City Council - Regular Meeting

Please rise as you're able for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

Welcome everybody to this snowy evening of February 18th and our Rochester City Council meeting. We begin each council meeting with our open comment period. This is an opportunity for anyone from the public to speak on items that we will not be taking public testimony during a public hearing later in the agenda. Each person has up to two minutes to speak for a total of 20 minutes. I'll be keeping time through two methods. One, the stoplight here and the red uh digital clock uh to my left. Uh, I'd request each speaker to be concise to allow for more uh people to speak during the designated time. Participants are further encouraged to limit comments to topics that are within the scope and jurisdiction of the city council's ability to affect policy. Council members and staff do not respond to your comments during public comment, but will instead follow up on any specific requests separately. If you have materials to share with the council, please give them to the city clerk who is to my right uh to distribute and you will be invited up in the order in which you signed up. We will start with Linda Parker.

Good evening, commission. Glad to be here. Thank you for giving me this opportunity. I recently listened to the mayor address a couple of newly appointed committee members that once you hold an official title, you're no longer speaking as a single group. You're representing the entire community. When you're using your official position in your comments to promote personal beliefs or partisan viewpoints, it creates the false impression that those views reflect the will of the whole community. Your responsibility is to make decisions based on what is best for all citizens, not one segment, political group or preferred constituency. By not doing so, you violate your oath of office and the ethics expected and you should and will potentially be removed from office. It's what she told us at the most recent council meeting, the last one. The decision to knowingly align with a broader partisan platform and pursue legal action against the federal government specifically in efforts aimed at abolishing immigration inform enforcement violates your authority. It is not a violation of humanity for immigration enforcement. It's a sovereign function of national security and public safety. When local leaders support the effort to dismantle enforcement entirely while remaining silent about crimes committed against citizens, it's a violation of public trust and the duty of their office. You all are basically saying, "You speak for all of us in the city of Rochester. I am a resident of the city of Rochester and you did not speak for me, but you chose as if you did." And I find that unacceptable. It's also my understanding that the city of Rochester may be funding services at legal representation, special education options, housing, utilities, food, transportations for individuals who are not legal citizens and also encouraging the harboring of many who have broken our laws. I'm not getting that assistance. I'm not

getting legal representation. I'm not getting my bills paid. I'm not getting any extra support. So again, you're not representing all of the citizens. Thank you, Miss Barker. Next up, we have Myron Roasted.

Hi, City Council. My name is Myron Rostad. I am a resident at 821 26th Street Southeast, Rochester, Minnesota. I am here tonight because on March 23rd last year at 11:00, I was woken by a neighbor to go check my basement in which she said she had water in hers. I checked I got a split level home. I checked my basement and I had the entire basement flooded and it got flooded due to because of a sewer line which got ruptured by a water mane in the street by my house. I did everything in which I was given a sheet of paper by stating call your insurance company which I did. I called them that night and we got a claim number and stuff. Uh documented all the damages and stuff. I had a service cleaner come in. I was able to get one that day come in. He evaluated the situation, read the situation, and told me everything. Sheetrock had to be cut. All the doors had to be taken out because he says, "If you don't do this, you will not be able to sell it because of the damages." So, I had to have all that done. Uh everything that was accounted for. uh after I got everything done, it's like I have uh roughly $58,000 in my basement and when I go to try to submit all this, nobody would ever I called the number on the sheet that said we give you a helping hand, everything, let us know. Nobody would return my calls. I reached out to my insurance agent and she tried to get some answers. She got answers that was uh they are not going to pay anything on the claim and close the claim due to because it was an act of god. Now I don't see how a water man and that which is considered infrastructure of the city can be considered a act of god when a mechanical function breaks

causing me hardship on all this. Um, I just ask the representatives to look me straight in the eye and uh tell me that it's justifiable that I got to accept that it was an act of God and eat the billing. I have documentation of all the work that I've had done. The cleaning bill, the cleaning bill alone ran me close to 19,000. And then, like I say, replacing of the sheetrock. I had a bathroom that wasn't even a year old yet that I had totally redone. I'd have that redone for 12,000. Thank you, Mr. Rustin. Thank you.

Next up, we have Adam Busby. [clears throat] Good evening. It's been a while. It's good to see you all again. Name's Adam Busby, representative for the ATU 105. I've been coming here since about uh November of 2024 talking about the union busting tactics of Transdev. And since that time, we've went through several manager changes and yet the action continues. the harsh discipline, um you you name it, it all find falls right in line with union busting. Some point the city has to do something or it becomes complicit. And got a nice group here with us today. And um as you can see uh the temperature has not been lowered with labor. It's only heating up. Thank you.

Thank you. Did you have other speakers that Oh, uh Ryan Timlin.

Hello. Uh my name is Ryan Timlin. I uh used to be the president of Amalgamated Transit Union Local 105. I've been very involved in the contracts over the years and I've been pulled into negotiations for the history of this current contract. And one thing I have to state, it is pretty shocking to watch and hear what I've discovered has been going on down here with Transdev. Um, when I was president, I don't ever remember anybody ever being suspended and I don't remember anybody ever being suspended without an investigation being finished before a suspension happened. You have 14 operators now suspended. No complete investigations or the suspensions have happened without an investigation being completed. And one of the most shocking things is the last suspension that just happened. 14-year employee with no disciplinary record, no investigation completed, and a three-day suspension. That is a morale issue that you guys have to address and needs to be dealt with. They are creating a hostile work environment and I don't have to speak much more. Busby explained it pretty well what's going on. But um I think if you want people to show up to work, you should treat them with respect. The company that operates the transit agency.

Thank you, Emma Smith. Good evening. Uh, my name is Emma. I'm a member of Workers Strike Back and I've lived and worked in Rochester for almost 10 years. I am using my allotted two minutes per month here to join our bus drivers in solidarity as they work through contract negotiations with TransDev. We [snorts] understand that the city and transdev have a contract renewal up for review and we do not consent to the city of Rochester aligning with exploiters of the working class and we demand this contract not be renewed unless all worker demands are met. This [snorts] morning I got to hear a dozen speakers at our state capital from all different backgrounds connected connecting the multitude of issues we are facing as a state to corporate greed. From the threat to our boundary waters to violent ICE agent presence to the absurd amount of data center projects being proposed and rising energy bills to the very companies you choose to work with in our city. [snorts] Transdev has displayed union busting behaviors and proven consistently that they will choose profit over people. You could hear more about this from many others, but their jobs would be at risk just from speaking out. We don't want your weak apologies. We want you to act like Rochester is a city that takes care of its workers who can all have fulfilling lives. We want the Democrats and Republicans on this council to use their seats and voices to advocate for the workers of Rochester who make life possible. Siding with corporations is largely unpopular and loathed by residents all across our state. We reference Shamas Sawant and her run for Congress frequently because she is leading the way for the working class. Her record of victories with Seattle workers while on city council have shown the rest of us what it takes to truly value labor and take care of the folks who are providing it. And to everyone listening, we are stronger

together. You can join our fight at workerstrikeback.org. Solidarity. Thank you. Uh Toby Hol with a D. Yep.

