Plan Commission - Regular Meeting

here. Peter Kemp here. Logan Zuber here. Dave Leur here. Chris Lamb here. We have Corum. Did you have an opportunity to read the minutes from the last meeting? Yes. Any changes, corrections, not move to approve the August minutes as presented. Second. All in favor? I I Sorry. Um, if you have pagers or telephones, please put them on airplane mode or turn them off. Any changes to our agenda?

We do. We need to add one item if we could do the oath of office for Sarah Payne. Okay. I think uh this the city attorney will handle that. Okay. It's just city attorney. Sarah, you raise your right hand, please. I state your name. I, Sarah Payne, do solemnly swear do solemnly swear that I will support the Constitution of the United States of America that I will support the Constitution of the United States of America. Constitution of the State of Indiana the Constitution of the State of Indiana and the ordinances of the city of Auburn and the ordinance of the city of Auburn. And I shall faithfully And I shall faithfully honestly and impartially

honestly and impartially discharge the duties as a member discharge the duties of as a member of the board of zoning appeals of the board of zoning appeals of the city of Auburn of the city of Auburn until relieved until relieved according to the best of my skill until according to the best of my skill according to the best of my skill and ability and according to law ability and and abil abilities according to law according to law. Thank you. Thank you. Welcome. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

New business public meeting for BBCA standard variance 2021- 003. Hey, uh Jim Karet, city planner for Auburn. Uh this request, uh comes from the city administration. Uh they're requesting to eliminate um an expiration date that is tied to the uh variance of use and the development plan that was approved for utilization uh of the property in the 300 block of East 7th Street just to the east of Union uh for a parking lot. Um this request uh we did advertise as a public hearing in the star on September 9th and set notice to six adjacent property owners uh for the for the request. The uh property itself highlighted u in the red is uh is currently a city parking lot. It's got a um a somewhat gravel surface. It's basically millings, asphalt millings. There are some paved parking spaces that uh front along Seventh Street. Those are the ADA accessible spaces for the property. It's access from an alley or the extension if you would of of 8th Street um to the south. An aerial photograph just of the property just to give you again some perspective looking south at the property. You can see the ADA spaces lining along Seventh Street. The property itself is zoned PR which is parks and recreation. Uh the u zoning around it is a mixture of commercial and uh residential to the uh east. A few photographs um sure you

won't drive by the property often, but this is just showing those 88 spaces along 7th. This gives you a view looking south at the property. This is along Seventh Street looking west. And then from the uh southeast corner looking north to the parking lot area. And then this would be the access drive to the property. Just wanted to give you some perspective for the uh property itself. We did send out again with the notices. Uh did not receive any public comment on the request. So just uh kind of scrolling back a little bit on how we got to where we are with this request this evening. So, back in uh 2021 at a hearing, there was a request because it's zone parks and recreation, a parking lot was not a permitted use. So, the city did request a variance of use to allow the parking on the property. That was granted um at your September 28th, 2021 meeting. There was not a time limit established by the BG at that time. So subsequent to the uh initial approval the next month it went to the planning commission for development plan. So uh basically site plan approval for the parking lots. That approval was granted for the parking lot that you see as far as the surface and everything. The planning commission did place a three-year time limit on um the use of the property with an expiration date um of December 31st of 24. Um that was um a deadline that was agreed upon as well um by FEMA because there are some um use restrictions on the property as far as what it could be used for. So there was a time limit established to that. the um property was then prior to

that deadline, the end of 24, needed to be restored back to grass to what it was before. In uh 2023, the city was looking to uh establish uh parking areas for the public. Um there was also an agreement with the credence uh property owner as far as providing spaces for them and since it was a temporary use of the parking lot we were trying to find addition as a city we were trying to find additional parking areas elsewhere. Uh there was a request uh made in uh 2023 to extend that time limit that actually had been established by the planning commission um to extend it for three years to basically afford a little bit additional time for the city to find additional parking areas. Um that was granted by the BZA in 2023 and it was at that time where the BZA established your own condition. Yes, we'll allow it for three additional years. So the expiration date um for the the use variance is 20 December 31st of 2027. Subsequent the next meeting after the next month after the BCA meeting the planning commission also extended the expiration date to the December of 2027 time frame. It was early uh this year, January, that uh the city administration did uh request of FEMA to uh basically remove that that restriction on how long that property could be used as a parking lot. They also uh requested to do a more permanent surface. Again, right now it's it's basically millings. It's almost glorified gravel. uh they um were

