Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

So, let's get this started. Uh, good evening everyone. I want to welcome welcome you to the Tuesday, September 9th regular meeting of the Palm Springs Planning Commission. Recording in progress. There we go. Uh, could you uh call the role, please? Sure. Uh, Chair Worermick, present. Vice Chair Lean, present. Commissioner Baker, here. Commissioner Miller, present. Commissioner Murphy, present. Commissioner Rottman, yes, here. Uh, Commissioner Morurell, here. And alternate Hernandez, here. Uh, can I have a report on the posting of the agenda, please?

Yes, Madam Chair. The agenda was posted. Uh thank you. Uh the agenda was available for public access at the city hall exterior building board which in the west side of the council chamber and the planning services counter by 9:00 p.m. on Thursday, September 4th. Thank you. And would you introduce yourself? This is your first time here with us. Uh I think it is. Well, it's my first time. first time leading the meeting. Um, introduce

Good evening everyone. My name is Tony Reer. I'm the assistant director of planning here in Palm Springs. I've I've sat in on meetings before, but with Chris in the driver's seat and with him out of town, I will be your uh shepherd in the moment. Thank you. Um, can I have a motion to accept the agenda, please? So moved. Second. Second. All in favor? I I

Thank you. Uh this is this time is has been set aside for members of the public to address the commission on consent calendar and other items and items within our general subject matter jurisdiction. Note that we can't take any action on an item that is not posted. Uh each speaker will get three minutes. Uh testimony for public hearings may be offered at this time or the time of the hearing. And the only public hearing item is the old number 2A Old Los Palmus Partners. Um so people who are here on that item can uh comment on um on it now or when it comes up. If you're here on the other items, um I think as a matter of discretion, I would let people comment on them a uh after a staff report on it. So, if you're here on the other two items, you don't need to give public testimony now, but you can give it on the item. Um I'm going to exercise some discretion there. Um, are there any members of the public who would like to comment now? Are we need a longer microphone? Are there any members of the public who would like to comment now? Please, if you'd sign in and

Oh, yeah. Uh, Madam Chair, we we do have two folks who have on on Zoom. Oh, no, not on Zoom. Uh, so if you want to call them then does he have a a card in with us? Yes, he does. So, okay.

This is my name is Frank Tyson. I dearly love this town and have fought most of my life to preserve its character. Uh just to give some of my accomplishments so that you know where I'm coming from. Half a century ago, I beat two refineries from coming in immediately west of us. A decade ago, I beat a jail from coming down here. I was also involved in moving the Aquacare uh arena theater from downtown Palm Springs where it would have ruined the place. And Palm Springs is only as desirable today because over the years we've had the good sense to say no to destructive projects. Another example of the past was Francis Crocker, the father of the Tremway, who fought three battles way way ago against the state highway department, which would have landed the freeway right through our town and the other Cove communities. I'm also proud of having been part of the movement of the new boutique hotels that helped jumpst start the city in the 80s. For those reasons, I was shocked that the planning commission approved a monstrous warehouse development which was justified only in the by the vice chairman by saying that it was spitting out money. Well, it Bob Swings is not an place to spit out money. That

that's not the point. The point is to keep the character. We simply are not an industrial community and you have to only take a trip to the Inland Empire and see the kind of disaster that's been going on there. Healthwise alone is a problem. City of Ontario is now in the 98 percentile of cancer risk. Is that what our planning commission is aiming for? Yet on the other hand, the city of Fontana, which used to be a industrial town, had had the guts to tear turn down one of the uh warehouses. It bothers me very seriously that both our chairman Ramuk and vice chairman Alleian whom I've always admired no longer seem to care about protecting the character of Russia very reason they were appointed Is is his time up?

Yep. If you'd finish your sentence,

thank you. The next speaker is uh we have Mr. Michael Valdez and he has um also brought um written material in support of his comments which I can distribute to the commission if they are agreeable. Thank you.

Thank you. I'll speed through this. I'm here to speak on the proposed zoning changes in the Sunrise Park neighborhood, specifically at Sunrise Way and Tits Canyon. As a resident, my single family home borders these sites where staff proposes five-story mixeduse developments. This is inappropriate and I'll outline practical legal reasons why. Start with the massing diagram I've attached to the back of the letter I've passed out. It shows a visual impact of a 50 to 60 foot tall five-story building from my backyard based on a 45 foot palm tree for scale. Practically, a five-story building would loom over my newly landscape backyard. It would block sunlight, erode privacy, and diminish quality of life for me and my neighbors in this otherwise serene neighborhood. We chose Sunrise Park for its lowdensity appeal distant from downtown. Yet, this proposal would devalue my home due to its incompatible scale. An appraisal meta analysis done by a reputable firm has determined that you can expect a 20% more reduction of property values with such an incompatible development next door. Ironically, as a historic neighborhood, our properties face strict development limits to preserve character. Yet now, we propose allowing towering structures next door to undermine it. Legally, the proposal violates the general plan's lowdensity zoning with a 0.35 floor area ratio for offices. Staff cites laws like SB 375 and AB 2011, claiming that it's near a major transit stop and a major commercial corridor, but no such transit stop exists. Sunline routes 2 and four, which service the area, don't meet the 20inut interval requirement for SB 375's transit oriented development incentives. Absent standard parking requirements, the waiver of which is built into these laws, a highdensity project with a parking exception would spill parking into our residential streets, creating congestion and safety issues. The commercial corridor claim under AB 2011 also falls flat. All but one of the lots is accessib access accessed by

residential streets, not Titz Canyon. Recent SB79 amendments allow cities to cap heights for these developments at 35 ft, a far cry from the five stories or 50 to 60 feet proposed. Additionally, it allows for density restrictions and objective design standards to protect adjacent uses. These include stepbacks for upper stories, window and balcony limitations to prevent overlooking transitional buffer zones, lighting controls, and landscaping screens to safeguard the privacy and compatibility with neighborhoods like mine. The proposed retail, hotels, and luxury condos that fall into this zoning classification don't qualify for state overrides. They're not affordable housing, making this an egregious overreach that contradicts the general plan. I urge the commission to direct staff to obtain an independent legal review and revise the zoning to align with the general plan and state law. Protect Sunrise Park's historic character with reasonable height limitations and design standards. This home is a dream I've worked for since 2007. I'll fight to preserve it while respecting state law to the best of my ability. Thank you.

Thank you. Are there any other members of the public that wish to speak now? There being none, u public comment is closed, we come to the consent calendar and the item before us are the approval of the minutes of July 22, 2025. Um, I have some comments on the minutes if I can find them. Um, I mean, does anybody else have Oh, I do have them. Okay. Uh, I have comments in three different areas. Um, the first is that on item 4A, I believe the commission said that this was a serious issue that while we wanted the um surf club to continue, the noise issues were serious issues and needed to be resolved and I think that should be in the comments. Uh the second is public hearing 2A and Commissioner Rottman moved and Commissioner Miller um seconded but the what they seconded were recommendations to the ARC and I think it should state that those were recommendations. Um the third item and I usually don't have this many comments was on uh the last item in front of us which was um item 2B and there should be a com there there should be a comment that the owner was asked uh and agreed to provide a best efforts

letter to the city to provide that purchasing by the applicant and his contractors would be done in the city of Palm Springs to the extent possible so that the sales tax could be paid to the city and that does need to be recorded. So I would um I don't with those changes I would recommend approval of the minutes.

I will second it. Um are there any other comments? Uh can you call the role please?

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Abstain. Yes. Yes.

Thank you. Uh that item is approved. The um next item is our first item of business. And this is a public hearing. It is request by Old Los Palmus Partners LLC for the approval of a two-year extension of time for a major architectural review application, a major development permit application, a tenative track map and a variance application for a mixeduse project consisting of 24 residential condominium units and a 5,411 11 square ft commercial space on a 2.4 acre undeveloped property located at 575 North Palm Canyon Drive. Staff report, please.

Yes, thank you. Um, thank you, Madam Chair. Good evening, planning commissioners. Um, the item in front of you tonight is an extension of a time request for a previously approved mixeduse project named Rios. Um so this mixtures project includes um a 24 residential condominium units and a commercial space and it was approved in APAN district and uh April 10th 2025 will be the date that entitlement expires and this project involves multiple applications such as change of zone major development permit measure architecture review variance and tenative track map. Um for this application um the applicant is seeking a two-year extension of time for these applications except for change of zone. Um just to give you a background of this project um this project was initially introduced to the planning commission in January 20 uh 2021 and in 2022 the planning commission approved the major development permit tenative track map and variance applications and recommended approval of the change of zone application to the city council and on April 10th 2023 the city council adopted the ordinance and uh the change of zone was officially approved. Um, and this makes the effective date of entitlement approval. Um, and the entitlement earlier in April, uh, April 10th, 2025 would be the date that the entitlement expires after the two years of them being effective. And this is approved site plan. The project site extends from North Palm Canyon Drive to Beraldo Road along Chino Drive. The development development is designed with a commercial space on the north palm canyon drive frontage and the residential units are proposed along

Chino Drive, Berdo Road as well as nose property line. The project consists of multiple buildings and the community amenities are proposed within the space between the buildings. Uh the primary access to the site is provided on the bar road frontage uh through controlled access. The propos sorry the proposed project is a twotory and the maximum building height of 30 feet. Uh the architectural design is contemporary and the character defining architecture feature is a perforated metal screen which is applied at a different places on the project site and the similar architectural treatment is proposed on all sides. Uh as the staff mentioned, the project includes a 24 residential units as well as a commercial space. The ground level will be dedicated to commercial, residential, and the parking. And the second floor will be dedicated to larger residential units. The Palm Springs zoning code and the municipal code um allowed the life of entitlement to be extended through the extension of the time review process. and the planning commission is the re the u approval body of the application. In order for the planning commission to grant an extension of a time specific findings that are stated in the zoning code must be met. And one of the findings states that the financial inability and the market conditions are not considered by reasons to justify an extension of time request. And uh under this application, the planning commission may grant an extension of time up to 24 months. In the justification letter, the applicants explains that the project was delayed due to challenges associated with finding prospective buyers and the design of the project itself which relies on securing buyers for further

progress. And as for the applicants uh efforts to exercise entitlements as of today there are eight to 10 serious prospective buyers and Africans team uh continues to actively work with a local real estate farm in search of additional prospective buyers and the team has been in communication with the state department of um real estate to create favorable conditions to secure prospective buyers. In approving this application, excuse me, in reviewing this application, uh the staff has determined that no changes are proposed to the approved plans and the project was not delayed due to financial inability nor market reasons and applicant has adequately demonstrated their efforts to exercise their entitlements as exemplified by securing 8 to 10 serious prospective buyers and active engagement with a local real estate farm and a communication with a DR and a two-year extension. of time until April 10th, 2027 is adequate and the project meets the requiring findings for granting approval for time extension. In conclusion, staff recommends that the planning commission approved the extension of the original entitlement approvals by two years until April 10th, 2027. And um staff is this concludes a staff presentation and the staff is available and Africa's team is available remotely. Thank you. Uh questions of staff. Go ahead.

Uh Nico, um when did the request to extend come in from the applicant?

The request for extension came before the entire expiration date. Okay. Yes, that's what I was trying to zero in on. Thank you. Commissioner Moral.

