City Commission - Regular Meeting

Okay, it is 4 o'clock. I will call the August 24th Salinas City Commission meeting to order. I will look to staff for confirmation the Kansas Open Meeting Act required notice has been properly provided. Yes. Thank you. May we have a roll call?

Mayor Hoppix?

Here.

Commissioner Davis?

Here.

Commissioner Lankowitz?

Here.

Commissioner Renk?

Here. Will those who are able please stand for the Pledge of Allegiance and a moment of silence.

of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thank you. Okay, we have no public hearing, so we'll bring us to the consent agenda.

Item 4.1, consider approval of the August 10th, 2026 regular meeting minutes. And item 4.2, consider approval of resolution number 26-8368, appointing members to various citizen boards, commissions, and committees.

Okay, is there an item a commissioner would like to have removed? Any comment from the public? I would like to make the comment that we do still have board openings, so anyone who's interested can contact the city clerk's office to apply. All those in favor of approving the consent agenda, I need a motion. I need a motion first. How about a motion?

Move to approve the consent agenda.

Second that. We have a motion and a second to approve the consent agenda. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That item passes 4-0. That will bring us to administration.

Item 5.1, consider authorizing publication of the notice of hearing to exceed revenue neutral rate and 2027 budget.

Good afternoon, Mayor and Commissioners. Debbie Pack, Director of Finance and Administration. Kansas State statute requires that a formal public hearing be held to exceed the revenue neutral rate and to discuss the proposed budget. We must publish a notice at least 10 days prior to the hearing date. This action today authorizes staff to set the public hearing date for September 14th. The notice that will be published will include the date, time, and location of the hearing, as well as establish the maximum limits of the 2027 budget and the maximum amount of ad valorem or property tax to be levied. During the July 13th, 2026 study session, the city commission directed staff to use the one mill levy over the current mill levy option to complete the city's budget calculations. The 2027 proposed budget establishes a maximum mill levy of 29.568 mills. This mill should allocate approximately $13,508,159 to the general fund and $3,372,476 to the bond and interest fund for a total property tax levy of $16,880,634. Staff's recommendation is to make a motion to authorize the publication of the notice of hearing to exceed revenue neutral rate and for the budget of 2027 to set September 14, 2026 as the date for public hearing and establishes the maximum property tax revenue of $16,888,000. an estimated mill levy rate of 29.568. I will note that that rate could change depending on the clerk's final certification in November. I would stand for any questions.

Okay, any questions for Ms. Pack? No. Okay, any comments from the public? Okay, if not, I will bring it back to the Commission for action.

Mayor move to authorize the publication of the notice of hearing to exceed revenue neutral rate and budget for 2027. which sets September 14, 2026 as the date for the public hearing and establishes the maximum property revenue at $16,880,634, an estimated mill levy rate of 29.568, with the final mill levy rate being determined by the county clerk upon final certification.

We have a motion and a second that the city commission authorized the publication of the notice of hearing to exceed revenue neutral rate and budget for 2027, which sets September 14th, 2026 as the date for the public hearing and establishes the maximum property tax revenue at 16 million. $880,634, an estimated mill levy rate of 29.568, with the final mill levy rate being determined by the county clerk upon final certification. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? Nay. That item passes three to one. That will bring us to item 5.2.

Item 5.2, consider authorizing the city manager to sign an agreement with Guy Swanson, trustee of the Harold E. Swanson Trust and trustee of the Harold E. and Donna J. Trust No. 2 et al. for the purchase of property adjacent to the Salina Municipal Solid Waste Landfill in the amount of $725,000. Mr. Marsh.

Good afternoon, Mayor and Commissioners, Ron Marsh, Director of Public Works. In January of 2026, the trustee for the quarter section of land in the southwest corner of Burma and Fairleigh Roads contacted the City of Salina to gauge our interest in purchasing the land. This quarter section is adjacent to the Salina Municipal Solid Waste Landfill. Knowing the large amount of dirt that the Salina Municipal Solid Waste Landfill needs for current and future operations, staff contacted our landfill engineers, SCS Engineering, to determine the cost benefit of purchasing the property for future landfill soil needs. During the ensuing months, the engineers conducted a soil analysis study, environmental site assessment, and wetlands delineation report to determine the suitability of the soil for landfill use. The studies determined that the quarter section would conservatively provide 1.5 million cubic yards of material for a final cover, daily cover, and bottom line of construction. Through negotiations, the city and property trustee reached a purchase price of $725,000 for the property, or $4,618 per acre. Funds for the purchase are from the solid waste reserve fund, which has a current fund balance of approximately 5.7 million dollars. Options for the City Commission consideration are listed on your staff report. Staff recommends approving the City Manager to sign the agreement. I'll stand for any questions.

Any questions?

No questions. I have a couple of comments, but no questions. Okay, go ahead. Well, my comp has, they're more for the public. We've had at least a couple of executive sessions regarding this when we've gone into the other room and discussed it. The property is adjacent to the landfill. Landfills don't last forever. And I just want, just throwing that out there that it is a little bit above the appraised value, but I think the last thing we want as a city is for a private entrepreneur maybe to step in and buy that land and kind of hold it hostage for us for the future. I just wanted to throw that out there.

Yeah, and a follow-up to that, I think we also looked at if we were getting fill dirt from further away, the total cost would be significantly more than having this, purchasing this ground and the cost to move it from here to the landfill. So there's an economic, positive economic impact by purchasing this in the long run. Okay, with that being said, I will open it up to the public.

I understand wanting to buy this for the soil. My question is, and hopefully it can get answered here and not later on in the week in the question and answer session from the city, the soil that we supposedly received from Schwann's out there, the big pile, Why has that not been moved? What is going on with that soil that was supposed to be used to go to the landfill?

Yeah, so we had negotiated with Schwann some time ago, and that negotiation kind of fell through, and we've never accepted that soil. You were getting it for free. Well, at some point, we were going to have to test all of the soil, and we never made it to that part. So that still could be a future endeavor. But at this point, you know, it's not.

And I believe we had an estimate to move that soil from there to us of a half million dollars.

You did, $500,000 from TNR Dirt to move it because they gave it to you. And you didn't take it because you think it's contaminated?

No, that's not the case. It would need to be tested. And the discussions with Schwanns at the time, they were still using the pile. They were still adding to it. And so I think there is a possibility in the future we still could do that. We just haven't ever finalized it with Schwanns. Okay, thank you.

Okay, anyone else? Okay, I will bring it back to the commission for action.

I'll move that the city commission authorize the city manager to sign an agreement with Guy Swanson, trustee of the Harold E. Swanson Trust and trustee of the Harold E. and Donna J. Trust, number two, for the purchase of the property defined in the agreement in the amount of $725,000. Accept that.

We have a motion and a second authorizing the city manager to sign an agreement with Guy Swanson, trustee of the Harold E. Swanson Trust and trustee of the Harold E. and Donna J. Trust No. 2 for the purchase of the property defined in the agreement in the amount of $725,000. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That item passes 4-0. That will bring us to item 5.3.

Item 5.3, consider awarding project number 26017, 2026 Water Main Replacements to Deal Enterprises Incorporated in an amount not to exceed $2,162,767. Okay, and I'm going to turn this over to the Vice Mayor as I am recusing myself from this item.

All right.

Thank you, Commissioners and Vice Mayor. A little bit of background. In 2007, the city completed a water distribution model that actually looked at the cast iron water mains throughout the city. At that time, we started a program to spend roughly $20 million for water main replacements at $4 million a year. As we got started, we learned that the time that it took for the contractors to complete the work um was longer than the one year that we were planning on and we split it into two projects to allow a couple of different contractors to work on that so in 2021 we started a budget of two million dollars per year currently we have about 338 miles of water main and of that there's about 175 miles that are cast iron pipes of varying sizes The unlined cast iron water mains develop tuberculation and as a part of that the iron is corroded away and results in weakening the cast iron pipe and ultimately replacement is an option. And that's what we're here today, is talk about the replacement of water mains. And the map is kind of small to see, but in the top corner there's a couple red areas, and that's 10th and 11th Street. And then Dover Street is on the west side of town, a red area. for that location and then larson is to the east of there and south so the three areas show up show up on the map and that's the project that we're here today and there's roughly about fifty seven hundred linear feet of pipe in that project we had four bidders on august sixth uh... the low bidder was deal enterprises at $2,059,778. Their substantial completion date was 365 days. NOAA construction. was roughly 2.3 million and their substantial completion was 335 days. Smoky Hills, 2.5 million, 500 days for substantial completion. Mies Construction, 3.75 million and 420 calendar days. So we see this project to be just short of a year to 500 days or about a year and a half. Deal construction was a low bidder and city staff has checked with other communities that have them doing some work for them. One is Concordia where they've done some street work, storm drains and water line relocation. They've done work for the city, demolition projects for parks and rec. the log jam debris removal for the city and they're currently working on infrastructure for magnolia hills number three subdivision that includes water sewer storm drains and streets Staff recommends awarding the bid to Deal Enterprises, incorporated in the amount of $2,162,767, which includes a 5% contingency. Looking back in time, we've seen that water main replacements have went from about $75 a linear foot to the Mies project a few months ago was $278. And this project's roughly, excuse me, $360 a linear foot. So we're seeing some of these costs go up. One of the projects on this one has a pretty narrow right of way of about 40 feet. So construction will be a little bit of a challenge there. Again, authorization not to exceed $2,162,767. This will be funded from the Water and Wastewater Capital Reserve Fund, which currently has roughly $9.2 million in it. Our standard four options are available. Approve a motion awarding the bid for the project, water main replacements to deal enterprises incorporated for the total of 2,162,767. including the contingency and authorize the city manager to execute a contract with deal enterprises incorporated bond fulfillment all the prerequisites under the bid documents second would be to approve a motion city commission deem It's appropriate for any other information they might like to see prior to awarding it. Postpone consideration to another date and request additional information or vote to deny awarding the project to deal. Staff recommends option one to Deal Enterprises Incorporated. I believe there's individuals here from Deal Enterprises, or at least I noticed some individuals, okay? And Jeff Schamberg, who's stuck in the back, from the Utilities Department. The three of us would be willing or however many is from Deal, would be willing to answer any questions that you might have about the project.

Questions? I have a couple. Okay. First of all, is the ambassador property, is that cleaned up now? I went by it earlier and it seemed like a lot of piles all through the property. Yeah.

Better you than me. I don't know that answer.

Hello, I'm State and Deal President of Deal Enterprises Inc. The ambassador, the debris is all cleaned away and signed off on and we're in the process of getting the concrete out.

That's what it looked like when I drove by. Is that part of the bid for that project, or is that additional?

Removing the concrete, the footprint of the building, yes, that's part of the original bid.

Okay, another question for you, sir, while you're right there. How many miles of water line have Your company, how many miles have you completed in our town or I guess any other town?

Oh, I mean, you want me to go back 30, 40 years, I guess I can add up miles and miles.

When was the last time you, have you done any water pipe in Salina?

Yes, we did one a couple Fridays ago. We went and fixed a water main service line for the city of Salina out by 9th Street and I-70. We're currently doing water lines up in Magnolia Hills. We're also in the city of Abilene doing work at the Ike Education Center, hooking on to the main water lines up there and adding services up there as well for the Ike Education new building.

This question might be more for Martha, and it's really more of a comment, but my guess for you both, Stanton, maybe this is appropriate for you. Stanton. Stanton, I see the project is in four different parts of town. Three. Well, I stand corrected. Three different parts of town, the two together up north. Do you have enough people for that type of work, or they'll have to do one part at a time and then move on to number two and then move on to three and four?

I believe the way we're going to attack the project is just like you said. We're going to do one phase, a second phase, and a third phase.

Okay, and I know you have your timeline set. on here of the substantial one year and final 395. Those were my questions.

Is there any substantial difference between water main replacement and putting in new service?

There's definitely a difference between putting a new service in and replacing old services for sure.

And you've done water main replacement before? Yes, sir. All right. So the type work you're doing,

I know there's a lot of confusion about who I am and what Deal Enterprises, Inc. is. If you'd like me to elaborate on that, I'm more than welcome to. There's been a lot of accusations brought over the whole last weekend, so if you guys want more information, I'm more than willing to give it.

Well, no, I wasn't going in that direction. When I looked at the work you had done, I knew you were doing the Magnolia Hills infrastructure, which is putting in new service. Correct. And I'm just wondering if there's that much technical difference between or skill required to replace a war domain as opposed to

Oh, most definitely.

So I just needed to know that you've done replacements before. I saw where you had done new, but I didn't reference that you had done replacements.

She had mentioned the city of Concordia. We're up there right now removing the street. We had to put in new storm sewer system to help them with their rainwater. Along with that, there was water lines that were in the way of those storm sewers, so we had to re- direct them so we could get the new storm system in. So we're finished with that end of the deal. We're on the finishing stages of laying curb and gutter and laying new asphalt, but all the infrastructure that we did for them is over.

Okay. Thank you. I guess don't leave the room in case there are more questions. Another question?

I do. And this is for Martha. Nowak Construction Company, have they laid pipe in the city?

Yes, I went back and looked over the entire history of our water main projects here. And NOAC did a couple of projects very early in water main replacements. Maybe the first project we did and then second or third project like that. And they haven't been here in that time frame since then to do water main replacements. But ten plus years ago, they were here.

Did they do their work in a timely manner?

Yes, they did fine work.

And on the overall work, were there change orders out of the ordinary added? I know sometimes they find a valve or a fitting or whatever it might be in that type of work where it's something that wasn't in the scope of work that while we're at it, it needs to be done. But Raising the bid above for whatever reason. Was there any history with NOAC?

Almost every water main project when you're working where things are buried in the ground, there's things that we just don't know about. Could be service lines that we conflict with. Could be buried concrete that's there that we didn't know about. So we do have some items like that. I don't know that we've ever had a water main replacement project that didn't have change orders that we needed to make additions for, so I'm not aware that I would say that any of them were out of the ordinary or change orders that would be unusual.

