Town Commission - Regular Meeting

okay we're recording okay it is 6 0 1 on august 19th uh six uh this is our regular scheduled meeting uh so if um town clerk mr jones would call the roll please

Mayor Allison Dennington.

Here.

Vice Mayor Terry Cronin. Here. Commissioner Anna Butler.

Here.

Commissioner Tim Reed. Here. Commissioner Sherry Corey.

Here.

Town Manager Amory Smith.

Here.

Town Attorney Ryan Knight. Here. Fire Chief Gavin Brown. Here. Police Chief Tim Zander.

Here.

Building Official Jeff Parsons.

Here.

Public Works Director Tom Davis.

Here.

Finance Manager Jennifer Kerr.

Here.

And Town Clerk Sid Jones is also present.

All right, we'll stand and say the Pledge of Allegiance.

of the United States of America, and to be a republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice strong.

All right, we will have a moment of silence and then do the civility pledge. All right, I will read the civility pledge. The commission and the staff of the town of Melbourne Beach pledge to conduct all public discourse in a civil manner. The mayor and all members of the commission will treat one another with courtesy and respect and ask the public to do the same towards the commission, towards each other, and towards staff. We will respect one another. Even when we disagree, we will direct all comments toward the issues. and we will avoid personal attacks. Meetings, additions, deletions, and changes. There are a couple of documents that are up here as walk-on or supplemental documents, so I'm gonna read those out just in the order that I have them. There is a one-page, one-sided document titled The Town Budget Expenditures by Department, and it's got a chart and some figures, so that is document one. There is a two-page double-sided email from Vice Mayor Cronin to the manager and the clerk. A quick reference regarding a point of order. So that's two pages, that's document two. There is another document, document three, which is a four-page document on 11 by 17 paper entitled Town of Melbourne Beach 2010 Bond Finance Stormwater Capital Improvements by Basin and Street. And it also has some highlights with technical memorandum, FDAP agreement report, and maybe some updates from the Jones-Edmund Associates May 2014 study. So it's 2010, but also has some 2014. That's four pages, document three. Document four is a one-page, one-sided FDEP agreement number G0320, Task Level Cost and Match Summary. And this also references the Jones-Edmund May 2014 report. Those are the four documents as well as the actual audit report itself. In the packet, the documentation looks like the PowerPoint but not the audit itself. But we do have this now and it will be on the website. So those four documents as well as the audit report will be supplemented to the website in the near future. Now with that said, does anyone have any additions, changes, moving around of anything on the agenda that they would like to propose? before we have a motion to accept the agenda?

Yes, I do.

Okay, what's your proposal?

So on the consent agenda, I was going to ask that we take items E and G off of consent item. Actually, the consent agenda. So I guess E, we could move down to new business. And G, I think that's old business. I think we've talked about that before, so.

Well, actually, so when we get to the, so you approved the agenda as it is, but then when we get to the consent agenda item, I would just say, does anyone have any objection? That's the point at which you would move those, and we talk about that as to where. If the commission would like, we could just go ahead and talk about moving those now, but I still, when we get to the consent agenda item, my duty is to ask, is there any member that would like to pull anything? So it would still happen anyway, so... I would suggest we just do it then, that way it's collective. Other than the consent agenda items, because you will still have, by approving the agenda, you don't approve the consent agenda items. We still do that when we get to it. Any other things that people want to move around, though, that's the, before we approve the agenda. okay seeing none i would entertain a motion to approve the agenda so moved okay second second all in favor say aye aye aye aye all opposed okay so the agenda is approved um next we will get to um uh proclamations awards and announcements so uh town clerk page four of the packet is the town clerk's announcements is there anything you'd like to add to that no for the next four weeks we don't have any special events so it's just the regular free classes in the park that are available on our website calendar okay all right then we will do there's two proclamations B and C I will read those do you want to give me the official one and then do we have any representatives from either of these organizations that want would like to get up and speak or to take any pictures

I believe we do for both. There was an individual, I think, who was on the way for the second proclamation recognizing Suicide Prevention Month. I'm not sure if they've arrived yet.

Okay, great. We can do a picture then later when they arrive. Okay, so are these in order? Yes, okay, so I will read the first one, which is item B. So this is a official proclamation, town of Melbourne Beach, 36th anniversary commemoration and solidified community support for persons with disabilities, caregivers, health support infrastructure. Whereas on July 26, 1990, the landmark American with Disabilities Act was signed into law, establishing a vital national civil rights mandate to guarantee equal opportunity, full participation, independent living, and economic self-sufficiency for all individuals with disabilities. And whereas on this day, August 19, 2026, Our community proudly joins local municipalities, Brevard County in the state of Florida, and communities across the nation in celebrating the 36th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act, recognizing three and a half decades of continuous progress towards unrestricted mobility, civil liberties, and equal access. And whereas out of Brevard County's total population of approximately 660,000 residents, over 109,000 individuals live with a disability, alongside over 60,000 military veterans residing with our region, many of whom carry service-connected disabilities requiring specialized housing, adaptive health systems, mobility infrastructure, and community-based support services. And whereas true disability independence and inclusion are sustained through the steadfast dedication of family relative caregivers, partner caregivers, therapeutic resource networks, healthcare professionals, specialized education, educational institutions, behavioral care systems, and local community-based organizations. And whereas this unified legislative appeal is brought forward directly by America's Persons with Disabilities, an alliance of persons with disabilities, their family caregivers, and healthcare support networks, standing as the sole petitioning body requesting this formal proclamation to ensure that all residents, small businesses, storefront operators, and residential developers uphold full ADA compliance, proactive, reasonable accommodations, and accessible physical and technical environments, and whereas our governing authority stands firmly committed to eliminating physical, technical, and systematic barriers across commercial corridors, public transit networks, municipal infrastructure, and housing developments, affirming that accessibility, independent living, and full inclusion are essential safeguards for life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Now, therefore, I, Alison Dennington, Mayor of the Town of Melbourne Beach in the State of Florida, do hereby proclaim July 26th as the 36th anniversary of the Americans with Disabilities Act and Community Accessible Awareness Day, and call upon all residents, businesses, community-based organizations, developers, and public institutions to honor the contributions of persons with disabilities celebrate the vital role of caregivers and health support infrastructure, and recommit to advancing full accessibility, inclusion, and civil rights throughout our community.

All right, thank you.

So I will give that to you so I don't spill anything on it and I will sign it afterwards. And you do believe someone is here from that organization?

They have arrived.

oh yes um if if they would like to come up and and and speak uh we would invite you to and then if you'd like to take a picture with the commission afterwards we could come down and do that is someone here from the sponsoring um group I'd love to hear more about the group that proposed the...

They had sent me a reply that they were attending, but I'm not sure if anybody has actually shown up.

Okay, all right. We will go ahead and move on to the next one. If they do show up, then will you let us know? Absolutely. Okay, the next item is a proclamation for National Suicide Prevention Month, September 2026. Whereas September is designated as National Suicide Prevention Month, is recognized by the National Association of Mental Illness, and whereas many health officials and community leaders locally, state, and nationally understand that mental illness is a significant issue of concern, particularly among our youth, and whereas we realize that to address mental health issues, issues requires more open and honest discussion about mental health, and whereas one major hurdle is removing the stigma attached to mental health treatment and discussion, and whereas individuals, businesses, organizations, public officials, and many others recognize the importance of emotional health, and now therefore be it resolved that the Town of Melbourne Beach supports efforts on the Space Coast to provide education and resources for mental health problems, And be it further resolved that the Town of Melbourne Beach will encourage a positive effort to encourage those with mental health issues to seek the help of a family member, a friend, a colleague, and or a licensed mental health professional to assist them in times of need. Now, therefore, I, Alison Dennington, Mayor of the Town of Melbourne Beach in the State of Florida, do hereby proclaim the month of September, 2026, as National Suicide Prevention Month. And witness hereof, oh, that's the next part when I sign it, so I don't need to read that. Okay, and we believe that they may be coming later, so if any, oh, yes, would you like to come up and speak? I'd love, thank you.

the importance of the suicide prevention and awareness and for issuing the proclamation. So thank you, Mayor Dennington and Vice Mayor and Commissioners. So I'm Lisa Hickman from the Space Coast Health Foundation in Rockledge. That's why I was a little rocklage. I always love coming down here, though. It's just such a beautiful drive. You've got a very, very beautiful town. So I'm the executive assistant to the president, CEO, Janet Gendling. And we have several programs that we operate. We have the Children's Advocacy Center. We take care of all of the little kiddos here in Brevard County that are physically and sexually abused. We also have Lifetime Counseling Center, which is the licensed mental health therapists. And we have the Center for Collaboration, which is a nice area for you to have meetings. And just a little side note, if you're a nonprofit, we do give you two hours free. And one thing that we don't talk about a lot, but we do, we are grant makers. So we like to grant to the folks in Brevard County that are helping making it a healthier and more beautiful place. So this recognition is especially meaningful here in Brevard County because the numbers tell us that suicide continues to be a serious concern in our community. According to the Florida Department of Health in 2024, which is the recent numbers that we have, 138 people in Brevard County died by suicide. So that's 2024, 138 people. Brevard's age-adjusted suicide death rate is 17.2 per 100,000 people, compared with 13.9 for the state of Florida. That means our rate here in Brevard was approximately 24% higher than the statewide rate. And this just isn't one difficult year. Over the past 10 years, Brevard's suicide rate has been higher than the Florida's every single year. And I have been coming for the past several years, and I feel like every time I come I give you these stats that are not so good, but I do have a little bit of good news. There is some encouraging news. Our rate has declined from 22.1 in 2015 to 17.2 in 24. So this tells us progress is possible, but 135 lives lost in one year remains, or excuse me, reminds us that there is still much more work to do. Behind every one of those numbers is a person, a family member, friend, coworker, neighbor, or a loved one, and a family and community forever impacted by their loss. So that's why this proclamation like this really matters. They bring suicide and mental health out of the shadows. They help reduce stigma, encourage conversation, and remind people that asking for help is a sign of strength. By recognizing suicide prevention and awareness, our cities and towns are sending important messages. You matter, you're not alone, and our community cares. So thank you for standing with us and helping us create a healthier and a more supportive Brevard County. I also would like to note that Brevard County is one of the only counties in the state of Florida that all cities, towns, have all signed proclamations. So we're very busy this month running around to all the different commissions and town meetings. So we do appreciate your time and thank you for letting us.

Thank you. Thank you. Would the commission like to go down and take a picture? Quite a long way from... Yeah, we'll come down.

Well, I appreciate that. Thank you.

Thank you.

Okay, yeah.

I'm gonna have to drink some water after reading all those. You need to, and I didn't even read it.

I tried not to read them too fast, but.

You did great.

Okay.

All right, so now we will get to item six, and then after that we'll have public comment, general public comment, but we will now do the auditor's report, and the packet, Pages 8 to 6 does have the presentation that's going on as well as the actual report will be on the website.

This year just based on the timing I will note the audit was completed in early June and then just timing wise with July meeting didn't work was how we ended up here but everything was completed on time prior to the June 30 state deadline so just to highlight that fact again given the timing of this meeting. So on the first slide, I got two slides, just hit a series of required communications. On this first one, we have just required communications first related to significant risk areas. We are required to just communicate from an accounting perspective what those significant risk areas are that we look at during the audit. The first two internal controls and override of those controls by management as well as improper revenue recognition, those are two just very standard risks in any audit. And then one very common for us in all of our governmental engagements is the improper use of restricted resource to say when you've got restricted dollars coming in, are those being spent appropriately? We came across no issues in any of those areas, but again, are just required to identify those. From a policy standpoint, the town of course does follow governmental accounting standards. We had no significant changes this year. Did have some new standards that went into effect, but there was no material impact on the town's financial statements from those. Significant estimates, some of these numbers are not exact. So your reconciled bank balance, that's very precise. When it comes to your pension liability being the big one, potentially some receivables where you If there's anything that ultimately did not get collected, there's some degree of estimability. So we have to identify those. But again, we believe all amounts to be accurately represented. Notable disclosures just related to your deposits and investments, long-term debt, as well as there's a few pages every year of disclosures related to pensions, both for FRS as well as your police pension plan. On the next slide, first, if we have any difficulties performing the audit or other issues, we would have to disclose those. There was nothing to that effect. Again, a very smooth process. With regard to any adjusting entries or changes to the numbers, what we basically do here is identify any changes from what was in the system, so maybe a preliminary year-end internal report to how it all rolls up in the audit. Most of those relate to just once the final numbers came in for year-end receivable accruals, As well as this year, we also had some disposed assets which did not have any impact to your fund financial statements, but just truing up what we call your government-wide financial statements where those capital assets show up on the books. And then like no difficulties, no disagreements or other issues with management. On the next slide, we summarize the four reports that we issue. These are very similar to prior years. The first is the audit report on the financial statements. We did issue an unmodified opinion. This is the best opinion we can issue and says that the town's financial statements are what we call fairly presented in all material respects. Effectively, the numbers can be relied upon. The second report is on internal control and compliance. And while this is not an internal control audit, there's separate engagements that would have that as the objective. As it relates to financial reporting, we do look at and consider your internal controls over key transactional areas in addition to just getting the numbers right at year end. So we do a lot of testing over accounts, payable activity, payroll. If we come across any deficiencies in the design of those controls or instances where say your controls were not followed, those are the types of things that could rise to be reported in this letter. We had no such items to report on this year. The last two are required by the state of Florida. Every year, just based on what the state legislature does, they usually will tweak a few things to address all requirements that the state wants reported back to the auditor general. Mostly here, a lot of the focus is on financial condition. If there were any negative trends or red flags of the town's financial condition, those would have to be reported here. No items to that effect. The only modification we had here is there was a section for just other recommendations or observations and we had one comment related to leave approval and the policy there just related to how when there's approvals being made to changes in leave balance or otherwise and what the documentation is there that there's just a very clear requirement in the policy to be followed. So that covers the reports. To hit the numbers, I always like to just do a quick overview first of four year history of your fund balance in the general fund. As you can see on this slide, a pretty stable trend in your general fund balance, more or less kind of inflationary increases, a couple hundred thousand dollar increase from the prior year. But what I like to focus on here is we have those five buckets and really the one that means the most is your unassigned fund balance. Because like in that restricted line item, That includes your restricted building department funds, for instance, that have to be used for that purpose where you're unassigned relates to just your unrestricted residual reserve. So on the next slide, we look at your unassigned relative to what you spent in the current year to measure, well, how many months are there in reserves? And you can see about 78% this year relative to 76% last year. So very consistent at that about nine month mark. The GFOA, Government Finance Officers Association, does recommend a bare minimum of two months. But as I've said in the past, as a small government, they have that two month recommendation as a bare minimum, give you a whole bunch of reasons why it might be higher. Natural disasters being, of course, the largest variable. But as a small entity, again, a $4.5 million budget of what you spent in the general fund this year, we typically will see that percentage higher just because we're still just talking $3.5 million, and that just goes way further as a percent when you're a smaller government. So overall, a very healthy position that the town continues to be in. And then this last slide here is kind of the catch-all. First, your other governmental funds generally where all of your restricted dollars flow for the most part to have the transparency and accountability over the use of those funds. About $3 million in total fund balance there. Again, we do test a lot there to say, were those restricted dollars spent appropriately? We had no issues that came up during our testing. And then I always like to touch on the net pension liability primarily related to the Florida retirement system. That shows up as about a half a million dollar liability. That's really just for informational purposes to comply with accounting standards. The obligation of the town is every month based on payroll. Those contributions to FRS are made. That has been done. So I just again like to say that's not one where you will have to write a half a million dollar check or anything like that. It's really more for informational purposes. And the police pension continues to be very stable, about 103% from the point-in-time measurement. So this measurement for financial reporting is a little bit different than what's used from a funding standpoint, but typically very similar. So that plan continues to be in a solid position as well. So those are the highlights. I wanted to keep it brief, but I'm more than glad to answer any questions. And thank you all for the chance to be here.

