Development Review Committee - Regular Meeting

Uh, let's go ahead and get started. Uh, our leader isn't here today, so I'll go ahead and get going until he gets here. He won't be here today.

I guess he won't be here today. And you are now the leader. Yeah. I came right after my dentist appointment, but not everybody can do that. Uh we'll start with case DP 2025-9 Valley Baptist Church. Is everybody here for Valley Baptist Church? Please come up in the front. This is development plan approval for the proposed church building edition. By the way, welcome to February 5th, Thursday, 2026 DRC meeting. Yes, sir. Could you give us your your name and address? Uh, Colin Schneider, 416 Jaylen Drive, Albert, Indiana.

And tell us why you're here. Yes. Tell us what you're asking the board for. Just a description of the project. Uh, we're asking for uh approval to add on to the church. Okay. Any details that we should be more familiar with or Well, I don't I don't know. I mean, Okay. Well, let's go ahead and get started with that. David, I guess I'm here just for an answer. Yes or no? Or or maybe I'll ask uh Susan uh what are there special exceptions? Do they need to go to DCA or

that they have gone to BTA for special exceptions or septic? Um they also obtained I believe some development standards variances and at this time they have both engineering and planning conformance. Okay. Thank you.

All right. So, uh, Valley Baptist Church, the initial submitt came in in um, August of 2008. Uh, there is an engineering conformance letter that was issued after two complete reviews. Uh, that was dated September 5th, 2025. Again, engineering conformance was found. Um there were two minor outstanding comments before they would be able to proceed with um permitting. Uh one was a uh a correction to what's called the CN values uh so that the drainage mask would exactly match the hydrocad report. Uh that has already been done. And then we also had a note to inform these folks that they would be um applying for a construction entrance permit. And uh the proper point of contact was also included on this letter. So that would be something I would be um wanting to know how how that was going if that taken place. But um other than that, I didn't have any other comments on this project.

Mr. would uh see the um state approved the change of use so the addition um to tie on to the existing system. So, um that was approved by the state. Um they just had um I know we had discussed this before, but there were some things that looked like according to the inspection, the septic tanks were that they're functioning right now, like that they're in okay condition, but it looked like they were starting to deteriorate. So, that was just to be monitored going forward. And then also um on the inspection there was a note for um it was marked not observed for roing guard on the subsurface drain outlet and and outlet function properly and I know that's something we had discussed before is we just need to make sure that outlet is functioning and I don't know if art's been out because art's the one that's going to be doing the work here. Right.

Yeah. So, I don't know if they've gone out there and verified that drain outlet or not, but that would be something that would be done before we would approve it, the installation.

Yeah. Um cuz we've issued a permit for this. Um like we've approved like the design and everything like how he's going to tie it on and everything. We we've approved that on our end. It's just as part of the inspection. When we go out there and inspect, we're going to need to verify. We're going to need proof. Yeah. show of the train out where it's been located and everything. So, but otherwise I don't have any other comments and for further explanation when they got your zoning variance it's because requires commercial and business buildings industrial to be connected water public water supply and waste water. But you know both what David said and what Dan said that we've already been over that like the last meeting. So I thought this meeting here was just something to do with the lighting that we had to turn in the photo.

Okay. I don't have the advantage of that note but I just wanted to repeat the reason why for others that uh you did get your uh special exception from BC. Yeah. the DCA for a sewer and water connection. Uh the lighting fixture specifications were provided in a lighting plan. But uh did staff have any comment about the uh lighting plan. It it conforms with our UDO. This meeting is not for the lighting plan. This is for the entire development plan. Yeah, I'm aware of that. I just I know. I was just

