Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Meeting of the San Ramon Planning Commission. We'll go ahead and call to order the meeting at 6PM. Item two, roll call. May the recording secretary please conduct roll.

Commissioner Kuznick? Here. Commissioner Kunjula?

Here.

Commissioner Zeng?

Not here yet.

Vice chair Avila? Here. And chair Albert?

I'm here. Item three, pledge of allegiance. Please rise and join me in the pledge.

Easy. Pledge allegiance to the flag of The United States Of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Item four, public comments or written communications. At this time, members of the public may address the planning commission on any item not already on tonight's agenda. If you would like to speak, please fill out a speaker card located in the back and submit it to the recording secretary. As in the past, we will not be taking public comment via Zoom tonight. Do we have any written or cards?

Written public comment was received from Brian Swanson. It's part of the public record and were provide provided to the commission prior to the meeting. I don't have any speaker cards for this item. Okay.

We we also got written comment from mister Blickenstaer.

That was for one of the agenda items.

Okay. That's fine.

Okay. I'm gonna go ahead and close the public comment this time. Item five, additions and revisions. There are none tonight. Item six is our oh, okay. The script is a little bit off, but item six, consent calendar. Item 6.1, minutes of the planning commission regular meeting. Are there any public comments on this item?

I have no speaker cards or public written public comment on this item.

Okay. If we could ask for a motion to accept the minutes as written, please.

I I recommend the more I move the motion to take the minutes of the planning commission regular meeting for October 2021.

K. Maybe we have a second.

I can second that. Okay.

It's been moved and seconded. Let me look at your screens.

Okay. Motion passes five zero. And, Amy, our screens aren't up in front here if we're gonna need those at some point.

The the TVs.

The television screens up at the oh, we're not using those anymore.

I'll have to message IT about that.

At some point, then we might need to see them. Okay. We'll continue to move on. Item seven, continue items after the close of the public hearing. There are none.

Item eight, continue items. There are none. Item nine is a public hearing revisions to the Bartlett seven residential project, DPA 2025007, and M X 2025 Dash 0005 At 2527 Camino Ramon. The proposed amendment is for revisions to our previously approved project based on the concepts of the approved Bishop branch affordable housing site development agreement that allows for the transfer of affordable units to the Eden housing site. The underlying approvals and physical design remain in place as originally approved. So at this point, there is a staff report from Ryan Driscoll.

Okay. Good evening, chair and planning commissioners. Yeah. As mentioned, this is an item for revisions to the Bartlett residential project at Bishop Ranch 7 located at 2527 Camino Ramon. Project site is 12.64 acres.

The general plan designation is Downtown Mixed Use North. The zoning designation is also Downtown Mixed Use North or DMU North. Little bit of background. The planning commission, approved this development project, on December 17 for the residential project for 190, for sale units. And then on September 9, the council approved a development agreement that allows the transfer of affordable housing obligation through land dedication from this site, the Bartlett site, to the Bishop Ranch affordable apartment site.

On September 30, the zoning administrator approved a development plan amendment to revise landscaping along Camino Ramon, the frontage there, as a result of conflicts with the existing utility easement and fiber optic lines along Commuter Ramon. And on October 3, the applicant submitted the proposed development plan amendment and minor exception applications under review tonight. So the proposed project, would revise the development project to align with the development agreement. As I was mentioning, it will remove the on-site construction of affordable housing units from the project, and then it will satisfy the affordable housing obligation for this project through land dedication at the Bish Ranch affordable apartment site at 2453 Camino Ramon. It's a Eden housing site.

Then as a result of removing those on-site affordable units, the project no longer qualifies for the state density bonus law parking standards that it was originally approved for. And so they're requesting a minor exception to allow a 12.1% reduction in on-site parking from the current city parking standards. Looking at the affordable housing. So the project was originally approved for requiring 15% of the 190 units as affordable, so that would be 29 units total. So those would be removed from the project site.

And the revised project would facilitate a 22 unit increase, providing 51 rental units at the Bishop Ranch affordable apartment site. In terms of parking for the minor exception request, as I mentioned, 12.1% reduction. That's a 60 space reduction on-site. What's important to note here, the revised project maintains the same number of parking spaces that were previously approved on on-site. That's 436 parking spaces on-site.

So no changes with regards to that or the number of units on-site. Also, the city council adopted a zoning ordinance text amendment reducing parking standards for multifamily units and adding a guest parking requirement for certain single family units. And with that text amendment, the a revised project will exceed the these parking standards by eight spaces, which is effective November 14. So the recommendation is to receive the staff report, open the public hearing, take public testimony, close the public hearing, discuss and deliberate, and adopt the draft planning commission resolution number fourteen twenty five, approving applications with the recommended conditions of approval. So I'll turn it back over to the commission.

Thank

you, Ryan. First, if any of the commissioners have questions clarifying for Ryan at this time. This one? Okay.

Good evening, Ryan.

Good evening.

Thanks for the report. One small question I have. Probably, this was something that was already addressed. But you have mentioned that there was a easement issue that has a result of conflicts with the existing utility easement and fiber optic lines. Is this something new after we have approved?

It was a amendment to this project that the zoning administrator approved, on September 30.

Can you kindly elaborate on that, please?

Yeah. Let me show you on the on the slide here. I actually have a a image of the revised landscape that was approved by the zoning administrator. Primarily related to number of trees that can be located because of the existing utility line and fiber optic lines. It limited the ability for for trees to be planted. So that was that was the revision that was approved.

Just the vegetation and the trees and plants, they were The site. Redistributed.

Is that correct?

Yeah. The site itself did not change. The the layout of the sidewalk along Camino Ramon didn't change.

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Additional questions for staff on this one? Okay. Then we'll go ahead and open public comment on this item. And have we received any written public comment or comment cards?

Written public comment was received from Jim Blickenstaff and Brian Swanson. The comments were provided to the Planning Commission prior to the meeting and is part of the public record. I don't have any speaker cards for this item.

Okay. We'll go ahead and close public hearing. Do we have any discussion on this item at this point? If not, Are we ready to make a motion, a decision? No.

I mean, I'll make just a few comments. This item is very similar to the two items that we considered last meeting. And it's just if anyone has some more questions about essentially our our reasoning or our vote on this item to check out the recording for last meeting. But, I mean, essentially, to to recap, it's very hard to come up with any reason to say no to these revisions. So, yeah, if you have more questions about the analysis, please for the reasons why, please check out that that previous recording. But that's it for me. Thank you.

Thank you.

We are good. Very similar to the last meeting.

Yes. It is very it is very much the same as what we did with district branch eleven. Okay? Yeah. Could somebody's ready to make a motion?

Yep. I can I can make a motion recommending receiving the staff report and after the presentation, move the motion to approve based on the recommendation from the staff and as written?

