Board of Commissioners - Regular Meeting

Thank you for this day, Lord, and ask for your protection.

And Lord, we just want to do a special ask this morning for the unfortunate accident last night, yesterday afternoon on the river.

And Lord, we just ask that you be with that family today. their loved ones and what we just ask that you give us a guidance put us under a hedge of protection here today Lord helped us as a board of members of Columbia County and make proper decisions for the best in the future of our county Lord we just ask that these young children today that's coming forward to us that are so proud for their accomplishments we pray that in their endeavor in the next few weeks that you'll be with them and guide them and yes sir

we would like to add four items. I apologize for their delay. Uh, we received just a couple of days ago, a release of lean from the ship program. Uh, they need it quickly because they're trying to close on the house and they did not get us the release of lean sooner. We have, uh, request on the cdbg housing award we're on a limited time we've got three months until it's expended we got one more house we can do they want to go ahead within your housing assistance plan but to increase the award amount from 80 000 to 160 000 for the house at 209 southwest fabian way uh we had talked previously and got approval to apply for the florida division of historic resources special grant category for the old richardson high school and we just wanted to bring it back and make sure that the board's still on that and then finally it's just a discussion of our future meeting space the school district has asked us to make some changes and so we wanted to bring it up before the board so you knew what was going on okay this time i have to improve the agenda motion minute motion approving agenda okay this time we're going to do a proclamation and uh

When I asked the young men to come up on the stage, if one of the mamas, Emily, want to come over here, it means that I know you. Just help them up there and make sure they get up there without falling, I guess. So, Joe, if you would, go ahead with the proclamation.

Yes, sir, Mr. Chair. Proclamation number 2026P-24, a proclamation of the Board of County Commissioners of Columbia County, Florida, honoring the Lake City 6-U-A All-Star youth baseball team as 2026 state champions. Whereas the Lake City 6-U-A All-Star team has proven itself an elite on the field with a record of 20 wins against only one loss and winning the district tournament matchup and the 2026 Florida 6-U state championship. Whereas each player for the Lake City 6UA All-Star team has not only exhibited a high degree of athleticism and skill, but has always competed with heart, hustle, dedication, and teamwork while on and off the field. Whereas the accomplishments of the Lake City 6UA All-Star team serve to instill a rightful sense of pride in each player, coach, parent, fan, and across our Columbia County community, And whereas the Columbia County Board of County Commissioners recognizes the important and unique contribution of each member of the 2026 Lake City 6 UA All Star team as as they continue their competition in pursuit of the Florida regional tournament winners as outstanding athletes and role models for future generations of champions to follow. Now, therefore, be it proclaimed that the Columbia County Board of County Commissioners recognizes and honors the accomplishments of each player for the 2026 Lake City 6UA All-Star Team. Kaden Bowers, Lane Cruz, Case Dix, Remy Gonzalez, Gage Graham, Colt Hempstead, Channing Keene, Deeks Lord, Rich Parrish, Ledger Swan, Chase Thomas, and Jensen Windham. be it further proclaimed that the board honors and recognizes each of the coaches of these champion athletes who have devoted themselves to help their players excel on and off the field jamie cruz kyle dicks andy gonzalez chad hempstead blake swan and austin thomas duly adopted this second day of july 2026. motion to approve 2026 p-24 second yeah motion and second all in favor say aye aye all opposed austin you uh you the speaker today

Come forth if you would, please. He didn't even bring a piece of paper. Oh, he's got his phone out. There he is.

I couldn't make it too short. Good morning, and thank you all for having us. My name is Austin Thomas, and I'm here representing the Lake City 6U State All-Star Team. This was a huge accomplishment, and even though I didn't hear it, audibly, I know it probably went off in a lot of your heads, and it was probably a sigh, a sigh that said, why are we talking about 6U baseball? Why are we talking about T-ball? I want to remind you of something. Something really big happened in Columbia County Youth Sports a couple weekends ago in Live Oak, Florida. Something that was a historic moment for Babe Ruth baseball here in Columbia County. something that has only happened one other time for Columbia County, and it was 25 years ago and never happened for this age group. And if history is any representation of what our future holds, I want to remind you of a story that happened just a few years ago for Columbia County Sports. The Lake City Fire Department Chief Josh Wanger took a 12-year-old baseball team up to New York to a Cooperstown tournament that they battled against over 120 teams. And when the team came back to Lake City holding the championship trophy, waving their championship rings, everybody had the exact same sigh. Why are we talking about 12-year-old baseball? But the story didn't end there, because four years later, that team went on to become the Columbia High Tigers. The Columbia High Tigers, with that exact same team from 12 years old, made two runs to the final four state championship for Florida high school baseball. And it's known as one of the most best and historic moments in Columbia high school baseball. That team was together before 12 years old and the people around them that watched them celebrate, the people that were in the know, the people that were in the stands that had watched this team knew how important it was, but it didn't become important to the community. until they went on to do what they did for their high school team and our hope is the same for these boys i remember a couple years ago commissioner murphy was running against his opponent brandon beal i like brandon but i also remember commissioner murphy saying this in the debate He said this to his constituents, he said this to his opposition, and he said this to his opponent. He said, it is impossible for somebody to show up to a few county commission meetings and read a few articles in Lake City Reporter and think they know what is best and that they really understand what it takes to serve the citizens of Columbia County. And I think the same stance with this, and I think what you said was true, it's impossible for me to tell you what this means to several, several dozen, several hundred people in the community. It's impossible for you to read an article in the Lake Sea Reporter telling you what went down at the state tournament. And it means something to you and know what it meant to the families involved. A few weekends ago on a Sunday morning at 9.30 a.m. in Live Oak, Florida, over 200 people showed up to a 6U T-ball game, a championship game that no other team from Lake City was involved in. I want to tell you who we're battling against. We are battling against teams mostly from the Jacksonville area, Ponte Vedra, Fort Caroline, Creeks Baseball Club, Julington Creek. This is the largest city in the continental US. Also, north of Orlando, the richest city. in Florida. These kids have trainers. They have over 700 or 800 players in their league. They get to pick the best of the best. We have two or three, maybe 400 kids at best in our entire organization here in Columbia County. We went to battle with these guys over a year ago to prepare for what we knew would probably be the state championship game. And instead of going to church on Sunday morning, Instead of laying in bed, sleeping on their only day off, these people showed up to Live Oak, Florida to watch a 6U baseball game that they were hoping would be historic. After five innings of trailing a Jacksonville Beach team, a great team, they were beating us five to two. We tied it up five to five. They were beating us eight to five for an inning. We tied it up eight to eight. In the last inning, It's tied 10 to 10 in the championship game. We go into extra innings in a T-ball game. It's extremely hard to get outs in T-ball. Normally, T-ball games are 20 to 25, 18 to 23. That's a typical score. The score in this game in extra innings is 10 to 10, where the Lake City 6U All-Star Team turns a double play and catches a game-winning fly ball. with the game on the line to put the Jacksonville Beach team away. The reason that's important to us is because we have been battling this fight for years. We have been battling against these teams for years. We battled Ponte Vedra. we battle jacksonville beach we battle these big organizations we battle mr pittman and and the guy on the golf cart fronting us off from the fields we're not supposed to be there we battle in columbia county to try to make what what happened a few weeks ago it has not been an easy process nor has it been a short process um again lots and lots of people showed up to support us and we're so thankful For everybody's support and unbeknownst to us once you win a state title The winners of a state title are invited to a regional tournament We had no idea because we've never been close to winning it When we win the state title they say we would love to see your team Come compete in New Smyrna Beach this this year for the regional the regional tournament Last minute very expensive and very unexpected. We talk with it amongst ourselves, we talk with it amongst our coaches to try to make this thing work for the kids because we know in their lifetime, it may be the only shot they ever get to go to it. In Columbia County history, this has never happened where a state tournament has been won for Lake City. And to think that these boys would potentially have another shot at it means that the stars would have to align again. And so our families are left with a decision to make. Do we cancel our family beach trip that we already had planned? Do we cancel our Disney World tickets that we bought months ago, not knowing that we would have the opportunity that we have today? Or do we do something to try to put these boys in a spot that they may have never get an opportunity to do again? And so we said we'd give it a shot. We said we're going to try to make it. Luckily for us, the tournament's not in Tennessee this year. It's not in Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina, which is where they rotate the hosting tournament. It's in Florida at New Smyrna Beach. But make no mistake, it's about a $15,000 endeavor. Our moms, dedicated to the little boys' dreams and opportunity, instantly start trying to fundraise, raffle stuff off, stand at Roadhouse for hours asking for any donation, any tip money, anything that you could possibly give to us. And they've done a fine job. We've raised four or $5,000 trying to take some of the load off of some of the families that are making. I was told by a couple families, I'll be honest with you, we can't do both. We can't go to the beach with my mom and my grandma this year and go to the regional tournament. I say, we're going to try to do some fundraising. We're going to try to raise some money to try to take the load off of some of these boys and some of these families so they can make this run. And so regardless of whether we go down there and go broke and don't win a single game or we're able to give a kid an opportunity that he may or may never have a chance to do again. I thank you guys. I thank you, Mr. Pittman, for working with us. Mr. Foreman, I know we had meetings about this last year, I think this time, about field usage and y'all charging us a couple thousand bucks to use the batting cage or something like that. I forget exactly how it went. But I do appreciate everything you've done for us to this point. and I'll ask humbly if there's anything the board could do or would like to do to help a group of boys that have done something historic in the history of Columbia County baseball. My goal is hopefully one day you can look back and say, you know that CHS Tiger team that's going to the Final Four this weekend or that just won the Florida High School Baseball Championship? I have a small investment of that because when I was commissioner, We honored them with a proclamation and maybe even donated to their cause. So thank you for everything. Legend has it this group of boys is so celebrated that even Mr. Looker was cheering us on at our tournament run. Thank you so much. Thank you, everything.

I told you he was going to go to two minutes. He was on the phone with me yesterday. I'm only going to talk two minutes. I said, Austin Thompson ain't never talked two minutes. But a special thanks goes out to the parents, too, because I know myself, Rocky, Everett, I think, but Robbie. I know Robbie's been sponsoring Little League Golf ever. Yeah. We're real proud to run it. You know, it's a heck of the best by a family. And just like me and Austin was talking a couple weeks ago, you know, the unexpected brings on a lot of different challenges and what have you. But, you know, we've stepped up this year. Fortunately, Columbia County has had a lot of success in kids going to represent us. And you will see these young'uns out here at the high school one day. I promise you that because it's – I remember them days. It's been a long time ago, but I remember them. I was actually the president, or the vice president, the year we won the state last. So heck of an accomplishment.

These boys run a double play. I'd like to have been there to win the game. That's a clutch right there. And I just, you know, I donated for years to baseball, and I always said that doesn't matter how old they are it's going to teach them skills that they don't they're not going to have if they don't do something like some kind of organized sport so but i mean i think regardless of anything i if you'll go if you'll call my office next week i'll get you you know i'll donate to it because i just personally you know because it's just a you know it's amazing i can't believe it i mean it's pretty cool you know to see them and look at them they're all nice Don't do, they ain't being like, I mean, that's good kids.

I think they all ought to go home with you this afternoon, except for us.

They ain't coming, man.

That's just what Robbie needs. But more than any other gesture.

Hey, they did a great job. And if any of y'all do want to come with me, y'all can come with me. I got plenty of tractors and hay needs to be processed. Y'all come on. We'll help y'all out.

But more than, you know, what I know we've done most recent with the some of the other athletic teams or what have you, I think I would have no problem making a motion to match the 5,000 that we give each one of them to give 5,000 to this team, and hopefully that'll make a heck of an impact, and they'll come back happy as they can be.

Second. Motion to second. Any discussion? No discussion other than I know where all these people have been. I've been with the kids this age, bigger, and it takes a lot for them people right there to do what they do, and I know all about it. So I'm all for it. When you go to New Smyrna Beach, my parents lived there for a long time.

So I was just going to echo whatever you said. You know, the time these parents take out of their time, their family time and everything else, their job, people don't realize what a sacrifice that is. I've done it. You've done it, I know, over the years with my kids. It's a lot of time my daughter played travel ball or travel softball We've been all over Florida. I know how expensive it is and I agree. I have no problem with this I'll also if you'll get with me. I'll make a personal donation also. So I say I appreciate the kids I'm gonna be out there playing ball than sitting on the couch and playing on the phone or something like that and it seems like You know, we just need to promote more of this with the kids. Sports is a good thing. And one of the things I've tried to accomplish as a county commissioner is adding on to the ball fields. We've purchased more property in Fort White, added more fields, added flat fields, and it's all for the kids. like I say I've supported this for years with my kids my grandkids and I'll continue to support it with my great grandkids and I say if y'all will come with me personally I'll make a donation and again I appreciate all the sacrifices y'all made as parents and coaches to support these kids and that's what it that we need more of that I said thank you all right so all in favor say aye aye all opposed okay

kids look for miss emily we're going to all come up here on the stage coaches uh you got your picture down here do you already give it to somebody okay we got one missing our clerk uh her grandchild actually is on here

Oh, I like that.

This picture's a little easier to set up. I like that one. Upside down.

Good job. Everybody say cheese real big.

Yeah, y'all don't have to stay.

Nobody's on the check.

Got to see Amy for the check.

We'll give y'all a few minutes to wander out. Thank you, guys. See y'all later. Y'all have a good time.