All right. You want to just go down the line? Everybody ask a question, then go back down the line again. Commissioner Reed, do you have any questions?

I don't have any questions.

Great job. I have a material weakness, and I think I've talked to you this before, but is there like a guidance for like what's the size of what's considered a material weakness? Because you don't look at everything. It's like there are maybe some certain numbers of things. Is there like a sort of threshold amount?

So there is a piece where it comes back to just judgment in terms of the severity. The underlying focus for it is, is there a risk of a material misstatement of the financial statements? So some areas that could cause that is say there's something that's accounted for in the wrong period. And we find an error from an accounting standpoint that, oh, hey, this $500,000 was in the wrong fund or in the wrong fiscal year.

That's material, okay.

Yeah, because if it, say, would impact your fund balance, well, whether you have a $3 million reserve or $3.5 million, to say, well, what would the ramifications be, is that a, again, material is the audit standards language to assess that.

I had a couple more other questions. Okay. uh and i uh on the uh the the leave recommendation did that have to do with comp time was that a comp time or was it more comp time and other i believe it was comp time also other again really i think there were some verbal approvals okay and really just clarifying okay let's make sure the policy says first what that needs to be because it was one to say well here's how it's approved the policy i believe didn't specify i do remember speaking to the manager about this that you know and i do believe that they have corrected that i think so that you have put into place some changes or whatever so i think that has been addressed that's correct okay that's what i thought um the on the this page page 11 of your presentation to some of the other pages you've got references to where these things um exist but i i was wondering like uh so five there were five entries that were booked and uh can you kind of maybe explain like are there is there a page reference for these in the audit or is this just some small things in the sort of like truing up that you would we'd be able to go back and like this would be we'd look at the budget itself to see correct at the end of the year

Yeah, so that's more just procedural items in terms of summarizing the audit process to say that, hey, there were entries booked relative from what was in the system. So basically that that's kind of bridging the gap from, again, maybe internal financial statements based on the numbers at the time that we started the audit. relative to what's in those financial statements.

Okay. So, like, because, like, one of them, like, it's true up on the state revenue gas tax timing, true up on recognition of FPL, you know, and then one of them is a 23.8

entry to correct the recording of a disposed asset which was initially but like what what do you know what so that related to your I forget the number you guys use if it's 900 or 850 I believe with capital assets it didn't impact your general fund or otherwise it was just again this roll-up fund to get to what we call your governmental activities okay because in these financial statements We have your general fund, your fund level data that's consistent with the budget. And then we have the roll up into your statement of net position and statement of activities where we put your debt on the books, your capital asset on the books. So that that adjustment related just to that roll up process.

OK, so I mean, like we recorded it, it just maybe had to be record like recorded in the right little category. And same thing on the 18 reclassification. I mean, like we recorded it. It just needed to be recorded with the right numbers. Yeah. OK. And then what year end pension close and entry subsequent to finalization? What is that? Our pension looks good, right?

Yeah. Again, I mean, over 100% fund on the police front. That's really just at once. We got the numbers, I think, before that actuary report had been published. So from the numbers, again, that we were given to what's here, we had to book that activity.

Okay. And the net position adjustment for timing of donated asset. Okay. What's the $100,000 for donated asset?

I forget exactly what, but... That was a boat to the fire department.

Okay, that was the boat. Got it. Okay. Okay, that was... Then the last question, or two questions. In 2023, one of your recommendations was us doing this inventory asset list or whatever, which we have and we've been working on. Done... done a little bit of research, and we have some weird stuff in our code, which later on I have some proposals for the manager for how we could clean it up next year. They could in the ordinances. But we define a capital fixed asset as anything over $500. But I don't think that as part of y'all's audit, y'all don't look at that. You just look at sort of some of the state requirements, because the state, it's like there's a state requirement with $5,000 and $10,000 from the audit reports. Is that... Like, you don't... You don't check things like our specific local code and do we have, you know, are we meeting that? You just check the state requirements, correct?

Again, really driven off of the financial statement side.

Those are not going to be in the financial statements then, I think. Correct.

Yeah, and your financial statement threshold can be different than your actual asset tracking.

And that's more of like an operational, not a financial statements audit.

Yeah.

Last thing, I read that there are a couple rules that are going to be effective for the next year, that there may be some things that will require us to change. Are there any rules that are going to be effective next year that might require us to change any accounting of anything that we need to be prepared for?

Probably not too much on the accounting side. I mean, there's, of course, the budgetary changes with the Transparency Act going into effect in January, but that won't impact... too much on the accounting side.

So no new like the GASB rules that are proposed right now that will go into effect that you can think of that our finance needs to maybe look at now?

Yeah, so there will be one GASB 103 going into effect, which is changing some of the yeah rules around it the impacts will not be significant the management's discussion and analysis at the very front formatted a little bit differently a few things kind of move but again not okay you know significant your budgetary comparison schedule so we have your your general fund and any major special revenue funds say here was your original budget your final budget your actual and the variance, that statement does require now there's gonna be a budgetary variance column. So again, just one more column.

Okay, but it doesn't require any kind of reclassification. And I think that was at the 103. Is that the one that has to do with software, software as a service, leases, and how you have to change the treatment of those?

So those were a few years ago, like 87 and 96 are the numbers.

Those are all my questions. I JUST WANT TO THANK JENNIFER KERR AND MS. SMITH.

GREAT JOB.

uh okay all right we will go to now public comment so public comment for any general items that are not on the agenda now is your time to speak if it will be on the agenda budget is something that will be on the agenda then wait and you'll also have your three minutes during that period although if we're not voting on the budget any issue then that might not be something that they would be able to comment on. So maybe if you do have a budget item, speak to it because we'll be discussing the budget but not voting.

Good evening. My name is David Manhart. I live at 213 First Avenue. Just moved in. We did reside at Windjammer across from Loggerhead Beach. We go out to see the launch a lot on the beach and down in Loggerhead Beach. It's very dark and nice and we went out for a They launched the other night straight out First Street next to the Sands restaurant. And the beach is lit up like a daytime. And it's like, I'm thinking, these turtles aren't going to know what's going on here. Because, I mean, it's just lit. And I would like it to be darker just for the launch, for one, but I think it's detrimental to the turtles. So I don't know. I think something should be addressed to stop the lighting of that. The whole end of the street, it's just lit from a quarter mile both ways from the parking lot. That's what I got.

We do have a lighting ordinance, at least for turtle season. which we are, it's May, is it May through November? October. Yeah, I thought it was May through November. So we are in turtle season, yeah. So I would suggest that you could make a report to the town to code enforcement. because there is a lighting ordinance and it's designed to, you're supposed to turn off certain lights so that it won't affect the turtles.

So this is not the place for me to do this?

No, no, that is. But I don't know that you can make a code enforcement complaint right here is what... think that you have to give them like a specific instance or a time or an address from which they can go out unless it's town property or town lights that is something that we could look into do you know is it particular houses on their property I mean it's on their parking lot okay yeah so which which which property

The Sands Restaurant?

The Sands Restaurant, okay. Could we take note of that?

Yeah, we will, and we have taken note of it. I think we have given them a warning, and they haven't done anything, so we're going to have to go back out there again.

Okay.

Yes, and I've seen it, too. I was out there looking for the baby turtles, and I saw one getting kind of turned around because of that light. So I did talk to code enforcement this week about it.

If you'd like to leave your email or phone number or just contact name with the manager, then she could if she would like to be able to follow up with you.

Got it.

Thank you. Appreciate it.

I've also applied to be on the zoning board building zoning and planning. As an alternate, probably, if it gets approved. But it didn't make this agenda. The other two applications are there. So nice to meet you, Sid.

Good seeing you too, David. Thank you. Yeah, he'll be on the September agenda.

Thank you for volunteering.

Hello Bob deal to 19 surf road. Um, I'd mentioned this, I don't know, a month or two ago, but, uh, the, uh, zoning board for building, uh, new homes or even replacement homes, that's usually what's happening mostly in Melbourne beach. So right now, um, the town is in violation of the law, but state law law says the building department has 30 days to issue a permit or give comment of why they're not issuing the permit. that can't happen with the current system. I propose that you do away with the zoning board. You know, in special situations like replacement houses and things, you already have a person who looks at the zoning to make sure that the new plan is within compliance, setbacks and all that. Not necessary to have a zoning board for that instance. Likewise with the commission. Yeah, you've got a consent agenda.

And that's what most of these come through in their consent agenda.

Why? All it does is waste time and puts the building department in noncompliance with state law. Go ahead.

Did you have a comment? Yeah. So you are correct. We have 30 days, but that's 30 days after a sufficiency review has been approved. And part of the sufficiency review is approval from planning and zoning.

I agree, but there's no reason to have a board that doesn't do anything.

That may be, but the building department is not out of compliance because like I said, that 30 days does not start until after the sufficiency review has been approved. And part of that sufficiency review is having planning and zoning approval.

I'd have to look into that further, but I'm not sure that's totally accurate. Secondly is the engineered site plans. All of Melbourne Beach is one big sand pit, and these engineering site plans cost a lot of money. It's just driving up costs for homeowners. And when it rains, it goes through the soil immediately. And having these retention ponds that are... seriously overstated is ridiculous and needs to be looked at and scaled back significantly so thank you thank you have you ever thought about applying to the PNZ come on up hey all doing Gary Neal 404 Avenue B and actually I know PNZ I'm actually here to comment on the same actual

Item from 2020. So first off I'm a big supporter of the IRL IRL big supporter of you know, saving the lagoon I believe we need responsible stormwater management and I'm willing to pay my fair share for the infrastructure that accomplishes that I'm actually a civil engineer myself and I have a concern for sure about the residential adoptions in 2020 that they went too far Melbourne Beach requires qualifying residential properties to retain eight inches of runoff for a ten-year storm To put that in perspective, right across the causeway, Melbourne only requires one inch of rainfall. I'm not sure if you knew that. And it isn't just an engineering calculation on paper. A recent residential property of 3,100 square foot property, or sorry, 12,600 square foot property, 3,000 square feet was dry retention. Maybe that guy's property, I don't know. And as a civil engineer, I believe that the regulation definitely diminishes the property value. So again, I'm just here to say we'd love to have that revisited if the new tax goes up.

I don't want to interrupt you.

No, go ahead. I'm an engineer.

You mentioned the 2020. Is that when, because I listened to a meeting from back that time, and I think it's when they pass it, and I recall the engineer at the time uh... missed mister scott actually recall him saying are trying to tell the town commission but that this is all applicable to commercial facility residential yeah i'm a commercial and i remember thinking haha and they just was that and then it was like the discussion just kept going completely nor i i would be interested in talking to you and understand that issue better because also think i think storm waters are important and we do have a lot of big houses that are being built and bigger you know but um you know i'm happy to meet you know meet with you on it i'm a commercial contractor as well so if you could leave your contact information i i'd love to call and hear more of your perspective absolutely i mean for me it's like you know you have 25 of your property used up storm water when it should be more like you know five percent Yeah, I'd love to figure out a way that we could adjust the swales.

Okay, sounds good. I'll leave my information. All right, thanks.

