Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

opportunity to answer um ask and answer questions so you can assess the ideas and share your input. Um I'll note that this meeting content uh all the slides presentation is the exact same as the earlier meeting we had on April 8th. Um though whatever questions come up in our meeting may be different from what was discussed um on the 8th. You're welcome to use the Q&A feature. uh it should be at the bottom of your screen to enter questions at any time during the presentation. I will be moderating questions for the team to answer at the end of the presentation. We should have more than enough time, but for efficiency, I will try to group similar questions by topic. Um so they may go slightly out of order. Um, we will also be putting links to our project page which contains the materials in this presentation as well as links to our public meetings um and a comment form in the Q&A. So, watch for that um in the beginning of the meeting and then at the end. And then a reminder that we are accepting public comments um through the end of April. So, that's April 30th. And um again, we will put a link to where you can submit those comments on our website. um in the Q&A. And um with that, I am very excited to turn it over to our consultant team.

Thanks, Karen. Hi, everyone. Um I'm Scott Archer. I'm a principal at David Ruben Lang Collective and also joined by our founding principal, David Rubin. Um and we are leading the design team um in this effort alongside um NCPC and um the the partners that Beth mentioned. Um, thank you for joining us and if you attended the webinar on April 8th, as Karen mentioned, um, you're completely welcome to participate with us today, but I will note that the content is the same as, um, that previous meeting for this presentation. Um, we also have an in-person exhibition at the National Building Museum City Action Hall through April 30th where you can engage with the contact uh content more directly and uh you are welcome to use this comment form on the QR code here on screen or a link that will be shared in the Q&A box. We will reference this form a few times throughout the presentation so um you can follow along with us if you wish. Um these are our project partners as Beth mentioned and we are uh part of a consultant team that we're working with buyer blendervel VHB and many others um to really bring this uh to fruition and we're working alongside another team that's focused on implementation um led by HRNA advisors. Um this effort is composed of two parts the public space plan and the implementation program. Today's meeting is focused on the public space component of the new Pennsylvania Avenue plan um and really focused on the uh the design side of of this effort. Um you may have participated in previous engagement processes for this planning initiative or the prior vision concepts in 2022. Thank you. All of those comments have been part of this robust dialogue um to get us here today. Um, this portion of Pennsylvania Avenue between the White House and the US

capital was designed to be the physical and symbolic spine of a new republic. A people's prominade connecting two branches of government. As a primary thoroughfare in the new capital city, it drew activity to the center of the city. Over time, it became a ceremonial stage and iconic setting for presidential inaugurations, national celebrations, first amendment activities, and local events. The avenue and the capital itself have changed through many design iterations, including unrealized visions over centuries. We we're excited to envision the next generation of the avenue that can respect these histories and set a stage for future histories for all of us to enjoy. Um, the Avenue and its immediate area are a national historic site home to many historically significant buildings, statues, memorials, parks, and landscapes. These elements are integral to the success of the Avenue, and the partners are working to allow them to continue to be relevant for us all today and into the future. From the 70s through the9s, the avenue had a single steward, the Pennsylvania Avenue Development Corporation, or PADC, as you might see referenced in future slides. Is dissolution in 1996 caused management and funding issues that the new plan needs to address. While not the focus of today, the project team is working with partner leadership to identify an efficient management structure as these design concepts continue to to develop. And sorry, slight delay. Oh, here we go. Um, the project area is shown in the solid red outline focusing on the corridor, a 1.2 mile segment of Pennsylvania Avenue between 15th Street

Northwest and the US Capital grounds at Third Street Northwest. the 40 acres of adjacent public space and major north south connections between the National Mall and downtown. In so many ways, capital cities are recognized by grand ceremonial spaces that represent their nations. The new Pennsylvania Avenue will stand among the great on the same global stage as great capital city boulevards such as those seen here in London, Paris, and Berlin. At the same time, the Avenue will be a joyful and engaging public space for downtown Washingtonians with amenities and activities that serve visitors, residents, and workers alike. Therefore, a new plan will revitalize the avenue as the nation's most prominent civic boulevard. With its framed view of the capital, neocclassical architecture at Federal Triangle, and its location in the monumental core, the Avenue is an iconic outdoor venue for spectacular events in everyday life. This vision will also deliver a beautiful and revitalized street that the city and the nation can be proud of. There are numerous physical issues the avenue is facing today, including flooding, broken pavers, dying trees, and an aging modernist design. And underground and underground is a complex mess of belowgrade utilities and aging infrastructure, some dating back to the 1870s. that will these will also need a comprehensive modernization as well. Another consideration is alleviating the overt taxed National Mall. The avenue will continue to host all kinds of events including its role as a significant site for first amendment expression. In addition, our national symbolic events for c celebration and democracy such as the inaugural parade every four years must be accommodated together with other celebrations, festivals, and concerts. These events are all different, but there are some standard

elements that begin to define the physical design of the corridor. operational and security challenges, safety considerations such as clear fire lanes, typical vendor sizing, and hopefully less reliance on temporary event infrastructure. We're continuing to continuing to coordinate with the military district of Washington and the mayor special event task group to find the best solutions for this space. The design concepts are tested as they evolve to ensure that they can support and ideally improve these critical event needs. and we'll talk more about those coming up. There's a shared vision for the public space plan. One that creates a grand avenue that is human- centered and lasting, a civic venue for first amendment activities and collective expression, simplified regulatory and management policies, modernized aging infrastructure, and the amplification of layered histories while making way for new stories, memories, and events. We want everyone to be included in our engagement opportunities both here today and in person at the National Building Museum. We want to hear from you. If you uh what do these groups of people need on the avenue? If you fit into a category or two, great. Uh but also consider what others may need. You can scan the QR code um that takes you to that same comment form that we shared at the beginning of the webinar um to leave feedback on this question and others coming up in the presentation. You can also engage with these questions directly in person at the National Building Museum. We've already mentioned some of these, but the avenue must achieve these baseline requirements. It should be welcoming and available to all Americans and visitors. Should prioritize views to the US capital. should support multimodal transportation, host events of all scales, including the inaugural parade, and integrate north south connections between the National Mall

