Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Chair, the meeting is now being recorded.

Thank you. I would like to call the regular meeting of June 8th, 2026 to order. Will the secretary please call roll?

Commissioner Escamilla. Commissioner Leo.

Here.

Commissioner Oliva. Commissioner Pham. Commissioner Wu.

Here.

Vice Chair Benninger.

Present.

Chair Ramos. Present. Chair Quorum has been reached at 5.30 p.m.

Great. Well, now go ahead and do the Pledge of Allegiance. Vice Chair Benninger, would you like to lead us?

Yes, please stand.

Place your hand over your heart and face the flag. Follow me. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thank you, Vice Chair Benninger. Before we begin, I would like to remind my fellow commissioners to turn your microphones on when speaking and off when not speaking. And when speaking, please place the microphone about four inches away from you. Thank you. I would also like to state for the record that we had Commissioner Pham join us at 5.30, just was not at his seat. He was present. Members of the public may attend the Planning Commission meeting either in person or virtually via Zoom. I now invite the Commission Secretary to describe how the public can access and participate in this meeting.

This meeting is being live streamed via our portal at www.santa-ana.primegov.com slash public slash portal and on YouTube at www.youtube.com slash city of Santa Ana videos. If you would like to provide a public comment, you may do so in the following ways. Join the meeting via Zoom, enter the meeting ID number, When the item you wish to comment on is being discussed, please select the hand icon to indicate that you would like to speak. Once called upon, remember to unmute yourself and state your name for the record. You can also join the meeting by calling 669-900-6833. enter meeting id number eight six two seven five one zero four three nine five when the item that you would like to comment on is being discussed press nine to let us know that you would like to speak you will be called upon by the last three digits of your phone number after you are called upon you may press six to unmute yourself for those who are attending this meeting in person and would like to provide public comment please fill out a request to speak form and turn it in into the recording secretary All speakers will have three minutes to speak. I will alert you when your time is up.

Moving on to public comments on agenda or non-public hearing items. Secretary, does anyone wish to speak?

If you are attending this meeting in person and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please fill out a request to speak form and turn it in into the secretary. If you are participating via zoom and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please select the hand icon to let us know you would like to comment. If you are calling in and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please dial nine and then six to unmute yourself. I will wait a few seconds. Chair, we did receive one email in the form of public comment before the 3.30 p.m. deadline. It was distributed to the commission and posted online, and we do not have any speakers in-house or via Zoom.

Thank you. Moving on to the consent calendar, which one motion for all consent items unless an item is pulled for separate discussion? Is there a motion to approve item A?

I like to approve.

Minutes from May 28, 2026. And item B, excuse absences. We have a motion from Commissioner Wu.

I second.

We have a second from Vice Chair Benninger. Secretary, please call for a roll call vote.

Commissioner Escamillo. Commissioner Leo.

Aye.

Commissioner Oliva. Aye. COMMISSIONER FAN?

AYE.

COMMISSIONER WU?

AYE.

VICE CHAIR BENINGER?

AYE.

CHAIR RAMOS? AYE. MOTION APPROVED BY MAJORITY VOTE WITH COMMISSIONER ESCAMILLA AND COMMISSIONER LEVA ABSENT.

That concludes the consent calendar items. We are now moving on to the public hearing. I will now review the process for the public hearing so that everyone knows what to expect. Staff will provide a presentation and answer questions from the Commission. The public hearing will be opened. The applicant will be given the opportunity to speak, limited to 15 minutes. Members of the public will be given the opportunity to comment, limited to three minutes. The applicant will be given the opportunity to respond to comments made by the public, limited to five minutes. The public hearing will be closed. Discussion will return to the Commission with formal action taken to approve, deny or continue review of the application. Please consider the following suggestions when organizing your comments. Please state your name and address. If you'd like that is strictly voluntary. State whether you support, oppose or are neutral to the proposal. Your statement should include all pertinent facts within your knowledge. Please note decisions on these matters are final unless appealed within 10 days by any interested individual or party. Recommendations on these matters will be forwarded to the City Council at a later date for final determination. This is the time and place for conditional use permit number 2026-09 for the property located at 220 East 4th Street, Unit 105, located within the downtown DT subzone of the transit zoning code specific development number 84, SD 84 zoning district. Before we begin, do any commissioners have anything they wish to disclose with regard to this item? City Council Chambers, Great seeing as there are no disclosures the case planner Byron Luke sorry about mispronounced that will provide a brief presentation.