I'm pretty made. Don't be played next year.

I want some video of that double play. I want to see that. All right, good deal. Okay, we're going to head off into our meeting here. Let me try this.

pick up where we left off last time trying to follow the rules a little bit better for us. We're all bad about it so we're in training session here but this time update from the Florida Association of Counties conference. David I'll let you start with what you learned on your end of it.

So basically the Florida Association's conference, there are two major issues. data centers and the big issue, the ballot initiative on reducing property taxes in November. There was a lot said on them. There are a lot of counties that are doing moratoriums. There are also other people out there that are saying data centers aren't as bad as everyone says they are. A lot of different opinions. We're hoping later on in the agenda that we can set a workshop for the, I think it's the 23rd, or special meeting not a workshop and data centers will be one of the key topics of that special session in terms of um the property tax initiative we know if it passes in november that we will face depending on who you listen to the small county coalition or the county property appraiser and i'll go with the property appraiser uh He's estimating about $8 million the first year and a total of $10 million the second year, loss in property tax revenues. We'll talk later about how that will impact us. We're trying to create a page on our webpage that just talks about budget transparency and provides the information that the public needs to know about, one, the budget that we do have to adopt this fall, as well as what will happen the next year and the year after should this pass, because this is something that is very significant to a person. Almost everyone says this is worse than... This is more impactful on the state of Florida than even the recession in 2008 or COVID. So this is a very significant change in how we may have to do business. With that, I'll defer to the commissioners.

Okay, I went, Mr. Ford wasn't able to be there. He was doctoring a bad hand, I've seen. I was supposed to be there. But I attended the, myself and Mr. Parnell, and I'll let him elaborate, but the data center conference in the property tax. And of course, I'm currently the vice president of the Florida Association of County Trusts. And the Florida Association of Counties did a great presentation. It was the last thing that we attended on Thursday. They are gonna vividly come out against this. They're gonna put all their efforts towards this. They showed the efforts. I gave to staff a card. Joel, I think, is going to be looking over it to make sure that information is correct on it because they explained to us in briefing Tuesday that you gotta make sure if you're gonna comment on somebody else's material, it's got to be accurate. So, but I encourage each and every, and from here on out, every meeting, I'm gonna, we're gonna have some papers, I see Joel shuffled through some, out in the foyer for that. Hopefully the community will take this at heed and study this and understand because it's not as simple as just that. Services will be cut throughout Florida. a very drastic measure and I'm for reform myself personally but you know I think we just got to really look at it do it the right way and because it will affect each and every one of our operations and most definitely each and every one of our districts I know for sure And hearing some of the horror stories already with the assumptions just in South Florida, they're the ones that can overcome it. It's those rural guys that's gonna have problems. And then also, briefly on the data center, I was gonna reach out to staff and get a little bit, I'm asking for not only the minutes but the information to come forth that they shared. They had a representative from TECO The young man from, I think, Georgia, Alliance of Business or something like that, and then an economist out of Florida, University of Florida, he brought forth some really, really serious numbers. And as we all know, we heard it right from the beginning, data centers, they sell their stuff when they come through that door as employers. According to him, they're not employers. When they accumulate this number, it's everything from the day they start trying to put the project together until the day they build it. They're contractors and all-inclusive. And that's a little bit misleading. But they do pay well. And they've come a long ways. But hopefully, we get budget behind us. There's a community in Virginia, I believe it is. No, I'm sorry, North Carolina. They've got 200 of these data centers, small and large. Before this board goes forth, and of course I'm sure we'll have discussion during our workshop on data centers, I think we owe it to ourselves to really, really educate ourselves. I'm not gonna, don't want to put them on, I don't want everybody, the newspaper getting on him, but a county manager came to me and he said, I hope every one of y'all put more to our money because we want every one we get. and uh you know they talked of 60 of revenue uh 60 of the income off of them can run their counties and uh so but the uh we got a lot of work ahead of us this year it's it's a scary thing with budget and this type of stuff but uh i learned a lot about the data center every time you touch that thing you touch in the data center somewhere you know it's uh mckinnon

Yeah, I learned a lot on two. There's there's such a negative connotation about him, but we do have to. We're going to face this real soon, so that meeting on data centers is very essential. Learned a great bit, but I do. I do think we need to educate ourselves even farther and I have seen a lot of other counties going into the moratoriums and setting standards for the data channels when they do come into town. I'm glad they clarified the part about the jobs because that's just not true. They said it would be one job every per square feet of the building. So, you know, depending on what size your size data center may come, you may only have five jobs. The main jobs we're talking about is the construction phase, land clearing, all of that. Those jobs are going to be what would be plentiful but that's only temporary once the building is done in construction those jobs go away and you have just a very few people run the data center and that's it so that was very misleading uh how they try to come in so we know that for a fact we just want to do a little deep dive into data centers and see what the real benefit would be for our county before we move forward with anything to do with it so the education is definitely essential for those and i forgot that mr parnell the uh i was a little shocked at that too one and a half

employee per 10,000 square feet but anyway that's the update I had I mean I'm not going to say gloom and doom but public really needs to pay attention

and uh because there's a lot of things moving forward joel was there also i'm sorry yeah no i i attend the florida association of county attorneys conference i don't see the same class as you guys do uh we received the legislative update from ginger delagal do you guys remember ginger she comes in gives us the legislative update and she also talks to us about current initiatives out of tallahassee and one of the things she pointed out and i don't think a lot of people know this First of all, we can only expend public funds to disseminate factual information. We're not allowed to advocate with public funds. You are allowed to advocate individually. I'm allowed to advocate individually. But if we spend any public money, it can only be to disseminate factual information. So that's the issue we're talking about with this bulletin. there's a thing called the total elimination agenda. Do you guys remember hearing about this down at the conference? I don't think most people realize this. If this amendment passes, there's the $150,000 the first year and the $250,000 the second year. But in the future, all reductions of ad valorem assessment on homestead will be controlled by vote of the Florida legislature up to and including total eliminations. So the Florida legislature would have the ability to grant a 100% tax exemption to somebody who owns a $20 million mansion in South Beach. I don't think most voters realize that. Voters like to have say so in who gets tax exemptions and how this works. If this passes, the voters are giving their ability to do that over to the Florida legislature forever. So it's another instance where power and control is being shifted out of the voters, out of the local governments, back over to Tallahassee. And it's really not hard to imagine, we have some very high dollar real estate in this, homestead real estate in this state. If you travel anywhere south of Orlando and you get close to a beach, you're gonna start seeing 10, $20 million properties that people do absolutely have homestead on. i think that's the hidden agenda in this effort that i think people need to be educated on with respect to data centers commissioner cornell is exactly right i'm already gathering moratoria that are being looked at by neighboring counties and when we're at the workshop we will actually talk about that there is a school of thought that adopting a moratorium might get you sued but the consensus of the county attorneys anyway was it was a risk worth taking Yeah, because if we all do it and we all get sued, we're not the canary in the coal mine. We're all in it together. So the consensus among the county attorneys was that we would probably want to go forward with the moratorium if our boards would adopt them. And again, I do know even smaller counties than us already have them on the docket. So we'll be bringing that forward. Otherwise, the tenor about taxes and things like that with respect to counties, the exact same thing you guys were hearing.

not all doom and gloom but there's a lot to be concerned about down that conference mr chair just for clarification i was not the county manager that made that comment but i wanted to leave a little bit of you know imagination out there but anyway uh but i appreciate it and uh at this time board if i may uh i got a uh notice from uh our on the agenda going all the way over here to the dental division under David. Our representative with the insurance company has got a very important meeting in Jacksonville at 1215. And if you don't mind, I'd like to jump that ahead where she can get on the road and be safe about it. So at this point in time. David, there she is. Thank you. I've seen you earlier.

I don't even have a row of six-year-olds pulling for me. Thank you, everyone. So glad to see you. It's been exactly a year since I stood here before you, so I'm happy to be here, and I'm really happy to have some good news to share with you this year about the... I know you're going to teach me one more time.

When you get back,

I'll try the down one.

I'll try the down one. Oh, there we go.

Thank you. That's me.

All right. Well, thank you so much. So the insurance committee we met on Monday and started talking about what we have done, we being Gallagher. I'm Ann Edenfield from Gallagher. I'm your lead consultant. Typically, Tyson is here with me, but I let him off on good behavior, so you know the criteria was low for him to meet it, so. Anyway, he's not here, but I am here to talk about the dental division and the medical going into plan year 2027. So one of the things that we did is we start out with the medical that's the biggest dollars of course and everything that drives that medical decision are the claims so we typically start out each year by letting you know that once we receive claims through may which actually thank goodness those claims were good then that drops off it's a rolling 12 that 12 months ago And we look at it and we say so far for the plan year, the claims are running at about a 72% loss ratio. Loss ratio is just a simple term to say for every dollar that comes in for premiums, 72 cents of that dollar went out to pay claims. So that leaves that little delta for Florida Blue to operate off of. So that's what they're looking at. That's what the underwriters are looking at in addition. I also want to remind everyone that the county participates in what is called a pro-share agreement, which means that Florida Blue looks at this agreement on a two-year cycle. If the premiums versus the claims are favorable, they will share in whatever that overage is between premiums and claims and the operating, they'll share in that 50-50. So we have benefited from that in the past. And right now we are wrapping up The first year of that two year agreement, it'll end September 30th, but at a 72% loss ratio, I'm hopeful that looks favorable and that we can have some pro share. But right now we're just in the middle of that agreement. And as a reminder, Florida blue wants it to be sticky. So you must renew in order to get any shared savings. So, no, you can't read all of this, but what we do is we take your plans and then we ask Florida Blue with their underwriters and the Gallagher underwriters, where does that renewal look like it's going to come in? First blush from the underwriters, which they had claims through March, they came in at 9.1% asking for an increase. Once we got the May claims, we went back and negotiated it to a 6% increase, but it gets better. because this year was the year that we went out to quote the dental and the vision benefits florida combined life which is the florida blue dental carrier is the choice for the dental and we're going to talk about that in a moment because a carrier gives a group packaging rates if you will because florida blue looks like it will be the dental carrier for y'all next year that knocked another one percent off the medical renewal. So now that medical renewal is 5%. That's lower than trend. That is an excellent renewal that equates to about 200,000 total premium, all constitutional offices for the year. My ask is that the board would consider taking the full 5% to allow the employees to have a rate hold going into 2027. So if you're all sitting there with lots of numbers in your head, what that means, what I'm asking is right now the board contributes about 11,000 per person. It would be an additional $40. So it would be $11,040 per person. to absorb that 5% increase, which is about 200,000 worth of premiums, but that would allow the employees to have a rate hold on the medical. So I'm gonna let y'all mull that while I continue to talk. So the dental plan, the dental plan went out. Your dental plan is currently with the standard, but Florida Blue, Florida Combined Life, was the most competitive of the rates and the benefits going into 2027. The standard said, I can't compete. I can't even get to where they're probably going to be. So really Florida combined life is the dog in this hunt going into 2027. They also agreed to improve some of the benefits. So on that dental right now, currently, your plan design for dental has not been changed in years, years and years. So they not only came in and said, hey, if you renew right where you're at, no benefit changes, we're going to reduce the premiums by about 7%. Now, dental premiums are low. So 7% or we're talking dollars. But what we did ask them to do and what that was encouraged by the HR department was to please give us an idea if we could improve employee benefits. So going into 2027, that buy up is going to take the orthodontia benefit, which right now and has for years, decades probably, capped at $1,000. It's going to increase by $2,500 for both the low plan and the buy up plan. also the buy-up plan is going to be much richer so in addition to that hundred dollar preventive that middle tier uh services go from eighty percent to ninety percent the low basic services go from fifty percent to sixty five so that buy up really becomes a very attractive The base plan still is good and still has better ortho, but the buy-up really has a better plan. And when I say the premiums for that, I'm talking that will go from an additional $2 per employee, $2.63, $5 for employee plus one, $13. So they get a much better benefit. As a reminder on dental, employees pick that up. So what we're asking is, Yes, Florida Blue, Florida Combined Life would be the dental carrier going into 2027. And the insurance committee's recommendation is yes, we would like to offer those buy-up options. And let's go ahead and improve it. We think employees will gladly pick those additional dollars up. Those dollars that I reeled off are monthly premiums. They get cut in half for payroll. Pre-tax dollars takes them down even further. So we're really talking pennies and dollars to get a much better benefit. So we think it's a great offering for next year to talk about the dental and the dental benefits. Vision, we had a very similar experience in that we had a couple of vision carriers come up and bid. They're not currently set up with your navigator system. Florida, the standards said, you know what, we will. take another run at that vision benefit. What we will do is we will give you a rate hold for two years on that base plan and on the buy up plan. If you want to improve those benefits again, exact same story, very much so can improve that buy up benefit. And when I give you an idea of that, if any of you wear glasses, you know that progressive lenses are very much, especially in the state of Florida, very much appreciated when you walk from one a place where the lighting is such, and then you go outside and you hit the sun, those progressive lenses, and those are expensive. They're expensive, but they become to, again, they're going to include progressive in the buy up for pennies to the employee. The employee would pick up that dollar if they wish to. So as a reminder, the vision, we're going to recommend that it stays with the standard. It'll be a two year rate hold. The base plan will stay the same. The buy-up will have better benefits. The employee, if they choose to purchase those better benefits, will get those progressive lens and a couple of other minor tweaks within the body that are improvements to the plan. But our recommendation is that we adopt the standards renewal, allow for those alternate plan designs to give employees the option to buy richer benefits. But again, that's on their nickel. are there any questions i know i've probably gone through a lot but so we're right now as a recap we're saying that the medical hey that the medical we'd like to stay with florida blue of course the five percent we'd like to ask the board to please pick that up the dental we'd like to renew with florida combined life allow for those better benefits. Yes, thank you. In addition, on that dental, we also have increased the maximum benefit to $3,000. That too is a great benefit. So again, for the dollars that we are asking for that the employees, yes, and the progressive lenses are for your bifocals. bifocal lenses. So internally, there are definitely some improved benefits, but that dental going from orthodontia and that buy-up plan going to a $3,000, that's just an excellent, excellent benefit. So the life plan, life insurance is in a rate hold. There is no change. As the board may remember, $30,000 is the life insurance amount for employees. If an employee opts to not take the dental, they get that PAC B, which are some additional benefits. They get $50,000 worth of life, but none of those rates change. They are in a rate hold again for next year. Short-term disability, same story. They are in a rate hold. Nothing is changing. Those benefits will just roll over into 2027. The premiums for that are the same for next year. PAC B. So this is what was implemented last year. And again, that PAC B is what we named the benefit package for employees that opt out of the medical, which is of course the bigger cost and the county provides the buy up, the better benefit plan for employees. If they want to buy, buy up for their dependents, they must pay for it. But the county does pay for the employee only. for that buy-up dental, the buy-up vision, the 50,000 worth of life insurance, they get short-term disability, and they get an AFLAC accident policy. So that benefit package for employees that don't take the medical is also quite competitive, which is the name of the game when trying to hire and get individuals coming into the county. So that is the PAC-B. So my recommendation and what I'm asking for, and I'm certainly opening up to answer any questions that you may have, or if I went over something and you're like, hmm, I'm not certain about that. Otherwise, I would like to open it up and ask for approval to accept this much improved benefit package for the employees going into 2027. Well, Board,

