Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

you haven't signed in back there. We have a sign in sheet. We appreciate you if you put your information on that sign sheet. You are like to call the meeting to order with the pledge to the flag. Please to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for [Applause] [Music] all. First on our agenda is our board appointments. We haven't had a meeting since November. Yeah. So, we have to reorganize our board appointments. Any uh suggestions? I think it should stay the same. Second. Okay. All in favor, I guess then I I motion carried. Next on our agenda is the approval of our annual written report of this planning commission. We all got copies of that. Yep. I make a motion that we approve the the uh report for 2024 as as submitted. Second discussion. All in favor? I I motion carried.

[Applause] [Music] Next on our agenda is the uh any correspondence, Cammy. No. Um did you approve the minutes this? We did. No. Uh Yep. The monthly. Yep. November last week. Gota. Um, I need to uh call for a motion on our approval of November's meeting. I'll make a motion to approve. I'll second. Discussion. All in favor? I correspond. Thanks, Tammy. You're welcome. Uh, next on our agenda is Old Dominion Freight Line, uh, Erie Pen Brier Land Development Plan on Foot Mill Road. Anybody here too? Yes, we got a gentleman here. Okay. Mitchell Scott. Hi. Uh, good evening. Uh, it's Mitchell Scott um, with Boy Bini. We're representing Oldian Freight Line and um let me go ahead and pull up I got a little presentation for you. Um so we're proposing a a truck terminal facility at the corner of uh Pinbrier Drive and Footmill Road. Um little information about the property. Um it's that's the parcel number. It's mixed use regional zoning. Uh it's corner of pin Bryer Foot Mill the Pro use truck terminal and the uh owner is Old Union Freight Line.

Um and zoning map kind of up in the northeast corner of the township. Um so proposed improvements, we're proposing a 43 door truck terminal. Um with the future expansion, uh up to 75 doors in total. So for this initial phase of be able to have about 43 employees and then at full buildout, you're looking at about 75 employees. Uh we're also proposing improvements to Footmill Road to increase its road classification from local to collector. Um, also another part of this is we had to abandon Durst Drive. Um, and we completed that sometime last summer. And here's a little um more of a zoomed in uh look at the site plan. And this is ODFL Colombia. This is a pretty this is another similar size facility. Um, initially it's going to be 63 doors, but you can kind of see back here there's potential for this to grow as well. Um, this has a little bit more yard space than what uh the proposed project has, but this kind of gives you a rough idea of uh what to expect. Um, and we received a special exception approval for truck terminal use January 23rd, 2024. and we meet all the conditions for staff review. Um, Dur Drive has been abandoned as I previously mentioned and we have uh Erie County Conservation District approval for the land disturbance and the uh Pennsylvania Detland permit. And um that's uh it. I don't know if you'all have any other questions or

questions from the board. Just as long as um it's our understanding that the roads are sufficient to uh provide uh basis or foundation for truck traffic. That's one of our concerns, but um I guess that's been addressed. Um I'm informed that core samples have been taken of the road. Is that correct? Yes. So that was one of my big concerns. Any other discussion? Call for a motion. I'll make a motion to approve it as presented. I second that motion. Any discussion? All in favor? I. Motion carried. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, next on our agenda is Nissan Certified Pre-Owned Center Development Plan. Good evening everyone. Matt Swanson from LSSC Civil Engineers and Surveyors. address is 10560 Walnut Street, Albian, Pennsylvania 16401. Sounds like the last time I was here was the last time everyone met. So, um I think we've addressed most of the comments that we discussed in the last meeting. Uh at this point, uh Matt is reviewing storm water management plans. Conservation District has the EMS and NPDS plans. Um, PENDOT has the uh HOP application. Can't really get that approval without the storm water consistency letter. Um, we are going to be asking for a sidewalk deferral along Town Hall Road. So, just like your

um suggestions, questions, comments, we're going to be um seeking a conditional approval, you know, just waiting for the other permits that I just mentioned. Yeah. Help me understand. So there's margin in here though for sidewalk or is it completely removed? Uh the transportation plan requires sidewalk on town hall road. So as such that's only place the sidewalks required by ordinance. So they're asking for deferment on on their side of town hall road until such time that the township deemed it necessary. Right. It would remain undisturbed and how tall is that wall? I think the tallest spot, Tim, would be right here. It's going to be about 12 ft. And I did give the retain wall design to Matt. I looked at it real briefly. It's a reinforced earth type wall. So it doesn't have a traditional large footer underneath. It uses geoexile fabric to kind of hold it together in a web. I think I'm explaining that pretty well. It's just a bunch of layers of soil and geoexile fabric to hold it back. Yeah, I think it's a it's like a geog grid. Yeah. The stone holds it in place basically. So there wouldn't be any necessarily disturbance of the the waterway. As being a kid, once kids like to climb and play, is any signage or anything? I don't know that that's going to deter anything, but