City Council Chambers, Thank you, and good evening chair almost and planning Commissioners tonight's first item. City Council Chambers, tonight's first item is an application for conditional use permit number 2026.09. LOCATED AT 220 EAST FOURTH STREET UNIT 105. IT IS A REQUEST FOR APPROVAL OF A CUP TO ALLOW THE SALE OF BEER AND WINE FOR ON-PREMISES CONSUMPTION THROUGH A TYPE 41 ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGE CONTROL LICENSE. THAT'S RECOMMENDATION IS TO ADOPT A RESOLUTION APPROVING CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT NUMBER 2026-09 FOR THE SALE OF BEER AND WINE FOR ON-PREMISES CONSUMPTION AS CONDITIONED. THE GENERAL PLAN LAND USE DESIGNATION FOR THE SITE IS DISTRICT CENTER MEDIUM HIGH. And the zoning district is the Transit Zoning Code Specific Development No. 84 with the downtown The surrounding land uses are commercial mixed use in a city owned parking structure to the north and commercial uses to the east, south and west. The lot size is 16,385 square feet, which is outlined in the red box and the unit size is a 1,124 square foot tenant space with a 425 square foot proposed outdoor patio, which is highlighted by the star and pointed to by the arrow. The subject site was developed in the late 1980s and has been tenanted tenanted by a variety of retail office and eating establishment uses over the last several decades. The subject tenant space has been continuously occupied by bakery uses from 1988 until July 2022 has remained remained vacant since. On April 16 2026 the applicant applied for a conditional use permit requesting approval of an ABC type 4041 license to allow the onsite sale of beer and wine for on premises consumption. The prospective restaurant Bloom is intentionally spelled with two zeros in place of the letter O to reference its use of homemade 00 flour, which is an ultra finely ground wheat flour that is commonly used in pizzas, fresh pastas and pastries. This will be Bloom's first location. The eating establishment is proposing to occupy a vacant 1124 square foot tenant space in an existing commercial building. The unit fronts the pedestrian Paseo along Spurgeon Street and will include a 425 square foot outdoor dining area along the eastern elevation. The restaurant's initial hours of operations will be from Tuesday to Saturday from 11 a.m. to 5 p.m., and they are hoping to expand their future proposed hours of operation to Monday to Sunday, seven days a week, from 11 a.m. to 8 p.m. These three site photos show the unit entrance outlined in red and the proposed outdoor dining area outlined in blue. And the outdoor patio will be enclosed with decorative fencing that is consistent with the architectural design of the neighboring establishments. The top left photo shows the eastern elevation along the Paseo. The top right photo shows the eastern elevation in front of the unit. And the bottom photo shows the eastern elevation showing the storefront entrance. The site plan shows the tenant suite location within the commercial building fronting the pedestrian Paseo. And the tenant suite is highlighted in yellow and pointed by the red arrow. The floor plan shows the locations of the kitchen areas and the indoor and outdoor customer seating areas, there are five indoor tables seating up to 16 people and five outdoor table seating up to 14 people. This map shows the 57 active on sale ABC licenses within track 750.02 which is identified by the color dots and the site is identified by the yellow outline and the brown boundary reflects the tracks boundaries. The proposed alcohol sales will be complementary to the mixed use and high intensity environment within Santa Ana's downtown area. It will not be detrimental to the health, safety or general welfare of the community or surrounding properties. The nearest school is approximately 887 feet southeast of the site. The nearest open space location, Plaza Calle Cuatro, is approximately 225 feet northeast of the site. And the nearest playground is approximately 980 feet east of the site. The closest religious institution is located 560 feet southwest of the project site. There are also residential units 100 feet and 300 feet northwest of the project site within the market lofts DTSA apartment community and the Rafferty mixed use development, respectively. However, they are located within a highly amenitized community with a live work and play environment that is compatible with the commercial uses in the downtown. Staff is recommending conditions of approval requiring security cameras closing procedures and appropriate signage. The operational standards applicable to an ABC license and conditions of approval, such as a good neighbor policy and property maintenance agreement will address any potential impacts and will ensure that the use will not negatively affect the surrounding community. The police department has also reviewed this request and has no concerns as the operational standards applicable to an ABC license and the proposed conditions of approval will mitigate any potential impacts. City Council Chambers, The request that cp is consistent with the general plan land use designation of district center medium high. City Council Chambers, And that project also aligns with land use element goal lu to and policies which aim to provide a balanced mix of land uses I meet the city's diverse needs provide employment opportunities capture local spending. City Council Chambers, encourage reinvestment into the city and strengthen the city's image as a business friendly regional activity Center. Oh, you for and policy also apply, which support improvements to the built environment and the promotion of complete neighborhoods by encouraging a mix of complimentary uses community services and people places. The project also lines with economic prosperity element ap 3.11 which seeks to improve the city's image through the creation of vibrant and engaging public spaces. In accordance with the California environmental quality act and the sequel guidelines, the project is categorically exempt from further review per section 15301 class one existing facilities of the sequel guidelines. Based on this analysis and notice of exemption environmental review number 2026 dash 32 will be filed for this project and there is no fiscal impact associated with this action. Staff's recommendation is to adopt a resolution approving conditional use permit number 2026-09 for the sale of beer and wine for on-premises consumption as conditioned. And that concludes staff's presentation. Staff and the applicant are here to answer any questions. Thank you.

