Council - Regular Meeting

information, timelines and that sort of stuff and people tough. Oh well.

Just Well, I know that.

Okay. Councelor Hammond, can you hear us? I sure can. How are you all? Good evening, Councelor Hammond. I could hear her. Yes, I can hear you. Can you hear me? Hello. Hello. Hello. I can I can hear you. We'll have him improve that. Okay, great. Good evening.

Now I can hear you better. Okay, I will call to order this regular meeting of the city council, January 14, 2026. The time is 5:32. I [clears throat] am going to move item 51, a mayor's announcement, to right now before we do the opening activities. As many in the community are aware, we lost a a dear council member this weekend. David Auggie passed away um Saturday morning. And I would like to read at this time the press release that that's the staff put out for this unfortunate event. The city of Paige mourns the passing of councelor David Auggie who died the morning of jeep of January 10 following a prolonged health battle. Counselor Auggie's passing is a sign is a significant loss for the Page community where he was widely respected for his dedication, integrity, and lifelong commitment to public service. Counselor Auggie and his wife moved to Paige in 1976, establishing deep roots in the city he would serve for decades. His service took many forms, including as a volunteer firefighter and EMT, and later through extensive civic and volunteer involvement. He also served on the board of the John Wesley Pal Museum and was an active member of the Canyon Club. In 2020, councelor Auggie began serving on the Page City Council where he was known for his steady presence, thoughtful perspective, and strong support for public safety, quality of life, and civic engagement. He brought valuable institutional knowledge and a collaborative approach to city governments, and he remained consistently engaged in community meetings and initiatives

beyond those required of his role. Vice Mayor Mike Pharaoh shared the following statement. Quote, "David was a dedicated volunteer and advocate for police and fire services, veterans, and many community causes. He gave his time generously and was always willing to meet with anyone to listen and work toward common ground. From saving lives to guiding others, there are few individuals who have had the lasting impact on the city of Paige that David has had. Councelor Auggie will be remembered with deep respect for his service, his compassion for others, and his enduring commitment to the community he called home. With that, I'd like to invite everybody to stand for a moment of silence, after which I'll lead us in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Reminder to counselors to put on your microphone.

Madame clerk, will you please do a roll call? Mayor Kidman here. Vice Mayor Frell here. Councelor Hammond here. Councelor Hedinger here. Councelor Pller here. Councelor Roundtree here. Item number three, consent agenda, seven items. I'm looking for any motion. Oh, councelor Hinger. Uh, I just like to make a note that I am recusing myself from the consent agenda. Thank you.

All right, Mr. Mayor. All I will motion to approve the consent agenda items 3, 1, 2, 3, four, five, six, and seven. Do I have a second? Second. Have a motion from councelor Preller, a second from councelor Pharaoh. All in favor say I. I. I. I. I.

Any opposed? Thank you. Item four here from the citizens. We do have several blue cards. So I will call on you randomly. Um, a reminder to the citizens. Um, you have three minutes. You have three minutes. There is a timer. Please, please watch it. But I can I can give you a reminder when you get really close. Um, and let's start with Aiden. Aiden Egan. Thank you. State your full name and just your city of residence, not your full address. And you'll uh the microphone is there at the podium.

Cool. Do I need to hold or anything or can you guys hear me like this? Just like that.

Sweet. My name is Aiden Egan. I reside in Paige. I was uh born in Flagstaff, but I was raised here. Um contrary to popular belief, I am actually here to express my support for the installation of the data center as a local asset. I believe that the associated benefits of having the center or the center inside Page city limits will be crucial for the community. Things like air pollution, noise pollution, and light pollution [music] are things that the citizens of Paige have lived without up until now. And I believe it's time for us to accept the [music] facts and move forward into the future. By adding a large data center to our area, we improve the visual majesty that people traveled the world to see. The boom in tourism will bring us income, just like the installation of the data center. I'm also excited to see that we're adding [music] jobs by installing this data center. Um, I may have missed the part where I was reading where they promised jobs to the local citizens. So hopefully the people that they import uh to provide these jobs or to uh to complete these jobs don't take up too much housing, increase the price of housing locally, or unfortunately, you know, cause a lack of tourism. But I don't see that happening. a data center is quite beautiful in my opinion. So de [laughter] sorry no my bad too. So diminishing the local majesty that we have here should definitely be majorly appealing to anybody that needs to come by. Um and [music] I think putting it across from Horseshoe Bend was a fantastic idea. [laughter] [clears throat] Hopefully things like light pollution associated with the security of keeping the data center safe from the unreasonable [music] citizens that are causing problems in this city doesn't cause too much of an issue. I really doubt that the people inside the ranchets are going to have too much of a problem with the years of [music] construction noise pollution and the noise pollution that is associated with

servers running 24/7. If they don't like it, they can wear ear muffs. As far as the air pollution, it's not really a problem. Um, cancer is on my list. It's on my bucket list. So, hopefully there's quite a bit of noise or air [music] pollution associated to this data center. So, I can kind of speed that up and get that over with. It's been taking a while. As far as the heat generation associated to the installation and installment of these [music] data centers, which produce no heat, global warming is a myth. Just believe in science. Anyways, I'll wrap it up. I know I'm a little short, but like I said, I do genuinely believe that adding a data center is going to improve the quality and lives of all paid citizens [music] and bring in a significant amount of revenue associated to everything [music] involved with a data center. So, thanks for hearing me. [applause] Okay, let's have Beth Henshaw. Beth Henshaw, City of Paige. Thank you for hearing me tonight. Um yeah, I want to talk about so Bernie Sanders and 230 environmental groups wrote a letter uh to Congress calling for a nationwide moratorum which is a pause on any new construction of data centers. Um I would love to see Paige since we're such a place for to for tourism to go outside and experience nature. I would love to see Paige actually jumping on that bandwagon. Um they are calling for the pause of new data center construction because AI is so unregulated right now. I am pretty

disturbed by the uses of AI right now. Um Instacart was just investigated for using an AI tool that was price gouging. Um the Federal Trade Commission launched a formal investigation into Instacart Instacart's practices and found that there was price swings between [music] 7 and 23%. So they're changing prices based on who they think can afford more. So it's not just eggs are $3 anymore. It's $6 for you. It's $2 for you. It's $8 for you. After that investigation, they um formally came out and said that they were stopping using that data tool. Um let's move on to Elon Musk AI tool called Gro. Um Gro is being used to alter images of women and children by removing their clothing. This is a new thing that uh became very popular. Uh on January 8th, as many as 6,000 requests were being made every hour to a chat GBT bot asking to remove clothing of children. This is completely unregulated. Is this something that you want your names to be next to saying the city of Page supports data centers when this is what AI is being used for? [music] There's two lawsuits right now against chat GBT. parents file filed a lawsuit against open AI who owns ChatGBT because their 16-year-old daughter committed suicide after discussing their suicidal ideiation with ChatGBT. Rather than providing mental health care, ChatGBT gave the child ways and ideas of how they could follow through on their plan. This is what unregulated AI looks like. A mother in Florida sued another chat jot uh character AI for wrongful death last year, alleging that the chatbot pulled her 14-year-old son into what she described as emotionally and sexually abusive relationship that also led to his suicide. So this is the uses that unregulated AI is happening. This is what's happening to this is affecting

our our health, mental health. This is a very much affecting children because there are no regulations on AI right now. It's common people against multibillion dollar companies. I would love to see the city council change their minds on this data center and choose to protect page as a beautiful place to visit and not support on the unuse unregulated use of AI. Thank you. [applause] We have Sharon Woodard.

Hello again. My name is Sharon Woodard. I'm an unreasonable citizen from Paige, Arizona. [applause]

I feel like while you were trying to convince us that you were sitting on fences, you were actually sitting on NDAs. It's it's accusing us online of spreading misinformation when you were gathering all the information in secret and not sharing it with the public. It feels like hypocritical behavior. I don't want to label anybody that. I want to say that behavior is not appreciated and a lot of us were insulted by what you were doing for months before any of us caught wind of what was happening. Since you're now going to be transparent according to a memo that came out, I'm wondering if you could answer the following questions. Have the a NDAs expired? If not, what date do they expire? And can you tell us tonight who will operate the data center that you're so keen on bringing to Paige? All we could find was on closed loop uh uh cooling systems is a pilot program from Microsoft down in Phoenix. A pilot, not proven effective at all yet. If you have more information, there's a lot of people that would like accurate information from our council rather than more behind closed door negotiations with a company we're not allowed to know about. We'd like you to approve the the agenda item about making a community survey or questionnaire. And I don't think that us and a lot of

other people we've spoken to are willing to wait 18 to 24 months while you get to be elected into those chairs again. We want answers in the next couple of months. We want transparency which you said you were going to give us. We are not pacified. [applause] [applause] Okay, next we have Michelle or Zia. Michelle. Hello. Do you need the address or the blue sheets good enough?

Just say your full name and the city of residence. Michelle Zia Page, Arizona.

The Oxford dictionary defines unreasonable as actions or governance not guided by or based on good sense. Unreasonable citizens are here to stay. If our city officials cannot make decisions guided by or based on good sense, we will we will use our good senses and microscopes [music] to crawl into every corner of this project. We will pursue legal action for any improper procedures of the city. We will ensure environmental studies to protect the ancestral ancestral lands of the Navajo Nation, the sacred drying and dying Colorado River, the protected public lands preserved for the enjoyment of future generations. And lest we forget the majority of the community that opposes this nightmare. Huntley and Paige, did you consider the absurdity of ramrotting this through? Considering all these seemingly uncsurmountable factors, Huntley should get out now before destroying our postcard community. The breathtaking views and experiences that support us. The sacred land, culture, and antiquities have been altered enough already. Leave us alone. If our government won't protect us, the citizenry will. Huntley thought Paige would be a good target because we are not cosmopolitan or aware or savvy enough to combat shady tactics.

