Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

So, this microphone is for the internet, not for you guys. All right,

I call this meeting of the Seaside Planning Commission to order. This is a work session and we will be turning it over to the planning director, Jeff Flory. Thanks, Robin. Uh tonight we're presenting on the status of our comprehensive plan as well as a kickoff meeting for some housing code updates uh that we've received some grant money for and 3J is also going to take care of that for us. So uh without further ado, I'll turn it over to Scott uh with 3J and uh he'll uh run us through our comp plan and where we're at.

Awesome. Thanks, Jeff. And Jeff as I'm well actually frankly anyone here I'd like to have this be a conversation so please interrupt raise my hand or raise your hand not my hand and Jeff you've seen this you've been around this Robin you as well if I miss something or something that comes up that sparks you know a thought I' I'd love to have everyone's comments so we'll go through this presentation it's actually quite exciting that we're at this point it's been two years now in the making to get to the point where we are um we have the draft comp plan which is excellent It's probably 90 95% there, I'd hope to say. So, we're getting really close to the point where we're getting into adoption of the comp plan. Um, and I'll talk a little bit about that schedule. Uh, but I I kind of view this as our our first step in formally adopting a comp plan for Seaside. So, it's pretty pretty exciting that we made it this far.

Real quick, Scott, just so the commission knows and that you know, um, we do have volume that's being broadcast out even though it's not working on our speakers in here. So, use your microphone so the folks at home can hear what we got going on. Thank you. Great. And let's see if I can get this to work. Nope, it's not working.

You might have to just do it for me. Um, so the presentation tonight, I'm just going to talk a little bit about the comp plan and recap. Um, kind of how we got there, particularly the public involvement because that was a big part and a big effort. and then go through the formatting and how the comp plan um works and then talk a little bit about the the mapping updates we did because that's another big big step. Um and then how you can help us review the plan which I know you've already had gotten to take a look at that and then adoption and next steps. So um we'll talk about that. Uh and then next one please. Um you can go again. So the basically every city in Oregon has to have a comprehensive plan. Now some cities um update these more often than others. We're talking I think before the meeting a little about periodic review and needing to update comp plans, but um yours is from 1993. I believe it was updated since then. Um but it's been a while and you've done some peace meal updates. Um in this effort, you know, we really looking at all of the land use planning goals. Um there's 19 Oregon statewide planning goals that are included in the plan. Um and it really tries to provide a vision. So this it's a guiding document for the city and how the city will grow over the next 5, 10, 15, even 20 years. Um and those statewide goals are achieved through doing this comprehensive plan process. Uh just a little bit about the process itself. We started with a background report. So it's kind of like taking inventory of what the city has, where we are now. Um and we developed a vision. the vision statement was is kind of the the guiding principles for the comp plan. So you'll notice at the very beginning of the plan, we lay out the vision uh for the for the growth of the city. And then the next one, we then draft goals and policies. Um those goals

and and an action plan. And so that's th those are the pieces that actually um have some some teeth in terms of making rules for the city about how they grow. So you'll notice plans really focused around those goals and policies. So the comprehensive plan that we've drafted has that vision. It includes all the information. The background reports is are essentially that introduction to each of the chapters of that background report piece. Then those goals and policies as well as that land use map that we've developed. So we did a one of the very first steps was to do a community engagement plan. So figuring out how we wanted to effectively communicate this process with with the um public. Oh, we lost it. There we go. Um, so we had a project advisory committee that we met five times which was very effective kind of as our sounding board before we could do public meetings or we before we release things publicly. We would have uh uh committee meeting. All those were recorded and and made available publicly. We had a few community events. We called uh and then we did um community conversations where we asked the committee to go out and have those conversations. We had a website with online engagement and then those uh two large community summits and I'll go over what those looked like. So our advisory committee met five times. You know the whole goal of that was to to comment on work products as the project moved forward. Um also one of the main efforts was kind of to guide and lead the public outreach efforts in terms of recruitment for people doing those community conversations. um and then also act as a liazison between um other groups, maybe their groups, um we ask them to host those public events. Um and then hopefully when we get to this adoption process, our committee members will come to planning commission meetings potentially when we get to adoption and and council meetings to say, "Hey, I was involved with that committee and I want to I think we should move forward with this plan because and I support it

because I was part of the development uh and and committee." We did a a community survey um online survey at the very beginning where we asked lots of different questions. I think we had I think the next one shows the next slide shows how we we did some word clouds on things. We asked questions like what makes seaside special today? What should we strive to preserve or enhance? Uh why did you choose to live, work, visit or vacation in in Seaside? And these these questions were all tailored to kind of help us do that first thing which was the vision statement. So these were generally things we got 435 responses which is pretty good um for that survey. Um I just touch on a few of the topics but housing of course was something that came up a lot. We have um we address that in the plan a lot. Beach access um small town feel walkable community embracing history um estuary conservation. interesting thing that I thought about the main topics. You could you could literally put these within the 19 statewide goals if you wanted to organize them that way. So, it's kind of neat that the community was thinking about, you know, subconsciously thinking about those goals and how they would work for for Seaside. So these community conversations we had, we just asked um the basically our committee members went out and met with specific groups and we handed them a packet which is a packet of information on questions to ask and information and these are the groups that we tried to reach out to to talk to. Um I don't think we had all of them but we did a pretty dang good job at at um going and doing those community conversations. So I thought that was a successful way to try and develop the vision and get the word out that we're doing a comprehensive plan update. Um we had two of these community summits. This one was at the convention center. We very well um we had very good turnout. We had maps on tables. We had some activities. Um I think the next slide has some we did instant polling which was pretty cool. So we were able

to ask live questions and then get everyone's input at once. Um and so again all the we have all these reports if you're interested in looking at the results for any of this stuff. We have all the results from this. But the instant polling was great. Um and then I think the next slide shows the recap. So we had about 70 people there which was great. Um we went over project presentation, we did that live polling. Um we had everyone review the draft vision statement and then they worked in small groups to kind of help us refine that vision and then people stood up at the end and kind of gave their uh a little summary of what we talked about at the table. We also had that big microphone that you could throw around at the time. It was a big blue microphone and that was a fun fun thing that uh you have at the convention center. Um and then the sec second one we did at Times Theater which we did some a different kind of instant polling. It was called Slido. But this was such a cool event because um people really kind of got into it and we were able I felt like a game show host up there um asking questions and everyone and I think that a couple beers you know that allows people to kind of loosen up a little bit. started opening up about halfway through.