It reminds me of when we were talking the fiber optic cable and how they were running into things that weren't anticipated but still had to be done or had to find a workaround. But that answers my questions.

And that's part of the reason we have a contingency amount, because you will find things that weren't marked when they were put in or have been forgotten about. Thank you. Any comments, questions from the public? Come up to the podium and please give your name.

My name is Ben Winholz. Martha and Mr. Deal, I don't think I'd go very far if I were you. One thing to bring to mind here as far as somebody when they get a lower bid, If they haven't done this work as far as what he's about to do, doing the phase three of Magnolia Hills involves farmland, everything's flat, there's nothing in the way. You're absolutely, no streets, no nothing, infrastructure goes in first. What you're doing is you're doing the mains and you're doing the taps and you're doing service lines up to what would be a curb at a later date for each plat of land that goes in there. So it just involves one service line and one shutoff. You are not dealing with any of that that you're going to deal with now over on any of these streets because of the fact that the mains are going to be in a different location than where they were before. Most of these mains are in the middle of the street. They're now going over to the side. So with that, you have boring underneath the street to be able to do the service lines on the side that doesn't have the main. And you've got the service lines on there. Every service line will be completely different from where they are now. So you will be dealing with their service lines, their meter sets, their boxes, the whole thing. Basically, this is not just an open field infrastructure addition. This is Maine. And like was said before, when you talk contingency of 5%, that's already been included in this price. So when Martha talks about that we're going to have possible fiber lines and everything that you run into, yes, you are gonna be dealing with all of this basically in there. With that being said, When you put a lowball bid in like this, knowing that possibly down the road you're going to get a change order because there's something that wasn't in the scope of work that you didn't know. After a while, your bid becomes more than the second or the third or even the fourth person. And if you look at the bid timelines on this versus his days versus the other ones, these other companies have already worked in this town. They have done this type of work. They already know how many days it's going to take to do this. And I don't think Mr. Deal has figured this out. And so what he's banking on is basically something that we went off already on with the logjam. You're going to come back with a major change order. And he's going to be more in price than the other three bidders. had ever thought of being done in the first place. That is something that you need to look into basically when a man tells you that he has not done any infrastructure on a street that already has established services that That is needed to be taken into consideration because you're dealing with a lot of stuff besides mains. You're dealing with everybody's service line, everybody's meter, everybody's meter box, everybody's curb stop, everybody's corporation. So all of this needs to be taken into account as far as that.

If you had a question, I'd let you complete it, but you made a comment. Mr. Deal, did you state that you had never done this? Mr. Wendell, you can have a seat. Thank you.

I guess I wasn't speaking English earlier. Yes, I have done main replacement. We're doing one in the city of Concordia right now. I have throughout my whole career of life done replacement of lines. I've worked with the railroad for 20 years. We've faced about every terrain. aspect you can. We've worked on utilities around the Union Pacific Railroad throughout my life. I've been in this town my whole life working through service lines. I know it's easy for Ben to say that I don't know what I'm doing. What Ben does not realize is that we have hired a team over the last couple years of 20 plus people now that have been hired to do bids, that have been hired to do these projects that we're bidding on because two or three years ago I noticed in this community that there was only maybe one or two contractors bidding on projects and I thought at that time this is something that I can do. I've done this throughout my life. At that point in time I met Craig Piercy and we teamed up and we went to building a team And we've built a team up to do work in this town and to do other surrounding areas. And we have hired people to bid projects a legitimate way. We have also hired people to do different types of work. We do demolition work. We do utility work. We also do dirt work. I did trees long ago, too. I don't know if anybody knows that, but I'll give you that information. So I do have the experience, unlike Ben believes, and they should know more about me as much as they follow me around town. So I'm up for other questions. Thank you.

Thank you. Mr. Winholtz, time is up.

Well, one comment on that. I don't follow him around town. Basically, I could care less what he does.

Mr. Winholtz, we have a long agenda, and a lot of people here want to talk. You can't take the whole show. Next person.

Ma'am.

I'm Lucille Sanderson, and I agree with Ben. Deal had the motel to tear down. They put a boo-boo. That thing set was an eyesore for how long? And it ended up costing the city more than what the original amount was. Now we've got the log jam. It ended up costing the city more than it was supposed to original. Same thing's going to happen with others. He's going to get in there and something, and he didn't have it in the budget. Now, I agree, don't always take the low one because the low one is going to cause you a problem down the road. Maybe you're going to mark my word, but you don't take the little guy. He's trying, yes, but maybe he's in a field that he doesn't need to be in. Do his dirt work. Finally, they're getting the hotel cleaned up. But how long did it set out there? And I saw her. And commissioners, you're sitting in those chairs to represent the people that are behind me. Sometimes I think you kind of forget where you're at. City manager, same story. I listened to some of the stuff you talked about. I never heard so much air. So remember, it's our money, you're representing us, not you. Thank you.

Thank you.

After this, Speaker. No, I don't know your name, but the lady in that first seat will let go next. So whoever else is going to come up will let this. No, they're fine. You go ahead.

Sherry Spratlin, Salina. You know, when you talk about bids and you say that the low bid is the best bid because it's saving money, look what we got for a manager. Look what that money cost us.

Please read the rules for behavior here in the room. Applause and jeering is not allowed.

What is not allowed?

Applause and jeering.

Ma'am.

I'd like to understand it better.

Could you give the clerk your name, please?

I'm sorry. Terry Walsh, I'm sorry. Well, my last name is not I'm sorry. My last name is Walsh. Sorry. My main concern is I understand now that we're really looking to get some stuff done as far as the water mains getting fixed. And I know that now that they've got just the few areas, are they still looking into cleaning up other areas? And I know that a lot of it, you know it's bad because it's so old. I understand that part of it. But is it only going to be dealt with if the people come and say, hey, I got bad water or...

No, we are working to develop a plan that does more water line replacement. We've been replacing water line, and we'll continue to do that. The city commission directed staff to come up with a plan to do more, and so we're working through that right now. So there will definitely be more projects happening.

Okay. And the other thing I had was – At one point in time, Millwood was on the list. Is there a reason why that it is not on the list right now? Does anybody, can anybody answer that? I mean, I don't.

The four of us would not be the one to answer. I'd have to defer to the city manager or public works. I don't know if either one wants to take a stab at it now.

And we've been replacing water line, water mains all the time. I mean, it sounded like there was a company in here 10 years ago.

Has it been a steady? Yeah, absolutely. We have two projects right now that are replacing water lines that are working in the community. So two companies, Smoky Hill and Mace, a company out of Wichita, are working on projects right now.

Thank you.

Bye.

Christy Dixon, Celina. First of all, I just want to ask one question regarding time, how long it will take, if it's going to take as long as it took the other projects. And second of all, I just want to speak on the incompetence of Martha and her boss. We had an employee of theirs.

Excuse me, we're talking about this one

Yeah, I'm talking about- Okay, please be direct. I'm talking about water.

Now this issue- I'm talking about water.

For this particular project. You had an employee that, back in February, left the water plant. And the water plant or the city has not asked for his keys. February. These are the main pump keys to every pump in Salina, Kansas. Way to go, Martha. Way to go, HR, and way to go, Jacob. I'll leave them right here.

Next. There was someone over here.

It is a security issue.

You can throw those down underneath so you don't have to see it.

It's okay. Rebecca Racy, Celina. My question is for Martha. How did you vet the companies that you received bids from? What criteria did you use to vet them? How could you not take that question?

I have to be directed to answer that. Oh, I see. I just got closer to be available.

That was your only question? That's my question. Okay. I'm done.

How did we get bids?

We provided... How did you vet the people who bid? How did you evaluate the company's

Well, there's more than one that was involved in the evaluation. Jeff Schamberg has called individuals. I've called individuals, and I've talked with Staten about the schedule that he's going to work and how quick he'll get started and that type of thing to see where we're going to go. So we've talked about the project, and I get a lot of phone calls from different people that are now working for Deal Construction that work for another company. So I'm aware of the individuals that have went to work there from other construction companies. So we have some insight from others. And Jeff has called several communities and talked to different people. So we have vetted them to find out.

You talked to people?

Yes. We called people. We talked to them.

Did you create criteria? For example... How often does this company come in on a project within the timeline? How often has this company had to, what do you call it, a change order? And to what extent? Those kinds of things.

Have worked with deal construction on the log jam.

That's not what I'm getting at.

And I've worked with NOAC.

In many areas of the world, business, education, you have an objective criteria. It's developed for... you actually start making phone calls. And you can measure objectively.

We look at the work they've done. We look at the people that are in their company. The standard questions that you ask any contractor when you're trying to learn about them.

And that's all great. I'm not saying we're doing it wrong. But I'm simply saying I'm referring to an objective criteria.

Yes, we do rate them objectively from contractor to contractor about the experience they have, what they've done. and whether they can do this job or not, and our past experience working with them.

And is this how you do all evaluation of bids for work in your department?

Yeah, we...

Okay, so I would encourage in the future that you create an objective evaluation criteria that isn't based on we talk to them, we feel like, that sort of thing.

Yeah, we've asked them questions, gathered information about their company, and we've talked to individuals they've worked for.

I don't think you understand that.

I don't believe I do, no.

Anyone else?

Karen, how far are the bids apart from the first bid to the last bid? Is it so close that we can maybe think it all the way through? I think we've gone a long time with this and we need to start sooner. Thank you.

To answer your question, there's a $240,000 difference from number one to number two. Another $160,000 to the next one and then $1.3 million between number three and number four.

Susan Cooper, Celina. On the criteria, is that something that is written out? And could we see that as citizens who are paying all of these monies for these projects that seem to go on forever and ever and ever? So if you've got criteria, please post it. And if you have criteria in the city manager's office for dealing with vetting people who are going to be replacing somebody on the city commission, please post it. Saying pretty words does not mean that it's appropriate action.

All right.

Kim Clucas, Salina. Question number one would be the fact that if they are not, they said 365 for example. If it takes 465, is there a penalty towards that contractor?

Yes.

Per day, or how does that work?

Yes, there's a daily damages that we would be able to collect.

Okay, and to remind you that you're spending our money. You're not spending. It's just being thrown at us. It's us taxpayers. The other thing, too, is there's a lot of contractors in Salina that sub out. You know, there might be construction number A, and they get into a bind, so they're going to call into another contractor to be able to cover the field. Is that acceptable when we have the bid out?

For a company to use subcontractors certainly is acceptable.

Okay. But I'm saying, oh, we're not going to make a deadline.

So our agreement will be with whoever the commission decides they want to go with. So if they decide deal enterprises, we will have an agreement that specifies all these things. Subcontractors can be approved. Generally speaking, they would have to let us know who they are, and we would just approve them. Okay. As time goes on. But yes, subcontractors are allowed. That's very common.

He said there's only 20 people that are working for him and maybe there'll be more. But with a big project like that, I don't see how he's going to get it done. We're going into fall. We're going into weather issues. You know, it's something for everybody to think about.

These aren't easy projects. I mean, water line replacement is a difficult project. And as you look down the list, he said substantial completion in 365 days. The top bidder said substantial completion in 420 days. So quite a bit more time for those other contractors and a lot more expense. So certainly, these projects are just not easy projects. I realize.

My ex-husband and I ran a business in Salina and we did work with contractors and we were a contractor. And so I know the ins and outs of a lot of things. I am not smart, construction smart, but I do know some things.

We've done 45 miles of water line replacement in the last 10 years. This isn't new to the city of Salina. It's not new to Martha and her staff. We have inspectors. We have people that will be on site to watch and make sure that the work is done well. If it's not done well, we'll have a contract with the contractor, and we will handle it as we see necessary.

Okay. Thank you.

Just a little point, I think Mr. Deal said he had hired an additional 20 people to help with bidding. He's got more than 20 people working for him. All right, bring this back to the commission for action.

I have one more question for Martha, maybe first. Or maybe Jacob, but on NOAC construction, And as far as that goes with deal, too, did they talk about or have you talked about a timeline for them to start construction? Because there's a big difference if they're going to start next week or next month or next year.

talked to Deal about when they would start and as quick as we can turn the contract around and the shop drawings can get approved and materials ordered, they're ready to start. We talked anywhere from one month to two months depending upon delivery of materials.

Wow. But you have not had that conversation with NOAC?

No, have not.

Okay.

I based it on their time and schedule that they put down. So we're going to get started pretty quick.

All right.

Any action from the commission to be taken?

Mr. Vice Mayor, I move this commission award the bid for project number 26017. Microphone.

Microphone. Can't hear.

Oh, my mistake. Thank you. Appreciate it. I move this commission award the bid for project number 26017, the 2026 water main replacement to Deal Enterprises Incorporated in the amount of $2,059,778 with a 5% construction contingency or total project authorization not to exceed $2,162,767 and authorize the city manager to execute a contract with Deal Enterprises Incorporated upon fulfillment of all prerequisites. upon the bid documents.

Is there a second? I will take the unusual action of second. It's been moved and seconded to approve the bid for project 26017 with the amounts as read. All in favor say aye. Aye. Any opposed? Nay. Okay, the motion passes two to one. I'm going to ask Mayor Hoppeck to come back.

Okay, you are ready for item 5.4.

Item 5.4, consider approval of the third supplemental agreement to the downtown master development agreement to allow for funding of a theater Salina expansion project.

This will be me.

