Plan Commission - Regular Meeting

is 5:30 and it is Tuesday, September 2nd, 2005 at 5:30 p.m. I want to get this planning commission meeting started. I'm going to start with a roll call. Oh, here comes Mr. Renie. We'll wait for him to get in. Thank you. Hey, we have another one. Yep. I hope the mics. They were. You guys are now live streaming. So, yes. Jan, how are you? Good. Right there. There you are. Have a seat.

Welcome. Just getting ready to start with the roll call. We'll start with the roll call. I'll go from this direction. If everyone would state their name and their position, please for the record. Michael Lonberg. I'm filling in for Chris Wisher as current attorney. David Wills, commissioner. Bill Bell. Rick Hornbeck, commissioner. Jag, commissioner. Stacy Kger, commissioner. Riley Jones, director of planning and zoning. Andrea Valon, deputy town manager. Chris Cook, town manager.

Very well. Uh, I'd like to go on to the reading and approval of the minutes. States here we have three sets. I only saw two sets to approve. Yeah. So, we So, we only have So, on here, I listed all the ones that were still pending. The only two that you have to approve or that are ready for approval are your September 5th of 2023 and your July 1st of 2024. And Raleigh, I want to thank you so much for getting these together. We've been asking for these forever. And so, thank you for digging all this out. And then she's she's working on um the rest of them for 2024 and 2025. And we hopefully we'll have those at the next planning commission meeting for you guys. We'll be all caught up.

Thank you. Great. Having said that, I will entertain a motion to approve the two sets of minutes that we have. I don't remember really if this is all we talked about, but it all sounds reasonable. So moved. So moved. Do I have a second? Second. All in favor? I opposed. Motion is carried to approve the minutes of the ones that we have. Thank you. Any comments by citizens present? I see none. Uh

I think she has something that she wants to talk about when we get into some of our business. Yeah, expect that. Uh scheduled request and appearances. I don't think we have any. We're going to run it uh run into new business. The C4 classificating classification ordinance. Michael, do you want to talk about it?

Yeah. So, what we've done is, you know, gone through the statute as it was or the ordinance as it was and eliminated um certain uses that we think the town would not want um within the C4 district as it currently exists. Um, basically this is a shortterm solution to what would later come on, you know, when we do the overhaul of ordinances which is planned um in the relatively near future. I think there are currently three properties that are, you know, eligible for C4 development in Newberg. Um, I believe that's correct. And really only one has not been developed. And this ordinance would essentially help us, you know, not have something come in here in the meantime while we're working on revamping the ordinances, you know, come in here and develop in a way that the town would not, you know, find acceptable

currently. So obviously it's just a draft and um we are open to suggestions and comments and and so the draft of the ordinance is um in your packet as is um a print out of the ordinance where they crossed off the ones that from your guys' suggestions from council suggestions that all end up getting crossed off. So you can see the ones that have stayed on and the ones that um have been crossed off. These are Chris Wishard's uh markups, right? Correct. Yes.

I have a question. We have one that says ordinance 2025, which I assume is the ordinance that's going forward. And it lists barber shop, hair salon, that type of thing, which we deemed inappropriate for C4. And on the red letter edition, which must have been the words, the very words of Chris They're still they're they're removed. So, it's in red, but it's not crossed out, right? What's the difference? Are they underlined or

No, they're So, I think they were they were kept. Um the only things that have been marked out so far um are the things that have the lines actually through them. Um, yeah, at like like you said, the 2025 the one that's labeled ordinance 2025-lb blank is how it's currently drafted. So, if you want changes to that, you'll need to you'll need I'm with you, David, because those are the only those the accessory uses B, C, and D are the only they're read but underlined and and kept It might have just fit up.

Everything else was actually read and marked out. Not anything else is underlined like that. So, was it a something that should have been marked out, but the line was under it went down under the wording instead through it? It's the same for uh under under CI. It's red and underlined as well. I'm trying to see if it's in there as well. Oh, parking lots. Yeah, parking lots. Parking lots. Parking. Yeah. So, that one in the ordinance as well. So, it could just be a font, you know, probably a form for color a color. Yeah.

But, I mean, if you guys are okay with those still being in there, it would just be whatever's on that ordinance. The other the other question I had I thought I I thought there was one C4 left within the town limits. There is. There is. There is. So, there's just one. Yes. That's That's available. That that that hasn't been developed. It hasn't been developed and it's as it stands now a single property. It hasn't been subdivided or anything like that. No. Correct. And I mean I'm I'm sure you can put a barber shop or a bar or cigar bar on other zoned properties, can't you? It's not limited to C4. Am I wrong?

It would have to pull the other ones. Um and it very well could. You could put those in others, but this is that could then go just within C4. So even if C3 has that listed, it could also be listed in. Yeah, there's some overlap. Is that correct, Michael? It could have the same in either one. Yes. I mean, as you go down it gets, you know, it's less restrictive generally speaking as you know, you go through the commercial ranks like C4 is going to be less restrictive than C3 and and so on. But well, okay. But but I don't know as to those particular uses. I'd have to look at the the current code to know. Yeah,

this and I don't know a lot about land zoning. Um, are these zones in place to encourage development of larger scale items like a automobile sales spot or you know shopping center is listed or grocery store rather than a cigar bar and a you know barber shop. Can I answer that?

