Commissioner - Regular Meeting

We're going to bring this meeting back to order. All right. Good evening, folks. Welcome to the Queen Anne's County Commissioners meeting. This is a public meeting that is being aired or aired live on our local cable television station QAC TV seven. These media broadcasts provide county citizens an opportunity to watch and participate in our scheduled public meetings. In addition to our live audience this evening, we are providing remote options for citizens to watch and participate in county commissioner meetings. Citizens may watch our meeting live on our website at QAC dot org slash live. or on our public access television channel provided by Breeze Line Cable Services. Citizens may also participate by joining the live Zoom meeting by going to QAC.org slash public comment. And citizens may also email comments to public comment at QAC.org and all comments received will be summarized during the press and public comment period on tonight's agenda. We acknowledge everyone's participation and by attending you acknowledge that this session is both recorded and aired. Press and public comment will be taken and is limited to three minutes per person. If you do care to speak, please sign up at the information table in the lobby and comments longer than three minutes can be submitted in writing for the commissioner's review. We will now stand and be led in the Pledge of Allegiance by Commission President Jim Moran.

indivisible, with liberty.

All right, commissioners, that brings us to the approval of our agenda for this evening. So the agenda for today's meeting, June 30th, together with the regular session minutes, the Rhodes Board minutes, and the closed session minutes from the June 9th meeting have been circulated for review. Any additions or corrections?

Nope. Motion to approve the agenda as submitted and all three sets of meetings as submitted.

Second. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? 4-1-2. Commissioner Duman is on assignment. So. Thank you Commissioner Moran. Commissioner McLaughlin on the TV screen and the rest of us are right up front.

Okay commissioners, we just held a closed session under the general provisions articles section 3305 for boards and commissions and personnel. Section 3305 to consult with council and section 3305 for land acquisition. So I do think we have some board appointments and one motion.

I move to appoint Douglas Jenkins to fill the vacancy on the board of electrical examiners. This term will expire on June 30th, 2031.

Second. We have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Opposed? So moved, 4-0. The Housing Authority, we're going to hold that? Yeah, hold that. And you want 2613?

And then I move to withdraw County Ordinance 26-13 and to develop a policy regulating all signs on County property without permission.

Second. We have a motion and a second on this item. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? Aye. So moved.

All right. Thank you, commissioners. That brings us to press and public comment. So we appreciate all citizens taking time to express views to the county commissioners. Comments are limited to three minutes per person. Comments longer than three minutes can be submitted in writing. This commission respects your desire and right to convey your message freely. When you come forward, please speak clearly at the standing microphone, state your name, your address, and your topic of interest. And in keeping with the dignity of our office, we ask that all views be expressed in a respectful and civil manner.

First up is Eric Truitt.

Eric Truitt 0 Southernsville Cemetery Road Millington. So I have a farm in Queen Anne's County here and I'm trying to get a permit to put a shipping container. I've been a month and a half trying to get this permit. I have the irrigation machine that I'm trying to set up and the electronics are going to go in the air in the shipping container and I'm out of stuff. There's no accountability at the permit office. You call up there and nobody has no idea what they're doing. I can't even have a refrigerator to get a drink there. There's no house there. It's just a farm. I want to keep some tools in there, stuff that I use every day, and I'm not sure what my next step will be. Any advice?

You took the right step coming here.

Yeah. Well, I called you last week, but I never got a call back. Oh, okay. Left you a voicemail. Very good. Okay.

Yep. Got it. Front row. She'll be happy to talk to you. Thank you. Thank you. Is it Michelle is it Beaver. I'm sorry.

Hi. My name is Michelle Ravert, and I am the Democratic candidate for Maryland District 36 here. And I am here today to introduce myself and to let you know why I'm running and why I'm here today. So I'm running because I believe that the people and the government have become too far removed from each other. And it's about time that the people we elect for our government represent the people. that they're there to represent the reason i'm here today is because we have a lot of legislation that's coming out of maryland that is one size fits all that really just doesn't work here in our district and i want to make sure that i am talking with county commissioners as well as the local town mayors and such to make sure that any legislation that is being considered is appropriate here in District 36. And if it's not, then I can go and fight to have it changed or have our district removed from the legislation altogether. Thank you.

Thank you. Marty McKenzie?

I'm going to defer to the second round of comments. OK.

Thank you.

Thank you. That's all signed up. Would anybody else like to speak? Seeing none, we'll close press on public comment.

All right, commissioners, we can move into the legislation portion of tonight's agenda. So we have two public hearings. The first one is a public hearing on County Ordinance 26-05 Supplemental Standards for Gas Stations. And this is a citizen sponsored text amendment. So Mr. Thompson here will officiate the hearing. And we have Stephanie Jones from the planning office as well, if there's any questions.

You ready? Ready. At the regular meeting on May 26, 2026, Commissioner Moran introduced County Ordinance 2605, a bill entitled An Act Concerning Supplemental Standards for Gas Stations to Include Fuel Pumps, Underground Fuel Storage Tanks in Islands and Canopies in Queen Anne's County. for the purpose of reducing the required distance between an entrance exit to a gas station to any intersection from 100 to 75 feet, providing how such distances to be measured, and generally addressing and dealing with gas stations and exits by amending Section 18-1-58B, the Code of Public Local Laws of Queen Anne's County. This hearing is being held Tuesday, June 30th, 2026, at 5.40 p.m. in the County Commissioner's Meeting Room, Liberty Building 107, North Liberty Street, Centerville, Maryland. The proposed amendment received an unfavorable recommendation from the Planning Commission at their May 14, 2026 meeting. Copies of the proposed ordinance have been available to the County Commissioner's Office during normal business hours and online on the County website. Speakers will be limited to three minutes each, written testimony of any length, could be submitted on or before the hearing date to the county commissioners. Hearing sites are accessible to individuals with disabilities, sidelined interpreters, and assisted listening assistants are available. Part of the record of the proceeding will be a certificate of publication indicating that notice of the hearing was published for two executive weeks. In debate on record observer, newspapers of general circulation in Queen Anne's County, as well as the recommendation of the Queen Anne's County Planning Commission. The first person I have signed up is Joe Cusimano. We're gonna bring him. We won't bring him around here.

Would the applicant sit at the front, or would you rather that the applicant speaks?

You could speak right there. Understood. Three minutes.

So I'm Brendan Mulaney.

I'm applicant for the...

I represent Mr. Cusimano.

Well, you're also listed here.

Would you prefer that Mr. Cusimano goes first?

No, but if he wants to speak, now's the time.

Understood. Okay, so I'm Brendan Mulaney. I am counsel for Three Seas LLC, which is the owner of a property at 1104 Price Station Road. Like all citizen sponsored text amendment. This text amendment is proposed to solve a problem in the county. This applicant that brought forward this text amendment owns a 6.8 acre property that is zoned VC and there is a local and minor road intersection that is essentially a sand road that intersects a minor collector that is 81 feet curb to curb away from the entrance to this property. property owner brought a conditional use application, which in the VC district, the convenience store with fuel pump use, which is proposed for this property, is permitted by conditional use approval. The applicant submitted the conditional use application and was told that the 100 foot dimension from entrance to intersection applied to the application. So we quickly supplemented the conditional use application with a variance to allow the reduction from 100 feet to 81 feet. Staff has concluded that supplemental standards in the zoning ordinance cannot be subject to a variance application and approval by the Board of Appeals. So that decision was appealed. It went to the Board of Appeals, I think last month, and the Board of Appeals found two to one that they agreed with staff. We're waiting on the written decision from that. But in the meantime, because frankly we have no interest in litigation related to what we believe is an erroneous legal conclusion related to whether or not the applicant here can seek a variance, we applied for the citizen sponsored text amendment to allow David. reduction and frankly to change what was the black and white letter of what was submitted for was to reduce the 100 feet to 75 feet. David. I believe that your packages for tonight include a variety of materials and memos that were submitted by. David. The applicant here and by my office, one of those is, I think, 13 examples of convenience stores with fuel pumps that have. entrances less than 100 feet from intersections. Another is a memo that we submitted to the Planning Commission responding to some of staff's concerns about the proposed text amendment. This applicant has no intention or desire to propose anything that opens the floodgates to something that isn't good for the county. They have a property that is unique in that it has an intersection 81 feet from its entrance, and there is no viable path based on staff's position that we can't seek a variance to get a convenience store and fuel pump on this property, even going through the Board of Appeals variance process.

So we went to the...

I'll be as brief as I can. We went to the Planning Commission and staff and the Planning Commission's counsel told them, you are not to consider anything outside of the strict text that was applied for. when this goes to the commissioners the commissioners can do with it what they want so our intention tonight is to come to you all and say and ask we proposed in the materials that were submitted to the planning commission a number of different approaches to accomplish what we would like to one of them and and the one that i'm the biggest proponent of is not have this be a reduction county-wide from 100 feet to 75 feet because i think staff's concern is Any property in the county would then be available for an entrance within 100 feet, no closer than 75 feet from local nearby intersections. What we would ask the commissioners to consider is applying this reduction only in the VC district. And the reason why I think that would be prudent is Fuel pumps and convenience stores are only permitted in the BC district with conditional use approval. So an applicant, a property owner has to go in front of the Board of Appeals for the county and demonstrate that there are not any unique and adverse impacts at the location where the convenience store and fuel pumps are proposed. So if the text were changed to say in the BC district only. In all other districts where fuel pumps are permitted, the 100 feet would still apply. The dimension to intersections from the entrance to properties can be no closer than 75 feet. An applicant still has to go through the process of conditional use approval with the Board of Appeals where they consider any unique and undue adverse impacts on local properties or local roadways. And one of the things that the Board of Appeals is tasked with considering is any undue threats to the health and safety of citizens in the area. So that was one of the approaches. Another was...

Understood.

We ask that you consider something reasonable and discuss this amongst yourselves to try to recognize the problem that we're trying to resolve with this citizen-led tax amendment.

Thank you. Mr. Cusimano, did you want to say something?

Joe Cusimano, one of the owners of Three Seas. I bought the property with my dad and my brother. We bought this four years ago. We're trying to make something of it. It's an existing commercial property. It's sitting vacant. We have a lot of citizen support. We submitted a bunch of letters from all the neighbors. They all want this. We're hung up on being too close to dirt road. We're four years in. It's costing us a lot of money. All we've got to do is get past this code section. We still have to fight the board of appeals and get through a whole other process just to get close to getting approved to open a gas station. So, you know, we're willing to work with anybody we can to make this happen.

Thank you. Jay Falstead.

Good evening, commissioners. Jay Falstead, Queen Anne's Conservation Association. We oppose this ordinance and ask that you accept your planning commission's unfavorable recommendation on this. Really for a couple of reasons. Both safety and environmental in our view. On the safety. I know the applicant mentioned that there are other gas pumps within the community that are less than 75 feet and that is true. But those are typically within the municipalities so Southersville Millington Churchill Centerville they all have pumps that are right near the roadway. The difference is between what they want to do and those the pumps that are in those areas are when they're in the municipality the speeds are much much slower. This section near 301 is totally different. And so at the very least I hope what you'll consider doing is asking guidance from the fire marshal. Public Works just try and get a better handle on the safety dimension of how this particular application could affect all of the county. I have to say in some ways this feels like a little bit of a backdoor way of spot zoning because if the 100 foot limit is right now countywide basically what we're doing is we're trying to accommodate a single landowner. But it opens the door to every every other area around the county. And so it's a little bit odd. For those reasons I hope you'll reject it. Very finally the applicant mentioned the Board of Appeals. I have to tell you anything that comes before the Board of Appeals under the standard of Schultz v. Pritz. They would have to show that somehow, or anybody that opposes this particular project would somehow have to show that this is totally different than everything else. Having testified before the board or before the the appeals board on numerous occasions nearly every single application is passed. And so I would not put a whole lot of faith that the that the board of appeals would somehow be able to reject this. So for those reasons I just ask that you support the planning commission's guidance and give this an unfavorable recommendation. Thank you.