Huntley chose poorly, didn't they? Yeah. [applause]

We are a tiny town, but will not go quietly. We are small but mighty. Please withdraw now and save us all the time, money, and heartache. Thank you. [applause] And next we have Shelby Staithm. Statham. Good evening. My name is Shelby Staithm. I am a resident of Paige, Arizona. And I am here today because like many of you, I am concerned about the city's [music] decision to move forward with a potential land sale uh in order to develop [music] a 500 acre data center. First, I'd like to start by reminding council of their vision statement for [music] the city of Paige outlined in their strategic priorities for fiscal years 2025 through 2027. Specifically, a bullet point under values. [music] These are the things that the city of Paige is supposedly committed to. They're accountability, transparency, and proactive [music] communication. [snorts] How exactly does signing a non-disclosure agreement promote accountability, transparency, [music] and proactive communication? [applause] The assertion that public officials or municipalities signing NDAs is standard administrative practice is baloney. Any city official who cares about public transparency would refrain from signing a non-disclosure agreement to avoid the appearance of impropriy. Non-disclosure agreements are written for the privilege of secrecy, not transparency. [music] I'd also like to remind council of a section in the code of ethics that they voted to eliminate last year under section 1C, conduct of members. The professional and personal conduct of members must be above reproach and avoid even the appearance of impropriy. Members shall refrain from abusive

conduct, personal charges, or verbal attacks upon the character or motives of other members of the council, commissions, boards, committees, staff, and the public. The mayor of Rapage has referred to concerned residents as unreasonable citizens, and that sounds like an attack upon the character of members of the public to me. [applause] While members of the council

you on the spot, isn't it? While members of the council have stated that the data center's water use will be net zero, I have yet to see that in [music] writing. There is no mention of it in the ordinance passed last October. Perhaps they can't discuss the specific details [music] of the project's energy and water use because it's subject to the non-disclosure agreement. How can we trust the city of Paige to be transparent moving forward when they've agreed [music] to protecting developers and tech companies by limiting discussion and offering us crumbs of information? Unreasonable. Mayor Kidman, really, you haven't seen unreasonable yet. That's right. Thank you. [applause]

We have Megan Brown. Hi. Um, I'm Megan. I'm a new neighbor. Um, I really enjoyed listening to everyone's um, points and so much I agree with and I have something that's just slightly different. I just want to say that I don't know if you if anyone has kind of extended this type of invitation. I think that um you know a lot of us have heard about data centers for the first time here and we get it's very easy to kind of get stuck in our role to play in this whole interaction of what's happening. Um whether that's you know it can get very combative whether that's us so-called unreasonable citizens or those that work for the city and that have been approached by the data center. But from our perspective, you know, we hear about it, we go and do this research and we look at communities where this has come in, you [snorts] know, whereas from your perspective, you're hearing from a developer, they they're telling you these um these promises and these um you know, things about how it's going to be so great. And so when you when you come at it from that perspective, it's very easy to maybe fall for those things. But when you come out at it from the perspective of [music] looking at what's already happened, you you can see so this is what I want to invite you to do is to look into these where it's already rolled out and to see that is it's a you know like the NA the NDA is a standard procedure. Well, this is all a standard playbook and it all involves a lot of big promises and it involves a lot of disappointments that they can see after the fact. So my invitation to you all is to really look into this um you know not from just what the developer has to

promise but what other communities have already watched happen um around them and if they could go back in time what would they say [music] um and so that's what I want to invite is that maybe you could consider the fact that perhaps you made a mistake um and and it can be it can be undone before it's too late and I think a lot of us would really welcome that and really appreciate it. Um and you know we could move forward in community. So that's all I have [applause] and we have Mike Charles.

Thank you Mike Charles. I have a home in Green Haven and I also reside in Brian Head, Utah. The one key thing you missed with Mr. David Auggie was he's a great golfer and he was a joy [laughter] a joy to golf with.

Shady Tactics has been used multiple times tonight and that's appropriate for me being here. Frank, I think this would fall under your responsibility. I'll leave my email address. I would like to file a formal complaint against attorney Joshua Smith for his shady tactic business practices. Multiple times he has reached out to my employer. He's doubled down multiple times. He has he and PUE has involved sheriff's [music] departments in a civil matter trying to use them as a bully tactic which violates two state and two federal laws. I'm fairly new to town. If the media is here, please get with me because we've only touched a tip of the iceberg. I wasn't as prepared as these folks. Congratulations on being very organized. But Frank, I would appreciate it if you would email me of the form. I'm sure there's an official form to file a complaint against Joshua Smith. He's turned down appointments with Mayor Kidman and I on May 10th and he just likes to lob threatening, aggravating emails to my employer. And I think you guys are his employer. So thank you. [applause] Okay, we will move to item number 52 because I already did my reading for city manager current event summary.

Do you have anything for us? Thank you, mayor, members of council. Well, first I want to uh thank you as this is my first official city council meeting. What a warm welcome from everybody. So, uh and I mean that sincerely. I do. Um not too many announcements. Just the the first one concerns our our police department. I'd like to to brag a little bit on on behalf of the police department. We had a dispatch uh position open up and we had 44 candidates test for that position. So that shows uh how good a job the police department's doing recruiting and and uh just just proud that we had so many people turn out and want to contribute to our community and and serve in that respect. So, I know we can only pick one out of those 44, but I wanted to thank everyone for their participation and coming out. And second, um being new here, we're still working on a lot of project updates. So, we'll be putting out emails and that sort of thing with with updates, but I wanted to specifically talk about u an update that we just launched probably 10 minutes before this meeting. So, and it's maybe a little timely. Uh, we've launched a frequently asked questions section on our web page concerning the data center of what we have to this point staff-wise. Um, including maybe some introductions for those that aren't too familiar with data centers. I know there's a lot of education been gone on here, but we'll have that page with some questions. the ordinance that was the land sale contract is directly linked to this page so people can look at it for themselves without having to do a records request or something like that.

And we have a a way on this page to also ask questions or maybe suggestions of things to be put on here to add to it. And I even took some notes from tonight of of maybe some additions. So, as we get moving forward through the process, uh, we'll put on their calendar of events, uh, opportunities for more public comment, uh, when more votes and changes will come up. And we hope it is a a good vehicle to provide communication that's easily accessible to the public. So, thank you so much. Thank you.

Okay. Item number 61, council leaison reports. It's been a while since we had our regular meeting. Has there is there any reports from council members on board meetings? We'll start with you, councelor Hinger.

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh the parks and recreation advisory board started the year off on January 5th with a meeting. Um, so one of the things that I wanted to highlight is that the city clerk and city attorney Cindy and Josh gave a training presentation to the board reviewing responsibilities about uh, sorry, responsibilities, open meeting law and resources available to our board members um, that will be rolling out to the rest of the boards. But it was amazing and I just want to thank them for the time they put together to um, help us all better understand what our roles are and um, where they can get more information. I thought it was great. The recreation department is doing an amazing job with all the activities they have going on. And then um one of the exciting things that they're working on is opening up the paracub so that people can use that space. Um so they are moving very fast and furiously to get that done. Um and excited to see that to continue to come forward.

Thank you. Any others done this way? Councelor Rantry. No. Uh, our meeting's tomorrow night, so I won't have a report until the next one.

Um, Page Utility Enterprises Board had their meeting last night, which I attended. Um, the federal government shutdown at the end of last year kind of stalled for a brief time. Our efforts on the water the water straw project, but things are moving again. We're excited. Um, with the Army Corps of Engineers and with the Great American Outdoor Act, um, they're the the right people are working on it in many different departments and so we're excited about that and the the reports from the utility enterprises is that it's a healthy healthy entity in the city and so that's very good. Any others? Okay. Um item number 62, economic development advisory board appointment for Brigham Adams. I make a motion that we appoint Brig Adams to the economic development board.

Second. I have a motion from councelor Roundree and a second from councelor Prowler. That was Prowler. Okay. All in favor say I. I. I. Did you? Did I hear you, Councelor Hammond? Yes. I Okay. Thank you. Um, item number 62, substance abuse task force force a board appointment of Brianna Vega. Do I have a motion? A motion to appoint Brianna Vega to a three-year term to the substance abuse task force. Do I have a second? Second. I

have a motion from councelor Pller, a second from councelor Pharaoh. All in favor say I. I. I I think that was a two-year term, correct? Oh, I'm sorry. Two and a half. Yeah. June 30th. Do we need to redo the motion?

Since he said three year, is it tell till tell the expiration date? Okay. Thank you to both of those citizens for applying for these positions on the boards. We need we appreciate their help. Um, item number 71, Northern Arizona Council of Government's Niko Microransit presentation. And we have two blue cards that were Are they going to Are you is Melissa and Camila? Camila going to address us first before the presentation or after? First. Okay.

Good evening, Mayor Kidman and city council members. Thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight. My name is Melissa Cerventi and I'm here to express my strong support [music] for a continued and expanded investment in public transportation in our community. In rural areas like ours, public transit is not a luxury, it's a lifeline. Reliable transportation helps our residents get to work, attend medical appointments, buy groceries, and remain independent as they age. For many families, seniors, people with disabilities especially, and workers without reliable vehicles, transit's the difference between participation and isolation. As someone who has spent my entire career in healthcare, I've seen firsthand how transportation access directly affects health outcomes, employment stability, and overall quality of life. Missed appointments, delayed care, and job instability often stem from transportation barriers. Investing in transit also makes sound economic sense. It supports our local workforce. It helps employers retain staff, reduces emergency service utilization, and keeps dollars circulating locally. Thoughtful transit planning strengthens the entire community, residents, businesses, and visitors alike. I also want to recognize that rural transit solutions don't always have to mirror large urban settings. Flexible routes, demand response services, partnerships with healthcare and employers, and phase growth allow us to build a system that fits our community size and resources while remaining fiscally responsible. Todd Morris will be presenting tonight from NACOG and I've had the distinct honor of getting to work with him as he's worked to know our community and take interest into um all of the current

needs of our community residents. I appreciate the council's willingness to consider transit improvements and to listen to community voices. I encourage you to continue moving forward with solutions that are practical practical, excuse me, sustainable and centered on the real needs of our residents. Thank you for your time, your service, and your commitment to keeping our community connected. [music] Thank you and Camila Adams.

