Select Board - Regular Meeting

15 second delay. Good evening, Littleton. Welcome to the select board meeting for uh Monday, May 12th. We're going to begin with an executive session. Okay. Move that the select board vote to enter into executive session pursuant to mass general law chapter 38 section 21 A2 to conduct strategy and preparation for negotiations with non-union personnel or to conduct collective bargaining sessions or contract negotiations with non-union personnel the police union the select board will adjourn to executive session and will reconvene in open session after the executive session second moved by Matthew second by Karen roll call vote Gary Gary's yes Matthew Matthews Karen Karen's yes. Mark's a yes. We'll see you in about 15 minutes. It has been switched 15 seconds and we will do that for you. Nope. Okay, welcome back. Uh we'll begin with the pledge of allegiance. He said he said it would be on before he was up. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Uh so we have the reading of the mail, select board discussions, department updates for PRC, DPW and another PRC, a public hearing at 700 p.m. for the setting the town transfer station rates. 720 will have public input 7:15 appointments. uh review the annual town meeting

minutes and adjourn promptly at 8:25. Uh we'll start with the mail. Okay. Uh current vacancies on the uh Mr. Chairman, current vacancies on the town board. Uh we've got uh opportunities with the agricultural commission, conservation commission, cultural council, economic development committee, historical commission, master plan implementation committee, permanent municipal building committee, zoning board of appeals, and one um opening that's appointed by the school committee uh on the uh for the finance committee. Um we have sign up for receive public notifications for the town of Littleton. Uh, register at www.ittletonmma.org/subscribe. Community impacts, public safety activity, transportation issues, town meeting changes, public health concerns, town events. Stay informed. Here we've got a notice of hearing of uh of compliance for Tavern in the Square, which uh with the Alcoholic Beverages Control Commission in Chelsea, Mass. They have uh the tavern has been notified that a hearing will be held with the ABCC at 954th Street, Sweet 3 in Chelsea on June 17th, 2025 at 10:30 a.m. Um uh in regards to permitting an illegally uh uh permitting an ille illegality on the licensed premises uh to it for a delivery of an alcoholic beverage to a person under 21 years of age. Um and here we have uh Arbor Day Foundation. We have uh extend the warmest congratulations to Littleton for achieving 2024 Tree City USA. Well-deserved recognition. This has been hard work from uh from Tim Pearson and Conservation Commission. Um and uh

this is the second year in a well at least since I've been here. It's been it's it's been every year. So, um good work. The mayor worked very hard at this too. I did. Thank you very very much. I I appreciate that. addressed to Mayor Dugen. I have my I have my business my business cards are being made up as we speak. Um and we also got notification from the town of Sudbury that um uh that they are withdrawing from the transportation dispatch program that we have with Actton Littleton and and Sudbury. And um currently uh we are scheduled to be spending $27 annually split into four uh uh quarterly payments. 27,000 20 What did I say? What a bargain. Pretty good deal. Yeah. Why would they relieve? Touche. 27,000 and change. Um for that that is our share. uh sudberries is a uh is a lesser amount and um so and the first thought is it's going to cost us more but the uh the 27,000 is based upon an average annual uh percent of the n the total number of runs. So that total number of runs with Sbury leaving will go down. So quick back back of the envelope calculations will probably go down to 20 about $24,000 from 27. Um, but I'm communicating with uh the town management act and just to confirm that thought process. I'll report back. Um, here we have the first uh the robotics. They finished up their season uh and uh as a result of when they came in in the when they lost the hotbreaker uh locally, then they went to the world championships in Houston and they did a

tremendous job. Um and uh they were in very very tough matches and uh they um uh it says here were selected to play in the sixth seed alliance with teams from Michigan, California and Canada progressing three matches into a double elim elimination playoff rounds before the alliance was eliminated. But they really had a a tremendous tremendous uh from if you read through this in the mail, it really was um quite impressive on on their enthusiasm and what they did uh all the way around. So uh very very impressive by uh by the robotics team. Berry. Um, here we have a uh gift acceptance form for EHS uh from Nancy and Bruce Morrison for $1,000. So, the safe return program. And for those of you out there in Littleton for the Safe Return program, uh you can get it either through the police department or or EHS Council on Aging. It's a toolkit of resources for family members and caregivers to assist in evaluating the home and taking steps to promote safety for their loved ones with dementia, neurodyiversity and/or tendencies to wander, air tags, anti- removal case, door chimes, uh anti-wander signs, caregiver support, uh support information. So, uh please take advantage of that. I think it's uh I think it's fantastic. Uh, another gift acceptance form um for EHS COA from the Rotary Club of Littleton, the amount of $1,100 for the safe return program. Again, thank you very much for your generosity. And we have a gift acceptance form for EHS uh Find Your Village Real Estate,

Kimberly Albertelli, the $5,000 for room naming an elevator uh for the gift fund. And uh thank you very much for that. She's cornering all the elevators, isn't she? They're kind of like the railroads on Monopoly board. The floor can't use them unless you um and um that's it on the ABCC as those results those hearings are held um are is someone going to make an act a recommendation on the actions we should be taking? Should we be like whether we should be holding our own hearing or sending letters or just It's your decision. According to town council, it's a matter of what what steps you would like to do as as a legislative body of the town. So, does that come to us from Pat O'Donn who does the investigations for Littleton or comes from ABC? He didn't do those investigations. So, it wasn't Pat that that these this was ABC Sting if you will, right? But I mean, how how to Mark's point, how will we be communicated with from the ABC? Yes, we just got one very recently that they had their hearing like it just came in an hour ago. It was not one stop. But so I guess the question is we're going to need we're going to need a little bit of background on is it second offense, first offense, third offense. We don't even know that. Yeah. Right. We're just seeing what how it went down so to speak. So I don't know what do we I think that's we don't have really a chart that says if this is your third offense you're going to have or whatever how egregious is it or right so maybe it's something that we I mean I don't know what what kind of records we may we may have because it uh and I'm assuming it may be at the at the police station that uh if because they would be notified like these four offenses that that occurred recently occurred that you know the town was notified And I would assume that that that same practice happened before if there were multiple ones. So I'll find out. It seems like we

should at least send a letter. Yes. Right. Warning. Yeah. Or a letter of warning or come in front of the the board of whatever we decide I guess. But maybe for another meeting we put it on there. You can Yeah. To to your point that uh you you may request them to come in and just explain the situation, you know, what happened and and everything like that. You can take your own separate actions if you feel you want to do uh it doesn't matter what what they what they came to their conclusion their decision if you feel that there is a whether it's a day or however long or or just a war you know confirm the warning however you would like to proceed. So this is kind of what we did one of the businesses on the common if you recall. Um so uh I guess it's more of what have you done to mitigate this since you found out the result you know the results of this and that's maybe so the question is do we want to call in everyone or do we just want to take the recommendation to the ABCC or react on on their recommendation? I I think we can we can look at the background. I think see what the ABCC does and also determine whether or not there have been prior violations. Yeah. I think if like that would inform at least for me I think would be the difference between just saying be careful versus asking for some concrete change like we did with um common con uh the Littleton convenience store. So So as they come in maybe we put them on the agenda to decide what we want to do. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Moving on. Select border orientation. My favorite part of the meeting. I'll make a motion that we elect Karen Morrison to be the chair of the select

board. Second. She'll take it. All right. We'll give it a go. Any other nominations? All in favor? Hi. Hi. Hi. Get a more. Um, and then we've got uh vice chair. I'll nominate Matthew Nordos as vice chair. Second. Any other? No, not discussion. You good? What? It's your turn. Um, but we don't have a clerk either, right? So, sorry. Moved by Chuck and second. Oh, there we go. Moved by Chuck, seconded by Gary. All those in favor? I. All right. And now we have clerk. Clerk. I think it's I nominate Gary Wilson to be the clerk. Second. Right. Anyone else? Moved by Gary. Seconded by Ch. By Matt. Matthew, I can advise. Oh yeah, you'll get it. We're off to a good start. You guys sure you don't want to reconsider? Minutes are going to be all over the Have a recall vote. [Music] Karen seconds that motion. All those in favor? I want to switch chairs. I think we're good. Okay. All right. So, that's that. Moving on, we've got uh select board discussion regarding the next select board retreat and goal setting session. Um, oh, it's that time of year again. Our calendars, I guess. Fill out their calendars. Let's see if we can figure something out. Did we last

