Cultural Commission - Regular Meeting

Trial.

Okay. I heard the recording is in progress. And you hear me through the TV and everything. Right?

Yeah.

Okay. And then you're talking, and I'm talking. And then how long does it take for the recording to

Okay. It's 6PM, and I'm gonna call this meeting of the board of library trustees to order. Start with roll call. Trustee Trigora Pietro Trigora is here.

Trustee Huynh? Yep. Trustee Rifuralson? Here.

Chair Evans is here, and we're missing trustee Marvin. Mhmm.

At so far, it's been four months before that he was gonna be able to attend. Is there somebody that could use trustee? I made the motion to excuse trustee

oh, I'm here. Okay. In favor of accusing trustee Robin. Say aye. Aye. Okay. Okay. We're on the consent calendar. Actually, the consent calendar are approved with a single motion. Do we have a motion to adopt the consent calendar?

On the presentation, these are for items not otherwise on the agenda. Do we

have anybody who would like to give a presentation?

No, Joanne. We have no

attendees online or in person. Okay. Then we will move on

to general business,

which is our first item item number two is discussion and action on recommendations for potential revisions to the Charter section 1,012 and section 1,013 for consideration of the Charter Review Committee. I will turn it over to. Okay.

So this is to go over the work that you have done in January. And I think I think Tammy, were we gonna bring it up? I'm gonna bring it up. Okay. Thank you. Okay. So what we're and and just as a follow-up, just let me let you know that

Go ahead.

Oh, no. It's okay. I just wanted to check if you had any questions. So, Tammy, can we move it up just a little bit? Yeah. Thank you. Okay. So the reason why you didn't get this whole wholesale thing right now is because when I shared some of the thinking with Glenn, he suggested that we do a couple of wanted to go over this again, of course, as we're gonna do tonight. The other thing he wanted us to kind of think about a little bit is that the ordinance, while very, very helpful Sorry.

Let me hear if you can Sure.

I hope something. Oh. Coming from the recording, I can't Okay.

That's okay.

Yeah. Is it okay?

You want their hair any better? I'm

okay. Okay. Okay.

So Glenn loves the progress we're mating making. He did and and Win's suggestion about putting in the bucket is is right on target. What he wanted to suggest to us, though, is that to remember that a couple things. One is that the ordinance, while very healthy to look at, is not part of the charter.

And

so charter language generally reflects and changes made to it should reflect what's currently in there. He did suggest, though, that if there's something in the ordinance that actually is not called for in the charter right now and you really wanna put it in there, that more than happy to kind of entertain you. But in many ways, the ordinance language, and we'll go through this together, is more about outcomes and less about responsibility. So that's what those that's his language for me when when he was trying to explain to me why there's a big difference. And that in the charter, less is more, I suppose.

They wanted to kinda convey. It's that if you complicate the charter language so much with so much verbiage, then you kinda lock yourself in. And then we need to be as flexible as possible within the charter so you can do your work well. And you'll see what I mean in a few seconds when we start going over ordinance because I know some of you really like some of the ordinance things and wanted to maintain that. There may be a time at a later time when the ordinance language might be cleaned up also, but this is not that time.

It's really mostly about the church. Now having said that, Glenn is coming to the March 2 meeting to meet with us to kinda go over the work that you've done. And we still don't know when the ad hoc committee is meeting. I'm sorry. But they kind of have a little bit. So it doesn't mean that all this oh,

I'm sorry.

When he's coming to the March meeting, is he here to critique us or to tell us what we did wrong?

Or No. No. No. I think

it's more of a conversation. Okay. I think it

Just one of things I need to

share the intention. And and even though I shared a little bit, I think he wants to hear from you directly what you feel is very strong about this work and also what things that you wanna maintain in terms of process and outcome. So, like, for instance, I think you wanted to have a a strong connection with city leadership and the selection and the recruitment of the city library. He understands that, but he also wants to make sure that the language that is selected for the ballot reflects that and is concurrent with the way you wanna describe. That's really kind of it more than anything else.

He wants to check-in with you to make sure that, you know, things are going well and that everything that he's going to so I will tell you, he's got one document, and that's the only thing that's changing is in that charter document. And so he was very clear that that that's exactly what's gonna happen probably when he works with the charter review committee. The language that they select for the ballot will be very similar to what we you talk about that night. Okay? So that there's kinda no surprises.

Now he doesn't know that they're gonna accept everything you say, but he wanted to convey that it's important for him to hear how you feel about it and why the rationale behind it. Oh, yeah. No. No. No. Believe me. This he is I'm I'm I'm in every conversation we've ever had about this, he is very dedicated to making sure that your intentions are very embedded in this process.

So just give us the guideline of you try to make sure that he understands our intentions so he can help make sure the wording is correct. They have intention.

That's right. Okay. That's right. Yeah. So then if you did work again. The attorney on that.

Yeah. That's perfect. And he has to he has to interpret it the way that they'll that's that's easy for the valid language too. Because otherwise, it's a little harder for the common person to kind of understand what's 's the goal behind it. Right? So but it's also meant to really not to have too many curveballs and, frankly, to be as flexible in the language as possible so you can accomplish it. Okay?

Are you talking to him about this also in the interim? Or

We haven't had specific discussion on it, I think, because it's still up in the air when that hospital meet, because it's very much dependent on their schedule. So we haven't had much conversation about this specifically. But if there are questions that any of the trustees have about an upcoming presentation, feel free to, you know, me or Patty directly and. Okay. Cool. Okay. So let's go from the top. So let's go over the roles that the board would like to maintain. Charter ten twelve, there shall be a board and we're doing this kind of as a review because last time we left this, there were two sections that we didn't get to. Right?

And so we're gonna go back to this, but I wanted to echo and frame what you've already talked about. So the board of library trustees consisting of five members to be appointed by the city council from the qualified electors of the city, and no member of said board shall hold any paid office or employment in the city government. I think we had a conversation about qualified electors in terms of the language. It does turn out that not everyone on the charter review agrees that this is a good language to remove. So I'm just letting you know that's just kind of an insight right now.

It's not to say that they won't remove it entirely, but there are certain boards and commissions that they would like that to maintain. They did not specify that this was about the library bill. So yeah.

Sorry. Another question. I thought we talked about we have to put something else in its place.

Yeah. We actually talked about that that the fact that we might suggest resident.

Right. So but we should have that. We can't just say remove that without saying what we're gonna replace it with.

I think it's a little bit later if I'm if I'm not mistaken, but I don't know for sure.

Okay. This this version of the diagnosis, don't think was in our our notes. No. Yeah. No.

This is

a working copy of what the board approved previously, so we can make notes on the Okay.

Any discussion. Okay. So maybe we'll make a a note saying that we would like to instead of qualifying a lecture, we would like to we recommend the

work rather. Yeah. Yes.

I I do recall a certain amount. Yeah. Think I'll read that from one of our previous we covered this in the previous meeting. Right. What did the ad hoc team say about about why did they object to us removing all five electros?

They don't they don't object to us doing anything yet. Oh. The the charter review committee as a body doesn't agree with removing qualified electors from every Oh, every agent. Okay. Right. So there are some. I think one of them was the civil services. Oh. One might have been the planning commission. I'm I'm just throwing that out there because in confidence, Glenn said that to me.

Oh. So it's not not I didn't want you to think that they took care of it already, and it's all gone because it isn't. Okay? Because we thought that was and Glenn thought that we're gonna do that too, but that is not what happened. So in the first few meetings that they've talked about it, there is a very strong interest in retaining this for some bodies, but not this body necessarily. Okay?

Well, one question about the document as we go through it.

So I I either hold questions or or bring

them up. And for changes we wanna maintain, are we talking about the changes we wanna make to that particular line here, or is there another spot where we talk about changes to things we're making?

No. We can talk about it here. Okay. I I think to save time, it's it's a good it's a good process to leave it in here. And then this way, if there's a repetition, we can clean that up. But we don't wanna lose track of it, I Okay.

So I just wanna mention for on this first one, like, I think we And then the five members seven. Right. Think Right.

That's that's So

that's the other one is five to seven.

Yeah. That's how we reach it.

Yes. You are. Yes. As I I

do remember that. Yeah. We don't have to worry. Of course. Yeah. I was like, do we need it in the doc?

We go.

Just put it up there,

and we'll

come back to you.

You got that, Tim?

Yeah. Sorry. There's a bunch of stuff.

I'll I'll look up her face, and she'll Okay.

Alright. Good. Okay. Is there anything else in that first clause that you see other than the five to seven and the qualified electors? We're just going over it again just to make sure. Okay. Alright. Charter ten thirteen. So that's the top section. The the board of library trustees shall have charge of the administration of the Santa Clara Free Library Prepublic Library and shall have power and be required to.

So the first change that we identified was the official city library name. This is Santa Clara City Library, and that is something that's legal. That is actually our name with as identified with the state library as our as our entity. And so that's easy enough to change. The other thing I think you you had a little bit of not anxiety. The conversation about is the word administration, but I think we're still dwelling on what that looks like. Right? But I think it was it escapes people some pause. Okay. Alright.

So, Tammy, I don't know if you wanna maybe put that one in red, and then you can just you can just say that there was a question about that, and then we can come back to it later when we have more conversations about that. Okay. Okay. Ten thirteen a, make and enforce such bylaws, rules, and regulations as it may be necessary for the administration and protection of the city library. Now one of the things that is a little harder with this particular line is the make and enforce part.

And that's actually explained that to me, but that actually is not part of your purview. But he'll explain that on March 2 when he comes. Until then, though, I think we'll just leave it alone if you don't have any questions about that right now. Alright.

