City Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

GOOD AFTERNOON AND WELCOME TO GOOD AFTERNOON AND WELCOME TO THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE THE COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING FOR TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER MEETING FOR TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER MEETING FOR TUESDAY, SEPTEMBER 15th, 2026. 15th, 2026. 15th, 2026. MY NAME IS AISHA CHUGTAI AND MY NAME IS AISHA CHUGTAI AND MY NAME IS AISHA CHUGTAI AND I'M THE VICE CHAIR OF THIS I'M THE VICE CHAIR OF THIS I'M THE VICE CHAIR OF THIS COMMITTEE. COMMITTEE. COMMITTEE. I WILL NOTE THAT CHAIR CHOWDRY I WILL NOTE THAT CHAIR CHOWDRY I WILL NOTE THAT CHAIR CHOWDRY AND SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT AND S

Councilmember Payne.

Present.

Wansley is absent. Greenville is absent. Vita. Present. Warren is absent. Osmond is absent. Schaefer. Present. Stevenson.

Present.

Chavez.

Present.

Whiting is absent. Palmisano. Present. Vice Chair Chittag. Present. And Chair Chaudhry is absent. There are seven members total.

Thank you, Clerk. Let the record reflect that we have a quorum. BEFORE WE BEGIN THE MEETING, I WANT TO OFFER A FRIENDLY REMINDER TO ALL MEMBERS, STAFF, AND THE PUBLIC THAT THESE MEETINGS ARE BROADCAST LIVE TO ENABLE GREATER PUBLIC PARTICIPATION. THESE BROADCASTS INCLUDE REAL TIME CAPTIONING AS A FURTHER METHOD TO INCREASE THE ACCESSIBILITY OF OUR PROCEEDINGS TO THE COMMUNITY. Therefore all speakers need to be mindful of the rate of their speech so that our captioners can fully capture and transcribe all comments for the broadcast. We ask all speakers to moderate the speed and clarity of their comments. COUNCILMEMBER WARREN, WE WILL FIRST TAKE UP OUR REPORTS OF FIRST TAKE UP OUR REPORTS OF STANDING COMMITTEES, THEN WE'LL STANDING COMMITTEES, THEN WE'LL CONTINUE TO OUR SETTLEMENT CONTINUE TO OUR SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT SUBCOMMITTEE AGENDA AGREEMENT SUBCOMMITTEE AGENDA AND END WITH A RECEIVE AND FILE AND END WITH A RECEIVE AND FILE ITEM AS IS LISTED ON OUR ITEM AS IS LISTED ON OUR AGENDA. WE'LL START WITH OUR REPORTS OF WE'LL START WITH OUR REPORTS OF STANDING COMMITTEES BEGINNING WITH STANDING COMMITTEES BEGINNING WITH THE BUDGET COMMITTEE. THE BUDGET COMMITTEE. I'LL RECOGNIZE VICE CHAIR I'LL RECOGNIZE VICE CHAIR SHAEFER TO PRESENT THAT SHAEFER TO PRESENT THAT REPORT. REPORT.

THANK YOU, VICE CHAIR CHUGTAI. THANK YOU, VICE CHAIR CHUGTAI. THE BUDGET COMMITTEE WILL BE THE BUDGET COMMITTEE WILL BE BRINGING FORWARD ONE ITEM. BRINGING FORWARD ONE ITEM. ITEM ONE IS APPROVING A ITEM ONE IS APPROVING A LEGISLATIVE DIRECTIVE RELATED TO IN ADDITION, THE BUDGET COMMITTEE HAS STARTED THE WORK OF RECEIVING REPORTS AND PRESENTATIONS RELATED TO THE MAYOR'S 2027 RECOMMENDED BUDGET. IN THE PAST WEEK, WE HAVE RECEIVED AN OVERVIEW OF THE BUDGET FROM BUDGET DIRECTOR GREEN, A REPORT REGARDING WORKFORCE OPTIMIZATION AND COMPARATIVE BENCHMARKING FROM CITY AUDITOR TIMMERMAN, A SECOND REPORT ON COUNCIL DEDICATED FUNDS IN THE 2026 BUDGET, AN UPDATE ON CHANGE ITEMS IN THE 2026 BUDGET, THE BUY ANNUAL PERSONNEL REPORT THE BUY ANNUAL PERSONNEL REPORT AND DEPARTMENT PRESENTATIONS AND DEPARTMENT PRESENTATIONS AND DEPARTMENT PRESENTATIONS FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, OFFICE OF PUBLIC OFFICE, OFFICE OF PUBLIC OFFICE, OFFICE OF PUBLIC SERVICE, AND OFFICE OF COMMUNITY SERVICE, AND OFFICE OF COMMUNITY SERVICE, AND OFFICE OF COMMUNITY SAFETY. SAFETY. SAFETY.

I'LL STAND FOR ANY QUESTIONS IF I'LL STAND FOR ANY QUESTIONS IF I'LL STAND FOR ANY QUESTIONS IF THERE ARE ANY. THERE ARE ANY. THERE ARE ANY. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS RELATED TO THE BUDGET COMMITT SEEING NONE, WE'LL CONTINUE TO OUR BUSINESS HOUSING AND ZONING COMMITTEE. ABSENT OUR CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR, I'LL JUST GO OVER THIS COMMITTEE REPORT AND I'M HAPPY TO STAND FOR QUESTIONS. THE BUSINESS HOUSING AND ZONING COMMITTEE WILL BE BRINGING 15 THE BUSINESS HOUSING AND ZONING COMMITTEE WILL BE BRINGING 15 ITEMS FORWARD TO THURSDAY'S ITEMS FORWARD TO THURSDAY'S COUNCIL MEETING. COUNCIL MEETING. ITEM 1 APPROVES A LIQUOR AND ITEM 1 APPROVES A LIQUOR AND LIMITED ENTERTAINMENT LICENSE FOR LIMITED ENTERTAINMENT LICENSE FOR TROPICO IN WARD 7. TROPICO IN WARD 7. ITEM 2 APPROVES AN ORDINANCE ITEM 2 APPROVES AN ORDINANCE RELATED TO EVENT CENTER RELATED TO EVENT CENTER LICENSES. LICENSES. ITEM 3 APPROVES TWO LIQUOR ITEM 3 APPROVES TWO LIQUOR APPROVES THREE GAMBLING LICENSE APPROVES THREE GAMBLING LICENSE RENEWALS. RENEWALS. ITEM 7 AUTHORIZES A CONTRACT ITEM 7 AUTHORIZES A CONTRACT AMENDMENT FOR THE CONVENTION AMENDMENT FOR THE CONVENTION CENTER MILL CITY PIZZERIA CENTER MILL CITY PIZZERIA PROJECT. PROJECT. ITEM 8 AUTHORIZES A CONTRACT ITEM 8 AUTHORIZES A CONTRACT AMENDMENT FOR THE CONVENTION AMENDMENT FOR THE CONVENTION CENTER KITCHEN CONCESSIONS ITEM 10 AUTHORIZES BONDS TO HOST APPROVAL FOR MINI HA HA SENIOR LIVING. ITEM 11 AUTHORIZES AN AGREEMENT FOR PUBLIC ART WITH SHERMAN ASSOCIATES. ITEM 12 ACCEPTS 2026 BROWNFIELD GRANTS AND AUTHORIZES FALL 2026 BROWNFIELD GRANT APPLICATIONS. ITEM 13 APPROVES PARTIAL FINANCING FORGIVENESS FOR 3631 PENN AVENUE NORTH. ITEM 14 AUTHORIZES 20 MASTER CONTRACTS FOR CPED'S PLANNING CONSULTING POOL. AND LASTLY, ITEM 15 APPROVES AN ORDINANCE RELATED TO FENCE REGULATIONS IN THE CITY. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS RELATED TO THE BIS COMMITTEE REPORT? NOT SEEING ANY, WE'LL CONTINUE TO THE CLIMATE AND INFRASTRUCTURE COMMITTEE. I'LL RECOGNIZE THAT COMMITTEE IS VICE CHAIR COUNCILMEMBER STEPHENSON TO PRESENT THAT REPORT.

Thank you, Madam Chair. The Climate and Infrastructure Committee will be bringing nine items forward to Thursday's council meeting. One, passage of resolution for special service districts and approving 2027 proposed services and service charges. Two, passage of resolution for gift acceptance for Cities Today Institute. Three, authorizing a contract amendment for the First Avenue South reconstruction project. Four, authorizing a contract amendment for the 42nd Street Intersection Safety Improvements Project. Five, accepting a bid for ADA Pedestrian Ramp Installation. Six, accepting a bid for Hawthorne Ramp Building Automation System Update. Seven, authorizing a contract amendment with JL Thies Incorporated for the First Avenue South Reconstruction Green Stormwater Infrastructure Project. Eight, authorizing contract amendment with Vinco Incorporated for catch basin and maintenance hole repairs. Nine, approving a legislative directive related to commercial and multifamily energy disclosure repeal. I'll note we also set the public hearing for the repeal ordinance for September 24th. I'll stand for questions.