Yeah. Yeah. And then it was interesting too. So we had this comment form um there available and some people filled it out. It was really interesting because you could see the results of these people's answers just come up on the screen. So it's really neat that people were able to type that out and I thought that went really good. I think the next slide just shows some of the questions. We asked things like um about community engagement, equity, um his historic resources, land use and urbanization, economic development, employment. So you'll notice that these questions we asked really relate to those chapters in the plan. Um uh and then um basically we wanted to ask about the goals because at this time we were beyond the vision. We had the vision statement and we were coming up with goals and policies. So we said we asked things like how do you make our transportation system more connected for all modes and people would type in uh their answer. So it was pretty cool. And then we had 16 questions. I don't I won't read them all but um again they they go they run the gamut from things like housing to transportation um parks and recreation um natural hazards, energy, um coastal resources. So the idea was again that these 16 questions were supposed to cover all the topics that we're going to talk about in the plan. So I thought it was cool. I would love to do that type of meeting again. Um I would recommend that any maybe some of these other planning efforts where we do uh public outreach we we utilize the same technology and um I just thought it was a fun a fun fun meeting. So any thoughts or questions about that public involvement? I think you know we did put a lot of effort into that. Um there is one I I'll get to this but we're going to do another uh final kind of survey on the draft plan to do a kind of a final wrap up of public involvement before we get into adoption as we get into adoption. So but it seemed to be uh very very well taken. So the next one is the the comprehensive plan.

So I wanted to just touch on those state 19 statewide planning goals. Um, now interestingly enough, there's some that don't apply to every city. So, for example, we don't have to deal with goal 15, which is the Wamut River Greenway because we're not we don't have the W River Greenway here. And then in some other cities, when I worked in um in Redmond and update their comp plan, for example, we didn't have beaches and dunes or coastal shorelands. So, just because there's 19 goals doesn't mean there's going to you have to address them all in your comp plan. It's tailored specific to each city. Um, the other thing I'd say is that some comp plans are organized chapter by goal. Um, we didn't do that and I'll talk a little bit about why we didn't do that, but I think it the format worked really well. Um, but again, we start with a vision statement and I think the neat thing we did here is we had, you know, discussing how we created the vision and then, um, how that leads into the development of the comprehensive plan. But there was kind of six topic areas that the vision touched on that came out of the public outreach and that was housing, strong economy, nature in the city, inclusive neighborhoods, accessibility and safety and history and culture. So um there's a vision statement about each of those and again these are kind of your overarching points uh to touch points that that guide the the plan as the vision document. Um and then we have 10 chapters. Um we have community engagement and equity, community services and historic uh resources, land use, urbanization, transportation, public facilities, infrastructure, economic development, employment, housing, parks and recck, natural resources, the environment, and the coastal resources preservation. So those 19 goals, at least the ones that pertain to seaside, are all kind of collapsed within those 10 chapters.

Question for you. Yes, please. Um the order that these are in, were they chosen for a specific reason? What's the thought behind that specific order? Just curious. That's so it it does kind of follow the 19 goals. So, for example, um goal one is community engagement. So, that's that's our first chapter. Um and then goals 181 19, the last goals are coastal resource preservation. So, they do they do attempt to reflect the same order of the of the statewide planning goals. um they don't do it perfectly, but that was that was the idea of that's why we we they became in the order they are. And then these are the 10 out of that 19 that apply to

Well, actually there's some some of these chapters um have multiple goals within them. So I'll show you how that works. But that's that's a really good question is and I and I made a point in the in the plan to identify at the very beginning of each chapter what goals um that chapter pertains to. But yeah, no, that's a great question, Scott. Just to Yes, please. Just to piggyback on that, I I really like that flow, the way it is structured. I'm just putting it out there.

I I really do. I It has a great flow because it introduces everybody. it uh groups the uh the human element of it and then you get into uh what we need to have as far as you know a society and um I just I just really like the way it flows.

Yeah, I was I was very happy with it too. I think like I said the easiest thing to do would be to make a chapter for each of the goals that pertain but um there's there there's the other thing is there's overlap between goals. you can cover a goal in one chapter or two chapters frankly. So you'll see that as well. Um so I want to use the the land use and urbanization chapter kind of just as as an example, but every chapter has the same outline. So they're all set up to have an introduction, which again is a lot of that background information about where what Seaside is today. Um and then um we also talk about future. So maybe there's a forecast or future need that's discussed as part of that. Then the kind of the meat of each chapters is the goal statement and the policies. And as a planner and as a planning commission, the goal the goals and policies are really what guide your decisions. So, you'll notice like um when Jeff comes to you with uh a staff report, someone's proposing a new mixeduse building downtown, let's say, and they may might need a conditional use permit for X, Y, and Z. So, he'll write a staff report, but a lot of the times you have to have findings. You'll, you know, there's findings and recommendations in that staff report. And as planners, we look at the goals and policies in the comp plan. as long as your plan's still relevant and not 20 years old to to kind of to make those arguments to help planning commissions and uh city councils make decisions. So, this really should guide decision-m at at at a government level. So, I I have a kind of a clip of each of the goal statements from each of the chapters. I don't think we'll spend the time going through each of them, but I want you to I want to show you how they work. So what every chapter has a has a set of goals and policies. Um and so we make a goal statement like conduct meaningful community engagement through

collaborative and inclusive process in in implementation of the seaside comp plan and future planning and policy decisions. So that's our goal and actually that's kind of a state requirement. It is a state requirement. part of all planning processes, you have to do public outreach and it's frankly it's probably a third to half of the effort we do as planners when we're doing planning process. It's a really big deal. So, um that's why goal one is community engagement. Um so then if you once you have the goal statement, then we have policies that that back up that statement. So what are we going to actually do as a city to make sure that the that we do have meaning meaningful engagement through collaborative um processes right so one example would be um residents and property owners shall have the opportunity to be involved in all phases of planning efforts of the city including collection of data and the development of policies. So it's a statement on how we make sure we do that engage youth and in civic activities through canvasing fostering a sense of community involvement responsibility and leadership among young residents. So, a couple good examples. Um, and then the next one I believe is um, community service and historic resources. Very similar. Um, and oh, the other thing I wanted to point out is we have little icons. So, the idea was we had a colored icon. So, when you're going through the chapters, you kind of have a visual representation of of where we are. And I think in the version you got there, we still may have a couple of those that need some updates or not. So if if we're missing an icon or the icons use double, we're working on making sure that all gets refined. But I thought that was kind of a neat thing to do is there's a kind of a color scheme and an icon for each chapter. Um but again, this is the community service and historic resources example. This is land use and urbanization. So I like this one just because it talks it's land use and we're planners and a planning commission. So we have to goal statement one, manage growth through cooperative efforts between the city of Seaside and Klatso County to provide residents with high quality of life, promote urban