My suggestion would be to say Santa Clara City Library since we said that above instead of just Okay.

Instead of saying City Library. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Ten thirteen subsection b, approve or disapprove the appointment of a librarian who shall be the department head. The board prefers to be included in this process in close collaboration with city administration. Now this might be a good time if you wanna strengthen that language a little bit, if you wanna change it up a little bit, or or if you like it anyway.

Well, I think that you're saying the bullet is we wanna keep that thing. Right? Because this is unique to our trustees. No other commission can hire fire their lead or their leader.

Well, we who's hired. Yeah. I I I guess I guess the question like, this is kind of about preferred just, like, trying to say we wanna stay as part of the process for how we improve the learning later. Or maybe the tend to be, like, a sub bullet. Like, I'm trying to understand

Well, for your I think is a little more and more.

Yeah. I would that that's why I was asking because I'm not I I I would I would not want prefer. So that's want to be I

think this is just a message to the Yeah. The city council saying, don't take this out. Don't we you know, we Our team prefers.

I I would say the board. Don't want it.

Well, I just want if he wants to be interested in the process,

I'm like How about desires? Desires.

Or Okay. Either way. Wants. Okay.

The first down below is

I think that just jumped a little Like, put all the time. Alright. And I think Go ahead. I guess this applies also to the the prior discussion, but I think know we're talking about a lot of the wording because of what's currently in the charter right now. But I think as the meeting comes up, if you want to think about specific actual things that you want to see happen as a result of changes we're keeping, then that way when you have that conversation, when you can kind of convey, you know, this is what you want to see happen. This is the changes we want to see happen rather than and then that will be translated into it rather than so you don't have to be too hung up over of the the wording. So just kind of imagine what you would like to happen, and she'd be able to kind of describe it to Glenn when he Mhmm.

We'll come back with, like, the appropriate language, and then we have a chance to look at that language. Right.

Okay. Right. So I think to Win's point, one of the things that Glenn suggested is that you might say the board will appoint two members of their body to sit on the selection committee for the city library. He was that specific. And the reason why wants you to think like that is because that would create more direction for what the city leadership needs to do and how to work with you. Okay. Okay. So, actually, I mean, he was very specific about just saying those words like I just described to you. If that's what you would like, he's not opposed to being that direct.

Okay.

Okay? I mean, that sounds good. See, I thought you never would have been that specific or prescriptive to be to allow for flexibility for twenty, thirty years from now.

But

However, one of the things so remember, you want a couple more members. There's a couple of things that you want that are in line with this. I think one of the things that we'll cover later is that you also wanted a formal report to the board with counsel once a year. I don't I think I remember you saying that. Yeah. Yeah. So because that's what you'd like from Anaheim. I I think that that is true. Right? So that is a real directive.

That's not saying we it's possible we may meet with the council once a year. That's like, we have to meet. I will tell you, there is something in our county librarian law that demands that the the the state librarian meet with all county libraries once a year. And it happens it's it's directly in the chart of the state of California. And, you know, it means that the state librarian has to meet, and we usually do it at CLA. But if CLA doesn't happen one year, he has to call a meeting. And so that's the only group he has to meet with. He doesn't have to meet with the rest of the municipal libraries, the county librarians yet.

Yeah.

So I would say that's that's kind of what Gwen is talking about. If if there's specificity to what you wanna have happen, be prepared to talk about it.

Okay. I mean And

I think another way to confirm it is where and it it just gets a little bit to what last meeting is filed, where there's concern about future managers or future trustees kind of deviation from something that is very crucial in your eyes to the duties or responsibilities, and you can be more specific where you and your experience have believed that, you know, the library can adapt and be flexible in certain areas, then you can kind of give kind of a broad concept wise to to that area. Okay.

Okay. So I I think that is one then where I I would like more specific language to make sure that we have least one, if not two members that are part of the selection committee. And then then later bring it back to the whole board for

the final

So just so that we can remember this conversation Yeah. We're gonna include right now. Mhmm. You could say specify number of board members to be participate in the process. I'm just kinda suggesting as a placeholder, the language so that you know that we've had this conversation. Is

that okay? Yep.

Okay. Alright.

Boardman's I I think specified number of boards would participate in the re selection process. And then I I think also in the final, we want the whole board. They can still be part the final approval. Right?

And I think in the meantime between now and when when it comes, if you can kind of order that picture again of, like, what the whole board is participating in the process. Like, Like, does it need, for example, with the appointment need unanimous approval by the entire board? Like, what kind of when does that kind of look like? But you haven't done March 2. Yeah.

Because if we have two members representing us, they if you

come back and say it's a good thing, I'm not gonna argue with you because I had nothing to do with it. Right? But it might be a formality that you wanna pay. It's actually formality. And Where the whole board is part of the process as opposed to just two representatives. We're not trying to force you in in anything. I think the issue is how much language would you like to be included in here. This is the opportunity to be very specific. Yep. Flexible in terms of the breadth of your accountability and responsibility, but not in terms of what you deem to be the most important thing that you have as a role.

Okay? So this is what he's trying to do is is is help us guide us, and he will do that on March 2. He'll say, okay. What what really takes you off about this, and what what what do you like about it, and what do you wanna change? What happened last time? What what what do you wanna happen? Because you're gonna be setting the tone for future. It's not just now. It's going to be years from now because we're not gonna have another chance to do this. And as one pointed out, it depends on you can't rely on personalities

Yep.

Or even relationships. You have to actually embed it in there.

Yeah. And and that's why I really appreciate about

the the way process. It does work

the last time, which is, you know, we had November go and participate at a detailed level because we can't have everybody do that. And at the end, they came back from Florida, and the whole board got to, you know, have that that final day. And, you know, most of the time, hopefully, it would work out that we trust members that participate, but it could always be a case that

They're Kennedy.

He came out differently, and that gives

both the board a chance to,

you know Yeah. So I I like that codifying how the process will go through with the right number. Right? Because I I don't know that the future city administrations that's in order to

do that. But in for historical, yes, there was the fact that only two members of this board interviewed you and all the other candidates. For practicality, you couldn't have all five do it. It would it would have been huge Totally. And that's what happened. So it does it does work, what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah.

But, you know, when you we can go back to it, maybe there's two finalists, and not everybody agrees on that full candidate. So that's that's what Lynn is suggesting is that if there is if you'd like to invite all the board to unanimously endorse that, you would say so.

Well, I think that did happen once the two people who did the detailed interview made their recommendation to the full board and got approval.

So, easily, this this could say, you know, specified numbers. So two members of the board shall participate in the selection process

Yep.

With the final decision being unanimous. You know?

Think it's learning involving all board participants. Involve all the board. Yeah. I I know I'll by and say unanimous.

Or whatever. You know? However you want it.

No. No. No. Whatever start in the details, and then and then ultimately, only full board votes.

Correct. Yeah. Okay. Alright. Good.

I think

So I think we captured the concept there. Yeah. And now I

think that's Well, no. No.

Not okay. Sorry. Selection process. We wanna change the first one. Two candidates shall participate in the interview process. No. Not that one.

No. That

Or you double the the bullet number three I'm looking at. That's sort of the same.

No. But I think bullet. Tammy, there's a difference between interview and selection. Yeah. I think that's what that's what the the body is is saying is that they want two board members to be involved in the interview process, and then the but the selection process remains part of the board's purview. Yeah.

Perfect.

Okay. Are we good? I just wanna make sure that we're good before we I know. I'm asking you if you got it. You've got it.

Okay. So as long as everybody's satisfied with how it's being done.

I think that at least the high level captures, and I guess we'll ask the city attorney to

Yeah. You can connect it, but I think what we're trying to do is capture as many details about what you exactly wanna do.

Well, the second bullet you may not need because we say that in the third one.

Well, I think it's I think it's okay to leave in there if you want Glenn to understand.

Yeah. Just more stuff for him.

Why why this is so important? Because you want the board to have a say. You want the board to be able to participate. You don't wanna lose that in terms of any changes to the charter. And in fact, you wanna embellish it a little more by being more specific about the role, okay, and the and the how.

Okay. So ordinance. Let's let's scroll down a little bit, and here's where I wanted you to understand why he shared this with me because it made sense to me after. While all of these great things are in there, they actually reflect more what happened or what the outcomes you wanna have happened, not what your role your role. And so he said, well, I think it's actually part of clause number two.

And I said, okay. Let me just talk to them about this. And I said it was he said good exercise. You should really reflect on what you wanna happen as a result of your actions as a body. But in terms of your specific role, isn't that part of number two? So and and let's scroll back up a little bit. So remember, all of this is, like, providing for balance of the collection, diverse programming, etcetera. Isn't that really this bylaws, rules, and regulations as it may be necessary for the administration protection of the city of Oakland? That's what he said. He said, all of those things that you just read to me because we went through every ordinance clause, and I said, oh, they went through it all.

And he said, okay. And he said, it wasn't a bad idea to go through it. The issue was, he said, affirm, affirm, affirm. Right? So he said, good. They affirmed that they wanna do all these things. And, frankly, they've even affirmed it further about how they wanna do it. But isn't it already in that about Yeah. The policies and procedures that protect the library? And he's not wrong, I don't think. So I want you to think about that, but that is reason why we're sort of not it's not that we're not gonna look at this again, but we're gonna sort of extricate out of this language spinning on the ordinance side because it doesn't really embellish more on the charter side.