Okay. That'd be resolution 14 dash two five. Do we have any do I have someone to second it?

Yeah. I'll second that.

Okay. Why don't we take a pretty quick look at the resolution? It didn't change much, so we don't need to go line by line. So that starts on packet page 16. I'll just go quickly through the pages. If anybody has any questions to clarify, page one, two, three, four, five, or six. Great. Okay. And then the conditions of approval, you know, essentially, they are the same, as what we looked at with Bishop branch eleven. Same updates and changes. So that's packet page twenty three and twenty four. Okay. Why don't I don't see any I think we're ready to take vote take a vote.

The chair, I'm gonna take oral votes for this item.

Okay.

So motion was commissioner Kenjula, and second was commissioner Zane.

Commissioner Kuznick? Yes. Commissioner Kanjula?

Yeah. I

Commissioner Zane?

Yes.

Vice chair Avila? Yes. And chair Albert?

Yes. Thank you.

So the motion patch is five zero, and we have our overhead screens. Thank you for bringing those back up.

Through the chair, just a reminder, decisions of the planning commission, may be appealed within ten calendar days of the decision by filing a letter with the city clerk's office along with the appropriate filing fee. Thank you.

Great. Thank you very much. Okay. We're gonna continue moving on. Item seven, continued items after the close of public hearing. There are none. Item eight are continued items. There are none. Item nine is a public hearing for new items. 9.1 oh, I'm sorry. We're gonna repeat things. Item no. I'm sorry. I apologize. Item 10, nonpublic hearing action items.

There are none. Item 11 is where we're at now as a study session. And tonight, we do have a study session, item 11.1 on the Orchard's affordable apartment development project study session, PhD 2025Dash0005, and DP 2025Dash004, and AR 20250011 located at 6001 Bollinger. So this is a study session for the benefit of the commission and the public to better understand the project vision and for us to provide initial feedback on this project to staff and the applicant. So the comments that we are to make tonight are not binding on the applicant, and the project is still being reviewed by staff and outside agencies, which means that we may not be looking at the very final version of the project tonight.

So with that, we do have a staff report from Annalisa. Welcome.

Thank you. Good evening, chair Albert, and good evening, commissioners. You've pretty much covered my little introduction spiel, but tonight, we do have this study session for the Orchard's affordable apartments project. I will mention it it proposes a 100 rental units, which is part of the lore the larger Orchard's development project that you've last sought the study session in July. The application is in its thirty day completeness review, so the so staff is currently reviewing the application and preparing comments on completeness, but we invite you to provide your feedback so that we can then relay that to the applicant early on in the process. And with that, the applicant and owner is here, and they have prepared a presentation for you.

Good evening, Chair Alpert and commissioners. On behalf of Sunset Development, I'm Stephanie Hill. I'm joined with, people from Eden Housing, Dixie, and then Katya from Steinberg Hart, who's the architect for the project. Sunset submitted the application for orchards, the redevelopment of Chevron Park in the 2024. And earlier this year, as mentioned, in July, the Planning Commission reviewed the concept plans for the development, which included overall site planning and design guidelines for the 92 acre site as well as architecture for the first phase of development called Orchard's Neighborhood.

Since then, the overall Orchard site has continued through detailed analysis, including traffic, utilities, and fiscal impacts, as part of the broader evaluation for the project. When the original applications were submitted, the Orchard's Neighborhood included a set aside for affordable housing. Since that time, Eden Housing and Steinberg Hart have been working together to advance the design of that affordable community, which is what is being shared with you this evening. For reference, the affordable site is in the northwest corner of the project and serves as a transition between the five to seven story multifamily buildings in the multifamily district and the three story townhomes within the Orchard's neighborhood. So with that general overview, I'll turn it over to Katya from Steinberg Hart, who will walk through the design and architecture for the community.

Good afternoon, commissioners. Mhmm. Is the site that Stephanie was mentioning for the affordable housing project. And a little bit of the just the general development overview. A 100 homes including one on-site unit for a manager. It's a combination of studios, one bedrooms, two bedrooms, three bedrooms. But the amenities is probably what complements this entire project. There's a community room, an after school space, technology center, an outdoor gathering area, and a childcare area. So we always, as architects, start with what is the concept? Where are we getting the inspiration?

And for this project, we felt that that really bringing the community together is where the concept should rely. So the trunk is the stabilizing force of the community. The building really roots the community, to the to the entire larger site and really taking that inspiration. You will see in the exterior elevations how we treated that concept and how we executed that. But continuing in that design concept with the trunk and the orchards and the beautiful orchards that are all throughout the site.

So we'll start with a couple of guiding principles. The first one is respecting the neighborhoods the neighbors with sustainability in mind. Once we start the development of a project, we'll start looking at the orientation. And something that was very key for us is that a courtyard opening to the south actually provides the best dead light for that courtyard to be illuminated and have the best quality of life. So really, we're breaking that massing towards the future neighborhood district and really that south facing being optimal for the connection with the neighborhood district that is the lower density on the South Side.

And when it comes to the architectural language, I get grounding the central segments of the public facing facades and recessing the massing for some idea of entry porches connecting to the perimeter greenway that it happens on the west side of the site. And I will have a little bit more explanation of how those connections occur. So I will start with the site plan. It's a little bit under two acres, 1.85 acres. It's 100 homes, child care with a size to meet licensing requirements for about 25 kids.

We don't have a provider just yet, but we start with just general guidelines, and those that's the number that is currently sized for. Approximately 110 spaces, all surface parking around the site. So the resident spaces are on a one to one ratio with a number of units. However, we're designating 10 spaces for childcare, anticipating that parents most likely will go into the site, park for a few minutes, drop off. So those could be actually become visitor parking, you know, at different times.

We're including electric vehicle spaces, accessible spaces for van and standard accessible, motorcycle parking and secure bike spaces inside of the building. So if you look at the notes on the right, again, perimeter surface parking, cover parking under the building in the west side of the project, a lobby area that is prominent and that you can see as you start driving through the streets through Chevron Drive bike storage that is inside of the building, secured trash and back of house that are not visible from the street, so it actually protected from the entire view of the development and that childcare space at the front of the building. And for us, those site connections, I talk about routing the building into the community, those site connections were key. So that entry plus, again, on the northeast part of the site, a drop off zone that will help for childcare but also for deliveries of the community, a community room that has some presence on the street, that has some nice windows opening to the street and a childcare center that, again, has that connection with the street as well. And on the left hand side, on the west end, we have the perimeter greenway, and we tried to connect all the way from the street through a green pathway to that perimeter greenway in order to start making those connections a little bit more substantial.