I'm just going through the list of uh just making sure we're in conformance with what BCA had directed us to make sure was there. And then the next uh issue was the uh right away. So I'll go to Martin and Bob check. Um your condition was submitting due dation for right away in front of the property and the commissioners did execute that. they received their preview. It was on their agenda it was uh signed but this need to be recorded now. Um we have final original documents that need to be reported and we will get with you after this meeting and make sure that uh that uh outside of that is a few other issues that uh need to be addressed. Yeah, I don't see any major traffic issues. It's relatively calm until you get down to Washington Square subdivision to the south of here. Um I did have one comment that the uh drainage uh comes directly south at I think 200 north and I don't think there's any eastments there as of yet, but we just want to pay attention for any future development to the south. you to make sure your drainage doesn't get blocked because there's a natural swale but we don't have a protection over the east at this time. So I just and I did notice on the development plan we have there's some culvers that are noted on the east side west side of your property there. Um it's like a series of 12ish CMP culvers seemingly just kind of popped in there. You know those are existing and correct?

They're probably existing. Yeah, they're on there and they're probably buried cuz there's not much of a ditch along there. Okay. Oh, there's a purpose they were serving there in the right way or not.

Those are field entrances, I believe. Okay. So, those need to be restored after this work is completed. But uh it's I would I would say those probably need to come out. Which ones? The the drive to the church. We don't have a in between the two Southern Drive. Middle and Southern Drive. Sorry, the screen. The screen's not working today, Monica. There wouldn't be a cover between the middle and the southern drive. Well, I wouldn't think so either, but I'm playing. You take a look at the landscape plan that I come over and show you.

I don't know why there would be a growing in there. Yeah. I'm pretty sure. Okay. I was just Why would they need to be replaced? Well, I just want to make sure they're not blocking drainage in the ditch. If they're not cared for properly, maybe they're blocking.

Yeah. I'm almost there in there. Dark surve.

I wonder if it wasn't. You know, sometimes when you work in CAD and they copy and paste something and move it around. I wonder if that's maybe that's not supposed to be there. Like there was some autodrafting, too. They had some codes put in for maybe they said to the ditch and Yeah, that's what I don't know. That's what I would suspect. And I would suggest we find out before you start any construction because that's could be a point of failure. They're told us I think that historically this has been going on for some 20 years. Yeah, that that doesn't even make sense. It's all mow like long through there.

Like somebody could have filled in the ditch and uh just covered up everything. So if it's buried in water, it's not a problem. But if there are olders in there that need to be removed at some point for 10 years. Yeah. And there's water over the top of it. No concern. They are open and they have a potential to fil. They might have had some historical uh information that was collected years ago because this has been kind of an expansion project, right? And if they have the old AutoCAD files that show CMPS, it's not for those ditches to get filled in private property. We don't have a lot of control of that. But please look into that. And like I said, from a drainage aspect, it concerns me more that the offsite is coming due south through uh neighboring property. We just need to keep an eye on it for make sure that this thing will function in the future and if there is development to the south we'll have the opportunity to create less but uh in the meantime you need to get together with highway to get that right away eased. Any other comments, questions, additions?

For the purpose of this meeting though, we can make any um approval contingent on so you wouldn't you wouldn't have to come back again after that. Absolutely. And just for knowledge to get that reported, you said that's something you can do immediately after. You can do that today. Yes. And that's a short process. Yeah. It's pretty quick. It's a three-day review process. Okay. There's a few different windows you have to go to, but we can walk through the material. It's not difficult. that the you'd still need to put together the instrument to record it. But yeah, we need a few days to review it so it's not instantaneous. Well, the review was already reviewed. I thought it was just recording now.

No, the documents themselves, we need to make sure the documents for what they're requiring, right? Yeah. Be reviewed by the auditor. Yeah. So, yeah, they'll be need to be submitted. So you So they're they're signed now commissioners already. Cool. Okay. I wasn't aware of that. They already signed. That's what you said, right? They're signed by the commissioners going to record them. Correct. And then turn them back into the users.

Uh once it's recorded with the auditor and with the recorder, that's all that happen. It'll be on uh we can access the public that. So uh any other comments on it? I'll have a motion. I move to approve contingent upon uh coordination with highway to make sure those filters are removed or having your forces remove drainage and then uh also contingent upon reporting the date of dedication. Second. Any other discussion? Hearing none. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Anybody against? You're good to go.