Mayor and commissioners, I'm actually going to do item 5.4 and 5.5 together. Really, we need 5.4 to go first, but 5.5 is the reason that we need to approve 5.4. So there's been a longstanding... relationship with Salina 2020, which is the master development for the downtown project. We have a very complex relationship in terms of an agreement that outlines how star bond funds are used, how tax increment financing funds in the downtown are used, how the CID is used, and a couple of other different incentives. And so Part of the normal course for approving a project, Salina 2020 will present a project to the city and the city will do a transfer agreement that will allow basically for us to incentivize a project over time. This is a little bit different than that. There are different funds set up in the Tax Increment Financing Fund that are set for specific reasons. One of those is the new business development and actually right now all of the funds that are being generated in the TIF are going into the new business development fund. But what we have before you today is a request for a transfer re-agreement for Theatre Salina. That's not a new business and it doesn't exactly meet up with the requirements or the intent of the new business TIF fund. So in order to do a transferee agreement to allow funding of the theater project, which is a theater expansion, and I'll have you throw up the slides. It's a theater expansion that will go on the east side, or the west side of the building, sorry. That project, they've requested these funds. They're in a campaign to do the fund, and you can see the expansion here just to the west of the building. And we took action several years ago to give them a portion of Founders Park so that they could do this expansion. As they've done their campaign for financing, they've asked Salina 2020 if there would be a possibility they could get some of those TIF funds to support that project. So there are two things that are different about this than the regular transfer agreement process that we use. First is that it's not a new business, and second is they're requesting those funds to be paid up front. Generally speaking, all the TIF, new business TIF financing has been done over time, so they receive a payment over a period of years as those monies come in. We do have a balance in the TIF fund, so it allows us to pay this out up front. There's a little bit of precedent in spending up front dollars as the funds have gone up. The shelter across the street at Ash and Santa Fe was used or was funded by TIF funds. So in order to do the transferee agreement, we also need to do an amendment to the master development agreement that would allow us to use those TIF funds to be spent on on the theater project and to be paid up front. So I know that's probably kind of a lot. If there's any questions that you have, there are representatives of Salina 2020 and the community theater Salina are here to answer any questions about the project. And I'd be happy to answer any questions about this. I do want to say the TIF funds have to be spent in the downtown. So we can't spend those monies anywhere else. They have to be spent in the district. There are certain qualifiers. There are things that they can be spent on. Theater certainly would meet all the qualifications of those expenditures. The request here is for $410,000 out of the TIF incentive fund. And with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions.

And I don't know whether you want to address that or someone from 2020, but if they could talk a little bit for the public as far as how that's collected, what that amount is, how long we're collecting the TIF funds. Yeah, sure.

So as we did the Starbond project in 2016-2017 timeframe, one of the other incentives that we put together, there are actually several incentive packages that happened as part of that. There's a CID in the downtown, which is an additional sales tax, and then there's the tax increment financing. And basically what that does is is it captures any increase in the property values in the downtown. So if you have a building, let's say a building that's $100,000 in value today and they do an upgrade and it becomes worth $200,000, any additional property taxes collected that's above and beyond the original $100,000 bill would go into this fund and then that fund, it can be used for additional projects that happen in the downtown. So it's kind of seed money. You put money in, and as the property tax grows, you're able to spend that off and support additional projects. How long does that run? It runs until 2037, I believe.

I couldn't remember.

Okay. And it's more a technical question. Does item 5.4 merely serve as an amendment to the transferee agreement? To allow Theater Salina to be included, or does it actually allocate the funds, which is what I thought- It doesn't necessarily allocate the funds.

5.4 is the transferee agreement that allocates the funds. 5.5 allocates the funds. 5.4 amends the master development agreement. It says that we'll take money out of that new business tax fund and we'll spend it at Theater Salina.

And that was my understanding on the blue sheet under fiscal note. It states that approval of this would allocate and kind of implies.

It would move it into the fund. I mean, these work together. So the mechanism by which the money goes from the TIF fund to that specific recipient. Okay, thank you. So if you approve 5.4 and then you don't approve 5.5, that money would be moved over into a fund and it would just not be able to be used. We'd have to come back and reamend the agreement if we were going to do it differently in the future.

Okay. Good question, Jacob. The community theater is not part of the city, correct?

It is not, but we do have a long standing relationship with the theater. We do support some operational maintenance at their facility. We've had facility maintenance at their facility. We pay their utility bills, some of those sorts of things. I know that was all part of an agreement that preceded you. That agreement is a 50-year long agreement. I believe it was in the 90s at some point that it was approved.

Yeah, and I know you and I have talked about that before. A 50-year agreement is seemingly crazy. Do you have any idea what the annual costs for the city are of supplying the janitorial? And I'm guessing lawn is probably included.

Yeah, I don't have that off the top. I can provide that. We do have that all broken down. I haven't looked at it. in a while. But generally speaking, $40,000 or $50,000 a year. And then depending on if there's a project that needs to be done. So a few years ago, we upgraded the HVAC system in the facility. Those capital costs are to be paid by the city. Now this addition, the additional part as part of the agreement to transfer property, we did require that the theater would be responsible for any kind of maintenance on the new part of the facility. So if there's new HVAC system that would go on that part of the facility, they would be responsible for that. And then we also asked them to put some money aside just for maintenance in a kind of a sinking fund so that there will be funds set aside from the theater's budget that we can dip into for larger maintenance items. I'm going to back up just for a moment.

On the community theater, if we were to If we were to provide this money, because I think we keep pushing the boundaries of what government is supposed to do. This is money that could be coming in and helping pay property taxes in our community. And I know that agreement you said goes to 37. But could you put a caveat on that? That from this point forward, they'll take care of their own janitorial, their own lawn, their own snow plowing, and take that off your plate or the taxpayer's plate.

Yeah, I'm not sure that we could do that as part of this agreement. This is really separate funds that really deal. I mean, the City Commission does have the final say in where these TIF funds have to go. We have a longstanding relationship with Salina 2020, where they come to us with a project. We kind of vet it together. And if it's something that we feel like is a good thing for the community, then we've approved those. And that is kind of in the same vein here. Their intent is to try to drive people downtown, Theater Salina, has a pretty big poll. Anytime they have a show, they're filling up the restaurants, filling up hotels, doing that sort of thing. And they expect that this addition onto the theater would only solidify that, help to expand that. If the city commission wanted us to negotiate a new deal with the theater, we could certainly have discussions about that, but in the original agreement, there's not a whole lot of outs for us. So I'm not sure that we have much ability to negotiate that, if that makes sense.

I'd like to think that you have 410,000 ways to perhaps do it.

Any other questions? Would anybody from the theater or 2020 like to address the commission?

Guy Walker, Salina 2020, Blue Beacon and 1858 Properties and Lighthouse Properties. I just wanted to take a few minutes to share Salina 2020's perspective on some of these projects. Jacob explained this one I think really well, but just kind of wanted to talk for a second about why we continue to support these kinds of things. So depending on Jacob mentioned 2037 roughly for when the TIF expires They all kind of had a different starting date I mean they were within a couple of years of each other but somewhere between 2037 and 2039 these these incentive districts will expire and You know, I guess the way we look at it is that we really, our goal obviously with the downtown project was for it to be successful for long beyond those 20 years. And we really feel like it's important to keep investing in projects, like Jacob mentioned, that bring visitors to downtown. So that's kind of the general, you know, just sort of our general way of looking at things. And I would say that although the downtown project has certainly seen some success, I wouldn't want to act like it hasn't. It's been successful. But I guess the way that Salina 2020 looks at it again is, and I think the city as well, is that don't yet know that it's over the hump of being successful forever. And that's obviously the ultimate goal. When these incentive districts expire, if all that incremental revenue is still there, and maybe then some, all that tax revenue starts flowing to those different taxing jurisdictions. So again, I think it's important that we look at this from a long-term perspective. And again, while it has been successful, we really want to ensure that it continues to remain that way. And so that's our big reason for wanting to continue to invest in things like this. I also think it's not uncommon for big projects like this to take a long time to feel like you have seen that certainty of success. When you look at downtown Kansas City, I believe that the Sprint Center opened in 2006. So that's 20 years ago. And downtown Kansas City, I think, is finally probably over that hump. But it took a long time. And it took a lot of private development, also public investment to get there. I think downtown Wichita is also a good example of that. They're still investing in downtown Wichita, I think, for the same reason, to really ensure the long-term success of their city. I would say also just when it comes to Theater Salina, I think Jacob said it well. I mean, the way we view it is it brings a lot of people downtown. You know, when you go downtown on the night of a Theater Salina show, the restaurants are full. There's people walking around. It's the same thing when there's a show at the Seafull. It makes a huge difference for all those businesses downtown. The other thing I would remind everybody or kind of think when we think about it is, I know there's some kind of perception that there's some chains downtown and there are. I mean, a few of the restaurants are maybe a little slightly larger company, but they're very regional. They have maybe three restaurants, 10 restaurants, not 150. And then when you look at the entirety of downtown, 99% of the businesses down there are locally owned. So when we're supporting downtown, we're supporting our fellow citizens. So I would want us to also look at it from that perspective. Again, just really feel like it's an important project for Theatre Salina to expand. It's gonna continue to increase its use for the community, bringing more people downtown. And then I just want to address really quickly to the upfront request. In some ways, like Jacob said, there's some precedent for that, but also one thing I would remind you, if we don't pay it out over time, we do save the interest costs, like the fund itself saves the interest costs, because typically when those get paid out over time, there's a 5% interest added. So if it gets paid up front, the fund does save that over the long term, again, hopefully providing more money for future projects. So happy to answer any questions if you have any, but just wanted to again share kind of Salina 2020's perspective.

Thank you.

Thank you.

If you'll wait just a second, we have somebody from the community theater to speak and then we'll open it up to the public.

Michael Spicer, Salina, Kansas. I am beginning my 29th year as executive director of Theater Salina. Theater Salina was created in 1960 and was a movable feast until our first home was created in 1972 at 303 East Iron Avenue. In 1992, the Lester Cave veneer wing added tremendous capacity with a scenery construction shop, rehearsal classroom, a small costume shop, and offices. In 2001, we redesigned the light and sound system and added an orchestra lift to the four stage. 2011 brought the theater education wing, which includes a large lobby, the Sunflower Financial Theater, two dance studio classroom areas, a large costume shop and storage area, and staff areas. This project will encompass a technical storage building. After examining a lot of options for storage the most elegant solution for us was to create a storage and technical expansion that connected to the existing facility. We will expand stage right that will allow us additional space for set storage and set movement. At Theatre Salina we have a long standing commitment to increasing technical capacity as resources allow. We have recently converted all of our production lighting to LED. We also We have also added the recent innovation of a scenic design by installing an LED array for projected scenery and animation. This technology is the current industry standard at the highest levels of professional theater. We also felt that this was an opportunity to best answer and to respond to the need for additional educational space that are included in the packet of information that you have before you. The education component will have two new dance classrooms, both with natural light and sprung floors, a vocal performance studio to meet increased student demand in that area, a lobby for families to relax, and a study area for students. This funding is an investment that benefits the community in many ways. The most obvious is the positive effect on the cultural tapestry of Salina. Our Center for Theater Arts has averaged 350 student registrations each year since COVID. We bus in more than 5,200 students at our cost in the fall and the spring to see our CTA productions. Our mandate in education is no child is ever turned away because of an inability to pay. This is an investment in our local economy as well. Theatre Salina has infused more than $9 million in direct spending into the local economy over the last decade. We have also harvested more than $335,000 in Starbond sales tax revenue in that same period. Additionally, our patrons dine, shop, visit other attractions, and stay overnight, adding additional economic impact. Peter Salina is also a destination point in tourism. 35% of our audiences come from outside of Saline County. We have patrons in more than 145 different communities in Kansas and in 28 other states. More than 425 volunteers donate more than 65,000 hours a year to help us bring to life 14 originally created live theater performances each year. Theater Saline is the only provider of this quality of theater and education between Topeka and Denver, from Wichita to Omaha. I stand for any questions for you.

Any questions for Mr. Spicer? Thank you. Thank you. Open it up to the public.

My name is Shirley Ruffus, and I know we need a theater. But downtown, where you're wanting to put it, is a very bad place. There's no parking.

I think you're talking about something different. This is Theater Salina that's already there on Iron Street. You're talking about a new- The new theater. Yeah, that's not what we're talking about here.

That isn't what the man was talking about, about putting where the bowling alley is?

No, no.

Okay, sorry.

Okay, thank you.

Hello. My name is Linda Salem. I'm a Saline County resident but certainly lived in Salina for three decades. I didn't grow up exposed to live theater and I was not part of the world even as an audience member until I moved here. I still remember vividly my first performance I saw here at the community theater. It was Godspell. That's when I understood how a live performance in an intimate venue could really touch a person. I had no idea then how many hours I would spend at that theater. Somehow from two CPA parents came two creative boys. Some people, some young people find a home in sports. My two boys found a home at the Computing Theater from grade school all the way till two years after graduation of high school. Experience as a young person really matters. My Scott and Nick learned to interact with people of all ages as they rehearsed and performed. Very few experiences let all the ages interact. They learned from older actors. They grew into role models for younger actors, and communication across generations is really a valuable skill. So it's taking direction from many different people from show to show. Taught them how to work with a lot of different personalities. My oldest, Scott, attained a degree in musical theater and a minor in marketing in college. He is a web designer by day in Lenexa, Kansas, an unusual IT person because he can talk to people and make them understand. By night and weekends, he is immersed in the community theater world in Kansas, the broader Kansas City area. musicals, directs music, and hoping to actually direct shows. I say that because that means as a parent I have been in so many community theaters in the Kansas City area. What we have here is special. It's very rare there. Even though they have a broad range of talents, the talent here is amazing. What we have here is a treasure. But you may not know that unless you've been to as many community theaters as I have. My youngest Nick graduated from Tisch School of the Arts at NYU. He acts, produces, and directs plays with a theater company in New York. To be admitted to NYU Tisch took some great auditions, and they were made possible by the high level of training here in Salina. Both boys knew immediately when they went to college that they were more prepared, more professional in their expectations, and had a stronger theater background than the other students. This came from the amazing program here in Salina. My sons have been out of Salina for a lot of years, but I'm still a strong supporter of the theater and I've seen the quality of performances continue to grow every year. Many young people have had the same experience as my son and they remain in Salina. Theater Salina is great at growing its future talent by starting out with the young ones. The skills they learn and the vibrancy they bring to this community as they mature are remarkable. I encourage this commission and Salina to continue to invest in Theatre of Salina. The quality of the performances is something this community is rightly proud of. The hundreds of young people who have their lives enriched by this program every year is impactful and the skills they learn invaluable. Just as sports provides so many young people with life skills, so does this high caliber theater program. Thank you.

Thank you.