Did we do it on a Friday afternoon last year? So, at the fire department? Yeah. Is that right? Mhm. I thought it was morning or earlier or something. 12 to 4. Yeah. Yeah. When um when aren't you available? Do you have any vacation income coming? No. Um no. Lisa's Lisa was giving me a vacation. So, uh um I will uh I'll work I'll I'll work around it. I mean, so not the 16th obviously because it's ribbon cutting for Shadic Street. Mhm. We we can't do the uh 23rd either. That's uh Memorial Day JLMC and it's JLMC mediation. So So the 30th would be the one after that. That's not so great for me. Okay. Yeah, we're still before the fiscal year, so we're okay. The 7th is that high school graduation? It is. Uh no, the 30th is the 30th is high school graduation. Um 6th of June. 6th for me. Anybody else? 13th works better for me. I'm supposed to be away that weekend, but I have office hours on the 6th, but so the 13th would be better for me. 13th is the last day of school. Oh, okay. I could do the 6th if I can I can just leave after the meeting. 20th is wide open for me if we're willing to go back that far. I'm fine with the 20th. Uh June 20th, anybody? Yeah, sure. That's all good. Okay. Phone number two. My my burner phone. I am at a 10 the 6. You notice how Mark and I are wide open, right? Shut up. I just have to golf

earlier. Do not like either of you. So, what the 20th? Yeah. Yeah. Jim, that's the day after Junth. Were you going to take a 4-day weekend or anything? I didn't even I can make the 6th work work at the sex work. So, I actually can't cuz I'm out of town. All right. So, the 20th then? Looks like. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Are we doing no saying noon to 4? Yes. And we'll do goal setting then. And I guess we find out if the fire station's open. If not, we can do it over there. If not, I mean, we have the new building will be up, right? Oh, that's true. So many options. I think we should cen it. There you go. It's got to bode well. Right. Cool. Okay. Okay. Uh, moving on. We will let's review and vote to reaffirm the select board code of conduct policy. Anybody have any questions or uh comments about Nope. I mean board of conduct look back at the at the year we I mean we I think um I think we did a pretty good job following I was looking through it. Uh, we didn't really have any thing that stood out that or anything we needed to add. That was the only thing. We said we're going to review this every year for potential, but we probably might need something. Maybe Jim might have seen something. No, change. Well, although we did take some lashings at town meeting for people saying, you know, we don't trust you. just looking looking through the you know kind of the the crux of the code I think that we have demonstrated

professionalism and um transparency and and garnered trust. So I I think and as anything has come up I think we've kind of addressed it. So I think we're I think we're in a good place. I think the other thing that has become that I thought was going to be hard but actually has turned out to be good is making sure that we go through gym before we contact any of the town department heads or employees. That's become second nature now and I think it makes a difference and I think it's not it doesn't slow things down the way I thought it might. So I'm I'm pleased with that change. Yeah. I haven't known any other way but it's worked well for me so far. Okay. All right. Hey, clerk. Mr. Cler. Oh, so we don't need any public sensor. I guess we we do adopt it. So, I guess um move to approve the town of Littleton select board code of conduct policy. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I I I don't think we need to take action there for not doing for not changing it or moving away from it, but still in effect. The motion was in it would stay in effect till whatever we start. All right. But if we were a new board, that wouldn't be the case. Correct. It's true. Don't forget to get sworn in. I did. You even beat me to that. All right. Department board updates. Um, we've got the vote to authorize the town administrator to execute a contract with MJ Catalo, Inc. This is uh this is for the Wickham Field improvements and the Littleton the tennis courts and uh um Littleton Middle School. Uh we were able to because the bid uh by Mr. MG Mr. Catalo uh came in under what was anticipated and um we're

able to get both at alternates in there with the with the dugouts and the fencing. Um so just just eaked it under the under the wire there and uh that is before us for uh 900 um for $900,000. What was the budget? 922 not including on top of that is 132,000 more for uh uh activities. So the bricks and mortar budget was 922 and that's what the So it says the estimated construction cost inclusive was 922 and that's that was the estimate. That's the estimate but the actual was 900 will come in at nine. Okay. Right. With including the two uh ad alternates, right? And 16th is the first day of construction. June 16th I believe I believe so. Yes, sir. Fantastic. Good to keep in town with another business. It's great. Yeah. Everybody good? Yep. I'll take a motion. Are we doing a motion on each one or you want to go through? Sorry about that. How do we want to? I just didn't know. Yeah. Um, here it is. Okay. Do it that way. Move that the select board vote to authorize town administrator James Dugen to execute a contract with MJ Catalo, Inc. in the amount of $900,000 for the construction of tennis courts and improvements to Wickham Field at the Littleton Middle School, inclusive of bid add alternates one and two. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I. Next we have the um JP Keading contract. Tell us all about it. Steve. Uh good evening. Uh Stephen Yi, director of public works. Uh, first thing I do want to say is the there is a typo on

the the number. It's not 506. It's 527 630. Copy and paste. Okay. I'll blame Ryan. 6:30 even. Yes. Thank you. So, I apologize for that. It's in the me It's in the memo from you. Correct. Okay. Got it. 52. 5276. Yeah, I see it. Okay, I see the motion. So, yes, uh back beginning of April, we advertised, um bids for road work. Uh PJ Key was low bidder at the 527 630. Uh surprisingly, uh this is the most amount of bids on a project like this I've ever received, uh in my career. 11 bids. Usually, we get the, you know, five or six. Um it's a very very competitive market. Uh when you look at the bid sheet, they were kind of grouped together or a bunch low, bunch kind of medium low, one really high. I don't know what their story was. Um but I just asked for your approval uh tonight for this um bid for road David. Do you have the locations on the website like the the planned up the paving plan for the summer? That will be up uh shortly. I did just receive the final version of that after some back and forth. Okay. Um but I do have a final version of that. Cool. Do the do you have the plan for not separate from Ernie's Drive in particular, but like a schedule for who you know what roads are being paved? Yep. That's why this year, next year, and so forth. Yeah. The the update to the pavement management uh system includes a fiveyear uh capital plan. Granted, I say there's always things can move around a little bit, so I don't take it as set in stone, but yeah, sure. I inevitably get two questions a year. I

got Well, I got obviously at the polls. I was Russell Street. Our roads are in such good shape in the center of town, so but more so Russell Street. I was getting beat up on Russell Street. So, is that Russell Street off topic, I think. Yeah. No, I I can happily answer that. Uh Russell Street honestly at this point we're waiting for confirmation from National Grid. They had three gas leaks over the winter uh and they're contemplating a little bit of main work. So trying to coordinate with them if they are or aren't going to do it. Okay. Okay. Just if if they're off if they're back and forth, is there a plan to go forward and just have them do UV when they when they do their work? Sure. Is that possible? I just it's it's definitely something that especially now at the point people just that set that's a super highway now to get up to the point. So absolutely to Gary's point there was a number of people at the polls that because they came in Russell Street. So yeah. Thanks Steve. 20 mph superighway. Russell exactly. Um yeah. Okay. Good. I move that select board vote to authorize town administrator James Dugen to execute a contract with JP Keing Inc. for resurfacing in related work at Ernie Drive in various locations in the amount of $527,630. [Music] Second moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I I Thank you. Thanks, Dave. Next up, we've got the request to solicit donations to support the Clean Lakes Committee. Yes. Uh Madame Chairwoman and members of the select board, this is uh uh the necessary proposal for gift solicitation form for PRCE. Uh and their uh uh their goal uh

for this year is to raise up to $5,000 for the CLC uh revolving fund. That was something that was discussed on efforts on parks and wreck part to uh uh provide um financial support. And this would be the while they work to identify a more consistent source because their rates have already been set. And so they wanted to be able to here's the opportunity to to raise some funds for this year. But in the meantime, uh, they will identify a funding source to be able to add on to going forward consistently. Is this in addition to the beach fees that were going to um be I think when I went to a PRC meeting and they said they were going to put in some beach fee that was part of the clean lakes. Is this something supplemental to that? They talked about doing both. So, they did. I I I'm only aware that this is going to be the only source of funding for year one the way the the director had explained it to me when I asked and I said is this going to be just for the year one or is this how it's going to move on just for the you know this is the first year they'll already they'll I I guess the question I had is we at town meeting these these have to be voted on at town meeting to create revolving funds I'm assuming this revolving fund already exists or we created a town meeting we created this one I don't recall created that Queen Lakes revolving fund. We did. I remember the the senior center ones and the coffee farm. It gone under consent. Did it go under consent? Yeah. Okay. I think you're right. It did cuz I knew we had the senior center ones for coffee and the Steven went up and kind of explained everything and that's made everything not seamless but Okay. Um my only question was it doesn't so the revolving fund I thought had to be the source had to be revolving funds whereas this would not

be this is a onetime gift but that's okay to put in there right anyway. Exactly as a as a jumping off point or kickoff. Prime the pump. All right. What? Prime the pump. Well, thanks to the commission at parks and recck for moving this forward. Good. Move that select board vote pursuant to master law chapter 44 section 53A and per its policy on solicitation and acceptance of money and non-monetary gifts for public purposes to allow the solicitation of donations to support the Clean Lakes Committee's revolving fund as established at the May 6th, 2025 annual town meeting. Second moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I I three minutes early for the public hearing which is next on the agenda. Take something out of Anybody want to sing a song or you have anything uh small we can knock out? Do minutes. Have minutes. Do an appointment to the ZBA? Yeah, we can do minutes. Do anybody have any changes for the minutes? No, I did not. Corrections. I didn't see anything. Good. I move that the select board vote to approve the meeting minutes from the select board meeting on April 22nd, 2025. Second move by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I. We now have two minutes. Do you want to do appointments? Well, we can do move to adjourn first. Move that up. Take that out of order. Yeah, we can do appointments. Yeah. Okay. See, is David Outman the first one? Yes. All right. So, we're uh appointing David Outman to the zoning board of appeals.

He's got his application form in here outside the resume. Does anybody know him? No. Said he was on the NGO work group. Was that when you guys were on or was that the one before? That was I think that was um th those are the two groups that he was a he was asking about. I see. I don't he was not on the he was he wasn't on them. Okay. I don't think he ever was. Okay. And this is a full a full member, not an alternate. Correct. Yes, that is correct. Oh, he's been on Cooper Farm Preservation Committee and Open Space and Wreck. Okay. Okay, great. Well, thank you, Mr. Outman. Move that the select board vote to appoint David Outman as a member of the zoning board of appeals for a term expiring June 30th, 2027. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I unanimous. And then we've got uh Judy Laro to the cultural council. All right. Second. Move that the select board vote to appoint Judy Lar Roach as a member of the cultural council for a term expiring June 30th, 2027. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I. Good stuff. Thank you guys. Get sworn in. There we go. Get sworn in. And thank you. Next, we've got the transfer station fees hearing. Can I just interrupt one second? Of course. Um, Mr. I don't know if he's here for we already did public take action. I'll get public input. All right. Thank you. We took action on the on the um Wickham Field stuff. So, thank you for your bit. Thanks. Happy to do it. Oh, okay. Hearing up. You got to read the hearing. You have to read the clerk. behind it. Oh god.

