have them be less of an administrative burden to have those be grants. with the larger dollar amounts because they're larger projects and also looking at the scope of them, the collateral, the dollars invested, having it be a forgivable loan and a relatively short time so that it's not a 20-year, a 10-year with sort of the tails and the work on that, but a four-year forgivable loan with that amount of investment into downtown, wanting to ensure a little bit more of the continued activation of the space and that it remains that opportunity. Thank you.

And just a quick follow-up question. Then if a recipient had to basically pay back the loan, where would the money go for that? Are you thinking it would go back into the same fund and you would just grant or loan it out again?

Chair, Commissioner, I'm actually going to get back to you on that because I don't want to misspeak as to any money coming back and precisely what fund it would go back into. I'll note with the four years forgivable loan, a quarter is forgiven each year. for the full amount at that four years. Thank you.

Commissioner Coleman.

Thank you. Thanks for the presentation. I really don't have a question. I just need to say that I'm really excited about this. It's really exciting seeing the list, particularly of the administratively approved grants and seeing the diversity of small businesses that are represented there, ones that are so vital to our city. I also am just particularly so excited about 134 Fifth Street East. I used to live on that block, and it's really hard to live on a block where basically an entire stretch is vacant and thinking about how do we use small business support strategies and business support strategies to increase our residential capacity downtown. It is hard to encourage people to live downtown when we have these great apartments that are opening up, but you have these big vacant spaces where people don't feel safe, where it feels like, oh, I can walk home from Lowertown, but I'm going to walk on this stretch of the city that is kind of bleak at night. So I just can't say enough how excited about this I am. I think it's really, really valuable investments that are going to pay off for many years to come. So can't wait to vote on this.

Thank you, Commissioner.

Commissioner Naker. Thanks, Madam Chair. I think bleak is an understatement and a very nice word to use to describe that block. So thank you for saying that. I was actually just wondering, to Commissioner Coleman's point, we do have some of those applicants here.

Yeah, you're still in my thunder, Commissioner Naker. Oh, OK. Then I'll let you do it. I was going to give you guys an opportunity to ask your questions. And then, yes, I'd be welcoming up the two project folks, because they're both in the room. And I have had a chance to tour one of the sites, but very interested in hearing from both of them. So at this time, I can bring up those two entities that are here. If you're receiving one of the project loans and want to speak to the body, whether with the St. Paul Downtown Development Corporation Or with Love, Minnesota. You're welcome at this time.

Madam Chair, there are a few folks from, I think, the administratively approved ones as well here. So I don't know if they want to entertain them.

Yeah, we'll start with the two. Thank you. And feel free to come up. You don't actually have to touch the mic, though. They will adjust to you. But feel free to just introduce yourself, and we promise not to ask you any trick questions. So welcome.

Thank you. Thank you, Chair Johnson. My name is Amelia Ndelio-Gunipe. I'm one of the co-founders and the CEO of With Love.

Good afternoon, everybody. I'm Damolo Gunipe, one of the co-founders of With Love.

And good afternoon. My name is Thomas Tolley. I'm the director of operations at WithLove.

We really appreciate this opportunity to stand before you guys today. As you know, WithLove is an 11,000 square foot integrated civic destination in downtown St. Paul. We are a cafe, an event and meeting space, and we really hope to bring that vibrancy back to that corner. We just left the space, actually. We were just getting our badges to be able to badge in. And we're just so excited about bringing a light to that corner, not only to be able to bring folks, residential folks, as you mentioned, into our space, but also to be able to employ local folks. Also, we'll be having events and programming in our space, and so we feel that it's not only a space for folks in downtown St. Paul, but it's a place for all the Twin Cities, all of Minnesota to be able to enjoy that programming and enjoy downtown St. Paul again. We also have ambitions of bringing national speakers in and want the nation to really see how beautiful St. Paul is and what a beautiful city Minnesota has. So we just really appreciate your time.