development, encourage the efficient delivery of services, and preserve adjacent agriculture and coastal lands. Now that's a mouthful. That's a lot of things to do in one goal. So we have multiple policies and you'll notice some of the policies um in the plan you'll have you might just have one under the goal, but sometimes there's three, four, five or six. So depending on the goal, you would have the relevant policies that go with that. Scott, real quick, and some of these things, specifically in this uh specific goal statement, it says preserve agricultural and coastal lands. Yeah,

that those those are that's language taken straight out of Oregon state law. So, some of that stuff we have to have into our plan and we can't really make a lot of changes. Now, we can change the policies on how to achieve that, but the goal statement itself, you know, per Oregon state law, there's things that are mandated that we hold on to.

Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, Jeff. So, and I think that that'll come up again when I ask you to do your review. Um, we'll happily take comments on some things. There may be some policies and goals in there that we just we're just kind of required to have, particularly in the coastal chapters. the esttoary protection stuff. That's there's a whole set of state rules that outline estuary and protection and how how it's done in a comprehensive plan. And it's actually going to end up being one of the larger chapters. You'll notice the coastal chapters because of all those requirements. And so question then, yes, as we're going through that. Yeah.

Are there because I haven't been able to go through the whole slide deck that we got. Yeah. um as we go through there is are there sections that mark demarcate not changeable required or are we going to have to go through and say hey is this required is this required is this required no they don't that's a really good point we I don't I don't identify what's required and what's not um but if you have a question or a comment about that you could put it in there and say this seems odd is this required that that'd be a fine comment for for me to take from you and then frankly if it is required then you're going to see it left in there and if not we'd consider removing it or changing it based on whatever comment. I was just thinking for efficiency purposes. Yeah. No, that's a really good idea.

And some of the things that are required the the policy on how we get to that requirement is flexible. Yeah. If you have a better idea on how to achieve that goal statement through policy, that's that's where we want your ideas in there because you may have a way to achieve that goal statement that's not on paper yet. And maybe it should be there. Maybe it's specific to seaside, a specific seaside way of getting to that goal that we want to look at and want to potentially implement. Sure. Remove all red tape. Let us do what we want. Exactly. There's your policy.

And you know, remember too in this whole scenario, this has to be um recommended by the planning commission and then adopted by the city council and then acknowledged by the department of land conservation and development. So yeah, we can put whatever we want in there, but they may not acknowledge it at the end of the day. So we want to make sure we're following those those required goals as closely as possible.

Yeah. And I would say too, I don't want you to feel like this onus or pressure to make sure that it's not your responsibility to make this perfect, but what what we want you to do is is make sure that you support it and understand it so that when we do get to council, you can say, "Yeah, we went through this and we asked, you know, Scott and Jeff and these questions and we were able to, you know, give our input because there might be some stuff you find in here that we do we probably should change." And that's okay, too. So, I guess we can just click through the next. I mean, I think there's transportation. This is one where we didn't quite finish the icon, but it might be finished now. Um, economic development, employment, um, public facilities and infrastructure. Again, these are chapters, just examples of the of the goal statements. Um, parks and wreck, natural resources and environment again, uh, and coastal resources and preservation. So, that's the last one. Um, any other questions or thoughts on kind of the format of the plan, how the goals and policies work? It's it should be pretty straightforward. Um, and again, I'll get to this when we talk about the review, but I would recommend really focusing on the goals and policies when you're doing your review because that background information stuff, it's kind of it it is there. Some of the future forecasting and whatnot, it is what it is. So, uh, another thing that I'm a geographer. My background is geography. And so, I'm a I'm a map nerd. So, we ran into a problem here when we first started. And, well, one of the neatest things I think you're going to get out of this, in my opinion. I love the plan part, too, but I love I love me a good map. So, we've updated your your your comprehensive plan map, your zoning map, your urban growth boundary, your city limits. Um, we first jumped in here, we realized that, oh my goodness, this we have three different versions of your city limits. So, the state has one, the county has one, the city has one. So, one of the main goals was to figure out how are we going to update your city

limits to make and and and actually we can't just change the line, you know, it has to be based on an ordinance. So, that was one. The next one next thing we looked at, I think, is um your zoning files. So again, there was a whole bunch of different zoning layers and I think Jeff was using a paper map on his wall and there was another PDF version that was old and so and the county had a different version on their GIS system. So it was one of these things that was really important to do was to make sure that some of it was just cleanup. I think the next ones show kind of some examples, but for example, this was these were some of the old versions of the map and so this would be a PD that was placed. So but maybe the zoning map was never updated. it wasn't reflected on that. So, um, we were able to do that. And the next one I think is another good example to just, you know, this is A2, A1. What is it, right? What is what was the actual zoning on that? It's aquatic zone, so it's not a development zone, but you know, what is it? Is it A1 or A2? So, we went through and we we updated all those maps. One of the neat things we're able to do is that we do these things the city does as planners. We do we have to notify the state when any ordinance is is done from a land use perspective. It's called a PPA or post acknowledgement plan amendment and so we notify the state and it's kind of a pain in the butt but it's something we do and because the state needs to keep track of all this stuff but the neat thing was as we were starting this they had just um started to digitize all of their records. So, they had a they were really able to help us with the UGB alignment and the city limit alignment um based on actual ordinances that that the city had notified the state so that we weren't we didn't have to go back and justify where the line was. We just looked at old ordinances and said, "Oh, well, the map just wasn't updated when this ordinance was adopted to ex to do this uh annexation or whatever it may be." Uh what's the next slide here? So, this is your map. It's pretty cool. Um, so this

I want to point out something that's really important. This is both your comprehensive plan map and your zoning map. So this is new. A lot of cities have two maps. They'll have uh a comp plan map which is kind of your future land use map and you have a zoning map. And um the tricky part with that is and not that this is a wrong system. I mean most the majority of cities in the state actually have a two map system is that oftentimes zoning changes will happen but then the comp plan map isn't updated or vice versa. The comp plan map is changed and the zoning and ideally your comp plan um designations are similar to your zones. So the whole goal here is that we now have a cleaned up urban growth boundary. We now have a cleaned up city limits. we now have a zoning map that we can rely on that's now going to be your both your comprehensive plan map and your zoning map. So, um I think this was something we accomplished. Um the state helped helped kick in some grant money to help us get this done. It was months of work. I I want to say we did this for 8 months or more just working on this map.