[Music] Yeah, I'll read the auto. Right. Read the whole hearing. Correct. The select board will hold a public hearing on Monday, May 12th at 7 p.m. at the Littleton Town Offices, room 10337 Shadow Street, Littleton Mass on the proposed amendments, regulations, and fees for the town transfer station effective July 1st, 2025, as shown below. Comments thereon may be submitted in writing to select board at littletonmass.org org or to the select board town administrator's office 37 Chatt Street room 306 Littleton mass 01460 by noon on Wednesday May 7th 2025 or in person at the hearing Littleton select board at that time Mark Granbacher chair um I don't think you have to read the I don't need to read the fees we have to that's what we're going to Yep. So the rest of it is the fees as published for the 2025. Okay. Okay. Yeah, let's hear it. Y thank you again. Uh Stephen Ali, public works director. Um so the first slide is just kind of a a look back over the last four years um at the sticker fees. Uh back in FY22, the annuals were 140 up to the um current fee of 155. Second stickers have remained the same at 70. Senior stickers back in FY22 was $70, dropped to 50 and then have been at 60 for the last two years. And then the second senior and then the replacement stickers have been the same for the last four years at 35 and 15 each. Uh the bag fees um sort of similar, you know, incremental increases stayed the same uh for a couple of years. Like the

the large bags are the that are the most popular ones. FY22 was 325 a bag. Currently, they sit at 375 a bag as we went up last year, but they had remained the same at 350 for uh two years in between. Next slide is just kind of a look at the annual sticker sales. um pretty level. Uh this year we had a little bit of a dip in the regular stickers for whatever reason. If you if you consider going from 736 to 706, a little bit of a dip. Senior stickers exactly the same. Uh second stickers both regular and senior more or less the same. And the replacement ones for people that lost them, got a new car, whatever it is. Uh just marginal. Looking at the tonnage, um we've had some pretty good increases since FY22 where we were at 625 for solid waste tonnage. Last year final number was 767. So pretty good increase. This year it looks like we're going to be somewhere around that same 750 760 number. Uh just kind of projecting out over the last couple of months. I didn't quite have April's numbers in yet, so I kind of had to uh estimate for the last three months. Same thing with the recycling tonnage. We saw a little bit of a jump over the last three years. Again, projecting out, it looks like we're tracking pretty much the same as we were a couple of years ago with a high point last year at 391 tons. Uh I included this slide. I don't know if it ever been included before. Um but kind of the revenues, what the monies were bringing in for bags and the sticker sales. I mean, obviously you can do your own math, but on the stickers anyway, the bags, it's it's tough to track because we don't know what the retailers sell. We only know what the supplier sells to the retailer. So,

Aishon Hardware could have a, you know, back room full of purple bags for all we know, but they paid for them. So, uh, that's the reports we get monthly from way zero, which is the bag manufacturer. But, see, you know, the it gives a general idea. um last year FY24 sticker sales $172,837 and we brought in uh $224,200 bag revenue. So coming into FY26, uh looking to do a increase on the sticker fees, bag prices to remain the same because we went up last year. uh and just some some small increases in uh three or four of the miscellaneous items just due to the costs of what we're paying to dispose of the of the items. Uh with that uh the annual sticker I'm proposing to go from 155 to 165. uh the second sticker on the the regular priced to go from 70 to 80, senior citizen sticker to go from 60 to 70, and then the second senior sticker to go from 35 to 40. Uh again, the bags are the same. And the other increase is just a, you know, a dollar on disposal of a TV, computer, monitor, that type of thing from 24 to 25. the bulk furniture, which is, you know, your sofas, that type of thing that go in the separate container, go from 30 to 35. And then mattresses, uh, which is the big item. The costs are increasing because you have to go to a separate facility. They have to be recycled, mandated by the state. Ours we take them, we're in contract with UTK and Lawrence. So when the when the container is full, holds about 38 to 40, we got to

hook them up to Lawrence. uh and that fee to go from 40 to 50. Okay. Anybody have any comments, questions? Um not specific to perhaps the pricing, but I know the single source uh is switching over. I know our recycling system in itself this year, correct? Coming forward. Yep. Um, does that affect stabilization of prices? Do you have any idea how that's going to affect the way? So really what that will end up saving when we consolidate cuz now we just obviously got approved for another compact town meeting once I get that installed and I can consolidate a little bit more. What that'll do is honestly save us trips. Okay. where I'm hauling a container full of aluminum cans that weighs 7 lb. You know, I can couple that with plastics and other items to bring to Bara. That's where the recycling facility is. So, I might cut my trips from, you know, 2:1, 3:2, 3:1. Okay. So, we'll see a savings that way. Okay. Uh the contract for solid waste and recycling services is up the end of September. You remember back the stickers used to be end of September for some reason. Um my hope is with the next contract that'll line it up at the end of the fiscal year. Uh so I can have a better idea of what pricing will be. The last few years we've seen increases 5% solid waste each year and then the recycling fluctuates. That could bring in bills from two different days and be two different numbers. So it that market's all over the place. It's not it's commodity. You know, we're not making money like only on scrap metal and even that's not great.

Yeah. Any question? Yeah. I'm just looking at I'm just doing, you know, quick quick math. The seniors are at 981. So with them going from 70 to 80 with a $10 increase which we got a lot of noise when they went we went down for one year to 50 and then we went up and we heard a lot about why did you go up on the seniors? Mhm. People forgot about us going down seniors the year prior. But um I mean as an impact it's about it's almost 300 stickers more for seniors than there are for non- senior households. Um, so even if you were to absorb $5 of that increase into the non senior households, you're still not making up the the math's not going to work for you necessarily. Um, so I was just trying to look at that and see if you know what impact we could potentially have to benefit the seniors because we're you we're always looking for ways to um limit limit their spending as much as possible. So um I haven't come up with a solution yet, but keep keep noodling. [Music] Can you can you talk about can you um do you have numbers for what it costs to operate the transfer station? Can you break that out um in its own number? I'm just kind trying to figure out is this income from the stickers and the bags neutral to as far as like what it costs to actually move the stuff out. Well, so the the intent of uh the sticker fees, the bag fees, and then the hard thing to calculate is all the miscellaneous sales because people do them online and through uni it comes up as like miscellaneium item item miscellaneous item with the fee. So it's it's tough to track what exactly if it's a propane tank or a TV that Oh, I just mean the aggregate. Yeah. Um, so I of course I didn't bring any of that information with me. Um, but

obviously your known factors are salaries, you know, we have electric bill, we have maintenance that has to go on, uh, which is all broken down in my budget, but of course again didn't bring any of that with me. Uh, and then the sticker and and bag and miscellaneous fees are going to help offset that, but then also should be cost neutral with disposal of everything. Right. Right. So, as I'm selling bags, the pay as you throw bags are paying to dispose of the solid waste. Stickers are offsetting some of the recycling, um, salaries, that type of thing. And then the miscellaneous items basically pay for themselves. You know, a load of wood, load of brush, refrigerator, furniture. you know, whatever. You know, that that all kind of just is net zero for the town. But have you done that? Have you Is that the case? Like I know it's supposed to be that way, but does that actually work? It does work. Okay. Yeah. You're not you're not operating at at a loss. No, I'm not. You're not making money either, right? When you look at at the budget, it's almost inflated a little, but we don't spend the budget. So, the revenues we're bringing in are covering the cost. Okay. Okay, that's what I Thank you. Any questions? So, just the just on the sticker fees, you're basically you sold basically close to 1,700 stickers. So, you're going to generate another $17,000 in revenue basically. And that 17 is enough to cover your delta in costs is what we're saying. So, if that's correct, then I'm okay with everything. Um I just wanted to note that the um I did a little bit of math on the first stickers. I didn't go through the second stickers, but you know if you look at the um discount rate for seniors visa v the regular sticker. So, back in FY21, the

SE senior sticker was $70. The regular sticker was $140. Um, which would be a 50% discount. Um, for the proposed FY26 numbers that um that discount is up to about 58%. Um, so more of a discount than and also it's the same price it was four years ago, right? I guess like I understand the reluctance of people to increase that number, but it's a cost of what you have to do to live. It's not necessarily proportionate to what we're Yeah. passing on to everybody else. It does feel like Yeah. So, I think rel you know, everything's relative. But I think once you once you put that it into that context, it makes sense. Um I did have a question actually about single stream though, a little off topic. Um, will this affect um the organizations that sponsor recycling in the shed with the like soda cans and stuff? Nope. Folks will still be able to do that. Will be there. They can people can sign up to run the weekend or run the days and take the cans for uh be at the Boy Scouts or soccer teams or the I think the Long Lake Neighborboard Association does it or used to do it. Uh that Yeah, that's still available. Great. Thank you. Steve, are there any other I know that at one point in time we're looking at mattress as a as a potential uh revenue generator. Are there any any of those ideas that have kind of panned out? I know introducing um the rolloff truck to to to do the hauling and and an additional compact. You're always looking at ways to try to make it more streamlined. Are there any other thoughts that you have? I know glass was something at one point in time you're talking about shredding or grinding and yeah the town had partnered with Groten some years ago and we were hauling the well at the time they were hauling the glass to Grot and Groten was crushing it and then we were taking it was it was a process it

sounded like uh really I'm just looking to try to consolidate the operation a little bit try to be get people in and out quicker you know uh by adding that extra compact we have the space for it it's where the mattress compactor is Well, it's already uh utilities are kind of there. I just need the compactor and one more container and I'm I'm off and running. So, you'll be able to come in, have your solid waste and basically all your recycling. We'll still have the cardboard dumpster cuz that's, you know, the most popular thing. Uh especially Christmas time, right? Amazon boxes. Um but then the other side we can have set up even though they're side by side by side can be set up kind of the same way. And that that'll not only streamline people using it, but streamline like I was mentioning earlier our operation of less trips to Bara which I think everybody likes. I can say that as a Chester who wants to go to the record picking away. Have there been any talks with styrofoam days? The problem with styrofoam and I talked to waste management their rep. Uh if we were going to do just have a styrofoam dumpster, it they will only take it if it's clean. Pure. So if it's got tape, if it's got glue, if it's got tape residue, if it's got they they're just going to charge a solid waste price for the entire for the entire line. I think yeah, it's got to be clean. I know like Westford does styrofoam days like once a quarter or something. I didn't know if we'd consider doing something like that or if there's any way to do that. We could do something like that. Absolutely. Um once I reconfigure and get rid of some of the extra dumpsters we have, we've talked to um just I'll stray off topic. We've talked to the Black Earth folks uh with the food composting. You start to see

