Town Commission - Regular Meeting

21st. This is our regular monthly town commission meeting, 6 p.m. If our interim town clerk will call the roll. Mr. Jones?

Mayor Allison Dennington?

Here.

Vice Mayor Terry Cronin? Here. Commissioner Anna Butler?

Here.

Commissioner Tim Reed?

Here.

Commissioner Sherry Corey?

Here.

Town Manager A. Marie Smith?

Here.

Town Attorney Ryan Knight is joining us via Teams. Finance Manager Jennifer Kirk.

Here.

Public Works Director Tom Davis.

Here.

Fire Chief Gavin Brown. Here. And Interim Town Clerk Sid Jones is also present.

Okay. We will stand and say the Pledge of Allegiance.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

All right, we will have a moment of silence. I will read the civility pledge. The commission and the staff of Melbourne beach pledged to conduct all discourse in a civil manner. The mayor and all members of the commission will treat one another with courtesy and respect and ask the public to do the same towards the commission towards each other and towards staff. We will be respectful of one another, even when we disagree and we will direct all comments towards the issues. We will avoid personal attacks. Okay. With that said, there are some walk-on items. So I'm gonna read those into the agenda. Um, it looks like there is an email exchange between the state department of, uh, management. Tila Sanders and the town manager it is oh that will be part of my managers report okay okay it looks like it is four pages two pages double space so four total pages it has an attachment and then we have a walk-on item that is and this is a total of three pages plus an attachment, so a total of four pages. We also have some updated board applications. They were originally in the packet, and upon looking, good, yes, okay. So these will replace the ones that are in the packet. And just for the record, there was a couple of things that were missing that had, there was a glitch with the filling out of the paperwork, so it does look like that that's been completed. So these will get supplemented. We can talk about that when it comes up. But there are one, 1, 2, 3, and that would be for Dan Hanson, Joe Solly Hanson, Dale Hinman-Farrell, and Rebecca Lees. So these are the updated ones, correct? Okay, great, thank you. And it also looks like there is a Ways for Life brochure that is up here as well, and I believe they're going to give a presentation. That'll be part of the proclamation. Proclamation, okay, great. All right, so with that said, we can get started. Are there any other changes or additions to discuss? None, okay. All right, we will go straight to the proclamations and awards. So we are on, oh, actually, I'm going to, I need a, I think I need a motion to approve the agenda as presented then. with these additions. So there will be an additional item from the manager. So moved. So moved. OK. And we will just put this in order at the end? Will this be as part of your manager report, or will this be in the new items?

Oh, that's the walk-on?

Yes, the walk-on.

That'll be in the new items.

OK. So clerk, could you give us a number of what that will be then? And then we can accept the agenda with that, if someone can make a motion to accept it once she gives it.

OK. So that's not part of your presentation?

no not the walk-on item yeah that would be new business what that would be like that is the last item new business I unless you need it to go sooner no I would I would ask please if you could put it sooner we have a guest here from Brevard County who is okay answer questions and I don't want to

okay would we like to put it at b then um i think our first presenter is item a yes and then she could be item b yeah and i see the girl scouts are here they would be c um or or would the girls would the girl scouts mind if we if um if we've got somebody from bernard county and they need to get going we could put would that be okay or do we put them at c i just need a motion from someone or two yeah okay valerie says she can stay till after the girl scouts

Okay, so we'll make hers item C then.

Okay, thank you.

Okay, all right. Okay, so that will be a new item C. Then all of the numbers from the original 13 from C, they will just be shifted down. So the old C will become D, et cetera. All right, that said, could I get a motion to accept it as amended?

Motion to approve the agenda as amended.

Second. Okay. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? That carries 5-0. Okay. So I will go, we will get to the proclamations and I have two to read, I believe. Actually, excuse me. 5A is town announcements, town clerk. Okay. So page five, if you're in the packet.

Yes, so we don't really have any upcoming events, so it's really just a reiteration of our weekly classes that are available.

Okay. All right. Okay.

So I'd like to add to that, if I could, for a minute. So I know the E8, the Environmental Advisory Board, is co-sponsoring an electronic waste roundup with the town of India Atlantic's Resiliency Board. So that's going to be on May 15th. 30th at the Indy Atlantic Shopping Center, which is just between Publix and Long Doggers there in Indy Atlantic. So electronic waste roundup, and you can own computers, printers, any electronics, batteries.

cables all those kinds of things that you're not really supposed to throw in the landfill they'll be collecting those between 9 and 2 p.m i believe on the 30th at that location thank you great thank you so much that is fantastic i've got a giant bucket of batteries you'll drop those off um okay so then we'll move on to item b which is a proclamation recognizing may 5th as national foster care day uh and um and may as national foster care month okay page six and i will read the proclamation um all right foster care awareness no that's the second one okay yeah um okay uh national foster care month uh and national foster care day may 5th 2026 whereas may is recognized nationally as foster national foster care month a time to raise awareness of the needs of children in foster care and to recognize the families and community partners who support them And whereas National Foster Care Day observed on May 5th highlights the importance of ensuring safety, stability and connection for children involved in the foster care system. And whereas there are approximately 86 licensed foster care homes in Brevard County currently providing care and stability for approximately 600 children in out of home care. Wow. And these families play a critical role in supporting children during times of transition and need. Whereas research and experience indicate that approximately half of foster families discontinue fostering within the first year, often citing a lack of adequate support and connection, underscoring the importance of strong community involvement and resources for foster families. And whereas the Brevard County Foster and Adoptive Parents Association BCF APA was formed with this need in mind, working to build community support and connections that strengthen foster and adoptive families and promote placement stability. Whereas Brevard County Foster and Adoptive Parent Association provides foster and adoptive families with practical and relational supports, including opportunities for family connection and peer support. access to community services, family focused events and partnerships with local organizations to strengthen caregiver resilience and family well-being. And whereas since its inception in November 2023, the Brevard County Foster and Adoptive Parent Association has served over 150 foster and adoptive families across Brevard County through community support, connection and access to resources. That is amazing. Well, therefore, be it proclaimed that the town commission of the town of Melbourne Beach, Florida does hereby proclaim May 2026 as National Foster Care Month and May 5th, 2026 as National Foster Care Day and encourages all residents to recognize and support the children, families and professionals involved in foster care. All right. Thank you. That is amazing. And I'll sign this afterwards, I'll give it to you. Okay, and now we will move on to the second proclamation, which is 5C.

Did you want to see if anybody from that organization was here want to do a photo perhaps before we move on to the second one?

Yes, okay. Maybe we could, I could read both and then I could do both at the same time because otherwise you're coming back. Yeah, that works. Is that okay?

No problem at all.

Okay, I'm going to do the next one and then we can get a little, a photo. Okay, foster care awareness, recognizing ways for life, May 21st, 2026. Whereas the 2026 foster care awareness theme is engaging youth, building supports, strengthening opportunities, as well as foster the future, and according to data collected by Measure of America, there are 6,000 disconnected youth, between the ages of 16 to 24 in Brevard County with one or more primary risk factors of foster care involvement. incarcerated parents, parents with substance abuse, domestic violence, and poverty. Recognizing that youth emancipated from foster care on their 18th birthday without permanent connections are at risk for adverse outcomes in adulthood. And whereas housing, healthcare, education, employment, legal services, each operates in its own space, often requiring young people to advocate for themselves before they fully understand what that even means. Ways for Life steps in that space and navigates and advocates to help young people understand what is available to them, to walk alongside them as they make decisions, and to ensure they are not facing these systems alone. Ways for Life envisions a future where all at-risk youth ages 15 to 25 have access to comprehensive wraparound support services that empower them to thrive and become successful successful contribution members of society. And whereas Ways for Life opened its doors in January 2020 and has served over 580 young adults and more than 228 of their dependent children by providing assistance throughout the year with professional staff at their recently expanded two-story location at 1401 Guava Avenue in Melbourne, supplemented with approximately 500 listed volunteers, including 150 active volunteers tracked in April 2026 alone. Ways for Life coordinates with Brevard County community-based nonprofit organizations such as St. Stephen's Way, Wings of Grace Ministries, and Nana's House to provide affordable transitional housing for young adults who have experienced the foster care system and or homelessness. And in addition to supporting the successful transition to adulthood, Ways for Life promotes the awareness of the needs of their members and our community and beyond by organizing fundraising events such as their 2026 Canopy of Hope Gala and the Ways for Life 5K Race held recently. Waze is appreciative of the support of the Melbourne Beach Rotary, Rock Harbor, and St. Sebastian's by the Sea churches, all located in the town of Melbourne Beach, as well as the support of many active Melbourne Beach residents involved in helping Waze for Life fulfill its mission. Now, therefore, be it proclaimed that the town commission of the town of Melbourne Beach, Florida, does hereby recognize Ways for Life, co-founded by longtime Melbourne Beach resident Pamela Bress, for providing a multitude of wraparound services for youth aging out of foster care in Brevard County to mark this 2026 May Foster Care Awareness Month. and the Melbourne Beach Town Commission encourages dedicated care providers to continue to model strength-based and solution-focused engagement with at-risk youth in need of supportive community-based and government entities to navigate a safe and secure path into adulthood. So if there's no objection, if the groups that are involved would like to come up and speak, I don't believe there would be any objection. If you'd like to come up and take a few minutes to talk, we would love to hear from you. Oh. actually you can do it that way but if you will press the yes there you go that way it will pick up and it'll be in the minutes as well thank you for having me here tonight i appreciate it

My name is Mary Grace West and I serve as the Director of Community Connections with the Brevard County Foster and Adoptive Parent Association. We call it BCFAPA for short, that's really long. We are here to support the families who are fostering children in our own neighborhoods. So our goal is to support them through peer support and provide events that families like other, I see some families here that I recognize, can get with other families and feel supported and not isolated. because it is a very isolating journey at times. And I am very thankful that I get to work with, most recently, Ways for Life in some ways, and we're looking to partner together more in the future. We serve teenagers as well, so it's really cool to see another organization that has set such strong standards in the community that we can work together.

Thank you so much. Hello. Thank you for having us tonight. My name is Pamela breasts and I'm an attorney 37 years and I worked at legal aid and saw a big gap in our community as youth. I was on a children's project and I represented teams that were aging out of foster care as well as special needs children in foster care. And I saw when they were about to turn 18 and when they turned 18 they fell in a big black hole and I started going to jails and prisons to visit them and it just broke my heart. And here we are. This is an amazing community, Melbourne Beach is an amazing community, because we have over 204 supporters just in the town of Melbourne Beach, 96 in the Atlantic, and a good portion of our staff, now we have 16 staff, started as volunteers for Melbourne Beach. Our kids went together to Gemini, Hoover, Mel High. we are a homegrown grassroots solution to problems of teenagers in this community and it's not just foster care there's a lot of teens that are unaccompanied they don't get even a case open their parents are dead on drugs in jail and the and child welfare doesn't even open up a case because they're a teenager that's a fact so we are filling that gap we are helping them get housing we are helping them with the pantry we're helping them with the mentor program we have a ged program with 54 graduates in five years So they go on to college, to the trades. We have two that went to the military. We are together, this community, and it is a light shining on here. All the people here really care. And I'm glad to be a part of it. I know a lot of people are sitting right here. And thank you to Suzy Stark for inviting us and bringing this to the attention of the town. And how many people actually live here? We're right over the bridge in O'Galley. And we are doing great stuff. We take up 11,000 square feet. So we have retired teachers tutoring. It's really awesome. So thank you for bringing the awareness to everyone else here, and thank you for the proclamation.

Appreciate it.

I want to say thank you so much for bringing these. I think that this is a great way for the community, for us, but for people watching at home to really learn about some of these programs. So thank you so much. And Susie, if you were responsible, thank you so much for doing that. I learned a lot just from reading those. And I thank you so much for your work in the community. We'd like to all come down, if it's possible, and take a picture with the proclamation. Would that be OK? Is that OK? Yes.

And we've had our wonderful volunteers since the beginning.

We should probably step in front of the dais here.

Yeah, and I think what we'll do is we can go like the same order. We'll have it in the middle holding the programmation. Keep doing one at a time.

Sorry, Brian. You guys go. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you go first. Yeah, that's what we wanna do too. All right, on three. One, two, three. We'll do one more. All right, we're ready. Sorry. Thank you.

All right, we'll wait for the clerk to be. Okay, now we will get to our first presentation. Okay, we are on item 6A, which would be the presentation by special guests. This is page 8 to 16. This is the Save Our Indian River Lagoon Sorrel Half-Cent Sales Tax Backs Ballot Initiative presentation by Terry Breeden. Come on up. And it has you listed for five minutes, but if you need more time, let us know.

I will try to stay on time. Okay. And Sid, you can skip the slides, or should I sit over there? OK. Gotcha. You are multitasking here. All right. Well, good evening. My name is Terry Breeden, and I work for Brevard County as the program manager for the Save Our Indian River Lagoon program. So between 2010 and 2016, our area began experiencing some devastating algae blooms that led to extensive fish kills, unusual mortality events, and ultimately the loss of our seagrass beds. Everyone was very upset about these events and demanded action. So the Save Our Indian River Lagoon half-cent sales tax was added to the ballot in 2016, and this referendum was approved by voters of every precinct to invest in a cleaner, clearer, and safer lagoon. The tax is collecting approximately $580 million over a 10-year period, and we've developed a mission of restoring the Indian River Lagoon through collaborative science-based projects which reduce and remove pollution to benefit our economy, community, and our natural resources. So to date, we have completed over 133 projects now. It's up to 134. And over 2,500 homeowner projects. So connecting them to sewer, upgrading their septic tank, repairing their sewer lateral line. We have these going on up and down the county.