Yeah. I I understand, like like, if these are already covered as a these are just, like, examples of, right, you know, the the other thing, then that's fine. Don't necessarily have to put those in the charter because we'll

The system with the mission, all of those things, it all has policies, firewall, protection, and all of those. Right? So But we don't have another clause. Right. So the issue right. If that clause went away, then we'd have a problem. But, okay, so if it's okay with you, what I'd like to do is scroll back down to past the ordinance.

Yeah. Why why is I'm sorry. I had a question on that. Why are we striking the words providing out of ordinance two?

There was a word that was made in the last meeting, but there wasn't a replacement word offered. So we just did the the. You had indicated that concern is the body about the word providers. It doesn't matter.

But remember what I just shared with you is that these one two three four five clauses in the ordinance reflect already your role in your relationship and your authority per clause two in in a chart. So you don't really have to iterate this again. And in fact, it's not preferable to include the ordinance language in the charter because it's the charter is meant to be sort of a a flexible document that with your with your with your role, but it also is supposed to be very terse. I mean, it's supposed to be very it's not meant to be 15 pages long or even five items long. It's meant to be very small because it is really the breadth of your responsibility, not just individual items.

So when we talk about collection, programming, etcetera, that's all rolled up into two.

Yep. Mhmm.

Okay? So we're gonna not forget that it's there. It's just that it's it's not pertinent to our conversation anymore.

Okay? I I think the feedback is I hear the feedback is the ordinance is probably good to look at, but it's not hard.

It's not hard to chart group.

Right? Correct. And and And unless Although we strip other things that we don't actually need to go in and change at this point. Right.

Now I will say again that Glenn was very clear. If you find one of those ordinance clauses that is not addressed in the chart, he is happy to endorse that moving forward. But he doesn't we look through all, I think, ten, eleven clauses, and he said it's all in there. As I said, okay. Well but I want them to see that. So I that's why I'm pushing that's why I'm sharing this with you the way we're doing it. Because we did take a look at it, and we did it very carefully with the intention of maybe using it. Okay. Okay. Let's scroll down.

So we're now onto would like to maintain our ad. Now having said this, I will say in secret, When I said, oh, we looked at Anaheim too, and he said, well, Patty, let me tell you why we lived at Anaheim. And, actually, the mayor said it the other day. Because the reason why they're looking at Anaheim is because Anaheim has utilities. They didn't look at it for the library reason. Oh. So and it's okay for us to look at it because he said, oh, okay. Did they find something they like?

And I said, they did.

And I said, so so, you know, because the job description for the city librarian and qualifications were addressed in their their Anaheim city charter, formal annual reporting back to city council and then providing feedback and review of the library budget was all in that Anaheim city charter. But it also that last one, especially, is also in parks and rec. Yeah. Right? Yep. Okay. And you liked that. So I did mention that to Glenn. He said, oh, then put it in there. And I said, okay.

Great. So, you know, he was very happy with the fact that he found something in there that was appealing to you and that that would direct staff. And I said, you know, we do do that, but we don't do it as formally as we might. And he said, well, then good. Make it formal.

And so this way, there's a regular meeting that has to be held with city council, and if it passes in discussion, and then your regular reporting about the budget. Okay. The job description for city librarian qualifications, I'm just gonna give you a comment. It's really not the role of boards and commissions to actually create the job descriptions for our our team, our staff. However, we know that it was a there's a point pinch point for us at the last iteration of this process.

And so I've already talked with Araceli at the at the at HR, and she said, well, how about if we do this before how about if we make the changes before the vote so that it it looks completely separate, so it doesn't look like cause and effect. Right? And so they are working on language right now. So I'm gonna be working with Marco Mercado, who is our interim acting I'm not sure if interim or acting HR director. And then this I think we're moving forward to make it instead of preferred to make it required.

As I pointed out to Araceli and the team, all of my library staff have to have another one. All of them. So the fact that the city librarian doesn't have to have one is kinda odd. And so she agreed, and so their their comments moving forward. So we're working on that on a separate track, but what he wanted to make sure of is that you understood it's not that's not driving this. Right? It's it's he knows that it needs to be done, so it'll be a separate

track. Yeah. Okay? I I think on our side, we feel like that in there, especially since we participate more in the process. I mean, what will happen is if you don't participate in the job job description, the trustees can just lose vote down whatever. Because of the process, they'll be like, you know, thumbs down, and it's kinda waste their own time. Right?

So so one of the things that I think Glenn Glenn will help you kind of maneuver this one because that one's a little cornier for him Okay. In terms of the board having direct influence on the qualifications of because that's generally a city responsibility. So we'll we'll see what happens. But I left it we'll leave it on there because we know that's important

to you.

Okay? Alright. So chart ten twelve again. So this is where we said additional two more members for a total of seven members of the board of leverage with these. And then qualified electors, we don't like that language, residents instead. So we're I think we're going over things we've already gone over before. So let's go to ten thirteen.

Debbie, you wanna put the notes in about pop out electors here again? Or Okay. Or just a note to go see Okay.

The first one. Go see the first one. Yeah. And then to the qualified electors and residents entered in as a as a Yeah.

Potential replacement. Right. I did hear multiple passing months.

Absolutely. Point Okay. Point at one of those. Well, I'll sort of, like, Senate Bill our city library to keep on repeating that. Okay. Charter ten thirteen of subsection c, acceptance of the library, fund, and administer money, personal property, or real estate donated to the city or otherwise acquired for library purposes subject to the approval of the city council. Now one of the things that Glenn suggested to me is that, you know, I told him, we were sort of on the fence. They still wanted to do this. And he said, well, let's talk about at what side. So if we got a request that was a 150,000 or $10,000,000 and I am saying that out loud because there is a possibility for that.

You would want to maybe say in how it how it works. Right? But maybe you don't want when somebody bequeaths a a grandfather. Right? So so he suggested that you specify language that might allow you to weigh in, really, on this level if you're talking about a large sum or an estimated value that is on a large side as opposed to day to day.

So that's why he said he said, if you wanna do anything over a $100,000, if you wanna do anything over $10,000, he's okay with any of that. But he said, you might want to not get into the nitty gritty of the small things, because we get donations all the time. Right? Yeah. But they don't all they're not all sizable. And, frankly, we tell you when we get them, especially if it comes in through us. Oftentimes, it comes in directly to the foundation. We do have a bequest potentially coming up that's going over there, and it's very sizable. Like, really.

It's a cash request. Right? It is a cash request. I know the grandfather.

No. It's not a grandfather clock. I'm not at liberty to talk about it, but because it hasn't happened yet. The person is deceased now, but they're still working out all the details with the attorney office on that side. But you're not gonna have any say in that if it doesn't come directly to the library, or you might. So but in that particular case, it's it's actually a request that they for the library that is going through the foundation. It's actually the the attorneys are all talking to each other already. So it's not this, but it but in the future,

there

could be this. Because know that a lot of people don't know about our foundation. So sometimes we'll just say, the library. And so you think about it. You don't have to decide today, but come March 2, he's gonna ask you, do you wanna specify an amount of money that you would like to use?

Reason we wouldn't accept it.

No. No. No. It's oh, there are lots of reasons. There are. Okay. So came with the caveat that it can only be used for. So there are okay. So, you know, there's you know, I teach I teach grammar. Yeah. Right? So there are lots of ethical reasons why some people don't exist. Okay. Okay? Yeah. I don't need to go into it with you. You can already kinda think already that it's okay. So you know? If Philip Morris gave us $50,000,000, would we say yes? Well, we might say yes, but we might not say yes if they required us to promote smoking to young people. Okay? You see where I'm going with this? Yep. Okay.

So what do you need

to do? So you don't you know? I mean, I have a lot of friends that live in Winston Salem. They cannot say no to children, but they live in a different world. We don't have to take that here. Okay? So okay. So think about what you would like to do or specify maybe minimum value at x, then it comes to you officially. You talk about it as a body. You vote on where it's gonna go. Because it could not it doesn't always have to go to the foundation.

Yeah. I'm just This is the one.

No. Okay.

But I'm not saying so

Yeah.

And the other thing is it could go

to the foundation, but maybe you wanna direct it for a specific purpose. Maybe it's going to the foundation for future libraries. Maybe it's going to the foundation for youth services. Maybe it's going especially if it's not indicated by the donor already. Okay?

And, of course, if it comes in the form of stocks or bonds or mineral rights or all kinds of things, and I've had them all, you might wanna weigh on that. I mean, I had mineral rights for an oil company in Texas that was donated to the library, and we made a pretty penny after selling it. But it was with the caveat that we would sell it and then use the proceeds for x, and x was at that time, it was, a new used services one. But it could be from collection. It could be from whatever you wanna do. But the goal would be, do you wanna do the day to day stuff, or do you wanna have it at a a larger level so that it's

your responsibility? If we decide on a larger level you know, one thing I always or, you know, the challenge, especially something like the counter. Right? If you put a dollar amount in there, inflation will make that dollar amount irrelevant to that. Just So you could get You mean, maybe you should take adjusted with CPI or something. Right.

Starting Or you could say a percentage of our annual budget.

Okay.

Anything that exceeds that or whatever. You know, you get what I'm saying? You don't have to specify a dollar amount. He just wants you to think about, do we wanna have responsibility for the day to day, or do you wanna have a larger

over Yeah.

Okay? So that's that's the only caveat he shared with that one. Okay.

Can we Yes. Include that?

Yes. Can you

certainly include that note?

Yeah. So you can specify a percentage of our annual budget. You could specify you know? As you know, I don't know.

No. But the other thought about do we wanna be involved in the day to day or holding a high level? That's an important thought. Right.

