Orange City Council - Regular Meeting

Good evening, and I'm calling the regular city council meeting of 04/28/2026 to order. If you have not silenced your cell phones, please do so at this time. Tonight's invocation will be given by pastor Josh Koppel of Spirit and Truth Worship Center to be followed by the Pledge of Allegiance led by council member, Talvaleris. Please stand.

Thank you, mayor Slater, and

thank you to the city council for inviting us to pray. We are very happy to be here tonight. Spirit and Truth loves Orange, but let's jump right into it. Heavenly Father, we thank you for this time together tonight for our chance to serve Orange. We pray for our city leaders that you would give them wisdom and unity as they use their time, talent, and treasure on behalf of others. We pray for the people of Orange, for the families, the residents, the businesses, that we would have peace and joy in our community. We ask for protection over our first responders and city workers that you would keep them safe and bless their work. And we lift up all of our students and our OUSD that you would give these young people a bright future in Orange County. Bless this meeting tonight to accomplish great things for the city of Orange. In Jesus' name, amen.

Amen. Thank

Thank you. You. Please face the flag and please place your hand on your heart and repeat after me. I pledge allegiance

to the flag of The United States Of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, pastor Koppel. Madam clerk, please call the roll.

Mayor Pro Tem Bellido.

Present.

Council member Barrios.

I am here.

Council member Dimitrios.

Here.

Council member Tavallaris. Here. Council member Gutierrez. Here. Council member Gillenhammer?

Here.

Mayor Slater?

Here.

A quorum is present. In accordance with the Ralph m Brown Act, the teleconference location has been identified in the notice and agenda for this meeting, and roll call votes will be taken for all action items as long as council member Gillenhammer is participating via teleconference.

Thank you. We have, one proclamation, this evening, recognizing San Diego Canyon College for its twenty twenty six, twenty twenty seven military friendly school designation, and council member, Gutierrez will be presenting that. And I'd like to invite, Lakeish Perez, Associate Dean of Student Services to the podium to accept the proclamation once it's been read.

Evening, mayor, esteemed members of the Orange City Council. My name is Doctor. Joseph Alonzo, and I'm the Dean of Students at Santiago Canyon College and a proud veteran of the United States Marine Corps. Doctor. Lakisha Perez, who is the direct supervisor of the Veterans Resource Center at SCC, sends her regard that she could not be here this evening.

On behalf of our SCC student veterans, right here, many are here, our military connected families, and our employees, I want to sincerely thank you for this proclamation. This recognition means more to us than words can express. Although we are housed over the hill along Santiago Canyon Road, our work extends far beyond our campus walls. The SCC Veterans Resource Center helps all veterans and military connected individuals who walk through our doors. Most of our team is made up of veterans or military connected family members, and that shared experience guides how we engage with those we serve.

Unfortunately, we've heard too many times about veterans not receiving the service they deserve from other organizations, and it is our priority to ensure we do not replicate those poor experiences. We do our best to offer comprehensive service to our students, and our military friendly designation is evident that our philosophy and our approach is working, and our students are benefiting. But we could not do this alone. This work would not be possible without our community partners. The Community Foundation of Orange has been one of our longest standing partners, funding emergency grants for veterans in dire need.

We're also extremely proud to volunteer annually for one of Orange's biggest celebrations, the Field Of Valor, where our students and employees volunteer and every year to install seventeen seventy six flags in remembrance of our fallen comrades. The Assistance League of Orange supports our students with monthly meals and a laptop award for up to five veterans each year. We also recently partnered with the American Legion Post one hundred thirty two, and we look forward to building a lasting relationship that supports veterans today and for generations to come. I wanted to end by saying that many of our employees not only work in the city of Orange, but they live here, raise families here, and or spend time in this community. When people see us wearing our SEC Veterans Resource Center shirts, they often stop us and ask us what we do.

More times than we can count, those conversations lead to someone finding their way to us for some type of assistance, navigating the medical system, applying for a disability rating, or their educational benefits. Sometimes, it also leads to enrollment for them or for a family member, but sometimes it doesn't, and that's okay. Our priority is simply to help, to give back, just as the city of Orange has given so much to our students. Again, thank you for this recognition and for your support of veterans and for standing with us as a community who truly believes in service. Hoorah.

Thank you. And thank you all for coming tonight. Please stay there when Council Member Gutierrez reads a proclamation, then she'll come down and present. Thank you.

Thank you for being here this evening. So I have the honor of reading the proclamation honoring Santiago Canyon College, 26, 27 military friendly school. Whereas Santiago Canyon College SCC, located in the city of Orange, is dedicated to providing accessible, high quality education and comprehensive support services that empower a diverse student population, including veterans, active duty service members, military spouses, their families. And whereas SCC has been recognized as one of the top 10 military friendly schools for the twenty twenty six-twenty twenty seven academic year, earning the distinction of being ranked number six in the nation in the small community college category. And whereas SCC is the only California community college to rank in the top 10 nationwide within the small community college category for the twenty twenty six-twenty twenty seven military friendly school designation, reflecting its exceptional commitment to those who have served our nation.

And whereas this prestigious designation highlights the outstanding efforts of SCC faculty, staff, and leadership in fostering a supportive and inclusive environment for veterans, dependents, and military connected students through programs such as the Veterans Resource Center. And whereas institutions earning the Military Friendly Schools designation are evaluated using both public data sources and responses to a comprehensive proprietary survey administered by Victory with participation from more than 3,200 organizations. And whereas final rankings are determined based on a combination of survey results, public data, and demonstrated success in key areas, including student recruitment, retention, academic progress, graduation rates, career placement, and the availability of support services for veterans, transitioning service members, and military spouses. And whereas, SCC continues to serve as a model institution by exceeding established benchmarks and advancing opportunities for student veterans to achieve their academic and career goals. Now, therefore, Dan Slater, mayor of the city of Orange and the entire city council, do hereby recognize and commend Santiago Canyon College for its designation as a top 10 military friendly school for the twenty twenty six-twenty seven academic year and applaud its ongoing commitment to excellence in serving the veteran and military connected community.

We extend our sincere congratulations and express our appreciation for the college's continued leadership, innovation, and dedication to student success. Thank you. I will come down and give that

to you.

All

right. We have two of our high school liaisons here tonight to give us school updates. And at first, I'll invite forward from El Medina High School, Dylan Platfoot. Dylan here yet? Maybe he's a little late. From Orange High School, Jacob Gonzalez.

Good evening, City Council. I am proud to represent Orange High School this evening and share our highlights on our campus and student community. This past month has been both busy and productive for our campus. One of our most notable accomplishments was the success of our penny drive. Over thirty days, we hosted 28 events and raised $10,000 to support the Blood Cancer United Association.

Showcasing dedication and strong sense of community among our students and staff. In athletics, our spring sports teams are wrapping up their season, and our student athletes have shown great commitment and sportsmanship. Our boys volleyball team stands out with an eighteen and nine overall record and a perfect 11 oh and record in league. Since securing their first league championship since 1999 and making this a historic season for our school. Initially, students are engaged in SBAC and LPAC testing while preparing for our upcoming AP exams. Additionally, our instrumental program is concluding the successful competition season highlighting a talent and hardworking our students have shown this year.

And also I was planning

on showing a presentation, but unfortunately I won't be able to show it today, but next meeting I will. Thank you.

Is that for your community service project? Video? Okay. Great. I see you lettered in water polo.

Oh, yeah.

Congratulations. You. Thank you.

All right. Appreciate it.

You bet. See next month. Dylan Platfoot make it yet? Maybe he's studying for a test. City attorney, is there anything to report out from closed session?

Nothing to report, mister mayor.

Okay. Very well. We have, how many speakers? Just a handful. Okay. At this time, members of the public may address the council on matters not listed on the agenda within the subject matter jurisdiction of the city council, provided that no action may be taken on off agenda items unless authorized by law. Public comments are limited to three minutes per speaker. First speaker is Martin Sherifanjad, to be followed by Drew Whitefeather.

I I'm a chalk baby. I was born in 1980. I grew up in mister Reetsy's Greenbrier Apartments. Mom used to walk me down to the dairy tree, which is now Brexy, to get me ice cream. But that's not what I'm here for.

My family and I are seven Eleven franchisees in the city, and I'm sure you've heard about it before, but there's a tobacco ordinance that's supposed to go into effect on July first of two thousand twenty six of this year that will be pretty harsh for us to deal with. At first, when the ordinance came about, we were under the assumption that the ordinance was kinda going after tobacco and smoke shops selling prohibited and illicit items. As you can imagine, what is it? The nitrous tanks and the illegal vapes, the flavored vapes, and all this stuff, and all these other illicit items that are naughty, no good, not cool stuff that we do not partake in. We are seven Eleven franchisees.

We are bound by a seven Eleven franchise agreement. We get constant communication about selling illegal and prohibited items in the state of California. We're bound by that. We risk forfeiture of our stores by virtue of being involved in these types of illicit sales. Reason why I'm contacting you is I understand we came up with tobacco licensing permit, was, at first, I just thought, oh, okay.

Well, there's a tobacco licensing permit. I contacted miss Barrios about it. I was a little, you know, worried about what it entailed, but it seemed as if maybe some people on the council thought it was to go after tobacco shops only. Well, come to find out, it actually is going after everybody. And I've stayed in contact with her the whole entire time. $880 a year is a lot of money. I have two little girls. That's a lot to come up with. It's one of the highest in the state. But I just wanted to tell you guys what we stand to lose as retailers and what the city stands to lose.

The sales tax dollars on that, the items that we're not gonna sell, they're big. Vapes, legal vapes, they're expensive. Legal, not prohibited, legal by state of California. Marvel cigarettes, these kinds of items. I know people don't like it. I get it. These items are expensive. You're going to lose that blue collar person from two to 6AM because of the restriction on just tobacco sales only, they're gonna go fill up their car, gas is taxable. Cigarettes are taxable. Vapes are taxable.

Monster energy drinks are taxable. But not only that, a complete ban on vaping, altogether, legal vaping in the state of California, which I think we should follow California law, that's gone. Vapes are very expensive. They generate a lot of sales tax. So just here to bring it to your attention where we stand to lose also on business licensing. It's based on gross sales, gross receipts. Our gross receipts are gonna go down. It means less business licensing fees for the city. So I just want to talk to all of you about this, see if we can have an open discussion and come to a pragmatic solution. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you, Martin. Following Drew Whitefeather is next, followed by Brian Lamb.

Good evening, mayor and city council members. If you guys didn't know, this truck ride on Soley Miller is closed. I've spoke to LEA, the waterboard, Cal Recycle, the Army Corps of Engineers, OHA, and we don't know what happened. So basically, what has happened is and I've asked and I don't even know if there is a grading plan for this truck route on Sully Miller, but they've widened the road on Sully Miller that was supposed to be 30 feet to 40 to 50 feet. Stockpiles were not supposed to be touched at all.

They used the stockpiles to build this land bridge across the creek. So now, the testing that was done on these stockpiles that went to OHA for the human risk assessment it's been used on the bridge before the human risk assessment has come back. And OHA has already stated this material was not Okay for housing, but it was being retested for open space. So now, is Milan's toxic dump poisoning our water system? We don't know yet.

But right now, we're waiting to find out if LEA is going do a cease and assist. So all plans that Milan has for their September deadline has gone out of the window because a full investigation has to be done. Full topo maps, finding out where this material was. And I just want to read this quick. This is from the GAN hysteria from LEA, the inspector.

