Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Oh, here we go. Now we're alright. So, yeah, it's more obviously, it's more informal. There no action can be taken. They in fact, the only thing that they can do is they can open the meeting and close the meeting. Those are the only two things that are are allowed to happen. I have a few slides that I'll go through, but you'll see that most of them are are just things that you've seen before. In case and I'm just gonna go through these in case you need to see any of these for discussion purposes so that you know what we have. So and as everyone knows, the proposal, it's a 22 by 40 foot structure, as the existing. Obviously, it's better materials and design from what is there.

Aluminum frame retractable awning roof louver system and which which is electronic and automatic. You push a button and the louvers open up. Same thing with the windscreens on the sides so they can go up and down easily. Four foot high masonry walls on all sides, gated to sidewalk as you can see fireplace. That's just a interior view in case we need it.

And we all know where it's located. Again, here, just so that you know what we have that's existing and proposed. And some ideas for how the masonry may look. The rendering shows that it's brick, but they're open to other materials as well. Okay. So that's all the stuff you've seen up until now. There's been a lot of discussion about parking and how you how parking could be handled. And as you know, everything is happening. There's 20 spaces that you can see that are existing. And there doesn't seem to be really any room for any additional parking, but it's one of the things I was charged with.

Could you could you develop the area that's to the east to have more parking over there to alleviate some of the the parking on some of the side street and and things like that. So this is the thaw and scale use AutoCAD. However, it's over an aerial photo, so it's it's more or less right. It's not the same thing as actually using a survey drawing, but we could get pretty close with it. So there's the potential for 11 more parking spaces, give or take, right in that area.

There are some things that don't quite work out right. There's a required 50 foot buffer. You can see the green line right there where it says 50 feet. So that's a requirement. As you can see, that's not happening anywhere anyways. So that's not exactly right. And the buffer is is from the the properties that are to the west or to the the left. That's where it's on single family. The buffer that's to the east where that apartment building is, that's only a 10 foot required buffer. So this this design, when I drew this up, I've I've pushed it, tried to get as far away from the residences as possible.

So it's actually at a five foot setback. So the actual parking and buffer requirement from the east is actually supposed to be 10 feet, so it's actually drawn at five feet. So, again, this is just because, you know, we've heard over the years what can be done parking wise. Is there something different that can be done? This isn't an endorsement for this.

This isn't saying that this is a requirement or something the city even the administration or the city is saying that that this should happen. It's just because this has been questioned over and over and over. I've got AutoCAD, so I wanted to play with it and see, yeah, could you actually add more parking? So yes and no. You could add more parking, but, in order to add more parking, you really have to give some exceptions, the buffer being the main exceptions.

And mainly, the buffer from the east from the west, I think, is more important than the buffer from the east. As you can see, it's pretty significant. Now if everyone agreed to this, neighbors included and and, you know, as a solution to, you know, to solve the parking issues over there and then the owner wanted to pursue something like this. Yeah. There's there's still you're not right on that you're not right on that West property line. You still do have, you know, probably around 20 some feet. I don't remember the exact number. 30 feet. Yeah. We've about 30 feet there to play with.

So something could be done in that area. But, anyways, this is just for illustrative purposes. And also with this, you can see the existing parking. We talked about things like setbacks and buffers. So the existing parking wouldn't meet the current standards for for either as well. So that sort of, like, light blue color that shows where the 25 foot parking setback is. There's some existing let's see if this cursor works. Yeah. It does. So there's some existing, you know, parking area here that's actually within that that 25 foot setback, and obviously, these spaces are then there's a a 30 foot parking setback from the residential area here.

So these would all be, you know, so and then there's actually a 50 foot buffer here. So and then if you're actually to do a building, there'd be a 60 foot setback. So really, if this if there was nothing here today and somebody wanted to develop this property, they'd have a hard time being able to really do anything with it because of all these different setbacks and things like that. Let me see if I missed anything. So, 20 existing spaces, potential for, we'll say, approximately 11. That equates to 62 seats. I don't know how many do you know how many seats you have inside the restaurant? How many chairs you have?

Including the bar stools, 40.

How many? 40. 40? Okay. And then do you know how many you have on the outside?

No. Okay. I mean, on any given day. Depends.

It depends. Okay. Well, certainly, this. So if you got 40 on the inside, this is take you know, technically by code, this is taking the you know, satisfying the inside parking because it's one space for two seats. So this this is doing the 40 on the inside. But then you

have How many how many parking spaces are in this?

There's 20 here. 20 existing. Yeah. 20 existing. I numbered them all so I wouldn't forget. Yeah. So there's 20 here. So that is actually satisfying what's required on the inside, but then you have the outside as well. And due to the high usage of the outside, I think that's where we're seeing some of these parking concerns that we're hearing about. Let's see what else. Talked about these encroachments. Dumpsters. One thing this doesn't do, it doesn't address dumpsters, and they do right now have a couple of dumpsters, I think, in this area. The other thing that comes up a lot with this is the nonconforming use of the property. As you know, this is on multifamily.

It's a commercial restaurant use. And if how can you address something like that? Well, you can't get the use variance in Westlake. It's it's prohibited. That code spells it out that they're not allowed.

So that kind of goes out the window. There's not a zoning modification. There's not a conditional use that can be done for it. Really, the only thing that you could do to expand the use, to expand the I'm not talking about parking, by the way, because parking is a that's an accessory use in a residential zone. But to actually expand the building, because that's something that that is is certainly so I've heard some people mention that about the expansion of this as a as a room.

If if that is something that everyone agreed should happen, how could you go about doing that? Well, you really have to change the code. And this is so we have something that's kind of similar to this right now in the code, the residential code, which is chapter twelve eleven, where we do allow limited commercial use of historic buildings and sites under certain circumstances. And the way it's written right now, and

this is the right

zone for it, you have to be in the RMF 24 zone. You have to be over a 100 years old and deemed historic, and there's certain requirements for that. You have to keep the building or site pretty much in its original condition and state, you know, so you can't, you know, deem something historic and basically, you know, rip it down and kind of replace it with something modern. It has to continue to look the way that it did before. And then then beyond that, there's some things you can do, health, safety, and ADA and things like that, understand that you have to do that that would be allowed.

But then after that, it's very limited to arts, crafts, antique, sales of of objects like that. There was a there was a a dental office nearby, the Bennett Dental office, and that was a gift shop at one time, and I had a doctor's office at the same time. And then it's it's been a doctor's office most recently. Then you do teaching of arts, crafts, and the repair of antiques, creation, assembly, and or repair of arts and crafts, restoration of antiques. Antiques were very popular when this code was written.

