Board of Commissioners - Regular Meeting

🎵 🎵 Bye. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you. A call to order the Ramsey County Board of Commissioners. Roll call, please. Jevin Singh. Here. McGuire. Here. McMurtry. Here. Miller.

Moran. Here. Zong. Here. And Ortega.

Hi. Can we stand for the Pledge of Allegiance?

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Land acknowledgment. I believe that's Commissioner Singh.

Every community owes its existence and vitality to generations from around the world who contributed their hopes, dreams, and energy to make the history that led to this moment. Some were brought here against their will, some were drawn to leave their distant homes in hope of a better life, and some have lived on this land since time immemorial. Truth and acknowledgement are critical to building mutual respect and connection across all barriers of heritage and difference. We are standing on the ancestral lands of the Dakota people. We want to acknowledge the Ojibwe, the Ho-Chunk, and the other nations of people who also call this place home. We pay respects to their elders past and present. Please take a moment to consider the treaties made by the tribal nations that entitle non-native people to live and work on traditional native lands. Consider the many legacies of violence, displacement, migration, and settlement that bring us together here today. And please join us in uncovering such truths at any and all public events.

Thank you. The agenda of July 28, 2026.

Mr. Chair, I'd like to make a motion to amend the agenda for July 28th, 2026 to add RBA 2026-284, which is a joint power amendment with the City of St. Paul for emergency shelters to the agenda.

Thank you. I also want to add, amend the agenda to move up county connections before the administrative items. We do have a staff person here who we want to recognize as doing the county connections.

So moved.

Second.

Second.

Roll call, please.

Chapin Singh?

Aye.

McGuire? Aye. McMurtry? Aye. Miller?

Aye.

Moran?

Aye.

Zong? Aye. And Ortega?

Aye. I'd like to entertain a motion now on the amended agenda. So moved.

Second.

Hearing no discussion, roll call.

Jebensingh? Aye. McGuire? Aye. McMurtry? Aye. Miller? Moran. Aye. Zong. Aye. And Ortega.

Aye. County Connections. Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for the courtesy this morning, Commissioners, to recognize a staff member as the team needs to. get back to the office. So today I would love to bring up the team and also Vicky Kornakos. She is a medical investigator. Come on up. I have your family and your team. She's a medical investigator, too, with the Ramsey County Medical Examiner's Office. Vicky received the very prestigious award of the 2026 Medical Legal Death Investigator of the Year Award from the International Association of Coroners and Medical Examiners. This prestigious national award recognizes an investigator who has demonstrated outstanding professional service, exceptional public service, and significant contributions to the field of medical legal death investigations. It is one of the profession's highest honors and is awarded by a leading international organization dedicated to advancing excellence in the field. So Vicki has been working with Ramsey County since 1991. She's dedicated more than three decades to serving families, supporting law enforcement, and ensuring the highest standards of professionalism during some of the community's most difficult moments. She is the first investigator in the history of the Ramsey County Medical Examiner's Office to receive this national recognition. So on behalf of myself, Vicki, and our board, I would like to just congratulate you on this remarkable achievement. Thank you. Thank you. I did ask Vicki to bring her, do you have your award? I wanted her to be able to show her hardware here to everybody. I know this is a lot of the folks from the medical examining team, so Vicki, if you want to say a couple words, I'll just turn the mic over to Gloria D.C. M. Reyes here after you're done.

Well, thank you for acknowledging me. I appreciate that. It is an honor to receive this award. I have given many years of my life to Ramsey County and look forward to giving a little bit more. Again, thank you.

We do want to take a photo if we can. I don't know if anybody is around.

Yeah?

OK. Oh, great. Thank you. So thank you so much, Chair, Board of Commissioners, and County Manager Becker for acknowledging Vicky. She's a tremendous asset to the Medical Examiner's Office. And to receive this award really puts us on the map. across the country. And so we are just really honored. And thank you, Vicki, for all your work with Ramsey County. And this is a really tough job, as you know. And so anything to celebrate and reward our staff is really important. So thank you for this time.

Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you for your service. Photo?

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

OK, moving forward, I'll entertain a motion on the minutes of July 14, 2026.

So moved. Second.

Seeing no discussion, roll call.

Jebin Singh.

Aye.

McGuire. Aye. McMurtry. Aye. Miller.

Aye.

Moran. Aye. Zong. Aye. And Ortega.

Aye. We move now to the administrative agenda.

Yes, I move the following administrative items. Number three, appointments to the Workforce Innovation Board of Ramsey County. Number four, Ramsey County 2026 Cooperative Deer Management Plan. Number five, acceptance of operation and maintenance funding from the Met Council. Number six, staffing study recommendations for the adult detention and requests for personal complement increase. I'd like to pull this item. And number seven, adding the joint powers agreement with the city of St. Paul for emergency shelters.

Thank you.

I'd like to call that, please.

Second. Second. Oh, second. Any discussion? Roll call.

Chabin Singh.

Aye.

McGuire. Aye. McMurtry. Aye. Miller.

Aye.

Moran.

Aye.

Zong. Aye. And Ortega.

Aye.

Let's move on to number six.

Yes. I'd like to move the staffing study recommendations for the Adult Detention Center request for the personal complement increase.

Second.

Discussion?

Yes, I'd like to have a little bit of introduction from staff about this proposal and the FTEs that it is being requested.

The sheriff is also here.

Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Chair, commissioners. Over the past several years, Ramsey County has worked closely with the sheriff's office to address ongoing operational and budget challenges, particularly the increasing reliance on overtime at the adult detention center. Recognizing that these challenges required an objective, long-term solution, the County Board approved funding in 2025 for an independent operational staffing study of the Sheriff's Office. The County engaged Matrix Consulting Group, a nationally recognized public safety consulting firm, to evaluate staffing needs, organizational structure, deployment practices, and overtime utilization. The purpose of the study was to provide an independent, data-driven recommendations that would improve operations, strengthen workforce sustainability, reduce organizational risk, and support responsible stewardship of taxpayer resources. Implementing the adult detention recommendations is one of the first major actions resulting from this work and reflects Ramsey County's commitment to operational excellence, using data to improve services, reducing risk, strengthening our workforce, and making informed investments that deliver long-term investments for our residents. Ramsey County has a legal responsibility to operate a safe and secure and compliant adult detention center. An independent staffing study, not opinion, identified the need for additional correctional officers and staffing changes to ensure the facility can operate safely while meeting Minnesota Department of Corrections requirements. This recommendation advances Ramsey County's operational excellence strategy by using independent analysis to reduce those risks and to strengthen that workforce sustainability. The recommendation replaces structural overtime with permanent staffing, and it improves safety, supports recruitment and retention, reduces operational risk, and is expected to significantly reduce overtime costs over time. The recommendation also includes clear accountability through measurable overtime reductions, operational efficiencies, and regular reporting to county leadership and the county board. Operating a safe and secure compliant adult detention center is one of Ramsey County's most fundamental basic public safety responsibilities. The county has a legal obligation to provide appropriate supervision, maintain safe conditions for staff and individuals in custody, and ensure the facility operates in compliance with constitutional requirements, state law, and Minnesota Department of Corrections standards. Meeting those obligations requires an adequate number of trained correctional officers on every shift. Correctional officers are the backbone to a safe jail operation. They provide direct supervision of individuals in custody, conduct required security checks, respond to emergencies, facilitate medical and behavioral health services, transport individuals to court, and maintain a safe and secure environment for residents, staff, and visitors, and service providers. Without sufficient staffing, the county must rely heavily on overtime to safely perform these essential functions. The matrix staffing study confirmed what the county has experienced over the past several years. Current staffing levels are not sufficiently there to sustainably meet operational demands. The study found the county's continued reliance on overtime reflects a structural staffing shortage, not a temporary staffing challenge. The study also reinforces the Ramsey County's operational excellence strategy by demonstrating the value of using independent analysis to improve these operations and to make evidence-based decisions, rather than relying on continuing costly, unsustainable staffing models, the county now has a clear roadmap to building a more resilient and safe operation. So what does this recommendation do? This recommendation implements the highest priority findings from Matrix's study by adding permanent correctional officers to replace a significant portion of recurring overtime. It includes 32 FTEs. 24 FTEs are correctional officers and 23 are correctional officers, and one is a community service officer. They all will work within the ADC. In addition, the staffing study recommended eight unfunded FTEs of correctional officer positions that were recommended as a workforce management best practice. These positions do not increase the 2026 operating budget, but provide flexibility to recruit ahead of time anticipated retirements and attrition, helping to maintain appropriate staffing over time. So what does this increase mean for the county budget? The estimated ongoing cost of these positions is estimated to increase the 2027 property tax levy by approximately 0.75%. The recommendations that I've provided also reflect responsible stewardship of taxpayer resources because we've included clear performance expectations for the Sheriff's Office. The Sheriff's Office is committed to reducing overtime costs by an approximate $900,000 to $1 million during the fourth quarter of 2026, with additional reductions anticipated in 2027 and beyond as staffing levels stabilize. The Sheriff's Office also committed to deactivating a housing unit, which is called a pod, as quickly as possible to better align with staffing with the current jail population. In addition, the Sheriff's Office agreed to meet regularly with the county board's audit chair and county leadership to review staffing levels, hiring progress, overtime usage, and personnel forecasts. In addition, we are asking for the ability to use contingency to begin the hire of these positions immediately so that we can get ahead of the need. And that's all listed in the request for board action. So if you have additional questions, happy to address them. I wanted to give an overview of how we got here, what we're asking for, and a little bit of where we're going.