During the inspection, the foreman from the grading contractor who identified himself as John approached LEA staff. John stated that he works for Garrett Construction, and this is in charge of grading activities at the Mayberry residential development under D. H. Horton. L.

A. Required about the missing soil, gravel stockpiles at the Rio San Diego site. John, the foreman, the LEA the foreman, the LEA and Garrett Construction used some of this material from Rio San Diego site to build a portion of the land bridge and use the rest to widen the road between Stockpile GH and I. John also informed LEA that the City of Orange inspectors were on-site during the previous day when the road was being built. So somebody dropped the ball really bad on this because the regulatory agencies, the Water Board in LA, gave three rules.

Don't judge the

I'm sorry. Drew, that comes up.

All

right. Thank you. Following Brian Lamb is Lorena Kolb.

Hi. Good evening, mayor and council members. My name is Brian Lamb, and I'm here representing the California Fuels and Convenience Alliance. And we represent independent gas stations and convenience stores throughout the state, including in the city of Orange. And I just want to come before the council tonight to raise some concerns about ordinance twelve-twenty five that was passed in June of last year.

This ordinance was initially brought to council with the goal of curbing underage tobacco use, a goal we wholeheartedly support and commend the city's efforts in addressing. But what it's digressed into on the other hand is an ordinance that punishes local businesses by painting all tobacco retailers with a broad brush, effectively roping them in with the bad actors and setting off a chain of unintended consequences that paints a grim picture for Orange and its small business owners and honestly, the community at large. As a refresher on ordinance twelve-twenty five, it utilizes arbitrary enforcement mechanisms like a 500 foot buffer and a citywide license cap while prohibiting license transfers on same site locations, effectively uprooting community establishments, many who over their decades of service have become pillars of their communities. You know, regulating compliant tobacco sales is one thing, but penalizing a whole category of local businesses and putting their livelihoods at risk is another. In essence, this ordinance loses the fight on two fronts.

It drives demand to the unregulated black market while the city and local economy lose crucial sales and tax dollars that otherwise would go towards funding vital tobacco education programs that have been actually proven to curb underage tobacco use. Couple that with a total ban on vape products and a restriction of tobacco sales between two and six a. M, which both limit consumer choice even more and it's clear why this ordinance is in dire need of revision. In order to ensure an equitable approach that still aligns with the city's public health goals, we respectfully urge city council to consider amending ordinance twelve-twenty five to exempt all gas stations and convenience stores. Thank you for your time and consideration.

Thank you, Brian. Following Lorena is Jaime Rojas. Is there she is.

Good evening, counsel. Thank you for this opportunity to address you. I own a property at 1502 East Locust in the city of Orange who has the reputation of being the worst gang property in Orange. And I'm here today to ask you why. Why haven't you done something? I've asked different people. We have juveniles juveniles that keep using the walls for their art projects, and they can't arrest them. I said, well, why can't you arrest them? Well, we can't. They're juveniles.

Well, there's got to be a problem with the city's ordinance that you can't take the child back to his parents and then charge them for the cost of all the graffiti they're putting up. So I mean, there are several things in my lifetime that I've owned that property over fifty years that I've found that I get no answers from the people that are working the streets. They say, well, they say, I can't. They say, I can't. We can't do that.

Why? Why isn't somebody saying, why can't we fix this problem? You know, I'm asking you tonight to say, take this problem seriously because I know we have several gang areas in the city of Orange, and mine being the worst ones. Just recently, we've had some difficulty shootings, etcetera, and let me I will volunteer. If any of you think that gang war in the city of Orange is bad enough that you make a task force and say, bring us back the things that we could do either by putting it in our amendments, in our ordinances, our resolutions.

How can we do the thing that will help this city and the property owners who have gone down the value my value several years ago was 1 0.4. I can't sell it today for 1,000,000 because they go through the area, see all the graffiti. I don't know who live there, even though it's close to shopping, it's close to everything. But I've lost my value because the city of Orange doesn't care about the investors that have put their money in, pay their taxes every year, help the city of the water department. I mean, I've done everything I could do that's what I'm supposed to do.

I'd just like the city to know what can you do. I on my card, I have my phone number, and I would be happy. I won't lead the task force. I will have with support, I will work with everyone to do something of that nature. Thank you.

Lorena, could you please repeat your address?

1502 East Locust.

Great. Thank you very much. Evident. I'm sure

there might be Albertson's at Collins And Right.

I know where you are. Thanks for coming down. I'm sure there's some folks here that would like to talk to you.

Okay.

Following Jaime Rojas is Greg Aerosmith.

Good evening, Mr. Mayor and council members. My name is Jaime Rojas. I'm with the National Association of Tobacco Outlets. I'm here tonight on behalf of our local retailers, just like my team, a franchisee owner of seven Eleven, which includes convenience stores and gas stations that serve residents throughout the city of Orange.

We understand and respect the city council's intent when the tobacco ordinance was adopted last year. We also were here then to testify on the impacts to our stores. The focus appeared to be addressing vape and smoke shops. However, the ordinance has also unintended impacted responsible convenience store and gas stations have long operated in the city, following the rules and served adult consumers legally. The vapor ban, the elimination tobacco license transferability and the 500 foot buffer requirements of tobacco has placed a significant burden on these small businesses.

Many of these retailers are family owned, employ local residents and depend on lawful tobacco sales as part of their overall business model. All of our members have successfully passed annual use sting operations conducted both by local and state agencies year after year. Many have electronic age verification CAD registers, which they have to pass an ID through in order for the register to open, abide by all local, state, and federal regulations in a highly regulated industry. With the vapor ban scheduled to take effect on July 1, we also respect and ask the council to revisit this issue and consider an exemption for convenience stores and gas stations of this ordinance. These businesses are not vape or smoke shops.

They should not be treated the same way. By banning these products, customers just go to surrounding cities to purchase the same banned products and no problem is solved. So now our members will lose product revenue and all auxiliary products sales like gas, milk, water, eggs and etcetera, which may impact approximately a loss of anywhere between 15% to 25% of overall sales. We appreciate the council's attention and respectfully request that this matter be reviewed before the effective date. We thank you for your consideration.

Thank you, Jaime. Following Greg Arrowsmith is Rusty Hodges.

California Brown Act of 1953 forcing local government agencies to be transparent with the taxpaying citizens. I emailed the US DOJ this presentation. Focus, Natalie Adorian. California State Bar License Number 274599. Reply back to the California Brown Act here or correct letter via email on 03/25/2026 at 05:20PM.

She addressed in the body of her email, that response addressed the timing of your public comment and confirmed that you were provided the full two minutes in compliance with the Brown Act. My argument, according to my email sent to Pamela Coleman, 02/26/2026 at 11:33AM, my wife and I timed my general comment presentation. My presentation was not at the full two minutes. The presentation was around one minute and fifty seconds before I was interrupted according to our stopwatch. Furthermore, Dan Slater presented the two minute time frame when I was walking up to the podium.

I did not hear him announce the two minute time frame due to the distraction of walking up to the podium. In conclusion, the 04/06/2026 City of Orange denied claims letter wants to turn this situation into a Greg Errolsmith versus the City of Orange, or as well as the Orange counsel due to the negligence of the City of Orange legal staff. With confidence, my general comments speaker presentation was interrupted before my two minutes was complete. This is in violation of the California Brown Act. Furthermore, public civil servants can will receive criminal charges if heshe violates the California Brown Act.

AI mentioned violating section 54,952.6 of the California government code can result in penalties classified as misdemeanors, which may include a fine up to $1,000 imprisonment for up to six months or both. Additionally, the city may require the violator to correct the violation.

Following Rusty Hodges is Rob Boyce.

Good evening, honorable mayor, members of the council. I'm here to speak. I'm Rusty Hodges, and I'm here to speak about 11502 East Locust as well in support of Ms. Cole. I'm the property manager at that property. It's a little small. It's a small four unit apartment complexes, and nothing large in any way. But there's a number of small units throughout that neighborhood. And I've had the privilege of working with detective Pistoni and investigator Guillen have been involved. And I I realized over there, it's probably a lot like playing the old game whack a mole.

You're trying to catch different things going on in that neighborhood. Most recently on April 5, there was tagging not only of walls and property, the walls of our property, but there's also tagging of the sidewalks, and it's just very unsightly. But aside from the blight that happens as a result of the tagging action, there's a safety aspect. And that aspect is one that's the most concerning for myself and for miss Kolb, aside from the property value issues and things like that. There was a there was gunfire and shooting a couple months back. It happened it's happened a couple times now. It's happened Thanksgiving, and it's happened it's it's it's it's it's more frequent, it seems. And the tenants that are

over there are at a

point where they don't even allow their children to go out and play in the yard. So it's it's not a safe place for kids to play, especially as it gets towards the end of the day. If the sun starts going down, nobody lets their children out. And during the day, it's even suspect at that. So we're just looking forward to maybe seeing what what else can be done. I don't know if there's some cameras or anything that maybe get some footage from others that are in the area. We have cameras on our building, which I've submitted to the detective and to for their help. But anything the city can do to help us correct the issue over there and make it safer for the residents that live there would be wonderful. Really appreciate that.

Thank you, Rusty. Thanks for coming. Rob Boyce. Well, didn't prepare

a speech for you tonight. I do want to weigh in on this discussion about the vape and the smoke shop issue. I think that I have friends that have the convenience stores that own convenience stores, and they are telling me that this will be very difficult for them to deal with. I also have heard that the city of Anaheim has put together an ordinance that somehow allows a cutout for businesses that are operating properly and are not doing the illegal things that these smoke shops are doing. I think that we all know that cities can change ordinances when the governing body realizes that there are unintended consequences that have occurred from the writing of the ordinance.

I think that that's the situation here. Not only that, I think that one of the consequences is when every penny counts right now, you're going to be lowering the gross receipts of these businesses, and that will affect their business license fees, which will be less money coming into the city as I understand the way it operates. Also, this possibility that some of these businesses who are under contractual obligations to be open for twenty four hours may find that in the evening when a lot of those sales take place that they can't continue to operate successfully. Then that would be the loss of a business, also loss of revenue to the city. So I would strongly recommend that the council take a look at this ordinance, go back and see if revisions to the ordinance are appropriate, and demonstrate to these long lasting law abiding businesses that Orange is really a business friendly city.

Thank you.

Thank you, Rob. And council member Gellenhammer, is there any member of the public there with you who would like to participate in the public comment portion of this meeting or otherwise address any agenda item for this

meeting? There is not.

Okay. Good. Thank you. That ends the public comments. Moving on to the consent calendar. I will, quite a few items on it. Are there any members who would like to pull anything? Council Member Barrios?

Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I would like to just note an abstention on item 3.5. My company works with that agency. And I would like to pull item three sixteen.

Three sixteen?

Yes, three sixteen.

Any other council members? Council Member Dimitriou. Sure. I'd like to pull 3.25 just for a quick question and then register an abstention due to potential employment conflict on 03/2027.

Very well. And Mayor Pro Tem Billeteau.

Yes. On items 3.5, 3.6, and 3.7. They involve the County of Orange. I need to declare that the County of Orange is my employer, but I do not have a financial interest in these items. That's all. Thank you.

Are you just recording abstentions on three five, three six

No abstention. I can vote. I just need to declare to the public that it's my employer, the government. But I don't have any involvement with the items whatsoever. Whatsoever.

Okay. And Councilmember Gutierrez.

I'd like to pull item 3.28.

We have a motion to approve the balance from Councilor Oh, I'm sorry. Councilor Miller Gillenhaver, forgot about you. No I'm

worries. Can I pull 3.21?