not from the bottom, Tim, but we will have a guard rail and chain fence on the top. Did they change that drainage out of the existing bullet? There was a there was a drain from that building going out on the into the creek. Yeah. So, we're working with the sewer authority. We're going to connect this to the the sewer. So, it has not been changed. It's still dumped into the creek. Correct. He is not going to service vehicles out of these buildings. He's just going to do occasional washes. That's it. just as they come in and go out. But he's not going to provide a wash service like he does at his other dealerships. And that space out front on probably the south west corner where there's there's a three that be parking also. I take it that's going to be inventory parking so he can put some of his nicer vehicles out there. Be kind of awkward to get to. you know, 10 ft wide. Yeah. So, he'll he'll drive them in, back them out, and then we also have this will be landscaping here, which is next on the agenda. So the number of parking spaces here that math refresh my memory the number of parking spaces here that's all within requirements correct now they if you remember last time they had everything striped they took off the striping for

the inventory spaces and those numbers in the hexagon shapes are how many inventory cars will go in each row so they're just showing the customer parking on this plan for clarity. Yeah, it looked a little sparse there. I just Yeah, that's why it looked a little different. And I believe when I was here in uh November, we had the the minimum amount parking listed. We've also had the maximum up to this point as well. Any other questions or discussion? I call for a motion. Make a motion we approve plan as submitted. Get a second. I'll second it. Any more discussion? All in favor? I I oppose. I Next is our uh the same property for green space plan. Yep. So, same thing just um wanting your suggestions, comments, questions. [Music] And this is I believe we're calling this an alternate green space because we're going to continue to utilize the wooded area along Town Hall Road.

[Music] Same thing on that back would be the uh easterly. Yes, this section right here. There's a house where somebody lives in there. They'll keep this landscaped here as well. This is that's the creek right there. And how much elevation change is there there? And how will that be landscape or you're not really showing any landscaping? Yeah, we're not touching that area, but you do have other landscaping. You've got there are other Yeah. So, we have landscaping along the road. We have landscaping in the islands, landscaping around the building, and then screening to the south. Tim brings up a good point about the house, if you don't mind me interjecting, um to the east there. Is there a way we can put privacy slats in that chain link fence to block the headlight layer onto the adjacent property since they're they're elevated above the existing vegetation? Yeah, I don't see why not. [Music] in this section here and possibly this section here. Guess that's where I was thinking cuz that neighbor is definitely going to get some influence for for lighting. I don't know whether noise really can't put much landscaping there. Yeah, we can add that to the

plan. Any other discussion on the landscape or the green spaces? So, we got one, two. What is the the size of the trees that are going to be up on Peach? My ears really [Music] And I asked because I I saw the ones across the street. They were all cut down. I don't know if those were being put in as larger trees or what the intent was there. right here. So, the trees are inch and a half diameter and 8t tall start. Yeah. Again, my my concern is we have trees up and then they just get cut down and I see that across the street. So, it's a concern saying, "All right, we're really getting the front edge look that we desire. I know they want front edge for their appeal. Totally get that. That's the way you sell cars. Um, but as a community priority, we do want to have that green space up there. And if we're putting trees in just to cut them down, what are we kind of really looking for? So, how do you maintain? Yeah. Basically, they're supposed to be I mean, they're they can trouble, but they're supposed to be replenished. Oh, they're cut down. Yeah. Should they be getting a letter? If they cut them down, they should replace them. Um, periodically we'll we'll notice that someone's green space doesn't look right. We'll go and hold the plan and at that point we'll send a letter that says this is what it needs to look like and we need to fix it. I know in good faith I don't think I can uh I can move forward with the green space plan knowing the same entity is doing one thing over the other on the other side just as one of those issues. I think it's a small issue, but it just kind of goes back to what um you know, we have concerns to the folks there. I

think you guys are willing to meet those, but we just at least I want to make sure that those are going to be met wholeheartedly and intentfully. So Chris, just so you know, also um um Matt and I do do an inspection after the green space has been put in and we go through and count trees and shrubs and so forth. Oh, no, I understand that. Just so you're aware of that, too. Oh, I I understand that. Absolutely. And they are required to maintain them. If they lose a tree, they have to replace it, etc. It should actually say that on the Yeah, just the pleasing of that is probably [Music] issue and I mean a lot of plans have gone through here with this same issue at stake and um it was always an understanding of both the people who presented and of the board if I'm not speaking on a term that they would be replaced as needed sort of but I get I get what you're where you're coming from. I mean, we can talk, but what we see are sometimes two different things and one on on one vote, but that's a concern I feel to be a fair concern. Some municipalities require the landscape plan to be reported as part of the land development as well, just so it has a little bit more weight to it. Definitely something to look into as we update the subdivision

ordinance. Can I call for a motion then with with the slat slats of the in that fencing on that uh easterly board that we can get Matt T in the revised plan? Okay. [Applause] I don't know what what more teeth we have to force the issue. I understand the votes vote. I understand. I'll make a motion to approve on the contingency that uh a revised plan is submitted that shows the slats and the fence, the chain link fence. I need a second. I'll second it. More discussion. Call for vote. All in favor? I I opposed. I Thank you. Thanks everyone. Maybe you could put a bug in your ear about uh across the [Applause] road. Let me see that there. Yeah. Uh next on our agenda is Country Fair's amended land development plan highway. Uh good evening Lake Sanford 4721 Atlantic Avenue. And I prepared this amended plan. So I'd like to just go through that with you what the changes were. Um the last week this plan was in 2015. So it was approved and Country Fair started some of their improvements. But the reason we're here

