Code of Ethics Adjudicating Body - Regular Meeting

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An on screen message will prompt you to unmute and speak. K. Have the pleasure of allegiance before I even say the Yep. Concern kind of Alright. Anyone want to bother you?

You go. No callers at this time Today, consent calendar, all matters listed under the consent calendar are considered routine by the board of ethics and may be enacted by one motion in the form listed below. There will be no separate discussion of these, items unless before the Board of Ethics votes on the motion to adopt members of the Board of Ethics or staff request specific items to be removed from the consent calendar for a separate action. We just have minutes. You go.

December 5.

I make a motion to approve I

second. Ready?

Motion passes unanimously. Thank you.

Alright. Discussion calendar. Again, audience participation is encouraged. Public comments are limited to three minutes. We have the ad hoc committee to research subpoena power and authority to compel city employee slash representatives to appear as witnesses as witness for board of ethics hearing update. Do we have anybody online in there for comments or anything?

There are no callers on the line.

You kidding?

Had an interesting research Mhmm. Aspect to this, and it gave me the opportunity to even look at our charter. And there were some specifics made there. We had a chance to speak to Justin. Is it I say Jason?

Is it just Jason Hunter. Jason. Yeah. Jason Hunter. And we looked through some of the aspects and gathered some information there that was particularly interesting of the fact that we discovered that there was some power of attorney aspect being granted for all commissions and board as well as and then specifically, you know, when I looked into further to us more specific for the police commission in itself. But Lou mister Hernandez, if you wanted to detail some of

the information that you you received. So, yeah, as mister Vega mentioned, we set up an appointment for with mister Hunter, and he kinda pointed us in the right direction as far as pointing out that in the charter, there are some limited powers as far as when it comes to the subpoena thing. And, you know, the police review commission has those direct subpoena powers. Whereas other boards and commissions, if we look at charter the the city charter section eight and where it says the organization meetings and subpoena power. This is section eight zero four.

And when it comes to the second paragraph, it actually states in there. If I can get this website to work correctly, that would be fantastic. Hold on one second. There we go. Okay.

Second paragraph. Bless you. Except except as may be otherwise provided in the charter, the city manager shall designate a secretary for the recording of minutes for each of the such board members and commissions who shall keep a record of its proceedings and transactions. Each board of commission may prescribe its own rules and regulations which shall be consistent with the charter and copies of which shall be kept on file in the office of the city clerk where they shall be available for public inspection. Each Board or Commission may request for the City Council the power to compel the attendance of witnesses to compel the production of evidence before it and to administer oaths and affirmation.

The city council by resolution shall have sole power to provide such power to the boards and commissions. So while we don't have direct subpoena power, we can go to city council and ask them to, compel someone to come to or provide the evidence that we're, you know, researching for a hearing. So that is in the charter. What what we were thinking was the fact that the police review commission has direct subpoena power. We don't see why the board of ethics shouldn't have the same power given that if, you know, police officers are held to that level of accountability.

No. We don't see why, you know, through their investigations, why city council can't be as well. So that is one of the things that we need to research further and what it would take to, you know, get those subpoena powers for the well, direct subpoena powers for the board of ethics.

So I still don't know why we need it. We've never had to use it. It's not and and also when police officers are held to that standard, it's because it's a legal transaction. It it affects, you know, their job, and it's it it's a a legal matter. This is not this is not anything like that.

Again, we would have to go and ask city council to allow it, which we'd have to get it put on an agenda, which means it would have to be the following month, which means it's still delayed anyway. It's a like, I just don't I still don't get the obsession with this. Sorry. I don't get it.

Well, I think the whole purpose of seeking the subpoena power is and I understand that, you know, the argument is, you know, office police officers deal with legal matters, but when it comes to city council, that can sometimes deal with legal matters as well. And even though, a situation hasn't arise where you needed subpoena power, that's not to say in the future, a situation may not arise where there is a city staff member or, you know, city council member who doesn't want to testify or provide any evidence. And what happens when when you come to

That's their right. If they don't want to and they don't want to defend themselves and they don't want to come and present evidence, they don't they don't have to.