Certainly. Um, having been around way too long, uh, when when they established the C4 with the parameters that you see in them, that was back in the day when we thought we were going to be bringing in a lot of the Lloyd Expressway strip. So, they were trying to write in things that would work with some I served on the plane commission for many years. I don't know when the last time was that I did, but I remember all that happening. And then Chris knows about it, too, because he and I have had several conversations about that. Well, that's in the past. Now, we've got a C4, but do we really want it to be the same as what we were looking at when we uh created a C4 before?

And that's why we crossed a lot of those uses out. Exactly. Exactly. So that especially that one strip of land that um is probably going to be something that we're going to see happen soon. That's our front door. I I hate it already that we have a brand new storage unit facility across the road, but that wasn't in town. There's nothing we could do about that. But we have an opportunity to make sure that what people see as they come into the town is It is something that we all would embrace. So that's just my two.

So that's probably not a cigar bar.

The only way it could be any of those is if it was a strip shopping center building. Yeah. That included those. Yeah. And it has been very long ago that I I would have thought it would have come to you. I know we at council that someone was interested in buying that and they wanted to put in a restaurant and a few little other retail establishments that would be like a strip center attached to the restaurant. I thought that was good. I mean I don't recall hearing that but no nothing's we've not heard maybe he just came and inquired to town council. Do you remember it Stacy? that was mentioned at the last meeting and it fell through for some reason.

There's been discussions but nothing official has ever come to any any both the realtor and the man. Well, we were thinking that we several of us would like possibly would be a kind of like a strip mall with apartments above above it like we have downtown. I'm not opposed to that. um it would bring in more um apartments or it would bring in more, you know, residential area, but also a nice strip mall.

Did you see to it that I did a nail salon? I really want that. Oh, okay. I'll work on that. I just that property has been for sale for ever. I know what 10 15 years. It's been forever. It's been It's interesting that there is possible conversation about or possible interest. That would be great. You're right. It's the front door. We did discuss possibility of reszone to C3, right? And that was kind that we did talk about. We did talk about that.

Okay. One last question then I'll quiet down. If we have a st strip shopping center that would have to fit the C4 designation. The businesses that are a part of that don't have to fit that, do they? I mean, you could have a cigar bar and a pet groomer and a laundry mat within the strip s without zoning changes. If if we I think if we accept C4 as as it's written here. I mean, if you accept C4 as it's written here, there is a a cigar shop can be in there.

Um but what you're what you're asking is if if we just accept a say someone comes in like we're going to build a strip mall and there's no and there's no designated person yet. You're saying can just anything go in there and they would still have to adhere to that C4 even if they come in with a blank slate. I'm just going to build four units and see who comes. Those four units would still have still have to met, right? I mean, I'm assuming that's right. I mean, yeah. I mean, these are the permitted uses. So, it's it's Yeah. It's not just about the building. What is happening within the building? Yeah.

And I I quickly looked up C3. There are some similarities to C3 and C4, but there's some big differences as well. So that's kind of the two difference, but um we can always give you a list of of both if you if you want. And C3 is less restrictive or more restrictive. Less more. Yeah. More. Yes. Because the closer you get. Yes. Opposite direction. One is the most restrictive. Okay. C4 is the most industrial and commercial. Okay. Yeah. All right.

Well, then should I think there's some confusion on how we came up with this list and maybe Chris came up with some of these but should not be allowed in C4 like um financial institutions. I mean many times there's a branch bank or credit union in a strip shopping center and under this proposal it wouldn't be allowed would it?

So I so I talked to him about that today. So the things that are crossed off were all recommendations for the plan commission or town council. So somebody sent in a recommendation to cross off financial institutions. So he crossed off whichever anybody said. So essentially now this is the list that is left with. But if there is a push to put financial institutions on or say there's a push to put a TV station there, you know, if whatever you guys want, if you look at this and you want something or you think there should be one in there, now would be the time before it goes to town council.

I think quite a while Julie had come up with a long list of what was in C4 then and she sent it all out to us and she said cross off the ones that you think you don't want in C4. That was our homework and that that was our homework and we did that and I think what is left here is what we just no one I mean maybe only one person crossed off financial institution but since one person crossed it off it didn't make the final list I think is what happened. That makes sense. So the ones that are here nobody crossed off.

How many votes does it take to pass this today? How many votes? So essentially this is going to go as a recommendation to town council. But how many votes does it take here? Uh you what? There's five of you here. So a positive recommendation would be three, right?

I'm not going to vote for him. I'm going to abstain. I think this whole system is uh not the individual things but the whole system is a foolish that that's too charged to work. I don't think it's a good way to delineate it. For example, uh you can have uh retail bakery butcher fruits and vegetables. How about nuts? How about legumes? You know, there's always going to be something. So, I just say food. You can sell any kind of food that's legal and services. Any kind of services and you know, just gigantic categories like that. You know, I tend to agree with you, Jim, but right or wrong, this is the way it's pretty much done everywhere.

I know. And that's why I asked how many votes does it take to pass it so that I can in good conscience hold it and let you guys and let you guys go along. So you'll be so you're going to be swayed by her answer. I just think that's and I think basically what we were thinking of on this and andrea let me know if I'm wrong. The C4 that we have now is so broad. We wanted to put something in place that was much more restrictive just so we can head off something that we might need to. Mhm.

