Town Board - Regular Meeting

Okay, I'd like to welcome everybody to the town of southeast town board meeting for August 6th, 2026. If we could rise for the Pledge of Allegiance.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Okay, just a reminder of the exits. We have two emergency exits in the back corner of the room. We also have an emergency exit up here to the left of us as you're walking up. Put your cell phones on vibrate or turn them off, that'd be great, any electronic devices. And I'll ask the clerk to call the attendance.

Councilman Cypress? Here. Councilman Larca? Absent. Councilwoman Lewis? Here. Councilman Mazzotta? Absent. Supervisor Castellano?

Present.

Thank you.

Okay. The first thing on our agenda tonight is the public hearing that we have scheduled. So if anybody would like to come up to speak about. I'll make a motion to open the public hearing. Second. All in favor? Aye. This is to amend chapter 138-44A, planning and zoning applications for signage.

Good evening. Peter Bell, zoning enforcement officer for the town of Southeast. Just a quick question. Do you have to have a two-sided sign in a place like Pugsley Road so you can see it coming up and you can see it coming down? Because right now, the only way that you can see it is coming down. There's no sign on the up.

I don't know which way it's facing, but generally they face the road, so they're kind of looking at it sideways. So on a corner, there'd be one facing that way and one facing this way. If that one is angled a certain way, maybe that's a problem, but this wouldn't fix it.

Yeah, the road is this way and the sign is this way.

Usually they're parallel with the road.

Yeah.

And this won't address that. Okay. Thank you.

Thank you.

Good evening, everyone. Lynn Eckhart, thank you so much. I just wanted to thank the board for moving on this. I think it'll really help residents a lot more, especially Peter brought up a good point. And I know on the Star Ridge and Route 6, it would have been very helpful. So thank you for all your work on this. And it was very fast, too. I appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you, Lynn.

Okay, unless there's any other comments, I'll make a motion to close the public hearing with a five-day written comment period. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? Aye. Thank you. Okay, we'll move on to our work session for tonight. Number one on the agenda was a discussion from our district attorney, Robert Tendi, but I see he's not here right now. He did not call me today, so I'm not sure if he's running late. So I guess we'll hold off on that and maybe continue it at our next meeting if necessary. And then number two is discussion from the Putnam County IDA pilot agreement for APAP, land management, Route 22, tax map 35-2-6. And you also have item number three, I'm sure you can tackle both of them at the same time here, is the discussion from the Putnam County IDA agreement for Kinsley Development, 20 Fields Lane, tax maps number seven dash two, dash 25.2. Mr. Knope.

Thank you. My name is Bill Nolk, I'm the chairman of the Putnam County Industrial Development Agency. And thank you for this opportunity to better present our request for resolution for the town, accepting the pilot agreements, better explaining the benefits and mechanizations of how the pilot works. I think we'll help everything here. And hopefully we'll go forward from there. I guess... At this stage of the game, again, we're asking for a pilot. Actually, we're asking for your resolution to authorize someone to sign for the pilot. And the mechanizations are is that when a project signs an agreement with the IDA, they go into an agreement and we have a lease agreement. When we take possession of the title of that property, that takes it off the tax rolls. And so rather than leave the town with nothing on the tax roll, the IDAs go and we have an agreement with the project that they will pay in lieu of taxes for the benefits or the the assessment that's due on the property itself, so that remains the same, and then they will scale payments for the project improvements to the property. And that's the standard project processes of 50% immediately, and then it goes up over 10 years to 400%. So we're asking for the signature on that one when we do the final closing. And that's that's what we're asking for. So is there any questions or clarifications?

Yeah, I have some bill. Yeah. And thanks for coming back and trying to clear it up. But over the last couple of years, we've had a few pilots come before us. And honestly, I'm surprised how confusing it's been. I mean, we've been told that all municipalities have to vote yes before you do it. We've been told it doesn't matter what any municipality does, you can do what you want. And we've been told that each municipality controls their own part of the pilot. still not 100% sure which is true. And I guess in the conversation you had with the supervisor recently, you told him that our no vote meant we get zero. So our options, our vote is yes is 50% or no is zero. And that was surely never made clear to us at any point prior to that conversation with the supervisor.

Well, I apologize for not making that clear because I've been in this for 11 years now, and it's the first time anybody's said no.

I understand that. That's part of the problem, I think, is everyone just.