I I guess my my feedback on this one is I don't think I wanna have to have a board meeting every time someone gives, like you know, if if you give us staff report, someone said someone gave me 50 gave us $50, great. You know, someone dropped some coins in the in some donation bin we have

out there or whatever. That's great. But I don't

think we need that to be involved in that. Something everyone does. But, certainly,

I think So that's

what some sort of major That's what he has to think about.

Because, frankly, this includes everything. Okay. And so he wanted us to not think too small because that's a lot of that's a lot of administration for us, and that's a lot of administration for you.

Is it reasonable to use language like major gifts or may like and then define that term somewhere else? Like, no. Absolutely. So we get so that they flexible some Yeah.

You could say that. Now remember, major gifts means different things to different people. So, you know, in some places, major gifts is anything that's 10,000 or above. On some in some places, make that's not a major gift at all. Yeah. Okay. But I you know, and you're right about the CPI and everything else, but I don't know if you wanna get too much in a week there. I think the goal is Yeah. Kind of to decide that you don't wanna do if you don't wanna do, the day to day, and you wanna have sizable. And then so you can decide what sizable looks like.

Yeah. I guess that's why I'm asking. Like, if we can have, like, a language of, like, sizable or major or something like that, and then somewhere else we define that could be a $100,000. Because we could be whatever is appropriate could be a thousand dollars. But we could go do that use

what that looks like for you on a on a, you know, on an infrequent basis. But the language is in there so that it guides your your process. For example,

we can create a policy to define the major gifts. Correct. As a library policy, and then just, you know, the Charter has a rule that Exactly. Policy sets the value. And then that keeps the value flexible without being stuck in some Yeah. Oh, we we thought a dollar was a lot of money a hundred years ago, and now it turns out. We're longer being paid. Yeah.

Okay. Alright. Very good. And I think just one quick point on that is kind of I think that's a good idea. You can potentially incorporate the language of saying that's significant as determined by most relevant board policy at the time. So that way it's, like, specific, but also allow some flexibility for for that time. And the second thing is recognize that that wording does also mention the right accept and administer. So something for everyone to think about that for the March 2 meeting, what is accepted, what is administered in terms of is it, like, unanimous vote by the board? Do accept the cycle donation? Is it just to be kept in the loop as to where that donation is going towards?

Is it just to provide general feedback before the city council officially accepts this? Just all so this left to think about for the next

meeting. Okay.

So it might be even specific enough to say direct staff to administer SFF in preparation

for something.

So you're not necessarily doing that work Okay. Because I don't think you wanna do that work. Right? So as we talked about before when we had that little conversation about administration. Okay.

Okay. That makes sense.

Tammy, you let me know when you're ready.

Yeah. I guess at the high level, as

I think about, you know, when

it comes to charitable donations and, like, I think, for involvement, for for my perspective, at least, know, larger gifts. And then if there's a decision to be made about whether, you know, maybe ethically we wanna take it or even maybe open ended and we wanna get some advice from us to to the staff as to maybe where we think it should be directed. It'd be nice to have that. Maybe we could just provide feedback. I think that's where the level. But I don't think I you know, we wanna have to know and do any of the accounting and all that. I think that's entirely a staff staff thing. Figure out how to work better.

Well, it could mean you know, I mean, the other thing is, you know, it could mean also deciding some of it goes to the foundation for investment. Others, it might go for a plan to establish some technology advancements for us. Right? Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of different ways where money can be distributed. Yep. And, of course, the city with with council approval would help us really administer Okay. That time. Okay. Library. Okay. So

Does this language Yeah. Accessible?

I think

captures this discussion. Mhmm. I somebody else. I I would appreciate advice from any time we'll get to that.

I think it's helpful for him to know the the the range of the conversation and not be so specific. I think, Sammy, it's okay that that it captures the the tenor of the conversation and not necessarily word for word. Because we're not about word spending today.

For sure. Yeah. If there's any notes on here Okay. Schedule makes this, like,

Okay. Great. So

the only thing

that we might say of that at at top is that oh, no. You have policy already in there. That's fine. That's fine. Okay. Charter ten thirteen, top section, the board of librarianship trustees shall have charge of the administration, so of the Santa Clara City Free Public Library and shall power and be required to. So not captured from the boards, but mentioned specifically during the motion that this should be discussed further, and I think it has to do with the administration. Right? So we we talked a little bit about the last time. The board preferred an advisory role to guide and recommend.

The board preferred advisory over administrative role, but had concern about a lack of accountability if that were administration. I think I captured it a little bit. I it doesn't say exactly that, but I put in the word administration. So did that capture kind of your feelings from the last time? I don't remember that last one.

But Yeah. That was the discussion that I recall. I I guess one question I have about that, maybe the city attorney could help. Like, I know so we have a council manager sort of that govern you know, government say. Mhmm. Does the city council administer? I cannot. Right? Because it's, the manager does the administration. What is what is the city council's formal role in in a binding or setting policy for the I

mean, it's essentially the the council's role is sorry. Let me make sure I understand your question right. So your question is, what is the city council's role in the administration of

Yeah. How how would it yeah. So so maybe give me a bit of, like, specific example. If if I thought of Patty,

of, like, the library one as our city manager, and we were

the equivalent of the city council for

the library because we're saying, alrighty. What is how do you formulate that relationship at that level versus, you know, whatever language it is? Like, because because that's kind of how I see our role. Right? We're we're helping the policy. We're approving things, but we're not, you know, we're not doing it. I mean, the data and accounting are not We're

not hiring staff.

We're not

hiring staff. Doing the budget.

You're And an ER role is similar to the city council, but just over this part of I

mean, I think there's there's kind of a few ways that that relationship could be established. Like, going back to my distinguishing between the two kind of whether to be specific or whether to be a broad themes. Right? Like, so in that sense, well, I guess the short short answer to your question is is the charter sets that relationship. And to that end, within the charter, you can set areas where Patty has discretion over the these areas.

And then doing the things where she she has to get your your being city council or your approval for certain things. So it it I guess the relationship is however the technically, the end of the day, however the voters vote to be when the referendum passes. But at this juncture, it's the relationship. It's whatever you would like the relationship to be, and you can kind of describe that. And then we can kind of incorporate that into the the language that we I don't think and I I know that there was a lot of discussion between administrative versus advisory.

And at at the end of the day, can be kind of a spectrum. Right? You don't even have to necessarily use focus on those two words. You can say fees are what we would like to have be in charge of. This is what we would like to give you discretion over, and you don't need to put a label on whether you are administrative advisory. This is what we want, essentially.

Yeah. Because I was asking you to, because, like, in the whole sense of, like, you know, seeing health office, you know, do the day to day, and I feel like we're doing it's something right. So I I

if this meeting means we're doing the

day to day, I don't think any of us think that the board of library trustees, that is our responsibility. Our responsibility is more like the relationship between the city manager and city council, however. But I I don't remember how that. What's the appropriate language you add or just capture something? It's just already captured by the fact that we have the we make policies, and that actually captures everything for that sort of company. Right? We buy the new policy. And then this this is just now redundant, right, unless we wanted to, like, write

checks or

something, which I don't think is.

It looks To that end, like, if you could have to the continued, you would need to seek out just, like, after Michelle, and then just list, colon. And then it would just list everything that Yeah. You all you all have. Want responsibility for Rochelle and then whatever the prior As opposed to labeling an administration? Yeah. I think that's what you were trying to get.

Yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm trying to get at is, like, how do we set the right kind of really show, like, the the policy, like, the the policy.

So in clause two, though, it definitely says that you have bylaws policy.

Which may which I said may already go wrong.

May be that there's redundancies through this. Yeah. And so and and it it makes it a little more clunky because then it throws in that word administration, and that kind of means everything.

Which is why I'm asking, like, the and this is where I asked the attorney about how how to capture that. But the answer to breaking is actually, you know, the verbal, the policy, bylaws, all that from two or three or whatever it is, already captures that sort of relationship, then then we don't necessarily need this because that's everything we really wanna do

But one of the things so think about also I mean, I hate to bring up the ordinances again. But one of the things that you could say is that as representatives of the residents of Santa Clara, You you know, you're there for a sounding board and a community voice and a number of other things that actually are not necessarily in the policy part. So that could be part of your role is that outreach and representation. And so you could add that in here if you wanted to as something that is not a departure, but it's it's not as specified, right, in terms of the responsibility. So when we do you know, like, you're gonna you know, they're terming out.

How are we going to describe what happens here? Right? And who we're looking for in order to be a good or, you know, candidate. Right? That would be you know, that's kinda looking at this. What do you do? What do you wanna do as opposed to being so broad that it's sort of nebulous. Right? Yep. It could be anything. Administration means a lot of things. I mean, the last time, you know, we were talking, I said, okay. Administration to me means taking care of business every day, you know, making sure the best is on time, preparing for council meetings, hiring staff, training them. You don't wanna do any of that. Right?

You don't. And so but what do you wanna do? Oh, I wanna represent the community in, you know, in things that are important to leverage the library's position within the city. I want to I wanna have a regular meeting with council so that we can protect the library as, you know, as indicated in in the. You know, those kind of things.

So whatever is not included in there, it could be part of this. But as as Winn, I think, pointed out very wisely, if you took out the word administration and just popped in a colon and actually said what you do wanna do, that's the opportunity. Mhmm. So you could look at ordinance if there's a lack of of word and verbiage and and concentration in that area if you want

if you want.