Hi, I'm Ted Funkhauser, 509 Banyan Way. I'd like to talk a little bit about the short-term rentals. Once again, AKA Airbnb, VRBOs, etc., Across the street from me, 510 Banyan Way, there's an Airbnb. And, you know, I've called countless times about people parking in the street, parking on the grass, all this other stuff. And up to and including today, they're still parking on the grass and not adhering to the rules and regulations. I've talked to the Melbourne Beach Police at least once. eight times called them and I know it's been 10 I think and also the code enforcement at least eight or nine times about this stuff and also they have garbage cans out there that I look at every day for weeks on end. They will have a weekend party over there. They will have two or three trash cans sitting there from Sunday afternoon until the next Saturday because even though they picked the trash up, they don't take the cans back. When I first moved here, I put big glass doors on my house so I could look out and look at the nice vegetation. Of course, the freeze kind of destroyed some of that. I look at trash cans for the last five years. It's disgusting. Nobody does anything about it. I keep calling and calling and calling. Nobody does anything. I'm disgusted with it. Anyway, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

Question. I even saw in the police report there was a discussion that you've started to put the complaints in and what the police and often those are some of those are parking and I know that the police tend to go out and they speak to the people there and they know that they moved the car so there's not a violation triggered. But are we by chance at least tracking if there are houses where we tend to get repeat calls even if it's a different check-in person but like it's there certain houses are getting repeat calls for that and could we potentially have a list to where we actually do more than just ask people to remove the cars but start citing them when they're it's the same house and that's a question to the chief and to the attorney

so we obviously uh respond out to these instances um 99.9 percent of the time uh they're different people that are staying there each time so it's not the same offender it's the same homeowner yeah it's the same operator so all the information is passed on to code enforcement to start that process if need be every single um uh RBO short term rental call that we get is given to code as well so that he is aware of that and he can track it and then start the process that he needs to do to take it to a magistrate and so on and so forth.

So then the question would be to the manager and to the town attorney is code enforcement potentially at least tracking where The same house is generating parking call complaints. It may be a different person that checks in each week, but it's the operator who is apparently not advising each check-in's group that you can't park in these places so that we could maybe get a naughty list and potentially say, okay, next time rather than just ask them and we're gonna give them a citation. I don't know, but.

It's not just me either. I'm sorry, but the people behind them, Brian Troy, has a horrendous amount of problems with that house because of the noise. He can't even sit in his backyard, period. You know, it's ridiculous. Every weekend.

It's almost like a trouble house for noise and for parking.

It's been a trouble house for five years. I've been complaining about this for five years. I complained about it when it first started. I tried and tried and tried to get things done on it. Nothing ever happened. Even up to today, now, there's only two cars at that house a day, but one of them is parked on the street, on the grass, right next to their, so when I look out my window, I see that car parked in the street. If I try to make a U-turn out of my driveway, I can't do it because that car's parked in the street. You know, I don't even know that, yeah.

the trash man got by it today so i they did get by it well i apologize for the frustration i'm hoping that maybe by you coming here and bringing it up five years yeah that perhaps that we we could find some way of addressing maybe problem houses that generate repeat calls i was told five reports and it would would go to something okay okay that's what i was you told by code enforcement that or by the police oh okay

Thank you, thank you, Sir.

Nancy Funk has a 5 a 9 band you way I just want to know do we have an ordinance about the trash cans when you're supposed to put them out when you're supposed to bring them back because they are out there 7 days a week.

Yeah, I do believe in our short term rental there is a provision about trash cans.

So the provision is that solid waste disposal at vacation rentals shall be in compliance with the solid waste franchise agreement adopted by the town.

Yeah.

So it incorporates the the agreement we have, which says that they're out on certain days.

Well, maybe we should note that for if we if we need to double check that to see if there is a permit where you have to put them out. And I mean, I think you have to put them out and

Yeah, they're overflowing, animals, birds. I've seen all kinds of stuff. Because they normally check in at Friday, check out on Sunday. But it's just so much trash. And when the trash cans are full, they just put it on the ground next to the... It's really bad.

I think if it overflows and it's on the ground, that's not in compliance with ours. Oh, well, that happens all the time. That would be something.

We got all kinds of pictures if you need them.

That they could cite for short-term rentals if it's not in the bucket. That is, I recall that.

Also, I want to thank the police for coming out so quickly every time we call about the cars. Thank you. And if you need a list of the problem owners, we have that too of how many times they're in violation. I think he lives in Arizona and the property manager is in, where's the property manager?

Do you remember?

California. California.

And they have a term for that, but I can't remember what the term is for the Airbnb.

An absentee owner. Yeah. What is it?

Well, anyway, is that legal to have somebody own it in Arizona?

No, it is. Yeah. I would encourage you to get some information to the town manager, and perhaps there is something that we can do where we can keep a repeat offender list. Maybe even just the manager could send a letter to the naughty repeat offenders and say, you know, that says... And after so many times, are they fined?

Yeah, that I mean, is that is that a rule or do we have to vote for that rule?

I mean, yes, there is a fine more than like $50 noise, noise, trash and sort of parking. There are some sort of Difficulties in terms of would you like to speak?

Yeah, there's a process in place for all of them Yeah, because he really knew there's been so many violations there and it's repeat repeat repeat that He really needs to be fine. And you know you find them they may stop or sell I'm always open for the sale. I

All right, let me get your information that okay, I think at that I mean at least even just a letter from the manager noting that we've been getting repeat calls and we're going to start taking it more seriously and take enforcement actions rather than just warnings that might help and it and he's right there different people every weekend every day, you know, so thank you and I apologize next.

Mark Emerson 512 Ocean Avenue. You know there were workshops where you ignored a lot of things. There was a lot of vengeful ordinance written straight across the board trying to put every short term rental operator in this town out of business. I saw those two different aspects and I brought a lot of things to you that you ignored. One of those things is having someone present at check-in. You said, no, that won't change anything. Having either the owner or a responsible party at check-in, handing over the keys, not a remote control vending machine where someone mashes six buttons and the door magically opens. Having someone there to say you can't park on the grass, you have to bring the trash cans in after the trash man picks them up. You have to stay quiet. You have to leave the neighbors alone. But for some reason, you wanted to write legislation that penalized everyone regardless of the issue. You need to change those ordinances. You need to require that someone be present, that it's not a remote control vending machine, that someone checks people in. My train of thought just fell right off the cliff. Because it's really frustrating that you You wrote ordinances to penalize everyone when it's the people that are causing the problem that need to be addressed. You and I sat in on a conference call with Airbnb Legal. We're that close to them saying yes. You call us up and say this person doesn't have a legitimate license number, registration number, we will pull that advertisement. I told you.

We actually did that. And that happens now.

They get notified and then they're like... Then pull their registration. Take them off the interweb so that they can no longer advertise. That's happening. It is that simple.

That's actually happening.

But you wrote things to penalize everyone and not the handful of bad apples that are causing a problem. And I think you need to revisit those. I think you need to eliminate the remote control vending machine. I think you need to require a responsible party to be there to check guests in when they arrive and hand them all the rules and let them know that it's not acceptable. My time is up. Thank you very much.

I will take your suggestion as a question for the town attorney that he may be able to answer or just get back to us. Is it even possible to...

require that a person be physically present for check-in i'm not sure it is or likely not but i can confirm that yeah there's also other issues with how to enforce that yeah can't really have somebody parked outside the house to make sure someone going in there has already met with somebody at some other spot so i do recall the discussion and there it was vetted and discussed at length but yes

I WAS GOING TO SPEAK ON SOMETHING ELSE BUT I DO WANT TO TOUCH ON THIS SHORT-TERM RENTAL ISSUE SINCE IT'S BEEN BROUGHT UP TONIGHT AND I DO AGREE WITH THE PREVIOUS RESIDENT WHO SAID THAT THE ORDINANCE CHANGES THAT WERE MADE ARE INEFFECTIVE AND OVERBEARING AND APPLIED FOR THE WRONG REASONS. In reference to 510 Banyan Way, I called Airbnb directly on the host line because I am a very responsible owner-occupied short-term rental with Airbnb. And I asked them for their advice on what someone can do, for example, the neighbors nearby that are affected by these continuous parties at this particular property. And there is a process for residents or neighbors to call in and file a complaint with Airbnb. So I would encourage, I can share this information with town manager. and code enforcement, I would encourage the neighbors there that are having to put up with this annoyance on a regular basis to call Airbnb or file, it's an email, it's not a call, directly so that it is on record because Airbnb has a no party policy and if people are partying, That home owner, not the people that are there because we know they change every weekend. It's pointless. It's okay to send the police over to get them to quiet down at that moment, but the next weekend it's going to be somebody else. The goal I would say is for these problem properties like that is to get the home owner or the property owner in trouble with Airbnb so that they could possibly be removed. So I will share that information, and hopefully we can get something resolved with this particular property. It has been a problem for five, six years now. It's the original problem. It's still a problem. And it's very hard to live next door to that. The other thing I wanted to just mention was earlier this week, President Trump recognized a young man who rescued a swimmer. And this young man, this lifeguard, was... noted as being a hero, as he should have been, and the president brought a lot of awareness to the importance of lifeguards and the importance of having them here on our coastal waterways so that people who are vacationing, they're usually the ones who do get in trouble, have the opportunity to be rescued if something goes wrong. So it was really good, I think, that he made such a point about that and brought some awareness to this topic so that hopefully now our lifeguard situation will get a little more meat in the game with getting some protection there for our swimmers. Thank you. Have a good night.

Really quick, I have a question for you. Would you be interested in putting a little presentation together at some point in the future for residents of how to use the Airbnb process to complain against problem repeat properties? You could do a presentation at a workshop with some material. It would be recorded. Here's where you go. Here's how you do it.

Yeah, yeah, I would certainly be open to doing that and you know, like I said to the the number when I called in I see you know there it's we're trying to protect the the good name of the hosts that are doing the short-term rentals responsibly and by protecting the neighbors in our neighborhood. It's just not something that I would want to live next door to. I wouldn't appreciate that either, having the loud musics and the multiple people in the cars and the trash cans and all those problems. So absolutely.

I look forward to you putting a little presentation together. It's up to the town manager, but sure. Thank you. Thank you. Next. Next.

Jesse O'Toole, 403 Andrews. I was driving home the other day down Andrews Street and noticed that a few of the yards directly adjacent to the road had been torn up. And I talked to one of the neighbors whose yard was significantly impacted by this. And he told me that it was AT&T that was ripping out these cables in their yard and that he had no notice that this was happening. And as we were sitting there surveying his yard, I looked on the road and the road looked like it had been damaged. The cement gutters looked like they had also been damaged and he had no time frame because I don't know if they're going to be replacing the grass that they've torn up in his well manicured yard or what the situation was. And so I was just wondering like do we have a process to notify the residents of this type of activity like if it's going to be in there you got some people that show up in your yard start tearing everything up ripping stuff out of the ground and you have no no notice i know there's easements but i think there should be at least some notification to the residents

i i i'd like to say i uh let me could i say something real quick the same thing happened on surf and it's happened a couple times i've had a conversation a couple with the manager about this the town does have a right to require the companies to give notice for the easements so we do actually have that right it is um and um i i do in the past i've got i haven't gotten notices for this time on surf i did get a little a notice um but But they hung a little tag. But there have been issues with some areas of road. Like I have some videos from the last time that are depressed. And so I have asked the manager to kind of what we could do with public works looking into tracking and getting pictures. Because the city of Longwood recently went after, I guess it was like FPL and some contractors because they went and did work and it damaged their road. And they basically sent them invoices saying, and I think that we need to look into it. Now public works.

Yes, ma'am. The Eustis cable. I think conducted due process or responsibility due diligence. I'm sorry I got attacked and that they yeah they the manager went door to door if there was no response. He did put the door hanger. And he's made himself, in fact, I believe that we even posted it on our town website, my request. It was placed on the website and social media. So there was proper notification. I watch, it's a stage and they are filling their holes back in, but they're to come behind later and I'm monitoring it, if they're gonna saw it, if there's anything. And like in your particular case, that's,

I think this company did it correctly. They did a good job. The people that did it six months or a year ago, they did not. And they folded.

And that's what happens, unfortunately. Sometimes that contractor fell. But they did do door-to-doors.

The guy that I talked to, he's handicapped. He's in a wheelchair, so maybe he wasn't able to get to the door or something.

It could be he didn't go.

So there might have been extenuating circumstances. He's right at the corner of Pine and Andrews, the guy.

Yeah, we look out for him, the guy on the corner. Sherman's. Yeah, yeah.

So I was just curious if there was a process. Sounds like we do have one, and maybe it just slipped through the cracks for this guy.

As the mayor mentioned, they were actually more – Transparent I'm that word but they were more transparent and a lot of companies, you know anyway, they they ripped up my water line and

And they were there with new PVC and repaired it within like 20 minutes.

That's why I think of wheat.

So they've been very responsible. But you're right, the grass is a mess, but it'll grow back. Fair enough.

I was just concerned that there was no, just talking with my neighbor, it seemed like, There was no process in place, but I'm glad to hear that you guys have something going on.

In the past, there haven't always been notices. I will say for this company, I got that door tag.

Me wanting to order a door, I was.

Because it had contact information, said what they were going to do, and if you had an issue to call. That's how they're supposed to do it. Okay.

All right. Thank you, everybody. Thank you.

Tom do you document that go at least and take pictures of when they do it so if we have a road failure well the roads what I look at and I've got a couple areas of concern now I haven't gotten a response where their equipment did break my pavement and stuff yeah I try to monitor those that one particular vendor I have a video of the whole thing that I know they bellied up on us and that's yeah all right next

They dug five feet on either side of the road and were like shoving stuff. I was like, I don't think you're supposed to be doing that.

And Mayor, I just want to let you know, once public comment's over, the group that brought forward the ADA anniversary proclamation is here. It's here. Okay, great. So we'll get down to that picture.

Okay, I see no more public comment. We will close public comment. And we're going to come down and take a picture of the other proclamation that we did. Actually, before, would the group, the ADA group that sponsored the proclamation, like to come up and speak? Yes. Yes, okay, come on up. We would love to hear from you.

Microphone is here.