Thank you, council members. Mayor Kidman, um I'm happy that you took my blue card even though I was late. Um but I appreciate the opportunity to speak. I like Melissa come from a healthc care background as well. So um I'm here to speak on the transportation uh that will be the transportation presentation that will be given [music] uh by Nikk. Um in a rural community like ours, transportation is often more complicated than people realize. uh distances are long, services are spread out, and [music] affect a fixed route system doesn't always fit, but the need is still there. People need to get to work, get to medical appointments, run errands, stay connected, especially seniors, people with disabilities, and those without reliable vehicles, and Melissa [music] spoke to that. Uh not long ago, I picked up a couple of neighbors um that I didn't know who needed a ride to the airport. That's what they told me. Um what started as a I shouldn't have done that really. I realized later, [music] but what started as a simple favor turned into several stops along the way. Um, and before I knew, I had been all through uh, Paige. I admittedly was a little unnerved by the end and I actually texted my teenage son and said, "Hey, if I don't make it home, this is my location. Please start tracking me." And him and his buddy, of course, they were super excited to take that challenge on. So, they did. And they thought they were the heroes when they saved me from uh, what was going to happen to me. But anyway, I picked up these people. I didn't know they all they needed was a ride to Page Airport. Sure, no problem. Jump in. Um, but then it was several stops because, oh, it's my day off and I really need to pick this up and this up and this up and then can you take me here? And so I that's why I became unnerved. I didn't know what I had signed myself up for. Um, but this story is [music] an example of what makes our community special, right? that I I felt safe in the moment to pick these people up and then it's it's this whole neighbors helping neighbors, right? But it's not a transportation

system and it's not something that people can rely on dayto-day. [music] Um who knows if someone else would make that same choice and pick them up. But transportation plays a big role um in all of these things [music] that we've talked about with healthcare, also with our tourism. Visitors want to explore the area. Limited mobility options, parking challenges can create congestion and frustration for [music] residents and for visitors alike. Transportation is a large barrier, as we said, in patients receiving necessary medical care, attending appointments, picking up prescriptions, everyday tasks like grocery shopping for fresh food. Um, some of my staff at Canyands are involved in some of these activities because our residents aren't able to do it for themselves [music] for lack of transportation. That is why I'm here to support flexible ondemand transportation [music] because it makes sense for a rural community like ours. It can respond to real needs, support people with disabilities, [music] adjust for seasonal tourism, and serve residents and visitors without trying to force an urban model into a rural setting. So, I appreciate your willingness to explore innovative solutions and I look forward to hearing Todd's [music] presentation um and his walkth through on how an ondemand transportation [music] service could help page.

Thank you. Okay, Todd Morris from Nikhog. That's if was that correct?

Thank you. Yes. Yes. And I believe we have a slide deck here. Um, good evening and and thanks to the the the members of the public that uh offered to speak on this topic. Uh, Todd Morris, transportation planner with Nikk. I spoke with this group uh back in September and I know we've had many conversations since since then and so excited to be back here. I will say that this presentation I will give a caveat that was 45 minutes long two weeks ago. We're trying to cram that into about 10 minutes now. So, uh, there's a lot of information. We'll see if I kind of cherrypick the right information uh, to share with council today. So overall, we have these four goals we're trying to accomplish within within tonight's presentation, not necessarily in any order, but we do want to talk a little bit more about why we think Paige trans uh uh transit matters in Paige and how we've identified some of that through our planning process. We also want to propose this new transit solution um as well as the opportunity to align it with a very timely funding opportunity through the Federal Transit Association. Really important piece of this is we do want to break down the silos. Um, we have quality connection staff here. Um, they're actually the ones that are going to be ultimately providing [music] the service and so we're excited for a chance to have an opportunity to break down those silos. And then finally, we do have an ask. Uh, we recognize that this ask isn't necessarily part of the formal budget process tonight, [music] but we do hope that this presentation uh kind of allows it to get to that point. Um, and so with that, I do want to take an opportunity focusing on the breaking down the silos to introduce Armando uh from Quality Connections.

Thanks, Todd. Council Mayor, thank you for having me. Thanks for the opportunity. My name is Armando Bernescone. I serve as the CEO of Quality Connections. QC was incorporated in 1999 in our living room uh in Flagstaff. Um my roommate Ben, my college roommate Ben had cerebal palsy. He required total care. Um I was his attendant. Uh Ben [music] wanted two things in life. He wanted a job and he wanted a girlfriend. Um, I made it my life's mission to help him find that job. Um, he found the girlfriend on his own. Um, but in that process of providing employment services and attending care services [music] to Ben, we started our first social enterprise, qoff.org, which is an e-commerce site selling office supplies, much like Staples [music] and Office Max. Ben was our web master. Um, he was terribly slow, terribly inaccurate, but he had a job. Um, that was our first uh social enterprise. Since then, we've grown to um employ about 260 staff and serve [music] about 400 families across Northern Arizona from Prescat to Williams and now Paige. Um in that process during the pandemic, we started our second social enterprise uh Evergreen Academy preschool [music] after our staff couldn't go to school uh come to work because they lost their uh child care. So, our two social enterprises grew. Um, our in-home services grew, our uh, group home programs grew, our employment programs grew. Um, [music] and then October of 2024 came and we got notice from the state saying that there [music] was an opportunity in Paige to take over the helping hands agency um, which lost its contract. So, we threw our hat in the ring. Um, we were interviewed, we were put through the rigorous process of becoming eligible. uh we were interviewed by the state and the families and we were selected and we were told primarily that uh they were

interested in our social enterprises to bring those to page. Um so we've been in the process in the last year actually January a year ago this month um we came to Flagstaff we took over we transitioned about 60 100% of the staff which is about 60 of them uh 100% of our members transitioned [music] over to us we had about 10 locations licenses DHS inspections all that stuff um it was uh a mad dash to the finish line [clears throat] I'm happy to announce that we completed that transition. During that transition, I got to step back a second um and talk about our our experience with transit and AOT. Uh we are very familiar with the 5310 program [music] which is very different from the 5311 program which we're here to talk about tonight. Um the 5310 program we manage in Flagstaff. We have routes [music] going to Williams and and Kacina Village and uh Dhoni Park, managing a fleet of 17 uh vehicles. Um in that process of uh transitioning into Paige, we found out about this 5311 program. We didn't know anything about this 5311 program. So what I did is I reached out to experts who know all about 5311's [music] programs. Um an a gentleman by the name of Jeff Malbeck who sat on our board decades ago. uh he actually created the mountain line service in Flagstaff. He took it from a county department to a nationally recognized award-winning service um which is a wonderful service in the Flagstaff area. So I asked Jeff, "What is a 5311? How do we do this?" And he said, "Let's put together a team." So we got our CFO, our COO, um and then we reached out and connected with Todd from NOG knowing that he's the transit guru. Um, we put our heads together and we started listing [music] out what we need

to do. Um, we started envisioning the future of what could be in Paige. Um, and it was a [music] really pretty picture and I think uh I think that that that that vision is an ongoing uh work. Um, but what happened is that um we identified all their needs and we found out that we do not have a match partner in page. Um, so that's what we're here today um to ask for is to become a partner with the [music] city of Paige to develop and create this um exciting opportunity that we have in front of us. Thank you.

All righty. Thanks, Armano. That was a brief intermission there um or break. So jumping back into NICOG and the work that we're doing in terms of looking at service planning, we're contacted by ADOT to conduct a five-year analysis for the greater Page region. That's what this kind of column on the left shows. Uh we're in this process of sort of living in the house uh while we're building it, recognizing the status of the transition between helping hands and quality connections. The local service was very much in need of a major overhaul. And so that's where we kind of shifted this second column. uh you know we're we're really emphasizing a lot of our energy into you know reinvisioning this local service and that's where tonight's presentation is really important as it does align with this 5311 application which is actually due in a month and so these conversations are all all very very timely. Um, as Armando mentioned, you know, part of the proposal that we do have is working continuing to work with the city staff on actually some of the specific service uh uh modifications. And we'll kind of talk about that a little bit, but uh we're here to get today to kind of present this overall vision. And so, um, I'm going to jump around in some slides, but a big piece here I just want to reference is that, you know, through this, uh, federal grant program, it only comes out every two years. So, if we do not take advantage of the opportunity today um and within this grant application, we won't be making any sort of uh major changes locally until 2028, which we don't uh we don't think is we do do not recommend [music] that approach. Um jumping into why all this matters, uh we conducted a survey this fall. Uh we had a goal of 300 respondents. We got 303. So, we're happy about that. Um and overall, we found that there's definitely a need and definitely an interest [music] in transit. 93% of survey takers indicate it's important to have for page to have it. Seven and 10 said the overall need is high or very high. Um 60% said that they would directly use the system where we had another 20 that that outright said they would not use the system. And I think what's important there is there's another 20% um that is unsure. And so that's part of what we baked into our proposal um is looking at that high need to educate and kind of market and