Thank you, Byron. I'd like to state for the record that we had Commissioner Escamilla join us at 5.37 p.m. And with that, does the commission have any comments or questions for staff? Commissioner Escamilla?

Thank you, Chair. I guess just two quick things with this particular item. Number one, are we still or they're still having to go through as an applicant the process to have the annual kind of enclosure permit? I'm not sure what our technical term is for that permit for the outdoor seating that they're utilizing.

The outdoor seating that they're proposing would have to go through our city's public works agency and would require an encroachment permit into that public right-of-way.

Perfect. And the only reason I ask is I guess just how we're currently doing our process. Sometimes there's some confusion between when a new owner comes in and the previous owner is there and they kind of forget to do the annual fee payments and then it becomes a surprise and like no one really tells them and then one day they get a violation notice. I'm just trying to see if we are doing anything or City Council Chambers, intending on doing anything differently, just so that maybe it's like a more permanent automated fee or something. City Council Chambers, Just so that everyone's kind of on the same even playing field and for those that maybe haven't paid their fees and about you know 10 to 15 years down there, because they're not even aware that they have to. City Council Chambers, You know just like if we're going to streamline that process a little bit because I just seen that happened before like around these areas.

City Council Chambers, Thank you, Commissioner is coming out that's noted and that's something we can relay to our colleagues in the public works agency, thank you.

And then the second item on this one is this does seem as we're going through our kind of zoning code update, you know, pretty much everything within the transit zoning code for on-site alcohol consumption. It seems to be like one of those kind of like potential minor CEPs in the future. So just letting you know that I think that this pretty much falls in line with that in the sense that it's an active restaurant. It's only on-site, limited hours to start off with. Like, so all of those things, if that can kind of expedite their permitting process, I'm okay with. though I know that every time there is an alcohol license we usually want to take a look at it, but this seems to be kind of that lowest threshold of review because of the fact that, number one, there was already alcohol there before, number two, the hours, and then just, you know, the predictably low impact from this particular type of sale.

Thank you, Commissioner Escamilla. Commissioner Leal.

Two questions. Did I miss it? Well, first of all, the question is, is this their first business? Yes, this is their first business. Okay. So note to staff, each time there's a new business and they apply for a CEP liquor license, six-month review and 12-month review, I will ask for it just so that they're doing okay and we're okay. Just a standard condition, right? Come in, talk to you. How are things going? So you guys have an idea. of how they're doing or if it's not working. Second of all, as to Commissioner Escamilla's comments about the encroachment permit, San Francisco has done a really good job in an online form where they just notify the city that they're going to put tables and chairs out, and then if you pick them up, police drive down the street. If they're not picked up by 9 p.m., then the business gets notified. Just a note to staff as future so we don't have to have the extra process of getting a permit and doing all this stuff. So that it does appear that we are business friendly. But yeah, just new business, six month, one year. So you guys are good and the business is good. Thanks. And then you'll know if there's police complaints or not, right? I mean, you'll know. So that's all I wanted to add. I'll ask the applicants if they're okay with that when we open the public hearing.