Hello, Roger Morrison, Salina. Congratulations to the people that started these star bonds and all the wonderful things that it have. And it should be noted that Salina is paying off early. There are some Starbond projects that are in the tank, and as has been mentioned, it's a wonderful thing for Salina. Part, and I would say I am a theater geek. I was in the plays and the chorus 60 years ago at Salina High. That auditorium is still standing. I was there not too long ago for a concert when Cissy and I were married in 1965. We got our... season tickets to the theater. We've been doing it, supporting it ever since. We were the co-chairs for the fundraising in the 2011 project, and that was an example of if you build it, they will come, or success breeds success. I want to speak specifically about the training that the young people have and in some places the adults have. But as was mentioned, not everybody is an athlete. However, the training and the life experience they get in live performance does a lot of the same thing. You're on a team. You work for a goal. You start with a cast. You work. The curtain goes up and you've accomplished a goal. You meet new friends. You learn time management. You work with adults who are instructors. But in some cases, you're on stage with the main stage. There's self-reliance because... as opposed to a sport team, there's no substitute for you. And that's kind of a good thing for the parents, grandparents, and neighbors. When you're in the cast, you're there, but you're not sitting out on the bench with the dust and the heat, hoping that your Johnny or Susie will get in the game at the last minute. But those kids move up to the high schools and then on to K-Dub. They all have strong programs. I'd like to mention again the 5,200 students that get to see live performance. Cissy and I are a major funder of that process because we believe it's good for kids to see their performance. their contemporaries doing something positive and off a screen. Lastly, the program is a good recruitment and a retainment thing for our community. People who live here and come here want something healthy and diverse for their children and it's right there on Iron Avenue. Thank you. Thank you.

My name is James Duane Vint, Jr., and I live at 1115 Andrews, Salina, Kansas. And so I'm all in favor of the money being spent to help out the community theater. My claim to fame is I don't have a television, I don't have a computer, and I don't have a smartphone. So I thrive on live performances. And it's my understanding that one of the challenges that's faced by young people is having authentic experiences. And so I see the live performances as being absolutely authentic and well, well worth the money.

Thank you. Is there anyone else?

I have one follow up comment. And you might have, Jacob, you might have hit on this earlier, but just wanted to verify this has no impact on the city's budget. No, it does not.

Okay. And I do believe that Theater Salina, when we look at economic development, I've said this numerous times, we have to look at what may make a family want to live here, whether it's athletic facilities, whether it's good schools, Salina Arts Center, the Theater Salina might be the thing that gets us to keep some individuals moving to and staying in our community. Okay, with that, I will- It's a question, two questions. Your name, please, again.

Rebecca Racy. Is the 400, I don't know exactly what the amount was, is that the cost for the total project?

No, I think it said that was, was it 8%?

I can't remember. Yeah, the total project is 4.7 million. I see.

And so if you pass 4.5, the other one, does that mean that anyone who is receiving funds in that way in the future could also be given the money up front?

No, it does not.

It specifies it's strictly for this project.

There would have to be another amendment to the master development agreement for upfront payments.

Okay. And I love the theater, but what if they can't come up with the rest of the money?

It would be reimbursable, so we won't make that payment until they start the project.

And I believe, and I'm going to look over here, I believe it's not paid until the project's complete. Is that correct?

what it says.

If we get this investment, I received a call today, and our total need is $4,733,320 will be within $20,000 of that total. I received a phone call this afternoon from someone committing to another donation, so with this $410,000, will be within less than 1% of that total, and we will go to bid in September and begin construction in October. It's anticipated to be a 10-month build.

Okay. Thank you.

Just thought I would clarify, Guy Walker, again. To your point, I think that that's a really good point and something I didn't think to mention. These investments aren't made until the end. So that is one really great thing is that the city's not at risk. So it's a reimbursement. So they have to figure out a way to pay for all of this, and then the city reimburses when it's over. And that's the way all of the projects have been, which, again, lowers the risk almost completely for the city. One other thing I really failed to mention is because there's so much talk about the fiscal impact that the city sometimes faces. And so one point I regret that I didn't share is that when you think about all the people that come to downtown Salina, I mean, I have a tendency to focus only on that. the out-of-county plates that are coming to Salina, they're not confining their spending just to downtown. So if they're spending money in other parts of our community, that tax revenue is continuing to go to the city. So I just wanted to make sure I brought that up because I think it's an important part of Salina's fiscal success is our pull factor and the fact that many people are coming into our community to spend their hard-earned dollars. So thank you.

Thank you.

Susan Cooper-Selina, I just have one question and that's about parking because that is a huge issue for downtown and I'm assuming that this expansion is going to take into the area that they're now using for parking. No, it's not.

It won't take any other parking spots. So it's to the east of the building between the building and the river. West. West. I don't know why I keep saying east. I don't know the difference. It's to the west of the building. Sorry about that.

Okay.

Anyone else? Okay. I will bring it back to the Commission for Action.

I move to approve the proposed supplemental agreement with Salina 2020 and authorize the mayor to sign the agreement.

Second that.

We have a motion and a second to approve the proposed supplemental agreement with Salina 2020, authorizing the mayor to sign the agreement. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That item passes 4-0. That will bring us to item 5.5.

So item 5.5 is to consider authorizing the city manager to execute the transferee agreement with Theater Salina for that expansion at 303 East Iron Avenue.

I think we've covered them both together, so I guess I'm bringing it back to the commission for action.

I move to authorize the city manager to execute the attached transferee agreement with Theater Salina as has been proposed.

Second that. We have a motion and a second authorizing the city manager to execute the attached transfer agreement with Theater Salina as proposed. All those in favor? Aye. Opposed? That item passes 4-0. That will bring us to item 5.6.

Item 5.6, consider approval of ordinance number 26-11299, amending and restating chapter 19 of the City of Salina Code pertaining to the Salina Public Library.

Okay, Mr. Hoffman.

Commissioners, the Salina Public Library is largely an independent body, however, It has a relationship with the city in terms of appointments and also the rules and regulations and bylaws for the city library board live within our code. The library board has been on a project for quite a while to update and renovate the ordinances as it applies to the library. This was drafted in conjunction with them. It's basically a thorough restatement of Chapter 19. It really eliminates a lot of unnecessary items and just kind of is the preferred language that the library board has asked to use. It's fairly just orderly in bookkeeping, I believe, but I can now try and answer any questions you have.

Yeah, it was fairly simple. I guess there wasn't a red line, so I'm not sure what was removed. If you have any brief comments about that?

You know, it was just we eliminated a lot of excess things, modernized a lot of the language. I honestly couldn't tell you a lot. I worked with the board and let them, they guided the process and I very lightly tweaked their suggestions. They looked at it at their board meeting last week to make sure we had it all looking the way they wanted it to. Obviously, there's no fiscal impact to the city. We just have that relationship where for them to make a change, they can't do it by themselves. They have to come back to this body to get the approval.

Does anyone from the library or the library board want to say anything?

The intention was just to simply update- Could you give us your name and title, please?

Sorry. Oh, sorry.

Melanie Hedgepath, Slanning Public Library Director. The intention was just to simply update the ordinance. It was written in the 60s. It's now updated for current library operations and current statutory requirements. Nothing other than that and simplifying.

Okay, any questions for? Okay, thank you. Any comments from the public? Okay, if not, I'll bring it back to the commission for action.

Move to adopt ordinance 26-11299, updating chapter 19 relating to the Salina Public Library. Second.

We have a motion, a second, to adopt ordinance number 26-11299, updating chapter 19 as relating to the Salina Public Library. May we have a roll call, please?

Commissioner Davis?

Aye.

Commissioner Linkowitz?

Aye.

Commissioner Remp?

Aye.

Mayor Hoppeck?

Aye. That item passes 4-0. That will bring us to item 5.7.

Item 5.7 is to consider nominating and appointing a member to fill a vacancy in the city commission.

Mr. Hoffman, I'll turn it over to you.

Yeah, commissioners, you're aware we've had a vacancy on the city commission since July 24th. Previously, the city commission requested expressions of interest from people who may wish to be that person. The commissioners have received that, and I believe you received that two weeks ago, and so you've had an opportunity to look over those expressions of interest. I have written up the packet, the agenda item, because our city code says that we should do this by the Roberts Rules of Order process. I want to make a point that in the past, the city has sometimes used the Roberts Rules of Order, but sometimes the commissioners have chosen to do a motion, second, and vote process. I will tell you that either are equally valid. We just need to have three commissioners that vote on the same person. But the default process is the Roberts Rules of Order procedure, which I can explain in a moment, unless there's a desire by the commission to just do a motion second vote. I just wanted to give you that opportunity to discuss it before I went forward.

Why don't you discuss the Robert rule of order and then we can- Robert, thank you.

Robert's rules of order, we will turn the meeting over to the clerk, similar to the way we do our organizational meeting. She will do a call for nominations. Any commissioner may not make a nomination, it does not require a second. When the nominations have ceased, whether that's one nominee or four, the clerk will then do a roll call vote of each nominee in the order that they've been nominated. Once we get a nominee that receives three yay votes, the nomination process will cease and that person will be the nominee. We will then begin next meeting with a resolution that affirms that that person is on the board officially. Are there any questions about that process or comments?

I would just assume the city clerk run the meeting. That frees the mayor up to participate freely.

Okay. And I think we'll do it by the Robert rule. So I will turn it over to the city clerk.

All right. And the floor then is now open to the remaining commissioners for the nomination of eligible persons to serve the unexpired term. We'll just go in our normal roll call order here. So Commissioner Davis, who is your nominee?

I nominate Dr. Gary Norris.

All right. Commissioner Lankowitz.

I nominate Haley Ellsner.

All right, Commissioner Remp.

I'm going to nominate Brian Weisel.

And Mayor Hoppeck.

Well, my people have been taken, so I'm not going to make a nomination.

All right, that makes it easy. So we have three nominees up for vote. I will start with the first one nominated and go by a roll call vote as far as who would like to vote aye or nay. So starting with Gary Norris.

That's a good question. I think I answered it. Because each nominee with each vote, it's resetting the table in brand new.

Correct. The clerk will now do a roll call vote for the first nominee. Once the nominee receives three votes, the process is over. If a nominee fails to get three votes, we go to the next nominee. If we go through the whole round and no one receives three votes, we will start over or you can defer to a future meeting. Okay.

All right. So, again, our first nominee up is Gary Norris. Commissioner Davis?

Aye.

Aye. Okay. Commissioner Lankowitz?

Aye.

Commissioner Rimp?

Nay.

Okay. Mayor Hoppeck?

Aye.

Well, I suppose then that ends the voting process, and Gary Norris has been elected to serve that unexpired term. We will prepare the resolution appointing Gary Norris to serve that unexpired term, and we will adopt that at the next city commission meeting on September 14th, 2026. And I will turn the meeting back over to Mayor Hoppe.

Okay, thank you. That will bring us to development business item 6.1.

Item 6.1 is to consider approval of ordinance number 26-11297 rezoning a 3.96 acre tract of land located north of I-70 on the south side of West Diamond Drive from C7 Highway Commercial to C5 Service Commercial.

Mr. Herbs. Thank you, Mayor and Commissioners. We have a presentation here for you tonight that we'll jump into as soon as we get it on the screen. All right, so this particular application has been filed and brought forward by Salina Investment LLC, and they're requesting that a property that's approximately four acres, you can go to the next slide, approximately four acres be rezoned from C7, which is our highway commercial zoning district, to C5, which is our service commercial district. Next slide, please. let's do it

See if the slides will advance now.

We'll do it this way. All right, here we go. So looking at the surrounding area, you have the map on the right. Go to the next slide, please. We'll start with the surrounding area. So the map on the right shows the current zoning. This was accurate up to two weeks ago. However, in... At the August 10th City Commission meeting, the Commission approved the rezoning for the property directly to the west for the Bobcat Salina. That property was rezoned from C7 to C5, and this particular property, which is directly to the east of Bobcat Salina, is requesting something similar. So this site is a location of what you might know as the Motel 6. And they're looking at potentially redeveloping the site for an apartment complex in the future for up to 66 apartments. Next slide, please. So some background. And this property was originally platted in 1974 and in 2008 a benefit district was created to improve Diamond Drive up to city standards as well as install public utilities. There is an eight inch water line and an eight inch sanitary sewer line that was constructed as part of that benefit district. Next slide please. Again, the purpose of this rezoning is potentially convert the existing Motel 6 building into a residential apartment complex with 48 total studio units and then 18 one-bedroom for a total of 66. The C7 district prohibits multifamily type of development. However, the C5 district does allow it through a conditional use permit process. And so the end goal for the applicant is to eventually submit a conditional use permit application before the planning commission for them to review converting the motel into an apartment complex. Next slide. And looking at the zoning ordinance regulations from a regulatory standpoint, it's important to clarify that motels and hotels are permitted in both the existing C7 district as well as the proposed C5 district. So the existing use remains compliant if the MAP amendment is approved. If they do proceed with the apartment conversion via conditional use permit, the zoning code requirements would have to meet the R3 lot zone minimums which the existing site exceeds. Next slide, please. Looking at the sustainability of the site and evaluating the suitability of the property, it is viable under this current C7 zoning as it is an active motel that is in current operation. However, granting the C-5 designation extends the service commercial pattern that has been established to the west. So all the properties to the west of this property on the south side of Diamond Drive are all Additionally, while the southern edge of the lot touches the AE flood zone, the existing structures all sit outside of the flood zone, and any future development would be subject to the floodplain regulations. And so that's what the right graphic on that slide is depicting there. Looking at the character of the surrounding neighborhood, West Diamond Drive corridor is primarily light industrial along its north frontage. And then on the south frontage, we have a mix of commercial properties, primarily hotels and restaurants with a few dealerships as well on the south side. So this particular rezoning would be in line with the existing character. Looking at the public utilities, as I mentioned in 2008, there was a benefit district that was created, and in that benefit district, an 8-inch water line and 8-inch sanitary sewer line were constructed along with Diamond Drive. Next one, please. So there's the map that shows that the green line to the north in Diamond Drive is the sanitary sewer. The blue line is the is the water. Next slide, please. So street and traffic, traffic flow and street capacity shouldn't see adverse impacts from the zoning change itself. C5 uses generally generate comparable or lower traffic than C7 highway commercial uses do. The applicant notes that the apartment complex of this size functions in a similar way with a similar traffic scale as the existing motel would. And again, a deeper dive into the traffic would occur if a conditioning instrument application is submitted. Conformance of the comprehensive plan. The comprehensive plan shows the entire south side of Diamond Drive as being part of the commercial land use category, which both the C7 and C5 districts fit within. And the location of the site meets the comprehensive plan's locational criteria for commercial development including c5 next slide please so the City Commission has a few alternatives here You may approve the ordinance as drafted. Option one, option two is return the item to the Planning Commission with comments. Number three would be postpone the decision if additional information is required. Or you may overturn the recommendation and deny the ordinance provided alternative findings are adopted. Next slide, please. The Planning Commission held a public hearing on August 4th and voted unanimous 8-0 to recommend approval of the rezoning to C5. Staff has received no opposition from adjacent property owners, and the Planning Commission found that the site is compatible with the neighborhood and adequately supported by existing infrastructure. The full list of findings that the Planning Commission made are on page three of the staff report if you want to review them. Next slide. And so for our recommendation, if the City Commission agrees with the Planning Commission and staff analysis, the recommended motion is to adopt ordinance number 26-11297, effectively rezoning the property to C5 Service Commercial District. That will take any questions you might have.

