Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

[Music] Pledge to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Good evening. I thank everyone for coming tonight for the June 5th, 2025 Springfield Municipal Regional Planning Commission meeting. Item 1.2. M. Marley, if you'll call the role. here. Bib here. Void here. Briggs here. Greg here. Morland here. Shot here. Thomas here. Townsen here. All are present. We have a quorum. Mhm. Item 1.3, approval of the minutes from the regular meeting of the planning commission held on May 1st, 2025. Do I have a motion? Motion. Second. Second. All in favor? Any opposed? Passes. Item 1.4 public comment period. Do you have anybody? Item 1.5, public hearing. um amendments to the city of Springfield's zoning ordinance by amending section 11-808 entitled sign regulations for the city of Springfield. Do you have anybody registered to speak this time? We'll close the public hearing. Item 2.0 0 old business 2.1 discuss and possibly take action on Blackwood Farms preliminary plat. Mr. Durm, good evening, commissioners. Before you is a request

for approval of the preliminary plat for Blackwood Farms. This request was deferred at last month's meeting to allow the commission additional time to review the traffic improvement study that was completed with the annexation and zoning in 2022. As you likely recall, this subdivision fronts both the north and south sides of Blackwood Drive. The second of the two traffic impact studies that was completed recommended improvements at the intersection of Blackwood Drive and Memorial Boulevard. Since this plan was last before you, there have been no changes to the preliminary plat except for the addition of a note that states, and this note is on the bottom of the plat kind of centered in the middle, it states, based on findings in the building, sorry, excuse me, based on findings in the traffic impact study prepared by Fishbach Transportation Group dated January 2022, no more than 310 building permits will be issued for Blackwood Farms. community until all identified intersection improvements at Blackwood Drive and Memorial Boulevard have been permitted, constructed, and are fully operational. Essentially, we ask that that note be added to reflect the findings of that traffic study. Additionally, since last month's meeting, staff has approved an updated HOA document that was provided by LAR Homes. That document was shared with the commission in your agenda packet for tonight's meeting. So, other than those two additions, there's been no changes to the plan. Um, we have folks with engineering and surveying and their development team here tonight if you have any specific questions about the project that you would like to ask of those representatives. Or any of our staff. Okay. As well, does anybody on the commission have any questions for um the engineering team or the city staff? [Music]

me. You did say that there would be a memorial drive and uh that before it's completed before it's completed. The way the traffic study there were two traffic studies done originally. One I don't recall honestly if it was the north and then the south or the south and then the north but there were two. The second one that was completed identified improvements that would be needed on Blackwood turning onto Memorial. So what we did is we asked that they limit the number of homes until all of those were there to reflect the number of homes that didn't need that. Essentially when the first traffic study was done no improvements or required when they added on those additional homes that's when the traffic improvements were identified as being necessary to support the development. Does that make sense why we added that? Okay. So, first I just wanted to make a comment that I was really grateful to everybody who took the time to explain to me some of my questions from last from last month. I've really uh appreciated learning so much about everything that goes into this and it sounds like um a lot of my questions were addressed. So, thank you for that and I feel a lot more comfortable about making a decision about it. That being said, I feel that we just need to make sure it's on record that um not for this project per se, but just in general in relationship to the growth plan we have for our community that this project is in a strategic location because of its proximity to Travis Price and where we see the community growing that way. As we bring more people in, we're definitely going to see growth in that area. um as I'd spoken to Terry about and I know that it's not this project's responsibility to all lot for that growth, but it