the little cans at the end of the driveways around town. Uh potentially partnering with them. uh we kind of had the first initial meeting and haven't really circled back, but that's there were 50 or 60 residents in town when we talked to them as as well as four businesses uh that are partnered with them for food composting. So, that's something I don't know if I necessarily want to introduce uh food waste containers at the transfer station because that opens up other balls of wax uh you know rodents mainly. Um but against all things to consider. Okay. Take comments from the public. Do we have to close and then get public comment or is public comment part of it? Public comment first. Okay. Anybody have anything to add? Public comment. I think he's doing a good job and I can tell you that price for a mattress disposal. I take a mattress to uh Demon's Recycling. I think we get back charged $150. So that's that's what he's doing. Let him keep doing it cuz that's seriously saving you some money which is great. All right. Doesn't mean you're going to get a raise any money. Every year he gets a raise. Every year close the public hearing first. Yep. Move to close the public hearing. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. All those in favor? I. Okay. Okay. Do we have to do roll call? Typically public hearing. Yes. Chuck. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. Move that select board vote. Thank you. Thank you. No further session. Sorry, I jumped the gun.

Good. Move that the select board vote pursuant to town code chapter 181 to establish the following fee structure for the use of the town of Littleton transfer station effective July 1st, 2025. Stickers full price $165. Seniors $70. Second sticker $80. Senior second sticker, $40 per bag, 33 gallons, 30 $3.75. 15 gallons, $2.75. 8.5 gallons, $1.75. And miscellaneous item fees for CRTs, TVs, $25. Propane tanks $15. Bulky furniture $35. Large metal items $25. And mattresses $50. Second. Moved by Gary, seconded by Matthew. Another roll call. or is this in I think you're okay. All those in favor I I Good night. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. [Applause] [Music] Thanks, Steve. Thank you, Steve. All right, we did the appointments. No, public input is next. All right, let's hear it. Who's got some public input? Please state your name and address. Sure. Before starting. Uh Brian Tarox, 16 Fletcher Lane. Uh I sent y'all a note along with the chief of police and uh the minister of the Unitarian Church about concerns about ICE. Um two nights ago, we got a not a message that ICE was snatching people over in Irish Court in Actton and they asked for people to come and witness. We a bunch of us came and stood around at a distance not interfering with cameras. Um and the ICE

vehicle had both uh a screen blocking its license plate. Um and 100% tinted windows, both of which I don't think are legal in this state from what I've checked. Yeah, okay. Um, we've also seen um a number of cases reported of pe of bad actors pretending to be um ICE people kidnapping women and assaulting them. And uh this we yesterday in Akran there was a rally attended by uh a number of people including state senator Eldridge and he confirmed that they had seen that as well. And the question I pose back to um uh the police department is um if I see someone with an unmar unmarked vehicle, no badge, a mask, and no warrant. If I see one of you all getting dragged into a truck, I'm going to try to intercede and stop them because I think you're being kidnapped. Because how can you tell a kidnapping from an ICE snatching these days? And so if it's happening in Actton, it's only a matter of time before it happens here. I've asked you all to have some kind of town forum where we come up with a plan so we're not reacting because it will happen here. And someone drives an unmarked van into um some location in Littleton and starts starts dragging people into a van with masked men. What are we supposed to do? And it's already happening in our next town over. It's going to happen here. I think it's incumbent upon us to get ahead of this. Thank you. Uh good evening board members. Joe Cotalo, my daughter Laura Beckler. Uh just tried to get a little thank you

going for our wonderful town employees. And I'm also here to talk about our favorite subject in town, crosswalks and sidewalks and RRFBs. Is that the right terminology? Yep. So, uh, first of all, Mr. Cat, if you could stand at the mic. Thank you. LCTV will thank you. Sorry that these are the only ones that I have. We just got those tonight. So, good evening board members. My name is Joe Catalo. I live at 41 Robinson Road. First of all, I want to thank all the first responders from both the police and fire department who came to the rescue of my grandson when he was hit in the King Street Foster Street crosswalk on April 29th. Fortunately, he only had road rash, bumps and bruises, and no broken bones, and he's doing well. It certainly was a scare for all of us. I've talked with town administrator James Dugen, Chief Matthew Pernard. I have not talked to Steel Mccur, Chief Steel Mccur, but I've also spoken to Jim Aiierro, our state rep, and my daughter and her husband have spoken with him as well, and wanted to thank them for their efforts in doing what's been done so far in that intersection with the painting and the signage and so forth. And I understand talking further with James that Mr. Dugen that um there is a plan to install the RFBs in three sidewalks in town, but I'm here tonight to ask you to consider pushing mass DOT for the crosswalks in the center in the common. Some of those pictures my wife took this afternoon. My wife likes to

walk downtown. a lot of the children from Robinson Road try to across in the common area to go to school and uh obviously with uh Northern Bank and um projected 550 King Street there's a lot going to be a lot more foot traffic. So, some of the problems are there is some signage on those in those pictures that you'll see. For instance, picture number one at Great Road and Adam Street heading west on Great Road. There's there's uh one sign um and it's not it's not clearly marked. Um and and the this there there's another picture that shows a sign for the crosswalk ahead. And in fact, there's no demarcation in that crosswalk. Crosswalk at Meeting House Road in Great Road has a problem because if somebody steps onto the street at Great Road from Meeting House and people don't see that person in the crosswalk, cars try to go around to the right or to the left, creating a real hazard right there. And I think if there's a and maybe what and I'm not a crosswork expert by any stretch of the imagination. I I'm I'm wondering if maybe the board and Mr. Dugen can push Mass DO to take this engineer one step further into the common and look at that. Maybe there's too many crosswalks too close together. I I don't know. I know there's one proposed at Northern Bank in front of Northern Bank. So that means there's going to be potentially four or five or

maybe even six crosswalks in a very small area. I think the concern is much like what happened um at Foster and well it's Rogers and and Great King Street where Jack was hit. Um there needs to be some type of flashing beacon, better demarcation, so forth. Really here to say thank you. We have great first responders in this community. Glad to see everybody's working hard to take this to the next level, but um just wanted to give it some consideration if you could. Thank you. Thank you, Joe. Rob Brown's 25 Juniper Road. So, I'll jump on the the crosswalk. Um I forget whether I said it or not, but along again I appreciate everything done with the safety zone, but a couple things about the safety zone. Uh the feedback that I got from two people on Goldsmith, particularly with with Crosswalks, was two individuals directly stating that within the week before I had approached them that they were nearly hit. uh going into the crosswalk crossing from the non-L long lakes side of Goldsmith to the Long Lake side. And so there continues to be uh a real concern. Goldsmith just you the speeds are just in excess uh significantly in excess of what would be expected. And so it's a real safety thing. I've heard from two people privately. The other part um along with the aspect of the safety zone because of 550 King and some of the statements I just heard, I wanted you to consider there is the capability the the the same legislation that gave you the safety zone and the same approval that

was done by the town vote in 2017. You have the ability, should you care to use it, to put in a 20 m per hour safety zone along your Littleton along your town comment, I think is a state road. We can't do anything on it. And state road excl. All right. We also don't I apologize. We own an ice cream shop. My intent, but you're correct. I I think we can we also can't change the speed limit there. So that's where I'll that's where I'll go back to do a deeper dive, but I think you're correct. I I'm sure you're correct. Apologies. We can we can advocate, but it did. Yeah. Dealing with the state by all means. So, um, moving on. Um, the town meeting, I look forward to your agenda item tonight with your review of the most recent town meeting. I also just want to say that um I'm concerned with regard to several of the comments that were made in response to article 12. I I thought it was problematic and just want to put to you or Tim Goddard or somebody. I I found it challenging with regard to hearing the sentiments. I recognize everybody's got free speech and right to say things, but when somebody yelled for point of order where I felt some view or some town officials were trying to in effect correct misstatements that were stated by the public. I think that's necessary and so somehow to bolster and not have a contentious some procedure seems to me to be appropriate because I know I was um alarmed by a couple of people that commented about the upcoming Shaker Lane building I think the DPW facility and as people are kind of trashing upcoming

items I almost wanted to be like well wait a minute where's where's the opportunity to rebut what's being said and I don't necessarily think that's the way to go but I just want to say that aspect of the town meeting concerned me. A second aspect that concerned me was the resounding defeat of article 12. And so with that I encouraged a public hearing because I think there's a lot to be said out there. I think it was almost deafening how there was clapping after certain comments that were directed recommending that article 12 be voted down and it got voted down overwhelmingly concerns me because we have big items coming up and big items that um if the town um doesn't go forward with them then Shaker Lane rebuilds 7 to 10 years as part of the information delivered during the school and the Shaker Lane at 6:00. So, I'm very much concerned about those things and I think there are potential ways out. Um, but they also have aspects that need to be vetted and debated. Um, but one aspect I've already been with the assessor uh asking questions is the deferral available to seniors over 65 years old. Um, there's a program that allows it. It looks to me like it's capped at with an income of 55 grand. And yet what I've done so far this week is determine that the legislature actually allows you to change it from that 55 cap to be uh equal to the amount of the circuit breaker in the state um income tax which is more like 72k for a single and almost 110k for a couple. Those would be sign my opinion. Everybody can vote it, you know, against it and say the property