Kerry was good enough to share. I was just so happened to be up in the office of the day when they came out of the meeting and seemed like everybody in that insurance committee was pretty excited about the minimal. I had this 1015% thing. I've seen a couple constitutional requests and I've seen some large numbers in there for increasing benefit. So I mean a mere $40 for what we're gaining in what it that little bit can truly help some of the employees i think but yeah i i i'm very comfortable with where it's at but move to approve the insurance second got a motion and a second any further discussion all in favor say aye aye all opposed thank you thank you very much thank you for working me and i do appreciate it thank you all right happy fourth everyone where you see bill yes i always do All right, at this point in time, we've got a public hearing on the Notice of Intent for Uniform Method of Collecting Non-Abderrahim Assessments.

Mr. Chairman, this is something we do annually. This is a public hearing to basically say that we will be using an assessment program and all of the different assessments that we have currently listed. The actual adoption of the assessment itself will occur in September, the first public hearing. This is just that we will be doing assessments, same procedures as we had in previous years.

Okay, so at this time, is there anybody? I will open up the public hearing. Is anybody here to speak for or against this action? Not seeing any, I declare the public hearing closed. What's the wishes of the board? We have to vote to approve this. Yeah, we got it.

Oh, Mr. Chair, this is the notice of intent.

Notice of intent. Notice of intent. OK. So what did I say wrong? No, you just need to make a motion to adopt the notice. Okay, okay. I'll make a motion to second. Okay, got a motion and a second. To adopt the notice of intent. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Motion to approve consent agenda. Aye. Got a motion and a second. All in favor say aye. Aye. Motion to adopt. Got a motion.

Got a motion. Second. Got a second to adopt consent agenda. All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed?

Where we at, Matt?

Did you get the slides? We had a technical issue this morning where the internet, including in this building, is out. It's another AT&T failure. So the slides prepared for Kevin's items, he's got, I think you said you had printouts? I do. And unfortunately, we can't show them on the screen because, again, the Internet is out and all our stuff is in the cloud.

Okay. Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. I have two items here this morning. The first is a recognition for a young lady on Murdice Road turning 97 years old. Her request is approved to designate a section of Murdice Road with signage in honor of Ms. Mary Moultrie for her 97th birthday.

Yes, this is in my district. lady contacted me and asked me about the situation the family has been living on this road since time i guess the road even started their family had and they went back as far as some of the people there were interacting with some of the folks back in slave time and so the people was talking about their slaves and they just wanted something to remember this

I'll second the motion got a motion to second all in favor say aye aye all opposed okay sure the next good deal okay the next one is as y'all know we're building a RC track out at Lake Jeffery in Bascom North it's time to light it up we received four bids Low bid was at $32,750. We had a local company at $32,800, a $50 difference. And as we all know, there is a local preference rule. This definitely falls under the local preference rule. Request a motion to award P2604L to the lowest responsible bidder, Graham & Sons Electric, and to approve the construction agreement. Thank you, gentlemen.

So this next item is the code enforcement specialist slash special assessment inspector position. you have a new job description which combines the two positions. Previously, we had code enforcement and then the special assessment inspector was a separate position. Troy, in working with the code enforcement officers and with the special assessment officer, determined that the best use of county resources is to combine the two positions and have both code enforcement officers also do special assessments. This would allow us to eliminate a position and ultimately save some money in the county budget.

Motion to approve job description, code enforcement, special and special. Second.

Got a motion and a second.

Howard, I just wanted to say, is this going to affect the special assessment side of the deal?

No. Ernesto feels that we are caught up and are getting caught up and that by having two of them, they can keep it caught up. This is the results of since we've hired Ernesto, what he has accomplished today.

Okay, that's all. Thank you. And board, if I may, this is a moving target that changes each and every year. It does. More people move in, more people buy sheds, put them in their backyard, put them in wherever. So this will be an ongoing thing, but the results are pretty staggering. This is well worth the effort that we've taken. It really helps out.

And they feel, you know, while they're out there doing code enforcement, this allows them also to see more properties and possibly do more assessment changes.

Looks a lot different coming through two eyes rather than on a GIS map. Yes. I'm very impressed with what's happened since he'd come to work and myself, and we talk quite frequently, but I think we've invested a Good money in good places there. Okay. I agree with it. So, need a motion? Motion to approve. Got a motion. Okay. Got a second. Any questions? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed? Okay.

The next item is representation on the board for the North Florida Water Utility Authority. The board directed us, I don't know, I think first of the year or something. I don't know. Previously to go out and seek applicants, you have four applicants before you. And so we're bringing it back to the board. One of the discussions this board had was to have these folks, once you select them, attend meetings to make sure it really is what they think it is. Because until you're on this board or attend these meetings, you don't really truly get a full picture. And so we're looking for board direction on the four applicants that we have. this motion is to approve the selection of two app make a motion to it would be to select the two people that you want to have sit on the board once they attend the required number of meetings that this board determines they need to attend okay i know it's in the backup but for the public purposes who have their names on this Yes, you have Steve Roberts, who was the utility director for the City of Lake City. You have Stacy Cowart, who used to work for the county as a utility director and is in the utility business. You have Walt Graham, who owns Graham Electric, is a local electric contractor, but who was in the utility business early in his career and advanced quickly in that process. And then you have Jock Phelps, who is a local business owner, local developer,

served you very well on the planning and zoning chairman also we have the utility director here he would like to speak on this subject okay okay okay Shannon he's hobbled it a little bit he had surgery on his ankle y'all having bad luck around at water utility well that happened a while back he just finally had surgery to fix it

well i think uh mr foreman said it well he said that the utility authority had turned into a mass unit between our board chairman and whatever he's done my surgery uh mr williams had surgery on his eyes where We're just trying to convalesce and get back to normal. Mr. Chairman, thank you. I did want to just provide some feedback. At different times, this board has asked the authority to come in and provide information around major decision points. For example, the last one that board made around the Ellisville construction that were related to resolving consent issues, we came in and had some discussions about that. So I'm here in kind of the same spirit. What I'm not here to do is I think all four candidates have positive aspects. I'm not here to denigrate any candidate at all, but. what i do think is important to discuss that based on some of their experiences and some of their their expertise and their line of work some of them may be a little better suited for the work that the utility is doing now and for the next few years others not to say that they couldn't do the job but they may have experiences in um contributions that might be better set for something farther down the road when the utility authority gets through its its its build out phase so what i just wanted to do is i just did a brief assessment of each four of the candidates and i want to list their strengths and i want to rank them in order of that i think who's who's the best fit now this is just the authority i'm here sharing what uh my analysis is to provide information for this board to make the decision it is ultimately this board's choice on who represents your board

uh on the authority so i'm not i'm not here to to do anything other than to share additional information that you could use in your decision making process that's all shannon i'll stop you right there we're not looking for that we've got i appreciate your opinion but this board is more than capable to read our backup material make decisions upon that uh that's uh I disagree with that. Board, anybody have any input on that? I did not know that this was, you know, you're basically, or indirectly or directly, in my opinion, giving your opinion on where is how to go. I don't agree with that. That's just myself.

understand what he's saying but you know we got people that are volunteering for board they're gonna have a lot of work to do on and I don't feel like ranking them and it being in a public forum like this and ranking people when they're nice enough to put themselves out there to be on a board I've never heard of that being done I don't think we rank people you know

I'm sorry yeah I mean I don't I've never voted to run or had a ranking I don't think of I don't know maybe that's normal but I've never heard of it so I think didn't we yes sir I think last week didn't we choose somebody for a PNZ board PNZ we did but this is for the utility but I know we didn't have a correct have a ranking for it it's just it's odd to me as well but I just want to take it could be seen I'm sorry I'm sorry about that

no go ahead no no it could just be seen i mean if i'm trying to get on a board and i get ranked below everybody else i'm not going to feel good about that probably won't be trying to be on any more boards i'm just being honest with you so so chairman yes sir so let me let me just ask the question why did we ask for experience and uh past past experience and knowledge of this stuff if we're not going to take any of that into into our decision i mean we had a we had each one of these candidates apply supply a recommendation i mean not a resume but a resume stating their experiences and past experiences and what they've done that helps make them qualified to be on this committee now i will also add that this committee is a very important committee it's the future of columbia county and utilities the more knowledge we have on this board I think the better off it is going to be in the future and I'll just say we got two people that's turned in their applications that stand above the other two as far as qualifications and knowledge in this in this field not to mention both of these people have been paid hundreds of thousands of dollars in the past for their knowledge and their experience in this field with the cities and the counties and private companies. I think them willing to be sat there and tell us, we'll do this for free to help the county out with all of our knowledge and experience, not asking for any compensation. That's a pretty good gift to the Columbia County citizens, I think.

that's just my opinion and I appreciate your opinion Rocky I think I understand exactly what you're saying but and but each one of us that looked at this and we can make our decision vote on that accordingly I don't we don't need Shannon as the director of North Florida Water Utility to explain that to us I think I did my research I did my homework

and i can only speak for that so to speak to the ranking process that commissioner hollingsworth was talking about staff just vets these and make sure they check all the boxes and then what commissioner ford's doing essentially is saying that there's two he prefers so that would be a motion to appoint those two individuals i did want to point something out that seth just brought to my attention i believe mr graham already serves on your planning and zoning board if you appoint mr graham he'll have to come off of planning and zoning you can't serve on two boards at one time i don't think that was included in the backup material and i don't know i just want to make sure as you make your motions and consider that i'm not saying he wouldn't want to do that obviously if you put his name in the hat he's considered that but you would open up a vacancy on planning and zoning if you appointed mr graham and chairman to finish up i i would be making a motion

that we appoint Stacy Coward and Steve Roberts to this board. I think they are the best qualified. I think they have the most experience they can bring to the utility authority. And I think we'd be doing a disservice to the utility authority if we put anybody else on that board on this list at this time.