Yeah, thank you so much for being here and just for also investing here in St. Paul. I'm really excited about this as it is a revitalization project. I'm taking something that has been vacant for quite some time and turning it into something that I am looking forward to visiting myself. And I know a lot of my colleagues have either went to the tour or have heard from you all. I'm really excited about this project itself, and I'm glad that just listening to you and just kind of seeing the vision, being able to walk through it was a whole different experience. So thank you for being here today with us.

Thank you, and we will have more tours if you want to come see the space. Thank you so much.

when downtown developers meet. Welcome in.

Good afternoon, Commissioner and Chair Johnson and Commissioners. I just want to say thank you for the thoughtful approach you guys have taken, as well as staff, on putting this program together in the first place and making this possible. We're excited about Fifth Street in general and look forward to putting these dollars to good use. If there are questions, happy to answer them. I also brought my...

friend and colleague joe spencer uh and uh i think he might have a couple words some thoughts on fifth street just also wanted to say thank you so much for this uh this program uh i think in particular these two projects that the location is so incredibly strategic uh as has been mentioned uh there is a certain bleakness to this stretch of fifth street and we see it as a key connection uh length to connect lower town to uh to this part of downtown I think the With Love project, an amazing project team, an amazing concept, and filling a space that's been vacant really since it was occupied by Woolworths decades ago. And so a real need and I think a great opportunity on both cases. So I just wanted to say thanks.

Appreciate you, Mr. Spencer. Commissioner Baker.

Thank you, Chair Johnson. Could you give us just a hint, a taste of what you think might relieve the bleakness in the future if you're successful? Sure.

Are you going to?

What does the Endicott Arcade want to be when it grows up?

Are you talking about Fifth Street in general?

Yes, the Arcade. And the Arcade.

And the Arcade in particular? I mean, our hope is to leverage the history of that building. As everybody knows, as you walk by both that and the Empire, they really are historically significant. And we want to amplify that with uses on the inside that make the most of those spaces. Happily the history of that building is multiple users and we would hope the same sort of thing comes out in the future when we when we bring it to market as to borrow kind of Joe's reference to strategic some of the timing for for programming that space is is very related to how we program the other spaces and the other buildings on that corridor and And it's a really unique opportunity to have the opportunity to create really a relationship and complement of uses across those properties. So we're pretty excited about that.

Just to add a note about that. So it was purpose-designed by Cass Gilbert to be retail. And so that's absolutely our every intention and plan is to revive and breathe new life into it as retail again. And it just happens to be in – It is a modestly sized but quite magnificent design by one of our legends in architecture here. So we're really excited about it.

Well, thank you guys so much for being here as well and just adding that additional context. I share the same excitement as my colleagues have shared just from seeing a building that we, I don't think, has been able to fully reach its potential in such a long time be able to come back and be talked about being revitalized and brought back to downtown in a way that community members can access it themselves. And so just really excited about this project as well and looking forward to seeing it come to fruition. Thank you for being here today. And yes, we have a couple other projects that are in the room from some of the, I want to say smaller, but it's not justified for your projects. But for those that are receiving economic development investments from the fund at all, if you would like to speak or kind of share a little bit about yourself or introduce yourself, this is the time to do so.

Welcome.

Thank you. I'm Jim Golden. I'm with the St. Paul Farmer's Market. And I have my friend, DJ, who runs the Ethiopian restaurant next to us. And so for us, we just want to say thank you, because I think sometimes it's lost. Just a little bit of money goes a really long way. And so we signed our lease July 4th last year. And that space, the Black Dog space, that was vacant for three years. And now, since we moved in, another 10,000 square feet has been rented out with like-minded businesses. So this, and that doesn't really make the statistics, you know, but that really, this really matters. And we'll be able to leverage this and we'll have that money spent before our indoor market starts November 7th on Saturday. So this will be quick and it'll look great. And so thanks again. Appreciate all the hard work I know you guys put into. Joe, Rich, all you guys, I see all the work you're doing. So thanks again for everything. We appreciate it. It matters. We love it. So thank you.