Uh yes. Um it to me I I like the project. I think it's great. I wasn't here in uh 2021 or at the prior hearings, but um the financial ability and market conditions uh per the code. This to me seems to represent both those problems because they state um in their application that um uh that the finan the marketing is affecting their financing. They need people to sign up for units in order to start construction. So um there seems to be something missed in the marketing side and um uh I wondered what you know what exactly their problems are. I tried to go online and find this project anywhere and it's not searchable that I could find. It's not on the developers website. It's not on the um real estate company's website. Um so how is it being marketed? where you know what is the problem. Um,

are those I'd like to know. Are those questions for staff or questions for the uh questions for the developer? But I'd like to know from staff how it met financial you know the financial inability and the market uh conditions why why wasn't that uh you know triggered? Commissioner Morel, if you if I may. Um

so in reviewing this application the stuff that the consumer behaviors are out of the applicant's control and also real estate decisions are not solely based on the financial consideration. This is a mixeduse project on the very busy street. So it does attract certain type of prospective buyers who desire to live in that that living in that environment. And then also this is a very large project which is very exclusive in nature. So the process takes longer than the typical project by design and uh the applicants team is available remotely and can provide additional information or clarify uh why uh their request meets the required findings too.

Do um are there other questions and are these other questions similar to this one? Yes. Question Murphy question of staff. Um, are we is it within our purview to make changes to the entitlements since this is being reopened? Um, no. The answer is no. Sorry. Thank you. Okay. So, what's here in front of us is purely to approve or not approve.

Yes. Correct. The item in front of you is whether the planning commission to grant an extension of the time basically extend the life of entitlement or not.

Are there other questions? I I think I have the same one of the applicant that Commissioner Morel has. Um there being no other questions, uh if the applicant is present to answer, did you have questions? I do have the exact time of questions. Sounds like others do. I think we all do. Is the applicant present?

The the Representative Peter is now online. Hi, Peter. Do we get to see you? Uh, you should get to see me. Hold on a minute. I'm not sure why you're not getting to see me. Uh,

well, why don't I I think we don't need to. If you'd if you want to give your presentation or No, I'm I'm happy to be seen and it's nice to see all of you and thank you, Nico. Hold on just one second. I'm

And you can hear me perfectly.

Okay. So, I uh I'm sorry for the the video part. Thank you, Doro, and thank you, commissioners. So, we remain completely committed to this development and I spend many months every year at my office at 800 North Palm Canyon and we're very engaged in these 24 custom homes. They are each being designed to the buyer's specific tastes and preferences. And for all of you who have renovated a bathroom or built a house, that is a specific process. So that is I would say fact one. Fact two is I did not understand that in California there were regulations with the department of regulation that prohibited creating binding contact contracts between a buyer and a developer until a project should reach a certain place and we are working through that mechanism. We have, I would say, eight very strong committed buyers who are all people known to me and known to my partners and known Palm Springs, part-time or full-time residents who are more eager than I am to downsize and to remain in Palm Springs in smaller quarters than they're currently living in. So I remain very bullish on this and appreciate the extension of time as do my partners to move forward and complete this project.

Um and and then that is your entire presentation. Are you done? I think that's my question. We I won't have people I have to I have to bring the public in first before the commissioners can ask you questions. I'm I'm happy to address any and all questions. Fine. Um are there members of the public who wish to speak on this item? Seeing none, uh this is open to the commission for questions. Uh, Commissioner Morel.

Um, well, I I have several, but I'll try to limit them. Um, what what um marketing is going on because I couldn't find anything online um suggesting this particular site. Um, there's nothing on Zillow or any of the uh state websites. You're correct that this is not online and we have intentionally not put it online. We need to complete the final interior elevations and all of those drawings and complete the final pricing before we present this to the broad public. We have been dealing with a small cadre of buyers and a small group of the top real estate professionals in the Coachella Valley.

And when you say 8 to 10, is it eight or is it 10 or or um what are the other?

Well, that's a good that's a good question. I think that we probably have eight and I think that probably translates to 14 units because people want two bedrooms, they want a guest house, there are one bedrooms, there are studios and some people want a studio as a guest house. Some people want it as a as an office space to work at home. So there are many combinations and our very smart partner and architect Mark Rios and his team have designed these in a way that allows buyers that flexibility. So what that does is we have a uh I wouldn't call it a waiting list but a reservation list where people have said I want this unit I want this view. We have some people who would like to combine two units. We have people that want to have the southwest corner. We have people who want another spot because they want to actually have the attached garage in their unit. So, it's a puzzle and it's a very interesting puzzle. Um,

is that helpful, sir? I guess so. I'm just not I'm not familiar with the development where the buyers are sort of driving the whole project. Normally um if you go to a Cena or Mirilon, you get a plan, you get, you know, this is your unit and it's not anticipated that you're going to make all these um changes. And um I would think it would be very difficult for you to have any kind of construction schedule if you're um you have all these players involved.

That's an astute point and I appreciate you raising that. Those developments are not custom home developments. These are custom home developments. So while the exteriors are the same, the interiors are all custom and they're being done at a level of an Aman hotel. So we expect these will these will sell for much more than those units sell for. Yeah. So, if these eight um parties agree and are ready to move forward, is that enough for you to get uh approval and financing and whatever else you need to start construction?

Yes, I think that puts us in a very good place and the Rios team has to finish the rest of their drawings and turn those into the city for approval. We are continuing to work with DW Johnson as our contractor and I just Go ahead. I'm sorry. Just one other quick thing. I don't want to take a lot of time but um what about the retail? Wouldn't it be possible to start the retail or is that somehow tied to this residential?

No. No, it's not. I have not felt I mean I have one Palm Springs current business that would like to be in the retail. I have intentionally not pushed the retail and I don't know if you were on the planning commission when we started this but one of your colleagues talked about the 2 and a half miles of retail from Raone to Vistacino on both sides of the street and we talked about the mag mile in Chicago and how long Rodeo Drive was. And so I have not promoted the retail because I have intentionally wanted the Thompson to fill up and to have some of the other spaces fill up and not uh dilute the market more. And I have felt that that was the right thing to do because the retail is not driving this development. It's the residential sales component. Does that make sense?

Um I I suppose so. I I think from um a neighbor position, um I'd like to see some retail there. Well, there's going to be retail there. It would it would really be nice to fill in that block and have people stop pointing at it and asking me what's going on there and why is nothing being built. So that's it for my question. I I appreciate that and there will definitely be retail there. I think it's 5,400 square feet of retail. Are there other questions for the applicant?

Um Peter, I have a couple of questions for you. I'm I'm troubled by the findings that we need to make and what is prohibited from making those findings, including that we can't say uh that that you're do an extension if the reason is inability to finance or market conditions. And what we're talking about seems to be tied closely to that. However, there are other things that I can see that potentially um would knock you back sometime and I want to know if any of these have impacted you. In particular, we have since your project was approved, we've had a great deal of turmoil and uh uncertainty with tariffs and how they are going to impact the cost of goods here in the states, including everything from steel to uh a lot of building materials. Is is that a consideration or a concern for you? Of course, for anyone who's in business, the cost of supplies and materials is absolutely a concern. And as we wind the clock back and when we originally started this, we got started and then, you know, the process through city hall was incredibly slow for us because of CO and so it took a long time to get through that. And

we all, you know, remember that well and we appreciated the city's,

you know, the city was just closed a lot and it took a long time. And then there was a period where lumber went up dramatically and we were actually grateful commissioner that maybe the city had been so slow because the cost of lumber materials was so high. And then there have been periods of the wondering what about interest rates and the outcome of elections and that impact on things. And the tariffs are certainly a concern and we've got a good working budget with our builder and we have to update that when we have the exact final plans. So I appreciate you recognizing that external force. Thank you. Does that answer your question? That absolutely that does. Um and the other one that I'm wondering um how this might impact you is the uncertainty in constructing workforces with a change in policy for um immigration and how does that does that impact your plans? uh we rely on our contractor to work with people who are eligible to work in the United States. And if there are less people available to do the do the work and the work pipeline is as busy as it has been and if there are fewer people that too could be an issue. We feel it will take another 8 to 12 months to finish the final plans and get them through our the team at the city. And we hope that some of these challenging external factors will uh have resolved themselves in a more

favorable way. Okay. Okay. And then we get to that point.

And then finally, um this is more a theoretical question, but I understand that it would take much longer to design and to detail uh and to plan check 24 custom homes or custom condominiums than it would if they were all spec built and you had a prototype and you just cranked them out. H how much longer typically would you expect uh a project like this to take in completion of the design and permit permitting than a typical project a spec build project? It's a that's a good question and that's uh I think the first 7 to 12 units that are completed are the hardest and then momentum is gained and you hopefully pick up some time there but I think it's probably an extra 12 months.

Okay. Thank you. I appreciate the information. Thank you. I appreciate your thoughtful questions, Commissioner. Commissioner Baker. Hi, Peter. It's Carl Baker speaking. Um, few questions for you here. I want to back up a little first. Uh, what experience do you have building other similar types of developments like this, if any. Thank you. Well, in Palm Springs, my experience is limited to the 800 North Palm Canyon building and the 830 North Palm Canyon building where workshop kitchen and bar is and room and board and compass real estate.

So, those are all commercial real estate projects. What residential projects have you worked on?

So, I'm sitting right now in a building called the University Club Tower in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, where I live. It's an 825 North W North North Prospect Avenue. You can all look it up online. It's a 35story luxury condominium that was designed by Skidmore Owings and Merrill, their chief residential designer, Peter Ellis. And I started the project and worked on it with three pro three partners. And the four of us sold it out except one unit before it was built. There's one unit per floor or two units per floor. Each floor is 7,000 square feet and we did that 21 years ago, 19 years ago. Widely recognized as one of the premier luxury buildings built in the United States in the last 25 years outside of New York City. So, in that development though, were those units built spec and then sold or were they

No, they were all custom. And how long did that take from start to finish?

Oh, I have to think about that for a minute. It reminds me of a time I was with Mousie Powell, William Powell's widow in Palm Springs, and I said to her, "When did the golden days of Hollywood end?" I was a kid. and she turned to me and she said, "Well, you know, sort of like one day you wake up with a bad cold and seven to 10 days you wake up later and it's gone." I think it took three and a half years to build these. These were incredibly complicated custom homes in the sky. Some of these are 7,000 square feet. Some of them are 10. All with plumbing in different locations on every floor. Some were building standards but very few. Incredibly complicated.

Okay. And so next question. What is the percentage of commercial space versus residential space in your spreadsheet? What are you saying? A percentage of my selling point is going to be commercial versus residential because you're saying your commercial commercial is inconsequential.

I didn't say it was I don't want to leave you with it. It's inconsequential but it is not driving the project and the commercial space will be very straightforward to build and I believe that we will have 12 to 18 months before the space is ready for someone to set up shop and that will be plenty of time for us to lease it to prospective tenants and the space will be really superb retail space. Peter, are you aware there's still spaces available uh downtown that have been empty for years? So,

I'm well aware of that. So, then how do you what how how do you convince this board that what you're going to provide is going to bring commercial property to you that hasn't filled up empty spaces that sat on that same street less than a mile away for several years? Well, if one were to look at our spaces at 8830 North Palm Canyon, we've almost been continuously occupied since 2009 when we finished remodeling and restoring those three buildings. Okay. Um my last question for you then is if you're unable to

So, let me just speak to that point of the real estate. So many of those spaces, and I walk Palm Canyon almost every day when I'm in Palm Springs four or five months of the year, many of those spaces are really in tough shape and the buildings have not been maintained and they're I think our space will have a real edge because it'll be new. The ceilings will be higher. The windows will you really it's designed for, you know, retail for today. It can be modular. The retail spaces can be expanded. They can be contracted. So, all of that was really worked through with the planning commission uh in what we originally approved. Sir, are

are you familiar with the Alain area down in the south end of Palm Canyon? uh Cody Place in Milan. They're building commercial spaces, but the builder itself, is it to I forget if it's Toll Brothers or whoever has bifurcated the project because they don't want to deal with the commercial aspect of it. So, they're putting those commercial blocks separate and apart from the residential blocks. here you're combining the two, but yet you don't you don't seem to feel that that's a major obstacle of filling those commercial spaces when they're going to be brand new commercial spaces that are far ahead of you just down the street at Cody Place.