I'm sorry. It doesn't matter. Questions for? I do not.

If this question's inappropriate for this action, let me know. But just a pure curiosity, do you have an idea of the target audience for this?

for the proposed apartment. Yeah, we haven't gotten into any of the details with that. That particular element of land use decision would be taking place at the Planning Commission after an application is submitted. I mean, we have met with them in a development meeting in which they indicated what their intention was. So we know what their intention is. We know that their intention is to rezone this property so they could submit a conditional use permit application for an apartment complex. But we have not got into any detailed discussions of what that might look like yet. So what that, how that looks and how that works is if you were to approve the proposed ordinance and the new ordinance gets, once it's published, the rezoning changes to C5, that then makes the property eligible for a potential condition use permit that they could submit along with, you know, plan drawings and a plan of how they would convert the property to an apartment complex if they still want to go that direction.

Yeah, that was the point I was going to make from reading the Planning Commission that this is just rezoning. Conditional use is going to be a whole other discussion and approval by the Commission.

Yes, that would be a second action.

And the conditional use also go through the Planning Commission again?

So the condition that you submit would require public hearing with the planning commission. Okay. And then whatever action they take would have a 14 day protest period. If there's no protest, then whatever action they take after that 14 day protest period ends, then becomes effective. If there is a protest, then it would come before you as the governing body. Right, okay.

Okay, thank you. Okay, any comments from the public? Okay, if not, I will bring it back to the commission for action.

I'll go ahead and make a motion. I trust the Planning Commission, so ordinance number 26-11297, rezoning the subject property from C7, Highway Commercial, the C5, Service Commercial District. I make the motion that it should be approved.

I'll second that.

We have a motion, a second, approving ordinance number 26-11297, rezoning the subject property from C7 Highway Commercial to C5 Service Commercial. May we have a roll call, please?

Commissioner Davis?

Aye.

Commissioner Lankowitz?

Aye.

Commissioner Rem?

Aye.

Mayor Hoppeck?

Aye. That item passes 4-0. Okay, I just lost my agenda. There we go. Okay, that will bring us to other businesses. Is there an item a commissioner would like to bring before the group? I would, but I'd prefer to go last.

Okay. I don't have anything today.

I have a couple things one of the things we've been discussing with city staff is to try to come up with some better communication we're trying to do questions and answers now but we're trying to find a way to get information out to people a little more precisely and in a timely manner. And a couple of things that I've heard here lately that I'd like to address is there was a, I know there's been some comment about the log jam and how that was handled and being a change order. And for some of you that maybe weren't here when that was all going on. And Martha, if she's still here, may have to help me if I get my numbers wrong. But originally, we had a bid based on 300 and some feet of logs. There were two more events that took that log jam out to 900 and some feet, almost 1,000. So we had already contracted to have the first 300 done, so it made sense to work with the people that had already started to do the rest. So that's how we got to the million dollars. It wasn't really a change, or it was actually two more events that happened that led us to that larger dollar amount. I don't think anybody would do three times the work for the same pay, and that's kind of what we had to do. I know it took a little longer but at one point they had to remove all their equipment because of one again one of the flood events was Had raised the river so much that their equipment had to be be moved The as far as the the bank that we discussed Riverbank last week that damage was done from the logs being jammed in the water going around it had nothing to do with the equipment that was used to remove the logs So I wanted to get that out there. Also, we'll get some information out there. I know there's been some concern about the debris that was removed from the hotel site on Crawford. I know that the contractor contacted KDHE and was given permission to take anything that wasn't above ground to a facility to be crushed so and there's a letter in the file from KDHE approving that. Also I know there was some concern about Loads not being tarped and about the fees that were being charged. The actual language does not say tarped, it says secured. And the contractor worked with the landfill, not with the city manager's office, with them. And what they did is they were given permission to put concrete on top of the loads when they went out to the landfill so as not to have any debris falling out. And they considered that to be secured. So that's how that came about. And that was approved by the individuals out at the landfill from working with the contractor. So I just wanted to kind of get those two things out there. The final thing I have is we did receive the shelter evaluation from National Center for Animal Shelter Evaluation, the company that we paid the $30,000 to. To say the least, the evaluation was very disappointing. If we were to continue to operate the shelter under the city, there's obviously going to be a complete overhaul of many, many things. We currently have an RFP out. That's due on September 10th. We'll see if we get some interest in coming in from a third party and I know at this time we've kind of made some changes over there. We've sent some additional staff over to help clean And I don't know if there's any other comments that anybody would like to make.

Yeah, there certainly were some kind of immediate concerns, chemical storage, that sort of thing, that were raised. And we have addressed all of the things that are immediate needs. We're in the process of kind of decluttering. We've thrown away a lot of stuff. And we're trying to get the facility cleaned and ready to go so that when we do have a private management company that we can- We can turn over a clean facility to them. So at this point, we're still minimally staffed. We're not taking in intakes. I mean, they're emergency-only intakes. So we are kind of a limited capacity operation.

What's our status as far as veterinary coverage?

So at this point, our staff vet did resign effective last week. So all of our animals are being cared with community vets. So we've transferred their care plans to new vets. Looking for somebody to maybe temporarily take on the role of our in-house vet. until we can get a private management company. But at this point, we have not been successful. But we're still working on that. So at this point, we do have local vets that aren't signed on as our vet, but they are caring for animals. We have no drugs, none of the controlled substance drugs on site that the DEA follows or anything. We won't be doing any spay and neuters. We won't have any surgeries on site until If we are able to find a vet, we may do that, but I'm anticipating we probably won't have any additional spay and neuters or any other kind of surgeries happening in our facility until such time as the private management company were to take over. And before you go, if you'll let me, I did kind of commit to providing a water update at these city commission meetings. So I just kind of wanted to tell you where we are at right now. A few weeks ago, there was a water test that was sent to K-State Labs and that made its way to the EPA. The EPA called KDHE and had KDHE come out and do some tests. They did four tests along Dover Drive. Those tests have come back. There were no bacteriological issues, so no E. coli, any bacteria in the water. The heavy metal test did not show any signs of elevated heavy metals. The tests that were conducted by KDHE at those four locations fell right in line with what has been provided in our consumer confidence report. So they're just... isn't any issues with the water that was tested. I want to speak a little bit about total dissolved solids. There's been lots of discussion about TDS in the community. People are buying meters from Amazon or wherever and testing their own water. TDS is not something that the city treats for. That is total dissolved solids are the the solids that are in the water so minerals that are in the water We don't treat for that that has a it's a direct result of our water Where we get our water from so Smoky Hill River and our wells. We're very dependent on surface water Even our well water is very close to the surface so that is the minerals and and different minerals that are dissolved in the water so The Environmental Protection Agency, EPA, does not, it's a national secondary standard for drinking water, so they don't actually, they make a recommendation that you stay below 500, but they don't, it's not enforceable. And they say that on their website that the contaminant may cause cosmetic issues or aesthetics effects, but it's not a health and safety concern. So TDS is not a concern. The only issue would be if we had something in those dissolved solids that is a regulated item. So that would be nitrates or some other kind of substance that dissolves in the water that is regulated. So at this point, we do not treat for TDS. It's been the same water source that we've had for years. forever, where we get that. So you may see that your level of TDS in a consumer confidence report, the levels range from 490 to 550. I did some searching on other communities across the state, and it varies wildly depending on where you're at. I saw one of the communities had a rating as high as 1700. So our rating is kind of in line with Wichita, a couple of other communities. It's not too far off There are some communities that have really low TDS. Emporia is an example of that. They have very low TDS. I don't know what the reason for that is. But at this point, we don't treat for that. We're not planning to treat for that. The only reason we would treat for it is if we had nitrates or something in those dissolved solids that caused a health risk. Most communities don't treat for TDS. The only way to get dissolved solids out of the water or the most common way, there may be more than one way, is reverse osmosis system. And those are very costly to manage and operate. There are a few cities that have those. Abilene has one, Hutchinson has one. They're very high maintenance, very high cost to operate. Cities that have or use the amount of water that we do just typically don't have that system because it's very, very costly to operate. So I just want to go on the record. The city's water, even if your TDS is high, it is not unsafe to drink. It's not unsafe to bathe in. There is just not an issue with safety with our water. If there was... KDHE and the EPA would be notifying us. We've never had boil orders in this community. The water quality, it is safe to drink. Now, we certainly do have issues in certain areas of the community where we have rust that is in the water, and that is from the old pipes. We did start the program, the rebate program. We've been doing testing. We've tested. We've got about 49 people that signed up. We've tested a good number of those. very many tests that are very high. We are looking at NTUs, the number of NTUs, most of the water that we've tested to date. Now this is just a snapshot. We do recognize that there are times when you may have more turbidity in your water, that there may be more rust, The tests that we've recently run, we really have, has been clear water. We haven't really had, I think there's been two locations where we've had some issues. Some of those had to do with one of the places that we tested had not had the water turned on in a couple of months. They're in the middle of a construction process. So there's lots of different things that affect that. The ones we've tested, we just really haven't seen a problem. Now, we are committed to going back to those houses. We've told them, hey, call us when there's an issue. We want to see it. We want to log those things. So I'm not saying that we don't have an issue. We do have some rust in our water at times. But there are also times where the water comes out clear and there are no issues with it. So that's kind of the update on the water system and where we're at with that.

Will that EPA test be posted and available? Yes, we will make it available. Okay. So everyone can see that. Thank you. Commissioner Davis.

Mine might take a few minutes if it's approved. But I'd like to move the city commission recess into an executive session for ten minutes. To discuss the subject of discussion of city purchasing policy with legal counsel based upon the need for consultation with an attorney for the public body, which would be deemed privileged in the attorney-client relationship pursuant to KSA 75-4319B2. I'd like to request five minutes before then just for a break. So return to this room at 6.08.

I'll second that.

Okay, I don't have that in front of me. We have a motion and a second to move into executive session. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed?

And who will be- It'll be- Justice. It'll be myself and City Attorney Patrick Hoffman. Okay, we'll be back at 6.08.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. . .

Okay, we are back in session and there's no action to be taken. So at this point, we will open it up to Citizens Forum, this opportunity to talk about an item that was, again, we've already had the meeting, but you have three minutes.

Please give us your name and- Sherry Spratland, Overdrive. Two weeks ago, Jacob, you were in this meeting. You told us in 45 days you'll see construction begin on your street. Today's 21 days. Don't think it's going to happen. So I brought a Bible with me today. Maybe we won't tell stories. Maybe the truth will come out. You say everybody's water passed. Mine didn't. This is the water Richard took out of my faucet. That's not drinkable. I marked a line in case you want to have a slug of it.

I'm tired of the lies.

I came in here with the purpose of this bottle of water that failed immensely. On the test that I have from Richard, it scored 84.4. So I'm deeply concerned about that.

And you think I'm going to stay with you. Was there clean water that went into your house? I mean, like, there is a distinction.

It came out of the faucet. He took this out of the faucet.

There is a distinction between, and I didn't say that all tests were clear, but we are looking at where clean water comes into the house. Stop the timer. He's talking. and in your bathtub it's dirty, that's an indication that it's not the city's water. So I don't know.

That came out of the closet?

No, it's absolutely not. It's absolutely not the same.

In the front of the sink. Did all the water from your house, did any of the water pass? No. Some of the water pass? No. So if I bring Richard back, if I talk to him tomorrow, he's going to tell me the same thing? Yes, he is. I'll talk to him tomorrow.

I have the results with Richard's signature. What more do you want? You want a drink? Have a drink.

Okay.

Can I go back to my?

Yes, please.

All right. I don't think I should keep jumping through hoops after hoops and having people come into my house and take samples when you can see what it is and I've already failed. You know? The second thing I brought with me today was a Bible, because I was hoping that the truth mattered, but evidently it doesn't. People in Salina deserve honesty with the city government. We deserve answers that are truthful with facts and records, not vague answers, not lies. I've heard a number of these issues including animal shelter issues in the management of the utilities department that have caused me to lose confidence in a question whether the public is even being told complete truths ever. I strongly disagree with the claim that everything is being handled well when the residents are still dealing with concerns about the water coming into our homes. And all of us have this. In fact, when we called on Friday because we had dirty water, Richard wasn't in the office, didn't have anybody to send out. Finally, some guy did come out two hours later after the water pretty much cleared up. Should have somebody available at all hours, even on weekends when it's brown. Should be up to our discretion when you come.

Wait, wait, so it did clear up. Stop the timer. Yeah, it did clear up though? It will clear up. Is your water clear?

Not today.

Okay, but it was on Friday.