tonight is about 5 years has gone by. So the plan became stale and the MPC requires us to resubmit. So we're here looking for an amended land development plan. And here's what the changes are. um since 2015 and now your township adopted new zoning code and so the property adjacent um to the rear of this to the west that zoning district line was moved a little bit to be along the property line. So that's one of the changes we put on the plan. Um also Country Fair after they got to approval in 2015 did a few things to the store. They put the additions on. They actually constructed the sidewalk along the entire front edge both on the main parcel and the one to the north. So the sidewalk is all in place. Uh they did do some parking spaces, but then they stopped doing their work. So um they had had the storm water plan approved at that time and so that's being implemented now. There's no change required for the storm water plan. The pond's going to be constructed. Uh they actually contractor is going to start today or tomorrow. And the uh with this new plan we did because your ordinance requires we did submit a lighting plan prepared by Jeff will uh to show the existing lights that are there. Some of which will be moved. The ones on the north side and south side are going to be moved. We're going to put new ones on the west side. But we provided a photometric plan to the township for Matt's review showing where the lights would be. He had a few review comments and so uh Jeff will responded to those and some of the lights will have shields applied to them so that the light doesn't get onto the roadways. Um the dumpster is going to be moved from the south side of the store. Right now it sits in here somewhere. We'd like to move it up to the northern end of the project up in this area. And this part of the plan before always was to close one of these driveways here. I think it's this right here. Um, Country Fair has one, two,

three existing driveways. So, this one was going to be closed and this plan is to open a new driveway up here. So, we're going to proposed on this plan is this new northernmost driveway. And what what really is prompting this revised plan also is they want to install a diesel canopy here to serve diesel customers. So, this is gasoline. Uh, this will be diesel. But what they did is they want to open this northernmost driveway to allow the trucks to flow around the building in this counterclockwise f fashion. Get queued up here at these pumps. Uh there would be six fueling positions and then the trucks could exit this southernmost driveway on their way back out. So this behind the store is set up as a you know oneway drive. That's why we have arrows on it to get the trucks around the back. If the trucks come in any other driveway with the gasoline canopy here, it's very difficult maneuvering wise to get those trucks in here and then once they're in, how do they get out? So, Country Fair is going to do signage to get those trucks to come in the north, circulate around the back, get queued up here, and then exit the south. So, one of the things on our plan is because this zoning district line moved from about here, it moved over to the east. Now, it's here on the property line. This rear buffer is here now on this plan. The prior buffer was over here somewhere and that drive this driveway was clear of that buffer. But with the revised ordinance, the buffer is now this dash line here. So we do have this rear driveway being partially in the buffer and I added a large note here on the plan to explain that that your ordinance does provide a provision that uh access can be within a buffer as long as it's to and from a rightaway line. So really what I what I explained in this note here is that just what I said the trucks would enter here, circulate around the back and come here. And so that we we believe that's permitted by the ordinance as stipulated by this section called my note. Um also what we're proposing is an interior

green space right here. Right now the store essentially has no green space and your ordinance requires for the spaces along the building or internal spaces we have to have a certain size green space with a tree in it. So, we are proposing to be compliant with that as well. We'll talk about green space on the next thing on the application. But I guess I'm here tonight just to explain why this amended plan's being presented. Um, it was due to the 5 years expiring and Country Fair would like to install their their gas canopy here. And the way we have this drawn, this gas canopy is outside of the National Fuel Gas easement. Um, National Fuel is a 50ft easement along the southern side of this property. And so this diesel canopy is just outside that. And uh NFG met with Country Fair about a week or two ago on site to discuss that. Mike, this canopy right here, has that changed since the original submitt size of the I guess that's the passenger car canopy. Oh, do you know if that was that was has not that was expanded previously. Okay. So that's remains unchanged. Correct. Okay. There's no change proposed at this time to that. Okay. This is the tank farm right here. Uh so we're kind of married to that. It's a tough location. Their new other stores, they usually give it a little more remote from the store, but we're kind of married to that tank farm and and this gas canopy. And if memory serves me correctly, the truck flow is the same as the original Sub. Absolutely. Yes, the 2015 submitt. This is really essentially the same plan. Um, what I had my survey crew go out is they go out and they has built everything. They they figured out what country were built, what they didn't, and what this plan shows is what is existing and then what is not proposed. But yeah, that's this this circulation behind the scene