should definitely be front and center in in how the city plans how we're going to take care of that and do that responsibly cuz it's such an exciting time. There's thousands of homes coming in, potentially thousands of families who can use that space. And as we know, it's become part of our identity, right? Last time a lot of people said, "Well, what about the the fair? The fair that comes every year is right there. What about Winter Wonderland which br which brought what 40,000 40,000 cars into that area." Um, so these are just things that I feel in my heart as a as a loyal committed resident that I would need to uh make sure is is brought forward because we are excited for change. Thank you. I'll just quickly make a comment. Appreciate the additional info that because I think it came up at the last meeting. So, thank you all for being patient and letting us uh review everything to to make a good decision. Meanwhile, did you say there was going to be a reduction in the houses that we're going to put in there? Mhm. No, this preliminary plaque shows the same number of homes. There's been no actual changes to the conceptual layout. So, the homes are the same. the road network is the same. Any further questions? Yeah, I was I was obviously last meeting I was a little concerned so I took a few minutes um myself and uncle of mine pass those down you will did a little traffic study just curiosity numbers and events and stuff that um happened through the year. I just wanted y'all to look at that if you had a minute. I appreciate, you know, taking the time to look, if you got any questions, I'll try to answer them best I can. So, it's pretty well

self-explanatory. This was all done on one day uh in a 6-hour period. You see the amount of vehicles on the 6-hour period. This, like you say, it states here, this is counting vehicles that are going both directions. it. We've set at the at the big gate at the Robertson County Fairgrounds and discounted cars going both ways. Um only concern or the big concern was was when school obviously you could tell when school let out and and when the ball games were going on cuz traffic backed all the way up to the to the big gate there at the fairgrounds on Blackwood. So, um you know, Mr. Mr. Be did the improvements to the intersection at Blackwood and Memorial was is was there any conversation in that study? I apologize for not remembering what any signalization required as part of the improvements flashing the light or anything. Mr. Lion, if you want to come to the microphone. I didn't think there were. No, it was. No, Bob. It was It was only uh a dedicated left or right turn length. One or the other is all that was required and a certain amount of storage. They're sitting at the end of Blackwood on the Memorial, but no signalization was required. So, it would probably be a left-hand only turn lane more than like that or add a right turn to dedicate the current one as a left turn. Yes. One way or the other.

The first study was done when the south side was originally annexed and zoned and that was up to 310 lots and then when they came back and annexed and zoned the north side that's when the second traffic study was done and it was added to what she had previously studied with the south side. So she added all that volume act in there and that's when she basically stated above the 310 from transition from one study to the next. That's when the requirement of the turnup lane came into place. So 310 and less there was no requirement based on her study and traffic flow. So that's reflected on the plat reflected on the construction plans. And what's the total number of single family homes? 391 391. Yeah. 391 and I believe 90 town homes. Yeah. The study was originally done for I think 510 total. The second study was So we're less than the 2/3 2/3 of the building permits could be let before any road improvement. Yes. Up to 310. And I'm I'm all for the development. I really I really am. And uh I think I voted no last time when we deferred it. The uh my only comment would be this is an ideal example of what performance-based zoning could alleviate in the future. when you look at what happens to uh protects the community for having to go out in the future and spend money that could have been taken care of through a zoning ordinance in the beginning a performance base based upon what is required address the road uh things like that I think

it's a it's just a it's not a pet peeve of mine but it's a a wish that I think every community that's growing should look at as a possibility of what type of zone the ordinance they should consider at some point in time. And I I can't speak to this to great details, but I know that when each lot is permitted, you know, they'll have to pay that the new fee that was established what, two years ago now, 18 months ago. So, that should be divvied up among the different departments for help with improvements and and maintenance because of this, you know, impact. And when those are are they are those lots when that fee is done is it dedicated or earmarked for that development or is it going to a does it go into a city pool for talk about system development [Music] charges system development charges for a single family home is $9,968 for a multif family it's76 64 I think. So there's a a non-res a non-utility component and a utility component. So for residential purposes, they go into categories, escrow accounts specific for the things. So parks, but it's not sight specific. No, it's for future project specific. So when the city overall does an improvement project or builds a new road or builds a new building or buys new police equipment or fire equipment or builds a new park or buy new park equipment, that's when those funds are used. And then for water and wastewater, new water lines or new sewer lines that