But we are going through all of our ordinances and completely revising, updating, whatever. And I think that part of what Jim is saying would easily come in the revision of all of our ordinances. So yes, you are correct. So you'll see it' be the next thing that you guys discuss and and Cook can talk about it when we get there, but um we're looking to do a complete customization of all of our ordinances and that is going to be done through a um a contractor through an engineering firm to do that. So um like Michael said earlier it's a very 26 into 2026. So this is a shortterm solution just to have it because there is so many

just to get in front of it or people have to us talking about it just to make sure how it sells it doesn't Yeah. But it sounds like maybe there's a proposal that's not public that maybe I don't know of any. I've heard we don't really know. We've we've heard people talk. We've heard people say they've heard this or heard that, but no one has officially come to the town with anything. But the property has been for sale. Grims, I think, done in the Grim property. I don't know. Grims. Okay. If it hasn't sold in 15 years, it's either flood plane, poor soil, or too expensive. Probably

I don't think the flu's the problem. But is there a place if the person wanted to open a computer and sell repair shop? I would personally love to have nearby. You've got one bill. Yeah, that's great. But why why are we saying we don't want we don't want a computer repair shop in this location? I I I agree. I I didn't I guess I was confused on how we were looking at these previously.

Yeah. So to me it's an impossibility to say everything that could go in. It's it's just impossible. That's and again I realize I'm an outlier on this and I fully accept the responsibility. Again I disagree with you but so in the new one you just say any technical services any technical services and it could be and in the new customization it could be a broad statement like that.

I have nothing wrong with that. I just wanted I think there's a group of us that just really wanted to get out ahead because we know that that is the last and I think the fact that the storage unit is being built right there that kind of really pushed it to the forefront because we don't want something like that. We want something more for the legal issue. Could we say whatever anybody wants to put in there, come to us first. Whatever. I I like that approach, but I don't know that we can. We've got And I think speaking to that, I think I was going to ask Michael.

I think if something falls outside of an R1, a C1, if they come to the town, that essentially can go to BZA, right? Or it can or plan or it can get reszoned or you can do a PUD or you can do these things that allow things to go in. outside of what is right currently and there's special use permits and things such as that. So why don't just start there just say hey whatever you want to put in this particular lot before you buy it run it by us.

Yeah I think some the reason that they exist in general is to let purchasers know you know ahead of time hopefully that they wouldn't maybe have to go through various governmental boards in order to develop first and get hung up. Um, but I also understand your point um, in saying that perhaps it's not broad enough and that they may end up coming before you regardless.

And but I I would also say there are some broader categories, you know, like retail, apparel, accessories, offices, business, government, professional, um, retail, general merchandise. I I do think a lot of general businesses could go in, you know, fit into these categories. Um, well, like a computer accessory shop, I think that would fall under retail, general merchandise or retail apparel and accessories, offices, business, um, professional. So,

and I know legal wise, like for example, the Driftwood property, um, now that it's up for sale, we've gotten phone calls from buyers and contractors and they want to know what they can put there. And Chris has advised us. All we can say is it is zoned this and you need to look at our ordinance. This is what you can put in there. Us as staff, we can't say, oh, you can put in X, Y, and Z, right? Or here's how. Now, if they have if they come to us and say, "We want to put in this," we can tell them the steps they need to take. But we use this a lot, especially for developers and contractors who want to purchase properties. When they want us to give them an exact thing they can put in, we just refer back to the orphans because we technically can't tell them exactly what they can put in.

It can't be too arbitrary, I don't think. Even though I like that approach just because we'd be open to lawsuits and all kind of liability. to Jim's point what he said. Well, I can't just say technical services I think is the verb it's used. But that but then that could be open that's in whose mind is that what does that mean? That's too that could be too broad where people say well this is a technical service or so is this or so is that? So then we're back to that's probably why some of these items are so specific is because it's happened in the every law is created because there was a misunderstanding of something that wasn't clear.

Something came through at some point something got something in that someone didn't want you know and you know and I know we keep saying it. I mean, we really are I mean, finance has already approved um the ordinance proposal is going to go to council the next meeting. So, um it really is a short-term fix to a much bigger issue with all of our ordinances. So, so with this, I mean, and Chris can talk about a little bit more later, but I mean, we're going to look at every single zone. I mean, R1, R2, C1, I mean, however many we have, we're going to look at all of them. So, um you know this you can make suggestions. Um council's what? Next week. No. Yeah, next week.

Um I don't necessarily know as of right now it's not on the agenda. So, we can hold off another week if you guys want to send different suggestions and send them to Chris. Um I just know it's been a push from council to kind of get this, you know, in place. Um but totally up to how whatever recommendation you guys I agree that some of these things that are most well all of these things that are marked out just first glance I agree that they probably it's things that need to go that we need to protect our town from I guess so to speak

and if it is going to be redone and and cleaned up and all of the ordinances are cleaned up in the future all the designations then it's only going to get better That's the goal for 2026 to get it all done by the end of 2026. And in my mind, it should be as easy of saying, okay, C1, here's what you can do. And then the next thing is, okay, C2 adds these things. C3 adds these things. But that's much easier than it actually easier said than done. much

and if you you know I know I know even um Wisher had talked to me about the financial institution I mean I kind of get the point you know most if there is a strip mall there is usually I mean we they can easily add that in if that's a recommendation from you guys if you guys want that um that was kind of the only one that I saw you know that could be put back in

and I I was thinking possibly they had that crossed off because a financial institute institution would take up a lot of space. Uh with all of your um your ATMs, your um drive-thru, you usually have at least two, if not three. Um that could end up taking half the property. And I don't know that that's a bad thing, but maybe they were thinking more retail for part of it. I don't know. I didn't cross it off, so I don't know. I'm just guessing.