There's a lot of meetings. Interestingly enough though, um, when we kicked off this project, I was going through our public library and the materials that they had there. And the public library had a plan from 1979 that was the start of our original comprehensive plan. And in that plan that was adopted by the city council was a comprehensive plan and zoning map. It's a one map system 1979. Uh, which that it's hanging on my wall in my office. If you guys are in there, you'll see it. and which was kind of unique because that was the only time that I had ever seen a comprehensive plan map because we've never had one. Abby, you've

been in the office for a long time and there's never been two maps. It's always been one map. We can never figure out why, but that original map from 1979 says comprehensive plan and zoning map. Yeah.

So, it's a good it's a good way to do it. I I think I mentioned I did it Redmond's comp plan and they did um they did the same thing. They went with a one map system. Um so, not unheard of. But I think it hopefully it'll serve you well and it'll it'll it's something the neat part too is that the county and the uh state were in on this and have acknowledged that this is have agreed on the boundaries and the designations and all this stuff. Um so right now this map is not adopted. So this is this is not not a a map that you can legally use when a permit comes in yet. But the neat thing is once the comp plan gets adopted, you'll also have this map adopted. So you're essentially doing a zoning update, too. So that's something I got to remember when we do go to adoption is that might that may be a separate ordinance beyond the comp plan is adopting an actual zoning map as well.

So um that just occurred to me. If during that adoption phase, if a zone changes, if a current zone changes to something else, how is that dealt with? it just everything's that's there existing is grandfathered in or Yeah. So the ne the thing about this is we actually didn't change any zoning. So you won't you won't actually what had happened was the map had just not been updated. Got it.

So the zoning the the ordinances are there so that that that didn't change. So I that's a really good question because that would be we would have to do measure 56 noticing if we did there's a that would be a bigger deal but luckily we don't we didn't actually change one parcel from one type to a different okay different type so it's more of just a cleanup and an acknowledgement that everyone agrees that this is the correct data now that takes a little bit of pressure off to be honest well and and that's for this project but to uh to take your question further maybe we will ask Jeff in another meeting because yeah, let's say we do do a zone change y

at XYZ property are the surrounding parcels uh grandfathered under the existing zoning

to to so to do a zone change it's an ordinance uh it's an ordinance through the city council that's adopted by the state starts at the planning commission though with a a uh a recommendation. So if, for example, if a property owner looks at this map and says, "No, my my zoning is supposed to be X and you have it listed as Y." Okay, now we need to go dig through ordinances and find the ordinance where that zone change occurred and and we'll have it here. Kim will have it and the state will have a copy, should have a copy through the pop-up process. If that's the case, then it's a simple ordinance cleanup where we will go through the whole process of a zone change similar to what you have seen as the commission before

all the way up through the council with the notation that this was the original ordinance that was adopted. We've adopted a new map. Does the council want to honor the old zoning that was changed before and and make that make that change?

Um, everything in this should be uh supported by ordinance already. Um, that's where DLCD coming through with their digitiza digitization process really helped us because all of those paper files became organized and digital to where DLCD could go through and say, "Yeah, this is this is the uh this is the uh acknowledged mapping that we have. um which now we can update that with 3J putting it into a GIS system where we can control that and make sure those updates happen and those shape files will be shared with the county so it'll be on the county's web maps as well. Okay, with their their GIS department

and so so finding the 1979 dual map and what we have here is an quote unquote finished product essentially. there were no big surprises or big changes other than oh hey this should be tweaked here and so that one example was like there was a a plan unit development that was approved and but it was never mapped so the base zone stayed the same but so exactly that so it's it's basically cleaned up but this is like the perfect segue to my my next topic which is which I'm going to talk about tonight which is this zoning update that's exactly what we're going to do

with um the middle housing um zone is we're going to look at making some changes to your zoning code to allow different housing types. So that would be a different process though. That would be a totally different process um than than a comp plan. But that would that will be an ordinance. So we're going to work together on this on this housing ordinance which is the next topic. And you'll um I don't I don't know if we need to bring it up now but um I'm just checking for Oh. Okay. We have a commissioner via Oh, okay. Yeah. Um, Zoom. I'm gonna bring him in really quick. But yeah, I think that

Yeah, we'll talk about it more during my second short presentation, but I think that it it'll help you it'll help us all understand, you know, that kind of zone change and we may end up doing noticing. You only have to do measure 56 notice if you're downzoning. If you're taking away someone's ability to do something, if you're allowing more things, then you don't have to Uh, do notice everyone. So, Commissioner Mitchell, are you there? Can you hear us? Let's test your audio really quick. Yes, I can hear you. Microphone's going. Can you hear me? Yeah, but it's not coming. Oh, because our speakers speakers aren't working.

Shoot.

He type in the chat if he wants. Yeah, that might be your only way to ask questions is to type in the chat and we'll read it out loud if we if they come in. Okay. Okay. So, anyway, um again, I I love maps. I'm I'm pretty happy with how this one turned out. Um we can print as big as small as we want now that we have all the GIS updated. So, it's all digital. Um we can the next one. So, um I think we can go to the next one, but this one I just want to talk about kind of I mentioned doing one more survey. We still got that in the works. I wanted to get the plan to you all in draft format before I gave it to the public just because I thought that would be nice. So, the idea again is we're going to have another C another seaside uh survey where we I want to ask like a question or two about each of the uh plan chapters. So, if you go to the next slide, I think I recently did this. I'm I'm helping Manzanita do their comp plan update as well. And we had um we did a public meeting specific to goals, the beach and the beach resources and beach dunes goals 18 and 19. And I want to basically have talk show the policies in the plan. So they'll be able to read the policies in that chapter and then we can ask two simple questions on each chapter. So it'll probably be 20 questions. It'll be, you know, what's currently working under this goal, what's not or, you know, what needs improvement or attention. So I think it's going to be a pretty general uh survey, but that's the whole idea and we'll get that up in the next week or so so that we can kind of release the draft plan publicly and then have a way for to get more public feedback. So, any thoughts or recommendations on that piece? Does that sound like a good way to do it? We originally had like a we talked about doing a another uh summit, but I wasn't quite sure how to

once we have the plan done. I didn't want to go back out and say, "Well, what do you think?" and open it back up, you know, when we have a draft plan. So, I wanted to I thought this might be a better way to have them specifically react to the draft plan and and policies within it. So, and how is that going to be executed? We haven't done it yet. So, the idea is that we're going to um probably use social social media and the city website and then it'll be uh usually I like to use survey monkey just because it's a quick tool and we'll set up the questions and policies and

send that out and so if it'll essentially be a web link that we can email, we can put on social media, we can put on the website and and then also have a link to be able to look at and download the plan itself. So at at those uh the summits that we had you know at the convention center at the times uh were email addresses gathered at that time? Yes, that's what I thought. That's a thank you. See that's why I asked the question. Brilliant. So I think we should utilize that mailing list that we've developed through this process. Send that link and send the draft plan and say hey thank you for being at these events. You helped us develop this plan. Awesome. Yes. That's why I asked questions. I like the side by side comparison where you can read it and then comment next to it. I do that a lot.