Childcare, courtyard, the community room, entry plaza. And the courtyard, while it's at Ground Floor, it still provides some very nice connections with the rest of the neighborhood, the residential units all around, but it opens up to that community room. There's a covered outer door area, and it has that secured childcare play area that will be dedicated for the childcare space. And inside of that courtyard, spaces for all ages, where people can congregate a playground space, people can do some large gatherings outside of the community room, but then some small gatherings for four to six people and also individual seating spaces for a different population to the entire building. A typical floor plan, again, a combination of studios, one bedrooms, two bedrooms, threes twos and threes, and those are, again, all surrounding that courtyard area.

The elevations, if you see, there is that is I'm noting the entrance on the right hand side, that's the east elevation along Chevron Drive. That is really the elevation that you will see. The rest of the elevations are within the development. So you may be able to see them if you're driving pretty close, but the main east elevation is what you will see as you drive as you approach the site. And if you can see, there's a darker area surrounding, you know, what we call the trunk of the building and grounding that building in the center.

That's where the community center is and the entrance, you know, to the building on the right hand side of the page outlined in a in a blue dash line. At the bottom, the south elevation, that would be the courtyard. That's why you can see the center is a little bit recessed and with a little bit of less color, just so you can see that it's in the background of that view. And then north and west elevations with a similar idea of continuing the materials, expressing some of the texture that we most likely will see in the neighborhood some verticality, some type of rhythm in those windows, but making it, in a way, integrating with what would be the neighborhood district to the South, but the higher density neighborhood to the North. We did some elevation, so I'm going to just walk you through those renderings as we walk through.

So this is if you were approaching Chevron Drive, you see that corner of the building with some emphasis on that corner. That is where the entry lobby is most likely will be the project name or project number, but in order to identify that this is the main entry of the building. As we go around, this is probably if you were coming the wrong side of the street. But on Chevron Drive, and you are seeing at the other side of the corner, you're again still seeing in that on the left hand side, that is the childcare. That's where we are assuming some of the parents will go and drop off.

There's a little seating area outside of the child care center, so parents can also wait for the kids. But in the center, grounding is where the community center is, and in the in the background, you see the entry that I show from the other rendering. And this is renderings from both sides. As I mentioned, this will be hard to see. Just imagine if you are sitting in your townhome on the other side, but we feel that it's at the appropriate scale even when we have those parking spaces under the building, trying to provide some warmth and divisions in between those parking spaces so it doesn't feel like just a relentless parking.

But we know that we need to meet some requirements for parking, but making it still a very nice space to enjoy. And the view on the right is a view if you will look in through the courtyard, and you will see some of the fencing around the area for the child care that needs to be protected by licensing requirements, but you will be able to see the rest of the courtyard happening in the background of that of that child care area. And going back, this will be the this is the main rendering for the elevation along Chevron Drive. So look forward to hearing your comments.

Thank you for that. I'm sure we'll have questions. So let's start with questions first. Do you have any questions for either staff or the applicants? Do you have some? Sure. Yeah.

Let me

go first. Sure. Katya, I don't think this is for you. I have some questions about the affordable housing, provision. Two questions. And mostly, this is for the benefit of the audience. First, what would be the overall plan for affordable housing in Orchards? From my understanding, this specific project will cover the obligation for the neighborhoods district, but, of course, we've got the multifamily and mixed use district. So I just wanna know what the the overall plan is for affordable housing at Orchard's. Thank you.

Good evening. What we are planning is that this would provide the affordable housing to support the Orchard's neighborhood, which has 368 homes. And this would be provided at a higher number of affordable homes than would otherwise be required. It would be a 77% premium to what would be otherwise provided on-site under the city's 15% inclusionary housing ordinance. What we're proposing for the other homes that will be built, so in the multifamily and the mixed use districts that there would be 15% on-site inclusionary housing.

So what that means is those larger apartment communities would have 85% market rate and then 15% on-site inclusionary.

And just to clarify, did you say that's more units than the neighborhood's district is required to provide or deeper affordability or both?

It's both. Okay. We're providing deeper affordability and a larger number of units of affordable housing than otherwise would be required in the Orchard's neighborhood with the proposed community that's being reviewed this evening.

Okay. Great. Thank you. That's excellent to hear. And then one follow-up question just to keep you at the podium. Out of curiosity, what are this might be actually a better question for Dixie as well. What are the benefits of doing affordable housing in this consolidated fashion, you know, rather than doing things, on-site? And, what on your end in terms of financing or what have you makes it possible to do the affordable housing obligation this way? Thank you.

Hi. Thank you for the question. Dixie Bouse, real estate development director for Eden Housing. What kind of there's a lot of factors involved in the in the financing, and But certainly one of the benefits is that with the way with Eden Housing as a nonprofit affordable housing developer and owner, we can secure tax credits for our developments. Tax credits are in the form of equity provided by institutional investors in exchange for credit over a ten year period.

What that allows us to do is access dollars that we don't have to go and raise to provide for lower rents over a fifty five year period of time, which is when the regulatory agreements are in place. Market rate mixed income developments do not have access to the same funding. That would be particularly at the 15% level. There's really no market for that in the country. The best mixed use market in the country, in the weeds, if you want, is in New York, and that is mostly what's called an eightytwenty.

That happens a little bit in Los Angeles as well and that's 80% of the project is low income and 20% is market rate, eightytwenty. So it's still 80% dependent upon the access to the below market financing that normal market rate developers don't have access to. So when you're looking at the cost to build versus what you can rent for for it, market rate doesn't have the ability to have the equity coming from this source. So their source is the rents that they charge the residents. Did that answer the question?

Yes. Very well. Thank you so much. That's all for me.

We have the same one. Okay. Commissioner Kuznick? Mhmm.

Hi. Just one small question. I I really appreciate the the schematics here. And could I ask a question about the child care center, specifically the playground area? Because we frequently encourage developments to include totbots, but I I know that you're limited by space. And the child care center looks like it has playground structures. But if you are a child that is not in day care but live at that residence, where where do you get to play?

There's still another playground area that is outside. Okay. And that would be open all the time. That is not within the fenced area of the child care sector.

Okay. Thank you. That that was

And the outdoor childcare is also sized for approximately 25 kids. There are licensing requirements of square footage, so that's what we have provided at this point.

Okay. I was just thank you. You answered it. Yeah. Thank you. Appreciate it.

Thank you. You have some questions? Mhmm.

Thank you. Thanks for the presentation. I have few questions starting with the request that you have mentioned about the day care, the child care. How is it funded and operated? Do we know any details about it?

If you build it, they will come. We've we've I know. I know. You know I'm gonna give you that one zinger. We've we've built a I'd say, about a handful of childcare centers in our affordable housing developments and communities. We partner typically with Kadango or some other provider who's already local in the neighborhood. We provide the construction, the box of it. All of the, I would say the building components that they need, they provide what is called the TIs. So they come in and put the equipment and paint the walls and all that stuff. That's on their dime.