Hello, good afternoon, everyone. I was not prepared to make a presentation, but I would like to take the opportunity really to say thank you for all you council members and the city staff for your continued support, listening to us, really valuing our contribution, the work that we are trying to do in Lord Towne. is we like to call it more than a traditional restaurant. We try to create a destination, not just for the Ethiopian community, but a larger city of St. Paul members and Minnesota, greater Minnesota. We are a coffee, kitchen, and bar. We are also a destination for events, for jazz venue, Ethiopian coffee ceremony, and holidays. So really, really thank you very much for supporting our effort and helping us to have a continued presence in Lower Town St. Paul. Thank you.

Thank you guys as well for being here and just for sharing. I appreciate being able to hear from folks directly and to see the vision come to light and from seeing this really start as an investment idea too and advocacy-based things that are coming through the organizations and being able to kind of see this come to fruition. I am going to do a final call for folks who would like to speak about it because we will be moving forward. So this would be the time to do so as we are looking to really hear from folks that are investing in our community because we want to invest in you.

Good afternoon, Chair, Council Members. I was not expecting to speak today to the Council, but I'll take my opportunity to thank you all for investing in St. Paul, investing in the future of St. Paul and for what it is that you provide for us here as small business owners. I am the principal owner of Metronome Brewery. It's not just a brewery we're in here because it was founded from the George Floyd incident to make a difference. And we are the only brewery in the world that wants to take our funds and fund music education for kids. And we want to do it right here in the Twin Cities. And it's been a struggle the last four and a half years. It's been a big struggle. This is a huge help. So just want to thank you all and invite you down to the brewery at some time for a concert. And I won't suggest a beer. Thank you.

You can suggest a beer. No, please. But actually, we do appreciate you for taking the time as well to be here. And honestly, I'm just like smiling over here because I really truly enjoy to hear the testimonies too. And I think some of the things that I've really brought and something that will stick with me is actually the words that sometimes a small investment can go a long way. We never want to underestimate that. And when we're looking at a multimillion dollar budget, sometimes we overlook those that maybe are the $20,000, $30,000, $40,000, $50,000 investments. But they're just as significant, especially right now, with the overall goal of being able to revitalize our downtown. So to clarify, those items that are on the slide around the 518 will not be coming back to you all for approval, but the two items that are over that dollar amount will require our approval, so they will be back with us not next week, but the week after that. So we will have it on the agenda and look forward to being able to approve it. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Wolfe.

Item number three is a staff report, SR26-191, introduction to HAM building conduit bond issuance.

All right. While Laura's getting that up, I'll hand it over to Director McMahon for the preface.

Chair, commissioners, thank you so much. Laura Hansen from our housing team is here to present information on this item. Similar to the last one, it's informational with opportunity for discussion and questions and action at the next HRA board meeting.