DIRECTOR DEWOLF.

Evening commissioners. I have a couple farms towards Ingleside in that area and like many people over there have always wanted something to get, you know, closer than Churchill for fuel and or food or just small, you know, necessities. So it's always been a wish of many of ours in that area to have something good on that corner. It's a great little spot. I mean, I come through there all the time. There's a railroad track. People are always driving slow through there. I mean, 301 is what it is right there, but There's nothing from Queenstown to Middletown, and this is the only good place for it, and it's just a shame that it's sitting there. Thank you.

That's everyone who signed up. Is there any other public comment on County Ordinance 2605?

I didn't sign it.

That's okay.

Good evening. This is kind of strange to me because I'm usually up here asking for something for myself, but I'm not this time. I'm just here as a citizen. I know the applicants. I know the property I drive by.

Name, name, name.

Oh, Jim DiDonato, Queenstown.

Sorry. I'm not 100% up to speed on all the issues with the property, but I do know that we drive, you know, 301 a lot to Delaware up to Pennsylvania, and it's an awful long road from Queenstown all the way to Middletown if you do need to stop for gas or something like that. And I think just from a perspective of a citizen, it would be nice to be able to have some place that you can stop, get gas if you have to pull over, something like that, because it's a long stretch of road. So, again, if there's something, I mean, if the county sees it as an opportunity to revitalize an existing commercial property, I think it would be well received by citizens, plus anybody that's driving through, if they spend any money there at all, it stays in the county versus going to Delaware, which I think is probably where it's going right now. From a tax perspective, I think that's probably a bonus. Like I said, I have no interest in the property whatsoever, but I would support seeing it developed. If there's a way, if it's not this way, maybe there's another way you guys can recommend that it goes through. So thank you very much.

Thank you. Anybody else want to pass the ball? All right.

We'll keep the record open for two weeks. All right. Thank you.

All right, commissioners also on your legislative tab item to page 2. This is public hearing county ordinance 20606. This is another citizen sponsor text amendment. This is for maximum impervious surface ratio for commercial and industrial uses in the suburban commercial district that were operating prior to December 31st, 2025. Mr Thompson.

This is a public hearing being held on county ordinance number 2606. A bill in play to enact concerning an increase to the maximum, maximum impervious surface ratio for commercial and industrial uses in the suburban commercial SC District, which were in operation prior to December 31st, 2025 in Queen Anne's County, Maryland, for the purpose of increasing the maximum impervious surface ratio for commercial industrial uses in the suburban commercial zoning district, which were in operation prior to December 31st, 2025, from 0.4545% to 0.8080% by amending section 18121E2A1 of the Code of Public Local Laws of Queen Annecy County. This hearing's being held on Tuesday, June 30th, 2026 at 5.45 p.m. County Commissioner's Meeting Room, Liberty Building, 107 North Liberty Street, Centerville. Opposed ordinance received an unfavorable recommendation from the Planning Commission that's on May 14th, 2026 meeting. Composite of the opposed ordinance have been available at the County Commissioner's Office during normal business hours. and online on the county website. Speakers will be limited to three minutes each. Written testimony of any length could be submitted on or before the hearing date to the county commissioners. All hearing sites are accessible to individuals with disabilities. Sign language interpreters and assistive listening systems are available. Part of the record of this proceeding will be a certificate of publication indicating the notice of the hearing will be published for two successive weeks in the Bay Times and Record Observer, newspapers of general circulation in Queen Anne's County, as well as a recommendation of the Queen Anne's County Planning Commission. Jay Fawcett.

Tonight's Daily Double. Commissioner Jay Fawcett, Queen Anne's Conservation Association. Once again, this is one of those issues where I hope you'll accept your planning commission's recommendation. But it also raises the question of just stormwater generally in Queen Anne's County. And right now, we're making progress in waters that reach the bay. Agriculture is making progress. The one area where we're sliding backwards has to do with stormwater. And so I hope we can find ways to accommodate some of these projects that are coming up while at the same time addressing some of the stormwater issues. In doing an AI review tonight, I just want to put this on the record because it does give everybody a little bit of hope, I think. I asked AI whether there was substantial construction cost increase in going with impervious surfaces over traditional parking lots. And here's what it said. Opting for a pervious layout can ultimately make a project 12 to 38% cheaper overall because it completely eliminates the need for expensive underground and stormwater sewers, catch basins, and retention ponds. Going further, traditional parking lots must route water to dedicated land-consuming stormwater retention basins. Pervious pavement is the basin, saving valuable land for parking spaces or for building footprints. I mention that just because Atkins Arboretum has a great parking lot where it's pervious. The water drains through. It does not sheet off into the local creek. And it is a good environmental aspect to have. And so if you're looking towards approving these types of projects, I hope we can find ways to find better mitigation standards that go beyond our code in preventing some of these toxic waters from reaching the bay and the tributaries. With that, thank you. Thank you.

That John is signed up.

I did not sign twice. Could you forgive me? I represent the applicant here as well. Brendan Mulaney, 100 Northwest Street, Easton, Maryland. Here on behalf of three parties, Chesapeake Boat Lift Service, Chesapeake Family Flooring, and the Mill at Kingstown. This again is a text amendment that was brought forward by 3 businesses that are operating in the county today to address a very real problem that businesses are facing in the SC zoning district. Currently the lot coverage the total maximum impervious surface in the SC zoning district is 45%. That doesn't just include asphalt and buildings and gravel. It also includes parking areas whether they're on grass or pervious pavers it also includes all lay down and storage areas even if they are on vegetated land cover and that comes out of the county code unfortunately staff has interpreted that to include all of those areas even if they're vegetated Um, the, the proposal was aligned with a couple of other zoning districts in the county that allow 80% maximum coverage to give the most flexibility to, uh, my clients, the property owners, uh, and one of them is a tenant in the county who operate businesses and are looking to expand and invest in the properties. In order to do so, oftentimes that means enlarging buildings. It means enlarging parking areas, growing their business. So this would be a vote if this should be modified to support businesses in the county. Recognizing that the Planning Commission was told only consider the 80%, we had submitted a modified proposal, if it is more palatable to the county, to propose an increase from 45% to 65%. Um, that would be consistent with what is permitted in the suburban industrial district. This again is the suburban commercial district. So you'd go from 45% to 65% and would give much needed flexibility to, uh, businesses like the ones I represent and throughout the County that are in the SC zoning district. I also think it's important to note that. Only 202 of the 27,375 properties in the county are zoned SC. So this is not something that I believe is going to open the floodgates countywide. It is a moderate increase in proposed lot coverage. The 80% that was proposed eliminated all of the nonconforming situations on SC zoned properties that my office could find. There are only three properties that we could find are significantly over that 80 percent and again that that um does not include my aerial review does not include the landscaped lay down or parking areas that businesses use to support their business that was only gravel asphalt and structures If the 65% were to be found acceptable to the commissioners, that would eliminate all but 12 of the non-conforming situations that we found. The total non-conforming situations that we found were 39 of the 202 SC zoned properties. We believe that this is a reasonable increase. It's consistent with other zoning districts that are similarly situated in the county. and solves a problem that real businesses in the county are facing right now that's preventing them from operating their companies. So I ask that you discuss this and look at it favorably, modify it within reason, and move it forward. Thank you. Thank you.

Any other testimony on County Ordinance 2506? Yes, ma'am.

Good evening, commissioners. My name is Annie Richards. I'm your Chester River keeper. I look forward to speaking with you in just a few minutes. But I just wanted to share short reverse concerns with this particular county ordinance. As Mr. Falstead mentioned in from QACA, impervious surface is a major contributor to stormwater runoff to our waterways. I participate in a lot of work groups for state legislation and something that NGOs and environmental partners talk a lot about is how to help counties meet their MS4 permit goals. And so when we consider a major impervious surface increase in zoning close to double in this situation, one of the concerns that is flagged for me is how the county quantify what that increase will mean for the increased water loads in terms of meeting your MS4 goals. Also, DNR has long supplied information and research that shows that when a county or when a sub-watershed goes 5% impervious surface, 5 to 10% impervious surface, you start to create conditions in the local streams and sub-watersheds that plummet dissolved oxygen levels and impact fishery habitat. So essentially you start to massively eliminate the biodiversity of fish that can exist in that waterway. If a text ordinance like this were to proceed, I would recommend having some sort of tally and accounting process as to what's happening in each sub watershed to see how much we're increasing impervious surface in those areas. And in particular, I would be thinking about tier two streams, which require which are currently in much better standing in terms of water quality in the county. And of course, the state of Maryland has heightened expectations for protecting that increased. So if you have any questions, happy to supply greater information from Shore Rivers and our staff. Thank you for receiving our comment.

Any other testimony on County Ordinance 2606?

Well, thank you very much. We'll keep the record open for two weeks.

All right, commissioners, we can move into the presentations this evening. So next up, we have Annie Richards, Chester River Keeper, Shore Rivers. And she's going to give us the Shore Rivers update. We have a presentation in your books, tab number six, item one, pages one through 17. And it's up on the big screen here as well. Should have just stayed up here. Yeah, that's right. Annie, how are you doing?