OK. Well, I know all these gentlemen. They're all upstanding people in this county. And I agree, kind of agree with Rocky. You got experience in the field. So, I mean, if you got experience in the field, well, why shouldn't we use somebody in experience in the field? Which, like I say, I know all these people and know them all well. And they've been friends of mine since then. So, I'll second the motion of, all right, go to guide or let them be on the board.

for him to include both of them in this motion don't have to deal separately yeah no I mean it's it's the question is who are how do you want to fill the spots the motion is to fill with those two gentlemen you have a second so the motions on the floor chairman I would also if I could I'd like to add both of these guys have a lot of experience in the Columbia County utilities already they have a lot of knowledge already in Columbia County utilities you know that that means a lot too so while we're in this phase of build-up phase i think they can bring a lot of knowledge and experience and be very helpful to shannon at this time okay okay got a motion on the floor to appoint stacy cowart and steve roberts all in favor aye

opposed aye okay that failed so I'll seek a motion to appoint and one clarification I'll just say because I heard something in the presentation just hold on I was talking don't interrupt me again the Walt Graham is not on Graham Electric anymore I think David in your presentation I just want to clear that up okay so

we've got four board members four applicants I'll seek a motion anybody got a motion to appoint I move to approve can I do one one I mean you can do one okay I move to approve Jock Phelps to nominate Jock Phelps for the got a motion

to appoint Mr. Jock Phelps to the North Florida Water Utility I second Mr. Phelps got a second all in favor say aye aye all opposed that was a yes that was a no is the clerk getting all these I'm trying yes if we could you might voice vote these you might voice vote these okay okay we'll voice vote for it that way we make it simpler on her so you're saying I'll make

that you're just making a motion to appoint the other two I can change my motion to make it more simple hold on just a second madam clerk when these are called since they seem to be going both ways if you could do a voice vote call the chair then go through the different commissioners and get them to say what their vote is if you want to rescind I can I can amend my motion to include Walt Graham and jock phelps wait wait wait wait you already got a motion and a vote on that that's fine so she's going to go through what your vote was on jock phelps okay okay so just call them out and let them vote she's going to start whatever and come this way all right i changed my motion i approve he said aye aye okay so you're approving mr feldman aye i approve him

I would just say I have got to vote for the two most qualified people that have put their applications in for this. Nothing against Jock Phelps. I think he's a great guy and a good businessman. But this is a board that requires expertise and I'll just have to say if any of y'all have read these resumes, y'all know who the best qualified people for this board is and I vote no.

okay so that takes care of one appointment I'll seek a motion for a further appointment with the remaining three names how many that we approve Walt Graham got a motion to approve Walt Graham need a second I'll second it all in favor say aye aye aye you want to do it yes please no for the same reason as before okay so mr. chair yes sir I do have one additional question

um you had said or the board has said previously that they wanted to attend meetings before they officially become the members uh does this board have any preference on what that time period is we've got a meeting scheduled shannon uh do you recall what's the 13th of july our budget workshop is july the 13th and then our regularly scheduled meeting is july the 20th i believe

My opinion, that's perfect timing because they can understand the budget and Shannon's got some adjustments and stuff. He spoke to us that he wants to make. And so I think it'd be a good learning curve. So my opinion would be, I think they, before they officially take the seats, definitely be a part of the next two meetings.

I guess what I'm asking for is a vote on officially when they would take the seats so that we can work that transition.

i would make the motion to for them to officially take the seat after the second meeting our next record meeting because we got a budget workshop excuse me and then uh the uh the board regular scheduled board meeting so i guess effective that would be effective in august correct so you would want them to take we got another meeting shannon after the uh and i'm sorry don't get up please with your broke foot but our But we don't have nothing after the regular meeting until August, correct? That's correct. Okay. Yes, sir. So do you want them to – I did workshops, and I was confused there.

So you want them in their seat at the August meeting?

That would be my motion. Okay. Yes, sir. Second. We've got a motion and a second. Any further discussion? All in favor say aye. Aye. All opposed. Okay.

Plenty of time. Before we move on, I just have one more thing to say. you know the whole reason we're putting this committee together for the utility authority is to take politics out of the utility authority yep i think with what everybody just saw here you injected politics right back in to the utility authority and i've seen it on your side you got your opinion i got my opinion did you read the resume believe it i believe i read it and i read between the lines too

between the lines between the lines between the lines that were politics was trying to be embedded back into it okay we're moving on uh planning and zoning board adjustment vacancy yes um you had a resignation from the planning and zoning board and so you now have another vacancy you have two applicants left um

were in your agenda packet and the question is of those two which one would you like to appoint or do you want to go out and look for another um on that one i'll make a motion we approve um there was applicant office johnson to add to the planning zoning board okay got a motion to appoint office johnson to the planning and zoning board of adjustment vacancy any further questions

wait i'm sorry got motion to second any questions discussion all in favor say aye somebody say something okay i thought somebody said okay all in favor say aye aye all right next one is emergency medical services in our last meeting on june 18th you asked to come back with a budget you have a three-year projection from the fire department on what it would take if you added two ambulances um And that came out to basically if you add in the contract for AmeriPro, because if you only have two ambulances, you're going to still have AmeriPro's contract, that adds up to about $4 million a year, slightly under $4 million a year. You can see that on page three of your budgets. And that's just for the two ambulances, one in the north, one in the south. That projection also includes the purchase of the ambulance. Now, if the hospital authority donates the ambulances, you can immediately reduce that budget by $1.6 million in year one, but that won't affect your budget in year three. Year three will still be approximately $4 million. Additionally, you're not going to hire the new ambulance crews, which is included in that year one budget, day one, because you're not going to hire ambulance crews until you have ambulances for the crews to operate. So that first year budget I would take with a grain of salt simply because timing is going to be critical on what happens when. But we do have to plan for worst case scenarios. You now have the three year projections for adding two ambulances year one. Again, the positions are 13, two per shift per ambulance, three shifts, two ambulances, that's 12, and one supervisor. So that's how they came up with the 13 personnel if you fully staff the ambulances. I was asked by a commissioner, well, how are you going to pay for it? Well, that's a good question. We can't give you a satisfactory answer on that until November when we know what is going to happen with the property tax. But having said that, we would obviously have to continue to fund it through general fund, which means transferring less of the general fund to other funds to prop up other funds. So we transfer money between funds to prop them up every year. We're going to start this year's budget with not propping up any funds and zero transfers between funds. You only gave me a week or so to actually come up with this plan. So within that short period of time, that is the best I can tell you. It would come from property taxes. It would be tied to property taxes. And as we move forward, even with the cuts in property taxes, it would be paid for by ad valorem property taxes. Having said that, the reason I say that is if you look at your property taxes, you can see EMS is paid for entirely out of your property taxes. And it's a small share of the total pie of the property taxes. But if that pie gets smaller, it does affect everything. So having said that, We could not produce the heat map, the link we had from AmeriPro didn't work, so I had Jason produce this map this week, and you can see this is what he can produce. This is, for the past two months, the location of every call for service. And you can see where the majority of calls are, and then you can see specifically like on the north side, you have people in dire need of emergency medical care, but those ambulances are gonna be located where the calls are, not necessarily where the people are. So we still firmly support moving forward with trying to get two ambulances from the hospital authority and paying for whatever needs to be paid for out of the general fund. Having said that, the other option that we have discussed is at this point in time, utilizing existing fire personnel as kind of a, we called it mutual aid. So they would not be running medical calls on a regular basis. They would be there when AmeriPro could not do it. So they would be there and focusing specifically only on the rural areas of the county, not as a backup to AmeriPro in the urban areas. So their call volume would be such. As such, as you know, when a fire truck ALS engine responds to a patient, they have to stay with that patient until transport arrives. They can't leave for fire calls. They can't leave for anything else. obviously if they're on fire falls they can't respond to medical calls what this would do would allow them to have a ambulance so that if they did respond to a medical call and needed to transport they could but ultimately the responsibility remains with our contractor and we have a three-year contract so the responsibility still lays with ameripro we're just there so for instance if you look at the north half of the county if you needed mutual aid, you're gonna have to request it from Hamilton County. That's the only people that can get there in any reasonable amount of time. And they don't have a whole lot of ability to help us sometimes. You know, they've got their own calls to answer. So this would answer some of that. I know I probably have confused everybody, and I'm willing to answer any questions you have, but our recommendation is for the board to tell us to proceed with acquiring, with the hospital authority to try and acquire the ambulances from the hospital authority.

Okay, so approved. Management staff say approved staff to request ambulance donation from LF with funding only for current staff. I move that. That's my motion.

So it's a quick question.

Yes.

So these ambulances you're saying are going to be, basically it's going to go in the far north and the deep south of the county. Is that what we're saying?

That is correct. That was always the plan.

Okay.

And they're going to be run by who? Is that a firefighter?

The fire department.

Fire department.

So when Ameripro gets a call, it's in the urban area, they won't go out this far north or this far south. The firefighters jump in and listen, go to and respond to whatever call it is. Is that what it is?

Ameripro is still responsible for responding. Right. So if they get a call in the rural areas, they still are responsible for responding. But if they don't have the ability to respond, you now have a unit that can.

Okay.

You've got a backup where there's none of these zeroes.

So we're not supplementing or trying to benefit the contract employer that we have ameripro right we're there and that's why we kind of tried to explain it as mutual aid when ameripro cannot respond you have people in rural areas that are having heart attacks gunshot wounds whatever so we can act as our own mutual aid to get to them treat them and transport them it's dedicated to the north and the south to rock your district and your district now having said that i know some commissioners have talked about eventually wanting to get in the business, you have the ability to revisit this every year during every budget cycle. So this isn't saying this is forever, but this is saying we have a contract for three years. It's their responsibility. They need to do it. We want to be able to provide mutual aid when they get to level zero or when they just can't get to it. next question is where north and where south is going to be staged that haven't got that far am i too far ahead um we've discussed it several places if you're using existing personnel you'd have to put it at a staffed fire station if you want to add personnel then you can put it at an unstaffed fire station but that's something that we would work with the fire department on trying to decide how best to administer i just want to ask mr i don't know where is the fire station in your district the one up the staffed one is at swanee valley roads It's one of Valley Road.

You're talking about?

Okay.

The one that we were talking about possibly was Mershon Road, which is the volunteer station. So it's not permanently staffed.

But this motion here is to go ahead and get those two embassies pursued for the crossroads.

And then we can work with the fire department on what best to do it.

Can we get Mr. Lance up here? Absolutely. I've seen Lance get out definitely before we. He's not completely on board with it.

So there's a couple problems with that scenario of you trying to staff firefighters on these ambulances. Number one, we cannot force that firefighter to work in a paramedic capacity. That is a stipend they get in addition to their base pay. We will have firefighters that will let that stipend go, period. So not only are we going to hinder the ambulances, we're going to lose ALS engines out of this scenario. That is our concern with this. We have paramedics working here because they refuse to work on an ambulance. And like I said, that is a stipend. That is not part of their original firefighter job description. They can let that stipend go. I've already had one do it.

So essentially is this, we talked about the last two minutes, we talked about the hybrid system. Is this essentially what they're trying to?

This is part of the original hybrid we were talking about. Yes, that was the one that Swanee ran. And it can work. But the problem is this board's always wanted more for less. Right now we're running half staff fire department. NFPA is two in, two out. That's a four man station. We run two man stations in Columbia County.

We do.

That's the problem. If I had four man stations, y'all would see a different attitude out of me on this and like, yes, we can still make this work. The problem is our personnel are already spread as thin as you can spread them. And you adding an ambulance to that,

they're going to seek other yes because there's plenty of opportunities out there so the issue becomes if you're going to add personnel how are you going to pay for it and of course i will follow whatever direction the board gives me my recommendation is if you are going to add personnel wait until after we see what happens with the ballot initiative because if we're having to cut the money in property taxes by 10 million dollars we may have to raise another tax, which is the next item on the agenda. Does the public support raising a tax to fund E. M. S. Putting that on the ballot in November. And if we get the public support, you know, it's it's a, you know, so you just turned down the M. S. T. U. Tax last month. That would have paid for you could do a sales tax. As we discussed, that would be in 2028. implemented in 2029. I just think at this point in time, we need to see what happens in November before we commit. We won't have ambulances by November, but we will be able to make decisions once we know what's going to happen with the property tax.

Because Lance brought up a very valid point, I think, you know, the two in, two out, and I understand that wholeheartedly. But currently, this is something I just, I don't know why I didn't think about it before, but thinking about this thing this week, you know, we're just going to say where we're putting the tower. Help me out, Lance.

Swanee Valley.

Swanee Valley. Okay. We've got the capacity to sleep how many people there?

You could sleep four there. You could? We could, yes, sir.

Because I just got thinking, you know, when you add, you know, we're going to add beds, too.

Yes, sir.

And of course, I'm sure y'all held to a different, you know, if you have a female firefighter, a paramedic, that's got to be, you know, however y'all deal with that. And again, we're still talking about ambulance is coming forth. It's going to be 10, 12 months before you get them. You know, so we got some time to do that there. But Lance, currently with your fire staff, how are we staffed? I mean, as far as positions allocated at this point in time, Are we short very many?

We are full at the moment. It's been a very hard process, but for the last 10 months, we've been full. We have worked very hard. Chief Crawford and I worked very hard to get everything we could, and we are fully staffed.

Having said that, we staff at minimum staffing levels. Like you said, two people per station. That means you pay more overtime when people are out or sick. you have to make a decision is it cheaper to pay overtime or to add more staff so at some point you're gonna have to have more than two in at every station but we've not reached that point in our determination at this point and that's where not to take Robbie's thing here but that's exactly what it is we need to see that number because me personally I think it's time to

hire more firefighters slash paramedics, whatever that word is. Because, Lance, that's it. I'm sitting there looking at a couple of dots there, and I can almost tell you I know where the top one is at. I know where the second one is at. But my point is that we got an incident, forbid, right here. And then I caught Winfield. They're up there. Boom, they're taking off. Well, you get there, basically what you're going to do is watch them. You know what I'm saying? Because two in, two out, you sure don't want to send somebody into a death zone. But, you know, the emphasis on, and maybe when we start hiring these people, you know, firefighters slash paramedics or what have you, this discussion can take place with y'all staff and management. And, you know, because I'll be honest with you guys, it looks like to me these paramedics, I mean, there's no doubt, and taking nothing away from a firefighter because they all do a job that, most of us don't want to have no part of, but my point is that we've got to start paying people. That's our solidary to it. It's a tough world that they live in, and I asked personnel to look up some numbers for me, and I was a little astonished that our paramedic pay was where it was at, but it still needs to be multiple.

On that, there's two very different, there's two words to look for on paramedic pay. There's an engine medic and a transport medic. $15,000 difference.

What is a, not the paramedic, but the next book, EMT? EMT, yes, sir. What do they make?

They're about $50,000. $50,000?

Yes, sir. Because I was hearing $60,000.