All right. Thank you. That paper's upstairs. That is with the commissioner's office. Uh I will get to know and get that copy for you. Okay. And then let me know when today sometime after this meeting go over there. Okay. What's that? You're telling me to hang around. Just hang around. Okay. Yeah. It's not always good to go first.

It'll be done. Uh let's go on to the next thing on the agenda will be Evangela Ellery and Carl Avenue Marsh. This is the amended Cypress Estates major subdivision 48 west division road in Morgan Township zone R1 low density single family residential district and this is in the formal review seat design waivers for three block major subdivision and the waiters are looking for conventional subdivision standards interior street frontage Side lot line open space standards. Open general open space for residential. The entire pedestrian network residential perimeter landscaping standards residential storm water standards use requirements from appendix 32B instead of appendix 32A and uh for the street rivalry standards want to begin. Uh good morning of Prol Avenue 111 East Street, Indiana. Um here with Lucasberry. He represents the owner. Uh we're here to floor the board to ex to uh get to design waiverss as listed by Pat earlier that I've already written to you. uh for 110 acre parcel where we're looking to amend the plat that was uh reported a few years ago to add two buildable lots where Lucas and his sons can live next to each other. Um the engineering performance was was given to us on

September 23rd, 2025. Uh and we're refer you guys right now to uh see the the design approvals. Okay, let's go ahead and go to the uh planner to pan for any comments or

um he pretty much covered it. Uh they can't get planning uh conformance until these are either granted or um the plans are changed to comply. I understand the most of these were granted previously a few years ago. Um with the understanding that it was going to be one lot. Now that they're adding lots, they have to come back and ask again. So are they coming back to plan commission for the design waiver or is this ECA?

It will go to plan commission. This is their informal review and I believe they're already scheduled for plan commission. Um and then after the plan commission it will come back to us for review of the subdivision and then the major subdivision will go back to plan commission. Which plan commission meeting are they scheduled for? Um are they sorry would be it's the fourth Wednesday of the month. So, February 25th. Yes.

So, we'll do that February 25th. And uh David, any other comments?

Uh yeah, as I mentioned, uh engineering performance was found on September 23rd in a letter dated September 23rd, 2025. Uh the bulk of this review as also referenced had been done um years ago under Michael. Um I printed out the series of letters that went along with that review. Um looks like that was all in like the 2022 2023 time frame. Uh but again, our letter was made September 23rd, 2025 where the only outstanding comment was just to um adjust uh some values uh to have them match the storm water design manual. Uh the ground cover actually improved from a drainage perspective and the values listed were very close to those found um in the design manual. So the decision was made to not go through another formal a full formal review that is amend those so that um the final records that we have on file would would match up with the resource submitt that gets put in as far as when backings were being used. But um my notes here show that there's ground cover improvements associated with this job. So there's no other comments on uh from a training perspective here. Any questions for David? Okay. Uh, uh, there's been borings on the proposed lots. Um, they support septic. Uh, the septic for the existing house there that's behind where these lots are. Um, where is that located?

You mean the house we just built about here or somewhere? Yeah, that's all the way on. So that's 100 ft away. Well, 9 miles that was built back in '95. That's uh probably 300 ft away. Okay. But it it behind the house behind the house and towards the farm. It's pretty okay. The distance from the house actually, right? Okay. That I was just verifying that. Proposed lots your subject can't be across the property line. I'm just making sure cuz then that wasn't shown on the plan. It wasn't showed on the the platform. Yeah, it's

it's totally it's almost the tour of the plan in the fields. This would be the time to kind of create a schematic for your future use. Uh I realized, you know, 95 was when your mother and dad built email and uh honestly I couldn't tell you where the septic field ended up or the well it is. It is east south of that house. Okay. All the way as far to the edge where the it's away from where the swale is lost. So and for your benefit, I just have us come at it because it's a 95. I'm not sure the health department right records that intensely. Uh

we should have a record of it. Um you should but it's going to be it up and everything but I was just you guys did those four lots and the records that could four lots. Yeah, I was just verifying that but um otherwise I don't have any comments or concerns. Clark. Um I understand wanting to use the existing uh driveway easement on the east side of the property. Those are currently that serving that would be serving five properties. Is that correct? Yes. My son actually wanted access on the division for the first house that we're talking about right now. Okay.