Go to the next one.

So the lagoon is something that we all care about and is one of the main reasons we all live and work here. In 2025, the Indian River Lagoon National Estuary Program conducted an economic valuation study of the lagoon and estimates the whole lagoon generates over $28 billion for the local economy. So each of the projects in our plan requires design, engineering, permitting, and construction, and many of those are hiring our local neighbors to complete those tasks. So I also want to add these values take in the whole lagoon from Volusia County all the way down, but the space industry does contribute a lot to this, so most of this value is in Brevard County. Okay?

Okay.

I have a handout I had up at the table, but our Save Our Lagoon plan has over 400 projects in it. It's over 350 pages long. So we have condensed it into a little two pager that has all the 14 different project types that range from public education wastewater treatment facility upgrades for reclaimed water, septic to sewer, septic system upgrades, stormwater projects, aquatic vegetation harvesting, muck removal, oyster bars, and planted shorelines and clam restoration as well, just to name a few. So I have more of those up there if you would like to see learn more You know the next one So with all of these projects, we want to know that they're working as well So this slide shows some of the pre and post post data collected from three different project types the first one on the left is the city of Titusville Osprey wastewater treatment facility upgrade for reclaimed water and Initially, that had total nitrogen concentrations around five milligrams per liter. Post-upgrade, the concentrations are closer to two, so significant decrease in total nitrogen going into the Indian River Lagoon. The middle chart is from a recently completed septic to sewer project in the Indian River Isles neighborhood right off of US-1. And again, we saw significant decreases in the groundwater total nitrogen concentrations that lead to the lagoon, going from around eight milligrams per liter to about two and a half. And then on the right, we have the O'Galley River muck dredging project. This is looking at the bloom severity index. And again, that project went from just over 100 bloom severity down to just over 20. So we're seeing significant progress with each of these different project types. So as I mentioned, we've completed over 130 projects. This is the cumulative nitrogen reduction for each of those projects, where each color represents the year. So you can see the first five years, we were a little slow going. We experienced a lot of issues, including COVID, supply chain issues. But the last few years, we've really ramped up. A lot of these projects take significant design and engineering and permitting, and we're getting some of those larger projects under construction and completed. So this graph shows the algae bloom response since the sorrel, I call it Savor Lagoon, it's easier to say sorrel, the sorrel attacks started. So between 2016 and 2020, we saw a lot of fluctuations in really intense algae blooms. Since 2020 to current, we haven't really seen as much. Can you go to the next slide? So this is brand new data right here from the St. Johns River Water Management District. This is showing the seagrass response. They just released the 2025 bar last Tuesday. So that's why this isn't in your packet because I just got it. But they had, let me get the number right here. So in 2008 timeframe, we had our highest extent with over 30,000 hectares. And then the district documented an additional 17,000 hectares of seagrass in 2025. Oh, sorry, 17,000 hectares in 2025, an additional 7,000 increase from 2023 and so this equates to just about 13,000 football fields in seagrass growth in the last couple of years. So we are starting to see significant progress in the lagoon. And so here, I just kind of overlaid everything that algae bloom map on top of the time frame of the seagrass growth. So on the left is our highest extent of seagrass at 30,000 hectares. Oh, can you hit the button again? It has arrows. Yeah, OK. So as our algae blooms increased between 2016 and 2020, we started to see that significant decline in seagrass. And then one more time. So, as we have seen the algae blooms decrease, we have seen our seagrass start to make recovery and come back. There was, so, can you go back real quick? Well, back in 2010, 2011, we had a really bad freeze and I think that really caused a significant shift in the ecology of the lagoon. OK. So the Save Our Indian River Lagoon will be on the ballot in November for voters to vote yes or no if they would like to renew the tax. May 19th, we have the public hearing to adopt the ordinance and ballot language by the Brevard County Commission. which was approved. So May through July we're working with the municipalities to execute the interlocal agreement or extend the interlocal agreement for that tax. So in August the ballot language will be submitted to the supervisor of elections and then between hopefully starting next week we will be asking municipalities and entities to submit PROJECT IDEAS FOR THE 2027 PLAN UPDATE. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE DO ANNUALLY, BUT WITH THE PLAN POSSIBLE EXTENSION OF THE TAX, WE CAN TAKE IN MORE PROJECTS. SO THE PROCESS WOULD BE WE WOULD NEED THOSE APPLICATIONS SUBMITTED BETWEEN JUNE THROUGH SEPTEMBER. staff is going to review and rank those projects in October the election will be November 3rd we will be sending our agenda packet to the citizen oversight committee that following Friday for them to start reviewing and rank those projects and they will vote or recommend those projects at their November 20th meeting And then whatever's recommended goes into the 2027 plan update. That draft is posted towards the end of December. The Citizen Oversight Committee recommends it in January. And February goes to the Board of County Commissioners to consider or adopt the plan. If everything goes according to plan and they approve it in February, we can start going to contract with those new projects that are recommended. So in the end, the Save Our Lagoon program is working. Restoration takes time. And then you can go one more. This is just QR codes to sign up for our newsletters, find out more information about our program. And yes, you're welcome.

Yeah, so we actually our first item under new business is the inner agreement renewal for approval. I don't know if you had any questions for Terry while she was here or if you wanted to. I don't know if we can switch it up now since you already voted on the agenda. But I thought while she's here, you know, if you had any questions, you should probably ask her about it.

We can always, I mean, on the agenda, it's procedural, so we can always change it.

Okay, it's up to you.

With that suggestion from the manager, did someone want to make a suggestion to you? This is something that's voted on by the voters, right? It's not like a special election for each.

Correct. It'll be on the ballot for everybody in the county.

I did have one. I don't know if you know. Do you happen to know how, what is the percentage of the expenses that are sort of like overhead, like that are non-real? Do you have any idea of what?

For staff, you mean?

Yeah.

I don't know those numbers off the top of my head. But I know that tax is collecting about $580 million, and that money is all going towards the projects.

I JUST WANT TO CONFIRM AND UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU WERE RELAYING THERE ON THE CHART. THERE'S A LOT OF DATA. SO JUNE THROUGH SEPTEMBER, YOU'RE TAKING INPUTS FOR NEW PROJECTS TO BE CONSIDERED FOR FUNDING, IS THAT CORRECT?

YES, THE 14 DIFFERENT PROJECT TYPES THAT ARE IN THIS PACKET, YES.

AND THEN IF APPROVED, THAT FUNDING BECOMES AVAILABLE IN

February of next year.

We have a contract for it.

Okay. Thank you I'm missing a page here. Let's get out of order It goes from 15 just I don't think so. Is there any other questions? Okay, we can move here.

I did have a couple questions. So there's a matching to this, right?

No, no, it's based on total nitrogen reduction so there's a cost share offered for each project type and so if your project a stormwater project reduces a hundred pounds you'll get a hundred hundred times that cost share which we the committee just approved a the cost share rates for each project type on friday so that's what i'm working to get the application portal uploaded to the county website next week to go live so for instance we have an item that one of our commissioners is putting on here for a swell project in base of 10. would that be something that would look be looked at if it's a nutrient reducing project it is eligible okay

good to know thank you i was i was confused um page 17 it doesn't have i couldn't tell what it goes to i thought i was missing a page but the page 16 is just on this but it doesn't have a title heading do you know what this goes to it's got public works procurement founders day but there is no and it doesn't appear to go with page 16. that's the town manager report Okay. Okay. Okay. I wasn't sure if it was this or not.

That was another item that when the files were merged, it ripped her header off of that report. So we just discovered that this afternoon. Okay.

So if I may, do you have do you help with writing those or help with the application process?

We will work with you in any way that you need. Thank you.

Yeah, if we start doing questions or presentations, that would be out of order. We can allow it, but what would happen is every time people have presentations, if we started doing questions, they do have the information there that they could reach out, and we're about to go to public comment. But if you all want to allow it, it's just that we don't generally take, it's not something we're voting on.

So would you want to make a motion? Make a motion to allow it.

Okay. Can I get a second? Second. Okay. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. All opposed? Okay. Go ahead, sir. Come on up.

Pat Kenny, 442 Sandy Key. I just wanted to actually point out that Sorrel already supports Melbourne Beach through several projects. That big a budget, they go through dozens of other organizations. So they fund the zoo for our oysters. So we foster oysters. We foster clams that are being done on Riverview Lane. We tried to do them in the canals. They didn't do well. So we're focusing on the river. They also do the Lagoon Watch through MRC. I currently make samples of the river water and the canal waters and provide that back to the county through the MRC. The other thing they do is they provide the septic to conversions as well as septics to sewer connections. They have already authorized the last eight houses in Melbourne Beach that are still on septic tank on Oak Street to be converted over with $4,000 I think is the token. I don't know why they don't convert because they're like the last eight houses in Melbourne Beach. So I just wanted to point out, as opposed to a question, that they are actively participating here, as well as storm drains and nitrogen reduction.

The numbers were fabulous. It's good to see the charts like that. It really does look like it's working. Maybe the town could help those last eight houses in Melbourne Beach.

The town in Melbourne Beach.

Thank you, sir. I appreciate you pointing that out. Thank you. Okay. Now, Vice Mayor, go ahead.

Did you have a suggestion? My suggestion is I see the Girl Scouts here. They're behaving so well, but I feel like the agenda is going to keep them waiting a long time. And I wondered if we could move them up.

Well, I think perhaps you're worried that when we get to public comment, we don't want to expose them.

Might be that. That's a good idea, too.

I think that would also be a good idea. Yeah, that's a great idea.

I agree.

Yeah. I don't want to use the Girl Scouts as a shield. Very good. I think that if you would like to make that motion, I would love that.

I would like to move the Girl Scouts presentation up to the next on the agenda.

okay second all right um all in favor say aye aye aye aye all opposed okay that carries 5-0 so you'll make that notation um with the agenda so there is a further um okay then uh what about the soy roll for for yeah that was that do you want to move that up too but that's something we have to vote on i believe yeah It would go in. Okay, that's fine. Correct. Or procedurally, Ryan, does it matter if we remove the sorrel as well? Because we do have to vote on that one. Mr. Knight. Okay.

Yeah, it should be under new business if we're voting on it.

Yeah, if we're voting on it, it doesn't need to be under business as opposed to presentations. But OK, please go ahead.

Hi, I'm Jeanette Soucy. I live at 211 6th Avenue in Melbourne Beach. I am the chair of the Parks Advisory Board here in Melbourne Beach. And we were blessed with our Girl Scout troop 231. and brownie troop 212 and they came and presented at one of our meetings and so i'm going to let the troop 231 come up and do their presentation and it'll be followed with the brownie troop 212. wonderful okay okay young ladies yeah yes there you go

Hi, thank you for having us. We are the Girl Scouts of Troop 231, and we are here to present you our idea for our bronze award, the second highest award in Girl Scouts.

What is it for?

We are trying to... And we are doing a pet drive for shelters that don't have enough pet supplies or food. All right.

So they're doing a pet drive, too, for supplies for sheltered pets. Yes. Okay. And would you like to say your name?

I'm Annabelle.

Annabelle. Okay. Okay.

How are we going to get people to bring us pet supplies? We're going to.

Well done.

I know.

What are we going to do? A donation.

A donation drive?

A donation drive. How are we going to get them to come?

We're going to take pictures.

With anybody or with their? Pets. Okay.

Yay.

So when do we want to do this, ladies? Sorry, we're a little late. No, no, it's okay. When do we want to do this? Okay, go ahead.

So we are hoping we could do this on the back to school bash. It would be people bring their pets. We take pictures of them, but that would be in the parking lot instead of in the park because of the no dogs rule.

Okay. Could you say that again? I didn't hear that because it was somebody coughing.

So we would like to do it in the parking lot because of the no dogs rule.

Okay. Which parking lot? The town? Yes. Okay.

I don't know which parking lot is which.

It would probably be right in this area.

Okay. Yeah, thank you. Okay. And do you have the date?

August 7th.

August 7th. Okay. from six to eight p.m. Okay, p.m., okay. So August 7th from six to eight p.m. I think we might have to vote on that, but that may be something that just the manager can authorize. I actually believe that would be something the manager could potentially authorize unless,

I don't know but do you see any problems with that or do you need some time for the specifics of it or I would just have to check to see what's on the calendar for the dates but if it's not in the park if it's in the parking lot I think that we should be okay with that it's the same day

We have a multitude of vendors that come. They are not charged. We don't make any money from it. And it's just a great way for them to be able to earn their brunt.

And I believe they do block off the parking for that anyway, or is it not?

We do not block those.

No, okay. No, no, no, but I mean right here because once the business hours close or, you know.

We would probably prevent some through traffic. Yeah, just right there, yeah.

The logs are right here. Yeah.

Yeah, we'll figure out a way. Okay. We'll figure out a way.