Thank you. Hi council members. I'm Toby, resident of Rochester and fellow member of Workers Strike Back. I'm here in solidarity with ATU Local 105 and their active fight for a fair contract. Last month, union members voted unanimously to reject Transdev's last best final offer. And they also voted unanimously to authorize a strike if negotiations fail. And just yesterday, 95% of members voted no on Transdev's insulting second, final, and best offer. This is not a small dispute. This is a workforce sending a clear message that TransDev is failing its workers and by extension failing our city. This should come as no surprise as the Democrats and Republicans on this city council would rather outsource drivers to a known union busting company. On top of nickel and dimming working in poor people with austerity budgets at the city and state level, Transdev ignores progressive discipline. Instead of following the steps outlined in their own contract, they jump straight to suspensions. 13 workers have been suspended recently, including two after the strike authorization vote. The result is staffing shortages, dropped routes, stranded riders, and a system that becomes less reliable by the day. Workers are also demanding basic respect with a fair grievance procedure to address harassment, safety issues, and policy violations. They're asking for affordable health care, wage increases, and basic dignity. Public transportation is a public good and should be publicly owned and free for all. We demand that the Democrats and Republicans stand up to Transdev and big business and potentially cut ties with Transdev unless the workers demands are met in full. Thank you.

Thank you. Uh next we have Rick Labor. Yes,

my name is Rick Labor. Of course, thank you for hearing me tonight. I just want to say a few things. The city of Rochester runs the fire fire department. They run the police department. They run park and wreck. They run the maintenance department theelves. They own all of the transportation, but yet you lease it out to somebody else. I would like I don't have records to this, but I would like we had a manager Tabitha and and uh Ken. I would like you to look up a week's worth of their ridership and look up Transdev's wrership right now. I would just like somebody that cares half as much as I do. Oh, excuse me. There is one person over here. Rachel does care. I've actually sat down and talked with her. Thank you for hearing me.

Thank you.

Next up, we have Molly Dennis. Thank you for your time. I am actually not going to speak on this issue, but I want to say I echo every single thing that has been said. I stand with the workers strike back um and uh atu with their cause. So, thank you for all of that. I I think we need more residents u more people speaking up coming to these meetings. I know that many meetings last year it was crickets here there wasn't anyone who spoke many for many reasons um I have experience I've you know uh have served on the dis I've been very transparent I think it's important that residents know where their taxpayer dollars are being spent and that includes where the council members spend their hours I have asked repeatedly to have council members uh share their office hours I've asked questions that have gone unanswered Uh the city council makes just shy of 56,000 a year. The president uh just shy of 65,000 and the mayor close to 84,000. If you calculate that by the number of hours I've been watching and observing you um doing work here on the council, it averages between $107 to $220 an hour. Many [snorts] people here do not make $220 an hour. There is many weaknesses but uh challenges but strengths of autism and ADHD is not only resilience and a strong moral compass but it also is hyperfocus and and uh pattern recognition and I pay close attention to who shows up with the exception of perhaps council member Miller and council member Keane. I do not see you any of you at uh these

events and um community um activis things going on. And when I when I've I feel so strongly that you need to have listening sessions, you need to have office hours, you need to be available, answer questions, and I I know just very a couple days ago, the W six council member who I am a resident of W 6 a town hall has canled all of his other Thank you, Miss Dennis. Thank you. That closes our public comment period and uh we will move on to uh clerk queso. Please call the role. Good evening. Council member Keane here. Council member Miller

here. Council member Wall here. Council member Frederick's here. Council member Palmer here. Council member Doring is absent. Council President Schub here. Mayor Norton is absent. Thank you. Next up, we have the city administrators report. Administrator Zelms, take it away. Uh,

thank you, Council President, council members, members of the public. Um, I always start the report by thanking our teammates um for acting with respect, integrity, safety, and excellence in mind as they go about their work each day. Um, did just want to acknowledge our teammates in uh parks, forestry, maintenance, facilities. um the public works crews and um our um transit operations group. They are actively working towards become coming together in a facility up north of town. Um and uh they joined together today to celebrate a milestone and as as we move forward with building out the maintenance facility up north. So just want to make some special recognition of that group of people today. Um it was a there was weather today during that and I appreciated that we have them working for us. [laughter] So um did also uh want to let folks know that in honor of Black History Month, we will uh be hosting in the Rotunda of City Hall uh the uh traveling uh um legacy kiosks. Um there are additional kiosks this year. There will be special recognition on February 24th between 11:00 a.m. and noon. Uh but the exhibit will be in city hall um through the week next week. So something for people uh to stop by uh and enjoy if that is something that they're interested in. Um also uh if you have been on College View Drive at all near Mstead Medical or RCTC, you have seen some very large vehicles. Um there will be a block byblock closure uh this Friday as um that equipment moves to its final location at the Prospect Utility Plant near Central Park. Um so be looking for that. There will be impacts on Friday, February 20th and Saturday, February 21st, um from 7 PM to 2 am. So, if you're out late, um that is a time where you may be impacted by those moving if you've seen them. It's going to be quite an operation to um get those um into some tight spaces downtown. You can uh follow us on rochesterm.gov

um for impacted areas um and our dispatch center will be aware. Also upcoming on February 21st from 9:30 to 11:30 a.m. Um, family game time is available at the History Center of Olmstead County. It's a free event. Um, it is a morning of games and puzzles. Uh, that location there is 1195 West Circle Drive. So, if you haven't um experienced the history center before, that's an opportunity for you coming up. Um, and I did just want to address that on February 11th, our transit system did experience a pretty significant impact. uh 40% of the fixed route drivers called in. Um and there were a total of 37 trips that were missed. So we do operate a transit system and we do prioritize that for people who are getting to work. Many of our residents requ are really reliant on that system being reliable in order to get where they're going. Um we there is a federal mediator that has been requested and transdev is under contract um with a driving company to utilize so that we can make sure that we have efficient reliable service for those that um rely on the transit system in order to um get through the city whether that's an appointment that they need to be at or whether they need to get to work. Um there was an all day negotiation that happened on February 13th and as noted there was a contract vote that happened on February 17th. The contract did not pass but is still valid um as long as negotiations are occurring um and uh Rochester public transit is consistently communicating with MINDOT transdev and the ATU. And I just want to highlight that the transit system is critical for many people across the city and it's really important that it remains reliable in order to be able to provide those services to the community members that rely on it at a low cost. Uh the center street ramp also has been um um a little bit of a challenge to access for a while. Um only mostly for contract parkers, but we are going to be in the final phase of restoration work for the center street ramp that's starting March 23rd. It will run through early August and there will be a full