Okay. All right. We have a motion to approve the balance by Councilmember Tavallaris and a second from Councilmember Barrios. Any further discussion? Seeing none, please vote.

That'll be a roll call vote.

Oh, that's right.

Council Member Gutierrez? Yes. Council Member Dimitriou?

Yes.

Mayor Pro Tem Bellido?

Yes.

Council member Gillenhammer?

Yes.

Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Council member Tavallaris? Yes. Council member Barrios?

Yes.

Approved unanimously. All right. First item is 3.16. Award of contract to Owen Walstead LLC, a California limited liability company, doing business as US Door Incorporated for replacement of rolling garage doors at Fire Stations 7 Corporate 7 and The Courtyard. As Council Mayor Barrios.

Yes. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. The city manager knows that I've had some many questions about this particular procurement and concerns. I realize that there is an inoperable door at this moment, but I do think that these are pressing concerns that need to be addressed. Since I have very thoroughly gone over what my concerns are, I don't wanna state them here, but I would ask my colleagues that we table this item to the next meeting until the city manager and I and possibly the director of public works can sit down and discuss this because I think it's serious. I would make a motion to table this to a date certain May 12.

Okay. Is there a second?

I'll second.

Council Member Tavallero seconds. Any further discussion? Please call the vote. Motion is to table item three sixteen until the next council meeting.

Council Member Barrios?

Nothing showing up on

oh, yes.

Mhmm. Council member Dimitriou.

Abstain.

Mayor Pro Tem Belladeau.

Yes.

Council member Gutierrez. Yes. Council member Gallenhammer?

Yes.

Council member Tavallaris? Yes. Mayor Slater?

Yes. Motion passes with six yeses, no, nays and one abstention. Council Member Dimitriou. Moving on to Item 3.21, authorized purchase of VeloCloud hardware from Sidepath Incorporated, and that is Councilmember Gillenhammer.

Thank you, Mayor. My question here is that just for clarification, we have Internet with Spectrum already for our city. I understand that there's a second like business class Internet service with Crown Castle. Is this just adding an extra layer of Internet over the city?

Correct. So this is going to give us dual Internet carriers as we move more and more of our applications and digital properties to the cloud. It's really critical that we have a backup to our internet provider. Currently, have internet with Spectrum here and at the police department. But if Spectrum itself has a problem, then we effectively have lost our internet connection. So we're looking for a diverse carrier solution in case there's a problem with spectrum, which has happened a couple of times in the last five years.

Do you know about how many times it's happened in the last five years?

Off the top of my head, I can remember three. It may have been more.

Okay. And then how material is the impact? And how long does it take to

come Yes. So some of the outages have been brief, so they could be as short as thirty minutes. But the most recent one was almost about twelve hours. So that would be significant, especially as we're talking about moving our CAD and RMS to the cloud with the Orange Police Department.

I appreciate that. I would move to reject this item, giving its redundancy in overall Internet and the discussions we're having tonight. Three identified with the thirty minutes to twelve hour impacts with a couple of them being thirty minutes, I don't think it's necessary to have a second layer of Internet.

All right. Councilmember, there's already a motion on the floor to approve that we will move through Councilmember Barrios' comment.

Yeah. I had the great pleasure to go to infra day, which I didn't even know what that was until I was asked to go up there. So I got to hear the head of Cal OES, or the head of IT, talking about really, there's actually new requirements coming down about redundancies. LA Metro, who I do work for all the time, was down for two weeks not being able to get to their documents, not being because their system had been infiltrated. So would this create also a redundancy in terms of security and being able to move from one system to another if something like that happened?

This would not save us from a cybersecurity incident, if that's what you're alerting to.

If something came right into the computers, yes. But in terms of a system going down, it would offer another pathway in terms of your overall net.

Yeah, effectively what it protects us from is if one of the internet providers has an outage, and it could be a significant outage, we have a backup. And again, as we continue to move things to the cloud, it gets to be a bigger issue email, CAT RMS, permitting, our own financial system. So as we continue to lose access to the internet, that gets to be a bigger problem.

Thank you.

There's a motion to approve from Councilmember Demetra and a second from Councilmember Barrios. Any further discussion?

Mayor, real quick.

I'm sorry.

Point of order. Technically, Councilmember Gillenhammer made a substitute motion without knowing it. So you really should wait for it to see if there's a second prior to going back to the original motion.

You are correct. Thank you. Council Mayor Gillenhamer did make a substitute motion to reject this item. Is there a second? Not hearing one, the motion fails. The original motion, to approve by Council Member Dimitriu and seconded by Council Member Barros will now come forward and I'll call for the vote.

Council member Dimitriou?

Yes.

Council member Gillenhammer? No. Council member Tavlores? Yes. Mayor Potem Bilodeau?

Yes.

Mayor Slater? Yes. Council Member Barrios? Yes. Council Member Gutierrez? Yes.

The motion is approved, six to one with Council Member Gillenhammer as a no vote. Okay. Item 3.25, letters of understanding between the city of Orange and the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers Local forty seven representing the maintenance and crafts and water division employees? Council member Dmitry. Just a procedural question.

We received a late communication that indicated there there was a flaw in the written document. In order for us to adopt it, does it have to be cleaned or is this something that does not have to go through? Or should we postpone the vote in order to make sure that that document is corrected?

Excellent question. Good evening, Council Mower, Dimitriou and counsel. The hot file that you received was simply an update to the salary schedule. Those items are correct and are ready for approval this evening.

Okay. Thank you. That was my only question. With that, I'll move item. Thank you.

Motion to from council member Dimitri. Second? Second from council member Gutierrez. Any further discussion? I'll call for the vote.

Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Council member Gillenhammer?

Yes.

Council member Tabularis? Yes. Council member Dimitriou?

Yes.

Mayor Pro Tem Villadeau?

Yes.

Council member Barrios? Yes. Council member Gutierrez? Yes.

Motion is approved, seven unanimously, and, we'll move on to item 3.28. Updates to the eligibility and preference criteria for the tenant based rental assistance program, policies, and procedures. Council member Gutierrez.

Yes. I just had some questions of staff. And I don't know if Jessica oh, there's Jessica. I haven't seen you in long time. So I appreciate you doing some updates. I'm sad to hear that nobody has utilized the TBRA program. But I want I'm wondering how we are making certain that now that we eliminated some maybe some blockades to accessing this program, how are we going to besides doing it through supportive services organizations, how are we getting it out there to the community that this is available?

Good evening, mayor and members of the city council. Councilman Gutierrez, one of the main focus of this tenant based rental assistance was to support the home ERP program, which worked with the HRC to provide services to our in house community. And so when it was structured, the idea was that priority would be given to

sorry

applicants that came through the continuum of care process to support those that were in house coming in through the HRC for services for rental assistance. We are broadening it to the to do all continuum of care services, plus anyone who qualifies with income based based on the income based eligibility. So right now, it has been focused on the continuum of care. Moving forward, if approved tonight, we would open it up on our city website. We are limited to about 20 to 25 households at this time.

And so it would more so be focused on the current list from our continuum of care partners that would receive priority. But if we did receive applications from anyone who qualifies outside of that, they would also be considered for the program.

My concern is the risk of the funding loss, right? And because in the past year we haven't had anybody in that continuum of care utilize it, I'm wondering if they're still going to be able to find anybody in that continuum of care, and that's why I need to know how are we getting this out there. Also of interest, didn't realize that the person that wants to use this program has to find a rental location themselves that's going to agree to this, which is an interesting caveat. So I think that that needs to be indicated in whatever our website and our literature and whatever it is that HRC or any is it going to be any other supportive care, not just HRC?

Yes. So it's opening up to all continuum of care partners to give them priority. I have reached out to multiple partners and informed them of the potential changes if approved tonight. And they've all informed me that they have lists of people that they feel would qualify for this program. Good. So the idea is to get this if we get this approved tonight, to go ahead and open it up so that we can spend this money and meet our obligation under the home ERP

allocation And it's just for the security deposit. And utility. And utility, that's right. And utility. Okay. All right, thank you. I appreciate bringing this forward back to CDBG committee and lowering down some of the criteria. And hopefully we will get some people that actually use it. So I'm happy to move this forward.

All right. Thank you. Good question. Moved by council member Gutierrez and seconded by council member Barrios. Any other discussion? Hearing none, I'll call for the vote.

Mayor Pro Tem Bellido?

Yes.

Council Member Tavallaris? Yes. Council Member Gutierrez? Yes. Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Council Member Dimitriou?

Yes.

Council member Barrios? Yes. Council member Gellenhammer?

Yes. That's approved unanimously. That ends the consent calendar. Next is reports from mayor Slater. Appointments of city council members to regional boards and committees. I thought it would be a good idea just to bring this up at the council level and so we can make sure that everyone is comfortable with the committees they're currently serving on. I'll just ask, does anyone wish to make a change or anything? Or they're happy where you're at?

I am happy where I'm at.

Well, I'm happy where I'm at, but they haven't had any meetings. Oh, wow.

I will let you know that was a meeting yesterday that I'm sure you couldn't make because you're at school, but at work. They said they invited you, asked.

No, I didn't receive an email. I usually would get one

from That's too bad. But anyway, I can assure you that they are going to be meeting on a regular basis and we gave them a whole list of things we'd like to see them do. Which I'm sure you would agree with.

Well, would be nice since I'm the member on it that they would have invited me to it.

They said they did. I asked. I will

reach out to Karen myself. All right, thank you.

You should. Okay, it sounds like everyone is good. Let's see, does this require a motion? I guess not. Everyone's good. All right. Thank you for mentioning that. Council Member Gutierrez.

Mayor, could we please get a vote for that?

You do. Okay. Well, good. Thanks. We have a motion from Councilmember Demetra, a second from Councilmember Barrios. I'll call for the vote.

Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Councilmember Tavalares? Yes. Mayor Pro Tem Bellido?

Yes.

Council member Gallenhammer?

Yes.

Council member Gutierrez? Yes. Council member Barrios? Yes. Council Member Dimitrios?

Yes.

Approved unanimously. Okay. So this is, an opportunity for council members to make brief announcements. Does anyone have anything they would like to announce? Yes. Council member Dimitri.

Real quickly, just, I represent the city on the Orange County Sanitation District and we're very proud of the sanitation district. This is the one thing you probably never wanna talk about, but it's a good thing. Some of our sewer replacement here in the city of Orange is coming to a completion on East Taft. The portion from Glacelle to Tustin Street is done. It's repaved.

Don't know if you guys have seen it, but the repaving and striping look amazing. The other portion that is on the other side of Tustin Street from Tustin just past the 55 Freeway is coming to a completion. Will that that project will then shift on to Sacramento in May and will last about three months. The final paving and striping on Tustin Street and that portion of East Taft will take place sometime during the summer. I don't have an exact date.

Also, on good news, the Orange County Sanitation District was once again for the thirty second consecutive year received a certificate of achievement in excellence in financial reporting due to our strong financial stewardship of the agency. And that will complete it. If you have any desire to get a newsletter, the sanitation district does put out a newsletter on sand.gov. Feel free to sign up. Be some interesting reading in June.

Thank you. Very vital function of the county. And who's gonna be the next chairman?

I will find out next week. Alright.

Good luck. Council member Todd Valaris.

Thank you. On April 18, we did our monthly cleanup of Canal Street which is the street right behind the old Mall of Orange. We had about another 20 bags cleaned up from the old mall site and the other side of Canal. And speaking of Councilman Gutierrez, since you're still on the Schools Committee, I'm having a hell of a time again with Peralta. The school board owns that of course.