Any discussion, questions?

Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I appreciate the additional background on that, Accountant Manager Becker. There are a couple of questions that I had just to clarify things on the record. So with the additional FTEs that will be hired here, just to confirm, these will be specifically for FTEs for their work in the ADC, these will not be additional deputies on the streets that we're approving here.

Yeah, maybe at this time, Chair, we could have the Sheriff come up to you if some of these questions are ones he can address, but I certainly... know that we are approving a specific job description on the correctional officers. And those are housed at the ADC. That is their job.

Right. The other question, and I appreciate some of the additional aspects of this that the sheriff has agreed to, the meeting regularly with the audit chair, can you share a little bit more about kind of the frequency of how often those meetings will be? And yeah, just a little bit on that.

Yeah, sure, Commissioner. So the plan for those meetings is ongoing monthly meetings with the added chair, who is Commissioner Jevonsingh at the current time.

Great. And the other two more questions that I had, can you share a little bit about the – I know one of the benefits of adding these additional FTEs is the – the prospects of us deactivating one of the pods. Can you share, just for the general public, the benefits of us being able to deactivate a pod in the ADC?

Yeah, with that question, I would like to refer to the sheriff, if that's all right.

Good morning, good morning.

Good morning. I can't say it better than Ling has. Thank you for that great document and great presentation. Regarding closing the pod, we always would like to close the pod if the population allows us to. because it helps us reduce staff and reduce overtime, burnout, et cetera. Of course, our biggest issue is we do not want to have inmates sleeping on the floor in other pods, and that has happened in the past. So we've reviewed our numbers. We believe that this fall, We'll see numbers that allow us to close a pod. And sometimes, like right now, August looks to be a lower number as well. So I'm anticipating we can close a pod for the next six months, which will help us reduce the overtime that we're generating as well. Really, during the day and afternoon, we want to have two bodies in there. And so there will be a reduction in overtime generated from closing the pod. And Ling has stressed the importance of that with me and the importance of that to the board to make a partnership here with... You know, making every effort we can to reduce our overtime internally as well. So I think you'll see six months worth of closing. I can't commit beyond March of next year because sometimes numbers explode in the spring, depending on what's happening. But we'll make every effort. It's in our interest, too, if we can keep the pod closed.

Let me follow up. Bob, so even if in March things explode, then they, you know, it is a cyclical type of thing, right? So will you be able to open and close, open and close? Yes.

Yes. And by then, you know, it takes a while to bring 32 employees online. We have a few vacancies already. So we're doing our best to recruit. interview hire it's a it's a major operation but you know we'll have several bodies hired in the next month and then it'll take a while to get us up to full capacity so by march though we'll we will be at full capacity thank you real quick and i appreciate that explanation so one thing that was mentioned is that even with um i'm glad to share that we won't be able to you know

rapidly get all 32 up and running. But even with the amount that you believe that we'll be able to get hired and trained, one thing that was mentioned in the document is that one thing you've agreed to is reducing the overtime cost by approximately $900,000 to $1 million for the fourth quarter of 2026. So I guess my question is, if we're able to reduce the overtime by that much, Is there still an expectation that we'll be at the same level of overtime that was in 2025, which is, I think, around 2.6 million, or do you think that'll be reduced?

Well, the overtime number is an interesting statistic in and of itself. And by the way, thank you for doing the study in general. It's great to have objective data in front of us that we can analyze and use in our decision-making. Last year, as you know, The budget required $3.9 million to rectify at the end. Two-thirds of that was overtime generated from the jail, $2.6 million. So if you were to guesstimate how much overtime would be earned in the second half of this year, it would probably be $1.3 million. And so the figure that you have there, actually, I'm hoping that we get up to speed staffing-wise before October 1st. So that says the last quarter, but I'm really talking about the last third. When Ling and I first discussed this, it was the possibility of the second half of the year. So what that actual number will be, I don't know. but it will be in the $900,000 range for whatever period of time we're able to implement the new staffing.

Final question is, you know, I think we've all been discussing over time for a while now, and I'm really appreciative of the county manager of getting this study implemented. With the addition of these FTEs, how confident are you that you'll be able to continue that we're not back here next year with a significant amount of overtime?

Well, I think the other parts of the study that we haven't discussed will need to be handled in some workshop fashion as well. Regarding the jail, I'm confident that we can reduce the jail overtime very significantly. There will always be some type of overtime, which is probably consistent with what has been budgeted. But the other third of the overtime is not on the table here today. And we'll need to have some conversations about that. There are other aspects of the report that Matrix recommended some tweaking as well. Nothing compares to this. And of course, our most important responsibility is to the people that live in our jail and the people that work there. But we're not going to have the same conversations that we've had in the past. There's no doubt about that. Let's just continue to look with our audit chair as we go forward, and we'll have a better guesstimate here by the end of the year where we're going to be at.

Well, yeah, I'll just open up with that and say I know that during the budget season, I asked almost everybody, almost every department chair, including our two elected offices, you know, the same questions around how, as we are stewards of public dollars, make me a champion of your budget and ask the tough questions as to why sometimes we're falling outside of our projections. And overtime was a big part of it. And I remember challenging questions around with the adult detention center that there are other 24-7 care ratio models like skilled nursing facilities and other types of staffing models that we could be looking at to make sure that we're responsibly resourcing the ADC so that we wouldn't have these issues time and again. And I am really happy that those weren't just words that we said sitting here. Over the last six to nine months, I've been able to chat with your office about different parts of the budget to get myself up to speed and to build that relationship to say, well, what are some of the issues that are prohibiting you from having the ability to staff different areas appropriately? This study really informs. some of those pieces that we were all grappling with and that folks have been grappling with for a long time. So I appreciate not only the data that we now have, but also building that relationship with your office so that we can better understand some of the challenges that you're having so that with these dollars, we not only can resource responsibly, but then hold ourselves accountable to say that the savings will truly be achieved, and if not, why, so that we can problem solve in real time. So I appreciate the opportunity for that.

You know, I appreciate those comments, and you and our office have a good working relationship, I'm confident. We'll continue to get good information for you. I will say this. The adult detention center is a unique government function that cannot be compared to anything else Ramsey County does. 20,000 prisoners arrested coming into our facility every year, a population of 400 to 500 in our jail all the time, with 60 of them going to the workhouse. And a little shout out and thank you to the workhouse for helping us with this problem as well. remember this is the safety of human beings that we're really managing i could cut overtime tomorrow if i wanted to jeopardize the safety of the people in there could lock them all in extended periods of time where they wouldn't be able to come out less staff it's not the right thing to do so you know we're going to manage it with a priority of the people that are both living there and working there.

Well, I'm glad that you said that, because there's another theme that continues to come from my district office, which is just that, the folks that are in our care and our custody. And kudos again. I remember the first time I toured the ADC, staff members could have been using that opportunity to advocate for themselves, anything that they could have wanted with a new commissioner who's impressionable and all of that. Instead, they used every opportunity to advocate for the people who are in their care and their custody. And coming from a mental health background and advocacy, can you just describe some of the changes in the needs of your individuals and the complexity of the folks that you're working with every day?

Well, it isn't just in our jail. You know, I've been involved with law enforcement for longer than I'd like to admit. But the mental health issues that have grown in our community over the past 15 to 20 years are significant. The addiction issues, of course, we've gone through different phases with methamphetamine, and we're certainly opiates, and now we're certainly in the fentanyl era. So there are many, many challenges to the work that is done. And as you point out, our employees deserve a little recognition because it is a tough job. Tougher, I would say, than working the streets of Ramsey County because you're in that facility for 8, 10, 12 hours a day. So we really appreciate the work that they do, but it is sometimes hard to get people to want that job. So that's been another one of our struggles. So I'm not sure if that answers your question in terms of what we've seen in terms of difficulties. But this is a tough environment nowadays. And to be frank, our facility doesn't really lend itself to addressing mental health. We should talk about that in the future. Some of you will still be here. The reason I say that is there's not outdoor space. like there is in other facilities. There is limited view of the external world through windows. There's not a lot of recreation space inside. It's a cost-efficient building when it was built 25 years ago. But our superintendent of the jail, Ashley Bryant, has made great strides. As you know, the inmates now have some access to the outside world through iPads that can be used academically and educationally to broaden their view. But it's not a great facility when it comes to treating mental health.