closure of the center street ramp during that time. Uh the recommended alternative is the first street ramp that's located at 13 um2nd streets southeast. Um rochesterm.gov/parking /parking is where you can see all of the parking opportunities downtown. Uh and um the last thing I wanted to highlight is there is another free event that's happening on Tuesdays through April at the historic Chateau Theater 11:00 a.m. to 1:30. There is a free brown bag lunch um to stop by um bring takeout or pack your own lunch um and uh join with folks to uh meet up and maybe meet somebody new in the community um and enjoy some good company. And that is all I have this evening. Thank you. Next up, we have one item on the uh mayor's report. Uh please join us on Tuesday, March 3rd, which is my birthday. Uh not for a birthday party, but for a town hall uh regarding uh advanced policing technology. It'll be held at the Heights Center from 6:00 to 7:30. and Mayor Norton in partnership with the Rochester Police Department will host the public conversation of on the use of advanced technology and policing. Town town hall topics will include drones and camera technologies featuring presentations, live demonstrations, and opportunities for audience questions. The town hall is free and open to the public, so hope you can join us. Next up, we have the order of the agenda. Uh are there any changes to our agenda tonight? Seeing none, uh I will entertain a motion to approve the agenda.

Second. Moved by uh Council Member Frederick's seconded by Council Member Wall. All in favor say I. Oppose say nay. Motion carries. Uh moving on to our consent agenda. Council member Wall is pulling item F12. Uh are there any others? Seeing none, uh, I'd invite a motion to approve and block items F1 through F11 and F13 through F21. Moved by Council Member Frederick's. Second. Second by Council Member Miller. All in favor say I.

I. Say nay. Motion passes. Moving on to our public hearings. We have two public hearings on our agenda this evening. Uh and a couple moments to clarify the public hearing process. Uh first staff will present the uh the item and uh and then uh if there is an applicant or applicant representative they will have up to 10 minutes to discuss the item. Uh after that I will open the public hearing. Members of the public have five minutes each uh to uh give comments on the item and like uh the open comment period and I encourage you to be concise and uh and uh address issues regarding the the item. Uh after that I will close the public hearing and invite the applicant uh to address any concerns, issues that come up during the public hearing for up to 5 minutes. After that, I'll invite my colleagues to ask questions of either staff or the applicant and then we will take a motion on the item. With that, I will move to item G1, which is a conditional use permit by ML Group I, Group One LLC. Uh, Mr. Elliot Mhler.

Yep. Uh, good evening, Council President, members of the um council, Elliot Muller with Rochester Community Development. Um so tonight the applicant ML Group I or LLC requests approval of conditional use permit CD2025007 CUP for the placement of excavated fill uh within the 100year floodprone subdist and compensatory sto water storage area improvement for the future development of multif family housing project. The site is located at the southeast corner um of country club road west and 45th Avenue Southwest. This application is related solely to the excavation of the fill um and the placement within the floodprone subdist um and not any specific development project. I just want to make that clear. Um approval of this conditional use permit doesn't equate to support for the overall development um that's being proposed afterwards. Um on January 6, 2025, uh the common council adopted a resolution determining that the associated environmental assessment worksheet um was sufficient and that an uh environmental impact statement or further review wasn't warranted. Um so the flood plane development permit um that we have reviewed um is intended to ensure that all development in the flood plane complies with all applicable federal, state, and local ordinances that are designed to reduce the risk of damage due to flooding. To be approved, the applicant must demonstrate um a couple of things that we review. Um so the first is um whether or not the design that they have is uh adequate to provide drainage to reduce exposure to flood hazards. Um is designed in a way that is not detrimental to uses in adjoining areas. Um and then it's designed to maintain the existing flood plane capacity. Uh the applicant has worked closely with city teammates and county staff to provide adequate compensatory storage um calculations and preliminary grading and storm water plans to aid in our review of of their work. Um and then tonight the development review team uh recommends approval of the CUP um with three

conditions and the planning commission is recommending um the same. So with that I'll stand for any questions and I know our public works teammates and community development teammates are here and the applicants in the stands.

Thank you Mr. Mhler uh is the applicant here and uh Mr. Titon if you can step forward and you have 10 minutes. Thank you President Schumer members of the council and Bill Twitton with WC Engineering. Uh on the line is Joe Wall from Bar Engineering who has done the heavy lifting on hydraology of this has signed a memorandum indicating the no rise uh from our work of excavating and filling the area. So for every cubic yard we want to fill to raise our site to 100 year, we have to dig out 100 a cubic yard of it of area to store water. So that has been done. Uh it's had several reviews by city public works. Um they have accepted as you'll see in your packet our our work and our technical memorandum of the team. Also with me is Dan Fitzpatrick the project manager and then Ryan Shonfelter is also an engineer. So the conditional use permit is allow conditional use permit is just to allow us to fill. It doesn't allow us any building permits. It doesn't give us any final plats. We have prepared a mass grading plan has been submitted to city public works for one round of reviews. We're going to send it back in for a second round review. We'll have to do a grading plan. We'll let our map revision to FEMA preliminary and final plat study um and basically a site plan approval on lot by lot as it goes along. So we've done a lot of work on this over several months and our team has u in is adamant that this is going to work as planned. So, we'd asked for the council approval based on um staff approval, city public works acceptance of our plan, planning commission approval, um and the determination that there's been no negative impacts to the site approves from this project. So, have any

questions? There may be something you need more technical from Mr. Wall. You'll have to I I don't know how the technology works here, but you have to connect up with him. Thank you, Will. Uh we are agreed to the three conditions. So just so everybody knows. Sounds good. Uh we'll call you. Thank you for you and your team and uh we'll call you back up after the public hearing to address any issues that come up.