You know, but I would also wouldn't I think a good idea to connect to that. That driveway is about 20 ft wide is made as like a width of a road. Okay. The main disco line goes down that side of that road. Okay. So, it's there to support far more. Originally, we were going to do subdivision. The more we live there, the more we said, no, we have doing it just our family. That's all we did. But originally, back in '92, 93, my wife, I was thinking of developing it. That's why we have a main line going down the center of that drive next to that driveway. But we uh after living there the way it is, we decided to take

You said the main line going down. Yeah, they paid I paid $3,000 back in 9394. They have a disco put in line and stops and you see the metal post with a sign on it for a future gas service. Yeah. Yeah. There was no gas in that whole area. I ran all the way down to 100 down 100. I did all that crispy buff or anything on the subject and we decided against that and and this is informal view. So I'm just kind of giving my own concerns with it.

I would say accessing lot four from an ement that's outside of the area you're subdividing is a concern. Um, I think private drives are really hairy and there's a history of a lot of residents that get upset later in time cuz they didn't understand how things were set up. There there is a that was addressed in the original subdivision, major subdivision, and there's an easement that was granted with language depicting who and what has responsibilities, right? for a major subdivision. You're asking for a waiver to not have an interior access roadway. Correct. So,

because we're going to utilize the the easement that was part of the original zone and that original sub addresses all the responsibilities for all the lot owners. Was that a minor sub originally?

We're we're amending the major zone. I I would suggest you go ahead and uh for the platting of these lots, put a driveway agreement on the recorded plan, freshen it up, and that way the liabilities and responsibilities are clearly spelled out way in the future. As long as the family compound, there's seldom problems, but unfortunately, uh I've come to realize this even with my own family, all the lots ended up getting sold off. No family live in the development anymore. And of course, the last guy that left, the last relative owned the plow truck that cleaned the snow. Then everybody's wondering what was going to plow.

Yeah. You in this case, and my family was a brother. And it just it's something you need to prepare for the future, albeit maybe 30 years from now.

That's why we have these are we have because I have brother-in-law in our homes. It's not to me it's family but still it's a different situation and luckily we did have that agreement because they did sell move to Texas and now we have another couple and they they're family too. So it worked out well for us but the easement stress was who pays what was taking care of. We had to repair the driveway and they did the chair and we had no issue. They knew they had to. And the reason why we had the repair, they had the uh they had their trucks going up there picking up the garbage where I did make the first 20 ft of the drive extra thick support the trucks. They didn't want they can repay that. They take their hands on that. So because they had secrets in the agreement and that's all I'm saying is when you record a new plan,

put the agreement on that. uh review the agreement that you had because you might want to make the terms uh improve the terms for your benefit as development. They just re they made me when we did the other house. Mhm. They had me update these when you're Oh, good. this one I think. Yes. This was a reference. But I still think put it on these two. Yes.

So you're not looking for a document elsewhere. Mhm. Uh that's just my recommendation. This isn't formal, so we don't need a motion today. Uh you've got a date certain for your plan commission period. I put the calendar 25th of February. We'll discuss. Do you have any questions for us? I have one more comment. Okay. And maybe you could clarify this Kevin as a surveyor, but the parcel that has the easement is not part of the parcel for the subdivision. So I don't know what the legality is if they can put that ement agreement on a flat when it's referencing a parcel that's not

they can they can because the family owns the entire parcel. So they're separate saying and they this parcel with the driveway is not included on that subdivision plat. We can show show it on the subdivision plan though although it's not within you're saying it's not within the bounds of the subdivision that's occurring. Yeah. It could be an external reason that's not an issue. What could be the Ethan would need to spell out these specific lots. Correct. and the access who has rights to these. Exactly.