They're not as popular today. And then professional services, which is why we've got the Bennett Dental office, for example. So those are all things, and this is all by conditional use. So in order to so as you can see, there's nothing here that is reflective of a restaurant that you see at all. So what you would need to do would be to add something like what you're seeing in d.

And this is just for talking purposes. This hasn't been run through law, but I think this would generally take care of it. So in historic commercial buildings originally designed and used solely for commercial purposes and never as primary residences are permitted. The uses specified above that I just read, along with the following additional uses: Restaurants, provided they exclude any drive in or drive through service outdoor dining facilities in compliance with twelve twenty six point zero four. I have that code if you wanna see it.

I've got it on the next slide. But what I've done here, this is really reflective of of the situation before you tonight, and that's that you have a commercial building. This wasn't a house. The Bennett Dental office was a house originally. So if going forward, if everyone thinks, okay.

This is the the path forward for this particular use, you wanna I I think you wanna limit it because there are a lot of 100 year old homes in RMF 24 zones on Detroit Road and on Center Ridge Road that you don't want turning into restaurants. Right. You might be okay with them turning into a an office. I don't know about these antique things. At least not in this time in history.

But you might be okay with some of those things happening with those other places. But as far as this goes, this this is the only commercial building in an RMF 24 zone that was you know, would meet this criteria being over a 100 years old and historic and, you know, architecture is significant and all this stuff. It's the only thing that that would would really fit within that. And and these are really the only thing. You know, restaurants, you don't wanna you don't wanna have something in here that's gonna conflict with other places in the code where drive in, drive through restaurants are only allowed in in two commercial zones.

So that's why I put this in about excluding it. They're only allowed in interchange service and shopping center. So I don't want something that would conflict with that, so I put that in there. And then outdoor dining facilities because there is one. And, again, this is none of this any everything that that I I've I've talked about tonight, just to reiterate, this is not a recommendation. No. It's not an endorsement for any of these changes or or any of the, you know, any of this. It's just because these are some some things that have been talked about in recent times, really, for many years. And I just wanted to get them on paper to help you with your discussion tonight. Thank you.

Thank you. Alright. Well, I know there's a question over there, but do we wanna have our conversation first and then open up to the presidents that are here? Does that sound alright? Yeah. Alright. So that's usually a new planning question anyway. So okay. So who wants to kick it off?

I'll be kicked off.

I mean, I can. I mean, I guess I guess the whole reason we're here is Dwayne spoke up and said, what about a compromise? Because legally, we can't prove it. I mean, legally, it doesn't meet the code of what you're planning to do. So what is there a compromise? I mean, I think that's why we're here tonight because we're taking into account there's a noise issue. There's a parking issue. And did I miss anything else? Yeah. And then maybe the rear area wants to be fixed up. I mean those are kind of things we've heard from the property owners. And as far as property owners are concerned, mean you have an economic development business there, and you have a right to have a business there. So we need to figure out what's the compromise. I mean, do you lease

or own that building?

I don't remember. Yes. Oh. I'm the the jewelry member. Billion. Okay. Got it. Billion. Lease from that's your business. Okay. Yeah. So I mean, I I don't see it going anywhere. I mean, I've lived in the Westlake most of my life, and I've been back here seventeen years, and it has never been a threatening business until now. So that to me is important too. So how do we compromise between getting the noise and, you know, the area cleaned up? I mean, it is a beautiful design, but legally, I don't think we can do it. That's the problem. So I I think you mentioned walling it in at the meeting or

making it enclosed. Well The ventral wall. So and and and so I think, you know, let's just step back to the sort of the beginning. Yeah. So we have a building Yep. That was a certain square footage, you for a number of seats in the

parking Yep.

Match that number. Plenty of cars. And so and you can tell over the years that it functioned the way it was the way the code, you know, the code sort of is designed to address some of

this stuff.

So you had 20 cars. You had enough seats for the 20 cars. It all kind of

work. Right? Right.

And so what happened, though and then there's a patio there. We still don't know how that patio showed up or showed up there.

In three days. These are it's the same. Three days. Yeah.

And but and and I've been here

you know, I I

can't say I paid attention all the times, but it's been press breakfast places and lunch places. And so they have a couple, I think, tables with, you know, full umbrellas umbrellas on on it. It. So that wouldn't necessarily add a whole lot more traffic to the parking lot. But the and then the and then the original concept that I'm not I understand it was there the patio was gonna have a canopy over it.

It's a retractable canopy. And then a structure came in that then had the canopy with it. And, of course, you the sides for inclement weather, which then, because of COVID, ended up being your ability to spread out a little bit, which we understand that that how that function. But it is more it morphed from it we you know, the what is this that we're look what are we actually looking at? Is this a patio with a a roof over it, or is this an addition to the roof?

And even as a patio with a roof over it, it has it we noticed caused parking issues. And so that's why let's just say, it is a patio that can, which we're showing you. But, by the way,

a patio is only allowed

to be a third of the seating.

And that's the problem. Yeah.

So if you had 40 seats, you should be limited to, I'm do the math, ten, twelve.

Like, probably, like, twelve, thirteen.

Three round tables with four seats added. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah. That's really what should be in there. And the reason why that is the idea would be, it's a nice day. Actually, people are on the set. They're probably outside. Right. So you're you're not adding even to the parking of the cars. So that's the reality of how things function. So so the couple issues I see is if we say well, the options sort of become it's okay. You go back to a patio where it slept, you know, a third of the ceiling. That's one approach.

You know, another approach is you say, this is an enclosed room. This is an addition, and then how do you dress the parking? So Jim, at least put, I mean, you know, an And then on top of everything else and, you know, this is our always our because if you've come to enough planning commissions, everybody knows this. We're always the it's always the issue of commercial with residential abutting, and we have it in many places in our city. And then how to come up with a way that has everybody is able to coexist.

So the businesses and the presidents, you know, there's a to the whole thing. So and, of course, we can see from all the set of the issue to begin with is just and it's just the reality of this particular site. The site is that but not what we would have is to today's commercial setbacks. If it was a if it was a new site, Greenfield site.

Right? Right. Right. So

those are the issues. So, you know, I'm not sure what the clear answer is yet in my head as to what to do. But, you know so I I guess that's the for us to discuss a little bit is what really should be, you know, applicant and take some weigh in with the neighbors a little bit. Is there a way to come to some meeting of the minds that this can work somehow.