Well, I agree. And those are conversations that I'm eager to continue to have. And one of the things that I wanted to highlight, though, is that this study not only asked for additional FTEs, but called for some specific positions that would address the managing of some of these complex needs, specifically because of the additional issues. And I'm just wondering, are you committed not only to the FTEs en masse, but also to to take a look at some of the recommendations here and to consider are there some additional ways that you're structuring or framing staffing to support staff and for the betterment of the folks who are in there?

Yes, of course. And we support all the recommendations that are in there, but we're also cognizant of the cost of implementing some of those. So as you work through in a workshop, Fashion which ones you'd like us to implement will be glad to do that. I know Ling has a plan I think in terms of how some of that other information gets rolled out So yes, we would like to do more So I do want to say that the workhouse is has worked out good for us, but it's also worked out good for the inmates because they can stabilize them and get access to certain services that actually help them transition to the next level.

I just want to say finally that I support this wholeheartedly for two main reasons. One is because I do think that this is important for the individuals who are working in the ADC, for the people who are in our care and our custody, and eventually for community. Because most of the folks who come through your doors go back to community. And we want this to be as positive an interruption in their lives as we can and do as little harm as we can during that time. And also, because I anticipate a continued relationship as far as the accountability of the dollars, we can be champions of missions and goals and still have to make hard decisions. And I like the idea of us being able to do that collectively and together in a productive way. So I look forward to that.

Thank you. Michelle?

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I have some just questions around the staffing and the retention plan. You know, I'm looking at some data from 2019 where your overtime was in the million, a million, and also the Average daily population there was less than what it is today, but not by too much, right? But then we just also see an exponential growth in overtime where it's increased by 251% from 2019 to 2025. May you help explain some of the drivers of that overtime and why it's increased by 250%? Sure.

I think the primary driver of that over time was the Department of Corrections, the State Department of Corrections, coming in and, well, you're aware, of course, the reduced our capacity for a period of time. At the same time, they told us we want you to operate in a safer fashion with additional staff. So I think the primary driver is they've told us you really need to do the job this way. And we've made modifications. To her credit, Ashley Bryant has said, we're going to move in that direction. And that's one of the reasons we're here. And the Matrix people agreed with the DOC assessment that we should do this. So I think, as you look historically at the overtime, we're really running a safer jail than we had previously.

And then I'm also looking, I went through the study too, and it's really showing that you're having higher turnover with correctional officers one and two. So what is the plan for hiring 30 correctional officers, more correctional officers, and then also the retention?

Yeah, it's a great question. Before I get to retention, we just posted twice. Kyle, would we get 200 applicants, roughly?

Yes. We have 200 applicants that work in the jail.

We have interviewed the majority of those. We have 77 of those applicants that we have forwarded on to background investigations. We're down a half a dozen in addition to the 24 that are hired, and we hope to hire... beyond that capacity since the document allows us to hire an additional eight in order to reduce the attrition that happens when people leave. We're going to end up hiring enough people off this list. Apparently there's a renewed enthusiasm to work for us, which we're happy about. Retention is another issue. I don't have an answer on retention. It's not a fun job. It's rewarding in ways. It can lead to other career opportunities, which many of them go on to be law enforcement throughout our state of Minnesota. But I will tell you this they're more likely to stay if the staffing is up Overtime is not so prevalent and they don't get burned out from working those long shifts. So I

Great. And then for the positions that we're authorizing here and adding, how many positions will go to fill the overtime versus just positions that have been just vacant?

Yeah, I think I understood your question. But yes, these positions that we're hiring will take the spots that are currently filled with overtime.

Okay.

And then the other question is just around going back to the retention and also just seeing where the turnover is highest with the one and two, that maybe it's not an opportunity that matches two. Do you plan to work with HR to, you know, work on that, like an orientation or like setting expectations in the hiring about what the experience of this position would really look like day to day?

Yeah, we do. If you really want to help the turnover, tell HR to help raise the salary. And then we'll have less turnover.

Yeah, well, we recently just did the class and comp analysis that was just passed a year ago. So hopefully that will help.

Thank you. Okay. Any further discussion? Mr. Chair. Oh, Mary Jo.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Sheriff Fletcher. I do support this, and thanks to everyone who made sure this study happened. I'm curious, when you mentioned that this was two-thirds of the study, there's another third of the study that we still need to deal with, and I just want to maybe ask you and the county manager what our plans are for... For that the rest of that and just a little more clarity on what that looks like I'll just as a link.

It's ready to respond The study was commissioned by the County Board and the county manager. So it really is up to her as to how the Study is rolled out and information is relayed Thank you Yeah, Thank You mr.

Chair Thank You Commissioner McGuire so I'll just use this chance to kind of summarize a few of the things that I was just hearing and I kind of ground us again after those opening remarks. First of all, I know we've been talking a lot about hiring 32. But really, we're authorizing the budget for 24 positions with some flexibility around eight, which is, that distinction is important. So I think when we kind of use the word 32 very broadly like that, just recognizing that not all 32 will be filled at any moment. We are providing funding for 24, and that there will be some savings as there's shifts and retirements and things. This is just to ensure there's some continuity, if that makes sense. I do think we did significant work around class and comp. And I do think that the board makes significant investments in the property tax levy, both last year and what we're going to be looking at this year to sort of offset that. So I just want to acknowledge that. And I would think that that is helping with some of your recruitment as you post the max and min of that position, the fact that you're getting a couple hundred people. I think that's not, you know, obviously there's some opportunity there. And I want to acknowledge that. tremendous investment that class and comp had on the organization in addition to the roles at the jail. One other thought about the 32 and your remark about March. We are authorizing those to be hired today. And I just really want you, if the board chooses to do that today. And I think it's important to not put out this idea of it's going to be March. We're really going to try to get you to a full complement so we can manage this over time beginning as soon as possible. So I need to say that publicly because that's my goal is to ensure the organization is supporting that and to help you get there with getting these hires made. And then in terms of the staffing study, It's a large document and there's a lot of components. What I didn't want was to have an incomplete report that would kind of mar our ability to deal with the here and now and what is the most critical for the safety and core county responsible services the county operates. And I also saw the timing as it relates to the 2027 budget. we would not want to take on this very critical, mandatory sort of function and the hiring that's needed in sort of ongoing one-time money versus kind of addressing it as we look at the property tax levy and what I'm going to be bringing here at the end of August to all of you. So the timing had to be now while the rest of the report is getting completed. What we will commit to, and from kind of the last round of drafts that both myself, our COO, DCM Reyes, and our HR department have been working through is there are some sections that are going to need significant work teams to do a deeper dive because they bring a bit of more questions than they bring answers. I think what the matrix study does is sort of illuminate some areas within the Sheriff's Office that we need to have a better understanding. of how the county can help manage the staffing needs there. And those areas include related to some of the codes and overtime, how we use codes within our systems. And we are obviously getting a new ERP system. And I think that's going to be a significant driver to how we are able to mitigate some more exposure and risk and be more compliant across the board for the whole organization. The ERP conversation around overtime is not limited to the Sheriff's Office as something that's going to kind of help us recalibrate across the organization with a little bit of hygiene, I would call it, in a good way. In terms of other areas of the staffing study, I definitely want to have a conversation and a work team to look more closely at our responsibility for our courts. I think that puts a lot of pressure on the county budget, and I think we need to sit down with our court partners and the Sheriff's Office to understand fully what is needed, what we're responsible to do, and what gaps are and that needs to be a joint conversation the other one would be other external partners i will say you know i want to better understand and you and i had a brief conversation about the uh community resource officers like at the schools you know i want to understand just all those components because they were all brought into the matrix study as all part of the sheriff's office and we want to understand all those lanes of work and who's funding them uh similar to that would be regents hospital there was a significant investment, obviously by the county and the sheriff's office in supporting some partnerships with Regions Hospital. We want to understand what those are in full transparency with Regions Hospital as well. And then the last one would be really just defining some roles and responsibilities around managing data and our budgets and our staffing as it results in the central finance, your office, and our safety and justice division. And just really being able to work more collaboratively as a team. I've seen it come more together, but I think The staffing study just further highlights the importance of this multiple lens management, because we all have the same goal. We want to make sure that you're able to do the job that you are required and supposed to do while we are able to be fiscally responsible and support that responsibility. I think you and I talked about those kind of five areas from the study. I don't think those are surprises to you, but it was good for me to articulate publicly that those are at least from the initial next draft of the report, which I anticipate will get finalized here early fall. And then we will develop a plan of how to start to create the work groups. I already had DCM Reyes think about staffing those work groups. And then we will think about how to peel those layers of the study back to the board for understanding in partnership with the sheriff's office. We're not going to bring... parts of that without the courts and the sheriffs and even regents. I mean, I think that it involves a lot of folks. So thank you for that. I appreciate. the partnership, and yeah, I'll take any other questions, but that's what I had.