No. Friday, they had somebody there to see the dirty water. So, today, Mr. Woods, I'm asking you directly, what are you doing for the people of Salina on our street? Anything?

I believe we just approved a plan to replace the water line on your street. Right.

But are they going to get that done in 21 days like you promised us from the last two meetings?

That is not what I said. I said we will approve the contract, and then I said we will, as soon as we can, get an agreement together, and they'll start 45 days after that. But certainly I didn't say that they would start 45 days from last week.

Well, maybe you better go back and watch your meeting. Did either one of you, were you going to taste that? Where'd the water go? But it's okay for me and the rest of our people on our street to have that water? Neither one of you can look at me anymore?

Nope. I think we all agree.

We failed the test just like the animal shelter failed theirs but he lied about that too so he's lying about my test. Thank you.

This is a good entrance for me.

Christy Dixon, a concerned Salinas citizen. It's story time, boys and girls. Because of this famous magical trait called a person, Pinocchio has become a common metaphor for someone who fabricates stories, stretches the truth, or is caught in an obvious deception. With that being said, in March, J. Wood Okio, publicly stated that the shelter had learned from its past mistakes and had taken steps to make sure they didn't happen again. So, Jay Widocchio, I have a very simple question. How do you reconcile those statements with the independent assessment that has been released? Because that assessment describes serious problems involving leadership, training, sanitation, disease control, policies, facilities, conditions, safety, animal welfare, and even more disturbing, it indicates the significant problems identified years ago remained unresolved. Cue the nose growing. That doesn't sound like problems that were fixed. Again, cue the nose growing. That doesn't sound like lessons that were learned. Again, cue the nose growing. And it certainly doesn't sound like the picture the public was given. Double cue the nose growing. Citizens repeatedly came before the commissioners, raising concerns. We asked questions, we brought facts, and instead of those concerns being treated with the urgency they deserve, we were told that Andy and Monique are good people, again. Cue the nose growing. Now, an independent professional assessment has validated many of those concerns regarding the citizens I brought up. So where is accountability, Jay Wood Okio? Leadership means more than standing, oops, I mean sitting in front of the public and lying about how things are improving. Leadership means knowing what is happening inside your organization. demanding accountability from the people underneath you and giving the commissioners and the public accurate information. Do you know that there is a pit bull currently at the shelter being housed in the bathroom? It lives in the bathroom. The animals housed in that shelter didn't come, aren't able to come to these meetings and tell you what was happening, so we do. And now the independent assessment has spoken as well. There is no longer what, there is no longer about, nobody around cares about who the clowns are or whose circus this is. It's about documented failures. Jay Wood Okio, the citizens of Salina deserve an explanation for the enormous difference between what you tell us and what is being reported through these reports. And most importantly, these animals deserve accountability, change the leadership and will never allow to happen this again. So at this point, I request you and Jeff Hammond resign immediately.

No. Diana Frobenius. I live on North 4th Street. Used to live on the east side. I am a thief because I stole a dog

that someone who had packed up in the middle of the night and fled left chained on a cement patio. The neighbors were nice enough to put water out and food out, but they rent, they weren't allowed animals. This, my vet said, was an Australian Kelpie. Fantastic dog and I couldn't take it anymore hearing him cry at night and bark. So I stole him and I took him to my vet. Got him shots, got him medicine for the skin that he'd been gnawing on. My son met me and we gave him a bath. I took him home And he was so glad to be inside. I forgot to get his nails trimmed at the vet. But he would jump. He would lick me all over everything. He was so thankful. And I'm 76. I'm an old woman. I have my own health issues. But I had to do it. I have suggestions for the shelter. They are so contagious in some of their diseases that it is only fair to whatever outer entity you hire or that comes to take over You can't have the existing employees washing with soap and water. It won't do it. You need a hazmat level cleaning of that whole facility and the outer yard. Yes? It's not fair to have a new person or a new entity come in and expect them to get everything up and running safely. In a short amount of time, if they come in, where they already have to hazmat the whole place anyway. And the employees and people that have gone in there, they need to have physicals paid by the city. Because the city is the one that let this get this far. Very respectfully, I request that. And I know I'm over. Do I get answers on any of my other questions that I had last time? You answered one, but it was very vague.

We'll have to look, and I don't remember what questions you had. We'll look at the...

I'll send you a list.

Okay, send me a list. Thank you.

I have more questions now.

Terry Walsh. This time I'll remember to say my name first. I'm sorry. The one thing that I was going to say when I was up here earlier was if we have more than one company that is willing to put in a bid, why don't we use more than one company to see if we can't double up and get done faster? You know what I mean? Because if you wait a year on one company... You're only getting that much done?

Yeah, I think we can. I think we have to get a project, the next project designed, and we're working on that now. And so I'm hopeful we'll be able to have something designed and out early in 2027.

So there'll be more than just one? I mean, that's just a good sense, I think. I think these gals took care of the animal filters.

Nikki, can you give them the files, please? Bonnie Newbrands, line of Kansas commissioners. I go over to the shelter probably since last October of 2025 to present date maybe 12, 15 times because I'm so concerned about what's going on over there. I went over there last Thursday and went to the laundry room and I was shocked after having two failed extremely volatile reports about what's going on at the shelter to find the laundry room with towels on the floor, towels hanging out of the washer and dryer, Dirt everywhere. And I've also heard that they didn't, I don't know if they do now, but they didn't have a hot water heater for a year and that they run consistently out of the detergent that disinfects this laundry. And I don't know where this laundry is coming from because they don't, to my knowledge, let the dogs even have blankets or towels or anything because they're scared to death. that the dogs might eat tells. I have a kind of a suggestion for them. They can put the lawn, oh, and machines were not running, neither the washer nor the dryer. Now, they can put the laundry in. They can walk a dog, kind of, you know, double up. Then they can come back, put the dog back, and my God, they can unload the wet laundry, put it in the dryer, Then they can get the dog, go back and walk the dog, come back, fold the laundry, just keep a beat going. They don't have a beat. Not a beat. And it just concerns me that even when Monique and Andy were there, I would check out the laundry room and go down that hall filthy, just like this. In fact, one time I went, the laundry was stacked up this high, and I just couldn't believe it that they weren't having someone consistently take care of it. Now, you say they're short of staff. I think it's short of management. Jeff doesn't want to go over there. I just think there's nothing for the interim. And I'm going to send out, and the only way I know how to say this, is a siren to save the 17 pit bulls that are there. They're one in the men's bathroom. He has a beautiful dog. I have a photo of him if you want to see him. But something's got to be done because of the diseases. Feline leukemia cat is right up front when people come in. So I guess my question would be to be answered next time. What is going to be the interim between now and you decide on whoever is going to come in? Thank you.

Thank you.

Hello. Jen Moran, Salina. I was one of the 31 people who applied for the vacancy. And I wanted to ask you if there were any interviews or anything like that for the position, if those were conducted. I really expected to get a phone call or something.

I met with five.

You did?

I did.

That's good. Did anybody else do their due diligence?

Talked to several, but not all, based on EOIs.

When I first saw that you were going to accept applications for this I thought that was great but you have to I hope that you see that at least the perception is that that just looks like lip service at this point if you I mean I I'm not feel I I think I'm well qualified I'm sure there's quite a lot of people that were on that list that were well qualified and never got a phone call so that's a shame I just wanted to share something else I believe that diversity is very, very important and I was hoping that maybe a woman would get looked at, somebody a little different than the status quo. Diversity can build trust and strength in a community, it's important, it's very important. I want to share with you some other beliefs I have. Diversity is important. I also feel that the Cozy Inn mural is appropriate and inconsistency with city rules is not worth the monetary cost to the city. I believe that the animal shelter situation should have been handled in a much swifter manner. I think you probably agree, down in your hearts maybe now. My all time favorite type of dog is the American Pit Bull Terrier. I've owned them and known many. They've all been excellent dogs. And I understand that the issues that Salinas face, I have brown water at my house. There's a lot of people like me. I think you've really missed an opportunity to pick somebody like me, if not me, somebody like me, because there's a lot of us. Personally, I have several personal and professional goals that I hope to meet in the next few years, but one of those is to run for commissioner. I think it'd be wonderful. If I'm unable to, then I will support whoever, hopefully a woman, maybe another person of color to do so. And I hope that all of you will support that person as well. Thank you.

Thank you. Good job. Thank you, Jim.

Nikki, can you pass those out? Thank you. Sue Nichols, Celina. Commissioner Davis, months ago you wanted a $30,000 consultant to define this. I think we finally can define this. On July 12th, consultant Tim Crumb emailed Jeff Hammond about an urgent chemical safety issue. He found a leaking 55 gallon drum of hazardous disinfectant. It's lid open. in an enclosed, unventilated garage with two dogs kenneled approximately 10 feet away. He warned of an immediate hazard to the animals and staff and recommended sealing the drum immediately and removing the animals until the area was safe. Jeff Hammond's response? It'll be removed in the morning. Not the dogs will be moved immediately, not I'm going over there right now, it will be removed in the morning. This is a complete disregard for the animals at that shelter. But after eight months, this is a much bigger problem. This is a leadership problem. Commissioner Davis, you said that we found what we wanted to find. You suggested the shelter might not be as bad as we claimed and supported spending the $30,000 on a consultant who might prove we were exaggerating. Instead, you received a scathing report documenting systemic failures and hazards to animals and people far worse than any of us knew. Then came another failed KDA inspection, 12 violations, 7 at the highest severity level, and nearly $6,000 in fines. If you read the report, it pretty much says that there is no one capable of managing the shelter. Jeff and Bridget accompanied the inspectors that day. Citizens warned you, a consultant documented the problems, the state of Kansas cited you, and after spending 30 grand for recommendations to fix this mess, the city doesn't appear to be following those recommendations. What exactly did we pay for? You could have spent an hour or two investigating the shelter yourself. Instead, you admonished citizens trying to tell you what was happening. You even said we moved this discussion to the courthouse as though citizens can charge someone with a crime. We can't. We brought you information. Instead of listening and investigating, you question the messengers. I'm no longer sure whether this city commission is led by Jacob Wood or he's the one in charge. It's not you guys in charge, it's him. This is a red stamp committee. He's been responsible for the shelter since 2023. We've been told he goes every week, yet he appears to have been there about as often as you commissioners have. When leadership refuses to listen and act while animals suffer, this is what you get. Anyone on this commission who cannot acknowledge that failure should show the same willingness Jerry Ivey did to step aside and make room for someone who will listen and act. Commissioner Davis, you wanted someone to define this? Now you know what this is.

Matthew Newbanks, Salina, Kansas. I've been involved with the Salina Animal Shelter for a little over a decade. During that time, I've been a member of the Friends of the Animal Shelter. I serve as a foster. I've been on the Animal Advisory Board and the head of the Animal Advisory before. Before I begin, I want to make something very clear. The shelter has been mismanaged for years and that's very evident. I'm not here to dispute any of that. What I'm here to say is that the animal control officers and shelter employees are not a public enemy. These are people who care deeply about the animals in our community. They are people who continue to show up and do difficult work every day. And right now, they desperately need the community's help while the city works through what's going to happen, which probably ends with an independent person coming in. I want to make two points that are very important that prove this. First, I want to remind the community that the information that ultimately led to the criminal charges of the previous leadership came from within the shelter, not from the public. If you read the arresting officer's affidavit, you'll see it yourself, that that report came from shelter employees. These employees are willing to speak up against... These people are willing to speak up about problems within their own workplace and that matters. Second, almost every single shelter employee is a foster. That means their work doesn't end when they leave for the day. They go home and care for animals otherwise might not have anywhere to go. Bottled babies, animals that have been hit by car, animals recovering from amputations. There's numerous reasons why they could be in foster. In fact, with Insulinus Foster Network, there are only two fosters that are not directly connected to the animal shelter. In a town of roughly 50,000, there are only two people These employees are not simply clocking in, doing their job, and going home. Many of them are continuing to care for sheltered animals in their own home. The second major issue is the staff. The shelter is severely understaffed. In the past few months, the shelter has lost the two employees who were charged with crimes. They've lost their veterinarian. They lost a dog walker. They lost a cleaner. And they lost a prospective employee due to public backlash. That's approximately five employees in a very short period of time. and the shelter has only been able to hire a single person to replace them. On top of that, several current employees are temporarily unable to perform all of their normal duties because of medical conditions. How well would your workplace function if you lost a third of your staff? And despite being understaffed, these employees are willing to make changes that are needed. I'm going to kind of skip things here. Guys, the foster employees are not the problem. The rhetoric against the foster employees have to stop. There was literally a shelter employee who was chased going 95 miles an hour on the interstate. They were being chased by what's going on in the public. Please tone down the rhetoric against the shelter employees. You don't need to chase a pregnant woman driving 95 miles an hour.

Thank you.

Good afternoon, Kathy Schwartz, Salina, Kansas. Commissioner Davis, I have to admit you were right when you said we don't know what we don't know. After our recent visits to the shelter, I can tell you that we are beginning to understand just how much we didn't know. And frankly, it is much worse than we realized. If the purpose of hiring a consultant was to demonstrate that the shelter wasn't as bad as we believed, I'm afraid the opposite has happened. What we have seen and experienced has raised even more questions and concerns. Our last two visits to the shelter were extremely uncomfortable. We were allowed to visit available dogs, but we were told that Jeff would conduct the tours. Later, we were told that employees felt that they were being harassed. Nothing could be further from the truth. We returned the next day because someone in our group wanted to adopt one of the dogs. We had not been there very long when Brett, the deputy director of Parks and Recreation, showed up. We were told that Jeff had contacted him to keep an eye on us. Then right before we left, the city attorney arrived to see if he was needed. That experience left us wondering why was our presence being treated as a problem. We are not there to intimidate anyone, we are not there to harass employees, and we certainly aren't there to pick on anyone. We are there because we care about the animals. When we see the employees on their phones while animals need attention, laundry that hasn't been washed, medication being thrown into the kennels rather than properly administered or dogs that don't appear to be getting adequate outside time, we have to ask questions. And those questions aren't accusations. They are questions about training, supervision, staffing and accountability. Are employees properly trained? Are they being adequately supervised? Do they have the sources and staff necessary to do their jobs? Are policies being followed consistently? And if something isn't being done correctly, who is responsible for making sure it gets corrected? Those are reasonable questions when we are talking about the care and well-being of animals that depend entirely on the people responsible for them. Commissioner Davis, you told us that we didn't know what we didn't know. I believe we are beginning to find out and honestly what we are finding out concerns us. We don't want this to become a battle between citizens and shelter employees. We don't want anyone to feel threatened or attacked. We want transparency. We want accountability. And most importantly, we want a shelter where the animals receive the care, attention, medication, exercise, cleanliness, and compassion they deserve. So I ask you, Commissioner Davis, if you were seeing the things we have seen, what conclusions would you be drawing? Because our concern isn't about winning an argument. Our concern is making sure these animals are safe and properly cared for. And we believe they deserve nothing less. Thank you, gentlemen.