is exactly from the same plan before. The storm water ponds the same. Correct. What type of vehicles are going to use that back to drive? It would be any truck that has diesel. So, that could be a cube truck, you know, a fixed body truck or it could even be a semi-tractor trailer. Uh, we have the turning radiuses. We applied the they're not shown on here, but we we do know that a semi-truck can actually make this turn and make this turn here to get around here. So, we're trying to accommodate up to a semi-tractor trailer and also cube trucks. [Applause] Any more questions for Mike? I call for [Applause] [Music] motion. I make a motion to uh approve the plan. And evidently, it's a reapproval of a pre-existing plan. Yep. I'll second. Any discussion? All in favor? I. Motion carried. Thanks, Chris. Just uh now the uh alternate green space plan. Yes. Um so this is similar to the plan we presented in 2015. Um again my survey crew went out and and we located all the existing plants shrubbery along the frontage here. Um there are some trees located along this southern side about in this location but those are going to be displaced by this diesel canopy and this edge of pavement. So you'll see

here this edge of pavement is going to be in in the national fuel gas railway. Um, I provided Matt Jonas a letter that NFG gave Country Fair at their site meeting that they say no trees, no hedges in our gas ement. This is their 12-in gas line, and it's very important to them. Um, it's under high pressure, and they just they want no plans of any kind. I brought a copy of the letter tonight if you haven't seen it. Um, so unfortunately, in one of my original submissions here recently, I proposed some shrubbery here along the southernmost property line. However, when we got that national fuel gas letter, I had to delete the plants. So, those have been removed from the plan. But we are proposing along the entire west property line the traditional trees and shrubs along the entire line. And along this north property line, there is a a resident that lives there just right off the plan there. So, we are installing the arborite screening that your ordinance requires along the entire north line. And then we are doing some more trees and shrubs along this rightway line. Even though the sidewalk is built there, but we want to put those trees and shrubs in now um just because we do. So we're actually doing on the east line, north line, and west line. We're doing ozero new plants. We're putting a tree in this landscape island. And then these plants along here are existing. [Music] So where that driveway was that you're eliminating doesn't look like there's any plantings in there. Yeah, that would be right in this location right here. I don't see any plants. Uh I could certainly add I can continue this same shrubbery line forward to the north. Uh the campy trees because of the penalt lines are all right right along that place. But I can add more shrubs in that area. No problem. I think that makes sense to me. Yeah.

Yeah. Any questions for for I call for a motion. I'll make a motion to approve the plan as submitted. Not to interject, but with the extra shrubs, right? With the extra shrubs. Is that is that going to be a revised plan or you going to just I'll I'll revise put a revision date and provide it to this week. All right. So, contingency is a revised plan. Second. Thank you. Any more discussion? All in favor? I I motion carried. Thanks, Mike. Thank you. Next on our agenda is a speed check land development plan on 7335 Edinburgh Road. So again, Mike Sanford, 4721 Atlantic. Um, I prepared this plan for Lucky Lucky LLC. They own the property. They bought it from Mr. and Mr. Willow and they would like to Mr. Sing would like to construct a convenience store on this property. So, it is zoned appropriately. It's uh mixed use and this is a permitted use. Uh, we did go to the zoning hearing board, I believe in February, and received four variances for the property. Uh, we can go through those if you would like, but they're noted on this plan what they were. But, this is permitted use. he would like to construct an 8,000t building. It's primarily a convenience store, but at the northern end, he did make provisions for a drive-thru. Um, he doesn't have an exact tenant in mind of who that drive-thru is, but for purposes of this discussion, it's a coffee shop, doughnut shop type use might be what it is. So, we have a the appropriate number of cars in the queue for the drive-thru at the northern end there as well.

So, it's basically, like I said, a convenience store with with fuel. And we do we submitted all of our storm water calculations to Matt Jonas. He had a few comments. I still have yet to revise those. Um, but I'm confident we're going to be in compliance with storm water. We have our various permits submitted to the conservation district and we're awaiting their approval. We've been working with the sewer authority uh for several months now to get the sewer extended here. Um, this project needs to tie into sewer obviously, but the sewer authority wants to get sanitary sewer to Hannah Road. And so this is like a collaborative effort. We're working together, this is what we need. This is what you want. How can we both accomplish the same things? And I just received an email today from Bill Stef telling me, he's had it for like 3 months of how he wants the sewer to be extended. So that's in my inbox and I'll be dealing with that later this week. Um, how to get that there. Uh, we did do a traffic study. We had a a scoping meeting with Pendot of the two driveway accesses. Uh that was a virtual call with Pendot and the traffic engineers HRG for Cranberry. Uh they prepared they are preparing the traffic impact study. That's not quite out in draft form. I've been hounding them on where that is, but again we need to get a pend permit. We understand. Uh but right now we propose two driveways. What's we contemplate here is that the the majority of traffic will come in off 99. And so we we fully expect this is going to have to be a turn lane uh for anyone driving southbound on 99 would be able to get into an actual turn lane here and be able to turn into the development. Very similar to what Copper Leaf did. They widened the road and they have a turn lane to get their people in. We expect a turn lane to get these people in. Um and then uh we have a driveway here on Hershey Road as well. So two driveways. Uh we did request sidewalk deferral.