sort of travel train the public into being able to utilize the service. And so we're excited about that opportunity. And then trip purpose. It was pretty evenly distributed in terms of how people [music] saw themselves using uh public transit. Uh I also interviewed uh many key stakeholders within the community. I won't spend too much time here other than emphasizing this get out of silos approach that I heard. Uh interest in looking at [music] technology solutions. Um focusing on advertising as a component for this transit system and then utilizing the data uh from the service to be able to inform kind of future planning. Um, we also checked our approach against the or we actually used the general plan to inform our approach and recognized that the the general plan also talks about flexible models uh leveraging federal funding and then looking at again technology and partnership [music] driven solutions. So, we feel like we're on the right track. Uh, this slide here kind of represents some service [music] parameters and guidelines that we identified. Uh, number one is as we kind of mentioned, we absolutely have to start a new with local service. uh the service needs to um be available to all. We very much need to get away from this perception of the service being available only to individuals with disabilities. Uh we need to make it a very uh reliable and convenient service that that kind of embodies and reflects uh the community support that we've seen behind it. Uh it needs to grow sustainably. I think there's a lot of ideas and needs. There's a lot of needs and ideas uh and so we need to make sure we're kind of very strategically stacking [music] those those solutions when it comes to transportation. uh Paige is a hard place to run transit out of. So if there's opportunities to uh find some supports, [music] we should definitely take advantage of that. Um and then capitalize on this opportunity for innovation. Uh not only do we think that there's [music] a lot of new uh uh uh opportunities within transit delivery models, we also feel like again we have a very strong starting point where there's this $600,000 that has traditionally come to the page region through helping hands and then quality connections. um everything that we do this is the N this is Nikko's primary uh objective within this entire process is

to make sure these these dollars stay within the page region and that's where this application and this discussion about a page partnership is so important. Um the because if if uh these funds are not this is a very competitive program across the state and so we use this graphic to demonstrate the supply versus demand of these federal funds. um if these fund if that 600 if parts of that 600,000 were to go away to different communities it'd be very very hard to get that back and I that's something I echoed back in September. So what are we actually proposing? Uh quality connections as Arando stated do they do have solid contracts in place uh to be able to sustain their long-distance routes. Um you can see on the left here where they have routes that go down to Tuba City as well as to Shanto in the morning and the evening. Um, we're proposing that those uh services essentially remain the same for this initial kind of two-year uh uh period. What we are looking at is then the local services [music] and you can see here that the series of routes that they used to have that that that included uh service on the mesa as well as out to [music] uh WIP, Green Haven, and Lee. These are areas that we would essentially propose kind of wiping these lines off the map. Uh removing the fixed route component and jumping in with a microtransit solution. Um I introduced this back in September. Microtransit is kind of like thinking about an Uber [music] or a Lyft with the shared ride component. And so it really is kind of uh a really very tech-savvy approach. Um and one we we feel like is is gaining ground in rural you in rural America. An important piece that we really did uh some of the findings we had from our surveys as well as our interviews is this need for individuals that don't have smartphones to still be able to access the system. Uh so there's a call center that's also associated with these solutions where you can call in and hail a ride. What's important about this is the data that we're able to um uh collect as a as a function of this system. We're able to constantly monitor and kind of improve and iterate on the service parameters. Uh I think a big piece here and we see within page with the seasonal variability, we're able to kind of match that uh demand and supply with what we're actually seeing. Um fixed routes

are based on that route being there at the exact time every day no matter what. [music] This allows us to be a lot more dynamic in how we approach that. Um and then lastly at the bottom right here you can kind of see this this these uh uh scatter plots or this uh origin and destination data. Um I that's very important when we start looking at other modes and how can we look at kind of building demands along certain corridors that maybe [music] would would allow us to shift models down the line. I know that the city has been in considerations with the trolleys. Uh we strongly propose uh looking at the data to inform the role of those trolleys. [music] um our expertise has indicate has has identified that um the Charlie's may have a limited uh capacity in terms of the overall need that they're trying to be able to serve and so making sure that we're using the data to really program exactly how they can do a job and do it well I think is something we would absolutely propose [music] within this solution and we think the microtransit feeds into that quite well. Um so what we're proposing essentially is looking at uh quality connections again they are the 5311 recipient um they would uh through this partnership uh kind of continuing that role uh and they would actually look at go and contracting out services. There's been a lot of work that Nikk's done and identified a lot of growth in this contracted service model that allows us to get vehicles um as well as drivers and an entire uh model to come in relatively quickly uh to start up service. And the baseline level we're talking about is about a three vehicle service area. Um we we've kind of struggled with how we wanted to communicate what that overall service looks like. Three vehicles or two and a half full-time drivers is the overall kind of coverage that we've been looking at within page. And we believe that's sufficient given the existing kind of service parameters [music] that we've seen and and its comparison with other peer communities of of similar nature. Uh again quality connections would focus on this quality control component. And we really want to highlight this last item at the bottom which is this [music] tra uh page transit ambassador. I think this is something that's been lacking in this community considerably and I think there's a tremendous opportunity again to help be this liaison between the community and the transit service as

well as the city and the transit service and that's a role uh that we would have quality connections filling uh in this proposed solution. Uh we wanted to show this exact uh as just an example of the work that we hope to do with city staff in terms of uh uh defining exactly what these service zones would look like. Uh we didn't want to bring those into this uh conversation yet. We want to work with you guys to figure out exactly where these [music] uh service parameters should fit. Um, I'm going to skip over the contracted service other than recognize that Nikko has really done a ton of work in this area and we're really quite impressed by what's available in terms of a quality of service and overall [music] cost as well as seeing that there's a lot of growth happening within Arizona itself with this contracted uh microtransit [music] model as we've seen a lot of communities and they're getting kind of smaller and smaller. They're making their way into smaller smaller communities uh that we think Paige would fit those parameters. So, um, jumping back into again we think the timing is now. uh we don't want to wait till 2028. We really advise against that. We don't know if there this federal funding will be there if we waited that long. Um [music] so this is kind of the overall solution or proposal that we do have. Again, that baseline microtransit service within the the local [music] page community. Um Quality Connections would continue to run those daily routes to Shanto, uh Kyau, and Tuba City. And then uh again, Quality Connections would really serve in this position of a transit ambassador uh and really focus on [music] kind of promotion um and and customer access and customer relations to the transit system. The pigraph here represents a million dollar roughly a million dollar budget and the proposed uh partners that we see as you can see here that 5311 grant we would propose them asking for about 630,000. Um these other components are the quality connections contracts would support which [music] would directly support those long-distance routes as well as the page transit ambassador. Um but the local service isn't [music] is would be entirely dependent on the city of PA's contributions here. Um quick note on the fairs. I think that's another point that we would really like to discuss with the city moving forward how we'd want to structure that fair [music] policy, but

it has a lot of limitations in terms of how it's associated with the federal grant source. So it's kind of a sort of a caveat thing that it's a it's a loaded topic there. Um, looking at other communities, uh, this is an example of other NIKOG, uh, uh, uh, transit providers [music] within the NIKOG region. You can see here there's definitely some, um, anomalies. City of Sedona funds entirely almost entirely of service [music] through local contributions. I think that's a direct result of Sedona being late to the game in terms of accessing these funds. Meanwhile, Paige has been able to receive this $600,000 uh, for multiple years. So, we kind of have that kind of grandfathered in uh, advantage within that. But that's just an example of where we do feel the risk of these dollars going if if we were to not proceed with this. Uh lastly is looking at these other two communities [music] that I think are a little bit more in line with Paige in terms of the amounts. You can see your uh uh Xolo and Cottonwood [music] to the right. Um these are two of those strongest uh transit systems within the state, rural transit systems within the state. And I think I point that out because they've been able to build partnerships over time to help diversify their funding stream. Um, Cottonwood, for example, has partnerships with the city of Sedona as well as um, uh, Yavapai County, but they've that, uh, system has been operations for [music] 20 plus years. And so, we absolutely would love to kind of utilize this approach of of having this kind of seed money and and initiating service here. Would be constantly looking to diversify [music] our partnerships down the line. And so, with that, I think I do want to introduce uh, uh, Ginger with Quality Connections to kind of talk a little bit more about that page ambassador role.

Thanks, Tony. Hello everybody. [music] Um, with our commitment, Quality Connections commitment to social enterprises in partnership with the city, we can create transit that works in Paige. Uh, the grant that we've been talking about allows us to turn one local dollar into a $1.58 that um can pay for an e an easier, more convenient way to get people around town. Um, Nikhog, as you can see, is a strong planning resource. Quality Connections has transit experience and Paige leaders know their city best. So by creating a solid partnership, we can create we can form a sustainable transit system that is specific to PAGE needs. Serving as oversight for the contract, I offer 17 years [music] experience in transit, including working with contracted services such as the University of Texas me branch and the Port of Galveastston. This will serve the microtransit initiative well in the coming months. The city's involvement in branding, promoting community engagement, planning service hours, and navigating peak season is essential to fully reap the benefits of this more personalized approach to moving people and the 531 5311 grant opportunity as well. Quality Connections is committed to bringing meaningful public transit uh to Paige. By working closely with the city and N and Nikk and investing in transit, we can improve how we move around in town and strengthen our ability to go to work, to school, shop, sightsee, eat out, and see our friends. [clears throat] Thank you. I forgot to mention that as the [music] in the preparation phase, um

Jeff Malbeck and Todd helped us uh do a a national search for a transit manager. Um and we had two very specific uh needs in that [music] transit manager, somebody who knows 311 inside and out and somebody who's wellversed in working in rural America with that transit. And we were very [music] lucky and fortunate to have uh found Ginger Burgess. Um, our ask is 325. That's a huge ask. I get that. Um, I I hope that it cushions it a little bit knowing that uh 75,000 of that is [music] a onetime uh expense going to the contractor for setup. Um, moving forward, the ask will be 250 a year. Um, thank you for the opportunity. We're looking for a partnership with the city of Page [music] to meet these federal match requirements to help us design um, this high-quality transit system. It'll bolster the economy and it'll connect the [music] community. Thank you for your uh consideration.

Is that the end? Yes, that is. Any comments or questions from council members? Councelor Hinger. Thank you, Mayor. Um I had one question just to make sure I fully understand it. I think you had the slide that talked about those service hubs and there were a lot. Would the idea be that someone could get picked up at their house or would there be virtual bus stops in most neighborhoods, but maybe you would have to travel a couple houses down to get picked up?