Thank you. Are there any questions on the Climate and Infrastructure Committee report? Not seeing any, we'll continue to the Enterprise and Labor Relations Committee. I will recognize that committee's chair, Councilmember Palmisano, to present their report.

Thank you, Madam Chair. The Enterprise and Labor Relations Committee will be bringing five items forward to Thursday's council meeting. Item one is to authorize a contract to evaluate our cybersecurity practices. Item two is a contract amendment for our employee engagement survey. Number three is a contract amendment for our city's laboratory information management system the last two are legal settlements the item number four is for thermospray approximately a hundred and sixty two thousand dollars and item number five is a workers comp claim of Jason Anderson for a hundred and fifty thousand dollars Happy to answer any questions

THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE ENTERPRISE AND LABOR THE ENTERPRISE AND LABOR RELATIONS REPORT? RELATIONS REPORT? SEEING NONE, WE WILL CONCLUDE SEEING NONE, WE WILL CONCLUDE WITH THE PUBLIC HEALTH SAFETY WITH THE PUBLIC HEALTH SAFETY AND EQUITY COMMITTEE. AND EQUITY COMMITTEE. I WILL RECOGNIZE THIS I WILL RECOGNIZE THIS COMMITTEE'S CHAIR, COMMITTEE'S CHAIR, COUNCILMEMBER CHAVEZ TO COUNCILMEMBER CHAVEZ TO PRESENT THIS REPORT.

PRESENT THIS REPORT. THANK YOU, CHAIR CHUG-TAI. THANK YOU, CHAIR CHUG-TAI. THE PUBLIC HEALTH SAFETY AND THE PUBLIC HEALTH SA will be bringing forward 10 items. Item one is an ordinance regarding the neighborhood revitalization program policy board elections. Item two accepts a grant from Subaru Loves Pets program to support animal care and control. Item three rescinds resolution 206R201 and accepts the Gary Sinise Foundation First Responder Outreach Grant to purchase portable radio kits. Item four, amends council actions related to the Minnesota Department of Health grant for cannabis substance use prevention by updating the accepted amount and the correct contract term. Item five, accepts reimbursement from the Minnesota Board of Firefighter Training and Education for approved trainings. Item six, seven, eight, accept donations for staff conference attendance. Item nine approves two appointments to the advisory committee on people with disabilities. And item 10 waives the residency requirement for current public health advisory committee member Tavia. I'll stand for any questions.

Thank you. Are there any questions on this committee report? not seeing any with that i will turn the chair over to the to vice chair payne for the settlement agreement and consent decree subcommittee portion of our agenda

Thank you, Council Member Chagtai. Our subcommittee today has two items in total to discuss. First, we have a contract with Grant Thornton Advisors for the Internal Affairs Division within the Minneapolis Police Department. I will have Deputy Schoenberger for more information on this item. Welcome.

Good afternoon, chair, members of the committee. Thank you. Deputy Chief Troy Schoenberger, representing Minneapolis Police Department, Internal Affairs Bureau, come before you today with a request for counsel action for contract with Grant Thornton Advisors in an amount not to exceed $2.03 million for a two-year contract with a possibility of an extension for one year to assist with the supervisory review process for investigations related to internal affairs cases. As part of this presentation, I want to go through a little bit more information for the history of the backlog, which I previously presented to this committee. So we'll try to get through it quick, but also talk about what requirements of the settlement agreement this applies to, the challenges in achieving compliance, the current challenges that led us to asking for this assistance, other examples of recent funding that are similar, as well as the scope of work to be completed by Grant Thornton. All right, so how did we get here? Briefly, I want to just mention that this concept of a backlog goes back to 2020 when we received several thousand complaints that had to be processed. As those complaints came through the process, um of review and assignment for investigation there was a major backlog just in that review process and then eventually in the investigation process and then beginning in 2024 was the creation of a supervisory review process where Once a case investigation is complete, an internal affairs or OPCR supervisor has to review those investigations to make sure that they comply with the requirements of the settlement agreement, that they're a full and thorough investigation, and in the event that they're not, they have to be sent back for additional investigation. So while OPCR was able to navigate their way through that supervisor review process, Internal Affairs has been stuck, and I'll explain why as we go through this, but that's where our current backlog is stuck right now, and I'll talk a little bit more about the number of cases that we're talking about, and again, why. Going back to the settlement agreement, paragraph 335 talks about the need for a supervisory review. This outlines all of the requirements, looking to make sure that everything that's required in the settlement agreement is included in the case investigation. And again, if it's not in there, it either has to be sent back for revisions or additional investigation, which in some case could include additional interviews or additional evidence needs to be included in the case. And so it's a fairly lengthy process. Also relevant is paragraph 328, which requires that this process is done within 15 days of a case investigation being turned in by an investigator. So when an investigator turns in what they say is a completed investigation, a supervisor of either IA or OPCR has to review that case and make a decision on whether to approve it for panel or return it for further investigation within 15 days. The biggest challenge right now is lack of supervisory availability to actually conduct this process. In Alifa's Fourth Progress Report, they note that IA has an inability to move cases through the supervisory review stage, and they go on to say that at least at that point in their review, with only one functioning civilian supervisor available to actively move cases through the supervisory review process, cases have accumulated at that phase with no viable path to clearance at the current resource level. and ultimately drew the conclusion that we have made no meaningful progress towards clearing that backlog. I'll note that the employee that was the civilian supervisor at that time is now filling the role of the senior project manager and is working on a lot of the projects that are related to the settlement agreement work. HELPING TO LEAD THE CORRECTIVE ACTION MATRIX PROJECT, THE ACCOUNTABILITY POLICY ROLLOUT, THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS 40-HOUR INVESTIGATOR TRAINING AND A VARIETY OF OTHER PROJECTS AND IT'S CONSUMING A LOT OF HER TIME. SO WHILE SHE'S STILL DOING SOME SUPERVISOR REVIEWS, THE BULK OF HER TIME IS SPENT WORKING ON THESE OTHER REQUIREMENTS OF THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT. Fortunately, in August, we moved a lieutenant from a different unit into internal affairs. He has previous experience as an internal affairs investigator, so he's familiar with the process. He's familiar with what these cases look like, and he started working on the supervisor review process and is doing a great job in getting through some of those. uh... the biggest problem related to that is that our current work this is not talking about on the backlog uh... currently we have fifty four open administrative investigations with thirty two cases assigned twenty two cases pending we also have forty six expedited disposition cases and on fifty three cases are at the intake review phase So as those cases that are not considered the historical backlog are coming through the process, I believe that that Lieutenant is gonna be able to review or conduct the supervisory review of new cases that are coming through, but that's taking the bulk of his time and he's not gonna be able to make substantial progress on that historical backlog. So that leads us to requesting additional assistance. The backlog as it stands right now in the cases that are in supervisory review, there are 266 cases in that phase. So these are either completed investigations or completed expedited disposition cases that are essentially done, but waiting that supervisory review process. Of those 266 cases awaiting a supervisory review, 55 are historical backlog cases. And again, 32 of those are administrative investigations and 23 are expedited dispositions. 203 are noncompliant cases, and so those are 90 administrative investigations and 113 expedited disposition cases that are cases that are beyond the 180-day expectation for a case from beginning to end. and then eight are considered current, one of which is an administrative investigation, seven are expedited disposition cases. So these are the cases primarily that this contract would be looking to address. Recent funding for ADMINISTRATIVE INVESTIGATIONS OR WORK RELATED TO INTERNAL AFFAIRS. WE HAVE A DLG CONTRACT TO DO QUALITY ASSURANCE REVIEW FOR USE OF FORCE CASES. THAT WAS A $1.7 MILLION CONTRACT AND AS OF JUNE THEY HAD COMPLETED 212 quality assurance reviews. Also, OPCR contracted with Wiley Reber. That contract was in the amount of 1.5 million, and by June of 2026, they had completed 75 administrative investigations. This contract, again, is seeking $2,030,000 to do reviews of, well, the supervisory review and some additional work for 266 cases. I'll talk next about the scope of what that work looks like. So the difference between Grant Thornton and either DLG or Wiley Reber is that the focus again is the supervisory review process. So they're going to start by looking at administrative investigations and ensuring that it's in compliance with the settlement agreement, ensuring that all evidence is there. However, if they determine that it's not, they will then conduct the rest of the investigation that needs to be done. So if, for example, they say we need additional evidence for a review, Internal Affairs presumably will pull that evidence for them, they'll do the review, they'll add that to the case investigation. If additional interviews are required, say with a complainant or witnesses or focus or witness officers, they'll conduct that interview and they'll finish the investigation. in terms of expedited disposition cases. They'll do the supervisory review part of it. If everything is good, they move it to the next phase of that process. uh... however the catch with expedited disposition cases is that it's presented to the officer as a proposal here's the evidence uh... by all accounts it's it's solid it's irrefutable evidence uh... but still and then here's the discipline that you're being offered it's up to the employee to accept that if they choose not to accept expedited disposition the case then becomes an administrative investigation that has to be fully investigated. Now, I like to say that will be an administrative or an expedited administrative investigation because the evidence doesn't change. The only difference is that it would require an interview with the FOCUS employee and it's just a little bit longer write-up. But essentially, Grant Thornton would be doing that. So if it changes from an expedited disposition to an administrative investigation, they would do that work. They would do the administrative investigation. They would do the review and then the supervisor review process and then send it to panel. When the backlog is completed, when those 266 cases are complete, we'll make an assessment at that time of what cases are we out of compliance with that are over that 180-day timeline, and then we'll look at whether or not we would use them to conduct those investigations to continue to take the pressure off of Internal Affairs and the staff that we have there now. So that is essentially the scope of the work that they'd complete. So again, while it starts out as just conducting the supervisor review element, it may lead to a full administrative investigation. Little bit more about Grant Thornton. We did our RFP, three different groups submitted a proposal. They were thoroughly vetted. Grant Thornton was selected as the preferred vendor. Their team does have experience with not only consent decree work, but also working with internal affairs process. And so we felt like they were uniquely suited to take on this work. And they've worked with several major city police departments in the country. I know that they're a national firm. They're actually international. However, within the United States, they operate in 25 states and they do have a local Minneapolis office that they would use to support our needs here. And again, they have the ability to conduct not only the supervisory review, but a full case investigation. That is all for the presentation. I'll open it to questions.