Because of a quirky little rule about we can use tax credits to fund that child care. We just have to make sure that we have a large family set aside and because we're in a qualified area, we can actually subsidize that construction of that building using tax credits as well. Not a real big subsidy, but when you're talking about integrating it into the building and the site plan, you get some efficiencies that standalone childcare centers generally don't get. Meaning, we are already building the building. We just are carving out space from the building to provide to the provider.

The provider would then lease it from the ownership entity, Eden, for $1 a year. They pay their own expenses. So it's not a moneymaker on our end. It's just really to give them the space. They pay their own expenses through what they charge. And then generally speaking, some of the childcare providers that we have on all of our sites generally in some way have subsidized childcare where the state subsidizes low income families. So the childcare center isn't being built to serve the residents of this building. It's for the community at large. And so, you know, it's it's a matter of and that's about as much as I can tell you about child care, but I can definitely get you some more information.

Absolutely. That that would be helpful.

I'm I'm dangerous when it comes to making up information.

As you are there, I do have some follow-up questions.

Sure.

So I understand during our last Eden Housing project, there were some comments that have come from the city council members as well. The the basic spirit of that is, yes, there is a mixed tenure. And what that means is from a rental versus ownership. I wanted to ask, is there any alternate ownership capabilities within that building that you guys can provide? That would mean that you have mentioned within this document multiple times that a high level mixed tenure alternatives, like, if there is a feasibility for 70 rental versus 30 sale.

Because the basic spirit of the last approval that we have gone through with the Eden Housing project, and I don't know what we call that, especially on the Camino Ramon project, The city council has mentioned that they would like to see, as a spirit, more more affordable ownerships as well. So just wanted to check with you if there is any feasibility, if there is any reason that you have gone 100% rental. That would be very helpful in understanding that.

The low income tax credit project funding program does not allow for the construction of buildings for condominiums or ownerships. So they aren't designed the program isn't designed at all to create homeowners out of the units that are living there. So I don't know if well, there are one or two cases I know that there are rent to own affordable housing developments occurring in Alaska, they're not very successful. I would love for one to happen here, but the numbers simply don't work. So the BMR for sale component would have to come from the partner at large, if you will, for the opportunities at large within the bigger master plan community.

And so that would be under the realm of Sunset Development's umbrella for those homeownership opportunities for any BMR, and that's the details I don't have information on nor can we provide funding to.

So, primarily, what you are saying is whatever project you guys are gonna pick up, it's gonna be 100% rental

Yes. That's correct.

And 100% affordable.

Yes. That's correct.

As a follow-up, you have talked about fifty five year contract. Does that still apply to this project as well?

It does. It's standard. It fifty five year affordability is restriction is standard across the industry.

Okay. And just one more. Within that, I don't know. Would that be Eden Housing that's claiming for waivers for parking, or would that be Sunset that would be doing that for this project?

I believe that I

don't know.

So this specific application would be requesting any waivers or concessions that were required as it relates to providing the deeply affordable within this community.

Yeah. Absolutely. And as per 100% affordability, there will be you guys can as per state law. But just looking at the parking in general, is there a capability at this location to have any structured parking? Like, instead of having a flat green, is there a capability that you guys can build?

And I see. That would that would in turn it would surely meet the numbers that you guys are asking for waivers and concessions. That's that's true, and that could be fine as per state law. But is there a way that considering the entire Orchard's community, any structured parking, say, you guys have built four floors, the 5th Floor can be considered a parking space. Is there a feasibility? Have you guys looked at that study?

We did early on look at that whether or not, and I modeled it up two different ways to do it as a podium project, if you will, with parking underneath, and then four or five stories on top of that. And given the nature of what we've got going with the other two sites, it's a better likelihood of the timing to have a non structured podium project, meaning it's a lot cheaper. It's probably $125,000 per parking space now in a structured building type, so it's a good roundup number to put it. And so that's $10,000,000 that we have less to raise. We don't have to raise that.

So it's how much parking can we provide around the site? Can we get a little bit more land? Can we do a little bit more efficiency? Can we do some tuck under to get us to a level that we're completely comfortable with within that range? And I think we've hit that sweet spot. Does it mean that we would look at it again at some point? If some money dropped from the sky, we would take a look at it. We would consider that alternative up until we would start designing the program. But right now, we have it designed for just surface parking and stuff like that, but it is in the back of our mind. Saying that would definitely make it a little bit more challenging to have a podium structure with childcare on this side.

We haven't been able to accomplish that yet. I got close in another city up the peninsula, but it still needed a stand alone child care center. So there's some trade offs that that would have to happen. So it's like, how many of these pies do you wanna, you know, try and get the sweet spot to? But it's still in the back of our minds. We'll still continue to look at it. So I'm not saying no, but I'm not saying yes.

So there will still be time for you guys to make the modifications both from Katya's point of view as well as your point of view?

It would have to if if we would switch gears, we would have to come back for a reentitlement because I'm sure that would change, all of what's been approved. So it's not something that's at the top of our list right now. Is it an impossibility to take a look at? No. It's not impossible. Everything is possible, but I don't see a financially feasible option for it right now.

Okay. Got it. I have one question for miss Stephanie Hill. So this project would, as you have mentioned and answered commissioner Zhang's question, would only correspond to the neighborhood district that would include 368 homes. Is that correct?

Yes. That's correct. This would provide the affordable for the neighborhood district with additional affordable developed within the mixed use district and the multifamily districts.

That will be on their own for Yes.

That that would be independent of this affordable community, which is being reviewed this evening.

Alright. Thank you very much, That's all,

Thank you. Mister Villa, do you have questions?

Dixie, I have some questions for you. Or maybe it would be the architect. I'm not sure. Okay. One of the things that I noticed was in the project description that you guys submitted to the city. There is one of the concessions being requested about parking. So does that mean that it's not compliant with the parking requirements per the state density bonus law?

No. It would be compliant with state density bonus law. The parking concession comes into play when we are not I hate is compliant the right word? Consistent with the city parking standards of what's written in the code right now. So by use of density bonus, asking for concession or waiver, that's saying that we're not we're we're asking for something that is not currently in the zoning code. And I do. Pretty good?

Pretty good.

Yep. I

have other questions. So I know that for this whole Orchard site, there's, you know, some certain level of different years on when some of those dicks districts will be delivered. And, of course, there's phasing and there's absorption in building those single family homes to, like, what we see down the road for the project that's currently being constructed where not all the homes are coming online at one time. Rather, it's phased. My question would be, for this project, when would you anticipate getting, you know, putting in your application for the tax credit financing?