It's it's a good question. I I do think that's something that we would um have some flexibility in being able to play. I think if we were to, you know, I think we probably propose starting out having it at uh at individual's houses, but if we, as demand grew, we might need to start seeing some clustered um neighborhood stops. Anybody else? Councel Per,

um see if I can get this into the form of a question like Jeopardy. Um [clears throat] you're saying two and a half uh driving positions. Uh, as far as jobs, um, what's the amount of, uh, staff that the helping hands operation has currently? And are there any other jobs that this would be creating other than drivers like mechanics or that um, it's a good question. I do if I I [music] the proposal or the the the the vision would certainly be that the drivers that are currently working with in helping hands running those or excuse me quality connections running that service could be hired on by this contractor and those kind of those [music] those those jobs shifted over to that. Um in terms of additional uh uh employees I'm not quite sure I could I could get back to you in terms of what that would ultimately look like. Um I'm not prepared to answer that.

Okay. But are we moving like up or down in headc count from coming coming from Alie Hands's operation? Say it's probably remaining the same. Okay. Um the the big pro that we're getting is the vehicles that are going to be coming in within this this third party. And then um you mentioned the 250,000 a year ask um recurring. How many years is are we locking that price in for until inflation or whatever takes over? It's a good question. I think that's something we'd want to work with staff on ultimately determining what that that long-term future would look like. Um I think at a minimum we would be looking at it. It's a two-year grant cycle. Okay.

Cool. Uh I think that's all the questions I have for now. Thank you. Council speed probably transit weights for no one. Uh well a bad bus does bite you. Councelor Roundree and then councelor Frell. Do we have any idea under helping hands what the annual service hours were? And then what do you propose that the possible service hour will be in the future with the the microtransit over the old system? Sure. It's it's a great question and one that is a little bit of a moving target in terms of looking at where helping hands baseline services were. Um, if we look at what they had on paper, what we what they had uh included in the grant, it was about 9 to 10,000 hours locally within these local routes a month,

uh, annual annually. The microtransit service is the the budgeted amount we're looking at is 8,000 [music] hours. So, we feel like we're in that ballpark, but a much more efficient service is what we were proposing. Councelor Farrell, and what were the previous costs that helping hands had yearly? Does it similar? I mean, I would assume that this would cost less to manage this type of a program.

It it it is Well, it's that's it's a good question. It does include vehicles as well. So, I think there's kind of a it's a fully loaded cost, so we're not separating out. There's different grants that Helping Hands was using to get vehicles. Um although they weren't necessarily getting them as regularly as we would have wished. Um so, they kind of broke things up where now we're looking at we're capturing those vehicle costs in this [music] operating component. And so that's that's that's uh where those kind of costs are are split between the two. So how many vehicles because last time she said that many vehicles were down. Are you getting new vehicles? Are you transferring vehicles over from helping hands into this program?

Yes. So the the very much the mission and the vision of this contracted service is they will bring brand new vehicles in the vehicles that we have and there's actually a slide I included here that just a a sample 60 days of what uh the first 60 days of quality connections running the service and the amount of vehicle issues that they had. Um any vehicles that that are currently in place which are dwindling significantly would be applied to those long-distance [music] routes. The vendor would come in and supply these local vehicles. They'd be new. Thank you. Does that answer that question? Councelor Frell,

thank you Todd and thank Nayco for your coming to help us. The the issue with the grant of the 627800 is that that been awarded or is waiting and is that planned and is that for a ongoing for the reoccurring that grants a recycling grant because we had challenges with the NACOG with getting their funds with all the other funding delays. So is this good to go the 6 the 627800?

So this is a competitive application. It's in a competitive application that comes around every two years. The page community being helping hands and quality connections has historically received this about $600,000 federal that's come in and that that dates back five or six years of a pretty routine, you know, pretty consistent step. Um, NICOT or excuse me, ADOT uh, usually does fund kind of those legacy programs because they don't want to necessarily look to take away service. Um, however, we're in a unique situation here with the transition. And so, um, but that'd be it's all going through ADOT. Those those dollars are, but that 600 is kind of the the goal in the parameters, but that is a competitive application that we um that they that Quality Connections is needing to draft uh to be able to kind of retain that. This is our proposed application amounts. That makes Is that answering your question?

Yes. Thank you. Any other questions or comments? Thank you very much. Did you have any other comment that you were wanting? You You were standing there for a moment wanting to No, it's okay. I was going to answer the vehicle question. I got it. Okay. Well, thank you very much. Was there any comment or question over here? Thank you, mayor. Just Todd, maybe next steps that we would look for is the applicant. Do you need any action for the application process to move forward? [music]

Yes, I I do. So, the application is due midFebruary and we and we certainly would hope to have at minimum a [music] letter of support um from the the city kind of stating that, you know, recognizing that you guys need to go through your budget process, but that this um local match request has been made and is being in consideration. Um I think that would help us in terms of that competitive uh nature of that 5311 application. Okay. So, we can uh bring something for council to consider at the next meeting on that. Good thing we're in budget season, right? Ready for that?

It's it's ve very timely. So, can I make a motion then that we direct um city staff to follow up with these individuals and bring us back a proposal, final proposal after you've looked at all of the fine print and and everything and have our legal attorney um address all of their proposals and bring it back to our nest council meeting for a final approval. Make a motion. Yeah, so that's my motion. Let's reward it. Let's make it a little

My motion is to direct um council or city of staff to um address um this proposal and bring back a final proposal for the city council to approve or disapprove at our next meeting. Do I have a second? Second. Any other further any further discussion? [clears throat] All in favor? We have a motion from councelor Roundtree, a second from councelor Hettinger. All in favor say I. I. Any opposed. Thank you. Thank you again. Thank you very much. [clears throat]

On to item number 72, ordinance 747-26, land sale to Premium Builders LLC for property adjacent to Newurn Road. This is Oh. Uh clerk, will you please read the ordinance by t is it title only? Okay.

An ordinance of the mayor and city council of the city of Paige, Cookanino County, Arizona, pertaining to the sale by negotiation of real property owned by the city of Page and approving the real agreement for the purchase of real estate real estate. Approving the agreement for the purchase of real estate. City Attorney, this is over to you. Or is there It's self-explanatory? This is

If you have any questions, I'm happy. This has kind of been uh in the works for quite a while, but uh this is a a contract to sell the land. There's three phases. It'll be sold really in there's three development phases, but really just two. So there's a first two originally will sell eight acres and then there's an option um for him to come back and purchase another four acres for a third phase later on down the road within the next two years if he desires to continue with his project after the first two phases

for the public to realize this is a housing subdivision off of Newurn Road. any com u councelor Roundtree? Um, yes. And so the contract because it's been a while since we were approved or contract, but it still contains the rights that if they don't accomplish this project that the city can come back in and take over the property if they don't meet certain deadlines and Right. Okay. Thank you. And it does require that it be a housing project, you know, residential housing and whatnot. So, and with no vacation rental options, right?

Correct. So this is [clears throat] and and what what will be happening is over the next month or maybe two months or whatever depending on how long it takes to hammer out all the details. There will be additional at least one additional agreement that will come to the city council which will probably be a development agreement that will hammer out some more details of that um where the city will be putting in some infrastructure down their roads and and city-owned infrastructure. Um the purchase agreement does kind of address that at a high level. Um but the details will come back to you in in another agreement.

Councelor Pharaoh. Move to adopt ordinance 747-26. I'll second it. We have a motion from councelor Pharaoh, a second from councelor Roundtree. All in favor say I. I. I. Any opposed? Thank you. Item number 73, land purchase agreement amendment with Kain Scott. We'll turn this over to city attorney again.

So, this is uh I guess a proposal that uh the buyer, Mr. Scott has um been working with the utilities and kind of planning a a a bowling kind of family fund center facility. Um this is located over across the street from the um public safety facility kind of in between that and the the water treatment plant area, the water tower. Um the the challenge with this piece of property, and we kind of knew this going in, was that there's no sewer that is um adjacent to that property. So, the buyer has been working with PUE um and engineers to kind of try to figure out what the best solution for that is. There's a couple of different options as to where they could run a sewer line to connect into the sewer facility, but they all kind of have pros and cons, and they're still trying to work through that. including pee. Um so the buyer the the original contract was for one year and it was and it is scheduled to um expire at the end of this month. So the buyer has asked for an extension to be able to finalize um the situation the utility situation with pee and the engineers and then finalize their funding and and come back to us. So I don't have any concerns with the request. Councelor Pharaoh.

Move to approve the amendment to the land purchase agreement with Kane Scott and authorize the mayor to sign. Second. Second. We have a motion from councelor Pharaoh, a second from councelor Hammond and councelor Pller. Amanda have it. Let Amanda have it. Okay, she's got a delay. All in favor say I. I. I.

Any opposed? Thank you. Okay, item number 81 under new business, fiscal year 2025 audit financial statement presentation. And we will turn this over to McKay Hall from Berdick. Did I say that correctly? Yes. Okay.