Thank you for that presentation. Are there any questions or discussion? Council Member Travis.

Oh. Okay, great. Thanks for being here. It seems like Internal Affairs currently has 266 cases sitting in supervisory review. This presentation has it broken down into three buckets just so the public can hear what's going on here. The first are 55 cases, which is the old historical backlog cases going back years, long past deadlines. I think that is... I don't even know why that's still here. That should have been addressed a long time ago. The second is 203 cases, which are non-compliant cases, and they've already blown past the 180-day deadline. And the third bucket, eight cases, are new cases still within their deadline, so that's fine with me. That's good. I hope that they don't become a part of a historical backlog. So out of the 266 total cases, 258 of them 55 historical backlog plus 203 non-compliant ones are now late and only eight are on schedule. That's pretty damning and I hope that gets addressed effective immediately. I do know that on the court enforceable agreement that we have with MDHR, we agreed on a particular timeline because police accountability really matters and should be addressed. Unfortunately, it feels like we're failing to comply with our own settlement agreement here today and our own stated goals. I'll be supporting this item today, but I need to express my grave concerns with the lack of urgency to address this backlog, the historic one, the ones that were not in compliance with our own settlement agreement, and the importance of why I'm bringing this up today is because that means there's a lack of justice for victims of police brutality in our city. If victims are reporting police misconduct and it's taking them years to get an answer, to have an investigation in place, and to get some resolve, that should be concerning for all, it's concerning for me, I'll speak for myself. I also, if we can go to slide nine, there's a 2004, is that accurate? It's talking about a case in 2004? Or did you mean 2024? I'm wondering if that's a typo or if that's a case that's 22 years ago.

That is, through the chair, Council Member Chavez, yes, that should be 2024. So the historical backlog is a period of March 2024 BACKWARDS.

THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN BREAKING NEWS OF A CASE NOT BEING SOLVED 22 YEARS LATER, BUT I'M GLAD THE PUBLIC WILL HAVE THAT CORRECTION IF WE CAN GET THAT FIXED AND SAID TO THE CLERKS THAT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE PRETTY SERIOUS. NOW, I GUESS MY QUESTION IS HAVE THERE BEEN CONVERSATIONS WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE ON ANY OF THE CITY'S LEGAL EXPOSURE ON FAILING TO ADDRESS THIS BACKLOG?

through the Chair, Council Member Chavez, these cases are our highest priority. And so getting to those oldest cases first, because we do know that there are some that are notable. And so the work of Grant Thornton would be prioritizing those cases that present the most risk or that are the most significant in terms of misconduct.

and i will repeat again 203 cases are non-compliant 55 are historical backlog that's a total of 266 total cases that should raise alarms for it raises alarm for myself i speak for myself like We are failing to meet our own goals in the settlement agreement with MDHR. And this is, yeah, I'm voting for this item, but I need to flag the concerns I have with this backlog and it needs to be addressed ASAP because that's victims, potential victims that are having justice here in our city.

Council Member Stevenson.

Thank you. Yeah, I also was wanting clarity on the 2004 versus 2024. That was really something. My colleague, Councilmember Warren, last time we had a conversation about this, brought up a conversation about people in IA being protected from retaliation. We saw our previous police chief be the subject of multiple IA investigations, and I think you were right on with that. I'm really happy to see this moving forward because not only am I concerned about retaliation, but a massive conflict of interest for officers who want to move up in their career, doling out discipline to their coworkers, or at least recommending discipline to their coworkers and whatnot. So this is a really welcome development for me. I'm happy to see that THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE THE INVESTIGATIVE AUTHORITY TO DO WHAT THEY NEED TO DO. SO THIS IS REALLY GOOD. THANK YOU. COUNCILMEMBER VITA.

THANK YOU, CHAIR PAIN. THANK YOU, DEPUTY CHIEF SHAUN BERGER. I KNOW I RAN INTO YOU IN THE HALLWAY OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS SINCE YOU'VE BEEN BACK IN INTERNAL AFFAIRS. AND I TOLD YOU THEN AND I WANT TO SAY IT NOW THAT I'M SO GLAD YOU'RE BACK IN INTERNAL AFFAIRS TO GO THROUGH THESE CASES. AND I MEAN, YOU'VE BROUGHT BEFORE US WHAT'S ACTUALLY HAPPENING. I've been asking for several years about what is going on and why there is a backlog. Is the backlog being cleared up? How and when are we going to get it done? And so you've brought before us the resources that we need to get this done. And I'm excited about that. You know, I know you as an ethical, smart, fair person. And so I'm really excited. Happy that we're finally going to do this. There's been a lot of turnover in that department. So I, you know, it was, it was a little off putting to see so much turnover and know how important the cases that are there need to be seen. As council member Chavez said, this could be people who are victims of police brutality. We don't know what these cases are and it's more unsettling to have so many cases and not know what they are. So I, I mean, we don't want to, you know, We don't know what they are, but we know we need to know and they need to be resolved. Resolved for the people who have filed the cases and for the people on the other side of them and for us as a city of Minneapolis. So I really do appreciate the work that you're doing. I did have one question, though, and you might have said it. How many staff are in internal affairs now?

Through the chair, Council Member Vita, yes. I'll call it 19. Um, roughly. And, uh, There are a handful of people, vacant positions. We may not be able to do anything with that depending on staffing challenges, but we're gonna work hard with what we have to get through these cases.

Okay, and so then does that mean that the 19 people in internal affairs somehow touches these, somehow everyone will touch the contracts that we have, that these contracts play a role in all parts of what's gonna be happening in internal affairs over the span of these contracts?

through the Chair, Council Member Vita, most of these cases are completed investigations or expedited. And so it won't necessarily touch the staff that are there. It will just help get these cases to panel where they can be reviewed by the CCPO panel and a recommendation made as to merit or no merit.

Okay. And I know we're in the middle of a chief search, but these, you know, they have to be reviewed by the chief finally, right? And like the reprimand or whatever happens in these cases have to be reviewed by the chief. Have you been in conversations with the interim chief or like what is... I don't want us to get to a place where all the cases are reviewed and then they're sitting on the chief's desk and that's the that's the next holding place right because we we had some of that too but like I want to make sure we get a steady flow of this and that we really can get through these cases

Through the Chair, Council Member Vita, yes. I may have hinted at this last presentation that this bubble of the backlog or the bubble of work that needs to be done started from complaints in 2020, moved through investigation, supervisor review. This bubble is gonna move to the panel process and then to the Chief's ultimate decision on either non-disciplinary, well, either no merit NON DISCIPLINARY CORRECTIVE ACTION OR DISCIPLINE. SO YES, THAT BUBBLE IS GOING TO DEFINITELY MOVE TO OTHER AREAS OF THE SYSTEM, BUT THAT'S THE END OF THE PROCESS AND THEN HOPEFULLY THAT BACKLOG, THIS BUBBLE DISAPPEARS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, DEPUTY CHIEF. I REALLY DO, IT IS REALLY REFRESHING TO SEE YOU OVER THERE BECAUSE I KNOW YOU'RE GOING TO WORK HARD AT THIS. THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

Yes, thank you as well for this report. I had a question on slide nine as well. If you could go to that one. You know, you're saying this 55 cases is 39% of the original backlog identified. So does that mean there's approximately 60% still that's not currently ready or completed in its work that still needs work?

through the chair, council member Schaffer. I mentioned this at the last presentation, so I'm sorry it's not clear on this one. 61% of the backlog has already been cleared. Those cases have already made it through the end of the process. So this backlog that we're still working through is 50, OF WHAT'S LEFT OF THE BACKLOG. AND JUST TO ACTUALLY GO BACK TO A POINT THAT THE CURRENT CASES CAN BECOME NONCOMPLIANT BUT THEY CAN'T BECOME HISTORICAL BACKLOG OR BACKLOG. SO THE BACKLOG IS ANY CASE THAT WAS OPEN AS OF 2024 OR LATER. OKAY.