Thank you.

I was still Sanderson Salina, and I had dealings last year with Jeff Hammond. No, it wasn't over the animal shelter. Guess what? It was a golf course. Why? It was in terrible shape. They had scrub trees growing up around their sign. They had scrub trees going up outside the buildings. And I told him, I said, that's terrible. Several years growth there, not just this year. Well, he got out there. I doubt if he ever left this office. And it got cleaned up. But it's starting in again this year. Scrubs, come on. You're the leader. He should go and check these things, wanting to send other people to check the animal shelter because he didn't want to go. Now, here's another subject. Man, the roundabout, Waterwell and 9th. Well, we watched a video or a movie, so we know what it's all about. Okay, you've all had children, or you know of nieces or nephews, taking driving lessons. Did they look at a film, a video, and know how to drive? I doubt that. They had to have experience. I dare you to get into an 18-wheeler on the co-pilot side and watch what he does when he wants to make a 90-degree turn. It don't all stay in the one lane. No. It takes that lane. The trailer's back here. It's on a... What do they call that where the spindle, the trailer is going off to the side because it's going sideways. Have you had accidents on that four-way stop out there?

I never have heard any about being written up.

And your city manager's salary is public information. I wonder how many people realize he starts out each month with $19,000 plus. And on top of that, 1900 goes into his retirement. You've got a lot of fooling going on there, man. You can't look. Neither one of you dare to look over when someone's speaking. You're ashamed. You should be. You should be running your city better. You're the leader. Get Jeff out there. Get him to clean up stuff. Don't send the little boys out. He is the leader. Right? I'm sorry. Kitty got his tongue. Thank you.

Rose-based, Celina. I don't have anything pre-written up. I feel like I've been at this podium many times and you guys haven't listened, so I don't know why I even try sometimes. But I did go over with the gals to the animal shelter and visit, I believe it was Wednesday. and they had no cats, or Thursday, I'm not sure what day it was, but anyway, they had no cats, we couldn't look at the cats, and all the 28 years I had been there, that shelter had never been without cats. You know, what happened to the cats? There was one cat up front, and it was positive for feline leukemia, and they had it up front. I guess it was for adoption. But I went back and I used the lady's restroom and I heard a dog. There's a dog in the men's restroom at the animal shelter. And it is a very strong pit bull. And one story was, this was all just in the time that we was there, is that it was there because it was scared of storms. Well, it wasn't storming the day we were there. And then the other story was, is they was cleaning the kennel. And then the third story was, I don't know, maybe this is the charm, is that it was their mascot. Now, how can you guys set up there, deny the public to have pit bulls? Granted, I'm not a real big fan of them, but that's just me, okay? But how can you stand up there and deny everybody else to have pit bulls, and you let the animal shelter have one, they keep it locked in the bathroom? Okay. And also, you know, the thing of it was is... I had five employees. I seen that they have 17. I had five employees and our place was spotless. I'm gonna tell you in the 28 years I was there and I'll tell you again, Jacob, that I never failed one inspection and I had five employees and they worked their butts off. So I just want to tell you that. And, yeah, Jacob, you are way overpaid for sure. And, Patrick, did you talk to the consultant about maybe having some things removed from the report because it didn't make the shelter look real good? Oh, don't look away. Don't look away. Look at me, Patrick. Why did you do that? I did not do that. Oh, you did not do that? Well, your nose is growing, too. And then getting back to Jeff Hammond and the Parks, two years ago I asked him about Thomas Park. We had a little playground there and I take my great-granddaughter there and at that time she was three. And it's in my neighborhood, Thomas Park. I said, you know, I said, there's no place to sit over there at the playground. And I said, I'm getting older. And I said, I'd kind of like to have a place to sit. And he said, well, they usually drag the picnic tables over there. I was like, well, I can't drag the picnic tables over there. And he says, I'll have a bench put in for you. And that was two years ago. And then also, there's still no bench. June 8th was our storm. The park is still damaged. And the shelter house, two years ago, you guys collected the insurance on it, and we never have gotten it replaced. So... That says a lot for Jeff Hammond.

Thank you.

Katie Shorlingville, Celina. I just think it's so unfortunate that it took the voice of Tom Wilber on KINA Talk Radio And an elderly lady in tears at a city commission meeting to finally get the attention of the city commissioners, the manager on the severity of living with rusty water. The friends of the animal shelter ladies have begged for years to get your attention. of the abuse and filth at our animal shelter, again, with zero results. You three commissioners and Jacob Wood and Martha Tasker, you all exhibit one thing, and that's a lack of empathy. And without empathy, you're nothing but an empty vessel. And finally, I just think anybody who's going to sit on this commission or anything like that that you're working with the public, it's imperative to have the ability to be able to forgive and forget and let go of hatred.

Thank you.

You guys are gonna have to bear with me, Jane Trostle, Celina, because I am very passionate when it comes to animals. And when I read what the inspection entailed is horrific. Do you guys understand? No, I take that back. You guys don't understand. I came up here months ago and asked you. to go check out other shelters to see how they are ran. I worked underneath Roe's base for years at the shelter and we never would have missed medication to an emaciated dog or not even fed it. I went out on calls. I brought in a boxer years ago to the shelter that was initiated. And unfortunately, he didn't make it. But we did our damnedest to get him medical attention and fed him and coddled him. I coddled him until he passed. And you guys sit up there and say, oh, it's not that bad. Really? And you guys talk about the employees that work there at the animal shelter. If they truly care about those animals, they would be asking to go to training. NACA offers training. CACA offers training. They also have scholarships, imagine that, that you can apply for. It breaks my heart for these animals You all should be charged with animal cruelty. You all, if not animal cruelty, then a civil lawsuit because you all knew and did nothing for these poor animals that don't have voices. We are their voices and you guys just laughed at us.

Thank you.

Susan Cooper, Celina. I want to talk, I'll take a little different tact. I'd like to talk about accountability and transparency. I have just recently started coming to the meetings and I brought up the funding for the river renewal project and I was told by Jacob Wood that it's in the budget. So I got the 26 budget and I read over it and I thought it was going to be in the general fund. It wasn't in the general fund. I thought it was going to be in the parks and rec section. It wasn't in the parks and rec section. So I said, where is this funding? for the River Renewal Project thinking it was going to be in the River Renewal Project. No, it's incorporated into the funding So the transparency that that $1.3 million annually that is going into the river renewal project, that wasn't really true. In 2017, June, the commission, and I don't know how many of you were on at that time, had an ordinance, ordinance 17-10885, and it talks about funding for the River Renewal Project. And I don't want to be accused of putting half-truths out there, and I don't want to be accused of embarrassing the city, so I'm going to read your words The public notices included the agenda that was put out the Thursday before the meeting. Then there was an explanation in the Salinas Citizen Spring Edition from the manager's office. A major park improvement includes a reasonable and slimmed-down approach renewing the Smoky Hill River And then it was to provide community gathering space along the downtown stretch. The city will not commit more than $1.3 million per year for this project. The original language says to provide general health, safety, welfare of the city. And it was in this ordinance. that was passed that the River Renewal Project was mentioned. So I'd like to know, you guys had a vote in 2010, the voters said no, then the ordinance came out and all of a sudden the River Renewal Project

back in play I don't think that's transparency okay Susan one I did want to say a few weeks ago you made a comment about how we transferred five million twice you know I was in error but I think I know where the other five million was if I remember right I think we took five million out of reserves to help pay for the fire station number four So you did probably see two $5 million transfers?

No. I thought when you answered that you were talking about that it was $5 million for the 25 and the 26. No. Okay.

I was going to say, if you were looking at a couple, if you were looking, there may have been two $5 million transfers out of the General Reserve balance, but I just wanted to, because you brought that up. No, it was just that one. Okay.

One transfer.

Okay.

But you're not even following your own ordinances. You're not supposed to take more than $1.3 million. And it was that ordinance that brought the river renewal master plan back into place.

Thank you.

And I think that Martha Tasker is, and she may be here and can review this, but I think she's the master plan of that. Time for somebody else.

Okay, thank you.

This brings up the phrase that President Ronald Reagan said, trust but verify. We don't trust you. And you need to watch the documentary, Damnation, what Cassie Lee said about the director of the Bureau of Reclamation. She says, if somebody doesn't do it for me, I'll cut them off. He says, I'll cut his balls off. It's in the documentary. Watch it. So we do need a change of power. Put some women in place. Maybe we'll get something done. And this was a paperback I had the library get for me. The demise of Isabella Anaconda and Columbus's trip to Central America. Anaconda, she was a woman. She run the whole nation of Native Americans in the Caribbean. And she took care of the men, too. She got rid of them. It's in the documentary. It's a paperback. That's it. Read it.

I'm down.

So men have screwed it up for 250 years. It can't get any worse unless you guys stay in power. Now, have any of you commissioners ever had a wellness physical done? Brain damage? Dr. Trent Davis, you know what CTE is. You guys need your brain examined because you've suffered some severe damages. That's in the documentary. You can get that from the hospital. They do a test on you. Can you fire employees? Yes, you can. What you do is give them a raise. Then you fire them. Unsatisfactory work habits. I've seen it done. So don't tell me you can't do it. Have any of you commissioners ever rolled up your sleeves and went to the shelter to see these conditions and help clean it up? Raise your hand if you have.

I've been there, but I haven't helped clean. I admit that.

Well, by God, one tells the truth. The Native Americans had a phrase for the white man, because the white man would never tell the truth, never kept any promise they made. Paleface speak with forked tongue. You're paleface. So... This is a good one. Who has the authority over the airspace at our airport and the property outside of the airport, property lines, drone issues, military or the FAA? Vertical airspace. Better check into it because this is federal.

Thank you.

Michelle Timpson, Solomon. I've been telling you the exact same thing since 2023 that the independent consultant just told you. For more than three years, I've stood before the city commission, asked questions, requested records, dug through documents, and told you there were serious problems at the Salina Animal Services. I was dismissed. I was questioned. So when the independent consultant walked into that building and documented systemic operational breakdowns, deficiencies in sanitation, biosecurity, Leadership, oversight failures, animal welfare concerns, I wasn't surprised because I already knew. I told you, Humane Celina told you, and when you wouldn't listen, we dug deeper. And look where we are today. The consultant's report essentially validated the concerns we have been bringing before you for years. I'm here to tell you that you failed. You failed the citizens of Salina who trusted you to oversee their city, and you failed the animals who had absolutely no voice in what was happening inside that shelter. And I believe the citizens, Humane Salina, and Animals of Salina are owed something very simple. An apology. Not a political apology. Not an apology filled with excuses. And not an apology... But an apology that means something, because if you truly understood what this report says, then you should be angry. And not at the people who exposed these problems, but at the fact that these problems were allowed to continue. And Jacob Pinocchio Wood needs to be held accountable for his role in this. He is criminal and so is Patrick. Both of you are criminal because you lied to the commissioners, both of you. I have watched him repeatedly minimize concerns about his shelter, this shelter and defend its management and conditions while citizens were telling you something very different. He has been lying since day one about the shelter and protecting incompetent management. Him and Patrick both have been lying to the commissioners, and you guys know it. The consultant's report gives you another opportunity to ask whether what you were being told by city administration was actually the truth. And Commissioner Trent Davis, please stop with the word salad. Stop trying to explain away legitimate concerns with complicated language that leaves citizens more confused than informed. You cannot speak with authority about the condition of a facility you have never even stepped inside. You want to defend the shelter, then go see it. Talk to the people who work there. Look at the conditions yourself, but don't gaslight the citizens who have actually been paying attention. And Mayor Mike Hoppeck, you have said that you didn't know about these conditions when this started in 2023, but you were on the commission. You heard us. You even called us names. You were sitting in these meetings while these concerns were being raised. You don't rewrite history now. And Commissioner Greg Ligowitz. I'm asking you to wake up and cast your own vote and don't vote just because you sit beside someone.

Thank you.

Ms. Timpson, was that a question?

No, statement.

I wasn't talking to you.

What? Question for what?

The question, were you asking me if I've ever been in the shelter or were you telling- Everyone on TV that I've never been in the shelter.

Have you been down to the shelter?

I want to know which question you were asking first.

When was the last time you were down at the shelter?

Early this year.

Early this year?

Yep.

And what did you think about it?

I got... I requested to get the consultant in there so we could find out. We cannot... Inspect every building the city runs. That's not our job.

You could read the records.

But we did think there was enough concern to commission that survey.

Multiple months later.

So don't say things that aren't true unless you verify it. But don't say that I have not been somewhere if you've not verified that. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about you coming up here and having everyone else in here think that what you're saying is true just because you have the freedom to talk for three minutes.

But we're supposed to leave all your word salad in our philosophy.

We don't refute everything people say because that's not the purpose of Citizen Forum.

But there comes a point- You can say everything you say to us. You know what you don't know.

And you all still don't know what that phrase means. Mr. Johnson. What day did you go?

We'll film.

We're good for that.