the city builds are new improvements at the water plant and the wastewater plant. So it's a first in first out. We spend it almost as quick as we get it. David, maybe you could speak a little more to what you and I had what you taught me yesterday just about how again I like to say in my non-engineering understanding in my layman's understanding of this project and what was recommended with the traffic study it seems that um the the way that the plat is designed meets the requirements that we have and maybe speaking to um what Bob said about in the future, you know, ordinances or what what we need to have in place to to I guess the bottom line is we're concerned about turning lanes, right, and traffic in that area, which obviously right now is not required based on what the guidelines and what what the laws say. So why is that? Can you just talk a little bit more on that? Well, okay. In a nutshell, you you for you to ask for specific improvements for transportation. Their impact study has to support that request. So, in this particular case, it supports it towards the end down at the end at Memorial where they'll have to put in a turning lane for lefthand turns on Black Patch. Blackwood Blackwood. Thank you. Blackwood. And uh so that's what the traffic

study says and recommends. you know, we have these outliers there at the fairgrounds and at the park. So, the traffic study procedure does not take into account those outliers. It takes into account average daily traffic as counted and projected. So, uh you know, each one of those houses has an average daily trip generation of 10. The multif family, the town homes has one of seven. So, uh, and that road, there's going to be a roundabout, but that road right now, if you don't purposefully drive the speed limit, the road will let you go faster than the speed limit. You you there most people that travel up and down Blackwood travel faster than 30 miles an hour. Over time, as traffic joins and gets on the roadway, it automatically regulates the speeds. So, more traffic regulates speeds to slower amounts and not and usually lower traffic incidences as well. Um, so we, you know, it'll self-regulate itself down. If and when there is a need for a turning lane or an additional lane on that road, you know, it will be brought this the city will know and those funds, not those specific funds, but system development fees, charges will

will and can be used for that roadway improvement. that about what we covered yesterday. Yeah. So I what I what I'm looking at is the context of kind of how we got here. And so you know 2022 it was reszoned or zoned to city zoning and annexed. So that that pulls in certain property rights that they have. So I think you know in complying with state law like looking at the fact that they've submitted a plat that meets the zoning like I don't think we have a whole lot we can push back on and they've addressed the the traffic impacts uh through that. I think there is this concern on the special events that definitely the city has um that contributes to the overall uh issue. So like I would be inclined to go ahead and have this move forward. It maybe and I know we've been talking about topics to address at work sessions that we maybe explore how infrastructure is done in the city and how uh maybe there's some other tools that is new developments come in before us. We're able to to leverage more um of of that opportunity when those those come come about. But I think in this instance, we're we're hemmed in and the fact that they've already got the zoning, it's annexed, uh the traffic study has been completed, signed off by an engineer, um and and some of these other issues related to the event I think have to be addressed through operational issues with parks, police, other folks. So to address multitude of things here, if as a planning commission you think that the city needs to look at and modernize the zoning

ordinance. You as a planning commission need to h set up some work sessions. We can find some working examples of some performance-based and formbbased zoning ordinances and you guys can decide what you think needs to be recommended to the board of mayor and alderman and we can set that up in a in a ordinance and move forward. Now, you know, a fullblown change for a zoning ordinance, it's going to take a little time, but you know, it may be the time that we need to start addressing some of these issues because the one that we have has been amended mult many many times and we're going to talk about amending it again tonight. So, that's the great thing about zoning ordinances. they they are a changing document reflecting the planning commission, the board of mayor and alderman and the citizens at different times and and so but we'd be glad to sit down and have workshops and and listening sessions with you and even the citizens of the city of Springfield so that we can get it right. I mean, I feel like there's appetite there and so I think, you know, if we can follow up on that, I think would be great. uh cuz the the comprehensive plan was adopted about a year ago, maybe a little less. So maybe reviewing the zoning ordinance and how it kind of helps deliver on that vision would be a good next step. Yeah. All right. But any further questions for anyone on item 2.1? I have one question. doing the traffic study. Um, was it did you guys consider maybe reducing the speed on the section of Memorial like couple miles