There is sidewalks under transportation plan along uh Route 99. Uh there are some provisions here uh at the intersection that Pendock made when they did their improvements. And so we did draw in the the sidewalk where we think it would go if and when that is called for. And then we put a note on the plan requesting deferral, but we did identify the appropriate location that it's not in the way of the rain garden. uh and and it actually could be constructed if and when the township deems it to be necessary. We do have some EV charging stations on the proposed on the project down here at the southern end. Um you know, we had those several places. We had them on one end, we had them on the other end, we had them over here, and that was one of our variances because, you know, I don't have an EV car, but it's my understanding when you charge, you have to sit there a fair amount of time. So, they wanted them kind of remote away from the store so that the the car could sit there. But because the EGVS charging stations are themselves a structure, we had to get a variance to happen in the setback. Uh we do have some green space islands. We have, you know, one here for the internal spaces and one at the other end. And just by virtue of this turning radius, these cars are going to going to come around, you know, in this direction. Um and so we have just a large green space here only because we need a certain radius to get that car uh to come around. And if you, this is interesting to me, if you go through a drive-thru, typically you go counterclockwise around the building. This one is actually clockwise. It's a little different um just because of the way we had the the way we had the cars, you know, we had you go around, you know, clockwise to get your driver's side door here as opposed to the typical you go around the store counterclockwise. So, we have a fairly large rain garden out here. Um the site did not infiltrate but so we sized this appropriately. So it's it is quite large

but uh it'll be planted and look pretty nice and we'll get to it on the next plan but there's quite a number of plantings along the the sides. The ordinance requires densely planting evergreens and hardwoods on these two sides and then the traditional plantings along the the front. Have you gotten any kind of reports back from Pendot at all yet about the traffic study there? Not not yet. Okay. Well, this is my concern. I live there. I go through the intersection multiple times every day. That island they've got with the turn lane, no one stops. It needs to have a dedicated turn lane with not that separation with the stop sign. dedicated turn lane with an arrow and the people. There's been people going right through there to get out there when the lights red and coming in come going out there. They can go maybe go north going out at the top. Oh yeah. But here that turning lane is going to be impacting that that entrance and exit. This one here. Yep. Yeah. Then were you talking about this this this this lane here? Yes. People don't stop. They just they just roll roll around. Yep. So, I think something needs to be done with that to may be a dedicated turn lane there, too. And I don't know whose responsibility that would be, if it would be your responsibility or the state since they screwed it up the first time. Um, but it's it's going to be dangerous because and then people coming around the corner even too all winter long they're in the ditch. So, and then at 5:00 or 4:00, whatever time Lords gets out, that's total solid traffic the whole time. So, something like something needs to

be done to fix that. What I can tell you is um and and Matt was on our Zoom call with Pendot. It's called a scoping meeting and basically the traffic consultant calls this meeting between the township and Pendot and says, "Okay, we'd like to do a project. What intersections must we study?" And so, They've been required to study 99 and Hershey and old Zuk and Hershey and Copper Leaf and Hershey. So basically, they set out cameras and they counted all the cars and the turning movements, who's going straight, who's turning right, and they did all those counts a few months ago. And now HRG is processing that data. It hasn't got to pend out yet. They're the ones that will review and issue the approval. Uh but HRG, the the consultant that was hired, is still gathering that data, but it will come to Matt Jonas for his Would not would not Oliver or Hammet Road being as close as it is and the traffic that's on it, wouldn't that impact that whole thing too? Shouldn't that be included? That's why we had the scoping meeting because uh the traffic consultant says, "Okay, Penot, what do you want?" And we started the meeting. We were only going to study 99 Hershey and Copper Leaf in 99. And they said, "No, you have to add Old Zilk and 99 as well." But I don't recall if Hammet was discussed. I feel Hammet should be included. I think they thought it was too far away to be an impact. It's not even a full city block. It's closer than I thought. So, it just it it was something that just didn't uh reveal itself in this in the scoping meetings because that's why we have those. We don't want to go out and do our own study of what we think that might want. So, we say, "Okay, what what are you going to require?" And they did add the third intersection, but not the fourth. Could that be included? Could you ask someone to include that? Uh the traffic counts have already been done. I don't know how easily it can be included. I'll put them on my chair up there. They they were hesitant to add also road because they thought it was also too far away.

What um I guess this is a question for for Matt. Right. What exactly do we expect to get from that traffic study given uh speed checks pretty popular place given that there's going to be and and the concerns are traffic, don't get me wrong. Those are the concerns. Oh, I love to have them there. So, yeah. So, what kind of information will we have flowing from that traffic study? Do they do they kind of put themselves in the mindset of of speed check being there and then figure out what the traffic in and out's going to be and or is there a maximum traffic at that intersection that will allow something like this to go in? How do they kind of you know it's a traffic study but is it going to do us any good? I guess the question so what they look at they'll do existing counts and according to Mike I think they're still working on those counts are collected. what the cops are collected. So, they'll do an existing count and they'll look at what the intersections look like today and then they look at the development going in there. It's a a gas station, convenience store, uh drive-thru, restaurant. So, they'll look at kind of the the generators there. What how many cars do they expect to use each one? And then they'll I don't know if they're going to do multiple year buildouts. So, they'll look at it a few years down the road. And what they're looking at is the level of service of the intersection. Um, so if I recall Hershey and 99 going way back, but I think whenever it was first redone and went to a level of service at B. So, uh, with PEND dot, I think anything D and up is passing. If it goes to an F, they have to do something. Um, so most likely it won't impact the intersection enough to warrant changes to the intersection