Good evening, town council, town of Melbourne Beach, distinguished guests, residents, both disabled and able-bodied. My name is Christopher, also known as C.L. Duncan, Jr. I'm the interim director for America's Persons with Disabilities, Florida Space Coast. What we are is an association that prides ourselves on bringing aid, information, and resources to persons with disabilities and their caregivers. Most of our resources are spent in transportation, but the reason why we're here is for a great reason, not just to have this proclamation to honor the residents of the town of Melbourne Beach, but to honor Melbourne Beach for remaining accessible. Thousands, approximately about 72,000 beachgoers per year through the Americans with Disabilities, also with the National Federation of the Blind, and the Division of Blind Services, we travel to the beach. Now, some of us can see some, some of us can't see at all, but even for the ones that have limited mobility, the beach remains accessible, the green spaces remain accessible, your public remains accessible. So today I brought with me Jake Mandarks, statewide communications director and also uh miss gabrielle cabrera she's our public relations director and i brought a local brevard high school student with us she's a volunteer that volunteers with us and they have some certificates for you all and they just had a few remarks as well good evening honorable mayor and members of town council

My name is Jake JT and mandarks statewide communications director for Americans persons with disabilities national group alliance and on behalf of the APWD of Florida representing the 7.3 million residents with disabilities across all 67 Florida counties. They're dedicated caregivers and children with special needs We are deeply honored to be here tonight to receive the official proclamation from the town of Melbourne Beach. We accept this proclamation on behalf of every resident who is facing, who faces daily challenges of disability. I want to personally commend the mayor and the council because Melbourne Beach was notably one of the very first municipalities in the entire state to answer our statewide call. Uh, so that rapidness heartfelt leadership sets a benchmark for the entire space coast. So thank you. And I want to equally thank the mayor for her ongoing commitment, sorry, and service to families and children with special needs in the realm of education, as well as ensuring together with the entire council. that the town of Melbourne Beach remains fully accessible to persons with disabilities of all ages from the age of one to 99, including our honored disabled veterans. So as communications director, I lead our Pennies for Change 2026 initiative under our Gold for Charity exchange program. Our core message is simple. Pennies may be copper today, but through steady community action and unity, they become gold tomorrow. Throughout local, through our local in-kind contributions, clothing and small tokens, we build a critical safety net around families navigating disability disparities. We take those resources and work side by side with our faith-based partners and independent transportation providers to address the biggest obstacles our families face, transit. because when you give someone mobility, you give them back their freedom and independence. We recognize the immense demands on local government, upgrading infrastructure, managing city budgets, and maintaining productivity, but tonight you provide that real leadership, you have proved that real leadership is about taking those infrastructure demands and using them to elevate the quality of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for every single resident from the age of one to 99. Because of your compassionate hearts and commitment to dignity, we are honored to turn around and present the town of Melbourne Beach, the mayor, the council members, and the chief of police and local law enforcement department with our honorary certificate of appreciation and commendation. So just want to say thank you, mayor and council, as well as your chief of police and law enforcement officers for recognizing our community and representing and presenting us with the proclamation and standing in steadfast unity with us tonight.

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Good evening, Councilman and Council ladies. How are you guys doing tonight? My name is Gabby. I'm the Director of Public Relations here with the AWDP. On behalf of America's Persons with Disabilities, National Group Alliance, Florida State Headquarters, and our Space Coast Chapter, we're deeply honored to be here tonight and receive this official proclamation from the Town of Melbourne Beach. We will gladly accept this proclamation on behalf of every resident with a disability in Melbourne Beach, their dedicated caregivers, and their essential support networks. As we send out reminders to other municipalities, we fully understand that local governments are balancing heavy demands, upgrading infrastructure mandated to ensure safety, productivity, and essential transit for all commuters. Yet it is vital that local leaders pause to celebrate their residents. Whether town leaders themselves live with a disability or know a loved one who does, true leadership is about the thoughtful realization of another person's daily challenges. It's about allowing someone else's life altering situation to alter our own perspectives, inspiring changes that elevate their quality of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Melbourne Beach was notably one of our first municipalities, which we thank you guys very much for. Our mission serves individuals across every stage of life, and we really just want to reach out to all the communities and see what little steps we can take to make this a more permanent solution for all citizens going forward. and making sure that we make everyone's lives a little bit easier. Thank you. Thank you.

Good evening, Honorable Mayor and Town Council. My name is Ayela with Americans with Disabilities, well, on the behalf. We are deeply honored to stand alongside with America's Persons with Disabilities National Group Alliance and and the town of Melbourne Beach on this momentous occasion. Americans with disabilities, our ethos has always been rooted in backing our colleagues, our customers, and our communities. Financial access, independence, and dignity are essential components of an inclusive society. That is why we are proud to champion accessibility initiatives that empower individuals with disabilities and their families, ensuring everyone has the freedom to navigate their daily lives. access critical resources and participate fully in their communities. As our country approaches 250 years of national history, we also honor key milestones of financial and civil inclusion, including 52 years of equal credit access and over 35 years of the Americans with Disabilities Act. True corporate responsibility means actively breaking down barriers, whether in digital platforms, working place accommodations or local transit models to create a sustainable safety net for individuals of all ages and abilities from ages one to 99. We applaud the town of Melbourne Beach for your protective leadership and compassionate commitment to universal design and accessibility. By passing tonight's proclamation, you set a powerful benchmark for municipalities across Brevard County and the state of Florida. Thank you, Mayor and City Council, for your dedication and inclusion. for working together to ensure every resident and visitor can thrive.

And now we will hear from our local community represent.

Sorry, county representatives. Welcome. Thank you.

Now, if you would like, we will all come down with the proclamation and take a picture. OK, great.

That'll be great. Yeah. OK. And we had some transportation blunders, but it's going to be there's so much congestion and GPS is messing up, you know, and they're trying to give me a GPS cane. And I'm thinking about it when the car ends up at the river.

And I don't know what's going on.

Thank you very much. You're very welcome. Oh, come on up here, Chief.

All right. Oh, that's very nice.

I actually signed that afterwards because they had to re-fix the stamp.

The clerk will get to you with you to give you the script.

Okay, that's fine. That's fine.

That's fine.

We're doing a lot. We're planning to proceed with the event. They're not the choice of the other. She's with the other space. We also have Audra. She has a service in traffic.

We actually have a blind resident who has been coming to meetings to advocate to get...

Okay. Thank you. Great job.

All right, this is probably a good time if anyone needs to take a break. Otherwise, we'll keep going. We'll wait for the clerk to get back. We're just going to take a little recess real quick that way if anybody does need to go. So we're going to take a quick recess, five minutes. Okay, we are back in session and we took a short recess and that was, I do wanna say that was very nice from that young group of dedicated professionals and volunteers and that was very nice of them to come all the way down here. Okay, we are on town manager report pages 17 to 19 and I will turn it over to Mrs. Marie Smith. Oh yes, thank you very much. We do need to do roll call again. Mr. Jones, could you do roll call? Sure thing.

Mayor Allison Dennington.

Here.

Vice Mayor Terry Cronin. Here. Commissioner Anna Butler.

Here.

Commissioner Tim Reed. Here. Commissioner Sherry Corey.

Here.

Town Manager Amory Smith.

Here.

Town Attorney Ryan Knight. Here. Fire Chief Gavin Brown. Here. Police Chief Tim Zander. Here. Building Official Jeff Parsons. Here. Public Works Director Tom Davis. Here. Finance Manager Jennifer Kerr.

Here.

And Town Clerk Sid Jones is also present.

Okay, we are all here.

I wanted to first say good evening, Mayor, Commissioners. It's been a very, very busy month, very busy week. I wanted to mention that the third item, the Certificate of Occupancy for Short-Term Rentals, we're taking off because we've had some interpretation changes. after talking to our building official here. And he will also discuss another item that's not on here that we wanted to get some clarification on, and that's House Bill 803, the building permits and inspections. But before we do that, I wanted to do something a little different, and I wanted to start with thanks and congratulations to two of our commission members. um so and this is honestly i don't even think about this the timing of this is perfect i'm so glad is this for the yes thank you commissioner thank you very much commissioner reed for um helping us get the addition additional pedestrian uh enhancement It's an audible feature to assist the visually impaired at Ocean and Oak at that huge intersection over there. And serendipity that these folks came in just right now.

I know.

And I happen to have this, so there is no coincidence. You know, we had a resident who is visually impaired who came up to us, to Mr. Davis and I, and, you know, walked us over to that intersection and said, all right, I am going to turn this on. There is no sound here. There's maybe a light. And she's like, I want you to close your eyes and walk across. And we were like.

Scary proposition. Yeah.

Yeah. So but she made her point very clear and we weren't getting any traction from FDOT. And, you know, I talked to Commissioner Reid about it and said, you know, we're really frustrated about this. And he reached out and he was able to get that. And as you can see here, it is on our website, our project, and it is part of the project. So just wanted to thank him again publicly for that. Thank you.

Yes.

Thank you very much.

a commemorative plaque for Commissioner Reed for that because I do think.

If you vote on it, we'll do it. Secondly, I am going to brag on one of the other commissioners. Yes, yes. Commissioner Anna Butler. So huge congratulations. She's part of the Brevard US Tennis Association, the 18 and up women's team.

They're good. 18 and up. I don't know how far I am from 18. They're really good.

They play 20-year-olds. I mean, 18-year-olds. They play, you know... young people, older people, but they won the Florida State Championship, and they're going to the Nationals in October in Arizona, in surprise Arizona. So this is a really huge accomplishment, you know, because Florida's a fairly big state. So Brevard County won, and you know, it was Anna Butler's on the team, as you can see, your former commissioner, Don Barlow, as well. So just wanted to give them a round of applause too and congratulations. So I know Jeff wants to get on the road and plus we don't want to pay him for sitting here for the whole meeting. So I did give you an email or sent you an email that he had written about HB 803 And that had to do about the $7,500 or less work for that permit. And I wanted him to just explain that the bottom line is it's not going to really impact us a whole lot. But I wanted him to be able to explain that to you.

evening everybody. So it's pretty simple. I'll try to do this pretty quickly. I just want to read through the verbiage that was used in 803 which mandates the change in Florida Statute 553.791. So the first section says a local government that issues building permits shall exempt an owner of a single family dwelling or the owner-contractor from the requirement of obtaining a building permit to perform any work valued less than $7,500. On the email, there's some explanations on what that means. I dive into it a little bit deeper. I'll get into that a little bit more in a second. The next section says an exemption under subparagraph one, which I just read, does not apply to any of the following. The exemptions of the exemption, if you will. The work on a property that is partially or entirely located in a flood hazard area as defined by the Florida Building Code. Any electrical, plumbing, structural, mechanical, or gas work performed on a property containing a single family dwelling. A construction project may not be divided into more than one project for the purpose of evading these requirements. And then the last section states, to qualify for the exemption under subparagraph one, the owner or the owner's contractor must submit a written request for exemption to the local enforcement agency, the building department, with a copy of the contract or other documentation demonstrating the nature and the value of the work to be performed. So essentially, the first part requires us as a building department to allow this exemption. Of course, the $7,500 rule and the work, as far as the value goes, up to this point, we have not been able to require a contract. We've been not allowed to ask for that. However, for this, it would be a requirement. um what did it say contract or estimates a contract or an estimate or something if they're purchasing the materials themselves they can provide a receipt anything that demonstrates the cost of their project so they still don't have to provide a contract if they don't have one but if they do have one they have to provide it we can make them now provide correct yes ma'am yep um and then the the second second section to kind of dive down on that a little bit um According to FEMA, which is the maps that we use to determine if we're in a flood zone or not, Melbourne Beach is significantly impacted, of course. So that's gonna rule out a significant number of properties for this exemption because of that.

so if your plot is a fully x a lot like there's no areas that are ae or any of the other you do qualify right you do qualify because we have i mean some we have some properties are fully there are some some that are a few yeah okay and basically that is the sort of if you're full if your property is fully x doesn't have any portion that's anything else then yes you do but if you're any of those other numbers correct even if maybe it's a portion of it with those numbers even a small portion then you don't because you're in the flood zone

Now, my understanding when I read through this, it did not include coastal flood zones. So although we are 100% impacted by coastal, I don't believe that that impacts here. The other main portion of that section that is very important to note is the exemption of the mechanical, electrical, plumbing, gas, and structural. Almost everything we do is one of those categories. So sheds, for example, which most people would think would fall under this exemption, do not. Because we are coastal and because our wind design criteria is 160 miles an hour, we require sheds to be engineered. Therefore, a shed would not qualify for this exemption.

However, some sheds are, if you buy the MBA sheds, they are already wind certified.

Yes, yes, and they are required to be wind certified, but we have to verify that in the building department. So therefore, it makes them exempt from the exemption.

Can I ask a question? Manufacturer Building Act exempts, but anyway.

Can I ask a question? Yes, ma'am. Or make a statement. So basically, anything that's going to be done still has to, any person, resident, still has to contact the building department. Is that correct?

That is correct, and I was going to address that.

And then they have to give you the information, and then you tell them whether or not they're exempt or...

okay so there still has to be contact with the building department so we still have to have a um fully accessible building department yes okay so question on that because i wrote down that to qualify for this exemption they have to submit a written request for the exemption and then the contract so my reading of that though is that if we don't have any sort of application for exemption or administrative fee or something to process the application then all they have to do is give us the documents and they've qualified if we if we have a policy that says to request this exemption here's the form that you you know that we were like we have a request for exemption form and then here's the documents that you would need to provide and we have a fifty dollar administrative processing i mean i don't know if we can charge like a like a administrative fee just for processing exemptions or not but i would suggest that we should at least come up with something so that we don't get notifications and then people say oh i sent an email to whatever and that was my notification

We certainly have okay and it does have to be a written request for exemption and the way that we are addressing as far as the fee goes is it the new fee schedule which we're not discussing tonight, but one of the things that it's my intention to have in there is an actual application fee and that will be required whether they're exempt or not okay.

Yeah, and I think we would call it an administrative processing fee. That's usually what for these things because it's not a good right.

We had to be very careful on the terms and I will get with Mr. Ryan or Mr. Knight to determine exactly the right words to use for that.

Have they published a form for municipalities to use?

So there are a few forms out there. What I am actually recommending is that on our building application form, our building permit application form, to have a very simple line that says, are you requesting exemption through Florida Statute 553.791, paragraph 3, and just have a little box. If they check it, great. If they don't check it, then they don't check it.