Right. And that would need to be specified on here that these proposed lots are covered under it and they actually have some property interest in it where the the agreement can't be changed without the approval of these people that are owning the lots. Correct. They have that legal right to get there that they have say over the original parcel owner can't dissolve the agreement later in time. Yes. And I don't know how the original um one is from a couple years ago. Um is that like if you need everybody that's a part of it to sign off to allow new lots to connect. I haven't read that easement agreement. I don't know. And they should probably have an attorney look at it.

We did have to adjust the easement agreement because of the fact that uh it was on the other originally wasn't our parents. That easement wasn't the agreement of the house that we sold. it was supposed to be going through my property. So that's why I had a easement of that pushing the driver out for my parents and put that in there. So keep it legal with the other house and then they had the new owners had to sign the agreement of changing did some kind of change uh and they did sign from when we updated they went ahead and signed it. So, we did have to have their approval of updating even though changes in the agreement, they still had to sign agree to it.

So, it sounds like then they'll have to sign off to allow for two more houses to depending on what the change. That's my recommendation that they just regroup the community cuz the cost of maintenance will then be split up. Yeah. Cuz right now they pay half. That's how I pay half with them coming on now. They're going to although I'll usually be there in charge of who we are. Yeah, absolutely. But uh just in case like I said most of this is for the future

because it's never a problem with the whole family has in my opinion but we start to have people who are disconnected not related then that's beginning of future issues. So yeah, I I think it's suitable, but today it's just a form of

Y. Okay. So we can just move on from to our next case. Thank you. Thank you. The next case is BW 2026-4 cow Jordan Wear where it carer and uh where major subdivision 603 East 400 South Valareerezo and Morgan Township zoning 81 general agricultural district 10.23 particular acres. And this is also in a formal review because they're seeking design waiverss for a proposed one lock subdivision. And all the variances are listed or request for design waiverss uh are listed on the agenda. So why don't we go ahead and proceed? Susan, uh, do you fellows have anything to say at this point?

I mean, yeah, basically it's just a one last subdivision. The reason we have one major subdivision is because of the way the property the original 8 acres went through an auction and because of that um, this lot has to go through major subdivision. So that's why we're asking for the design waivers. Okay. Just for the record, giving your name and address team land survey 223rd. Ryan Okconor. He's the applicant. Ron Ron Conor Okconor Builders. Thank you. Address the 36 South Seed Operation. Susan Hill.

Um, this was submitted not too long ago and we did have a pre-application meeting a month or so ago, but I have not reviewed this yet. Um, I believe they're not going to appear at the next plan commission for their waiverss because this hasn't been reviewed yet. Um, and if there's additional waiverss they need, they can include that with this application rather than having to apply for more waiverss, pay another fee, and attend two more hearings.

So, um, because of that, they're probably looking at the March Plant Commission meeting. Um, but I don't have any comments right now. I haven't looked at the plat yet to see um how the waiverss that they requested compare with the waiverss that I'll identify. Um so they may appear before you again. I'm not sure exactly if they'll come for another informal review before they go to the March Plan Commission meeting, but that's kind of where we're at.

So you're under the direction of the department at this point. So we'll just keep it moving along. Uh David, I'm kind of in the same boat as uh Susan there. This hit my inbox um earlier this week. I don't recall exactly what day, but I know it's sitting in my review queue. Um I will say uh in the time I've been with the county, there's been many there's been many a one lot major subdivision that have requested um the variant here that would impact my role, which would be that I'd be reviewing it against the um minor tech list rather than the major. So, um, certainly not the first time I've seen that. Um, I will, uh, get to this one as it comes up in my review queue, but I don't have any other comments at this time. Um, is the current land, um, the current ground cover agricultural? Yeah, half of it is the back of it, but the front half is far. Okay. So, and you don't have any documentation under the minor subject rules at this time because we haven't got approval to act as that.