and downtown, to complement, not compete, with downtown DC. The new plan lays the foundation to design and implement these aspirations, addressing the corridor, these three main and these three main public space areas. Pennsylvania Avenue is where Americans unite, where we convene to act, live, and gather. Now um the current design concepts as part of the process we are facilitating the NEPA and section 106 requirements. The National Envir Environmental Policy Act or NEPA is a decision-making process for federal agencies to analyze the potential environmental impacts and engage with you. Section 106 of the National Historic Preservation Act provides a formal review of any potential disturbances to historic or eligible properties. This process is also underway. You're invited to comment on the NEPA scoping process with the QR code comment form on NCPC's website or in person at the National Building Museum through April 30th. The project purpose is to evaluate and be is to elevate and beautify Pennsylvania Avenue as an iconic corridor and an attractive gathering space for residents, visitors, and workers by upgrading the infrastructure and streetscape, enhancing the civic stage, and streamlining governance. The primary envir environmental impact topics include vegetation and trees, visitor use and experience, noise, cultural resources, and traffic and transportation. Let us know if you see any major missing categories as well. On the following slides, we'll describe these in more detail. You'll hear both words alternative and option in our language. You can think of an alternative as a big design move and an option as a detailed way to articulate that alternative. The corridor between 3rd and 13th Street

is the primary uninterrupted section of streetscape. We have two alternatives and two design options which are primarily focused on the trees. We'll look at both tree options in more detail on the following slides, but both are built on the same basic corridor framework. If you know the avenue today, you'll see the bicycle lanes are moved from the center to the south on a protected area that improves safety and provides additional security setback for federal buildings. The eight lanes of street for traffic which were defined when this avenue was a primary primary thoroughare decades ago are reallocated for modern needs. You'll see five lanes of travel plus two curbside use areas for pickup and drop off or pudo pudo as you as shown here in orange. This allows the modern street needs of ride share, deliveries, and loading to happen outside of the active travel lanes without holding up the lanes designated for moving traffic as is common today. The main difference between these options are the trees. One is a staggered grid of canopy trees and another is a double LA of columnar or figit trees. We'll discuss both here in more detail. First, the canopy grid alignment. This frames US capital view similarly to the trees that exist there today, providing shade in a large central zone for multimodal transportation and events. While the larger trees along the curb provide more shade nearest the cartway, they may partially limit the long views down the avenue for pedestrians and cyclists. Here is the view of the canopy trees option from the vehicular roadway. This would be the view primary p pedestrian view experience on the north side

and this view is the primary cyclist experience on the south side. The second tree alignment option has two rows of columnar or al or an allay on each side of the roadway. This is a more formal expression of the landscape that might may provide a more dramatic difference to other avenues throughout the district. These frame views each views from each experience separately. The vehicular experience, the primary pedestrian experience, and the cyclist experience. Although these provide a little less shade along the curb to facilitate that long view, additional canopy trees will be provided beyond these alleys to the north and south closer to the buildings. This option may impact event spaces differently as well. This is the view of the columnar or figit trees from the veh vehicular experience from the primary pedestrian experience on the north and from the primary cyclist experience on a new protect protected cycle track on the south. We are also considering an alternative with symbolic and functional poles flanking each side of the avenue. These could work in conjunction with either tree option. The poles would provide a monumental expression of this portion of the avenue between the legislative branch of government at the capital and the executive branch at the White House. These could host lighting and flags as seen here, but may also host temporary infrastructure for events such as speakers and screens or even shading devices. These poles are not intended for utilities such as telecom uh because of thetic requirements that these would demand. However, our team is considering other solutions for these important infrastructural requirements.

A similar condition is seen in London where the flags can be installed amongst the trees for events and festivities. This is the view of those poles with the canopy tree option. And this is the view of the poles with the columnar or figit tree option. It's worth noting that there are several poles already existing on the avenue at various scales. The poles you've seen in the concept imagery today are shown at approximately 60 ft tall, but if this alternative moves forward, additional heights or variations could be considered. Now to the public spaces, the western end is the public space between 13th Street and 15th Street and includes the National World War I Memorial at Persing Park and Freedom Plaza. We do not expect changes for the memorial. However, the spaces around it are likely to be adapted. Freedom Plaza is expected to change and we have multiple alternatives and options to consider. It's worth remembering that the legacy of this particular urban space and it has ex existed in many iterations and several concepts have been considered. Um, moving forward, the postmodern Freedom Plaza was never fully realized to its design intent and has several issues, including the plaza's elevation, lack of lack of shade and amenities, and poor relationship to surrounding buildings. Two alternatives are under consideration for the Western End. One restores the historic alignment of the roadway diagonally from 13th Street to 15th Street as one as seen here on the left. This bisects what is today Freedom Plaza and creates two triangular plazas that could be more connected with the adjacent buildings. The second alternative keeps a central plaza but

brings it down to grade to match the elevation of the surrounding streets. Traffic circulation would be similar to what exists today. However, the inaugural parade could move through the through this plaza diagonally to 15th Street as indicated in the orange line on the right-h hand drawing. For the first alternative with the restored historic alignment of the roadway, there are two options. This PL the planted respit option um here on the left amplifies horiculture on both triangular plazas to provide significantly more shade connected to the Wilson building which is the seat of the district government on the south and the national theater on the north while still allowing a central space in each plaza and the roadway itself as a place for larger events. Primary traffic circulation would move diagonally on the new roadway while secondary vehicular traffic and cyclists could move on a more pedestrian-friendly streets to the north and south. The second option on the right shows triangular plaz what we're calling the triangular plazas option which focuses on uh large open areas on each triangle that can be used separately or combined with the temporary closure of this portion of the avenue for occasional events. This explores removing the southern roadway in front of the Wilson building for more direct access to the plaza while maintaining more pedestrian friendly streets to the north. For the second alternative, we have two more options. The first shows a framed plaza option which creates a framed a frame of shade trees surrounding an atgrade plaza. As previously noted, the inaugural parade can move diagonally across the plaza as shown with the orange line, but primary traffic circulation would be retained on the north and south, much as it is today. The second option on the right shows a large plaza that connects fully with the