There are beer cans there every weekend. They're renting it out. I've gone through four now superintendents since I've been on this council begging them on behalf of the neighbors to clean up that area and they just just say this is just my opinion but they have pipe dreams of what they're going to do there with no money. But anyway, I just want it clean for my residents, please. Thanks.

I agree. Mayor Pro Tem Bellotto.

Yes. As you know, one of my roles is I sit on the transportation corridor agencies representing the city, which is the 241 and the 261 Toll Roads. Excited to announce that the TCA now has 3,000,000 account holders. They're very excited about that. But more importantly, the TCA is going to construct a direct connector between the 241 North and the 91 Freeway, as that backs up in the evening.

So they completed negotiations with Caltrans to make that happen. And a few months ago, they completed negotiations with the OCTA. So now that project is going to move forward, and construction is expected to be completed by 2029. Thanks.

Very good. Any other reports? All right. We'll move on to 5.1. And Council Member Barrios has a proclamation she'd like to bring forward for consideration. Council member Barrios.

Thank you, mister mayor. So this is a proclamation that was brought to me by members of our community. And as we often do with so many of our proclamations, a lot of times, just like we heard tonight about SCC and its veterans programs, they are often an opportunity to set the record straight, share history, and kind of make sure people know the bigger story or an unheard story. And this one, when it came to me, seemed really valid and worthy of consideration by my colleagues. So what this is for is for the city to create a proclamation for May 1, International Workers' Day.

I, too, had preconceived notions about what that meant. But with the research that was provided to me and what I did on my own, it is actually a history that starts right here in The United States. Very interesting. I have in your packets, I included a copy of the actual proclamation. So what I'm seeking here tonight is, I guess, just a I don't know if we we have to do a full vote. Yes. So I'm moving that we recognize this day and do the proclamation for the members of our community. So I'm going to move that.

Shall we hear from the public? Yes. I'm sorry, Council Member Gutierrez?

I will second but I also wanted to add that this is in the Cypress Street Barrio story map as well. And we are currently working on Al Medina one as well, and it's in that as well. So it is historical context and information that we need to make certain that we keep informing our public, keeping them abreast of what happened in the past and the history. It's important to know what happened in our own city. So I welcome you all to see the Cypress Warrior story map and soon to be seen the Al Madina story map as well.

All right. We have four speakers. The first one is Mary Oberschleich, followed by Ryan Johnson.

Council members. I am going to skip my bona fides and get right to the point. I stand before you tonight to ask that each of you approve counsel Woman Barrios' agenda item for the May 1 proclamation, celebrating the workers of Orange and acknowledging our workers' history. Why? Just as the women at Everett Mills in Massachusetts in 1911 demanded, we too demand bread and roses.

We deserve more than just drudgery and survival. We, the American people, stand on the shoulders of giants that struggled for a democracy committed to guaranteed rights in a system of laws that serves all people. May 1 is a globally recognized labor holiday that pays tribute to American workers that struggled and died in the late 1880s for the eight hour day that we now take for granted. But for how long? I mean, we face an authoritarian no fascist government led by an increasing imperialist president and the billionaire class that he serves that want to dismantle our rights.

Now, some of you may have been educated that this is a communist holiday. While it's true that The USSR celebrated May 1, let's not be misdirected or naive. The majority of nations on our planet celebrate the contribution of workers everywhere and pay tribute to the brave men and women in The United States that struggled for a better way of life. Now, I, for one, will not blame any of you for your manipulated education. One of the wealthiest all the wealthiest people in the world created a system to keep you ignorant of our history.

Well, knowledge is power. To that end, I've prepared a reading list for you. I'm sure you all have an Orange City of Orange library card. We also have examples. I've pulled some of the books that you can read.

I also have one for the city manager. So a reading list for all of you. Know that in our community in Orange, in 1936, workers were brutalized, even murdered by the lackeys of Richmond with no care or regard for the people that make our city in fact, our nation great. History is said to be prologue to the present. Currently, the American people are engaged in a struggle against an authoritarian takeover of our government.

We cannot let the billionaires and their lackeys in government dismantle the democracy we, the people, have struggled to create for a more perfect union. The proclamation is a small gesture to the working people of Orange. We demand our history be acknowledged. We demand bread and roses. Vote yes.

Thank you, Mary. Next is Keira Dawson followed by Ryan Johnson.

Is Keira here?

By the way, city clerk, the order keeps changing on the speakers. I don't know if you're aware of that. Because it was Ryan Johnson next, now it's Kira. But Okay. Alright. Thank you. Alright. I'm sorry. Kira, please start.

Sure. Thank you. Hello.

You have three minutes. Council. You have three minutes.

My name is Kira Dawson. I'm an Orange resident living in council member Barrios' district. I'm a Cal State Fullerton alumni and current graduate student there, gaining my master's in American studies. I'm wrapping up my first year. I am here today to urge the city council to support the proclamation on this evening's agenda in recognition of May Day to commemorate workers' history.

The protections advanced by the American workers we're recognizing have shaped the very fabric of this city. I know this as a worker myself and daughter of a teacher and granddaughter of an iron worker, both proud union members who built a life for themselves and myself in Orange County because of the hard won protections we want to commemorate today. As a student of American history, I feel that it is important to facilitate the remembrance of our public history. This proclamation, is the city council's opportunity to do just that. Thank you for

your time, and thank you

to council member Barrios for bringing this forward.

Thank you, Kira. Next is Ryan Johnson, followed by Michael O'Neil. Hello again.

I'm a resident of Orange District 1. I made this, request for the resolution last time I was here, and I I really don't understand why we wouldn't want to acknowledge our history. I know that we've moved Labor Day to September in a way to distance ourselves from the philosophies and hard work of the people that risk their lives for our eight hour day, which we all expect is standard. And people don't seem to have a problem with that, recognizing that, but for some reason, we wanna hide the fact that May Day started here in The United States. And in Orange County, we had the citrus strikes and the workers then were harassed by police and the American Legion.

And I think it's important to acknowledge that history. And, I'm just here to support that. I won't reiterate what everybody has said, but I just wanna say I urge you all to support the resolution. Thank you.

Thank you, Ryan. Following Michael O'Neil is, Janna Anderson.

Good evening, counsel. I just wanted to take a second to reiterate what some of the other citizens have said and thank the council for looking at this resolution. And as you guys read it and as I have it in front of me, there doesn't seem to be anything in this resolution that attempts to rewrite history or hide history. We know that, as Ryan mentioned, Labor Day was created by Grover Cleveland in an attempt to move and change history. And we won't go into all the history of that, but it's certainly able to look up on why we celebrate Labor Day and instead of recognizing International Workers' Day like much of the rest of the world.

So I just ask the council to, in reading this resolution, as I have, that basically at the the end of it says, International Workers' Day in the city of Orange recognize May 1 as International Workers' Day in the city of Orange, and encourage residents, businesses, and community organizations to acknowledge the contribution contributions of workers and to support efforts that promote fair and safe working conditions. So I can't see any reason why a common sense individual wouldn't say,

I agree to that.

So good luck.

Thanks, Michael. Last speaker is Jenna.

Good evening, Mayor Slater, Mayor Pro Tem, and City Council members. My name is Jana Anderson, and I'm a resident of Orange. I'm here to speak about the importance of May Day and its American origins. The misconception is that it is a communist or socialist holiday, but that is not true. May Day is officially celebrated in 66 countries and unofficially in many more, but is rarely celebrated in the country of its origin, The United States Of America.

As a former small business owner, I appreciate the dignity and importance of the everyday worker. The workers who put on a uniform, get their hands dirty, whether with grease, dirt, or dish soap. The workers who keep our homes, buildings, and cities clean and safe, the people who sell, prepare, and serve our food, professionals who teach our children and grandchildren and take care of our sick. I'd like to read a quote from the IWW website. History has a lot to teach us when we remember that people were shot so that we could have an eight hour workday.

If we acknowledge that homes with families in them were burned to the ground so we could have Saturday as part of our weekend, when we recall that eight year old victims of industrial accidents marched in the streets protesting working conditions and child labor only to be beat down by police and company thugs. We understand that our current condition cannot be taken for granted. People fought for the rights and dignities we enjoy today, and there's still a lot more to fight for. The sacrifices of so many people cannot be forgotten, or we'll end up fighting for some of those gains all over again. This is why we celebrate May Day, and this is why we ask you to give recognition to the workers in the city Of Orange.

And I'd also like to thank council member Barrios for her support of this proclamation, and I hope you can all support it as well. Thank you.

Thank you, Janet. Bring it back to the council. Councilmember Gillenhammer.

Thank you, Mayor. I'm going to vote no on this, but I want to explain why. But first, I wanted to thank Councilmember Barros for bringing it forward. I do think we need a proclamation to celebrate labor. I agree with the sentiments of the speakers as well.

We do have Labor Day, and I and we should send this proclamation out on Labor Day. This holiday was considered on inception, and the specific reason why the date wasn't chosen was entirely due to socialist anarchist groups, and that's why it was shifted to September. We can celebrate labor multiple days, but we have a day established. I think we should send the proclamation out on Labor Day.

Thank you, council member. Mayor Pro Tem Billeteau?

Yes, echoing Councilman Gillenhammer, I want to briefly share my concerns. First, I want to clearly say that I support recognizing and appreciating workers. They're the backbones of our community, and they absolutely deserve to be honored. But that said, we already do that in The United States with Labor Day when Grover Cleveland established Labor Day, the first Monday in September. And it was intentionally set in September to avoid the political tensions and associations tied with May 1 at the time with the socialist movement.

And that context has not completely gone away. While some people see May Day as a simple celebration of workers, others see it through a more political lens. Because of that, adopting this proclamation would come across as taking a position, whether that's the intent or not. And as a governing body, I think it's important to focus on things that bring our community together. We have plenty of ways to recognize workers that are widely supportive and unifying. And so for that reason, I will not be supporting this proclamation, but I do believe that we should press a proclamation recognizing Labor Day in September. Thank you.

And Councilmember Baios?

Yes, obviously, fairly obvious where this is going to go, which is disappointing. Think several things I find it a little funny because several things have come through that have been highly political. And there have been things that I deeply disagree with. But they've gone through anyway. Obviously, the majority is going to rule, that's to be that. And I understand. And it's just really disappointing that we can't just see clear that we're trying to show what the history actually is.

But

that's that's the the way way it it goes. Goes. Thank Thank you. You.

Taspar Gutierrez. Sorry.

And again, this is not so much a Labor Day. It's an International Workers' Day. And it is, as we heard the speaker say, internationally recognized in many other countries. In Mexico, it's celebrated on May 3, and they call it El Dia del Albanyl, which is Workers' Day. And they have parades, and it's their May Day parade with all factions of workers and labor that walk and are proud to walk and carry their tools with them down this parade.

And my father-in-law is one of them, and he walks the parade, and I would watch videos of him very proudly. And I don't see this as being political. I see it as reminding ourselves of history, and it's an International Workers' Day. It's not Labor Day, which we do have. But this is remembering our history and why not celebrate who got us that eight hour work day.

So I'll just add that I appreciate the sentiment. I know that there's been a lot of injustice and abuse of various groups of labor over the years, and this process has brought to my attention some history that I wasn't even aware of. It certainly wasn't taught in school. But given that, because of the taint that I guess it's kind of hijacked by some socialist countries, and the fact that we do already celebrate a Labor Day unique to The United States, I agree that we should do a proclamation for Labor Day because workers need to be recognized and appreciated and respected. But that being said, I cannot support this particular proclamation either.