OK, hi. Once again, I'm Annie Richards. I'm your Chester Riverkeeper with Shore Rivers. It's a pleasure to be here. I'm not often able to give you all a presentation about our programs. I'm proud to do so tonight. I'm going to be speaking to you about our Swimmable Shore Rivers program. So in case you're unfamiliar, Shore Rivers is a local water quality nonprofit. Our mission is to protect and restore Eastern Shore waterways through science-based education, restoration, advocacy, and community engagement. Those are the four pillars we think really work for a rural area like the Eastern Shore. And it's not just river keepers, though we have four. I'm happy to work with more than 30 full-time staff members across the Sassafras, Chester, Miles Y, Eastern Bay, and Choptank watersheds. We have many different departments to uphold the four spokes of our mission that I mentioned earlier. We're trying to achieve a vision of thriving rivers cherished by all Eastern Shore communities. And you can't cherish our rivers without getting in them. We've been busy since becoming a merged organization of legacy grassroots organizations in 2018. We've been able to accomplish a lot. I'm not going to go through all of those things, but this is one of our annual reports that summarizes the many achievements each of our departments have made in terms of stewarding students, restoring underwater bay grasses, planting trees, and many many more things. But what I think really makes us stand out compared to other organizations is our commitment to science. So this graph here shows you Shore River's testing sites. And those have been community supported as far back as the 1980s when our grassroots organizations, our legacy organizations began. Today we operate 67 tidal water quality stations across the four watersheds we serve. We have 54 bacteria monitoring sites. Let's compare that to what the state does in that same geographic region. Maryland Department of the Environment operates seven tidal water quality stations and 19 healthy beaches sites, which again are comparable to our bacteria programs. This isn't to throw shade at our state of Maryland, but it is to show what the power of community investment does. We have a lot of community support, a lot of community requests for this data because they want to know what's happening in their local rivers. And I would say the thing that gets the most public engagement that we do is sharing the results of our bacteria monitoring program through swimmable shore rivers. As I mentioned, we have 54 bacteria sites. We test those sites with a suite of volunteers. We have more than 50 volunteers that go out to public access locations. Not all of them are swimming sites. But we also know that when you're launching a kayak with your children, The chances for recreation in those shallow waters are very high, so we want to make sure that we have reliable bacteria data, even if it's not a designated swimming beach. Those volunteers go out between Memorial Day and Labor Day. Every Thursday, they collect a water sample, bring it to our in-office labs. We process those for fecal and pterococci, so we're talking about waste, so bacteria that comes from waste. We're not talking about Vibrio or any kind of flesh-eating bacteria. This is something that is in the gut of every warm-blooded species that lives in our environment, including us. And so that's what we're testing for using the IDEX system. We share those results with the public every week on Friday so that they're ready to recreate for the weekend. We also share with local agencies and we follow the Maryland state clean water standards in terms of our thresholds for passing and failing. And this is incredibly tiny for you guys to see, plus shameless advertising from my cute children. So you can see all of the different dots along our watersheds. You'll see green dots, yellow dots, and red dots. Red dots are testing locations that pass less than 60% of the time that they're tested. Yellow between 60 and 79 percent of the time and green pass 80 to 100 percent of the time. Happy to report that we have a Corsica River site that passes 80 to 100 percent of the time. That's a Corsica River Yacht Club. And then Conquest Preserve also does very well. It can toggle back and forth between yellow and green year in year out. I think that goes to show that we have a lot of natural lands out on Spaniards Neck and that contributes to healthy water quality. I also wanna flag that we're in the final stages of becoming tier three certified, which is the highest level of certification a NGO lab can become in terms of having our data recognized by the state of Maryland, by the EPA, and having our data integrated into the state integrated report for water quality. So, there are many different stations that we test that are actually public landings and publicly operated by Queen Anne's County across two of our watersheds. Miles Y Eastern Bay, we have Mattapique Beach, Kent Narrows, and Drum Point Y Island. All of those were in the red, you could see. And then in the Chester, we have some others, Southeast Creek, Crumpton Landing, Jackson Creek landing so those are the publicly operated landings as I mentioned that are part of Queen Anne's County that we test for and unfortunately most of them are in the red except for Jackson Creek which is yellow so while we wish all of our sites are green they are not what environments do bacteria thrive and grow in darkness heat and nutrients we have turbid rivers here on the eastern shore We have nutrient and sediment pollution problems. That kind of creates a perfect environment for bacteria to grow and thrive. Even if it's a normal amount of bacteria, and what I mean is bacteria introduced by wildlife, deer, creatures living in the marsh, that type of thing. But we also have common sources of bacterial runoff from agriculture, from failing septic systems, wastewater treatment plants, illicit discharge from boats, and then stormwater runoff generally across the land. All of this can contribute to situations where folks really want to know what the bacteria count is in their waterway before they use it. And we have the web traffic to prove that. So as I mentioned, this is something that we get a lot of feedback from the public on. This is a tally of the web traffic that we get through the swim guide for each of the Queen Anne's County sites. You can see we have over 54,000 views of people checking this website to see if their favorite landing is ready and appropriate to be recreating in. We've also been surveying our members and general community members about the utility of the program. And we've gotten a huge response from the public. 88% of respondents said that the bacteria results from shore rivers influence their decision about where and when to swim. And that's important to us because this program is not telling people not to get into our river. It's teaching people how and when and where. We also use this data publicly. A program I'd love to highlight is we actually share this data with the Smithsonian Environmental Research Center, and they use that data to train satellites to pick up different pigments in the water and then attribute those pigments from satellites to certain bacteria counts, certain turbidity accounts, and then certain algae content. So it's training satellites from space to detect our water quality. And then as I mentioned, we also share our data with the state of Maryland and with the EPA to influence integrated reports and other things. And so today I'm here before you to humbly ask for your support for this program. So we are approaching our counties this year to help support this program as it is a public resource and a tool for all county citizens. We are asking for the funds that it would cost to cover the sites that are operated by or that are operated and owned by Queen Anne's County. That's seven public sites. Our price to operate and serve these sites is $50 per site per week. We run this program for 16 weeks, which is a total of $5,600 for the entire season for all of these sites. And that covers testing supplies, staff time, and lab equipment depreciation. And with that, I would welcome any questions that you might have.

Can you go back to the last slide?

Absolutely.

Is there any way to get more testing sites from Mattapique Beach south? And the reason I say that is because we have gone through our Southern Ken Island sewer, and I want to see how much it's cleaned it up, or if it's trending towards cleaning it up.

Absolutely. I can speak for Ben Ford, our Miles White Eastern Bay Riverkeeper, to say he would absolutely love some more sites in his watershed. And so if that's something that Queen Anne's County was interested in exploring, adding to the docket, then we could absolutely talk about that.

What do you need to get the site selections done?

So typically, the way that Shore Rivers chooses sites is it's got to be a publicly accessible location in some way. Like, for example, Corsica River Yacht Club is not a public access point, but it serves the public because it offers summer camps and swimming activities and things like that. So you have to have a willing site, public access. We have to have a volunteer, which we're very proud at Shore Rivers that we do not have a lack of volunteers. It's quite easy for us to identify a swimmable Shore Rivers volunteer. And then we need the funding. And that's how we bring that new site online.

We do.

I can't do math that quickly, but if it's $50 per site per week for those extra sites, then yes, we could do that $800 a site

Yeah, $800 per year per site, yeah.

Annie, are you, I couldn't tell on the screen, are you testing by the mouth of the White River? The commissioners just invested quite a bit of money in an oyster restoration project there. It'd be interesting to see the water quality.

I'm doing the math right.

So we want to do.

Did you hear what you said again about the oyster restoration real quick?

I was just saying, Annie, are you testing by the mouth of the Y River? The commissioners invested quite a bit into oyster restoration there last year and then this year. And it'd be nice to know what the water quality is by the oyster reefs.

I see. Thank you for repeating that question. So the closest testing site we have to the restoration site you've mentioned is Drum Point on Y Island, which is pretty close. It's not right over it, but it's certainly in the neighborhood.

I can speak because I've done it, my wife and I, many a times, Drum Point And just south of it where everybody ties up the minute they leave first thing they do is pump out. And we've taken samples. Plenty of times doing that. But well then I'll make a motion for eight thousand dollars. That'll cover us for three more sites. Three more sites. I would, can I come back and accept?

I would absolutely love to accept, but I'd love to just confirm with my colleague, Ben Ford, and it's incredibly generous of you, and we love to add sites so that communities have more information, so that's wonderful.

I'll make a second on the 8,000, so we'll just go ahead and do that, and then come back if you need more.

Okay.

Make it easier on you.

Great, thank you.

I think you're still up there?

yeah okay so we have a motion in a second for eight thousand dollars all those in favor signify by saying aye aye aye aye 4-0 so Annie can you um can you let us know if there are other areas that oyster uh reefs restoration barges so to speak would be helpful absolutely you don't have to tell us now just you know let us know

Sure, I can come back with a whole oyster presentation at another time. Okay, thank you.

You don't have your oyster barge handy, Dan? Yes, I know.

I got to keep them in organized boxes. But thank you all so much for your generosity. This is a wonderful program. Thank you.

All right, commissioners, moving on to our second presentation for this evening. This is also tab 6, item 2, pages 18 through 34. We have Janet Melson, Commission on Aging member, Subcommittee Chair, Ms. Janet Salazar, Commission on Aging member, Queen Anne County Library Director, Ms. Annie Sparks, our Department of Aging and Transportation Director. The presentation is entitled Longevity Ready, Queen Anne's County. So Annie.

Hello, thank you for having us.

All right. Thank you. Good to see you.

Are we ready? A few people I do want to introduce before we get started. So to my right, we have Miss Janet Melson. She is a commission on aging member and chairperson for the subcommittee of the Commission on Aging for the Longevity Ready Queen Anne's County. She's joining me up here today. Thank you for that. And Janet Salazar, Queen Anne's County director, as you know, sends her regrets. She was under the weather today so she won't be able to join us. And then we have Bonnie Walter here with us. She is attending as the Queen Anne's County Commission on Aging long-serving chairperson. So thank you for being here and all that you do. And Becky Barbee is another member of the subcommittee group we've had and another member of the Commission on Aging. And then if other members of the Commission on Aging can raise your hand, thank you for coming. And then we have some staff here as well, aging administrators.

so thank you and I will turn it over to Janet to get us started well our program started when the state of Maryland did a presentation on their longevity ready Maryland program and it was to recognize Maryland's growing over 50 population and what the state could do well we started thinking why should we wait for the state let's look at Queen Anne County well as a result queen anne county's commission on aging believes let's bring the awareness to our county okay because of the increase in our population our slides are going to show statistically how it's really increasing for those over 50. so to accomplish this mission we would like to and or have planned presentations to bring awareness to our increasing aging population. Everybody's aging, right? And we would like to give it to county government departments, civic organizations, and businesses about the aging population in this county and what their needs are. And now, should we go on with our slides? Sure thing.

So again, who we are for people watching at home to the department of aging and transportation, which houses the community care division, senior centers division, and the transportation county ride division. And of course the commission on aging, which put the subcommittee together for this presentation. Um, they do a lot of large events for the aging population. And coming up in September, they will be hosting a resources spotlight event. So be on the lookout for that. And then in 2027, there will be the usual senior center tour for the commissioners as well as a town hall. So a couple of big events that they have. coming up. So how all this got started. Governor Moore signed the longevity ready Maryland executive order through the leadership of Secretary Roeck for Maryland Department of Aging for moving aging services from a category reserved for a specific group of people at a specific time of life to a unified whole of government process that better prepares Maryland for longer lives across the lifespan. So this QR code for people watching at home too, if anyone wants to check out the full Longevity Ready Maryland plan, they can click that QR code and have access to that and a lot of great resources through the data dashboard. So with the Longevity Ready Maryland plan, it is a 10-year multi-sector plan which put together four epic goals of building a longevity ecosystem, promoting economic opportunity, preparing Marylanders to afford longevity, and optimizing health and wellness. Some stats for the state of Maryland are included in the slide. By the year 2030, One in every four Marylanders will be over the age of 60. By 2035, one in three American households will be headed by someone 65 or older. Maryland's 85 and over population is the fastest growing segments. And then we have some Queen Anne's County numbers here as well. So looking back in 1980, the 50 and over population was at 29%. then going up to 2000, the year 2000 was 31, and then in 2020 was 43.6 with a continued growing population. For Maryland, For Marylanders, for the 60-plus in 2020, it was 22%, and then estimated by the time of 2030, it will be 26%. 44% of Marylanders' jobs are supported by Marylanders over age 50. By 2030, Marylanders age 50 and over will support 1.7 million jobs and occupy 36% of the workforce. By 2050, the 50 and over population will account for 60% of all money spent in Maryland. And yes, there will be a pop quiz at the end. For the ALICE threshold, the asset limited income constrained employed group looks at a group that falls above the federal poverty level, but they don't make enough to afford the cost of living. So this is a big group that is underserved and really all groups are. So we are going to be sharing this in our presentation with the businesses that we go and see. as well as sharing some information on ageism because that is an important part of it with stereotypes and prejudice being included in people's abilities to live longer work longer and you know important of thinking that if someone is capable of doing something based on abilities and not on age And it goes both ways. So assuming younger people are incompetent or unreliable is a stereotype as well. So what we're going to be doing in the community, you all are our first presentation, so we're metaphorically cutting the ribbon with you all. Thank you for doing that with us. So we're going to be talking with businesses on how they can prepare for people living longer. The big part of the Maryland Department of Aging multi-sector plan is bringing businesses together to talk about it. I think Commissioner Wilson said it well in one of the budget presentations with the public where he said we are an aging county. And you mentioned the emergency services getting another ambulance because of that aging population. And that's really what this multi-sector plan is about. It's talking about the aging population so every department and every business is ready for it. So we will be brainstorming with the businesses on what they can do to be longevity ready and be ready for every age and every stage. And with that we have a video I will ask for QAC TV's help with.