So I don't think that Cody Place is a retail competitor of ours. It's a completely different part of town in my view. I would agree with that.

Okay. So then getting back to my last question. So if you're unable to solidify these buyers to obtain the loan, what happens then? Two years from now, you still have eight buyers. Nothing's there's no guarantee of anything. What happens? It's hard to predict the future. I feel that we are a very well financed group and are well prepared to do this. Uh, can you elaborate a little more, please? Because you're saying you can't get construction financing, but yet on the other hand, you're saying you're very well construction financing.

Well, please elaborate. Optimizing construction financing and interest rates improves when B when one has committed signed agreements and we are working through that. At this time and we are working through the customization of these projects. I have uh a group of investors that have deep pockets and are committed to Palm Springs. So, you're not looking for commercial lending. You're just using private.

There will be absolutely there will be some commercial lending in this. But I feel that we're well equipped to take that on. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Other questions? I I have one for the applicant, which is Yeah. Uh we're already about five months uh into the extension that you're requesting and I'm just wondering I I mean I was on the commission when this came through. I remember with and I love the project. Thank you. with but

you were very helpful

but but very little discussion at the time about these being custom homes and the custom aspect of the project uh I think our uh the time limits we give people this this isn't anticipated and I'm wondering what your thought is that you can get this com you can get into construction and you need to I my understanding is they need to start construction within the 18 months 18 19 months that are left. Um how do you how do you get there?

I thought it was a two-year extension from this period from this period. We turned our it's a two-year extension from April of this year. So you would have until April 10th of 2027. So that to be under construction or to be completed with construction to start construction.

That is my understanding too. And so the question is you have been working the the issues um in an interesting process and I'm sure it will become a very interesting development when it's built. How will you get into construction in that time period? I'm confident that we'll be able to do that once these plans are finished by Rios and start grading. And Johnson's very experienced at this and Brian Adamson who's leading our development team. I have full confidence in their ability to do that. the uh planning director.

Uh just for context, I believe the threshold the that the project needs to cross within the time limit is issuance of a grading permit. So that would be the kind of the finish line of the starting line. The finish line of the starting line, but you would have approved you would have a grading permit and and approved construction plans. Yes. Correct. And the city has a process which isn't always speedy. Correct. We would like it speedier than it is.

As they say, from your lips to God's ears. And remember when this started, we were at the period where there was no planning commissioner. I don't I was on it. So I don't think there was No, no, no. I mean, excuse me. No, director of um prior to Chris Hadwin, there was a big gap where before Chris arrived. I'm who was the Flynn Flynn and Chris Chris was hired in March of 202 came on board in in the fall.

Right. Okay. Um, that's not relevant. But, uh, and I have one more commissioner who has questions. Uh, yes. Yes. Uh, Robert Rottman. Um, so I thought I heard you say, uh, to get the drawings completed, it's going to be 10 to 12 months. Is that correct? I believe that's pretty close to accurate. And so that leaves you, if we have 19 months, yeah, seven months to secure all of the the approval and the grading permit and start grading.

But the city doesn't always issue a separate grading permit from a building permit. It's it's not automatic. So that's something you need to confer with the building department or with engineering but they don't always issue them separately. Um understood. And so um if I'm understanding with the customization of the units proposed units with the proposed eight potential buyers what is the reduction in the number of units or I should say owners um well units

well there will be 24 addresses. The question I think you're asking is do I have an answer to how many units will be bought by individual owners? Is that your question, sir? Well, you mentioned that you may combine some units. Uh you had mentioned that uh somebody may want a guest house, which I assume is a studio or one-bedroom unit that's separate from a two or threebedroom unit. So, I'm just wondering what the final uh total is going to be. And I understand you don't know everybody, but given the direction it's going currently, what do you think it is? I think there'll be 16 owners. 16 owners. Okay. And what's But that is Yeah,

that what I think and that is my instinct. Okay. And what is the threshold for you to get uh preferred financing in terms of percentage of number of commitments? I think we'd be very comfortable if we had 10. Okay. Um Okay. Thank you. And we're gohead.

I appreciate everyone's questions so much. And in addition to, you know, we've spent $4.5 million on this. were very serious and like all of you, Palm Springs is very important to me and it's my favorite place in the world to go and I care deeply about it.

Are there any other questions? to having this done at a high level. And we're really talking about doing something that no one else has done. There's not anything like this in Palm Springs. There's nothing like this in Cathedral City. You have to go to Rancho Mirage. You really have to go to Palm Desert. And Palm Springs deserves this. And it was very interesting when we talked to real estate people and they talked about their reactions to it and how positive and the interest in new product that is done at a very high level with services.

Commissioner Miller, you had a question. Yeah, I have a question again. All these other questions raise a question for staff. Nar Rico, what does the code say about any additional extensions that could be requested after assuming this two-year gets approved? Are they able to ask for more? No. So, the part of the zoning code requirement, the applicant may request I'm sorry, the planning commission may grant an extension of time up to 24 months. So, for this particular application, applicant is already seeking extension for 24 months. So if that's approved then that's the end of no more.

And then also I think the zoning code says on an extension it's a singular of up to 24 months. Thank you. I have one for Nico on the the lot line itself. There's a sliver of empty space on the north end between copies and the development. Is that a easement? It's an easement. Okay.

Whitewater. Um, thank you. I think the matter is before the commission. Uh, and a question of our assistant planning director. The, um, this is novel. What's before us? Uh, it I haven't seen something in this form come before us before. I'm more comfortable with language that would go to the sort of national issues that are the uncertainty issues. How comfortable are you with the finding individual buyers and putting the pieces together as financial or not financial? Well, I I think the it does speak to the idiosyncratic nature of the project and that would set it apart from um a more typical project and could introduce some additional potential challenges separate from um marketing or financing. Um like likewise um as you kind of point out the kind of macro conditions um nationally in terms of supply of both materials and labor could be considered as well.

Thank you. Um comments from the commission commissioner or vice chair sorry. Well, I uh I think this is a beautiful project. I think it's a good project for the location. I would like to be able to be patient enough to wait two years. Uh rather than making rash decisions that may not be in the best long-term land use issues interests. Uh that being said, I'm not comfortable with the findings on two of the findings that were being asked to made make. However, I have proposed alternative language for findings number six and seven in the event we get to the point where uh the commission seems to be interested in granting an extension.

Do you want to say what those are? And then I think what I'd like to do is take a straw poll as to where we are. Um, what I would say is on finding number six that the applicant has made reasonable, substantial, timely efforts to exercise the entitlement and advance the project, uh, blah blah blah. I think that I I would recommend that we delete the last two sentences. Um and just end it with uh has been actively working with different en entities on the project. So strike out about the part in search of other prospective buyers. And then for finding number seven, which deals with extenduating circumstances, I would strike the entire finding that's been proposed and say circumstances beyond reasonable control of the applicant causing uncertainties in project development, including institution and fluctuation in tariffs, changes in the interest rates and availability of construction workers due to changes in immigration policies implemented under since the original project approval. These here's where I can't read my handwriting. Okay. Uh, these extenduating circumstances support the required the requested 2-year extension

period comments comments on that or just a straw pull is

I I support those changes. I think those make it more defensible. Um, and if I might, uh, chair go a little bit further. This was a good project then, it's a good project now. It's got some uniqueness that we've just we're just learning about tonight from Peter. And Peter, I appreciate that. Um, it's a mixeduse project in a location we fought very hard to get the design and the elements just right. When this came through the process, it got approved by the planning commission during COVID. It got approved uh by the city council just before the public uh health emergency of COVID was announced. That was a very tough period of time for development and a lot of other things as we all recall. Um I see no reason why we would deny this the ability to try to finish. They got a lot of work to do, especially if the if Peter is saying it's going to be seven to 10 months for the design drawings to be done. You got a lot of work to do. Um and it it appears that there's not the ability for another extension. So I feel comfortable because of that um the COVID and the other peculiarities of this project as well as the changes that chair vice chair Alan had mentioned. I will support the extension. So, just going through um let me ask how many of us have sort of share the feelings of Commissioner Miller and Vice Chair Lean. Just to raise a raise of hands. Okay. Uh then Commissioner

Morel. Yeah. Are you making um I wondered if there's any way um in these projects to push the retail forward. um or to put um different conditions on the retail to get that moving forward. I don't think we have the ability to do that, do we?

No. Unfortunately, the only matter before the commission this evening is whether or not to grant the extension of time. And I don't believe that there's the capacity to condition that on changing the timing of specific elements. So I would I would suggest too that it would be unfair to the retailers to go ahead and build and then get them moved into their lovely new space and start building right on their back doorstep uh for the next two years.

Yeah, I would I would like to see more marketing going on. That's, you know, sort of what I'm getting at is there's no marketing for that commercial space that I'm aware of and no marketing for the individual units either. This seems to be a word of mouth marketing plan. Other comments?

Yes. Uh my concern again goes back to the finance because there have been so many projects brought to this commission with good intentions but have fallen down and then we end up with vacant land that sits for years. Um I'm seeking for you to convince me that this is not going to happen but uh I don't think you've reached that burden. the the if you're talking to the applicant, he's uh this is before the commission. So, what you're saying is he hasn't convinced you. Okay. Um I Are you ready for a motion?

I'm ready for a motion. I would like to see the motion that gets made include some of the language regarding COVID so that we add to the justification uh the circumstances in which they started. And I'll move to I'll move to approve a two-year extension subject to the findings as amended by Vice Chair Lane with the additional language referring to the COVID pandemic as a rationale uh that created difficulties just as this project was getting out of the approval box. Is there a second? Second.

Uh any discussion? There being no discussion, can you call the vote, please? Uh, Commissioner Miller, yes. Vice Chair Alan, yes. Chair Warmick, yes. Commissioner Baker, no. Uh, Commissioner Murphy, yes. Commissioner Rodman, yes. Commissioner Moral, no. The motion passes. 52. Peter, get it built quickly and figure out how to use the video screen on your computer. So, can you hear me?

Yes. Yes. So, I think the city's not allowing me to turn on my video. I think you have to do that. That's okay. Uh, we're done. Congratulations. Just get to work. Thank you all. And I hear your message loud and clear and I understand the time frame and I understand the finish line and the starting line and I understand that a grading permit is not always issued separately from a complete building permit.

Okay. I am the I am want to just make sure relative to the concerns of the retail Peter it's okay. Uh I think I what I'd like you to do is discuss that with the assistant planning director and the planning director in Norico. Thanks so much. Good luck. Yes. I think we're going to take a quick break. We'll be back in a quarter of recording.

ing for Megan, aren't we?

Recording stopped. Megan a a technical question for you. Uh in terms of volume in on my speech, is there a way of turning that up? Uh terms of like so turning your microphone volume up. Yes. Um yes, I believe so. Try that. Try that please. Try what? Your microphone. Testing. Testing.

Oh yeah, that's good. Yes. Okay, we are all here. Uh we are we'll call in progress.

I'll call the meeting back to order. We are at uh item there's no item three. We are at item 4A. A request by Toll Brothers, Inc. for the approval of final development plans for 119 new single family residential units in planning areas 5A and 7A tracks 38721 tract 38722 and 387 uh 22-1 of the planned development district 231 of the Asena development located at 100 North Gene Autry Trail. Uh before the staff report, I need to disclose that I live at Aena and have for about 14 years. Uh I don't live within 500 ft of the proposed development that's in front of us and that I have had a short discussion with the HOA president that is not will not be definitive in terms of decisions I make or how I think about the issue. Uh thank you. Staff report please.