maybe? I don't know that they I feel confident that they did not reduce the speed out past Blackwood in that traffic study because it was I'm you know, believe it or not, 4,000 additional daily trips on Memorial with four lanes and a turning lane isn't going to impact it that much. It'll impact traffic, you know, twice a day, maybe a third time on your average day. You know, in the morning when the when you're going to work, the kids are going to school. In the evening when you're coming back and the kids are coming home and depending, you know, if if that community is a bedroom community to Nashville, there's not even going to be a a real spike at lunch. You're saying it's not going to affect Blackwood? I know you're saying what you're saying on 41, but Blackwood 41. No, I said 41, right? Black, but you're not saying anything about Blackwood. Well, yes, it's going to affect Blackwood. But Blackwood is a road that's designed already to handle 50 mph roads even though it's a 30 mph posted speed limit. As traffic adds on to Blackwood, Blackwood will self-regulate speedwise. Yes, that road is capable of handling that much more traffic. We're not talking I'm not saying the road is not capable of handling that much traffic. My problem is getting in and out there. That's going to be the problem. Well, it it will not be as big a problem as you think. A 30 second to a minute and a half delay is not an unreasonable weight at peak times. And if and if the state of

Tennessee if we petition the state of Tennessee and they say there are warrants at the intersection of Blackwood and Memorial, they will allow an a traffic signal to go in. But there right now, according to state regulations, the municipal the traffic control manual, there's not enough warrants. There's not enough traffic coming off of if you dumped it all on the memorial to justify a traffic signal. I think the biggest thing would be if it was a one way in and one way out situation. That would be one thing. You've got a thorough affair that goes all the way through. You got a ton of people coming from the north that are wanting to go to 49, I mean 76, and they use it as a cut through. Well, if I know I'm going to be huge amount of dump trucks. Well, you'd be surprised how many other trucks and I mean, you know, they still go in both directions. And if I know I'm going to be sitting in line waiting to get out at a no signal intersection, then I'm going to pick the one of least resistance and I'm going to go whichever way it requires me to go. And if I see a bunch of cars coming in, then I'm going to go around to the signal side, go up Fifth Avenue, and come around that way. I mean, there are options to be used. It's not the ideal situation, but like Michael said, we put ourselves in this position already and we had no recourse at this particular point in time. So, that being said, do we have a motion for approval? I'll make that motion. Second, Briggs, yes. Thomas, yes. Floyd, yes. Bib, yes. Shot, yes. Bagot, yes. Townsen, yes. Gray, yes. Morland,

yes. Passes with nine. 3.0, new business. Item 3.1, discuss and possibly take action on amendments to the city of Springfield zoning ordinance by amending section 11- 808 entitled sign regulations for the city of Springfield. Miss Durham, uh what you have before you with this um agenda item is a request to approve an amendment to the zoning ordinance that would revise just a portion of the sign regulation, specifically to how high signs can be mounted on buildings. We've run into a lot of situations lately where in the past it was presumed it was just roof line. Well, it turns out the code actually says 20 ft. No sign is supposed to be mounted on a building greater than 20 feet. So, we'd been presented with multiple requests for variances. So, I said, "Let's just look and see what the code says. Let's look and see what other cities are doing." Before you was a list of all the cities I looked at. Every single one of those cities said roof line. So, I thought that it made sense to go ahead and just strike all of the words after. Um, it currently says the top of all wall and marquee signs shall be below the roof line and at a height no greater than 20 ft above the ground. Just striking everything off of after roof line and letting them be just below the roof line of buildings. It makes sense. Some buildings we found are architecturally designed to allow wall monument or I'm sorry wall signage in certain locations which is where these variances have kind of been presented. So, it's just a request for you recommending approval of that change. Any questions for Miss Durham on this ordinance change? In commercial developments where you have a strip center that maybe have six