QUOTE, CAUGHT UP IN A SENSE. I KNOW THERE'S A BACK AND FORTH PROCESS, BUT THOSE HISTORIC ONES WILL BE DEALT WITH IN TOTAL.

THROUGH THE CHAIR, GOVERNOR SHERRY, YES.

OKAY. THEN MY OTHER QUESTION WAS RELATED TO THE CONTRACT ITSELF. FOR THIS TWO-YEAR CONTRACT, CAN YOU ESTIMATE WILL THIS 266 CASES BE COMPLETED IN TOTALITY, DO YOU THINK, IN TWO YEARS? I KNOW THERE'S A CONTRACT EXTENSION. DO YOU PLAN ON IS IT KIND OF A FEE FOR THAT WORKLOAD, WHETHER IT TAKES TWO YEARS OR THREE YEARS, ET CETERA? CAN YOU SPEAK TO THAT A LITTLE BIT? OR IS THERE ADDITIONAL WORK THAT YOU ARE HOPING THAT THEY TAKE UP?

THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION. Ultimately, we hope that it will be much sooner that we're able to clear that backlog I would hate to think that we'd have to take this into year three. So the hope is that we can clear as much Next year as possible going into the year after that and so Once we get to that point, and we also don't know how long it's going to take them. They estimate how long it's going to take to do a case. We have an idea of how long it took Wiley Reber to do a case. Ultimately, we'll see how long it ends up taking. So some of these are expedited disposition cases. They should be fairly quick. A full administrative investigation will obviously take much longer. And I think we estimate roughly 10 times as long. The hope is that we can get through these within the next year, maybe two, but hopefully not going to that third year. And again, prioritizing the cases in order of which ones are the most significant, because it is a wide range of cases, some of which will have no merit. Some will have very low level discipline, which is what most allegations of misconduct are. And then there's some that are, you know, the more serious cases that we hope to clear first.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPONSES AND THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE TODAY.

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. JUST A COUPLE QUESTIONS. STARTING WITH THE 19 STAFF APPROXIMATELY WITHIN INTERNAL AFFAIRS, CAN YOU SPEAK TO LIKE WHAT THE BREAKDOWN GENERALLY MIGHT BE BETWEEN HOW MANY OF THESE STAFF MEMBERS ARE CIVILIANS VERSUS SPORN?

Sure, through the chair. The 19 actually includes the force investigations team, which includes two civilian investigators, three sworn, a lieutenant, and a commander, say roughly that. And then on the internal affairs side, we have the senior project manager, a commander, a lieutenant, three sworn investigators, and three civilian investigators, and two support staff.

That's super helpful to know and I really appreciate using that 2024 time as a place where you're measuring that backlog from. Do you have a sense of what staffing for internal affairs looked like around that time in the lead up? What I'm really trying to wrap my head around is, is this backlog a product of insufficient staffing for internal affairs?

through the chair. This is about the creation of the supervisory review phase, which went into effect at the same time as the end of the, we'll say the date that Alifa determined was historical backlog. That was a date that Alifa came up with. They said any case from March 2024 back is considered historical backlog. That's also when the supervisory review process was implemented. And so that's when everything got gridlocked at that point. And then, as I've previously mentioned, through a series of staffing changes, the new lieutenants, commanders coming into the unit just didn't have the experience CLEAR THOSE CASES THROUGH THAT SUPERVISORY REVIEW PHASE. SUPERVISORY REVIEW PHASE. SUPERVISORY REVIEW PHASE.

THAT MAKES SENSE. THAT MAKES SENSE. THAT MAKES SENSE. AND THEN I AM WONDERING, SO AND THEN I AM WONDERING, SO AND THEN I AM WONDERING, SO YOU'VE CLEARED 61% OF THE YOU'VE CLEARED 61% OF THE YOU'VE CLEARED 61% OF THE BACKLOG, THE HISTORICAL BACKLOG What's so special about the remaining 39% that it can't be cleared with the existing staffing capacity when you've clearly pulled off a miracle in clearing 61%? That's a big deal. So yeah, is there something that's uniquely hard about this remaining 40% or... Is something else going on?

Through the chair, yes. As I mentioned, the supervisory capacity is what the challenge is right now. So while the lieutenant in the unit can process all of the cases that are coming through now that aren't historical backlog, he doesn't have the capacity to do more than that. So he's managing the cases. We don't have a civilian supervisor. That position is vacant because we've moved that employee to the senior project manager to manage the other implementation work that has to be done. And so it really just comes down to a lack of supervisor availability. And that's what Alefa highlights in their report is that we don't have enough supervisors and their recommendation is another supervisor. But obviously with funding issues and staffing issues, this is where we're at. And so we just don't have the capacity with current staff to accomplish that. One of your questions was what was staffing like in 2024. I can't remember exactly when we hired the most recent employees, but I'm going to say it's roughly the same. It hasn't changed substantially.

That's super helpful. Thank you for answering these questions. I think between the discussion here today and some of the conversation at agenda setting, I feel like I've got the information I need. I really appreciate you making time to do that. And I will be supporting this item today. I really want to get this backlog cleared. Thank you so much. Thank you.

I added myself to queue and just like right off the top, I'll be supporting the contract. But I was curious, is this a budgeted expense or is this unbudgeted?

Chair, if I could defer to Deputy Director.

Good afternoon, Council President. I'm Jared Jeffries, the Deputy Commissioner of Community Safety for the City of Minneapolis. Council President, to answer your question, in 26 this was not a budgeted expense. In 27 it is, at least in part. I think it depends on the expenditures that go into 26 and how much actually is spent down, depending on the work that's actually needed under the contract.

So... MY UNDERSTANDING IS WE WILL NOT HAVE ANY VACANCY SAVINGS THIS YEAR AS I LOOK AT THOSE OVERTIME MEMOS COMING THROUGH. SO WE SHOULD ANTICIPATE BASICALLY DOLLAR FOR DOLLAR THE COST OF THIS CONTRACT TO EAT THROUGH OUR CONTINGENCY FUND. THAT WOULD BE A SAFE ASSUMPTION?

COUNCIL PRESIDENT, ON THAT QUESTION, I THINK WE ANTICIPATE THAT THE STARTUP FOR THIS CONTRACT WILL OBVIOUSLY CARRY THROUGH Q4 OF THIS YEAR. the expenditures I think that actually occur this year should be minimal if that answers your question.

And then I was wondering if you could expand a little bit more Deputy Chief on the difference between the administrative investigation and the expedited. It seems to me that the expedited suggests that these are cases that have gone through intake and they've already had an investigation they just haven't had that supervisory review to make sure that that investigation is in compliance? Is that the right way of thinking about that?

President Payne, no. So whether expedited disposition or administrative investigation, they both have to do a supervisory review. In the cases that we're talking about, none of them have had a supervisory review. An administrative investigation, just in terms of length, would be anywhere from 20 to 150 page long investigation. An expedited disposition is more like three to five. An easy example might be during an audit, we found that this officer did not activate their body-worn camera when required. It's clear, it's very straightforward. It's typically maybe a letter of reprimand is the discipline. So it's a very short write-up and we present it to the employee and say, are you willing to accept a letter of reprimand for this case? But even that write-up still has to go through a supervisory review. And even though it's very short, you know, we could clear all of those, but then we wouldn't be doing the administrative investigation, supervisor reviews, which are typically more serious investigations. or have the potential to be more serious.

So then the distinction between these two categories is not where they're at in the process. It's the severity or the specific conduct that's being investigated.

present pain, sort of. So some expedited disposition cases could be more serious to the extent that you'd consider this more serious. A DWI, for example, would go through expedited disposition because there's a baseline discipline and the person got arrested and charged with DWI. So that's an easy expedited disposition case. WILL YOU REMIND ME WHAT THE QUESTION WAS? QUESTION WAS?

MAYBE SEVERITY ISN'T THE MAYBE SEVERITY ISN'T THE RIGHT TERMINOLOGY. RIGHT TERMINOLOGY. MAYBE IT'S THE COMPLEXITY. MAYBE IT'S THE COMPLEXITY. SOME OF THESE THINGS ARE NOT SO SOME OF THESE THINGS ARE NOT SO COMPLEX. COMPLEX. YOU GOT ARRESTED FOR A DUI. YOU GOT ARRESTED FOR A DUI. THAT'S A PRETTY DIRECT CAUSE AND THAT'S A PRETTY DIRECT CAUSE AND EFFECT. EFFECT. IT'S NOT AN INSEVERE PIECE OF IT'S NOT AN INSEVERE PIECE OF CONDUCT BUT IT IS A VERY SIMPLE CONDUCT BUT IT IS A VERY SIMPLE DETERMINATION ABOUT WHAT DETERMINATION ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED, RIGHT?