Thank you madam chair. As you mentioned this afternoon uh we are here to look at a final PD for areas 5A and 7A for 119 single family residences. So what's before you today is four different floor plans. Plan one and each one of these has a specific name. The Derianne, the Jud, the mayor and the Vincent. Two of them are one-story and the other two the mayor and the Vincent are twotory. And within that there are three architectural styles international modernist and then mid-century. So in total there could be 12 different combinations of house types and designs and floor plans for these proposed 119 single family residences. The scope of the review today by the planning commission is to review the final PD that it's in conformance with the listed criteria of the Asena design guidelines in relevant to the site plan lot sizes building massing and scale. The project uh once it uh moves forward if it does at some point to the architect review committee they will look at the building design, colors, materials, landscaping and lighting. to orient everyone as to where we're uh what part of Aena. This is planning area number five, which is uh the northern section of the proposal today. It includes 83 lots. Uh this is Grand View Drive that let me go back. There's a little highlighter that goes along the main spine of Aena on the west end of the development. The Desert Sun building is right here. And then there is currently a storage facility along Tati Tativa Drive.

This is a closeup of the internal lot showing that there are multiple sizes uh ranging from 4,50 ft to almost 9,000 square ft. uh internal circulation of the streets uh Lavender Lane uh Pearl Street uh and then Crimson Lane. The second area is planning area 7. This includes 76 lots and this is the area that is adjacent to Geonatry Trail which is the main state highway that runs along the western edge of the property. And then this is the main gate when you come in the circle. And this is Grand View Drive to the east. And these lot sizes also range uh in from 4,000 to 9,000 square ft. The applicant has provided you a simulated streetscape, including uh a mid-century contemporary international and then another contemporary showing what a street could look like and the relationships to each other being one-story and twotory homes. They also provided floor plans with a a little bit of a matrix showing what the dairy would be as a 16 for six 1,644 ft house u threebedroom two bath twocar garage and then as we go from the jud the mayor and the Vincent the houses get larger uh up to a maximum of threebedroom three and a half bath loft and twocar garage. Another floor plan showing the second level for the mayor and the Vincent. And looking at each of these, I'll go through these fairly um short, but they're um there are three different types of the Darian, the onetory, the

smallest size, international, modernist, modernistic, and mid-century. Uh and then each one of these I'll show you the intended height. This one is a maximum height of 15 feet three inches to the top of the parapit as a cross-section. And in your packet, uh the applicant had given us some booklets that I handed around to the planning commission. Um we have four extra ones so you all can share them. And also there was some questions about the design guidelines. I copied sections of the design guidelines that had to do with the types of uh house specifics for uh the uh international, the modernistic, and the mid-century. So, these are the designs of the house, the one-story house. This is a plan one for each of the different styles. The jut is also a one-story. It's larger at 1,700 square ft. The maximum height also was 15'1 in. And these are the plan two modernistic mid-century. And then the mayor is a twotory 20,000 or 20048 with a maximum height of 24t 3 in. And the different styles being international, modernistic, and mid-century. The Vincent is also two story. This is the largest at 20 uh 2,162. [Music] In this cross-section, the maximum height is 25 ft 2 in. Uh the applicant uh when they come up can explain the heights and the reason for the height. Uh it's based upon floor plans and mechanical uh duct work and so forth

between the first and second floors. And this is a international a modernistic and a mid-century design. Each of these could be interchangeable uh with the different types of floor plans and styles on in the on the individual lots in your packet. There's also exterior color selections. There's a wide variety of the types of colors for each different scheme that a potential buyer could uh secure. Moving on to landscaping. Uh you'll see that they provided landscape plans for the proposal. I would like to point out that the landscaping along Gina Trail on the exterior portion of the perimeter wall. You'll see that there is a note here on the plans that say common lot G landscaping to have all dead and missing plants be replaced per original master plan streetscape plan uh to existing uh any existing to remain. So within each of these tracks there are lettered lots which are small lots that are usually at the ends of each of the different individual house parcels along streets and entryways into this particular planning area. I did not take a slide of every one of them, but there are in the packet and you can view them on your on the actual website plans. But this is uh an example of what those types of entryway edges ends of the labor the letters would be. So the types of plants that are uh are proposed are acacas, creassot, pala verdees, Texas ebanese and a variety of

shrubs and cactus that are listed here on the plant pallet. Once again, this is a uh letter lot E as to what this landscaping could uh will potentially look like. These are also lot letters L and M and lot H. And then each of the houses has a typical landscape plan which is presented before you that also has the same landscaping as proposed as the other lettered lots. So uh staff recommendation is recommending approval that it substantially conforms the design guidelines the ARC review to architectural design landscape colors materials and lighting. And madam chair, that concludes my report. And uh if you would like, the applicant is here and can has a brief presentation of a couple slides. And um I also was asked by um Commissioner Rottman to include some pictures. I can pull those up when he wants me to.

Questions for staff?

Yes, Commissioner. Vice Chair L. I note that in our staff report when the landscape plan is discussed, it says the proposed front yard typical typical landscape will consist of a 36-in box and a 24-in box, primary, secondary, and specimen trees. Um, that is at odds with what the design shows. The landscape drawings show most frequently one tree, sometimes two trees in the yards, which governs the staff report or the looking at

the I looked at this plan. If I described it incorrectly, I apologize, but it is what this plan is representing. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Other questions? Uh I have one which is the exterior landscape just as a uh question. The there the city does not have copies of the original plans that were approved back in 98 or 2004. Correct.

That's right. We've searched our records and as you know recordkeeping is different today versus then. Um and they are um we can't verify as to what the original plans are and you Okay. Um thank you. And did you did you go out after you looked at the letters from the HOA and um Mr. Stone, Mr. Julian Julian Stone, did you go out and look at look at the issues?

Right. Yes. I that um I I did read that letter. I did receive it and um try to address what he asked about. So did you see blow sand? I'm sorry I didn't. He he raised the issue the two issues I think he raised were blow sand and insulation uh of the homes. Right. Yes. I had mentioned that to the applicant uh and it's my understanding and they can address this at the HOA meeting they had on Friday or Saturday this was discussed so we should look for the discussion of those issues to to the applicant.

They're willing my understanding is that discussions with them is that they're willing to do noise attenuation. Okay. Um I I'm sorry I have another question I meant to ask. One of the findings that were asked to make is that the final development plan is in substantial conformance with all other associated entitlements for the development. Um we have now the inena design guidelines. These are part of the entitlement plans. Correct. Yes, those are the design guidelines that we evaluate projects against.

Okay. Um, so when it's suggested that everything is in compliance, does that mean does that include the exterior architecture of the homes? We we look and see if it's within the scope of what the guidelines are asking for. Um in this evaluation there was a neighboring project that is also Toll Brothers the Nola project that was approved. Okay.

These houses are very similar in design to those. Other than compare against what's in the style guideline uh we took a look at it and said well if it's been done before it's okay. We we evaluate each project individually. Um granted the planning commission may determine that there needs to be work and that they don't conform. Um that is at the discretion of the planning commission. Okay. Okay. Thank you.

Thank you. Um the we don't have a public hearing but the applicant will have 10 minutes to come forward and then I will take comments from members of the public if they are here to speak and then the applicant will have five minutes and then we will uh ask questions of the applicant. doing that. Why is it doing that?

There's a mic. Test. You could

maybe it's my Okay, perfect. Thank you for giving me a second. You sure this one is? Oh, sorry. Doing the entertainment question.

Uh, good evening, Madame Chair, Madame Vice Chair, and commissioners. My name is Leia Mugay with Toll Brothers, and thank you for giving me the opportunity to pre present our project this evening. With me today, I have my design team, including the architect, Bill Hashmahalt, our landscape architect, Tom Dossi, and our civil engineer, Joe Basa. Um, before I dive into the details, I'd like to share a brief overview of Toll Brothers and the contribution that we've had the privilege of making to the Aena community here in Palm Spring. at the Aena community opened in 2005 and since then brother has purchased and built 258 lots within the community before you tonight an additional 119 single family homes continuing continuing our longlasting commitment to Asena and the city of Palm Springs from a market standpoint this community will be offering a low price point making it the most attainable new homes offering within Aena while still maintaining the high design standard Toll Brothers is known for. All homes will have the three-bedroom layout designed with both rear and sideyards along with a spool to meet the buyer demand for livability, amenities, and attainability luxury. In short, this project reflect brother ongoing commitment to Asena and to Palm Spring, delivering highquality design that respects the community, thoughtful architecture, detailing consistent with the city's heritage, and a product that is both market ready and responsive to resident feedback. Um, we have met with the Cena HOA last Friday and are working to further enhance the common area landscaping per their request. I have our landscape architect Tom Dossi that can now walk you through the revisions that have been made between what was presented to you earlier and our discussions on Friday.

Um and I uh and we are really excited to move forward with this project and look forward to your support. Um thank you for your time and I'll be happy to answer questions further after our landscape architect speaks more on it. Thank you. Uh my name is Thomas Dosey, landscape architect, TKD Associates, uh Rancho Mirage, California. And uh we've been working with Toll Brothers on all their projects from the very beginning and we're happy to be involved in this project. Um I'm not sure if if the commission has received the letter uh from the HOA with some of their items of concern. So what I wanted to say is that we had a very constructive meeting uh with the HOA on Friday and we've reviewed uh the letter and some of the items that they would like us to take a look at for the common area landscape and we we are in agreement with them. We want to thank them for their constructive and concise list of items and we've prepared a couple exhibits to share today that how we may address those and work those items into our construction drawing set. Um a number of the items that we're going to work on was in the development of the open space areas. So I think um in fact the track or the the slide that we have right now this is the area along Grand View and and one of the comments that may come up was regarding a wall along that open space strip between the development and the street. So in in this slide here you can see towards the street side there's an area that's not in color. That's an

existing landscape area. And initially, as the top corner exhibit illustrates, uh we were going to have this as an open space landscape area buffer without a wall. Um the HOA has requested a wall. So we are in agreement with Toll Brothers to build the wall. So the wall will go in there so it'll be consistent with the rest of the community walls. And then along with that they've requested some areas uh for different tree species in lie of palm trees to be uh utilized and we're going to work with them on on uh implementing those changes. And then also an area a small area of grass that would be uh part of the community with a bench and a dog station. And we've kind of illustrated that here on this overlay. So up in the left you see the existing and below you'll see kind of our concept for how we will implement that into our drawings. This was another area um where they asked us if we could also integrate some turf area and a path in a bench. Uh so again you can see how we will incorporate that into that open space area with some changes in the plant species. And then the third area uh down below along Nova Street is is what was presented in your plan set. And then um this is our concept of how we could incorporate their comment in the exhibit just up above. And again it's utilizing a pathway, an area for a bench and some lawn areas uh for the residents. and then the recommendation for some plant species and changes in uh the

plant material. So with that, I'm happy to answer any questions. Uh I think we'll come back for questions. Uh thank you. Thank you. We have to have the public hearing or the public speak first, but we will call you back. So, sit in the first in the front row, Mr. Dosey. Don't go far. Don't go far. Uh are are there members of the public who would like to speak?

Madam Chair, we do have one registered speaker for item 4, a Richard Gordon. Ah, thank you, Madam Chair, Madame Vice Chair, members of the commission. My name is Rich Gordon. I am president of the Aena HOA, and I'm here tonight to let you know that um we did send a letter with a long list of concerns. Um, I will let you know that in a very productive meeting with Toll Brothers last Friday, I believe that almost all of those concerns have been addressed. The key issues that remain for us are these landscape issues uh to verify that we can make these changes that there we've talked about with them. Um, and we think that that's very possible. We also um in in that regard um are looking forward to addressing the exterior along Gene Autry uh and how that will be addressed since the original plans are no longer available. Um and that may be an area where we'll have to do some kind of a redesign rather than just trying to figure out what died and and what needs to be replaced. We may need a different approach there. Um the um and also there's a an a little interesting area that um is an an easement at the northern end of one of the

perap staff could show that on the screen. It's slot G.