But we do have a motion on the floor, Council Member Barros, seconded by Council Member Gutierrez. And is there any further discussion? Then I will call for the vote.

Council Member Tavalares.

I'll be abstaining.

Council Member Gutierrez. Yes. Council Member Gellenhammer. No. Mayor Pro Tembilito? No. Council member Dimitriou? No. Council member Barrios? Yes. Mayor Slater?

No. Motion fails with four noes and one abstention. I can't remember all the noes, but it was council members Dimitriou, myself, Mayor Pro Tem Billadeau and council member Gillenhammer. The abstention was council member Tavaleris. Okay.

Are there any AB1234 reports? Please don't disrupt the meeting. Please give us the respect that we gave you. Annual presentation of local appointments list of all city boards, commissions and committees. So you see in front of you all of the boards and committee members who would like to renew.

In addition, Perla Lozano, who is currently serving on the CDBG committee, would love to serve on the Parked Planning and Community Events Commission. That is supported by council member Gutierrez, whose seat this is. And I also interviewed Perla, and she would be fantastic. She's the head of the youth soccer organization as well. And there's going to be two vacancies coming up.

Jack Schroeder has decided he would rather enjoy retirement and no longer serve on the audit committee. And Rick Martinez has felt that he has served well on the Planning Commission, but that he voluntarily is asked to let someone else take his place, and that will be Mayor Pro Tem Billadeau's appointment. So with that, I would entertain I'm sorry, we have Councilmember Dimitriou.

Yes, Mayor. If I can respectfully ask you remove Mr. Vasquez from consideration tonight so I can speak with him? He is on the Planning Commission as my appointee.

Okay. All right. So we have a motion from Council Member Tavaleris. Would that include giving Council Member Dimitra a chance to talk to David Vasquez in postponing that reappointment? Okay. Looking for a second. I'm sorry. First, I'll ask for a second, then we can have discussion. Is there a second? Thank you, Council Member Gutierrez. And you would like to ask a question.

I would. I was just looking over at the attendance list, mayor, of the different people that sit on the committees. And there was some committees and I'm trying to find it really quickly where some of the committee members

I noticed that

Attendance is like 33%. And I'm just wondering if we should reach out to those individuals and find out if they can no longer serve. I'm grateful for them serving, but if their attendance is so low, perhaps they have other things, the reason why they can't attend. So that's something that I'd like you to bring back and maybe speak to those individuals and see if we can find out, do they want to continue? Can their attendance improve. But I'm looking at Park and Planning Commission had 33 about two or three people.

DRC member also has very poor attendance.

Yes. And then yeah, DRC as well. And then on CDBG as well. And so quite a few committees had some low attendance. So I just wanted you to look at that and bring that back.

So just to follow-up on that, I had a discussion with the city clerk. And the good news is all of the poor attendees have had valid excuses and have not just not shown up, they have had excused absences. Is that correct? So with that, I thought I know some of them have had personal challenges in their lives. I would be happy to I would like to move forward, I would be willing to contact them all. If they decide, no, I'd rather not continue, then they can pull off.

I completely understand because I know one of my committee person had gotten cancer and whatnot. These are things that we need to reach out and find out. And I appreciate them being on there, but their attendance is low as something's going on and maybe this is not the right time for them.

Well, other good news too is now we have seven members on everything but the library board. So if a couple are missing, it's the committee can still function thankfully. I'm glad you mentioned that though. We have a motion again from Council Member Tavallero, second from Council Member Gutierrez. Any further discussion? The motion is to approve all the recommended actions, I assume, with the exception of David Vasquez. Call for the vote.

Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Council Member Dimitriou?

Aye.

Mayor Pro Tem Bellido?

Yes.

Council member Gutierrez? Yes. Council member Tovaloris? Yes. Council member Gillenhammer?

Yes.

Council member Barrios?

Yes.

Approved unanimously. Thank you. Reports from city manager.

Yes. Thank you, mister mayor. At this time, there's nothing formal to update you on. But during public comment, we did hear from several tobacco retailers regarding their concerns with the adopted ordinance. I wanted to let you know staff is currently working on some adjustments, specifically that two to six a. M. Refinement. But prior to bringing it back to the full council, we'll make sure that we reconnect with speakers so their concerns are fully understood and considered. With that, nothing further to report.

Great. Did you wanna speak on that, council member Barros?

Yeah. I just wanted on record. I know we've spoken about this, but I wanted on the record that what I, at this point, have asked for is that we convene a meeting before it comes back and that we invite some of the retailers who are represented here tonight to be part of that discussion so we don't have to go through this again because we've missed something else that's important to them or that affects, you know, the good actors within our city that are paying sales tax and contributing to our base. So thank you.

Thank you, city manager.

And I'm sorry. I do want to add to that council member Dimitri has asked to join me on that.

Very well. All right. We have two public hearings. The first one, item 9.1, is a public hearing to consider a request to subdivide an existing vacant site and construct 15 detached three storey residential dwellings at 715 West Fletcher Avenue and finding of California Environmental Quality Act exemption at ENT 20 five-fifteen. And I understand there is a staff report.

Yes. Thank you, Mary. Presenting the project tonight, we have our planning technician, Elisa Yerkovic.

Good evening, honorable mayor and council city council. As I mentioned, my name is Alissa Jorkovic. I am a planning technician with the community development department. And today, I will be presenting you the residential project of Fletcher 15. So the project is located at 715 West Fletcher Avenue.

The request includes a small lot subdivision, major site plan, administrative design review, and a tentative track map to subdivide a 0.72 acre lot for the development of 15 residential units. The site is located within an R3 zone and has a general plan land use designation of low medium density residential. The proposed 15 unit project includes one affordable unit, which allows for a density bonus and a reduction in development standards, such as setbacks, open space and parking. The residential project is located in a residential zone and complies with all state density bonus laws. No zoning code changes or general plan amendments are requested within the project.

And then the site, which you can see in the image, is accessed from Fletcher Avenue, and the homes are orientated towards a private T shaped driveway. The project is designed with a Spanish Colonial Revival architectural style. The detached single family homes are three stories with two car garages. The project is compatible with the surrounding multifamily development in the neighborhood. On February 19, the Planning Commission voted seven to zero to recommend approval for the project to City Council.

Staff recommends that the City Council adopt Resolution 11,662, approving ENT 20 five-fifteen, and finds the project categorically exempt from CEQA. To date, staff has received two public comments submitted electronically. That concludes staff presentation. Staff is available to answer any questions, and the applicant is also here this evening to provide any additional clarification. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Questions of staff? Council Member Baios.

This is a question for our city attorney, and this is specific to the letter we received late from the Kennedy Commission. Did I get that right? At the Kennedy Commission. I think this was in the staff report too. But I think they're arguing about a regulatory issue or potential regulatory issue that we may or may not how material is that? It sounds more like it's more of just an opinion than it is that this has is, in fact, following all the rules of those regulations.

Thank you for the question, Council Member Barrios. That is correct. The project before you has gone through all of the regulatory based on the state density law because this is a subdivision lot project, and it does qualify for some reductions in some of the regulatory requirements. And this project and all of its documents went to the Planning Commission as well and it comes before you vetted for your consideration tonight. Thanks. Thank you.

So therefore, it's legally defensible. Okay. And while, for the record, I would have liked to see at least one other unit be put on this property considering how many units we're putting on this property. Appreciate knowing that we are well within the regulatory

Thank you. Council Member Tadaliris.

Thank you, Mayor. Russell, this is my district. I haven't heard anything from the applicant since day one, so I find that kind of unusual. But my questions are, have there been any crime in this because it's been an empty lot since when?

Approximately.

So has there been any crime there? Because I know every time I drive by there's just things parked there.

I'm not aware of the crime reports for this specific And

did the applicant talk to any of the adjacent neighbors? Knowing that I know that there wasn't anything outstanding on my end, but I want to make sure that is there anything we have to do to because of the tight fit here with neighbors that are next to that?

I'm not aware of the communication, but the applicant team is here this evening and they may be able to respond to that comment. It's not Oh

yeah, that's why I'm disappointed.

It's not a requirement that they, I guess, reach out to the neighbors. We do a public notification.

We have done that?

Yeah, we did it for Planning Commission and for City Council, a 300 foot radius. That's required by our code.

So we did not hear from anybody. We did

not hear back from anybody.

Okay, thank you. That's it, Mayor.

I'm sorry, Russell. Did you say the applicant is here?

Yes, they are.

Okay. Did you want to ask the applicant any questions?

I'm going

to ask

it, my colleagues.

Okay. Councilwoman Gutierrez.

Yes, piggybacking on Councilmember Barrio's question in regards to the Kennedy is it Kennedy Commission? I'm not going say Kennedy Center Kennedy Commission letter. In regards to the density bonus law, I understand because of the square footage, he was allowed 30%, which gave him four extra units, which is fantastic. That's what brought it up to 15, because if not, it was going to be 11. And my only question is, is there a requirement as to how many units you make affordable? Is it like, Okay, that gets you one affordable unit only? Or could he have done two or three affordable units there? I'm curious.

Yeah, sure. The state density bonus law sets forth affordable housing requirements if you want to qualify for density bonus. So depending on the level of affordability, there's a calculation that determines your level of density bonus that you would achieve. And so based on the applicants what do they do? What level of affordability? 50% area median income. That allows them to have the additional 30% of the units, which equaled four for this particular project.

And I understand that part. Just wondering if was he boxed into only doing one? Could he have done more?

Oh, it's totally the applicant's choice of how they want to qualify for the density bonus. It's been my experience that most of the time they provide the least number of affordable units as possible to get the largest density bonus that they could achieve. But it's up to the applicant to propose the project that they would like to.

And in the past six years well, haven't been here six years. The past six years that I've been here, I have yet to see a project come before us that is having for sale homes at and including an affordable build in there at very low or low income level. I don't know staff that has been here six years. Can you I cannot recall a project coming forth. So that made me very happy.

If the applicant is here, just know that I wish I would have seen more there at this project. But I will let you we'll hear the public comments, but there's more I want to talk about this project. But I was curious as to if they were limited, how that density bonus law operated, that you do one, you get 30%, you do two, you get 60%. I don't know. I just didn't I wanted to know how that operated, because I would hope and I appreciate staff's efforts on this as well, and I hope that we continue walking down future projects on this avenue as well.

Because as you know, for our arena numbers, that's the hardest area for us to reach, and we don't have very many of those units. We get them in the senior housing, but not actually for sale homes. So this is good, but we need more. So I appreciate it, and I'll let public comment.

All right. Councilwoman Demetriou. Two real quick questions. I don't recall. What was the property prior usage?

It's like a street sweeping service.

All

right. So in the environmentals, there potting to ensure that the soil is not contaminated?

This project was categorically exempt from CEQUA as an infill project.

Okay. Then the second question is, is the project two car garages or one car?

Two car.

And is there going to be restrictions to must park in the garages as opposed to the garages being used for storage? Because parking on Fletcher is already pretty difficult with spillover from the multifamily surrounding this project.

Well, there's very limited other places to park them other than within your garage. We do make sure that they provide the amount of parking that's required for the project, but it's difficult for us to make them park their cars in their garages.

Well, we've done that with projects in the past where they've been conditioned that it's on their I forget how we did it. I think it was on their deeds. It was a deed restriction that mandated that cars had to be parked in the garages as opposed to on the street. If it's a two car garage, should fit two cars and not be used for storage. So that would be a condition that I'd want to see in All right. Thank you.