For expedited disposition, it's more about the evidence. That's sort of irrefutable. It doesn't require an interview with the employee to say, did this happen, or give us more information. But also with administrative investigations, yes, it could be more complex. But certainly not all of those cases are going to be serious. We just don't know. So there are many administrative investigations that end in a decision or recommendation of no merit by the panel. IT'S JUST THAT IT TAKES A LOT MORE TIME AND ENERGY AND WORK TO IT'S JUST THAT IT TAKES A LOT MORE TIME AND ENERGY AND WORK TO IT'S JUST THAT IT TAKES A LOT MORE TIME AND ENERGY AND WORK TO GET TO THAT POINT. GET TO THAT POINT.

GET TO THAT POINT. AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION, I AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION, I AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION, I THINK YOU ANSWERED THIS, BUT I THINK YOU ANSWERED THIS, BUT I THINK YOU ANSWERED THIS, BUT I MAYBE WANT TO ASK IT AGAIN AND MAYBE WANT TO ASK IT AGAIN AND MAYBE WANT TO ASK IT AGAIN AND MAYBE GET A LITTLE BIT MORE GRANULAR. GET A LITTLE BIT MORE GRANULAR. GET A LITTLE BIT MORE GRANULAR. IT SOUNDS LIKE, We will, this contract will start with the historical backlog. That'll be their first priority and they're not gonna be taking on even the out of compliance investigations until we finish the historical backlog. Is that an accurate understanding of their priority? Yes. Okay. Once they get through the historical backlog, guess i'm wondering what's the what's the rate of us getting the cases out of this stage and what's the rate of getting new complaints do we think we have the capacity to stay in compliance with any complaint received today but it's more of the ones that are out of compliant that we're having a hard time keeping up with

President Payton, yes, that is the hope, is that current staff can focus on everything that's currently in compliance, get it through the process in the required timelines, in part because we won't have to focus on the historical backlog, because that'll be taken care of through this contract. But it will entirely depend on the rest of the process. So once those supervisory reviews are complete and are sent to panel, if there's a backlog in the panel process and then a backlog in getting it to the chief's office, those are sort of inevitable. But if we I GUESS, CONTROL THE FLOW OR THE PACE OF THAT, WE CAN HOPEFULLY MITIGATE SOME OF THAT POTENTIAL FOR BACKLOG AND THE END PHASES OF THE PROCESS.

YEAH. WELL, AND THE END GOAL IS THAT WE HAVE A DEPARTMENT THAT DOESN'T GET A LOT OF COMPLAINTS, RIGHT?

PRESIDENT PAIN, THAT'S THE GOAL.

ALL RIGHT. WELL, I'M NOT SEEING ANY FURTHER QUESTIONS, SO THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. IS THERE A MOTION TO APPROVE THIS ITEM? All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed say nay. EYES HAVE IT, AND THAT CARRIES. OUR SECOND ITEM WAS ALREADY RECEIVED AT OUR LAST COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING ON AUGUST 25TH, BUT A FEW COUNCILMEMBERS WERE NOT ABLE TO ASK THEIR QUESTIONS ON THE RECORD FOR AN OPPORTUNITY TO RECEIVE AN ADMINISTRATIVE FOLLOW-UP FOR THOSE ANSWERS. I WILL NOW TAKE THIS MOMENT TO LET COUNCILMEMBERS COME INTO QUEUE IF THEY HAD ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE MDHR UPDATE AT OUR LAST MEETING. IS THERE ANY QUESTIONS? Questions from colleagues from that update Going once twice three times Oh councilmember Stevenson I had a lot of questions and to be honest with you.

I left my notes on my desk so I'm gonna have to save those for the next time that we do this, but Yeah, thanks for giving me the space

no problem uh with that i will ask the clerk to file that update and i'll turn the chair back over to vice chair uh chug thai thank you sir um

for our last item today we will be receiving and filing a memo from the minneapolis police department in response to legislative directive 2026-00495 authored by myself and council member vita we received an initial response on may 19th of this year but needed additional information and what brings us here today um is anyone here from the minneapolis police department or the office of community safety to answer questions today I WOULD DESCRIBE OVERSPENDING IN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AS A PRETTY IMPORTANT ISSUE. I'M CONFUSED AS TO WHY THEY'RE NOT HERE, BUT, YOU KNOW, I GUESS I'M NOT SEEING ANYONE HERE FROM THE MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT OR THE OFFICE OF COMMUNITY SAFETY WHO CAN ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THE $20 MILLION WORTH OF OVERSPENDING THAT HAPPENED IN THE DEPARTMENT LAST YEAR, WHICH EQUATES TO APPROXIMATELY THREE LEVY POINTS. SO, I GUESS, WE'LL ASK THE CLERK TO FILE THIS REPORT. I DON'T KNOW.

SORRY, SORRY, SORRY.

ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS? I WILL RECOGNIZE COUNCIL MEMBER CHAVEZ.

THANK YOU, CHAIR. VERY DISAPPOINTED THAT THE that has overspent their budget that is leading to massive layoffs across the city enterprise is not in the room with us today to answer questions. So I'm gonna be making some comments on this report. MPD came in $21 million over its 2025 budget, nearly a 10% overrun on nearly a $227 million appropriation. MPD exceeded its budget in 29 out of the 30 expense categories tracked in this memo, and it's very clear that the Minneapolis Police Department did not manage the budget it was given. If we look at overtime, MPD's own memo admits what was foreseeable. They cut overtime budget by five million in 2025, betting that new hires would cover the gap while knowing full well that new recruits take months of training before they can work a shift alone. That was not transparent to our residents. Then there's a settlement agreement. The settlement agreement expenses that were unbudgeted totaled approximately $2 million. As a city, we've known that the consent decree was coming for years, and at what point do we get budgets presented to us that tell taxpayers how much they're going to pay for these required reforms? I think it's important that we are being transparent, because one, the reforms need to happen, and two, taxpayers should know how much the police department's lack of accountability is costing taxpayer dollars. Another issue that I found in this report is that MPD bought license plate readers and an armored suburban vehicle as an unbudgeted item, not as a part of a plan. It was not disclosed. And there was purchases of surveillance equipment that wasn't even brought to our attention. So that's something council should always be aware of. There were also many categories. So eight out of the 30 categories that I saw here had started at zero dollars of budgeted expenses. And then eventually they ended up costing taxpayer dollars. So how was something not budgeted for and then money was spent? That makes no sense to me. And I think this is a good example of the need for us as a council to re-look at our financial policies because this $21 million overrun in overtime is money that is now being taken out of housing inspections, basic city services, violence prevention, city services that really matter to our residents. And when one department can blow over its budget and 29 out of the 30 budget categories that were presented in this memo, our residents now have to face those cuts elsewhere in the city budget. So I want us to be looking into our financial policies to make sure the MPD is being more responsible with its budget because now other departments are facing cuts. Thank you.

THANK YOU, COUNCILMEMBER. I THINK YOU BRING UP A VERY IMPORTANT POINT ABOUT 29 OUT OF 30 CATEGORIES BEING OVERSPENT IN. I THINK THE WAY THE PICTURE HAS BEEN PAINTED FOR US BY THE DEPARTMENT IS THAT NEARLY ALL OF THE OVERSPENDING IS DRIVEN ONLY BY AN INCREASED NEED OR INCREASED DEMANDS FOR OVERTIME. THE DATA TELLS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT STORY. IT TELLS US THAT THERE'S ACTUALLY MISMANAGEMENT IN EVERY BUDGETARY CATEGORY THAT EXISTS WITHIN THE MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT. WE DON'T HAVE, LIKE THE DEPARTMENT ITSELF IS NOT MANAGING ITS BUDGET AND 29 OUT OF 30 CATEGORIES BEING OVERSPENT TELLS THAT PICTURE SO CLEARLY. THANK YOU, COUNCILMEMBER. NEXT I'LL RECOGNIZE COUNCILMEMBER

Thank you.

Thank you. I think at the base here, the public should know that behind the scenes there's been somewhat of a, I guess, freak out that MPD doesn't want to be responding to our legislative directives anymore. The administration has told the council that we don't have the authority to require them to come and present. We can only request them to come and present. And so they are now declining our request. And they say we're just, we're asking too much of them. They don't have the time to come and speak on the matters that we think need spoke on. And so I wanted to address why we give extra oversight to MPD as opposed to other departments. Because it's true that we do. We at least attempt to do that. And the reason that we do that is because other departments don't overspend their budget by $20 million. back-to-back years. Other departments don't have the state of Minnesota say that they have a pattern and practice of racial discrimination against black and native residents. And other departments don't have a history of murder that caused an uprising that cost billions of dollars in the city and created so much psychic pain to our residents other departments don't have these problems and so we don't request them constantly to come before us but MPD does have these problems they have these problems today and so yes we do request uh... and we do expect greater oversight because these are entirely unacceptable and we all agree that they're unacceptable every person in minneapolis agrees that these are unacceptable and so yes we will continue to do the best and do the most that we can to do oversight until we do not have a pattern and practice of racial discrimination against black and native people by the city of minneapolis until we do not have recent history of murder by a police department and by the city of Minneapolis. And until spending is not so insanely out of budget that it's $20 million over. So yes, the oversight will continue.