I am aging. We are aging. We are aging.

We are aging.

We are aging. We are aging. We're all aging through every stage of life. The Queen Anne's County Area Agency on Aging invites you to explore all of the fun activities and supportive programs they offer to older adults, individuals with disabilities, and caregivers, from crafting and lunches to events and dancing. This department encourages residents to learn about services offered, preparing for longevity at every age and every stage. For more information, please visit the Department of Aging and Transportation's website.

Thank you for watching QAC TV. Thank you, Bruce. And so with that we will conclude our presentation because we are all aging and we want to be prepared for every age in every stage and we look forward to going out into the community to offer this presentation which will be a lot more interactive and So if you know of businesses or things that may be interested, please let us know. And we would like to do a group photo with you all since this is our inaugural presentation, if you're willing to do that with us and everyone here that came for this presentation, if you can get in it as well. All right. Thank you.

You don't have to jump like Tom. I'm all against it. He's better shaped than us. Very good. Oh, no, you guys got to get a prop. No, no, no, no. thank you why do you need that yet yeah keep it handy

All right.

Commissars, you ready to proceed on with our absolute business? Okay. Next up, we have the Department of Public Works. They've got several action items. So if you want to turn to tab number two for DPW. So we have Lee Edgar, our chief engineer, and Alan Quimby, our director of public works. So tab two item. One on pages 1 through 3 is the Department of Emergency Services Station 400, which is out near DPW, the old helicopter hangar. This is a renovations contract award for DES Station 400 to remove and replace existing exterior metal wall panels, install metal over metal retrofit roof system, interior wall panel systems, and exhaust. None of them from our county. I'm sorry, Commissioner, couldn't quite understand that. Are they from our county?

Are they from our county?

We had bidders from Rockville, Harrington, Delaware, Salisbury, and Gaithersburg were the four bidders.

We got a motion?

I move to award the DES station 400 renovations contract to Bayside Roofing and Exteriors LLC of Rockville, Maryland in the amount of $338,108. and authorize the director of public works to issue the notice of award and execute the contract on behalf of the county commissioners.

Second. Do you have a motion and a second? Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye. Aye. I think we're allowed 90 days.

That's correct. And we're ready to hit the ground running. Thank you, commissioners.

Commissioners the next items are for the sanitary Commission so being a sanitary second.

All those in favor.

All right, thank you commissioners. I'm 2 on page 3, 3, 6, this is a consent to sign a Maryland Department of Transportation. He's meant to license agreement from the town of Southernsville to the county. The town had to secure a license agreement from them dot in order to place one of their water mains in Main Street under their railroad right away there. And as we all know, the county is now the owner of the water main and the utility systems in Sellersville. So this is a transfer document from the town of Sellersville to Queen's County.

I move to execute the consent to assign a license agreement with the Maryland Transit Authority in order to transfer the license allowing a water main with Main Street to cross under the existing railroad right of way from the town of Southernsville to the county.

Second. Got a motion to second. Any discussion on this item? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed?

Okay, thank you, commissioners. Item three on pages seven through nine. This is a memorandum from Director Quimby for the Barclays Sewer Sub-District Rate Hearing. As I mentioned, the county owns and operates the public wastewater collection system serving the town of Barclay through the Barclay Sewer Subdistrict. Following an exhaustive review of the system's first full year of operation, we've completed a financial review and determined that the current user rates are unfortunately insufficient to cover the actual cost of the operating and maintaining of that system. And the staff is recommending that the Sanitary Commission authorize a public hearing to consider revisions to the Barclay sewer rate schedule. We propose to have that on July the 28th. And I think we want to hold that up in the northern part of the county if we can find an appropriate venue. The idea here is we would be Ready to have this the new rate schedule be effective for the October billing cycle. And there are a number of components to that rate schedule. Would you like me to read through those real quickly? The motion? Well, yes, in the motion as well.

Yeah, I'll do the motion. Okay.

All right, Commissioner.

I move to hold a public hearing on July 28, 2026 to adopt a Barkley sewer service area rate schedule and consider the following rate adjustments. institute a customer charge of $6 per quarter per account, institute a ready-to-serve exemption program to assist homeowners with limited incomes currently defined as a gross income of $38,484 or less, to modify the ready-to-serve charge billing from a per-account basis to a per-EDU basis. to increase the current operations and maintenance charges by 25% per EDU to institute an annual rate escalator to be applied to the operations and maintenance charge and the pump maintenance charge effective July 1, 2027 and each subsequent July 1 thereafter.

Second. We have a motion and a second. Any discussion on this item? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed?

Thank you, commissioners. Item 4 on pages 10, 11, and 12. This is for the Southernsville Water and Sewer Subdistrict rates. Again, the county owns and operates the public water and sewer system serving the town of Southernsville through Southernsville Water and Sewer Subdistrict. Again, a comprehensive cost of operating, maintaining, and servicing. debt associated with these systems. And again, staff recommends the Sanitary Commission authorized public hearing to consider revisions to the Sullardsville water and sewer rate schedule. And these proposed changes do include a phased three year adjustment to those water and sewer rates. And again, we would like to hold that on July the 28th in order to be prepared for implementation by the October billing cycle.

I moved to hold a public hearing on 7-28-2026 to adopt a Southernsville water and sewer service area rate schedule and consider the following rate adjustments. 1. To institute a customer charge of $12 per quarter per account. 2. To institute a minimum quarterly flow of 4,550 gallons per quarter to all improved properties. 3. To institute a ready-to-serve exemption program to assist homeowners with limited incomes currently defined as a gross income of 38 484 or less number four to increase the current water and sewer ready to serve charge and usage charge by 30 35 for both water and sewer to the to be effective october 1 2026 To increase the rates established on October 1, 2026 by 15% for sewer and 5% for water to be effective July 1, 2027. And to increase the rates established July 1, 2027 by 15% for sewer and 5% for water effective July 1, 2028. 5. To institute an annual rate escalator to be applied to the water and sewer ready-to-serve and usage charge of 5% to be applied July 1, 2029 and each subsequent July 1 thereafter. 6. To institute an annual allocation fee escalator for new development to be applied to the water and sewer allocation charges of 2.5% to be applied July 1, 2027, and each subsequent July 1 thereafter. So we have a motion and a second discussion. Alan?

Yeah, I was going to say, we should probably explain a lot of this. And I'll start off. And then, Alan, you can fill in all the blanks with your expertise. For those not aware, the Sellersville plant was upgraded in 2006, 7, 8 time frame with the anticipation that two large communities were going to come online and support the project. Fortunately, with the housing bust, neither one of those communities became established, and therefore the plant moved forward. It's created a lot of debt on the back end with USDA and other sources of money to upgrade the plant. And it's been pretty much in that situation for the last 15 years under the town's, the town commissioners are the ones that have run it up until, I guess, last year, two years ago now, I guess, in toll. MES, well, MES ran it, but the town commissioners had control of the purse strings and everything else. Two years ago, the county stepped in because it was basically going bankrupt and services weren't gonna be able to be provided. So it's been a painstaking thing for the commissioners to have to step in first and even Go down this road, but unfortunately with sewer and water it is enterprise zones, which means it's user funded We met with the commissioners who went met with their townspeople came back with This is a really good compromise based on the severity of where the plant lies today so hopefully the hearing will be able to share more information out to the public in that area and But I think this, in three years, will actually get the plant in good shape financially, and the users will, it'll kind of settle out. The good news is, too, they have two housing projects that are due to come online in Sudlesville over the next two, two to five years to say that will put an additional 300 plus homes there which will greatly reduce a lot of this long-term effect of the sewer plant so there is a silver lining to where we're going with this and it is painful to have to do this honestly as far as i'm concerned but it unfortunately it is necessary at this point so anything else you got alan um one of the things you asked us to look at is the impact of growth and it would make a huge difference if and when it comes

Right. That's the issue. And also, these rates, as drastic as they may seem, that only brings us to a break-even. There's no reserves being built up. There's no capital program being set aside for it. This is simply to keep the operation moving and having the customers pay the cost of the operation. We're looking for a break-even. One other thing, in order for us to be able to implement the Ready to Serve exemption program by October, which would help out the low-income people, I really have to start that process now to get the applications in. Because what I have to do is send them to the comptroller to verify their income, which takes a long time, four to six weeks. So if you decide not to go that route, which I can't imagine you would, but we just throw the applications away. But I really need to start canvassing the public now to get those applications in.

Something you need from us to start your canvassing? Nope, just say OK. OK. OK.

all right any uh any additional on this item or you got anything else now uh no i really need to know by monday the location and time for the for the advertisements well we'll we'll have to get a location uh we were thinking 6 30 or seven yeah seven yeah seven seven seven o'clock at the middle school right where we do the budget here maybe you can try for the middle school what about since it's summer whether or not it's open Oh, gotcha, gotcha.

Maybe the firehouse, middle school. We can check those couple venues, but those would be the two. Firehouse has rooms. Firehouse, yeah.

Okay, yeah.

So he needs that money. So I can't foresee the firehouse, right, as long as they're... Yeah, we'll check with them. That's about it for me. Very good. Thank you.

All right. Thank you, gentlemen. All right. Moving on, commissioners.

On tab three, we have been voted. Did we not vote? Not on the second one. We haven't voted yet. Did you get the vote on that or did we not vote? No. We did not vote. Oh, I'm sorry. Excuse me. Okay. Well, we have a motion and a second. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed?

There you go.

All right.

Todd gets so excited when we talk about sewer, he just brings it back to the days.

All right, commissioners, moving into the action items this evening, tab number three, item one on pages one through five, we have the Mako annual accomplishments list and the FY 2027 dues and assessments. They've submitted their membership dues invoice. And once again, Dues remain frozen. This is 17 consecutive years where they have not increased their dues for county governments one penny. It's been a great year this past year, as I'm sure our past president, Mr. Jack Wilson here, Commissioner Jack Wilson, can attest to. So this would be right there.

Yeah, that's true. That's very true. All those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? So moved.

Thank you commissioners item to page 6. This is from our Queen is County health officer. This is requesting approval for the FY 2027 contract along with the option to extend for additional 5 years for non emergency ambulance transportation medical assistance services. The amount of this particular service contract caps out at $96,000 and this is state funded. Dollars that the County Health Department operates the program for.