Thank you, Director McMahon, Chair Johnson, commissioners. My name is Laura Hansen. I'm a principal project manager on our multifamily housing team. I will be introducing the HAM building conduit bond issuance, so in keeping with the downtown investment discussion. An overview of the project, the HAM building is located at 408 St. Peter Street in downtown. The developer is Pack Properties. And the project will be to convert office to housing, resulting in 128 housing units affordable at 60% AMI. There will be a mix of studios, ones, and two bedrooms. It's a historic building, so the renovations will follow state and federal historic guidelines. Current conditions of the site. As I mentioned, it is a historic building. It was built in 1919 as offices for the Ham's Brewery located on the east side of the city. The basement and ground floor of the building are currently occupied by multiple tenants, well-known tenants such as Park Square Theater, Meritage, Loon Cafe, and plenty of other retailers on site. The top floors are former office spaces that are currently vacant. Pack Properties is the developer with Ham Partners LLC being the owner entity. The property was purchased in 2022 with the intention to convert it to housing. Pack Properties has experience in both affordable housing development as well as mixed-use development, commercial retail leasing. The sources and uses for the project, total development costs for the project for the renovation is just over $49 million. That will be funded in large part through the tax exempt bonds, low income housing tax credit equity, and historic tax credit equity. The project will be 100% affordable at 60% area median income for a minimum of 15 years. And you can see on this slide the income and rent limits that will apply to the development. So what will be before you in two weeks on September 23 is a request up to $14 million in multifamily conduit revenue bonds. The terms of the bonds meet all the HRA policies, including closing fees and ongoing fees for the long-term bonds. Upon receipt of the bonds, the project is eligible for 4% low income housing tax credits, which attracts that significant equity to the project, so long as 25% of eligible project costs are funded by the bonds, which is expected to be well met for this project. There are no additional gap funding requests for the HRA. This is solely for the conduit bonds that will be before you. And just as a reminder, this is a conduit bond issue, and the bond shall not constitute an indebtedness, liability, obligation, or other risk to the HRA or the City of St. Paul. The borrower will be solely responsible for all payments of principal and interest. So as a reminder, in two weeks, there will be a public hearing at the HRA with a resolution and then a final city council approval for the bond issuance on the same day. With that, I'm happy to address any questions. We also have Rich Pakkinen and Peter Broad from the development team here if you have any questions for them as well.

All right, thank you, Ms. Hanson, for that report back and update, because there was a lot of conversation surrounding this building and the development, so it's great to see it at this point. Mr. Packner, I'd welcome you up if you had anything that you'd like to add at this time. For everyone who's watching, it's not a great HRA meeting without putting the people on the spot, and I have done that multiple times today, so I can't stop now.

Chair Johnson, commissioners, thanks. Thank you for having me. I don't have any comments prepared. But I first want to say thanks to the city team for all of the work that they've put into this project. It's been significant. This has been a hard project. And so we've come a long ways. And it's an exciting development. We've been working on this for several years. It's an amazing building. I consider myself fortunate to be a part of this. And it'll be an iconic project when we're done. But I'm happy to answer any questions that you might have of us, of the history of the project, what our plans are, what have you.

Commissioner Naker.

Thanks, Chair Johnson. No questions, but just a thank you to you, Mr. Pakkanen, and to the team. It's exciting to see much more affordable housing coming to downtown St. Paul. And in particular, in this unique building that has such a great first floor space, wonderful tenants. I understand the former chamber orchestra performance space within the building is going to be potentially turned into pickleball courts. There's a lot of interesting nuggets in the development plan, so a lot to be excited about. And I also want to thank Mr. Packman and team for always investing in quality affordable housing and never assuming that because affordable is before its name that there needs to be any diminishment in the quality of the amenities and the housing that residents deserve.

Thank you, Commissioner Finneker. And yes, it's been really great to just kind of see, especially the tail end. I know that you came across this property before I was a council member and just kind of seeing the tail end of some of the work. It's been great to be brought on the project now. Just a quick question for you just around maybe what drew you to the site. You mentioned just kind of being with the project for years. What's kept you invested in developing in this space?

I think there's a number of points there. What drew us to the site, first of all, I'm proud to call myself a St. Paul developer, business person, what have you. And the Ham Building is one of the most iconic buildings in the city. And so in our career, we've been in business 30 years, we've taken apart and put back together many buildings in St. Paul. And this building is by no means the largest. It's probably not the most complicated. But it probably is the most iconic. And so I'm proud to have a hand in this. And it's an iconic piece in a 30-year career to be able to work on a building like this.

I really appreciate that. And it's been great to just get these nuggets of getting to know you a lot better. And so I appreciate that and appreciate you for being here today.

Thank you.

I don't see any other questions from our colleagues. I'll simply share that this also will be in front of us for public hearing, not next week, but the week after. So appreciate your time, Mr. Pakkanen.

Thank you all.

All right. So again, our next meeting date is September 23rd. We have no other items that are coming before us. So with that, we are adjourned.