taxes are too high. I get that. That's a personal decision. But having a deferral program to offer up as potentially a um you could have a single at 72K and couple at almost 110K and still be able to be eligible to defer any amount of your property taxes year after year after year and connect it to your house. It's it's a worthwhile program. It would require changes beforehand, but I'm trying to come up and I'm going to start to work on consideration of solutions with regard to how we can offset some of the concerns that were voiced at that meeting and the April meeting with regard to Shaker Lane, uh, excuse me, the April meeting pertaining to 37 Shadic Street. I think those are things out there and I'd love to hear more of the discussion and not just the three minute time focus of I'm voting against this etc and some of the rhetoric that we got. But I'd love to have a legitimate public hearing to hear what people are so we can be better prepared for what I think are be very challenging uh requests of the public to vote override something like that in future. So thanks for your time. Thank you. Thanks Jim. On the subject of crosswalks in the common, is that part of what the grant Marin's going for? We'll cover. We can get that. I know Northern Bank had crosswalks in there um in their plan. I don't know how we go about when Northern Bank is developed to actually Well, Northern Bank's going to have a sidewalk on their side. I don't know what their plan is. when the sidewalk goes on the other side until that other side of the road's developed. I assume the crosswalk of meeting house will actually end up going away because it's probably a dangerous crosswalk is what the state will say. But I don't know what the how we're going approaching these. And I don't know if like we're looking for the crosswalks where we could control like

on Goldsmith about putting in these uh RRFBs where we could uh to to to answer your question um yes I mean we had a meeting uh today as a matter of fact with uh uh uh Leolei companies um the uh the town and uh LWD for the next grant uh the one-stop application and because we are an MB BTA community which makes us eligible for uh another funding round other funding uh for for grant availability. And one of the things that we want to do is is really look at um highlighting the common and making it more user friendly and how we can do that because as as you as you connect the 550 with with the common uh you know because you're also going to have 410 great road. So there's going to be a tremendous amount of enticement for foot traffic uh for people to be around there to shop the local shops to go to 550 also. So uh that will um identifying the the safety areas such as the RRFBs, sidewalks, uh proper uh handicap accessibility on and off uh things of that nature that will be addressed. Absolutely. And and we probably I think Mr. Galdo's idea of getting the engineer in earlier on what whatever we can do by Northern Bank is a good one. One question I have and maybe you don't know the answer to this. So when the boy was struck two years ago on route 2A in Actton Actton was able to drop the speed limit from 45 to 40 and they policed that to this day. Grten Center I believe and I could be wrong I think that might be 25 miles an hour. Now those are both state roads. So I don't think Rotten Center is I think Rotten it's not a state road and we have

petitioned so I will we have petitioned the state to lower the speed limit. They have agreed to lower the speed limit on 19 on through um from Middle Sex to past Actton Toyota. I believe it's supposed to go down to 30 in that entire stretch. Um they are still looking at uh the transition areas beyond that. Um, so there is something in the works there. It's just not finalized. Um, through the chair just, you know, I this is um the fact that we don't have every single crosswalk with flashing lights doesn't make any sense to me at this point in time in that area. I mean, and we're not talking about a side road way down the middle of nowhere. Yeah. You know, there's a lot of sidewalks in town, but so what? Every one of them should have the flashing lights like Kimbles has to me. Push a button. It's not active all the time. When someone's in the crosswalk, they push the button and the lights come on. Everyone sees it. It blows my mind that this has to go through what we have to go through. So I I mean I would propose that we we do control a lot of the sidewalks down there. The end of Goldmith, the you know, we can start taking care of all of what we can control and immediately push this forward because the state has 50 ft. Do they? Yeah. Then I just it's going to take a lot more force from us. This is a lot more noise from us. And if we have to use 550 King as like you just mentioned that we're about to have a population room of walkers, not just that live there, but we're enticing people to come to Littleton to walk around to commercial businesses. What are we doing? And it it's just frustrating. I'm having a hard time understanding the state's interest in signage or changes that don't impact traffic flow. So, you know, what they're proposing putting in right now has no impact on traffic flow

whatsoever. It's a it's an awareness signal. And the fact that we have to go through the state and beg mother may I or you know, mother will you is when one of our citizens is in a crosswalk just doesn't it doesn't make sense to me. I would love to understand why, you know, or whether there's any interest at the state level about increasing some sort of autonomy for localities and on state roads to make changes that have no impact on traffic flow. I understand, you know, that they don't want us putting in stop signs and and red lights, but a walker on the road advis or advisory signage even if you know we could put our own pedestrian ahead. Even that doesn't that doesn't do it. the the lights, the flashing lights get you at Kimbles, you know, and I've been going on a Kimbles at an hour 45. That's the stretch of road you're in. Yeah. Boy, you see those lights and you slam those brakes on as soon as you see them. So, um and and people get are more distracted than ever now. Yeah. And it's just and we've got Yes. The common house has the sun setting, the sun, right? That's enough of a problem. But just in general, there's so much going on and there's only going to be more. I just I think we really I I'm not I don't want to say we can we just kind of push it forward and we we say this is really an issue, but maybe we do something where we all sign it and this is almost like an emergency situation that we're talking about. I I think Jim made a good point though. I think that 550 and Great Road and then Northern Bank and 410 is a golden opportunity for us to like push through some significant changes in safety. I think that, you know, there's a lot of money involved. Clearly, there's grants that we're going to get and people doing a ton of development and bringing pedestrians in. We should like absolutely take advantage of that to like push an an agenda for for making it safe for bikers and pedestrians downtown. And we're also um uh we should have uh

middle to the end the end of the summer, we will have the the the uh the traffic the traffic study for the for the development of 550 and the and so they're as they progress in their infrastructure improvements and the infrastructure improvements that's taken in consideration for for proper lighting, signage, sidewalks, accessibility, things of that nature. and we're just trying to partner with them in the common area um and identify those areas because we know it's going to be as we we just discussed it's going to be a uh you know a uh a tremendous opportunity you know for for example yesterday if if 550 was built out we had the town common open gorgeous day you know mother's day and it would have been yeah the plant sale and everything absolutely I mean it would have been it would have been amazing so and that uh that is that is absolutely the goal of what we have internally as we plan to uh make common the improvements to the common. So when we're talking improvements to the common are we also talking what to do with Steven Street and Meeting House Road because those just become almost dangerous again too, right? Yeah. Yes. site that has got to that's that that's that's that that's got to be the whole thing has to be I mean if you look at the over the picture that we just saw the overview of the the whole common and you can see the I don't know let's say 10 crosswalks in in the common district I just don't understand this we're not talking about every one of them needs to have a flashing light but let's let's not forget that so when it is this is probably going to be the first hard impact it's going to have in terms of an evaluation of of road improvements in that area that's been in a long time. So they'll they'll identify and they'll examine all the different what is currently standing, what the reconfigure is going to what the reconfiguration is going to be, what the traffic count going to be, number of different factors, data points that are put in place. Then they're going to propose and say, "Okay, we're going to do a flashing

one here. We're going to do one here. We're going to do one here. We're going to do one here." So that is still information that will that will be presented to to the select board and as part of that um that development process and the planning process. So 100% there will be a a public hearing for people to for their input. I mean we this to me is a public hearing, you know, an action that makes a public hearing to me. But just having some things you just don't need a public hearing for. This is this is so common sense to me. It it drives me crazy. Exactly. And I'm not and I'm not and I'm not kicking the can down the road, but also if I I quite honestly I really think and not to be I'm not trying to be Debbie Downer here, but if but I think if we are looking at major improvements that that are in the in the in the in the near future, I don't believe that the state at this point is going to invest that type of money into the RFBs. I could be wrong, but I think if they do the first I think if they do a first stage and they and they'll at least do what they've done just recently in those three intersections. The engineers went out, they made sure that they cut back anything, they put the new signage, they painted the crosswalks and and try and bring attention to that area and not have it just blend in as much. Um, I could be wrong, Jim. It works a little bit, but I'm telling you that same exact intersection as someone that's, you know, drives it every day like most of us, it doesn't really look any difference. I notice a little bit more paint on the road, but when you're coming east, you don't see that paint till it's too late. Y So, I don't know. It just doesn't that just doesn't do it for me. So, and Northern Bank's well underway, and their plans have for crosswalks, but I don't know the state has plans to put the beacons out there. I guess it's I think if we don't I I would like to to have a letter

from us, you know, a sense of a more sense of urgency to that area because this is not going to end well. This isn't going to get better. We're going to be waiting on grants and the Leapolei property to build out and get the infrastructure bills and draw more attention to that. Meanwhile, the the issues are still there. The state is already they're getting back to us in the next week or so about those threeations, right? Correct. And then I guess when we when we talk about you know the state and the grants are we do we think that they would be waiting until after this construction is over because the construction itself is is a huge hazard. Right. Okay. the development the development. when we're talking about the traffic study and we're talking about, you know, the state will go and re-evaluate the whole, you know, the um common and the curdage, you know, are they going to are they going to come back and say, "Okay, well, once S's done, no, then we'll start, you know, then we'll do this." It's kind of like on parallel tracks. Okay. Similar to the point when when Sand Park was building out the point. Yeah. But but the the plan was in place although the construction was going on and you're right it was it was on parallel tracks so that there were turn lanes and traffic signals that never were there before that that were planned. Okay. Good. And you had something to say. Yeah. Hi 33 Robinson Road. Um I just you're we're talking a lot about 550 now and a development that is to come, right? And I don't want to forget our youngest citizens in this town. Right. I mean, the crosswalk that was um where the accident was, it it it joins our two parks in town. Yep. Right. So, we're talking about the common, we're talking about businesses, and I appreciate that. I live on the common. Excuse my emotion. Um but our students, our children should be able to have a safe space to go from playground to park, to walk to school, to meet a friend, to ride a bike. And it

