Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Thank you.

Thank you.

Good morning, everyone. We are going to call to order the August 5th meeting of the Lake County Planning and Zoning Board. If you would all please rise for the Pledge of Allegiance and remain standing for a moment of silence.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

All right, you may be seated. Good morning, everyone. The Lake County Planning and Zoning Board is an advisory board to the Board of County Commissioners. The board is responsible for reviewing proposed changes to the comprehensive plan, zoning, conditional uses, mining site plans, and making recommendations on these applications to the Board of County Commissioners. The recommendations of the Planning and Zoning Board are transmitted to the Board of County Commissioners for their consideration at a scheduled public hearing. And in the instance of the cases On today's agenda, those would be scheduled for the September 1st, 2026 Board of County Commissioners Meeting scheduled to occur at 9 o'clock a.m. At this time, we will review the agenda for any update on the agenda items.

Good morning. Janie Barone, Planning Manager for the Office of Planning and Zoning. I'll be presenting to you the agenda. Today, at this time, I would like to enter into the record that the cases being presented before you today have been duly noticed in accordance with state statute. For agenda update, on tab three, you've received an errata memo that was provided for the data center temporary moratorium that includes a fourth definition, so you guys accept it. Staff would like to proceed with the item as shown on the agenda. For tabs four, six, seven, and eight, a memo containing correspondence has been placed for you in the dais as these cases received correspondence after the staff report and public hearing and ordinances were transmitted to you. and staff will be removing those to the regular agenda and we'll be doing a full presentation. In addition, in respect to tabs seven and eight, the applicant is present. They have sent an email to staff indicating that they would like to request a postponement to the October 7th Planning and Zoning Board meeting subject to the Planning and Zoning Board approving the postponement and the applicant is present to do that.

No other agenda updates. Okay, we also have speaker cards for tabs, tab four and five. So those would also be coming off. So that would leave tab one, two, nine and 10 on the consent agenda. Do we need to pull tab seven and eight to do the postponement separately?

I think you mean we're gonna leave tabs one, two, three

no i have a speaker card on tab three on three okay sorry i just heard tab five perfect thank you so melanie do we need to pull seven and eight off consent to do a postponement motion yes okay okay so that would lead leave tabs one two nine and ten on the consent agenda are there any reason to that the board would like to hear a full presentation on any of those four items Okay, we do have to pull tab nine to a separate consent because I have a conflict, so I can't vote on that item. So if we want to just separate the consent into those, it would be tabs one, two, and 10, and then tab nine as a separate consent. Good?

Yeah.

Motion to approve one.

Gotta do minutes first. We're just reviewing the agenda and reorganizing. Okay. So that updates our agenda. And there's nothing else to add to the agenda, correct, Janie?

Correct.

Thank you. All right. At this time, we will review the minutes from the June 3rd meeting. Are there any questions or changes to those minutes? If not, I would entertain a motion.

Move to approve.

I have a motion. Is there a second?

Second.

I have a motion and a second. All in favor, signify by saying aye. Aye. Opposed, same sign. Motion carries. So wait, wait, sir. At this time, we are going to move into citizen question and comment period. Should anyone have any questions or comments on items that are not on our agenda today? This would be a time to come forward and ask those questions, um, or make those statements. But this would be specifically for items not on our agenda. If you wish to speak on an item that is on the agenda today, you will need to speak up, fill out a speaker card and provide it to the clerk. Is there any citizen question or comment not about our, on these items on our agenda? If you'd like to come forward. And if you could please state your name and address for the record.

Well, my name is Rick Carlins, and I am from 5144 Albert Road in Fruitland Park. And I want to address concerns with two that they were on. They're not on now, but I filled out a card for those. But I'm going to speak a public comment to item three and four, if I might. That's my...

Sir, item three and four will have a hearing today.

They are on our regular agenda. I know, but if I understood correctly, and maybe I didn't, that I may be able to speak to items that are not on the agenda. So it's not on the agenda, and I would like to speak to it.

Items three and four are on our agenda.

For today?

Yes. the data center and the S the Islamic center of Claremont.

Okay. Well then I misunderstood the whole previous.

Those are coming off of our consent agenda. What that means is we're going to do a full hearing on them.

Thank you. And I'm sorry for any confusion.

That's fine.

Appreciate it.

Um, let's see. All right. At this point we will move forward with our consent agenda, which will be made up of tabs one, two, nine and 10. Again, tab nine does need to be voted on separately because I cannot vote on that item.

Move move to approve consent agenda items one, two, and 10.

I have a motion. Is there a second?

Second.

I have a motion a second all in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

All opposed. Same motion carries. All right. And move to approve tab nine and consent. Okay. I have a motion to approve the tab nine under the consent agenda.

Second.

I have a second. Is there any need for discussion? All right, all in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. All opposed, same sign. Okay, motion carries. At this point we will move into our regular agenda starting with tab three. Oh, wait. I'm sorry. Melanie, since we're moving into regular agenda now, do we need to go ahead and deal with 7 and 8?

I would suggest that you do that so they don't have to wait through the whole hearing if you're going to postpone it.

OK. So is there any reason the board would like to not move tab 7 and 8 up to the top since they're seeking a postponement? No. OK. So Janie, if you're comfortable with that, we'll go ahead and start with tab 7 and 8.

Absolutely.

Should I go ahead? Good morning. My name is Madeline Damon. I'm the attorney for the property owner, as well as the applicant for tabs seven and nine or seven and eight, excuse me. My address is 700 almond street, Claremont, Florida, three, four, seven, one, one. Um, and just as Ms. Barron, uh, mentioned, we are requesting a postponement. Um, there were some items on the staff report that we, um, notice would need some revising. Um, so I'm working with the planner, Ms. Reagan, um, on revising those items in the staff report.

Okay. And are you seeking to postpone to the next board meeting or for a date? Are you seeking a date specifically that you want to postpone to, or just any date in the future? And we'll re advertise.

Um, yes, I spoke with Ms. Reagan yesterday. She said that we'd be unable to, um, meet the deadline for September planning and zoning boards. So we're requesting the October planning and zoning board. I believe that's October 7th. Okay.

Jenny that's October 2nd. Correct. It would be 7th, October 7th.

Okay.

All right. Does anyone have any questions regarding the request for post moment? If not, I would entertain a motion to postpone. I have a motion. Is there a second? Oh, do they need to say to date certain or did we already clarify that?

Okay.

Okay. We have a motion and a second all in favor signify by saying aye. All opposed. Same. Okay. Motion carries. We will see you October 7th. Okay, we will now move to tab three.