Is that on um Tom's slides here? Okay, if I could have the studio go back to the main presentation. It would be the other one. One second. There we go. Thank you. Would that be in planning five or seven? That one.

That one. Yeah. So, there's a um at the top of that slide, there's a 10-ft easement that is a a gas line easement. And um

we need to figure out exactly what we're going to do in that area. Um so that it originally sort of some discussion about that being a landscaped area, but it'll be very difficult to maintain a 10-ft area between the rear wall of the property owner, the homeowner, and the master association wall. So that's one thing we're working through. But again, I I just want to stress that the level of cooperation we've received. Um, we believe that the issues we have remaining are all going to be addressed. We'll be able to work them through. Uh, and our design review committee looked at the the architecture, the home design, and think they substantially comply with what we presently have. [Music] Are there other members of the public?

Uh, none that have registered now. So, if the applicant could come back up and Mr. Dosey, uh, questions questions from the um, commission.

Yes, Commissioner Moral. Uh just a quick question on uh PA5 that's up there on the plan. There's those um there's five lots along uh street F that are uh a skew. You can see the houses are a skew. All the other houses in the development are pretty much facing directly towards the road. Um I assume there's no way to sort of Yeah, right there. There's no way to reorient those so they face the road or you might lose a house which I wouldn't want to lose a house

I think and we have our civil so he can speak on it a little bit more but uh looking at the width of the lot where it is the closest to the house we just don't have the space and the width to be able to fit the house and then have our five foot on each side which is why the houses are set back further so that you have that relief and that larger lot. Okay, that that's what I assume. Yeah, it still provides a large front yard and backyard um for the that specific buy here.

Commissioner, yeah. Um the houses that back up to Gatri, uh what do you what are your plans to mitigate some of the traffic noise? Yeah, we actually brought on an acoustical uh consultant that has done a full report and a study and were able to provide us with recommendation. Um, frankly all of them the recommendations are already going to be implemented due to code requirement as far installation. The only requirement that we are implementing to make that better is the window rating. The STC rating is recommended to be at 35 for the second story which we will be implementing and he deemed that to be able to mitigate the noise from the street.

And u what's the height of the wall along Gina tree? Uh I believe it is currently at six foot six foot. Okay. All right. Thank you.

Other questions? I have some uh questions about the architectural styles. As I read the style guideline um for the three different styles that are used and then as read the guideline and take a look at the photographic examples that they have in there and compare them with what's being proposed. To my eye, they look widely different. So, were you trying to match those or were you trying to match what's proved successful elsewhere? And um and why?

So, yeah. So, the backstory on that is that we went with the design guidelines and we're working alongside the city and the design guidelines. From my experience, it has been going with the design guidelines, but also recommendations from the city and uh the prior comments that we have gotten from the commissioners and you madame the chair uh from our last round of project and we've been able to incorporate those comments that we received last time into this new project to be able to try and um like work on those comments prior to coming here. What do you mean by try to work on?

So, so I think that last time we were here some comments were made regarding architectural elements that you would like us to incorporate and we took that into consideration as well and um we're able to provide like such as more shading was required or recommended. So, we incorporated that that into our architecture. Um, we also had recommendation of providing more for-sighted architecture and creating popouts. So, that's something that we took the liberty of including as well.

Okay. I want to make sure I understand this. We are not the architectural review committee. You'll go to them. Um, but we do pass on recommendations to them or suggestions to them about broad issues and what we think should be addressed. And I'm just not sure quite sure um how how to approach that. Could you put up uh as example slide 52? It's the plan three international.

Yes. Let me find it. There we go. Um okay this is an example where if you look at the design elements and the key features according to the the design guidelines it said that there should be smooth wall surfaces uh windows flush with the walls no decorative detailing at the windows or doors key features cantaliever projections including roofs balconies and second story. Obviously, what we have here is a setback on the second story. It's not cantal levered out. We don't have the smooth walls. We don't have the flush. I I mean, it's just not what's described here.

Um,

and and I find that with each of the styles and and each of the plans. So, um I I guess I'm asking again, was there an attempt to reconcile uh or to end to include the key features of the different styles or and and I'm I want to make this clear. I'm not saying that it should be exactly what the this says. I don't know. um if if it's working well for you and the community is happy with it, you've got a beautiful community, then maybe we don't mess with success. I'm just trying to figure out what you were trying to do um and determine whether or not we should be passing on suggestions to the architectural review committee.

If you'll let me uh I might have my architect speak on that. I think that he has more experience with the design and we'll be able to answer your question um better if that's okay. Okay. Thank you.

Uh, good evening. I'm Bill Hesmahol, the architect and designer. So, um, design guidelines and stuff. We actually wrote the design guidelines many, many years ago, and we spent numerous days walking and canvasing these styles and stuff. As time has moved on and stuff, you know, different product widths have come, different configurations of products and homes. These are these are 45 foot wide lots, which is a 35 foot wide product. So we have to interpret the design guidelines for those types of elements that make up those styles. So for instance, this international clearly this resembles international because it's a mixture of different masses put together and cohesion. It's very simplified. It's less or ornamentation and detail. And so you know we try to take those styles and put it into here. We did in a lot of the contemporary um international styles there wasn't garages that we had to deal with and stuff with this. We had all the architecture pulled forward which is a really good statement to kind of bring that forward set the garage back. So we're de developing plans and architectural vocabulary with product types of different sizes and scales. So the second floor we on purposely set that back one you know it helps us with um shading for adjacent homes. It also helps us privacy. It also helps us with the massing. So what we're doing is we're kind of interpreting these three styles. These three styles work really well together. Neither one of them kind of tries to outbeat the other ones. They work really well in harmony together. And so that's why these styles work together so we can complement each other. But, you know, we do we do take a lot of time in trying to interpret those things.

A question for you. Uh, where are you putting the two stories? And maybe you could show the map and show us where the two stories are going. Okay. Well, if you if you look at the floor plans, if we pull up a floor plan, you'll see the the lower level. Well, or you could go back to the street scene if you wanted to. Also, it's not the street scene, it's the location. I mean, I I see the street scene. The question is where they're placed within. Well, the the second floor is usually in the center of the house. So, there's we're pulling them in from the sides. We're pulling them in from the That isn't my question. My question is where which where are the second stories on the map on the site plan? Yeah.

Okay. I think they're they're shown there on so on our on our plotting plans. It might be difficult to see, but there's a color system and our two stories are orange and purple, so you will be able to see them. Do you know what page they're on? Right. It's page 14 on and for planning area 7 in the booklet or online. Uh I'm I'm sorry the way the PowerPoint you can't really see the colors, but in the drawing there's a green blue. Do you know where the what page? cuz it's page 14.

Okay. So like lot nine would be a plan two which is one story lot 10 would be a twotory and then the corner lot lot seven is a twotory and similarly how do I know which architectural style goes on which lot

that hasn't been predetermined I don't believe that at this stage it has been to make that decision. Um, we include as much variation as possible. So, we try to provide as an even amount of percentages and also I would like to say to provide more variation. Some of those plans are mirrored as well. So, between our different floor plans, elevation, mirroring them and our color scheme, it provides a lot of variation within the site. Okay. So, we're not trying to create uh an international village in a mid-century But there'll be Okay, great. That's what I wanted to hear.

So, uh just some questions. Uh just confirmation. You're going to put on Grand View. You are going to put a wall uh in the southern portion. Uh you'll put a wall that matches the other. Correct. And you're stipulating that you will do that. Yes. It will be a six foot tall wall just like the rest of the walls along the community. Okay. and you are going to um follow your re the recommendations regarding soundproofing and you'll do some additional soundproofing of the windows on the second story. Yes, that's correct.

Okay. Um and maybe these are Mr. dosey questions, but you you are going to create a landscape plan for uh the two areas along Gene Autry since one does not exist.

Yes. At that point, I think that we will see how we best want to address it, but clearly a plan needs to be made. Um and then that will give us the ability to move forward and see how the missing plants and new landscaping will want to be incorporated. I living there for years, I can tell you that very little exists of the original that things uh have moved and either died but changed over time. So that it there probably is a little resemblance some trees still survive. Yeah. Yeah.

Um you are going to deal with the blow sand on the on tree. Um could you expand on that a little bit if you There was a letter saying that there has been blow sand building up uh there areas. Yeah. And and if there is blow sand in those areas, it's something you will remove. Yeah, I think that that's definitely something that we can take on and look into uh the landscaping and how that may be able to help. And you are going to revise your plans to show the changes in landscape in the common area landscape that the HOA requested.

Yes, that is correct. What we provided was very preliminary considering that we discussed those comments on Friday. We wanted to be able to put something together for you, but you will be seeing the same level of detail for the new design that was presented. So with that you will get uh irrigation plans and lighting plans for those areas. Yes. And we have discussed uh incorporating uh some uplighting at the trees and seeing how we can um mimic what has already been done in the existing community.

Just speaking of uplighting, one of your uh I think it's sheet page 52 shows uplights on the house. You can't do that. Is it a a rendering? Yeah, it's on the drawings. We we have a we have a dark sky ordinance in the city. So, just um I think um for the lighting it will be on the front yard landscaping and that was that is what and you can do you can do so you'll work within the city guidelines but you won't uplight the houses. Yes.

Thank you. Um, in terms of uh let me see the the other is you you probably work through some kind of solution for that section on the the northern section that is the easement. Uh work something through as to how that's going to be treated or maybe N Mr. Dosey has an recommendation as to how to treat that. Now,

thank you, Madam Chair. Uh, currently what we are showing there, it's if you see the plan, there's two walls. So, the wall closest to the lot is a just a low retaining wall and then there's uh like a planter area and then the perimeter wall in the back of it. Um, we were showing plant material in there. It was a Carissa green carpet, right?

And the plan was that that would just fill in, not require a lot of maintenance, maybe drape over the wall. There was discussion at our meeting with the HOA that perhaps that area may just be uh rock and not require any maintenance or irrigation. And then if homeowners decide they would like to landscape that area, they could do that. Does does the homeowner wall go across? I mean, that's an interesting thing where you're going to have access to each other each of the homes because of that. That again, yes, was the concern how if if the uh sideyard wall continues to the back, how there would be access for that. So that's when the discussion came that it may be best just to have those areas as rock and then the homeowners themselves could take advantage of that space back there.

Okay. Well, so there will be a solution at some point when you get to um either either the committee or uh the ARC that there will be a solution for that. Uh the other is uh gene in in this northern portion doesn't have any electricity. How how are you going to solve that?

Um in our discussions what well starting with the gene landscape. What basically we're going to have to do is walk the project and create a asbuilt drawing if there's anything left. Uh we'll review the irrigation to make it sure that it's all functional. And then the possibility of getting some electric out there was discussed that we could bring it from one of those adjacent uh common area lots if we wanted to get the electric over there and the and we'll develop a full plan for that streetscape. The young woman who just spoke said you would do a new landscape plan. Yes.

Okay. For that area. Okay. Um, I'm just trying to see if there were any other I think probably we've covered most of the issues. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you. Uh, does anybody else have questions? Commissioner Miller, I've just got one quick one. Um I I beyond the one story and two stories that have been laid out on the plans, is there anything built in that would prohibit if a buyer wanted it would prohibit the same floor plan and same architectural design from being placed side by side?