Okay, so for everyone listening, did you say that's August 7th? okay august 7th from 6 to 8 p.m they will be taking pictures of people bringing your dogs up and holding a um a drive a supplies drive for sheltered dogs so anyone out there uh listening please come on up bring some supplies to the girls so that their drive will be very successful um and thank you so much ladies

Is that the backdrop for the pictures? Yes.

We're also asking permission to hang up posters around town to raise awareness for it.

Okay. I believe that when we had, I would need to, Mr. Knight? I don't, I mean, is there any objection? Yeah, I know. No, I know. I know. I mean, I think when the town has had events born, I believe the back to school bash is an event. And so if so, I just we'll figure out how to make that work. OK, great.

We have to put it on the poster. Yeah.

If you all will get with the manager, she will be able to handle that for you because I don't. think that we need a commission vote on that I could be wrong but I don't think that we do and she'll be able to to handle that with y'all but I think it's wonderful thank you so much anyone else have any questions I think we should all come down and take a picture as well yes would you would you let us take a picture with your backdrop oh yes oh yes perfect yes oh yes yes yes I know yes I think we should get them to come up here.

My name is Addie and I'm from Troop 212. I am doing a service project and my troop noticed a lot of trash so we made some cleanup buckets that we would like to put around the community.

I think that's wonderful.

We have nine buckets left unassigned. Can you show them what the buckets look like?

They look like this, and they come with one bracket.

And then you just go like this and put it away. That is great. Okay.

Yeah, they really are.

Where would you like to place some of them?

um we would like to place one here here in the town okay um at some beaches okay and possibly accessible at parks and possibly some parks i think it's wonderful i would love it um i don't know mr knight do we need to take a vote on that since it is at some of the public parks or is that just something that the manager can approve we were mostly concerned about the beaches I think so, too. Great. What's that?

We were mostly concerned about the beaches and having clear guidance at beachfronts. That's a touchy area.

Yeah. I think it's great. I wanted something like this a long time ago, but I'm glad that I'm so I'm grateful that you're doing it. And if no one has any discussion or objection, I think the manager is going to sort of take this over with you in order to get the logistics worked out. Wonderful. Thank you so much. Now, we would like to take a picture with y'all. I actually was thinking what would be nice. We've got the seal back here and the if y'all if we had they could come up and sit in our seats up here and we can take a picture. We can take a picture behind them. I love it. Look at them running to do that. Let's let's know they are ready. You got to be a mayor. I don't know. I will. We'll get on your way. I'm really proud of you.

I was getting here and I should be brave enough to do it.

You guys can sit in the hallway, don't you think? All right, see you guys later.

This is the future. This is the future right here. Oh, but first, let's do the gavel and get everyone together to... All right, one, two, three.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

And mommies and troop leaders.

Okay. All right.

Should we take a short break for the girls to be able to leave?

No, I think we're going to keep going. I mean, it's 6.49. Thank you, everyone.

Thank you.

All right, we are gonna move on. We are now on public comment. Okay, three minutes. address your items, address your comments to issues, and if you have questions, say them all at once. We won't be stopping the time for questions.

Is it on?

Yeah.

Hi, my name is Tina Coppock. I'm from 505 Avenue B. And I would like to begin my public comment by quoting our Mayor Dingington herself. Her statements near the end of the last regular commission meetings were, and I quote, We are about to have our 250th year anniversary. This country was founded on free speech and a revolution against a repressive government. I really don't want to have a repressive regulations on our 250th." With that being said, I'd like to draw your attention to an issue that has plagued our commission meetings since Mayor Dingington was elected. It has become increasingly apparent that she wishes to silence and even remove anyone from the meeting that opposes her point of view. She's even stooped to removing people who simply laugh at a funny or ridiculous statement. This is unconstitutional under the First Amendment and has been upheld in court many times. The Supreme Court has established that the government may not prohibit the expression of an idea simply because it finds it offensive or disagreeable, a principle that applies to laughter or reaction in a public forum. In Acosta versus the city of Costa Mesa, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals established that a person removed from a city council meeting To be removed from a city council meeting, their speech or behavior must cause an active disruption. Passive or momentary outbursts such as laughter do not reach this threshold. Additionally, rules of order and decorum must be content neutral and they cannot allow laughter from some supporters while banning it from critics. It is a person's laughter makes it impossible for the meeting to continue. The chair may act, but cannot do based solely on the fact that the laughter is disrespectful or mocks a speaker. Additionally, it should be noted that the commission civility pledge cannot be forced upon citizens who make public comments. or used to remove people for voicing their opinions. In other words, we may address individual commissioners by name if we choose to do so. The court has ruled that while public boards may try to enforce civility codes that would ban any such action, that the government cannot ban offensive, rude, or insulting behavior, including laughter, simply because they find it disagreeable. In Barron v. Kolandina, the Massachusetts Supreme Court ruled that civility requirements that prohibit rude or personal remarks are unconstitutional. This means that a resident cannot be ordered to leave a public meeting for being rude, which includes laughter or mockery as a form of political expression. With all this being said, I'd like to ask the commission to support the public's right to freedom of speech, not to allow Mayor Dingington to remove individuals who are as we are protected by our First Amendment rights. I have forwarded this message to our town manager for forwarding to Chief Zander and our town attorney. In summary, I am not advocating rude behavior. I'm just saying that the public may address members of the commission individually as or a group time.

Thank you. I would like to address this. No, no, no, no. I raised this before and I agree with you as to the during the three minutes when the civilian.

Hi, my name's Lauren. I live at 326th Avenue. Lauren Hardman. I'm here to follow up. Was out of the country for a while, but I'm going to follow up. Handed out applications. Mr. Reid, have you handed in any firefighter applications yet to date? No, okay, then you need to lay off our chief for demanding and asking for more volunteers. If you can't produce one, you need to lay off. You really do. We have tried, and it is very difficult for us to be able to get volunteers, especially with the way the morale is right now, because all you're doing, commissioners, is beating up our chief, which ends up coming to us the members you need to knock it off grow up the morale stinks and here's the here's the point okay how long would you leave uh walls open in your home we still to date have walls open repairs that are not done two years two years make it happen this is our home this is where we are You don't care. That's how we feel. That's why the morale in this fire department's going down the tubes. And she makes a comment saying, hope nobody gets hired. Come on, really? So you need to lay off. Get to really good things that could be done for this town, like the ramp, Sixth Avenue ramp. That's been like two or three years now. Get some work done rather than attorney fees and lawsuits. That's where our tax money's going. Thank you very much. Last thing I would like to say is that there are several residents that have come up to me saying they wholeheartedly feel that Mrs. and Dr. Fundrow LLC want to dissolve this town. It's up to you. She's not stopping. It's up to you to shut it down. It's still, to this day, you are not doing the Robert's Rules of Order. Still, to this day. I brought this up years ago. You, you need to have it happen. It's unbelievably unacceptable. An attorney still doesn't know how to run this meeting. That's all I got to say. Thank you. Next.

roger newell 506 colony um well each one of you have an extremely difficult job as you were just told and it's up to you guys that being said i would like to thank the town manager for her presentation at the budget meeting it was precise Content was great and it seems to me that you have the tools to face the crisis that we are in today However, we need the Commission to step up and We need the commission to come up with a multi-year financial plan for capital needs, expenses, income, grants, et cetera. It seems that it's the same problems, old answers. Project estimates go way overboard, and then it has to be decided in one meeting, one vote, and then put on the taxpayers' back. Basic services for the town residents should be the number one focus. And this is the responsibility of our local government. Nobody else. Time for action is now that being said, I would like to say that in all my years in this town town, I have never witnessed an individual be constantly attacked, demeaned, ridiculed, and threatened because she cared enough to make a difference. She saw the problems early on as a citizen. And as a mayor, she exposed the gross mismanagement that everyone refused to look at for years. And I seriously doubt that there are many in this town that could take the years of abuse as the mayor has. And so for that, I thank you. I'm sure there will be a spin put on this. However, in November, if the residents want to go back to a rubber stamp government, then you know who to vote for. If you want someone who will fight for you and not cave to special interest groups, then you'll also know who to vote for. Thank you.

Thank you.

Next. J.M. Pence, 200 Riverside Drive. At the budget workshop meeting this month, mayor Dennington started in again on her personal agenda to get rid of our local fire department and push her and her push to waste taxpayers dollars on an unneeded referendum. Last year's election of the two new town commissioners sent a very direct mandate to our commission. Our community spoke loudly, decisively, and with purpose. And the result was a resounding endorsement to keep our local fire department. The future of our fire department was a central issue in last year's campaigns. Town's residents turned out in the highest voter count recorded for an off-year election in our town and overwhelmingly elected Terry Cronin and Sherry Corey, both who 100% pledged to preserve and support our local fire department. Terry and Sherry were elected with a landslide victory. The message could not have been any clearer. The two candidates who lost, Bruce Larson and Steve Walters, attacked the funding of our local fire department and did not support keeping them here loudly. They wanted to turn our fire service over to the county. Candidate Quarry, now Commissioner Quarry, did extensive research, worked with the programmer, and spent a great deal of time to develop a fire tax calculator. She sent it to everybody in town to actually be able to understand how much more it was gonna cost if we turned this fire department over to the county. Commissioner Quarry's fire tax calculator has currently been moved to the front of Truth and Accuracy Matters website. So anybody in this town can go, click on it, put their statistics in for their house, and realize that going to the county will cost them more money. A mandate carries a clear obligation. When residents vote with such clarity, it is the duty of those they elected to respect and act on that expressed will of the people. For this commission to reopen a matter the electric has settled wastes taxpayers' dollars, drains staff time, and undermines public trust. It distracts from urgent work to strengthen the various services this community has chosen to keep. Our town has clearly decided. We very clearly want to keep our local fire department. The commission's role now is to implement that mandate, the decision of the town people. and do it with responsibility and professionalism, not to second guess, try to reverse it, or insist we have a referendum. I urge this commission to stop expending time and money on attempts to revisit a question the voters have already resolved, and to instead dedicate your efforts to strengthening the local fire services our community mandated we keep. Thank you.

Next.

Good evening, Commission. Joyce Barton, 322 3rd Avenue. I'd like to start off by thanking Public Works for the pretty flowers out front of the building here. They look very nice. And I'd like to also, as an extension of that, is to ask about the two blue vases that are in Bicentennial Park. I'm wondering where those came from, who put them in, and why they're not being maintained to look pretty. I've been waiting since Christmas. There were some scraggly little poinsettias in there at Christmas time, and they've long since died. The vases are not straight, they're cockeyed. You know, these are things that are important to the beauty of our town, which is what makes our town special. So I would like some attention paid to those vases. I mean, it's shocking that they've been sitting there that long. I'd also like to just mention to the commission, sorry, my notes are a little all over the place here. I'm taking little excerpts from our article, our last article on truth and accuracy matter, and to just point out to the commission that parks here in the town are a wonderful asset to everyone. young and old, there were some comments made about senior citizens not appreciating having to pay for park upgrades. But we have resources for everyone. We have bocce ball, we have pavilions for shade, we have tennis and pickleball courts, restrooms. We have wonderful wooden rocking swings at the river and at the ocean. There's walking paths, there's the Melbourne Beach Pier that's maintained. beach accesses and crossover platforms, a basketball court, bicycle parking, golf cart parking, gazebos and girls for family gatherings, as well as age-appropriate playgrounds. So the playgrounds are one point, one thing. And this is all with police and fire patrol, all coming from our parking fees revenues. So at the workshop meeting, Commissioner Reed proposed to take money from the two paid parking funds to move into the general fund of our town budget. That is a breach of the allocation of those funds intention, which was for the beautification, safety, and accessibility of our parks. which will suffer if those funds are moved into the general fund. They were not meant to move into the general fund and they should stay where they are. So we are asking the commission to take that into heavy consideration when trying to move money around in the budget. The budget is intended to provide services to the townspeople and not to

move money around so that it can be applied to other things like legal fees thank you thank you next seeing none we will close public comment okay oh sorry come on up mark emerson 512 ocean avenue some of you know me as the idiot across the street the house with blue lights I was busy working and I was listening to what's going on. And I just, last meeting I heard something that really disturbed me and someone just brought something up earlier in public comment about not supporting the fire department. Someone said something about a referendum. I didn't prepare anything, but I can tell you that in 23 years of living across the street, I see what's going on over here. I have a different perspective. I see what's going on in the park. I watch the moms and their strollers and their kids. I watch the drunks. I see it all. You don't need a referendum. You got one in November. Every Tuesday, what is it, the first Tuesday of the month, The fire department does something in training in their driveway, and people just drive by. It's just a normal Tuesday. They do lots of stuff. They set fires in the parking lot. They put it out. They rescue fat ladies that are stuck in the swings. They do all kinds of stuff, and nobody pays them a bit of attention. When the results came in at seven o'clock on election night, within minutes of those results coming in, people driving by were honking their horns in front of the fire station. They were supporting our chief, our town, and our volunteers. I think that's a resolution. I think the people have spoken loudly with their horns. It went on all night. That's never happened before. There's your resolution.

Good night. Thank you. Anybody else? All right, closing public comment. We will move on to item eight, town manager report, page 17.