It varies depending on where you're at.

So... You need at least one paramedic on every ambulance, and you have automatic overtime built into the system. So when you say they make X amount a year, are you talking about their base rate, which is straight time, or are you talking about the effective rate, which is their base rate plus the built-in overtime?

How much it costs us a year to have that EMT. Our base firefighter starts around $17 an hour. There was some confusion. I talked to somebody, and there was some confusion that paramedics were going to start out at 60, or EMTs were going to start out at 60,000. With the overtime. That might not be what they make base. That's what they make because of the situation.

So we can prepare for you a listing of our positions, what the base pay is, and then what the pay is, what I call the effective pay of the base cost plus the overtime cost.

I like to see it because then we understand. But now that might take away from those guys. Then you're taking away income that they're usually making. You know what I mean?

But in addition, as long as you staff minimum staffing, you're going to have to pay additional overtime beyond the built-in overtime to cover the vacancies because you have to have a minimum number of people to operate.

So Lance, let me ask you a question. The motion was to approve staff to request ambulance donation from Lakeshore Hospital Authority with funding only for current staffing.

Yes.

Now you're telling us you can't staff these ambulances.

I'm telling you, it's going to create a ripple effect and I don't know how far it's going to go because I know that at least half a dozen of my medics will not run on an ambulance.

So my question is, we're right back to asking Lakeshore Hospital authorities to fund ambulances with no plan.

So one more thing I'll say.

I don't know what we have accomplished here.

The problem.

They've said before, bring us a plan. We're not bringing them a plan. We got our fire chiefs telling us we can't, we can't staff these ambulances with current people. So there again, Where's our plan?

So my disagreement is that we do have a plan. Now, if the plan is flawed or you want to change the plan, we can do that, but we do have a plan and that is to get the ambulances, put them in basically the mutual aid type role, not running every call, but running only those calls that can't be covered by the person we're paying to run the calls and use our current personnel. Now, if you don't feel that that works, We're okay with that. We'll go back to the drawing board and come up with something different.

Well, I'm just saying our fire chief is telling us right now that's not going to work. I mean, are we going to have two ambulances just basically parked at the fire department?

The other thing that y'all really need to consider, especially you, Commissioner Parnell, because this adversely affects your district, right now that ambulance should be at Station 42. That is your only two firefighters north of I-10. We get a wreck on I-10, trauma alert. No helos are flying. That ambulance is out of pocket. Your two firefighters are out of pocket for five hours. There is no fire coverage north of 10. That's the problem with this.

If they respond to a medical call in a fire truck, they're still out of pockets.

But the transport to Gainesville is the problem, and you get caught on the wall at North Florida for three hours. That's where the issue comes in with these scenarios. That's the problem with not having the personnel for that box. It is.

Absolutely. I think our major hang-up is this whole property tax thing, how that's going to affect the budget. So determining if we can say, hey, we're going to go out and hire 13 people people for these ambulances, for one ambulance and 13 for us. That's 26 people total, is that what I'm understanding? 13 total. 13 total, okay, so 13 total for these ambulances.

Six per ambulance plus one supervisor.

Okay, so let me ask you this. Would it make sense if we go ahead and get the ambulances, then after November when we know exactly what's going to happen, we make a decision on go ahead and staff them right then? Yes. Essentially, we're going to have to staff them some way, shape, or form. We're going to have to staff them, and we need those ambulances for north of the town and the south of the town.

And then that would give us time to determine if we're going to staff them strictly as running an ambulance or staff four man stations.

In those two areas. We're going to have a minimum six months for them to get here too, right? Yes. Which is well beyond November. So can we form a plan of saying, let's go ahead, let's go to Lake Shore, and they'll give us those three ambulances. After November, we see what we're going to do as far as hiring people for the ambulances. We have to have ambulances. We can't hire people and not have ambulances. We can't have ambulances and not have people for them. So we're going to have to do something anyways. But we need those ambulances for north and south of the county.

so I would ask that part of this motion be when these ambulances arrive the county will insure the lakeshore hospital authority we will staff these ambulances in some form or fashion whatever it takes so then because I can tell you there's a lot of things we fund that's not as important as public safety exactly there's a lot of things we fund that's not important and we're sitting here telling the people that this is the lowest on our list to fund we don't know where we can cut any money to do this this is on the bottom of our list we got to find money for it and i'm telling you this should be on the top of our list to fund not the bottom it's at the top for me

So, Robby, can you amend your motion that you made?

I don't know. Approve staff. You know, and I won't. And another thing is, no matter what the governor does, if the people approve EMS, we're in like Flynn. We're going to be able to do it that day. You know what I mean? And we're talking about funding. You know, we're talking about full funding. So, I don't know. The attorney may have to tell me how to say that.

I don't know. Clarify what you mean when you say if the people approve EMS.

We're talking about the straw poll. I mean, that's when we'll know. you know, the straw poll we're doing. Oh, you're talking about the half-same sales? Yes, yes. Okay. When they say, we say we're ready, then we know that we have future, you know what I mean, we're going to be able to fund it. And those are the two things that happen in November. They either, you know, what happens there, and then also you have whatever the governor and them do as far as the or whatever happens with the the property tax thing so it there's two huge things that could affect that there's two things to go either way that can affect this in a in a huge way so i think i think i don't know how you i guess you would say approved status question donation from ls with funding only for current staffing until at which point we receive Y'all tell me how to write that out. You've lost me already. We want to buy a car, we can't buy it until November. If the people approve us buying that car, we're going to get out.

So what you're saying is unless they approve this half-cent sales tax draw ballot, the analysts are off the table.

No, because the next thing we have to see is what they do with property tax. There's no guarantee that that will get voted out. up or down. It'll win or lose. There's no guarantee either way. So it makes a big difference as to what you know I'm just saying our guarantee has to be to the people we're gonna make this happen whatever we have to do that should be our guarantee yeah but but we're not receiving any anything we're not even going to be able to do it until after November even if we right now say we're gonna put 20 million dollars between can't do anything till after November so let's it's all about taxpayers dollars and and I, as a businessman, I'm not going to go and say, I'm going to spend $5 million November 2nd, no matter what happens with my business. I'm just saying, I'm sure that we'll find a way. But right now, especially, there's two things that can happen, and they can go either way that'll make this a slam dunk, and we'll have the money to do it. Or we'll have to figure out how to get the money to do it.

And that's what I'm asking. We ensure electoral hospital authority. That we're going to man these ambulances if they buy them for us. Because I don't want them to come back next month and say, well, you know, we're going to buy these ambulances because we don't know how y'all are going to fund it. Are they going to just sit at our station or what? Y'all are not guaranteeing us anything here for us to spend $1.6 million.

And I concur with Rocky there because. like you said a minute ago, David, you know, yeah, this was a one-week put-together plan. We'll just call it like it is. And, you know, Lance has got, you know, concerns with it. And, you know, no doubt I'm sure our chief does, too, because they've been in conversation. I guarantee that. Negotiation with you guys. But my point is that Rocky's exactly right. You go after this, you've got to say, okay, we are going to put when these things arrive a year from now, I'm just using that as a number, these things arrive a year from now, we're going to have a plan to put that in place as that. That may be good enough for them, may not, I don't know. But at the end of the day, already going into budget like i asked before and we voted upon it we've already got a million six sitting over here that david and them's got to work with on the proposal you know the upworking of this current budget but but mr hollinsworth's exactly right there's so many moving parts of this budget it's the craziest one i've seen in the years i've been and i cannot imagine that we're going to let three amateurs sit in the garage right i just can't imagine that no i think um as i mentioned

we would be guaranteeing future property tax revenues. Because even if the amendment passes, you're still going to have property tax revenues. You're still going to tax vacation homes, river homes. You're going to tax commercial, industrial. We will lose $10 million. We already will probably next year, according to Jeff's numbers, collect, I think it was either $39 or $49 million next year. This year it was $36 or $46. So you have property tax dollars. So you can pledge property tax dollars to this. But no, depending on what happens in November, depending on what happens if citizens want to do a MSTU or a sales tax, that changes. So our plan is wait until we know what happens in november before we commit to how many people we're hiring what types of people we're hiring and then we're pledging the resources of property tax it's that simple well today but it could change given what happens in november or if they vote for a sales tax or msd and you beat me to it david but you're exactly right because you're going to have new monies irregardless you know time at times of growth so

there there's a part of a funding source you know in the you would just call it next year you know when the ambulances get here so to speak but my point is is that yes you can allocate that money as so but today was a perfect example you know until the insurance committee sat down and went in negotiations and thank god we've got a good you know we had good response this year on but i've also sat here and watched that that that health insurance go at 15 too and then frs had that big remember the year we got medicare medicaid yeah that big bump that that's and these are bumps that we have no say but but but but you've had a you hit a very very good point there and it goes along with what uh mr ford's saying you know your new monies a percentage of that has got to be in the back of your head okay well the growth in other places because and i also agree that there are some things that i think we fund uh rock that uh we could cut you know cut back on to be able to absorb cost of this but you know although ems is a very very important thing in my opinion you know because that person on that little dot map just a minute ago i know who that was at the very top i know i know the situation okay but my point is simply this is that I'm kind of hard. I think we need to really work towards, while we're doing this, keep in mind this minimum staffing thing, we really need to look at that hard because we are not getting no smaller. I like that. I've never seen this dot map, is what I'm going to call it, but I've never seen that before. That was pretty impressive. It's going to show you how much Fort White's grown up. Several years ago, whenever Lifeguard, I was sitting in that crowd, There wasn't that many dots down there. That's just the way it was.

And he's pulling it straight from 911 data.

But go ahead, Rocky. I'm sorry. I just want David to go to this map up here now. Kind of go over what the pie, the piece of the pie is public safety. What all does that include?

So public safety includes the sheriff's office, maintenance of the detention center, 911, dispatch, and communications, radio communications.

Okay. And then public health, what is that?

Let's see if I can remember them all. That is your Medicaid that you have to pay. It is your state agency that you pay. It is the coroner, the medical examiner you have to pay, and HICRA, which is a federal thing that sometimes you have to pay, sometimes you don't.

So those right there.

And I've got that breakdown if you'd like it.

So that right there, we spend three times more on that stuff you just mentioned than we do EMS.

Absolutely.

Three times more.

Absolutely.

Now put that in perspective. Yeah. Because we use a contractor.

Well, for years EMS was free.

You didn't spend any on it. But we know that's not working.

It doesn't, and it's never going to go back to that.

That's why we're here right now talking about this. But, you know, we're going to put a plan to the Lakeshore Hospital and Authority, and God knows they've been through a lot with theirs. I think they're going to understand what we're saying. We want to get the ambulances. The ambulances take forever to get. I don't believe for one minute any commissioner here is going to let those ambulances get here and just say, we're not going to staff and we're just going to be done with it. I just don't believe that's going to happen. My point is they asked for a plan. That's the plan. I'll go up there and speak to them when we do it.

And for all fairness, that's why I wanted your direction on this.

We have other things affecting this. We have a new law. We have a straw poll being done. We've got a lot of things that will affect what we do. I mean, I'm not going to go out and hire 13 people right now. And all I asked for was a guarantee to the electoral housing authority that we will man these houses.

That's all I asked for.

Mr. Chair?

Yes, sir.

From what I'm hearing, and if I'm wrong, please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm hearing that at this point in time we want to get the ambulances if we can and then make a decision on how to fund personnel after we know are we doing the ballot initiative and we have to cut $10 million or not? Are we going to do a sales tax or are we going to do an MSTU tax? Or how are we going to pay for them but the guarantee is they will be paid ultimately out of property tax. Unless another form of revenue comes about.

So David, you're saying, right now you're saying today that if this sales tax passes, we're going to be $10 million less revenue next year than what we are this year.

No, what I'm saying in the upcoming budget, in the upcoming budget, it has no impact. The budget after that, if it passes, because it's in November. So our budget for October will be in place by then.

This year's budget ain't going to change. It ain't going to change this year's budget. If we do like regular, we're going to gain about $5 million this year.

That is correct.

That's actually what we get new money every year, about $5 million.

Absolutely.

That's what the point I'm trying to make. Our budget next year is not going to be affected by this. That is correct. That's when we'll know what we have to do.

Yeah, I understand what Rocky's saying.

It's not going to be affected in January. But also, we know we've got the B&B coming on. That's going to be a big gas tax revenue. That's going to be a big property tax revenue.

And sales tax.

Exactly. We know we've got a lot of things coming on. Can you spend gas tax on EMS? Yes. No. We can spend it on roads, and we're funding the road project with the budget right now, a million dollars a year out of general funds right now.

I think what he's trying to say is, and please don't let me speak for you, is that he believes the growth will be enough to help offset this.

Because we know we've got several ongoing projects that will happen.

It's always a timing question. When do they come in, and when do you collect the money?