This maybe because financial institution on the other corner. Nope, I didn't do that. Ordinance 2025. This is Chris's summation of what we talked about and what would go to council for approval. Yes. Yes.

Okay. Well, then I I'd like to propose a couple changes. I'd like to delete cigar bar, which is item D. I'd like to delete item J, dog grooming. Item K, dry cleaner. Item M, coin operated laundry. And item O, locksmith. And just that becomes our recommendation unless other things appropriate. I mean, if you look I I can't think of the name of the the development that u Target and Bajis

that's a really classy development that looked great in that property, but you don't see any dog groomers or coin operated. You mean the building that Bajis is in? Well, just that whole area or the pavilion the whole the whole shop. Yeah, it is nice. So, What did you say? Did you say vets? No. Did I say what? Veterinarians. Did you say no? Uh, you said dog. That's That's the grooming. That's the at the very bottom. I I would probably add KK Beth's office to that. Right. So,

I'm not I'm not going to participate uh in this. However, let me point out that we're saying it's okay to have a veterinary a veterinarian there, but not a medical doctor's office. That's what I'm saying. Yes, but I've I I've amended. You don't want a doctor's office, but a vets's office is okay. No, I said I I added vets's office to my list. Now, I think a medical It's on here, isn't it? There's a medical lab. It was changed from medical medical

well is offices medical and dental and then P is medical and dental lab. Oh there okay there there we go back because it was crossed off the medical and dental was crossed off but it was listed twice. Ah, that's why there's a yellow I'm actually there's a red line and dental clinics here but that's because it's on there twice. Yeah. So okay

I mean a lot of these depending on how deep you dive like printing blueprint operation I mean that probably wouldn't exist in a space like this. Nobody does blueprints anymore anyway. It's hard for me to believe that they keep building financialists just like UPS stores. I don't understand the purpose. We have way too many of those. I agree. I agree. It's of course like they keep building. No one goes to the bank. Oh yes, they do. I just think in my mind I You'd be surprised how many people actually come in.

Okay. Is it age? Like is it older people that do it? Well, unless they're applying for a loan. No, I mean, no, we have a lot of young people that come in. Okay. Uh it's more of a service of um I'm a teacher, so you'd be surprised how many young people come in to me and we talk about this is how you do this. This is how you keep from going in the negative. This is how you keep a register. This is how Yeah, there's a lot more of that that goes on than than you would think.

Okay, I'm going to try to push this along a little bit. I'm going back to Chris's note that said, "I'd like to plan ahead for public hearing on the ordinance for October meeting." Okay. So, where are we at in that process? Do we feel comfortable with that's attainable or do we need to No, I think that's attainable with what you added or took away. Would that be something we'd include in Well, others may not agree with what I'm suggesting or what other things added and taken away. Let's go through that list of what you were suggesting. Okay. I would eliminate item D, the cigar bar. Okay. Item J, dog grooming. Okay.

K, dry cleaning. Uh M, laundry, coin operated. O locksmith and KK vets office. Okay. And I think he spoke to the fact they could publish this for public review and we can make changes up to the point where that was published or something. So we this isn't the final draft. No.

And technically we could have one plan commission meeting before that first October meeting if needed. But yeah, I mean, so I marked so I marked all of David's recommendations. Um, did you I guess with going back forth, did you guys want to add back in the financial institution or do you want to leave that cross off as it is? I'd leave it crossed off. Okay. Only because of the space. We got We could change our minds. Oh, sure. Yeah.

Yeah. But there are financial institutions like is there still some kind of a bank in Walmart that doesn't have the ATM and the drive-thru and all that? Yes. Second chance bank. What's that mean? That means um people who have credit problems. They have eye doctors in there, too. I mean, I don't know if you Yeah, you got to be careful.

I mean, again, we can dive so deep if if you think it should be left off. only I'm thinking not necessarily a fin I'm just thinking of the space that a f a financial institution would take up with all of the outline things that they have to have with drive-throughs and ATMs and I'm I'm guess I'm leaning more towards retail um department someone wanted to do it and it could work it could be a it could be a PUD or it could be a single use or some what what is that use building a use term? I can't think of the term, but yes, mixed use. Mixed use.

It could it could be something. So, will you take these to Chris then? Yeah. Yes. Any any edits that happen? So, do we need to recommend this to council at this point or would you want to make a recommendation based on these edits? Yeah. Yeah, I would. I mean, yeah. If you're going to approve it, I would approve it in the form that that you want it. Are you okay with a liquor store? I am. I personally don't drink, but I don't care if they're out there. I'd like to open one about now. I'm with you.

It's the gold mine. The gold mine is that shop is the one there with dominoes. I it is insanity how much pe how the traffic in that it is. Okay. So, what would that re what would that motion sound like? Make a motion to propose the to Yeah. to make a motion to recommend ordinance 2025 or you can say I make a motion amending chapter 57 um with the proposed edits. Yeah, something like that. That's fine. We moved. We Yeah, we have that. We'll take her for wording. So moved. Do I hear a second? Second. All those in favor?