Good morning. For the record, Jamie Brown planning manager with the office of planning and zoning. I'll be presenting to you tap three, otherwise known as the data center temporary moratorium. The ordinance establishes a temporary moratorium on the construction expansion of, and the issuance of building permits, development permits and development orders, or the rezoning of property for data centers facilities within the unincorporated area of Lake County. The board of County commissioners has the authority, to protect the public health, safety, and welfare of its residents and to enact ordinances for valid governmental purposes that are not inconsistent with general or special laws. On June 23rd, 2026, the Board of County Commissioners directed staff to prepare an ordinance instituting a temporary moratorium on the acceptance, review, or approval of applications for data centers, data center facilities, and data center utilities. or the issuance of building permits, development orders, or the rezoning for data centers, data center facilities, and data center utilities. Lake County is located within a region that relies heavily upon groundwater resources from the Floridian aquifer system, which has historically been to significant management and conservation. In addition, the Board of County Commissioner finds that Lake County currently lacks These specific zoning provisions or development permits, regulations addressing the unique operational characteristics, infrastructure requirements, and environmental considerations associated with data centers, data center facilities, and data center utilities. The Board of County Commissioner further finds that allowing such facilities to proceed without the appropriate regulatory standards could create a risk to the county's water resource, electrical infrastructure capacity, and land use planning objectives and long-term community development strategy. New forms of industrial skills development need to be evaluated carefully and responsibly. Local governments are entitled to enact moratoriums as a land use tool to promote effective planning to preserve the status quo during times of study and while changes are enacted. In addition, as shown in your backup, a temporary moratorium on the acceptance, review or approval of applications for development permits, development orders, rezonings or site plans related to data centers, data center facilities and data center utilities within the unincorporated Lake County will allow time to review, study, hold public hearings and to prepare and adopt an amendment or amendments to the Lake County Land Development Regulations and or Court of Ordinances as may be required to address such uses. This concludes staff's presentations. Do you have any questions for staff at the moment?

Does anyone have questions for staff?

I do have a question. I don't know if this is... Absolutely. Has there been any solicited or unsolicited proposals for data centers that would fall within the parameters of the moratorium? That sort of triggered, oh, we've got to slow down and put this in place in order to get regulations.

Solicitations from the public?

From proposed data centers within Lake County.

Not that I'm aware of, but I can definitely check with our economic development staff.

Good morning. For the record, Kathleen dial executive director. Um, we have had two projects that have come to the county. Um, there are not any that we are working currently, so there wasn't sufficient capacity or there was issues. So we do not have any at this time on the table.

Those were just inquiries. They didn't make a formal application. Correct.

Okay. Yeah. How they come through the state or they come private. Yeah. But we have had some inquiries. Yes.

Thank you. Are there any other questions?

What's the expiration on this moratorium? What's the expiration?

12 months, yeah. The expiration of the moratorium will be for 12 months.

It says up to one year. So could that extend beyond one year as a result of that, the language?

So the Board of County Commissioners would have to extend it through another ordinance and public hearing process if we weren't at a point where we could do regulations.

The one thing nobody understands about the data centers is it's going to take two years to do a study with Duke or SECO or somebody just for the energy infrastructure. I mean, there's a process to it. You know, okay. You answer my question.

Thank you, sir.

All right. Are there any other questions for staff before we hear from the public? OK. I will go ahead and call members up based on the speaker cards that I have. When you come to the podium, please state your name and address for the record and keep your comments to three minutes so that we can get through everyone as quickly as possible and try to be efficient with everyone's time today. So we will first hear from Oscar Rodriguez.

My name is Oscar Rodriguez. I've been in Lake County for three years, and I have been a Florida resident for 64 years. I came from a county that has had very little foresight on two different aspects and I'm very worried of the impact that any of these data centers can do on the environment as well as the well-being of the people within the community of Lake County. The reason why I came to Lake County was to get away from more where you would have an infrastructure that would make it easier to live in a quiet community. As we grow, do we have the infrastructure of it? And the second part of it, has anybody come up with the impact of these data centers coming into Lake County on citizens, the roadways, and all of the other infrastructures that make Lake County a little different from every county in the state of Florida. And I just yield my time for the answers.

Thank you, sir. I'm sorry, could you please state your address for the record?

Yes, ma'am. 10701 Summit Square Drive, Leesburg, Florida.

Thank you so much. Okay, Rick Carlins.

Good morning again. Rick Carlins and Fruitland Park resident 5144 Albert Road. And in addition to, you know, the environmental concerns and the health concerns that the data centers would, there are concerns for that. They're just making that statement. I also, you know, I'm concerned about my and our individual liberty because it's the data collection. they're collecting data and you know that goes hand in hand with you know your real id where you go when you use that real id and it also goes along with all the flock cameras and you know all the other avenues that there are for data collection it goes into the data center and they're tracking they they have the ability to know your patterns you know everywhere that you go it's like they're monitoring good uh people who are you know honor the Constitution, God and country, and one justice for all. They're tracking us as well. This should be just for the criminal. What I'm trying to say is it can be used for good, but these data centers ultimately are going to get into the wrong hands, I believe, and we need to be very cautious of that because there's so many things that it could be used for in order to have us comply to their demands. When I say their, I mean any government agency that would be involved with the oversight on that and have the authority to use it to monitor and implement the laws. Just an example, I guess, like during COVID and in 2020, when, you know, things were locked down. There's not so much here, you know, but it has happened. We need to look at what other things have happened throughout the country and what they've done to people in order to just maybe go get some food or go to see if your mother's all right because she's not going to be all right. If she doesn't have you there, you're her only advocate and, you know, she's home alone or something like that. You really wouldn't be able to get there if the control that it is that they would be able to do with all the data that they're collecting can be used for. So that's a concern for mine, of mine, and we just, We don't need to have that risk in Lake County. And as far as the moratorium goes, I think that it should be permanent until otherwise, you know, lobbied against that because public sediment, there's a growing concern on this, there really is. And it does tie into all the collection which has to do with the data cameras, you know, the flock cameras and the LPRs even. That information goes to these places, but also it's acknowledged that it's shared through every law enforcement agency and every bureaucracy throughout the country. It's shared. Once that information goes out from a camera.

If you could just wrap up, please.

Yeah, that's all. It's just shared. I'm just saying it's out there, and it is being stored. And the data is important for people to use to control. That's it. Thank you.

Thank you. Does anyone else wish to speak on this item? Seeing none, we will bring it back to the board. Are there any further questions for staff or any of our legal team or any of those folks? Okay. Seeing none, I would entertain a motion on tab three. Move to approve. I have a motion. Is there a second? Second.

Madam Chairman, just to clarify, that includes the additional errata sheet.

Yes, ma'am, the additional errata sheet. Do you want to amend your motion to clarify? To approve with the included additional errata sheet. You maintain your second. Thank you. Okay, we have a motion and a second. Is there any need for discussion on this topic amongst the board?

I just have just a brief, we're working very hard in Florida to try to reduce tax burdens for residential, like homestead taxes. And to do that, you shift the revenue burden on commercial. uh... i actually think that there's any do this smart uh... but and i think more time would be fine in order to figure out what regulations we want to put in place close systems they have to generate their own energy these are things that are already being you know legislative a higher level just like county uh... but I, I would encourage folks, you know, you don't, you don't regulate gas stations to correct how people drive. So that as far as data collecting on individuals have nothing to do and there's, you know, revenue property tax revenue that we could be shifting, uh, uh, more towards commercial and to, uh, for the infrastructure needs that we have in the county.