So but I think that the

proposal as is is probably not gonna get the support because it's a it's it's with or I should say I should say it's not with the support. The concern is is is it is it really an addition to the building? Because it's gonna function like an addition to the building even if it's partially open in terms of seating and all that.

And even if we could approve it, there's still an issue. I mean, so how many times have you guys been to the planning commission? Five, ten? Many more. So so I mean years. Yeah. So I mean, it just keeps snowballing. So what so let's stop it and figure out how to compromise to get make it work for everyone. That's that's my goal. I mean, I don't know. Again, I'm not an attorney. I don't know the exact specifics, but, you know, I guess one of my questions I have is do your employees park at the church right now? Yeah. Okay. So that's that's the solution that I would help you with. Doctor. Bennett's. So when he's not open, then we're Yeah. We park there. Yeah. So that other lot is used by the bus. Which is great. Yeah. And that's that's very proactive. Proactive.

But still, there's other issues we need figure out. I don't know if my other fellow commissioners want to weigh in at this point. Or if you have any great ideas to solve it?

Well, I've I've been thinking about this. I'd like to build on what mister Biddell and commissioner Van Dyke have said. And I think my goal for this would be to satisfy the noise issue, which might be, you know, a full addition.

So

I have

I'm trying to figure out, like, so when did how long was Hail Mary's operational before the patio roof went on?

So the roof went on and was finished the day before they shut us down for COVID. So March, April 2020. Yeah.

Prior to that, when did you guys

'28. We opened March 2018.

So two years prior. Okay. So obviously doing well in 2018 and

Yeah. I mean And

with the existing no patio, limited parking.

Well, the big reason was weather protection. We had university hospitals did a party there on the patio when their residents came, and and so on and so forth. But the problem was if if you plan something on the patio or even if you're midway through your meal, we had no recourse Mhmm. To cover those people. So that was the idea behind the patio.

And then when COVID did happen, with the understanding we came to the planning commission, we got occupancy outside of the building building and and do do all all of of those those things for so long, we were never we didn't even have to roll back the sides anymore. But that that did not happen until last year because then all of those things were lifted. So then we found ourselves with that roof tips doesn't really work well. Mhmm. So the hope was that we weren't gonna do anything but just improve what was already approved and what we were operating at.

So I guess my my point on that is that 2018 business was doing okay without a roof on it. Good enough to do to put a roof

on it? The it was doing well, not I mean so the original idea was that we could expand. Mhmm. That that we would knock that wall out and put garage doors around it. That's what we originally came to the city with, and that's when we realized that we could not do that. Right. We wanted to add bathrooms because there's only one bathroom. It's not what I would say is ADH. It's not compliant, but it is compliant because we can't do those things

Right.

Because of the code.

So you're 40 seats inside currently.

Mhmm. And I forget. I'm sorry. I do not I looked for the occupancy sticker. I don't have it. I can, you know, call the fire department and see what the occupancy is for the patio.

Why don't you go to the appointment? Could you go to one of the inside pictures? We can just get a sense of about how many seats are there.

You also the top was also allowed to be used before it went out of compliance. Mhmm. So the the The second? The 2nd Floor is 20 five. Is an apartment. But Yeah. It was three tables.

Yeah. Yeah. Gov. Yeah. And see.

More. Mhmm. And then So that

and that's just Robbie. That's probably good morning. So I I I think, you know, again, from my standpoint, there's already existing, what I'll say is issues in the neighborhood and recognizing that it is the positioning of the of the structure and the ability to function without the patio originally, it works. And now that we're we put a patio or we enclose the patio, we're only exasperating the potential for the parking and the noise and everything else. So I that's where I have some concerns with that is I I appreciate mister Bedell's showing

us how

the parking layout could potentially happen in that back section. But, again, there's a lot of other things that I think once we start laying that out, dumpsters was one thing that we brought up where the locations of those happen. And the next thing is going to be where it's laid out is that without that buffering, we have cars that are now now you have headlights sitting at one house on both the side and the back of it. You know? So I see a lot of issues arising from adding the parking in order to reach that occupancy parking ratio at this point.

Is there a potential for shrinking down the patio? Bringing it down into less tables, less square footage to to try and alleviate some of the the parking to the table issue. You know? And at that point, can we be bringing it any closer to Center Ridge and getting ourselves away? So when we shrink it down, we're cutting it in half and bringing it or whatever it is and bringing it the back half that is north side of it, getting rid eliminating that to get yourself a little bit more distance from 202163033.

You know, is that an option? And would that by doing that, would that also give you any extra parking spaces? Probably not. But at least it's going to get us closer on a occupancy occupancy to parking space ratio.

I'd I'd I'd have to do the math. We've put a lot of money into that.

Jim

so right now, they they're doing shared parking, I guess, with the church. We're having an agreement

with them.

Right? Right.

But it's just a it's not a

it's not a city It's not

formalized. It's

Yeah. Which they could do. Mhmm. Yeah. Right. But at some point, the church would say we don't wanna park there. Right. True. But how many years has it been going on? It's going on for quite some time. Yeah. Like, three years. Well, yeah, I think if there was an agreement in place Mhmm. Documents signed by both parties. I'm just thinking we, you know, we don't really have a shared parking in the city. Of course, at times, we say that's not a bad thing to to look at in

those certain circumstances. Right. Right.

We have a regulation for it, but it's number one, it's in the business code. So it's a and this is not business zoning. It's residential zoning, so it's not gonna apply. And then number two, it's the way the way shared parking works, it's it says you can share parking with another use, but between both of your uses, you have to have enough land available so that if the other use says no, you can go ahead and build your own parking out at some point in the future. Right. Right? So that whole thing about, you know, church says no, well, then you just have to build your own lot at that point. So it either you know? So it would it doesn't it doesn't work here for this. K.

What's behind

the building? Between the on the north side?

Let me see if I have a this one. Okay.

Is there any is there

there's there's a cooler back there on the north side of the of the inner cooler. And This is the airfocus coolers back there. Yeah. And the building on the front, is that is that setback for the street? No. It's inside of it.

Yeah. I think the setback is I I can I can check on that? I'm gonna unplug you so you can't see.

I'm going over there. I get

I get stage fright.

Conditioned space inside of that. What's running out there now? I do see driving by, do you see ductwork inside of the patio. Is that heat? Is that AC? Is that o?

Heat. Heat? Mhmm. And

is it connected? Do you have do you have central air in this in the building? I mean,

we're using that term recently.

Yes. It is and I'm assuming it's not

It's not connected to the central air.