I wanted to start there is an extra handout that you all have received it is. Something yes that one. Yeah, so during the budget workshop I mentioned that health insurance for employees was very expensive. and not really great quality. And I said that there was a law that the state of Florida has where if you are a small municipality of 12,500 population or less, you can use the state's insurance plan. And I've attached that to this as well. However, Tila over there, who we contacted, Jenny and I both contacted, She runs this program, and she said that while a municipality can join the program, they cannot join the pool with the state. So the cost is still sky high because you're still looking at it. The insurance company is looking at it as, you know, 26 employees. So it really does no good. And this is something that's on the books but is not usable. She told us that nobody has used it. No municipality, no small county has used it. So three of the five of you independently contacted me about this. So I wanted to give you all the information about the law itself and the person you can contact or you can get legislators to contact to see how we can change this. I don't have a copy of it, but I know the year before, Tila would have a copy of it. She said that all the university systems in Florida were allowed to join in partnership with the health insurance, with the state employees. So there is additional legislation. There is precedence in that. But this is already a law, but it's not functioning properly. So I wanted to just provide that to you. So if you can do anything, I'm happy to help or have ideas as well.

I do have a contact that I wanted to set up an appointment with. They're just there in special session, you know, trying to work on the budget. So it's just not going to be possible until that's done. But I would love, if you were available, to try if I could set something up on this and the health care.

Okay, great, that sounds good. I think some of the folks have mentioned the beautification of the town and have seen the flowers. I just wanted to thank Tom and his public works team. They're gonna be doing some phenomenal things as well coming ahead. You'll see there's two dead trees out there because of the frost. They're going to take those down. They have already beautified, they have repainted the signs, the town of Melbourne Beach. They have reworked also the bulletin boards. They've repainted it. They've taken all the rust and gunk off of them. They look beautiful. And we're going to do some more plantings and we're going to be proud of our town. We're also going to do something. So we this is just initial for Memorial Day, but we are going to do a lot more for our 4th of July and our 250th anniversary. But I first want to start by thanking our public works team. They're very excited, engaged in doing this. So I just follow up on that.

I just wanted to follow up with what you're saying exactly and on my run today. I saw Joe and He was I stopped I said I don't stop for everybody when I'm running and he was so excited about the changes that he's made and Rickman part looks amazing and he was so thrilled that residents had stopped him and said I wow this is great and complimented him and he takes it personally as as do all of your staff but it it was remarkable and i it was just such a great way to start my day here so shout out to joe i i did just want to raise especially with it being fourth of july coming up and you know the the graffiti issue that had happened i understand that you know issue about that it was on um county property

but i guess um i'm hoping that maybe y'all can reach out to the county so that something ever happens like that again that we maybe have some agreement where we can take care of it really quickly on our own if it's possible so that you know like with with some of the protests and different things yeah you know like like you know it's one of those if it's never something like that's never really happened before but if it what happens once you get a learning experience and I don't know if that's possible, but I guess I just would like to run that by, because when we go to have other celebrations that come up, if that ever happens again, and we do have some sort of agreement where, or it's their property, but that we can cover, like if there's some atrocious graffiti that we can cover it up, because, I don't know. Anyway, it's just a thought.

but we'll look into that we'll look into that um tom will probably talk about this more but basin one the stormwater project was um you know for the most part completed last week and we were doing a final uh walk through i want to thank anna butler for um going through the project with us and seeing firsthand what you know was done talking to some of the residents there um there's one item that may need to be We're trying to figure out if it's a change order or something else once we get estimates. But from everything I can hear, the company did a really great job. The residents who live in that area are very pleased. There was an emergency stormwater repair at the intersection of 6th and Oak Street. And I think Tom can talk about that too, but it was an abandoned corrugated metal pipe under the road. that had collapsed. I showed that during the budget discussion. And the road buckled, and it caused a large dividend in the road. The costs were a little bit north of $24,500. So this will be in the new business that you'll discuss. Also, WastePro is reporting a much heavier collection volume, a little bit more than 50% year over year from last year. This is due to the frost that happened. So they said that as vegetation is growing back and rains are coming a lot of the dead palm fronds and other dead trees and things you know they're seeing it out on the street as residents take care of it however they expect our community will be cleaned up quicker than others with the large condos and commercial properties but wanted you to know that they are aware of it and they're they're working as hard as they can they try to pick these things up and clean up the town With respect to procurement, we have three procurement notices that went out earlier this month. One was an RFQ for planner services, an RFP for grant writing services, and an RFP for non-ad valorem financial services. They're due the first week of June. So if you know anyone who can provide those services or are interested, please take a look at it.

Is the planner services, is it also for a zoning official or is it just for planning? think it is just for planning uh ryan do you have more information on that are we going to have a zoning official is it not for a zoning official as well okay because that's a specific term in our code yeah okay all right so the rfp does include for the zoning official part okay good okay thank you

And then Founders Day went off very smoothly. You know, we had to close a little early because of threats of weather conditions. We sold 27 of the excess street signs, which also came with a cute little Melby coin from our police department. We raised a total of $1,555, and all the proceeds will go to fund the manatee protection devices that we put on our storm water pipes.

Was that after the cost of the, I saw a $2,000 bill for those coins.

Yeah, that came out of a different that's that's there's a lot more of it comes out of a different budget with okay, that's their challenge coins.

Okay, so that wasn't the man.

Okay, now now that's not going to come out of there.

Miss Smith, I got one of those coins last meeting we're at and was showing showing it off and people were asking me how how could you get a coin can you still get a coin and can you purchase one.

Well, we have had some interest in purchasing other signs. We just put the coin in there with the sign that came with it. So I think we're going to look. We have to go to an auction site to be able to...

uh properly dispose of the signs so we can consider maybe putting the coins with the signs that we we have to get a sign to get the coin yeah well you might want to make it like if any any bid that or that's over a certain amount that way it doesn't we don't lose money because if i don't the coins probably have something the coins the coins are with the police department so that was just a

Donation from the police department saying here put these with with whoever bids on a sign to get a coin They're not it's not like we bought the coins To to put under bid. That's not what that was.

They were just an added bonus But that $2,000 bill is that what for them to purchase those coins?

I don't have it off the top of my head. It's an invoice. We can get that. But the coins they bought did not come from the money. It came from the police department from their donations fund.

Well, this one thing I know, I know you look at me and you think I don't hang out with nerds, but I do. All right. And there are, there are coin collecting nerds out there who are very interested in these coins. So they have to buy a sign to get one.

Is that what that's, that's what I'm trying to get currently right now. Yes.

That's our highly collectible just to let everybody highly collectible.

The other option is to turn this around and put it on Chief Zander.

OK.

I'm sure he would love to give out coins to people.

I know they like to do that.

Oh, he's texting me. He said that. Oh, he texts you, really? Because I think he said he doesn't text.

That's interesting.

No, he says the coins came out of the donation account, none from the general fund. So he's confirming that.

Thank you for telling us his text message to you. That is wonderful. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Okay.

Okay, then finally I did want to mention that the safer grants have come out again so this assumes that we probably did not get the last safer grant we have not been able to confirm or deny it. But it closes June 22nd it opened 2 days ago we are probably the safer grant as you know is for fire fire departments for new positions.

or for money for volunteer departments to, you can do, there's two grants under SAFER. One is to get hired paid positions. The other one is grant money to do recruiting for volunteers. So it's actually, it's always been that way. So we could apply for money to actually give money to Chief Brown, but for his recruitment efforts. He's shaking his head saying yes. So there are two grants.

There's different options under the safer grant for funding to be spent on and volunteer recruitment is one of those items.

So you can get great money for that.

Well, the part for personnel, though, I just wanted the commission to know we are not going to pursue it this year just because we hadn't heard back from them about what happened last year. So we've made a decision not to unless the commission wants us to reverse that decision. because we would have to, we would have a match that we would have to give or provide for for the first three years. So we're at this point in deciding.

Unless you do the one for the other. If you do the one for, not for hiring people, but you do the one, you could apply for that. It doesn't require this match, I don't believe. It's not this huge amount.

That's the AFG part. chief so i and we'll we'll look at that separately but i just the bigger part is the personnel grant and we've just decided not to unless you all have unless you all say to do otherwise but i just wanted to let you know we're going to pass on it this year and that's all i have in my report okay we will um move on to the town attorney report mr knight take it away

We completed the trial yesterday with the new LLC. At the closing of the proceedings, the judge reserved ruling, which is what we expected him to do. Part of his order. by June 29th. He imposed a 20-day limit on that. So the trial is over. The case is still not over.

I thought it was June 12th, Ryan.

Sorry, June 26th. We will submit proposed orders for the court to review. Once we do that, there's really no way of knowing how long it will take to actually get a judgment from the court. Some courts do them in three months. I've had other courts where it's taken eight months just to get a judgment. So it will depend on the judge's caseload and essentially when he can get a final judgment for this case. But in any event, we did conclude trial, so that's the good news. Once we submit our proposed order on June 26th, I will provide a copy to the commissioners I Had in my notes it was June 12th at 5 o'clock by 5 o'clock did I oh Okay, thank you. Sorry

Thank you, Mr. Knight. Obviously, there's other litigation. What's next on your docket? When are you going to court again?

I don't have anything on my docket for any other cases. So at this point, not for the next couple of months.

Ryan, could you maybe... Explain to the commissioners where we are with the other case with Elizabeth Harris.

So the other thing I know about the appeal case with Elizabeth Harris is that they were working on possibly trying to request a hearing in front of the court. And the reason for that is because there have been outstanding motions, such as the motion for reconsideration. along with a few others.

thank you if there's no one else any other questions we will be moving on anything else uh okay so we're now on 10 uh the consent agenda so um i would like to pull item a with some questions so that will go down to new business um and some of the for anyone out there in the audience if you've reviewed the packet there um we do have some town board applications uh one of them did appear to be it had some missing information that probably what I mean that was critical but on our desk we did get for the benefit of the public new items that are in and I've looked at them and they're they are complete and if anyone's what it just has to do with some of the qualifications to be on the boards there was some they were left out but those are now complete so these will hit the These will hit the website soon, if you will. Yes. But I'm good with these now that I see that they are complete. Do you have these over there on the table for the public as well? Yes, there are two copies of each on the table. Okay, good. So that way, if anyone wanted to look and compare. I'd like to pull item A. If anybody else wants to pull anything otherwise, if no one has any objection, by consent, items 10B, 10C, 10D, and 10E, would pass by consent unless anyone, with the caveat that we have the completed forms now updated.

May I ask a question? Yes, go ahead. Why are we, does anyone know why we're getting another alternative, alternate for the tech board? Is that an additional one, or did we have someone step down and we didn't hear about it?

Let me double check. I don't remember how many alternates they have.

I think there always was one alternate space still open, I want to say. There wasn't, I don't think.

I could be wrong.

My website's running a little slow for me, but.

And I'm personally at a place with the tech board that I'm not entirely sure how much we need it.

So they currently have one alternate. I would need to review the establishment of that board to see if it has allowance for two alternates like most of our boards do. I could just double check that. But yeah, currently we only have one alternate.

Right. I will say, there's a couple cities that I've talked to that they're creating technology advisory boards. They've even asked for copies of our, when we created it. In Melbourne, they were looking at it, and there's a couple cities over in Volusia County that have added technology advisory boards based on our having done it. So I would hate to disband it. I think it's a great asset. I disagree. Okay. All right. We will, so 10A will move down. And can you, on 13A, we did earlier, we moved that up. 13B, we did earlier and moved that up. And then right.

Yes. I'm sorry. Did we actually vote on 13 a that's the, that's the actual agreement. Oh, okay. Sorry.

So 13, excuse me, excuse me. So, um, the proposals that would be 13 B we moved that up or no.

So the S-O-I-R-L?

No, no, 13 would be the Girl Scout troop. Yeah, the Girl Scouts did move up. That one we did. Yeah, we've already done that. Okay, so that one we moved up. So this will become, the Consent A will become, where will we move that? Will that move down to the end, I guess? I mean, unless anybody wants to do it sooner. So what would be the new number? Because they get moved around, so I need you to explain.

So if we moved it, If we moved it to the end, the next letter would have been J, unless we're considering the Girl Scouts to be totally in a different section at this point, in which case it would be I. So did we consider the Girl Scouts part of presentation?

Well, do we have somebody here for the swirl that's going to present, or they are already gone and did that?

Yeah, no, she's there.

Oh, okay, okay. So what I maybe would suggest would be, do we have the applicants that are here for that property, for Shannon? Yeah. yes okay so i would suggest if it's okay that we put them right after um uh they have them be b so we because we've got somebody from the brevard swirl and you probably would like to get going but we could but we also have somebody the walk-on item from brevard county okay assessments okay so then how about we make them see so unless there's any objection sorrel a storm water with the county b and then 200 shannon c Yes.

Does anyone oppose that? Okay.

All right. So without objection, we'll do that. Then you'll reconfigure the numbers and let us know. Okay. All right. Great. There's no objection to that. Okay. So we will go to public hearings then. This is 11A, page 41 to 43.

Did we approve the consent agenda with the page? We approved it.

We don't have to approve the consent. What you just do is you, oh yeah, yeah, we approved B through E. We did? Yes, yeah, because I asked if there's no objection to B through E, those will be approved by consent.

Okay.