Any other questions of staff before we open the public hearing? Councilmember Barnes.

I think just following up on what council member Named Tru is it would either be it would be a condition and for it to be placed within their CCNRs, I think council member Bill Vildo said. And that would be I would agree because otherwise we'll be right back here looking for parking permits for the next street over.

Councilor Mayor Tullers.

I'm sorry, was actually one of the questions for the applicant. Knowing that there's just 10, is there no kind of HOA or anything that's governing these properties?

There will be. They'll need to do because they're shared common space, a private street, that they'll need to have covenants and conditions and restrictions, so CC and ours. So there will need to be some type of HOA service for the landscaping area And that

would be my request if we had a meeting is that there are deed restricted in the garage that they don't rent out the garage to students and they're not parking on Fletcher. That's already a problem.

I think the applicant could speak to those things.

Thank you.

Would you like to wait till the public after the public hearing? Okay. All right. This time I'll open the public hearing. We have two speakers. I'll call forward Matt Hamilton followed by Adrian Gladson.

Property owners and applicants. Just want to quickly thank staff for all their efforts in getting us to this point. It's been a smooth process, and we really appreciate it. I want to point out this is going to be a very environmental friendly project. All of these homes will have solar panels.

They'll have high efficiency or energy efficient fixtures, appliances, water heaters, low water flow fixtures, drought tolerant landscaping, and lots of other green features. I think it was mentioned the project is CEQA exempt, which shows it will have negligible impacts to the neighborhood. To address some of the comments, we did reach out to some of the neighbors. Not all of them. I think there's maybe 50 different homeowners that kind of surround us in the various condos.

But we definitely did reach out to some of them. Two public notices did go out. All the feedback we've received has been positive. There will be CC and Rs. There will be an HOA for this project. The CC and Rs will include requirements that residents park in their garages. Garages are not to be used for storage or anything but parking. We did do soil testing on this property. So we did a phase one environmental report and then also did a phase two with sampling

of

the soil. All the sampling came back clean and shown it was appropriate for residential use. Sorry, I'm just going through my notes here. In terms of the affordable set aside, we elected to set aside one unit. We could have set aside more units and gotten additional density bonus.

I think the maximum for this site under state law, you could take it up to 22 units. But we try to balance what's appropriate for the neighbourhood, what's economically feasible. And in this case, we felt that 15 detached homes fit in nicely with the neighborhood. It's basically the same density as everything around us. So we thought that was the appropriate project to propose. We're very excited to move forward with construction, looking to get this going by the end of the year, and happy to answer any other questions you may have.

Thank you, Matt. This is public hearing time, but please be seated. If there are other questions, we'll call you forward. I was expecting a different Matt Hamilton quite frankly. But anyway, nice to meet you. Adrian Gladson.

Mayor and members of council, the applicant has all the time they need later so the clock doesn't need to click. But just for a point of contact, I'm in front of you and mayor pro tem Billido, and all the members of the council. I submitted written comments on this electronically, and I'm a little bit conflicted and a little bit struggled because there was an error with our processing of the ordinance for removing small lot subdivision in front of the design review committee citywide. I actually didn't catch it myself until March, and your staff has been gracious in understanding that when I brought it to their attention. So I understand there will be some cleanup required, but as we heard earlier with the tobacco issue, ordinances do sometimes need to be tweaked.

And the conflict I have with raising that is that this is an exceptional project. Small lot subdivision projects are really difficult, and this is the first one that's coming through that really does hit the mark. This applicant, Mr. Hamilton, just told you the verbiage that you need to hear from an applicant. Sensitive to the neighbors, aware of the situation where they're located, not maxing the mean density just because they want to make a little bit more money.

Achieving an affordable ownership unit here is phenomenal. And in my letter, I identified eight things that this project does with heights. Its overall height is around 32 feet or under, so it falls under our subdivision, small subdivision ordinance. It has a high peak at one part. But the articulation, the design, the features, the architecture, the sensitivity, which I've already said to you, is paramount.

You guys lived with a project previously. This is the second one in the queue that is in construction. It is clear to us that we need to go back and amend our small lot subdivision ordinance, particularly when it's adjacent next to single family or one story. It's very complicated to make those fit, and privacy is critical in that regard. So I really do want to say how excited I see and hear an applicant that can work with that.

And I do want to commend the two staff members. I had a chance to meet with, the planning technician and walk through these details just to make sure I have this straight in my head. I appreciate that opportunity. I'm sure your legal team has a solution for how you're going to handle the conflict, but I think this is a good project. But there are also details that you may want to go over with the applicant on the features that they did to incorporate that privacy.

Thank you, Adrian. Now I'm going to close the public hearing, bring it back to the council.

Can I ask a question?

Sure. Okay.

Before you close the public hearing Oh, Okay. I think probably appropriate. Just a question for staff. So I know that for the state density bonus laws, we are required to waive a number of development standards. And what I had a question about was, I know that there's development standards, and then there are health and safety standards.

And those we cannot waive. So what I had a question about specifically was two things. I noticed that the center drive aisle is 20 feet wide. And our standard is 25, I believe. And I wanted to know if that is a standard we would typically waive under state density bonus law, Or is that something that falls more under a health and safety issue?

So there's two different topics. Thank you for the question. There's two different topics. One is the state density bonus reduction of development standards, which if any of those are development standards, they would qualify as the ability to have reductions. The second one would be a safety thing.

We would never want to reduce a standard so low that it creates a particular safety standard issue or point of conflict for any vehicles to be in a situation that's unsafe. So the development standards are either in compliance with our development standards in our municipal code, or they qualify for a reduction based on the state density law. And with that, the project is in full compliance. As far as the safety concern, I believe our public works traffic engineering department is here with us as well. They could answer any questions about safety.

Okay. Yeah, I noticed there's when you look at the proposed track map versus the site plan, the track map would suggest that the width is actually 25 between the lot lines. But then the actual paved area is only 20. So I guess that if you backed out of your garage, you could essentially back all the way up to your neighbor's garage door and utilize that area.

Yeah, that's correct. The drive aisle is 20, but each house has a five foot sidewalk in front of it as well. So from your garage, you would have 25 feet to the opposite curb. You wouldn't necessarily need to use your neighbor's five foot sidewalk or driveway either. So you'd have 25 feet from your garage face to the curb on the other side.

Okay. And then the other one that I noticed that was being waived was the actual the throat length of the drive aisle behind the back of the sidewalk as you enter the project off of Fletcher Avenue. I know that our standard is 30 feet. And on this, it's about 10 and a half feet. And do you have any opinion on that, if that causes a safety issue?

I wouldn't have an opinion on safety, but I would say the reduction from 30 to 10 would qualify as a reduction in development standards for the state density bonus law. I would have to rely on our traffic and engineers to talk about safety.

Well, have to see Mr.

Tay

standing in their wings. Maybe he would have an opinion.

Mayor Pro Tem, of the city council. So in terms of this particular configuration and design, is not an uncommon configuration for these cluster developments. We do with the narrowing of the driveway that could potentially provide a traffic calming effect requiring entering vehicles to enter the site a little bit slower. That potentially mitigate any concerns. I would say that would be a mitigating factor, the geometry of the driveway. Okay.

So you've reviewed this and you're comfortable with

the

configuration? Staff has reviewed it and no flags were raised.

Okay. And I would note that I don't think anybody would consider Fletcher Avenue to be a busy street by any stretch. I mean, of course, people are picking up their children maybe during those shoulder hours at the elementary school. But aside from that, I think it's pretty quiet on that street. That's correct. It's a fairly low volume facility. And I would note there's a very important water percolation basin operated across the street by the Orange County Water District, which is a great thing. Okay, that's all my questions, Mr. Tae. Thank you for your input.

And I'm satisfied. Thank you for your response. Lastly, I wanted to recognize, we have a new planner that presented tonight. I want to tell you welcome. I hope you stay a long time. You have a long career here. Thank

you. Thank you. The

public hearing is still open. I know that Laurel Mackin would like to speak.

Thank you. We have a unit over in that area and my concern is is that you've got 15 units there and there's not going to be just two people in that unit. You know how all these units are filling up with our kids and even the high school kids, college kids, which will be driving. So you're allowing two cars, which is husband and wife working, where are all the other cars going to come from go to and park in that? There's only I went by a couple of times.

One time there was nine spaces open during because the people from the other units there, which there are quite a few, park on the street also because they have the same thing. They have more kids coming home and they have to have a place to park. So I'm kind of concerned about the parking over there. And I would like somebody to take that into consideration.

Okay.

Yeah, because if you're putting in 15 units, you know, that's going to be 30 cars just with the husband and wife. So it's going to be a lot. And you've got a school there which kids are coming and going all the time, and it's going to put a lot of traffic on that street.

Okay. So

I'd appreciate it if you'd consider it.

Thank you very much. Could someone please speak to her parking concerns?

Yeah. Each home will have a two car garage as we mentioned earlier. There will also be an additional five guest spaces on the lot in the development project. You said nine?

Yes.

Excuse me, nine. I didn't see the other ones in between there. Nine guest spaces for the 15 homes. And so with those, we hope that that is going to be enough parking. But like we discussed earlier, any parking requirements could be lowered with the density bonus project.

Okay. Thank you. So I'm now going to close the public hearing, bringing it back to the council for further discussion. And I will note that there is a motion to approve made by Council Member Tavallaris and a second by Council Member Barrios. So under continued discussion, Council Member Dimitrios.

Hey, I still sorry, I still had a question for staff. Oh, go ahead. Russell, on the plans dealing with the parking spots, and I've seen another project in town that had to get a little scrappy with on a parking project. It shows here that the spaces are 18 feet deep, nine feet wide. Is the 18 feet considering any type of hangover where it's they're considering the curbside as part of their parking?

And then the spaces that are bordering the two guest spaces that are bordering on the West, the Northwest Side, do those also meet the same requirements of the nine by 18 which is in our code?

Yeah, the development standards, again, an affordable housing project, they qualify for reductions. But the 9x18 would be the typical. So we don't always have them all dimensioned on every lot. But when they dimension a few of them, we just understand that all of them comply with that.

They're not considering any type of hangover as part of that 9x18, right?

Think we should ask the applicant to specify that's Mr.

Hamilton, if you'd like to come forward,

That's it's been a hang up before. We've had a prior court case on that.

The nine by 18 is the dimension of the spot. So if there was a hangover, would be beyond the 18.

Okay. That's what I'm looking for. Thank you, Mr. Hamilton.

All right. Any other questions? Questions of the applicant? Counselor Gutierrez.

Yes. If Mr. Hamilton could come up and tell me a little bit more about with the subdivision, you get to have all these wonderful lots, and with their density bonus, you've got 15 units. And I was really intrigued with your 3rd Floor windows, the rear facing ones to your backyard. Can you tell us a little bit about those? Can you show the

Yeah, went iteration? Elevation.

Yeah, elevation. There we go. There you go. So the private yard elevation, 1A, 1B, up on Top 3rd Floor, those windows don't look like they open. So could you tell a little bit about those windows?

Yes. To answer your question, there was a study done to see how the view angles from the 3rd Floor would allow someone to look into the neighboring properties. And addressing that with those smaller windows. So basically, instead of tall windows that would allow you to look down, they're going to be starting at five feet, so you can't really look down. You're looking out.

Okay. And so if I read correctly, 14, they're fixed 3rd Floor accent windows facing adjacent properties, which is really good to again, sensitive to your neighbors, right? Sensitive to the line of sight and whatnot. And the fire egresses where on that 3rd Floor?