Yeah. And and the existing condenser is not probably sized to handle what you have. It's if it's not running well right now, but adding adding any more to it is gonna push it beyond as long as it's if we if you connected that duct to

My my father owns part of the building. Oh, okay. I

think they Dave, I think that that furnace was put in as part of it just for COVID heating was the idea was to condition the space so that they could use it the wintertime for colder weather.

I would I would call this kind of inconclusive because let's say I'm unfortunate with Ariel. Sometimes this happens. So the probably the property line is probably over here at the furnace on the back end of the sidewalk. Back of the sidewalk. Yeah. That's usually how it works.

Not always, though. Yeah. It's possible the sidewalk's

underneath through there. Yeah. Yeah. That does happen. That's possible. Yeah. Okay.

Good for now. Okay. Mister Jones?

I mean, I don't really have anything

to add at this point. I I'm I'm kind of in the same mindset as as a councilman Van Dyke right now as far as, you know, maybe the maybe the least disruptive thing would be to find a way to get this space enclosed largely for noise. I I think that it it seems like one of the biggest complaints that we're hearing, and I'm sure the residents will, you know, fill us in or clarify what what the thoughts are. But, you know, it's it seems like noise coming from that patio is is a pretty significant concern. And Mhmm.

You know, enclosing the space gives you the opportunity to dramatically change the sound equation on there. Of course, you'll still have the fact that you have disruptions outside when people come and go. Unfortunately, that's just the reality of having a restaurant and a, you know, when a and a nonconforming use in the residential zone that's allowed to be there. I mean, that that there's nothing that it can really change that. But, you know, having the actual activity of the restaurant be something that could be more quieted, I think, you know, would benefit the residents.

And I also see a benefit for the business owner as well because, you know, that space, while, you know, I'm I I know they make the best of the space they have, but I think that it would give them a lot more flexibility certainly on a year round basis if that space were all closed.

The issue

becomes now we think about how parking is gonna work, of course,

because, you know, they're

they're clearly below they'd be below code if they were going to expand the building for parking. It sounds like they just barely meet it now, which actually surprised me. I assume they were under, but they're not.

With I

I do have concerns about expanding that parking to the north unless we can come up with a way to satisfactorily buffer that, particularly on the west side. The east side, even though it is, you know, up against this RMF on the other side. Right? So the buffering apartments are less, but it's still residential over there. Residential use. Yeah. So I, you know, I I would have concerns with, you know I know your your first crack at it was, let's just push everything as far as the East as we can to get it away from the single family residence as well. We also gotta think about the residences on other side. So there's gotta be you know, does it even work to have parking there with, you know, considering all that? I'm not sure.

Although, I like the idea of them being able to expand on-site somehow. I I think that that, you know, while while it's great that they have access to parking in other areas, and it's good that you have your employees utilize it, that's obviously a smart thing to do. It's still your inclination is gonna be

to park as close as

you can.

You know? And the church is great, but it's also, you know, a block and a half away. So so I'm kind of so I guess I'm sort of back and forth in the whole thing, but I do think that it it seems to me just in general, the least disruptive thing would be to enclose the space and find a way to make that work. Because think I that GET gives an opportunity to make things better, further away from it around the area.

And I think the part I I have nothing wrong. I mean, downtowns, we share parking agreements all

the time.

I mean, that is that is not should not be foreign to us. That should not be scary to

us. Mhmm.

Again, the liability issues and all that good stuff. But, I mean so the dentist office is closer. The dentist office is yeah. Closer. So that's Yeah.

I wasn't worried

you're using that. That's that's great.

Yeah. That's great. And really, the church doesn't need to

the church has so much

The church has way too much.

Yeah. We overparked.

Yes.

So the idea of using and I parked over at the church before the walk is nice.

Likewise. Yeah. When the weather's nice, it's perfect. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, it is a thing where people do They don't care. Yeah. But you also have clientele that are almost there. Always. Yeah. So I I think you We have some of our clientele tells the other clientele Right. Exactly. Yeah. So I I think that your business is a a group of people that really like to go there. I mean, it's not like you don't see new faces. I never see new faces. You see the same faces there when I go, which is a good thing. You should come to the other day. That's what That's what you do. And that's kind of that's

what you want.

But I think that training those people to say Yes. You know, you've got a park here. You gotta park there. Yeah. I I we could couldn't figure out how to close I guess I wanna hear you guys what you think the thoughts are about closing it. I mean, it's expensive. It's gonna be really expensive. I mean, my thoughts are like

I I don't running the restaurant now, and I'm from that world historically. I mean, running a thriving restaurant in that footprint is a difficult thing

to do. I bet.

Yeah. And so the cost that enclosed, that's certainly gonna be more than what we've talked about this year. Not insurmountable. Doing that parking lot,

that's a

whole another big bill. But then it starts to get into this math. That's what it begins to because can they afford operating that business and the lease that's required for us to have any type of return on investment. And so it becomes a difficult well, would I close it? I'd love to enclose

it. Mhmm.

I mean, I'd love to do it. It's just it becomes a math problem. I know the big thing is right now is this one's labor so much more significant than it was when they opened.

But maybe it's difficult to run a restaurant in today's industry in a perfect setting.

Yeah. With

in a in a This is not a

This is not a perfect setting, so I'm I'm assuming it's just magnified the the difficulties in in that.

But I I'd be willing to wiggle on the parking lot. I I'm tired of pavement. I'm tired of concrete. I would I would rather see a shared parking agreement because that makes sense to me economically, ecologically, and it solves to me, it solves a problem.

I I I'm not aware. I I would my preference would be to have a formalized

shared

parking arrangement or multiple formalized

shared parking arrangements. So

you're about 300 and as the crow flies, 365 feet to bench parking lot, and then about 620 some feet to the church.

We do have an employee who parks in the church and rides his bike.

So I'm pretty sure everybody's going with parking. But before we leave the parking subject, I guess I I just wanna be really clear about this issue, which is that, you know, we try and have parking come to some relative amount of seating. Yeah. And this is a test, a perfect example of there's not enough parking because there's too much seating, and we see it happening all the time because they go down the street Mhmm. And they're parking in the neighbor's front yards.

And so, you know, until that until I'm comfortable with that, sir, that's a resolved issue because I get calls and other people get calls, and and it it you know, it's an ongoing thing. So it should either be resolved. And and the other thing is we we need to get this in a such as we need to resolve this whole issue in a way that we're not, again, the old opening up precedent here. Right? Saying, no. At least we can do it here, and then, you you know, we've got

five more restaurants or other people coming down overnight.