Nobody objected, so I said, okay, those are approved, with the caveat that we have the completed ones now that have this. Right. Yeah, so the only thing was the 10A. So we go to public hearings. uh ordinance 2026-01 proposed edition of the employee firefighter to frs second reading uh mr knight this is your item do you do the reading part do you do we do it take a vote yes could you okay i would need a motion in a second we could see if there's any comment and then we would take a vote make a motion we approve ordinance 2026-01 a second reading second okay we have a motion a second is there any public comment seeing none all in favor say is there any discussion oh i'm off okay we have a motion and a sec we have a motion by commissioner reed a second by commissioner butler um uh no public comment no discussion all in favor say aye aye aye aye aye nay so that carries 4-1 Okay, we go to unfinished business, but there's nothing on the agenda for unfinished business, correct? 12, so we will, yep, so we will go to 13A. So we will turn it over to the swirl. Yes, come on up. And if you're following along in the packet, these are gonna be pages 44 to 75. Oh, excuse me, actually, I apologize. This is actually, but if you could, that way if there's questions. So I'll turn it over to Manager Smith to present.

Go on ahead, go ahead.

You just hit that bar. Got it.

Okay. So this is the renewal of the Save Our Indian River Lagoon Infrastructure Surtax Interlocal Agreement. In 2016, the Save Our Lagoon Program executed these with every municipality in the county. And with the tax coming up on the ballot, this was part of the presentation. This was the... meeting to get the interlocal agreement approved and if you want to join and then Start the process

And I just want to add that our town attorney has reviewed the agreement. He's okay with it. I think that you had some minor, minor wording changes.

I changed it in the ordinance. It was just the only language that changed was one of them said yes and no for the ballot language and one said for and against. So we just made it consistent. Yeah. Yeah.

Are there any questions?

I have some questions, Madam Mayor. Does Melbourne Beach have any oversight over this fund?

So we have a citizen oversight committee and one of your residents is on our committee.

Fantastic. OK. And and you mentioned earlier that we could apply and possibly get grants from this fund. Correct. Which is really nice. But it is something that the entire people vote for. It's not something that Melbourne Beach votes for. Correct. AND BY SIGNING THIS, WE'RE JUST VOICING OUR SUPPORT FOR THIS FUND, IS THAT CORRECT?

YEAH. SO THERE'S AN AGREEMENT THAT THE COUNTY WILL MANAGE THE TRUST FUND. THERE'S A BASIN MANAGEMENT ACTION PLAN CREDIT SHARING INVOLVED WITH IT AS WELL, WHICH IS A DEP MANDATE. SO IT EXPLAINS ALL OF THAT IN HERE.

THANK YOU.

Any other questions? Okay, seeing none, would someone like to make a motion? Sorry, I'm just putting the...

I'd like to make a motion to approve the Save Our Indian River Lagoon Surtax Interlocal Agreement. Second.

Okay, we have a motion and a second. Any public comment? Seeing none, any discussion? Seeing none, all in favor, say aye. Aye.

Aye.

All opposed? That carries 5-0. I can't hear you. Is your mic on, Commissioner Reid? I can't hear you. Oh, okay. Because I don't know if you're abstaining or not. Yeah, okay. But you're not red, so if you can, do it red when you vote. Okay, that carries 5-0. all right thank you so much ma'am thank you um okay so next we will go to um It's 13B, but since we moved things around, which one are we?

That'll be the stormwater assessment rate increase. Okay, which is the walk-on.

It's the walk-on. Okay, all right, I will turn that. So that's not on your agenda. It is a walk-on item. It's on the public table. It will be updated on the website, but I'm turning that over to the manager to handle.

Marie, did you want the PowerPoint up? Or not the PowerPoint, but did you want your information up on the screen?

Sure, that's fine. So I think the public can take a look at that, too. Yeah, so the public can see. That would be good. Yeah, go on ahead.

That's this walk on item that we are. OK, great.

I wanted to introduce you all to Valerie Sita, who's been very kind to share her time to be here. She's a stormwater program support specialist with the county, and she and Jenny have been very instrumental in helping us find a legally satisfied, satisfiable way to increase our stormwater assessment without having to do a rate study and without having to have a 5 year capital plan already in process. I just wanted to mention a couple things as you can see on the memo good. Yeah, as you can see on the memo. There's some result. You know some uh projects that just came up you know chariot redwood riverside at avenue b 410 riverview lane that was like over sixty thousand dollars six and oak these are not capital projects these are emergencies this is maintenance and this isn't this does not even include like patch repairs cleaning of baffle boxes or anything else but more and more we're seeing these projects come up so We really do need to raise the stormwater assessment said I don't know if you can. Scroll up to the chart the first chart there. So as I mentioned there there are 3 3 avenues by which we can raise it fairly quickly. Valerie helped us put together a plan where we can based increase on the consumer price index that's based on the US Bureau of Labor and Statistics. It's the same thing, you know, Social Security, veterans benefits and all are based off of. So we have not changed our fee since 2000. and it's been at 36 dollars per not kept up with inflation no it's so it's it's called an equivalent residential unit instead of household so our eru dollar amount has been 36 dollars we can change the dollar amount but we can't change the formula right correct right so valerie explained that to us so what uh we're proposing is to change it to to um be up to date with the consumer price index over the past 26 years. And in doing so, that would raise it to $68.90 if we're using the April 2026 CPI. What that does is, as you can see there, the total would be a little over 111,000, as opposed to 58,000, which we had collected. So this will gradually increase. In addition to that, we're also suggesting that we tie it to the CPI for the next five years and we would cap it. So every year we would do a CPI increase to the stormwater fund Um, and we would cap it at 5%. So if in any year, the consumer price index is over 5%, it would just stay below. It would stay at 5%. Yeah. So that way we won't have a huge surge at any given time, but we will then at least be keeping up to inflation basically. for prices. And as you all know, the prices of the materials, of labor, everything has been rising very quickly, and our stormwater system continues to age.

Yeah. This will actually maybe start funding our yearly sort of emergency maintenance stuff.

Yeah, so this this is a modest increase that you know Valerie helped us figure out. I also wanted to mention if you could scroll down a little further. It is lower than the Florida stormwater Association their average assessment fee. There's a should be a graph. yeah so they're the they're the uh organization for uh stormwater and state and their average assessment fee is 106 dollars and 32 cents ours would be lower be a lot lower um the corresponding this is a monthly rate that is on there those graphs okay if we were on there we would be to the left of uh melbourne there which would only be we would only be three dollars per month right so we really do need to up our fees so that we can take care of our storm water Valerie provided us a draft. If we want to have the public hearing on this July 15th, we have to mail out letters to all the residents to let them know we're looking at increasing the taxes. And then there is just a kind of a draft timeline of when we need to get things in place. So we'll be working very closely with Valerie and her office to make sure that we meet the deadlines and we don't miss this opportunity.

This is wonderful. Thank you all 3 of you for working on this. This is exactly all of the information that we in the public needed. I appreciate all of the hard work you must have put in getting this and getting this information and this is great news.

Jenny has been really helpful with Valerie. It's a great partnership. Both of them have been really wonderful. Absolutely.

Thank you, Ms. Kerr. This is really great and we very much appreciate it.

Yeah. So I don't know if you have any questions for Valerie maybe?

I do so when we were having this discussion at the last meeting or is the meeting before I can't remember there was some talk about the need of our town you know with all the all the repairs everything that's going on it would it be wise to look at the need what we really need and then decide on how much we're going to to raise the tax because Is is a is a plus of $53,000 going to make the difference when we have an emergency repair that was $26,000 we we might have 2 of those and it takes up everything you see what I'm saying is it should we be shooting higher not that I'm you know pro higher taxes, etc. But some somehow I feel like this is really not everything we need.

Well, this is something that we, I think, I agree.

You remember this conversation.

Yeah, no, I agree, but see, I think what you're maybe conflating two of them, because we're still planning on doing, I believe we have the RFP out, to be able to get a study, because there are different types of assessments that you can do that aren't ad valorem taxes, but we've had this existing one, And we basically, without doing all of that other stuff, we're still going to do that stuff, but that takes a long time. And that you can do for fire, for all kinds of other things. But it's going to take a while. This is something that we actually have to pass soon, our stormwater assessment anyway, and those go out. You'll see that soon. But this is something that just they can actually do now, bring it back to us, and it can go, you know.

Well, Madam Mayor, I understand the time frame. I understand that. It's just I'm looking at... what we bring in and is it enough is it enough for what we need for what it is necessary. Could we you said that we have to keep the formula, but we can change the dollar amount.

Yes.

So part we're also lower than any other to other town in in the county.

I think it probably has to do that what we will be yeah, yeah, I think that this current yeah.

What is the question.

So the question is you know we're we're asking to do this it seems like we're going we're low balling which is nice, I think that is it really satisfying the needs of our town is this enough to to to have money when we need it.

I wouldn't know that because I'm not familiar with the needs of your town specifically. This is an option that takes less time. You certainly still have that other option. That's up to the town. But you could get a needs based assessment. It just does take a while. You need a consultant. YOU COULD SHOOT HIGHER IF YOU WANT. BUT IF YOU BUILD IN THE CPI, YOU WILL BE LIMITED TO THAT CPI INCREASE. SO YOU COULD JUST DO IT FOR THIS YEAR. But you would have to do the mailing in the legal notice again next cycle if you wanted to raise it higher.

So Terry.

We you can't go higher is what you're saying.

Yes, we can so certainly we talked to Valerie and Jenny about this and we're going to meet our time frame. This is the option where we can do this quickly. Ryan has also advised that it has to be defendable, legally defendable, otherwise we'll get sued for just surging up with taxes. And Ryan, I mean, he's certainly certainly so he had suggested a rate study, but that also we'd have to put out an RFP. It would take time. The other option is to have a capital improvements project for stormwater for a five-year plan. We don't have anything like that, but that takes time. You need a consultant to do that, engineering services, and it takes money. There is no way for either of those two options to be done to meet the timeframe we have to to put the stormwater assessment out there. So this is a way to be able to do it in a timely manner and get some increases and then guarantee an increase of cost of living. If next year, this year we decide we want to, which I think we do want to do a capital improvements plan for stormwater and Commissioner Reed and I have been talking about how we can maybe find funding for that. We can do that and then next year, we can propose that based on our capital improvements program and the need for money exactly to your point. It's just right now we don't have the time to be able to do a justifiable job where we wouldn't get sued.

Yeah, like what you can't or we couldn't arbitrarily pick a number. And I think the idea is that by doing the cost of living and like the sort of you're tying it to inflation, It's it's you're you're tying it back to the original study just every you know, it's an option.

Yeah, there are many are just but it's up to the town then we're at a rate though.

That's that's less than half of Indian Harbor Beach. Right we're I mean less than half of Indian Harbor Beach wouldn't be defensible to say hey, we're you know, fairly comparable size communities.

Well, that's a bigger and they have a lot more commercial but yeah.

No, because they have different, their pipes are in different conditions. It's a little bit different. And in fact, they do tie it to a five-year CIP. I just talked to the manager today about that. And so they do have that program, but it is a robust program that they keep updated every year. We don't even have that. So we will be developing that.

And by the way, if somebody challenges on this, the standards are pretty strict scrutiny in terms of is it, like, did you do it arbitrarily or is it, you know, is it tight?

Ryan, can you maybe explain that a little bit better about the legal jeopardy if we don't have it properly assessed?

Yeah, so like the mayor just said in the discussion that was just being had, it can't just be an arbitrary number. At least here we have a formula with CPDI already built are going in the right direction as far as having an increase right now, and then having a great study for where you can make the determination if you want to change the impervious And then that way you have the data and the numbers to point to as the basis for either a new calculation or an even greater rate increase. Thank you.

Increasing the impervious area would be a methodology change. So you could do that on your own, but you would have to mimic the county's methodology

We would not want to do that because you would have to have your own tax department and we just have Jenny.

So would we would we find out what the rate study will be and put that into our budget discussions for 2027 or 2028?

Yeah we could we could do that if you want to do a rate study we could also do a capital improvements budget Yeah. Five year, which might be enough. That's another option. So, you know, you could. So we can run both at the same time.

Yeah. One's like a short term. We can do now. One's a long term.

You can do both at the same time. I think you're going to need to do a CIP I think that's just a wise thing so that we can plan for future funding and so that we're not taking hits just all at once. And I think that's a very responsible thing to do that I'm going to definitely be working on. But both of them are going to require funding. One will require funding for an engineering services to help us put together the CIP. The other one would be a rate expert. So if you do want to fund both, At the same time in the same fiscal year you can do that. But I I know for a fact that you all will will more than likely need to do the CIP one for for other reasons. Thank you. Any other questions for Valerie. Thank you so much.

It was so much we can appreciate you coming. Thank you all 3 of you appreciate you. I feel like you did all that work and I thought you wanted to speak. Was there anything that you wanted to add? Yeah.

no i was just going to step up and pretty much say the same thing that was being said there as to why why we're presenting it as this because the other two would take too much time and we wouldn't be able to move to move forward this year if we don't select this option yeah yeah i'm thank you so much i'm really appreciative you did great work on that and getting that to us do we need to vote yeah we're going to prove them to proceed yeah we will so would somebody like to make a motion

I'll make a motion that we allow the town manager and the finance manager to proceed with the stormwater assessment rate increased as presented.

And I would say, do we need to do a time limit? Because there is a time limit for like publishing and hearings or no, you need to you got it.

OK, we have it all.