looking the city proposed a permeable pavement. So uh in essence it would enable uh it'd be a hard surface like asphalt as an asphalt product. Um but it's such that it does allow water to permeate through it. So it's not a complete runoff like a typical asphalt parking lot would be. Um we did the administration heard back from FEMA. I included a copy of that letter in your packet where they did consent to uh the use of the permeable pavement um without any time limit. Uh what that does enable the city to do is make it a more usable parking area, make it defined parking spaces. So actually be striped, it would be clear. The current plan that's included in your packet shows 55 parking spaces with the traffic flow pattern around it. Right now, it's kind of a free-for-all except for those few marked spaces along Seventh Street. There's no really defined area. This would make it very clear. And again, it is a city, it is a public parking lot. There are spaces reserved for Credent employees during the daytime, but aside from that, it is open to the public. Um, so we did get the authorization again from FEMA. Um, and that has kind of led to this request this evening. So, I think the city and the administration may talk about the efforts of trying to still find other public parking areas, but this makes this one just more viable. Uh there is access with the sidewalk on Seventh Street. So, if you park here, you could walk up to Seventh Street and then have access to the downtown area. Uh there would be a little bit of a drainage improvement uh in the property again to collect what what runoff wouldn't uh uh soak into the ground. um and then connect to the city storm sewer there. So that is the uh gist of

the request uh this evening again will be just to eliminate that uh time limit for how long this can remain a parking lot. That way it gives more flexibility. The city's going to invest some money if we do put the permeable pavement here. So we'll want to be able to to know that that could go on um as long as the city felt that was the best use in for the property. Uh so the staff does recommend uh that the board of zoning appeals approve the request to eliminate the expiration date for the use of the property as a parking lot. No specific findings on this type of request. Again, it was a condition that we're looking to modify. Uh and with that, that concludes staff report.

Go ahead. Um, do you know how much space there would be from the proposed parking lot to the creek? U, I don't know. I don't know exactly. No, I I know there's there's been multiple proposals about a greenway, right, through there and correct. You know, that was kind of why it was a temporary Yes. permission in the first place. Is this going to be part of the veterans park? Was this area going to be used as part of the veterans park?

It's not necessarily certainly it's attached to it and it's a public parking area so individuals could park there if they wanted to go to the veterans park. I don't believe the uh the permeable asphalt will go closer than what the current surface is of you know the the millings believe that covers that same area. Looks like about 35 36 feet. Yeah. rough measurement on beacon. Will the property stay with the parks department? Yeah, property currently under city ownership. Yes. Um during the day, how many spaces are public park? They're all public. I'm going to come up and speak.

Yeah. Okay. Credented, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong. CEO has an agreement to utilize those spaces. Correct. Or so many spaces. You you'll clarify. Okay. Okay. Um, one question. The A Street entrance, which is just sort of crummy alleyway right now, is that also going to be I'll let the mayor answer that. I don't know that for certain. I don't think the plan that I see that's included in your packet shows an improvement, too. Does not. Yeah. Questions. modification to timing would not impact any um other conditions about the remediation to it should that parking lot go away back to green space. Correct.

That's correct. That's that's my understanding. Yes. It just allows it for an indefinite period of time. Okay. Um, this may not be the time or place or even our issue, but the the uh trailers or those FEMA trailers and the uh Yeah. All those trailers and stuff that's parked there, could that they possibly move be moved to the edge of town? And I think that's county county building. Um,

it's parked on property owned by the county, so it's not on city property, per se. Just a problem. It'd be nice to get them out of there and use that for parking space. Okay. Thank you very much. Yep. Will the please come forward, introduce yourself. I think we got spider.

Good evening, Dave Clark, mayor of Auburn. Um, yeah, first of all, I'd like to thank Jim for the thorough presentation. Uh, but I'll start off answering your question. Uh, Pete, um, this parking lot would not be restricted. Um, however, speaking with business owners that are on the east side of town, I said if you arrive at your 7:38 a.m., it should be open. But um I don't believe in spending city tax dollars to reserve a parking lot. That's my philosophy on that. Um be open to the public at all times.