Okay. Just up my what I do for a living. Okay. Where it's side by side. Here it is. Here's the update or here it is. Let's make comments. It it it makes it easy to easy to go step by step. So for me that's a great great

Yeah. And I was thinking you know how like on surveys you click like we we'll have it organized by chapter. So then once you're done with that those policies and the comments on that one, you can click next. And people might not have comments on every single one, but that's fine. They can just click to the next chapter. So awesome. Um the next thing we did is we had we called it a technical advisory committee, but really it included city staff, county staff, and DLCD. Um they've been sent the draft plan. I think you might have heard me mention this, but we did receive feedback um from a lot of these folks already. I have to tell you all of their comments have not been um incorporated into the current draft that you have. So again we we will be going through another round of draft edits based on the input we got from the U technical advisory folks as well as yourself. So um I think the next slide just talks about um DLCD. Yeah, particularly the coastal chapters um because they have staff they're I I'm a city planner. I'm not a coastal expert. So, um, I really rely on those coastal experts to be able to help us with those chap with those chapters. So, that'll that'll be great. Um, so in terms of plan adoption, our next step, this was kind of our timeline, the planning commission and council meetings. I think, you know, this probably is more aggressive than we're really going to get to is I I I don't know, Jeff, you think adoption February is probably too aggressive, but you know, if we have another work session, this is kind of our November work session. Maybe we have another work session or what we we may actually end up doing two a public hearing and keeping that public hearing open for a month. Um we actually have to do a public hearing for you to make a formal recommendation to send it to council. So, at some point, we're going to have to get beyond the work session and kind of get down to brass tax and have you guys really make a recommendation. And that that include that will include a formal public hearing with noticing and whatnot,

which which uh DLCD and state law, we've got to we've got to put out the pop-up notice what 35 days 35 days. So, a public hearing at the earliest could happen in January. In January. So, and you know, December, nothing happens in December. So, so we'll probably end up skipping December, just being honest with you all. And we'll move into January, February, uh, March, and potentially even April for council to do that because they're going to do two. I think they're required to do two public hearings, right? Our council requires three readings. Three readings. Okay. Uh, and it can be done in two meetings. Something like this, I doubt they'll do in two meetings. They'll want three. So, we'll do three meetings. 106 pages. They're gonna

take a little bit more time. So again, probably more aggressive than I than reality, but we'll be into early next spring till we get hopefully we get through adoption of the comp plan. That's great.

Yep. Um and then um how can you help review the chapters? I mentioned this. Focus on the policies. Provide feedback by commenting. Um we're going to send a review link. I'm hoping to get it out tomorrow. If I don't, I promise it'll be this week, but it'll be just to the planning commissioners. And it's and it the reason I'm doing it this way is because um rather than have you all mark up a plan, I I figured I'd organize it kind of like a survey where we have where you go through and then we'll have um you can comment on each of the policies or whatever or or skip it. So, we'll just make it a way to collect it all in one spot rather than um taking comments on the plan. So, feel free to do that. Um the other thing that you could do is if that's not the best way, you can always take notes and send me an email. We'll be flexible, but trying to be organized as we can to get you a link to help with that with that review process. And I it's not a huge rush. I think we'll probably give you a few weeks to do that. Um especially since we're not likely going to meet in December, probably even more than a few weeks to do that review process. So, um yeah. So, that's kind of what we want you to do as part of part of the planning commission review. um because I'd like to get to the point where I've incorporated all of your comments um before we get to that public hearing where we're making a recommendation. So, we'll have another draft based on the technical advisory committee and then the planning commission's comments. We'll do another uh cleanup draft and then we'll do those public hearings.

Will you have a due by date then on there?

Yeah, I'll do that. That's a good I I will. That way you can make sure that get some sort of deadline. I appreciate it. All right. Um, yeah, I think I just had to, you know, review those policies. Oh, the other thing that I've done, and I don't think we're you're going to utilize this, but what I've done and I will continue to do is, and I I mostly do this for DLCDs and also once we get to adoption, it's nice to know what the goals were and then what we're what we're proposing. So, I have a I actually have a spreadsheet that I'm logging all of this in so that we can go and say, "Well, this is what your current plan says and these are your new policies." And there's a there's a direct comparison uh to uh be able to review. Um the state really likes that and I know that a lot of times elected really like that too. So, they can say, "Well, you know, how is how different is this in our current stuff?"

And and as you can see, it's drastically different organization and layout. It is completely different. plan. That's why this is a whole new comprehensive plan. It's a brand new thing we did. Yeah, we we basically started from scratch. So, that's just another tool we're using. And if you want this, we can share this with you. Um that's not a problem. Yeah, that'd be great.

Um so, next steps, I'm going to update the plan again based on your input and the and the technical folks. Um we're going to do that community survey. We'll do your public hearings as I mentioned. We'll probably do a city council work session, then city council public hearings. So, that's what's going to take us into spring is is those next steps. And I think that's it for that presentation. Um, any questions, thoughts? You now have you will hopefully have a new comp plan to use when you're making all your land use decisions as a commission now. Well, I say thank you for all your hard work and input, both of you. Yeah. No, it's been fun. It's It's the Bible, you know. It's the Bible

in my opinion. So good. Oh, good. Rogers. Oh, what does Roger say? He can hear us. So, that's good. Wonderful. He'll have to talk type in the chat if he wants to tell us anything unfortunately because we can't get the speakers to work. Any questions? Anybody? Any other thoughts before I get on the other one? Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I mean that that was kind of the idea tonight is you wanted to have a discussion, but it's probably better to just really go dive into that plan, start reviewing it, and let let us know what you think.