With that I will open the public hearing and invite Matt Puffer to step forward and you have five minutes. Thank you, [clears throat] Council President. Sorry about my voice. These things happen in the wintertime. Um, [clears throat] so I distributed I thought I had distributed this packet [clears throat] and I'd like to just go through it quickly because time is short. On the first page, this page you'll see the entire flood plane in this section. Nature has created it very nicely and our Meadow Lakes Homeowners Association on the bottom section the southern border [clears throat] um uh is uh right along the edge of the flood plane. So it works really well right now as a natural body. Um, we had a flood in 2019 and actually a 140year flood and we had waters lapping up under our property but no wet pavements or no wet lower level floors. So, we know it works as it is. Now, you can also see from this map that um this development, proposed development takes up a significant amount of this flood plane and changes it. And so we go from something that we know that works into something that we've calculated, assumed, and we maybe monitor construction. And then it's also dependent on maintenance for it to continue to work as designed. I'll go on to the next couple pages which are pulled out of your agenda packet, pages 236 and 237 if you don't have them. And note that there are for brevity's sake three [snorts] different situations in their current design that

city planning I presume engineering staff have said don't meet the design requirements. So I'm a little surprised to hear tonight that everything is okay and has been approved. Um there's the uh specific construct of a uh of a storm water infiltration basin and the notes say that um that those are designed to be too deep according to design standards. There are the storm the floodwater compensatory storage capacity ponds and we'll look at these on the map in just a minute which are also designed too deep and so their volume indications are not correct because the bottom of these are listed at an elevation of of the nearby creek normal water levels are 1,021 to 1,023. So that bottom 5 to 7 ft is going to be filled with water all the time because that's what happens with water tables. The third thing is there are water there's are there are waters that come onto this site from under county 34 and 45th Avenue and um those uh waters typically flow across the entire site in a waterway or a wetlands and are deposited in the creek 2thirds of the way down the flood plane. But as a late step, as they prepare the building site for buildings, they will alter that water flow and send it straight south into the very upstream portion of the Cascade Creek, which sends an increased volume of water, increasing the water speed in the now restored Cascade Creek, increasing the risk of erosion, and

worsening the water quality, which is what DNR was did a nice job of improving. Finally, you'll notice that there is a a design. If you go to this fourth page, this map, you'll notice that there is a entrance from their uh roadway system onto county 34. And I've not seen anything written about the success of applying for that access permit. My sources uh suggest that that has not yet been achieved. So this stepwise process conditional use for a minute it's only a first step and all these other things need to be done but the one of the very first steps is moving dirt around and once that dirt is pulled out of the ground and piled up in another place you've changed the nature's fully functional flood plane and it won't be undone. And these subsequent things that need to be solved as part of this iterative process may be deal breakers if you will for this whole project. And I don't see why we would allow these this mass grading plan to be considered or even um or or even activated when we haven't solved all the problems yet to know that the project is actually doable. So, I think I'm done with my time, but and my voice is still there. I'd happily address any questions you might have.

Thank you, Mr. Puffer. Welcome. Next up, we have Jamie Newman.

Hi, Jamie Newman. Thanks for the opportunity to I'm just gonna keep my comments short. I don't representing myself only in this proposal having lived on Birkshshire. I'm on the end would be least affected by this. But I have two concerns. The one we heard about is the flooding. This this neighborhood especially the eastern side near the road is already prone to flooding and the addition of this uh potential complex is going to lead to more flooding. You also you also looking at it in total new development to the west side of 45th. So, it's not just this area, it's additional developments to the west of there that are going to increase the uh risk of flooding. It's a significant issue and you can't just look at the single development. You have to look globally at what's happening. Additionally, I'm really concerned about traffic with the addition of the Cascade parking structure. 2500 spots I think is the amount. You're adding the additional developments to the west of this complex and then this complex. There's going to be a significant increase in the traffic on that corner. It's already a dangerous corner. Um I I can't quote the uh statistics on accidents there. I just drive by it all the time and keep my fingers crossed when I make that left turn off Second Street. Um and you have uh people who use Cascade Park cross streets and the traffic volume is going to increase and this just worsens the situation. So my concerns are the flooding but also the traffic increase. So thank you. That's all I have to say.

Thank you. Uh uh this is a public hearing. Anyone wishing to be heard on this it item, please step forward. This is a public hearing. Anyone else wishing to be heard on this item, please step forward. Seeing no one, I will close the public hearing and invite Mr. Titon and his team back up to address uh any of the issues that came up during the public hearing.

Uh Mr. Chairman, members of the uh council, um I didn't hear all of them, but I understand there's some concern about the project to the west of the site, which has gone through the council approval, and they are DNR is going to be doing a stream restoration in there to help improve the the uh uh the floodway situation over there. [clears throat] And they also have a condition to fill in the floodway. We we are not filling the floodway. And the city also has, as I understand, a project that they're going to do for flood control over there. If you looked at our plan on the west side is 45th Avenue, and there's some culverts under 45th Avenue that are uh currently I don't know current remember the size of those, but they're not going to be able to let any more water through those culberts than what it is today. That's the that's the key thing here is that water from the west is not coming through here. and the modeling that we've done and and took a look at that as well. So that's all included in the model that Joe Wall produced at bar engineering and we're really confident that our plan is correct and it's not going to flood people out downstream or on the site. Well, that's all I have to say unless there's any other questions.

Thank you. We'll call you back if uh council members have questions.

Council member Palmer had a quick question for staff. I think I asked this last time when we were talking about this project. Country Club Manor Road is a county road. My understanding in the next two to three years it's going to be rebuilt all the way up to the top of the hill. Am I correct on that? I can take that. Uh President, members of the council, um the county is public works team is working on a project to reconstruct county cas. It's a state aid highway. uh 34 all the way from the intersection of West Circle Drive out to uh into the Byron City limits. Uh I would imagine it'll be a phased project where they do a couple different phases and they are planning to have that in their capital improvement plan. I don't have the the year memorized, but they do have that in their capital improvement plan.

Thank you, Council Member Keane. Yeah, just uh for staff here again, um I I do worry when I look at this area, there's a lot of different projects going on. We're looking at a specific conditional use permit here, but can you talk about the timing and the interactions between when we do an approval one mile west of here and there's a lot of like storm water concerns there and they get addressed one way. Um is the assumption then that they don't have any impact on this property or how do we like stack those up on a timeline? Yeah. Well, thank you for the question, uh, Council Member Keane. Um, I mean, for this one in particular, I know that the, uh, Dell web Property of the West and this one, they've been more or less coordinated, but, um, to your point, I think that our public works teammates do look at this at a higher level than just a parcel by parcel basis. Um, you know, how was one project going to affect downstream flow? I assume there's the assumption that the water in the property being developed to the west will all be retained there and will not flood with the with the flow of the creek. Is that is that the assumption or is there a slightly different uh something different I should understand?

I'll take that one. Yeah. So with any of these development projects, they they are required to uh hold the storm water flows back at levels that are meet or are less than what's the existing condition. So they cannot exceed existing condition. So that's all built into the storm water management plan and our our grading and erosion control plans and and we do look at it globally across projects, but each individual developer still needs to meet all of that criteria so that they're not adversely impacting anyone downstream.

Okay. Um the the other thing with this specific I I'm doing I'm dealing specifically with a conditional use permit that has to do with manipulation of topography and changing where the flood plane is and making these sort of changes. I've heard a lot about permitting the work. Is there some step either through DNR or the county or somewhere where somebody validates the work was done and it was done to the standard we had set out to estab to to to get to? Yeah, al along with our team evaluating the design and reviewing the hydraulic modeling, the county acts as the flood plane administrator. So, we work closely with them. If it involves the water of the state, the DNR gets involved. So, all of those different agencies are in this case going to be involved in reviewing this project. So, if I state it differently, before we go on to seeing a general development plan for this property and some and our like storm water people starting to look at it, there'll be other groups that will say yes, what what they started out to do here has been done to the level that pro that allows them to be building in in these areas.