Mhm. That is correct. Um the footprint fits, we designed it inside of what's currently there temporarily, so it's not Is that correct, Darl? Um so it's not expanding any closer to the creek. Uh, as you can see, I spoke with the county surveyor, too, who I believe he's a non- voting member on the drainage board, but I want to get his opinion as well. Um, as for the alleyway or the drive coming off union, um, this this plan was just designed for the the parcel bought with the the FEMA grant, but if we need to make improvements from there to Union, we would do so. um that was not a part of the request when sending it off to FEMA because it was not on that parcel. Um as Jim mentioned though, one thing engineering took in consideration is putting a drainage tile ensuring that that will slope. Uh so we will collect the storm water as as much as possible for discharge. Um I believe I think Logan's probably got beacon up. But the drive coming in, isn't that the edge of that property if I'm not mistaken?

Yeah, basically right where that the yellow is on the left hand side in the bottom there. Yeah. And if you go to the up to the yellow right there. Yeah, that's pretty much on this side though. There's a stop here.

Uh it on beacon it shows that it stops flat at that yellow line. So the question was asked um there was a question asked in regards to Veterans Memorial. The thought process would be to put in a sidewalk ADA compliant from the south side there connecting to the northwest corner of that Veterans Memorial because currently the only parking they have is on 9inth Street. We don't want them parking in the business that's located over there. Obviously that's private property. So, this will serve several different purposes. Um, I think most people that go visit the Veterans Memorial, most of them are probably going to be handicapped, wheelchairs, you name it. Um, so it's going to serve multiple purposes and provide, in my opinion, a safe access for that. And we would uh the intent is to clean up take out that partial the old asphalt drive from the old Legion to um because it's our understanding the city will be gifted that parcel with the veterans memorial uh upon completion. The parks will acquire that. Um and I'm happy to answer any other questions. So, I was looking through the old minutes um from 2021 and 2023 um when the extension was initially authorized and then extended um the initial phase of um the parking lot had an agreement with CEO for a certain number of years. Has that that number of years been expired?

We we have not extended that. Um, it's just still that original agreement that is probably most likely expired. I would do you know, Darl, I don't recall a time frame attached to that other than an agreement to provide. So, okay, that's been the struggle. Yeah. And that that was aou. So, um, but I had spoken with Credent and I made it clear that if we do this that it will not be restricted. It needs to be a public parking lot, which is what it would be intended for.

The original threshold of the existing material was roughly 3 to 5 years, and I realize we've got a lot more life out of than we originally expected. What's the expected life cycle of this, Daryl? That's a good question that we're not we this would be like the first time we've done permeable asphalt forest asphalt. We did a little bit there at the north end, but we're still kind of experimenting, but we believe it's going to be similar to regular asphalt if it's taken care of. Uh you have to clean it. You know, it's it's porous and it allows that storm water to percolate through. Uh so it's similar to regular asphalt which would be in 10 to 12 year taking care of you know it's going to require maintenance.

One of the concerns that was originally addressed was the compliance with the 2040 plan and parks and accessibility and and I understand now that especially with the new veterans memorial end I think that almost negates that argument because now you're offering accessibility to the park. But within aligning yourself with the 2040 plan, how does the extension of this indefinitely support moving forward in that regard?

I'm going to begin with this. So there is a lot of things in the 2040 plan and other plans that show a river walk, right? Going from I mean I think it went down as far as 15 14th Street. The problem is these parcels bought by FEMA, you cannot put any permanent structure and that's why this had to be presented with to FEMA with permeable asphalt. So, you can't put in a permanent sidewalk. Um, we're actually going through something right now and this is this is a a different project, but uh no permanent sidewalk. You could put a pavilion as long as all four sides are open. They do allow I believe public restroom but obviously that's not a place for that and that's not a discussion for today. Um so with that uh the county is is doing some things as well. Uh facility studies I believe at some point in the future that area to the west their goal is for that to open up which you had that question Dave about the trailers and so forth. And if it does, then I think that's the area that we incorporate any sort of additional uh whether it be uh park amenities, what have you. Um but with the Veterans Memorial there, you couldn't put playground equipment in. You couldn't do any of that. You couldn't bolt benches down to concrete pad. It's very restricted, I found out. So,