Really didn't expect you guys to digest that entire 117 page uh plan over just one weekend. So, there's a lot there. There's a lot to look at uh before you want to start having discussions on it. Next meeting I will have a quiz. So bring your number two pins. I'm just joking. It's a robust document. I'm gonna tell you that. I'll cheat off of you. So I put that word out there.

Well, good. Okay. Um so this is a really short presentation, but this I I um this is a grant that the city received in 2024, I believe. So, it's um that DLCD gave the city to look at doing middle housing code updates. So, um and you're right on the cusp of 10,000, right? Or do you break 10,000 already? No, we're we're at 7,300. 7,300. Okay. Got a little ways to go.

So, this is kind of being proactive because um a lot of these middle housing rules at the state level don't kick in till you're about 10,000 uh population wise. Um but there are some things that you are required to do um that your code is not currently in compliance with anyway. So that's this whole project here. So let's jump into that. Well and and also yeah since you guys are going to take a deep dive into this. Yeah. Yes. This is going to get us closer to being compliant with state law. No, we're not going to probably get there because the laws keep changing before we can adopt. Y the goal is to get us as close as we can and then as rulem happens at the state level we can come back and make amendments to this

we're catching up yeah just get us caught up and get us in a good spot and then let's work on keeping caught up after that and I I will say that that is not abnormal

um you know I did a very similar project to the as to this in um in Warrington their middle housing update I did in Newberg I did very something very similar similar grant and they're in the same situ situation uh you are in terms of of getting there. I also think that this is it's kind of like the lowhanging fruit to allow for more housing which you all need. So um but yeah, the whole idea is to kind of address part of your housing need um expand opportunity for middle housing. middle housing. You probably know what it is, but it's basically dup the the way they define it is duplexes, triplexes, quadplexes, um cottage clusters, um multif family, some multif family housing, and what am I missing? Adus. Yeah, ADUs. So, those are kind of the the things that that we're looking at um you know allowing or making more easily done and then also again being in compliance with the RS's. Um so there you go. I just tried to memorize it and I had it on my next slide. Um yeah, I think the idea is to kind of remove barriers to development for more housing types. Again, this is I always people think you'll hear you I'm sure you've heard this a lot, but the term affordable versus workforce. There's all these things. We're not really addressing affordability in this, but we're trying you do address affordability through housing stock. So, if you got more housing, it's going to hopefully help with affordability overall. And also t these types of units tend to be smaller and more dense, which then makes them more affordable uh just in in their nature of their their their design. So that's that role. Um I I did this schedule and um it takes us through next next summer. We may be able to do it faster. I wanted to I was probably conservative in the amount of time that I had. Um I also didn't tell you that as

planning commission you are our form my formal committee. You're my advisory committee. So we decided not to do to you know on the comp plan we had a specific committee that did this

steering committee. steering committee, but we really only have about four meetings for that committee through this process. And I thought that you all would be you're the ones that are going to have to adopt this and move move it forward. And it's kind of fairly technical in terms of the things that we're going to work on. So, it made more sense to have the planning commission be our steering committee. So, you're wearing two hats. You're wearing a planning commissioner hat and a and a project committee steering committee hat as part of this. So, I mostly want to point out my colors. There's essentially four tasks. What we're going to do is we're going to do communications and outreach. There's there's a there is a public survey and online public meeting that we will have just one of those. Um, and then we're going to basically do a code audit. That'll be my first step. And then we're going to draft the code updates. And then we're going to do a final code update for adoption. So, those are the real tasks. But essentially, here's our first meeting in November planning commission meeting. Um, we're going to do stakeholder interviews in the next couple months as part of that scope. So, we're gonna probably talk to some folks that build this type of housing to try and, you know, that have used your code um that um will give us feedback on what works and what doesn't because that's always a really good start is, you know, talk to the folks that have to to build it. So, those stakeholder interviews will happen. Um, we'll come back after we do the stakeholder interviews and at this meeting in February, I want to have my code audit and some concepts done. So, and the interviews so that our next meeting what I'd like to share with you and probably it might be March, it might be February, but it'll be right in there. I want to share with you the results from those um interviews as well as our initial code audit, what we found. Um, then we'll come back in May with a draft code update. Um, so that'll be here's the our recommended code changes to for the middle housing and then um and then in June we'll probably have I was thinking maybe a joint work

session where we actually come back with kind of the code update that we're going to recommend for adoption and then get into adoption next summer. So, but this again is is will be an ordinance and it'll be a a code code change

and it'll it'll mostly target well it will target your residential zones. It's not going to we probably won't even look at your commercial or mixeduse zones. It'll be just your residential zones and allowing uh these middle housing types in those. Um if you're over 10,000, you have to allow those uses within there. But the neat thing is we can as we work through this, we there's a lot there's more flexibility um for us to make some choices as as a commission and as a guide as a committee to uh make sure that it fits for Casside now. And then once you hit that 10,000 and you're forced to do all those things, you could do that then. But it's but well, as Jeff said, it's move we're moving forward.

Can I uh can I question Jeff? And you probably know this. In that uh project, does it address manufactured housing as well? It should. There should be some updates to our manufacturer code because it is out of date right now. Okay. Okay. So, we need to look at that. Okay. And we'll look at the scope. Scott and I haven't sat down and gone through the code. That's where the code audit's going to really reveal what we need to do. But yes, manufactured dwellings has to be part of this because we are out of compliance on our manufacturing code and it's going to be more removing barriers than adding anything. Right. Because it's, you know, it's only allowed in specific zones at this point.

Yeah. That's really interesting. I'm I've got a I'm working on a project in Ashland right now, which is my hometown. um specific to they they proposed doing a ma uh they're trying to protect their RV or their manufactured home parks. Um and it ends up that none of the land owners really want to buy in on it. I'm going off tangent now. Sorry, but I got to tell my story. Um, and so it ended up not not going to be a it's not going to be a zone, but they are doing exactly what Jeff said in terms of relaxing things that are a lot of these manufactured home codes are so specific like it has to be a double wide, it has to have a roof pitch of this and it has to have this setback and has to have a porch and a deck that's this size. And it's like it's like straight out of the classic ' 70s double wide, you know, code. It just doesn't make any sense. And these days, manufactured homes sometimes are modular. They come in pieces, you know, and they can be all sorts of different shapes and sizes and they can be smaller and they, you know, might not need a porch and they might not be up off the ground. So anyway, um that's a really good point in terms of looking at how we need to be in compliance with the state and also just frankly that's a very viable housing type, you know, and it's not in the past it's been looked down upon as you know cheap or not built well or but these days it's some of those new homes are really built

like you said the the there's manufactured homes like we always refer back to but there are so many different types of modular housing, component housing. Now that how how does it get labeled if it's not made out of Yeah. fur, you know? I mean, fir tree. Um, so yeah, I mean that that's a viable option. You stop that. I didn't think of any I'm just saying I meant tree for wood anyway. I mean because uh you know that it's much more economic for a lot of folks and in small spaces as well. My mind went to those I don't know if you've seen those like 3D printed homes.