So, and that's why I asked what the expiration on. Yeah. I mean, there needs to be an exploration on it. Not everybody understands exactly what data centers do. They think they do, but they don't.

Everybody wants oil revenue. That's correct. They don't want it drilled in their backyard. There is potential for some great opportunities for our kids, for jobs in Lake County. So I'm for the exploration of how we could make data centers work. In concert with conserving our way of life here in Lake County.

And exploration is the key word.

Yeah. Yes. That's it.

I think the ordinance gives the county and the Board of County Commissioners to develop land development regulations that are consistent with data centers because they do have very specific needs and they do drain a lot of the natural resources. If we get Georgia to stop pulling from the Florida aquifer, that would be great. But we have no regulations now. We should have them. So we can be consistently applied.

Putting that together at the state level.

Yeah. Agreed. Agreed.

Yeah. And this, so I agree, this would be for 12. This is the way the duration is written. This is a temporary moratorium that should remain in effect for a period of 12 months from and including the effective date of this ordinance. or until the date of an ordinance amending the land development regulations or the code of ordinances relating to data centers, data center facilities, and data center utilities, whichever occurs first. So 12 months or an ordinance gets adopted. I look forward to seeing the study and evaluation outcomes for the six items they're gonna be looking into at the county. So if there is no further discussion, I would entertain a motion on tab three. I move to approve. We have a motion. Second. Second, all in favor? Aye. All right, we'll move on to tab four.

good morning for the record megan bracciali planner with the office of planning and zoning i'll be presenting tab number four apologies um yes tab number four case number pz 2025 352 otherwise known as the islamic center of claremont The applicant is requesting a rezoning of approximately 3.69 net acres from the agricultural district to community facility district to incorporate that subject property into the existing adjacent CFD approved under ordinance 2007-20, which will facilitate the expansion of their place of worship. The subject property is located at one five one zero six John's lake road in the unincorporated Claremont area. The subject property is currently designated with a rural future land use category and is zoned agriculture district. The accompanying concept plan depicts the existing home site, agricultural structures and the proposed civic use structures. Staff finds the rezoning request consistent with the land development regulations and comprehensive plan. I'm available for questions as is the applicant and owner. This concludes my presentation.

Thank you. Does anyone have questions for staff or the applicant before we hear from the public? Okay, we will go ahead and move into public comment. Thank you so much. Again, when you approach the podium, please state your name and address for the record. And as you heard the little beep noise go off, that indicates you've been speaking for three minutes. If you could please wrap it up as quickly as possible following that sound. We are going to start with Susie Westbrook.

Good morning. I'm Susie Westbrook. I actually own a home on Johns Lake Road. And I'm just curious what this is going to do for the traffic at the intersection of Johns Lake Road and Hancock. That, as my understanding, Hancock is overloaded already, and there's no place for it to expand. So what's going to happen to the traffic if this facility enlarges and the attendance gets much larger. What's that going to do for Hancock Road and for those people who live on Johns Lake Road trying to get off of Johns Lake Road? When they get out of their services or whatever they're doing, are we going to have, you know, hundreds of people trying to get on our little two-lane road to get off of, you know, to get out of church and get on to Hancock? And then I would be curious what kind of buffers they're going to be. as far as setbacks and buffers along the road. That's it, ding, my three minutes are up.

Thank you. Gordon Warren. Oh, okay. And then Paul Adams.

Okay, if you could just state your address for the record and you can pass those to the clerk. Thank you. I'm the meat in the sandwich here. You can see on the current maps that there are three different parcels in question. The first CFD in 2007 is what this is trying to piggyback off of. I want to point out that there was a center that zoning was denied in 2012, and there were many reasons, but one in particular was sewer. Susie mentioned the road access, so I won't get into that, but the bottom line is the the five-acre lot that they tried to file for rezoning on was denied. And not only was it denied, the residents were told they could not operate at the intensity that they were operating at at that time. Fast forward, they bought the property for the 2007 CFD. I'm looking at the history there. A sewer connection was required. Did that happen? No. Were any studies done? to analyze the impact on the wellheads in the area? No. In fact, every single one of these says, you gotta do these studies. You gotta connect to the sewer. And I'm here four times now. My house is in the middle. I've got three different parcels. Every one of them touches my property. Okay, yes, there's a road in between, but the point is I am impacted directly. I am worried about what's happening to my water wells and my drinking water, and I have not had any relief from the county on this. They shut them down in 2012. They moved over. over in 2000, from the 2012 over to the property. And let's see, they bought that in 2013, and then the next one in 2015. They applied for rezoning in 2019, it was denied back then, and now we're doing it again. The fourth time I'm here, it's an hour drive for me every day, every time I have to come here. I don't think this is fair to the residents that live here. And I want to look at the specific considerations. Let's see. The bottom line is the existing usage that they're doing right now was not permitted in 2012 on a larger lot, and now they're coming and wanting to expand onto another lot? Are we begging for forgiveness here? Aren't the ISR requirements being violated right now? Hasn't anybody evaluated that? What about all these studies? I keep hearing promises. It's been 19 years, and we're still doing this. I want it done. I want it to stop. Thank you.

Thank you for your time. All right. Asif, Dr. Asif Ali, our ally.

Good afternoon, Madam Chairman. Jimmy Crawford, Crawford Monaghan Holt for the applicant. Dr. Ali is with the owner and the applicant.

Okay.

And so we'd rather wait until we hear from all the neighbors and then we would like a chance to respond.

Understood. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Um, Jacqueline harp. Good morning. Good morning. My name is Jacqueline hop.

I live at one 50, 40 John's lake road, Claremont, Florida, three, four, seven, one, one in conjunction. It is my home sits right in the center. This Islamic center that is going on is just like a U-shape and within this U-shape, our home, my husband and I, David Hart, and myself, we took a house and we made it a home. My concern is with us sitting right in the U-shape, what effect this is going to bring to us. One already been spoken on is the traffic. The driveway is right there side my home. The next is the lighting. Lighting has already been put up and right with that lighting, it still shines down within our home. The drainage, I have a concern about the drainage as well. How far is this supposed to be from our residential home? When it starts, what kind of disturbance is it going to bring to our home? We try to live in a home of peace. How far is this facility in the distance that it's really supposed to be from our home? We've been in Claremont for over 34 years. When I moved here in Claremont, it was a dirt road there. That's the reason for us coming here, for the quietness, not a city, but as we've been here, we've been able to see the city grow. I have no problem with anyone worshiping. My concern is what's gonna come out of this with my home sitting right in this U shape of this. So it goes up on one side of my driveway, all the way across the backyard, and now all the way down the side. I have grandchildren that I have to be concerned about. This is gonna bring more people to the area, more traffic to the area, more everything to the area for them to operate. Just that facility alone if it's put there. So I just wanna let someone know and ask if you could visualize this around your home and you sitting right there in the center, would that be a concern to you? Thank you for hearing my concerns. Be blessed.

Thank you so much. Rick Carlins.