Uh yes, thank you for your question. Yes. So, uh, as it was presented today, the plotting is what we will want to get approved. And the buyer, um, only has selections and option choices within the inside of the house. The selections as far as floor plan and elevation style is decided by us as the builder. And we, this is just not a possibility to be putting the same floor plan, same elevation style next to each other. Is that just based on your policy or is because there's nothing in the in the city's conditions or anything that would prohibit that? But

um I think that's within our internal policies but also the precise grading and the plans get approved by the city. So precise grading will show the plan and elevation type. So that has to be getting approved and if we want to make any revisions it has to be approved and um re um resubmitted and reapproved as well. Right. So, Madam Chair, the planning commission could add uh some discussion in a condition of no two house types next to each other or provide a matrix or something of that nature. Thank you. Are there any other questions?

How much variation is there in setbacks from the street? As I look at these, it looks like they're kind of lined up, but I don't know how much room you have to work with.

Yes. So, um, if you don't mind going back to the floor, the page that shows all four floor plans. Yeah. So, this shows you the setbacks. Um, and right now we are mainly at 10 ft for the front of the house and giving a 20 foot setback for the garage except our mayor, the third floor plan where the house is set back a little bit more. The lots are fairly tight. We're working with 45 width by 90 deep. Um so unfortunately we don't have right now the freedom to really give a lot of relief. Based on the staff report it does note that we can have the garage setback be at a minimum of 18. Right now we're showing at 20. So I think that we can have conversations about bringing them up to 18 to provide a little bit more relief. But as you can see, our lots don't offer very large backyard. And because we want to provide the buyer with a spool, being able to give the backyard the space that it needs to provide that, it just doesn't allow us to push our houses back.

The 20 is required in the Aena, excuse me, the 20 ft is required in the Aena design guidelines. It's uh it it isn't 18 and it isn't it isn't discretionary as far as I understand. I think it was my understanding that it might have been 18, but I apologize misunderstood and I will make I think I think staff can show you the section. Um,

right. Yes, we'll we'll confirm that. Um, I I think the point is that they they're aware of providing some variation and setbacks and so forth. And the page 26 of the of the booklet shows uh the setbacks 10 10 18 and 10 depending on what the house type is with the 20 foot driveway. Oh, with the 20 foot driveway. Okay. Yeah, it isn't the It's the driveway that's required, right? There's a bump out in each of the three of the floor plans

and just we will get two trees in front of every house. Uh right now I think that our landscaper is able to be able to revise the plans to show that as well.

Um thank you. The matter is before the commission. I have some suggestions on a motion. I don't know. Um I think there are a number of things that need to be revised and come come back. Um and so I'm going to list what what I want to see. I I think I would like to have a subcommittee with the design with ARC and uh our commission uh to go over this, but um I'd like to see a streetscape just to show what the streets are going to look like. Um so a a drawing and a rendering. Uh the one thing that I didn't see in the design is four-sided design. And because you've got zero lot lines, what the house what the what the adjacent house looks like is really on on the sideyards is really going to matter to the people next door. So I would like uh four-sided design to be paid attention to. I didn't see I didn't see that in the renderings. uh two trees per house, a uh complete landscape plan for Gene Autry since one doesn't exist. Um you've indicated that you're going to change your landscape plans to meet the the requests of the HOA. So seeing those modifications, seeing an irrigation and lighting plan come for um the common areas. Um uh I I I think we just condition this with can we is it in our purview to condition it for the soundproofing

or show designs that show show the soundproofing? Right. that that would be looked at when um it goes through the plan check process, but you could add that as a

Okay. uh that the wall be added on Grand View in the southern portion as shown so that we would that this committee would see the see that um to the extent there can be more shading on the windows, small projections. I would like to see shading um some focus on shading on the windows. More of the windows. The front window is has a small projection shading it and an eyebrow. But I think more shading on the windows. Um, and I think that covers most of the issues. I think the I'd like the committee just to look at the architecture. I I understand the constraints that you're working with and the history that that the the Aena design this is me speaking the Asena design guidelines were written probably 20 2001 or 2002 and people were copying styles um uh they were doing more absolute absolute references and people are probably doing today to what the historical styles are. But I do think I do think it should people should still look at that um just in terms of the materials that are used and and the attractive the overall attractiveness of the the units and as they're placed together. uh but it would come to a committee that would be uh I think two repres two it's three probably three representatives of us and two of architectural review and this would just be to make sure that the changes you've

said you're making today would be coming in uh in terms of what goes into arc that's my motion are there additions or or changes or Second,

just some additional comments I didn't make earlier about the architecture and um the I know the subcommittee is going to be a process but I think in terms of letting the applicant know what I think the issues are more specifically um I think uh in many cases they've missed the spirit of the uh the design guideline. Uh, I think putting a sloped roof on a building does not make it mid-century. And and the essence of mid-century is indooroutdoor. It's clear story windows. It's asymmetrical. You know, it's stone walls or uh block walls that don't wrap around a volume to create something very heavy. So, I think you've completely missed it. you know, and again, I understand that, you know, there are ways to interpret it, but I think what we're seeing here does not even come close to what's possible. Um, I think your proportions on the front bedrooms are way off, way too tall. Um, I agree with uh the chairman uh Wormik's comments about uh being more sensitive to solar control on all of the windows. the lack of foursided architecture is clearly missing. Um, and yeah, I just like to see um I think when you look at this in total, it's very homogenized and I think it doesn't hurt to vary a little bit more than just changing a block texture or color to from one house to another. I think there are opportunities to architecturally revise window locations, wrap the corners, you know, there there's so many opportunities that you can still use and

maybe get closer to the spirit of the guidelines without being literal. So, those are my comments. Thank you for your comments, Commissioner. We'll take those into consideration. those and especially on the mid-century I thought that the roof the roof lines were just it was too cliche much too cliche. The only other comment I would add would be regarding no two uh floor plan and in styles the same next to each other. Yes, sorry meant to include that. Um so uh I have a motion. Is there a second? I'll second. Okay. Any comments?

Can you call the question? So, if I could just to I'm sorry, just to clarify, this is a motion for approval with referral to a subcommittee. Yes. But it's not coming back to the full commission. Oh, no. Okay. Thank you for that. It is approval. It's going to a subcommittee. I really want to thank you before we vote for all of the work that you have done and all the work you've done with the HOA on this. Um it it's really important what you've done, but there's because there's they're going to be changes, we want to make sure that it comes through with it goes to ARC with the changes you've told us you would make.

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you everyone for your time tonight. Uh can you call the call role, please? Chair Wormick. Yes. Uh Commissioner Rottman, yes. Vice Chair Lan. Yes. Uh, Commissioner Baker, yes. Commissioner Miller, yes. Commissioner Murphy, yes. Commissioner Moral, yes. Motion passes. Thank you so much. Can I have a subcommittee chair? Oh, yes. Uh, yes. I will give you a subcommittee in a moment. Uh, Commissioner Rottman, would you like to serve on this? Uh, it really depends on when it happens. We'll make it happen to your

I won't be back until uh the next planning commission in October. We have one next week. Are you gone? I'm not able to attend that one. Okay. But you you'll be back October. I think just to you're here. Does one It's basically one month. Does that give you the time you need to get things done? I think it gives us a lot more time than needed. I think that we can definitely have those turned around to you within a week or two and it would be our preference to be able to get feedback and moving forward as soon as we have our plans ready. Are you going to be abroad? No. Can you do it by Zoom? Uh potentially. Okay. Uh are there any other volunteers?

Commissioner Ramen's given you a lot of suggestions that work that could be going on before you meet with the subcommittee. Yes, of course. Yeah. And even if your architect can do as opposed to a finished presentation just some sketches of potential alternate uh you know changes that would be very helpful for the subcommittee to see. Yeah, of course we'll take that into consideration which um makes us think that the month timeline is a lot more than what we need for those sketches. Uh we we also have to work with people's schedules. So yes ma'am I understand. Uh do we have another volunteer from here?

Yes. Great. Uh is and we would need a third person. Can she be a volunteer on this?

I'll be honest. I don't know. I think since the subcommittee is per is really tasked with ensuring that the will of the commission overall is kind of carried through into what goes to ARC and rather than rendering a determination necessarily. I think it might be possible. Let me um I'm going to text the attorney quick. Quick. Okay. Thank you. Uh, Commissioner Miller, Commissioner Moral, either of you want to do it. Uh, I'm I'm not available for the next couple weeks. So, um,

I'm available, but I would respect respectfully ask for a decline. Um, because I'm expecting to be a part of another subcommittee that I'm hoping will come forward at any week now. Um, would you like to do this? Um, I will do it. Commissioner Murphy. Do you want to be on this? I'm the last one.

No, I don't. I'm just a I'm asking. We need I I mean there their issues. Uh I will be on it, but I don't I would rather offer other people the chance to be on it. you're available. So, we've got we've got potentially three members and if Megan can't do it, I will do it. Right. And we have a we have a ARC meeting on Monday. We can ask the ARC for Right. Um hopefully the chair will do it and

I'll I'll relay that to him. So the the guidance has come back from our city land use attorney. It is acceptable for our alternate to serve on the wonderful. Thank you for for volunteering. Okay. So we have a committee and um if Commissioner Rottman needs to be on Zoom that we'll do it that way. Okay. But I don't think we can do the architecture piece of it without you. Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you, Madam Chair, and everyone else. I need the restroom. I need a five minute break. I talked through the last one.

recording in progress. Yay. So, I turned up the volume. Can you hear me better because I did? Okay. No, it's just um

I'll wean in as much as I can. Okay. The we are at 4B a request by PSLUX LLC property owner for a major development per permit application and a tenative track map for a one lot condominium to construct a duplex on a 0.56 acre site located at 301 West Via Esqua. Staff report please.

Good evening chair and commissioners. The project before you is a request for a one lot condo map to construct a duplex on a 0.56 acre site. The scope of work includes review of the application for conformance with the development standards of Palm Springs zoning code section 9203, section 94041, which is the findings for development permit and section 66474 of the subdivision map act. Following an approval, the architecture review committee will review the architecture, landscape, overall design and color and material of the project. The project site is located at the corner of West Vasquila and North Mirror Vista Way and is surrounded by single family and multif family development on all sides, single story and uh twotory. Currently, the site is developed with a single family residential house. However, due to the zone RGA6 and the general plan designation, the lot permits up to three dwelling units. Lots on an RGA6 zone, sorry, lots in an RG A6 zone have a minimum lot area of two gross acres. This lot is an existing lot of record and though substandard in size, considered a legal non-conforming lot. In addition to the duplex, the applicant is proposing a one lot condo map for the purposes of creating airspace on the lot, which will allow them to be able to legally subdivide the property and sell them in the future. Again, as mentioned, the lot is zoned RGA6, which permits single family and multifamily residential uses. The general plan designation is low density residential, and three units are permitted on the property. The RGA6 development standards include height, lot coverage, and open space, which all comply within the Palm Spring zoning code. The maximum building height in the zone is 15 ft, and the project is proposing 13'5 in. Additionally, the

buildings in the surrounding area are mostly singlestory and around the same height uh with the exception of the multifamily you zone um uses on the on the west I'm sorry the east uh which are um twotory the setback on the north and west property lines require sorry let me start again additionally um setbacks are required as part of your review for the develment velopment standards. The setbacks on the north and west property lines require an AMM application which are processed. It's an application that is processed at staff level. Overall, the total amount of open space does exceed the 50% threshold. And though there are only two units that have um access to the pool, the standard is still met. So above is the proposed site plan and floor plan. the proposed landscape plan and the proposed elevations of

Can you put the landscape planet back on for a moment? Thank you. Mhm. And and uh you know the accompanying elevations. Overall, the project is considered categorical exempt pursuant to section 15303 uh new construction and it meets the findings of a development permit. Staff does recommend approval of development permit and um the parcel map uh subject to the attached conditions of approval. This concludes my presentation and the applicant is available for any questions. Uh

questions of staff. Commissioner Mororrow. Yeah. On um one of the last couple slides um it's the overview. Uh uh not that one. That one. Mhm. Um the the uh two units shown in that are cross-hatched in color. Um they left out the 10-ft easement. There's like a 10-ft courtyard between those two garages, but I think the garages are disproportionately large. So, I just wanted to make sure it doesn't affect the overall um area of the building,

the setbacks. Um yeah, the setbacks on the side, right? Yeah. So, the setbacks on the side, those are consistent. It's it's consistent and complies with the development standards. questions of staff. U Commissioner Murphy, um I'm having trouble reading the plan. Can you just give me an idea of the wall that um goes along Mira Vista and Esquea? Is it a is there a planned six foot wall that goes around the whole property?