Good evening. I'm grateful for the opportunity to be here this evening. Um, my name is McKay Hall. I have been an audit partner with Hinton Berdick. We've actually recently gone through a change and we've merged together with another firm and there was uh, at least for me there was a big debate between which name to keep, Hinton Berdick or Squire. We decided Squire was a lot easier. I decided Squire was a lot easier to say and keep. So, but appreciate the opportunity we've had to work with the city and with your team. We'd like to express our gratitude to them. They've got plenty to do and an audit is not always the easiest thing to go through, but they were extremely amicable, very professional, and uh extremely accommodating in getting what we need in order to get through the audit. So, by way of how this presentation goes, I was thinking about my own experience when I started with Hinton Berdick, well, about 20 years ago now. And when I first started, my wife said, "What is it that you do as an auditor?" And I'd say, "Well, it's not very interesting, but I'm happy to tell you about it." And she said, "Eh." And so we went on for about 10 15 years. And then one day she said, "Actually, why don't you tell me exactly what you do?" And so I started and about two, three sentences in, she said, "You're right. It's not very interesting. I'm okay." So I'm very excited to talk about this. I know it may not be the most interesting subject, um, but hopefully I'll try not to take too long. If you do have any questions as we go through the presentation, please let me know. When we come in perform an audit, we're looking at the financial activity of the city tying it to the financial statements and we perform tests um through confirmations, analytics tying to supporting documentation through various avenues to make a determination as to whether the information in the financial statements is materially accurate. And then we issue an audit report on the financial statements after performing that test work. We're happy

to note that it's a clean opinion, an unmodified opinion for the city, which is to say that the information in the financial statements based on our test work is materially correct. And so you as a city council can take a look at that, rely upon it in your decision-making process. Along with that, there is also a report on controls uh compliance and on internal controls over financial reporting. When we perform a financial audit, we are not coming in to audit your internal controls, your processes and procedures for safeguarding the assets. But in order to make a determination as to whether or not the financial statements are correct, we do have to have an understanding of what those processes are and if they appear to be operating as designed. And then if we come across any issues with that, those are listed in summary form as material weaknesses or significant deficiencies within this report on internal controls. We're happy to note that there were no material weaknesses, no significant deficiencies noted in the course of the audit. And that is kind of a a commendable situation. Um people systems, there's usually something in there that that comes up and so for there to be known noted, I think that speaks highly of your team. the commitment that they have and the level of work that they that they work to have. So, I'd like to commend them on that as well. There's also a state compliance report that's issued as part of the financial audit that also has an unmodified or a clean opinion. And then anytime that the city has over $750,000 worth of federal funding going to a million dollars of federal funding in this next fiscal year. If it goes over that threshold, then there's also a single audit that's performed with respect to the compliance and use of federal funding. And the city did need to have a single audit this year. We're happy to note that that is also a clean opinion. Couple of key numbers to watch and keep

an eye on. I'll touch on those then I'll go through a couple of five-year trends u comparisons. So total net assets is basically the equity for the city. Um it's an important number to keep an eye on. It tells you what the it's a short way of getting a read on the financial health of the organization. If it's increasing over time that's generally a good indicator that you've got a fairly healthy stance. inflation occurs, prices go up, and so that equity, that that fund balance, that net position needs to be increasing over time. If it stays flat or decreases over time consistently, that's generally an indicator that there may be an issue that needs to be resolved and addressed. So, it's an important number to watch. At the end of fiscal year ending June 30, 2025, there were 225 million. Um, on page 19 of the financial statements, it gives some more information on that. For fiscal year 25, that was an increase of 18.2 million from the prior year for the city. That split out, you've basically got two types of activities, your governmental activities and your enterprise activities. Of that change, 15.5%, excuse me, 15.5 million of the increase came from your governmental activities and 2.7 million came from your enterprise activities. Long-term debt is another number, set of numbers to keep an eye on over time. Um, it's an important financing mechanism, but you just want to keep your fingers on on the pulse and see how it's going. The total governmental long-term liabilities for the city are 7.3 million as of June 30th, 2025. Um, of that 7.3 million which is for the governmental activities, six million of that was coming from net pension and from other post-employment benefits which are primarily running through the state programs. the total

governmental long-term liabilities decreased by 155,000 which was primarily from the changes in that net pension and OPED the other post-employment benefit numbers and those can be a little tricky to keep your arms around in some ways because um they are state programs and an actuary goes through each year runs their calculations and then sends over to the city okay this is what your liabilities are and so you don't really have a whole lot of control over that um as an as an entity, it kind of comes over to you. Okay. For the business type activities, those enterprise funds, their total liabilities, long-term liabilities were 4.3 million as of June 30th, 2025. And that included 3.6 million coming from net pension and OPED liabilities. Um there was a decrease for those enterprise funds, long-term debt of 129,000 overall. Again, mostly coming from changes in the pension and the OPED. The five-year trends, just to take a look at, this is your general fund balance sheet. It's the main operating fund of the city, kind of the catchall. It's reported on what's called a modified acrruel basis, which means that there are no capital assets or long-term debts included in the general fund balance sheet. This has got a pretty healthy trend going. It's if this were a map, it would be a northeasterly direction and so it is increasing over time, which is good. Um the general fund is ultimately meant to break even over time. City closes down, you don't want to have a big fund balance, but nobody's expecting the city to close anytime soon. And so you do want to make sure that you have the resources there to be able to meet your needs, any surprises or shocks. Uh the red line across the bottom are the liabilities tending to be payroll liabilities uh accounts payable and those sorts of things. And over the five years those have remained

reasonably consistent uh which is a good trend allowing the resources to meet your needs and and obligations to increase in the general fund. The revenues and expenses over time that blue line across the top is the revenues. The red line across the bottom are the expenditures. And so that tends to indicate a pretty healthy financial trend for the city. Horseshoe Bend um because it is a large source of revenue for the city. It is one of the major funds for the city. And so we take a look that blue line across the top are the revenues. The red line across the bottom are the expenses. And so that gives you an idea of the uh operating margins that are coming from it. It opened in 2019. the revenue being generated from that fund increased pretty quickly. It took a bit of a dip in 2020 when the pandemic hit. But as things began to open up, you can see over the last five years, it's generally been trending upward. Um, from 2023 to 2024, it was pretty consistent. It's come down a little bit in 25, but some fluctuation is expected. That's tied in so closely to tourism. Depending on what's happening there, you may not have a whole lot of control over it as the city. So, a little bit of fluctuation is not typically something to get too excited or worried about. Looking at three of your major enterprise funds, your electric fund, your water fund, and your sewer fund. Next, um, for the revenues and the expenditures, this is the electric fund. The red line are the expenses. The blue line are the revenues. As an enterprise fund, it is much more business-like in nature. Um, while it's still not meant to gather profits necessarily, it does need to have a healthy operating margin because it's got infrastructure that ages out over time and will need to be replaced and those tend to be large capital investments. And so your enterprise funds need to keep uh a

healthy margin in the operations in order to gather those resources. In three of the last five years, the expenditures did exceed the revenues. Generally, a year or two where expenditures are in excess of your revenues is not necessarily a bad thing. That happens sometimes. And if you've got a bit of resources that have been built up, it's generally not a big thing. If it's a continuing trend over time, then you want to typically take a look and see what's happening and see what you can do to either increase the revenues or decrease the expenses. Yes.

Can I ask a quick question? I think you mentioned that the general fund doesn't include like the capital expenses. With something like the electric fund, would that include big capital projects in these numbers or revenue and expenditures are just like the baseline regular stuff?

No, that's a good question. In the enterprise funds, it is a lot more like normal business type full acrruel accounting. And so capital expenditures, that's the funny thing. In modified acrruel capital expenditures are reported as expenditures because the cash flows out. In enterprise funds they are not. So for example let's take 25 for example. Revenue is 12.6 million. Operating revenues are 12.6 million. Operating expenses are 10 a.5 million. if they had a $24 million capital project in 25, it wouldn't show up here because that would go on to the balance sheet and not be reported in these types of funds as an expense. So, thank you.

That's a very important thing to keep an eye on as well. The big spike in 2023 was due to just the cost of power took a huge increase.

One month bill of $4 million, that's what caused that. It was it [snorts] was excessive and extremely unusual but it was pretty consistent for everybody. There was a large that year there was a large increase in power overall. So uh it was not unusual for municipalities and with increases in rates and decreases in the cost of the electricity. Uh the last two years have been a much better situation where there has been an operating profit in the electric fund in the water fund. In three of the last five years, the revenues did exceed the expenditures. In fiscal year 24, it was pretty close to break even. And this year, the expenditure expenditures did actually exceed the revenues a bit. Uh, as I mentioned earlier, that in one or two years may not be a big issue, but it is something to keep an eye on. And if it appears to be an ongoing trend, then you want to look at your revenues and expenses and see what you can do about it. Same sort of trend with the sewer fund. In three of the last five years, the revenues exceeded the expenses. Um, [snorts] last year was pretty close to break even and then there was a little bit of it uh excess expense this year over the revenues. Okay. I know that it's the most exciting presentation of the year, but are there any other questions?

Councelor Frell, I'd just like to make a comment. I thank Linda and her team for the hard work they do day after day after week after week after month. Thank you, Councelor Roundry.

I would like to make a comment. I mean, we've some of us have just been on the council for a year and um I would have to say that finance has truly impressed me in how you function and accuracy and and commitment to the city citizens and this and the job that you do that is very boring to me. I've done it for a lot of years for the animal hospital and I hated it and I'm so glad I don't have to do it anymore. So, I also want to say thank you and how impressed I've as I've watched you guys work this last year. Thank you.

And I would like to add along with um what's been said towards Linda to add Katherine from the PUE finance department. It takes takes both to do as well as you do and it does. So, any other comments or questions? Thank you very much.

Thank you very much. Have a good night. Item number 82, short-term rental licensing, city attorney. This is an item that um I believe councelor Roundtree had had requested to be brought back to the um council for a um formal it was a old future potential future agenda item that got approved. So, this is coming back um on the agenda as a result of that. Um in 2023, I believe it was, we did have some discussions uh or the city council had had quite a few discussions about a short-term rental licensing program. Uh the legislature had just approved it that year. Prior to the change in the law, we weren't really allowed to do licenses uh for short-term rentals. um that changed in 2023. So we are the the law does allow us to to to require licenses. It's primarily tied to um you know health and safety type issues that we can regulate and ensure that they're complying with. So what I did was I took the last draft of potential regulations um that the council at that time had pretty much given the green light. It was never formally adopted but um but it was there was a lot of um support for this version um that I that I attached. So really, I just kind of wanted to bring it back tonight because the council had directed that and start a discussion as to where you want to go. If you want to use the old template and and maybe put some little tweaks in it if you want or go a totally different

direction entirely, it's up to you. One of the one of the things that kind of that we got bogged down in last time was um adopting a fee for the license and what that fee would be. It's um state law caps that you know we we we can't charge more than I I think it's $250. I can't remember what it is. Um and we would have to go through the formal fee adoption process to justify whatever fee we establish. Um in order to do that, we kind of need to know which department this is housed in, which employees, you know, how much money they what their salaries and benefits cost us and how much time they're going to spend on this, any software that we would need. And so that's what would go into establishing the fee. So once we kind of have an idea of what the program would look like, then we can start the the fee adoption process um because we'll need to know what resources will be required to operate the program in order to establish the fee. Anybody have any questions?