Well, good morning again, and do you want me to state my name in that? Yes, please. Rick Carlins, 5144 Albert Road, Fruitland Park, Florida. And I want to just highlight some facts and some realities that we are witnessing in our nation today with regards to in Texas, where they are building an epic, City there that's an Islamic city where they were going to just incorporate Sharia law and manage it themselves and only People of the Islamic faith could live there the other thing is enters is what you see going on in New York and in Detroit and in Michigan. They have calls to prayer that would wake you up out of bed and have your, you know, in the middle of the streets they're having these things. There's no separation from The beginnings of it, which seem to be very, you know, just the way that it is right now, that you don't want to encroach on somebody's faith or what they believe in. And I do not want to do that. But the thing is, what happens is it grows into where they are encroaching and removing your ability to have a different faith and to live your life that way. It turns into that. That's what's going on. As I said, in states in this country, you have to have seen it. But there's no separation. That's all that I'm trying to say. It's not compatible with our United States Constitution. It's the honor killings, this is all in the Quran. And this is the same thing that they're wanting to expand there. In Tampa, for example, they have a school where they teach Sharia law. and the children all have to wear whatever the dress code is and so forth. The females are not even allowed to walk beside a man, they have to walk behind. So this is just, there's no separation is all that I'm trying to bring to your attention. You may think that there is, but there's not. This will eventually evolve to all the things that it is that we see. And with that, I'm done, thank you.

Thank you. Oscar Rodriguez.

Oscar Rodriguez, 10701 Summit Square Drive, Leesburg, Florida. My main concern is any... I'm open to any faith as long as any prayer areas are kept within themselves. There is no need to have a community need, how can I say, be exposed to or come up to the standards that they've shown in all different areas within the United States. I'm concerned for the people that are there. I'm concerned for the people that will travel back and forth in the area if they're going to be disturbances of such a kind. And the third thing is for them to explain why is it that they're trying to expand if the physical community, what is their census? How many people are they actually attending the services there? And how often are they doing that? Is that exposed to the community? I believe that the people that live around them need to be exposed or shown at least what their intent is for that particular center as they expand in also one of the main roads going in across Lake County. I yield the rest.

Thank you. Tom Vale.

Good morning. My name is Tom Vail. I live at 7322 McGill Road in Groveland County. We're talking about an Islamic center. An Islamic center is a mosque. A mosque is a forward operating base for the conquest, the Islamic conquest of our country. We cannot let this happen in Lake County. This is a political movement masked by religious practices. We cannot allow this to expand in Lake County. Islam must be stopped. The conquest must be stopped. We know what's happening around the world. We see what's happening in Europe. We see it in Minnesota. We see it in Detroit. We see it in New York City. We cannot let it happen here in Florida. Lake County has got to stop this. Thank you.

Thank you. Is there anyone else from the public who wishes to speak on this matter before we move to board discussion? If you would like to speak, you can come forward, just state your name and address for the record, and you can hand your speaker card to the clerk. Thank you.

Yes, my name is Robin Pasto, and I live at 27505 Stellar Seaway in Howie in the Hills. And I would like to reiterate the sentiments of some of the previous speakers here. Islamic centers, this is a map. Here they already are. in Lake County. And as we know, what has previously been said, they are nothing really more than FOBs. Mostly they are financed by foreign actors. The money that is used to purchase these is not homegrown. We also know that the domination of the West is the Islamic centers, is Islam's, their purpose. And there are three main phases of Muslim immigration. First, they play the victim. They claim Islamophobia. And then there is also the second phase, which is they demand Sharia law. and intolerate infidels. The third phase is militant and strict Sharia law enforced. And again, it is happening in Tampa. Temple Terrace is an expanding Islamic state, if you will. And Islam was not allowed in the USA in the past under the McCarran-Walters Act. And then in, I believe it was 1992 or... It was undone by the federal government. They cannot hold, they shouldn't be allowed to hold public office either because they cannot pledge allegiance to our US, because their ideology is in direct conflict with your US Constitution. That was happened in 1990. That's when the 101st Congress repealed the McCarran-Warren Act of 1952 that forbade Muslims from holding public office. So in addition to that, it is not a religion. It's not a race. It's a political ideology, okay, which imposes itself by force. Any political doctrine that calls to kill those who do not believe in it is not a religion. In their Koran, as stated before, it is claimed in there many times. And we should not allow anything like this. In addition to that, care has already been outlawed in Florida by our state government. And it's continuing to move forward. Islam itself, because it is a state here to infiltrate and dominate, is not a religion. And that's all I have to say.

Thank you. Anyone else on this item before we move back to board discussion? If you'd like to speak, please come forward, state your name and address, and I will ask you to please fill out a speaker card before you leave.

Good morning. My name is Randy Brazell. I live at 16550 Johns Lake Road. And basically the bottom line is there's no infrastructure there to support an expansion. And I support all the colleagues that came up here previous. I just want to let you know that there's a lot of us out here who do not want this to expand. So that's basically it. They just don't have the infrastructure there to support this. Thank you.

Thank you. If you could just get with the clerk to fill out a card. David Harp.

Good morning. I'm David Harp from 15,040 Johns Lake Road. My wife finished speaking a few moments ago. Paul stays right in front of me. I've been there for 30 years. I've seen the change. Traffic. I've seen trees and things be moved. I want you to know that this is heaven for me. The birds, the tortoise, the eagles, all of this is important because we want a home. I don't want to be invaded. I think that would be the problem. You're talking about a youth shape. We are right there. We got an acre right in the middle of all of that. That's heaven for me. But if anything change, I'm not going to allow that to move me. But I do have a say. And my say is I want to keep my wife happy. I want to keep my grandchildren happy. And I think that expansion would be a problem. I see their services. We have no problems with them praying. We have no problem with your studies. I have no problem with that. But I do know if there is an expansion, you're going to have more traffic. Now we even have to wait 15 to 20 minutes to come from Oakland to the house. That's the traffic around 4 to 5 o'clock, even before you get on John's Lake Road. So I plead and I ask that you consider, if you was in the midst of that, what would you do? Thank you.

Thank you. Gordon Warren.

Hi, I'm Gordon Warren. I live at 15147 Sunburst Lane in Claremont 34711. First, let me state that this is not about religion. It's about buildings. It's about buildings and property. When we had the other discussion several years ago, again, it was about buildings. So this is what we're dealing with. I was hoping somebody would expand on some of the problems with the properties around there, but they haven't done it. I do have some solutions for it. The Islamic Center wants to put a 4,000 square foot building on the Johns Lake property. We'll have to differentiate the five acres. It's the mosque property and the Johns Lake property. The Johns Lake property is zoned agricultural. It is 3.8 or 3.6 acres, depending on your measurements. It is... They want to do that because they want to relieve the overcrowding in the mosque area, which they have a house on there now. There are several solutions to this problem that do not require rezoning of the Johns Lake property to a CFD. They can take that 4,000-square-foot building. Now, I'm not sure if they can use it as a religious... Facility even though it's zoned agricultural that one. I haven't been able to get an answer to but they can also take that use a Trailer double wide triple wide for four thousand feet put it on the mosque property next to the Existing facility and use that for their overflow it would not require any change of zoning for the Johns Lake property to do that and it is a a very acceptable way, they can put that on there so as they build the mosque, which would eliminate all the problems with the expansion or the overcrowding, they could use that. It's something that people do all the time. And when they get the mosque built, they can then move the trailer to the other property. Let's see. The other thing is they can I can't remember everything. Another situation is that they can sell all three of their properties and move to another property somewhere else. It eliminates all the problems they have. They have the problems with sewer, drainage, traffic and everything else over here on this property here. They also have limited use on it because it's under the rural future land use property, where if you have a CFD, 20% of your property has to... You can just wrap up. Okay, has to be left in natural, whereas if it's agricultural, it's only 10%. So when you do the math on that, their property now shrinks from five acres to about three and a half acres. So anyway, thank you.