concerns me that we're now talking about a development that's coming down the road and focusing on the common when I I believe that our common should extend to our our playgrounds and our parks. Um one of the firefighters who helped my son in that day said to me, "Our playground is in the worst possible place. We are a cross through right 495 to 495. We have so much traffic that comes through our town. I've lived nearly my entire life in this town. I just realized after my son had the accident that it's 35 miles per hour through that crosswalk. A crosswalk that is easily hidden by many of, you know, from many citizens in this town. Um, so it just concerns me. I just want to make sure we're not overlooking that crucial area and forgetting about our youngest citizens while we're talking about the business and and what's to come. So I think if I may I think we're talking the you hear skipping over because we've seen the the um the communication from the state that they're already on. The one you're talking about we're working that one that's in process and we're going to be hearing in in the next week or two about what their timeline is and it should be much sooner than all the other things we're talking so beacon at that location. I think everybody realizes it's there's kids that's chalk full of kids every day and they're trying to get to school. Why didn't we do it sooner? Thank you. And yeah, I would just encourage also I think you said we can ask about the speed limit. Great that it's happening on 119, but I think that area as well. I mean for anyone that saw the skid marks there like 35 mph is is really fast through there especially with a full full truck. Yep. Yeah. So, um I just I just wanted to make sure that we were remembering that piece, too. Thank you. Kids are definitely important, but there was a fatality there about 15 years ago at that crosswalk. No, it wasn't. No, it was at

the it was at the end of Robinson. We removed that crosswalk. The crosswalk was there was when I was a child, there was a a woman, a mother in town, who was hit at the crosswalk, what is now the Littleton Historical Society at the other end. moved about I don't know 30 ft right and the reason the person that hit her never saw her she was heading westbound the sun was in her eyes never saw Marielen crossing the street never hit her brakes it was at the end of Foster across to correct near the compound it moved you're right it moved down towards 300 King Street so and I mean certainly the kids are a huge priority but there has been a fatality at essentially that same location and Gary made the point about you can't always see them and Part of it is because of topography, but part of it is because we have east west facing roads that the sun blinds you. I know you don't want to spend the evening debating sidewalks, but one thing you might push the state to do is I believe it was approximately 40 years ago that the whole center was redesigned and that was to eliminate Steven Street as two-way and now it's one way. But now given the influx of everything that's going on in the center, I think you need to ask the state, look at, you need to look at us as one big picture here with everything that's happening as one piece. I know you said Jim, they're going to run parallel, but I feel like the study's going to be they're going to put their arms around everything because it's time again. You know, it's 40 years. So, if we do include 410 Great Road, Joe, to that point, um 410 Great Road, Lei also owns that house. I think it's 410 King Street, maybe the yellow house that next to the Shell Station. And that potentially will be the access if that property is developed into housing or whatever it happens to be. My guess is that that would be access to King Street for that property, 410 Great

Road, instead of coming down Great Road and banging a left into that. And if it's if it's helpful, it has to be a broader reach, right? It's help if it's helpful for your board to get community support with a petition or something like that. I know a young lady that's got a lot of energy that'll get behind that. So, we can certainly get kicking around. So, but thank you all tonight. Thank you. Thank you. I'd be curious to see what Steve thinks, Jim, about um different colors on our crosswalks that we do have control over like on Goldsmith. You see it in other towns where the crosswalks instead of just pavement and white, they're blue and red or really multicolor to catch people's eye or reflex reflectives on it. Million different things. And they went to blue and white stone. It was the the town the town clerk from Stonem was Mary Ellen's brother. Yes. That's why they did it. That's right. Had a good memory. John Henry. Yes, he does. So on that point, uh, my granddaughter played in Westford recently in the pro lacrosse game. the optical illusion of their painting. I don't think it was blue and white, but but they were wider crosswalks. And we were stunned. My wife and I both said, "I thought that was going to have a a speed bump." I thought it was, but it didn't. But it made us think we were going to hit a speed bump. There were multiple utilizations of pretty dramatic painting that really gave even as we're going over it and our mind knows we're not going over speed bump. It made us pause as if and cars will stop for when they think they're about to lose control and go over speed bump until you realize it. But Chris Stoddard, our previous Steve Yonley, um he he practiced that a little bit at behind the DBW yard at the

gas pumps. He practiced the shading and how to how to create those faux speed bumps crosswalks. Westford has it very local. You want to take a take a drive by. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Lara. Thank you, Mr. Cal. Jack's doing okay. Thank you. Okay. All right. Good conversation. [Music] You want to start Gary? Yeah, sure. Um, thank you once again everybody for attending town meeting. Um, it's always uh great a great form of government. We get to we you know you know to Rob's point a little bit. You um it is a time for people to to speak. um as town officials, we kind of have to we we we take it and but I think you know you bring up some good points um about um maybe comments that are not directly uh relative to the subject of warrant that's being discussed. I I and I you do see it gets people go so far off track because they're so passionate and I understand that but I I really think um we can do a better job of reeling people back into the Tim catches it a lot but it's sometimes it's just so much. Yeah. Um so more discussion I know there's going to be a a afteraction review I think murder. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Um, thank the Touch of Truck people, the plant sale people, the election. Um, thank you Littleton for putting your trust in myself again for another 3 years. Um, but there was a lot going on and uh on Saturday and not the best weather, but we made it through. Um, yeah, that's that's all I have. Look forward to another three years. Yeah, I'll jump on the back of Gary. The we wouldn't be able to have the polls,

the elections without all the people that volunteer and all the people that work the polls. So, yeah, hats off to them. Unfortunately, they weren't that busy. Um, we had about 1,200 peopleish show up, which is about 15% of our um registered voters, which you know, we we hear a lot we get a lot of um grief, but we have a lot of apathy. So, and we're working towards communication and trying to find ways to reach people and um Well, now that you can mail in, I mean, you think everybody would vote, right? Yeah. Well, um yeah, but did want to say thank you to all those that do um show up first of all and all those folks that do help us pull it off and to Diane and her team. Um, couple things that it's really not a u an update and obviously touch truck and and um the different things that happened and all the all the department heads that did show up at Touch a Truck to make it a great event. From what I understand, it was very well attended regardless of the weather. I mean that it was really well attended. Um talked to some folks that did work it. Um but a couple things I just want to kind of keep on our radar is um for the future agenda item. Madam Chair and Mr. D. Um 31 Shadic Street status, you know, what's kind of what the plan again? You go to the polls and people come up to you and you have a laundry list. Um pave Russell Street. Um 37 Shadic Street, I think Rob brought up, you know, now what? Let's let's let's uh do some outreach and and get some input. Um the cannabis license that's out there. I know that there are people that are interested in giving us letters of interest. I think we should address that because there's some money on the table there that we should we should be jumping on. I think we should get a town seal on our podium right there. That just stared at me while I was writing my notes down. And um also an update on the whole Grommit situation. I've heard from people that um grommet's been up at Whitesill Woods and um I think we put down the edict that grommet was not allowed on town

property. So I I think that that needs to be reviewed and revisited. That wasn't part of the decision. Are you certain? Yes. It was he off off of off of the the owner's property. Had to be muzzled and on leash. I thought we said not on town property. No, we we said that he could only be loose on his owner's property, right? But other than that, he had to have a muzzle on, right? And on a leash. It's I I circled the decision to the select board uh when uh a neighbor or someone had expressed concern that Can you Can you send that back to me again? Sure. Just so I can I can address it with the folks that have addressed it with me. Yes, sir. Um but I do think, you know, the cannabis license is something we should be looking at sooner than later. And um we've had letters of interest then we should start having those people come in and if we can get another active license, not that it's you know it's kind of plateaued a little bit maybe or um but if someone's willing to open a shop and we can get 3% of whatever the revenue is and they're expecting to get a few million dollars in revenue, let's take 3% of that. So again, [Music] uh, so I wanted to thank everyone that showed up to town meeting in the election. As well as, uh, Chuck said, we didn't get a great turnout, and I think this was the first time we actually had more mail-ins than people show up. So that just could have been that they didn't want to say hi to Gary and myself. But um I also on a different note I attended the meeting with Clean Lakes and DCR a few weeks ago uh where they were talking about a potential plan going forward. There was a lot of discussion about dredging versus eco-h harvesting versus herbicide. So that's all I have. There was really no conclusions other than dredging is hard. Okay. [Music]

Um, I was going to just mention the how pleased I was at the fast response to the crosswalk and and impressed. It has not been my experience that the state moves quickly, that mass dot moves quickly on anything. So, the fact that literally the next day in the morning, I walked out and that had been restriped. I was like, "Wow, they really did that." So, that was that was great. And I I want to kudos to Jim and Matt Bernard and Steve Leaf and anyone else who was involved in in routing them. Um Jim and Jamie. Yeah. Yeah. Um also, um just on the orchard front, um the water has been turned on to the barn and the pump for the well was supposed to be installed today, but there was too much water. Ironically, too much water in the well um because of all the rain we've had. So, they're rescheduling for Tuesday, next Tuesday. That's all I got. Okay. Um just like everyone else, thanks to everyone who voted. Uh thanks to everyone who attended town meeting. Uh thanks to Diane and Andrew and LCTV um for the um coverage of the town meeting and um also to the poll volunteers for election day. Um I wanted to I guess congratulate Gary and Mark on their reelection. Both of us. Both of you. Yeah. Yeah. Um and then I wanted to congratulate Kristen Mcmanis. Um, she was featured on WGBH for teacher appreciation week. Um, and I don't know how many people saw it, but her name, her picture was huge and right there on the side of the building downtown. Um, and it was just great to see a great teacher um, from the high school um, getting the recognition that she deserves. So, thank you. Um, and then I also uh we received a letter from the Clean Lakes Committee. I wanted to uh let everyone here know that uh Clean