That's good, because if they don't check it, they can't claim later. right if they do check it if we have some kind of form for okay if you are then this is what you fill out i would suggest that there's a box that each one is like this is not structural this is not mechanical like where they check and they sign and certify correct correct and then we still have to perform a sufficiency review okay so

um so there's that and to what you were asking earlier in regards to um the uh do they have to have a form yeah so that should address that um other than that um i do not believe it's going to significantly affect the town i do have the permits for june and july in the month of july there was not a single permit that would have qualified for the exemption In the month of June, there were a total of five, two of which were for pavers and the others were for fences for a total revenue loss of $526.12. So if we average that between the two months, it's a $263 loss. And for that month of June, it was

yeah sorry the month yeah the month of june it was um right at two percent of the revenue brought in okay so it's not a huge it's not a big impact okay well i'm glad you're on top of it thank you so if we are not going to be discussing the if you're pulling the airbnb one um uh i would like to if it's possible if i could get with him on one of the days he's here just like 30 minutes to kind of understand that i don't know if that's possible or not yeah i'll be here friday friday okay all right we'll arrange that yeah great absolutely

all right um two other things happened uh from the time that i published this and uh today and i just want to mention them fairly quickly uh first of all um there had been some misinformation on social media about the previous general obligation bond and we put together a list of a number of the products and projects that were conducted that were all stormwater And you'll have the list here. A lot of these, because it was before 2013, the bond was released in 2010, are not in our system electronically. So we would have to go upstairs and go look for the files. So again, because this came out a few days ago, we didn't have the time to go up there and check it out, but we did have a list of all the projects based on our stormwater master plan, on what the projects were, so you have that information. And then there's that secondary sheet. There was one project that had FDEP funding, so that one is about a million dollars. That one, we did have that funding number there, because we had to send stuff to the state regulators. So I wanted to make that awareness, and I will make this available, we'll make it available online, Clerk Jones as well. Also, I wanted to update you briefly about, you know, back to school, the crosswalk at Pine and Ocean. Right now, temporarily, we're not able to staff that because we are down a police officer right now, but that's not going to be permanent. We are currently right now looking to see if some of our police volunteers can fill in that morning, and I told Chief I would volunteer in the morning too to fill in. I'm happy to do so. I have four kids, so I understand that importance of doing so. We did have a meeting though today, Chief Zander, you know, Public Works Director Davis and I, with the Space Coast Transportation Planning Organization, because we have noticed that the multimodal traffic on Pine Street is ever increasing. You got people walking their dogs. You got people doing their morning walk. You have kids walking, biking, e-biking to school. You have golf carts. and you have regular cars and it is a fairly modest size road. So they are going to do a traffic study for us. They put down the little wires to measure the traffic and it'll be multimodal, not just for cars. They will tell us when they're gonna do it because they may have traffic cameras there for a little bit of time and only for that time that they're doing the study. So I wanted the public to be aware and you to be aware that that is going to happen. But once we get that data, they said they're also going to look at maybe doing a larger project with Pine Street looking at Gemini Elementary and looking at the school routes, doing a school route analysis to see what other roads might be impacted, and also doing an area-wide multimodal street analysis for us. The great news is that they said that they may be able to do that for us free of charge. we just have to show up to their meeting September, October and plead our case. So I will be doing that with my two comrades here to get us the money for that. So I think that's gonna be helpful in planning for school safety and for our kids going up and down the roads and for all other pedestrians, people walking their dogs and everything else. So that's gonna be in the works. They said that they would have a rough draft of a study probably by December, and beginning of the year they would have their recommendations to us. So I just wanted to let you know that was in the works and that just happened today. Also, we have an update on the library parking after hours. Chief Zander and I spoke with Miss Wendy Jo Boast, who's the director of the Brevard County Library Service. um and there had just been some um various information about whether people can park there or not i've attached her email to us she says the county does allow people to park in our lots when the library branch is not open it is common occurrence for members of the public to park at library lots in order to visit businesses churches or take nature walks or run runs or bike rides. Library patrons also require access to our book drops which are accessible only through the library parking lots and are open 24-7. Brevard County does not allow people to camp or park overnight in the library parking lots. The county also does not allow people to camp or sleep on our building porches or under overhangs overnight. They do not canone or allow illegal activities in our parking lots and gives local law enforcement permission to trespass or arrest individuals if a law enforcement officer determines that the individuals are trespassing after notice or are engaged in illegal activities. One thing else they notice is that not all the county library parking lots are Brevard County property. So that was interesting. because we asked her about you know why they're different signs in different places and that's what they said you know Chief Zander and I though we will still work together on solutions because there has to be some equity between our First Amendment rights and also the rights of our neighbors you know who experience you know, maybe some vulgarity and other things on a Sunday, Sunday morning. So, uh, but we wanted to, um, make sure that you all had that clarification and that clarification was known and it's, it's also documented.

So just to clarify, cause, uh, I do believe that a lot, there was a meeting where the chief stander, you had said that you could trespass them or they weren't allowed to part, but they actually are. So they, so they, County owns the property and they've specifically said people are allowed to park there even just to walk around town other bit whatever As well as the the 24-7 book return people have to be allowed to park there essentially even 3 a.m In the morning, but for book return, but people are not allowed to park overnight. So if they're parked there Not in the car or like parked and sleeping in the car. I was a little confused about that one But and they're also not allowed to park and do illegal activity so if there was some suspect of like Drugs or or or some other activity that could be considered illegal that we would be able to do something, but that's correct, right? on the overnight parking thing does that mean that they can't like be in the car sleeping or does it mean that they can't and

Yeah, it's pretty much that they can't be in the car sleeping. It's overnight. They don't want tents there. They don't want things like that, people sleeping there.

So I guess I would just be like the trespassing someone or citing them, we would just have to make sure that it was one of these issues because otherwise we don't want to have a First Amendment sort of civil rights charge or issue.

That's correct.

We're going to follow the law. All right. OK, great.

May I just add really quickly to that? I was the commissioner that brought that to the topic, that topic to a meeting. I remember the date of the meeting. And because at that point we were ill-informed or not fully informed or misinformed, and so I apologize publicly for having spoken and confusing any residents or any of us, and it was not my intention, but that was the information we had at the time.

it does seem like if some parking lots are owned or aren't that's maybe there is that's why there's there was some confusion there thank you for getting it definitely clear and just for the record uh commissioner butler there's nothing to apologize about we went up the chain and as we went up we talked to six different people and we got six different things yeah um and then we finally got to the top and then and then it kind of changed a little bit so it just it is what it is but we have to deal with it now so okay

We never did actually trespass or ask anyone. Okay, so we're good. Great. Thank you.

I just want to finish up quickly. The cameras at the life ring station on the beach. I know we had somebody come up and speak about that. Chief Brown, Chief Zander and I met with Shoreline Sentry and Drown Zero on August 12th to discuss operational issues. We were planning on meeting with them, but we also talked about the cameras on the life ring stations. And even though they're used to do her theft and vandalism and they point just down at the life ring, we just opted to take the cameras out out of abundance of concern for having those cameras there on the beach. Um, and uh, they, you know, they'll be coming down probably in the next couple of weeks. So we wanted to let you know what our decision was. Um, and we will continue to partner with these organizations to continue to boost each safety, uh, especially the after hours when the lifeguards are not on duty. uh... lastly joint legislative audit I know I haven't talked about in a while but it is continuing it is fast and fierce as always every week we have you know multiple calls you know dozens you know a dozen or so emails if not more uh... to various staff members uh... everything from finances policy procurement legal public records incidences meeting minutes and a lot more uh... hundreds of records have so far been handed over to them to JLAC And it's anticipated that their report will be issued sometime towards the end of the year or early January, at which time we'll have to respond fairly quickly. But I just wanted to let you know that we need to respond quickly. So if we're not as quick in responding to you, it's because we have to respond to the auditors in a timely manner, otherwise it will document us as unresponsive. So I just wanted you to know that this is continuing to go on. and it is affecting every single department. But that's it for me. Now off to Ryan.

I had a question on the cameras on the beach, or the life ring stations on the beach. So I was down there the other day. I think the cameras might already be removed, at least at the access I was at. see it on the camera or on there. So do we have any form of an agreement with these entities for the placement of these on the beach? You know, just some outline of an agreement?

So the cameras have all been removed already, so those are all taken off. We did not have an agreement when they came before us. We kind of piggybacked underneath the county's agreement. They have one with Brevard County. However, since you brought that up, we are drafting an agreement with Drown Zero that will outline all the expectations and the location. So that will be in place shortly.

Great. Thank you. All right. Okay. Let me get my... All right. Town Attorney Report.

So I really don't have much tonight. On the litigation front, there's really nothing to report. We are just waiting on the court to issue a ruling on the motion for rehearing. So that's the main issue that we're waiting on. I will have at the next meeting the draft reserve fund policy for your review and the paid parking ordinance for your review. Is there any questions?

Yeah, that was going to be my question. I noticed that there was some draft on the task list at the back. There was various different places. There may have been more than just those two. Are there other that, say, town attorney working on? Is there a status update on that? And can you just brief us real quick? Have you started any work on the ethics opinion letter?

Yes, so I've met with Bruce this afternoon to gather some information So I will be preparing that draft and I will send it to him for review too Before we actually send it off I'm just in going over your charges.

I saw that the JLAC audit was interested in the litigation I go ongoing litigation. Do they have a right to To those records that seems like that might be overstepping. I

So the records they were requesting were not necessarily litigation records or work product records. They were requesting clarification on some of the billing as to which cases some of the billing referred to. So we've gotten a few requests from those just got another one believe yesterday from Jay lack just requesting what certain billing entries corresponded to the different cases.

Thank you.

Are there other policies that are in the past report other than those two that we're waiting on?

Yeah, there may be. I don't have the full chart with me, but the chart was updated when it was put into the packet.

Okay, yeah. So here, just since we're on with town attorney, let me see. I just saw one right there. It says night two... night to find out uh when do uh short-term uh rental when do they expire uh night to find out when and then digitation of records take the night to find out when let me see that's not a policy one yeah here we go three draft reserve policy so that's one you're working on correct draft special reserve fund policy that one too is that because they're listed as two separate things here yeah i included it and then draft parking ordinance so that's those three okay and

if there are other ones but well you'll be here when we get to it so we can ask then okay all right so thank you i had one other thing so the um the audit report we talked covered this evening or whatever so i guess the question was where where are we at in our contract with the auditor i believe we are in a three-year contract of them are we at the end of that contract now um

Fiscal year, 27 is the last year.

So we have one more.

We have one more.

Thank you.

I do have a somewhat related question. Our town charter code mentions an audit committee for selecting the auditor. I think is that only applicable when we don't have an auditor under contract where we're renewing? Like if we were gonna, do you know Mr. Knight? there's there's like a library trust fund and then an auditor selection committee in our charter and i'm like we don't have either one of those but yeah we don't and that usually is when um either the contract is up or we don't have an agreement with the auditor i mean i i didn't know if like are you allowed to keep using the same auditor repeatedly and never have that that i guess i just would maybe look i'd be interested in the original sort of when that was passed like what what is it yeah i'd have to look at the agreement later yeah we have provided them there all right cool uh sorry this just got all out of order any other questions for the town attorney report then we will move on these fell over and they're totally okay we will move on to the consent agenda items so now this is where if anyone would like to pull anything then please just state the item number and it will be pulled from the consent agenda and placed into new business or it will be placed in a suggested location somewhere so uh commissioner reed which were the two items e and f that you wanted to e and g oh e and g okay so e and g shall be pulled from consent no you cannot ask why unless he wants to tell you but it's the the rule is any one member just by by objecting it automatically because what is automatically pulled they don't have to statewide so e and g will be pulled i would like to ask is there anyone in the audience who would like to speak to the site plan 3 20 22 hibiscus trail or has any objection okay seeing none um i did have one question on it i don't want to pull it i see the gentleman in the audience if the commission would mind and that way we don't pull it there was one and it was mentioned at the pnz the documentation says two two-car garages and one one-car garage, but that it's just two garages. then one is a two car and one is about a car and a half okay is there any way that just in the diet because it was mentioned but in the documentation that there could be a little update because it the way it reads it says two two car garages and one car garage i believe it's clearly stated on the plan okay as a one car garage okay let me double check single car garage okay big and black and white yeah okay good I am glad because I was like well that's a lot of garages um okay uh if nobody nobody in the audience wants to speak to it or object and if nobody if anybody else has any questions they vetted it through PNZ and they did a good job asking questions and there was an issue with the landscape ordinance but it's not something to hold up i think that's being addressed so okay uh then um if oh my only suggestion and we don't need to pull it on the minutes is just that and i already spoke to the clerk about it and she has those ready that there's two meetings on here that i was not present and so those have been changed for you to actually sign those so that's the that's the only change so

It's the two February meetings.

Yeah, just because I wasn't present at all. Yeah, but anyway, so without objection, items 10A, 10B, 10C, 10D, and 10F will be approved by consent. Uh, items E and G will be moved to new business. Uh, are they going to go to the top of new business or the bottom? Normally it would go to the top. How should, how should you like, we'd like to deal with it. I would suggest we go to the top since one of the gentlemen is so moved.

So moved.

Okay. So we have a motion to make them go to the top of new business. Can I get a second? second thank you because the gentleman is in the office otherwise they have to wait and come back okay we have a motion and a second to move e and g to the top of new business they will become a and b new business a b and c will become c d and e all right uh all in favor say aye aye aye all opposed okay that carries five oh uh all right so now we will go oh yes you're good thank you yeah Looks like it's going to be a very beautiful house. Thank you. Okay, so public hearings, special orders, and I don't believe we have any. So we will move to unfinished business, which is 12A, the C Avenue Seawall RFP. We will turn this over to Public Works Director, and in the packet, you can turn to pages 112 to 148. Mr. Davis, please proceed.