Yes. Where they like they extrude the I was like Yeah, exactly. The concrete one, you know, for on site. So, yeah. So, going forward with the the housing codes. Yes. Um looking at the slide deck that we received, look uh looking um seaside predicted to grow from 7,489 people in 2022 to 8772 in 204. That is a 32year span. Yeah, correct. From 2022 and we're only growing by what was it, 1700 people. Not a big port growth forecast.

That's what Portland State's numbers population forecast. But that also doesn't factor in that we've got 300 apartment units in the pipeline right now. Right. And that's what I was that that's the point behind that is cuz if we have the 300 units is this going is what we're as we're going into this we need to be maybe a little bit more aggressive. I think aggressive. So yeah, but keep that in mind that being a higher number for the future. A higher number. Yeah. You you keep dropping 10,000 and we have 300 in the pipe right now in 2022, you know, so we're already over, you know, potentially 8,000 people. So I think we're going to reach that way before we hit the

I think you will too twoyear I think I and those PSU so just I don't know if you know but PSU and I think that's going to change I think it's going to be DLCD in the future but Portland State does population forecasts for all jurisdictions in the state. Um and they do it for a lot of different reasons. They do it for well funding. They do it for housing needs. They do it for a whole bunch of different reasons. Um, and they're never perfect. It's it's a forecast. It's always a guess. And in most of the cities I work with, they always feel like it's not as aggressive as it should be. Sure.

But they're also feeling that pressure from day to day as new growth happens. But I agree, you're you're not going to be it's not going to be 2050 by the time you hit it might be. It's probably I bet you're 10 years away. I'm just guessing. You're probably 10 years away from adding 2,000 people. Sure. So, so let's say, and I don't want to get too in the weeds on this, but um let's say that we're already over eight right now or about to be.

Once this gets put together, can we send that info back to PSU or DLCD and say, "Look, you guys predicted this. Here's the reality. We think our projections because would that affect any state funding or anything like that? future state fun or any type of future funding or considerations. I just I don't want to be too reserved on our numbers and then run into oh hey we didn't expect such a housing boom when we clearly are expecting more of a a boom. The tricky part here though too is you do not have a whole bunch of land that's ready to develop, right? So, but there are sites like the high schools, you know, there's there's some stuff that you could put some lot of people.

So, um that might be scary, but it's true. there's some, you know, you got some areas that that could grow. So, I don't think their numbers that far off. Sure. But I think the first point you made made is the most important is that that when we're doing these changes, I really would think about that $10,000 $10,000$10,000 population number as something that we should consider and because I don't think that what they're requiring is is that extreme, frankly. It's really not. So

with with how our and you may get into this and tell me to shut up at any point. All right. Um with how our codes are currently and of course how it you know we're looking at them. Um what is the current maximum population that we can have and what is our potential oh highest population? I don't know that. But what I would do is do you have a how old is your buildable lands inventory? Who knows? Uh 2013 was one, but I thought we just did one with the county. We did do one with the county. Which? Yeah. So, I guess what I'm getting at is land study. There's two there's there's kind of two factors there. It's like

what is your actually what's your growth potential and then what's your capacity? So you can do I do a zoning capacity analysis which is a whole another GIS exercise where you look at your buildable lands and you look at the zoning category and then you make some assumptions about how many what density would grow on theirs and you can kind of play out a scenario just like you have capacity for this X population under your current buildable lands inventory with your current zoning. Um now the cool thing would be to do is to look at it now without making some of these middle housing changes that will allow more density and say well the cap your capacity frankly is going to go up once once these adop once these new code from changes are adopted for the middle housing you're going to create more capacity because you're allowing more density in the single family zones. Um, so I don't know if that helps your

Well, so when we hit 10,000, the big trigger is that we required to perform a housing capacity analysis. Y and then we're also required to put together a housing production strategy to meet those goals. Um, Atoria is going through that right now because they're over 10,000, right? We're not subject to that requirement just yet. Um, and in fact, I don't know how many uh contract planners are available to help do those because everybody that's over 10,000 has to do that and they're all trying to get that done. Well, interestingly enough, they just put the cities on a schedule to make sure that so all the cities now that are over 10,000 are scheduled when they required to do those updates. Yep.

So, with with and there's a lot that goes into that, too. It's not just buildable land too. We got to be thinking about infrastructure. Uh, do we have water and sewer capacity to handle x amount of units? And and I'll tell you, we don't have a solid answer for that just yet.

Right. Appreciate that. Another question. Um, what as we're going through this, what should we as a planning commission keep in mind, what checks and balances are there? So what we don't want to do also and and just thinking through it is don't want to create more housing and influx of population than there are jobs cuz we're extremely seasonal. I know exactly how many people were, you know, aren't working at my hotels right now. So sustainabilitywise, great. We get all these people here in here moving here in summer. All these units are filled. We get to the off season and there's no jobs. they're, you know, just at what what checks and balances do we have to say, okay, we've reached this level, we need more industry, we reached this level. Is there anything like that or are we just shooting the

not not really as part of this process though is it but that I mean super good information to have if we can figure it out. But yeah, probably only half unfortunately the process.

I was going to mention though and then let's keep going here on to the next one. What's the next slide? I was going to mention something, but oh, I'll get to it on the next one. But what I wanted to say was that um one of the things I'll make sure I do as part of this is I will have a a list of mustd dos and like a can dos. So you'll know that the these are the code changes that we have to do to be in compliance and these are some other cool things you might want to consider. So, um that that's kind of how I've done these in the past is and that's really helpful, too, because then um then you know what what you can and can't change and if you have other options to do that. So, um I already talked about this with the schedule, but we're going to review your existing code, do those interviews, show you the code audit, review with you guys, um do that community meeting online survey. I'm not quite sure what to do on that survey because the public and we always have to have public input on these things, but this is so specific to middle housing. Um, we'll have to figure out a creative way to try and get get input on this. It's a it's a this I guess what I'm saying is this is a difficult topic to get people to be interested in. Unless you're saying, I'm going to change your zoning on your property, then they'll be at the meeting.