I move to approve that Queen Anne's County Department of Health enter into the FY27 contract along with the option to extend up to five additional fiscal year terms for non-emergency ambulance transportation, medical assistance transportation services with AMVAN LLC transacting as AAA transport. This service contract is not to exceed the amount of $96,000. Second.

We have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor, signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye.

Here you go. Thank you, commissioners. And item three is a similar item. This is also from our health officer, and this is requesting approval for their FY27 contract, along with the option for an additional five years for the ambulatory and non-ambulatory wheelchair medical assistance transportation services. And the amount of that service contract is not to exceed $800,000. And again, it's with... triple-a transport and that I will mention too that this both these contracts were competitively bid on a Maryland marketplace and we only had one bidder for these contracts the only service provider really in the region so just wanted to make sure you were aware of that and again this is a state funded be transacting as triple-a transport this service contract is not to exceed the amount of $800,000 second

And these are fee-for-services, so it's just basically a knock-out seat.

We have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? So moved.

Thank you, Commissioners. Item 4 on page 8 is a letter of support. Address to Governor Moore endorsing the town of Centerville's wastewater treatment plant expansion project and the town's request for state funding and assistance to advance this critical infrastructure investment for the town of Centerville. And they also sent letters, similar letters requesting support from our delegation members as well.

I move to execute the town of Centerville wastewater treatment plant expansion project support letter to the governor of Maryland. Second.

We have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed? So moved.

All right. Thank you, commissioners. Item five is a letter in support of Chesapeake College's grant application to the Rural Maryland Prosperity Investment Fund for the development of the Queen Anne's Technical Building. This will be a letter that we'll be getting later for signature by all of the Chesapeake College counties via DocuSign. Just need your approval to have Commissioner Moran sign that when it comes in. And the application is for $112,875, which will help offset design expenses incurred by the five counties for the Queen Anne Tech Center.

I move to agree to execute the letter of support for Chesapeake College's application to the Rural Maryland Prosperity Investment Fund for the development of the Queen Anne's Technical Building via DocuSign when the document is ready for signature.

Second. We have a motion to second. Any discussion on this item?

and I also believe I've read that they're gonna also next year will apply for construction yes grant as well yeah all right commissioners item number six

we want to do seven first yeah we can sure that's a good idea commissioner item number seven uh this is um engineering services for kenton arrows thompson creek landing bulkhead and matapique boat ramp replacement so our department parks and recreation held a bid open bids on june 22nd for engineering services for the three projects i mentioned four bids were received and they're recommending award of the lowest To the lowest bidder, George Miles and Bure from Salisbury, $97,810. And we do have some grant dollars from the Waterway Improvement Fund to help out with those three projects.

You owe Jack big time. What's that? You owe Jack big time for moving you off the list.

I do appreciate it. Well, earlier would have been great, but this is new. What took you so long?

So you want the motion first? Go ahead, Chris.

I move to authorize the Department of Parks and Recreation to contract with Engineering Services George Miles and Burr LLC from Salisbury, Maryland for the Kent Narrows Landing, Thompson Creek Landing and Manatee Boat Ramp projects for a total amount of $97,810 utilizing the MD DNR Waterway Improvement Fund grants. Second. We have a motion and a second. Discussion?

We're all good, right? So actually, yeah, let's do the motion, because I actually have a question for James after this in relation to the River Keepers presentation. Oh, is that different? Yeah.

Just out of, so these, this is just the engineering to design new ramps?

Correct. And bulkhead.

Two bulkhead repairs, one ramp. And it's just repairing and replacing them. It's not a new site. Okay. for St. Grant funded.

All right, well, we have a motion, we have a second. All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Opposed? So moved, four zip. And you wanna?

Yeah, so in the Riverkeepers, she was showing where they took a lot of their metrics were at, Boat landings. I don't know how that's a good place to be taking a water quality metric when you have boats in and out there with fuel and a lot of things going on there. I don't know. I was just questioning because you looked at some of the other ones that weren't related to boat landings. They were in much better shape. Do you see that where the water quality right there at the boat landing, if you go out 50 feet, it's probably much better 50 feet out than it is actually at the boat landing? I mean, in my common sense mind, I would think so, but I don't know.

um i wasn't part of that presentation so i'm not i'm catching up a little bit here um i'm glad there's the you know where people are uh getting out on the water which is what we want and yeah the boat ramps are uh a place where you know it's the interface with land and water and a lot of times the runoff is coming off there so right yeah okay i know they help us out with the swimming beaches at mata peak i think they're studying that one so does mde and that's really our only public swimming and that was the other question i mean it really haven't that much time with them that was what i was going to say is most of that they're testing aren't swimmable anyway people aren't supposed to be swimming

Or should we be telling them go swim in there because the conditions are right? Because none of them are certified swimming places in Queen Anne's County. Right? As far as I know. It's only Mattapique.

Mattapique Beach is. That's the only one.

I'm saying Mattapique is our only beach that's certified for swimming.

Yeah, there's some rules. I'm not the expert on that. Other folks are handling that. But as far as swimming beaches, you need a shower, a bathroom close by, and things like that. Okay.

Yeah, that's my question. I was just wondering why they would be testing there if they're not really swimming areas or swimming.

Well, I think it was part of where she alluded to the fact that, you know, if it's a kayak launch or a canoe launch, you're still stepping into that water. So you're still being exposed. I got you. They're trying to bring information that way.

Yeah, I think you can make the argument people are tubing and getting, you know, our boaters are interfacing with the water.

Yeah. I'm just saying at the landing, though. It just seems to me it should be somewhere.

away from the land and i think there's a a certain standard of how far out into the water they're supposed to go and again that that goes with consistency and consistency of the test taker too they have to get locations where there's public access that's probably why sometimes it's at the landings is the only place they get the access but if we get a couple more of these locations for them we'll get a better feel for how it is as you're sort of going down the right which are non-landing locations that's what i'm thinking is it might be better hopefully

Yeah, you would hope you're going to see more yellow or green at least.

We are trying to look into ways to intercept material before it gets into the water as that interface point.

That's a landing itself?

Preliminary work behind the scenes, we're working on that. Excellent.

all right thanks gentlemen okay our final item is item number six this is a follow-up to the presentation we had a couple of months ago on the building moratorium we have some findings recommendations and we would like to seek out some policy direction from the Board of Commissioners so I think we have a number of the committee members here I think come on up steve cohen and uh and director quimby are gonna lead lead us through a couple of these uh policy questions but um we um we still have a lot of work to do yet we have to update and adopt the comprehensive water and sewer plan and the associated sewer allocation policy and related to that the county's adequate public facilities ordinance and the memo in the book outlines and some of the findings The appendix in that item in the book on page 20, I'm sorry, the last page of the memo does show the appendix A on page 17, the remaining capacity at the sewer plant. where we had the allocations set aside for residential, commercial, and climate resiliency, and then the re-rating capacity and the buckets for public health concern, unidentified public health concern areas, non-residential and residential infill uses. So all in, we have about 450,000 gallons remaining. So we wanna get some direction from the commissioners how we are gonna allocate that. And if we're gonna have annual caps, winter to be allocated and then Steve will be going over several additions and modifications to the adequate public facilities policy and ordinance for school capacities. So with that commissioners have any initial questions. before we get started and I'll let, I don't know who wants to start first.

We had an initial presentation on this a while back and there was some social media outreach for citizens. Have we gotten any input from any citizens by email or anything?

Not to my knowledge.

Yeah, we've received very limited feedback from the presentation on the proposal that we had laid out before.

Well, just so folks know who are watching, there tends to be a lot of people who voice concerns about whenever there's a development or something that's approved. That's what this is about. This is about what resources are available for future development from Kent Island up to Queenstown. And so if you have strong feelings one way or the other about what should be loud, what shouldn't be loud, how it should be mitigated, how it should be sequenced, this is like a big deal important thing to be active as a citizen because if you're not and then a year from now there's something that you don't like you know there's gonna be a new policy that's in place and this is the opportunity so just so people know that the words put out there but there's been shockingly little feedback on it

The final component of the water and sewer plan before we can publish it for adoption is the water and sewer allocation policy. If you recall, we were here a couple months ago. One of the things we proposed was quarterly restricting applicants for allocation quarterly, which wasn't well received, so that's off the table. There's only really two components left that we need answers to. finalize the draft sewer allocation policy is one for residential do you wish to meter out the allocation remaining allocation 70 gallons per year and if so how many gallons per year or just leave it as it is now on demand and the second one is where in the development review process would a project be eligible for asking for allocation currently they have to go through concept plan review and approval and then they can ask for the allocation One proposal put forth was to hold it to the very end of the process, which I guess that's on the table as well. I'm not sure how you feel about either of those things, but again, to frame them up, we need to know if you want to meter out the residential allocation or not, and we need to know where in the process you want the project to be eligible to request the allocation. That's the direction we need at the moment as far as allocation policy.

If you're... Just from my perspective metering out the allocate future citizens future commissioners to use that allocation without having it all used up quickly. So I think there's some some logic to it. Then the other side I guess would be if if it's too rigid then you may prevent certain projects that do make sense that need a larger allocation. I wouldn't want to see it all gobbled up. quickly and then there's nothing and then you know there's some who knows what it is that we need that now we we're we're in a bind because when this is gone absent new technology like that's it for the county there are some change in laws at the federal level or new technology this is it

yeah nine thousand gallons yeah the hundred and fifty thousand remaining in the current plant and then the three hundred thousand re-rating yeah but only a hundred thousand years of residential we're only talking about residential right so you've got a hundred thousand basically yeah yeah to be clear we weren't talking about at least we weren't initially talking about metering um commercial allocation right or public health needs or institutional uses just the residential 150 000. and historically those have not been ones that have sort of used large volumes at once so they almost sort of like historically have been self-metering yeah residential users consume the bulk of the allocation so we had suggested before a 10 000 gallon per year cap for residential allocations out of the re-rating.

That was about 40.

And just to, this is not a one and done situation. This is something that as projects come in, as sewer allocation is allocated, we would keep the commission informed on where we are and if policy changes or changes are needed to the allocation. You could change it. it could get tighter or looser so if at if at a certain point there were no caps then a year later we came back to revisit it those caps could be put in place so this is a starting point as we move forward and we could and we're going to it's going to be an ongoing annual process but i think the caps also keep the county from getting into a bind legally with a development that comes in that just say wants 500 homes and

that's gonna gobble it all up for say a two-year foreseeable future and we say no because we have another project or whatever the case may be and that begs me to my next question was I brought up the concern about this group of commissioners can't sit up here and pick and choose who gets housing and who doesn't and I feel like that's a situation that's going to be a very hard unintended consequence it's going to be out of this the way this is drafted now and i know you're shaking your head alex did you do that i mean and i get it but it's it's like we have to come up with a system of how that is me if we're going to meter it there's got to be the rules got to be very clear as to how it's metered and you know whether it's first come first serve at the end of the day do the commissioners get the final veto that kind of thing I think all that's got to be thought about before we jump into this because this is it I said it during all these forums and stuff we had this is it this is going to be something that's going to stick with Queen Anne's County till the end of Queen Anne's County now like to your point unless technology changes and there's something drastically happens and It all just disappears in the air after you flush a toilet, but I don't think that's coming anytime soon, so. And then the other one is the clawback. We already have a clawback feature for developments now, right, for if they don't break ground, blah, blah, blah. Clawback. For the allocation, the clawback allocation. We already have that in place, right? I noticed that was one of the things that was on here to decide on, but I think we already have something in place for that, correct?