THANK YOU, COUNCILMEMBER. I'LL JUST NOTE AT THE TOP OF I'LL JUST NOTE AT THE TOP OF YOUR COMMENTS YOU MADE MENTION OF YOUR COMMENTS YOU MADE MENTION OF A MEMO FROM THE MAYOR. A MEMO FROM THE MAYOR. I JUST WANT TO NOTE HERE THAT AT I JUST WANT TO NOTE HERE THAT AT AGENDA SETTING WE DID HAVE AGENDA SETTING WE DID HAVE REPRESENTATIVES FROM THE MINNEAPOLIS REPRESENTATIVES FROM THE MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT IN THE ROOM POLICE DEPARTMENT IN THE ROOM WHO WERE READY TO COME BEFORE US WHO WERE READY TO COME BEFORE US TODAY AND PRESENT ON THIS ITEM TODAY AND PRESENT ON THIS ITEM AND THEY WERE VERY EXPLICITLY AND THEY WERE VERY EXPLICITLY TOLD BY REPRESENTAT SO JUST WANT TO PUT THAT OUT THERE. THE POLICE DEPARTMENT WAS ACTUALLY READY TO COME AND PRESENT TODAY. COUNCIL MEMBER VITAW FOLLOWED BY COUNCIL MEMBER WARREN.

THANK YOU CHAIR CHUKTAI. I'M JUST EXTREMELY DISAPPOINTED THAT NO ONE IS HERE TODAY. MY OFFICE HAS BEEN WORKING REALLY HARD FOR OVER A YEAR TO GET ANSWERS TO THE QUESTIONS WE'VE HAD ABOUT THIS BUDGET. FOR ME THIS BUDGET HAS BEEN ABOUT ONE THING AND THAT'S FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY. THERE'S BEEN AN OVERSPEND IN FUNDS AND I'VE ASKED QUESTIONS AND HAVE um waited patiently for answers to those questions now what i will say is we did get a document uh sent to us that is attached in limbs with the answers to the questions that we asked but you can't send this without there being a follow-up and so you know context nuance all those things matter to me so i was expecting someone to be here before us today so i can ask questions to the answers that was given to me in the document. And one of the things is how will the overspending be prevented in all of these categories in the future? There was something brought up in the responses THAT I WASN'T AWARE OF. ESSENTIALLY WHAT THEY SAID IN THE RESPONSE IS WE HAVE A BUDGET AND WE TRY TO STAY WITHIN THAT BUDGET. THAT THERE IS NO SPECIFIC OVERSIGHT IN THE CATEGORIES. I DIDN'T KNOW THAT. I REALLY THOUGHT LIKE EVERY SINGLE CATEGORY IS, YOU KNOW, micromanaged and making sure folks are staying within what they say they're going to spend and not just like okay it's 200 million dollars as long as we stay under 200 million dollars i have questions about other things in here like the four motorcycles we now own and we have to maintain can we sell those and get our money back where does the money go if we get it back because i was told it was um purchase with funds from i can't remember the name of the um FORFEITURE DOLLARS. SO DO WE GET IT BACK AND IT GOES IN THE GENERAL FUND OR DOES IT GO BACK TO FORFEITURE DOLLARS? I DON'T KNOW. BUT THAT WAS A QUESTION THAT I WANTED TO ASK TODAY. YOU KNOW, THERE ARE JUST THINGS IN HERE THAT, YES, WE CERTAINLY RECEIVED ANSWERS TO THE QUESTIONS, BUT THERE ARE MORE QUESTIONS SINCE WE RECEIVED THE ANSWERS. COUNCILMEMBER CHUKTAI, I WAS NOT AT AGENDA SETTING AND I WASN'T PRIVY TO ANY CONVERSATIONS ABOUT MPD not being here today. I really wish I had known that because I didn't, I was really expecting someone to be here. And not only was I expecting someone to be here, I was expecting someone to be here happy to answer our questions because I have been so patient. I've been okay with folks pushing the date back so that we got the real answers and we didn't have to keep doing this over and over again. I was hoping today would have been the final time that we had to have this conversation. And so I guess the future of this is me looking to find who will meet with me and answer my questions. And how will they answer my questions? I guess I don't know what that is yet. But I just want to end with saying I'm extremely disappointed. My office has worked hard over over a year to not only make sure we develop the proper questions to ask but we've done a lot of research into these very specific categories we've asked uh questions behind the scenes for months and couldn't get the answers then and then started the the public legislative directive to get the answers and it and I mean, I suppose we have them, but I'm certainly hoping for opportunity for follow-up questions to the report that we were given.

Thank you. Next, I'll recognize Council Member Warren, followed by Council Member Palmisano.

Thank you, Chair. I have to say that my frustrations rest very similar to the rest of my council colleagues. I think in the short tenure that I've been here sitting on the council, we have asked MPD to come before us a numerous amount of times with questions around the budget and the budget process. And I thought that that was something that was reflective in an era of leadership. Right. And now, since we are not underneath that leadership, that we should be able to find some clear answers and decipher a lot of the questions that we were coming for, like with the questions about the motorcycles, like the questions about the SUVs, like all of these different things, and then to know. that excess budget from remaining depart from departments that are go unspent at the end of the year, then roll over to the police department. So then there was more money that was there than what they initially probably we thought they started off with because they ended up with some extra change from some change that didn't happen somewhere else. And no one knows what happened with every dollar. And this is frustrating because I just can't get out of my mind the fact that North Minneapolis is facing anywhere from an 11 to 18% tax increase. And I need to know. where we need to cut dollars at in order to ensure that we have neighborhoods that exist to keep safe. And so, because that's huge, that's a big thing. I want people to be mindful of their spending and I wanna make sure that every tax dollar that has an assignment is utilized for the assignment. that it is set out to be used for and not wastefully as though individuals just have endless pockets or something because this doesn't make any sense. So I'm equally as frustrated. I would I would hope that I mean, whoever is jurisdicting the police department and their budget at this time that there is a gap in leadership could come forward and deliver some information on the budget. I think that would be more than fair to ask, and I would think that we should really have those things in order, especially being that we're searching for a new police chief right now, and we don't want them to come into a messy house. We want them to come into a clean house that is decent and in order so that there is an understanding of what they have to work with, what the confines of that is, how this looks, And we're setting out a new, clean, and responsible track record going forward in a path of building healthy relationships so we don't end up with more of the same. And then people are willing to answer our questions because they don't have a feeling of embarrassment around what they have wastefully done with taxpayer dollars over a time period when no one was looking and questions were being asked and people were playing the game of plausible deniability. Anyways, here we are. Thank you. I hope we can get the response that we're looking for. I don't know what's the next step after we have submitted the legislative directives five, 10 different times. How does that work? When it I mean, seriously, like we keep submitting them and then they don't get responded to and or they come back incomplete. Like how many times do you get to do it? And then it doesn't get a response because this is can you clarify? I mean, I don't know.

I'm asking a question. No, no. I hear that you're asking a very genuine question. Mr. Attorney, I'm going to recognize you to speak to what you have advised this body is our legal recourse, our tools of recourse when the administration fails to respond to a legislative directive that was properly and lawfully adopted by this body. Just what's our legal recourse when someone decides to just disregard that?

thank you vice chair let me just first start with what my advice is not my advice is not advice on what is good or bad public policy my advice is what is in the city charter and what are the requirements of the city charter and also i will say i think there's a distinction between Failure to respond at all which I'm not aware of that happening versus a case where a response comes later than the council requested or No presentation or less information than the council requested But you know Under the charter, the council has authority to request information for the exercise of its legislative function, and the mayor must provide that information. The charter does not specify the form of that information or the timing. Essentially, there is a big piece of this that is more of a political issue than a legal question so the city's attorney's office has consistently advised that the council can request dates but those dates aren't mandatory and that the council does not have legal authority to compel presentations The charter is, generally speaking, pretty silent on what happens if somebody doesn't comply. If it's a staff member as opposed to the mayor, the mayor under the charter is responsible for disciplining staff, and the city council can advocate to the mayor for disciplining of staff. But the city council doesn't have direct authority over the mayor if it believes that the mayor is, not responding properly to legislative directive, the same way that the mayor doesn't have direct authority over the council if the mayor believes that the council is not doing its job.

Councilmember Warren, did that answer your question?