or eight different entities like that. Is there regulations that require the signs to be symmetrical? No, there's not. Should there be? I mean, not I mean roof line can be anywhere. They can put it wherever they want from 10 ft off the ground up to the top. It would look kind of silly depending upon the size of the sign, but they can only go a maximum square footage. That is that is certainly something we can consider looking at if this board would like us to. Some of those things are often regulated by the developer of those projects as well though. They sometimes put limitations in place regarding signage internally, but we can look at that regulating that per se if one was already there that everybody else is consistent. I don't know if you need to go that far. I mean, you need to have some leeway at the planning at the city level, staff level to be able to say, hey, you know, let's let's try to make this cuz some some if it's not all the same company, maybe they own their individual space. Somebody's going to want theirs up here just as high as they can get it because they're going to get the visibility. Uh the other ones may not care. Well, they are limited to the square footage though that is regulated. And I will say I went out and looked at the new signage that was installed at Walmart because they requested an inspection and theirs is all over the place too. It is in different levels throughout um the walls of the building. So, but we can look at it if that is something the board would like or the commission would like us to look at. That's I mean they're not competing with anybody else other than themselves anyway. No, that's fine. Do we have a motion for approval? Some move and a second. Second. [Music] Morland, yes. Bib, yes. Boyd, yes. Thomas, yes. Shot, yes. Bagot, yes.

Townsen, yes. Briggs, yes. Greg, yes. Passes with nine. Item 4.0, community development director's report. Mr. D. Okay. Couple of things tonight. Um, ironically, I have a whole slide on proposed zoning ordinance changes, things that we're looking at in our office. Um, first though, we have two small preliminary plats that have come before us that I would like to get permission from this board that we can do staff approval. Um, if you would like us to bring these back before you for your review and approval, I'm happy to do so. But both of these are three lots. I believe the one on the left is the rightway abandonment that was recently approved for New Hope Lane. when they did the rightway abandonment, now they have to uncombine all of the lots there and turn it back into one lot. And then the one on the right is some property that is near um Legacy. It's on Oakland Farms. It's a number of lots that were never built on and they've subdivided to make them a little bit smaller. We've been reviewing it internally because there are some drainage issues, but we have not yet approved that final plat. So, The the first one that's the Gupton property, correct? That was No, that's the XL Industries. Okay. That was a bunch of lots. It was three separate. The one on the left? Yes. It the property on the north currently has a building on it now. We brought it back before the commission a couple months ago to have that section of New Hope Lane abandoned. and they're they're working through engineering documents right now to permit a second building on the bottom half of the property. Okay. And working through all the documents to officially abandon that portion of the road. Again, if the board wants to see these in detail, they can be presented

because they're more than three lots. But there wasn't anything significant on either of these that I figured it was worth asking for staff approval. But whatever you want to do is fine. Does anyone have a problem with the staff approving this? Do you need a motion? Does it have to have a motion? Yeah, just in general. Are we good with it? I'm good with staff. Okay, moving on. Um, a list and we'll go over these some more. Um, when we look at the development tracker at the end, I want to make sure everybody's comfortable with the development tracker on your iPad. Uh before you was just kind of a list of some of the bigger projects that are under review still. Blackwood Farms were really close on getting all of the civils um approved and ready to kind of issue permits on. I think we're only down to a few landscaping issues. Uh Spring View Village, that's a big project that's coming back. It will be presented to the board next month. Um you will see before you a final master development plan that was previously approved. they the time expired and so we're having to come back through for that approval. At the same time, they are submitting a preliminary plat and civil drawings for believe it's somewhere around 92 single family lots. So there's actually three different portions that are coming back. Um that's a project. It will have a total of four 550ish residential units off of Batson Parkway and Old Highway 431. That's the former Kumar property, correct? That is that property. So, you will see that in detail next month. Um, couple of mixeduse ones that are the same. Um, they've just been kicked back to engineers with review comments by city staff. commercial. The only thing new on there is Veterans Restoration, which is over off of Bradley Drive. It's a 5,000 square foot industrial building. Um,