buildings to the north and south. Eastbound traffic would transit to the south and westbound to the north of this large central space. The inaugural parade could move diagonally through along its historic alignment. And this option shows the possibility of a large atgrade water feature that could be turned off for events to make the large open plaza free and clear and the possibility of of a pavilion for seating and amenities near the plaza at 13th Street. Um, there's one alternative at Market Square or what we call the crossroads. This area is already some of the most active public space on the avenue with access to Metro just a block from the museums and the National Mall and a gateway to downtown along the commercial spine on 7th Street. Historically, this location was the site of a central market for the city and still has some of the few remaining uh Victorian era buildings. It also has the National Archives to the south, the US Navy Memorial, and several other monuments and statues nearby. Additionally, the last remaining piece of Indiana Avenue is present here with a connection up to Judiciary Square. Both options for this space aim to create a more unified public space amongst the these various elements. The first one on the left focuses on the Lanvontian crossroads highlighted by Indiana with an allay of trees, considering the 8th Street Vista up to the National Portrait Gallery and creating a new visible gateway to Seventh Street, connecting 35 million visitors at the National Mall each year to downtown. The second option is called the neighborhood garden rooms, which creates a series of smaller landscaped environments, which may be focused on more local amenities such as play

spaces, dog parks, or other park-like spaces. Both options include a potential for a covered commercial space or galleria at Indiana Plaza, as well as concepts for new art locations that may change on a predetermined schedule, so the space is continually refreshed. Finally, at the eastern end is a public space nearest the US capital at 4th Street and John Marshall Park. This area is physically closest to the National Mall and adjacent to the National Gallery of Art. The views north of Fourth Street and the Avenue uh from Fourth Street and from the Avenue are very important focused toward the historic DC courthouse or old city hall and with the pediment of the pinion building which is today the National Building Museum. beyond. Today, some of the avenues largest events already occur already occur in this location. Despite its size, John Marshall Park is highly underutilized and has minimal visibility with it with its elevation changes that impact free access. The park is surrounded by a high concentration of daytime use uses such as courouses, law enforcement, and embassy buildings that don't generally enliven the space. and many of them have robust layers of security requirements. There are three options for this space. The raed lawn option on the left removes steps and walls to create a single sloped surface which can be more accessible and easier for events. Planted edges provide buffers from the adjacent buildings but also create lovely park spaces for daily use. The center hillside pavilion option creates an at level a level at grade space just north of the avenue which could be extremely useful for events. This provides step seating along the edges and embedded pavilion um for amenities just south of sea street. The terrace spaces option is an upgraded version of

what is there today. It would change some of the elements to achieve full accessibility and begin to insert more park-like programming such as potential for a splash pad or water feature or a small kiosk or pavilion. All options expand the area nearest Third Street to accommodate larger stages and will consider integrated event utility infrastructure to rely less on temporary um elements. To wrap up, our final question on the comment form or in person at the National Building Museum is, "What do you want to experience most on the Avenue?" We want to make sure you are included in the future that we're planning together. Finally, our schedule for this process is focused on a series of engagement events during April, which uh the official public comment period is March 31st through April 30th um of this year ending next week. We will have more commission reviews throughout the year and expect to have an approved plan in early 2027. We will now open for questions that were subst that were submitted in the Q&A tool and please continue to submit those. As those come in, I'll remind you uh one more time that all of this material is available in person at the National Building Museum City Action Hall in the second floor coming together gallery that will remain up through April 30th. Thank you. And I'll introduce some of my colleagues who are available with me to answer questions. Um we have leadwire from VHB and is one of our NEPA specialists Katie Hmel our historian um from buyer blender bell who focuses on section 106 process. You already met my colleague David Rubin and the NCPC team with Beth Miller and Karen Sherhold and we also have their colleague Jeff Jamawat who is leading the implementation program portion of this project. So I will pass it back to

Karen to begin the Q&A.

Great. Thank you so much Scott. Um so we did have some questions come in um during the registration process and I will try to hit those first. Um I think first let's talk about overall timeline impacts to the neighborhood. Um so especially those who are residents in the area, how may they be impacted by the project? Um, also are there plans to contact um residences in the neighborhood and um what can the the neighbors expect moving forward? And so I'll I'll take a first pass and then hand it to you Scott. But do want to say that we we've been working with representatives from both the commercial and residential properties along the avenue. Um the extent of the avenue really to understand their operational needs, critical access points, um things like that. We have been hearing throughout the public engagement process um concerns about noise especially related to events um and neighborhood disc disruptions and access. and the design team is very much taking that into consideration. Um, so Scott, if you could talk a little bit about our approach to understanding neighborhood impacts and then also hit on kind of what the the overall timeline is and how far we may be from actual construction.

Sure. Um, I'll start with the first piece. Uh we've already heard from a lot of our um neighboring residents in the project area and we're excited to continue to hear from them. Um some of the things that as Karen mentioned that are coming forward especially from other residents are noise concerns um how events really impact the public space and access to buildings. Um and we know that that's been a challenge for many years and we've we've heard that. Um so we're working we have as I mentioned at the very beginning we have a pretty expansive team of consultants that are really experts um national experts in these areas. So, first of all, we have an events um production expert that will help us think through how we can build in that infrastructure and those um processes for the ultimate design um that hopefully uh not only uh solve some of the challenges that are expect or um felt today in terms of access but make them better um in terms of security and access and all all of those kinds of things. Um from an acoustic point of view, we have an acoustician um as part of our team that is thinking a lot about how events acoustics really impact um the avenue. Um, something that we're talking a lot about is today because uh, a lot of the events infrastructure is brought in in a temporary way um, and there's no built-in um, infrastructure that that means often there are very large um, speakers and sound equipment in one location or maybe a couple locations that are blasting sound as far as it can. um where we're thinking a lot about the newer technology um that can have smaller sets of speakers that are timecoordinated um to have a more focused um output so that everybody's part of the process um and part of the event um that wants to be and those along the sides are not getting um as much of the spillover. Um I don't know if I miss missed anything

there but others feel free to chime in. In terms of the construction um piece, we are focused on a plan. Um so eventually the end results of this project is an approved plan that will update the 1974 plan um and really provide guidance for the long-term upgrades of the of the project. Um implementation is still a little bit unknown, although we'll be ready for implementation as soon as the plan is complete. um when it actually happens uh will be based on funding and other political priorities um across the the federal government and the local partners.

Great. Thank you, Scott. Um on the event note, let's uh talk about how this plan uh may impact the use of Freedom Plaza for special events. This is another question we got through the registration process. Um, for example, how may it impact uh recreational road races that start and end on PENAV? Um, so I'll take this first. And so we've been at NCPC uh and with the project partnership looking at event use on the Avenue for multiple years. Um, we have a lot of permit data and understand that the Avenue on any given year hosts um around 150 events per year. Um, and so this design is very much including that in consideration. Nothing that we're doing will preclude. As Scott mentioned, we're working with event specific subject matter experts to really understand how we can make it better. And I will say we're also working with the National Park Service who permits um a lot of the races. Now, we're also we've been working with the mayor's special event test group, the military district of Washington, and then on a smaller scale, um the bid to really understand how this future design can support events of of all sizes. Um so, while the plaza configuration may change, as Scott um kind of walked us through, nothing should preclude hosting events in this in this space. Um, Scott, did you want to add anything to that?