Thank you, Commissioner. And to the point about the review, there is a condition of approval proposed, condition number five that would do just that. Take a look at this permit if it is approved in a 12-month period.

Thank you, Commissioner Leo. Commissioner Will.

This property is next to the Yost Theater, and there are two or three businesses that operate outdoor patio seating already. Right. So it's like we're not doing anything new. And the outdoor seating they propose probably fits to the one on the left and the one on the right, and then you have it in between. Right. Now, in terms of jurisdiction, I'm wondering, I read an article about how under the stupid administration, they're looking at unfamiliar things to them in terms of products that come from new seeds and plants and things like that, like honey and flour, that there's new flavors in these new flours that they're being created like the B100. So although we don't regulate food processing, I think we should support our local businesses that are trying to be innovative, new, and try to bring a more diverse population to the downtown area. We could use some stimulation of new people coming downtown and, you know, patronizing the businesses that we have. The second point I'd like to make is that I was going by that And someone was having an outdoor game. And I think it was across the street, someone that has a magazine store, and they had a bunch of tables set out. And they were using little model metal cars, going up on ramps and things like that. But it kind of blocked the flow of traffic, you know, in that in that square here. And then off to the side in the parking lot, which a bunch of people vaping and I think some of the vaping was very creative, rafting. And I didn't know what to do about it. Who reported to? But my concern is that it's a square regulated some way where they need permit for for outdoor activity. Take it are our existing thing.

Cover it right. Thank you, Commissioner, for the question. Yes, any activity in this Paseo, since it's in the public right of way, would have to have a permit through our parks and PD agencies. So the finger boarding activity that you mentioned, that's one of the events that routinely obtains a permit to have finger boarding festivals in this area. I'm not sure if the specific one that you are referencing had one or not, but that is one that I'm aware of that routinely holds events in this area.

And we'd like to have things down there to bring people. It's just that I think there needs to be more concern about pedestrians walking through their event. But again, I think the new chefs are trying out new ingredients that go into their products and things. And I didn't want the federal government to mess with these new chefs that are trying out new flour and stuff to make the pizza. It's not the same old pizza. Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Vice Chair Benninger.

Yes, I think this is very exciting. A couple questions. The hours that are being proposed, how does that fit in with the other businesses in the area?

Yeah, thank you for the question if I share. Some of the other restaurants in the area, for example, Tacos Los Cholos, they close at, I believe, 1 AM on Friday and Saturday. They close at Sunday at 10 PM, and then from Monday through Thursday close at 11. And then some of the other restaurants around the area, they're also closing Later in the evening, for example, there's a couple that are closing 7 p.m. to 9 p.m., for example, Restaurante Las Casuelas. So for this restaurant to be closing earlier than the other restaurants around them, they're proposing right now initial hours of operations closing at 5 p.m. They're wanting to be more of a brunch or lunchtime business. So they are in comparison to the other downtown restaurants they are closing earlier.

I'm very excited about brunch on Saturday and Sunday. It's a nice attraction. Also, tonight, are we approving for the liquor license closing at 5 or do we need to extend it to 10 when they want to extend the hours? 8 o'clock, I'm sorry.

Yes, thank you again for the question, Vice Chair. So the hours of them serving the liquor will be the same as their hours of operation. So right now, as they're proposing to close at 5 p.m., then they'll be able to serve alcohol the entire time. When they choose to expand to 8 p.m., they'll be able to expand their hours of operation for serving liquor to the same time. Okay.

That will take a second vote from its council to make that happen, right? To go from 5 to 8. Is that going to take another review?

It will not take another review.

City Council Chambers, They can do it once they expand and vice chair benninger in the conditions of approval they'd actually be allowed to serve alcohol or to remain operational and 12 until 12am consistent to what's allowed in the transit zoning code. City Council Chambers, If they wanted to go beyond that, then that would require an after hours conditional use permit and that would have to come back before this Commission very good one condition, can we add, can I switch double zeros to you, he says go go blue.

Just kidding.

Thank you, Mr. Benninger. I have no questions for Seth. Thank you.

The public test.