There are the two windows on the garage side are the fire egress, and then one above the front door.

Okay. Okay. Very good. That caught my attention because really with the small subdivision, the mass and the sizing is important to match with what else is happening in the neighborhood. And you've got multifamily what is it? It's an R3, so they're two story multifamily units there as well. And so I really appreciated that the roofing of this I mean, it gets to 35 at the end, but that's not really where your structure's at. It's probably a little lower than that. And then I really like the privacy window, especially for the rear facing. So that caught my eye, I wanted you to speak to that.

So I appreciate that. And again, I really like a lot of this, and I just wish there could have been more affordable. I'm going to keep on harping on that. Thank you.

Okay. Any other questions? Okay. I will call for the vote.

Council member Gutierrez? Yes. Mayor Slater? Yes. Council member Dimitriou?

Yes.

Council member Tavallaris? Yes. Council member Gillenhammer?

Yes.

Mayor Pro Tembilito?

Yes.

Council member Barrios?

Yes.

Approved unanimously. Congratulations, mister Hamilton. Thank you for investing in Orange. Wait. Oh, there you are.

Okay. Yes. Absolutely. So we're going to take a 10 break. Our Our next item, our next public hearing is to consider revision of the master schedule fees and charges to adopt revised fees as a result of the cost allocation plan and user fee study.

Would any of my colleagues like a presentation on this? I am not seeing any questions yet. So this time, I'm going to open the public hearing. We have two speakers. The first is Christopher Sandoval, followed by Adrian Gladson. Is Christopher there he is.

Good evening, members of the council and mister mayor. I definitely would like to extend our sincere appreciation for the support of the city of Orange that we've had over the last few years. Thank you, Mr. Mayor, for throwing the first pitch out at our opening ceremonies earlier this year and definitely proud to say that South Sunrise Little League is happy to be in District 5. So with that, I just wanted to highlight the fact that city staff has been extremely helpful in communicating with us potential changes that are present before on the vote tonight and would like to offer our recommendation or at least suggestion that the tiered approach for the fees would be accepted.

We understand that fees obviously have to change. The low cost that was offered to the leagues for a very long period of time is understandably not sustainable, but an increased approach really helps our league because it lowers the impact that families would face with youth not being able to play rec ball within the city of Orange. The continued subsidy also would allow us to maintain maintain the premier fields that allow our youths to play baseball here within the city of Orange. And at the same time, because of the reinvestments that we put into our facility, it also continues to allow us to support local businesses that we buy supplies from, whether they're groceries to stock our snack bar or even site one that helps us maintain fertilizer and dirt for the fields. With that being said, our league has grown over 20% from last year and that would ultimately, we believe, remain possible with a continued subsidy that would be suggested and the lowered fees that would be offered to our leagues.

When families come from outside the city of Orange that play within the same district, they always mention that we have the nicest facilities within District 30, and we're proud to have that. And I think that that's just a result of our families and also our board that make sure that we continuously reinvest, and that will be continued if the tiered approach is adopted. So with that, we hope to see all of you at all of our games, particularly this Saturday if you've got time. We have games that start as early as eight in the morning and continue on till about three in the afternoon. So, again, that's as a result of our league growing this year. So, again, with that, thank you very much, and let us continue to play ball. Thank you.

You. Mr. Sandoval, thank you for your comments. It's nice, when, staff is given the recognition, that they deserve for their hard work. And also thank you to the parents for all the extra work you put into maintaining those fields and really keeping them at top notch. I know that it's a lot of extra effort, so thank you. Adrian Gladson.

Mayor and members of the city council, as many of you know, I'm a big advocate for the little guy, and I've been consistently looking out for neighbors in Olive Orange, whether I live in their district or not. And I appreciate my ex parte communication opportunity with five of the council members, including my brain can't talk. Council member Gillihammer, council member Barrios Scutera, Mayor Slater, and Jimmy True, on this item so I could talk to you individually about the issue of a flat appeal fee related to either discretionary or nondiscretionary or ministerial items. It's really centered on an ability to provide fairness and opportunity for someone to individually appeal a decision, be it the design review committee, planning commission, up to you or a decision by a director. Right now, there's a deposit fee of $1,000 and the meter runs and that appellant is responsible for all fees connected to it.

I'm only aware of four or five appeals in the last six years in the city of Orange. I gave you a survey of the cities I took a look at to see how Anaheim and Brea, Garden Grove, Laguna Hills deal with this. Most of them do a flat rate. I'm suggesting $250 for a minor decision and $750 for a major. To give a sense of fairness, and yes, this isn't 100% recovery, but it's an opportunity to you for somebody that may want a decision to be relooked at.

I think it should be nonrefundable, and it's an easier process for someone to step forward. Instead of approaching our council members individually, which should still continue if you wanted to bring an item up, for consideration by the council, you could do that with no fee. You do become the appellant and you would change your role. But I think this is really helpful for us to have this process. There are folks in our community that just stop.

If they feel that they haven't been heard, they just give up. And the opportunity to come in and bring a decision forward, particularly now that we've tiered a number of decisions in the administrative process, It gives an opportunity for that decision to be brought to council. Now, again, I know this stuff because this is what I do. Most of our actions have two items connected to it, the one you just approved. That automatically comes to city council.

So if it's a major site plan, a tentative map, it would come to you, so nobody would need to appeal that. They would have an opportunity to talk to you at the council level. But if it stops at the commission, they would need to appeal, or if it stops at the design review committee or staff. So that's what I'm proposing and would hopefully have you consider that.

Thank you, Adrian. I'm now closing the public hearing and bringing it back to the council for further discussion and or action. Council Member Gillenhammer.

Thank you, Mayor. I'll be quick. Jared, I want to say thank you to you, Leslie Community Library Services team, just for the intentionality in a phased approach to raising fees for youth sports and for field use. I think it's the right thing to do to continue to subsidize in this area. And I appreciate the intentionality with doing so.

It still keeps Orange as one of the most low cost places for kids to play sports, and I think that's super important. So thank you. And then Chris, I know you represent many people who have provided a lot of feedback on here, but just thank you for your servant attitude and volunteerism you put into the community and for being here tonight. That's it, Mayor. Thank you.

Thank you, Councilmember. Councilmember Barrios?

Yes. Thank you. I just had two items on well, actually, I just have one item, and it just goes to Ms. Gladson's particular question concerning those appeal fees. I do agree and concur that we've had so many things kind of taken off the docket and that are now going to be in the administrative fashion, I was hoping we could look at that staff would be open to two things.

One and I actually did one more than what you did in terms of the cities you looked at, because I went back and looked at Laguna Hills in particular about how they do it. And again, to your point, Ms. Gladson, yes, a lot of flat fees. But also tiered fees, which I thought was interesting, because it allowed somebody to at least have their voices heard. And if they wanted to pursue, they would still go on and pay more.

But it wouldn't be this running clock of fees that could be exorbitant. And I really don't think we want to be a counsel that's seen as chilling speech and keeping people out of the public process. So if we could just look at that to if we go back and look at that and see if we can maybe break up that fee or maybe just change that language, that is what I'd be asking for, number one. And number two, as far as staff is concerned, thank you for I know we are still waiting on what we're going to do overall long term with the Mills Act. So but I was appreciative to see that the fees were had risen for that.

But they're not crazy. I think for the benefits that you're getting for that, it was long overdue that that was raised up. So thank you for that. And to community services, I just wanted to thank the briefing that you gave going over all these fees and kind of how you were doing, particularly the recreation, that we were able to come to a new agreement, especially for the Little League fields. So that we took a step back, came back down. So there's still some subsidy, that we're tiering it in terms of how it's phased in. I really appreciate you being flexible on that. But everything else looks really good, and thank you for explaining so much of that. So I just wanted to say thank you.

Council Mayor Dmitryu.

Thank you, Mayor. Again, to our community service staff, thank you for working those bugs out. Appreciate, all the effort and the time, to kinda take the hodgepodge of direction that was given and come back with something I think is viable and will work. I spoke with Ms. Gladson as well. I have a lot of agreement with her towards the fee structure associated around appeals, having been somebody that has had to try to raise, when I was not on council to try and get $1,000 when you rely on all your money in order to pay your bills. It's tough only to have it be told no

and no and no, and

you have to keep forking over money to fight and then eventually go to court and win. So I agree with her. I also with what council member Barrio said, I would hate to think that this would be the council that would say we want to chill free speech. I think that's the opposite. So if we can work on that, I don't think tonight's going to have an answer.

But I think that we can come up with something that mirrors like cities, like ideas, and come back with something that's more workable for the public. But the caveat is also it can't be too low that it creates a nuisance on every item and project that comes forward where someone can just drop $25 and then blow a project up for a year and a half. So we have to find that fine middle ground. And I appreciate Ms. Gladson for coming forward and speaking up as a member of the public to try and fix that. Thank you.

Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Gutierrez.

Thank you, Mayor. I also wanted to thank our community service department for listening and meeting with our youth sports teams and for coming together with a really good plan on how we can increase fees but in a very tiered manner. And so I truly appreciate all the teams and community service, and I think we were able to come up with a really good solution. So I appreciate that. And as Ms.

Vance had said, I met with her as well, and I was completely shocked to hear, and I didn't know this, that besides her $1,000 that she paid in order to start the appeal, that there was this running bill quite large. And I'm just astonished the amount that it grew to. And that is not something that I would want for any of our other residents to feel stifled, to be able to if they don't get one of us to file the appeal for them, that they would have to go through that. And I would like for the maker of the motion, who has already made the motion and you've got a seconder, to go ahead and we can improve. But if we could just bifurcate this item out so that staff could work on this, because I definitely think that we need to look at some kind of flat fee or tiered fee.

But it's too much for a non applicant to pay $1,000 up front and then this continuous running bill for staff time is just the I just couldn't believe the amount she paid or was billed. So I would appreciate if the maker of the motion would be okay with that.

We do, by the way, have a motion to approve by Council Member Tovalera, second by Mayor Pro Tem Bellido. Continuing discussion, Council Member Barrios?

My question is strictly procedural. The because it's a public hearing, is it tonight and then it comes back for final approval? Or is it everything going through tonight and so this has to be pulled out as a substitute motion?

Everything would get approved tonight.

So do we have to come up with an idea?

So the recommendation, if it's okay with the maker of the motion and the second, would be to approve the master fee schedule updates tonight with the exception of the development appeal fees and then direct staff to return with the revised recommendation for that strategy.

And I would be happy to share all my all my research.

Okay. The maker of the motion is willing to wait on the appeal fee schedules and move forward with the other master schedule fees and charges proposed tonight. So I wanted I'll chime in as well. I'm curious, Mr. City Manager, how does our proposed fee schedule compare to Laguna Hills? Or are you able to answer that question?

Really I'm just not even able to answer that, right? It's based on cost of service. So the third party matrix, I think we use matrix here, consulting firm comes down, interview staff, walk us through your process. No two cities are alike in this. It's staff time, effort and energy that goes into the fees. As cities, we can't make money on it, right? We're here to recoup 100 based on council policy direction what that fee would be. So it's really hard to comment on that one because generally speaking, no two cities are alike with their fees.

Just curious. But I also concur. I think people should have the right to appeal at a reasonable cost and not just be billable hours because it reminds me of attorneys. So at any rate, would also support coming back with that also and doing a comparison with other cities. It's something that's reasonable and fair.