I have several, but we'll let whoever else starts first. Councelor Hinger and then councelor Roundtree. I have one and hopefully it's not too complex. Um, currently the city has a vacation home rental business registration versus a business license. Can you super high level talk to me like I'm 5 years old like what's the difference between the two? What would this add that we don't currently have under the business registration?

So just in general terms and this goes for this would be true for a business license versus a business registration. We don't have a business license program. We have a business registration program. A registration is something that we simply take information for someone and register that information. There's no discretion. We can't deny it. Um so they give us the information, we note it. Thank you. Um a license is a little bit different. It's where the the city is actually giving somebody permission to do something and so they have to meet certain standards and we have the discretion to deny the license. We do under the law have to have a a process and procedure whereby if we deny a license someone can appeal that. So that would go into this. It's a little bit more complex program to run a license than a registration.

Thank you. That helps.

So what's the benefits as citizens or for the city between the two options? So, with a with a license and the the idea of the short-term rental license and when the the legislature passed this, the benefit is that the city, depending on which side of the fence you're on, this could be a benefit or a detriment, but the benefit is that the city can regulate certain things through a license and say, "Yay, verily, you have to do X, Y, and Z in order for us to give you permission to operate here." Now, in the in the context of the short-term rental license, um we can't we can't cap numbers and do those kinds of things. What we can do, and what's in here, is we can require notice to neighbors, for example, that you're going to operate. They don't get to say no or object. You just have to notify them. we can require that they provide us with an emergency contact that's local so that if we have an issue at a at a at a house that's a short-term rental, there's somebody that has to be in page that has to be able to respond within 60 minutes if there's an issue. um we can require for example through a license um if they have a swimming pool that they have to meet certain code provisions to ensure that there's safety measures around that pool for children and those kinds of things. Um we can also regulate um certain things about uses where so in this for example we prohi the the draft we prohibit um special events. So you can't have a v you can only use a vacation rental essentially as a place where you know you're going to sleep and and hang out together but you can't throw a big giant party at one um and be a nuisance. you can't engage in sexually oriented business activities in a a short-term rental. And so that's what the license allows us to do is to put some of those

stipulations and say, "Yay, Verily, you can't do these things um as as a condition of us granting you a license,

council." So, um I know so this whole vacation rental years ago in the early 20s was one of the the things that I took on and and council eventually approved allowing vacation rentals because they were going to deny them for the city of Paige and they started out I think back then with a lot of good regulations for them but then because of the state of Arizona and what they did didn't matter anymore and so [clears throat] vacation rentals became a little crazy not safe. Um, not licensed, you know, people aren't paying their sales tax. But one of my largest concerns about vacation rentals is after attending almost 20 hours of human trafficking training in the last year and a half um is the state of Arizona has placed regulations on motel and hotels. And so all motel and hotels have to um get licenses and identification and all of their employees have to be trained for human trafficking. And so human trafficking in the state of Arizona has now left motel and hotels because they can be held accountable for um overlooking those activities if they become aware of them and they've switched into vacation rentals. And so I'm aware that we have concerns, you know, even for Paige for our vacation rentals. And so for our neighborhoods, um, can we make part of it requirements that, um, in some states that I've stated vacation rentals, there has to be a sign posted that that home is a vacation rental. That way, neighbors and people going by can watch for activity that they're concerned about. So, can that be part of the licensing requiring the home is clearly identified with a license in the window from the city of P?

I think we could. Um, we do require I'm sorry, but point of order. This the the purpose of this portion of the agenda is to decide whether or not we're going to discuss this in a meeting. I feel like we've into actually discussing the topic without agreeing to discuss it. Again, I think that the whole rule that we have to bring topics ahead of time and vote on whether or not we're going to talk about it is silly and we should do away with that. Amanda, but it's on the agenda. It's on the agenda. It's not on the potential future agenda item. It's under it's under new business. Sorry, that was I probably confused you because I mentioned that that's how it got here. Um was it used to be a potential future agenda item, now it is an agenda item tonight. Um I think in our last meeting you guys voted. So um

thanks for clarifying.

Yeah, we do we do in this uh and this is common through the other license requirements in other cities. We do require that they post some things inside of the house for example to for the benefit of the people that are staying there. So, you would have to post the emergency contact information if somebody has an emergency inside. I I I believe I haven't seen that in the other regulations that I've looked at. Um, but I believe that we could require some type of a you know, like you say in the window or something that they have to and maybe it's part of the registration quite frankly or the license. when they come in and get a license, we give them a sticker that they have to stick on, you know, the a front-facing window or something so that we can see that it's that it's licensed and that it's current. Um, so yeah, we could do something like that.

Yeah. So, because I've been talking with Aaronib and their representative and they say it's becoming really common um and that they're requiring, you know, identification and and they had a lot of different ideas that they do and they now I think VRBO actually also has um a link that you can post and that you can share and that the I think um um the police possibly have it, but um you can share it with your communities to where you can call these um um numbers if you believe that um human trafficking is going on. And so she says that they encourage and she shared that link with me and it's something that we could share with the community and encourage people to use. And then the other one was parking because some of these vacation rentals I know people have called me and I've driven by the examples they've shared with me. One home I think I took a picture had seven vehicles parked up on the grass and in the driveway in the yards. Um, and so we're able to control. So that looks more like a normal neighborhood instead of the entire front yard consisting of parking or

so the parking wouldn't actually be regulated through the license. We already have parking regulations. Um, I I don't believe, you know, my opinion would be that we can't treat vacation rental parking any differently than we treat any other parking in that neighborhood. So they can park on the street because the neighbors can. So, our parking regulations in the neighborhoods would have to apply to everybody equally, but we do have parking regulations for all of our residences and you can't park on the grass. You can't, it has to be a hard surface or graveled. Um, so they can't just park all over the yard. They can't, you know, you can't block your neighbor's driveway. Those kinds of things. Uh, those just general rules that apply to everyone would apply to a vacation rental as well. Council Pharaoh and then council Keller.

Uh as as [clears throat] I understand the question is is what next? So last I recall staff that previous city manager and with staff was going to determine which department would manage this and then what that fee would be and that's I think was the last step. Um, so I don't we think that we should have the new city manager work with staff to figure out which department would manage it and what that fee would be and that fee is based upon the process of somebody coming to the window, filling out a form, getting a sticker and the price of the software or whatever else per person. So there's a wrap that into the cost that the state allows. And then finally, as I understand it, the volunteer registration, which is the current method, we we don't know if a person does it or not. We don't know. I when I briefed this before, we don't know what we don't know. This time we'll be able to if this goes into approve, we will know exactly how many we have. Then when Linda sees the budget money, we'll know who is paying the taxes and who's doesn't. And each one will have somebody some the neighbors can call if there's an issue. So I propose that we push this back towards the city staff as directed by the city manager to figure out what that fee would be. And then we none of us had a problem with the previous writeup that I recall, but then come back with what come back to us of what the program will cost, what it will be, and let's either adopt or reject the ordinance.

So, I got a quick question and then council prowler. Um, so this was before my time. Um, what was it that caused it to stop? Do you know

it? It really just kind of there was there was some turnover at the time I think in some departments um particularly in the clerk's department. We had a brand new clerk and she was still trying to It wasn't Cindy by the way. Um it was Carrie. Carrie had just come on kind of around this time or there was a transition between Kim and and I think that just kind of never got off the ground very well. And so because you know the clerk's office does the business registrations and the registrations for the vacation rentals and so it may be a natural fit there but that needed to be a discussion between the clerk and the city manager because the clerk doesn't work for the city manager and kind of some you know to make sure that the clerk has adequate resources to tackle a program like this. If not would she need another employee? if it isn't in the clerk's h, you know, office, where does it go? And that just never happened. And so we never moved to to establishing the fee. It just never happened.

Just kind of stopped. Okay. Councelor Prowler, did you have something?

Uh, yeah. I got couple of notes here. So, I don't know if I necessarily agree with uh having signs up in in front yards to notify that, you know, places. That's proverbial and also quite literal scarlet letter. Um, and that doesn't do anything as far as aesthetics go. Um, but having a database, an inventory somewhere of of licenses and collecting those fees, I think, is a reasonable way to gather that paperwork. Um, I just, you know, it's it's like if the health inspector leaves a a D on the window. It's it's not great. Um, so, um, the fees capped at 250. It's not like we're trying to get super crazy rich off of this. I mean, if that's what we're capped at, um, I think if we're going to make every house go through this, it might make sense to have the, uh, fee as well as the B business registration combined be 250. Um, so that way it doesn't feel like we're trying to gouge each individual house. Um because for someone that owns multiple of these I think that's going to be um a increasing uh cost. Um then that I don't think there's all that much question of cost since we're capped on that. Um my only other thing is uh in here I feel like there might be some I don't know awkward phrasing on uh on some restrictions. So I I'm very much aware that the concern is to stop uh human trafficking and other sorts of um illegal behavior happening at any houses. But the way this is written, it restricts I I think anyone that's had a felony in the past from running a um a

VBO or short-term rental. Um, honestly, if someone is a reformed con and committed a felony like 40 years ago, who are we to restrict property rights on them? Um, I mean, like, oddball stuff like that happens all the time. I've got I've got no interest in that. I'm very much on board with trying to stop current crime from being committed. Um, but, you know, if someone's done done their time, who cares?