Yeah, so then that means that our beloved mayor would have to come to our council meeting or our committee of the whole meetings and provide descriptive information on our police department budget where it currently stands and where we foresee it going in the future. And I think that's a fair request to ask. And we look forward to seeing Jacob here, Mayor Fry here to deliver that information. At least then we have a level set, right? If it is too much, you know, to have individuals here and I think as we are, like I said, we're researching and looking for a new chief at this time and this will be information that he will also share with the new individual who comes into position so then we can all level set together. And that way we have a clear and concise understanding of where we are and where it is that we intend to go. And I think as we are even in search of this new police chief, that these are questions that we ask even about budgeting you know how well are you able to um financially manage a budget and a department of this size right what are your spending habits how are you like as we're putting together all of these police chief search committees and all of these things these are very pertinent questions that need to be asked so we don't end up with more of the same because when our former chief came before this body he stood right there and told us that he would have to get back to us so many different times with information that he did not have before him. And that was extremely frustrating because again, that's money for him to stand at that podium and not come with complete answers and information that is being requested that the public deserves to hear. So I hope that whoever is on the search committee for the new police chief that they take all of these things into thought and consideration as they're bringing forward these questions and that our mayor is able to provide that information to us so that we can level set and have clear expectations of accountability for individuals that we're placing in position of leadership, the end.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, COUNCILMEMBER WARREN. I THINK YOU BROUGHT UP SOME EXCELLENT SUGGESTIONS. SO SOMETHING I'LL JUST NOTE IS I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE THIS ITEM AND WILL REQUEST MAYOR FRIED TO JOIN US IN THESE CHAMBERS AT OUR NEXT COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE MEETING EXACTLY AS YOU DESCRIBED COUNCILMEMBER WARREN TO ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS HIMSELF DIRECTLY. SECOND. THANK YOU. WE'LL CONTINUE WITH Q. I'LL RECOGNIZE COUNCILMEMBER PALMISANO FOLLOWED BY COUNCIL PRESIDENT PAIN.

I think that I was the first recipient of this new policy actually from the mayor with the neighborhood funding report. Follow-up questions will need to be submitted via a staff response memo, and we can all do that. I don't really have specific questions, just some comments here. In this report, some of these things like overtime and settlement agreement implementation are being increased in next year's budget to more accurately reflect the true cost of running the department. The mayor and the budget office have explained that multiple times. I'm hopeful that these types of coverages will be limited, these types of overages will be limited in the future because we've better budgeted for them at the outset. That's my hope. I appreciate the remainder in question six, page seven of the report, that funds get allocated at the fund level, not line item, like the report is laid out. I understand that means departments may knowingly go over in one category and then just make adjustments in other categories to make up the difference. That's good oversight and management by any department leader. And if it were just that we went over in overtime and implementation, I could understand that this is the reality of providing public safety services in the city of Minneapolis. And I support spending for public safety. But here's the thing, there are also a lot of categories, primarily contractual and operating expenses that have gone over budget. and it's not just one item, it's a lot. I agree with my colleagues that it's unacceptable to just keep spending without any apparent recognition of the overall department budget. I will offer the department grace that we can't predict emergencies and they need to respond regardless of whether these are budgeted funds or not. There are some unplanned expenditures in here that make a lot of sense, but then leadership needs to counterbalance that with decreased spending in other areas that they can. From what I see, it looks like funds were spent without any consideration of the overall department budget. I appreciate the steps outlined the MPD will follow to get spending under control, and I hope this is a good start, but the damage has been done, and the department has lost the trust of this council, I think, I don't speak for you, but also some of the public when it comes to their ability to manage their budget, and that will have to be earned back. SO ONE OF MY HOPES FOR A NEW CHIEF IS SOMEONE WHO HAS STRONG ADMINISTRATION AND BUDGETING SKILLS OR HAS THE HUMILITY TO RECOGNIZE THE NEED TO PUT THE CORRECT PEOPLE IN PLACE TO BETTER OVERSEE THIS DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. NEXT I'LL RECOGNIZE COUNCIL PRESIDENT PAIN FOLLOWED BY COUNCIL MEMBER VITAW.

Thank you, Chair Chagtai. There's the proverbial canary in the coal mine. The canary is more sensitive to air quality and was a very rudimentary early signal that the mine was no longer safe and that you needed to fix something about that mine to continue operations. We have, instead of a canary in a coal mine, we have a horse and a barn stall. And as I look at all of these line items, I see $129,000 unbudgeted spending in contractual services, space and equipment rent. The last time that we actually approved a budget for boarding of the mounted patrol horses, that was about $136,000 a year. That's a very similar amount of money spent for the mounted patrol. This is a canary in the coal mine because it is a reflection of an absolute breakdown in governance. This body, very clearly, weighed the costs and the benefits of managing amounted patrol and by way of policy and to the city attorney's point, whether you agree with the policy or not, this body really affirmed that we don't want to allocate spending for amounted patrol anymore. That should be the end of the conversation. And what this unbudgeted line item suggests is that This adopted budget means nothing to this institution. It's not a mere suggestion. It's not guidance. It's irrelevant. If a department can look at a budget and decide we're gonna spend the money anyway, what is the point of budgeting? There's no reason to even establish a budget. We don't even have to get into whether you're funding the police or not funding the police. It's irrelevant. They're gonna spend whatever they wanna spend. And we've politicized this conversation to the point that now it has become toxic to provide fiscal oversight of this department, as though you are some sort of unhinged person who is detached from reality for daring to question how much money is spent on policing. And so I would like to actually contrast that with what we just voted on today. We voted on an unbudgeted expense for the settlement agreement. We had senior leaders in the police department come and present their case about the need. We got clarifying information about whether that need was budgeted or not budgeted. And we all understood the gravity of meeting the requirements of the settlement agreement, particularly around the sensitivity of how we're investigating police misconduct. And we all said in affirmative, This is an unbudgeted expense that is worth taking on. Every one of these line items should have that opportunity. And I agree with Council Member Palmisano. You don't want to micromanage a department. If they have room in another line item in their budget to accommodate and overspend, we should give them the flexibility to run their day-to-day operations without micromanaging them in this chamber on every single council cycle. But we've seen other departments be able to function that way and live within their budget. This is a department that clearly lacks the basic administrative competency. Before we talk about oversight, administrative competency to manage within a budget. And perhaps we need to treat this department differently. Because going forward, we are looking at an 11.3% property tax levy. This is not because of overspending in the health department, although that's one of the most severely cut departments. This is not because of overspending in the regulatory services department, although they're experiencing cuts to, we don't even know, but quite likely, the people who make sure that our housing is safe and dignified. This is happening across multiple departments where department heads have spent a career competently managing their budget. And instead of having an opportunity to say, hey, we are struggling with our staffing, we have, you know, increased violence in the city. We need to bring more officers on board. We need to activate more overtime. We wanna at least let you know, even if that doesn't require a council action so that the council and the public can understand what to anticipate at the end of the year. Instead of that proactive communication and outreach, let alone a request for spending, what we get instead is departments just having to suffer cuts instead of in mid-year recognizing we're going over and if the department doesn't have the capacity to absorb it in another line item we should actually be allocating money responsibly to make sure that we are meeting those core service needs and doing it in public through a democratic debate but instead all of these overages were hidden to the public they were hidden to us and now Not only are our departments suffering, who are all facing meaningful cuts to their ability to deliver their core service, but our residents are suffering with completely unsustainable property tax increases. And so this, today needs to be the day that this changed. Because this is not sustainable, and the fact that we are here is just, SUCH A FAILURE OF GOVERNMENT. IT'S A FAILURE OF DEMOCRACY.

THANK YOU. NEXT I'LL RECOGNIZE COUNCILMEMBER VITA.