itself. Uh, like Mike said, it'll probably warrant turn lanes. Uh, the extent of the turn lanes will determine based on its impacts with uh, copper leaf driveway and with oak road whether that's just a left turn lane or if it's a center turn lane. Uh, those are things that'll be looked at. But as far as changing, it might change some timing of the lights at the Hershey Road intersection. If there's a lot of cars coming off Hershey, it might increase the timing of the the Hershey gets up the green light. So, but as far as infrastructure changes the intersection, I don't know. It most likely not, but there's always a possibility. And if I could add to that, I I learned something this week, last week on traffic. So um if you build like a target, okay, target is a destination. You wake up and you say, "I'm going to go to Target." And you set out from your house and you you're that is your destination. That that's what that's what traffic people call a generator. It's generating traffic. Most convenience stores, they talk about uh capture. And that means you're driving by and you're like, "Ooh, I want gas." It it's an impulse term. It's not gen. There's a certain percentage of people that say, "I want to go to Speedy. I want to go." But the vast majority of traffic on a convenience store is captured. That's why they want to be on popular roads because people driving by, "Oh, I want a candy bar. I want gas. I want something." And so, it's not like Matt says, um, the generators, but this is more of a capture. When you see the study, you'll understand that. And so what it does is it looks at where all the cars are going today. Who's on 99? Who's on Hershey? Who's going straight? Who's turning left? And so the habits of those drivers remain unchanged and you're just capturing a certain percentage of them that want to come in and they'll say, "Oh, I'm going to come in and drive." Wanted to explain that. I

think it's going to draw more people than they think because they have the cheapest gas in town right now. And he prides himself on that. I mean, and I'm all for having it there. It's just that traffic is just hideous. Yeah, it's a feature of that specific brand. It's it's a feature that they're lower and they're going to draw and multiply traffic and vehicular traffic in that area is going to be a problem. And as a planning commission, we have to try to alleviate problem before they happen. And I'm I'm a firm belief that unless there's some alterations in that area, it's going to be it's going to be difficult to pass through that area and it's going to be a hazardous area. I think if you convenience store gas station and try to head south on 99, you're taking your life in your hands. If you've gone north, you can probably get out. The the issue with that, the way that's bottlenecked for traffic that even uses the southbound 99 and you make a almost a you know 300 245 degree turn to to go towards the to the target let's say your generator. But again I think this is not going to be a convenience or a capture function. It's going to be uh it's a generator function. I mean the prices are so low that they're going to they're going to draw because certain aspects of the city that have this have noticed the an increase of of traffic vehicular traffic in the neighborhoods some of the areas at 26 in Sherry or wherever you want to talk about that it's captured it's not captured as much as it's generated. I actually dug that down

based on your comment uh cheaper gas as a generator and I I will call HRG the traffic consultant. Yes. And just see how that can be incorporated in the result because when I'm going to get gas I look at my Gas Buddy app on my phone and see where the cheapest gas is in town. I they do okay and I think everybody does it. the the bottleneck at Hammock and Hershey which I go through fairly regularly is going to be uh more exacerbated because you can't get through there. You come out and text coming out and try to get down on Hammer Road to get on to Hershey and it's it's 15 17 cars back and that's when you start getting people want to uh cut, you know, cut the safe distance and turning and I'm I was amazed when Matt showed me or or enlightened me on the number of accidents that uh were at Hannah and Hershey that there not that many, but I'm quite surprised. And it's not just the tech schools, sports, too. Remember, those are reported accidents. That's true. It's reported. Of course, reported accidents just one vehicle has to be towed or somebody's injured, but a minor fender bender that can drive away. But again, as a member of the planning commission worrying about that uh that area, I I have some very very deep concerns. Yep. And I drove that down and like I said, we will well HRG will conclude the study. Um and I I will pass your comment along to them. They'll give it to Matt and it'll work its way through the $10 approval process and ultimately the supervisors will have that for their consideration. I would also note that the the restaurant with the drive-thru, so to speak, that is a generator. I mean, if you get something that is a coffee shop, that can be very substantial. I mean, I know I don't really I frequent a shop downtown, but when I drive by a Starbucks, a Dunkin Donuts at Tim Horton's, the lines wrapped, you know, so I mean, that that could be an attraction that could add to that highway occupancy. And I mean, and