And then when would you anticipate breaking ground? And how does that relate to when the rest of the single family, homes and, you guys are calling it the neighborhood district would come online?

This might be a two part answer.

We're gonna tag team on an answer, and we'll try our best because we're slightly trying to project into the future. So where we're at right now, if we look big picture at the 92 acre site, it currently has office buildings on-site. And the estimates that we've received from demolition teams is that it will take nine to twelve months to demolish the existing buildings on-site. And that obviously happens over time. And so we can start at one point or we can start at multiple points.

We haven't gone through the exact logistics of how we do demolition on the site. From that demolition point, then we have the the backbone infrastructure. And what that means is essentially putting in sewer lines and water lines and electrical conduit to support the vertical development for the residential. And there are certain pieces that have to go in certain orders because of where there's existing sewer and where there's existing water. And so we do need to sort through what what needs to happen first and what happens second and third and sequentially.

If we look kind of big picture, we have a a year of demolition. Earthwork typically takes about twelve to eighteen months before you can go vertical with a a single family home if you look at Summerhill as an example. Obviously, it's a smaller scale, but we're looking at three times as large of a site. So if we have a year for demolition and another twelve to eighteen months for infrastructure, we're two and a two to two and a half years out from being able to start building vertical and what all of this is subject to markets and phasing and how how we figure this all out. But I would expect we're at least two and a half to three years from being able to have kind of vertical construction on residential depending on when we start.

I I haven't pulled a demolition permit, so I I can't start demolition tomorrow. So that's generally how I would think about how we start building. And then if you look at single family homes, they can take about nine nine months to build. And Dixie, she has requirements from when she pulls financing to when she needs to finish her community. And I think that's eighteen months from when you pull financing to when you need to finish your building.

No. That is not true. So I'll I can hand that over to Dixie, but we're we're looking at there's several years of work that needs to be done before we can start having vertical construction. Typically, with for sale homes, they're built they're built in phases. And so you don't start all three sixty eight of those homes at the same time. There's typically an absorption rate, so that's built over several years. So that what we're hoping is that as those homes are being built, Dixie is also under construction.

That was that was

a helpful part one. I wanna go back. How do I dangerously go back to the big site plan, the '92?

Yeah.

Mhmm. So what Stephanie was talking about, do you guys see the Orchard development up on your screen, is everything, neighborhood district, mixed use district, multifamily district, that all has the office buildings on now. Sunset is delivering to us what is called a pad ready site. That means the site is level. It is not final graded, but all the streets are in, all the sidewalks are in, all of the utilities are going to be installed and stubbed to grade.

So that's what she was talking about when she said horizontal construction. So if we think about, let's just say I am going to make a broad assumption to say sometime in June they are going to start demolition. Demolition will take what, ten months, nine to ten months, let's just say ten months, so to say that will go throughout 2026. The backbone infrastructure will take about a year and a half. Right?

So then that will go through 2027 into half of 2028. So that is really where I can get a what's called a pad site where I can describe it. I'm feeling good about the timeline. It's going to happen. It's getting financed because it's on their they're the ones who are generously donating that piece of it.

I would probably look at when they start that horizontal construction and then start making a decision. I'm doing something very, very similar in, I can't say the city, Santa Clara County right now where the backbone infrastructure started about nine months ago, and we are applying for our tax credits in April. So I would look for those backbones to be about a year underway before I start applying. So that puts us into 2028, and then getting lucky, getting lucky, we get the award, and mid two thousand twenty eight, break ground. I have one hundred and eighty days to break ground, so the deadline would be break ground by end of the year 2028.

And then, not eighteen months, but I would have two years to do that building because I am doing it under the 4% program. So I would have twenty four months to deliver that building. It's not a hard deadline. That hard deadline is a hundred and eighty days to start construction. So I would have to jump through some hoops. So you're talking about doors open in about 2031.

It would take two years to construct the building?

Yeah. It's a long time.

Eighteen months to two years. Maybe maybe shorter because we're not building a podium, but I'm still remembering what you asked me. Podium adds about a year. So, let's see. Let's correct that. Sixteen months. No podium.

So doors opening sometime in 2030?

Yeah. Best case scenario.

And do you guys have plans to demolish the structures that are existing yet? I'm not sure where Sunset is with plans of about the demo. And so it's not like you need an entitlement to demo.

That is correct. We do not need an entitlement to demo. We do not currently have demolition plans. As I mentioned in the precursor, we submitted application materials in November 2024. We've been working through with various comments and meetings over the past year on the approvals for the Orchard site. So we're we're hoping with approvals for the Orchard site, we can turn to when we can start demolition of the existing buildings.

So you're gonna wait until you get the approval for the entitlement on the Orchards in order to demo. So okay. My other question was, Dixie, I know that we have a couple projects here within the city of San Ramon that are also going to be going through the same system with you and trying to pursue the tax credit financing. I'm not so familiar with that, but I'd like to know from you, like, would there be some sort of how how would that work? Like, is is it okay that you have these many number of projects in the city?

I'm not sure what the implications would be or if the state would somehow have to prioritize certain ones over others.

Yeah. We ran up against that in our last last round award with the state funding, not the state tax credits, where we had to choose. We actually had eight projects that were awarded, but we could only take five. But that's what the state funding. The tax credit program has that umbrella, but that umbrella is in the same year.

So we would have to, I think, get, like, seven projects in the same year with tax credits regardless of what geographic area it's in. And I don't see that this is gonna be any way that it's gonna stifle our pipeline. I think it it weaves into our pipeline as long as we stagger it. I don't think that I would wanna be doing three separate applications in one year, to be quite frank, but I would I wouldn't hesitate to do two. It would be better if one would go get awarded and then another because there really is only so many attorneys and people at the city who can look at plans and approve plans.

And there's a finite amount of, you know, professionals out there who can help close these loans. So in an ideal world, we're just piggybacking off each other one after a year, one after a year, which really helps with lease up and absorption rates as well.

Dixie, another question for you would be, I know that we went to a study session for the orchards a couple months ago, and now we're seeing this site come before us. Are there any other plans that Eden Housing would have on the orchards in particular for another proposal?

On this particular site, on the 92? Yes. We have not been invited to do another building yet. Yet, look, ever. I couldn't help myself. I'm a developer. I don't I don't believe that's in our plans. We don't do market rate apartments nor do we do homeownership.

Let's see. For the bio retention, I was just curious to what What's that?

Yes. We are thinking that some of the greenway on the West Side could contribute to that. But this in talking with our civil engineer, this site would qualify for a different type of bioretention strategy, not to have everything on-site, but do some different infrastructure in order to concentrate the bioretention and not having to have bioswales throughout. So the strategy is a combination of the greenway and some additional strategies on-site rather than having bioswales throughout. If you see the site is pretty tight, so there's not a lot of space, you know, room in order to do biofiltration, you know, at grade.