OK, second. OK, we have a motion from Commissioner Reid, a second from Commissioner Butler. Any discussion?

None. Any public comment? Seeing none, all in favor? Aye.

All of that, I'm off. We have a motion by Commissioner Reed and a second by Commissioner Butler to approve having that go forward with the change to the stormwater as presented. No public comment, no discussion. All in favor, say aye. Aye. All opposed? That carries 5-0. Great.

Thank you. Good work.

Thank you. Thank you. Okay, where did the clerk go? Do we need to take a break for a minute? I think we need to.

I need to go to the bathroom.

Okay, we're going to just take a five-minute recess. It's 7.51. We'll take a five-minute recess, and then we'll be back on. All right, we're recessed. It's green. Oh, okay. Oh, yeah, okay. All right, I might leave it on so it catches all the whispering.

Thank you.

71. It got voted 5-0.

Yes.

And then it was a 5-0. Correct. Just tell me, always tell me that we'll take a break. Because I think he wanted a break too.

All right, we took a five-minute break. We're going to get back going so we can kind of get through. Okay, we are on agenda item 13B, which is actually 10A that was, is that correct?

Sorry, so it'll be 13C, which came from consent agenda 10A. Do we need to call roll now that we've?

Oh, yes, we do. You're right. So, Mr. Jones, could you call roll, please? Okay.

Mayor Allison Diddington.

Here.

Vice Mayor Terry Cronin. Here. Commissioner Anna Butler. Here. Commissioner Tim Reed. Here. Commissioner Sherry Corey.

Here.

Town Manager Amory Smith.

Here.

Town Attorney Ryan Knight is with us on teams. Finance Manager Jennifer Kerr. Did she already leave? Sorry, I didn't catch that. Public Works Director Tom Davis. Here. And Fire Chief Gavin Brown is leaving, and Interim Town Clerk Sid Jones is also present.

Okay, all right. We are on 13C, which is not from the original agenda, because some things had moved around. It is actually 10A that's being moved down to 10C, and I understand the individuals are here. i i wanted to hear i if they i just i wanted to hear from them about their experience and their frustration and how can we maybe is there any way we can do this better i understand i'm seeing all of these looks like there's emails about different interpretations and going on i guess i'm just kind of curious what happened we are also looking into um for our building process um and uh you know our fees and stuff and i guess um

Madam Mayor, I have to recuse myself. This beautiful couple, I'm related to them.

Oh, okay. Okay, thank you. Thank you for saying that, yes. And I'm planning to approve it, so I don't, I want you guys to be worried at all. I did just want to, in reviewing this, I am, like, what happens, and it just felt, it seems like you guys had to go through a bunch of stuff to figure it out. You were told by... you were told by the former building official something but i suspect that was not in writing and then things change and then a new person comes along and you hear something different and it's very frustrating and this is something i will say for me for years has been one of my things let's have processes and then let's put things in writing because then we have consistency so i guess i just wanted to know what like what's your takeaway for what how we could have done this better if you have any suggestions i wanted to apologize for the run around maybe you've gotten a little bit i imagine it's been a bit frustrating i've seen the property before and you know it's it's a 19 the property itself was built i own a property was in the 50s and it was built before there was any zoning restrict you know laws at all so Is there anything that you would like to say, if you would, about just the process and maybe is there something we could do better with what you've learned? I'm sorry for putting you on the spot.

No, no, you're fine. So we were initially interested in this house to remodel, and we wanted to have a garage that would fit our vehicles in. Before we bought the property, we went and had a meeting with the building official at the time and just wanted to see what our options were. He told us we could get a variance or why don't you do this? You can build your garage in front of your house. And I even said, well, I thought the setbacks had to be a certain way. And he said, no, you just have to be 15 foot setbacks. And so he gave us this information. He even drew it out for us. We didn't get anything. written in stone which doing it over again I would have done that because I think it would have made things a little bit easier so anyway well plus the building official is not the zoning official so yeah so being ignorant to the career you know you don't know yeah we didn't know what exactly what to do which is why we went to the building official to get the information and knowledge we needed um anyway so and it wasn't just that meeting we confirmed multiple meetings and was we're still giving the same information um so then we we go with our architect get the plans made find our contractor then finally we're ready to submit for permits i remember that and then all of a sudden we get told no this information you're given was wrong. And you need to do all these other things to get it right. So we went and we got the variance. We had to go to two meetings for that. Then we went to the planning and zoning. So we've been working with the town since then, trying to get all our ducks in a row, trying to do everything correct. It was just that initial misinformation we were given that has just set us back almost a year now. OK.

Yeah.

Well, from getting our permits.

Is it how could we do better? How can we prevent this from happening again? Do you think you have any suggestions?

Well, I know I feel like our circumstance was just odd because we're on a corner lot. Yeah.

Well, and it's a catty corner one, too. It's one that faces it. Yeah, it's like the front line of the building faces that both houses. Yeah, it's like that. Correct. Yeah.

so i feel like maybe if there was a little more information on corner lots specifically because if you just go on your website there's nothing about corner lots and i know a lot of um and non-conforming and sort of vested rights houses our chapter eight is blank

Yes, there's no definition. Our chapter eight is blank. Yeah, I mean, yeah. Personally, I would love if we started with ones like this, because there is a detailed opinion, but it's sort of in emails back and forth, not really, you know, if we could take this, have the zoning officials take this, turn it into a letter, and basically it's a zoning opinion for this particular issue, so we start building those up. You know, it's like other cities do have this so that people could research it and we could, you know, I don't know anyway.

Yeah. But all right. I think it was just kind of like a wrong place at the wrong time because it was like, you know, you can't stop people from changing positions, moving somewhere else. And I think it was just like a lack of everyone playing catch up.

Yeah. Well, and I mean, if yes, miscommunication. Yeah.

That's a big thing.

But I do think when you get things in writing, people do tend to think about it a bit more. And then you also have some sort of a stoppable reliance that you can sometimes use. But anyway, I apologize. I'm glad that you're going to get to build. It is a great property. Yes, thank you. We're really looking forward to it. anyway well thank you and i apologize for putting you on the spot but i just i'm reading the information i just i felt so frustrated for y'all and i thought maybe you would have some suggestions for us because we are going to be reviewing some of our processes on the for the building plans and stuff if we're going to charge more we maybe need to do better so okay thank you so much thank you uh does anybody have any questions um

I just think that beautiful baby needs a beautiful house. I know.

So this has gone through PNC. They did get a variance for what they had, too, and this has gone through PNC and gotten approved, and there are no other outstanding issues?

Yeah, this one was just approved, as far as I know, with no...

yeah well i think it required a zoning interpretation on some things and so that that's that's what there's there's a there's it looks like what it was the email between dan harper and um corey o'gorman where dan harper asked questions corey o'gorman responded so that it's he keeps saying my interpretation is this and he's our zoning right so correct okay so and so that's i mean it's approved so if there's no other objections i would entertain a motion to approve it

I make a motion to approve the site plan for 200 Shannon Avenue.

Okay, I need a second. Second. Okay, we have a motion and a second. Any discussion? Any public comment? None? All in favor say aye. Aye.

All opposed?

nay okay uh okay that carries uh three one all right with one abstention and you'll have to do the uh yeah okay you're like afraid you're gonna say anything you're all the way in the back well let's step down okay we will move on that thank you very much and i'm sorry for your having to okay um uh Oh, so what is our new, because we're all moved around.

So we are on 13D, which is the consideration of painting the beach cabanas and car stops.

Okay, so we're on 13D, which was the original 13C. And I'm sorry, ma'am, that you had to wait around. Thank you.

That's okay.

Jeanette Soucy, 216th Avenue, chair for the Parks Advisory Board. You guys were gracious enough to approve us potentially getting the fire hydrants painted on Ocean Avenue contingent upon the town of Melbourne or city of Melbourne approval, and that was denied. So we- City of Melbourne. Well, they're required by law to be yellow. So we understood why. So the Parks Board would like to ask the town commissioner if we could paint the car stops in Rickman Park in red, white, and blue, and also the beach cabanas in red, white, and blue. I think that's cool.

All right.

May I? Yes, go ahead. Tom, didn't you say those beach cabanas are ready to fall down?

They're ready.

so i don't know if we if it's safe to have uh people painting on them i'll double check they can have one plan this will be their burial yeah well they we're gonna send them out with a bang yeah but it would be our staff painting it correct yeah i mean it's not it's not

Oh yes.

Yeah. No, thank you.

If you need any help, the Parks Board will be happy to help.

I also think that we probably need to do it that way, especially if the structure is, if there's a question about the structure, I don't know that we want volunteers doing it on their own. It might be dangerous, but whereas, I don't know.

If we have a question about the structure, we should be using them at all.

If it's dangerous and we were discussing health insurance, I don't know if we should have staff do it either.

I don't know that they're going to be finding that. So Tom, do you think this is a doable thing? Yes? OK.

If I try to hook a duck to a train, you can hook him up. It'll be done.

Wait, what? Say that again.

I tell you that a duck can pull a tree, just hook him up because he will. Okay. So, yes, ma'am. Okay, good. That's a country saying yes, ma'am.

And do you think it is safe enough for you to be able to do it?

I would mark them off if I thought. Okay. They're just patched up. They're a poor reflection on Ocean Park.

Yeah.

do you think it will be have you looked at the area do you think that painting them if it's not if they're not in great shape i i i think it would at least add to making our town a very patriotic town for the fourth of july i love it 250 celebration and again I DON'T THINK HE WOULD ALLOW US TO DO IT. IF IT WASN'T SAFE, I COMPLETELY PUT TRUST IN TOM AND THE STAFF TO MAKE THAT DECISION AND THEN WE CAN REALLY SHINE.

I LOVE IT. I THINK IT'S GREAT. DO WE NEED A BUDGET FOR THIS? DO WE HAVE A BUDGET? THAT WOULD COME OUT OF PARKING MONEY.

Yeah, it would come out of the Ocean Park.

Ocean Park, which is.

Yeah, well, they also have the side money, too, or I guess that's going to the well, the manatee. Yeah, manatee. Yeah. But do you do you all have money in your budget from last year?

No, no, not that I'm aware of.

Because we had funded it with $500 last year. Each one got $500 from the sale of the signs last year. I don't know, but they've gone through a. Yeah. Would we need an estimate of how much we're going to need for this, though? Because we don't know. We were approving it, but we were approving it essentially without a budget. I would imagine it would be less than $5,000.

Up to, it would fall, in my opinion, in fact, no reservation. It would fall under purview of the management authority.

So do we want to approve it up to a certain amount, which would be under the $5,000, or do we want to approve it and she has the anything under $5,000? Y'all need to make a motion, so how do y'all want to structure that?

i'm just raising the idea that if you you might be able to give us idea of how much you think it might cost and we could give you a buffer my thinking is correct me if i'm wrong any of you that it's been there but i believe mayor and i'm completely happy if the what we're saying hey Jeanette's asking, hey, you do it. You guys say, yeah, and say, okay, public works will do it. You can do that without a vote even, I believe. But at any rate, whichever way you want to do it. It will be well under the $5,000. If you guys want to set the $5,000 amount,

Well, or we might want to set lower is what I'm saying. I don't know, but that's why I'm just trying to get an idea. We're not paying labor because we've got the staff, but there might be some supplies we need to purchase, or I don't know.

I would just say set it to up to $5,000, and we know it's going to be lower. We just don't know exactly what it's going to be. Okay. And, you know, Tom and I will manage that. Yeah. Go ahead, Vice Mayor.

So a question, Ms. Smith. When we were talking about the fire hydrants, we were talking about enlisting artists and giving them a chance to to show their chops. Are we going to do the same thing for the car stops? Are we just doing uniform painting?

IT'S WHATEVER YOU GUYS WOULD LIKE. WE JUST BROUGHT IT AS A SUGGESTION. SO IF YOU, WE CAN ASK THE TOWN IF THEY WOULD LIKE TO, AGAIN, THERE'S A LOT OF CAR STOPS. ARE THEY GOING TO SUBMIT A DESIGN FOR EVERY SINGLE CAR STOP OR ARE WE JUST GOING TO SAY AS LONG AS IT'S WITHIN THE RED, WHITE AND BLUE THEME AND IF IT'S NOT APPROVED THAT THE TOWN HAS THE RIGHT TO COVER THEIR DESIGN?

yeah and also note you cannot paint the blue has to remain at all handicapped yeah oh yes yes yes i think she's talking about just the stops a little concrete just just the concrete yeah those those both yeah yeah oh yeah yeah yes and they are worlds yourself so i i like the idea well here's what i think because they're like you said there are so many of them i like the idea of we authorize up to five thousand dollars for to do the um to do the you know the and all of the stops, and we take a certain number of stops where we say we're gonna have designs for these, because that way, if we do it, we don't have forever in time, and there is some coordination that would be required in getting people to submit designs and stuff, But this way, we would have that part available, but we would have Public Works working on all the other ones. So come July 4th, we'll have a lot of it done. What if we don't get a lot of entries? Then the park could do the rest. I mean, I

I honestly did not count how many car stops there were. I imagine there's probably close to 70, but I could be off. So let's say 10 of them. We can just say, artists, if you'd like to come forward and submit a design.

we can say hey if we get 50 applications great we'll do it but we let's anticipate the fact that we might not get that many and that public works will be doing a bunch of them because they need to sort of factor that in their time planning i think right so we will get it rolling so we'll we'll get as many as that we do and then they'll know how many that they're going to be responsible for i think what do y'all think and and you just what do you think yeah tom editorial no i'm good with that okay

Because this is our 250th anniversary, this is not like 4th of July and we're done. I want us to be stellar for the whole daggum year. I agree. I agree. And the flowers today... Was just one example of how stellar... Yes, one example. And we're getting that from money you've already given us. We're operating out of our grounds maintenance and stuff. And the manager... she's a marine wife, she better say this, but she supports us. We have a lot of old guys like me and your daddy and really respect that. So that's why we're going on. And so I have no problem painting those down because leave my collar more hopefully down. So there there is a method to our madness. We're kind of coordinated. Yeah, good with that.