Nope, I think you got it. Um, I would just say yes. Uh, we're thinking about how all kinds of events, um, definitely those that exist today can continue to move forward and happen hopefully in a more streamlined way, but also new kinds of events that might not even be possible today. Um, and how do we integrate those into the avenue?

Great. Thank you. Um so again somewhat related to events let's talk a little bit about infrastructure. So we did get a question in about telecommunications infrastructure um that it's not currently incor vis visually incorporated into the plan um and could you kind of talk a little bit about how that will be understood in the future?

Sure. Um, and David feel free to jump in, but we have a huge team of uh engineers and people thinking about all the stuff and infrastructure mostly underground um here and so that is probably not as visible in the current iteration of the design options but we are thinking about those um very uh thoughtfully and how those will be part of the plan. I don't know David if you want to build on that. Absolutely. the Oh, your microphone's on your head.

Thank you. Um, absolutely, Scott. Uh, the notion that what is seen on the surface does not reflect what's underground is important. There are assets underground that are ancient, relatively speaking, to uh city uh use uh dating back to the 1870s. uh a myriad of different um aspects of infrastructure um which compromise the living systems associated with the street which then compromise the social systems associated with the street. So our goal is to really think comprehensively about the street from below grade up to its surface expression to ensure that it lives into the future vibrantly and resiliently um in all aspects of design experience. Great. Um, again an event related question. How are the gathering spaces responding to the need for outdoor crisis assembly? I guessing this is more like first amendment ad hoc um gatherings in addition to the more celebratory planned events and celebrations. So David or Scott

I'm happy to uh take that. Uh Karen, uh regardless of whether it's implying first amendment activities and the need for assembly um or whether uh it is uh the crisis implies something uh more dramatic, we are really trying to ensure that uh assembly is um easily possible um and assured um and uh should there be a need for um first responding, if that's the reference to crisis. Um, all of the layouts that we're doing incorporate um, uh, ways in which um, first response teams can move through assembled spaces. So, I'm just trying to balance the the ambiguity of the question. If it is about the need for first amendment um expression, we are right there and have expressed in the opening um description um that this avenue is intended to support that. And indeed, if there is some um aspect of attendance or celebration that is um and there's some jeopardy involved, we want to make sure that uh people uh the first responders can move through uh easily and effectively. Great. Um I think that's yes uh public safety is very much um a top priority as well as the ability to demonstrate um and hold all the wonderful permitted events that we see every year. Okay, let um let's talk about um had the public spaces. Um David or Scott, could you walk through

some of the differences between the market square options and kind of what the approach is there, how um the approach aims to improve the space um and what we might be see developing in the future.

Sure. Um at a high level, these options might seem very similar and there are some similarities between them. Um it is this crossroad of this LFontian uh grid from the LFont plan um that Pennsylvania Avenue, the remnant of Indiana Avenue which uh looks uh southwest towards the the Washington Monument and 8th Street which is a really important um connection between the facade of the National Archives and the facade of the National Portrait Gallery. Um all come together here. um that also is overlaid with the activity of the businesses in the commercial district um that really bleed into this space um especially at 7th Street but also um increasingly on other a on other streets as well. Um, and so how we're thinking a lot about how all of these things come together. And today the number one thing we hear about this location is chaos. And so how do we uh really try to provide some order and structure um for all these things to happen at the same time? And so, um, some of these might lean more towards, uh, like the crossroads option might lean more towards this like symbolic, um, linear gesture of Indiana Avenue or, uh, a really important triangular gateway, um, pulling people from the mall into 7th Street and then the commercial core of the city. Um while the one on the right, what we're calling neighborhood garden rooms, might really focus on a series of individual spaces that are animated by different kinds of programs. So it could be play, it could be dog parks, it could be dining, um a lot of different more parklike feeling. So if you imagined um Indiana Avenue while the roads the street still goes through um imagine the spaces alongside it uh being more parklike. um could be uh a way to imagine the differences here.

Great. Thank you, Scott. Um other public space, let's talk about the eastern end at John Marshall Park and is John Marshall Park eligible or listed in the National Register of Historic Places? I'll pass that to Katie.

Great. Thanks for the question. Um it is not listed in the national or individually listed in the National Register of Historic Places, nor is it um considered contributing to the Pennsylvania Avenue Historic Site. Um it was completed in 1983, and so it is not yet 50 years old, which is the typical threshold for um considering uh properties or for properties to be considered and and evaluated um to be part of the National Register. But I will say that through the section 106 process, we will be working um with the consulting parties and the state historic preservation officer to um identify any eligible properties that are um within our area potential effect. Um and so we will be continuing that process and then um assessing any effects to um eligible and um and historic properties as part of that. Great. And if I can, I'll add just from the design perspective, uh, as you see three options here, we intentionally, um, included options that might retain u more of the existing, uh, landscape design intent um, and others that might change it more dramatically. And so as we go through this process, um, those uh, issues will continue to come to the front. Um, but we wanted to have a range of options for this this phase of design. And I'll insert myself because I uh understand and appreciate that this is a Carol R. Johnson landscape although not uh registered or potent potentially yet as Katie has inferred. Um the option on the right I would consider not just terrace spaces option but managed change. Um, Land Collective has a a lot of experience in dealing with managed change in the context of uh uh updating and refreshing landscapes uh to make them relevant to 21st century society.

Um, and um, as Scott inferred, there is a gambit of uh, or a spectrum of options here uh, from significant change to modest change uh, or managed change. Thanks, David. And just to follow up to that question, um we have a a note in the Q&A that Persian Park was determined eligible and was um created later than John Marshall Park. Um thoughts on that and then maybe you could talk a little bit about your experience with Persing Park um in World War I.