Lakes Committee sent a letter um thanking Jim um and us and um Mark, you for um your help in um supporting Clean Lakes this year and particularly in helping to get um a funding source put together. And that's all I've got. Jim, um really just um aside from the the meeting that we had today regarding uh 550 King Street and the common uh we uh I am going to start uh I'm going to take uh Ryan Scott with the Shaker Lane School and that meeting the next meeting is on Wednesday. Thank you very much Chairwoman Morrison for the for the reminder today. Uh and uh we have the ribbon cutting obviously on Friday the 16th uh for the center on Shadic and uh there was a an extension of time I just signed today for King Street renovation project that uh um so we'll people will be uh the departments will be moving in there in June. So fantastic. So yeah looking looking forward to a lot of good stuff. Just out of curiosity I think I mentioned this to Is there going to be a plaque through Madam Chair? Is that is there a plaque going in that building in 36 King or over center in Chadic? Yeah, 36K. I know there's a plaque over there. Is it go is there one going in a chat to identifying it as a municipal property? That's all I mean I I don't know. I will I will confirm that. 36 King. Yeah. What's the identification of the building being a municipal own? That's all. Yeah. I will uh town hall annex. I will let you know and um and share it with the entire select board. Thank you. [Music] That's all we've got for updates. Yes, I think the next thing on the agenda is

we're already done it. Talk discussing town meeting. Post town meeting. Oh, I'm sorry. That's right. And it touched on it. I think I I'll I'll kick it off. I think it's no m uh no secret that I was disappointed with how 12 went. Um of course you've got to respect what everyone's opinion. Um you know, respect the vote. Um I think it was an opportunity missed. I think when you've got an opportunity to run some information to ground, when you've got an opportunity to come back with more information versus less information and make decisions that are more informed versus less informed, um I think that's the way to go. So, I'm sorry to see that didn't go uh the way that we wanted it to. Um but um otherwise, I thought it was a pretty smooth meeting. Um to to that end though, it it gave us a lot of information. I mean, it gave us a lot to talk about and think about and and to, you know, to deliberate about and get more information out there and and try to gather more information and better inform people, you know, so that there's not that apathy or that that um I don't want to call it ignorance, but you if people aren't as informed as we'd like them to be, then that's incumbent upon us to try to get them to that point. Yep. Yep. Absolutely. I I would say from from that um you know sort of like we did after the orchard no vote we acted. I think we this is a a point of action for us where we really um need to show what move forward with showing you know kind of some of the things we mentioned before what what it's going to cost to renovate potentially knock down build here you

know for future need future purposing things like that. Um, even the layout, um, I don't know what the layout currently is. As soon as everyone's in that building and everyone's in that building on the other side of town, I haven't what's the plan where where are people vacating to? Where is it? Where are people moving? You know, I'd just like to see kind of what the I know you probably have some idea, but where we we haven't discussed it as a board of where people are going or what people are and and office space. And to add on to that, you know, are we mothballing sections, floors, sections of the building? And what do we expect that I to do for the building? Are we can and what does mothballing mean? Can we turn off utilities? Yeah. This is our control, right? This building. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So we So definitely with that I'm just saying be more active with that because of that vote, understanding the vote and moving forward with things we probably would have moved forward with anyway regardless of the vote. But Exactly. Even if the vote was was was was positive, we were still going to be here for another four or five years anyways. So, we would still have to take appropriate steps to as uh um Mr. Rambacher said that uh we can uh you know, our goal is to mothball the two ends and and and keep our operations uh within the middle as much as possible. There may be some spillover a little bit uh but that is what we want to uh we we want to do. Um and uh to your to your point is uh in regards to action uh part of the one-stop application, we've got $250,000 we're going to include in that for uh design, feasibility, analysis, and study of 37 Shadic Street. So that data will we will we will uh taken the appropriate steps to present data um and we'll have that information going forward uh moving forward through the one-stop program and application. Jim, who's here besides town hall? The

preschool is the preschool here still and the club. Uh and right and what and uh the offices down on the first floor will move up to the second floor and uh there's you know I understand there down the first floor of the same building but it's just there's better there's better synergy there's better communication there's better uh uh flow they'll be on the second floor with uh with the with the with the finance team with the accountant uh I mean I'm sorry with the clerk things of that nature um but these are things we haven't even discussed I I didn't even know I you know the the prek I didn't know I didn't know that was moving. I had no idea. Uh well I mean I they had no place to to move it over to over 36 King Street. So it's like okay then you could stay here but uh you know take take the space uh downstairs uh which was fine. And I thought I said that in a date. So preschools moving down and the club are they staying where they are or are they moving as well? the the club the like teen after school program the the one that's on the that's second floor that that's on the third floor or the third floor is it right third floor rear I think they're moving to 36 kids they're going to okay but so the only ones preschool okay right is it possible to have I don't know the the departments that are going to be using this space and I know we've had some conversations during the budget process with Eric about moving, you know, um moving up to the second floor, right? And I think it would be good for all of us to know what's happening. Okay. Yeah. Just because just mean even at a meeting or what have you. And it doesn't have to necessarily be in a in a email summary. It just uh I think it'd be good to be on TV and you know other folks will know too because if they have to come in for a permit one of the primary

reasons that we move the building department down to the first floors right off the driveway right off the parking lot right off the driveway not tracking mud and you know contractors coming in and out their own entrance and their own private entrance basically where they can't access the rest of the building right four hours or after. Yeah. And and another thing to I mean u this Clyde said at the meeting like you know we should determine what the use of the multi-purpose room will be going forward. So yeah if we're going to put it in the rotation of rooms that can be reserved and and I know there's still discussion of the parking up front with a slanted line you know as a study I will have uh two uh two a couple drawings of of different options for that because that's going to be done this summer. I saw that. Yeah. So, um, that's going to be done in-house by DPW. That kind of got us sidetracked off a town meeting, I guess, but that's a big this was that was the big vote, right? Right. The rest of it kind of went um, you know, the cannabis vote um was a you always look at the no votes, you know, the the ones that get in that one um wasn't our article, so that one that Tom voted. I haven't really heard much conversation from uh the planning board. I'm sure they'll discuss it. Um but what the future looks like for that. We must have done a great job with the budget cuz no one held any items. Yeah. Oh, it was a great presentation. I think um Steve Fincom setting the standard for future meeting uh future town meetings um really helped. I think people that if town meetings the only they're not watching this and town meeting is the only snapshot they get that's a good prequel to what they're voting on, you know. So I think that might have helped a lot. Yeah. Agreed. Um I think I wanted to to talk about article 12 but at a larger context of like what happened with the orchard and what happened with MBTA and it's you know my frustration at um you know low

information voters showing up on town meeting night and I I'm not disparaging that like I understand that people don't have time to look into the issues the way they do. I think that the problem is we or volunteers spend hundreds or thousands of hours researching a topic and coming up with the best solution to have it sort of derailed at the last minute because of an emotional plea. And it is very frustrating and I I think that we are doing all we can to expose information to people like we we can't literally I don't I don't know what else we could do in order to to give them what they want. But I wonder if um the charter committee will rep will will come up with a recommendation for representative town meeting so that hopefully you have more informed people there. Um although it might be the same 200 people I don't know. Um, but I wonder if I just I keep thinking that there must be some way we can pre-answer those questions or derail the sort of, you know, I the the biggest frustration was the lack the people claiming that we were l not transparent. Well, this like this doesn't help though. I will No. Well, so that was a very complicated article and and I think that there was there was legitimate confusion about all the three motions and I think it was very hard to explain and and I understand that but I think the the tendency of people to complain that we are not honest and not transparent or corrupt. It boggles my mind. I mean I don't I don't know how much more transparent we could be. Like none of those people who are accusing us of that have ever talked to me or any of us I bet to ask us any questions about any of these issues. And I'm pleading with the residents to just for freak's sake talk to us. None of us has any secrets about any of this stuff. We'll talk your ear off about it. Um, and I wish there was

some way that we could get that word out in advance of of town meeting so that the four people who sort of stand up and and constantly accuse us, you know, could could at least get um, how I don't know. Uh to me the thing that concerns me the most, you know, people can say what they want to say, whatever, but there's a reason that there are blank slots on our ballots. This is true. I I mean, and part of the reason is because the folks who do go to town meeting and even the folks who don't, I mean, we all know it. We say, "Oh, you know, what do you how do you spend your time?" Oh, I'm on the slapboard. We all know that look. And I think I am a big believer in in being skeptical and asking questions. Um, but I also believe there is a direct correlation between the amount of abuse that is, you know, thrown at people at volunteers. and the lack of volunteers. Yeah. And I just I I wish that um folks would think twice about that and and for them to come back and say, you know, we don't trust you or I do trust you, but I didn't trust the people before you. Well, how do you you know, how are you ever going to get anybody you trust, right? If you're undermining the people that you're saying you do trust right now, it's it's tricky. I I don't you know I don't want to make this a cathar you know some sort of uh catharsis or something but it's it's um it's we do have a crisis in terms of um volunteerism in this town and it's not going to get better as people get busier and I think we really need to think about how we're going to

tackle that. I mean this takes solace in the fact that there are people that put trust in us by voting for us to put us here. So yes, I you know that means something when I'm when I'm at town meeting especially cuz that's the one where you get lamb based the most um unpopular articles. You know I think that's that's the time where you can really rely you I kind of you elected us to make decisions the body elected us to make decisions the citizenry and um we make those tough decisions and there there's no possible way I would ever expect everybody to agree. It just cannot ever happen. So I I expected I you know initially I think I was shocked when I first started. You were but I've grown you know to understand um that that's you can put as much information as you can out there. Um I but I I will say with article 12 I mean I I think I was sat in your office and I had a bad feeling about it from the get-go. I I just I thought I felt the pulse of the people saying this was not going to pass and I so knowing that that's kind of why you heard me. I was skeptical of it the whole way where I didn't want I didn't think we should I thought it was premature to put it forward because I if nothing else and you're always going to have those people that will complain no matter what we do and how much we show. You know, if we could have absolutely ahead of the game spent the next year showing what it costs, what it would cost to put a building here, what it would cost to tear it down, what it would cost, what what it looks like to put it here, here's what it would cost, Littleton, and then how fast do we really need it? Do we need it? Some people just say, "Well, we've got a school. We've got that was brought up in DPW." Unfortunately, you know, we have a lot of infrastructure things that we need to get done and the and the state's not exactly pouring money into us to help us with schools and things like that. Um I