Yeah, and we cannot... You done, Rocky? I'm done. I understand what Rocky's saying, but also just like at your home, just like with taxpayers, just like at your home, if you find out in November, honey, we're not going to have, we have this much money coming in and next year we're going to be 10 million short we better be preparing for that right now not not next week not so what i'm saying is i understand what you're saying rocky but in november if they vote to take that 10 million which i'm against i don't like property tax either i don't blame them for it i don't blame the people who are voting that i don't like property tax anymore and anybody's unfair to me so if they do that we don't just spend money like we've been doing all these years, our next budget will not be like this one this year. We're not missing that 10 million. Next year in November, when they say we're gonna lose $10 million in property taxes, we gotta start adjusting our spending now, in my opinion, just in case, but especially in November when that happens. So that's why I say we have to figure out a way to do this. But then again, Rocky, the the straw poll may say we'll pay you know what i mean so it's all up in the air but i don't have any problem saying that i don't know what to say that's what we're trying to say what to say in the motion here that's what we're talking about right so if somebody will give me a a way to word that i'm not looking at the motion now so it's hard for me to do that so mr uh procedurally you have a motion on the floor to accept staff's recommendation

The discussion I just heard is that this board does not want to accept staff recommendation because you want to plan for staffing. And there's uncertainty about how to pay for it. So my recommendation to the board would be to vote on that motion first, give yourself a clean slate, sounds like it'll probably fail, vote on it, give yourself a clean slate and then start over.

with a fresh motion unless you want to withdraw your motion I'll withdraw that motion and if you can show me the motion again we'll can I make a motion I can well if you will Mr.

Chair I can make a recommendation to how I think you guys should proceed here based on the conversation I just heard is direct staff to go back and bring you a more thorough plan that does include the actual cost of minimum staffing i think the fire department's given you ideal staffing which would be 13 individuals six for each ambulance and a supervisor if you can get a minimum or if that is in fact the minimum but i think you need a number for that And then I do know what the hospital authority is looking for is exactly as Commissioner Ford indicated and as Commissioner Hollingsworth indicated, a commitment that if they buy you three ambulances, you will absolutely use them. And the interlocal agreement that I'm working on says that if for any reason you stop using them, they go back to the authority. So it's a clawback, right? So that will be the assurance you will give them is we will use them. Because I don't know that you can provide them an adequate level of assurance about how much money you're going to spend staffing because you don't know right now. So that's kind of where you are procedurally. Can I restate the motion, what it says?

If you don't mind, Commissioner, give me just one second before you do that. Lance, you just said something. I want to make sure it's clear. Joel alluded to hiring 12 people would fix minimum staffing. But you're not saying that. No, no, 13. But the 12 that you're recommending hiring are EMTs that will run the ambulances only. Is that correct? Yes, sir.

That's the minimum staffing for the ambulances. Correct. The staff, the two of them, 24-7.

Did you hear what he said? That's why I kind of stopped because I just wanted to make that point. And that's not what we're saying at this point in time is that – minimum staffing on fire protection i think is a very necessary if we need to really work as hard as we're working on this we need to work on this no doubt but my point i just didn't want it to get uh dusted up here that that 12 just because we bring that 12 in a minimum staff that was gonna now i believe we'll hire some with uh paramedic values and what if that's what you want to call but i think it's staff's responsibility to come together with this plan because again i'm not going to vote to go out there we're going to hire 13 people later on at this point in time when i all the discussion mr uh holland's work just had i agree with them wholeheartedly but put minimal staffing together. However we work this out, you know, that's up to y'all. There's nothing that can be done in a two-hour meeting or three-hour or whatever it is. But I just wanted to clear that up, because I've seen Lance's eyes kind of roll up back and forth.

Go ahead, Rob. So I just want to refer back to what Mr. Krause told me more than once. You tell me what you want, and I'll figure out how to fund it. Yes. Have you not told me that several times?

I'll tell you right now.

Okay.

That's my job is you tell me what you want and I have to figure out how to fund it. My recommendation is to fund it through property tax, guaranteed funding for property tax. But that funding may change depending on what happens in November and what happens if you decide to go to a sales tax or what happens if you decide to invoke the MSTU at a future date.

And Mr. Ford, I agree with you. That's what I asked in the previous meeting. Bring back that whole, you know, because Jeff compiled these numbers here as far as the, you know, to operate them, which I think is as accurate as they can be. But I agree with you that, you know, we need to look at the whole plan as to where the cut is going to come and what happens. Give me just a second, Rob. Go back to the pie real quick. There you go. Public health, public service, other constitutional officers. I wanted to point out, pay attention, that says property tax section. Most of that is statutory. There's nothing that can be changed. Am I correct?

Let me be clear. If the amendment passes, it gives you seven things that you have to spend your property tax on. There's one of them that's kind of a fudge factor. I'm not going to lie to you. The last one's kind of a fudge factor. But the state is trying to tell you, we want to see that property taxes go to these agencies. So that's why we applied. Now, in the past, you could spend the property taxes how you want. But if you don't spend it on these things, you're going to have to fund it through sales tax or small county coalition tax or other. You have a whole lot of revenues. Property tax is just a small part of your total revenue pie.

But most of these things, public health, public safety, and the cost of these offers are mandated. And that's what the legislature... We're going to pay, regardless of where the money comes from. Right now, we're just chose to pay it out of property. all these things are mandated you don't really have a whole lot of choice you can whittle it away a little bit here and there but you won't come up with 10 million out of these things and boy this is what i'm hoping that we can send out with percentages on it you know with the trims i know it's going to cost us money but this will give this will be one more uh piece of information that the taxpayer can understand because every one of us have had the conversation with constituents that you know the sheriff's office takes up most of your you know because it's a large operation and uh but a lot of people don't understand that you know but i'll just say i think what david is and i ain't trying to put words in your mouth either but i think what you're saying is i'll find a way but i can't tell you where that how that way is going to be until i see the actual revenues we're getting

Correct. Is that what I'm saying?

That is true.

And I agree with that 100%. But at the end of the day, you said I will find a way.

If you tell me to, that's my job.

Exactly. Okay. I just want to clarify.

So typically, we don't get into the revenue picture this early in the budget cycle because the state doesn't issue their revenue projections until middle of July. So we're way ahead of even the state telling us how much money they're going to give us. We just had the governor adopt the budget. So now we at least can start putting together how much money is in that budget that just got adopted that will be revenues that the county has. And then again, the state DOR will put out, this is what we think fuel taxes will be. This is what we think sales taxes will be.

We're ahead of where the true revenues are.

We're guessing at revenues at this point. And I don't like giving you guesses. I would rather get a much firmer number on revenues before we start really talking about how much money do we have. But what we do know is, according to Jeff, normal growth, not the addition of new industries, not the addition of new commercials, normal growth this year should get us about $3 to $4 million. And that's not talking about year-end monies or any of that stuff. That's just growth in how much he would collect or he would assess.

So we need to go back. It doesn't matter what happens in November. This county has still got to add on to our EMS to make our county hold.

Am I right? Yes.

If you want to. That's where you're going to come in and say, look, I'll work all this out and make sure we do it the right way and get it in the right form. and you can make the money come out.

So the first question I would have is, I'm presenting to you a plan that says we're going to use these ambulances only in cases of mutual aid. So we're not going to be running calls all day long. If the board agrees with that, that allows us then to proceed on that assumption. If the board says, no, we want them to run calls all day long. If I'm going to pay for an ambulance, they're going to be running calls. That's a whole different scenario. So that's what I need direction on.

Not even sure you do that with the current contract. Is that correct?

You'd have to see. Thomas and I have had a conversation on this. It goes down to public Thomas Stinson, the operational manager. It's public safety. If our ambulance is closer to somebody having an emergency, that ambulance is going, period. And Maripro will not combat that because it's in the best interest of your citizens.

And it's in those outlines also.

Yes, yes.

So we're all discussing this trying to find a motion. So we will find a way. I mean, I don't see the motion. Put that motion back. We've always got to have them just perfect. Can you put the motion over here?

Oh, you had me change it.

We're discussing for the last 20 minutes.

There we go.

Okay. Approve staff to request amateur donation from LSA with funding, with funding to be, with funding to be, um, to be, uh, there's just so many ways it can happen. You know, if we get the, if we get the straw poll, you know what I mean?

Can I make a recommendation? Can I make a recommendation?

Oh, go ahead.

So, i think what me and robbie both are trying to say and we agree on that we approve the staff to request eminence donation from lakeshore hospital with the understanding by the time these eminences arrive we will have a plan and funding in place to staff these emphasis at that time okay here's my motion

i moved i moved to it i just made a motion he just made a motion okay all right i i would say i would i would add that i don't have staff are we are we saying are we seconding that motion before we keep talking okay okay yeah we need a second for discussion if you want to put your other point so second for discussion I'll second for discussion, but this is what I'm saying. To me, the motion should be approve staff to request amnesty donation from LSHA with funding to be determined by staff at the time after November because of the, you know, or after November whatever, and have staff determine the funding at that time to staff these amnesties. I can understand. i think we're talking about two different questions rocky's talking about whether to fund and commissioner hollingsworth is saying where does the money come from

that make sense commissioner ford says come hell or high water we're funding it commissioner hollywood's saying from what source to determine what source of funding that'll be up to our county manager and i think that's what commissioner ford's motion does is leaves it with your budget officer to determine the best so i think commissioner ford's motion skins the cat

I think that will solve this whole problem that in the event you know because Lakeshore Hospital Authority is looking for some type of guarantee if you want to say but my point is simply if they go ahead and put forth the money take care of that And we don't because this board could change in November. And my point is, is that if the board did change, you know, you can't restrict them from voting that proposed budget down. So I guess the caveat was assumed to need to be in there to words of that. If the hospital authority at that time is not satisfied with our funding mechanism, we got to refund them that one six. That solved all. You know what I'm saying? Because the points that Mr. Hollisworth is making is 100% valid because can't nobody look past that witness who looks out the other side. And that's the critical point that we're in. I would ask one of the two, it's in Mr. Ford's... He made the motion to add that caveat to it, correct, Neal?

Well, the interlocal agreement will be separately negotiated and presented. And understand, hospital authority hadn't committed anything yet. That's correct. You're giving us parameters to go out and get the commitment. What I'm telling you is I've already started preparing that interlocal with basically exactly what you said, Commissioner Murphy. But I had said give the ambulances back, but they'll probably say give us back our 16. Right. So that would be the clawback, and that's the guarantee. So I think it works. So that could be in the interlocal agreement, right? Well, that's the point, is that would be in the interlocal agreement. We are not negotiating today.

All of this will come back to this board before anything's done in the form of an interlocal agreement. This is to give us direction to help draft the interlocal agreement and to come back to the hospital.

So we've got a motion on the table. We've got a motion and a second. You've already got a second? Yeah. Okay, good. We've got a motion and a second. And before we vote, Mr. Looker,

Chairman, while he's coming up, Dale's here. You might want to just have to ask Dale if he thinks the short lecture would require something different than what we've done here. Because we've talked about a lot of things. I just, yeah.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just got a couple of things here. On the chart with the graph, the pie chart, this is usual. Nobody at home can see this. There's no numbers. It doesn't say how much money anything represents, and it doesn't say percentages. I don't know. You know, you guys have been doing this a long time. Mr. Ford's nodding his head. Everybody should be nodding their head. This is disgraceful. The county manager says, well, I have numbers someplace else. It's just wrong. It's wrong to the public not to be able to see this at home at any time. That's the first thing. The other thing is, could you go to the dots, please? What do the dots represent? A heat map gives you a better idea. What does each dot represent?

One call.

One call. Each dot represents one call. So I said there was like 1,500. There was like 2,000 calls or something total between fire and EMS. How many calls were there? Thousands. There's not 1,000 dots on that. So, sir?

Go ahead, go ahead.

There's not a thousand. And I put in a public records request. And I will tell you something that I mentioned to Dale Williams before that this county, it was never problems with public records. I've been into the fire department. Apparently, Mr. Crawford doesn't like to cough up public records. I put that in when he was here. I asked when he was standing up, shaking that budget around. He just ignored it. I put in for the call data. I got half of it, and part of that was screwed up on the county side, which accidents do happen and mistakes. But that's been outstanding for a week, and I haven't gotten that from the fire department either, data that you guys need to make this kind of decision. But I don't think all these dots represent all these calls, because there's thousands of calls. So there's maybe 2,000. Mr. Hill is kind of shaking his head yes. There's thousands. This is not accurate. This is just May and June. So this is not even a year of calls. So this doesn't represent what's gone on here in the last year and a half or the last year. Represents two months. And the final thing, Mr. Chairman, is how much time does this clock say? Nobody can see the clock. 44 seconds. Sir?

44 seconds.

Thank you very much. There's no telling. That should be turned around so speakers know. There's no telling, number one, if the hospital authority is going to approve this. Number two, if the hospital authority's even gonna be there, the authority is now an illegally constituted board, there is no hospital. They're gonna get the ambulances back. The county would get them anyway because if the hospital authority ever decides to go out of business, then you guys get everything that's at the hospital authority. So Mr. Foreman is just wasting time and the county's money by making an interlocal agreement with no legal opinion from the hospital authority's crack attorney about what's going on because the interlocal agreement is useless because they're going to go away. Thank you very much.

Appreciate it, Jeremy. Okay. I've got a motion and a second.

You want to have Dale? I'm sorry. You want us to talk now?

You had a chance. You went out the door one time and you should have stayed.

Well, I can tell you Dale ain't going nowhere because he's been here hundreds

It's hard for me to find words, but I'll try to talk.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the board. Here's the way I would look at it, given your discussion. Number one, the interlocal agreement is where I would think it would begin. There's two things that need to be included in that. Just like you have restricted revenues, the authority has restricted revenues. To me, the bigger issue in all of this is that Joel and the attorney for the authority, they have to work out the language which makes the purchase of EMS units a legal purchase. Or else they have to punt and find another way to fund. Basically, maybe give you money for indigent runs in the past or whatever that may have occurred but been uncompensated for.