So does that mean that you're proposing underground detention or and the combination of having the bioretentional

It's it's not quite a detention underground, and I'm not a civil engineer, so don't get me in trouble, you know, talking about civil engineering. But it's a different strategy that is allowed for affordable housing sites, you know, to treat to treat stormwater

Okay.

On-site. Okay. I can come back with some details.

Yeah. I just guess that my feedback would be I'd be concerned about having the bioretention being on the greenway since it will be, like, a multiuse path.

And Correct.

We don't wanna get that flooded or

anything. Why you wouldn't wanna use the entire site. There may be some localized areas where we will do that, but definitely file for an exception, you know, under the affordable housing, you know, requirements.

Okay. My other question was for Dixie and whether she can kind of explain a little bit more about the amenities, like the community room and the after school space in the tech center.

Okay. I'm with you. So this is without having the areas programmed, meaning we just have the kind of boxes, if you will, identified as to what we'd like to see in terms of complementary uses in a large family. So one of the challenges that we have is making sure that we can have that separation of the child care entry away from, as far away from the residential entry as possible so that it just makes it easier for both parties and then having that separation. And then the thought here is that we really wanted to see more indooroutdoor kind of movement, if you will, for the community.

So having the community room have the ability to spill out into, like, a covered area that then spills out into an open air courtyard was super important to our thought there with the playground area, sitting area, hangout areas, stuff like that. The after school care program area is really standalone away from the childcare, so it's it's not even the same, like, children. The after school the aftercare is for the residents and our service program geared to providing services for our kids. We have this really cool after school program, and it's not babysitting. I mean, like, really?

There's more homework and stuff going on. Yeah.

Typically, Dixie, how many kids would be able to use? It's, like, about 500 square feet or so, like that after school area.

In the after school area? I think what we've seen in in communities this large is kind of a participation number around 10 kids. And it ebbs and it flows. Sometimes there's more participation during the years, and then there's also spillover into the community room. So it's not just confined to one small room.

There there could be, like, an art project going on where they're gonna hold that art class outside or maybe even potentially in the bigger room. So but in terms of, like, is anyone else gonna go into that after school care room? No. It it'll be full, like, of all it'll look like kind of a kindergartner class. I I went in one time, and I'm like, wow. This is amazing. Like, really, it looked like a a schoolroom with books and tables and homework areas and stuff like that.

Is it geared to a particular age of kids?

No. Not really. The after school is is, like, all the way from T Tiny to high school, so whoever wants to come in and get some homework help or whatever. In our technology centers, we have tutors that come in from the universities and help not only with tutoring the students, but also tutoring parents sometimes. And sometimes that's after hours.

And so it really does spread things out after hours on weekends so that it's not all crammed into one time. It's It's really a cool kind of way to schedule around. And it really is based upon the need of the residents. So you don't know what your demographic, what your makeup is going to be until you lease it up, who's going to be living there, you know. That we found we can have the base plan figured out and then it will morph as people move in, as families move in and sometimes even over the years you find the need to change your curriculums a bit.

Do those tutors or people that come to help the individuals, do they come, like, every day, or is it just like a once in a while, once a week sort of thing?

I think it's a few hours a week. I'm not sure on the specifics, but I can certainly get you, what a what a typical 100 unit service plan would look like for for our next gathering and and bring that to you.

And I'm assuming there's some sort of hours of operation where this is Yeah. Open at a certain time.

Yeah. I think that that is true, but I simply I just don't know that, but I'll ask for it and get you that information.

And is there it's it was kind of a little hard to read on the plans, but is there a walkway structure, or is it just surrounded by parking aside from the sidewalk along the frontage there on the street?

And then the shelter?

Oh, just the the whole building as a whole. Is there, like, a pedestrian walkway around the building?

On the left hand side, you have covered parking. So that is just there's an area of a pathway that you can then, you know, go around. But all around, there's the stronger connection is at the south end and what we're calling the green pathway, the one that is in blue on the screen. But there is frontage along Chevron Drive, there's a pedestrian walkway, and there's also a pedestrian walkway on the where the shadow of the building is projected on the slide that you see on your monitor.

Okay. Thank you.

And what I would add about the community room is it's actually a very cool program. Even if it's just for residents, it's designed for the residents. It's not uncommon for people to come and actually ask the lobby, hey, can we rent a space for this afternoon, for an event for the entire community? And it's not uncommon to see the entire community at the end owning these rooms and knowing that they are available for the entire community. Again, the primary purpose is for the residents, but it's not uncommon, you know, to have those type of availability to to the rest of the community.

That's a great point. We do that quite often. Yeah. Including, hey. The city wants to have a meeting. Can we have a community room? And I quite frequently take over a few of them down in the South Bay. So I can't wait to take over one here. Yeah. Where is that bike lounge area?

That bike the bike storage is adjacent to the lobby. Oh. It's right there.

Perfect.

That's a huge thing right now is having that internal secured bike thing across every one of our developments, particularly for e bikes and stuff like that. So we started to do kind of a a bike lobby, if you will. It helps with keeping the traffic from the bicycles all throughout the building. It's not prohibited, but it's a little bit easier on the wear and tear.

I'm assuming the mailroom would probably be there pretty close. I don't know if it's on the plan. Sorry. I've just lived in a big complex before with this sort of setup with the bike storage, but a lot of people's bikes would get stolen even though it was inside the building and we needed to have, you know, a key card. So it would still happen.

Yeah.

Yeah. In a sense. But having it located directly next to the lobby and other areas of lots of lots of traffic, if you will, is better than placing it to back of the house. And so the thought of because we easily we I we didn't want back of the house next to the lobby area because then you don't have eyes on it. The back of the house doesn't need eyes on on stuff like that. So it helps with eyes on the street. The elevators are there, so people are coming and going. And it's it's separate from the mailboxes. Right? Mailboxes are on the other side. Yeah.

Okay. Thank you. That's all my questions.

Thank you. I I have a few questions. Try and break them up by person. Thank you. The first couple were on for staff, I think, just to make sure that we understand what we're looking at tonight versus orchards versus the master plan and everything. If you can clarify our role tonight versus the overall Orchards project.

So you had the study session in July for the overall Orchards project, and those applications are still kind of proceeding. They'll return to the commission again. And these the Orchards affordable site is proposing a 100 units. That is part of the 2,500 or so units that are proposed under the larger Orchards Development Project. So this is a separate application, but part of the greater orchards project.

I see.

And as I recall from the original orchards, original Eden project, it was kind of a sequence of approving the projects before we could approve Eden and then having to come back and modify the original projects. Is that gonna be the similar pathway we're gonna go on this project?