Excel Industries, we've already talked about. And then Pan Commercial is a 6,000 foot building. I think we did talk about this one briefly last month at the corner of Brent Lawn in Memorial. That one is back to the engineer for additional review. And then since last month, we have moved Jasper Fields to construction. That one is at Fifth in Stevenson. You've probably seen the construction going on. That's 130 homes. They are approved to do all on-site construction. They're limited to building permits on that one as well because of traffic improvements that need to be in place before they can complete the subdivision. Excuse me, Karen. Yes, ma'am. That's not in our agenda packet, right? This is not. No, these are all ones that are on the development tracker. Uh, Highland Reserve. Most of these ones that are under construction, you've seen all of these, but if you have any questions about any of them, we can look at them with the development tracker. So, but really the only big thing that has been approved is Jasper Fields. Okay. Some of the different things that we are looking at in my office. There are definitely revisions and amendments to the zoning ordinance that we know need to be done. Um, as Mr. Brewer said, it's time consuming to do this. So, looking through it, amending it. Um, I will add looking at performance-based zoning um, into my list of things. The signage regulations, we've already talked about some of them. We're still looking at the square footage allowed on monument signage versus pole signage. Multiple developers have come wanting to do more monument signage. However, the size limitations are pushing them to do pole signs, but it's starting to be a problem with the electric department as well where they would prefer to not have so many pole signs. So, we're looking at

that. Um, we've had several meetings about updating the landscaping requirements, making sure all of the verbiage is just legal. It's all legal now, but kind of updating it and making sure it's exactly where we need it to be so that it can be enforced. And then also kind of making the residential component a little more stringent. We're not really in compliance with what other cities do in the sense that we currently require one tree per lot and a lot of other cities require for residential developments kind of a per acre requirement or a inches per acre. There's a lot of different ways that it's looked at. We are definitely not as restrictive to a developer as we could be, but there's probably a way we could make that a little more green for us. Uh district additions, development of a multif family district. The comp plan that was approved last year recommended adding another zoning classification that specifically spoke to multifamily developments because we currently don't have one. and then one for mixed juice developments as well. So in addition to just looking at the ordinance as a whole and recognizing there's some clarification, there's some modernization that needs to be done. We have opportunity to add more visuals and more tables and diagrams to just kind of make it easier and more user friendly. We have some work to do with adding some categories that would be useful depending on the type of development you're doing. So, any questions about any of that? I know that's a lot. Uh, we have training. We need to get everybody caught up on state required professional development. We have to do four hours. So, my question

to you is, do we do it all at one time? No. Okay. I think so. Do we break it up into two, three, four sessions? Do you want to do a component online and a component in person? There is an opportunity to do that as well. So, I just you don't have to tell me today, but I want you thinking about that and maybe sending me an email. Let me know what your thoughts are because we have to get the four hours done. With that being said, I provided you a list labeled A through E of all of the different areas. It's in the I did not have this in your agenda packet. I just had this created. I was trying to do it in a digital form document and then I realized not everybody loves when I do things digitally. So, I said I'll go old school and I'll do paper. Um, but it has five areas that planning commissioners generally would get training in that I wanted you all to have available to kind of decide, hey, where do we want training? What is going to serve you as a commissioner? Where do you want to know more or what do you want to know more information about? So, I would like it if you don't have to do this again today either. Take it with you. Get back to me. just look at it and tell me which one is most important, least important, that sort of thing. So, but we do have to get this training done sooner rather than later. What's the timeline on the training? I honestly do not recall it's by the end of the year. Okay. I don't recall when this commission did their training last, but I know each calendar year every commissioner is required to have four hours. So, and then that's it for my presentation. Um, if anybody wants to go over the development tracker, I put a QR code up that you can access it from your iPad. You know how to use it. You don't The things you and I talked about have been corrected. I have. Yes. Although I will say I do know there are several

developments on there and like I said in my emails, this is going to be an ongoing thing that we need to update regularly because things move from construction to completion or from approved to construction. can take and so it's just a matter of getting those updates made but we do have a system in place for it. It just I get it done. It takes a little bit of time to get done. So do you want to adjourn and then anyone that to uh wants any help with that? Do we have a motion to adjourn? I got one. Yeah, absolutely. Um, of course I'm new on this board. So I what what what's the purpose I guess of this board if when we come in and city each department is is okay or or told us that this is great. What's the purpose of us if I mean it it's a done deal basically if in my opinion. I mean, what's the purpose of us? It would depend on where it would depend on where a project is. If a project is coming in at the zoning stage, that's when you have more opportunity to kind of say these are the things we would like to see. It's when it's already been zoned and there's stipulations put in place with those zonings that You're right. You're you're somewhat limited at that point, right? because it's required by law for I understand that part of it but it's kind of like what I mean we're just here to say yes I will say that at a point yes I will say that Bob helped out a couple of times when some streets were very narrow and we added some sidewalks to both sides of the streets and some things like that that weren't originally in their plan that we were able to direct them to do before it was approved and I think that's the biggest part of this this commission is to make sure things are good for the future of that development.