Sorry You hear me now? Yeah, we ended up with the three bids They're pretty obvious So, you know and I'm sure common sense dictates that you know that I compared all the products not only to each contract but also to the standards that normally one would expect in construction seawall and those bidders did fit those materials and the certification and materials, etc. So generally they're the same and then we come down to the end product course which is the price and as you can see they're significantly different. And you may already know as you'll see in the roof bids for example, some people bid ridiculous prices whatever reason one can speculate they don't really want to job. When you hear comments in the bid meetings like, oh, boy, this is going to break me if I don't get this. I pretty much figured that person, if they bid at all, will be ridiculous not to be critical. That's their business and they're welcome to do it. But that's the big disparity, because if you compare the materials listed in the actions, they're almost verbatim that way. And the low bidder has done considerable amount of work in town. And I think he listed some of the references. And in conversation with other companies, certainly I heard no bad feedback from the lowest bidder here. And so that's it, guys. I brought you the lowest and the best and my opinion.

Yeah, I know that there were a couple items when you compare the exact line item across, you're like, it made me wonder whether there was specific to that that might differentiate on materials. Like, look at page 115, 116, and 117. The first one, page 115, it's like to extract and expose 54 linear feet. So that's not even materials. That one's 4,800. The next bid is 8,100 for the same. And then the third bid for that same line item is 3,000. And there was one or two others that were significant bump up changes. And that is there for any of those where that one of those line items really was different across that there is it like do we need to look at that like, oh, this one's a lot cheaper because maybe they're not like.

And I apply those may or any any of those materials. And, you know, with AI today, Lord knows I can ask it two different ways and I get 50 different opinions. And I realized that that really hasn't changed in the world. It's always been that way. So a lot of it, you've got to trust me. And what I do try to compare the materials, you get brand name conflicts. The specs and the bottom line will be the same if you look at, for example, the type of rebar, for example.

Let's present the one I'm looking at, and this would be an important one. Right. It's line item 3.1.

What's that?

Two bids both bid at that line item. And this has heavy gauge vinyl sheets, whatever. Oh. At $27,000, for the same quantity, 54 quantity, the low bid was $10,000 under on that item. Are the specs of the quality the same?

It looks like it is. You can read the gauge right there.

I'm welcome to.

There are a range of heavy gauge, like heavy gauge is this to this, and maybe the reason why one of them is $10,000 cheaper is because they're on the low end of heavy gauge, right?

May I solicit two experts in the audience, if you don't mind? Mike? The specs on the gauge, why the different gauges on the vinyl? Why are there different gauges? Those are... No.

They said they'd be using the exact, like, is there somewhere in here where it actually says what the actual, these gauges, usually there's a number.

Yeah, yeah, come on up.

Please, because he is, but I think.

I mean, a lot of the things shifted a little, but that was one of the ones that there was two bids for 27,000 and the low was 17,000.

yeah but what you have to realize is those line item numbs are just line items it doesn't necessarily I mean they're throwing 10 grand extra in there because it's an easy place to hide it if they get the job it doesn't really matter so they're all using the same materials the low bid guys probably the best qualified to do the job anyway so that in my opinion

No, I never saw. It's no. They make reference to the brand names. There's one that leads the way, and there's a second or third. CMIs. Yeah, but I see no great big difference in price on them.

quality that certainly quality mayor I didn't see any standard yeah I would defer to an expert it's it's really not a gauge it's a it's a thickness and it's a it's a panel designation okay it was by certain designations Some panels are, yeah, I mean.

Or is there fluctuate?

There definitely is, but there's no drawings done, so that's something that needs to be done too. An engineer's gonna stamp some drawings for it, I would assume, and then you'll get the gauge, and then they can spec the sheet. Some sheets are better than others, just quality-wise. I could pull personal preference. Yeah, I mean, you can, you know, I can give you my opinion.

I'm not trying to be picky.

No, no, no, no, no, I understand.

Have something where it's like, oh, it's not, it's uncertain, but then when you get, you pick something, you get to it, and then it's like, well, wait a minute, like, oh, well, if you want that, that's a better one, that's going to cost more than you want. Oh, well, that's one of the other bids for $10,000 more on that item.

No, I think, I mean, the high bid was the high bid because they're from Daytona. Yeah. So they're charging for it. And the other guys, I mean, I know him as well. So.

Okay.

The series models.

Yeah. Those were my only questions.

All right. Any other? Yeah. If I don't find a major deficiency in that, if I did, then I would. But there shouldn't be. It'll be a series.

Commissioner Reed, go ahead.

Yeah, so thank you for putting the package together then. My question has to do with where the funding to pay for this work will be coming from, where in the budget is being funded from. She can defer to finance.

This is funded out of Fund 141 as per the fiscal year 2016 budget.

Okay, so I'm not disputing the fact that the seawall needs to be repaired. It obviously does. And the bids seem to be reasonable here. The fact that we're intending to pay for this out of the Fund 141, which is a stormwater fund. So this is really not a... STORMWATER IMPROVEMENT THAT'S BEING DONE HERE, AND I THINK THAT'S KIND OF AN IMPROPER USAGE OF THOSE FUNDS. FUND 1441 IS FUNDED DIRECTLY FROM THE ASSESSMENT THAT APPEARS ON THE PEOPLE'S TAX BILLS FOR STORMWATER. SO I JUST DON'T FEEL IT'S AN APPROPRIATE

Funding place to do this work This is something we voted on as a commission Previously I Don't it was it was the fiscal year fiscal year 26 Approved budget, right? I don't remember if it was unanimous No, it was four to one

So I agree that in, I'm looking at the page 141 for the fiscal year 26 here, I agree it has those listed on there. And that in and of itself is kind of wrong because for the same reason that it's not an appropriate usage of the money. And up to this point, it's been wrong on paper. So now we're at the point now where you're talking about actually spending the money, which I'm, again, saying that's still wrong. So now two wrongs doesn't make it right. Do you mind?

Can I look at that just for a second since you have it? This is our bid it actually does mention the sheets. So could you just verify when they do it?

Should be in your budget book if you do you explain to me a little bit more cuz I'm I think you make a good point But I'd like to understand it better It's in 141, there's a line item for capital outlay. It's a total of 86,000 some dollars. And then in the notes below, the breakdown for that capital is for the boat ramp seawall and then the river view lane pipe repair. And those two together, they had 46, 184 on the notes here in there. So it's not appropriate.

to use these funds for the boat ramp seawall as as it's not a stormwater infrastructure yep yep got it yeah because i i think that the stormwater aspect of it was actually that work underneath and this doesn't cover that correct

Not something separate talk about later.

Yeah, okay. Thank you appreciate that explanation. Any other questions.

Yeah, just a clarification. So this was voted on in 2026. I was not on the commission at that time, but the other members were separate commissioner quarry. All right so that it's did they've all vote for that or the past by majority.

the the the budget was passed four to one okay it had to have four votes okay but my vote was very i mean we we spent hours over 22 meetings picking out funds and and making concessions and i remember this one because part of the issue was not just the boat ramp and like the seawall it was there's like some drainage issue in leveling areas and it was going to be one whole project and this is not covering that part of the project so it was gonna be sort of treated as one whole, like we were gonna get the engineers to look at like how do we, because there's like some undulation, like there's some issues there underneath which ties the stormwater aspect of it. So it was funded, it was a stormwater type issue because there was that, and basically now this is like hey let's pay for the non-stormwater part of it and just do part of it. So which is a problem. So it's a valid point.

Well, and you as a commission can vote to pay for it where you see fit.

One other comment. I would have to beg for $814 in addition to that in that we fell short. Oh. For what of the amount you out or whatever what's listed in the budget is a 46 one 84 we came out at the 47 even which leaves us 100 or I'm sorry $814 short of what was proposed what was given.

But it does does this have to be repaired in order to do the stormwater repairs.

The area that the mayor's referencing, if memory serves me correctly, is there's the design of the road going into there has a high crown in it, and it's causing the water to run to both sides. And what we want to do is I want to do it. Address that road as part of coming where the stormwater came down.

So this.

I mean, yeah, it does. Would it need done? It needs done because the whole area has fallen in along the seawall. So, I mean, that'd be speculative on my part.

My thinking is that that part should be done first. Like, you do this sort of as a collective thing. Look at it, do that part first.

Joe's call.

Go ahead. Anybody else? Speak freely unless somebody objects.

So, I'll just go back to this again. yeah like i said this this isn't i was the one in the in the vote for the approval of the budget the 401 vote i was the one who voted not to approve it this is one of the reasons i voted no because of these kinds of what i view as inappropriate error in in here um And I do think we should be doing this. I mean, in just a few line items down here on this agenda, we're going to be talking about the fee increase for that assessment, right? So we're going out asking, we're going to be adding an increase in that for stormwater. So I think it's important that we use the money appropriately for stormwater. Um, and I, yeah, I want to have, I'd like to see the seawall repaired as well. Um, I don't think it wasn't budgeted properly to be done this year. And I think doing it is basically a misappropriation. Um, and I would, I would question it. I would, I would, I would, if we, if we decide to do that, I, I would, uh, I would, I would be questioning it at higher authorities on whether the, uh, the properness of that.

So.

So, Madam Mayor, when I was running for office, the neighborhood over by Pine Street and the numbered streets, this was a big issue for all the all the residents are tired of that boat launch being kind of a wreck and they wanted wanted it to be fixed. And it seemed to be a priority to them. And there was there was a lot of contention whether it was going to be a dock or there was going to be a seawall where they're going to fix it and then erosion. And if you get your car down there, you could get stuck. People want to go down and see the enjoy the sunset and it's kind of what they like to do in the community before everything kind of fell apart So I think it is a priority to the to the community I understand what Commissioner Reed saying maybe the maybe how we divvied up the budgeting Doesn't seem quite right but at the same time, the past commission voted to pay for this, and to pay for this improvement, and it seems kind of strange to go back and say, hey, you know, we're not gonna go pay for this anymore. And if that's the feeling, I think we should probably investigate this further rather than to make any decision tonight, because I think it's really important to our community, and they've made that known to all of us on the commission.

so i take that as a an option where we we have a discussion or a suggestion that we would table this item and i do think that there could there for the purpose potentially of is there a way to make a budget resolution where that money is taken out of stormwater because before when it had it had a stormwater aspect to it tied to it but this project doesn't have anything to do with stormwater. Is there any way that we could table this so that we could determine whether there's a way of fixing the sort of budgeting aspect of it, maybe through a resolution that could be brought back where we're properly allocating the funds, not as a stormwater, but as a capital improvement repair, and then at that point it could be brought back with the budget resolution, changing the allocation, and the amount for this, separating them out,

and then potentially um it could be voted on well i think which should be prioritized but i think it's a good idea yeah and i think we could bring it back and you know i'll try to to look at it if if there's a problem with the road you've got a you've got to fix that seawall before you fix the road because you're just going to have erosion until you fix that seawall so It's all tied up in it, but I think this is a priority, and I don't think we can vote this down. I think we need to discuss it more or go at it.

I do 100% agree. This has gone on for so long. We've had the orange banner on the website. I mean, it's irresponsible, in my opinion, to just keep pushing this down the road. If there's a solution, I understand what Commissioner Reid is saying. So a solution to... where that money should or should not come from. I think that's what we need, and perhaps your solution is something we should consider. Finance Director?

Expiration of these bids?

Yes, typically about 30 days is what they're gonna hold, so I only got a month. I mean, I can go back and appeal to the vendor. 30 days.

So we should have it by our next meeting. we should make sure what we're doing by our next meeting.

As far as the money.

Yeah. So like have a plan that gets communicated and a budget resolution ready where we could at least budget resolution it so it fixes the sort of like fund allocation aspect of it, then we could vote on it.

So that should be our timeline. Yeah. Okay.

Or we could fund it in the fiscal year 27 and move the work till that time frame.

That is an option, too, but I think that's irresponsible. But I think at least right now we could say that we'll table it to next month with this option because I do think it needs to be done, but I also would be voting against it the way it is now because Commissioner Reed has made a good point. But if we can bring it back and make it proper, like with a budget resolution, make it proper so it's not out of stormwater, I'd be much more inclined to vote for it, so.

So I'm just going to try to make her a resolution that we that we talk about this at the next workshop as part of a part of the workshop because I think we have to have a discussion of the are all good points. But we're not we're not really prepared to talk about this and different options and different solutions. But we need to discuss it and we need to have a final a final decision made by next meeting.

Yes. Okay. So this will be tabled to the next meeting. I believe finance, um, and public works have marching orders to work, but I think we need to have a workshop.

I don't want to just bring it back to the next meeting. I want to, I want to be able to talk about it freely.

Okay. So could we also schedule this for the workshop?

Do you want this to be part of the next budget workshop? Is that what you're saying?

Or maybe a little separate, something that's just focused on this. Because I think we need to talk about this. And this is not a, you know, it's kind of get a jump on this and maybe research this.

OK. And then I just want to understand. So you want us to come with some other types of funding options outside of going into reserves? Is that right? Yep. Or I mean, reserves is always an option if you don't want, you know.

I would also love if you could maybe just reach out to the engineer to say, is there any benefit to doing these together? You know, or is there really nothing? Because the point that Commissioner Readway that well, we could do it in twenty seven budget. If there is some point in doing these together, you know, the stormwater aspect of it, then again, we're getting close enough there that we might say, OK, we don't want to wait, but we could wait a little.

I don't I don't follow what you're talking about. It's related to this.

The pipe that we that's a separate thing.

OK, that's not even related.

i thought they were really pretty sure they are but you know we can discuss this later i just want to you know we're running out of time so i just want to make a motion to table this item until our next workshop okay we have a motion second okay we have a motion for commissioner corey and a second from commissioner butler to table this to the next workshop okay discussion uh any i think we we killed we killed the discussion but all in favor yeah is there any discussion seeing none any public comment Seeing none, all in favor say aye of tabling it. Aye. All opposed? That carries 5-0. Okay, now we move on to unfinished business town hall roof, 12B, pages 149 to 186. This is, again, Public Works Director Tom Davis. Take it away.