Correct.

Okay. Uh last question on the same sort of thing with permits, but um I I just want to limit I've heard things about we also have a preliminary thing in my my take is we wouldn't start looking at any sort of development plan and approving anything to be built in this area until all of this uh grading and all that's all done before all this dirt is moved and the um that we have a new basis for what the what the flood plane is. Well, we would look at um you know what they've what they've designed, what they're moving around that you know where they're not impacting the flood plan. They could begin to start working on preliminary drawings and design, but um incrementally that that won't happen until this work has occurred. So, you wouldn't be able to approve future um applications until this has happened. I

I guess that's where my question was going. I mean, I I'm almost looking for some sort of standard that someone approves that what was set out to be done here is done and done correctly before we start saying now we can start building on it. Yes, we will do that. And it could be a future condition on another application that says until this is met, you cannot proceed with the following. Okay. I I hear you saying that, sir, but I'm also when I when I do these approvals now, I just want to get it in the record that that's what's going to happen. Um, and I have one other point of clarification for us. Um the p the council um suggested motion doesn't include the three conditions, but if I were to make a motion, I would include the three conditions.

Correct. Yes. And we do have one more speaker before very good. A motion or maybe two. Council member Wall, thank you. Uh over the past weeks and months, we've heard uh a few iterations of some of the concerns that were issued uh tonight. Uh did the staff hear anything new uh tonight that you have not heard before? I'll let the community development team start and then I can answer from a public works perspective. Yeah, I mean it's pretty much the same uh uh um issues that um we've been addressing um through the planning commission process and as well as tonight here with you. Um, we've been talking with both the applicant and those neighboring property owners

and both from what I have uh read and heard, it seems like uh the land owners are in fairly frequent contact with city staff with their questions. That would be correct. We like to be responsive to them. And so, uh, it would appear that what we have is, uh, not necessarily a failure, uh, to communicate in any way, but a disagreement on here's what we believe is good and right so to do that characterize it that way.

Yeah. Okay. uh and the city uh feels that the correct expertise from DNR from the expert uh that Mr. Titon has online for us has sufficiently answered the questions for uh our own staff and being able to recommend that we move ahead. Is that a question council member? Yeah, I I is that is that true? We we've we'll continue to work with, like I said, the other agencies and the design consultant and make sure that it meets all of our standards and specifications and any other permitting requirements.

Thank you, Council Member Miller.

Sure. And this could be a question for staff or the engineering team, but the specific issue that was raised about the depth of retention ponds and uh other excavation, can you address that? And is that is that worked through? Is it going below the the standard water table? What what's occurring is there is a higher water groundwater table out here. So when we look at the water quality treatment and the the the different capacity, we don't count anything below that normal groundwater level. So they have to ex exceed that above that elevation to make sure they have the appropriate storage and um limit the conveyance.

So they would have to build up the grading then to dig down. They they need to be working outside of those elevations and and that's what goes into the computations and calculations. So so no approval would happen which allows them to dig below as the M as Dr. Puffer mentioned they can dig below but it would it would not count towards what they need to meet. So it just would essentially be dead storage that isn't benefiting them.

Okay. Thank you. So it wouldn't count. Um could staff or the engineering team talk about the assumptions particularly with u changing rainfall patterns in the hydraology models. How is this modeled looking forward or is it based on historic data or projected rainfall data? It's based on the current rainfall charts um which have been changing um could change again in the future. So as you are aware our storm water team is working on a comprehensive surface water management plan that starts to get at what are other things we can be doing to think about sustainability and resiliency when it comes to storm water and flooding. And so those sorts of best management practices will continue to happen. the um DNR project to improve the stream is going to be beneficial in this case. So um the team's always thinking about different ways to achieve you know the needs with the changing rainfall

and and could you since you mentioned the updating the models in the broader uh storm water management area I believe that those are being done by section could you talk about where this um and I'm going to use the wrong term but this section of our map and the the project location within the the drainage district or the storm water management district falls like is is that has that model been updated? How's it interact with this project's timeline? That that isn't a model that's been updated. Um those are updated by FEMA and uh I don't know which phase this you know at what point they're they would be updating the Cascade WHED.

Okay. And I guess uh last question, could somebody on staff go through the three conditions and talk about the the the timeline and the specific approval process of each of those conditions? Um, yep. Thank you for the question, uh, Council Member Miller. Um, the three conditions are more or less related to what comes next. Um, so the first one would be obviously, uh, they would need full approval for the grading plan, um, before they can move any of the dirt. Um, and so that would be the next step. Um, and then the and who would who evaluates that? And our public works team. Public works. Okay.

Oh, thank you. I was forgetting the second one. Um and then the second one is any of the wetland impacts that they may or may not propose uh would have to be approved by the technical evaluation panel um through the local government unit which is Mstead County. Um so if they want to do that then they have to get that approval. If no approval then they can't disturb those wetlands. Um and then lastly um a second flood plane development permit will be required for the actual building and structures and roads. And I apologize council president. I do actually have one final question. Go ahead. They were all great questions. Council member,

so under the um condition the nothing can be approved that would cause a net a new net rise. Correct. There was also a concern brought up about water quality. Are there any considerations of not worsening water quality or how would the velocity of storm water entry into the project with the prior stream restoration be considered in a net neutral or improvement kind of consideration? that that gets back to um what I noted earlier is we think about um no adverse impacts. So the water quality the the volumes need to be um meet our MS4 permit. So that that's all very clearly laid out such that we're not again adversely affecting downstream.

So it's not just the level. Yeah, it's other no other adverse impacts either. Correct. Okay. Thank you council member. Actually two of your questions were my questions so they were answered. Any further questions? Seeing none, is there a motion on this item? I can make a motion. Go ahead, Council Member Palmer. I'll make a motion to adopting a resolution approving conditional use permit number CD 2025- Z007 CUP by ML Group One LLC for the placement of excavated fill within the 100-year floodprone subdiv subd district and compos storm water area improvement for the future development of a multif family development project.

Do you want to cite the three conditions and the three conditions? Second. A motion made by council member Palmer, seconded by council member Keen. Any further discussion? Council member Palmer, go ahead. The one thing in that I will bring up is is that the now the Dell Well project which is was the Negan farm. If you look at the map with the Cascade Creek, it's a straight run shot. Um farm fields don't retain a lot of uh water. Um not to bang on egg, but this will be a huge improvement for this entire area. And the improvement we've already done at Metal Lakes Golf Course has been already a huge improvement um with the DNR and if you look at that how that meanders through um you can see how that helps out water quality and and I think this is important for people to realize that.