But the legality...

how they use the public's money which they don't control just like you don't control it has to be a major component of that interlocal once that is determined between Joel and Todd then it can specify how this will be funded I'm simply of the opinion that if they don't come to some conclusion that the authority can buy a EMS unit directly, they will find another way in which to provide funding to the county in order to purchase. That may very well dictate the second part of the equation about the funding of the EMS units altogether. You may just end up with a check and you do the purchasing directly. I don't know. not saying that's going to happen i'm just saying that all of that is yet to be determined so it's just not okay we're going to make a request we're going to order you three ambulances and a deal it's just not that clean and it hasn't been from day one the initial indication was from the attorney for the authority and also in talking to mr foreman is yes we do believe that there is a pathway where the authority can use the public money that it holds in order to assist the county in this regard and they've got to word that and they're the ones that are going to have to indemnify everybody for saying yeah okay that that's correct in that same agreement depending on what they determine They can put the language in about the units or whether it's just cash or whatever it may be that they decide on. But one has to come before the other.

And Mr. Chair, the interlocal agreement will include specific legislative findings of this board as well as the hospital authority board with respect to those legal considerations. So that's part of what Mr. Kennan and I are working on is what legislative findings do, particularly the hospital authority trustees, need to be satisfied that certain things are true. right that this will in fact benefit the indigent that this will benefit the underserved that this meets with their mission so those legislative findings will be adopted by the hospital authority board when they vote on the interlocal and then would be ratified by you so mr. mr. wins absolutely correct There's a lot of little, and Mr. Looker's correct, there's a lot of unresolved moving parts that we have to check all those boxes to make sure that when you vote on it and this substantial amount of money is paid over or if it's applied to something, that it's all going to hold water.

And also, just to clarify because it come up, if the authority is abolished or if the authority's legal standing is changed in some way, What the authority's understanding is is that anything that they put in place that needs to continue needs to be memorialized in formal agreements. So the interlocal, even if the authority doesn't exist at some point in the future, it may help with memorializing those things. We're building a primary care center. That primary care center is supported by an agreement. If authorities functions should transfer one day to the county we would expect that those would continue now of course the transfer of the funds and the other assets go with that but that's the importance of memorializing it in writing now it is true what Mr. Locher said you buy ambulances there's no authority you're going to give them back to nothing I mean, they would become whoever would be responsible for maintaining the authority's responsibilities at that point, whoever that may be. But I feel like I might have confused you more than I've helped you.

I don't know. It's not footwork. It's nobody's mouth. But the MOU is a big hinge point here. but I think with the way Mr. Ford presented his motion and got a second here I think we're clear enough to the point that we can put the lawyers to work let's get going I think if it's done and done properly and I'm sure it will be when it's presented it will cover all of these issues

the legality of it, as well as any guarantees that were requested in one document, and it's done.

All right. Thank you much, Dale. I appreciate you coming up. Okay.

And having said that, if you did know you wanted to buy ambulances, you still have to go through procurement. Sure. There's still legal things that have to be done.

A lot of work.

Okay.

All right. So, uh, Got a motion and a second. All in favor say aye. Aye.

So the next thing is the ballot question. Now this is a very, very basic ballot question. You may want to change it or add things to it. We were talking with Joel, our attorney, and he said it has to be in the form of a yes or no question. So you can't have like three or four different options. Once you have the language, we have to get it translated into Spanish and get it to Tommy before August 1st. And so the question is, do you want this on the ballot? And if so, what do you want it to say?

I'm reading that. I just want it to be plain and simple where people can understand it. That's good.

David, if I may, it says to provide... our ems to contract but it says consider funding in-house ems will this property tax only paid that i guess what i'm trying to say if we decided or board in the future decided that they're not wanting to come back in-house and will that have set sales tax enable us to fund part of our prop up that we call it if that's what the board wants yes and you may want to change the language to reflect that Okay. I think Joel has a comment. This is a little bit different than what I read.

This is a straw poll. If this got 100% yeses, you're still not bound to anything by it. Just using that language. Now, another way to ask this question is would you favor a new tax to fund pms services right and then that's a little more broad because you could also maybe use that money to subsidize the expense of of retaining the private contractor because that price is just going to go up so you could leave it a little more it just depends on what question you want to ask your voters it's a straw poll it doesn't bind you anything uh regardless whether it passes or

And I'm not, I personally, I think the simpler you keep it, the better off it is. But my point is, is that, you know, again, I say a future board for now may not support the way this looks because it's non-binding, just like you said. And, but I personally would think everybody I've talked to, hey, would you be willing to pay half cents? to pay for your medical services. Absolutely. To this day, I've had nobody say no. That's just me. Rocky?

I think that you need to clarify, though. They will still be billed for this service also. It's not paying for their emergency medical services because they will be billed for this service also. So, when you presented that question just now that you said that, we're not paying for their emergency ambulance service. They're paying for it still, or their ambulance is paying for it. This is subsidizing.

Okay, good point, Rocky. Because I think that could get foggy.

So the other thing is, we did not mention what tax, if you want to specifically say a sales tax, you can.

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. I think we need to have that in there to say what it's actually going to be, so it's not just... We're thinking of something else. If it's going to be a half cent sales tax, I think we should say, you know, if it's going to be funding a county run EMS through a half cent sales tax.

Because they're already supposed to be getting a break on property taxes. I don't want to go and say, well, if you want to do funds, you know what I mean? It's kind of a...

That's a good point. That's a very good point.

I think it ought to say that. Do you support funding running EMS through a one-half cent sales tax versus a new tax? Because a new tax, my thought is, okay, you saved me on private tax, but now you're adding it right back to me. But if you say a half cent sales tax, that clarifies what it is versus being a new tax.

And to Mr. Ford's point, Kevin, when the half cent sales tax goes up, know the the clarification part that rocky alluded to i think it needs to 100 take clear place are we having a great joel on the way this is working today yes okay we would like to have a language because as as david indicated we need to translate it under current rules and we have to have it translated and ready to go

to the supervisor August 1st, before August.

No later than August 1st.

Yeah.

So we're earlier, the better. Mr. Parnell, I mean, uh,

run over that again and uh if you'd like to put that in the motion we'll go from there so we'll put it to where it says uh i make a motion that we the verbiage states uh clemmy county currently provides private emergency medical services through contract clemmy county is considering a funding considering funding an in-house ems do you support funding a county-run ems through

a one half cent sales tax but you got to put new in there well with a new one half cent sales tax yep and you're going to leave that on there this is a non-binding stroll poll question patrol stroll poll question oh yeah you have to yeah it's non-binding because then we have a the next year we'll actually put in 2028 you would have it on that november this is just this is what all y'all want i feel like every one of y'all want to do before we i will for any taxes are implemented i want to make sure the people of columbia county are okay with that they're not okay with it we're going to do it okay and that's why we're doing this to ask them for it ask them what they what our thoughts are so we're not just putting something wrong that's right on our constituents go on forth and plan a future right budget you know

So, Kevin, that's the motion.

That's the motion. I mean, this happened with the school system. They said, hey, we need some more money to fix up schools. You know, people, people, people.

Give them an option to support what they want to support.

That's right. That's right. And that's how I want to do that.

Motion on the table. Got a motion. I'm going to get them out of here. Anybody? Come on up here while they're figuring out who's going to. Keep it straight. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I have a couple of questions. It's a little confusing to me. I may not be the brightest light in the sky. It says for a county, funding county EMS, is that the county run EMS or county subsidized? It doesn't say. Well, in-house, so does that mean the subsidization goes away? Is that what they're approving? Because this is the fund in-house. So it's still not clear whether the public is going to have county-owned, county-operated, county-run EMS, or this is just a continue. I mean, this is not clear at all. The other thing I have, which Mr. Foreman maybe can help me, I don't remember the exact name of it, is there's a public safety sales tax, which the county can... institute which gives you up to no it doesn't say there's two kinds of sales taxes so this doesn't say which sales taxes this if you can you guys have the ability to add a half cent sales tax another one and that goes that if you remember your conversation about hamilton county that would make columbia county the either the highest or the second highest sales tax county in the state something you may want to consider But the public safety tax allows you to tax in increments, but you can go up to 1%. So you might want to consider that. The sales tax is not defined here, Commissioner. So you might want to rephrase this, and you really do have to do this today to get it on the ballot from what I understand, is exactly if you want to use a public Safety tax or whatever the correct terminology is at, which gives the board a lot more leeway. And that's a defined purpose. That tells you what it's for. So those are my comments. I think this still needs a little bit of work. It's up to you guys. I don't vote. I only vote for you. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chair? Yes, sir. Mr. Loker is correct. There is something called a public safety surtax that is up to 1% and can be levied in 25% increments. The question to the board is, do you want to be that specific? Because you can't adopt it with the straw poll. The straw poll does not adopt a sales tax. Whether it's a surcharge, whether it's a generic surcharge, this won't adopt a tax.

And when it comes back after a straw poll, it can be determined whether or not it's a public service tax or a half-sale service tax.

Correct. The wording you have says in-house EMS. That is the wording you currently have.

So what you are saying is it can be a surtax or a sales tax, whichever one. They're both the same. They still come out of sales tax.

The general public, they don't see a difference.

They don't.

There's some legal issues that are different, but the general public.

So we can do either one once this is passed by the people, or if it fails, we do nothing, right?

Up to the board.

Yeah, yeah. The new board. You don't ever know who's going to be there. Okay.

Any further discussion?

So the only suggestion I would offer is with respect, if you wanted to call it a one-half cent public safety sales tax, that would narrow your scope.

That's going to bring both of them together.

And then... my point about just saying a you know fund ems versus fund in-house the way this is written if you get yeses on this that would be the public telling you to both go in-house and charge a sales tax so you're kind of asking two questions at the same time so do we need i mean an emotion

it just needs to reflect what you want towards public safety before sales tax i think we want to do that so i mean it'd be up to you okay so we'll change that we'll change that line so well i'll min my motion do you support funding accounting around ems through a one-half cents public safety plus a safety sales tax right that's what it states with a question mark okay and i'll second that motion as a man got a motion in the second all in favor say aye aye okay okay

Because I'm against any new tax.

So the next item is a request for a special meeting. We're looking for the special meeting on July 23rd, which is a Thursday after your second meeting of the month. So it'd be the third week of the month. That is also probably the date of the planning and zoning meeting.

Is that correct?

Don't they meet? Yeah. So if you want to change the date, we can. We'd not like it to be any later than that. It is to discuss data centers, update on the budget, and setting the preliminary millage rates, because you will have to set the preliminary millage rates, which again is the maximum, not necessarily the final. And again, this year, setting millage rates is going to be different, because if you don't get four votes, the rollback rate is adopted. do more than the rollback rate to do the we want to keep the tax rate the same requires at least four votes it's opposite of what it was last and that'll be at the okay it'll be so basically whatever day you guys want to have that workshop we just need to set it so we can bring in the data center people

You're recommending the 23rd, is that correct?

I recommended the 23rd, but if you have a different date, there's no magic to the 23rd. 23rd of July, yes. We'd rather it not be later than the 23rd.

And this one has to be after 5 p.m. because you've got the millage rate issue.

Right, and it's a special meeting, so you'll have, yeah.

Say that again, Joe. This has to be in the evening. You don't have the ability to set this early.

And then, so let me see. Okay. I'll go to the 23rd.

The 23rd works for me, too.

Rob? Let me see here. I think so.

Yeah, let's go ahead and set it up for the 23rd. Okay, Rob. Yeah, yeah. I got one week I'm going to be going from town 25th through October the 1st. So that's next Thursday.

No, no, no.

The 23rd. Thursday after your second meeting.

Yeah.

Three weeks. Three weeks from now, not next Thursday. So we're going to have it before our afternoon meeting or after?

No, the after meeting is the week before.

You can't have it before 5.

You can have it as part of that same meeting. Oh, it's got to be a meeting, not a workshop, right? It's got to be a meeting, and because we're going to talk about military, you have to be there.

And if you want to vote on data centers or moratorium or whatever, you have to be at a meeting. You could have a workshop.

You will not be voting. But we will have to put this on the 16th. You will not be voting on a moratorium at that meeting. Okay. It has to be done by ordinance. You won't be prepared for that. So it can't be a workshop? No, no, no. It needs to be a special meeting because of the millage rate issue. Right.

We can move the millage rate to the 16th if we have to. I'm good.

23rd is fine with me. Okay. All right.

Everybody's good with the 23rd?

At what time?

530.

We did the motion. Do we have a motion?

We had a motion. We did a motion. The meeting would have to be at 5.30, correct? And you can call if you don't need a motion. Okay, I can call the meeting. You got your order at 5.30.

All right. So then you had four items that were added. Not a big deal. The first one is a release of lien for the ship. They want the lease released so that they can go through a closing because it's being refinanced.

Move to release the lien. Got a motion and a second. All in favor say aye. Aye.

You are at a CDBG housing grant that is closing out within three months. It cannot be extended after that point. There's one property left. $80,000, which is in the standard application, was not enough to cover the improvements that need to be done. Your HAP allows you to go up to $160,000. The funds are available. We're requesting you Approve the increase in award from $80,000 to $160,000 for 209 Southwest Fabian Way.