Oops, again. records the records kind of speak for themselves this was not a you know the remediation or the re screw we we move forward with that suggestion with it extensive research to make sure that it was an acceptable practice and different things like that and the bids came back again I would suggest the 80,000 was Pretty indicative. They would have rather done a full roof instead of, and you might notice in your package, during my tour with the bidders, the fire chief was present also, they collectively kept saying, oh, well, how about a new roof? How about a new roof? So my statement was, I am only asking for the bids for preschool remediation. But if you feel so motivated and you want to share any data with me about worth replacement, you can certainly submit that. But it would not be considered an RFP if the commission said full roof, we're back to Jump Street. We have to start with RFPs for that. So that's why you see a couple, two of them reflected that, I know, which is, I wouldn't have, but they did. It's been discussed if knowledge with our building official Jeff is here the managers where that and. We feel comfortable presenting it to you as we have is a solution.

Any questions, yes, but have this man.

The severe difference in the same flashing Invent repair and resealing are they trying to replace the flashing?

I mean, it's like 20 30,000 more yeah it because of the Couple of things they're cricketing around the top but we have to do the flashing We've got two valleys at least that was part of the problems that we've existed and secondly I The screw-down requirements for our storm wind ratings would require that flashing to be replaced. It's come loose and it's really bad it It should have been addressed in 2018.

So are you saying that the that the bid for 83,000 is is way It because that's the one that has yeah, and the highest amount for the flashing. So you're saying that that would be more appropriate?

No, OK. I mean, I mean, I know. OK, I'm sorry. No.

So the so the thirty nine hundred dollar flashing is what we need to have for a hurricane.

And the cupola is all the valleys. OK. Yes, ma'am.

That was my only question.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Davis, on page 185, we're talking about Peterson Aluminum Limited 25-year acrylic-coated AZ-55 Gavalume warranty. Is that something that we would get?

No, sir, not with the remediation. That was one of the two companies that submitted the $80,000 for the re-screw. And that was one of the galvalumes to redo the whole roof. Gotcha. Gotcha. Yes, sir. There's no.

Because their warranty wouldn't apply to us anyway. No. According to the fine print.

According to, hey, precisely. And that's, we always, coastal restrictions.

Close to the water. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Close to the water. And, yeah, we've learned a lot about, yeah. So for your own homes, just be aware of that. Be aware of that, right. Because it's very significant. Superior is a company, if you check them on Better Business, like I do all these, they've been around, they do a lot of work, and I could not find a lot of, I didn't find any bad ratings on them, other than you get them as a physician, everybody, somebody always gripes about you a little bit, but they didn't seem a whole lot of substance.

I will say that going through this, that right now, right now, we need to repair that roof. It is leaking, we've had to cut out some areas, it's now leaking on the fire system, so we have to repair it. Replacing the roof is gonna take a lot more time, but I think replacing the roof maybe in 10, 15 years is going to be a probability, and we need to start, we should budget for that, and we can budget for that over a number of years, but right now this would be to repair.

And as the manager said, we kind of in discussion and common sense, you guys probably think the same thing. If we can get 10, 15 years out of this, and hopefully we'll in the future every year have, like the playground fund, X amount put projecting we'll get a whole new roof in year 11 or whatever is what I'd hope.

but in 10 to 15 years, instead of 175,000, it may be 300,000.

It probably, and I will not be in this seat, Commissioner.

Nor would I. Hopefully I'll be above ground.

Madam Mayor, can I make a motion? One thing I will note, and I know that you guys, because I talked to the manager about this recently, but you guys got up there, there's pictures, y'all did a bunch of inspections, but i would think that with those inspections you'd be able to have a bunch of different areas even like numbers of areas of roof flashing that need to be replaced repair whatever but we don't have any numbers like that and the bid proposals on both of these repairs they i mean on the on the major items um you know some of that were like different but it it just says like repair there's no like repair at least three sections and seams you know and identifying the ones we literally know about as well as other like there's no no so they they could be like oh well we repaired the you know like if we've inspected and we know critical sections but those aren't in the country so i'm i just it's like we're gonna if we even the lower one spend forty thousand dollars on a repair with no warranty we They still might not be repairing all the sections and we do have some data on which sections We literally know need repair and we don't we don't have that in either of these contracts You know, it's like repair and replace and but but no Numbers like how many sections are getting repaired? How many sections are getting replaced? These sections are getting new, you know, whatever We don't have any of that. Sorry

They specify sheets of plywood because what we projected is 400 square feet of the repair. Mayor, you'll see there's a reference. Well, probably not in, oh yeah, go over, if you will, to the... Superior one the one I'm proposing It would be 152. Okay, and they make reference to the seven sheets of plywood There And in networks and that they'll sister to the existing trust which is not something we need and the new Hardy board replacement because there's damage from bad flashing under there and That's why we're putting new wall transition flashing. And installing existing panels over the repair area. So that interprets from our, and the chief has pictures, we were up there, he's seen it. Those are the number of sheets of plywood in that leak area that we've identified. There's been no other, areas like that.

How much money did we put in the budget for the repair?

We had requested up to $75,000 y'all had given us.

It would come out of reserves. You'd voted on that.

Yeah. I'm sorry. Yeah.

So are you ready for a motion? Sure. Yep. I make a motion that we award the bid to superior one roofing for the town hall complex metal roofing repairs in the amount of 43,000. For 4040 get 40. just in case there's a little bit of a buffer needed. Second.

Thank you for that, because I would like that, and because, as you said, it might take eight sheets of plywood. I really hate to, because we inspect it every day with them, and if we see something.

Will you repeat your motion, because when you were making it for the bid, Mr. Davis, there was a little bit of discussion about the actual price. Can you repeat your motion for the amount?

Make a motion to accept the bid from Superior One Roofing, for the town hall complex metal roofing repairs in the amount of 43,000? Second.

Okay, so we have a, y'all want to fight over who's got, I heard him on the set. Ladies first, ladies first. No, I know. Ladies first. Okay, let's go. Okay, well, he's going to get this one. So we have a motion from Commissioner Corey and a second. I'm just kidding. We have a motion from Commissioner Corey and we have a tied second between Commissioner Butler and the Vice Mayor to approve the quote and bid from Superior Roofing in the amount of $43,000. Any discussion?

Yes.

Okay.

Right, so we're basically just buying time here is what we're doing with our roof, right? So we're, this roof was in 2003, so we're 23 years into a roof that has a 30, 35 year lifetime. So like the town manager said, I think along with doing this we should start we should have a capital line item in this next year's budget for starting to accumulate the funds to replace the roof in a in probably whatever the time frame it is probably 10 years so the other question i have is in in the uh in the bid tabulation there for superior one um who is who you're choosing here, they didn't provide any information on their insurance, which I find hard to believe that they don't have insurance.

I didn't check my email today, but I did request it. Like you said, they've got it. I just got to get it. I request today, go ahead and send that as an attachment by email.

But we don't have it yet?

It wasn't in their bid package.

So we would be voting on a roofing repair that's going to get up on top of a very large building and we don't know that they have insurance? because it's not.

I would almost, well, I don't know, ma'am, that if Superior fails overnight, I'll leave.

Provision of their insurance information. There you go. Thank you.

Okay, so we have an amendment to the motion, which would be, and I'll try to state it, but if you disagree, let me know. An amendment to the motion, which would be to approve the... superior bid company to do the roof repairs in the amount of $43,000, but subject to the requirement that they provide us proof of insurance that would meet any state, what would you like to say? Because I think there is a requirement for what it's supposed to cover.

Just going to say your code requires a formal written contract and or purchase order. Correct. If there's anything in roofing, I always recommend having a written agreement. instead of just a purchase order that outlines the terms and conditions of that. And one of the conditions would be the insurance requirements. It would require them to furnish that prior to any work being done.

We actually issued the RFP that they know will enter in the contract. I base that on legal.

Would you like to give us a suggestion for how then Commissioner Corey could word that? It would be that we accept the bid and proceed with drafting a contract, which would then require insurance. Would that be the...

Yes, it would be accept the bid and to enter into a written agreement with Superior One.

Okay, and to require the proof of insurance?

It would be included in the agreement.

All right, so are you good with that? Okay, we have an amended motion again by Commissioner Corey, which would be to approve the bid and Superior according to the RFP and direct that we enter into a contract with Superior, which will include proof of insurance. Do we have a second?

An amount of $43,000.

In the amount of $43,000, yes. Do we have a second? Sure. Vice Mayor has seconded that motion. Any other discussion?

Public comment.

But no discussion, public comment? Seeing none, all in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed, nay. Okay, we will move on. to new business. So now new business, new item A is the appointment of Michael Colasian as a board member on the Planning and Zoning Board, pages 104 to 105. And I want to thank Mr. Colasian for volunteering and for staying. Would you like to come up? We have his application. Would you like to come up and speak and take any questions?

Well, I don't and my name is Michael agent 524 sunset Boulevard I Grew up in this town was born and raised here in 52 Some of the guys talking about the drainage and all that stuff and I've sat through planning and zoning meetings plenty of times and We do a lot of things and make it a lot more difficult in this town than it needs to be so I Figured I'd finally step up and get on the board and try to help Does anyone have thank you Does anyone have any it is a huge commitment a lot.

So we appreciate it any questions?

Yeah Yeah, so Planning and zoning and the Board of Adjustment, two boards, those two boards are very much different than the other boards in town in that those boards have authority to make decisions affecting the town. So that carries more weight and responsibility for doing that. So it sounds like you've been participating in the planning and zoning BORES THAT HAVE BEEN OCCURRING YOU'VE BEEN ATTENDING THAT AND PARTICIPATING IN THAT AND I JUST WAS AND LOOKING AT YOUR EXPERIENCE YOU LOOKS YOU'RE VERY HAVE A CONSTRUCTION BACKGROUND AND AN OWNER OF THE TWO CON YOU KNOW TWO CONTRACTING COMPANIES THERE SO I GUESS I WAS GOING TO MY my thing was looking at was that is is there do we have any is there any potential conflict of interest uh things here that we needed to uh air out and discuss this uh um because of the authority invested in the board you're you're the fact that you're you're a contractor you were doing doing work in town and elsewhere. So I was going to ask if the town attorney could highlight or kind of brief that so the commission and the citizens understand that.

sure so on its face the fact that he's a contractor and doing business in town is not a prohibited conflict of interest the only way that there could be a conflict of interest where he would have to recuse himself from a vote would be if it's something that his company is involved in if they're submitting plans whatever it is to the planning of board obviously he would not be able to vote on that and would have to recuse himself but just the fact that he's a contractor working in town it's no prohibited conflict of interest with that

I have a question because I see your signs in town, but you probably, I mean, one or two per year, maybe some years or so.

So I own, I own an engineering company, a structural engineering company and a Marine construction company. So the engineering company already, I don't, I own the company, but I have someone running it for me now. That's a licensed engineer who signs and seals all the drawings. So it's not even me signing it anymore. I own the company. He signs the drawings. Um, So yeah, we might work on two projects a year, if that.

So even though if he's not the engineer signing it, but at his company, he still would have to recuse, though, I believe.

Yeah, so the statute says either that person or an associate. So if that situation were to arise, then the safe bet would be to recuse from that vote.

Which is fine. I mean, I think one or two years is not that big of a deal. Now, if you had like four, five, six, it would, you know, but... And, I mean, every year is different.

You never know.

Yeah. So, but you will commit to following the law and if your company is on a project, you'll recuse.

I mean, I'm a licensed professional engineer. I have ethical things I have to follow, so.

And one thing, we will be updating our comp plan, so an engineer would be helpful for that. That's not something you would recuse on, because it's...

I think you'd be a great asset with your expertise and knowledge. Thank you so much for volunteering.

Does anyone else have any questions?

Just thank you for stepping up. You're welcome.

This is a concern that's not relevant just to you, but a concern I have had before with two of the boards, particularly BOA and PNZ. The fact that there's no BOA email or PNZ. It's just your personal cell phones and your personal emails. But I would love in the future for there to be a BOA and a PNZ email. So if you got an email to your personal email, you just forward it to that. The town's able to track it. But will you commit... to trying to avoid communications on your personal devices, and if you do get them about any town business that comes before the board, that you will provide a copy to the town clerk, even if it's just forwarding, oh, I got this email, so that we can keep a record of it.

Yeah, that's easy. I mean, a lot of people come, I mean, I've been here forever, a lot of people come to me, so they're gonna send me stuff, so it's just, they do now.

But I appreciate your volunteering, I do think you'll be an asset and helpful. Okay, there's no other questions, and thank you for being here. I would entertain a motion.

I will make a motion that we approve Michael Kalajan as a board member on the Planning and Zoning Board.

Second. Okay, we have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Public comment? Seeing none, all in favor say aye. Aye. Aye. All opposed? That carries 5-0. All right. Yay. Thank you. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you. Oh, and I do know you two are friends. You're both on the panic zoning, so don't have email or text communications because that will, yeah, about, yeah, okay. All right, next item of business will be the We pulled G. Did we not warm water pipe?

Okay. Yeah.

Sorry. I saw you Is the consent agenda item G that was pulled so that is new business item B now Stormwater pipe repair 449 for if you want Riverview Lane public works director Tom Davis page 111 take away This problem

Involves one of our stormwater pipes down our easement between the two aforementioned properties Commissioner Reed back in the original time frame 25 I think it was when we first started solve some of the problem that we had and at that point we Dug it up and we've confirmed it and it's quite honestly. It's got belabored by many management changes. It fell between the cracks between managers, inter-managers who made choices. Now, of course, now the permanent manager is burdened with this. But when we originally looked at it, we considered tying it to a seawall to appease, if you will, for lack of a better term, the property owners on the north and the south. But one should consider, and I could I guess you could add. We applied past experience. Whenever we, meaning the town, have touched a seawall, as one contractor put it, don't call me if you ever do that, because you touch a seawall, you buy the seawall. And we had a multi-year, non-legal, but a battle in house with a House not too far from this one where the town had attached to a seawall seawall on one side failed. They tried to blame the town for the failure and that we should replace it. So it just turned. So my advice in the opinion of the engineer was we should just stay where we're at. As constructed, which is the header and the pipe. When we look at that, that brings the cost down greatly. And it still serves a purpose. We repair the pipe, the stormwater problem is solved, and that's it. During the course of that, Brewer, or not Brewer, Atlantic is still conducting finished up Basin 1. And I always like to reach out for experts. And so at my request, the superintendent met me and we went down there and we looked at that. Not only that, I reached out for BSE because they had originally conducted at one of the manager's direction a complete connection to the seawall and all. And when I decided that was, Given my investigation, it was not necessary. That's when I said, please modify the plan to the repair, so stated. We, the three of us, went down, we looked at it. Because we save on mobilization some, if we were to do the change order, because we still have not closed out the final payment and payment back from the Basin 1, Atlantic feels comfortable they can do our repair for 25,000 or less when we were looking at well over 75 to 100,000 if we did it the other way And I'm satisfied that it is a way to go. I feel very comfortable But anyway, that's why I'm proposing a change.