So I just think that that still needs I'm not I'm not quite Yeah. There yet with that. But

But it's a oh, I'm sorry. As

a committee, are we in agreement that this is this is an expansion? The patio is an expansion of the of the seating.

Right now? Yes. Right now. Yes. Proposed. Yeah. Proposed. That's why I don't think it's

In its current state, would we say that it is? If it was just what we're seeing today, is it considered would it would you consider it to be an expansion of the

I think it it it shouldn't it functions like that because It looks like it. Yes. It's because you have to have people inside, and you can have people inside Mhmm. At the same time. So it's really that many seats that, you know, it's a rainy day. You can all be there.

And so we looked at it from that aspect right now. We're we're parking isn't compliant as we speak.

Yeah. I was gonna say, I don't know the necessary agreement it's an expansion, but I do think that the parking issue is there either way. Yeah. Right? And because because you have that many seats, there's, know? Irregardless of If you're gonna you're gonna count every seat within the ones outside, there's, you know, your short apartment.

So regardless if we didn't close it or don't close it, it still has a parking issue.

Right. Well, let's say you take the you take the roof off completely. Mhmm. And you go back to the tables with some umbrellas down

there. Yeah.

It should only be a third. Right. Well It'll be 13 seats. That. 13 seats. So if you put 13 seats with umbrellas out there, did you have a parking issue? It might on a beautiful On certain days. Days. But on the whole, you wouldn't. But this is not how it's operating. And on top of it, you know, the other thing would be to say, okay. You can add on to the building, and you can have 12 seats out there.

That's what I was thinking. If they add on and then the bar goes away, you're not gonna have mean, I'm not assuming if you add on, it would actually be tables like you have inside. So that would be less than what you have because you're gonna have people standing around. Right?

I think you're gonna have a restroom too. It's gonna

take Yeah. Big chunk of Yeah. Right.

And it was gonna solve, hopefully, part of the noise issue. Or

I do. Gonna solve for the

The activity in the restaurant, it should solve that issue. Yeah. Yeah. What it want it won't solve the issue of people being noisy and hard enough. But, again, there's nothing Yeah. There's not a solution to that.

A buffering. Yeah.

So well, since we're just having a conversation, so go back to that site plan. Because Dave mentioned something. I thought, oh, that's kind of an or you should go to the front of the building, the the a photograph of the front,

So,

I mean, rather than that that addition extending out the distance it is to the left, like, you painted only half that distance and wrapped the rest of it around the front and you had it extend out towards the front. So you have more seat. You you take that seating, but maybe not still quite that many, but move some of it to the front and just literally pull it up so you don't have this big addition on the side of the building.

At that point,

strictly to go this side?

Move it to the other side of

the Yeah. That and the other side does does have that's where the dumpsters are. There's some additional, I think, employee parking on that side. So and there's not a lot of not a lot of room to do much work. Or something really dramatic? No. No. No. It's pretty flat. Yeah.

It's my impression here. But,

yeah, here, you kinda see there's sort of this is like a service service lot over here.

Is that where your deliveries come in at? Is that typically

Some deliver right up front. Yeah. It depends on how brave the delivery driver

is. Alright.

But the dumpster truck comes in Mhmm. For sure.

That's I mean, if it's something if it worked out for them, there there's some room next to the building here.

Yeah. If we go to the next of the building, the dumpster could still

be tucked back into that corner. Driveway's over.

It's kind

of up into the Mhmm. Northeast. Let me switch. I can

do a Google Street view for you. Okay.

So do

you know the ins the

square footage of the interior?

Do we have that?

And

what's the square footage of the what's the patio dimensions?

Yeah. So the current

agreement with Bennett and the church is handshake. Right? That was just conversations.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And so, Jim, I asked you, we need to be as a city, would we need to be involved with that? That area?

Yeah. To for an expansion.

So No. For a share.

Part.

Share. Expansion that triggers a share share expansion that require that triggers more parking.

Yes. Yeah. And so if you the change in the code would require a conditional use permit for this to if if you if that was the the path forward. Right? Allow the expansion. So you have to write rewrite the code. I put that up there. That would be a conditional use permit, and you would make that one of the conditions of the conditional use permit about the shared agreement with SIUV.

It's an assembly.

But you wouldn't be a party to the actual shared agreement. The city would be

The city wouldn't know, but we would be We would just have

to confirm that it exists.

Yeah. Confirm that it exists. And then my question would be if it's a CUP and then it sells or the church changes, then and the new owner says, I don't want a part of this.

They have to find another location. And if they can't, then it then it gets messy.

Right. That's my concern to

the sheriff. Yeah. It's not forever.

No. It's not forever. So There's yep. And then it's it's a legal

matter. Right. And at that point, the city has what's our recourse on the CUP that's in violation?

Again, that's a legal matter, and I'm sure it would be it would be

thought out. That's kind of where I'm at with the I think we've said to think about

the likelihood that happening. You with benefits one thing

I wouldn't do better after

the church. Benefits one thing because, yeah, that that business could that building could change hands. The church is way over parked and Oh my gosh. It's like it's for me at church for I don't think probably as long as you're placed worthy in a restaurant.

So don't see it being so I I agree with

you that it's church for the church, but

I see it more from a liability standpoint at that at that juncture. Like, at some point, pastor could change who says, hey. I got people that are leaving there coming into my parking lot that are can potentially do damage or get hurt or something else and saying it's not worth the liability for us. Yeah. That's more likely to happen than anything.

Then it could sell. And Well, yeah. I think that that I agree with. Yeah.

But I think this is such a unique situation in Korea. There's has to be flexible. I mean, people I mean, there's a lot of

I I probably have you we live where we live. We have a bird's eye view of the restaurant, and we've been there since 1988. And there have been Fountain, American Grill, Molinos. Never had any problems. They had a patio. They had several tables with umbrellas. When the Almarys moved in, we were thrilled that you were doing so well. And when you purchased the the place, you knew what it was. Right? Or were you planning on expanding?

We were

planning Okay.

So that's number one. It's a legal nonconformant use. Correct? Correct. So you knew what you bought.

When COVID hit, we were pleased that you could make it. What is different is they got a liquor a liquor license, which was different than the other restaurants. So we didn't have all the lingering people at the previous, restaurants. Now we do, and it's not pleasant. If I can go back, there's actually five of these long tables with 10 stools in each and that doesn't include the bar and it doesn't include a smaller table over on the side.

So that's 60 plus seats right now. When the initial planning committee approved, I'm gonna quote from here. It was questioned what the state of Ohio Liquor Control Commission requires for barriers that will separate the patio from other areas which are not permitted to have liquor. And at that time, in fact, I brought it up to, the law director. Nothing had been done.