Well, I mean, I'm just since you're going to it's going to be what what do you think is the best route in terms of us making a vote? What's what would be your suggestion like so that you'll have the authority to do what you need, but the two you working together with a budget or coordinators?

Yeah.

OK.

more than cover me for the ocean okay I'm very comfortable with that the curb stops will probably use heavier traffic paint on those that we do the striping with so that could run up but 2,000 max in on that for materials. Now, I'm not doing my labor formula.

I do have contacts with a striper, Burton Asphalt. You better.

I do. She has some of them all.

That works for Burton Asphalt, who put in these four parking spots. And he's also in Melbourne Beach. Yes.

Yes, ma'am. Give me a couple grand for that if you want to.

And we will try to remedy that cost with a donation.

So, Tom, how many cabanas do we have?

Oh, gosh.

With picnic tables?

Yeah, about. We've had to tear two down. I have a picture on my phone.

I was going to say, I have six in my mind.

I had six when I looked. Yeah, it was just there.

So could we take one and make it a base white and then have an offer an artist maybe to do some type of a film on one instead of car stops?

We'll make it...

I think that's a great idea. The most predominantly west, southwest cabana that would be the closest to the street. I think that would be a fun way to do it because I know that some of the artists that have been doing some of the wall art throughout Brevard County, I think they would come up with something pretty awesome.

I ALREADY HAD AN ARTIST REACH OUT TO ME WHEN WE WERE ORIGINALLY THE COMMISSIONER HAD APPROVED THE FIRE HYDRANT. SO I ALREADY HAVE AN ARTIST THAT WAS VERY INTERESTED.

SO THAT WOULD WE HAVE TO GIVE OTHER ARTISTS THE OPPORTUNITY OR JUST GO WITH THAT ONE?

I THINK THAT WOULD BE A GREAT IDEA TO GIVE OTHER.

WOULD IT BE A FREE?

I THINK THEY WOULD HAVE TO SUBMIT A PLAN. I THINK THEY WOULD HAVE TO SUBMIT THEIR DESIGN.

but they wouldn't charge us to do it.

And we would keep it up all year. We would let them know this is, if you would like to do this, this is on you, which is what we had done with the fire hydrants.

I think that would have a bigger artistic impact than, I mean, we could paint our stops. We could do one row red, one row blue, one white. but make one of the cabanas a spectacular artistic feature.

Yeah, I love it.

And make sure that it's very sound because it's got to last a year. This will be their burial paint, believe me, if you guys are... Yeah, and we could guarantee them maybe either... What color are they now? I know at one time they were different colors. I can't remember what color they are now. they're blue and they're blue and teal kind of they're teal they're mostly so maybe we could just provide a white canvas if they needed it yeah yeah that's what they want and that would be a very artistic yeah piece okay

And we could submit that out on our website.

Yeah.

And just let the word go out that way. And once we get some designs in, we can meet and present them. Would you like those presented and approved by the commissioners?

I don't know if we have time. Yeah, I know. We need to get it.

Or would we be allowed?

think so and it looks like we were going to do yeah tom and uh yeah and the parks board yeah okay we can just do it i'm i'm comfortable with the parks board and the manager and tom deciding because you guys have a public meeting and people from the public can go and you know okay i'm comfortable with you guys can handle it and approve it we just need to give amounts that we can approve and then if you need more you come back with but i feel like that's to me yeah we would need to vote on that I do think because it's town property and it's a change and there's a mount that we probably should make a vote because it will give them cover too. Okay.

Just a thought too. If we have this artistic feature and it's really fantastic, we should have an unveiling event.

Oh, I like that.

Right? Something to think about. Any reason to have a party is good in Melbourne Beach.

I make a motion to I make a motion to approve the artistic painting of one of the kiosks, what do we call them? Cabanas. Cabanas, sorry, in Ocean Park, and throw that out to the public to bid for the right to be able to do that as a gift kind of to the town, and with a cap of $5,000.

For the remaining cabanas?

Remaining cabanas.

For the town to paint?

Town to paint.

And car stops?

Supplies, yeah. And car stops.

Okay. And supplies. second okay we have a mo and for the it for them to be able to approve it they don't need to come back to us on designs yeah correct okay yes all right uh we have a motion and a second is there any other discussion any public comment seeing none all in susie oh sorry come on up

Your car stops, I believe, are only along Rickman Park. There are no car stops in Ocean Avenue. So when you're counting that, it's all there. But there's the town ones. The ones that are here, but there's none in Ocean Park.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. All in favor, say aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. All opposed? That carries 5-0. On this point, you talked about murals. You know, we have on your public works building, there's that big wall. I know it's not as seen. It's kind of around there. But that is, we talked a few years ago about murals, and there was that building that had gotten built. Do you know what I'm talking about? Well, or it's like, yeah, I mean, like, it's a big wall for a mural at some point, if ever.

I don't know.

It was years ago, but that might be something where you could do a 4th of July, you know, 250 years sort of kind of mural, you know? Anyway, if you wanted to think about it, since we're doing the others, it's a big canvas right there, so... yeah yeah i mean i think having a really cool cool on your on the building there would be neat and it is a big it's a big swath so i just wanted you to think about it with the other but um okay all right we will move on thank you miss lucy we appreciate it we appreciate you you've had several items and a lot of work and we appreciate it thank you for all your work thank you uh okay all right so now we are on what is my what is my it's old 13d but it is now 13 e okay old 13 d is now new 13 e which is amending the motion to approve the 10 000 for staffing page 78 to 79 i'll turn it over to ms smith to present town manager

Yes, thank you very much. Last month you approved $10,000 for staff training out of the same budget the employee survey came out from. Unbeknownst to me, it came out of the legislative budget and we don't have $10,000 in that. Jenny caught that and she said that it needs to come out of the operating account and so we just need to make that technical change.

What do you, out of the operating account?

General account.

Oh, okay, sorry. Okay, yeah.

So basically you just need a motion to take that $10,000 out of the operating account. Correct. That's it. So just so a different pocket second.

Was that a motion or what question? Oh, sorry. I didn't hear the words question. Okay. We have a motion and a second to make this minor technical change for a budgeting purpose. Is there any discussion? Any comment? seeing none all in favor say aye aye aye all opposed nay i'm just voting against it because i'd voted for on the reason so um for the last time so uh but I do agree that you need to do it the right way. Okay, now we are on 13 old item E, which is now... 13F. F, yes, which is... Your public hearing, Mr. Drake, correct? This is consideration of a request to remove the electric street light near 604 and replace it with a solar street light public works director. Are we not at the public hearing part yet?

We...

Oh, okay. Okay.

And we got the blessing of our building official.

Okay. Okay.

And as we and council, if you interrupt me, if I'm right, all we need is your approval to say it's okay to do it. And according to council, then. manager will then sign a letter saying hey it's okay to take it forward that to mr drake a copy and the lady at fdl and it's done deal that is what i thought that yeah great all we need really great okay isn't approval to pursue taking that light down and mr drake installation of the solar equal to actually greater lumens in existence

Okay. Mr. Knight, I have a question because I do, Faneu owns a house that is in this little area. Do I need to recuse on this? Because it's not an annexation going on, but I will, but I need you to tell me. No, you do not have to recuse yourself.

This is just authorization from the town to send a letter.

Okay. Okay, I didn't think so, but I did want you on the record. Okay, so the attorney has said that I do not need to recuse on this because it's just sending a letter. Okay, great. All right, would you like to come up?

Yeah, I know, I bet you don't.

Would somebody like to make a motion? I make a motion to request the manager to sign the letter needed for the power pole to be replaced, for the electric power pole to be replaced by a solar light fixture of same, is it candle? IT'S ACTUALLY THE LIGHT. MY NAME IS DAVID DRAKE.

THE POLE THAT SUPPORTS THE LIGHT THAT'S CURRENTLY THERE IS

SUPPORTS AN ELECTRIC WIRE. THIS ALL STARTED TO REMOVE THE ELECTRIC WIRE. ONCE THAT LETTER GETS SENT, FPO WILL START AND SEVERAL MONTHS FROM NOW THEY'LL REMOVE THE ELECTRIC WIRE. AT THAT POINT, THE TOWN HAS AUTHORIZED THEM TO REMOVE THE LIGHT, WHICH WILL THEN HAVE NO POWER. AT THAT POINT, WITH THE HELP OF TOM, I WILL SHINNY UP THE POLE AND ATTACH A SOLAR LIGHT. WHICH IS OF HIGHER CANDLE POWER THAN THE CURRENT LIGHT IS. I'VE SHOWN YOU THAT BEFORE, BUT I CAN SHOW YOU THAT AGAIN IF YOU LIKE.

SECOND THE MOTION. WE HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND. ANY DISCUSSION?

I HAD A QUESTION. So I understand he's offering to put a light up. So currently the way the situation is now is that that light stays on all the time, you know, goes, runs through the night. Solar lights typically run out of a battery before before the dawn. Plus, if it stops working, undercurrent, the way it's set up now, if it stops working or is damaged in a storm, FPL comes out and will take care of it. They will fix it, repair it, whatever. I guess, are you also agreeing that you're gonna provide that same level of service in perpetuity to maintain that light so that it stays on all the time? and then secondly um that's you know if you no longer own the property then um how how then what happens so i don't maybe we need to have a lien on the property that always goes forward that that light gets maintained continuously because that's what fpl will do hit the button david david yeah well this is

Mr. Reid, I'd be happy to charge the town to maintain the light the same way that FPL does. I'm also happy to donate the light and to make sure that it works. If I die, I bequeath the light to Tom.

Thank you.

Tom, if you die before me, I will sit under the light and toast your memory.

I don't really think it's a big deal.

I don't mean to make a laughing joke of it. People have expressed their concern for light and safety as they walk down the street. That's fine. I wanna go on record as saying that all the neighbors, except the mayor, because she didn't wanna get involved, SIGNED THAT IT WAS A NUISANCE AND SHOWN INTO THEIR HOUSE AND WAS NOT NECESSARY. I UNDERSTAND AND WE'RE ALL GOOD WITH THAT. SO YOUR STATEMENT THAT SOLAR LIGHTS DON'T LAST AS LONG AS ELECTRICAL LIGHTS, I GUESS BY DEFINITION IS TRUE, BUT THE BATTERY ON THE SOLAR LIGHT LASTS FOR MORE THAN 12 HOURS, WHICH IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA IS ALWAYS GOING TO BE ON DURING it's triggered by the light of the sun. So I don't think that the company that I bought the light from would have any business if they were putting out an inferior light. If you wanted to have a light to your liking, you should have given me the specs. All I did was outdo the candle power.

I don't think you're misunderstanding me. I'm looking to ensure that the light is functioning from now on, just as it is ensured right now under the situation we have now. So there was an alternative solution for this, and that would have been to underground the power to the light. And then you would... you wouldn't have the, I guess it's the aesthetic value of the THE WIRE THAT IS BOTHERING YOU. IT'S RUNNING ON AN EASEMENT. WE HAVE MULTIPLE PROPERTIES WITHIN THE TOWN WHERE THE POWER LINES RUN THROUGH THE BACKS OF PEOPLE'S YARDS AND THE POWER COMES OUT TO THE LIGHT POLES. MANY OF THOSE PEOPLE HAVE POOLS IN THEIR HOMES. THE STREET LIGHTS DO PROVIDE A PUBLIC SAFETY ASPECT. UM PEOPLE ARE OUT WALKING THEIR DOGS EARLY LATE KIDS BIKES UM I BELIEVE THE LIGHT NEEDS TO STAY UH I FROM THE BASICALLY FROM A PUBLIC SAFETY PERSPECTIVE AND I'M LOOKING AT FOR A WAY THAT WE ENSURE THAT IT REMAINS WORKING

I would like to say I appreciate Commissioner Reid's comments and opinion because it is like, We should not set a precedent of sort of abandoning things and then not having the, like, perpetuity of the future. Because, you know, there was this issue that came up with the dock before. Now, like, that is a huge issue. So I do, I thank and I appreciate Commissioner Reed's thinking about that. I will say, though, this part, you know, the streetlights and stuff, generally cities, they have them on high-traffic areas, so you're going to have, like, oak, you know, like that. I do personally know this area. I see this light a lot at night. It literally provides hardly any light whatsoever. And that Alden, it services five houses. There's five houses. That's it. It probably services fewer houses. There may be one street in town that services fewer houses. I'm not sure. So it's unusual. So I don't think that we are setting a precedent, because I think that the circumstances like this of happening again anywhere else in this fact pattern is so unlikely. So I don't think we're setting a precedent. Other street lights that are in higher traffic areas that service more houses are different, I do believe. And this is, you know, it's, anyway, so that's, but I do appreciate your thinking about the point of setting a bad precedent. I JUST DON'T THINK IT APPLIES IN THIS CASE. THAT'S ALL I WAS GOING TO SAY. DID YOU WANT TO?