It's part of the thing, and I understand that. And yeah, the mechanizations or the mechanics of it are really cut and dry. I mean, the state says the IDA takes possession of the property. therefore it's off the tax roll rather than stick the towns with you know no no tax benefits the whole purpose of an idea is to give you back tax benefits to bring business in and to increase your tax base which is what our job is and so we turn around and part of our universal tax exempt policy spells out the fact that we have to give a benefit to you, and it explains the process that we have to go through. And that includes the standard one, the typical one, is the 10%. It's similar to the old 485 process that towns used to do. But this way it's done. And now the state has gone and change the rules and they can be some pretty wild pilots, but we haven't participated in any of those yet. We actually, with the Pugsley Road projects, they came and they asked for a pilot that was a deviation from what was regular and we quickly decided that that wasn't going to fly and so we went to a standard 10-year pilot with them.

So just so I understand though, each municipality votes. You give the pilot regardless of what any municipality says. Municipality votes, a yes vote they get 50% first year, a no vote they get zero. And each municipality stands on its own. Is that accurate?

The answer is I looked all over the place. I've never found a place where it's been contested and lost. The only time that I ever heard about it, and one of the reasons why we originally said, well, we're here because we want to let you know that we have a pilot here and we're asking for your acquiescence to it, is that back years ago, Mount Pleasant contested one in Westchester County. And they lost the contest, but they spent a lot of money trying to go through court and stuff like that. So it just made no sense to get involved with that kind of stuff.

You understand that it feels a little weird that you're asking for my vote, but we still can't get a clear answer on the process. I mean, you told the supervisor that a no vote means we get zero. And then when I summarized it, it feels like you won't come out and say that.

Yeah, maybe we can start from the beginning again, because we did have a conversation offline recently to make sure we understand it. So your closing is coming up soon, right? That's correct. And when is the closing?

uh actually it hasn't been set a date yet but it's within the next couple of weeks okay so do you need our vote for that closing or are you guys going to just accept we need your signature on the paperwork that says that you agree to accept the pilot that we have negotiated with our project so that you guys can get the money.

Right. But his question is, do you need our permission to have the closing and take possession of the property? The answer to that is no.

No. So you can have the closing. If we vote no today. We're not voting today. If we voted no today. Right. You could still have the closing and take control of the property. That's correct. Lease it out to the business. Right. And therefore, it would be off the tax rolls for the town of Southeast.

I, to be honest, I'm not sure whether or not we would give you the money anyhow because our agreement is with the project for the amount that's described in our pilot lease agreement.

So you'll be in possession- And the rest should go back to the county, to the town. Okay, but you'd be in possession of the money because they would pay you guys. Yeah. And you would pay us through taxes. Yeah. But you need this agreement to pay us is what I understood.

Well, they don't have any obligation to pay the town anything because they're tax exempt. Okay. So if the IDA were to pay us the town anything, it would be at their discretion. um and even if we vote yes no no no if you vote yes then you're going to get the pilot okay and now that's let's we've got many ida projects in this town that are that are operated under idas under pilot agreements and uh it's really just an agreement that they pay monies to the town in lieu of taxes because they're tax exempt

Yeah, I totally get that, Will. There's projects I like and there's projects I don't like. But this is our third, fourth pilot vote since I've been on the board. And it has never been explained to me that a yes means I get half and a no means I get zero. So until Eric Larkin started last, Councilman Larkin started last time, because we left the meeting the last time you were here under the impression our vote didn't matter. And just speaking for the two of us, I know we all feel the same. Our vote's important. So if our vote doesn't matter, why give it? So after we make our statement that we're not going to vote because our vote doesn't matter, now all of a sudden we get threatened that we're going to get zero. It just doesn't feel right, Bill.

We're not asking you to vote for the pilot itself. We're asking you to assign someone the authority to sign the agreement at the closing.

I will let it go after this, but at no point in any pilot conversation has it been clear. It's always been phrased as you want our support to go forward with the pilot. That's just simply not true.

want our you want our vote to take the money or not and of course i'm going to take half over zero but you know well i think it's full of i was coming at it with the attitude that hi we're happy here because we've got a project that's coming in they're going to take and develop some property that has not been developed and increase the value of that property and so the tax base is going to increase and that's a benefit for the town of southeast and putnam county And that's what we're going for.