Okay. Alright. So we're still gonna come back to this, I think, and work on it a little bit, but, clearly, I think with Glenn's support for us moving forward. Okay. Let's keep on going. Okay. So let's just make sure that we're not interested in this again because we wanna make sure that everybody and I'm sorry that Lynn's not here today. So there shall be a board of library consisting of five members to be appointed. So we wanna get rid of qualified electors. We would prefer to get rid of five members and have two more people. Right? And

the

paid office of employment, that's just standard for all of us. Right? So nobody gets nobody's a staff member. Are we good? Okay.

I guess it said the same thing that we said.

It says the same thing.

Yeah. I don't know.

Alright. So the same. Now

prefer that well.

The the one issue that we talked about this last time was the contract, which is clause ten thirteen section d, which is to contract with school, county, or other governmental agencies to render or receive library services or facilities subject to the approval of the city. May I have your The library will as we discussed, this was the ability of our board of library trustees to be able to negotiate for services beyond the library the head library. So this is you know, you could contract with a third party. You could have all of the books, but we could buy all the books for Santa Clara Unified School District or vice versa. All our books could be bought by them.

I don't think they'd want that to happen. But, anyway, the goal is that you could have negotiating rights to actually subvert and redirect service and through a contractual agreement about delivery of service. And I think you all kind of agreed that that

probably wasn't qualified to do that.

Well but you may not wanna do that. Okay. So I just wanted

to question. Okay. I mean, it would be subject to

the approval of city council, but remember, city council receives something that's already kind of embedded by staff and the body.

Yeah.

So they kind of they don't they have the background, but they don't know what happened, all of the in between. Right? They just have the final recommendation from team to look forward or not. And then so, anyway, are we still concurred that we don't wanna do this? I just wanna double just double check.

Yeah. I think we I remember during our conversation about this, you mentioned this terrible company that

That's terrible. I I shouldn't say that. There's a third party company Yeah. That does provide in public library world. They provide services on demand. It's called Library Systems and Service, And they are an independent body. They are a they

are

a for profit organization. And so as a as a as an institution like that, they actually have they're responsible for a lot of libraries out there that cannot afford to have their own municipal agency. Right? So a lot of times they go to mayor's conference or they go to health and legal cities or they go to and they they promote their services. It's not it's not unlike any other business promoting their services, but they physically come and take over the library the running of the library and the operation.

And so what that means then is that all the money goes to that agency for making it happen. They take care of hiring the staff, firing the staff, letting them go, etcetera. Oftentimes, the staff have to reapply for their jobs, etcetera. It is it's not a a tasteful kind of experience. And

Can I ask a question that that goes back to maybe just a

little bit we're trying to do this? Could the board of libraries let's let's pretend this isn't there. Could the board of libraries just use direct staff to contract library services.

At this point in time, no. Because if you took this off, the answer would be no.

You could couldn't even say, you know, call it

that we could look at it, but you couldn't order that it happened. Okay. Right? This actually allows you

Well, I was I

was trying to say, like,

if if this language is, the board itself goes and doesn't affect any person. That's Yeah. Which is what this says versus kind of policy or direction or whatever that the city should go and do this. But, you know, I'm trying to Right. I understand. Level.

I understand. No differences. No. It's actually it's

a direct action. Yeah. This is

a this is a high level. But, like, if this was gone, the board could still say, well, and the policy or direction could have saved, you know, with, like, city staff with a contract

for Well, let's say, for instance, you wanted us to go into business with Amazon.

Yeah.

Okay? I'm just gonna say that out loud. You could suggest it, and then what staff would do is analyze why it's gonna work or not work.

Yep.

And they give you a response, and the answer would be, no. We're not gonna do that. And and here's all the good reasons why. And we do use Amazon, but not as an exclusive product. And so there's antitrust. There's all kinds of reasons why we don't do that. And so but we would give you the reasons why. But you wouldn't mandate that we make that happen. Right? This is the mandate.

So when except that it has to go to city council. So the council is always the end result in terms of all of this happening. But the issue with this, though, is that you would could, if you wanted to, you go to the California legal cities to find this group. They say, we can do it for half the price, and guess what? Today, you can get a makerspace. We'll make it happen. You can put in library of things. Yep. We know that library is too slow about doing all that stuff. We'll make it happen for less money, 50% less.

But but we could also, like, based on how we're doing this, we could go to, like, the county and or something and say, hey, county. That's right. We need a We wanna rent we'd

like a library in the Northwest, and you have you

have property there. We'd like to participate. That's right. Right. That that's an example of where we could do it directly, or we could have staff to go acquire. And then And that's what I'm

trying say. Bring that back. The staff would still have to

Do all

the do all the analysis, but we you would then be speaking directly to counsel, and we would say, that really disagrees and actually but but it's it's our, you know, it's our job to actually give you analysis of both sides, whether pro or con. Right? But in this particular case, you could just go ahead and work with let's say, for instance, you said, Patty, you know what? Jennifer Weiss is doing a darn good job. We wanna be part of the county. And I said, you're you're making my

I I was giving you different things. It's like, we're at emergency support facilities. I was like, hey.

Can we can we

need to rent the space? Can we That's That's I wasn't thinking about services, but it's like

Well, it could even you know, you negotiate with related to have something in there. Yes.

You can't because it's not a government service.

Well but you could Or is it cooler kind of heat growing?

So so that's a very specific limiting what

pool we get on.

That is true. Okay.

That is true. In fact, that third party wherever, we couldn't actually do that because they're not

a government service, third party school.

It depends on the property and who owns that group. Yeah. So we just saw you probably just saw our the tribe purchased. Right? Yeah. So so But but I'm sorry, like, that

third party company. We couldn't we don't actually

To run it. Right. Right.

I'm not thinking somehow. There's lots of things that are happening.

But, anyway, so I think you get the picture. I think the question is, are you still okay about leaking this off?

It sounds to me like in the case where we have suggestions of we would like the library to go consider, hey. There's an open facility. Maybe that you can go get it. We could go direct staff to go take a look at it. Absolutely. And that that is not for, you know, something that wouldn't happen. Staff would go look at it and then come back and tell us why we're if we have a bad idea or not. Or It's a

good idea.

That's a great idea. Yeah. Let's let's

just But it's just that we as a group don't have to go and do that and then tell come back with that. So

this implies the ability to enter into contract and to negotiate and to to establish the beginnings of some conversation. So let's say you had a really great relationship with the school district, and they said, wow. You know, we see you got 42% off your books. We don't get that.

Yep.

Okay. Now and Yolanda did such a great job. We're gonna give her the the responsibility of buying all the books for the school district and cataloging them and shipping them and doing all of those great things. And, yes, we're gonna get some some residuals back from them, but, you know, we you do it better. There's a lot of reasons why, technically, it might work, but it's not necessarily the best idea. And we would tell you this. But if you were to contract with them, that would sort of eliminate us from actually having a conversation with you about why or not it would work or it doesn't work.

I guess you would have it, but, like,

the the the the board gets completely ignored. Just be like, well, it doesn't matter if we're doing that.

That is true. Okay. Are we okay about sunsetting this one or recommending that maybe a sunset?

I think most of the cases that I can think of where we wanna use something like this, it sounds like we could do it through the policy try to direct them and have a I think a good outcome. So I'm I'm a little less worried. I'm always a little worried about taking these away, but I also don't know in the future, so I think the board would

use it as well.

So So although we can't find it anywhere, we definitely think it is related to the fact that this particular agency was very aggressive at some point in our path and actually went after many, many public libraries and problems. They would go to their French groups and say, we can do it better. Yeah.

But I but I don't think that, technically, this will. Yeah.

Okay.

Alright. So so okay. We can remove it, but I that's I'm just it's I'm just Okay.

And then this ordinance one is more like that other program, clause number two. So I think that one can go away, this one. This one's redundant. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Great. Great. Great. Alright. So More

than that? No.

One other thing

wanna note that last comment?

Yeah. We wanna take that yeah. You wanna strike that?

So just that we're not we're not entertaining the sort of members part of the show. Not.

We want I I

think that will look at the yeah.

I'm sure if you change

the look of using just I I think these two are fine, but the the the third one, because it's, like, qualified.

We've already So so send me what's right. Yeah.

I I I I I always I might suggest deleting charter ten twelve from this because we we are maintaining it. We're just making changes, and we've already got the changes.

So are you okay about just getting rid of this whole thing? Because we've already addressed it with the changes in the other one,

and it's a little redundant. Still. But I think it's good.

I I personally think it's confusing because

it's like you wanna not interested to maintain, and then we it's like, we're actually doing changes. So we have, a spot where it's like, Keith, then we want changes. And then we have things we wanna change, and we have the changes. And then we have get rid of, and then we have the same changes. So I I just think the doc's cleaner. We do the Okay. Alright. That's okay.

Are you good? The claws you wanna retain. The the there's two pieces in there that you wanna strike. Correct.

That's really what it is. Yeah. I think it's confusing to say that the claws

Is is not okay. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Are you okay with that, Tim?

I'm okay.

Steve, you're okay? I'm good.

Are you okay? Yeah. Okay. Alright. Good.

Sure.

Okay. So we'll strike that one entirely because we've already dealt with it in a prior iteration. Okay.

Well, let's save the notes just so that they may help us on the other one.

We'll save for historical purposes. This is draft that indicates what the changes are. And then when we meet on the on March 2, the city attorney will have a cleaned up version of Right.

But you'll have the the red notes to help us in our conversation.

Yes. We can share this version of March 2.

So I think what I wanted to do is make sure, though, that we actually cover every part of the chart that you wanna talk about. That's it. Okay. So chart ten twelve. Okay. A. B. C. D. Okay. Alright. Are we good? Okay. So there's a little bit of time left.

We're good as long as you don't know yet. Don't wanna talk about my.