I think we we really have to work really hard to to explain to people before it gets to town meeting. Um because this was a very difficult article that's if we look at the commonality of those articles that you know between the orchard orchard was just a very passionate article um but if I look at the MBTA one with this one um they were complicated and this being complicated last second where people might have read this for the first time as they walked in that room I think was the kiss of death if it was ever going to pass anyway. I think that was the kiss of death. I think it was I mean I don't think a I think even if it's even if you have a bad feeling if one thinks it's the right thing to do for the town one should still try to get it out there and give it a shot but two you know it was either going to be rushed or it's going to be too late. That's fair. Yeah. you know, um it very rarely are we ever, you know, um congratulated on the fact that we had perfect timing. Yeah. Um and a pitch perfect um you know um article, but it it was rushed, right? And I think but again, I think the question was is it going to be rushed or was it going to be too late? So, I I agree with you, Gary, that the green sheet wasn't ideal, but I think I mean Karen and I had a lot of discussions about getting to that green sheet because we didn't feel comfortable what was what what was printed in the book and we tried to get to a point where we thought, you know, at least the board felt comfortable uh compared to what was in the book. I mean, the green sheet was a result of a lot of hours. I can tell you that. I think that was s I think actually that was a great change. Like I that that swung me from being pretty ambivalent

about it to like yeah let's do this. This is great. We can go forward and get information and not be committed to anything and we have the safety net of town meeting has to vote on another article. I thought that was a really good compromise. So I think that was a a a huge success as far as like what we ended up with. It's just a shame have more runway. It was also unfortunate that it was so complicated and so many moving parts. Yeah. Yeah. But we did. We went from three two. Well, I you know I I think that this this building, if I learned one thing, it people a lot more passionate about this building than we than we thought. There are there is a segment of population that, you know, likes driving through some of the other communities and they see the brick buildings and they've got all these beautiful brick buildings that they've restored. So I and this is our only one. So, I think there's something to that uh to a lot of the voters and I at least people that spoke to me, but at the end of the day, um we'll move we got to move forward with what what we're what we're left with. Yeah. And similar to the orchard, you know, folks are invested in the brick, you know, then we'll run it to ground. We'll find out how can we can we can we keep the brick? Can we keep the shell? What would happen? Yeah. So, one of the problems with what you were suggesting, Gary, of going through and finding out how much it would cost to do X, Y, or Z is we really don't know if we're not if we're doing it by ourselves, right? We know how much it would cost to build a town hall. We don't know necessarily know how much it would uh if we gave this building over how much it would that complicated things for sure. It complicates things and it um both in the process and in the cost, right? it could, you know, be s significantly cheaper for us. Great example is 36 King Street. I mean, the the difference between what we thought it was going to cost to renovate and what came in was large. And that and as a result of that, we said, "Next time we got to go back with a bid in hand, and this was an

attempt for us to go back to town meeting with a bid in hand. We did exactly what we said we were going to do." Oh, well, that's a great point. I mean, it's, you know, we are I think we're being effective and making choices and following through, but um don't get don't get hung up on your losses. No, I I'm fine. I mean, I you know, I I said to Jim afterwards, don't come up. I said afterwards like, "Welcome to Littleton." You know, like it's fine. Well, you know what's best? Just go watch some other town meetings and you'll be like, "Oh, wow. Five nights worth." I don't want this to come across as as me as this sounding like us griping and doing nothing but griping. What I really am focused on is I I do wish there was a way for us to impress upon people how how open and available we are for conversations about this. I like when people disagree with me. Not enough people come to me and disagree with me about things and talk to me about it. And I would welcome that to hear that ahead of town meeting honestly. When are your next office hours? Uh two weeks. I don't know. Rob, can you keep it to a minute or less? All right. Thank you, Marge Payne. That's all I have to say. Yeah. Right. So, a couple things. Um, you may remember that I was there at Super Saturday and for all but the last hour, maybe. That's when we did all the big work. What's that? That's when we did all the big work. Yeah. Well, well, and and I raised my hand. I remember Steve looked at my hand, saw it, and said, "We're not taking public comment." So, with regard to a comment earlier in this discussion about the annual budget not getting comment, I've had a difficult time trying to figure out when FINCOM's holding a public input and I choose to not do it at town meeting. I'm not going to stand up there and and elongate all that. But I think something does need to be done and make available with regard to citizen questions, etc. And so it's

another round for me with regard to like whether it's MBTA or whatever the orchard etc or or what's going to come up in the next with regard the infrastructure needs. I think holding public hearing maybe two months out. We already know there's going to be a Shaker Lane. We know there's going to be uh a building DPW building. There's going to be probably another, you know, this building, etc. If you hold public hearings couple months in advance before it happens, before the article's written, etc., you're giving I would then feel more comfortable basically saying, "I respect your opinions, but where were you?" Because they're trying to get your input and you didn't give them the opportunity. and and there's almost as Chase you know said point of order etc with regard to conflicting I'd love to hear some of those those contrary viewpoints in order to then work up a series of citizens to combat the five six not that might change their mind but to offer wait a minute all respect Rob that's already been deliberated we've already gone through multiple meetings where all of those points encounter points have been deliberated. So it's the the it's incumbent upon the resident at some point to pay attention. Well, you know, you're they have to educate themselves at town meeting because of something that we've already discussed. I mean, I think at least I can say you see me here. I attend wasn't aimed at you. No, no, no. I I respect that. But what I'm trying to say is for me right now, I'm working I'll just give you a subset of Shaker and I'll try to be done. is I need more

people. I talk to them in the neighborhood, but then they're gone. And I need more people to come together when you folks are listening. And it's not just Friday office hours. It's all five of you together and really get all the different issues. I I've probably heard six or seven different reasons why people voted against this building change, article 12. And yet I didn't have all those things in advance. I only had them that night. And therefore just one resident and there were other people. I give the council on aging the chair credit for speaking up when she did because it was overwhelming and obvious it was going to fail and yet she spoke up. But there's some aspect of needing to be able to come together to see like-minded citizens so that we can then see, hey, there's more than just me. There's you and you and you. And and to bring up the thoughtful comments that can compete and hopefully convince and the timing of it. We're not going to do it at town meeting. The dynamic is it's already baked at that point in time. It needs to be something before for these big dollar items, the ones that you already know are going to have the hourlong public comment at town meeting. Anything you can do to force us, and you're right, Chuck, terms of the individual things, but it's an individual thing when 30 people are going to watch this, you know, on LCTV and nobody's going to have that interaction aspect. So, it's just my attempt to try to to offer up I respect that and I respect the fact that you do put the amount of time you put in. Thanks for letting me go. So, you know, just last piece. So, 250 people at Tom meeting. I don't know what was the 241. 241. Our typical meetings when we discussed that that article five people 10 people you just probably

here for something else but they hung around views on views on LCTV. All right. I'll be you know how many so you're basically I will say out of that 241 is half are just coming to town meetings. Yeah. And getting this in the mail. Yeah. And coming to town meetings and never paying attention before that. Right. That's why this green thing when I said it didn't help. That did not help because that's they read this and they were coming to town meeting and they're like, "What?" No. To Rob's point, I think there's there's a lot to be said for advertising something that says, "Okay, we're going to talk about Shaker Lane." versus okay, we're gonna have a meeting and you can dig through the agenda and see what we're talking about. Yeah. Yeah. One one will bringing in more people than another. So, so it might be there's only so much bandwidth, right? 100%. Maybe like we try an experiment before fall town meeting and hold extra office hours at random times. You know, we do. Yeah, we do all represent all of the voters. Yeah. And um I I Matthew made the point earlier, you know, very easy to get a hold of you or any one of us, right? And and I think that we each represent there's there's going to be a contingent that's going to reach out to me and not necessarily out to you. And we have to make sure that we aggregate the whole and you know, sometimes I think each one of us has probably made a vote that wasn't necessarily the vote that we would have made, but it was the vote that we thought we thought was the town and that's what the presidents wanted. And that's that's that's what when we get elected in May, we need to be represent we need to be representing everybody. And and if only 1,200 people show up or only 250 people show up to me that says then you're putting your trust in us to try to get the best for the most. Yeah. So, so the other thing I was going to just circle back on is I went to an MMA

talk about a month ago where they were talking about not mixed martial arts. No, the citizensmies, right? And I really think we need to figure out how to do a citizens academy. It will help build the bullpen and fill those slots of people coming up and get people in more informed of cycle. Yeah. It's been done in the past and it should be done again. You're right. So, I'm gonna I'm not going to lie. I had a person with me today Um it was a landscaper. Um and is that landscaping? I said I have a meeting tonight. So I I said I have a meeting tonight. I'm going. He goes, "What are you doing?" I I'm on the select. He goes, "What's that?" That's a residence. Just to let you know that there's that extreme. Yep. And then there's they don't even people just live their daily lives and sure do what they do. So some people wasn't the same. So that's where something like a an academy would go. All right. I didn't want Karen to end on time. Ain a motion to adjurnn. So moved. Second. Moved by Matthew, seconded by Chuck. All those in favor? I. Thank you so much. Thank you. Good job.