So, yeah. And and you know that's a good question. So the the way that it's drafted now and certainly we can change all of this stuff. This none of this has been approved. The the the city could deny a license with respect to prior convictions if they're a registered sex offender. if they're a current registered sex offender, if they've been convicted of any felony act that resulted in death or serious physical injury or has been convicted of any felony use of a deadly weapon within 5 years of submitting the the application. So, that's it's not any felony. It's not, you know, but it's that limited subset of felonies and time periods. Um, but yeah, that's that's something that we can modify if council directs to to to change those parameters.

Councelor Hinger and then councelor Roundtree.

Thank you, Mayor. Uh, I'm I feel pretty good about this as is. I would be excited to see it move forward and come back with more information. I want to echo what councelor Pller said. I if we were to move forward with putting something up on the front of the house, I could see potential safety concerns with that. If I'm visiting an Airbnb and that's outside, people know that I don't live there long term, it's it could potentially be vacant a lot. So, I would just want to know from someone smarter than myself if that's a real safety concern or if cities haven't really seen a problem with it before we added something like that in. I think it's an interesting idea. That would be my other side of it. If the if the notification of all neighbors within a certain distance that they're going to do that is already in place, I I feel that that would be suffice versus a sticker

is it's so the notification is adjacent properties across the street and corners. So, you know, diagonal from the house. So, you know, you've got all of your immediate neighbors would be notified that it's going to be a vacation rental. And to your point, I mean, that's fair um not only for the guests, but also for, you know, people who are looking to burglarize homes if they know that it's a vacation rental, you know, because it's got a some sort of a designation on it that that may be a target or something like that. Councelor Roundtree,

I'm just taking the suggestions that Arb says that communities are doing and I've owned several vacation rentals and stayed in lots of them and I don't think it's a scarlet letter. I think people who own vacation rentals are very proud of them and um I've never felted targeted or anything um from vacation rentals where I've stayed where they were identified. Matter of fact, it made them easier to find. But um Aronb says also some of the other things that communities are requiring is um video. Of course, you cannot place them on the inside of a vacation rental home, but um entrance or inside a garage as entrances. They're requiring them so that they can see you can see if the individual who reserved with an identification um you know with a driver's license or passport is the same person that's entering and using the home. Um they said that another one that's very popular that I would like to encourage is that when you do give them their business license or their things that you give materials to help um homeowners or um vacation rental owners to be able to identify activity um that could possibly um um be leading towards human trafficking. That's the reason why um like VBO does not allow you to last minute reserve um a property because it's popular for people to go on and want say hey let's have a party tonight so they'll want to go on or human trafficking who they do short I mean they don't book three months out they book the day of so that there's some other policies that you can look at so as we move forward I'd encourage city staff to look at what the industry um is looking at in regards to as um I think Aaron Nibb is doing a little bit better job, but I just read some material today that VBO is now stepping up to be as competitive with ARNB to help try to prevent human trafficking and identify those activities. Um and other activities, not just human trafficking,

that occur, illegal activities with inside of um vacation um I think it's pretty clear that we agree to the council is of the feeling to have staff proceed with this. So, I'll ask for a motion if anybody is willing to give me one at this point. Councelor Hinger. Mayor, I move to direct staff to continue moving forward with the short-term rental licensing by having our city manager and city clerk work together to determine the department and fee schedule. Second. That was that was enough, right? Yeah. Okay. We have a motion. Councelor Hetting chair and a second from councelor Preller. All in favor say I. I.

I. Any opposed? Thank you. We have one item on number nine for potential future agenda items about a data center information questionnaire process. Debbie that will be did you have something for us? Yeah. So I have um just a reminder to council members that this is not a discussion item. This is just No, it's not. This is for this to be on. I want to know if we will.

It's a copy for everyone. You can give one to Cindy or to the city manager so it can go on to public record. Um and I didn't start it off, but I'll start off obviously this evening with the um um call to the public. Um, and and I understand and I know the rest of you understand that when the referendum was filed, you know, that was the time we wanted to start getting all this information out about the data center and our hands were tied and and so legally there was nothing we could say or do um and um till after Christmas. So here at the first of the year and so because of that we can see how much misinformation is going on in regards to the data center. I wanted to propose an agenda item for future meeting that addresses the community's concerns regarding the potential data center. As we know there are many misunderstandings and misconceptions surrounding this project. To ensure that we are accurately representing our constituents concerns, I suggest we consider implementing a questionnaire aimed at gauging the public's understanding and thoughts about the project. And I would add here it, you know, at city staff's recommendation, whether that's a month or or two months, we want to make sure we have time to start getting um the misunderstandings cleared up. And then um so this would help clarify misunderstandings, enhance transparency, inform um help um planning and zoning efforts be informed as they move forward, and promote constructive dialogue. So in light of these points, I encourage us to prioritize the discussion on our future agenda as it will be instrumental in aligning our efforts with the community's needs and ensuring that we move forward with a clear understanding. Thank you for considering this important opportunity or this council agenda item for the future.

Okay, that was pretty clear. um for council members that would like to see this come questionnaire process to help improve information accuracy. I I like it. Well, can I make a comment? Yes. Yeah. Comment, councelor Pharaoh and then councelor Hinger

comment. the city manager put out today the the new list that starts the communication process opening it up for questions which I think is a good step forward and and I and I don't want to overdo [clears throat] what we're doing and right now we're in the contractual process and we're looking at city staff to do something uh downturn down the that that almost answers the mail right here. The what you have. So I'm happy with what we're doing for right now and then as we have additional meetings we that process that will be announced will be shared. So I don't know how what this does different than what than what the city manager started. Councelor Prowler and then

um just real quick because it's not a full discussion.

Correct. Uh I I don't necessarily disagree with what this is saying. I think uh the awkwardness of the timing of the data center kind of happening um before we had staff um has led to not as much information being out there as would have otherwise been. I feel like um I like that now that we have staff, we have press releases coming out. Um, and I haven't seen the FAQ page on the city's website because it's 10 minutes old. Um, but I I will after this meeting. Um, and I assume it's good. Um, but uh I think it, you know, in in kind of this avenue, um, it would be great for, I don't know, an an officer that, you know, is allowed to put out information publicly. um doesn't matter who um to uh keep putting out the the um press releases, updates, timelines, that sort of stuff. Um charts and graphs and colorful dates and all, you know, you get it. You know, make it make it presentable. Um I I think that might be the the route to doing this. Um but I that seems to kind of be the same as as this questionnaire idea, right? Where you envisioning something different.

The only difference is that when somebody asks a question, that's one citizen. Did one citizen have that question or did a 500 of our citizens have that question? And um we have to remember that there's a we want to believe and we create these echo chambers on social media that everybody is a part of social media or the posts that we put out there and they are not. And so there is a great deal of our citizensry that is not going to participate with the the web page and not know about it unless we do a a a greater attempt at um creating a questionnaire. But I was very excited to hear what you're doing. Um and I did feel like when I had to read that that it was um duplicating the great idea that you guys had staff.

So you were you were on the same page. And so I was on the same page. So I would say that what you've done answers everything that I had there except for that one question of whether or not one person had that question. And then a questionnaire can also answer how many people still feel this way about a data center but have these misconceptions and then how many people understand what the project really is and still are then are in favor of or against a data center. So a questionnaire would give you a little bit more information. Do you see what I'm saying? And then you'd also for um you know if you were on the um would a questionnaire

for the planning and zoning board they would really like to know I mean do the citizens of page not care about lights? I mean I do but you know [clears throat] do the citizens how they prioritize and how that question felt. So, that's the only thing that's different about a questionnaire. And I'm fine with us putting this on and discussing about it occurring in two or three or four months after you've have several months of being able to answer all of these misconceptions that exist. Council prayer real quick.

I mean, we could just put a counter on the new FAQ page, right? And as new questions come in, get data that way. But I think that the questions appear and the answer appears there. So you don't know how many people just read it and didn't have the same question or did have the same question. So that's my only thing I want to throw out there. But we can't discuss it now. This is for a future agenda item to discuss whether or not we do or not want to do this. Councelor Hinger and then councelor Hammond and we'll be done.

Um I've got first a process question. I think we get into this frequently on these future agenda items where is it appropriate tonight to discuss what it would look like at a future agenda as we discuss this issue or is the question do we want to discuss at a future meeting a questionnaire or a survey about the data center? Thank you. I feel the same way. Okay. So, so we're not discussing tonight how we want to have that discussion. It's just whether or not we think a surveyquestnaire is worthwhile to discuss. Whether you want to have the discussion. Okay. Yeah. Whether or not we want to have the discussion and we should have the discussion then as well. That's [clears throat] a hard one does not cross over that line. Councelor Hammond, real quick.

Okay. Now, I'd like to make the point that our ordinance that we approved to pre-approve agenda items is stupid. And if anybody listens back the last five minutes of this meeting, like I feel like stabbing my eyeballs out. It's inane. Um, we need to vote. Are we going to talk about this or not? Yep. So, I'm do not put this on a future agenda item since the city manager already addressed the issue. I think though the difference is that this is a survey about the data center versus FAQs about the data center. Yes. So, so that's the because I I was also confused about that. I thought it was the same.

Okay. Well, my motion stands. I move not to put it on a future agenda and it's not really going to be a motion. It's just by regardless of my rationale, I move not to put this on a future agenda. Okay. So, I would just kind of ask the rest of the council here for a future agenda item. Yay. Yay or nay? Nay right now. Nay. Okay. Nay for now. Okay. So, what was the count on nays? Five nay. Yeah, but we're not voting. And it's not really It's not really a count. It's Yeah, just it's not a motion. It's not a motion. Okay. It's not a motion, but it is. It's not a count, but it is. It's bizarre.

And item number 101 and 102 we do not need to do because they were completed at 72 and 73. So with that I will announce that our next regular meeting is Wednesday January 28 at 5:30 and I will adjourn this meeting. The time is 8:29.