Thank you. All right, does anybody else wish to speak on this item before we bring it back to the board? OK, seeing none. Does anyone have questions for staff before we hear from the applicant? I actually just have one question. The the concept plan that we're looking at for this project depicts. Oh, I was thinking about the one that's in my packet. That one. Yeah, the sketch. So the existing facility that's to the left, the existing CFD that this is being included in that overall site, correct? That's the intent? Yes. So is that structure, that structure hasn't been built that's shown on that other property, correct?

That is correct. That is going through a site plan evaluation right now. The only existing structure is this small residence that is there.

The one that's shown on the aerial photo?

Yes.

Okay. And that is what's currently being used for their operation, correct? That small structure? The small residential structure on the neighboring parcel?

The applicant could talk more directly about what exactly they're using it for, but that is the only existing structure for right now.

So based on this concept plan, their in-site plan approval on the other property that has the new facility shown on the concept and they're now proposing an additional facility on this adjacent or adjoining property, and they just want to carry the same zoning with the new conditions applying to everything.

That is correct.

Okay.

It will all be one zoned CFD property for that use.

Okay. Are there ingress, egress, like transportation routing standards on, I mean, this is going to be a pretty big property, so is there a, A standard in our land development regulations that stipulates how traffic would have to move around the site itself.

We do have Seth available for traffic questions, but that will all go through the site plan review as well. Okay. Right now, and this is not a final approved plan, but this is imagery of what the Hancock-Johns Lake Road corner parcel is doing. sketched to look like that's that's one point so that's the that's what's already under site plan review right now right this is an imagery of what is on the adjacent parcel under site plan review okay this may change um based on how this new ordinance goes forward understood thank you

Can you put the concept plan back up? I'm struggling to read because it's so small. What's in that circle near the outside building?

Just north of that proposed structure? I believe that's intended to be a turnaround. Okay, but on the concept plan, it's just parking, no turnaround. on this concept plan doesn't align with the site plan that's going.

Okay, so is this not accurate or is the rendering not accurate?

The rendering is just imagery for what they're hoping to put there. This also has hopes of future structures as well and that is specific to the turnaround itself. Specific to the turnaround itself.

I believe I don't believe that is in place right now It's all concept Okay, so is the the concept and we can probably get clarification from the applicant on this is the concept plan that's in our packet Is that basically just the a rip from the prior? rezoning to CFD that showed what they were planning to do with the original property and

And then they added on the other? This concept plan is more specific to the subject property that we're discussing today. The adjacent parcel, obviously being in site plan review at the same time, will have, has a different concept now than it did when this was applied for. Okay. And it's not approved, so. I have a question on the ingress, and that might be a Seth question.

Seth Lynch, Pullet Works Department.

Thank you. On the ingress on the concept plan, is there a reason that Hancock Road cannot be used? And maybe that's an applicant question, but.

Yeah, the access for what, their left side?

Left side and right side.

Which is the current site. There's a driveway there now that's permitted.

Right. But on the concept plan, the ingress stays there.

In order to access Hancock, which is a major collector road, there would be improvements needed. So that driveway is not being used.

So there's no reason they couldn't put it there. They just haven't put it there.

We would have to look at stuff. It might be limited on how they access. left turns might be restricted because of spacing criteria, because there's a left turn lane northbound left to turn onto Johns Lake going back towards Claremont, I'd say, back to the west.

So that could be impacted. You'd essentially need a full site plan with the traffic study to even look at that, correct?

Yes, that's what they are trying to propose with that.

So they've got an ingress location shown on, the existing property as well as the property we're considering right now. And then of course there's a driveway on the property that's in the center that is not in their ownership, it's not part of the proposal. I'm not sure, does John's Lake Road allow that many, or would they have to consolidate when they do their site planning?

It's not a code issue, it's more related to traffic and then also fire and public safety type aspects. So being in the Claremont area with the Claremont JPA, they're gonna probably have to have a second access. And we don't have a site plan or the data to know if that's a full access or is it just gated. It's hard to say right now.

Okay, so essentially this is just conceptual. Once they submit site plan, we'll do full engineering review, transportation review, fire safety, all that good stuff, plus compliance with the JPA and all those fun little pieces and parts, correct?

Yes, correct.

All right. Anyone else? Other questions for Public Works?

I have a question in regards to they're currently on a septic program or plan. And I know that I know that the county has been encouraging folks to use that advanced water treatment in order to reduce nitrogen runoff. And I think I had heard someone speak before about those levels, has that been addressed? And did I miss that? I was searching.

Yes, the current site is on Well and Septic. Should the rezoning be approved and they be able to develop this site as a CFD, they would need to update their utility agreement with the city. So they would be on Central.

And I see that's in the ordinance as item L, utilities. The development will be serviced by central water and sewer systems in accordance with the comprehensive plan and land development regulations? Yes.

Okay.

I did that.

down there in the garbledy goop at the bottom um are there any other questions for staff or any of the county's representatives there was a concern or a claim made by one of the earlier speakers that these requirements to connect to utilities were part of the original um cfp and or cfd i'm sorry um Is that accurate, and if so, why was it allowed to not happen?

So when they construct a new building, when they make improvements of that nature, then they would connect. But the existing building, they would have to make sure they comply, everything is compliance there.

So they haven't built anything yet, so it wouldn't warrant Connection, correct?

Correct. Once they build the, like you see that stuff on the left, they have something that they're trying to get through. They haven't gotten approval yet. That would have to be hooked up to the Claremont water and sewer.

They rezoned it to CFD and essentially they were good with what was there at that point. Any improvements?

As long as the health department was okay with the use.

And if anything fails during that time, they would have to probably hook up the water and sewer. Correct.

Okay, so basically the claim that that was a requirement for the first building was not accurate. That there was not a requirement to hook up for the first building.

The requirement was upon any expansion.

Right. The building already existed.

When they make improvements on the site, such as a structure, a building. Okay.

Madam Chair, I have a question. Yes, ma'am.

My mic is off.

I have a question. There was also some reference to stormwater and drainage. I'm assuming that that is to come with further things that they submit to you. I couldn't find anything about it in here except that it was going to be addressed. Is that presently a problem for the homeowners that surround them?