Okay. Mr. Johnson. All right. Tony Johnson, Celina. I want to address something from the Q&A article put out by the city manager's office from the last meeting because apparently we found a way to turn a simple rule into a game of balls and strikes. Okay. In it, he said the KDHE required a mixed waste above the ground, which in this case was sheetrock, plywood, insulation, there was probably shower and tub enclosures in there, mixed in with the concrete and brick to go to the landfill because it had all been shoved in a pile and intermixed. But here's a question. How exactly does someone keep that material from blowing out of an un-tarped trailer and still qualify for the tarp rate? I've had people tell me they've seen it blowing out on Crawford Street. I even had one citizen send me a video. And that sure doesn't match what the city itself has published on its own website regarding what constitutes a secured versus unsecured load. In fact, I had it printed on this t-shirt so it's easy to see. Tarp and no tarp. The city created a rule that should be pretty simple. Secure the load and you pay the secured rate. Don't secure the load and you pay the unsecured rate. Black and white, but apparently it's now become a judgment call. So let me make sure I understand the precedent we just established. Any un-tarped load of mixed waste will now get the secured rate regardless if some of it is able to blow out or not. Is that correct? Because if that's the determination, we got a problem. I would encourage anyone who has paid the unsecured rate under the same circumstances to call Ron Marsh at City Hall and ask for an explanation and a refund. And if I owned a roll-off trash service in this town and used the saline of landfill... they got a pretty simple business decision to make. Quit spending money on repairing or replacing tarp systems because the city has just set the standard that they aren't required to receive the secured rate. What you did is create a loophole, and once you create a loophole, people are going to take advantage of it. So I'll ask again, is the city's unsecured policy actually a rule, or is it a suggestion that employees get to interpret depending on what happens to be in the trailer that day? Because taxpayers and landfill users shouldn't have to pay guests to rule that day. You also said in your reply the contractor coordinated with landfill staff. That's just useless rhetoric when the contract signed by both parties clearly says, in section one under general specifications, item six titled disposal of debris, normal disposal fees will apply. So who did he coordinate with? Because I don't think any employee at the City of Salina is worth the $325,000 we forfeited, especially in a year with supposed budget obstacles. So you can either enforce the rule as posted, or maybe we just view this as another example of favoritism and mismanagement.

Good evening. I'm Lori Hall Salina. The consultant and KDA confirmed widespread failures in sanitation, biosecurity, leadership, oversight, and animal welfare. KDA also issued unsatisfactory ratings, violations, and penalties, which we, the taxpayer, now have to pay. The wildlife records I presented earlier this year revealed many of the same issues already detailed in the failed inspections and the consultant's assessment, including problems with oversight, procedures, biosecurity, record keeping, and animal welfare. So on January 30th of this year, I submitted a detailed investigation packet to Kansas Department of Wildlife and Parks Special Investigator Mike Hammerschmidt requesting a full investigation into the wildlife handled by Andrea Murphy and Monique Holley. I've given you a copy of this letter. However, the packet is missing from your view. In 2025 alone, the Salina Animal Shelter recorded 458 wildlife intakes and 104 wildlife euthanasias. Wildlife handling was clearly a significant part of the shelter operation, yet neither Andrea Murphy nor Monique Holley held any federal or state wildlife rehabilitation permits during that period. Kansas law strictly permits, or excuse me, limits how unpermitted citizens may possess sick, injured, or abandoned wildlife and requires transportation to an authorized rehabilitator. Yet records show mammals and federally protected birds were being held at a private residence. A few examples of the evidence I sent to game warden Hammerschmidt. Three seven-day-old Canada geese goslings were kept at a foster's care. Her name was Andy Linder. Do you know Andy Linder? No, you don't, because that was her first married name. She used that name. to put on the records of the Salina Animal Shelter. She's never used that name before. Records also indicated that Andrea used several names, and that was a concern about record keeping and the ability to track wildlife from intake. Communications with licensed wildlife rehabilitator Carrie Newell indicated that Andrea took in a great blue heron, a Mississippi kite, and a falcon. Carrie advised her to transport these federally protected birds to Operation Wildlife. She kept those birds seven days and then they died.

Time.

The great blue heron, we don't know what happened to it.

Thank you.

They are. So I'm asking you to please remove those responsible. Please bring Prairie Paws in and maybe then you can wipe the egg from your face.

Thank you.

Hi, my name is Peggy Ochoa. I live here in Salina. This is the first meeting I've attended live. I've attended Probably four or five online because I work and I work till five. So today I graciously said I need to go do this because this is my community. And I don't normally talk. I don't get up to talk to people. That's not my deal. But what I've seen tonight has me so passionate about what is going on in our community. I lived in Smolin for 49 years of my life. I moved to Salina 15 years ago. Never had any concern about who was taking care of our city. And pretty suddenly, this year, it became very apparent, starting with the animal shelter, that we had a problem. And then I heard about more problems and more and more. And it seems like we've got a whole bunch of wild cards up here that don't really have our... best interests in mind. Please excuse that, Mr. Rump, because I see your passion. I see what you have tried to do. I hear your nays, and I hear the puppet, the puppet, I, I, I. And if we need another I, I. And, you know, I have some concerns. The first thing I want to address, which I went way off track here, the first thing I want to address is the smirks from over here to Sherry. Where's Sherry? The smirks from this table, the laughs. That was rude. That was rude. That was totally uncalled for. You should be ashamed of that. You want everybody here to stay in line. Then please stay in line yourselves. The other thing that I have noticed for the last hour is that Mr. Linkowitz does not look up when people talk. He's this. I don't know what he's doing. I don't know if he's reading.

I've never been in an environment where I've actually been admonished for taking notes, whether it's school.

Well, but maybe you should look at people and pay attention because that way we feel noticed. Otherwise... Because the other three, their heads were up. His was up 99% of the time. Mayor Hoppick, yours was up most of the time. You probably get a five. So, the other... Well, I just want you to look at people and pay attention because out here, everybody thinks that you're just up there. You could be playing a game for all we know. So... The other thing I'm very, very concerned about was I was looking forward to this vote for the new commissioner. I didn't realize that probably what happened was people talked beforehand, and Mr. Norris was going to be up, and the first person that got three votes, boom. They're the first one up, first one in. Why did we not take a vote on every one of them and whittle it down? And maybe we'd have got that woman in there.

Thank you. Thank you.

Is there anyone else?

Ben Wendell Solana. I too was one of the 31 candidates. Actually, I told everybody that if you would put money on me, I was a 200 to one odd of actually getting it. So, 2016 vote to raise the sales tax. You will have people in the community telling you that, ha-ha, you guys voted for it, so it's in. And the River Renewal Project goes on because you voted for it. I have a copy of the actual ballot here in Fundament. I'm going to read it to you word for word, just exactly what's going on. Shall the following be adopted? Shall the city of Salina, Kansas be authorized to repeal the current 0.40% sales tax, retail sales tax scheduled to expire March 31st, 2019 and replace it with a 0.75% general purpose retailers sales tax and proceeds of which shall be used to pay the cost of. And these are important guys, so look up Linkowitz and let's see what we got here. Improving neighborhood streets and drainage. You guys have done it. Very good. Preserving a stable property tax rate. The city side has went up 3.44 since 2017. That's $110 on a $200,000 home on the city side. Not the whole thing, just the city side. So much for preserving a property tax. Susan put out a great thing about insuring quality park system. Insuring quality park system. Did I say it again? Did it say river renewal project? No. Alright, here's the important ones. Constructing and maintaining capital improvements. Do that. Funding equipment. Funding bonded debt issued for capital improvements. Funding bonds for capital improvements. We got a capital improvement that's in front of us right now. And it's not the river renewal project. It's the water infrastructure. Jacob Wood has told me that he cannot do anything as far as taking money back out of the River Renewal or anything. It's up to you guys to make the decision. So here's the decision, guys. And if you don't think it's important or it's an emergency, let me put out for you the reactive... The reactive response that the fire department, because I told you before, fire control could be compromised if you have plugged up mains. They have a policy in place with the city of Salina that if they are fighting a fire, they go out and there's a major fire and they hook up to a fire hydrant. And they don't get enough pressure. They are to call the city water department treatment plant and have the pressure ramped up. All right, so we run 60 PSI in Salina. About five more seconds. No, you're not going to stop me on this one. It's very important. Very important. I need to get this finished out.

Why do you get more time than anybody else?

Because this is very important for what you guys need to listen to and need to do as far as water infrastructure.

I'm not, Ben.

Okay, so let me finish what the fire department does, and then you can cut me off. So what happens is the city will ramp up the pressure. They will ramp it up from 60 to 80 or 100 PSI. If you do that with our old water lines, things blow everywhere. People's infrastructure in their home that's weak will blow everywhere.

Okay, thank you. So we are in an emergency. Okay.

We are in an emergency, and something needs to be done now, and it needs to be done with you guys by taking all of the special interests out.

Okay, we'll talk to the fire department, and we'll talk to the water department, and we'll- Listen to him, he's going to tell us the truth. Thank you. When are you going to talk to him? One's standing right back there. We'll talk when he leaves. Okay, so Shane, come on up and talk. I said, no, I'll talk to him after the meeting. No, no, no. Shane can come up and tell you if that policy's in place right now. You have three minutes is up. I'm just like everybody else. Thank you.

Is anybody else wanting to speak? No. Is there anybody else wanting to speak? Ben? I'm the last one. No, there's somebody else.

I'm sorry.

No, okay. Okay, you can stay in the room or you can leave. Try to kick me out. Okay, thank you.

Officer Brown will likely. Thank you, Ben. Thank you very much.

Susan, you'll get up here once. I made the mistake last time and let you up here twice. That was my mistake.

No, once. I was up here once.

No, only once. That's the rule.

What rule?

We have one time at open forum.

Everybody, yeah. Thank you.

I just wanted to say that. Next time, okay.

I can't, if I start. You've already looked at the budget.

Susan, please, I'm trying to be courteous. Everybody gets their three minutes.

He doesn't like women.

Okay, thank you. That is uncalled for.

Women with a voice. Kick me out.

Mayor, I'm sorry.

Okay, is there someone else back here I think had their hand up?

If not, I move we adjourn.

No, Mayor Hoppeck, Mayor Hoppeck, I need to add something, sorry.

Yes.

My name is Shannon Russ and I'm reading this statement on behalf of a Salina citizen who is unable to attend tonight. I have a question I believe City Manager Jacob Wood and City of Salina need to answer publicly. If an entire street or neighborhood has already been approved for a multi-million dollar waste line replacement project because its infrastructure needs replacement, why aren't the residents served by those same lines automatically eligible for temporary filtration assistance while they wait? Perhaps the city has separate technical criteria for these programs. If so, please explain those criteria publicly because from a citizen's perspective, this makes absolutely no sense. How can the city say, yes, the infrastructure serving your neighborhood warrants millions of dollars in replacement and then tell a household served by that infrastructure, no, you haven't demonstrated enough of a problem to qualify for temporary filtration assistance. That disconnect is exactly why people are losing trust. Accountability does not stop with the utilities department. It also belongs with the city manager, Jacob Wood. If current policies prevent reasonable emergency assistance from reaching residents and neighborhoods already prioritized for water line replacement, then leadership needs to intervene. That could mean changing in eligibility requirements, bringing in outside expertise, temporarily assigning different leadership to oversee the response, or evaluating whether the current utilities department leadership is effectively handling this situation. This is not asking Jason Wood to fire someone because citizens dislike that person. It is about asking him to evaluate performance based on what is happening to the citizens in the city. Citizens, the city is supposed to serve. Leadership means recognizing when something isn't working and having the courage to change it. Residents should not be standing at their sinks looking at brown water while simultaneously living above infrastructure the city has already determined requires millions of dollars in replacement. So Mr. Wood, Please explain the contradiction. If these neighborhoods qualify for major water line replacement, why aren't households served by those same lines being given immediate access to temporary filtration assistance? And if existing policy prevents that, who has the authority to change the policy and why hasn't it already been changed? Those are questions the citizens of Salina deserve to have answered. Please share this until it reaches someone who will be in that room tonight sincerely fed up with groundwater and excuses supposed to serve. I felt compelled to speak on this citizen who couldn't be here tonight because it obviously doesn't work out with jobs and I have the luxury to be here. So I just wanted to speak on her behalf.

Thank you.

Just so we don't forget.

We're not going to. Thank you.

Tom Wilber, Celina. I told you guys a couple weeks ago that I called the KDA and spoke to the inspector and that they were on their way in. You didn't even lift a finger to do anything different and you got spanked. I do want you to know I've spoken to the Saline County Attorney about the possibility of filing criminal charges against our leadership regarding the continued abuse at the animal shelter. I'm not big on taxes. Today I sent an email to each of you. Outlining a $2 million reduction in overhead plan that I developed, I think it's pretty easy to do. I could probably do it if you need my help. But reducing overhead at the city by $2 million would correct the problem that we have with the $700,000 deficit that you guys have saddled us with. And if you want my help, just give me a call. Thanks. Thank you.

Rosemary Mai, Celina. I've heard a lot of negative comments today about the animal shelter and the water situation, which is justifiable. But I'm here to give one positive comment that has been Some of us from the dog park have been working on for the last couple years and I know I've talked to a couple of you commissioners about what was going on out there and what we needed and I'm here to say that the Parks and Rec department has been working very closely with us and have done a good job of doing some upgrade at the dog park and today they closed the park for a week to try a new chemical that K-State has asked them to try to get rid of the chipweed and the small barley. So I wanted to thank Brett Lamer for helping us out to get that started. So I wanted to come up and give a positive report tonight. Thank you. And I want to thank Brett and them for helping us at the dog park on Markley. Thank you.

Okay, if there's no one else- Mayor Hoppe, can I say one thing?

Yeah. I hate to say this, just I'm worried that from you personally that after the meeting, people are going to try and twist some information I gave in an open records request. When I communicated with the consultant, I asked him to remove the employee name so that we could put an unredacted version. On the website, I also at one point pointed out to him that there was likely to be an investigation of a third party based on his report. And I asked him whether or not he should consider removing or changing that part of the report. He did not, and I told him that was fine. So just to be clear about that.

Okay, thank you. I move to adjourn. We have a motion second to adjourn. All those in favor? Aye. Aye.

We had another one right over there.