We do. Okay.

So, I mean, I'm good with that. And then the APFO side, obviously, that'll work itself out. And, Steve, you did all those numbers, and I understand that there is some maybe shift on.

Yeah, so we'll get into APFO.

You want to just do the sewer part first?

If we want to go through sewer, then we'll shift to APFO. And so people understand, too, what we're talking about at $10,000. This is for... new development proposals there are there are developments that already have allocations but have not yet put a shovel in the ground or they're in the process of putting shovel in the ground they've already got allocation that's outside of what we're talking about here so southern kent island a house that there's a lot that hasn't been built yet but it's buildable that's already sort of accounted for in a separate allocation so we're not talking about that doesn't stop those from going forward these would be new developments I think some people don't understand that distinction.

If you do do a metering, you have to set a date when it takes effect. As you know, there are three, or at least two, there's three projects in the wings that were held up by the moratorium. Right. So you need to keep those in consideration. One of them actually fits under the 10,000, so I'm not sure about that one, but the other two would exceed the 10,000, if the 10,000 is the number you pick.

well also i think we need to keep in mind that these appendix a at any given time the sitting commissioners could vote to move some of the allocations from one category to another all they have to do is amend the water sewer plan that's it right so i mean i think that's something that's I think that's a good thing. I mean, I think that Queen Anne's County has, and shoot me now if you want, but it's always been a bedroom community. And that's why there's so many commuters, but I don't know. I look at this from another standpoint, the Clean Water Act. The TMDLs, that's why we're here. We have 3.3 million gallons of discharge into the Chesapeake Bay where what we're discharging is a hell of a lot cleaner than what's out in that bay. And we have 3.3 million gallons for a county that has 53,000 people in it. And I look around all around us and the capacity that a lot of these other counties have, we are the first one to run into this in the Chesapeake Bay watershed. to reach our limits and our limits were very, very low. And I would like to see some sort of report on all the other counties and municipalities that discharge and what kind of ratings they had to begin with. Because I approached Senator Sarbanes three or four years ago about this when we saw this coming. And I said, what are we gonna do? I mean, you're gonna shut down a county's ability to grow and without growth, We all know what that means with taxes. So he goes, that's very interesting. Let me look into it. Crickets. So I just think that while we do the metering, and I don't have a problem with that, I think it's going to be difficult to get that up and running. Because like you said, if the property is going to need a lot of improvements to it before one house is built, and you can only build so many houses, I think we're going to see a lot of things not being cost effective. so and again that's just the housing cost goes yeah right way up right so you know those that have you know are looking for workforce housing this is going to push hard against it i think i think there's no doubt right and that's where the municipalities i think that you know they have to step up right you know and that's so i mean i'm just giving that information out there so i you know I don't know how we want to proceed from here to get that daily or annual allocation out there, but were you thinking 10,000 gallons?

I haven't, honestly, really haven't.

That's just a number we pulled out of the air.

That's the number they threw out.

Well, and again, it's how many gallons for a single family?

We allocate at 250.

250 per home, okay. Amy's already left. I wanted to know how many homes got built last year.

I think well and I said this too I think we're looking at a bad we're at a bad stage to compare because we've had 20 years of homes that are now getting built that have been through legal challenges and things like that that are actually given so it looks a lot worse now but it's really just catching up to what is already allocated was already in the pipeline was already permitted in a lot of instances and so as that tails off i think we talked about this out as that tails off you go back and look traditionally before that with in normal growth times it was less than 40. you know what i mean so i that's think that's 10,000 right we triggered 40 is 10,000 so but it was less than 40 so again looking at what we're doing today I don't know it was a good comparison but 40 seems like a reasonable number in my mind just because of the old growth rates that what what you were seeing was less than that I think I looked at some numbers a little while back that over the last eight years Commissioner voted on new residential units is about 88 a year

Okay. That's it.

You're talking about single-family homes?

No. Resident units. So that includes, like, the senior complexes and all those things. Apartments, too, included? Yep.

It averages out to about... Well, apartments are going to be residential now, too. You've got to remember.

So... I think it averages out to about $88 a year based on some of the spreadsheet I was looking at. Obviously, you see a lot more being built because Four Seasons was not voted on by us. Southern Canal was not voted on us. Bay Cove, Ellendale, all of those were as you're talking about the ones that have been in sort of like this rubber band that had been pulled back and then it got finally let go and now we're seeing that but actual ones the commissioners have voted on far far less than what people think but that's what it gives you a numbered look at like so if that's 88 and if we had 40 at 10 000 that's 40 so it's like half Um, now all those 88, you know, that they approved, but not yet all built, right?

But some other parts too, right? I'm thinking you got apartments in their town homes, you got slippery hill, those town homes. I mean, so there's size and, and, and quantity. We got to look at that too, in my mind, that's what you're getting.

How about let's do the easy one. Hopefully it's easy. When in the process, do you want to keep it as it is now? as to when they can ask for the allocation, or do you want to push it further down the development review cycle? That's a good question.

And that's one that gets asked a lot, too, is when should they have to be, when should they have to ask for it? It's like when they're $500,000 into design or before they get $500,000.

That would be my theory. You pull the rug out under a measure, they've spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on design fees.

I mean, I feel like that's, to me, that's the first look, right? If you don't have sewer and water, in an area that requires it, you're not going to build anything. Well, what's the pro and the con to the two? I mean. But I would think they have to do like a concept plan, like a concept plan first. Right. And then in between that and going to that next level of planning, I would think would be the point.

But before they're hundreds, hundreds of thousands of dollars. Right.

Yeah, because the next level of planning after concept plan is now they're all in at that point. Yeah. So now they're into APFO studies and all that kind of stuff, so. And then we can adjust where that is because right now isn't the APFO post that?

APFO is between concept and preliminary. Okay, but you need an allocation.

About the same time, actually.

Same time, okay. If you move it too far into the process before they get approval, then the smaller, maybe more of your local developers, they're not going to be able to shoulder that kind of cost and that risk. They're just not going to build. So you're going to have the larger builders from outside the state that come in to do it. So if you're trying to help promote the locals, who build, you know, I'm gonna go and do 16 homes here. You can't make it so expensive that they find out after $400,000 that it's a no-go. It was just something not fair. If it's not gonna, if a location's not gonna work or get approved, I think the commissioner should know sooner rather than that late.

developer, everybody involved, really. And I guess the one thing about that, too, is the APFO itself. I just feel like, and it's just my opinion, the APFO gets rubber-stamped once you get to that stage a lot of times. I don't know that they look at traffic. I mean, let's face it, if they use the APFO for four seasons or any of those from when they originally conceptualized them, a lot's changed in terms of traffic. So there's no way in a lot of those that traffic, in my mind, would pass muster to where you could build her. And the schools have changed. There's a lot has changed over that time. And you're supposed to take all that into account. But I don't know that that always gets looked at as hard as it should down the road. And unfortunately, a lot of that was because of legal stuff. But to your point, I think if you do that at that same point, now they know everything they're up against, like, right, like you're not going to get your you're not this traffic side is going to come back a flat F and you're going to have to do a lot of mitigation for the roadways and that kind of thing to get your to do what you want to do. that's a that's a big ticket item that may be the one where they go out okay I'm out and I just think that's fair to anybody that's coming to the county looking to do something too whether it's a business or residential whatever the case may be so I'm in favor of earlier in the process yeah keep that as is everything earlier in the process if we can yeah

Yeah, we'll keep it as is in the documents with the recapture provisions, you know, via PWA like we have now. Right. In case they don't advance, because we have had projects.

Right, then we can pull it back.

Yeah, pull it back. Okay. All right.

Now we're back to the metering question.

So you're saying that that 150,000 gallons is 600 homes? Yes. So you're saying that 600 homes The way the allocation sits right now is all that can be done in residential until we either decide to take from one of the other categories or the federal government eases the TMDLs and allows us to discharge more.

As far as allocation goes, the reality is homes typically don't flow 250. So how this works is as they connect, you look at the actual flows through the plant and capacity kind of creeps up a little bit, not much. But other than that, yes, you're right.

And keep in mind to commissioners we have a 150,000 gallons for public health area concern zones which will have some new infill development to if public sewer goes there Marlin farms to mean there's some vacant properties there so there will be some new home construction in those communities when they get served. Not a lot, but there will be some infill like like Rudy.

So that stretches your capacity out 15 years. That takes you to not the next comp plan, but the next comp plan.

I'm sorry, what was that?

If you go with the 600 that you just said, that takes you out 15 years and 40 a year. So that takes you.

40 a year. I just, I don't know.

I think it makes it too difficult for some of the developers. And then they're going to want to be more expensive, or you're going to have out of state.

Right. Again, there's nothing magic about the 10,000. We just had to have a number to talk about.

I think we also looked at a scenario where we did not meter the remaining 50,000 gallons for residential from the 150,000 gallon allocation pool from the existing plant, the 3MGD plant, and then we started the metering process with the new re-rating allocation at 100,000 gallons. So you could let it be market driven for up to 50,000 gallons. And then once that's exhausted, then go to metering at some threshold, 10,000 or 15,000 at the next group.

Steve, what was the infill for Southern Penn Island?

The sewer, SKI, what was the best guess? Vacant lots.

Yeah, on vacant lots that have been built on. That have been built on already? Have the possibility to be built on. That's 500 total lots.

500. 500. Of which a little more than half, I think, maybe two thirds have already been built.

Yeah.

When we presented before the commissioners last time we considered an idea as Todd said where we wouldn't have where we would allow for a short period of time those projects in the pipeline to come in secure their allocation the projects that were were caught up in the moratorium and then January 1 start the metering out of the amount of new allocations you know so There was a kind of a hybrid of finish out the year, let the market do what it's going to do, or let people request what they need, and then begin a metering process at a certain point in time. And that was a $10,000 suggested.

Well, you know, I think that part of this is trying to slow growth, residential growth. So that means you need to count. the municipalities and the question is the only one that's really close to county island and that's what we're trying to control all this is queenstown so you know maybe we go to a combined 75 to 100 per year but you're counting queenstown in there also so that you know i don't know i just looked because if you say 40 here in in in Queenstown says okay I'll do 200 300 or whatever I mean then that's going to really skew it and make it look like that didn't work at all I don't I don't know I just I think it sounds still be using the schools and on the roads and everything else right that tends to go to the next Queenstown as a municipality that goes to the next conversation honestly that's a whole different conversation at that point well but I'm saying it's possible for the ones when their development goes through and They're gonna build 100 homes there. Maybe that's, you know, do you want that 100 plus 40? Or do you wanna just cap it at 100? I'm just throwing out different options. Different ways of looking at it.

Just a throttle back to the Ken Island ones, if Queenstown is growing at a faster pace so that you still have a set amount of homes that you're allowing in a region.

But the net tax effect is much worse when Queenstown does it versus Ken Island and we control it. Because Queenstown can go unvetted, put 100 homes in, with no, but they're going to do that regardless, but no kickback to the county. That means that people on can island are going to pay for those homes in Queen Queenstown, but it doesn't work the other way. So I feel like that's, well, that's, like I said, I'm, but that's, that's, that's just the EPF. I have nothing in my head right now. I'd have to really sit down and, Yeah. And take what you're saying. Look at the county. Why? So those bills getting ready to do 300 over the next five years.