I I opposed. I No. You abstain? No. I'm voting no. You're voting no. Okay. One. No. Three, four. Uh, the motion is passed. Would it have been good to add nuts behind vegetables? Sure. I mean, no. So, let's let's leave it because that could always go under the one that says grocery, correct? Yeah. Well, yeah, I guess I'll just All right. Next. So, just just a quick question. Are we done with this now or will it come back to us in its revised form? I think we just revised it. I

think we're done with it. I think we're done with it. Yeah, I mean you guys made your you guys made your recommendations with those edits essentially. Chris will take those edits to council be really be up to council but with your recommendations on what they what they put in there. And again, this is temporary, right? Until we get 2026.

Okay, next item a new business semicustom ordinances proposal. Yeah, I was just going to bring this up to advise the the commission tonight. Um, we're trying to budget for next year and we put some money in the budget to to put out a a request to partner with a group to relook and look at all of our ordinances top to bottom, which would Sorry, it never fails. Um, and this is just an example. We actually would have to once the budget's approved put out like an RFP or an RFQ and and talk to three other vendors, but I just wanted to get you guys updated on what we're thinking about working on and say if we went with this one, for example, um you know, they would partner with us. They would work through Riley and and Andrea and myself and there would be some recommendations. You guys would be heavily involved in the in the process of discussion and it would look at all the the codes from top to bottom and there would be some recommendations because a lot of them date back to the '9s,

the early days, early days. And um when we have people that want to come in and do the infill, it creates so many challenges because of the lot sizes we have. They have to go visit every board. And one of the complaints we get and the reason we're not doing as much infill as we need to um is because that process has not been looked at in several years. So we put money asideing pending, you know, final budget approval that what we think it would cost based on this one that we've talked to because uh the reason we talked to HWC, they've worked with us on other reports similar to this with the town on your guys' comp plan.

Yeah. So there's a good relationship already there with the town. They gave us this as a price so that we could look at it. But once the budget would get approved, we would start working towards the end of the year on putting like a request out so that we can hit the ground running in 26. And you can kind of read through that. But we mainly wanted to get that in front of you just more of I don't think there needs to be a vote on it or anything, but just as a hey, here's what we're thinking. Here's what's coming. there'll be some opportunity hopefully in early 26 um to start looking at a lot of these things top to bottom uh because we're not annexing, you know, we've got to look inward to get that tax base kind of up and uh this will help that with some other ordinances as well, not just the zoning and planning ones. But are there any questions? I mean, if you have any after tonight, don't hesitate to reach out. Um, before we I would assume before we do an RFP or RFQ, we would come before the board and say, "Here's the language.

Here's what we're doing." And I don't know if we have to do that or not. We don't, but we would if we Yeah. We would keep you in the loop. Yeah.

So, I just if you have questions, don't hesitate to reach out to any of us. Uh, this will be Riley's baby. She'll be the main point of contact once we move forward with this. Andrea and I will be kind of in the background involved. Um, but we really want to look at these things top to bottom mirror what other communities are doing well, but still have that uniqueness that makes Newberg Newberg. Um, but there are some small things that we can tighten up. And this will give us a look top to bottom and really uh set the stage to go after some of this infill and uh go from there because you know the state's made it so hard to annex

and there's I mean you're always talking about annex but uh you know this is another thing we need to do just to tighten up the codes. I mean even like trail codes you know road codes all kinds of stuff but this is a big part of it with the zoning and and stuff. So, and and then I've got if if there's no questions, I've got the next question. Yes, sir. I'm mouthing tonight, aren't I? Usually don't say much. Now that you bring it up, well, dinner's not ready till 6:30, so great.

Um, the previous process that HWC completed was very inclusive and interactive. A lot of town opportunity. I I don't see a lot of interest, and I may be wrong in people wanting to weigh in on zoning. It's more of a in-house.

Yeah, it's more cloistered. Not a lot of If you read through the Did you They have like a breakdown of what the timeline looks like in here. And there are I mean, it's not as open as the comprehensive plan, but there are some opportun these um for input depending on how we want to tailor the process. I mean this is just a blueprint. This we can we could tailor it make it whatever we want. Um there'll have to be some public input at some time on some of the issues I would imagine

but we would probably inhouse lean more on the boards and the commissions for guidance on that. Um, and then the the final input would be like when the council would adopt stuff, that's when you would have your public form and get the information out and uh stuff like that.

Yeah. And they and they just recently did this last year um for Booneville. Redid their whole UDO. They just redid Booneville. So um so they're very aware of this area and stuff. But yeah, I mean really public presentations. There's so much that we have to do legally as part of all this stuff. So, but yeah, and really participation wise, it just is whoever shows up, right? And where that interest lies and some people there was a nice quote from the lady in Booneville that just went through this in the pocket too,

uh, where they had some some recent folks and I think you said like you said that was last year they just did that. Let let me offer my strongest support for this process and not only support but I'm willing to do leg work or whatever it takes to move this forward. This is a this is a wise thing to do. Uh the Haney's Corner Renaissance came about because of a change in zoning. Didn't cost a dime. They just changed some zoning rules and that took off into an arts colony just because they changed. So, it's it's a bang for the buck kind of a deal.