Sure. Um the uh I think Persing Park is a perfect example of managed change. It uh uh reflects M. Paul Friedberg's original intent. We worked strategically with the Cultural Landscape Foundation um and with um the varied project partners which included uh the World War I commission um National Park Service um NCPC um uh state historic preservation and others who had um aspects of oversight to ensure that um the qualities and character of the urban park which was at the time um in significant decay and um um underutilized to to say the least. Um to to revivify it um as an urban park, but also um to recognize that Congress had appropriated the entirety of the park as the World War I memorial and to integrate them in such a way that both can read at once. Um and I think that that is the best aspect of managed change. Um and uh I'm proud to say that Land Collective uh uh guided that that project. Katie, anything to add?

Um, no. I think what David said was is perfect. Okay, great. Um, we'll shift gears a little bit. Um, sort of overall design approach. Um, will there be a significant amount of shaded seating along the avenue? Um, in terms of groups of seating, areas for respit, um, areas for breaks. Um,

happy to take that. Sure. Uh, I hope that you can see in um the perspectives that Scott shared um particularly on the two side shots or the the the um um areas where human beings will participate as opposed to cars. um that we are thinking um very strategically about the avenue as um a place of respit and recharge where a single individual could find the comfort of dappled light and shade, but also where um groups of people uh whether they be um young students on a classroom trip or um or uh groups of adults uh can find opportunities for um seating um whether uh in individual benches or in conversational groupings. Um the goal being um from Lan Collective's perspective to create environments where conversations can take place in the context of um this great avenue. So we very much want to create a variety of spaces um both in section and along the length of the avenue um where um events great and small can take place uh from as I said a wellpositioned bench with a a dappled light uh to a market to um other aspects of daily life and uh heraldic life if you will. Um, so, um, absolutely it will be a, uh, a street of, um, great gathering in many different aspects.

And I'll add that we probably didn't talk about it, um, in the formal presentation, but some of the most successful spaces on the Avenue today are where some of the restaurants and dining actually spill out onto the sidewalk. And we really uh aim to protect those uh but also amplify them and and find more um places where those kinds of activities um can happen and and enliven the space.

Great. Thank you. Um on this similar topic of public space along the avenue, what is this team's role around the existing buildings located on the avenue? Um, I think we did mention how we've been vetting some of these changes with the property owners to make sure that nothing is um, negatively impacted, but also um, potential redevelopment opportunities, especially with FBI moving and potentially that um, building being demolished. How will those moves impact the public space? Um I can start and then I don't know if others from NCPC want to build in on the redevelopment piece but um our effort is focused on the public space. Um so where uh building entrances and facades and those kinds of things interact with the public space. Um that is uh part of our purview and we are excited um to make sure that those are working to the best of their ability. But we're not proposing changes architecturally um to private property or to the federal triangle um in any substantial way. So um we're really focused on the public space piece and then maybe someone from NCPC can talk about the redevelopment opportunities.

Yeah, I'll take that one. Thank you. Um, back in 2016 when the Federal Bureau of Investigations was originally consider considering a new site, we uh worked very closely with GSA and the city to develop what we call square guidelines, which is really the the the form and and building mass and the type of uses that would take place on a redevelopment a redevelop site. Um, so those are in place. Uh so when this site redevelops uh sometime in the future uh those guidelines will be applied and they were developed ve in specifically with the public realm in the public space in mind so that we would have ample space for public activity um along its frontage but also how can we increase the interface between the first the ground floor uses and the public realm. Uh so we are thinking about that comprehensively

and Beth if I can add to that um you know Pennsylvania Avenue will always be the image of the federal government and with the presence of federal triangle that structure on the map here and several federal agency headquarters. So with the redevelopment or potential redevelopment of the FBI site, uh we hope that it will inspire um a lot of the other opportunities along the avenue and we hope that the master plan, the public space master plan that we are working on here will vice versa inspire redevelopment.

Thank you team. Um see you have a question about are will there be any secondary environmental infrastructure solutions inherent in the design similar to the canal park projects. So David

yes uh well uh thank you for recognizing Canal Park. It's one of my favorite projects. Um it is uh uh one of the most resilient uh in the country and we intend to apply uh a similar um uh approach to Pennsylvania Avenue. There may not be uh there's more machine in Canal Park underground than um the park expression. What we're trying to do, as I mentioned previously, was think about this street comprehensively from what's below grade to what's um uh we experience as human beings on top of it. Um and there is an aspect of resiliency that we want to see applied here for the challenges associated with storm water. Um Pennsylvania Avenue is on uh one of the low points of uh uh Washington DC. um it is uh uh challenged by flooding uh as was the case at Canal Park. We're trying to think about this um as a stormwater management system uh comprehensive street uh uh so that uh the living infrastructure and the uh natural systems as well as the civic infrastructure are all working uh sympathetically uh with each other. Um and so uh we are not quite at that stage but we have strategically uh been thinking about that and designating areas in the plan where these um aspects could take place. Um it is a very methodical process. Um so there will be more of that in the future.

Great. Thank you. Um, and I just wanted to clarify something regarding um, public space safety and permitting. Um, I know you mentioned that we're working with the mayor special event task group. Um, we're basically we're working with them to vet these potential changes to make sure that public safety is prioritized and um, we're not redoing the permitting process. So all all of their process is still no change to that, no change to the existing permitting structure. Um we're just working with them and the other event producers to really understand how we can make the avenue easier to set up, easier to tear down. Um prioritizing public safety and um minimizing neighborhood impacts. So that is no change to the process. Um and then we had another um followup on a a comment that we discussed previously about Persing uh Persing Park and John Marshall Park. Um that Persing Park is in fact two years older than John Marshall Park. Um but the DOE was done before it turned 50. And then the question being um in the three designs for John Marshall Park, how does that consider the um historic design um how does it kind of acknowledge the history there?

Yeah. Um I can start and um other David or others feel free to jump in. I'll just say that um all of our project partners um that Beth mentioned at the very beginning um this importance of how do we both make way for new um new memories and new activities um while respecting this incredibly important um national historic site is always part of the conversation and so we are um still thinking through that to be honest right so we don't exactly know um how what each indiv idual public space uh will be realized. Um but we know that some of them have um design legacies. Uh many of them had uh things that have been fully removed uh that were important to other people. Um and so how do we tell all of these stories um at the same time and which pieces are most important um to maintain um as David said in a manage change kind of way. So, um probably not the the cleanest answer you were hoping for, but we are I will tell you that it's very important um to all the project partners and we are thinking about it um often. I don't know, David, if you had a different approach.