Right.

So what if Centerville what? Centerville's got what? Two large annexes that they've been sitting on for three or four years that I know of now that if they got their sewer, they'd already be building them out. And that's close to 600 homes, if I'm not mistaken. So the concentration would be moving north at that point. And then would you need them up there? Would these be more affordable? I mean, that's what I'm saying. This is more than just, I think 10,000, in my mind, 10,000 right now is a good target number, and that's just me for sake of this conversation.

What are you looking for for us to tell you, like today or next meeting? I mean, I obviously want it today. I just want to say that. Soon, soon. We just, you know.

I just wanted to say that the number I've been throwing out is 30 to 40 based upon a year ago, the numbers. And I don't think it'd be a good idea to give one developer 30 or 40 houses over a year for two or three years in a row. And I hadn't even considered the Queenstown part about that. I've got to think about that, too.

I mean, in theory, one developer could grab 60 to 80. They could do two phases. I was going to say. Year one, I get 10,000. Year two, I need the other 10,000.

Yeah. I haven't figured the mechanics out of all that.

Yeah. Well, that's where. I don't feel comfortable. We have that system right now that I would feel good about doing because you think they say we take money from developers now and we know it's not true. Can you imagine that? Oh, my God.

So that's the challenge with that, creating a criteria and mechanism, and we would have to,

put that in place if it's not first come first serve what is it right yeah and and what effect does that have on housing prices as well it's an important issue because you know housing affordability is difficult now it's going to be it's told people they don't understand like demand i agree you're going to be thinking wistfully of the days of the 500 000 house on kent island because it's going to change a lot in like a very short period of time and then everybody else's houses their costs their their assessments are going to go up

I hear that, Chris, but the comp plan has put the growth areas not on Captain Island. They put it up in Centerville and Barclay and Southernsville, and that is where people should start looking. That's where developers should start looking.

Well, I think people need to look where they want to live. I'm all in favor of that. Wherever you want to live, you find a million dollar home you love and you can afford it. God bless you. Live in that million dollar home. But I think, you know, to your point, Chris, to have any illusion that this is going to drive down housing prices in Queen Anne's County is just that it's an illusion. It's when you get that supply and demand, once that supply is finite, number one, and continues to drop off. demand's going to get higher it's you know there's no secret queen anne's county people want to live here it's i mean that is just what it is it's closest to baltimore dc it makes it a good place to live other than the bridge traffic but you know only one hurdle at a time yeah so promise that million dollars that's going to be the starter home eight years from now i i don't disagree that's why i say don't have illusions that prices are going down in queen anne's county anytime soon so Let's go to APFO. Yeah, let's go ahead.

We've got to move on.

We've got to go to the next one.

Okay. With APFO, school capacity and how we calculate school capacity was one of the issues brought up during the moratorium. We looked at a couple different things. When somebody does an adequate public, when a new development is proposed, if it's over seven units they have to do a school study when they do a school study we have a formula which they use to project the number of school students at that project or development will generate historically we've used 0.5 students per household so every two houses generate one school-age student but in our school system and then for multi-family it's 0.25 so we went back and looked at enrollment last year and compared that to new developments new communities throughout the county and looked at how many kids were in each community to come up with ratios and what we found was the actual ratios that we're seeing on the ground are more or about 0.43 for a single family home so a little bit lower than what we have been projecting and 0.27 for multi-family so pretty much the same but just a little bit higher and this is a practice that should be done every 10 years or so to look at market trends and changes so we went through that and we think that changing or updating it's updating these ratios to meet current meet what we're currently seeing makes sense to do with the APFO so we're recommending that we change the single family ratio from 0.5 to 0.43 for single family homes and for multi-family homes go from 0.25 to 0.27 one of the other things with APFO is calculating pre-k historically pre-k is not a required educational level however we do have six schools that include pre six elementary schools that include pre-k out of eight it is turned into a regular standard practice as well as being right we're seeing more and more regulations from the state to make it a permanent opportunity. So we recommend that the historic practice of not including pre-K and APFO studies be changed to include pre-K and all studies moving forward. So that's a change that we need to make. And then we went back and looked at high school capacity currently. If a project comes in and they're proposing school-age children in a school that's at 100% capacity, the 100% capacity is the limit for APFO. And that makes sense when you're putting kids in an elementary school and a middle school where they show up. Yeah, they're there all day and they go home. So so when you look at the number of kids registered in an elementary school or middle school, that's the number of kids that are there. High school is a little bit different. High school has a lot more flexibility in their programs. And we see things like dual enrollment, like work work programs where they leave school finishing before four years and then also web-based learning and also CTE there's a number of different programs that allow flexibility so you might have kids registered at the high school totaling a hundred percent of capacity but only about ninety percent of that building filled so high school operates a little bit differently and we think we ought to recognize that and one way to recognize that is by adjusting the maximum capacity for high school from 100% to 110% and we think that would be a way to recognize how the high schools actually work and how kids physically move when they're in the school and when they're not.

And there's other jurisdictions that do the over it. I mean, we've been at a hundred with a lot of jurisdictions. Yes.

Many APFOs go to 110, 120% of state rated capacity for schools. And some jurisdictions do have different for elementary, middle, and high, different percentages for elementary and middle and high school, trying to account for how they function.

So in the IEC, what's the IEC trigger for getting the matching funding and all? It's like 110, isn't it? It's over 100, right? You have to hit that threshold before you can get the matching, I think.

There's not a set percent, but you have to demonstrate the need for the new school or demonstrate that you can fill a new school. Right. You've got to be above. And otherwise, they're going to fund a much smaller school. Right. Or expansion.

Yeah.

So you have to demonstrate that if you're going to build a new school for new capacity, you have to demonstrate that you're going to have enough kids in that school to make it worthwhile.

And the APFO, there's no real way to, the other thing that I think we ran into, not anymore, but we ran into the bubbles, the bubble years with the classes, you know, the 9-11 class when everybody was going to die. And of course, nine months later, we had a ton more kids. That was a bubble class where we had, I think, almost 580, almost 600, whatever it was, between the two high schools, which is the most i can ever remember um since i've been commissioner graduating between the two um but there's no way to factor that in is it i mean to where you know because you know what i mean if you got two back-to-back bubble classes hitting high school in two years and now you're going to bump to to your point the diversity is going to take you to 120 percent of capacity when in reality the next year you're going to be back down under 100 that's your 90 that you're

So APFO tries to take that into account by looking at future projections. So if you have a project coming in that's 100 units and they're going to be two years in the development review process and then they're going to take seven years to build out, you would project those kids coming in in those years of build out. So and you would be projecting that with the Board of Ed's 10 year projection. So if there is a bubble where the Board of Ed projects that number going up and coming down, that would be...

It should smooth itself out over there. Okay. That makes sense.

Okay. So they may be held up for a year because of that bubble, but if they adjust their plan or wait a year, that bubble will go by. Go by. Yeah. Okay. Got you. But with sewer, we're only going to see a limited number of these large projects. You know, APFO applies to, for schools, applies to projects over seven units. And we're talking about rationing out sewer or, you know, limiting it. So there's only going to be a limited number of projects dealing with APFO based on that. Right. So until we get into the towns. So the towns, as you mentioned, the towns do not have APFOs. They're not obligated to do the county APFO, which has been an ongoing discussion with the county and the towns.

Which, for everybody to understand that, basically the rest of the county pays for the kids that are going to be born into the town.

So... So APFO does not apply to the towns however impact fees do right so when it when development occurs in the incorporated towns they do have to provide it pay for a school impact fee which would be a capital contribution towards the school but that's a well we know that's not even close to building a school nowadays with the cost of doing anything with schools gonna do it a middle school that's going to be the same capacity for 80 million dollars that doesn't

maybe even 90 by the time it's built.

So those are three policy changes we believe would make sense to implement. Adjusting the student generation rates, including pre-K and making some adjustments, maybe going to 110% of high school capacity to deal with the flexibility in how high schools operate.

So and we don't have an automatic period within the APFO ordinances as to when it gets reevaluated again the next time, right? The APFO. Yeah. Like so when we look at these numbers again to see.

No, no, it's been quite a bit. Yeah, there's a trigger that says do it every week. We could factor that in.

I'm wondering if we should. I think we should add that in there as part of it, too. So they visited.

We can. One of these changes requires an amendment to the APFO, which could also, we could add that language in there that on a set schedule, we would revisit those issues.

No later than every 10 years or something like that. So if they want to do it early, you can, but at least it's sort of triggering that review. Because you also don't know. Well, it's how much everything's going to change in the next four or five years, right? That a lot of these numbers, how schooling is done, could change a lot in the next five years.

It just depends on how things evolve over the next several years. It's hard to say.

and school numbers I mean we have we track these numbers every year we get new enrollment numbers from the school we plug in developments we this is a this changes with every every year when we get new enrollment numbers or if the change state changes state rated capacity it's constantly enrollment is currently down right now

I would have thought it wouldn't have been down. It's crazy, huh?

What's that?

The student population.

Yeah. That it's down. That's the way it's going.

OK, so is that acceptable that we make those changes to the APFO? We'll start the process to develop those documents.

That'll all come back to the commissioners. We have to have a hearing for the APFO ordinance change, but that'll all come back around, so we'll proceed on that basis.

To your point, Chris, too, I would like to see mandatory triggers on some of this stuff, so the next set of commissioners don't have to keep doing what we've had to do with a lot of this stuff.

Right. Some people will just kick it down the curb when they should look at it. That's why we're sitting here today. Building in safeguards is important.

Right. So I think we need some guardrails in there for making sure that it gets reviewed. Whatever makes sense in between comp plans, at least once or whatever it makes. OK. And the schools, I mean, I'm hoping the Board of Ed is on top of this a lot more, at least from the student population side and what they're seeing, what they're looking because, you know, the target funding is going to keep coming back and it's based on where Kerwin is going to settle in. Well, that doesn't, Kerwin is looking at nothing in terms of county population, how we're growing, what we're doing, how much sewer we got, they don't care. This is what it is per student, so gotta be conscious of that, and I think that's where Jim was going with, if you're not growing at all, you're not gonna keep up with Kerwin. This county, no county's gonna keep up with Kerwin if you're not growing at some pace, so.

Yeah, we work with the Board of Ed on, we're using their state projections, yes.

Thanks for all that work. I appreciate it.

So back on the sewer side. So we're going to keep the allocation request commensurate with what we're doing now. I have a concept plan. Commissioners can review those requests as they come in where we're in. It's a concept. They got a concept plan review and then they can make a request for allocation in front of the Sanitary Commission commissioners. So as far as the metering, it sounds like we do want to have some type of metering component or rationing of this the residential component of the sewer so if we're not sure where that number is yet we can still proceed on getting those documents ready and come back discuss that some more before we finalize everything but that's that's part of the sewer allocation policy which um important again you know that sewer allocation we're not saying one development's going to be 40 houses

We're not saying one development is going to be 100 houses, right? You're saying you don't want more than 40, 100, whatever the number is. And if it's five different developers in five different locations, I think everyone sometimes gets hung up on a number thing and they're going to be 100 homes there.