So there is a motion to move forward with the master schedule fees and charges, hold off on the appeal fees at this point. Motion made by Councilmember Tavallura, seconded by Mayor Pro Tem Bellotto. Any further discussion? Please vote. Roll call.

Mayor Pro Tem Bellido?

Yes.

Council Member Dimitriou?

You're right. Yes.

Council Member Barrios? Yes. Council member Gallenhammer?

Yes.

Mayor Slater?

Yes.

Council member Gutierrez? Yes. Council member Tavlores?

Yes. Proved unanimously. Okay. Ends our public hearings, administrative reports, item 10.1, agreement with the Orange International Street Fair Incorporated to produce the annual Orange Street Fair, Treats in the Streets and Christmas Market and Tree Lighting Ceremony events. This is a staff report, and there's no formal action required. And, we'll now hear, excuse me, from our staff.

Thank you, mayor mayor pro tem, members of council. So the agenda item before you tonight pertains to the city's ongoing partnership with Orange International Street Fair, now operating as Orange Plaza Traditions Inc, for production of key community events. The Orange International Street Fair remains a long standing high attendance event held in Old Town each Labor Day weekend, drawing hundreds of thousands of visitors and supporting local nonprofit fundraising. This partnership has also expanded recently to include production of treats in the streets and the Christmas market and tree lighting ceremonies, which are now produced by the organization under an agreement that's similar to the agreement we have for Street Fair. So under these agreements, the organization manages events, operations, and reimburses the city for costs incurred primarily for direct staff time and other costs.

Staff is in the process of developing an administrative amendment to both the agreements, one for the street fair and then the other for the other two events, but intends to provide counsel advanced notice of those amendments and their key components and then receive direction if necessary. So the key updates include updating both agreements to reflect OISF's entity name change being updated to Orange Plaza Traditions, reflecting its updated five zero one c three status. Also, the tree lighting event for additional years to be consistent with their treats in the streets production schedule, which would take them through 2028. Extending the allowable vendor sales hours for the Christmas market tree lighting event to 7PM, and then finally, including, Grand Street parking Lot Number 1 as approved for closure during the tree lighting ceremony to accommodate parking for the master corral. So following my portion of the report, Adam Feliz, president of Orange Plaza Traditions, will provide an additional update on the past year's events for all three of those as a part of his agreement with the city.

So as a part of this, we're also just asking that council receive and file his report that he's about to give. And after Adam's report, we'd be happy to take any questions.

Thank you. Mr. Feliz, you're up.

Good evening, mayor and city council. It's not often I actually come up with notes, so I knew it might be a long night and I may be tired. The Orange Street Fair successfully produced Orange International Street Fair Inc, successfully produced the OISF event, treats in the streets, Christmas market, and tree lighting ceremony. Collectively, the events were well attended, positively received, and continued to serve as important community traditions of the city of Orange. Following the 2025 season, OISF transitioned to the Orange Plaza Traditions Inc, a five zero one(three), a nonprofit organization, to better reflect the organization's broader mission and long term stewardship of multiple community events.

The strong outcomes from 2025 together with lessons learned during the season now serve as the foundation for our continued planning and future enhancements. Then I'm just going to provide a brief overview of each event. So for the Street Fair, despite the challenging weather conditions of heat, the Street Fair remained a strong, successful, and continued to demonstrate its value as one of Orange's signature community traditions. Participants reported strong sale numbers, reinforcing the event's continued strength, resilience, and economic impact. Looking ahead to 2026, OISF is already working on some enhancements to keep the event fresh, engaging the addition of a new country, which I'm not going to name tonight.

So we're to finalize a few things into the mix, and then we're also working with some existing food boosts to elevate their food menus, and efforts are under the weight to bring in some new commercial and arts and crafts vendors to further enhance the entire experience of the event. For Treats in the Streets, Treats in the Streets was a tremendous successful event in its first year under our production, drawing a very enthusiastic community response and strong participation throughout the event. Vendors constantly or consistently, excuse me, reported having a positive experience, commented on how well organized it was with the help of Brandy, wherever she's at in here too. Thank you for that. And many have already expressed their interest in returning to that this year.

In fact, about the amount of participants we had last year have already committed to us that they will be back, so that's a good sign. Several vendors also shared that it's the most children they had seen at the event, highlighting the strong family turnout and the broad community appeal. Based on this year's success, we'll be we're already looking at enhancements for that event, including expanding some activities and also bringing some additional boost a little bit further down the spoke streets than we went last year. For the Christmas market, the Christmas tree lighting and ceremony was also a major success and delivered festive and memorable holiday experience for the community. Feedback from the market vendors was overwhelmingly positive and the market itself was widely viewed as successful.

As with any first year production, there were some issues that need some redefining, in particular, in relation to the audio and visual aspects of the event. But those have been identified, and we're currently working with the vendors and imposing some things with them and some timelines and some time frames to make sure that we address those for future planning. For 2026, we plan to continue to shaping the market more into a traditional Christmas arts and crafts experience, introduce some views, and then obviously, as we mentioned, implement some audiovisual enhancements as well. Together, these events brought residents, families, visitors, businesses, and community organizations together in a way that strengthens the civic pride and reinforces the traditions that make Orange unique. Beyond attendance and sales, the events created meaningful community engagement and helped support a vibrant and welcoming atmosphere in Old Town.

Thank you, Mr. Feliz. Stand by. There might be some questions. Any questions of staff or Mr. Feliz?

I want a clarifying answer. In the staff report, says extension of all vendor sales activities to 6PM for the tree lighting ceremony. So is it six or seven?

It's a good catch. So in the lead up to this report, we had been in discussion with OPT now regarding the request to extend the hours potentially up to seven and there was coordination between OPT and the master corral. And ultimately, the master corral got on board with recommending an up to 7PM request as well. So we coordinated with the police department to confirm that they were open to that as part of this amendment. And so that changed from the time of the report to now.

Anyone else? All right. Thank you, Mr. Feliz. We have two public speakers. First one is James Couchon, followed by Brandi Romero.

Good evening, mayor, members of council, staff, our first responders. Recently in the non council setting here in this very room, a member of a long standing nonprofit mentioned the ever rising cost of street fair making it difficult for his organization to participate, a sentiment that's been echoed across many nonprofits. A couple of weeks prior, street fair leadership mentioned that the city's purchase of the meridian barriers was going to, that itself, increase the cost of participation by the nonprofits. So while tonight a council where you're considering expanding the programs and expanding the street fairs excuse me, the forgive me for not having the new name committed to my memory yet. But before we're considering expanding their reach and expanding the amount of time that we're going to have the retail and the alcohol sales overlapping with the traditional family programming, I want us to ask ourselves one thing.

Are the fees and the public and the benefits aligned with the best interest in the public interest for the city? Because one thing that keeps coming back across multiple meetings, the same question over and over. And then we're at a time right now where every dollar matters to our city. And staff has determined that these public events, these public activities are outside of the purview of the Parks Planning and Community Events Commission. So the oversight for these events rests solely on the city council.

So your decisions are final. We have no say in this whatsoever. I have tried, my colleagues have tried for the better part of the three years that I've been on this commission to try to get some oversight and reviews on this. So I think that the question is not whether or not they were a success, it's whether or not that at this time that break even events are the best use of the city time and the city resources. And before we do any expansion, let's ask ourselves that. Thank you for your time.

Thank you, James. Brandy Romero.

Good evening, mayor Slater and city council members. As you know, Treats in the Streets is very beloved to my heart. The, first year, I guess in 2023, it was estimated the attendance was 5,000 to 7,000. When Councilwoman Barrios and I saved it in 2024, they estimated the attendance at 10,000 to 12,000. And last year, after partnering with Orange International Street Fair, attendance was estimated at 25,000 to 30,000 people.

It has become a tremendous success, and working with Street Fair was wonderful. At this point, the event has grown so large that it will fund itself, and Ariana and I won't have to hit the pavement and ask everyone for money through sponsorships and boost sales. So I'm so excited about that and also looking at expanding our decorations this year. So I would like to request that you please approve it as is. Thank you very much.

Thank you. Councilmember DeVetriou.

Great. Thank you. Great. Thank you very much. I just wanted to really quickly say I know I was a pretty big let's keep an eye on this for the tree lighting in particular. And I just want to say, when I'm critical, I also like to double back. And when something goes right is to congratulate an organization that ran it. So I think Adam and his crew, with Brian Lockery, with I can't remember everybody that's involved with the Street Fair these days. But I think the whole group did a good job. You're right, there are definitely some hiccups.

You and I have talked personally about it that need to be addressed. And I think some of the changes that are being recommended with the vendors, the alcohol, I think, being that close to where it was laid out, being that close to the event might still need to shut down earlier than the event. That's one of the concerns I continue to have is that you get folks that have been drinking and then start hooting and hollering and doing their thing because they just do. But maybe further down on the arterials, further down on Glacelle, further down on Chapman away from the plaza itself could potentially be a tiered maybe there's a tiered shutdown. And then it gives the opportunity perhaps for booth rentals is that if you're on South Chapman past whatever point that it's $25 more or what have you, that's up to you guys.

But I did want to say that I thought tree lighting overall was a success minus a couple hiccups, and I'm looking forward to another continued year of success. And one of the key things to remember, and I know we're going to be talking about this in a little bit with our budget, is these events wouldn't happen unless people stepped forward. So Adam and Brandy and council member Barrios, these folks stepped forward and did exactly what we asked was find the quarters and the cushions and figure out how to put these events on and they're doing it. So, I wanna say be the one of the first to say congratulations and thank you.

Good comments. Councilmember Barrios.

Yes. I'm sorry, mister mayor. I saw this as a receiving file, city clerk, miss city clerk. So I did not know that we would be voting on changes specifically. So I am stepping off the dais and recusing myself since I have a direct connection to the event.

But no, is a receiving file.

No, there's a

There's a provide direction, but I don't think there was a direct vote.

I'm really confused.

Sort of a two part, right? The first one was to receive and file the report for last year. There is some specific items that we need direction on. Does the City Council support extending the tree lighting ceremony agreement for one year, extending the vendor vendor hour operations to six PM? The other, I believe, is the Grand Street parking lot closure, using that as an approved closure area for the tree lighting event operations. And any objection to updating OISF's legal name to Orange Plaza Traditions?

Therefore, if decisions need to be made, I will step off. Thank you.

All right. We do have a motion to approve the recommended actions made by Councilor Mayor Dimitrios, seconded by Councilor Mayor Tavallaris. Any further discussions? Yes, Councilor Mayor Gutierrez.

For the Grand Street parking Lot Number 1 that we were they're asking to close, how many parking stalls are we looking to close? I don't remember how many are there.

I don't have the exact number right in front of me. I can gather that. But it would be the entire lot being closed, but it's worth noting that we're coordinating with the church that's adjacent so that they'll have some access to parking as well during the event. I can get that exact number.

Do you know Adam?

I don't know if it's all

the number,

but historically, that lot has always been closed for the tree lighting. Yeah. It was just an oversight last year when we came with the agreement. We forgot to include that lot.

Okay. But it's not that it's not, like, really big.

Maybe 35 ish. Okay.

Yeah. I'm trying to visualize it. I'm trying to remember what it is. All right. Thank you.

Yes, Council Member Demetri.

Before you leave, if the parking lot gets closed prior on Saturday night, needs to be accessible to all the churchgoers at First United for Sunday morning. That's always been a problem.

Correct. Correct.

Just to make sure that we let them know. So maybe the two weeks prior or three weeks prior or what have you that their minister can announce that parking still can occur for their Sunday service just so we don't get inundated with complaints.