THANK YOU, CHAIR. I, YOU KNOW, I DISAGREE WITH COUNCILMAN PALMISANO ON THE MICROMANAGING PIECE BECAUSE I HAVE BEEN MICROMANAGING THIS BUDGET. IT HASN'T ALWAYS BEEN PUBLIC, BUT I'VE CERTAINLY BEEN MICROMANAGING IT SINCE I GOT DOWN TO CITY HALL. AND SO I THINK PEOPLE GET TO CHOOSE WHAT THEY WANT TO MICROMANAGE AND WHAT THEY DON'T WANT TO MICROMANAGE. AND THIS HAS BEEN SOMETHING FOR ME, AND I KNOW, CHAIR, YOU TOO, And so I just want to make sure that people micromanage what they want and let me do what I want to do. Every single line item in this budget means something to me because people ask me about the police budget more than anything when I'm in the community. Even people who are big police supporters, they still want to know how the money is being spent in the police department. I just... i don't know a world as an elected official even when i was on the park board where people did not ask about police budgets constantly and so i came here feeling like i had to micromanage it because there's always so many questions about it and i i also want to say what i thought was different about this presentation was this came before the mayor's memo and before the exchange so we had the former chief before us he couldn't answer questions at that time council member chuck ty and i were actually the only ones asking him questions publicly about this budget when he came before us her and i had we were ready we had our questions ready he didn't answer many questions and um we were just being told that someone's going to come back to answer our questions so so i understand you know the memo and where things are now i just thought this was an exception because it predated that and and like what was told to us in public by i think i asked jerry jeffries was someone coming to present to me who was it going to be And I got answers to those questions in a different committee meeting because I wanted to know who's coming, when are they coming, how is this going to happen? I can be patient, but just tell me when, why, how. I'M CERTAIN I GOT THOSE ANSWERS. SO THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE HERE IS WE HAD A PRESENTATION GIVEN TO US. WE DID NOT GET THE ANSWERS. A DEPARTMENT ASKED FOR TIME. WE GAVE THEM TIME WITH IT BEING A PART TWO COMING BEFORE US, NOT A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PROCESS PUT INTO PLACE. SO I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S DIFFERENT FOR ME THAN ABOUT LIKE WHAT THE FUTURE OF LEGISLATIVE DIRECTIVES ARE. before that. And so I expected something different. And, you know, I really am glad to see us all on the same page with this because it was not easy for council member chuck ty and i to put this together and to ask all these questions and be willing to ask these questions publicly at that time we i certainly was getting a lot of pushback about the questions that i wanted to ask publicly um At that time, and I was getting a lot of questions in my community, all the headlines were saying police $20 million over budget, and people wanted answers. So I'm glad to see that we're on the same page. Do I want to spend every single minute of my life going through the Minneapolis police budget, figuring out what's being spent, if there's any abuse of spending? No, but will I? Absolutely, because that's what I signed up to do. If something's not right, it's not right. If we have questions about motorcycles, if we have questions about, I don't know, I think council member Chavez bought it up. There's an expense of like a million, $1.3 million of a tank or something. I don't even know what it is. It's some kind of vehicle with the, whatever it is. I don't know. I didn't know we were getting that. And I didn't know we had money for that. and so like in the future i want to know like what is that needed for how can i go back and i would like to know before because i want to go say hey we're going to get this new shiny object and this is what it's going to be used for i want to be able to explain to the people in north minneapolis what it's for and how it's going to be used and what the benefits are for them i expect that from everybody like i don't sign on for anything here that does not benefit or that the north side does not get a say in and so in the future i mean that mechanism isn't in the place and it's not in place now but i want to know that i want to be able to go back and say what these expenses are why we have them if um where what are we using them for and the benefits to them and and i think we're all old that Like, I had no idea the amount of equipment that was being purchased has been purchased over the last few years. And if someone asked me about this, I mean, they've given us just pages and pages of Dodge Durangos and Ford Explorer and Chevy Malibu. Like, I don't even know what this is. If this is something new, if this is something old, I don't know. But I really wanted to ask the question today. What is this ledger of... I mean, a whole lot of cars. There's, I don't know if everyone else printed this off, but I have like a ledger of like all kinds of stuff. Some of this stuff, a Corolla. I had a Corolla in 1994. What's the police department doing with the Toyota Corolla? know but it's in this ledger and I don't know what it means and I don't know what it's for there's like a bunch of list of things and I and there's dates it says like 20 2002 for the accord in 2009 for the Corolla but I don't really know what that means And so I was expecting someone to tell me exactly what that means. So I really am glad we're on the same page about this. And I hope that in the future, we work together as a council to make sure that we get the answers that residents deserve around everybody's budget, not just the police budget, but all the departments in this city. People want to know how their money is being spent, especially since it's getting tighter around here. Like when you're asked to pay more, you want to know what you're getting for more money. And if the more is not benefiting you, you don't want to pay more.

Thank you. Next I'll recognize Council Member Schaffer.

Yes, thank you everyone for your comments and for Council Member Chagtai and Council Member Vita bringing this forward. I just have one question if we do have follow-up questions and I think I flagged it for a few people but I'd like to flag it for all of us as well. One thing that would be really helpful I think for us as we head into the budget process is to understand in the overtime line item WHAT CATEGORY OF WORK HAPPENED WHAT CATEGORY OF WORK HAPPENED WITHIN THAT DOLLAR AMOUNT? WITHIN THAT DOLLAR AMOUNT? IS IT ALL COVERING SHORT SHIFTS IS IT ALL COVERING SHORT SHIFTS ON THE PRECINCTS, 911? ON THE PRECINCTS, 911? IS IT SPECIAL EVENTS? IS IT SPECIAL EVENTS? IS IT ADMINISTRATION? I THINK THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT QUESTION THAT WE NEED TO GET THE DETAIL ON BEFORE WE CAN, YOU KNOW, AGREE ON AN OVERTIME NUMBER TO RIGHT SIZE THE POLICE DEPARTMENT. AND I THINK THAT'S A FAIR QUESTION TO ASK, IS WHAT IS THAT SPEND BY CATEGORY? SO LET'S ADD THAT TO THE LIST OF THINGS WE WANT TO ADDITIONALLY FIND OUT. THANKS.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. YEAH, COUNCILMEMBER SCHAEFFER, YEAH, COUNCILMEMBER SCHAEFFER, YEAH, COUNCILMEMBER SCHAEFFER, YOU'VE RAISED THIS POINT BEFORE. YOU'VE RAISED THIS POINT BEFORE. YOU'VE RAISED THIS POINT BEFORE. SO IF WE CAN NOTE THIS FOR I SO IF WE CAN NOTE THIS FOR I SO IF WE CAN NOTE THIS FOR I GUESS ADMINISTRATIVE FOLLOW-UP TO GUESS ADMINISTRATIVE FOLLOW-UP TO GUESS ADMINISTRATIVE FOLLOW-UP TO WHOEVER IS NOT HERE AND IS NOT WHOEVER IS NOT HERE AND IS NOT WHOEVER IS NOT HERE AND IS NOT PLANNING ON COMING HERE TO ANSWER PLANNING ON COMING HERE TO ANSWER PLANNING ON COMING HERE TO ANSWER BASIC QUESTIONS ABOUT IF WE CAN JUST NOTE THAT WE'D LIKE TO KNOW EXACTLY WHAT CATEGORIES THAT OVERTIME SPEND GOES IN, BECAUSE AS WE'RE AWARE, THERE'S $13 MILLION WORTH OF OVERTIME THAT WE'RE INCLUDING IN THE LEVY, WHICH IS ABOUT TWO AND A HALF LEVY POINTS, AND SO MAYBE IT WOULD BE GOOD TO KNOW. Thank you. Did you have any additional comments? Wonderful. Well, I put myself in queue because I was hoping to ask a few questions. And clerks, if we can just note this for administrative follow-up, I guess. It'd be really helpful to understand the justification behind 125 take-home vehicles and why 125 different vehicles are being brought to their homes THIRD RING SUBURBS, I DON'T KNOW. IT LOOKS LIKE FRINGE AND UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS WERE UNBUDGETED FOR THAT WENT OVER, AND IT SEEMS LIKE AN ODD THING TO HAVE NOT BUDGETED. WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR BENEFITS, IN OUR FRINGE AND UNEMPLOYMENT COSTS THAT'S DRIVING THIS BUDGET OVER? IT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL TO UNDERSTAND, OKAY, AS ONE EXAMPLE, THE MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT HAPPENS TO HAVE THE LARGEST FOOD AND BEVERAGE BUDGET, $50,000, THAT'S BUDGETED. THEY HAPPEN TO, THEY MANAGE SOMEHOW TO OVERSPEND THIS LINE ITEM AS WELL. THEY HAD $50,000 WHICH IS MORE THAN ANYBODY ELSE HAS. So it's really difficult to understand how they manage to, if someone can explain how they manage to overspend while having the largest food and beverage budget, that'd be great. I mean, I guess it'd be great to understand IT contractual services that apparently were unbudgeted. I mean, every single department budgets their IT costs. It seems really bizarre to me that this department didn't and then ended up overspending it by $100,000. The road to $20 million is built every penny at a time. I MEAN, CONTRACTUAL SERVICES WENT $600,000 OVER BUDGET. AND WE ALREADY BUDGETED FOR TRAINING COSTS AND SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT COSTS. SO I'M JUST NOT UNDERSTANDING WHAT DROVE THIS INCREASE WHEN WE ALREADY BUDGETED FOR SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT RELATED EXPENSES. SO YOU KNOW SINCE WE'RE CONTINUING THIS ITEM AND WE'RE REQUESTING THE MAYOR TO JOIN US NEXT TIME OR YOU KNOW I GUESS IF HE WANTS TO SEND OCS OR MPD TO ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS HE COULD SO ON THE MOTION TO CONTINUE THIS ITEM ALL THOSE IN FAVOR PLEASE SIGNIFY BY SAYING AYE AYE THOSE OPPOSED SAY NAY ANY ABSTENTIONS? THE AYES HAVE IT AND THAT MOTION CARRIES. ALL RIGHT. SEEING NO FURTHER BUSINESS TO COME BEFORE US AND WITHOUT OBJECTION I DECLARE THIS MEETING ADJOURNED. THANK YOU, EVERYONE.