I was saying this love in your comp plan talk about doing this, right? And we've kind of had this in in motion and been wanting to do it since kind of Chris came in and we were already talking about it and then Riley coming in and you guys remember, I don't know if you guys remember, but Riley was our intern during the comp plan. So, she's very much aware of everything that we have. So, all this will kind of fit into that comp plan that we've created and hopefully, like you said, the infill and building up everything

and just in the year I've been here to watch what some of the developers have gone through pain-wise um knowing that if we had this in place it would be a lot more seamless and there wouldn't have to be as much like five months meetings because you know I mean for some simple stuff and I'm not saying everything's a simple solution there does need to be a time for discussing discussion on some of it but other communities have streamlined this process and made it more modern and they've really like you said Dr. Renie um seen a renaissance and it didn't really cost the town a lot of money. we just had to look at our ordinances and update them and have that discussion and uh we feel at least on the you know the staff side that this is something that we've really we've cut a lot out of next year's budget but this is one thing that we've really tried to make room for even with all the stuff that the state has dealt us because this ultimately will be an economic tool as well that will help the town long term. So for the few pennies we'll invest in 26 we'll get untold return on investment for many years to come. So, I just would ask that if you have any questions, don't hesitate to reach out if something comes to us or to you after this meeting. Um, you know, we'll keep you in the loop as we make progress, but the next step would be the the budget for next year getting approved and then we know that it's made it through the process. Uh, we we've asked I forget the dollar amount um a little bit more what's in there just to make

I think we said 50 I think 50 I think is what we asked for um because there was some GIS stuff that we were unsure of that they included in there because we're the GIS is going to be under the next thing that I'm going to bring up on the day but we're trying to get the building blocks in place to build the foundation so that we can really start moving on some of this stuff. Okay. or at least get it to you to decide if we're going to move or not. And this is for information tonight. Yeah. Yeah. We're not. This is justformational. And then the if you're ready a the next thing's kind of the same thing. Um if if you're ready, Mr. Chairman. Sure.

Okay. You see in front of you in your packet a proposal from the Novo Solutions. Over the past year, we've kind of realized that the utility, the civil town, clerk treasures office, they've all been kind of operating on different systems. This will get everybody on one system. And there's a component of this software that Riley can use to utilize the GIS systems to get a lot of the stuff. Eventually, we'll work through the backlogs of stuff that is on paper and get it digitized on maps that are usable with updated zoning maps and stuff like that. Uh, but we just wanted to bring you up to speed on what this will go before the town council uh Wednesday night, next Wednesday for their approval. Um, we started a committee here in the house earlier this year. like we tried to start before the flood, but then the flood happened and that kind of put us back. I'm just being completely transparent. The flood kind of set us back a few weeks, but the uh we had uh people from the utility, a couple elected officials, uh staff. We kind of looked at about there was originally about 10 or 12 different companies. We narrowed it down to about two and then this one came out of the final two as the most user friendly uh cost effective and gives us the flexibility once we have it um to tailor it. So if there's something we need to do three years from now, we're not spending thousands of dollars to customize a component to put in here. We can just do most of it in house. The additional thing say five years from now we decide to leave them we own our data. Some of those companies you talk to uh if you don't redefine print uh you leave them you lose all the data you put in

that system. So this allows us to maintain ownership of every you know hour that of labor that we put in data wise to go through how many boxes?

A lot. a lot of boxes of uh stuff to where we might actually be able to pull something up by the address instead of just going by the year. Um, you know, I could pull up some addresses depending on what or Andrea could pull up or Riley and it's not broken down by address. It's broken down by what happened in the year at that address. So, think of the man hours and woman hours that you have to go through to do the research. With this system and some hours of getting that stuff digitized from a zoning and planning standpoint, we're going to finally uh join the 21st century. Um, so I mean, you're still going to have your hard records. Don't we're not burning stuff as we're scanning it. Um, but it'll give us a a tool that actually will end up paying for itself. um to where I did something similar in a past wife and I was able to eliminate a part-time person because the software once we got it dialed in took the place of a part-time person. Now, we have a need for that, but with Senate Bill One, you know, we're not doing any hiring anytime soon uh budget-wise. So, by having this tool, we're going to work smarter instead of harder. So, uh just want to keep you in the loop on that. That's what's coming. Riley's a GIS expert. Uh I'm a hobbyist compared to her and I won't speak for Andrea, but we've got to start getting this stuff online. Um so that when we go after a streamline process and we start working with developers, they want this information 24/7 that they can search themselves. And it's going to open up the process for some of this infill that we need. And it's going to get us a seat at the table as developers in our region really want to start looking at this stuff.

Anything to add? Did I I didn't have enough caffeine today. So I a quick question out of curiosity. So vital records or paper records like you were talking about you don't throw anything away. What do you do with those now? You send them to Iron Mountain or where do you store those? So as of right now, so in local government we have um there's rules on certain things, right? Each thing is a certain retention record policies. Yeah.