And the same thing with the, barrier from parking. And I believe in your notes, you were saying how that was gonna take care of something that was five years in the making.

I'm I'm not I'm not understanding. Are you asking me something?

No. I'm just actually, I'm just yeah.

The fence serves as a barrier, and that is compliant with Ohio River laws.

That fence is not on the on the parking side.

It is. I mean, enough of it is that that we are compliant. I promise you.

Okay. You just mentioned that in your notes that you were gonna be in compliance.

Well, because part of the thing with the fire department was they wanted so that would also serve as the same barrier. That that's what I meant in the notes.

That's what it looked like. That's what we're looking for. Okay.

That's what

yes. What was covered

in 2019.

And we have an inspector that comes.

I'm I'm sure you do. But since

And it's just and, you know, not to not to shut you down, but this board can't I understand. Something that the state regulates.

No. I know that.

I'm just stating what was written in the initial, And then now it's just coming to fruition. Okay. That, you know, that there was something that was gonna be done, but it never was done at the time. Okay. That's all.

The other thing is, you know, since, you know, we've added a cooler, I mean, for a nonconforming building, which you knew when you bought the place, you've added several things that are not that weren't, you know, compliant with the building. The HVAC system, I don't know any other patio in Westlake that has an HVAC system. And then in from the original planning, you said you would take the sides up and they would be stored in the attic. I've never seen those sides. All they do is roll up, and the roof never gets rolled back more than two feet.

So I think our concern with the noise, number one, and the parking, is just a symptom of, you know, you're wanting to expand in our neighborhood that is not pleasant for us. And, you know, we've we've been through this for five years, and, you know, we were told to come to the, the meetings for the ordinance. And so you can you're allowed to be open till 01:00 and 12:00 if you wanna be because they didn't wanna change that in the ordinance when a restaurant is 30 feet from a home. But we're not open till then. But it can be.

But we chose to change that

Well because of saying, know, on Saint Patrick's evening, there were little shenanigans going on, and it was midnight. So

But we were closed, and our people clocked out by that in thirty. That's fine. I mean, I don't want

my back and forth. No.

I don't either.

I'm just saying that it's you know, we lived there for all these years and never had these issues. And this is why we're fighting so hard to let you people know that, you know, this is this is not what was grandfathered, which is what we've been told. You know? And you're in a in a building that's legally nonconforming, but we keep wanting to add on. I don't understand how that can be so simple to understand. It's it's a sports bar on a patio.

Would you have problems if they closed it? What would you think if they closed it?

I think we would still have problems. And how are they gonna close it? What are they gonna do to close it? Are they gonna have, I mean, garage doors that open up to the parking lot?

Barry said no. I meant to go. That was

I mean, that's I'll tell you. They took down the one tree that hit my upstairs bedroom window. So, you know, we have a a full view of everything that goes on over there.

Can I say something to that? You and I spoke, and I asked you what we could do better than the neighbors before us. And you told us that those trees leaned into your neighborhood. I would have never or into your yard, and I would have never taken that one.

You're talking about. Okay. There's there's

a huge evergreen. I don't know what

But and we often to have all I wanted to do was cut them on side off so that the berries wouldn't be on our side, which is would have been fine.

I didn't realize.

But, no, it was the evergreen, the huge evergreen that I think you took out for your parking, which is fine. But that's why we can see everything that goes on, and we hear everything that goes on. But we didn't have the problem prior. So I don't I don't know what the answer is either. Okay. You know? And like I said, I we were thrilled when they moved in. You know? But then everything just expanded into which I don't understand. If it's a nonconforming legally nonconforming building, how can it keep growing?

I mean, if if this was on another corner, I mean, like, down by the the oyster bar, Can you build that in and make that a sports bar?

So we look at it

from an enclosure standpoint. I know you you're not sure, but, like, what would you like to see as as I'd

like to see it go back to four tables, round tables with umbrellas. Yeah. Because what it is now is a whole different clientele. It's not a bad clientele. It's just a different clientele. You know, with the umbrellas, you have families that come and

they eat and they leave.

And a sports bar is different than a patio with correct? I mean Mhmm. Is that am I right? So I I don't I don't know what else to say.

So the biggest issues coming out of it, would you say, are parking and noise?

Just parking and noise. Yes. Okay.

Any other concerns as a as a neighbor?

I don't know. Yeah. I think those are the biggest, you know, the noise, the commotion. The kids still come over and play on the grassy area. You know, they were there Father's Day, which I'm not I'm not opposed to kids. I love kids. But when you're 30 feet and you're entertaining, you know, I mean, that's the whole thing. We're so close. I know a lot of the neighbors down the street, they don't come to the meetings because they're not totally experiencing what we get to experience. You know?

So, you know, maybe we are you know, and I know there are people that are concerned. The gentleman across the street complains because when they throw all the bottles in the dumpster, you know, you hear all the clam, clam, clam. I mean, I don't know what the answer is either. All I know is when they purchased it, they knew what they were purchasing. And if they wanted to expand, they should have looked for something that wasn't a nonlegal, you know, legal nonconforming use, I guess. Sorry.

Whatever this ends up to be, however this is going to be, if it's not a total enclosed area, it can't be keep on going as a 60 seated patio, and that's what they have now. You you saw the picture? There's five of those

tables. Yeah.

And that breaks every fire cold that I know. I don't understand how this can exist without somebody

And there are the other way or what? There are ten ten seats per table.

Yes. There there there's stools. Stools. Right?

Could could you go out and That's

all I wanna say.

If if you'd be willing to have mister Fidel come out and count the seats and just get a I mean, I guess

I'd like to see what

I don't know what the

plan is. Is that possible to do that? Or Yeah. You know, just so we know a a accurate number? Yeah. Sure.

Anyone else from the audience?

That's fine.

Good. Part of it it's Mike. Part of it is they could leave it the way it is right now, and the neighbors would have the problem continuing forward. But kind of taking a couple of the ideas and combining them might be a possible solution with wrapping some of the seats around the front of the bar, leaving it open so that way it keeps the patio feel, shrinking the backside of what's the rib that's there now can enclosing the two sides on it So that way, it buffers the neighbors from the sounds that's actually happening inside. And then with the parking issue, and I don't know if this is even a possibility in Westlake, I know a lot of people don't care about it, a 10 or a $25 ticket every once in a while.

Raise it up to a $100,150. That way, it gives them something to think about, and they'll post the signs there. It's like you don't wanna park there because if you're parked there, it's gonna cost you a lot more than the $100 you're spending at the restaurant.