And I I agree with Jessica. Also the difference with the cops is that's having to do with laws and crimes. We don't we don't deal with that. Crimes and laws, we don't if any of the things that come before us have to do with a crime, it's not ours. We don't do that. Nope. That's a whole separate thing. We don't deal with breaking the law. We deal with violating the code of ethics. That's a whole whole different thing, whole different world. I agree. I just can't see where why we would ever need this. You know?

I I agree with mister Hernandez, though. I believe that the fact that the charter gives us the ability to do this on some level, there could come a time when we do. And and if it's something that we can pursue, I I don't understand the resistance,

The was not not enforceable. I would well, it was originally kinda thought of when we were gathering some of the other aspects and improvements of the of, you know, the ethics code and the idea of something like this happening. You know, it's it has to happen probably before, but you mentioned that we did have some sort of or was it always just

like No. It was just something that was written. We did the research again to find out what what it would take and whether we can enforce it and what how often it's ever been put into use, and all of it came up with to strike it out of our charter. And we voted to do that, and we submitted it, and I still don't know why it's still here.

Yeah. Because

it's supposed to have been gone.

Well, you know, the the mere fact that I was thinking, what if, you know, a situation comes into be where we're dealing with a city council person or the mayor? You know?

Right. And the way that it's written right now, we would have to go to city council and say, hey. Would you please mind enforcing this for us? And if they're if it's against themselves, they're gonna say no.

Right. And we know what it is. And that's where we were thinking of conflict of interest or or what have you in that situation because, you know, unless we're gonna be used like a rubber stamp to to follow the follow-up on this process. I thought that some some sort of independency just like the police commission

That's right.

Has. Yeah.

But we're not the police. And, again, we're not dealing with crimes. And, again, when we rule if we don't get evidence that we're asking for and find someone guilty, that that is still public record. It still can have the same effect on whether they get reelected or not. The subpoena isn't gonna make any difference.

Actually, it will because granted we're not police, but neither is the board of the police review commission. Those are all citizens, residents of Riverside, and they only, you know, oversee. It's kinda like the board of ethics for the police. They don't have you know, they don't go to the police and tell them you have to do this. They report to the city council. So

But it that directly affects their job and their income, and they have the power to do something about it. Ana? We don't. That's the bottom line. How how? It's not we're not getting it

with subpoena. So my question is if so it sounds like three board members want to pursue this. Two of us don't. So what would be the next step if if it's decided that we should pursue this? What what specifically happens next? Who does what? Who does what when, and what happens with it? What's the next thing?

Well well, we're still in the Specifically. We're still in the research phase of all of this. We still need to gather more information. And, you know, granted, we've obviously you know, we reviewed the charter and, you know, that we can go to city council and ask them to compel someone. But, you know, I think that there's more research that needs to be done as far as seeking direct subpoena power from the board of the board of ethics like the police review commission had.

So so the next so the next action is to find out how do we get this subpoena power that the police commission has. That's the question Run. To be answered. How do we get this power? And then what if we're told you can't? Then then what? If we can't, but if Okay. So who do you ask this question of? So I'm very my I'm very detail oriented. It's like, who does what? Who asks what question upon, and what happens next?

Well, one of the main things would probably be go to the police review commission and ask them how, you know, how they got the subpoena power. Obviously, talking to other individuals in the city to discover, you know, how we go about that if it's even possible and how long it'll take. So, you know, it's all a process of doing research and meeting with individuals to find out if it's even possible. Obviously, it's possible because it's in the city charter and You're right. One of our commissions already has that direct power.

That's correct. Well, that so if our if our ad hoc committee is willing to go do this research, then that's fine with me. I but I agree with Jessica. I don't know why, but if if you guys are willing and three of a majority of this board wants to pursue it, then I would think, okay. Go ahead and keep keep doing what you need to do to find out what you need to find out.