When they make improvements, they have to go through the site plan process. With that, they show us how the drainage and grading will work. with what improvements they're showing, and they'll have to comply with Lake County, Claremont, and also the water management rules of the state under St. John's River Water Management, and get a permit from them, and basically satisfy all three groups with their drainage.

But we're not there yet. Okay.

Yes.

I have a question for staff.

The landscape buffering... Um, it says under the ordinance itself under item F the section one item F that minimum 50 foot type C landscape buffer along all property lines adjacent to the neighboring parcels zoned agricultural, which doesn't really make sense because that leaves that house exposed. And granted, we're only looking at the one parcel right now. So we're not even considering the other half of the project. We're only considering this one parcel. So if we were to approve this based on this, that leaves that house exposed to significant improvement on this property, yes? Is there? That house is zoned agriculture, yes. It is zoned agriculture? I thought it was zoned residential.

No, it's ag.

Okay, never mind. And then the other question is on the noise. And tab five and six have the same or similar language on noise. The ordinance on here, the restriction says after 10 p.m. But it says no restriction up until what time? So it says no permitted sound is permitted, and pardon me, this is on section H under noise. No amplified sound is permitted outside of a fully enclosed structure after 10 p.m. But there's no morning time where it says, but you can start again at seven or eight, normally at seven o'clock, which is kind of consistent throughout the county. It also says no amplified sound is permitted outside fully enclosed structure. But in some cases, we are allowed to say no amplified sound in exterior spaces, period, full stop. especially since this is technically a residential neighborhood. But that would apply for tabs five and six as well. So just questions on that. Is the ordinance flawed in not having that morning time

Boundary? You can certainly add a start time to it. I mean, we do have other provisions of our noise code that would be applicable. They're just not incorporated in here. But you could add a start time.

And would it be in the... Would be... Sorry, I can't talk. Would we be... Would it be in our purview to... prevent exterior sound amplification during daylight hours. Like no speakers on the outside of buildings.

So if you were going to recommend something like that, it would have to be the same recommendation across all uses, right? So you can't just segment out this use and say you can't have any outside amplified sound. So that would be more of a recommendation to the board if you want to change the overall noise ordinance versus something specific to something that's on your agenda today. You also need to think of enforceability. It's going to be incredibly difficult to enforce absolutely zero amplified sound outside of every single building in the unincorporated county.

Well, for say if I wanted to put a speaker on the outside of my house and blare music all day long. Right.

You can do that and then you would get triggered under the regular noise ordinance in which a deputy would come out and determine is it reasonable, not reasonable.

Decibels, et cetera. So that's all.

We don't do decibels in our code.

Okay.

We do plainly audible, right?

We do plainly audible, yeah.

Okay.

Reasonable person standard.

So technically it's already in there.

It's there, yes.

Just restated in the ordinance to be clear. Perfect.

Correct.

So we wouldn't necessarily need to put anything on that morning time boundary or?

To my knowledge, I don't think there's been any complaints about this particular one. And we typically don't have noise complaints in the day. The only typical noise complaints we get are construction oriented. And again, that's governed by other parts of the code. OK, perfect. Thank you.

Are there any other questions for staff? sorry all we are closed to public comment that was what we did earlier so that now we're having the board talk to staff talk to the applicant and get clarification so i see a few of you with your hands raised but during public comment that's your opportunity to speak so at this time we will go ahead and hear from the applicant

Thank you very much, Madam Chair, members of the Planning and Zoning Commission and staff. My name is Jimmy Crawford. I'm with the law firm of Crawford, Modica, and Holt, 380 West Alfred Street, and also have an office in Claremont. And we do represent the owner and the applicant in this case. And I'm going to say just very short words, and then Dr. Ali from the congregation is going to get up and speak just a few minutes as well. Let me say... For the persons, the public who talked about traffic and infrastructure, completely agree that those are very critical issues in any rezoning, not just this one. And Ms. Westbrook especially, I respect her opinion and know her from other interactions and we take her words and the cautions and concerns of the neighbors very seriously. Also, Mr. and Ms. Harp, we haven't had contact with them, and we will. They are the U-shaped in the middle, and they are the ones most affected by this, and we are certainly amenable to points of entry issues, extra buffering issues, those type of things, and they've agreed to talk with us after this, so I hope before county commission we can have some agreement, at least with that. For some of the others, let me say I'm sad and embarrassed. I'm a Christian, and Jim Jones and David Koresh don't define my faith. And I know these people. I've been working with them for a year. Dr. Ali is a nationally recognized health policy expert. He's a PhD. Oh, I believe he's a medical doctor. I'm sorry. He'll tell you in a minute. They are your friends and neighbors in this community all the time. We're not Dearborn, Michigan. and the Constitution protects, I'm gonna quit, I'm sorry, I get a little. The actual substantive issues brought up are very solid. What we do is we operate for about 80 families. That's been steady for the last five or six years. We are overcrowded in the residential home that was converted to the religious building. We bought the property in 2016. Everything that happened before was not us, has nothing to do with us. We have Friday prayers at noon, once a week. And something short of those 80 families come the ones that are able to and aren't working. Every one month we have a community meeting on Saturday, and that's at noon. The food pantry we operate is from 9 to 11. on the first and third Saturdays. So the school traffic issues are just a non-issue whatsoever. We have no traffic during peak hours, a.m., p.m., or during school times. And as Mr. Myers addressed, I'm sorry, Mr. Lynch addressed, I keep getting confused with the actor, I'm sorry. I notice he tried to bail like six times while you're asking the questions too. Many of the infrastructure questions are site plan and there are code and comprehensive plan and state law provisions that require concurrency, which means availability for services for all of those, traffic, storm water, water sewer. We do have our agreement signed with the city of Claremont for water and sewer. we can't get a co on any new building unless we are connected to central water and sewer so we hope that'll alleviate the concerns of our neighbors regarding traffic and infrastructure which are very genuine concerns and i would like to answer any questions you might have if i can or bring up dr ali to say a few words about uh the operation

Okay, does anyone have questions for the applicant regarding the site plan, concept plan, anything?

I do.

Sure. Just going back to that ingress being basically a horseshoe around that house, is there opportunity to see alternate routes through the property to offset?

The answer to that is absolutely yes. Through negotiations with staff early on, we were discouraged from a main Hancock entrance. It would require turn lane, at least one, and I think we're fine with that. We would definitely consider eliminating the ingress, at least one of the ingresses. We have to have two, as public safety requires that. eliminating the one that's closest to the Harps House. I understand the disruption that even though it's only once a week and then another time on the month that that does. So we are going to offer additional landscaping and we will talk with staff about trying to move that and utilize either the entrance that is there on Hancock improved or another entrance. We have to stay a certain distance away from the intersection. But we are, we're absolutely open to that conversation and whatever the county will allow, we'll try to move it away from the harps.

On the future food pantry, I know it's currently operating. You do have a food pantry on the property. And the food pantry, believe it or not, creates more traffic than the worship usually does. As we can see locally here, the food pantry lines, I mean, we've got police directing traffic through those pickup days. And that would, you know, when we say we're only worshiping, I don't care if you worship seven days a week. That's not the issue. It's how is that traffic moving throughout the week? And how can we offset some of that disruption on neighboring properties?