I see I guess for us as a border, as a community saying if something like this were come to fruition to make sure we're talking to the county and saying, "Hey, the state, do we need more lighting on this road?" or things like that because um whether this goes through or not. We still have an intersection that has a need. There was a whole 100page study on this entire area. Um I don't know six, seven years ago. There's plenty of little variations of that plan. But I think it's important that we understand that we advocate for those things outside of this room um when these things were. Yeah. Cuz if there is a coffee shop or something like that, there's some sufficient traffic in the morning to make a real traffic jam there. Cuz at Starbucks down at the mall there, it's always the traffic's always wrapped. Always. So that's what maybe I would love to see it there. I'm just Right. So question. It's a permitted use. Is that correct? And from the comprehensive plan that was delivered in 2020 2018 2018 we identified Edinburgh Road as a growth corridor. Is that true? Correct. That is a growth border. I just wanted to make that that clear. One other observation is and this may be a minor one. It might not impinge on what we're doing or but there will be pedestrian traffic, people running across Edinburgh Road from Copper Leaf. Good point. And there is some concern there. Edboro Road's busy. Yes. And you know, we did have concern about that. Um, some someone did use the word lighting at some point there and I just we did submit a phototric plan prepared by Jeff Wheeler and again Matt had a few review comments and so we did provide a

revised plan with some shields to bring the lighting plan into conformity with the ordinance. Well, my comment was on the road lighting. The whole road. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. just because you know what does come with with the gas station or anything being on that corner for that matter. It's a definitely a state issue to address. I think we all want also want to be um cordial to the people right across the street right across Hershey. There are residents that there's two houses there that I think we need to be paying attention in that photometrics. You you've got that intersection lit up, but what about the people that live there? I I I know it's a juggling act, but I think we need to be more cognant of of people that live there. They've been there for years and years. This is somebody and that's why um and I've been to a lot of your meetings about lighting and concerns specifically Smith properties and what I can I I told Jeff will summit is very concerned about lighting and I said they need to be downward directed. They need to have shields and they need to comply with the foot candle at the property line. So that's his resubmitted plan did do all that. So we don't have lights just shining like I said a downward directive which is appropriate. Any thought process too from uh from Hershey Road if that's going to be a congested intersection or more as it gets people cutting through from from Hershey over to 99 without just bypassing the light. I think that's a it's interesting you said that cuz when you remarked earlier I actually wrote on my piece of paper no through traffic signs. I actually wrote that down. Sometimes signs don't work when people speed bump or something. I don't know. So, I did I did actually write that down. So, a speed bump or something to to deter I guess I can write that down. I I don't know.

I mean, cuz that driveway that's closer to G Club Road should not have anybody turning left out of there. Yeah. Right now, we have it set up as full action. Um, and that's the same as copper is full action. Yeah. They shouldn't be able to turn that way because they're not going to be able to and they're knew there's going to be accidents. I I will say, yeah, I'm not traffic expert, but yeah. The red light does offer some breaks in traffic countered by if that sweep lane is un stop. Everyone just keeps sweeping. They never stop. They just keep going. That was neat. And I will say I've seen other intersections that PEDOT has actually installed stop lightss to uh Peach and Interchange at Barnes & Noble. You can't do that open sweep anymore. They signalized it to to stop people to do that. So would be that would be an answer too. I don't know. Yeah, that's have to pend their intersection to No, I know to do that. Just seems just for just to mention it. Um I believe Matt you said that Hershey Road is scheduled for a reconstruction in somewhere around 2028. Is that true? Roughly. Yes. Uh Pendot's looking to replace the bridge over 79. And when are they do that? They're going to repave Hershey Road the whole length from uh Broad Road all the way to Peach Street. And and there is a study that precedes that. Is that for public comment or open for public comment before that pre proceeds? Typically when PENDOT does a project, they'll have a a public comment period on it. I can keep an eye on that and make sure whenever I see it come to pass along

fix. Yes. Any other comments, questions from the board? [Music] Um, we have people who want to speak. We open this up to public. [Music] Sure. Anybody here has a public comment to to voice opinion one way or the other? Anyone? Can you come up to the microphone and your name and address? My name is Cindy McDonald and I live on Hershey Road and everything that you're discussing tonight about the traffic and that hazard. Um, we are on Edinburgh Road every day going to the mall and the turn line when you're going south to get on Hershey Road. many times you're waiting, you know, the late changes that you can't go through. And I looking at this, this is much larger than I ever thought it was going to be. I don't know who determined why we need a gas station there when there's so many gas stations on Peach. And now I see Red Lobster is going to be turned into a gas station. And um I am concerned about accidents and just increasing traffic because as you were talking about Hammet as well, it's hard to get on to Hershey from Hammet. And um looking at that diagram like I can't tell how far the p how far up from the pasture are you going on Hershey Road. You know that one house that is corner the whole pasture. Oh, it's going to be the old pastor. Oh yeah. Okay. So, you know, the lighting that's going to come from the gas station will

definitely keep us up at night. Also, Sure. I'm I'm just not happy about the gas station coming to that area. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Anybody else have comment questions? We have our engineer that put it together here to answer every question that we'd have. Yeah, [Music] it is free enterprise. Unfortunately or fortunately, however it goes, we can't all we can do is with the rules and rigs of of the township, we try to apply them to what we have presented to us. So that's where we come from. Anybody else? I I just have one comment. I I think the traffic study is key to understanding this problem. And personally in our history, we've tabled items for less concern. Agree. Now, you know, we're not throwing it away. We're just saying we're tableabling it so we can get a better understanding of the draft. And I'll leave it there. I agree with you. I don't know what their schedule is, but you know, this is this is the process. Mike, you've been you know, you've been here many times, [Music] I guess. We have all of our questions. Can I call for a motion [Music] then? I'll make a motion to table this