Council member Keane. Yeah. Again, I'm going to support this uh resolution tonight. I guess my my comments more for community development. I look at the the full resolution as presented in our packet page 249 with the conditions with the therefors. Um, again, it's it's what I feel like I'm voting on, but what I I don't care for the fact that we put in something um for the future development of a multif family housing. It's just not part of what we're voting on, and we really shouldn't have it in there. What we're do, we're really doing a a very tightly narrowed def definition of a conditional use permit, and I'd rather not muddy the waters to say it has to do with some other project. So, just for future consideration. Any further discussion? Seeing none. All in favor say I.

I. Oppose say nay. Nay. Motion passes 521 with council member Millie Miller voting nay. Moving on to uh G2 which is major land subdivision by Bigalow Homes LLC to be known as Westbury First. Mr. Miguel.

Uh thank you council member or council president Schubing. Members of the council. Good evening. My name is Desmond Mciel. be introducing this application for you. Uh the applicant is requesting a uh major land subdivision on uh 35 acres of land that is zoned R2. Uh the request is for 100 single family 105 single family lots um to be known as Westberry First. Uh the site is located just east of 60th uh Avenue Northwest and approximately 500 ft south of King Arthur Avenue. Um the uh present presently the uh site is undeveloped uh and is used for agricultural production. The overall area uh is encompassed by the encompassed by the subdivision plat is 68 acres in size. Uh the 105 residential units and the Parkland site comprises phase one of the development which is 35 acres in size. Approximately 33 acres uh on the south side of this uh site will be held for future development of a phase two of the project. This is uh represented as outlaws B and C on on the subject plat. Uh the general development plan for this project was approved uh last March uh consisting of 220 single family lots uh with lots generally being 55 ft in width and 120 ft in depth. uh and uh the 8 acre dedicated parkland site. Um the connectivity index score on this is 1.55 uh which does meet the requirements of the UDC. Uh this uh this phase of the development will extend uh two local streets which are Lion Hart and Gate House Drive from the north and west sides respectively. Uh there will also uh be two local streets extended in the

future as part of phase 2. Uh one to the east and one to the south uh which will be stubbed and extended into the future development of the uh joining project which is Highland Preserve. Um phase one of West Berry has a total of 63 lots which are uh um just have a single point of access. Uh condition number three requires that a temporary fire access road be constructed uh through phase two um to provide a second point of access. Um or alternatively uh the developer can sprinkle all 63 of those units with a sprinkling system. Uh the development review committee is uh and the planning commission are recommending uh approval of this application. uh planning and zoning commission uh did unanimously recommend approval subject to the five conditions uh present uh in the staff report. Uh that concludes my presentation and I'd be happy to answer any questions that you may have.

Thank you, Mr. McIll. Is there a representative of the applicant here? Please step forward and uh identify yourself and you have 10 minutes.

Um good evening. Kyle Scove with WHKS. I'm representing the uh developer Bigalow Homes. Um we are in agreement with all the conditions proposed. Um and I'm available to answer any questions. We are looking forward to this development 105 um affordable lots and added to the community. So, thank you and we'll call you up after the public hearing. Uh this is a public hearing. Anyone wishing to be heard on this item, please step forward. This is a public hearing. Anyone wishing to be heard on this item, please step forward. Seeing no one, I will close the public hearing and invite Mr. Skull back up. Any comments at this point, I'll ask my colleagues if they have questions. Council member Palmer. A question for community development. And this is kind of inquisitive question. Isn't the minimum lot size in this area um 3,000 square feet?

It is. And if my math is correct, 55* 125 is 6,800 square feet. That's correct. And this being an infill project, I would think that you'd want smaller lots. I know you and I can't do anything about that and that's the market that drives that, right? Um Okay. Thanks.

Any other questions on this item? Is there a motion on this item? I'll move to adopt a resolution approving major land subdivision CD 2026001 plat by Bigalow Homes LLC to be known as Westbury First with five conditions subdividing 35.4 acres into 105 residential lots, four outlots and a dedicated city park land parcel. Motion made by council member Keen and I didn't hear which of the two of you said that. you uh council me and seconded by council member Wall, council member Keane.

Uh no, again I I was uh involved in the the neighborhood information meeting for this project. Um I did a little checking today just looking at the uh connectivity indexes here with this idea that you do the connectivity indexes on the whole thing and then you build it in parts. So you don't have that all at the upfront, but it seems to hold together. Um, I was worried about the one access point and again it was explained to me that the that's a fire will um call that out and we'll we'll get that resolved before it gets built. So, uh, with that, I'd be comfortable supporting this tonight. Council member Wall,

uh, I met Mr. Keane in the parking lot for this neighborhood information meeting. We came a little late, both coming from some other uh, uh, city uh, obligations. uh and the people there seemed uh probably most concerned about traffic, but that would be true of uh any additional uh housing or business that [clears throat] one would add to the streets. Uh we believe that Biglo Homes is uh really very responsibly offering housing that will cater especially to uh young families in an area that is exploding uh with young families and I'm very happy to support the project. Council member Miller.

Yeah, I'll just say I I do plan to support this, but in the broader conversation, I I know we're talking about connectivity and access, and the way I understand that and Mr. Wall's point is well taken that people are concerned about traffic impacts because it does feel like their only access option is likely going to be driving. So, as we're talking about families and other people living in the community, we've heard about the importance of transit. Um, I do worry about a development pattern that doesn't consider alternate access. We're going through a project this year to reconnect neighborhoods south on 18th Avenue Southwest. We've talked about disconnected parcels. And I do worry that in this current iteration, we are creating more disconnected parcel problems. Um, if we consider travel modes beyond just owning a vehicle. So again, I I I look forward to having a bigger discussion about this. I look forward to public works bringing a presentation later this spring. Um, but I do share the concern about how we're growing and what options we're providing to families when we know that transportation costs are the second highest after housing cost and thinking about those two things together. So, I'll just make that point, but do plan to support this tonight because this is a policy that we've set forth.

Seeing no other questions, all in favor say I. I. Post say nay. Motion passes. Moving on to our reports and recommendations. We have uh H1, which is professional services contract amendment for Bolton and Mink. And uh this was pulled by council member Wall. Council member Wall. Thank you. I I have pulled this for uh the opportunity to uh more explore uh the uh reallocation of some funding within this project uh and to uh really it provides an update for the community as to how we are progressing on the Sixth Street project.

Thank you. Uh Mr. Samson Brown, do you want to talk about the item?