Alright. Okay. So what's what what is that? What was

Yeah. Share it with you? Yep. So we have two other items. I think couple of them we actually might be able

to go through pretty quickly. So let's

Do you wanna do the Really? I mean, do you wanna speak to her, or would you like us to do the strategic plan and facility

plan? Let's let's

just do that. Think that'll be short. Okay. Okay. Alright. So, Sammy, if we could bring up

Oh, do do we have to take any action on on the stuff to to authorize that off time before you move on? Like action on that.

I think you're gonna be talking it about it again Like, two on March 2. So I don't know. Our our city attorney. Yeah. I'm I'm I'm on with I think to make it cleaner if all trustees present are comfortable with kind of reverting the direction the trustees would like that to take, especially at least in preparation for the March 2 meeting. Yeah. I think it would be good to take action as in the the recommendation and the discussion today.

I guess I guess before we finish the last item Mhmm.

I'll look. Recommendation is here on the screen.

Yep. I'm just checking the okay. And then I I guess this question is, does anybody have a wanna make a motion to accept staff's recommendation for IVG?

I move that we accept staff's recommendations.

And just to sorry. For the record, it's 2698 because, technically, there's another

Oh, sorry. Yeah. 269. Yeah.

Yeah. And there there's no members of the public, either physically present or online. For the record. Thank

you. I second. All in favor of the motion? Say aye. Aye. I take the pass unanimously on absence.

Okay. Thank

you. Yep. And we'll move on to next. Okay.

Great. So this is gonna be a little adventurous, I think, for a couple of our members, and thank you again for being for Jonathan and and chair Eileen and and vice chair to the world for coming to our council meeting.

I have mixed emotions. Know.

And I'm so sorry that we had a little I mean, for those that are listening, and I know that we're hurting, it was a pretty tough meeting because we had a very rough set of public comments that were unprofessional and and very difficult. They were Zoom bombing. We have taken precautions and training, and both our our leaders here are now, hopefully, well well versed in what to do and if it does happen again, which one of the reasons why we looked very carefully at who might be in the room tonight because that's exactly what happened at council on Tuesday, which is we had several individuals calling one after the other with very vitriolic and racist and offensive comments ranging

from

describing the African American I mean, the issue is it was they were terrible. And and it was very hard to control the temperament in the room, and it was very shocking and difficult. Very, very difficult. And then it continued to get worse. So part of the issue that we have as a body is is that if we do have those situations that might come up because we do offer Zoom, that our chair and our vice chair actually working with Lynn.

And and Glenn sent out a very nice list of what to do in case we do get video bombed. So that we were very careful, and that's why Lynn said there's nobody in the room because we we don't normally get people coming to visit us. And that's a clear sign that there might be something happening, but it was definitely another an unfortunate opportunity for some people to make some terrible comments, and it set everybody on edge. And, thankfully, it did not have the same kind of response with the temple that I was you know, I guess I'm saying, please let it go away. Because it might have chain I don't think it would have changed our vote, but it it set a tone and a tenor that was not positive.

And

we

are very positive in terms of moving forward. So and, you know, there was a lot of batedness, unfortunately, to all the presentations at night. So except for the ones in general business, which is started with us. So we're gonna go through this very quickly. And this is probably, though, we've done this all with staff already. We've done this with we are gonna do this with our San Clara City Library Foundation and Friends board also. And you have seen this already too, but this is the version that we are that we shared with Teflon successfully passed. Okay. So let's keep on going with the to the PowerPoint very quickly.

I'm just like, I I think we've seen the the I don't think there were any changes from the previous plan, so maybe we just go through the PowerPoint Got it. For people who didn't see it. Yeah.

And then Absolutely. And then we can Absolutely. Okay. So this is our three year strategic plan. You'll notice that a lot of things are very familiar. It was Tammy, when to move forward? I'm gonna go through it really quick. Okay. So know that bright colors, we dabble, blah, blah. And well, because we want the public to pick it up.

So we also want you to be very proud of it, and Bruce did a fantastic job about kind of organizing it, and the staff all helped put it together. So it is a three year strategic plan, but it is also meant to be evergreen. And you'll notice that the mission and vision, I think, were very, widely accepted by council. I think they appreciated it, especially the discover was possible because, of course, that's a a nice extension about the city where everything is possible. Right?

So, you know, let's yeah. Next slide. So it was really based on all of that good work that we all did, more than 1,500 surveys, lots of representation and engagement with community, etcetera. And, of course, we've spent the better part of two years into the past. Okay.

So key points for from us from the community is that high satisfaction with staff and services, desire for greater access to library spaces, need for greater awareness of services. So so that meant stronger communication, stronger public awareness, stronger social media. Just we it's not so much that we don't do it, but we need to do it better, and we need to try to reach communities that are still out there that we aren't able to reach. Especially, I think there's a strong interest from council on the Spanish speaking community and wanting to do better by that by that particular group. So desire for library to represent diverse cultures and languages in the community as it's developing, so not just the point in time.

Right? You know, we have the largest Ukrainian collection here West Of The Mississippi. So in a public library. So we get a lot of people coming to us to look for those materials and, interlibrary loan, etcetera. And strong interest in innovative technology and digital literacy.

The council is especially interested in us not forgetting that even though 75% of all of our residents have a computer, they may not they might have a smartphone. They may not know how to use it well. We still need all of those computers that are out there, and we see it being used all the time. So the issue is how do we maintain that digital literacy need at the same time as providing innovation within technology? So strong emphasis on librarians, community resource, place to connect to community, social and civil civic services, and then, of course, life needs.

There was a strong interest, I think, in us maintaining resources for our homeless population, being that lifeline to that particular community, but also anyone who needs resources and that especially that we're open and free and available to everyone. Okay? Next one. When the when when it came down to what the community actually identified, and we were had the blessing of many people helping us on this. But we came with three themes.

The first was increasing community connection, and that's driven external partnerships, fundraising, and marketing and public relations. The second one was about improving capacity. How can we do things better with the tools that we've got, but also looking to other resources to support the work we do through organizational structure, policies, maintaining those policies, updating them, and then through voluntary steps. Mhmm. And the last one is building a stronger today for a better tomorrow. What does it look like in our future? How can we be more efficient? How can we be more effective? How can we measure and evaluate our services better still? And how can we use data to make better decisions?

How can we support our library facilities through Measure I and moving forward? And then, of course, using technology in its best way. Next slide. Okay. Increasing community connection.

We talked about partnerships with schools, organizations, small businesses, and really using our partners to expand library services and to make a stronger use of those services so that everyone can participate. Fundraising, we mentioned specifically the Santa Clara Board of Library Trustees, this body, as well as the Santa Clara City Library Foundation in France to for and thank them for their support and continuation of enhancing library services. We did mention the twenty fifth anniversary at the event and welcomed and invited all of the council to come. So they're well aware of that. But we also wanted to emphasize the fact that this body and and our our foundation and friends are are about resource sharing and about philanthropic support to further our mission and to make sure that we can serve everyone now and in the future.

And that included facilities also as well. Marketing and public relations, just improving that, continuing to improve that. We have mentioned to the city manager that we need a communications coordinator, and they are interested, I think, in helping us pursue that with parts of road because maybe a joint position. Okay. Priority number two, improving capacity.

Organizational structure, it's really kind of, how do we do things better? And so that means cross training our staff. It means, spending, more time training staff. It it also means using interns and other kinds of groups of people, making it and setting policy that allows those interns to participate in a and and and not ever transplant or supplant what the staff is doing, but to be able to extend the service that we have to offer. To really make sure our our policies were five to ten years old, and both Luis and Nepalyn are actually helping us update them so that they are easily usable for us.

So we're not hampered. So we can have an art gallery so that we can you know, we don't we don't have so many restrictions on we used to have tabling for free speech, and now we don't have to authorize that. It's it's available outside. And for volunteer and staff development to really deploy our volunteers and and staff in such a way to have them attend conference and to develop their their resources and and skill sets, but also to acknowledge their good work. Okay.

Priority three, building a stronger today for a better tomorrow. Operational efficiencies really to maximize that service. To incorporate data and measurement and evaluation, we are looking at at in in creating a dashboard so the whole community can actually see what we're doing and also in reports and a number of other communication tools for making that. Library facilities, that was really more an acknowledgment about the good work that we did with the facilities sponsored plan. And then, of course, technology is really how do we use technology the best way possible?

How are we apprised not only for the tools that we need, how to save for that, how to spend the money wisely, but also how to use new technologies and learning like AI and and to maximize what we can do, not only for the staff and our community, but also as I think our council member Jane was very concerned about this. How can we make sure that we are very aware of sharing with our community as we're teaching them to be aware of pitfalls, how to be interested in vetting information. What does that look like? And to not rely on technology as the only source of tools that they use in terms of making things happen as we move forward. So with that, really, it's our our next steps are are going back to the staff.

Each unit has actionable steps for every single part of this strategic plan, And they're ready, and they're actually, they've been more than ready. But we didn't have this opportunity to get it for capital. So now that we have it and now that it's been approved, the staff can now develop metrics and the number of things and more time get back into the budget process. So you'll see the results of that and what it what and the outcomes. Questions about the strategic plan.

So our goal is actually to get to a color version of this in print. We do have to you know, there's a law in the books now that that all of our digital information, especially PDFs, have to be ADA accessible. That that means it has to happen before April. And so we need to convert everything, including the strategic plan and the facilities management plan into ADA ex you know, formatting. And so that with you can imagine with lots of color, but not just color, with lots of maps, with lots of charts, with lots of images, those all have to be described and captioned.