It gets to the point to where and you know this is one of the things that planning commissions have to be extremely careful of and I've said this before and I'll say it other time because it's part of the it's law. You don't want to have to go in front of a judge in order for him to tell you you were wrong. I understand. I understand that. But there is a point in time where the compounding commission is has a very vital part of the planning process. But once that planning process is in effect and in place, then yeah, our hands are going to be pretty well tied and you can't deny something just because you don't like it. You can, but if there's enough people on the planning commission that vote that way, then yeah, you're going to go in front of a judge more than likely because whoever got denied is going to come back and say, you know, we met all the requirements and had all the things in place that we were requested to do based on the zoning orders, based on the subdivision regulations, and based on what we were told by the individual departments, which we have to rely on their expertise because we don't know. I'm not an engineer. I'm not a a mechanical. I'm not a civil. I'm not any type of engineer that would know the difference. I know what I would like to see and whatever we don't like on this particular development should weigh heavily on what you would want to see coming at the next development because anything that comes in now. But you get what I'm saying. It's already it's already a done deal basically before it comes to us most of the time. Well, not necessarily. Not necessarily. You'll see that that that process will change on each and every every every thing. But, uh, you weren't here when the Blackwood property was zoned to annex, right? That would have been an ideal time for you as a person who had the concern about it to speak up and then those things could have been worked. I'm not I'm not against the development. I'm against the traffic. Right. Yeah, I understand. Yeah. And that's the thing that one the

performance based zoning could could help address uh provided it's done right. And anytime you change your zone, you're going to be tweaking it from now on. I just don't want to see the taxpayers have to go back later on. Yeah. And and put you know, you're exactly right. Spend money to to for this when the developers it might be the developers should pay for it. And that's that type that's what that type of zone that I mentioned does. It puts the burden on the developer, the end user, the land owner, whoever buys the lots, they're going to pay for it one way or the other, but it takes the city away from being the person that has to fund it, right? That's that's the beauty part of performance based zoning. It's controversial, but it's also beneficial. Developers don't like it. That's plain and simple. They don't like it. They're the ones making the money. Well, they're the Exactly. So, I will I will say I feel like in some ways I'm in the same boat as you because I'm fairly new as well. And it's it's really been humbling to come in and learn from all of you who do this day in and day out. And I've asked myself a lot, well, is this a stupid question I'm about to ask? But I feel as a resident, I I would want to know. And and I've had a lot of people come back to me and say, "Ask your questions." Even if we've made these recommendations, ask them because that's what we're here to be a voice for. And you know, today was really a good time for you to bring up that zoning and for for David to chime in and say, you know, do do a working session if if you want to and and figure out how we can be more impactful moving forward. I would say that's definitely one of the

areas where commissioners have a lot of input is when we do things like change the zoning ordinance or amend the zoning ordinance. if there are things that you would like to see in that ordinance by letting staff know. I mean, every city has an ordinance somewhere. They're all available online and some are better than others. So, well, we're probably looking at realistically 6,000 new homes that have been approved to come somewhere along the line. We need to figure out a way to throttle that back. Now, Mhm. growth is good, but too much growth will make a man move. It's kind of one of my curiosity questions. When you look at surrounding cities and their growth, are we in line with that or are we playing catch-up because it seems like we we're trying to get it done now? A lot of stuff. I mean, I think we're a little behind what some cities have done, but I wouldn't necessarily say we're playing catchup. I mean, that's kind of a it depends on who you ask kind of question. Yeah. A lot of things just coming down the pipe. So, basically, Mr. towns and we put things into place such as the system development charges. Those those allow us to as we grow the city gets funds to grow. And so when we can ask the developers to do or or do improvements, we do. But we can't catch it all. Like Mr. Greg said, there's 6,000 houses. You know, it's impacting a little here, and it's impacting a little here, here, and here,