So, yeah, we can shop it around though, too. similar how we did the comprehensive plan to CDA chamber Lions Club some of the other community groups and get that survey pushed out to everybody. So yeah, we'll hopefully get that done and uh do it well.

Um Yep. And then I just put a couple of examples in here just and these aren't really to discuss tonight, but these are the types of things that we will be talking about. So right now you can't your ADUs can't exceed 520 feet without a conditional use permit. You probably already know that. I don't know if you've done one and they can't exceed even with a uh conditional use permit they can't exceed 800 square ft. Now, a lot of cities I work with, they might allow, you know, so so the question would be, you know, do we want to keep that? That's fine. We we we're going to be require we required to allow ADUs, which you already do, so you're already a step ahead there. But is there a reason why we're limiting them to 525 ft? Do we maybe we could make them bigger? Maybe we could allow 800 square ft without a conditional use permit.

Then it's no longer an ADU. It might not be. And that's that's exactly the type of thing that I want to talk to you guys about, though. But that square footage is def defines the ADU. Yeah. In another. So,

well then then the next slide too. I mean this makes it more complicated. But then there's all these other things. It's not just the size. You know you have things about where they're located. Um you know exceed you can't exceed one story. Is there a reason why it can't exceed a story two stories? I don't know. So those are the these are the types of things we'll talk about um uh as an examples. AD uses one we'll we'll discuss. And then another one, the next one is um this comes up to parking a lot. Um you know, sometimes I don't know if your code requires off- streetet parking for ADUs or not. It does, but it's not enforceable because of state law. All right. Yeah. Because technically you can't. You can't. answers.

So, um, but for example, if someone's putting in, you know, shoot, one thing that might be interesting is maybe allowing on street parking where it meets city safety design and performance standards to count as on-site parking cuz sometimes requiring a parking spot or two for a a forplex or something, there's just no room on the lot. And so, does it make sense to do this or not? I don't know. That's kind of controversial. You know, some cities are like, heck no. I don't want to allow my on street parking to be count for someone's off- streetet parking but something we can discuss. So um just a couple topics to to share with things that we'll talk about. So next up I mentioned this code audit concepts stakeholder interviews and then the survey and we'll do the updates. That's I think that's it for tonight.

Questions, comments, thoughts. That's great. So should be should be interesting. something something fun to do, something different than you have to do, something that's different than your regular job duties. Jeeoff, with everything changing so rapidly in the housing and state law and whatnot, there's obviously ordinances or state law that we have to adopt as a city. the process. Say the state says you must do this. Does that automatically get adopted into our ordinances or do we have to go through a whole process on that?

We still have to go through the process. Even though it's a mandatory um state law that we're adopting, we still have to go through the process to get it into our our code. Y

um and I I will so on the staff side of things right now um we're working out a contract to go through all of our city ordinances, all of the ordinances, bring them up in to a standard that they should be and organized in a method that's digital um online version as you've seen from other cities. So, that is a process that's starting right now. Along with this, they're going to do every one of our ordinances and make things hopefully easier to find, um, easier to, uh, to be able to interpret and easier to have access for the public. Uh, but these housing laws, my goal here, and I've talked with DLCD about this because they were, you know, are you sure you want to do this grant now or do you want to wait? Well, I don't want to wait because the more we wait, the farther behind we get. let's get us up to standards now and then we can always go through an update uh process as the the rule making u things are worked out over the next year year and a half with DLCD and let's not forget we're getting ready to go into a short session too so

y we may see further um housing uh requirements come out of that um which again keeps it's it's a never- ending cycle right now with the legislature and housing codes they're not letting us keep up they keep adding more, adding more, adding more. And we're not the only city that's behind. U we just we're pretty far behind. It's it's time to get caught up and then try to to stay caught up once we're at that point.

Why isn't there just because I've never gone through this process before. Why isn't there like an auto adopt? We're required to we're required to do it. Yeah. So why isn't it, you know, when as we're going through this comp plan and and doing these ordinances, why can't is there the ability to do an ordinance that says the city will adopt any blah blah blah state law that comes out. I don't know if that's, you know, I can tell you a lot of the problem is is we don't know what's out of compliance until it's pointed out to us.

Yeah, exactly. So, while I know there are things that are out of compliance in our code, every every week, every couple of weeks, I'm learning of something else that's out of compliance in our code. And and if we don't have if if you've ever uh sat down and tried to go through the OS, Yeah.

it's pretty uh robust and these these these codes are all in the OS. That's why it's important for us to get it into our city code, which is much easier for the public and for city staff and the planning commission, city council to manage. um and with an an an an an assurance that that city code is updated to state law. And that's the goal is to keep that updated. Every time a new law passes, we should be adopting those changes if we're required to.

Yeah. Got it. I I I am not we don't have as many laws and rules in the hotel industry obviously as a state and city dynamic does. with one of my brands that I have, they released, they used to release it up until last year. Twice a year they would change brand standards and I have 216 pages of brand standards that just change a bunch of it just changed in August that we're you know we're obvious they push it out to us we're required to

but we I I do get the whole going through everything line by line because three months from now they're going to say oh this wasn't such a good idea let's change this over here I get it I don't envy you but I get I understand the process. Well, the interesting thing, too, is that if someone wanted if if someone came in and wanted to do a project, they could challenge the city's code and the state law is going to actually trump that.

So, you're going to, you know, they would they could potentially do something that's allowed under state law just because your code says no, they could make it. I mean, they'd have to go through a legal process to do that, which is not fun and cheap, but they could. Another thing is they they have a lot of these ordinances or a lot of these ORS will have what they call model codes and if if a city or jurisdiction doesn't adopt a code then they default to that model code. Mhm. So just another example the FEMA thing. Yep. Yeah. Exactly. Good example. Yep. So

yeah, that's all I've got for tonight. I'm I'm looking forward to working with you on getting the comp plan across the finish line and doing this for the next several months into next summer. So, you don't get rid of me that quick. That's great. I think that's it. Unless anyone else has any other thoughts or comments. That's it. And nobody has anything else to say? No. Okay. And I presume we lost Roger, right? Uh he's still there, I think. Bye, Roger. Last time he wasn't here, I totally missed him. So, the next step is we'll be received that survey from you and then go through policy by policy.

Yep. I'll send you the survey link for the comp plan review and we're good to there. And you don't have to worry about this project till I come back to you in a few months with some more information for the housing. Okay. Okay. We'll call this work session to the end at 609. All right. Yeah.