in regards to the 2040 plan, too, just look it up here. It can help with downtown goals. So, supporting our downtown development through parking, which as somebody who's gotten multiple parking tickets, I can tell you that we need it. Um, and basically encouraging adaptive reuse of land that supports the community needs. Yeah. One of one of the other ideas tossed around and we did not submit it with this but it's still on the table is um you know we got a kayak entrance or kayak entry point up at Doc's Landing. We have one down at Echart, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Because you kayak um the thought process is possibly doing one here um mostly get utilized on the weekends. Businesses are closed. That's going to be pretty open. if somebody wants to come in with their truck, couple kayaks. But that's another idea we've tossed around. It's not implemented in this plan, nor is the sidewalk. The sidewalk we had to do separate because of the uniqueness of the parcel and the restrictions. So, we couldn't tie those together. Thank you. Is the city still looking for additional parking for the downtown area? Yeah, the structures

the difficult thing is where, right? Just like a restroom. Um, it's always on the forefront. Um, we've done, actually, I give Andy credit. Andy has done several parking studies and updated it the last couple years. Um, there is a lot of two-hour parking in downtown. There's also a lot of unrestricted parking on the streets. Um, I can tell you, you know, you we were talking about how uh the utilization of this parking lot during like say the work week. I can we can drive by there any given time of the day. There's 10 cars. They park on the streets and we can't tell them they can't. Obviously, it's public parking, right? So, um, this this will accommodate 55 spots. I think it'll make a huge dent. It'll help the businesses on the east side. On the west side, they have the new Fifth Street parking area there so that they can park there for the day and not have to worry about getting cited. So, um, but yeah, parking and and those amenities are always on the forefront. It's just a matter of where where can we put them? [Music] Any other

questions? Thank you very much. Thanks. Anyone else in the audience that wishes to address this project, please come up, state your name, give me a boost membership. Uh Max Short, uh 5036 County Road 31. Um, just confirm for me that the only thing that you're looking at tonight to vote on is the elimination of the expiration date. Not how it's planned, which is what we've been talking about, but the only thing you're going to vote on is elimination of the date. I understand.

Okay. Um, and just a heads up or maybe a clarification, back at your meeting in November 28 in 2023, uh, FEMA agreed to the three-year extension, the Miami River Vape Basin. Actually, FEMA agreed to eliminate any date at that time. According to your minutes, the Miami River Basin um wanted a three-year extension. There's no documentation that they've even been contacted or they approved what you're trying to do tonight, but yet in 23 they were referred to. Jim, can you tell me that approval is required? [Music] don't believe it is required. Um but there has been discussions with Bali River Base on this with the director. So they are aware of the request and aware we made the request as well.

And FEMA has approved the extension without Yeah, there is there's with your documentation there is a letter from FEMA but there's nothing that says Miami River Basin is okay. Right. I don't know how to answer that. Well, I don't either. It's up to you guys. As I just indicated, they are aware of the request this evening. They're aware of FEMA's approval, but they have not submitted anything that would stay, but we want you to hold the three-year agreement.

Well, I I guess I'm dating. It was if if it was important at the last meeting where you changed the date, why wouldn't it be important at this meeting? Thank you. [Music]

Is there anyone else else in the audience that wish you to speak for this project? Please come forward, state your name, display your last name and address. [Music] Kevin Webb, WBB13 Matthew Cove. Um, extending the date. There's critical information you're looking at. Uh, and what they're trying to do, you know, why it'd be okay to extend the date if they're going to build a new parking lot and everything. Couple answers that I can give you. The asphalt, the permeable asphalt is a special mix of asphalt. They do that with concrete also. Eliminate the fines and they juice up the sticky stuff. So it's rocks stuck together with gaps between the rocks because the fines the fine aggregate fills in those gaps and that's what makes asphalt and concrete not permeable. So u they don't know the life expectancy. It might be a little less than regular asphalt but it's good product. It's probably the product of the future both concrete and asphalt especially in situations like this. Um uh as to parking the good that they going to eliminate the restrictions for Credent because uh being on the council I kind of watch that we do have a lot of two-hour parking but we are lacking in free parking and I get emails and letters every once in a while from the business owners have trouble finding a parking spot especially like between 10 and like 3:00. clock. So, even the new lot on Fifth Street is full uh with business owners and stuff. So, this would free up that aspect of it. And

being on the tax phasing committee, I've met with Cretton several times and commented, you got like 10 park cars in the parking lot, but you get there's a sign on there that you're restricted and it's restricted and you only you guys can park in there. Well, he said, well, the they say the bulk of the time they work from home. the like Wednesdays there may be a larger group in there. So, currently they really don't need all of that parking and it would be good for that to be opened up and available to uh all the the public that needs it. Uh the other thing is if you you look at your long-term goal on your FEMA letters, you it's permeable. Grass is permeable, asphalt's permeable. So you got the same same s aspect here that you're trying to achieve. It's permeable and what functioning we need is definitely more free parking. We have it and like I can see and I would be in favor of keeping that. So thank you.