You know, I just always Go ahead and break a leg.

No, that's I do.

Well, I do see some purpose with and we may not see any aspect in terms of being generated in the immediate future. We're looking at the trying to avoid any particular conflict of interest, especially with the city council. And so far, you know, some of the complaints that we've had, not to say that it would arise to this, but it's been with city council. Exactly. Yeah. So it's Away. Yeah. It's always well, always. People's framers? Yeah.

Because the fact that I just, you know, I see that that I I feel that there's some issue that we need to deal at that point. Well, I

appreciate you guys, the diligence that you have with this matter. I I don't I I don't ever wanna be a part of a board as a rubber stamp. I I believe that, you know, when I decided to do this, it it was, you know, to for a purpose, not just as a rubber stamp. So Mhmm. I'm I'm glad that you guys are pursuing whatever we can do.

I wanna say I don't think we have ever acted as a rubber stamp. I agree. Time and time on this, I'm I feel offended I do too. That that's even a suggestion we've never been. Every single thing we have looked at specifically and say, does this violate the know, we we're very, very careful in questioning everyone and making a careful decision. We've never rubber stamped.

I wasn't talking about you. I said me. I don't ever you're never part of a rubber stamp. You are never no. No. That's what I said. Right. It had nothing to do with you.

It's just me speaking.

But that's us as a group. Yeah. That that we're

When not I was speaking, I was speaking for me. Okay. And then I don't wanna be a rubber stamp. That's what I said. And you will not.

I trust you will not. I will not. You have integrity.

And I think, overall, I think the importance of this is as the board of ethics, If the whole point of us is to have a hearing and to and, you know, to hear the evidence and to determine whether a city council member has violated the code of conduct or, you know, things like that. I think it's important that we have the power to be able to gather more evidence and determine whether someone is has, you know, violated those Yep. Those rules. And if we don't have all the information, it gets difficult to determine that. And the more information we have and we can gather makes it easier to make those determinations.

Agreed. And it facilitates transparency

That's right.

You know, even more, you know. And, you know, again, we will pursue some of the aspects, you know, doing some a little bit more research and stuff, but I thought that was really interesting what we've discovered so far. I do too. Do we need to make any kind of

motion or anything, or do we just listen to the report and say,

No. That was just our findings as of right now, and we'll continue to gather more information and report back in the next session the next our next session, obviously, once we approve that.

Thank you for doing all that work. Yeah. Interesting information. Even though I disagree, I I really appreciate you doing the work. It's important. Thank you. You and I'm glad it's not me. So you guys just you

go ahead. Aye.

So do we need to make a motion to be able to cover No.

It was already a doctor made

it to you. Would it be put on the next Agenda. In the agenda next to continuing process? Items for future board consideration as requested by board ethics members. Only items that fall within the powers of duties of the board as set forth in the city charter and or the Riverside Municipal Code will be agendized for future discretion of which is.

I'm just did we were we supposed to ask for any public comment on that last discussion?

Well, there was no callers on the line. That's it. We're missing the item that asked us to report if any of us had attended any meetings representing board of FI.

No. We haven't any meetings, any any I wouldn't attend it in that path. I think this is it. Our next board meeting ESSEX board meeting is scheduled for Thursday, February 6 at 5PM. Oh, by the way, just I was just thinking the this is end of the year. They were the mayor's office combining all the state. Oh, the state of the city? Yeah. Anybody have not put any of your time? Because it's I am.

I am. Well, the So

other than that When is it?

It is it The thirtieth. I think January 30. I believe I I did not. It's a email. Yeah. It's a

I didn't. That's what I'm telling you.

Tell you. I will. Yeah.

You did. Okay.

Right. Anything else today? No? Okay. Without further ado, we don't have anything else to discuss. We adjourn the meeting at this time.