but it impacts the central core of what we do. So, there are going to be some roads, maybe Main Street, maybe Blackwood that are going to have to be improved 10, 15, 20 years out as more and more people get into Springfield, more vehicles go to Travis Price Park on a daily basis, you know, and we we like to think we're pretty good at kind of projecting where all that is, but you know, it's fluid and u the next group in is going to who's going to help the next planning commission go, okay, we need to be looking here and and y'all will help the next that planning commission, help the next board of mayor and alderman. So, yeah, we we're looking ahead, but we did, you know, we do need to look ahead more. We need to address these issues in the zoning ordinance so that Springfield grows smart and at a nice steady pace that we don't wind up like other places. There there's a place I just read about in Texas that's just right outside of Houston that has had like 3,000 homes built in the last 3 years. and they're trying to play catchup and their their main their affairs are way undized and so so yeah, you know, it's something to think about and y'all keep asking, y'all keep going, hey, we need because and and each and every one of you represents a ward. Talk to your alderman. Let them know what you're hearing here. Let them know what you're thinking so that they are aware that yeah, we got to start doing some things so that they're not caught off guard when y'all come to them

and go, "Hey, we want to revamp the whole zoning ordinance." They need, you know, so yeah, have those discussions, have those heartfelt discussions with the people that appoint you. They need to know. Well, I think that's u kind of what we are all after. We we want growth, but we want to get it right the first time. You know, responsible growth. Yes. That's why we're called a planning commission. Yes. Well, are we planning to bring any type of entertainment of any kind into this area? Any type of venues where uh we don't have a theater. You know, I think about that so often. We got a drive-in coming in where? Well, 431. 431. Okay. a driving. So when I was young, I because your mama wouldn't let you go. Well, I Yeah, that too. But I The kids have nothing to do. I mean, I know that the kids have nothing to do, right? And on the summer programs we I think that we have here is what at the Y. Yes, ma'am. So, you know, does the city have a recruiter for those types of things? No. that that so and we're not poised to recruit entertainment venues. Mhm. So, you know, we don't have an entertainment development board. We have an industrial development board. Okay. We have an industrial development. Yeah. But we're talking also about growth and you got to have I think and this is my opinion and we know everybody has one and uh to offer you know to we talk about our schools what we offer in our schools we talk about you know we don't have a bowling alley we don't have a skating ring we don't have these things you have a state park sure but just uh in inside things that we could would have to offer does that come into that I know you said we don't have an entertainment committee, right? Well, and I understand

that we don't we don't have anything that recruits that way. The other side of that is is you know, if we have those things, we have to support them. The reason we don't have a bowling alley is because people quit going to the bowling alley. The reason we don't have a skating rink is because people quit going to the skating rink. The reason we don't have a movie theater is because people quit going to the movie theater. So, you know, we farmed that out to other communities and we suffered the loss for it. And you know, maybe this would be a good time to interject that it would be nice to see that comprehensive growth plan and what all is a part of that cuz it sounds like some of our concerns here would have been would have been um identified there and proposed there, right? Like you should have and if not, we can get you a copy. No, I have access to you know I actually have physical copies for each of you. They're upstairs in there. Um, I thought I was bringing everything down tonight. Elements of those sorts of things are definitely in the comprehensive growth plan, but like Mr. Brewer was saying, the city's not a developer. So, and the other side of that is typically those sorts of venues don't come until you have the rooftops and it's it's a which one comes first. We want them, but we also know what you you need the houses and with the houses comes the traffic. So, it's all collective and everybody probably recognizes that they would like all of those things, but there is a reason they weren't sustainable in the past. That doesn't mean they won't happen. We still have a retail recruiting company. Yes. Do we have a motion to adjourn? Well, I mean, we're getting all we're getting way off in the weeds.

I got to go. [Music]