Okay, Mary Jo, are you finished?

I'll just, well, I'll just, actually, mine is on a different topic. I'm gonna let my child, and then I have to answer.

Yeah, I wanna go back to the timeline of closing down one of the pods. You're giving a six-month timeline. County Manager Becker is saying sooner than later, and also, on top of that, the board RBA says that you'll reduce overtime costs by approximately $900,000. to $1 million in the fourth quarter of 2026. What is that plan to be able to reduce that overtime cost then?

Regarding the pod closure, I'm hoping to close a pod in August. And that would be the beginning of the sixth month period for you.

August of this year?

Yes.

Okay. And then...

Go ahead.

Oh, just about reducing overtime costs. Is that the plan then to close the pod so that you do reduce the overtime by 900 to a million?

Well, the closure of the pod will result in some savings of current overtime. We're hoping to hire quickly. It takes us a while to train people in, probably a three-week academy and then time working as a We call it an FTO, basically. You're in there shadowing another person. So there's probably a six-week window before the people can be brought online. And that six-week window will probably be over by October 1st. So that's why the last quarter. And then once we have those 24 bodies online, they will all significantly result in in reductions of overtime because they will take the place of the people that are currently working those positions on overtime. And so I'm hoping we can actually expedite it to get this done by September 15th. As soon as the state fair is over, I'd like to be up to full complement. And so we're hoping the combination of closing a pod in August, September, October, November, December, And the savings that are reaped there plus bringing the 24 bodies on by September 15th will result in a $900,000 reduction in our overtime.

For the staffing study, does it assume that all the pods are being utilized?

Probably. Or that they need to be, yes.

Mm-hmm. So, yeah.

And they may need to all be utilized if there's a surge in population. So don't assume that we can run with pod closed all the time.

Okay.

Which is the question I raised before. This is going to be cyclical. And so the point is that that we close them when we could.

Well, right now, I believe we can. But I will tell you that every time St. Paul puts a new class of 35 new police officers on the street, our numbers spike. Because during their training period, they are making more arrests than they are after they have five years on.

I think what's even more important, I mean, these are all good questions. And this is the first time in my tenure that the sheriffs and the board are working to address the overtime, the vacancy issues. We've labeled it various ways. And this was not only the sheriff's department. This was across every department. The sheriff's, I think, is a little more difficult than some other departments. But don't forget, last year, we added 40 employees to the financial assistance because of the backlog, right? It was 40? 80. 80 for mid-choices, yeah. OK. So it was 80. So I mean, these are questions that are going to be constant to address. This is the art. It isn't fixed. And the same thing with the sheriff's side. I think the important thing is the fact that the sheriff would not participate with the audit committee to look forward to see how we address these things. Lines of communications are open. That's going to be a critical piece to all this. And hopefully, it's a constant management of these issues, right?

Yeah, Mr. Chair, I'll close out my comments or my questions around this.

I didn't mean to interrupt, but it just seemed because we're asking a lot of the same questions.

You know, and also in the board report, it says that the overtime accounts for approximately 65% of this, of the overtime in the ADC. So I would say I do look forward to continuing the conversations about the other portions that are resulting in the overtime. In addition to that, some of the concerns and reservations I continue to have is just also the fact that even in Hennepin County, when they authorized increased FTEs, they're still seeing a lot of overtime as well. In addition to that, the closest example I would give is our correctional facility, Community Corrections. They have also experienced overtime as well. However, they made other changes and adjustments within their budget to be able to fill those overtime as well. and didn't have to come back as well. So I think it's a part of a larger conversation. And I just want to set the expectation clear that us authorizing these additional positions does not necessarily mean that we're not going to have overtime, that we're not going to see the sheriff come back to us with another budget amendment and or ask.

Well, let me respond to that. I don't think the workhouse is a good comparison. Their population at the workhouse was way down. That's why they were able to take some of our bodies. They really had no need for overtime because their staffing was more than enough to take care of their problem. But you did raise another issue that's worth discussing briefly and putting all this in context. If you take out the $2.6 million in overtime for the jail, you're left with the $1.3 million for law enforcement-related services. That $1.3 million that we were over last year pales in comparison. The Minneapolis Police Department, the Hennepin County Sheriff's Office, and the St. Paul Police Department. They were all over millions and millions in overtime over what we were. So this isn't just unique to Ramsey County. This is an ongoing problem throughout the industry because the workload has increased in law enforcement.

Oh, yeah, may you expand more about that workload and the increase?

Well, there's more and more mental illness on the streets. And officers in St. Paul, in Minneapolis, and Hennepin County Patrol districts are experiencing a high volume of calls with things that take time to resolve. And, you know, after COVID... Crime went up as well. Minneapolis' homicide rate right now is spiking. And my point is, law enforcement needs overtime to do its job. It's tough to put a price on public safety. And so when law enforcement needs the job to get done, they use overtime when necessary. My point is that our amount of overtime is far, far smaller than any of the other three agencies that are generating overtime. At some point, you need to look at this problem in the context of what's happening other places.

Oh, yes. I definitely understand that, too. And I'm also just paying attention to the trends of the county's ADC that I'm also comparing against as well. So I definitely agree that, you know, the... Reliance on the overtime may have contributed a lot to the burnout and to the turnover. There's also the piece about the expectation where I'm seeing more turnover between correctional officers, one and two, so it may just not be a match in the work environment. There are just some cultural things, too. I want to say that I agree with this report, and I also want to set the expectation to the public that this doesn't mean that we're not going to see any more overtime. So I just wanted to make that clear.

Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you. I appreciate my colleagues' questions, because it's helping me understand this more. And because we're heading into the state fair, and I just want to set expectations. When we do, the state fair hires our sheriff's deputies to help patrol the fair, which we need. And it's a very safe fair, and we appreciate that. And so we know. that your deputies do a lot of work there. And they pay us for that, right? The State Fair actually pays for that. Sometimes I thought I was under the impression that sheriffs would use overtime then when they came back. But do they take vacation? Or how do we actually handle the extra burden of the State Fair?

We charge the State Fair $120 an hour for every deputy that's on their grounds providing service. That money is either applied to cover the body that's missing from other functions, but in either way, it covers all of our costs. And you just recently upped that from $110 to $120.

Okay, so they don't pay for us, an officer, then they come back and get overtime from the county.

No, well, even if overtime was generated, the $120 exceeds the amount that they would earn. I will tell you this. You can think about this for next year as we plot ahead. The troopers charge the state fair $135 an hour. And the city of St. Paul, while they're in our area of $120, they're going to raise their rate to $134 here in the near future. So... You know, Ling and I talked about other costs like tort liability that needs to be included, but you may want to consider raising our figure at some point in the future as well.

I appreciate that, and I do appreciate that. We have the largest event, which I learned, largest event in the country for that 10 days in a county of our size, and people feel safe there.

Well, it's an amazing event, as long as you brought it up. I know you love that fair, as do I. It's an amazing event, 2 million people coming in there over a 12-day period of time. The Texas State Fair has 2.5 million, but they run a 24-day state fair. So ours is the largest in the country, and it's something really to be proud of as a state. But it does require law enforcement services, and the fair could not conduct a safe fair without our participation.

Exactly, and I appreciate that. Thank you.

Yeah, I just wanted to say, given the concerns and the engagement and the positive place that we're at with our board being engaged and working productively with the sheriff's office, and that I'll be, as audit chair, meeting regularly, but that doesn't mean that our extended board will be getting updated reports. And I'm just wondering, we... The chair brought up the 80 FTEs. We were getting regular reports from that department letting us know how the hiring was going, how the training was going, how cases were being cleared. And it was nice to see the progress along the way. And I would request if we could be getting those kind of high level, it was five or six bullet points, but it kept us abreast so that we knew that these investments, that the progress was being made. It was a way for us to be able to share with community when they said, hey, you just raised my property taxes by almost a point for the sheriff. How's it going? For us to be able to say, well, we've already hired most. He's already hired most of the folks. They're training on board. We're already seeing reductions. Or if things aren't going smoothly, then at least we know, are there things that we could be doing to facilitate the success? So can we have a commitment to a written report back to the board on a regular basis so my colleagues also have a chance to engage in this as well? Of course.

And you know who will provide that to you, your assistant, Kyle Miestad. Thank you.

Excellent.

I appreciate that. And I ask my colleagues to continue to feed these questions, to keep this conversation going, even when we're not here in this formal setting. Because this is a significant investment. And we do want the best for our staff, for our community. And that requires all of us to stay on task.

So I thank you for that. Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, roll call.

Chabin Singh.

Aye.

McGuire.

Aye.

McMurtry. Aye. Miller.

Aye.

Moran. Aye. Zong. Aye. And Ortega.

Aye. Okay, I believe we move on to outside.

What do we got?

Number seven.

Oh, number seven written in. Okay.

So, Mr. Chair.

Yes.

I was just looking through my notes here around, just need some clarity on some things, yeah.