Right. So, there's currently an existing um six foot wall along um Mirror Vista Way. I'm trying to That must be behind the FAS edge. Yes. And it currently wraps around here. Um I believe and maybe the applicant can confirm that there's a wall here as well. Yes. and and I believe that's going to be removed to make access for this. Okay. So, it's all existing walls, correct? Basically, and here as well. Okay. Thank you. All sides. Uh I'm not sure there's a wall on the back cuz I drove into that parking lot and it was just a chain link fence I believe.

Commissioner Miller. Yeah. unit at this point. Yeah. I just want to confirm with staff that this zoning and this product type with a total of three units, two uh two being a duplex does not permit a short-term rental of less than 30 days. Is that correct? That is correct. Uh you in the city aren't allowed to do short-term rental um within a multif family zone. Okay. Thank you,

Vice Chair Lane. I'm looking at the site plan which has the uh that you have up there. Now, there's quite a bit of landscaping, existing landscaping, um that looks as though it could remain, but when I look at the landscape plans, it looks as though pretty much we end up with just uh permeable pavers everywhere. Do you know what of the landscaping would remain, if any? I'd like to actually direct that question to the applicant. From my last conversation with them, uh the the hedging along uh North Mirror Vista Way was to remain and in front of um the main house on West Vasqueila. Um but we could clarify that with

applicant. And then do you know if there was any consideration given to um other site configurations, excuse me, uh such as taking entrance um rather than from Esqueala, taking it from Mirror, whatever it is from the east, right? Uh as far as I know, there is actually a an existing carport at this location.

Okay. that would prevent or at least make it a little difficult to get access from Veristaway. Um, as far as additional consideration, none that has been discussed with staff. Okay. And it appeared from what I saw that most of the other homes along um via take entrance from side streets rather than via. Is that what you saw?

No, I went through um on just you know the aerial and I saw that there was quite a few that did take um access from Vasquea. It is not is considered a um local uh collector street and access from VSU is is a permitted um access point. Um but and there are there are a few. Okay. Thank you. Uh one question is the house that's the western most I think it's unit A that has no access to the swimming pool. Am I correct?

That is correct. Oh, well, when I spoke to the applicant, um, they had s said that there that was correct, but maybe maybe some things have changed. Okay. And when I I I drove and walked it today, when I went along uh via, there are no double there are no homes that are only garages facing via. Is that correct? I could say yes that is correct.

So and and the there are a few homes that have that aren't most of most of VUA is trees or hedges similar to what's at the property uh where there are homes the homes that open up onto it. You can see the home you it isn't just a just a double driveway. Okay. I think given um you know the size of the lot it's it's a little difficult to put the garages um side by side and still maintain the development standards. Yeah.

Um but one of the things we could add is um you know decorative gates or walls to kind of alleviate that view. Other questions?

Yeah. Um do you know is uh as they vacate uh a portion of the the side of the property are there plans by the city to widen that or what's going to happen with that uh land because there's currently a hedge I think that's you know now will be floating around you know so are there is there anything from the city side about what's going to happen with that? When I spoke with um our engineering department, they are going to dedicate a portion of you know there's there's a there's a route of red dedication that needs to be taken and a sidewalk that would need to be I think reconfigured but I want to say that we've come to the agreement with planning and engineering that it won't affect that existing hedge on

allowing for like instead of um I want to say an 8ft sidewalk. They were okay with a 5ft sidewalk. So, where will that sidewalk be located? Is it uh is it going to be at the new property line along VUA or is it out further in alignment with you know your photo? Is it out further? It would be it should be in alignment with the remaining or the existing sidewalks.

Okay. All right. Thank you. Uh if there are no more questions, uh is the applicant here. Good evening, uh commissioners and staff. uh to go over the project description once again. Um the proposal is a a single story duplex on a 5.56 acre site at West Vasquila and North Mirror Vista Way. The existing conditions consist of a one single family residence that remains on the east portion of the property. As mentioned, the new development will contain of two units on the west side creating a three total dwelling on the parcel. Unit A consisting of a total 2,285 combined square footage with garage and living space, three bed, three bath. Unit B, a total combined of 2,915 total square feet, three bath, three bath, and three bath. The outdoor amenities for the private yards such as a pool, spa, and fire pit will only be accessible from uh unit A and the existing single family residence, not not the uh farthest units on the west side. And as far as the site and design, as mentioned, RGA6, the general plans low density residential supporting two or three units. Uh project provides three units total. Lot size is 2,00 24,829 square feet consists of 0.56 acres. As mentioned um per staff the our total proposed height is 13 and 5 in which is below the 15 foot height limit. Our lot coverage is 31% which is under the 50% uh allowed. The open space such as landscape is 51%.

Such as setbacks I believe we are compliant with the minor reductions via administrative minor modifications. parking. We require five parking spaces. It provided two garages and two driveways for units. Um, as far as that, any other questions? Are there questions of the applicant? Yes, Commissioner Broman. Um, yeah. So, I asked staff the about the um dedication of a portion along Vasqueuela and the existing hedge. So what's going to happen between on the back side of the hedge and the new your new property line?

Uh that hedge will be uh cut down below four feet. So it'll it won't cover the entire view of the proposed unit. Uh we're going to have a low desert uh maintenance uh landscape that will provide a clear view towards the proposed units. Okay. And Okay. Thank you. Any other questions? And

so if I don't understand this correctly, um both the residents and any visitors would come up off of Vasqueuela and their entrance to either unit is walking up uh through an alley be between the two. Correct. between the existing single family residence and the unit closest to the eastward. The unit on the westward will not have any access towards this. And then in the purpose of this uh wait, I'm sorry. It won't have any access.

So the the unit that's located on the westward location of the of the site will not have direct access to the amenities such as a pool, fireplace. But from the street, how do you how do you get into the house? Where's what's considered the front door for that? In between the garage and the existing family res um dwelling, there is a proposed five- foot tall block out with a a gate, a self uh self-latching, self-closing gate that will have direct access towards a pool. No. Oh. Uh no. I'm coming to visit you. Mhm. Park on. Mhm. Where's the front? The front door for the for unit the one that's uh more on the eastward

for both for both the the two new units. Um how where's the front door? I'll start off with the unit on the eastward. Okay. There to the right of the garage. There's a proposed uh gate with a walking left entry towards the suite. I mean to the to the unit, the unit on the eastward to the right of the garage passing the uh trash enclosure, the gas meter, there's another gate that will have direct access to enter the the main unit. So somebody in the unit, there's no eyes on the street essentially. You're not able to see the main entry,

see out your front door. Okay. And then on the west for the west unit, where are you coming in? Is that is that the front door that is facing west? Okay, so for the existing uh single family dwelling, there's a existing door. Excuse me, but maybe we can get a pointer and you can point on the plan. That might be easier. HVC equipment. Yeah,

just going back and forth. How do we get the pointer to be activated? Nobody. Why don't you come up to the screen? No, the two units. Those two units have

the unit that I'm pointing at is on the eastward to the right of the garage. There's a main entry for the central more or less courtyard which will directly enter the unit for the eastward unit. The westward unit to the right of the garage passing the trash enclosure. There's a a gate that will directly to the central courtyard sideyard and the main entry towards uh the main unit. You have two options, one behind the kitchen and one to the main of the living room. So visitors come past the trash enclosure and either enter into the kitchen or keep going and enter into the next.

Yes, ma'am. Okay. Okay. And uh I asked the same question of staff. Was any consideration given to um taking entry from the east? Uh having a common driveway from the east side rather than coming from the north off of Via Escua. Well, you can carport can be moved. The carport's fairly minimal. It's not a it's not a major structure. Can I speak to that? Yes.

Sorry. Uh, so the lot's kind of a strange odd little lot. So it dates back to 1939 and the original entrance to the lot and the address to the lot is Vasqueuela. So over the years, the front entrance to the lot has always been Vasqueuela. The house, the original house is there now. It was built in 1939 and it has the exact same original entry that it's had since then. When we looked at the overall development of the lot, we did look at doing the eastward entry off off of Mir Vista, but there was kind of a choke hole that we weren't able to get in and then kind of expand. It made more sense to go around to Vasquea because we had much more frontage to be able to get access for multiple driveways, garages, and that type of thing. So it made more sense because we had more French accessibility via than through Montist.

And if I can uh also add on to that considering the the width of the units and also the setbacks not just the setbacks to the property lines but also the setbacks to the existing single family dwelling. It'll limit us to a 13t wide approximate building width. Therefore, it makes more sense to locate both units and locate both uses of um a duplex on this portion of the property, which is the mass piece of the puzzle that's empty.

Okay. Be-c because of the congestion on the site and the configuration. Um, I agree that the site could take two more units, but was there consideration giving to perhaps smaller units? 2900 is square feet is pretty large as is 2200. Was there consideration that might give you a little more breathing room so that you could have front doors and things like that?

So, the the biggest unit, which is 2,900, that's a total square footage. Um, the livable space on that is around 2,200. sh a little bit shy of 2,300 ft². The second one um a hair under 1,900 ft². The purpose of this uh new duplex is not to um uh provide rentals for for anybody that's out there looking for rentals. This is mainly for the uses of the owners occupying the sing the single family residence at the moment. Um there's two owners on the property. One of the owners will occupy the existing single family uh dwelling. The second owner will occupy one either unit A or unit B and then the remaining unit will be left for a family member of their choice. U they're not looking for any financing. They're for this. They'll be paying directly out of pocket. It won't be looking for any any marketing issues or anything like that to fill up the or occupy the units. This is a a project that's ready to go if allowed to do so. I've had engineering and MEP plans as as as well as grading plans completed since um early in the year of March. So, at this point, we're just asking for your guys' blessing to move on forward. We want to do the same thing as you guys. We have the same mission in mind. We want to avoid and and and use up empty lots and get them get them built and get them built fast. So, we're on the same page as as as far as you guys go. We want this to be done as smooth as possible. We're

um just saying I'm not on the same page. Uh but did you give any consideration I mean what you've created is very awkward from my point of view. So it's very awkward on Mira. Did you give any consideration to possibly putting one house in front, a walkway, the other house in back so that you you don't create the kind of block you're creating on the street? or just doing one house because it the the hard part for me is what you've created uh doesn't work from from my point of view it doesn't work well as an entry and it doesn't work well on uh via so did you look at and I know I'm talking but uh you you'll hear my point of view moving the house the houses back so that you don't have a block having two driveways only with no eyes on the street is is a problem. And and did you look at any other alternatives to do to deal with this?

Yes, ma'am. I appreciate your concerns. The other two alternates that we had were were definitely reducing the size of the units, but due to the amount of uh bedrooms and bathrooms as requested by by the clients, not just that, but the main usage of uh Vasquella, there are other um dwellings that occupy and use the main entry on Vasquea. Um although Google Maps or Google Earth might not illustrate that properly, if you guys take a visit down there, I did visit down there.