Good evening, council president, council members. Uh we're here tonight uh requesting your your authorization of a contract amendment with Bolton the Bank in the amount of 981,449 for the Sixth Street Bridge project. Uh the Sixth Street Bridge Project uh bridge road safety and riverfront improvement projects will construct a bridge to improve access to neighborhoods, the riverfront and key destinations downtown. Provide equitable transportation access with walking and biking infrastructure being added. implement traffic calming and other safety improvements to manage traffic and speeding using a complete streets design on Sixth Street Southeast and improve the Zumbro River access while maintaining flood protection along with uh creating a new connection to link uh BRT eastern terminus. Uh as of this evening, the project is approaching uh 90% completion of design plans. Uh we are actively submitting permits required for the project uh going to uh US Army Corps of Engineers and FEMA. [snorts] In fact, the one uh FEMA I believe was submitted earlier today. Uh we are also working with uh Canadian Pacific Kansas City Railroad to obtain permitting for the new bridge adjacent to their rail spur along with getting design approval from them and negotiating a construction agreement and obtaining uh needed uh rightaway easements on CPQC owned property. And we're also moving through the rideway exition process uh for needed for the project uh which is about 80 uh% complete as of uh this month. The amendment uh in question primarily reflects uh three primary activities. Uh additional preliminary design work needed. Uh it's been a combination of uh

bridge design options being analyzed, hydraulic modeling to see if uh those options can be permitted uh along with understanding regulatory requirements and also uh looking at different concepts. So for instance uh the original concept uh called for a clear span bridge. After getting into the design and doing the math and understanding the hydraulics of the floodway uh through this area of the project, uh clear span was not possible uh due to the taller depth of the beams that would be required which uh created an impediment to uh the river flowing underneath. Therefore, we had to add peers. as we add peers in the river that's a different form of water blockage and needed to work through several design iterations uh to get to a point where those were satisfactory to submit permits on. Uh the second area was just refinement uh the initial scope of the project again that happened in uh 2023. Uh some areas were unknown in terms of how much environmental uh contamination investigation may be may be needed adjacent to the ampy site. Uh we've also got into things like uh requesting a variance from mindot uh in order to save trees and reduce the total clear zone width uh so that those trees can remain adjacent to the multi-use trail in through the slably park neighborhood and things like wetland delineations which are based on area of impact which isn't really uh determined until we get through the preliminary design phase. And then also the third area of additional uh work effort involves uh just public engagement. We did multiple rounds of public engagement was which was not originally comp contemplated by the base contract agreement. Uh and through that work we've added enhancements such as uh changes to the Riverside school uh elementary school dropoff sequencing and location. Uh we added streetscaping elements uh along the street area uh rest areas and area

uh small landscape nodes to to beautify the corridor. And then [snorts] we uh detailed some uh riverfront enhancements. So um so while it's a rather uh larger uh number for a contract amendment uh we when you compare the total estimated cost of construction which is currently in the magnitude of uh 28 to 29 million. The design fee represents about 13.5% of the projected construction budget which is within typical industry standards of 12 to 18% for projects of this level of complexity uh that include highquality public spaces and also regulatory and permitting complexity. Uh in a desire for maximum transparency about uh the numbers involved, we've asked Bolton and Mink and the city multiple city staff including help from the public works department negotiated over a period of almost two months with Bolton and Mink to prepare an 11-page contract amendment uh to provide the max amount of detail uh regarding each area of effort that uh is needed to uh complete the design and and and finalize the project and prepare bid documents for uh later this summer that I'd be happy to answer any additional questions.

Council member Wall. Thank you, Mr. Samson Brown, and thank you and to Miss Steinhauser for extra information today. Um I I this is a project like all projects that have a finite number of dollars assigned to it. I I think this one's 36.5 million. Is that correct? Yes.

Okay. Um, and my concern in initially reading the item is by assigning an extra million dollars or so to uh the uh little more than $3 million that uh was assigned to project design initially. Uh that by necessity we take a million away from perhaps construction. And we I I think the whole council wants the very best project possible and have every dollar possible to uh pour into the project to be able to deliver u the really nice renderings and the amenities that uh we saw uh that we've seen over years now, lots of years. Uh how how is the staff uh working uh to ensure through value engineering uh that even if we assign this extra million dollars uh to design that we will eventuate this uh project that really will be a jewel for uh entry into downtown and to further uh invigorate the neighborhood. Miss Steinhauser, were you gonna answer or I I I got a kind of a nod from Miss Steinhauser. So,

okay, I'll start. Perhaps Miss Steinhauser may answer. So, um Council Member Wall, uh you know, going back six to nine months, which is really the time period where we started those iterations on what the bridge might look like. Uh we've met uh weekly as a staff uh bi-weekly with the consulting team again to evolve the project. We've always had at our forefront the primary outcomes of the project. Uh we had series of uh listening sessions with community members. So we've also adjusted our focus. But uh in terms of value engineering, the prioritization always went to what what caused the project to be created first. What were we hearing from neighborhood uh members as most important residents of the public? And uh we've really just while we've scaled back perhaps for instance landscaping, we don't have as many trees and bushes as we initially hoped to have on this project, but we still have them because beautifification and enhancements along the waterfront uh was an important aspect of of the project. So, uh again, we just work through it an iterative process, but we always go back to why did this project start and make sure we're not missing any pieces.

Thank you, Mr. Samson Brown. Miss Steinhauser.

Sure. Thank you, Council President Schub, and um members of the council for the question. The only other thing that I would add to Mr. Samson's Brown's um comments are um as part of that due diligence and value engineering um a lot of what we did in terms of bringing cost down were around means and methods. For example, on landscaping, the means and methods might be seeding instead of potted plants, which are a fraction of the cost. Right? Those are the ways in which we approached value engineering so we could retain, you know, the original intent. um uh delivering a design that had the elements that Mr. Samson Brown um spoke of and which came out loud and clear through the engagement the additional engagement we did with the neighbors when we bring it forward from a bidding perspective it will the I think you'll find that the bids the bid documents will reflect that um some may live as an ad alternate just because of the bidding climate that we're in so that we aren't putting ourselves in a situation where we have to um completely reject all bids but rather we can be judicious in continuing to bring the project forward in a way that um was envisioned in the small area plan.

Thank you. Any further questions? Is there a motion? I'll make the motion to authorize a contract amendment with Bolton and M in the amount of $981,449 for the Sixth Street Bridge neighborhood safety and riverfront improvement project. Project number J7919. Second. U moved by council member Keane, seconded by council member Palmer. Council member Keane.

Yeah, I actually I appreciate council member Wall bringing this up. I think whenever I see um you know that sort of thing, some of them I almost feel are inevitable as you go through the regulatory thing. Um in some of the discussion today after council member Wall brought this up, I saw some you know I I thought it was important sort of comments. Um one is that like value engineering has been applied on these sort of projects and that's that's become a a bad word for me. where you know you start out with a project that has all these cool things and then you take them out near the end and I think that's what we have to protect from happening but in that same thing I I there was a thing the structural integrity the safety the hydraulic performance and the long-term viability of the bridge are not being reduced in any way and I I think that was the nature of you pulling this is to say let's make sure we keep our eye on the prize so I appreciate that

any further comments all in favor say I post say nay motion passes unanimously ly. Um, moving on to our ordinance first readings. Go ahead, Mr. Spindler. Craig.