Did I get, I'm sorry, did I get a motion on number seven?

Motion to move. Second. Okay, go ahead. It may be for you, Lane, or someone else, I don't know. But I'm just looking here, like according to the city estimates that we have 140 individuals currently residing at Pig Eye Park encampment. And so we have entered into a contract with Catholic Charity to expand the capacity by 49 emergency shelter beds at higher ground, leveraging the county emergency shelter grant solicitation in the amount not to exceed $969,500. So is that the investment that's coming from Ramsey County?

Commissioner Moran, commissioners, let me just give a little context to the whole JPA because a lot of things are kind of happening at once and what you're citing there is some of the context for which that kind of surrounds the encampment response but is not directly related to the JPA per se except for a small little portion. So let me just kind of give some overview. So what you're considering today reflects our commitment to helping the city make an immediate response while we're also very much as a county focused on long-term strategy to prevent and end homelessness along with our partners. This joint powers agreement with the city of St. Paul will help us facilitate additional emergency beds on behalf of the City of St. Paul's LAHA funds, if that makes sense. So what we have already done is that we have had around one of a solicitation for emergency shelter beds. That happened. That was basically targeted toward recurrent emergency service grant providers. That was the way by which we could reach out to those partners and see if they had additional capacity. The county already executed against that solicitation, and we were able to get 49 beds through that effort. And so that is the $969,000 that you spoke of. The goal was that St. Paul would contribute $200,000 toward that amount, and the JPA will facilitate the transfer of the money to do that. In addition, The JPA will also then allow for another $880,000 to be put in a brand new solicitation for emergency shelter beds. And that will be released shortly after this meeting on a web-based solicitation for providers to provide those beds. The JPA allows us to basically be the administrator of the solicitation on behalf of the city of St. Paul. They asked us to do that for them. And that is something that we have more, I guess, muscle to do. And so we are acting on their kind of executing against their funds. We are not putting any additional more county funds into emergency shelter beds than what we've already put in on the Catholic Charities contract, less the $200,000 that they will also contribute. Does that make sense?

So for clarity, it's the $969,500 that's coming from the county?

Minus $200,000. Minus $200,000. Yep. So $769,000 would be coming from the county. And we're using some 2025 LAHA funds. that were under-programmed, and then also a bit of opioid money to make that.

Just so we clarify, if anything, for whoever's watching us, it's very confusing to people hearing us. So what we're doing here is the city is providing $200,000. The Ramsey County is then providing $800,000, and that makes up the million.

Nope, that's not true. So let me go over it again. There are three solicitations that are happening right now. The first one is already completed. We contributed. It cost the county $969,000. But we anticipate applying $200,000 of the $1,080,000 that is part of this JPA. So subtract $200,000 from this. The JPA is for $1,000,000. That makes sense. The remaining of that amount, $880,000, will be for a new solicitation that we are going to do today. The third solicitation is the county is actually putting case management funds into its own solicitation. So there's three things we're buying, round one of emergency shelter, round two of emergency shelter, and case management. Ultimately, the county... is facilitating $1,080,000 of the city's money toward the shelter beds.

That make sense? And the city's putting in? $1,080,000.

So it gets a little confusing, right? The city is putting forth the $1,880,000.

I think the confusion is that the Catholic charity beds is about the same price as $1 million. But that was just a context and background for you. They're basically pivoting $1,080,000.

So we bought the beds for higher ground for the 769. Done. 49 beds. And there's another solicitation that's coming that is going to be that $1,080,000, $1 million. And out of that, We're going to hike towards $200,000 towards the higher ground expansion contract, which is that additional beds.

No, that goes toward the 49.

That goes towards the 49.

That reduces our cost of the 49, and then we still have an additional balance of $880,000 from the $1,000,080 to buy new beds for them. I think that makes sense, hopefully.

And then $880,000 for Ramson County to administer the new solicitation.

Yes.

Yes. OK, so that's a total of how much? For the new solicitation? In combination with the beds that we're buying.

So it would be $769,000 plus $1,080,000.

So however that math works out. About $1,008,000.

Yeah, $1,008,000. Pretty close to $2 million. Yeah, almost $2 million between the city and county, if that makes sense.

OK. Yeah.

I'm happy to provide a little grid or something. I gave that to Commissioner Zhang last night, so I'm happy to do that again for the rest of the board.

They would be helpful for me as chair of Hattie Home Ramsey County to be a little bit more, get a little bit closer understanding of what we're doing here because it's in partnership with the housing stability group that comes out of Hattie Home Ramsey County. So that would be, I know it would be definitely helpful for me to get some real good clarity.

So you also, are you done? I wanted to add a little bit more. So we can add a little more clarity. I think part of why it's a little bit out of order is because we were trying to actually respond to the situation of trying to get some of those first beds stood up faster than we could bring this agreement over to you because you didn't have a meeting last week, if that makes sense. So out of kind of the necessity of sort of keeping the work moving, we went ahead and signed the contract with Catholic Charities knowing that the JPA was coming. And that was a risk I was willing to take knowing that we wanted to get these beds online to ensure that to the community that's very concerned about the residents. I want to kind of put the whole thing back to the purpose of the work that we're doing, right? That those folks needed to understand that there were some beds available should they decide that they want shelter. So that was the first thing that we were trying to do was manage the emergency while also going through some of this governance and this due diligence. The city council took action last Tuesday, or last Wednesday. You didn't have a meeting. So this is why we're here today. But what I did want to say, though, if there are no more questions about the actual funding situation of this JPA, I did want to use this moment to just say that emergency shelter is a really essential part of the continuum of care. But it is only one component of the overall homeless response system. While this investment addresses the immediate and operational needs, Ramsey County has to remain committed to strengthening the entire continuum from prevention and diversion to the behavioral health services to permanent supportive housing, affordable housing, and long-term housing stability. This agreement reflects our regional partnership with the city and others, but homelessness cannot be addressed by one jurisdiction alone. By working collaboratively with the city service providers, health care providers, community orgs, we can respond effectively to these challenges. Now, Ramsey County, we recognize one thing. This is a very important reality. Our financial, operational, and human resources are finite. Every investment represents a choice, and our long-term success depends on ensuring that urgent operational demands do not come at the expense of long-term strategy. So I think this is what you're getting at, Commissioner Moran, by wanting to get to this number of approximately $1.8 million between the city and county. However you add this up in the little more confusing order of operations we just tried to describe, ultimately, I'm guessing what you're trying to get to is that is the commitment that has been made around emergency shelter beds at this point and for the county. LAHA resources are very precious, and we are very strategic about them, especially as it relates to our Heading Home Ramsey strategic plan. It is the funds that are going to help us to build out and strengthen that continuum, and we need to be mindful while there's a very current situation that we don't... lose sight of the overall work that we have before us. So Commissioner, is that helpful for you?

That was helpful. Could I just interject, Reena, because I read your question a little differently. So this JPA was really motivated by the transferring of funds from the city to the county, correct? Correct. The city is, if I understood you correctly, is really transferring $200,000. No. No. $1,080,000. Okay. I think that's right. So the city is transferring $1,080,000. Yes, $1,080,000 over two solicitations for emergency shelter. Okay.

OK, go ahead.

So on that note, and thank you for highlighting the overall goal of what we're trying to do here, that we don't have unlimited dollars just for emergency shelters. So do you expect that this would, is that our capacity right now around emergency shelter? And how do that, how would this impact, you know, looking at permanent supportive housing, affordable housing, stable housing, home ownership, the whole continuum of care that we have to invest in?

Yeah, so thank you, Commissioner. I appreciate the question. So, you know, I believe I usually get the shelter reports a couple, they're a night off because you hear about the previous night, if that makes sense. A couple of nights ago, there was 16 men's beds and 13 women's beds available. Now, that's a little high compared to what I've seen as the pattern over the last two or three weeks that I've been taking a closer look. I would say numbers are closer to in the single digits for men's and women's shelters overall each night. But there is current emergency shelter capacity generally. I think that's a safe thing to say. In terms of overall shelter capacity, I believe this is part of the continuum of care's general framework. There does need to be a bit more capacity. And so to me, the investment of 49 beds here by the county It seems like a good investment not only for an encampment response, but overall for sort of a short-term sort of buffering of that part of the continuum as we move into winter and other things. Regardless of who uses them, obviously what they're created for, the encampment response first and foremost, but I do see that they add capacity to a spot that needs some capacity. In terms of the other parts of the continuum, we have significant work to continue to do. And that's not work that only the county has to do alone. We have to do it in partnership with the Heading Home Ramsey. We have to do it in partnership with the city. The city has lots of things that they do around zoning, around neighborhood planning. So this is a thing that we're all kind of in it together in many ways. And the Heading Home Ramsey is really the perfect place that we do a lot of that. And then let's not forget the further end of the continuum. which is the significant work that CED has done in creating more affordable housing units. You know, the investments of the HRA and other mechanisms of Laha money on that part of the continuum is very significant. So one thing I would like to bring to all of you is sort of a look at the whole continuum and the work that we're doing across that. I don't want the current situation to get us so fixated on the front end where basically, as I kind of tried to share with the city council, we create sort of a clog in the pipe where then what? We're not moving people through the continuum. And so that's why I think it's really important for us as the county to stay in our respective role as the administrative lead of Heading Home Ramsey and stay completely focused on the work that that body's supposed to do strategically, learn from some best practices nationwide, but don't don't have the immediate, forsake the work of the bigger picture. And it aligns with our economic competitiveness inclusion plan as well on the other side. So we have very strong frameworks by which to work from. It's not like we're going to be drawing this stuff up a blank piece of paper. There's been so much community engagement and also data. Exactly. So you know you've been in those rooms. And we look forward to more of your leadership in that. And so I just think it's really important that at this moment of meeting, we talked a lot about meeting the moment during Operation Mental Search. So I'm kind of saying, do I want to say it like that? But we're kind of meeting the moment while also not losing sight. of the bigger work the county has to be about.