I think it's, the larger orchards development project applications would need to be approved before this site would want to move forward with approvals because it's relying on the larger project being approved. But in this case, the affordable is coming the affordable that will be provided here will be from the neighborhoods portion of the project. So in that sense, I don't think we would be coming back to kind of

Modify that.

Modify.

Yeah. And then if I could ask on the approval of the day the childcare. We understood earlier that the childcare, what Eden's providing is the is the physical space, but not the operations. So is it safe to say that the child care and all the things that we've done when we've seen day care facilities before, we'd have a similar approval path on that independent of the housing part of the project, or will it be all together? Or how do you envision that one?

In this case, we would be approving the child care use in the space, and then it would be when their operator comes on board, they would be able to come right in with their business license.

And all the parts with it. Okay. Perfect. Perfect. I think the next questions maybe are for the architect, if I could. You know? Thank thank you, Annalisa. Yeah. Mhmm. The it's probably the wrong word, but the horseshoe part of it where it looks like it's open Yes. Is that truly open, or is it gated or fenced off to people wandering in there?

The childcare needs to be have a secured fence around. So if you look at that site plan, most of it is that fence, you know, around the childcare playground area. And we are proposing that there's a gate in to go inside of the courtyard. However, the path where we're going the green pathway to connect to the greenway is outside of the building. So you will be you will be able to come from the neighborhood and connect to the perimeter greenway without having to go through that through that security.

Got it. Okay. And then I don't recall it. Have you have we seen this at the ARB? Has the ARB looked at we have not.

Not

yet. I assume at some point they will. And I can tell you right now they're gonna always ask because they always do. You know? Amazon package deliveries and things

like have the you know, we that's what we pay special attention to that drop off and making sure that there was a drop off area. We actually work with a civil engineer to provide, you know, to reshuffle that, from the regional plans in order to make sure that, you know, that, yes, Amazon drop offs are there. Perfect. We also were thinking, you know, childcare, you know, and how is that gonna work. So we're hoping that drop off area would also help for childcare.

Great. Okay. And and I think you already told us, but I wanna confirm, the programming of the the childcare is not dedicated to the residents of this 100 unit building. Anybody in the is that right? Did I hear that correctly? So if somebody from the Orchard's neighborhood in general wanted to use that, they're eligible to apply to have their child there as well.

Correct. So the provider just comes, utilizes the space, and then they're open applications.

Okay. And then this is I'm not sure if this is in Eden or just child care TBD. I think I heard, Dixie, you said that there's also on occasion there could be subsidies towards paying for the child care. I assume that's just a finance thing that's independent of where the person lives, or do they have to be a resident of Eden in order to qualify? It's just

No. It's sponsored by the state, and the subsidy is provided to the child care provider. It's my understanding it's based upon that family's income.

Okay. Okay. So that's it's not exclusive to just those individuals. And you did a great job outlining the timeline from today to 2031.

Yeah.

My question yeah. More or less. Yeah. More or less. That's fair.

Give a year.

Yeah. Give or take a year. That's fair. That's fair. Is your vision and this is a combination of neighborhood one and childcare and the Eden housing project. I guess my real question is when somebody rents at Eden, they'll know there'll be a childcare on the 1st Floor. And if they don't like the sounds of kids in their neighborhood, then they would know there's a childcare planned and programmed for this part of the building even if they're not coming online at the same time.

Yeah. That's correct. All the marketing on the material will say it's an affordable housing community with childcare on-site, and people can make up their preference mind and opt in or opt out as they wish.

Perfect. And then combination question for perhaps Sunset and Eden. Is the is the goal, plus or minus a year or two, to have Eden come online, you know, meeting the the affordable requirements for neighborhood one sort of about the same time somehow eventually. Is it all gonna come together more or less at the same time? You know? Or is there any is that all just dependent on it depends.

That's the goal is that there will be simultaneous construction with Orchard's neighborhood and with Eden if the stars align. But that that's our intention is that development will be happening concurrently given that the as Dixie outlined, the pad will be ready, the infrastructure will be ready, and it will really be a function of Eden's ability to secure financing.

Okay. And this is just more a curiosity question about how this all plays together in our housing elements. You know, we're bumping up against 2031. Do you have an excellent is when does it count in our current housing element or not? You know?

So just a reminder that the Orchard's site is not considered at a housing opportunity site in our housing element. So, therefore, the units that are anticipated within this development are above and beyond what we had originally committed to as far as planning for housing development during the twenty twenty three to 2031 cycle. So the I guess the the benefit to a project such as orchards is that based on their time frame, we should be able to count approval of the units in the current cycle that we're in, and that will increase the buffer and the surplus that we have for our housing element so that we don't run into a no net loss issue. So, for example, the 99 affordable units here would be able to count towards our production as long as the the development is approved. It doesn't necessarily have to receive building permits during the cycle to count towards arena production.

Perfect. Thank you so much. Okay. That was it for my questions. At this time, we'll go ahead and open the public hearing. Do we have any written or speaker cards on this item?

No written communication or speaker cards for this item.

Okay. Well, I'm gonna go ahead and close the public comment. Any final and, again, there's no decision required by us tonight. I think if there are things that you didn't you know, staff took serious notes with the questions, so every question turned into a comment in their mind. So if there are any other comments that we haven't heard tonight.

So the project as designed from Eden's perspective and Sunset's perspective and what we have seen that was brought about by Steinhardt, the only consideration would be one looking at the parking spaces. So for a 100 units, there are 100 parking spaces. Mhmm. So, of course, they have the density bonus law. They they are availing and things like that.

That's absolutely fine. But I I would suggest as a spirit of looking at the policy of the entire neighborhood itself, if there are n number of complaints that are coming in from the neighborhood when they when they come in for a period of time, would would you guys revisit some kind of a parking allocation? That would be my only concern. That's the reason I was trying to allude towards various different opportunities or different ways of trying to find innovative parking solutions. So Okay. When you guys come in for a development agreement, you guys can kindly think about it.

Okay. Thank you. Other comments wrap up at this point? Commissioner Zeng, one commissioner Villa, one or the other?

For comments, well, I mean, first, thank you for coming in for the study session. It's always appreciated to give us this early look, even before staff have determined if the application is complete. I have to say from, you know, all the architecture, site plan related stuff, looks great. I never have issues with the work that you guys do. I think you always do a great job.

And I've got my other commissioners here to really take a fine tooth comb through through anything that maybe I've missed, so I have no worries there. I'm just really I I would say I'm more grateful about the affordable housing component. It's it's great to know that we have these clever solutions to get more affordable units and deeper affordability to meet arena goals and meet our affordable housing obligations, through these clever arrangements, rather than, just having to do everything on-site and sacrifice the efficiencies that you set that we get from consolidating the units. And, of course, the amenities that are being provided on-site is a really great bonus as well. So just expressing my satisfaction of that. So thank you. That's all for me.