Oh, yeah. No, I don't think.

50 homes. I mean, there could be, but that's not what we're. We're not something that we're implying. Or just how do you assimilate it on a yearly basis?

Yeah. Yeah, you're just saying that when you hit this cap, you've got to wait a year. And then to discuss that, you're saying that they can come in any time for it. I know the last time we said once a year, like a text amendment, you could come in once a year and apply for the allocation.

You said quarterly, but no, any sanitary commission meeting they could ask, once they get the concept plan approval. OK.

I think that makes, I mean, I'm there because you don't know when they're going to be doing their concept plan. They should have a concept plan and say, now I got to sit on this for.

Oh, plus I was thinking about planning and zoning, having to go through 35 concept plans all at one time. Like they do text amendments all at one time. Yep. Stress.

They like it.

Stephanie smiles. Maybe they do like it.

All right.

All right. Yeah. Well, I got one answer. It's not bad. It's not bad.

All right, thanks, gentlemen. Thanks for the other members of the task force that are here tonight. I appreciate everyone being here tonight.

Alan, we'll get all the commissioners out in the heat tomorrow, and we'll let them leave the sunlight until they come up with a number for you. All right. He'll be out there soon.

All right. Well, commissioners, that is all of the items on the agenda for tonight. Open roundtable and any closing.

Pressing public comment. Oh, I'm sorry.

Pressing public comment. Yeah, that too. Do we have anybody signed up?

Yep. Oh, good. This young lady here wanted to go. Yeah. All right.

Thank you.

Again, my name is Marty McKenzie. I'm from Centerville. And I tell you, tonight's been a real wake-up call for me for a reason I didn't expect. I can't understand what you're saying. And I'm so glad that the Agency on Aging People are here because I hope the longevity study includes something to help us. I got spoiled. I watch C-SPAN with the closed captions all the time. But I think what I heard you say is there was a chance for public input on this moratorium report. Am I correct there?

Absolutely. There still is a chance for public input. Absolutely.

And it has been made that the findings have been made public?

That's what this presentation is for. And there was another presentation two months ago, two months ago now with the initial findings of it. And this was just a follow up on it. But no action being taken. We're not voting on it yet. So there is time for people to get more of the information. And our meeting materials are also available.

So the report tonight, though, is available to the public.

yeah i think the slides but it's in the book yeah there was no slides but it's in the book yeah so on our website um we have uh an agenda with all the meeting materials for each meeting you can click on you can also go back and watch uh the meetings they'll be there also and hear better uh so can i assume the moratorium is still in effect yeah yeah it is still in effect okay it doesn't expire until august yeah second meeting in august second meeting august is when it expires

And I wanted to also give a big thank you to your County Commissioner and your Board of Public Works. I was one of the organizers for the No Kings rallies that we've had in the past year. And you all have been wonderful to work with because I am so technically challenged and they helped me so much get through all the permitting process. So thank you so much.

Thank you. Thank you. Anyone else like to speak? You got any emails? Nothing to read? Roundtable. Patrick, we'll let you go to first.

Oh, you're muted. Any update on the big, beautiful flagpole that's going up by the bridge?

Tonight.

Have we heard anything?

Tonight. Oh, we've been in here. Rumor mill says it's supposed to go up this evening sometime. Yeah. Yeah. It's a great thing. Unfurl tomorrow, though.

Is that what it is?

Tell the people what's going on. They don't know. They're all excited.

Well, let them be excited when they come across the bridge tomorrow, right? Or the next time they're at the bridge. We're worried about that.

I'll give a shout-out to the commissioners and to the American Legion and to MDOT for putting this together, our county administrator. And it's just going to be a welcoming... welcoming people to the Eastern Shore. Queen Anne's County is the gateway to Delmarva and the Eastern Shore, and this is going to be a big, huge, beautiful American flag, patriotic, and it's going up for the 250th anniversary. And I just want to thank my colleagues for getting it done. Second thing is a little bit of a challenge I had. I went to Tyler Hendricks down to the Romaco Fire Department and spent a lot of time with our young kids and our first responders. These are 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 year old kids that are our up and coming first responders that are going to take care of take care of us as we get older. Fires and car accidents and EMS. And it was just a tragic loss that we had on Father's Day. And then I went to the candlelight service at the high school football stadium and it was packed. There were so many people and so many young kids Just asking questions. And then on Thursday, when they had a procession from Baltimore from the coroner's office, and every bridge between Baltimore and Ken Island had fire trucks on it. and uh just hundreds if not thousands of people on on all the bridges saluting um our first responder so i just want to thank all of our volunteers and all of our paid ems staff and and our fire firefighters who just put everything on the line for us and we're just a grateful county and we just um Very thankful for them. And lastly, our very own William Packa, who had a summer home here, signed the Declaration of Independence 250 years ago. And we should celebrate that. That Queen Anne's County had one of our own on the parchment. from july it's actually july 2nd 1776 put out july 4th and maryland signed actually on i believe it was august 2nd so just a little bit of history there that's it thank you

Yeah. So first of all I want to set the record straight. Price had a post office when we were talking about burners and where they want to put the gas station. So it was a big city when I moved here because it did have a post office. Matter of fact my address when I moved here was price and is now Centerville because it no longer exists. Real quick I just wanted to talk about that with that gas station there is somebody who crosses that intersection for the reasons that were brought up about going to get anything literally whether it's gas snack whatever. We know how dangerous 405 is crossing there in my mind I think having that convenience store on the other side would eliminate a lot of crossovers of locals and think we're seeing more locals have been injured at that intersection than out-of-towners and have been critically injured dead and unfortunately in quite a few instances here in the last year so you know this is one of them ones that I'm looking at hard I got to look deeper into how it's going to affect other parts of the county if we do this but honestly right now the way I'm leaning is I think it makes sense to be able to have that on that side of the road because points were made tonight that are very good there's no gas between the split and Delaware unless you get off and go into town and there's no place to get a drink there's really no place to do anything until you get to Delaware so that's my opinion on that one and like I said it I think it will eliminate a lot of that cross traffic which are local people and hopefully save some lives second thing The river keeper, she took the ask for money, but I'm gonna ask anyway. So, as you know, our Clay Target team is one of the best in the states. We went out and swept the Maryland state finals, and now we have the reigning national singles champion in Clay Coppedge, who is going back to defend his title July 8th. They're heading out to Michigan. And we have a full team of five we have 10 people that are going out to compete individually for the national title um clay uh cole i'm sorry i'd say clay cole coppage um to compete and then we have five individuals who are going to compete who are the the basically the creme de la creme of our queen anne's county high school team that are going to compete for the team title nationally We also have one Kent Island student who has gone out to compete from Kent Island. They didn't have enough to get a team together this year. But my ask is, so roughly with the registration fees, ammo, and everything else basically put on there, this is no travel expenses for them. It's about $500 a kid. So I'd like to cover our team, which would be roughly $5,500 to cover the kids and take that expense away from the money they've raised this year and let them enjoy themselves. It's fantastic. Cleanance County has a national champion and really by, all accounts we have a good shot at winning 240 teams we have a good shot at winning the team title this year and that would be awesome to have a national champion in our third year how cool is that right so i will make a motion to put uh five thousand dollars towards queen anne county high school teen kids and 500 towards our one kent island high school for their registration ammo and other uh expenses and just with soccer okay there you go got a motion in a second all in favor aye

There we go. That's all I got.

All right. Fireworks are tomorrow. at the Narrows and some people have asked about why are the fireworks not on the 4th of July and we do have fireworks on the 4th of July when the 4th of July is not on a weekend and there's a lot of reasons for that and I know it's preferable to see fireworks on the 4th of July but there is a lot of logistics that goes into this and as people may not know there's beach traffic that comes through in the summertime on the weekends, and that impacts a lot of things. And so it's not so much that you're going to have Beach traffic, when people are arriving for the fireworks or leaving for the fireworks, although quite possible when they're arriving on Saturday, you could have those backups. But there's a lot of logistics that goes in beforehand. Parks and recs getting there and setting up, law enforcement getting there, the first responders. And we wanna make sure that we also have the first responders in place. And on the weekends, a lot of times, they're responding to calls and they're going to hospitals across the bridge and they gotta wait because the ERs are full and so they have to stand there with the beds. until the patient is accepted into the hospital and then they got a battle traffic to get back and that drastically also impacts their ability to be available and for us to not only make sure that the fourth of july event is safe but that we have personnel who can respond throughout the county as well so all of those factors go into it it's not a decision that we take lightly but for the sake of the planning logistics and the safety including also for the county staff that works really hard we do it during the week. And by doing it on the 1st, if there's rain, it gives us the opportunity to just roll it into July 2nd. decreasing the chance that we're going to have an issue with it being being canceled so that that's why it happens that way but for those of you who are really excited to celebrate america on july 4th as well i've got great news for you um every july 4th we get in front of the old courthouse and there is a reading of the declaration of independence it's a whole bunch of people mary margaret puts it together and everybody reads the portions of the declaration of independence And I bet most people have never read the Declaration of Independence or haven't since high school. It's really cool to listen to it. And it's really cool event to go there. And this is 2.50. So I would like to see as many people as we can get possible to the old courthouse, eight o'clock in the morning on July 4th. Mary Margaret would be ecstatic if we just packed downtown Centerville with people to hear that. So please tell a friend and tell a friend to tell a friend and show up. It's a really cool thing. And fireworks are cool. But the Declaration of Independence is really what it's all about, not not the fireworks. So that's the more important thing to be there for. So I encourage everybody to come to that. I have enjoyed participating in that for eight years now. So that's my plug.

You'll be there. I'll be there. I'll be there. Yeah. You know, so, yeah. And it's nice because when you screw up the real big words, nobody knows. Nobody knows. So it's nice. You know, I guess I want to talk a little bit about the bridge and a little bit about traffic and a whole lot about accidents. We need to slow down out there. I mean, I think that the traffic right now and the speed of residents, people just traversing through the county, it's like NASCAR. And two weekends ago, we had five accidents on the Bay Bridges in one day. It's just crazy. And it's just because, honestly, we're not doing enough to enforce some of the laws that we have on the books. Tomorrow night is the Bay Bridge Reconstruction Advisory Group meeting where I will be there to discuss that. Again, we're in the process of the Red X cameras. Hopefully it won't be this year, but next year having that in place and possibly doing something with speed cameras to slow people down, if not hurt their wallets. And that's one of the main concerns I have about the flag. We were talking about this brand new flag, 50 by 30, to cover this room. And I'm more concerned about people coming on down the downhill slope, looking at that giant flag and not paying attention. I hope to God that doesn't happen tomorrow. But yeah, I mean, so just, you know, I just want people to slow down, enjoy what you're doing and where you're going and you'll get there. You know, it might take a little longer, but you're going to get there. And also, the one thing on the Economic Development Commission, the reason the fireworks also are on the weekends is because the restaurants are full on the weekends. So during the week, they're not full. This fills them up because most people will sit there, especially as hot as it's going to be. I don't think the restaurant's going to, you know, be loving it, but that's just, you know, it happens. So, you know, stay hydrated. Enjoy the show. I'm going to try and see three of them. So, you know, that's the way to go. So looking forward to it. I'll take a motion. Motion to adjourn.

Second.

All in favor? Aye. Thank you.

Thank you, everybody.

See you, Patrick.