Yeah, that was questions for staff. Thank you, Commissioner for clarifying. The public testimony portion of the public hearing is now open with the applicant like to speak on the matter. You can share as little or as much as you'd like. And it's also an opportunity for us to ask any questions we may have. That's fine.

excited about bloom we're excited that the public's excited about them the logo has been received very well yeah but it is meant to be like a daytime lunch pasta wine bar um we are hoping to get you know once the streetcar opens we are hoping to get people from the federal buildings to come eat lunch with us we feel like lunch is kind of a little sad down here especially living at the rafferty we feel like we don't have a lot of lunch options so we're excited to be kind of like a handmade healthier lunch

we'll go ahead and start taking uh would you like to share more would you like to take questions now perfect we'll go ahead and take questions from the commission I see commissioner Leo's eager I had a question um about the rent about the lease I'm sure you look at other spots trying to figure out are the are the rents on 4th Street comparable to elsewhere that you looked or are they high or are they low and the reason being that I ask this question is because I ask it lots of times, because there are other parts of the city where you guys know the storefronts are empty. And for whatever reason, the landlords don't want to make it. So how do you see the leases downtown compared to other places that you may have looked?

So honestly, just because I've been in that same building, I already knew the owners. They gave us a great Okay. But we have looked at other locations, but not in downtown center area, but like in Orange County in general, like some in SoCal marks, and there are much more expensive. Okay. And in given the size of the of the spike in the space, like, pretty great.

Okay, so you show you would say that the downtown lease rents, or leases are, are comparable or

more affordable than elsewhere that you looked as of what we've looked at yes okay thank you thank you commissioner leo do we have any other questions or comments commissioner will will there be any seafood in the pasta um what yeah i mean like there's gonna be we are planning on having uh appetizers and like crudo dishes on the menu so yes but not mainly be a seafood

and Mediterranean salads.

I take her Mediterranean. I mean, it's going to be more of a fusion than anything, so we can definitely add flavors on. Want to make pasta have like some. Expand its horizons of just being Italian. So, yes, it could be a Mediterranean style type of pasta, but also we were also doing sandwiches, focaccia sandwiches. Oh, and so those focaccia sandwiches would have like Mediterranean flavors on it. If we take like the.

That makes sense for the takeout. Yes.

We're also taking over trust. Eventually. And so we'll be able to share some product from that and make sure we're kind of a zero waste program.

Will there be Italian wines selection of beer?

What was the question?

Sorry. Will there be Italian wines that you'll be featuring on it?

Not really. I do like Italian wines, but not exclusively to Italian wines. It's going to be more like we really want to have a little flavors of everywhere, so we don't want to tie down to just Italian.

We hear from those people that frequent downtown, we need something a little different than some of the restaurants like Italian. They have them in orange, but...

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Do we have any other questions or comments from the commission? Vice Chair Bueninger, go ahead.

Yeah, I want to thank you for choosing Santa Ana. I think it's very exciting, the first business, and I like the uniqueness, and I think this is going to help be great for the downtown, and I enjoyed the dining outside. I think Warren's made a lot of great moves during the pandemic about moving outside and getting people to enjoy it, and so I really see this as a nice addition. I really wish you guys luck.

Thank you and then i'll just add quickly, thank you for the information you shared I live, not too far from the downtown and there are times when i've tried to have lunch meetings in that area. And most things are closed so i'm excited that there will be a lunch option and it's something different, so thank you all, and thank you for sharing about trust as well. I was going to ask since I know they're right next door.

Yeah, that's our other, it's in the back burner until we can get this one open.

Well, I am excited to see and go and try the pasta that you all will serve. Commissioner Escamilla, did you want to make final remarks?

Yeah, just another positive comment for you all. So number one, just yeah, thank you for choosing the downtown and having all the other options. But I think also your story goes to show the importance of kind of creating these urban walkable communities and the opportunities. So now we are going to make that long commute from the Rafferty over to Spurgeon, which I think is just like such a wonderful narrative about what we're trying to build down here. And thank you so much for being a part of it.

Thank you all. If there are no additional comments or questions from the Commission, you may have a seat. And recording secretary, have you received any written communication or is there a member of the public that would like to comment on this item?

chair we have not received any public comments if you are attending this meeting in person and would like to comment on this item please fill out a request to speak form and turn it in into the secretary if you are participating via zoom and would like to comment on this item please select the hand icon to indicate that you would like to speak if you are calling in and would like to comment on this item please dial nine and then six to unmute yourself i will wait a few seconds Chair, we do not have any speakers in-house and via Zoom.

Thank you. With that, the public testimony portion of the public hearing is now closed. Is there a motion to approve this matter?