Yeah, there will be some vehicles parked on the side of the street and using that as a secondary option as a as a point of entry. At this point, we're making it better. Instead of having just random vehicles out on the street, we're making a uniform garage entry uh as a point of entry due to the size of the law and the configurations that that were that we piece around with. Thank you. Are there any other questions for the applicant? Seeing none, thank you so much. Thank you, guys.

Uh comments, I think I've made mine. I'm I'm very uncomfortable with this. I don't I don't feel comfortable putting two garages on the street. There is nothing like that on Via Esqueala, which is a very residential street. If there are houses, they're they're they're open houses where they have eyes on the street and a single garage. I could have been comfortable with three if there was a second entrance on um Mira Vista Way, but I I think this is overstacking the site. So, those those are I I'll give comments. I don't know if anybody else agrees with me.

Um well, I uh certainly agree that the two sort of garage only uh frontage um you know, elevations facing via Esquea is very awkward. It's it's not really acceptable. Um this is like the worst version of snub houses I've ever seen where the garage is the only thing that you see from the front. I don't have a problem with three units total on this site and I think I've heard others say that it just needs to be designed differently. Um there needs to be some sort of shared driveway situation where you don't need two more separate driveways. uh in this case that happened to be on Vasquea perhaps one where they pull in and then maybe you only have three garages instead of two and they're side loaded garages instead of front-facing and that way you can dress up the side of that garage facing the street so that it doesn't look like a garage. Something has to change. I understand the need of the city to get more housing in and I appreciate that you're, you know, sort of approaching it from that standpoint, but uh just packing in the density and coming up with something that looks like this is not going to be acceptable, I think, to a lot of us. I would certainly enter, we can hear from others, but I would entertain a continuence if you're want to entertain a redesign, but I I feel that you're probably maybe not getting an approval tonight for this design

here. Yes. I'm sorry, Commissioner Murphy.

Um although I will the applicant can can speak to whether they want a continuence or a denial. One thing I would say is the lot being substandard in in total lot size as well as the additional now dedicated wide of way which is taking 25 ft off the front leaves us with such a small kind of tight buildings building space that every time we tried different configurations we'd run into different you know setback issues on this side setback issue. So, it got very hard for us to be able to try to get what we what we needed into that kind of quirky little lot. Um, we tried all the different variations off of um, Mir Vista and we thought that being able to provide uh, twocar garages for both units off of Esquea was something that made sense. Um, and the idea that having the kind of setback entrances to the units was a way to kind of create privacy and and with that type of unit. Um, I if you can help guide me in terms of the difference between a denial versus a continuous. This is the first time we've ever done this. We're not big developers. We're just two guys trying to build a retirement house for ourselves to be able to age in place and take care of each other. So,

Commissioner Rottman, do you want to speak to Well, continue. I'm Well, the continuation is that basically you come back with a new design and so I don't it sounds like from I don't know your name. I'm sorry, but you you're pretty much committed already with HBAC and you know what all that stuff. So, it's not an inexpensive endeavor, but the other opportunity, the other choice is that it's denied and it's done. So, um you could appeal it. You could appeal it. Yes, you could appeal to council.

Yeah, I don't want to appeal it. I mean, I trust your guys's judgment and input and we want to do the right thing. So, you know, my comment is I understand completely what you're trying to do here and in u in perhaps a more urban area, something like this would be not an issue. But if you look around the neighborhood, um they're large lots. They're, you know, they're they're single family. So, this it's unusual that there's three units on a property in this particular area. I know there's multif family, but some of the other houses adjacent are are not. But anyway, um I I I understand the comments my um fellow commissioners are making and I just wonder uh from a staff point of view if there isn't some relief on some of the setbacks that they could apply for which would make it easier for them to come back with a different approach. Yes. So, um the AMM application would be your an option, um which I know you're familiar with because you have already applied for that for I believe it was like the north and the west setback. Um or like a a full-on variance would also be another avenue we could look at as well.

No, sounds like the right road that we can It's a better option if you want this project to go forward. We want the project to go forward. And you know, just already we spent close to $75,000 just on plans and and we're we bought this to be able to build for our long-term retirement and to be able to live together and take care of each other. So, we're committed to doing this.

The the hard part is fitting three units on this site. It easily fits two. Uh, and you could you could do something on uh via Esquea with two uh if there's some relief on um Mira Vista Way that would allow you not to build a 13- ft house. Uh the better option on this site is to try and find something uh an entry there and a single a single entrance. Um the other would be some kind of shared driveway and houses placed at different, you know, a house in the back and a house um a uh a house in the front. I mean, I think they're they're different they're different configurations, but what you're doing here is is just hard for us to approve. And I'm I'm sympathetic, but I it's a small a small lot with what the city's taking away from you, too.

We're kind of stuck as we've got kind of three family members that we need to try to you know, can in this in this area, can they go to two stories? No, they can't go to No, they're limited by height. Um I think to 15t. Yeah, they're not going to be able to get two stories in 15 ft. And you might not you may not be able to get the same size houses.

So we're So you're saying suggesting that maybe look at one of the units have an entrance from your Vista or the potential of both having entrances on aa but some kind of shared driveway and some kind of change where there's eyes on the street from at least one of the units. Yeah,

I would um suggest that there are condos that have uh a common carport or a common garage for all the vehicles for for the various different condo units and especially because your family members that that might work out well. Um, but the other thing I I want you both to understand is we want you to have a great retirement, a wonderful place to live that works for you, but we need to look out for the long-term interests of the community of the entire community. And sometimes the land use deci decisions that are made for a single family, what they can do on their lot doesn't work for the rest of the community. and someday you may want to sell. Um, and so we need to make sure that we're looking out for all of your neighbors, the community, and the future because decisions that we make can leave an awkward uh, poorly functioning site for a hundred years, not just for length of time that you'll use it. But I'm I'm optimistic that uh, there is a large enough lot here that you're going to be able to come up with something that works. Again, it might not be quite as large as what you have now. Um, by by sharing, especially by trying to share one driveway with a parking for all three uh um units, I think you can get there. The duplex could also in some configuration could be you could work a duplex into the existing house as a way of not having the sideyard and being able to um to to do your duplex on Mirror Vista Way that

it's Is there a setback for the drive? What if you did a tandem garage instead of a Oh, that would you do a tandem the garage and then have Oh, tandem the garage and then have then you'd have a front door for both units. Just narrow your garage. Okay, I see what you're saying. Do we allow tandem back to back? So, so tandem isn't really preferred. It's not outright prohibited. Uh, usually the garages are 20 by 20. Yeah.

Because we also did look at trying to kind of sidestep the garage so you could kind of drive in and go to the side so that we could open up the front and they're just setback wise and there wasn't enough room to be able to turn. There's always a onecar garage. We we could, but I thought we were required to have a 20 by 20. But again, trying to figure out some way of using Mirror Vista because that's that's the area where it would be easier.

Yeah, maybe a way that I can make that work is um use the westward unit, keep the same layout, and then just flip it, having the garage face on the south side. Yeah. And utilize that uh mirror Vista entry, removing that carport, shrinking the the pool, and using that as a shared entry. um removing the the total appearance of the garage appeal from Esqueella and and now uh kind of dump that and now you have some house on with a garage which is a normal house.

Correct. And now I can attach that garage on the westward unit to the side of the of the of the unit to the point where you guys can actually see a part of the unit from the street and not just see complete garage. So there's and it's the double garage that's really a headache. Yeah. Could I take the pool and maybe transition it over to a to kind of frontload it to open up that is pool? Yeah. No, thank you guys for yours is Yeah. I mean, we want you to we want you to figure out how to do this. We just need it done in a way that we can approve it to help.

Oh, no. We It's a great idea and and we're encouraging it. So then I guess through the chair, if I could, the question to the applicant is how much time do you think you need? Is it 30 days? Is it 60 days to really flush out a new design and come back to us? because we don't want to keep wasting your time and vice versa. Um, how long do you think before you could get it right? We are going to make this happen. So, I think to be safe if we could have 60 days or we could have it and I guess these aren't getting this isn't a a 500 foot notice anyway, right? So, we could do an open-ended date uncertain. Okay. Data uncertain. That's that leaves work on it when we're ready. Come back. Yeah. Represent. Okay.

Okay. Okay. So with that, I would move for a continuence to an in indefinite date allow a redesign as per our comments. Do I have a second? Second. Who uh can you call the role, please? Commissioner Miller, yes. Vice Chair Alan, yes. Chair Wormick, yes. Commissioner Baker, yes. Uh, Commissioner Murphy, yes. Commissioner Rottman, yes. Commissioner Morurell, yes.

And if there possibilities of variances or lenences, I would say that a the a different version of an AMM, which is already kind of on offer for the project as it is today, would be a could be a possibility. I think that they would it would be difficult to sustain the findings necessary to grant a variance. Um just because it was it I don't want to say a hard no, but I you'd have to really kind of dig in especially on Oh, no. No. Yeah. Yeah. Soft no.

A soft no. Okay. So, if this passes um Thank you. Okay, good luck. We look forward to seeing what you come up with.

Um, okay. Right before us is item uh 4C, which is the appointment of two alternate members to the architectural review committee. Uh the recommendation is uh to appoint um Bob Dylan who is a architect and Charles Elliot who is a landscape architect uh for terms they're alternate members but terms beginning September 15, 2025 and June 30th uh ending June 30th, 2025. I would say that we interview them. They are excellent candidates um and they will be real additions to the committee.

Uh Madam Chair, I just want to note there is a typo in the agenda. Those dates should actually be ending 2026, not 2025. Oh, few good because otherwise they wouldn't they'd get a we would be appointing them to terms that had already expired. Expired. Yes. Okay. So, uh those of us who interviewed them should make the motion. I move to appoint the two new members to ARC. I second author. Commission. Yes. Sorry. Uh, Vice Chair Lean. Yes. Chair Warmick. Yes. Uh, Commissioner Baker. Yes. Commissioner Miller. Yes.

Commissioner Murphy. Yes. Commissioner Morell. Yes. Great. And we've I think we have informally heard that we may have a resignation. Uh yeah, I'll touch on that on planning director reports that Oh, thank you. Planning directors. Well, oh, there's committee uh planning commission reports, requests, and comments. Are there any?

Great. Um a couple items of note. Uh as Chair Wormer referred uh we did have a resignation from the ARC. Uh so at an upcoming meeting we'll be asking the the commission to formally accept that resignation and um will be one of the shortest tenurs of an alternate member in in my experience. We'll be asking you all to elevate um the landscape architect uh alternate to a full Can you find out uh we had a third excellent candidate. Can you find out if they're interested in being an alternate?

Yeah, I'd be I would be happy to. I know that they also expressed an interest in a different board and commission with the city and I don't know if they've moved into a role with that commission, but I I can certainly find out. I think it I think it would for those of us who interviewed him, he was also excellent. Uh and it was a hard decision except that he wanted to work he was interested in two two commissions. Uh so if he is available um we can take a look at that.

Sounds good. The only other um report I have is that as a preview of upcoming attractions, uh it is although it's not published yet, uh your meeting in a week will be largely centered on a relatively large mixeduse hotel, condominium, and retail development in the section 14 area. So, look forward to getting that um rather meaty packet in the coming days. Yes. When is the Beller Greens study going to happen? Is that scheduled?

Uh, it is not yet scheduled, but I can check with Ken who's uh project managing that the Beller Greens project. Uh, any questions with that? Uh we are adjourning until 5:30 Tuesday, September 16th, which is next week. All right. Thank you all. Recording stopped.