Um no, I mean I think that's appropriate, Scott. I would probably just add that um it the the park itself can be analyzed in many different ways uh by the way in which it's broken up uh compared to its current uh iteration. um how it uses topography, um what materiality it uses. Um in all cases, uh it starts with an idea and a beginning um of where what program elements would function best in what spaces. Um and then there's a level of adaptation that would take place and uh comparison to the existing conditions whether it is the um distribution of the spaces which if you squint your eyes can see in plan that there is a four court uh a main central space and an upper court in all three iterations. It's just the way in which the topography has been delineated that is different. um the in the aspects of materiality uh I believe this was uh designed in the 1980s I think 83 if I remember correctly um there's a significant use of granite which was used a lot in that period um there may be in order to lift the bell jar of history to make it relevant to 21st century um society and programming there may be an aspect of shifting um those materials to allow for a similar effect uh but for a more comprehensive programming uh opport opportunity. Um you'll also see in its length um a distribution of three spaces along its two along its edge, one along the main central spine. Um in each case there is a uh an adapted reflection of that from the original um uh design. So in each case we're thinking of the level of of managed change um from um subtle to extreme. uh but in all cases we're uh we

recognize that there is a starting point um which is uh the present uh state.

Great. Thank you. Um and this also relates to John Marshall Park, but we had a question. Is there any coordination with the current rehabilitation at Freedom Plaza or are those two separate exercises? Um short answer is they're two separate efforts. Um there's also rehab rehabilitation going on at John Marshall Park um and parks throughout the city. So Beth, I'm not sure if you could speak a little bit more about that and the the safe and beautiful and how um that's a bit different than this longer term effort.

Uh yes. um president's executive order on making D uh DC safe and beautiful uh actually has an aspect of sort of near-term improvements to the uh to our public spaces um in really in focusing on the celebrations and getting prepared for our celebration for our 250th anniversary coming up here in a couple months. Um and what we're looking at is really a much longer term uh rehabilitation beautifification effort. Uh we are very aware that there is investment being put into these spaces which we're thrilled about because that'll make them more functional and beautiful. Um until such time uh we're ready to move forward with um the the redesign of of the avenue. And just a huge shout out to our partners at the park service for really doing the the literal work on the rehabilitation of of these beautiful spaces. Okay. So, I think um we have links in the Q&A few times. Um we're happy to stick around. Um, we could give you a tour of our project page. Um, Scott, if you'd like to pull that up because we don't have any more questions in the Q&A. Um, oh um, we'll get to get through the project page tour and one just came in. Um, so yes, this is our initiative page on ncpc.gov. Um, if you scroll down under a new vision, you can see the design concepts and the scoping materials that is the that is the content that we're asking

for public comments on. Um, to the right you see the button that goes to submit comments. And Scott, if you could click on that, it's um it kind of bounces you down to the bottom of the page, but actually up there in the blue box is um blue button. That is where you submit your comments. So, if we can close out of that page. Um, and then we will have links to this presentation um under the public presentations uh box. And then this is a link to the um write up of the display at the National Building Museum, which I will mention is open um and up until April 30th, which is also when our public comment period ends. Um, and if you are local and you have time to stop in, it is free. It is on the second floor and we're so thrilled to be there. Um, so, okay, another question about John Marshall Park. The planning area ends at Sea Street Northwest. This is relating to the project boundary, but your three alternative proposals would need to make alterations north of Sea Street. Um should the planning area be expanded to acknowledge the full scope of the proposals?

I can answer that. Um a good landscape architect doesn't uh limit themselves to a project boundary because all the systems associated with what we do go in and out of those project boundaries. So um we're trying to demonstrate um in these alternatives um how the ideas could be expanded. Um you'll also see in the context of the red outline um the dashed lines which um uh reference coordination with adjacent property owners because those quarters are so so important um such as the fact that Pennsylvania Avenue actually ends on the architect of the capitals property. We are working with them in the most wonderful way um to ensure that their uh master plan which is being envisioned now um actually um uh will incorporate ideas that we're thinking about um so that the avenue can continue as a whole. Similarly, the area to the south um where um the red dash line is between the two buildings of the National Gallery of Art um we're working with the National Gallery of Art to um ensure that we're doing no harm and actually enhancing their capacity to do great things um uh associated um with the avenue itself. So, it's a long-winded answer, but the notion is that it would be wrong of us to just simply stop at the red line. We're just trying to demonstrate that um the ideas have life beyond the red line in that context.

And I would just like to add that one of our primary objectives is to help really um provide an experience for those 35 million people that come and gather on the National Mall throughout the year and to help draw them north. So we're we're really looking at um how we those north south um extensions and how to move people uh through these spaces and we are working very closely with the District of Columbia and and coordinating with them on some of these. So, you know, time will tell. You know, we actually get to the final design aspect. Um, we may extend some of our design plans and construction documents that will, you know, ultimately realize the design um outside of this boundary. Or it may just be a coordinative effort uh with the adjacent jurisdictional um, you know, landholder. You want me to take the last one?

I'll I'll intro that. We've we've had a question about some of the projects on the the western side of the avenue um specifically the east wing modernization, but I think that we could also touch on the um White House Visitor Screening Center and and how our project may um relate or not. Yes. So, um really those areas on the west side of 15th Street are outside of our scope. However, we are very aware of um the proposals and thinking about the the visual relationships as well as the pedestrian connections amongst uh Pennsylvania Avenue um into President's Park. Uh but we're we're not um the ballroom is a a separate the east wing modernization is a separate project from from our initiative here. Great. So again, no questions in the Q&A. We're happy to stay here until I believe our scheduled end time. Um if anything pops into your head, please feel free to drop it in the Q&A. Um, my team, is there anything that we forgot that you want to follow up on with any of these questions or answers, additional context that might be helpful? Um something that came up last time that I don't know um if uh we want to explain more uh but was just the um that this this uh study area is filled with monuments and statues and memorials and um that we are very aware of that and taking those into consideration. Some of those are contributing features,

some of them are elements within the historic site. Um but all of them have um substantial meaning and back to this idea of making sure that we're um telling multiple stories and keeping these alive um as we make way for new stories. So um these uh you'll see in many of our um plans uh that we're labeling um some of the monuments and memorials. Just because something's not labeled does not mean it's gone. Um that was I think a confusion um previously. uh is just uh there are many many and Katie probably has the full count, but there are uh many monuments and memorials or uh name spaces um that have these historic um references. So um just because you don't see a label on something, please don't think uh we're removing it. It it's just uh for brevity in the graphics. And I just want to um emphasize the importance of your your input, your feedback through this process. Um we have a lot of ideas um you know alternatives that have been put on the table as well as different design options to achieve those alternatives. Um what we what we're looking for is your input and your thoughts on the strengths and weaknesses of those various ideas because that will very much help inform uh the next iteration and how we uh begin to narrow down and um move towards a preferred alternative uh that will become the the kind of schematic design and design plan for the new Pennsylvania Avenue. So,

and I I just wanted to mention as well that another thing that people can provide comments on um during this open period is uh the public or the the uh kind of scope of the environmental review. So, we're we're in the process of doing the NEPA, you know, National Environmental Policy Act um analysis and review for this project. And so some of the topics that people brought up today of, you know, uh, noise and storm water, those will also be, um, topics we'll look at as part of that, um, analysis or assessment.