And I guess I'm going to reiterate that, too, that we are meeting a moment, and it is a moment of emergencies. But there are an abundance of other people who have been waiting for housing, waiting to get in supportive housing, affordable housing, right? And so we just can't stay in the moment and just react to this moment that was thrust upon us, because there are so many others who are also waiting. I want to talk about the 49 beds that we're spending $769,000 for. For some people like myself, we're like, wow, that's a lot of money for 49 beds. What are we doing? What do that encompass to have 49 beds?

Is that like a year investment? It is more than just beds over at Catholic Charities. We had significant conversations and sort of working with them. on all these things. And so obviously, every time that they increase capacity over there, there are security concerns. So part of that budget is put toward additional security. I think we all have to acknowledge that that's a really important component for the safety and well-being of both the community and residents and all the people in those operations. So we talked about that. But more significantly, there are shelter advocates. And they provide direct support to those individuals experiencing homelessness. They're kind of like a soft case management. to help people have a conversation about what else do you need, what do you need next. And so while not like a full-on case manager, I would call them kind of a soft case management role that is advocating for that person, working through how to help them navigate for some resources, working on ensuring that the environment that they're living in is welcoming and organized and kind of upholding some of the policies and things of the the situation. There's also some occupancy expense, obviously. They've got to deal with having 49 more people, basically, and providing laundry services. And what they have at Catholic Charities is offering meals and laundry services. And they are a very low barrier, which I think meets a need here. People can bring pets. They will do some storage. So I think we're trying to find an emergency shelter while there's not many available. that meets some of the low barrier needs that particularly an encampment population might find most attractive and helpful. We recognize that many people would not choose shelter, emergency shelter, and that they have some individual choice. But for the people who are interested in making that transition, we wanted to make sure there is at least more capacity.

For the 49 beds that we are buying, is that a bed for one individual for a year? Is this just open to whoever come to have that bed? What do that look like?

So I might have to call Director Wilkins up. You're getting deeper than maybe in my knowledge. But I'll take a first shot. It's a lot of money. Yeah, it is a lot of money, and I appreciate that. So the beds are for a year. Jamie, if you want to come on up, maybe you can help reiterate. But they go through what's called our SHED program. And those beds at Catholic Charities are not held for a particular individual every night. They don't get the same bed. They're available for, like, as people go through the shed system. Am I correct there?

Yeah. Good morning, Commissioners. County Manager Becker, yes, you are correct. These are emergency shelter beds, and it also determines on how we are prioritizing that. HSD is working on an interim policy to... To your point, Commissioner Moran, make sure that the people that are already utilizing the beds are not displaced based on the emergent need that we're seeing from the encampment enclosure. There is a right to reserve a bed depending on which way you enter through the shed, which could reserve your bed for 30 days. You do have to come every night at 8.30 to continue that reservation. If you don't show up, your 30 days is displaced. These 49 beds that are coming online, we are looking at them more on an emergency basis so they would not be reservable for the 30 days, which is our current shelter policy. So there are some interim policy changes that we have to change due to the encampment closure.

OK, that is helpful. And I think it's really important to have some clarity around that. What does that look like? Because anybody numbered 49 beds, $769,000 is a lot of money. And there are services that will be provided to these individuals as they utilize Catholic charity and the beds and the spaces that is needed. Because it's complicated. They have multiple, multiple needs. to get them through this process. And so thank you for that. And I'm just wondering, as we think about, and maybe it's just me when I think of Catholic Charity, I know at one point there was conversation about utilizing Union Gospel mission. And as I was able to walk through the encampment, I know there was an abundance of women out there where we was handing out women's feminine products. So my question is, is there intentionality around ensuring that we have enough beds for females who are also homeless? What do that look like? What does that process look like?

Commissioner Moran, that's a great question, and it is something that we have really raised out. And I know County Manager Becker talked about a solicitation that is forthcoming. One of the populations that we are calling out and defining is people in the encampments, to your point, have said there's not enough beds for women, there's not enough beds for people that are gender neutral, or places where couples can go. And the three Ps that people are really concerned about right now are their pets, their property, and their partners. And so we are really calling on individuals for more innovative, creative ways to raise up beds, whatever that might look like. Some of our current places, you mentioned Union Gospel Mission, that is for single adult males. And so that is a unique population. Catholic Charities has opened up, but in those 49 beds, only eight of those are for women. And so that still remains a need. And so we do have safe space model cities, which does also have single men and single women. So we're looking at all of those unique populations individually. And we're really making an ask for community to be creative about how they think about raising up emergency shelter space for those populations because that's important.

So there is some planning and thought that's going to go into this whole process as you solicit other organizations that you're thinking about the capacity of the homeless population as a whole and how we can make sure that we are sheltering a diverse group of individuals and with not just a huge focus on with all good intent, the male population. But we're making sure we're taking care of the women. We're taking care of partners who want to stay together. Otherwise, they're out on the street. And we're looking to make sure that we, you know, people love their pets, to make sure that we have places for their pets.

Yeah, Commissioner Moran, I just want to interject that you said that we would think about those things. The team has already thought about those things, and that solicitation is opening in a matter of a couple hours. We've been walking and chewing gum at the same time, is the way I like to call it, and doing things concurrently. And we are ready because of the situation, right? We can't wait till you guys approve and then start the work. So the work has already kind of been done through late last week and into yesterday so that we can just turn on the switch basically after your anticipated approval. And that gives me a chance just to thank the team. I just really publicly want to just thank everybody who's been part of the coordinated response. It's been a lot, and that has not only been the people who've gone out to the encampments, while that is a huge lift to do that, in addition to their other work and sort of bridge some of that with our kind of increasing the work we've typically done out there, but also behind the scenes, the people on, I mean, the county attorney's office, our procurement office, like, having everybody drop a little bit of what they were doing to reprioritize so that we were walking and chewing gum at the same time, it is a big ask. And I just really want to publicly thank all the teams who've touched this project, who've touched this work. It's important. We are grateful. And there's a lot of people hoping that the county can really be leading in the things that we can do. And you're helping us show up in a really, really big way. So thank you. And thank you, Jamie, for your leadership also. I see DCM, Francois, and a lot of folks in here. So thank you. I have one last question. Yeah, go ahead. And that's about the organizations.

As we meet the needs, as we're in this emergency, and as you are doing a solicitation, do you think this is a moment? I mean, are you being very strategic around the organizations who have a history of doing this? that you are partnering with, or are you open to somebody new who's never done this before, who may step forward and say, oh, I have beds, or I have a building that I can, I mean, what would that look like, and what would the training needs to look like if you do that?

We, Commissioner Moran, that's a really great question. And as you mentioned, there is a lot of people, community partners, organizations that are already involved at the encampment that people have been in communication with. We are working really hard to get the solicitation out to all of those platforms to make sure that this is accessible. the the web-based solicitation hopefully will be easy for people to access and respond and we're hoping and looking for any innovative way that people could raise it up with technical assistance and a community partnership so it might be organizations that already do shelter and have that great expertise and it might be some new ones that we haven't seen at the table with the uniqueness of the encampment enclosure but the ranking is set up to accept all of those solicitations and think creatively and strategically about how we can create more emergency beds for all of those populations you identified.

OK, well, I do want to thank you, too, for your leadership and the work that you're doing in partnership with all the other partners that we do have. And kudos to Ramsey County, who has showed up in large numbers at that encampment to do this work, to see the individuals, and then to support them. It's been really awesome seeing that happen in real time.

Thank you, Commissioner.

I have Mary Jo and then Garrison. Thank you.

Thank you so much for all the work that you and your team are doing. We really appreciate it. Just a couple of questions. Can you just clarify, an emergency shelter bed is not necessarily temporary, or it is temporary? And how temporary? And if we don't have affordable housing with services, where are they going to go? I mean, we don't want this to just be a temporary solution, and then they go back on the streets in some other place. So can you just help me understand when we say emergency shelter beds, which we're putting the RFP out, what's the definition of that?