I'd like to make a motion.

I'll ask that again. Is there a motion to approve?

I'd like to make a motion so does County Supervisor Sarmiento.

We have a motion from Commissioner Wu.

I second it.

And we have a second from Vice Chair Benninger. Secretary, can you please call for a roll call vote? Commissioner Escamillo?

Aye.

Commissioner Leo?

Aye.

Commissioner Oliva? Aye. Commissioner Pham?

Aye.

Commissioner Wu?

Aye.

Vice Chair Benninger?

Aye.

Chair Ramos? Aye. Motion approved by majority vote with Commissioner Oliva absent.

Thank you. Congratulations. That concludes the business calendar. Moving on to staff comments. Does the commission have any closing comments or questions for staff?

I did have one tonight, Chair Ramos. Tonight, I'd like to present a certificate of recognition to Commissioner Escamilla.

Commissioner Escamilla, can we have you go down to the center? No need to share.

Sure. While Commissioner Escamilla makes his way down and hopefully you could all join us and we'll take a photo with him. I'd just like to share a little bit about Commissioner Escamilla. As you know, he's leaving us to start a program at the Harvard Kennedy School. While we're proud to see him take this next step, his departure leaves some pretty big shoes to fill. Commissioner Escamilla isn't just a commissioner. He's a long term resident of the city of Santa Ana, a son of Santa Ana, and he truly embodies what it means to give back to his hometown. City Council Chambers, And then, before joining the planning Commissioner of the planning Commission as a Commissioner. City Council Chambers, Commissioner scummy I served this Community through his work at the city library. City Council Chambers, And he also worked with planning and building agency and I had a chance to work directly with him in the advanced planning section for a number of years. City Council Chambers, And then, most recently, he extended that impact to the broader region, working with the county supervisors office so Commissioner scummy I thank you for years of service your insight. and your commitment to Santa Ana. We're gonna miss you here on the commission, but we know you're gonna do incredible things at Harvard. So thank you on behalf of the city of Santa Ana and on behalf of the Planning and Building Agency.

Can we all join Manny Escamilla for a photo?

it's carl's missus oh

You got that right.

Thank you, sir, for your very kind and honest and accurate comments of Commissioner Escamilla. With that, we'll move on to closing comments from members of the commission. And I invite all of you to also share some comments for Commissioner scamia in a brief and kind way. Would anyone like to go first?

I was going to go first just to say that I was going to provide the update that my departure is probably going to happen on the 23rd. So I'm going to be able to make it to the next meeting. So I got one more meeting in me.

Well, in that case, we'll hold our comments for the 23rd. Since you received your formal document recognition today.

I swear it wasn't planned. I was just looking at flight price tickets. And I was like, you know what? I'll do that next week.

okay well with that all commissioners have now two more weeks to write your very nice words for commissioner scamia are there any other comments that any members of the commission would like to make before we adjourn tonight you're going to be a harvard learning government affairs right yes it's a master of public administration so i can learn how to work for government let's change the way they think about it and give them the people's view

Okay. And you could do it.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Do we have any other closing comments tonight? Commissioner Pham?

Yeah, I had some errands to run towards Main Place. And, you know, I had some extra time, so I was just driving around. And I thought, and I didn't kind of realize it in general, but as I was driving through, I thought that area has a really good mix of residential development. You know, you have like the the Prisma, then you have the townhouses, but it's different type of townhouses, there's the shop house typology, there's the townhouse, the trees are matured. And it just felt very like community based. It's a great I think it's a great case study. Obviously, you know, we don't have that much density in other places within the city. But, you know, as a case study, I think that areas really will well develop.

Thank you, Commissioner Pham. Vice Chair Benninger.

I'd like to follow up on the question. I was there for a dedication, so was Alan, for the new apartments that are being built. And what we found out at that meeting is that the apartments that are right off from Broadway took them less than a year to rent all of that out. So to go back to the question we had at the last meeting, evidently they're right. The apartments are running and are running full. short period of time, another $3,000 to $4,000 a month. So it is potentially now for developers to build.

Thank you, Vice Chair Benninger. And I'll just share, I'm excited that we'll have Commissioner Scamiglia for one more meeting. With that, our meeting is now adjourned at 6.09 p.m. We'll see you all on June 22nd at 5.30 p.m.