Good question. The food pantry only operates from 9 to 11, the first and third Saturday. So it's only those times. And we do serve about 120 families. If we're able to gain the rezoning, we think we can up that to closer to 200. So it will be busy from Saturday 9 to 11, twice a month. But that's the only time it's open, otherwise it generates no traffic.

But there's no restrictions in here on those operating hours either?

There is not. We're open. to those because we don't have any intent to expand to a daily food pantry operation.

Okay. So is that something that we could consider by limiting operating hours of the food pantry?

And Ms. Marsh, I understand we're in an area that can implicate state and federal laws, but if we voluntarily agree to things in a CFD, which is a planned zoning ordinance, it's okay, right?

Correct.

Okay.

And we can, if we want to talk about those conditions, we can do that during board discussion when we get there, if you think that would be something we want to get to, and then we can always get consensus from the client before we make a motion. Perfect. Does that sound good?

Yes, ma'am, that'd be great.

Does anyone else have questions for the applicant? I really just have one question. I understand the concept is highly conceptual at the moment and that the one property is already under site plan review. I would assume that the site plan that is under review for the existing CFD property is likely to be modified?

100%. And to Commissioner Owens' ask about the circle, that is because of fire turning radius that we put it in, but the current site plan has it handled differently in a circle around the property. That's why this was done before then. But especially if we relocate the ingress-egress on Johns Lake Road, it's gonna require an amendment to the site plan and we have to go back through that process.

And is the intent here for these two properties to operate as one?

Yes, ma'am.

So there will be cross connectivity. All of the internal circulation through the property will work as one cohesive property, not as two separate properties.

That's correct. And that's why our second entrance can be a secondary entrance only. We just want to talk to staff about that on. friday prayer and well the once a month when we have a family event i think the ability to use two accesses would be a good thing i think one access on hancock for all of that traffic dumping out you know churches get out traffic and so we'd like to keep two accesses but we're certainly open to limiting those and placing them in accordance with our neighbors in the county's wishes

I don't have a problem with two entrances or egresses or whatever. I just wanted to make sure that the on-site circulation was going to be done with both properties in mind.

It is.

So we won't be having two sort of independent entrances and exits because then that creates more conflict points on... John's Lake with everybody turning left and right coming out of those two spots. If it can just be thought of cohesively when you're doing your internal circulation, I think that'll help.

It absolutely can. The yellow future worship center that is labeled on the second parcel, there is no money and no plans for that right now. We just wanted to be as transparent as we can with what our Cadillac golden 10-year wish is for the property. So for now, it's just going to be an improvement, not expansion, to the food pantry building that's existing and the 4,000 square foot, it's called a worship hall, but they really call it a recreation and family center internally, and I'll let Dr. Ali speak to that. But that's all that's planned right now. We have to come back in for site plan approval, and we have to meet the ISR, which we're way under right now, and we're not asking for any changes to those.

Okay, anything else for the applicant?

I would like to have Dr. Ali be able to say hi.

Absolutely.

Thank you, Mr. Crawford. Respected commissioners, audience, good morning. My name is Asif Ali. I am one of the members that attend the Islamic Center. I'm a president right now for the Islamic Center. We're all volunteers. And I just wanted to share a little bit about, you know, what we do and what kind of individuals go to the center. We have about 80 families right now, and the purpose of, you know, the rezoning and, of course, the activity center is to serve those families, because we have—it's very difficult to serve 80 families in the small residence that we have right now. The individuals that attend our center are healthcare workers, including doctors that probably see you at AdventHealth or Southlake, blue collar workers, and retirees. So they're normal citizens, taxpayer citizens. There's no new law that we follow. We follow the Constitution, just like everyone else. So I wanted to address some of that misconception. We have been serving the community for over 10 years. And as you probably may know, we can get reference letters from a lot of the you know, congregations that we collaborate, including New Beginnings and other congregations. And our objective is the same, is to help our citizens be better humans and to be better neighbors. And our objective here is not to increase traffic. We're actually serving the existing constituents. And if you notice the hours of operations, as Mr. Crawford shared, They're all outside of the rush hour, which is great and we intend to continue operating that way because that's when we serve our constituents. A couple more points I just want to share in terms of our misconceptions. We would welcome some of the members who offered some concerns related to their perception of what happens at the center, we welcome them. We have a monthly lecture and dinner once the first Saturday of every month. We welcome them there so they can see and learn and meet some of the people. And like I said, the individuals who come to our centers, if they're not retired, they're the people that serve you in our community, including healthcare workers, engineers, and blue collar workers. Myself, I have the privilege to work in healthcare. My firm has worked with the governor's office to help with health care policy, help save the state $200 million in just drug expenses. I work primarily nationally, so I just want to make sure people know that we're just regular, normal citizens just like you all. So there's nothing happening at the center that shouldn't be happening, and I hope you all can recognize that, and we welcome you all to come see it. The ask on the rezoning is simple, is to update the 2007 ordinance and to give us that CFD so that we can operate and make Claremont look beautiful. Right now the buildings that are there are very old. We want to make it look beautiful and make it look integrated in the community. That's all it is. And to serve our existing constituents. Thank you for the time.

Thank you. one one item i just yes sir 10 seconds we are fine with a no amplified sound outside condition we have none we don't need any we don't even have bands on the weekend for our thing or anything like that and dark sky requirements for the lighting are in the ordinance they weren't in the previous ordinance so hopefully that'll help some of the neighbors concerns thank you thank you

OK, we have now heard from the applicant. And are there any now additional questions for staff before we move into a motion? OK. At this point, I would entertain a motion on tab 4. We need a motion so that we can go into board discussion.

I move approval.

We have a motion. Is there a second? Second. We have a motion and a second. We will now move into discussion. Is there anything anyone would like to discuss relating to this application or any conditions being placed thereon?

Yes. On the permitted land uses, since the applicant is OK with the restrictions of hours of operations, I would like to see that put in there. In the ordinance? In the ordinance, yes. If it's not in writing, it's not enforceable. And they are OK with it, and it's a traffic issue more than it is anything else. The permitted land uses? I think that's where it would go. as far as hours of operation because, and here's why I said it's section A, any other use of this site not specified above will require approval and amendment.

If you get back to section two on page five of the ordinance, there's a condition section. Is that where we would put that, Melanie?

No? No, we would probably put it under place of worship. We could add the hours there.

So is it the place of worship that we're wanting to limit the hours on or the food pantry? The food pantry.

The place of worship shouldn't be limited. If they want to pray in the middle of the night, they should be able to pray in the middle of the night.

So the staff could identify place of worship, add a number two for a food pantry, and then we could put the hours there and then leave the remainder accessory uses and any other uses.

Yes. Does that make sense? Does anyone have any thoughts on that? Or is there a general consensus amongst the board to want to limit the hours of the food pantry?