submission until we have further information on the traffic study and if possible recommendations from Pendot. Second. Any more discussion? All in favor of the tableing. I I will get that set. Okay. Thanks, Mike. Thank you. Would it be appropriate to discuss the green space or would that be likewise table? I don't know. We probably should wait till we till we know what's going to happen. Yeah, we can wait. to the next [Music] meeting. Next on our review is the con uh letter for White Birch sewer line just so they're consistent consistency letters. Um the Summitric Sewer Authority is applying for a grant through the DCD um to construct the new low pressure sewer along Hershey from 99 to Little Creek along White Birch and a low pressure sewer will be an extension of the existing um sewer system on route 99. The proposed extension will add 21 EDUs which are currently served by an onlot treatment system. And I have a map if you're interested of the proposed extension of the sewer line um on White Birch. And the other letter is another consistency letter verifying for a grant. Um the sewer authorities applying for a grant to renovate the

existing gardener and harp pump station located on Route 19 between New and Lee Road, which will include new pumps, guide rails, piping, valve, vault, and controls. There are no proposed no changes are proposed to the existing pumps station capacity. Here is the proposed pump station. So um we just have to confirm that the um extensions and the renovations to the pump stations are consistent with their comprehensive plan and we're looking for your authorization. We're studying. My lights here. I'll make it easier to read for you. Thanks, Matt. Wow. Closing time was going to catch catch all these. Catch all these, which probably Yeah, and I I don't even know what the you know the topography is. Fairly level. I mean, there's small elevation changes, but they're fairly they're fairly flat, but going Let's see. This is Hershey, right? And that's okay. So, this is going uphill and this levels out. Yeah. And that's pretty level. But this right here goes up. Probably a good thing cuz that's where you want the flow. Yeah. So, and it all flows downstream. [Applause] I've heard that. This is my house right there. And where's the Oh, that's that the other one's pretty change, right? This is our driveway up here. Thank you. And

I need to call for a motion for us to allow us to sign it. Sure. I make a motion. Make a motion that you sign the proposal as submitted. Consistency both of them. I'll second the consistency with the comprehensive plan. Yes. In the letter. Thank you. All in favor? I. Motion carried. Do we need to have another one for the second letter? I'll put a vote. Next on our agenda is the comprehensive plan implementation update ordinance amendment recommendations. That's all you, Matt. So, everybody laughed, but um Wait a minute. Wait a minute. We have good news. Uh so Mark and I just signed last week a grant for $400,000 to fill sidewalk gaps and put bus shelters on Upper Peach Street. Greatly. Yes. So, uh, we were awarded $400,000 from the Commonwealth Financing Authority. Uh, we have three years to to spend the money at this point getting the money. There's some coordination with the MTA and design work that needs to be done. So, not going to happen this year. 50/50. Do we have to donate to that too? We uh basically we're using the EMT shelters and match and then we had to come up with roughly just under 200,000 based on the estimates. Now we won't know until we actually go out the bid how much it's going to cost but and this is going to go this isn't going to take us across the creek, right? This is No, this will take us to advanced autumn to Chipotle or something. So down in there. So that'll get us

it's 1.1 mi of sidewalk that would be going in. So it's a lot of sidewalk. Uh 18 to 20 curb ramps. I don't remember off hand exactly. So it's a it's a big project. Um are there going to be signal lines pedestrian crossways? The existing intersections have pedestrian signals already. Okay. So we'll be using those. And then in other news, our downstrive, which we've gotten, we've received $250,000 in grant money from the common financing agency. That's currently out to bid right now. Uh bids will be opened in May, so that project should easily go this year. So, we're just chugging along. I think we've brought in $850,000 worth of grants within the past year between the two infrastructure projects and the $200,000 for Picnic Hannah. So, we're doing pretty good. That's great news. That is I'm Yeah, I'm with you. I'm I'm sorry everybody left. I know that. Mike came back. My Yeah. Oh, I'm sorry. Thanks, Michael. That is great news. But that that's the updates I have since November. Now, if we can just connect now from that from from Chipotle or Vance Auto up to Whiteman. I I'm looking at it. It's going to It's going to be a tough one. A lot of elevation change there. But if we can figure out a way to make it work, I definitely would try. It's kind of like the last crossing point there. So that Wegman has a little development line here. Maybe they could Well, it's funny. You get to Wegman's and there's no pedestrian signs. I I don't know if you ever noticed that, but when I was looking at the imagery and everything, there's no pedestrian signs of license. Yeah. But

that's that'll be a a big gap off the transportation plan. That's awesome. That's great. Next on our agenda. Are you done, Matt? I'm done. Unless Cammy has anything. Oh, no. I know other other business public comment any other public comment. Okay, I need a motion to adjurnn. I move we adjourn. Discussion. Come on. Got to be some discussion. All in favor? Motion carried. Thank you. Thanks, Mike.