Commissioner McGuire, County Manager Becker did a really good job of outlining that we need to invest in the whole continuum. One of the biggest things that we need to do is there's lack of affordable housing and there's lack of permanent supportive housing units. We are seeing that gap with the change of the NOFO and the federal dollars, something that we need to change. So to your question about emergency beds, they are emergency shelter beds. One of the things that are different is she also mentioned the solicitation for case management services. So we are really starting to strategically think about coordinated entry and assessments might not necessarily be where somebody needs to land because that list is long. So what we are calling more is housing problem solving, which means maybe we can get you directly into a private market rate. Maybe we could pair you up with somebody and be roommates so that you guys could afford it together. So not necessarily the answer isn't just encampment straight to shelter. It could be encampment straight to housing. It could be encampment straight to treatment. There's different pathways that we're really exploring. They are emergency shelter beds, but there's different layers of those beds depending on each individual circumstance and their assessment. Some of them that I mentioned could be reserved for 30 days. Some of them are emergency and on a nightly basis. When warming spaces come, that looks different. That's just a drop-in space. So there's just different layers of how the continuum look. just putting it all into emergency shelter beds is not going to solve our bigger issue of what is my next path after that. And so that case management piece will really help identify some of those needs and get people moving from shelter to that next step. The other thing that we are also focusing on is when you are in permanent supportive housing, you could also be moving on to something that's less restrictive. So moving that continuum forward also creates more spaces for people from emergency shelter to go and so on. So we have to keep people moving across the continuum. And one of the things is case management is really going to help us do that. And that's something since my tenure we haven't really focused intensively on, and that's a change that is needed. And so that case management solicitation will help us do some of that as well.

I really appreciate that clarification. Thank you. And so just my last question is, so what percentage of need are we actually resolving with this? There's not only 49 people in the encampment, right? So I think they're going different places, and we're going to take care of 49 of them, how many more are there to be worked with?

Commissioner McGuire, there's around, we think, approximately 120 residents that sleep at the encampment that might need shelter space. With that 49 beds and the forthcoming solicitation, we're hoping we can get closer to that number to think about that. And again, that's not just saying that emergency shelter is our only solution. We could also be looking at treatment or behavioral health or some other places where people are diverting. Some people have wanted to be residents of other counties, or they are residents of other counties. Some people have taken buses to go back to family members. So even though emergency shelter is just a piece of that puzzle, it doesn't mean that we're going to have a bed for bed count, because that's not what every individual needs. I appreciate that. Thank you for that. Yes.

I just want to say, this is a tough job. You've done an excellent job. Excellent job of explaining the current situation. It's very difficult for people to realize that this is such a big picture. This has to do with all housing. This has to do with first-time homeowners that could afford to move. We're in a gridlock situation in housing right now. But you've done a very good job. I just wanted to make that comment. Thank you. explaining the situation. I have Garrison.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. And this may be a question for the County Manager. As we discuss the funding towards the continuum and what that looks like, we see that the City of St. Paul is providing this $1,080,000 for the emergency shelter piece through their LAHA dollars. Has there been conversations with the City as we start looking more broadly the full continuum of what their dollars will continue to be used for and where we could see there where we would would appreciate their assistance on maybe shifting where their priorities are so that we are really meeting the need for the entire continuum and not just in these emergency moments yeah Thank You Commissioner I have not had those conversations I don't know Jamie if you've had any conversations across

Good question, Commissioner Murphy, County Manager Becker. I think we continuously have those conversations at Heading Home Ramsey prior to encampment and closures. We do have several investments, even with our federal funding, some state dollars that we have. It is obviously not enough to meet the need. The city does contribute their LAHA funds to prevention, eviction prevention. They do have some of that, but there needs to be more conversations as we continue this about where we can strengthen it in areas that we have gaps. One of the things since I've been hired that we've really been wanting to concentrate on is system redesign as far as our coordinated entry. So identifying and quantitating how much that supportive housing gap is and what that would cost to close that. I also know that... CED has been doing a good job of helping affordable housing stock as well. And so those conversations continue to happen. So we've been having those conversations and will more robustly continue to have those as well and putting some dollar signs as to what that could look like and some investments that need to be made.

I appreciate that and definitely want to encourage us to continue those conversations because this is not just on the county. It's going to take the effort of a number of entities, including the city, to make sure that we are fully supporting the entire continuum. My other question is we're addressing the 49 beds and then a few additional beds. This is just in regards to this one encampment. We have other encampment closures that are coming. Has there been any discussions at all with the city on the timing of when those other encampment closures will be happening? What work have we been doing on our end? Will we likely see another request come in like this? I know there was a lot of questions, but I'm just thinking through, you know, we're specifically looking at this August 5th. closure, but also know that there are more closures that are coming.

So, Commissioner, I can answer the couple questions that I know the answers to. One is there are no definitive dates on the future encampment closures. They're keeping it flexible as far as we've been communicated with. In terms of the other encampments and our response, our coordinated team has started to make some touch points into the other encampments just to sort of to deepen some of that understanding of what those situations are. However, we are more urgently focused on the Pig's Eye encampment in our work.

Thank you. Oh, and then Tyler.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to note just the amount of work and acknowledge the amount of staff, both in leadership, from County Manager Becker to DCM Francois, Reyes, Abdi Nadir, all hands on deck, and then also the staff on foot, basically, to assemble an outreach team. And I just want to say that I think this is a moment in time where we've had the Heading Home Ramsey for a while now. And it's been a place where we have worked very closely with the city around addressing homelessness. And with this pressure and the time that's been placed on us now, it is exactly that where we now have to bump up the weight, right? Like when you think about weightlifting and fitness, right? We've been doing the same amount of reps and same amount of weight for a while, and now there's added weight. And so we are learning how to work together and using those muscles to strengthen ourselves and our response. And so I really hope that we do not end this outreach and homelessness response that we have created across multiple departments. And then finally, also, that this is really an important step from the city of St. Paul to move these dollars to the county to focus and prioritize. We will only be able to address this together if we get these more coordinated efforts And another partner that is super crucial is also the state. And I know that there are many of our legislators who have been asking and also are asking us about how are we using the homelessness dollars that have been allocated to. So I just want to make sure that I name that and that we are responsive to our partners all across, whether that be the city and or the state. And finally, County Manager Becker has also shared with us about that Heading Home Ramsey has a strategic plan. And that strategic plan names out specifically kind of the path forward, multiple different strategies. And these are points that we can draw on and really focus in on during this moment in time. And so I look forward to having more conversations about the plan, having it presented to our board, But also, I think it's a great time to bring along our partners from the city, from the city council members to the mayor, about this strategic plan that has already been created. You know, I'm a big proponent of having studies and not putting it on the shelf, right? That is actually about mobilizing people together to put resources and agree on a plan and strategy together. Thank you.

Okay.

Yeah, I have one question and then a couple maybe calls for us for future actions. One of the questions I have is, throughout all of this conversation, Ramsey County is bigger than St. Paul. And I'm just curious, there are resources in greater Ramsey County and also problems and issues and challenges and concerns. And I'm just wondering, as a broader ecosystem, how much coordination has been happening between St. Paul, Ramsey County, and all of the other municipalities to help address these needs?

I can start, Commissioner, and then Jamie can fill in. But just to be clear, the Heading Home Ramsey actually has suburban elected leaders on that governing board. So I think for the bigger ecosystem scan, certainly. We've been connecting with different city administrators, law enforcement, you know, like the cities, just to keep them apprised. Certainly, we've had some outreach from other counties and cities about what is happening there and sort of can you let us know how it might impact our community. And so I think Krista Dillon's here. She's kind of, as part of our coordinated team, she's our partnerships person. So she's been kind of our conduit to sort of keeping others updated and keeping the lines of communication open, if that makes sense. Yeah.

And then my other kind of calls to, this is collectively, as we are thinking about our work. Today we've talked about some challenges at the ADC, the complexity of of individuals that we're facing that have some high needs and whether that is because of being a victim themselves and dealing with trauma, whether that is substance use disorder or complex mental health issues or economic disparities, all the different kinds of things that are impacting people who are bumping up against our systems. I think that we've seen some through our almost daily reports from the county manager on our activities in reacting to the decision to close the encampment has been a ramping up. not a beginning, we've been working with people all along, but a ramping up of our outreach activities. And one of the things that I would just say, whether it's public health, whether it's mental health, whether it is any other, our housing coordination, navigation, how we can be increasing our time where people are at in community to get out from behind our desks and our computers and make sure that we're doing outreach where community is at. Um, so that goes across our continuum and really has issues beyond this particular thing. So I just want to throw, throw that out as an expectation to address many complex needs that are impacting many things that come before us all the time. Um, and then the other piece is just the complexity of supportive housing, um, with the, the evidence-based and long-term, um, uh, direction of housing first that has been gutted by this administration and funding changes and expectations there. I mean, regardless of this current situation, those services are already under some shaky ground and are things that we as a county are going to have to address. So I just encourage us to continue to stay up to date and have input from Heading Home Ramsey County and our departments that are dealing with supportive housing so that we are keeping up with this ever-changing landscape as the needs are increasing and the funding is shifting.