TO SAY YOU'VE NEVER BEEN TO MY HOUSE. YOU DIDN'T SHOW UP TO THE PROPERTY TO SEE WHERE THE WIRE IS. THE REGULATION, DO YOU KNOW WHAT THE REGULATION IS FOR A WIRE TO BE ABOVE A POOL?

I ASSUME YOU HAVE A BUILDING PERMIT TO BUILD YOUR POOL. IF IT WAS IN A POSITION THAT PREVENTED THAT, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE ISSUED THE PERMIT.

and no one has measured the height of the wire. Be that as it may, the wire is right on It's obvious that if the wire comes down in the middle or from either end, that it's likely to go on my side of the wall that was built and therefore in the pool. So I think it's a hazard. I'd rather not get there. I don't want to go there. I would like the wire removed. In order to get the wire removed, the light becomes inoperable.

As I said before, there was an alternate solution that you could have had the power undergrounded.

To the tune of excessive $7,000. um maybe i don't know what i don't know what it costs and i think probably i do i've done it can i finish my thought if if you're gonna say things that make sense rather than blanket statements that don't have any they don't have any basis i don't want us to get into an argument we do have a motion in a second yeah we do have a motion did you want to call the call them

Call the question? Yeah, do you want to call the question? I would love to call the question.

All right, so we have a motion and a second. Thank you. And public comment? I don't think we had any. Do we have public comment? Yeah. Come on up.

Hi, Tina Coppock, 505 Avenue B. I've been in this position where I had a pool built and there was a power line above it and I buried it. I was forced to bury it. There really wasn't I wasn't given the opportunity to put a solar light in or anything like that. And I've spoken with the gentleman, and we're not necessarily at odds. I'm happy with a solar light being there. But I agree with Mr. Reid that we need to make sure that if a solar light is put in, it is maintained and kept lit in the event of a storm or if it wears out. I mean, things don't last forever. These five or six houses you guys keep talking about are not the only people who walk their dogs or bicycle or, you know, especially when the time changes and it gets really dark really early. IT NEEDS TO BE LIT AND POWER POLES AND LIGHTS WERE NOT PUT UP AT RANDOM. THEY WERE PUT UP FOR REASON. WE NEED TO MAINTAIN THEM. I LOVE HIS SOLUTION TO PUT A SOLAR LIGHT THERE. I AGREE WITH MR. REED THAT WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT AT SOME POINT EITHER THE TOWN ABSORBS THAT OR WE DO SOMETHING TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT SOLAR LIGHT WILL BE MAINTAINED IN THE FUTURE. I DON'T KNOW HOW LONG SOLAR LIGHTS LAST. IS IT 20 YEARS, 5 YEARS, 10 YEARS, WHATEVER. And I did bury a power line for my pool at a very expensive cost because you not only have to bury it, you have to put it in the conduit, then you have to have another inspection, you have to do all... It is a pain in the butt to bury the power line. So if a solar light is a good solution, then... Let's go for it, but let's just make sure that it's going to continue to work. And not just because five or six people in that neighborhood say, we don't want the light. They're not the only people who use the streets. These are public streets, and everybody walks, their dogs walks, rides their bikes around, not just the people who live in those few houses.

Thank you. Is there any other public comment? Seeing none, all in favor, say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Nay. Aye.

still waiting on one aye okay that carries 4-1 thank you uh i would like to say i think we should create a process now um because there was not a process for this gentleman to utilize and i do believe he did a bunch of research i would love for you to propose that because we shouldn't be confronted with issues where there's no process and we work through it and it's an issue then we just forget about it until five or you know ten years later when it comes up again let's create a process so i hope that will happen thank you mr drake i'm sorry for all the frustration i appreciate your patience and coming every month um and how you've handled it i believe you've handled it very well and thank you i appreciate the time i'm working with um Well, we already voted and it's, you know, but I would love to get your sort of research with the manager so that maybe she could start working on a process so that if this ever happens again, we actually have a process to follow. And it's not your fault that we didn't have one for you to utilize, but I'm glad that it all worked out and I appreciate your patience and your effort and time.

Just an FYI, he's already communicated back and forth with forms. It's a work in progress.

Yeah, great. And so hopefully, Mrs. Coppock, because of this, we will actually have a process that we can follow. All right, thank you. Yes, go ahead. Okay, I thought she was right, but I wasn't gonna speak on anything. Every once in a while, I get it right. Thank you. I thought if I speak on this and correct you, they'll kill me, but I'm just gonna shut up.

So the 12th is the date that it's required to be in, or that's when the town is planning to submit?

That's when, go ahead. I'm not...

all right uh okay um we are on um original 13 with mf which is 13 g correct yeah okay approved payment for emergency repairs at oak street and 6th street public works director tom davis page 82 to 84.

Any questions on that would you like a brief description on what happened just an FYI? We it's not a bad Because we're dealing with a lot of potential Pipes that old pipes like that that are abandoned if they were not properly sealed This is what happens and that was the case here when that pipe was abandoned probably during 2017 Oh seven. Okay. Instruction. Okay. They sealed the ends, but did not pump it full of grout. Had they done that? That's we would never have. Yeah.

Um, how does this happen like that though? That there is, I know it's forever ago, but where there's, or do we not have like a compliance check for projects like that then? Because that's kind of a big deal. How this, this could happen. Do we not check these things off to make sure that is. And I was curious for the, Mr. Knight, are there any statute of limitations that are like, because, you know, statutes are usually like one year, three years, five years, seven years, ten years for various different things. But there's, like, there's discovery stuff, you know, rules. So since this is covered, is there a statute of limitations for this issue potentially for us to go back on whoever did this? Because if somebody was injured, I mean, that could be, it was kind of a big deal, right? So, Mr. Knight. Yeah. So what year was this installed? He thinks it was around 2007.

I think it was 07, I think, counselor.

We just discovered it. It was covered over, so concealed. Is there any kind of tolling for when something's covered over?

So you have a statute of limitations, but then you also have a statute of recodes.

Yeah, which is usually 20 years. Even if it's a covered condition like that, all the way underground, concealed? No?

Okay.

Got it.

Okay. Okay.

Inspection checklist.

Yeah.

And you're pretty sure that it's probably at least 10, 20 years old? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So I was going to say, because if there was any question, we might look. Go ahead. It did.

THANK YOU, MADAM MAYOR. MR. DAVIS, THAT'S JUST ONE CORNER OF MELBOURNE BEACH. COULD THIS BE GOING ON AT 5th AVENUE, 4th AVENUE, 3rd AVENUE? I THOUGHT THE SAME THING.

I'M LIKE, OH, MY GOD, THIS IS GOING TO BE REALLY BAD.

JUST BELOW YOUR HOUSE. that issue with the road failing at Coral?

Well, no, there's one right by my house. Coral's a little bit farther down. There's one by my house, but I can tell you exactly who that little patch is. That was AT&T, and I have a video of them doing it, and I said, I don't think you're supposed to be cutting under our road. If something happens to the road right here, I'm going to show this video. Oh, good. Yeah.

We repaired it once and I think it's gone again.

Yeah, I think they they dug 5 feet down can we get back to the topic of hand here.

Yeah, but what I was asking is is could this possibly happen at every little corner and and and did they maybe not fill the pipes at every other corner.

I thought that yeah, you have a day that could yeah, yes, and they're in just a sidebar is the Main driving force but behind us asking to up our maintenance money, which is in fact what that is, right? You know and that's why Sure on the stormwater. Yeah, it'll go to you being able to fix these And hope me and hoping someday bond money will replace it ahead of time at any rate Yes, and that's very I want to manage. I'm very concerned. There's no doubt. Those are around town And that just emphasizes, like Basin One, contractors were excellent. The manager, his super or his guy on site, we met almost every morning. I made a point to drive up there. We need to lay eyes on them. I feel the town as the client has a responsibility for me or whoever's in my place. The manager and I have talked about go up, drive, look, and they'll talk you through that project. And they'll educate you because they know why you're there.

Yeah. So do you take when you do these when they're doing work? Are you do you take some pictures of completion so that we have a file with pictures? Because we really ought to have that going forward.

We could.

But I think we have a town that has a camera that we pay like for. Yeah. I do think that if you're going and doing inspections of looking at stuff, you ought to take pictures and we ought to have a file where we have our own pictures of areas.

Yeah. Well,

Could I ask a question about the invoice? Yep. On page 83, the equipment has a markup of 7.5%. Yeah. And on page 84, there's another markup of 10% at the top. And then a little further down, under subcontractors, there's another markup of 10%. Is that standard?

In fact, not defending these guys, I'm surprised they went 7%. 10 is usually just bare minimum. So they can mark up.

Quite honestly. So the equipment markup is why?

Well, I think it's because it was such an emergency and they had to deploy, I mean. That's the way they pay for their equipment.

Like if you notice how he breaks down his manpower. This is the format that he breaks down his man hours per se and actually shows you their salaries. You didn't used to get any ways near this fine.

We would get like, I know when we, when we had that Riverside one, the detail was, there was no detail like this on that Riverside.

Excuse me.

This company's really good. Yeah, they are. If we could go direct with them, they deal 20%. cost plus 20 across the board when they have to bid jobs you got a huge expense so this company atlantic development of coco yes ma'am bids the whole thing with a cost plus 20 so what we're looking at is the cost actually uh like the basin one that's why their bid was i would see They bid cost plus 20 and that generally beats a lot of other companies.

I think they're doing a great job.

So the markup on this is about $1,000. So you're saying that's that's okay.

Using the equipment, the equipment.

And then I don't know on the on the back, there's another 276 and then there's another 150.

There is a pro rate, as I understand it. Like if I buy a piece of equipment a bobcat and i it's take the price of it and the cost you extrapolate that out over the years of use and that rate is them recovering wear and tear on their uh on their equipment their use i guess so they're charging us for the use of their equipment

yeah that's why yeah even though they're charging us for the hours that they're using it they're going to charge us another where seven and a half percent because they're using the equipment they yeah okay and that's standard in the industry is what you're saying i think he's saying it's a little lower for those companies right but it's standard to do yeah these yeah i never used to see this broke down

the first time. Brewer doesn't do that.

Remember that patch on Riverside? Yes. All we got was like, it literally had like one item and it's like $30,000. And I was like, where's the information?

I can get you more breakdown.

No, I was just wondering.

Well, I'd like to, only so you'll be informed. you know what i'm saying since hopefully we're moving forward yeah no i think i just wanted to i'm good yeah so i'm good with it it was an emergency we had to have it it was good it had to be done i had a question commissioner reed i know i'm driving you nuts getting off target

Go ahead. The try to make us understand what the the repair action tale there is the invoice says as a storm replacement. So what failed was an abandoned storm pipe right correct. So that was not a part of our operational stormwater management at this time? No. What failed, okay. So they just went in and removed the old failed, that had collapsed, right? And filled and repaved.

Well, they also had to seal the ends on the, it's hard to explain. When they did the work in 07 or whatever,

Was that like the Pedway project, when they did that for the whole oak? Can you let him finish, please?

They had to literally go in and rebuild, to save the box that that pipe was coming from before, they took it out, cut the end, and partially sealed it. They had to rebuild the side of that concrete box.

That box is part of our current stormwater system, the operational system?

Coming off from the box itself. The box was in good shape. It's just that pipe, the way they had removed it. They left a hole. Okay. Because I lived there, I saw it over the years, the dip created, Commissioner. And now once we opened it up and I got down in and looked what was happening, Not only was that roadway going, but that dirt was filtering down in where they had cut the pipe and not sealed it. So that box was actually filling up with dirt from the roadway.

There was also a manhole that they had to remove. The manhole thing, yeah. I have a couple pictures. There was a manhole. They just filled it with dirt. It went down, what, like five feet or something like that. And so, I mean, it was a mess. But I went on site, and I have a couple pictures if you all want to see. Gotcha. that i took pictures of them you know replacing it um and what they removed and i showed you that picture during the budget uh presentation of what they removed out of there where they only filled it partially with the concrete and they didn't fill it the rest of the way and that's why that failed So, you know, it was a fairly, it was a fairly, you know, sizable production and they did it, what, in a couple days?

Oh yeah.

Yeah, it was done in like a, it was done quick time, kind of like the Melby thing. So, you know, it was, I can show you guys these pictures.

I appreciate them being available and getting it fixed because it was, that's a big high traffic area. They're a good company. Yeah, yeah.

But that one by your house, the big one, Coral, that's not on our ticket.

There's one around the corner. There's a small little one. The small little one is AT&T. I can get with you later and tell you exactly when it happened because I have some notes. Are you ready for a motion? Yes, we are.

One last question. I'm still getting at the likelihood that there's more problems like this. Do we have the technology or way to scan roads so that we can know that there's closed pipes down there that are falling apart or that have been abandoned or do we know do we have a map of abandoned pipes that we know that probably not right.

We don't we know you know the surprises we found in every job based on one. We found it yeah, okay. I wish.

But that is a good question, though.