This is in my district. And this is, I don't know what happened here, but this young lady's in a really bad way. So I'll make a motion to approve it. And I hope that we have, if there's something that's causing something to be missed or, you know, if there's some organizational thing that needs to be better, I would like to look into that.

zoning was part of the issue as well yeah what was there was a zoning issue zoning oh okay okay uh is that a form of a motion yeah i mean you probably got a motion motion to approve second got a motion second no further discussion all in favor say aye aye all opposed okay so the next one is one you've talked about before it is the grant for the historic richardson high school renovations

The estimate we have on the cost of the project is $1.5 million. There's at least a 25% match, but given the funding mechanism, the way it works, it will be more than that. So you will have to fund or find a way of funding $500,000 minimum on the project. So we just want to make sure as we move forward, you're aware of that. The application is due, I think, in a week and a half.

So basically, with the grant, we'll still have another $500,000? I know what you're saying.

They won't fund any more than a million.

Won't fund any more than a million. It's 1.5, 1.4 something.

The project is 1.5, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Okay, now, I thought I looked in the backup, didn't it? Not qualify for the 25%.

It does, but if you only do the 25%, you won't have enough money to finish the project. So the question is, do you want to finish the project or not? Okay. The project, according to Danny Kale, the project costs 1.5 million. This is over at Richardson, correct? Yes.

need a motion well yeah well I mean we need to approve that we need to they need that the historical ground over there is needed we've missed some stuff with them before want to make sure that we get everything we need for Richland Community Center and the high school there with it so we need that on here so I make a motion we approve second okay we got a motion second all in favor say aye aye no and there again I know we need this but there's a half a million dollars

we're looking at this is the kind of stuff that we've got to put ems in front of and then the last item is future meeting space i'll keep this real short school district asked us to consider moving to the richardson sixth grade center because they're not um they have some security issues they would like to address or increase our security here at the center here if we continue to use here um the plan is and i've discussed it with some of you and i'll just make it public that when kyle moves out of the annex where your license plates are we would empty that room and turn it into a meeting space for the board of county commissioners at minimal costs because the room's already there it'll cost more to retrofit it into offices to retrofit the sixth grade center um It's a very large auditorium. The seats are in good shape. There is no audio system. There's no internet. There's no video system. The bathrooms at the lobby are not handicapped accessible. The only handicapped accessible bathrooms, you would have to go out of the building, go around the building to backstage, and go backstage for the handicapped accessible, which means that they would be coming in behind you during a meeting. So I don't think that's really plausible, but I just wanted to inform you that... We may have to increase security until we can find other alternatives.

Why are we having increased security? Has something happened?

I will tell you off record, I don't want to divulge the security issues that the school system has without the school system doing it.

So basically, we've got to find a new meeting place.

Well, we can increase security until we find a new meeting space, yes.

At the end of the day, we've got to move.

At the end of the day, we've got to move, though.

At the end of the day...

would be better off moving yes yeah so how big is that room that when he leaves how i have the actual dimensions uh it's actually quite large the fire department lance are you still here you estimated it would hold about 105 110. oh yeah yeah i i'm gonna tell you and then you got staff not having to come i mean let's just make it easier for everybody you know and and as long as we got enough room for people to come in public and again

If there's a meeting that you expect more than 100 people, we can come here still. Or a community center. Additional security. Or a community center. Absolutely.

So I've been wanting to have our own place. Anyhow, it's not going to cost us hardly any money. Let's do that.

The cost of moving into that building would just be your sound system, your AV system. And if you want a fancy diocese, a fancy diocese.

And I'm going to... tell you we need better sound system we need better video system and for our meeting you know all right that's it thank you very much that's the problem with here because you can't hear enough you know too many people got their hands in it but the uh well anyway and we can't just have a meeting when we want to we gotta schedule it make sure it's open okay uh

you'll come back to us dave with that okay at this point in time i'll open the public comments and at this point in time a bobby papper bobby as you're making your way up here i'll just put my finger up when you got about 30 seconds but we got a timer right here we'll work we'll work on something different but we got three minutes public comment we're just gonna beat an old horse so we'll get be real quick

All right, it's beat. My issue is this panhandling's gotten out of control.

Give your name to her, please.

Bobby Pafford. Been a longtime resident, born and raised here. I know about all of you. It's panhandling. It's now become a public safety issue. They're standing in the middle of the roads. When you're driving, the law says you're supposed to concentrate on your driving and what is around you. Having somebody standing in the middle of the road, walking up to you with a sign, that's creating a safety issue. It's distracting you from driving. When you start pulling forward at Walmart, all of a sudden a car stops in front of you to hand them money.

Now you rear-end them.

That's a safety issue. Now if y'all are going to issue some permits, charge $50 per person per day to panhandle if they want to. That'll stop it. There's some income for you that y'all have been looking for. also north carolina has this thing no panhandling passing to and from vehicles prohibited prohibited in roadway ordinance one six dash two six six posted now charge people that are stopping in the roadway handing them if they got money to hand out they got money for a hundred dollar fine there's more income for you that y'all been looking for we need to do something about this people's tired you're our county leaders time to get off the ball boys Pass a rule.

I'm done. That exact picture was sent to me probably by one of your friends or somebody. And when I saw it, I was like, you know, when you say no panhandling, you got people that want to get money for their schools and, you know, hold up signs on the sidewalk, which to me, that's not, you know, that stuff in the middle of the road has got to be dangerous. If you hit them, you're going to get sued. Right. If they're legally there.

And then you've got EMS, you've got firefighters coming that you are saying that's costing money to run. So now we're eliminating that cost. So you're helping.

And I was talking to, I don't know if you've talked to the guy that lives in my neighborhood, but anyhow, he's dealing with the city on the park benches that they're sleeping on. So those park benches aren't owned by us, not owned by the city. They're dealing with that right now. And some of them are on county. That's right. So they're dealing with that. But we really do need to take up that situation there. I sent that. You've got that photo, don't you, David? Yes, you just sent. We need to find out how we do that because I'm with you. Trying to get out of Publix and people trying to get out of there and people stopping and everybody honking and trying to get people out of there and they're stopping people from moving. Same thing at the mall or at the Walmart opening. traffic is being held up by all that and and that one area there where it's two foot wide there's people standing on so i agree with you i i we do need to look into this a little heavier you know we have other counties to do it but i know that this is a huge issue for for the law and joel's over there probably going to look but oh no i've already been down this road yeah yeah we've been down the road and lost appreciate it You know, there's got to be something that, like that North Carolina town or whatever it is there, it's upheld there. But maybe they hadn't had the right, you know.

So we adopted Alachua County's ordinance, which said you may not pass the white line to pass things in. We made it a violation for the operator of the vehicle. We made it a violation for the person. We said it was a public safety issue. That statute, or excuse me, that ordinance in the state of Florida has been defeated multiple times. And again, I agree with this gentleman. I think it is a public safety issue. The problem is the federal judges don't agree. They say it is a content-based restriction on free speech. They say asking for money is free speech. There is a permitting mechanism that can be implemented. $50 a day won't pass strict scrutiny, but there is a permitting mechanism we can talk about. The problem is it has to apply to everybody, right? So your folks going out there trying to raise money for the Little League team would have to pay the same permit fee. It's not as easy as it sounds. As recently as this is an opinion of the 11th district court of appeal, which is one of the most conservative district courts of appeal in the country, which also happens to be our district court of appeal. And, um, in, uh, excuse me, circuit 11th circuit, uh, June 25th, 2026, the city of Daytona had an ordinance trying to curb panhandling completely struck down, completely struck down. So I agree with the gentleman. It is a problem if we do try to combat it, but we are losing at the

Well, there's one gentleman that was actually interviewed, and he has been doing this in Lake City for eight years, and this is how he makes his living. He's getting paid.

Yeah, absolutely. There's no doubt. Again, everything you're saying is factually correct. We're not having success with the federal courts, and not just us, the city of Daytona, Alachua County. Everybody's trying to fight this. It is a losing fight. is there any way we can get the sheriff involved to start writing tickets for interfering with the flow of traffic causing again it's maybe maybe you know but that would be for him to decide and that would be a matter of state law um every time we start talking about this it always delves into a first amendment issue the reason people can ride down the road playing their music at all sorts of volume first amendment right the reason they're able to put profane stickers on their car First amendment. And so we constantly run into that as a governmental agency.

Bobby, I appreciate you coming up. Thank you a lot. We're all on your side. Believe me. We're cut out. Okay, at this point in time, Ms. Debra Fellows. Debra, same thing. I have about 30 seconds. I'm trying to hold you up. I'll just put my hand up there. Go ahead and turn around. You're going to hear the beep anyway, but

Okay. Hi, my name is Debbie Fellows. I've been here a hundred times over the last two years. You all have been notified that I have the intent to sue the county, the sheriff's department. The court system is a whole nine yards. It is going to cost this county thousands, if not millions of dollars for what the sheriff's department and the lack of movement from everybody involved has done to me. I was illegally arrested on February 28. The sheriff, without a warrant or probable cause, entered into my property, handcuffed me when I blacked out because I have a traumatic brain injury from assault and battery on November 28 by the people that put the complaint in on me. They sat there, the sheriff sat there and watched me face down in the dirt with no ambulance coming for 22 minutes. I have asked for public records requests from the Sheriff's Department, and since April 22nd, I have put in six public records requests. Sheriff Kitchens and Captain Dees, I think it's Captain, refuses to give me the unredacted video. of one of the incidents that led up to this. This is a misdemeanor charge in the state of Florida. They are violating their laws. We all saw that pie. That pie, the Sheriff's Department gets more than twice what the public gets times two. There was two accidents by two of the deputies that are named in this suit. Corporal Latimer and Deputy Aaron caddy both of them totaled out their police cruisers we've made public records requests for these accidents what caused it dot records for their blood alcohol and drug nothing radio silence the sheriff does not follow their own laws you're talking about increasing the public's tax rate but while giving a sheriff's department that is operating illegally and unconstitutional this county is being sued and it's not only by me there are video after video after video on on social media of corporal latimer walking well he walked onto private property and without a warrant and probable cause he was asked to leave he did not leave This is illegal. Attorney, what are we going to do about this?

Thank you, Mr. Ellis. And I'll just sit while you walk your way back. Excuse me? We have no jurisdiction over the sheriff.

You have jurisdiction over the budget.

We do. And if this money... Okay, make your way through there. But I understand what you're saying. But you're talking, you're on the law side of things. We're not that person. I'm sorry for what you went through. But the...

Why do people have to pay when you're paying them? Why do people have to pay when they come out of their contract? They're getting more than the health department to invest in everything.

We appreciate it. Okay, thank you. Okay. Staff comments?

No, sir.

No, sir. Okay. I got two little things. I said no, sir. You said no, okay. Updates were good there. Go ahead, Kevin.

um there's two back school events that i would like to see some kind of presentation at uh recent community center they put on one it's actually through uh tyrone mullins his organization they put on one last i've attended it for the past 10 years um just as kevin parnell not on this seat but i think we need county recognition there's a lot of organizations that are there school board members are there a lot of organizations are there last year they they cut they quit counting kids at 1026 kids coming through there from out of school events. I think we have representation there. I think it'd be good for if any of us can show up besides me, because I'll be there under my business and just as being Kevin Parnell and my family. But if we can show up, any of us show up for kind of representation there, it would be great, I think. That's a great idea. The kids need it and deserve it. That'll be August 2nd this year. August 2nd is on a Sunday. We'll do August 2nd. The next one is Pathways. Kevin, before you on, at the Registry Center. At the Registry Center, yes. Okay. And then the other one is Pathways to Purpose. I think it's Pathways to Purpose. They're putting on one August 8th. I'd love to see representation there as well. And I think theirs will be at Antimatics, I believe. And I might be wrong on that, but I'll get with them and go from there. But I believe we need to have our representation there at these events because we do represent. school supplies. So I just like to see us have a booth or something set up there at these organizations to just make sure we're passing on stuff to the kids and just being present in the community. and last thing i got a couple phone calls uh about the baseball fields this this past weekend we had some rain come in and uh there's you know complaining about some of the the mud and the water across the sidewalks and all so i don't know if we can get if there's a way to have maybe chad come out there look at some kind of way to get some water drainage off of the areas by concessions and sidewalks and all just i had a few phone calls about it i want to just address it kind of put on the table if we can just make a look at that that's all i have guys Kevin as a individual commissioner what do we need to bring to something like this for back school events just school supplies there's no set thing paper pencils pens highlighters A lot of elementary kids are there, so crayons, color pencils, things like that. It doesn't have to be some fancy name brand. I mean, go to a dollar store, rack up. Or if there's a sale at Walmart or something, usually I go to Walmart and dollar store, and I just rack up, get a bunch of supplies, and I fill a table up with supplies for kids. I know I think last year Walmart gave out over 1,000 book bags that they had, and the year before that, They came with a bunch of bags, ran out, and was upset. So the guy up the ante, he brought like 1,500 bags this time last year to get them out. So there's a lot of people there, so much so that we're partnering with the city to have police officers there to direct traffic. Because last year, people were literally just stopping their car in the road, getting out, going, and getting their kids in to get supplies. So it's a big event, big event.

I think it's a good point. I mean, it seems like, given Denison,

sure we could put something together to represent the board but i didn't realize it was that Carey. Carey.

Do you know where you get your licenses from? Yeah, we look around all the desks and stuff.

It's a pretty decent site. Do we not have a special assistant? Board members can go out and stay.