That's a great point, Lee. Thank you. Um, and maybe either you or Scott could talk a little bit more about the timeline and what folks can expect to see as we move towards the fall. Sure. Um maybe I'll give an overview of the timeline and um Lee you can fill in um how it applies specifically to NEPA. We are looking uh towards uh more um commission reviews which are all public um both the um National Capital Planning Commission and the Commission of Fine Arts. Um we expect those this fall. Uh those will then go through a series of um approvals. um and that ultimately we will have the finalized plan um approved by both commissions and all of our project partners um at we're going to say at the beginning of 2027. So we are really really excited for that process. Um so as we're um developing these uh concept ideas and uh visual graphics, we're working through the the required federal processes like NEPA and section 106 um which maybe Lee and Katie can describe um better than I did in my brief overview. Um and uh we are literally writing um the plan um that will then guide us um to the future and update that 1974 document um that in many ways is written for a world that's very different than the one we live in today. So um we're excited um to be doing that. So part of this overall arc um towards that approved plan in early 27 um includes the NEPA process and the section 106. So maybe um Leah and Katie if you want to walk through these boxes quickly.

Yeah, sure. I can jump in first since the NEPA is up there. Um so right now we're in the process of uh scoping. So that's um developing the scope for the environmental document and uh what what we're going to analyze the impact topics. Um and then we'll be drafting the environmental assessment. um will coordinate with uh different agencies um you know some of the ones that that Scott mentioned earlier GSA uh DOT obviously NCPC and then uh that draft environmental assessment will be released to the public there will be a 30-day um period for public review and comments um so that'll happen later that'll be you know several months out and then um based on that uh We're anticipating um you know s uh finding of no significant impact or fonza um following the kind of review and incorporation of those uh comments and the final lia. So that's a quick over overview. There's a lot more to it than that but it's a little bit of a of a boring process so I won't get into it.

And that's closely related to the section 106 process focused on historic properties. Correct. Um and so we are currently in the um the step of identifying historic properties um and that are within what is called the area potential effect. So we've in effect um drawn a larger boundary um beyond well well beyond the planning area. Um and then we are identifying historic properties within that. Um and then any uh potential effects, physical effect, visual, other atmospheric um uh other types of effects and cumulative effects um will be considered. Um so nor do we appreciate your comment um as far as potentially eligible properties um because we are are in that step at the moment. Um but we will assess effects um uh uh identify those in what is called an assessment of effect report. Um and then that report as well as any um uh potential mitigation to avoid reduce or mitigate any adverse effects that are identified um will also kind of be discussed and will be um will kind of be incorporated into um what is called a programmatic agreement uh for this project. And so both the assessment of effects report and a draft uh program programmatic agreement will be part of the environmental assessment. And so that's where 106 and NEPA really tie together. And so um and and and those two documents uh will be open to the public to comment on. Um and then uh before we we revise those and um with the consulting parties um the uh

signitories NCPC and the other project partners uh will have a signed PA that um that mitigates any adverse effects to historic properties. Thanks. Great. Thank you. Um one last question. uh tell tell us a little bit about implementation and who is responsible. So I will pass that to Jeff. Yeah, sure. Um and I

think we lost Jeff. I think he lost his microphone that he I'm sure he'll get back on in a second. Beth, do you want to start maybe or um Sure. overview? I know it's throwing it at you. Sorry. No, that's that's fine. That's fine. I just don't want to take his

thunder. Um yeah, we are we have been working with our project partners um really from the the day we kicked off the project looking at um how it will be implemented um not only just to to get it constructed but also operated and maintained and programmed into the future. Uh we've been uh we have another uh team on on board with us called HRNA Advisors and Jeff is back. Um and I'll just finish the sentence and I'll let him take Jeff, could you hear me? Yeah. Can you hear me? Okay. Yeah, we can hear you now. Okay, good. Good.

Yeah. So I just left off with um we're working with HRNA advisors and that they have um been they started the evaluation on um uh the the different options we might have to uh move forward implementation. So I'll let you take it from there.

Yeah. Uh what's very exciting about this uh master plan is that the design work doesn't exist in isolation. So the work that David and Scott's team are doing um in the master plan and physical design is happening in coordination with implementation and as Beth mentioned um the implementation consultant is looking at different management model from the business improvement district to conseratory to development corporation like the former PADC to a 501c3. um they all have different pro and cons to each model but um all we know is that this entity is um will need a baseline power and authority to really implement the plan. So that's how to look at final design and develop the construction drawings and how to do capital improvement as well as operation and maintenance in the long term. So these are the power and authorities that this new entity would have and also of course PNAF is the the location where federal and local interest intersect um at the nation's capital. So we know that this entity will have to reflect this uh share value and share interest of federal and local but more to come in the fall.

Yeah. And I'll just um wrap that up with uh what we're working on now is a master plan. And that master plan will include these two aspects, the public space plan implementation program. Um and we're going to be taking the the master plan will provide it. It will be a schematic design essentially. I know that's kind of a technical term um but that and it will also have guidance and direction so that as we move forward with design development and construction drawings uh we want to make sure that any future actions that take that occur and any kind of final construction plans implement the vision and implement um the master plan that that we're developing uh you know in this this current phase of work and we hope that this plan will will live for the like like the PADC plan it lived for 50 years and as Scott said um they designed for a different you know we're designing for a very different world today and we're hoping that this plan will will also have a it's a good 50-year life if not more.