Thank you, Mr. President. [clears throat] Item J1, an ordinance creating and enacting chapter 5-24 of title 5 of the Rochester Code of Ordinances relating to film permits. Moving on to item J2, an ordinance reszoning approximately 13 acres of land located west of Highway 63 and north of 60th Street Southwest identified by pin number 045418 from AG agriculture to R1 mixeduse single family and amending ordinance number 4478 known as the unified development code of the city of Rochester, Minnesota. Moving on to a second reading. Item K1, an ordinance reszoning approximately 2.04 04 acres of land located at the southwest corner of East Center Street and 6th Avenue Southeast identified by pins pin numbers two 026571 through 026576 and 026578 through 026583 and 026585 from R2X low density residential infill to R4 four highdensity residential and amending ordinance number 4478 known as the unified development code of the city of Rochester, Minnesota.

Move approval. Motion made by council member Keane. Second. Seconded by council member Wall. All in favor say I. I. Post say nay. Motion passes. Moving on to other business. Council member Palmer has two items. the county land use plan amendment issue which was heard by the county uh last evening and uh tax increment financing policy. Go ahead council member.

Thank you sir. Um well first of all I'd like to thank the community development um department and all the people who worked with them with the county on the um loop with the county. Last night we had a meeting and it was um an interesting meeting and we now has been continued um so the city can work with the developer. It's an exciting time for us and I and I enjoyed watching the cooperation with the township and the county last night and it's been great to see that that we're working together um to achieve something I think that in the long run will be great um as interim development comes around and this is one of the projects that we'll have in development. Um it's an interesting concept. We have two of them already in Rochester. Uh one of them off of 48th Street. Um, but again, it it's it it's great to see how we're cooperating with our our township people. I sat next to uh John Johnson, who has been a township officer at Havel for 18 years. Um, and uh, he looks forward to working with our our staff on this with the developer.

Thank you.

Um, and then the second one is, um, there there is a need for there's a need for us to look at our TIFF policy and have it come back to the city council um, sooner than later. um development just can't wait until I think May or June. Um the need for for attainable housing is great right now. Um and and right now we're adding about 20% of the cost to an apartment, which translates into about $200 more a month. Um I don't want to really get into the facts right here, but I do really want to get us as a council to look at our tiff policy and um and see what we can do. So, hope Miss Miss Elms that we can get um this on our agenda sooner than later because time is money.

Uh Miss Elms, go ahead.

Council President, council members, you did approve a um a contract during your last uh economic development authority meeting that talks about getting things done and bringing something to you in June. And there's a lot of important information that we need to go into that. So, um, we I I believe you also received an email from staff explaining that, um, the current request falls outside of the TIFF policy that you've adopted. So, if you want to change the t policy, that would be up to you. But, I would be a little bit concerned that if we aren't able to get the valuable information from the um, consultant that we've contracted with that that might not be money well spent and that you might not be fully informed on what your um, tiff policy changes might be. And with that, I would ask if Josh has any other information. Thank you. Thank you. Uh thanks, president, council members. Um yeah, I would just add that we're also going through an urban 3 analysis which also has a tiff component in it which will provide additional uh useful information to help um you know help with our recommendations for the tiff policy moving forward.

Council member Keane.

Yeah. Again, I I think I know the the precise project that um Council Member Palmer is talking about and I I just want to be a little clear here. There's two different things going on here. One is, you know, does this project uh meet the standard for TIF through through our our policy? And then the second thing is should we wave one of the requirements of getting TIFF? And they're two different things. Before we get into and should we wave something, it's my understanding that this project hasn't reached the standard yet where the staff would say, hey, based on what we have uh lined up for TIF, whether it be affordable housing or blighting, whatever those things are, this project hasn't met it. So, just to jump into the idea that we need to change what the policy is, I think we're getting ahead of ourselves. I think there's two different problems here. One is, does this project meet the standard that we've set up for ourselves? And then secondly, is there something about our proc our policy and our requirements that is hurting the ability to build affordable housing in Rochester? I think they're two unique topics.

Thank you, M. Council Member Keane, and you uh explain that exactly how I look at the issue as well. It's there's a project out there uh that has uh its needs but there is our policy and I think they need to be looked at separately. If the uh if the project gets to us then then we may look at that exemption but I think the the uh the pol policy itself is on a road looks like we're going to look at it in June is is it uh that's correct it's it's scheduled for June 22nd at the moment

so and I have not heard that it needs to be ex expedited is council member Palmer

well don't jump to a conclusion. I'm not looking at a project. What I'm looking at is an overall policy in in in the policy that we have and how does it help um attain affordable housing for us or attainable housing for us. Not not because if you just look at a project, you don't get good decisions. But if you look at the overall policy, the problem what I'm having is is that five months from now, we're going to look at this and and that's a long period of time. and and we have other developers who are going to be coming to town going, "Oh, I can't do this." But if you have a policy that we've looked at, maybe it'll be a four to three vote, maybe a three or four vote, but I think that we need to take the time to look at it as a council and make a wise decision. Council member Miller.

Yeah, I'll just say I I appreciate the discussion. I also had the opportunity to meet with community development. It was a very productive discussion and I would not want to expedite this tiff review process ahead of the existing projects that we've contracted to have a more thorough involved discussion and so I appreciate the urgency of individual projects and yes I wish it could happen sooner but I would much rather have a comprehensive discussion with all of the right information and considerations and not change our tiff policy and then change it again because I think that unpredictability um is is not good governance either. Any other comments? Council member Keane, a different topic. Uh, but just I this a new other other business. That's it's another other other

very good. I I didn't know of it. It didn't think strike me to do this beginning, but I didn't just change my seat for the fun of it. I I wanted to just Can I just say something about other business? I one I think I I know I and I know our administration really appreciates when other business is comes up. I think we can be flexible with other business. I I think if you know you're going to bring other business up uh and give us a heads up, that's appreciated as well.

Yeah. I I was just going to say the seating arrangement. Um this wasn't I just decided to move to a different seat. Um Council Member Doring was going to take the end there. So because he's using a wheelchair right now, it is better accessibility form and we'll just do that switch until we don't need to do it anymore. Sounds good. Thanks for pointing that out. Seeing no other business, is there a motion to adjurnn? I'll make a motion to adjurnn. Motion by council member Frederick's. Second. Second by council member wall. All in favor say I. I. Oppose say nay. We are adjourned. I said,