And so before it gets published. So this is kind of a prob not a problem. It's a challenge for us. We accept it. But know that it's gonna be a little while before this goes in a digital format for everyone to see. So we'll probably have the print version out a lot sooner.

My one question that's keeping mine is, when now it's approved, does that mean that it's starting as of, like, a Tuesday right now? Yeah. Just running with it and and hear it correct.

They're not quite yet, but they are aware that it happens. They're joyful because it's been a long time coming. And some of the things that are already on their list, they've done already. Yeah. So now they have to kinda recreate a little bit more because they've checked it off the list. And so, you know, like, trying to spend this point is Sunday hours, extension of the hours was one of those things. I mean, we were able to make that happen. We just opened another hour on Saturday. So some of the things we've already done, and we shared that with counsel the other day, and they're well aware that it's sort of a a gift in progress. Right?

And so we just keep on giving, and and the staff will adjust. They'll they'll add other things in there. The goal is that this is not a prescriptive document. It's really to guide them in their process moving forward. It is to set a few priorities that we wanna spend money on this, this, and this, especially getting our community back that we lost a little bit during COVID because it took us a little bit of time to come back.

So how do we get regain some some traction with our Spanish speaking community, with our nonusers? How do we how do we bring them back? And the staff have a really strong set of plans to make that happen. Our goal then, next step, is to actually create annual reports that we share with you, but also have regular reporting here so that we can make it happen. Right? K. So you are aware. And it's not just you think about, you know, the next evil kind of conversation that we're gonna have. Actually, we're gonna bring that to you with a set of outcomes. And that's why the dashboard is kind of important because that'll keep track of all of the things we're doing.

Okay. Questions? Okay. Let's go to the facility master plan, which meant for twenty years. This one the the three things, just as a reminder, that we were going to do is the property condition assessment.

We and so there was a goal to look at our current buildings, but also with the forecasting to the future to come up with a funding strategy of what's possible. And then the last part was that next was the general plan, which is, as you were as you might remember, some of you, that was really jam, and, you know, we've talked about this for such a long time. It's really gonna happen now. So, also, based on data and community engagement, lots and lots, and you were all part of that. Let's go to the next one.

Okay. So more meeting rooms, gathering, and study spaces. I am delighted to tell you that Northside, we will probably be able to open that community meeting room very soon for after hours use. And so that probably will happen. We late spring, early summer was we're still working on process, but we have the technology.

We already have it rezoned already, so we just have to kind of finesse the process. But they wanted you know, the community wanted more meeting rooms, gathering, and study spaces, more access to technology, materials, and services in all languages. And, of course, it reflects the demographic need that we have in the community. Okay. Service and population.

So, basically, there's the takeaways from this slide next is really kind of to share that Mission, although small, has a significant service area, and it's a it's a it's a little undersized for that area as it's gonna grow, but not terribly so. Central Park is pretty much the best size it can be. In fact, it might be a little bit bigger, but we're not gonna take space away. Okay. But Northside, if all of the development happens in the Northwest quadrant of the city as projected, that could mean an additional 30 to 40,000 people in that area.

There is no way that Northside branch alone could take care of them. So so that's one of the reasons why we have the recommendations, which are just guidelines for moving forward. Okay. Next one, recommendations for Central Park Library. It's really to centralize the 1st Floor as the showcase of what we have to offer as a community.

So library of things, international languages will all be captured together. It's really meant to be sort of the living room for all of our community to come. They can still pick up their goals. They can find the newest books, but we hope to add library of things and a makerspace perhaps and have even perhaps some additional study rooms. The goal is to consolidate the adult collection up here.

And so both so that it's easier to find things. On the 1st Floor, there is some desire from the mayor and a few other people that we expand the cafe. Now I am very happy to tell you that we signed the contract with the cafe. And so we have a group coming in very shortly, but probably, I think, mid March. But they're they're still doing a few things to, you know, enhance the the services so they can help them.

So who's the new who's the one in Cathay?

The group is called Latin Asian Fusion, and they are based out of Campbell. They are going to come here six days a week. And but, really, it's it's not the full day, like, ten to seven. It's going to be more like 10:30 to 05:30 every day. There's a couple of days when it's gonna be ten to 04:30. But we will see them every day except for Sunday. They they there's some religious reasons why they don't wanna participate. We totally understand. But if you go down to the cafe right now, there's a little freestanding sign, and it says you know? Oh, 1,000.

You may not be able to get from now from here, but it there's countdown. And the freestanding side will have digital it is a digital side, basically. It'll have the rotating menu. They are also doing catering, and they will have a full coffee bar. And so we're very excited about them coming. Okay. However, one of the things recommendations from the mayor and a couple of other people is that they wanted to see an expansion of the cafe. We do too, but we're not sure. So one of the goals for Measure I is to actually incorporate two options. One is to expand the cafe as may be prescribed by the recommendations from the architect.

The other one is actually to think about an an outcropping of our current design to have the cafe extended to the park. So we'll see what happens with that. There's no prescriptive anything, but it it is Measure I was designed for us to have the broadest perception about what we could do with these buildings, and so that's that's the goal as we move forward. The second page for Central Park is once again more of a community feel. So there's gonna be, like, community engagement, another business pavilion so that people who are doing their business work can kind of use it as coworking space and really spread out.

Reed Santa Clara will be pulled out, and there will be room for them to meet, but have a presence. So they're not behind the closed doors. Right? They'll be they'll have a physical public presence. There still will be places for them to meet confidentially, but it it does offer a better opportunity for us to attract more people to that particular program. Genealogy is gonna move back a little bit to the back of the house, their their work room, anyway. And then we might be able to relocate the team, though. We're still debating about whether that could come. Okay. Any questions about any of that?

Okay. Mission branch. So as you know, Mission's gone through a few renovations, but it hasn't always been to the staff's advantage. So one of the things that we have an ability to do now is to redesign that staff area a little bit better. And so because, for instance, they really don't have a kitchen, And the the desk is too easy to run by, so it's there's a lack of security there.

So we're gonna redo those areas. There's also a lack of privacy for staff. There's no one place where any of them can go for a phone call or anything else without leaving the building, so we're gonna install a privacy pod. There there was a small conversation about whether or not we can add another bathroom to the community meeting room. That's debatable.

We'll still have to see whether it works because it might change the shape of the building. Chair Evans made a very good comment at at council that it hasn't gone through the historical landmarks commission, this particular design, or any of that. And so the issue is that we might we probably will write into the SOQ, the Cigna qualification, that as an RFP, that it has to go through that process. Because if it's on a you know, if it's a historical building, it needs to be part of that review. Likewise sorry.

The architect also recommended a second building maybe could be put on that premises that still may not work too because it'll change the lighting and a whole bunch of other things. So but we did appreciate very much, I think, Sharon, her daughter, Evan's very strong endorsement of the process and the really, the collective wisdom that came about in terms of creating these. That was wonderful. Thank you so much. But it is something that we need to be mindful that these are not prescriptive.

They are meant to be guidelines. We are going to the staff don't concur with all of these recommendations either. So the issue is that it has to go through a process where we bring it back to the staff and to you, and then it'll definitely go to whichever commissions it needs to go through in order to get it processed. And then, of course, then it goes into the council anyway to get. So the measure I money is gonna go towards a couple of things that I will talk about at the end.

But let me go to Northside. And you see all of the the dollar sign, you know, about approximately how much it might cost. Now North Side has a little bit of a problem, and so it's all the interior. It's not the exterior. Oh, well, we're coming maybe for the endocrine problem, but we'll have to see.

So it's better used to the outdoor space with that garden area out there, maybe more planters, stronger engagement so that it doesn't it's not it's a little hostile feeling out there, and, of course, there's a lot of weather. Right? But the one thing that is key, unfortunately, is that the back is all jammed in there. And so and if you've ever been there and you've seen the back of the house, you know that our restroom there is huge. So it takes it's almost the size of an office.

So we're gonna cut that in half and expand the staff area so that more staff could be okay. But we also wanna open up the spaces a little bit because our our community is is not used to sitting adjacent to each other so much. So if we could create more creative spaces where more people can attend and and participate, but not get easier this way. More study rooms, and, of course, library of things is very important there too. Okay.

Questions? Okay. So the big thing was that if all of the if all the development happens and we get an infusion of 35 to 40,000 more people, more than likely, there will be a need for some kind of service commensurate with the population growth. And so there was a proposal for a Northwest. It's it's about the same size as North Side, but a little bit further up in the quadrant.

As you know, this is about the same place as Patrick Henry, but maybe a little bit further, but it's not meant to be prescriptive. That's the general area on the other side of one on one. There it offers a lot of opportunities that maybe we don't have right now. Library of things as opposed to just a, you know, a placeholder, it's a real thing now. Right? Maybe a learning garden. Maybe a very much a a strong collaboration with Parks and Rec. We hope it will be exactly that. It might be in a park again, but we hope that there's much more dialogue with Parks and Rec about the activities that Okay. Questions about Northwest?

Okay. And then station area plans. The task force actually had some recommendations that there'd be some library presence, but not specific about what kind of library presence. And so, initially, I think we thought as the population grows that there'll be a kiosk and maybe some leased space later, but that will not happen until everything gets booked out. So another 6,700 people are planned to be there, and that might you know, of course, that's gonna include BCA and BART and a number of, you know, the other transit. Question? Okay. Alright. Sending strategies. I already talked about Measure I being a a big part of it.