Okay. But then if you do that, somebody has to be there to ticket them. So somebody has to call. So that's an issue too. And I've seen people Naomi, go back. And I've seen people park on grass too. Levy, what did say last name was?

L e b u c k. Thank you.

What are your hours by

the way? Monday through sports bar. I mean, I I I know you're saying it functions like a sports bar. Closing at ten is not to me, that's a restaurant.

Just come when when they have

the Indians games or the football games and you get all the way up. That's a sports bar. They have a TV. They have They

have a have Well, that's why that's why I think and closing it. I mean, in a perfect world, I think in closing it might be the best.

I would agree.

Think Because I think you're gonna shrink the seats down, and you're gonna make people sit in the seats.

They're not

gonna be at the bar yelling. Right? I don't know. I've never been there before. Watch this grow. Sleep at eight. We've watched this grow.

I know. And so that's where we I have to tag And so I don't know what to tell you. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think we're

as as a commission, we're

in this meeting to try and alleviate the two, as I asked

you before, two major issues, which are

the parking And in our opinion, enclosure would help us with the noise situation.

Mhmm.

Obviously, you've heard this whole meeting. We struggle with this parking Yeah. Issue, Crystal. And Sure. How can we how can we affect that? And, you

know, at

sixty, hundred so it really boils down there's a 100 seats. Yeah.

You need 50 parking spaces, and there's no way Yeah. Building parking.

Right. You're gonna need you're gonna need a shared arrangement. Even if you have a lot, you'll need a shared arrangement.

Right. Yeah. Yeah. And most you can get maybe 10 more.

Right. Right.

So the options so that brings us to reducing the seats. Right?

However, what if if this if this was to be an addition, then it would have to have, you know, your ADA restroom, which is gonna be a chunk out of it, so you're not gonna get as many Yeah.

You're not gonna get 60 seats in an

additional outside. Yeah. But

even so if we're saying 60 inside, so we're saying in the in the addition of 60.

Forty and forty. Well, it's sixty and sixty.

What there's what the residents

are saying is they've counted 60 seats on the patio right now, which I have no reason to doubt that that's true. Plus four. But what we're saying is if you if you enclose it and actually lay it out the way you have to have this, you would know, like, you know, you're gonna have to look at clearance between tables, you know, accessibility. You're gonna have to add an accessible restroom. You know, you're not gonna get sick. Sick. You're not gonna have

60 seats in

that national field.

You'll take a lot a large chunk by being compliant. Right. I mean, this is which we've known.

So at

least so you will have your tint.

Or heating and cooling. Where would that go?

Sonoco? Sonoco. You know, it should have a side on it, not just be you know?

Right. If they use Sonoco as their guide, I think that that would, like, potentially address that. But the

whole, you know, the whole bag so so besides let's let's say we do go down this path. There's still I think there still needs to be between between your business and this and the the the residence. There needs to be some attractiveness addressed.

Mhmm. Yes.

So that they're looking at a nice back of a building that what right now, I mean, go to the let's go to the picture. Oh, let's see. It's

and the and then that kind of where the Arborvitae are. I don't know how long that was there, but, you know, they long enough to get a picture.

Yeah. We've had and I'm Max Novak,

by the way. We're both Yeah.

We I've had conversations with all our distributors and everything. We've gotten the kegs and everything taken out. They went on this weird run where they just would not pick them up. I had conversations with all my

drivers to make sure that all

of them are getting picked up.

So that's that issue's been handled. And I personally cleared out anything that was back there in that area. Took it all either upstairs or anywhere where it is hidden from a neighbor's view. And that's not a quite realistic picture of what that area looks like right now

because we planted some trees and

everything like that. So

What what's on the roof and the backside?

Building would help. I like that. Yeah. More of a seating, the less or maybe then we have a bar, another bar you put on the other side.

I think a lot of it just depends on where the ingress egress is for the building. You know? I mean, I I don't know that the layout of it or where it goes necessarily matters. I think it's more about where do people come and go. Like, that that's really the more important thing. You could rather like that and suddenly we're gonna go in the back, and it's gonna be just as bad as

it is now.

And you know

they're still gonna be going to the parking lot as part of

it too. But Of course. Yeah.

Ultimately, yeah. Whoever's parking in the spot closest to, you know, the house to the north, that person's loud, that person's loud. And then you're

not able to figure out that. But that's the biggest issue. But that buffering would help.

But it's sustainable buffering.

I agree. I that I think you're adding more buffering will

help. I gonna think

I think the now, this hail Mary is higher than Yeah.

This is lower. Right?

The house is at lower. Yeah.

Can I ask some what kind

of buffering are we talking about?

That's a great question.

You've been to the planning commission meetings where we talked

to other

new builds and how strict we are about how close the tree should be and how, you know, not just be trees. Yeah.

So mounding trees Yeah. Fencing, solids. A lot more

See the the plants on that

on there.

Ardenvites. Ardenvites. Okay. There

There are more there now.

There's a little bit more there, but Doesn't really It doesn't do

a thing. Thing with sound.

That's in our defense. But

Mhmm.

If this somehow happens, they somebody has to really think about how to cut the noise however it can be done. And I

think that's why we do typically use a nerve ravages as a quick run, fast growing.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's why we

got it. Solid year round. Creates an We'll

be done before you guys

visual versus

on the patio than it has

a problem. That's why guy here.

And that goes right through. Yeah. And he looked at the side there, the north side. The noise That's

where we're at with.

And that's that was kind of our feeling from what you're saying is it sounds like the noise issue is not coming from peep necessarily. I mean, yeah, you may for a few minutes hear people coming and going, but the ongoing long noise is coming from the back.

At night, you hear people sometimes. Like, you know, it's a bus. Yeah. They'll come and go. That's not a big deal. Even the parking we myself and my wife did not

say, oh, we didn't We didn't object to

people parking. Just as long as they did it. Right.

Or didn't park on our

It was a long other neighbors. The neighbors down the street. Yeah. So So, I mean, that's excess too.

Yeah. Okay.

And your street is narrow.

So there's It's a narrow street.

Yeah. And and there's many times when they were parking, if they were parking on half of the tree lawn, they were parking Full on the tree lawn. On the floor. Yeah. But on the street itself too, which is

I was like I was like, Moosehead has the same

scenario. Right.

Yeah. Yeah. They're in the same predicament.

Right. Yeah. So As we

go across the street. Right.