Okay. Another comment.

Uh so been done uh port looks like drain outlet's going to be questionable. It's pretty flat. So it's but you can do in a buffer. You can do a mount system without a drain. So, um that might be the route you have to go on this, but otherwise we've been to the property. We've taken a look at it and uh so will support us out there. So, uh that's really all I have. Um for my ignorance, but what's prompting a subdivision here? Um, as I explained, the way the original I explained, the way the original property owned, all three of the par, property owned, all three of the par, you know, the level one, the parcel next you know, the level one, the parcel next to it, and the 65 acres east of that, to it, and the 65 acres east of that, they went through an auction. So, it got they went through an auction. So, it got split at that time. So, because it got split at that time. So, because it got split like that, that's why it's split like that, that's why it's required to go through major subdivision required to go through major subdivision process. process.

They didn't follow the followers. Um, as They didn't follow the followers. They don't have a legal out of record because it was partial out through auction and because there's been splits under than or less than 10 acres, they don't qualify for administrative anymore. Um, and there is an existing parcel, but it's not it's not buildable by our standards, but it's not a legal lot of record cuz they never went through subdivision control to establish that lot. So now they are, so they can build a house on it. Okay. Yeah. Primarily the parcels east 5.2 acres. That's an existing furnace. There's a bunch of buildings on it. That was less than 10 acres. So that's why we're stuck doing major silver. Okay.

Yeah. That gets to my question is this is an existing farmstead to be sure, but was that sold off as 5.2 acres? It was created to be sold off as 5.2 acres. Is there a deed specific? There is no yes. Pardon? There is no yes. It was all split off um in 24 or 25. Yeah. June 10, 2025. it was recorded. Okay, I see it here. 2025. So, that's what we're dealing with. And yeah, the original owner kind of stuck everybody in the future with how they wanted the property. So,

well, whoever was marshing off probably could have coordinated better with the planning department. I think they're always receptive to hearing those proposals. They don't want to wait. They don't want to wait the time period. Nope. That's why Joshua. So that's kind of where we're at.

I see you have right being dedicated. Um I'd be looking at a drive rightway in the future from a high engineering perspective. I'd probably take a look at concerns in the area as a history too just to evaluate at that time. I I don't have any other comments. My suggestion on future plat referred to County Road 450 east. You have it on your plat uh not the road but the southeast corner the southwest corner. I believe that's the intersection. Okay. Of uh what's the 400 south. So that kind of gets a location of where all this is at. Sure.

There's no road to the west of it. And uh yeah, can do that. It looks like they have enough frontage and we're going for 10 acres. And did they have a soil test? Yeah, so once did those turn up. It's like 21in water indicator. Um it's better than what I thought it might

Yeah, it's but given the topography and how flat it is, it's greater no uh glacial tail showed up. It's greater than 66 in for the um dense basil tills are pretty pretty decent. It's lone sandy clay lone lom sandy lone lomy sand. Um, but yeah, it's the issue there is going to be the water indicator because I don't see where they're going to get a drain outlet that's 3 ft below trench bottom. You're really subsurface a mountain system. And if they do a mountain system because the water indicator is deeper than 20 in, they don't need a drain. Lucky.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We dug a hole in there 6 ft deep and there was some water. Yeah. So it's it's an indication because there's they look for um oxidation of natural iron in the soil. So they saw rust at 21 in and so at some time historically the water's gotten within 21 in. That's a good point. Anytime in the history that indicator is up that high and fortunately uh you just meet it by a couple inches. Yeah, it was 21 and 22 in. So 20 is the cut off. If it was shallower than 20, then they would have had a drain for a mound, too. So, um, but yeah, been a little easier, but still might have been difficult.

Yeah, could be to find an outlet for dread beer. Really good soil, actually. Okay. Uh, any other comments, questions? This is informal again, so we really don't need a motion. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Good luck. Keep pressing on, Dave. Do we have anything else uh for this morning? If not, a motion to adjurnn. Move to second. All those in favor? I I