So we have $9,000,000 to our name. The box just got sold. I will tell you. So that's no news too. Really good, good rate. Very good paid. So so what's gonna happen at Central Park? At Central Park, what is absent from this document, the facility's master plan, is that they didn't talk. They didn't take a look at our storage areas, and they didn't look at the bed. So our bathrooms here are not they need some help. And so, yeah, they do. You know?

I mean, if you've been in

a public bathroom, this one's not so bad. The dumpsters, it needs a little bit of fresh air. Okay. But the other thing is that we don't have a place for gender neutral anybody. And or we do, but guess where it is? At in the youth services room. So that creates a conflict of people coming in and and not being as welcome or not feeling as welcome. So we're gonna move the family restroom, which is our general mental visual bedroom over to the front side here, and we're gonna work on this air whole area here being centrally controlled so that we can change the security system so people can be here after hours as we are today. Mhmm. It's much easier.

You know? The reason why Northside is easier to rezone is because it's already on it's already on a, you know, an alarm system. This place is not. And so that's kind of a problem. So, anyway, that's that's kind of what Measure. I will pay for we help design and design for the three locations. Measure I will also be able to pay for the majority of Mission and North Northside changes. So that's really good. And then it'll pay for the design element for here and those we hope the best. And then as where as well as the security control.

It's also gonna pay for new doors, new sliding glass doors here and admission. And then there's one last thing, which is the the lighting control system is is ten years old now here, and there's over 24 lighting systems. Believe me, it's a pain

in that.

And so

We have evidence during this meeting. Absolutely.

That was a meeting for cephalosotol that can be done remotely, and so that's gonna mean an RFP going out. Okay. So Northwest, you know, we talked about this with council. It's going to mean a number of things. Council, I think, this point is not interested so much in the COP returning, you know, the certificate of participation. It's okay. It's okay. So we just talked about budget options being very cursory about it. We did have a very nice call from Betsy and Vegas who said, give the money all the to the library. And so and, you know, anyway, that was very heartening.

But she'll be the only one that said that, but that's okay. Okay. But joint use with parks and rec. We wanna maintain what that looks like. Stationary plan, I've already mentioned either leads or that.

And then, of course, our foundation and friends are critical to our philanthropic review of this. The key takeaway about the general plan is that community development actually took apart that whole section and then rebuilt it with us. And so that means that now it will read, and more importantly, our community development director indicated that she will comply with because the language is already in there, that there's a commensurate increase in library services with the growth of the city, but it has not been implemented. So now she's going to make sure it's implemented. So the two clauses in here have more teeth to them.

And then I won't go into what it says because that's just a lot of there's a lot of sections and ordinances that she kinda threw back in there and said, there is there is there. But she arranged it so that it's a network of library system. So it's not just the three branches. She never mentions the fact that we have three branches. She talks about it as if it's where it's a network of library services. So that means it could be a number of things, which gives us the flexibility that we need to really have those things we talked about, lease based kiosk, maybe another branch. Okay? That's kind of it. So what are what's gonna happen next? Well, we sold the bond.

So we have money now. We have a $100,000 a $100,000,000, excuse me, in the tranche. That's the first tranche. That will pay for those things I just talked about. It'll also pay for the design. Second tranche and third tranche will be the implementation of that design. Now what's gonna happen with the SOQ specifically that they I can't remember what it is. But, anyway, is we're gonna get a catalog of different vendors who are going to be applying for them, and then we can pick from that group. So it won't be an RFP that we have to work with one architect. It might be 10 architects.

It might be three senior engineers, engineering firms. So that actually gives us a little bit of breath and room. If for some reason, the design bill thing comes to the charter review and gets approved, then it is possible that those agencies might be eligible for construction too. So we're not counting on that, but it does leverage some hope for that to happen. So because that actually is the one hurdle that we've all had.

You that was told by you that we were limited in terms of the call for proponents for the consultants for both plans because they wanted to have another say on construction or something else. We weren't we don't allow that here. And so we didn't get any California Yeah. Candidate. So that's a problem for us, frankly, because can California architects know California libraries better.

And so it is it is difficult for us to work with this. But any questions about that before? And I know we're we're running short on time, so I don't think we I don't know if we have time for it. Would things like new furniture come from? So that's included. So that's furnishers, fixtures, and ex expenditures, and it's in their equipment. I was No. It's in there. I was reading some of this the other day, and the staff is. Chairs and stuff. Absolutely. I mean, it's everywhere. It it is everywhere. So I will tell you that we had success already with Michigan. They already have the chairs.

You know, we're commensurately so there is a little bit of pot of money that is left that has come from the renovation and from the original construction that our lovely foundation has been taken care of. And so we've been asking them for little amounts every every little bit to restore because, you know, the staff a lot of our equipment and our and our furniture is as old as the the last renovation or the building for us. Sometimes it just falls apart because it's wear and tear. We did get permission to for here, this building, to redo the carpet and the painting, but that won't happen for another two and a half years. So we will probably have to close in order to make that happen for that time being.

So it's about it might be two or three weeks. We're thinking that we wouldn't stay open during that winter holiday so they can kind of make that happen. We'd have to do that over two years because there's not enough money in the kitty to make sure. Because so that money is totally separate from Measure I. That's CIP money. Any other questions about facility sponsor plan or or strategic plan?

I relate building up on Debbie's question. Yeah. For the expansion of the cafe, what would that look like? Because you said that you want to you're thinking about expanding the cafe into outside. So how would that look like? Will you just be simply us putting more tables and chairs, like

an outdoor pavilion or It

it be up a wall or maybe right? If they

Or it could be expanding the the entrance or the exit. So one of the things that's why we have the architect. I can I mean, I can forecast it's gonna cost a lot of money, but but the issue is not so much that is it gonna cost a lot of money, but that the council wanted us to take a look at it? So we are gonna put it in front of the architect that there's gonna be two options. One is to kind of encase and expand the cafe within the compliance of space that we have. And then the second option is to think about an external presence, Whatever that looks like.

But it's gonna cost money to hire an architect to do this.

That's coming out of Measure I.

Oh, okay. So but they have the funding

for it.

We have the funding for that. We have $9,000,000. So it's gonna cover all of Mission, their changes, all of Northside, their changes, and the design for the three building, as well as a few other things that I talked about, the bathroom, you know, and the sliding glass doors and the the sliding glass doors. Mhmm. Yeah.

Any other questions? So I really wanna kinda share with you that the next three to five years are gonna be about design and construction because we needed not only to spend we have 1,200,000 to spend upon design. Okay? We have to spend the rest of that $9,000,000 within five to seven years after the after they sell the second set of one. So it's not a small ask to have everything ready because, you know, it takes a few years to build something, but it also takes a few years to do renovation.

And that is very expensive. So the other piece of this is what are we gonna do when we do the renovation, and how are we gonna move the staff around? Because you cannot you usually don't have too much renovation with the staff present. So we may have to close Mission for its renovation. We may have to close Northside for its renovation.

They may all come in here, staff, to you know? Or, you know, in my other crew in my other presence, I actually was able, dollar wise, to open up a satellite places. I don't I don't there's no money for that. There is absolutely no money for that. I was able to fundraise for the in my old location, and we were able to do it. So I renovated a hockey rig. We renovated a bank, all within the dollar cost that we have, but that was a different time. That was really, like, ten plus years ago. So I don't think there's enough money to do that here unless by some miracle somebody says, hey. You know what?

I wanna give you some money so you can operate a satellite mission or a satellite north side. Because there is there are places out there that actually we could reuse. The issue is that it costs a little bit of fun, not a little bit, a lot, to do the TI, the tenant improvement, in order to make that happen. So but, you know, some we've had satellite places before. You know? We've had this place move around a number of times, right, before this building got constructed. So it it is possible that there's no extra money for that to happen. So council would have to authorize something like that, but we're not quite there yet. Right? It'll take some time.

We will be coming back to you with all of the design elements so that you have a say in in what happened, but also your you have a front seat about about what takes place. Okay? And I can tell you it's a great process. I've done many of these myself, and it it you'll have fun. But it it's meaningful because this is a really great way of engaging in the department.

They they have a really you know, we did engage with them originally when it first got, but now they need to see and and engage with what that really means now. What does that really mean, library things and and makerspace, and how does it look like? And, you know, you have youth picking out the colors of their of their furniture. I mean, that's kind of the sort of level that happens, so it's gonna be fun. Anybody else have any questions about this? So I hope you're happy with it. That's sort of a distillation, Steve, of what I'm gonna give to the president of foundation. But it's not it we haven't decided on the date yet. Okay.

Yep. Thank thank you. And I just want I think the one comment I have is that the council looks like they were, you know, excited to hear about it. They are. They definitely have. I think they all ask good questions about how they about making sure that the library has this party. That's why I think that was very positive. Cool. Do we need a for a permission, should we have a a motion as the recommendation on file?

I think just on the records, check with other any public online.

Yeah. Do you

We have no other attendees.

I'm assuming not. I yes. I would recommend that. So we'll make the motions then. Excuse

me? The motion is what?

The recommendation is staff recommendation. Note the final status on the That

you received the report.

The staff recommendation? I think that we

Go ahead. So know I can

file the the recommendation report real quick.

Do we have a second? Second. Okay. All all in favor of the the. Okay. That passes. Yeah. So the point after. So we do have a third topic. This is a work plan. I think this is gonna be a long discussion, I'm sorry. Already getting late. So I guess that's the question that I do we have a motion that we continue to

our next meeting for Will we have time for next meeting if the city attorney is there?

I think it'll be okay because you've gone through mode of the work, and you've had a really good conversation about it. He's just it's just kind

of a

look and feel. Right? So he's gonna have some questions for you, but I don't think it'll be his thoughts.