The vote wasn't about the pilot itself, Bill. I'm sorry, the vote wasn't about the pilot. Yeah, there's merits to pilots, there's merits to an IDA.

It was more about the process that is why we voted or didn't vote the way we did. So it's the mechanics, I guess, is what was hidden, and to be honest, In all my years, it was never explained to me quite as clearly as I had to bang my head against it to find out how deep it is. The attorneys are very good at writing a whole big thing about stuff like that there in a tiny little bit. By the way, the property belongs to the IDA. They have title and it's tax exempt. The only way to get the money to the towns is to have the agreement with the project that we will pay in lieu of taxes for what we described.

And what they end up doing is recording a pilot mortgage so that in the event the property or the occupant, the applicant, whatever, fails to pay, they can actually foreclose on the mortgage. That's true, yeah.

You've all heard me say this on the town board that my frustration since i've been involved in government is i feel like i have to break something to make progress and i feel like that happened again here we had to break this pilot boat to finally understand how a pilot works and it's it's the most frustrating part about government i mean that why we can't you know get clear answers get clear direction until we break something so

I apologize, but that's kind of what I've been up against for the last 11 years, is learning this stuff, and all of a sudden, every time you turn around, there's a little blurb somewhere hidden in the big stack of papers that says something that you might or might not agree, and trying to find somebody to explain it is a challenge.

So I understand the county legislature approved it already. Yes, they have approved both. The school district, have they voted yet? Has the school district voted yet?

No, they're voting on Wednesday, I believe it is. Tuesday?

Maybe Tuesday? Yeah, it's the 11th.

Tuesday, August 11th. And I've already talked with Mr. Carlson. We've got everything set up. We sent them a complete list of all the information that I sent to you, describing the mechanizations as we understand it now. And I think he's in agreement that everything will probably fall into line. They had an attitude that they don't have to do it until after the county does it. And as I explained, it was just a question of calendar. is that your meeting was the first one of the month, and so, hi, here I am, and it didn't fall into line where the county went first, and then the town, and then the school district.

Okay, and again, so that we're all clear, if we take no action tonight, it doesn't stop you from having the closing. That's correct. And when you have the closing and you take control of the property, you're off the tax roll. Right. And what we have in front of us, or potentially in front of us if we sign off on it, is a mechanism of receiving the lesser money that you guys had agreed to in the pilot. Well-

the lesser of the more money that you're getting because it's already and it's going to be assessed higher than it is currently but you know the improvements to the property got it okay thanks bill okay thank you thank you bill okay i hope it makes sense now it does okay it was very helpful thank you bill just one one question more just for clarity's sake when you had your closing

Do you also have the applicant sign the pilot agreement?

Yes.

So then you do need the authorization of this town for that pilot agreement at the closing.

my experience has been in the past that it's usually in advance that you have the authority or the the uh the authorized signature in advance of the closing right yeah a lot of times

especially in the days of covid everything was done electronically passed it around so i mean sometimes we never sat around i guess that was one good thing about covid well we only have we only have three town board members on today we don't we don't have it on the agenda to vote on today okay so we're would you consider letting us wait two weeks to uh august 20th and we'll put it on the agenda for a vote on august 20th right okay would you like me to come back again that night no you don't need to come back you don't have to if you like to you're more than welcome to come back we always like having people in the crowd but yeah no we'll be it'll be on the agenda for august okay and actually that was one of the things because uh right now you've seen a letter from our attorney

uh specifically for the apap project mckinsey project is still getting formulated it'll be virtually the same thing and we'll request the same thing is just your authorization for a signatory on that well we'll have a vote on it in two weeks for both of them okay on august 20th thank you very much okay thanks bill have a good evening thank you

Okay, I'll make a motion to go into our regular meeting. Do you have a second? Second. All in favor? Aye.

Aye. Okay.

Number one on our agenda is I'd like to make a motion to set a public hearing for Thursday, September 3rd, 2026 to amend the town code chapter 126 taxation. Volunteer firefighters and ambulance workers an exemption for surviving spouses i'll make that motion do i have a second second all in favor aye thank you okay uh moving on to item number uh two on our agenda is a resolution for 25 independent weight tax ID 56-1-28.1, the release of a performance bond that was sent to us from the planning board. I'll read the resolution here for you. Be it resolved that the town clerk is directed to cancel and return the original performance security erosion and settlement control for 25 independent way. Southeast tax map numbers 56.1-28.1. In the remaining secure amount of $8,000, and to return any and all original bonds, deposits, letters of credit, or security posted in connection with the project provided upon the express condition that the applicant slash owner file, first file an erosion and sediment control bond in the amount of $48,000. Such bond to remain in place during a period of the construction and the proposed office building to be located at subject premise and be it further resolved that the town clerk shall forward a certified copy of this resolution to the applicant, building department, and planning board forthwith.