I have some feedback. And it's gonna take a little bit to get through. I do appreciate you guys coming forward and presenting this project. Overall, I was really satisfied with the architecture, especially the materials that were selected. That aluminum batten almost looks like a wood, and I think it adds some depth to the project instead of just having a stucco building.

So I I do really appreciate that. One of the other things that I noted was in the courtyard, it seems to be a little bit more geared toward toward, like, a tot lot rather than older children. I think there was some sort of climbing structure. But if there could be some more amenities to play to other age levels, since primarily it seems like a child focused sort of courtyard, I think that would be great. I don't know how many of the residents usually have kids that would probably live in affordable rental housing like this.

And if that's significantly higher than other apartments, I I don't know. So so long as the amenities are meeting, I think, the age levels and the percentages that you typically see. In terms of the internal amenities, I really appreciated having the community room and the child care center and the technology space and the after school. And it sounds like, you know, there's a lot of benefits there, not just to kids, but to other age levels as well. One of the things that I did notice and I didn't look too clearly on this was that the childcare is pretty close to an exit.

And I would just hope that you guys would kinda just look into what additional safety measures or precautions can be taken, just to make sure that if someone is, you know, trying to exit out of the parking lot, that they're just being mindful of kids. The other thing was the connection points. I appreciated that drawing with the site connectivity to the multiuse trail that's along the western side of the building. I would like to see more pedestrian connectivity on the northern side as well, just having, like, a path around the building or yeah. I don't know.

That was just kind of my thought that sometimes I think that connectivity is just having this be, like, a walkable, welcoming environment instead of a core oriented one is always, like, a benefit. The other thing I wanted to note was that I didn't see any sort of connection to the apartment complex that would be to the north. However, I know that connection point could come through the multiuse trail if someone wanted to, and that's why I kinda wanted to see, like, a northern connection along to to similar to what you have on the South Side. One of the other things that I noted was for some of these, you know, multistory apartments when you are walking around, and I think you don't have too many units that are on the 1st Floor. But something that's always typical that I see is the people that live on the 1st Floor.

When people are walking by, they tend to want to look inside the person's home. The person has the blinds or curtains drawn, and then it kinda, as I've seen, like, makes them vacate. That's something that I've noticed living in apartments is that if there can be something that can be done to, like, have a little bit more screening for those people that will be on the 1st Floor or some sort of grade change where they sit at a higher level, maybe doing something like that. The other thing was the courtyard. There is that gathering space that you guys referenced with a community terrace and large gatherings, and it would be really neat to have some sort of pergola or shade structure going ahead and above that.

I know for one of the parks here, one of the local parks has a a pergola, and that space is used every single weekend. Every time I go to the park, it's always used. There's always people setting up. And I think that's, like, one of the things that I've seen. Like, people really benefit on that.

The other thing was I I saw that for the lobby area, you have numbering. So when you are coming from that angle from the northern side, you can see the numbering of the building. However, maybe it would be beneficial to also have it on the other side as well because I think, typically, people, when they come upon these larger apartment complexes, they get confused about where the lobby or the entrance is. So maybe there could be, like, some sort of additional emphasis on that. And the other thing was, for the parking, if you can have some guest parking spaces that would be labeled as guest.

I know that you guys are wanting to go ahead and have a lower parking standard per the state density bonus law and what that allows, but I just wanna make sure that, you know, there is some parking spots for guests that are just reserved for them and not having that spill over so much on the rest of the community, especially since you guys are not proposing to have any underground style

parking.

The other thing was, you know, overall yeah. Overall, not related to this project, but, similar to what commissioner Kundula went ahead and mentioned before was, I understand that the neighborhood district and how you guys want to go ahead and offset the affordable housing to be all within development, and you're providing more affordable units as well as a deeper affordability. But that's not to say that I think there would be some particular benefit in having some affordable homes as a for sale product as well. There seems to be a lot of different product types. I I, I can't recall how many different product types there are within that neighborhood district, but it it would be, nice to go ahead and not have all our affordable housing again in one location, but rather, you know, dispersed throughout the community.

I understand that this is a community as a whole. However, I think there would be some benefit for that to have some affordable for sale product within the neighborhood district just because a lot of times what we've seen now is they're 100% affordable, which is you know, has a lot of benefits, especially as it relates to amenities and so forth. But, you know, one of the things that people really do have voiced their concern over time and time through planning commission is wanting to have the for sale affordable product, and that doesn't fall on this project. But if there can just be, you know, some sort of for sale product that's affordable, I think that would go a long way. And that's all my comments.

Thank you.

Okay. Thank you. Commissioner Kuznick?

No. I'm good.

K. Okay. Well, I'll just wrap up and say thank you for taking the time to present this. I do understand that this is preliminary, and staff will continue to review the the applications. And it has not been deemed complete or consistent, But thank you again for the time tonight. I think this is a great project. I think all the comments from the commissioners were spot on, for the most part. And I know that we'll continue to refine the project, and I thank you very much for coming tonight. And with that, I think we've provided a lot of comments, and I don't I'll turn to staff to make sure if there's anything else that you need from us tonight, or we can move on. You're okay?

Okay. Well, thank you commissioners for all the feedback. Thank you to Sunset, to Eden, and Stein Steinberg Hart. It's always a pleasure to have you here. At this point, we'll do liaison reports if any of the commissioners have any to share. No. I don't believe nope. Doesn't sound like any of us have had any there. So then we'll turn to

The meetings were not happening or they have been canceled. So

yeah. Yeah. It's it's it's very early in the month, and they when they generally meet once a month, sometimes we're on their supply cycle, and sometime we are not. So I'll turn to Cindy and or Lauren to give us a preview of what's up next. Sure.

So next scheduled meeting is November 18, Tuesday night. We are anticipating two items for that evening. The planning commission has previously seen bishop ranch eight, the canopy project at a at a study session earlier this year. That's ready to go to public hearing, so that will be one of the items. The second item, bishop ranch 12 also reviewed at a previous study session with the planning commission. That's also going to be, a public hearing item as well. So our plan is for those two items for November 18.

Okay. And I have one little minor item related to something that's not really on our plate that is next to the Crow Canyon Apartments. If you haven't read, the school district is buying that brick building on Crow Canyon Place just to the north of the Canyon Place project, and they will be moving their district office personnel from Danville, Old Orchard Road, and it's a concept we all understand. That is the housing opportunity site for the town of Danville. And per the superintendent's press release, there are a number of developers interested in that site.

And, the timing for them moving those folks there should be by the end of this school year. So they're gonna be moving very quickly. So it's not related to us, but it's right next to something we've looked at. So with that, we can go ahead and adjourn our meeting for