Thanks. Appreciate your input. Anyone else in the audience that wishes to speak forward against project come forward. If not, I'll close the public hearing for this project. Board discussion. I'd like more parking.

Yeah, I think that we've proven that downtown parking and downtown access is the need is growing. Um, so to if it was the existing surface asking for an extension, I think that'd be a concern, but the fact that the city's looking to improve that surface is a positive. Um the application in the area I think is the right application for that area at this point. Um I echo the mayor and Darl and Mr. Webb's feedback as well that it it's needed in that space and and to remove any credent requirement. I understand the value and commend the previous mayor for his idea to get them as an incentive to provide that parking initially. But if it wasn't timestamped, I think at this point it needs to be. Um, so the fact that it is going to be opened up to the public, I I think speaks volumes to moving this project forward.

Long as there's room for a trail. Yeah. If it doesn't take more space than what's existing, I think there's room. Is anybody here on the trails committee? No. I used to be, but I'm not anymore. Mhm. Uh I think that was one of the proposed lines going through the city and down by the point. Yeah. Yeah. I mean there's plenty of room there from when I measured it. If we just take the existing anywhere from 40 foot the south end to

I feel a little bit I feel bit a bit poorly about the city. um twice asking to use that area not as a park, giving us a a date where say it's going to go away and now it's all changed. It's coming back and now it's going to be there forever, at least my lifetime. Um you know, that just doesn't seem quite right to me, but I'll go along with it. So yeah, comments 24 of you and I don't really get around.

Yeah, for what it's worth. I was on the parks board and we had, you know, we've they improved a lot of the parks over the time and more parks are more man-hour and maintenance and they look at memorial. Have you gone Have you checked out Memorial Park since they finished it? Yeah, it looks really It looks really good. Okay,

go play pickle ball there. Well, as somebody who was originally on the Hometown Collaboration Initiative project, which this property was part of that um initiative that came out of that, um I'm a little disappointed. Like you said, the same thing, right? This this project and this property was really initially meant to be a park as part of this Veterans Memorial. Um but I'm with you and that we do need parking. It's part we're looking at 20 240 now and I'm glad to hear that we're thinking through what our next steps. What are we doing to partner the county buildings and those county trailers we were talking about? And I think that was 2016 when we had that HCI committee meeting and so we were talking about those trailers then.

That should be good. Those we were talking about those buildings then. So I'm glad that we're still having those conversations but I feel the same way. Okay. Uh, since there are not findings at that is all you want is a motion to accept the extension with no extension date. That's correct. Could somebody read that properly? Sure. Let me get down to the actual clarify too. Can you uh application on here says BZA use variance 2021-003. On the agenda it says 2023-004. So I just want to make sure we get the right one through. It does say 400

and they're both two different years. So I want to make sure they must have assigned it to the 23 request. The assignment case number 23 all tied together. Okay. 2023 Chris the word smith. Yep. So wait so are we is it still BZA use variance 2021003 still or is it a new one? I would utilize the 2023. That was the most recent that's what established that case established 2023004. Correct.

All right. I would move to remove any time use variance for the city credent temporary parking lot related to 2023004.

Second. Is that right? In favor? I I I was going to make it more complicated, but leave it simple. That was simple enough. Any other business? Meetings. We have a meeting next month. We will have a meeting next month. Meetings calendar. We do have a calendar on there. Yes. We have another agenda item after this after the case was the 2020. Oh, the meeting. Okay. That's simply to establish the filing deadlines and the meeting dates for next year. Okay. Great.

So, we would get a motion on that. Motion to approve. I haven't even went to the calendar to be honest with you. Yeah, I actually did I miss that calendar. So I have too many move to approve the 2026 meeting schedule for the BCA. Second. All in favor? I approved. Be nice if we could eliminate fair week. Tonight was great because it rained so but it is fair week so it rains. Okay. Anything else? Motion to journ. Move to adjurnn.

Second. All in favor? I we are. Thank you for the clarity, mayor. Appreciate the insight. I'm glad Kevin.