There is a typo. I just found another one.

Okay.

So what the planning board sent you was 48,000. What the engineer sent was 48,500.

So is it 48,000? It should be 48,500. The resolution says 48,500.

Correct. Okay. But what the planning board sent us was 48. Was 48.

All right, so I'll change that number from the 48 that I read, 48,000 to 48,500. And that's the correct amount. Do I need to make an additional motion for that rule or anything, or have we caught it at this point?

We didn't even vote yet.

All right, so we're good? So it's 48,500. Just move it as amended. Moved as amended. Second. Thank you. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Okay, thank you. Okay. Item number three is a resolution to amend town fee schedule for filming permits. Be it resolved that the 2026 County Southeast fee schedule is hereby amended to insert a new line for filming permit and the fee to be charged in connection with such permit will be $500 per day or part of thereof. and be it further resolved that this resolution take effect immediately. Do I have a second?

Second.

All in favor? Aye. Item number four is a resolution that I'd like to introduce. I'll make the motion to introduce it again. Be it resolved, I'm going to read this off, I'm sorry. It's to amend the town fee schedule for food truck inspections. So be it resolved that the 2026 town of Southeast fee schedule is hereby amended to insert a new line for food truck fire safety inspection. There'll be no fee if the vehicle is brought to the building department for inspection and a $50 fee if the inspector is required to go to an alternate location to inspect such vehicle and be it further resolved that the resolution shall take effect immediately. I'll make the motion. Is there a second?

Second for discussion. We need to do something. So I'm going to support this. But I think between the multiple permits and the multiple fire fees, we've made this more complicated than it needs to be. And I didn't get my proposal done in time. So I'm probably going to suggest something different maybe for next season. But I'm fine with this for now.

Any other discussion? Nope. I'll make the motion. Is there a second? Second. Well, I second. Yeah. Second for it. Okay. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Thank you. Number five is new business. Is there any new business that any board members have?

Nothing. I have nothing.

Okay. Recognition of the public for public comment?

I'm sorry, I was so confused by the IDA. So good for you guys, but maybe someone can answer this question. So the IDA leases back to the company, is that correct?

Yes.

Okay. So the company pays the IDA taxes, is that correct?

They pay a payment in lieu of taxes.

Payment in lieu of, which is gonna be the 50% in this case, okay. And so it's the IDA then who won't pass this along to you? I'm really confused. That's what it sounds like.

I'm trying not to be super difficult.

And I want to paraphrase what the supervisor told me. But my take on the conversation was by voting no, we would get zero. Bill wouldn't stand there tonight and say, I am going to give you zero. Will said it would be their discretion. I don't know that that's a chance we want to take, but it was, and that's part of my frustration with the whole process is you can't just get a clear and definite answer, what will happen at each vote.

And my understanding of it is that what they haven't proposed in front of us, if we get the resolution done correctly, is a mechanism for the IDA to actually make some type of payment to us. Without that, they're not obligated to pay the town.

Right. It's not, I mean, the payments in lieu of taxes are made by the occupant of the property. Right. To the IDA. No, to us directly. We bill them. We send them out a bill.

I'm even more confused. We send them a payment in lieu of taxes bill.

We send them a payment in lieu of taxes bill. We do.

Is the resolution the mechanism of receiving those payments because that's what I was- The resolution allowing for a pilot agreement is what is the basis of those payments. See, because of the fact that the IDA is tax exempt, when they take title to any property, it becomes tax exempt. And they could go on and do their thing with the people they're gonna lease it back to, who are currently the owners, and pay the town nothing, as far as taxes are concerned, because it's tax exempt. And that's really a creature of state statute. It's got nothing to do with Putnam IDA being different than anybody else. But I think the problem with Councilman Larca and his struggling with this was that they were told, you all were told, and I was here when it was said, that we have to get the approval of the TOW before we can do this at all. Meaning enter into a financing arrangement with the owner of the property, which is not true. I mean, they have in their rules, in their local rules, that they would seek the approval of each taxing jurisdiction. But it doesn't mean that they would not be able to do that which the IDA does. And there are other incentives that IDAs give to property owners. When they take, they are exempt from mortgage recording tax. They're exempt from- Sales tax. Sales tax. They're exempt from a number of different things that really is an incentive to people to come into a particular location to do a development. commercial development. I think the problem with maybe these two were that they were so far down the line before the idea ever showed up that it sort of felt like, well, why are they getting an incentive? They're going to build here anyway.