Some of it seven, some of it. So, anything permanent right now, um, we have down in the basement. Um, and the clerk has done an amazing job and she's come in and everything's colorcoded. Um, and then if it's one year, three year, it's all colorcoded so that we know how to constantly rotate it out. Um, if we ever wanted to, currently right now, we house everything in if we ever wanted to. the permanent stuff we can send it to the um to the state the capital I think holds it holds it all there's somewhere up in Indie that will hold it all for us if we want them to as of right now we have okay

everything so we thought about doing that we have some minutes going all the way back to like I think the farthest I've been able to pull here is like 198 so we've scanned a lot of those it all fits in the baser tightly Yes, it does. That's impressive. So, we have those and at one point now that we have scanned them all in, can we send them somewhere that's a little bit more control? You know, they specifically hold those records for that purpose. So, that's kind of where we're we're heading. But as far as like these companies, they keep the data on the cloud and there's different server farms. There's not just one server somewhere in a room.

You got a lot more flexibility. So it's like it's on multiple servers plus once we get it loaded to a point we can download things periodically on some drives and what I always did in my previous role I carried you know every few months I would update like the records and I kept them on a little portable drive and I kept them with me if the you know say the comment that's coming in November gets a little too close we're going to be good you know I mean that would be the only gets too close we won't need anything. Yeah.

And as far as you guys for plan commission, this will work great for pulling any kind of reports you guys wanted to see. If you wanted to see specific eventually once we get it all in, you know, you see anything specific zoning wise? How many open zoning lots do we have? Like all this stuff will eventually be able to be pulled up and we can share that with you so we'll have all that data which I think will be great. Just as a curiosity, how long do you think it's going to take you all to digitize what we've got? It'll take us eight weeks to get everything up and going trainingwise and get the system. No, no, no. Just to get everybody trained up, get the system installed and get it going. Okay.

And then at that time, we'll make a educated guess. It just depends on often times like what what I've done in the past is I've worked with interns in the summer to kind of shorten the curve. Okay. And what we figured this gets approved, say it gets approved next week, we'll be up and running by the end of the year. And we would look at what we can do inhouse and then maybe hit that intern market uh get a couple interns in here in the summer, whether that's depending on the college program, you don't always have to pay for that. You just have to sign off on some they get some college credit for it

on the on the back end. right now when you come to your building permits, everything is everything before 2005 is TB did go through and put it by address. Um, but anything from 2005 is by year. So if you come and you're like, I need to see a building permit from one, two, three, four, I can pull some older stuff and it's all together. And and when I say it's all together, it's just all in a file. So Riley and I are looking at going ahead and like creating files for each of these. I mean we have 1600 households in town, right? Create a household file so that way if someone does come right now I can't give you all the records for one house without pulling all these different ways. So um it'll probably take a bit of time. I can say I can see where it would be very advantageous.

It will take probably two to three years fully to get it done. Yeah, I can imagine it. It's not not just sitting the system up is the data models and the arrangement of the data going through and organizing everything. And we're already, you know, we have we have books from the 50s and the 60s when they did building permits and these kind of things. And we're already working on an Excel sheet. So hopefully we can import it quicker. But I mean really even back then it would just say some some of them by the way would just say someone's name. So, I have to go and talk to Ann because I know she knows, you know, but it'll say the Renie house and I'm like, I don't know whose house that was in the 50s, right? Like, so, um, we're working on a spreadsheet for all those older building permits, so hopefully we can put that in. We're already doing a lot of backend work.

This is just like one component. It puts in a work order system for our street, for our utility. There's a vehicle management asset management software to where we can start tracking mileage and making better use of like when the maintenance needs to happen. There's there's all different kinds of components um that are a part of this. But the beauty of it is the civil town, the clerk treasurer's office and the utility are going to be on the same platform just different phases. So, like say we do get in a gym and we have to start cross trainining some folks and might need to utilize some people part-time from, you know, like Julie for example might help out to sew her a couple days a week. She's not going to have to relearn a whole new software program because she's going to have she's going to know the backbone of what it is. Um, so it's going to help our staff be uh leaner and meaner. Um, we're going to maximize what time we have and you know it's a 21st century. We need to let the software do some of this heavy lifting once we get it dialed in and set up right. Um in the past it took me several years and I was a oneman show. So we've got a team here. It's I would say ideally without until we get into it at least two to three years depending on the intern availability because with the budget we're not going to be able to pay somebody to to help us. It'll just be staff time, free time. They'll always I mean there's always something to do in this building. It's just, you know, this will be another task that we'll add to the team and we'll have multiple people. You know, the sewer is going to be doing the same thing. I'm sure the clerk's office will be moving some stuff in and um you know with the GIS layering and the mapping is going to improve vastly for the town on

many levels. So stay tuned. But we just wanted to put that in here tonight. Um because this is budgeted for this year and it will go to council next Wednesday night. It's the final review with Chris for the legal document for them to sign. But once we sign that, they tell us six to eight weeks before we get everything implemented and going. So, I mean, just to be realistic, pending no floods or freezing rain or ice storms, we should have it up and running by sometime in December and start loading that stuff up so we hit the ground running in 26.

Well, we have to start somewhere and this sounds like the best place to start. the the group that looked at this really dug into I mean when we got it down to like three or four we really start digging into these and um this was the most user friendly if you can run a website or send an email you can do the basic requirements of the system so we're not having to spend a bunch of money and time on training people that might join our team in a new manner so it's uh very flexible and uh They've been very easy to work with so far and the uh the fact that we own the data that we put in that wasn't always the case with some of the other options out there. So uh data retention is a big thing in the industry right now.

Great. Okay. Thank you. Any questions about that? I don't. If none I'm going to move on to unfinished business. None. Great. Uh staff reports, town council lays on.