Great. Thanks Beth. Um and team any closing thoughts? I know that we we will stay on until our scheduled um time. So again, if you if you think of anything, if you want to share anything, just drop it in the Q&A. You're also welcome to include precedents, ideas, um suggestions in your public comments. We've gotten so many creative comments, um really good examples of things to look at. We so want to hear what you want to see on the Avenue, what what ideas bring you joy. Um so again, public comments open until next Thursday. Um

and can I add to to that public comment period? Um, if you are local and happen to be in the in the district or um in DMV um and can stop by the National Building Museum before next Thursday um April 30th, please do. Um it's a really great um space that we partnered with the building museum to um make available to all of you so that we can get your your thoughts. Um there's many ways to interact many of the questions uh you saw here today. Um but you can see what other people are saying and um hopefully join in the conversation. Um the building museum uh generously made this gallery and the coming together exhibition uh free during the entire comment period. Um and we thank them for for working with us. Um and they're very excited um to have an exhibition that is about planning and how we create the cities that we live in. um to have a real life example of participatory planning. So um please join the last room which is called the city action hall in the second floor uh coming together exhibit. Um and you might see one of us there. We pop in um quite frequently um and happy to have more conversation.

Excellent. Um couple more comments and questions. Okay. as someone who worked on a PADC project in 1983, the HABs report for the Wheelard Building. This is very exciting and thank you. Um, we love hearing from PADC alumni. We've had some of them on our project team and um it's a those are big shoes to fill. Um, so thank you for sharing that. Let's see. Uh, construction work. Will this future construction work um will this require closing the avenue to auto traffic for a period of time? If so, for how long? Um I will start by saying that our construction has to be phased uh per the inauguration parade schedule. So it won't be closed for more than four years. Um, but Scott and David, um, maybe you can talk a little bit about all the different ways that this could be implemented, keeping in mind that our deliverable is a master plan and final construction is a ways out.

Yeah, I'll just add that we're part of the plan will be thinking about phasing and potential strategies for for doing that. Um, we've already began to talk with all the project partners um about different um ways that might happen. Honestly, that will also, uh, depend on funding. Um, so if it's funded in one big swoop, um, which would be amazing, uh, then, uh, it could happen pretty quickly probably, uh, relatively quickly. Uh, if it's funded in a lot of pieces, you might see different, um, components happen at different times over many years. So, um, my guess would be that there's never a time where the entire avenue is closed, uh, for construction. there will always be portions of it open. Um, and there's many ways to do that to to maintain um access to all the the private and public buildings along the street.

I'm just going to only uh add uh reinforce what Karen said about the fact that we are only doing a plan presently. We are thinking about phasing in the future, but uh we have to come up with the vision that is uh achievable. Um in this context I I will also reinforce that um our goal is actually to again think about the street comprehensively from what's below grade to what's above grade and experienced by us on an everyday basis. So um it um aspirationally would include uh uh dealing with the um aging infrastructure that's below grade and adding better living systems associated with it so that we can have a long-term life plan um for the avenue as Beth inferred. Um um all of that does take time. Um there I think a a good significant a good way of thinking about it is probably um one big concert comprehensive vision and then um breaking it down um perhaps block by block. But it it does have to um include everything that's below grade to support everything that's above grade.

And I'll just add to that the other thing that's it's interesting about the avenue because of its significance. symbolism um and and in in a sense it's formality for for what it's representing in the nation. Um you know we we want to make sure that you know as the corridor is implemented that there's consistency you know that you want the the trees to be the similar size and and planted you know in a in a very deliberate way. Um so in many ways what we could see is one of the three parks or major public spaces could be done at any time in any order. Um the avenue also will obviously as Scott mentioned will need to probably happen in segments but I will say that is an important objective that that avenue hang together cohesively um um you know in its in its design um in its age. you know, we wouldn't want one end to to be in five years earlier than the other because then it would never really hold hold together. Um, so it's a it's it's complex. It's there's nothing simple about it. It's complex,

but we got the right people and we got the right minds thinking about it. It's a great team. Um, one final question possibly is can we do we have an estimate of how many people attended the two public meetings we've done online? Um, I think this one max was 48 or sorry 38 somewhere around the 40 mark. It was it was in the 40s. Was it okay? Jeeoff did you do you remember a number from our meeting on the ETH? Yeah. So I think with the two combined we have over 100 people from I think more than 10 to 15 states ac across the country. We will get the final number tonight.

Nice.

And that um that is just our zoom registration data. Um we also will be we have comments coming to us um that people have submitted at the building museum. We have our email comments um that have been submitted through our website. Um we have the Google form comments um and feedback and we will probably need a little bit of time to package this but um it will the entire record of public engagement will live on NCPC's website um all the comments and that includes even the the cards that people put in the box at the the building museum. So that will be um that will be posted on our website. We may send out an email to we have a special penav mailing list and you can sign up for that um and those project updates via our website. Um and that will be up probably a little bit after the the comment period ends. There's a lot to pull together

and I will say that we also that will include um the official scoping comments from the NEPA process. um that again also will be part of that um report and uh we've already started to receive um formal letters from organizations and um others. I I think I saw some of the the folks um names on this list today and that have sent letters. So, thank you for that. Um and all of that will be uh brought um into the process and uh shared with all the project partners and the design team. Um, I'll just reinforce I believe in the Q&A box, um, there are links, uh, to the website, um, and so please, uh, peruse, uh, there's a lot of information as well, as well as links to previous studies that NCPC um did prior to uh the engagement of our firm um and we are using all of that data um and the there's prior public engagement which we've used all of those comments um and getting to where we are today. So, um, thank you if you engaged with us in this process, but also in those prior years as we've really gotten to this point. Um, it is no small feat to have, um, six federal and local um, organizations and agencies working together um, for such a substantial project. And so, um, we're excited to be part of it. Um, and thank you all. Uh, the public input is really important to us. Thank you, Scott. And um I know we covered the timeline. We won't be doing public meetings um really until the fall

again when we go back to the commissions for preliminary review. So don't think if you're not hearing from us, we're not not doing anything. We'll be very hard at work um learning from all your comments and feedback um and making this a great design. And um but yes, we won't really have another public meeting until the fall. All right, we're approaching 8:00. Um a big thank you again everyone for attending on this Wednesday evening. Um, we really appreciate your interest in the project and following the progress and all the feedback you're you're sharing. Yeah.

Big thank you. Big thank you. Absolutely. Thank you all very much.