That was my problem. I felt like they were already established.

But it's really, unfortunately, it's not our, we can certainly raise that flag. But I don't believe that it's something that we have any say over. It's really the IDA.

And that's why we chose to abstain, because we're led to believe that our vote doesn't matter. And honestly, I feel like we're pretty confused, and I wish Bill was still here. But Lynn and I both seem to think that Bill said- Your vote does matter.

Your vote matters because if you don't vote yes, you don't get anything. Right. The 50%.

I mean, I think that should have been explained the last three times we voted.

That's possible, but can someone foreclose? I mean, and I'm not suggesting you do it and then foreclose, but can they be eventually, can that be resolved?

No, because they're tax exempt. Okay. it's a tax exempt entity that right we can't uh we don't have the power and that part i get but i mean i feel like bill just said that they pay him the pilot money and it's up to him if they give it to us that was my understanding that's why i'm confused actually i would i wish laurie was here today uh because she she's the one that generates these letters so all right

Because what would be a benefit to the IDA to stiff towns just because, I mean, that just. Right, like if Bill got the money and didn't give it to us? Or the county, yeah. Right.

The IDAs are paid a lot of fees for doing what it is they do. So I gotta believe that there's some self-preservation aspect of this.

Well, it was my understanding that a great part of the IDA was that they would solicit businesses to establish themselves here, not- Right. Not bring a deal to a business that- I think in theory, Wendy, you're absolutely correct.

Yeah. In theory, you're absolutely correct. That was the initial motivating factor for creating IDAs. in the first instance when the state came up. Putnam County has an IDA. Tell us how these had an IDA. But there was a period of time that in state government they started looking somewhat more darkly on the town IDAs and the village IDAs. So they started to end up being disbanded, as ours was. probably 30 years ago.

I even can remember it vaguely. But so it is the planning board. I mean, this came as a surprise even being on the planning board to me. But that is a question the planning board can ask from the beginning. But it's hard to get answers sometimes.

Clearly. I don't know that the planning board, if they were to ask that question, many of these projects would, at that point in time, not know whether they were even applying.

who knows I know uh apparently no one well it's it's unfortunate but I don't think it's something that the planning board could uh well no we wouldn't refuse to no I no but it I the reason I think it would be good to know is because we are pro when our presentations are given to our residents they promise a lot and we all know this and it would be much it would be less disingenuous if They said from the get-go, you're going to get, instead of $20,000, the town's going to get $10,000 because we are doing a pilot program. I mean, I think that frustrates a lot of our residents because we're promised big money and then we don't get it. That's all.

But to that note, if the property is vacant and we're only collecting $5,000 and then next year there's a big building there and then we start collecting $20,000 and it gets cut in half to $10,000, it's still $5,000 more than we would have collected if the property remained vacant.

right and and i think joe to that point it does and and we don't need to get to a big debate but it does depend how much more traffic's going to generate what the bonuses are is it full of great white collar jobs that people are going to go out for lunch et cetera et cetera but um i just was curious i just wish the their the I guess the applicants would be a little more straightforward on this and I think they probably know you're right I think some of them don't but these this came as a surprise to me because they both you know or well at least certainly Kinsey's been in Southeast and we never heard anything about this so yeah and APAP I think was well into there yeah well into it so well into there Anyhow, I don't have to belabor it. I just wanted to ask.

Yeah, I mean, merits of pilot aside, it's the mechanics that frustrate me. And I thought I got it, and apparently I still don't. Anyhow, thank you.

Progress. Thanks, Lynn.

Okay, unless there's anyone else. No. Recognition of the town board for town board comments. Anybody?

No.

Okay, good. I'll make a motion to adjourn. Do I have a second? Second. All in favor? Aye. Thank you. Thank you.