Well, we'll have our uh next meeting next Wednesday and like she said, a lot of this will be coming before you and then in October we'll do the um the C4 designation, the ordinance for that. Um I can't really think of anything else that we talked about. It was not a long meeting. What about motorized scooters on the trail? Not motorized scooters. I will say motorcycles with electric motors that go 50 m an hour on the trail. Do you want me to answer that? Go ahead. Chris is I can't stand it myself.

There's three different classes of electric scooters and unfortunately where you're sitting, if I lined up all three of them right here, you wouldn't be able to tell which is which. Under Indiana law, if I'm not mistaken, two of the classes we can't do anything about because it's approved and allowed on trails and stuff by the state. It's that third class that gets a little faster. But the problem is you can't ID that unless you get right up on it and find the flip it and find the model number and serial number. So, we're trying to work with legal on a way to

um get a code that's in place that will hold up in court and gives us the teeth we need to uh start enforcing this a little better. Now, part of that's not just the code. It's going to take a public education component, too, right?

It's going to take some signage. Uh, you know, we're going to utilize like the newsletter to do some education. We'll start doing some tidbits online. um on the social media and uh just kind of you know capture some folks that way. This isn't just a problem in Newberg. I've talked to other folks in the in the region. They're having the same thing. And it seems like just when you uh make a code for something. Have you seen those uh little wheel things?

Um those aren't even mentioned anywhere in the code. And I know in the police commission those things were brought up and we've actually you had a student come in that was concerned about wanting to make sure he was following the law and I you don't see that out of the youth anymore. He actually took the proactive step and came in and talked to us to make sure where he could ride this thing. So the techn he felt unsafe on the streets because he can't go that fast. But then on the trail he's getting people that yell at him on the trail. So he's like where am I allowed to ride this? Can I nod? And yeah, so it's called a one board or something like that. I don't know the name. It's like a It's like a board with one wheel in the middle. So you have that you have the scooters, you have it's like a big like you know a bigger wheel.

So yeah. So how do you regulate all that? And so yeah. So Wisher's diving into it. Police commission is fully aware of it and they're they're going at it. We just got to figure out a way because you know a lot of it the the the ones that are allowed are all allowed because of ADA and then the ones that go over a certain mile an hour those and there's those battery assist bikes. fall into a whole different class. So, you don't you it's like a pedal assist where you hit like an electric boost. Generally, if they got pedals, they kind of at least look like a bicycle, but when they're popping wheelies, going through the stop signs and not stopping on one wheel, that's a motorcycle. And a part of that going to boil down to enforcement, too. So, I mean, it's

I know it's on the agenda. It was kind of tabled at the last commission meeting for the police commission. I haven't seen the agenda for next week's meeting, but uh if it's not on there when it comes out, I'm going to remind them that we need to keep continuing this discussion because I get at least a couple calls a week uh from concerned residents about encountering these things on the trail. And you have to remember, it's not just resident. I mean, there's a lot of visitors on the trail, too. And there was an incident recently where, you know, somebody kind of took the law into their own hands. And I know that's in the courts now.

Um, so I mean it's just uh we we don't want folks to do that. Um, but I think we need to do a better job from a public education piece. And as far as what we're doing with our staff here, we're wanting to wait and not get ahead of legal.

So until Chris gives us some guidance, um, once he does, we'll start the education process immediately. We'll get with the street department and figure out what the sun is. you know, we don't want to just throw up a bunch of extra signs. We want to make it make it fit. But as far as like motor motorized gas powered vehicles, those are not allowed. Like the minibikes, scooters, you know, the gas powered scooters, those are not allowed. And that's still up by the state, I believe. So, um, but often times people they see that no motorized vehicles and that's it should say no gas motorized vehicles instead of electric

and that's a part of that education process and that our hands are kind of tied on those two classes by the state. So, um, I brought it up to I think I brought it up to our state legislation delegation as well. you know, all these communities. The state just made a commitment in this last budget to kind of put communities uh have more trail connectivity. Uh big push in all parts of the state. The state kind of put some funds out there for these trail programs. And I said, "Hey, you put all this money into trails. We need some clarification on the ebikes

because it's not just a problem in Newberg. You know, the Monon Trail up in central Indiana, they have the same problem." And it's it's an area of opportunity, but I assure you we're on it. If you have any questions or concerns, just email me or Andrea even. Well, we'll get her up to speed. I don't think she's up to speed yet on that one, but u we've thrown a lot at her the first few weeks, so we don't want to we don't want to overwhelm Riley. We want to run away. I'm fine. I'm fine. Well, thanks for that update. I appreciate that very much. Yep.

Uh director of planning and zoning. Okay, so Plank Commission's a little bit behind on some of those minutes. So, I'm working on getting us up to speed, getting all those files together. My goal is to be caught up by the next meeting and have those minutes ready for approval so that we can go into the new year ready. And uh that's pretty much all I have for you guys. She's been working very hard. A lot of stuff thrown at her in the past couple weeks, but she's doing great. We appreciate her here. Thank you. Great and welcome. Thank you. Uh miscellaneous business announcements. Next plan commission meeting scheduled October 6th. Anything else?

Anything? Usually we go with comments from citizens present. Maybe that was early in the agenda. I will move nothing else. I'll move for a motion to adjurnn. Some moved. Second. Second. All's in