Now everybody's I've noticed because when we've always came in, people started parking at Siskis and those other spots. And but, you know, that's a that's a very narrow one way. You know, it's really, you can get one car by it, as soon as people start parking on it. So but if the parking so I think that's where we're kinda out. If the parking lot isn't as big an issue, the enclosure of that patio will reduce that. Okay.

And it's concepting vessel. Yeah. And the amount of people that are allowed on.

Well, and again Well, that shrinks down when we close.

That's gonna happen as a matter, of course. You you close the patio. There's gonna be fewer seats. Yes.

There's Well, if they stay keep it a patio.

Well, when I say look. Let me rephrase. If you take what's the currently being proposed as a patio patio enclosure or turned into a building addition, you're gonna have fewer seats. It has to. Yes.

So will it be will it be a permanent addition, or will it be a patio that's enclosed?

Our our opinion would be it would be a permanent addition. I I think

that's what we discussed. Legally, I don't think we can do what they're we cannot

Right. I think that's the whole point of this discussion. Like, they they were looking to do a Patio. Patio that can be enclosed. Didn't we we're just not seeing a path forward legally for that to occur. So

yeah. It's not the owner's fault at all, but the where our fence is and that that land right there, that's where, you know, the kids come out and play. And, you know, that's not a bad problem, but they jump off the the fences, and we're out there. I have a rock thrown over Oh. The the fence. Luckily, it wasn't on there. It was in the on the on the fence or sitting on my deck about five minutes earlier than that. So luckily, it was and then we've had other issues. And I can't understand anybody going into a bar and let their kids play in

The parking lot.

The parking I just don't understand that. I don't know. And I don't know how they can regulate it. It's just Yeah.

So we keep talking about it, or what's the next step?

I think we need to Yeah. Hear from the owners. Yeah. It's obviously different than just roof structure and some half walls and some beautification. It's actually it'd be a full blown addition. And then the other thing too, planning commission, as you know, they're recommending body. This would take changing the code. Council would have to agree to it. So, really, you know, it's important what they they think, obviously, but the council had the final say. But but there's really no point in them going down this road if there's if if you're never gonna do an addition. If that's something that that's never gonna happen in in the first place, then there's no point in going through the effort of changing the code to allow one.

Doing the addition is just it's it's just math. You know? For for our relationship. You know, I would love to do it, but it's gotta work financially that makes sense. And so that's that's that part of it Mhmm. For my involvement. Knowing the building a little bit, it's gonna go where that patio is. It's not gonna go. It won't work the way that's laid out in there in the back half of that building, how it's raised. Just I think it's gonna be real difficult to try to do something any place with that footprint. Enclosing is gonna take care of the noise. Mhmm.

And, hopefully, the kid's running around. Consideration that we would have liked to have done from the get go. That was originally why we came to the planning commissioner in the first place. Now it does become a matter of of math and can the restaurant support whatever that addition would be. But there's there's no earth where the answer to that would be a straight out no. We would not consider that. Of course, we would consider

So I do think, though, you need to keep in mind if you do when you if you do enclose, you still have apartment situations. Yes. Need to be formalized with someone. And and that

I'm not I I I feel pretty confident.

Okay. And that's fine.

Just I mean, I think I can.

Can't. I hate I hate the back of

the bathroom enclosure when we're you're gonna come back and just hear me about parking problems.

Right. As long as everyone's aware of that.

But so you don't count the the delivery area slash I mean, we said the employees park over at the church. So the the delivery area, you don't count those spaces. I there's a reason that I don't know whether they're counted or not.

I they're not striped, and I I just they're

striped They're striped now?

Yeah. I So Yeah. They can be they can issue it.

Counted as part

of the thing. But I I will just say that would it also and that's why I want I guess, I'd like a confirmation as to how many seats are there right now. But we know it. We know if we know how many seats there are and we know how it's functioning, that should help us also make some decisions because the other thing may be maybe it's too there's too many seats even so with an addition, we might have to say,

you know, the number

of seats have to be at x.

To mean parking

or the shared parking? To mean parking plus their you know? Because we still have to have some you know, you can't have a parking lot this big, and you have the the shared parking area. Can be I don't

think right about that. But yeah.

And there's some people who can't walk. I mean, they can't walk that distance. So that's another issue. Right. Right. Alright. So you'll get back to us with numbers or if you can numbers are you'll figure out if it's gonna work and then have them all

table. It'll be able to be table.

So this is now it's it's tabled. It's tabled until the next meeting, which is July 7. Okay. And so I guess if everyone agrees so I it sounds like you wanna do your do your homework. Right? We're gonna figure out if this is something that's possible for you before they make a decision. So right now, as you can see, if they have to make a decision on July 7, it's it's gonna be just based on the structure and not on these other these other options for it. So if that's if you're if you agree to that, you're okay with that, then we'll just have them table this at the July 7 meeting. Yes. And then they'll table it till maybe August 4,

I think? Fourth?

I don't know. They'll tell you.

If you want if you need more time, they they will they'll table it to whatever meeting you wanna push it forward.

Yeah. August 4 would be the meeting I would try.

So do you September, do you think that would give you enough time to to

That would be a September 8 meeting.

November 8 or really, whatever works for you.

Whatever works for you. It's it's

the new one. Probably the earliest. Okay.

Why don't we just table the September? September? Okay. Okay. So table is through September. Okay. Do they need an extension?

So at the next planning commission meeting, I'll make note of table of two separate Correct.

September. We can do that.

And then it's there won't I don't think there will be need for another work session just at the September meeting. I guess we'll communicate beforehand and get a feel for, you know, your thoughts on on on whether or not to do an addition. And then I'll of course, I have the draft that I language presented tonight. I can run that for a long part and see if there's anything else that needs to be addressed with it and if there's anything.

So so my suggestion might be, though, just like we've done some of these preliminary plans and then a more developed plan, I would suggest you keep it at a very schematic of of concept to start. So we can Without drawings. Well Well, some of it. Yeah. A little for us

to look at, like, showing your handicapped restrooms and how you're gonna get into the building

and size of

actual size of the patio planned it out. Or the addition, excuse me, planned around with the quantity of parking maybe now.

But not not in other words, don't bring a full blown set of drawings in.

Yeah. That's necessary. Ready to do a building. Yeah. And I don't think

we're ready for because Yeah. I think so while we're talking about, I think there's a you know, somewhat of a consensus, but I I'll just tell you, I'm still a little on the fence with this whole addition and park making parking, make sure it works, making sure the residents are concerns are addressed. I'm trying to find that Valid. So I'm not sure where they're at, but at least this is a but let's take a step in that direction.