I love it being less. Even that, you know, it's like there's a, I saw a 75,000, a 40,000 budgeted, but this is the 25,000. But can you do a change order on a basin over here for a completely different basin?

I believe so, but I'll defer to legal. But we have, that's fairly common practice. I'll let legal speak for that, I'm sorry.

No, yeah, my interpretation of that is that it would be allowed with the change order. It's aligned with the same... sort of range of work that they're doing right now. And if you were to bid it back out, you're going to pay for all the mobilization. And that's why there's going to be such a discrepancy with the change order and what it would take to bid it back out.

I don't know about this whole change order thing, because it's literally a completely different project in Basin. I do know that there's a $25,000 provision in our code that allows the commission to do stuff like this. So I would rather track it to $25,000 and citing that, not calling it a change order, but just still taking the benefit of the fact that they're not going to charge us a mobilization fee.

well there'll be some but it'll be minimal yeah because there is a i'll find it there's a provision for approval by the commission for 25 000 amounts i think what you're referring to is that the um 15 contracts or orders less than 25 000 may be placed on the consent agenda for the commission oh okay yeah

That's what it was on.

Yeah, so it was on the consent agenda. So we could basically approve it at $29,999. We don't need to call it a change order, but we're just approving the cost for fixing it with that company. But is the change order because it saves it from having to go to RFP? Is that why the change order aspect is important?

You can look at it a few ways I think the change order is because it's been determined that there's an additional scope of work that would That they could perform while they're out there In their scope of work does it say base in one and I mean does it have any language we can hook to I Don't know but I can pull it up

i could you pull that up and just look and see if we can if there's any language where it's where we can say okay yeah so that language yeah change order because it's that basin and any other i don't know go ahead yeah uh and one that i referred to that was significant dollar amount mayor was during the

actually use of the part of the bond money some years back mission or may remember we have a very unexpected major repaired had to be done in base in 10 and we had was under contract on base in 2 and I do know that we did that by change order and that's not I could probably say at least I'm not saying that that makes a legal basis right, but I'm saying

we've done on multiple occasions for example on cherry we had a k i could name two or three that we've done it past practice has been but again i don't make it i think past i think that our past practices though are what cause trouble so it's more of like let's not follow past let's do it the right way it's more my my thinking but we're just gonna i kind of need to take a break for a second we could give the town attorney a chance to pull up the actual scope of the work

He wanted to pull it and would like to get his opinion.

So I had a question for Public Works director here. So in in it was confused a little bit. So you citing Atlantic material as the as the contractor here. So now it sounds like you're talking about. Atlantic development is that the same contractor from Basin one?

Yeah, I was curious about the name.

What I do name it is the same.

It's Atlantic material, but they're called Atlantic development Yeah, so I mean yeah, I would yes, I would like that I think with that needs to be corrected in here I mean, there's probably 500 companies do the business starting with Atlantic me in their name so makes that that's clear I guess the What what what kind of pipe is that do we know what kind of pipe that yeah believe it is?

it's actually reinforced concrete and what happened that area that we looked at that we've put that emergency patch on that had washed out settled and the joints are down like this and that's where that leak on that by the way uh a caveat commissioner reed witnessed the fence situation i'm in current contact with the property owner where the fence we're going to have to move is located and he's aware of that by the way

Could you elaborate?

Yeah, we'll have to move it. It's a foot and a half over on our side. Is this the neighbor of Robert Baldwin it's and well, yeah, bald ones on this side and this is on the other side of the cul-de-sac but the oh Sullivan's the property owner on one and then a contractor South Florida actually owns the one in question his his business rep and I've been communicating and they're aware of the need.

The communications. Is it just oral emails document?

I wasn't done with my question so. So OK, so you confirm it's the reinforced concrete pipe here and it says the the the failure is due to this sinking ground. So are they when they do this repair, they're doing something to stabilize this this ground right?

You may have it. Did it get included in your package? The actual.

There's no drawings or no yeah, yeah, there is going on your your your words here.

Yes, sir. It's the F D O T standard thing I can email a copy of that. Meeting the concrete collar setter setter in the compact rate of the soil underneath it and right now will be that I can I can shoot you that it's.

You should include it in here if you can. Then the last, I guess my last question, really question is then where it doesn't, it says it's funded in the current budget. And so I'm just trying to look for the specificity of where we think that funding is. It seems like it's fund 141. Can we confirm that? That was, yes.

Was it 141? It's 141, 449 was right next to the. Seawall. Seawall. Yes, sir. Under 141, it says the Riverview Lane. Yeah, Riverview Lane on the budget item for 40,000. Okay.

All right. So we're looking at.

And that's actually out of stormwater. Yeah.

All right. So there's this. Okay. So that's we're confirming it is the funds would become from 141. Yes. A Atlantic Development Company for this stormwater repair. That's my questions, thank you.

This issue with the fence? Is that directly and directly related? When does that happen?

Legal appeal. It will be moved. It's in our easement. And they will probably move it. Or we will. We will do it. We will not replace it.

I think that we should be removing it in conjunction with this project.

And I've asked they move it to the line, which is almost two feet. And that's going to be done, I believe.

I'm hearing maybes and nothing certain. Are they connected in any way?

The fence and this pipe?

The pipe is the outfall.

It runs right to the right edge of it.

We're repairing a pipe that then has a fence that's over it.

So do we need to have the attorney write the homeowner a letter requesting the removal?

I think we need to have it.

I think I can get an agreement from them, but it's up to the legal. I mean, if you want to do the verbiage.

I'm looking for something certain and with the documentation.

Okay. So I'm not familiar with this area. There's a fence on the property that's going to need to be removed. Is that correct?

Okay. It's about two feet into our easement, which is a dedicated easement on the survey.

Okay. So yeah, we would definitely want to speak to the owner, give them notice and then make sure that the fence is installed. Yeah. My big cab, big,

I also feel like we should remove it because if they remove it and they damage the other end of the pipe, I mean, what? Like, but anyway, or.

Do you want to add that to the resolution? I don't know. The motion. Motion to approve and that the fence be fixed before repairs are made.

If you need to be specific or. I mean, we have. It's up to you.

I'm waiting for some sort of concrete details on what actually is going

i i will you said you needed legal you said you're not familiar no i'm not familiar with the setup but if there's a fence on the property within our easement then we would have the rights to enter upon there remove that fencing as long as it is installed back the way that we found it so here here now right now what what's the plan you'll send a letter are you comfortable with this oh i will move the fence we're going to

That we we have all right in the world of mom in that easement. I don't have to be so kind that remember on this to give people notice I have the right to remove I have no obligation.

I'll project manage this we're going to have a Mister Davis, he's already spoken to the property owner, the property owner is aware of this. Mister Davis as soon as we start on this contract he's going to let them know that we're going to remove it. uh you know uh mr knight if we need to send a letter a legal letter or anything to let them know we will send that as well um and let them know that if they want to replace it it has to be outside of our right away or easement i'm sorry easement could i request that we that that we as a commission um require that legal contacts the homeowner instead of going through public works about the removal

So if the commission's OK, OK with that. Yeah.

And a timetable on it. OK. Did you get that the project scope? I'm going to have to take a break real quick in the restroom. So if you haven't found it yet, we take a two minute break.

No. So I have the project scope. The project scope is based on one. However, we also have an exhibit a to the agreement. which contemplates change orders and it states the contract documents may be amended to provide for additions deletions and revisions in the work or to modify the terms and conditions thereof and one or more of the following ways one is a formal written amendment the other one is a change order okay so specifically contemplated if the parties can add to the work delete the work or revise the work and the base in one part where it says that what is that

it's this is a 166 page document okay um all right uh so we have a motion do we have a motion in the same motion the motion is had a motion from the vice mayor the motion from the vice mayor and seconded but we have a friendly amendment to that from commissioner corey which would be that in conjunction and before this project starts i would accept that friendly expeditionally the manager second uh and the town attorney will commence with writing a letter um the legal aspect of it and the public works director will remove the fence in the right of way Okay, so any discussion on that? Any public comment? Okay, we have a motion and a second all in favor say aye aye all opposed that carries 5. I'd like to make one comment on my vote. I am a little uncomfortable with the change order. But I'm I'm OK with it because there we do have advice of Council. And I'm happy that this is reduced debt and this is a potential safety issues are for 25,000 we need to fix that we have a depression in the road. will say going forward though it would be nice if you included pictures at least in some of this there there is no depression in any roads this is in their backyard basically it's a crushed pipe okay well again there's no pictures so no there's no pictures so but all right that carries five oh we're gonna take a quick break five minute recess and we'll be back okay

Don't worry.

I hold it.

All right, we will go back on the record. Not so much stuff up here. Roll call. Mr. Jones, town clerk, if you could call roll, please.

Okay, Mayor Allison Dennington.

Here.

Vice Mayor Terry Cronin. Here. Commissioner Anna Butler.

Here.

Commissioner Tim Reed.

Here.

Commissioner Sherry Corey.

Here.

Town Manager A. Marie Smith.

Here.

Town Attorney Ryan Knight. Here. Fire Chief Gavin Brown. Here. Police Chief Tim Zander. Here. Public Works Director Tom Davis is here. Finance Manager Jennifer Kerr. Here. And Town Clerk Sid Jones is also present.

Okay.

We will pick up back where we were, which is new business item C, which was originally item A, but we had some adjustments. So new business old item A, which is now new item C, is resolution 202604, stormwater utility fee increase and assessment role certification, finance manager Mrs. Kerr, pages 187 to 215.

So this resolution is to adopt the fee schedule, the increased fee schedule of 68.90 per ERU, and that's resolution 2026.04. And if that is approved, then we have resolution 2026.05, which is to certify that rate for the fiscal year 27 budget. Okay.

and sorry i did not label all those uh okay um are is there any detail you want to give us or anybody want to take questions uh there i do have a couple of public comments on this that i will be reading on the record i'll have to probably read them fast but i will try so are we looking for approval tonight

yes that is correct um prior commission meeting you guys agreed to the assessment increase so we sent out the letters i'll make a motion to approve

we have a motion to approve a second we have a second oh wait are there options though in there do we need to see no the option is to stay with the current one okay yes so we have a motion to approve and a second by motion to approve by a vice mayor a second by Commissioner Butler is there a discussion I do have some discussion anybody uh so there were several public comments that we received written and i read all of them uh and they have caused me pause what page are we on right here because i'm going to at least 187. even though i absolutely do think that we we need to do this and it is not a huge jump in money um The issue in the past has been that we necessarily tracked or accounted all of this stuff well or as we should the record sort of keeping and that was what each one of these comments mentioned they said that they're not opposed necessarily to the raise but that they are opposed to the raise right now because the record keeping for this stuff from the last budget you know has not been established properly and they requested like an accounting of how have these stormwater funds over the last 20 years every year how have these been being tracked and used They also, there was an objection and it related to, it does include every year a five year increase and they said they were opposed to that. We're gonna be doing a bunch of, hopefully soon we're gonna be doing some assessment studies and stuff. So I think it should be a one year thing. I think the valid point about the five year raise is that we shouldn't do that. It should be a one year. We could always do it again but you know, the assessments may, anyway. So I will read those public comments. But it has caused me to change my mind because sometimes I think that you don't change your sort of record keeping practices unless you really are forced to or it becomes an issue. And I know that the manager and Mr. Davis have been doing a ton of work to correct that, but I still think that we have a lot of places to go. Even tonight we had an issue about something being calculated for stormwater and it wasn't. Those are my issues. That's my statement. I will read the public comment when it comes up.

Could I just quickly. So specifically, it's a five maximum 5% increase, but it's only going to be raised by the cost of living. So the cost of living is 2.5 and it's only 2.5. And the commission has to vote on that. So if you don't think that it should be raised, then you don't have to vote on it being raised. But it's an option that we would automatically you know, increase it by the cost of living and that you'd vote on it, or you would vote to keep it the same. So there, there's a lot of options every single year, right? So it's not an automatic increase. Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you for pointing that out.

Any other questions, comments, we'll go to public comment. I'll read the public comments that I received.

Madam mayor, I don't know that you need to read them. We've all read it. We've got an impact and it's there's a motion on the floor. So you're not asking any questions and it's not germane.

No, actually, in fact, this has been an issue before where there have been comments that have been sent and and they were read on the records. So that's I mean, people sent comments.

We've read them.

I think we do have a live person that wants to. Okay, but we have had this issue come up, and I've had the town attorney, and when people sent comments in, they were read on the record. It was a new policy that was established two years ago, and then just, like, I'm not going to not, like, I believe they sent these in in order for them to be read on the record. Somebody chose to put them in the packet, but when other comments were emailed in, if they weren't, I mean, so I am the chair, and I will be reading these. So if there's no other discussion, I'll start reading. I think there is someone waiting. Oh, you got to come on up to the microphone. Can't escape it.

Hi, I'm Dirk Nasker for 13 Driftwood Avenue. With regards to the increase, I believe there needs to be a plan or some sort of objective stated for justifying the amount, particularly if it's over five years. So the question I have is, do we have a plan, an objective that has been communicated to the public? that one that was presented at the last meeting? As I understand, that was not an accounting for this is what we're going to do with first year's budget. This is not what you know, it didn't itemize how we're going to spend that money.