Commissioner Jevonsing, I appreciate that. And the one thing I will just add to your comments is that even though Ramsey County also intentionally has outreach services and we are also grantees for several organizations that are out boots on the ground. So sometimes you might not hear the word Ramsey County is out there, but we do fund over six organization outreaches that are out at the encampments on a daily basis, including Radius Health. Just to mention, I don't want to mention all of them, but that just gives you an example of also it's not just us boots on the ground. We also are grantees and overseeing compliance for those that are out there doing that wonderful work. And to your point, Heading Home Ramsey talks about daily about how do we continue that mission of housing first, because we know that's what works, even though there are cutbacks from federal government. And we have a really strong community that's really standing down and firm about being creative in those solutions. And so those are constantly agenda items on the Heading Home Ramsey agenda that we talk about often. So thank you for those comments.

Thank you. Thank you for your good work. Oh, I'm sorry. Rena, you have one more question?

Go ahead. It may be a statement, too. But I just wanted to piggyback I always wanted to piggyback off Commissioner Zonk, who talked about the work that we need to do in partnership with others, including the city, the county, and the state. And just say that I did receive a phone call yesterday from our chair of our Ramsey County delegation, Representative Hussain, who said that the St. Paul delegation, they have many, many questions too about this process and what we're doing and how it probably needs to be done. But it's working to get a meeting and pull us all together, including the mayor, the assistant mayors in the counties, and our delegation, to look at how we move forward. Because one thing we know, this is not just a city or county problem. It's all of our problems. That goes beyond just city, county, and state. It's our philanthropic communities, the business department, the business community. It is looking at our community-based organization. It is that all hands on deck. And we all have to come together collectively to see how we can solve this problem. And it's not really just a Ramsey County, in my opinion, a Ramsey County issue. I would look at our seven metro counties, and probably state counties across the state, because there are many who are coming from other places into Ramsey County to get the services that we are providing. And we never turn anyone away. We don't ask those deep questions about where do they come from. Where is your last place of residency? But I would like to say that it is, the burden is falling on Ramsey County residents, right? And so as we look into, now into 2027 with what we see maybe coming down from the federal government, we're going to have to make some really hard decisions about how we're going to do our work and support everyone from across the state of Minnesota because it is really having an impact on the tax base that comes from Ramsey County. And so I think it's important to say that because with an emergency like this where we are stepping in to fill these gaps and take care of this emergency has an impact. It has an impact on us, even though I did read that some of the work that we are doing now would not impact our levy. But that's at this moment. And so we have to be very strategic to pull up partners into this work. And I know at Hidden Home of Ramsey County, with the many partners that we have with the governing board and those who come to our governing board meeting, which we will have one at the end of this month, this is going to be some of the questions we want to address and put forward. I really look forward, and I know heading home, Ramsey County, look forward to the many partnerships that we can continue to create. This is a shared burden. If we're going to call it a burden, it's a shared leadership, it's a shared proposal around how do we all come to the table and take care of the peoples in Minnesota? Because for sure we know that this is not just a Ramsey County issue of populations of people who's coming before us. So I just look forward, whether it be to be in partnership with the city, county and state, because they need to go back to the Capitol and think about how they are supporting St. Paul, right? and what that looks like for Ramsey County in general and the work that we need to do going forward. So I look forward to that. Thank you, Chair.

Thank you. Mr. Chair, just a last comment. I just want to uplift the work that Commissioner Moran has been doing, both as Chair of Head & Home Ramsey and also Vice Chair of the Legislative Team here, too. So thank you for navigating and having so many of those conversations, Commissioner.

Thank you. See no further discussion, roll call.

Oh, I think Commissioner Miller has her hand up.

Oh, Commissioner Miller, I did not see that. Go ahead.

That's okay. Thank you, Chair. Thank you, other commissioners. You guys have asked fabulous questions, and I'm like, check, check, check on my list. I just have a couple of clarifying ones or just a couple quick ones. One, when we talk about our coordinated response or our coordinated entry system and the people on the wait list, are we looking at, are the people in these encampments also already on the wait list? And so do we have an accurate picture of that data already? Because once you get on that waitlist, how do you get off of it unless you're being offered a spot? Are they continuously checking up on people? I guess I'm not really familiar with that process. And then two, I just wanted to go back to a comment that our housing stability director mentioned. Some people will go right into housing and some people will go here, but we do have a waitlist. So what happens to those residents that are already on our waitlist for shelter, for other services, and

now we're because we have a crisis or immediate attention in front of us with the closing of these encampments what are we telling those other residents commissioner miller excellent question and there's been a lot of questions around this so i would like to try to explain a little bit in about this amount of time of the coordinated entry wait list in order to get a coordinated entry assessment one has to be unhoused or living in a place not meant for human habitation Right now in Ramsey County, the policy to give an assessment on coordinated entry is that you have to be long-term homeless, which means a year or more, or you have to have a disability or another identifying factor even to get on that wait list. When you're on the wait list does not mean that you are unhoused or unsheltered. You could be in emergency shelter or that 30-day shelter that we mentioned and still be on the coordinated entry wait list. What that wait list feeds is permanent supportive housing stock that we have federal or state funds that give us permanent supportive options where these people are assessed, individuals are assessed to go. So once you are on the list, we contact you when somebody has an opening in their permanent supportive housing. Some of them that you might have heard are Kimball Court. Another one might be single room occupancy at Higher Ground. There's several organizations, and I can provide a list, if that's helpful, of all of the permanent supportive housing that Ramsey County funds, either through the state or federal dollars. Once you put that into the coordinated entry list, you then move into that opening when you are available. So the encampment residents would not precede anybody on that list. Everybody is assessed. There are some priorities, such as veterans, some different things for how long you've been homeless or your disability status. And that is how the list is prioritized. When I mentioned to you system design, we do need to do a redesign of that list and what that list looks like. Right now, there is approximately 1,400 people on that list. But again, some of those people might have already had found housing. Some of them might not be able to be reached. Some of them, unfortunately, may have passed away. So we are doing our best as we're, I like what County Manager Becker said, walking and chewing gum. We are also trying to really look and sweep that list to make sure that everybody who's on that list is eligible and needs to remain on it. The wait for permanent supportive housing is long. And so now we are also using that case management and housing navigation that while you're on that list, somebody will work with you and say, maybe you don't want to wait for permanent supportive housing. Maybe we need to find another alternative for you because that wait is too long. And so that's increasing that affordable housing stock. That's increasing our partnerships with community landlords. That's including helping people apply for housing stability, formerly GRH funding. So we have to really do a better job of navigating that list in real time. And that is something we are dedicated to do. But the real answer is, an honest answer, is there's not enough permanent supportive housing units for the amount of people that are currently on the coordinated entry list. So sometimes it's another re-messaging for the community as well. that just because you get on the coordinated entry list is not your magic ticket out of the system. And so we're having to create more creative pathways for people just instead of waiting for permanent supportive housing beds to open up. So I hope that answers it. It's a very complex system to explain in a brief time. Oh, you did fabulous.

Thank you. Thank you.

Any other questions coming?

Nope, I have no more.

Okay. There will be no further discussion. Roll call.

Excuse me. Jebin Singh. Aye. McGuire. Aye. McMurtry. Aye. Miller.

Aye.

Moran. Aye. Zhang. Aye. And Ortega.

Aye. We are way behind schedule, so if you need to speak on your reports, keep it to one minute. Otherwise, you're cutting into the workshop, which we already have. Go ahead.

I'm good. Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you. Mary Jo?

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll reserve some of my comments for next time, but I just want to say thanks to our communities for all their great community festivals. Village Fest for St. Anthony Village is this weekend, and so is Canadian Days for Little Canada, so lots of activities going on, and we're looking forward to that. Thank you.

Just quickly to say that many of us were at the NACO Policy Convention, and I'll just say, summing up, almost every one of my panels that we were at talked about how, regardless if you are a county that's large or small, urban or rural, blue or red, all of the changes that are coming in this massive shift from federal to county governments, is a world of hurt. It's coming our way. And this is just one of many tough decisions that's coming. So just wanted to say that we are leaning in on the experts that we have here, our colleagues, but bearing down for what we know is going to be another difficult season.

I will pass, Mr. Chair. I will pass. Okay, thank you. Mr. Miller. I'm going to pass as well. I thought you were still at Mardi Gras. No. OK. We have a board workshop on workforce traction, retention, and promotion chaired by Commissioner Singh. We'll do that in about five minutes downstairs. And then at 1.30, a board workshop on community health assessment and community health improvement plan chaired by Commissioner Zhang. We are now adjourned.