So current, my understanding from the discussion is the food pantry is the first and third Saturday of every month from 9 to 11. Are you just looking to tie that down specifically to those, the first and third, 9 to 11?

If that's how they're currently using it, but without handcuffing them in the future, I mean, Lake County's not getting any smaller. Our communities are growing, no matter what religion you are, no matter what sect of industry you're in, your industry is growing. So if they're serving, if their goal is to serve 200 families, that's not two Saturdays a month. That's probably more like every Saturday.

Or it could be a longer time period on the Saturdays, 9 to noon, something like that.

Or it could be a shorter time, more days. Of course, it could be scheduled. I think it actually kind of prevents them from being able to... Accommodate a growing population if we lock down that they can only operate their food pantry four hours a month, right? That's gonna basically say well, they can't do it by appointment. They can't do it on shorter terms They can't do it by you know other standards or even if they put better circulation in and this all flows really beautifully and that may not be, it may be no issue at all if they operated every Saturday. So that's my only concern is if we kind of lock them in but then they grow and this food pantry's serving a larger population, the hours are gonna limit them from serving that but also it may actually create more congestion because they can't go a different day.

Madam Chair, I have an idea.

Yes, sir.

What if we said the food pantry can only be open to the public for, I like 9 to 12 better just because it gives us a little bit of wiggle room. 9 to 12, two Saturdays a month.

but that it could be then open to like your constituents.

An appointment, an individual, a somebody, but it won't operate as a food pantry except for those hours and limited times.

Where it's open to the public.

Right. And then they could do it by appointment only separately to say, you know, a family could call in and say, can I come in on Saturday at 2 or on, you know, Thursday at 4.

Thursday, my kids are hungry.

Yeah. So then they'd be able to handle like individual requests as opposed to having to do the whole car loop thing.

I think that's fair. I think that's fair and reasonable.

Okay.

so then is everyone on does anyone on the board oppose adding a under an additional permitted use standard that would say food pantry with the hours of operation open to the public limited to two saturdays from 9 00 a.m to 12 pm fine with that is everyone okay with that any concerns i'm okay with that as an amendment to my motion yes okay excellent Is there any further discussion or any other topics to address on this application?

I have one other comment to make. I mean, there were some very legitimate concerns made about political and religious ideology, and some of us up here may or may not agree with some of those comments, but I think we need to have it on the record that those are not criteria that we can use to make decisions on these matters.

Thank you for that, Carol. Anything else? All right. Do we need to amend that motion, Melanie, or Carol already agreed to it being amended? Yeah. And then who was our second?

I did.

And you're okay with that amendment? Yes. Okay. So we don't need to re motion, correct? All right. All in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. All opposed, same. All right. Motion carries. We will now move on to tab five.

Good morning again. For the record, Megan Bracialli with the Office of Planning and Zoning. I'll be presenting tab number five, case number PZ2026-36, otherwise known as the Church of God Campground. The applicant is requesting to amend their planned unit development ordinance 2014-5 to revise the land uses to include neighborhood commercial C1 uses. Increase the total number of RV sites and allow a total of 29 permanent RV sites. The subject property is located at 33926 County Road 473 in the unincorporated Leesburg area and contains approximately 43 acres. The subject property is currently designated with an urban medium density future land use category and is zoned planned unit development by ordinance 2014-5. The concept plan depicts the existing gymnasium, office, cafeteria, sheds, cabins, pool, meeting room, caretaker's residence, bathhouse, lift station, sewer plant, Current RV sites, proposed RV sites, dormitories. It also depicts potential future siting for single family residence lots and a townhome block in the northwest corner. In the northwest corner east of CR 473, the concept plan depicts the requested commercial uses site. I also have zoomed images. Thank you. The staff finds the rezone consistent with the land development regulations and comprehensive plan. This concludes my presentation. I will stand for questions, and the applicant is present and available for questions as well.

Does anyone have any questions for staff?

Yes. Looking at the floodplain management on here, it says that the applicant's conceptual plan shows development right up to or possibly in the special flood hazard. A condition of any approval moving forward would be that any development would be set well outside. The map is AE flood zone, so requiring them to bring everything up to out of zone AE, right? We're not building things that are gonna be flooded.

Ideally. Ideally. Yes. So the commercial site specifically is not what you're, it's outlined in red on the concept plan, but those buildings were from the previous ordinance concept plan. They would be replaced by whatever commercial use comes in and that site planning would address any flood zone as well as the jurisdictional wetland line setbacks to ensure they met code.

Okay. So that building on the right-hand side, it says 40, is it 40 unit?

It says 40 unit, three-story ACLF. That is what was previously approved. Got it. Okay. Thank you.

But they would be resolving that issue at site plan if there's any setback concerns or encroachment into the jurisdictional wetland?

Thank you.

Are there any other questions for staff? Okay. Thank you. We have one person wishing to speak on this item, Terry Petriberg. Petriberg. That's pretty good. Did I get it close?

You can blame that on my ex-husband. Hi, my name's Terry Peachburgo. I live at 33930 Washington Avenue, Leesburg, Florida. I've been there for 40 years. My house is two blocks away from this camp. My problem with this is I called when I got the little postcard in from the county, I called zoning and a really nice guy was nice enough to email me the whole entire 34 pages or whatever it was. Okay, and my biggest problem is what was in it said an 80 bed ACLF, okay, an adult congregate living facility. Okay, I don't know if anybody here knows this, but when the border gates were open to our country, this particular place bussed in bus after bus after bus of people into our neighborhood and released them. They were there. We saw the buses. They came in late at night. Then they put up fences so you couldn't see what was going on over there. This place property is four blocks from an elementary school. They brought all these people in, I'm sure unvetted. We have no idea who they were. They were walking our neighborhoods. They were riding bikes everywhere. My problem is I've been there for four years, worked to pay off a house. I have no problem with a church property. They've had camps over there. I love watching the kids come in and do their thing. But what they're requesting sounds to me like that I could end up with a 80-bed migrant camp of young military-aged men in perpetuity two blocks from my house and four blocks from an elementary school. We already have a homeless problem in our area. I see it at the parks. I see it as they're going up and down the roads. I see the trash on people's property and what they're proposing, who are going to be in these RV spots? Is this going to be campers that come to their camps, which is fabulous? Is this going to be, they're just going to offer to rent them out to all of these people that are a little sketchy sometimes and I don't want this in my neighborhood. Thank you very much for your time.

Thank you. Does anyone else wish to speak on this item before we bring it back to the board for discussion? All right, seeing none. Does anyone have questions for staff or is the applicant present? Would the applicant like to make any statements?

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for being here. My name is John Stockham, and I'm with CPH Consulting, LLC, 500 West Fulton Street in Sanford. And I'm here today to bring forth this rezoning. And mainly this amendment, if you'd kindly look at the proposed ordinance, page 2 of 11, the main The focus here is adding the commercial retail uses, that's item A, permitted uses, one, principal uses, G, as in gamma, commercial retail, the C1 uses for a convenience store on that corner, that northwest corner, and then item K, recreation vehicles, the 29 spaces, the 18 existing on the west side, and then the 11 on the east side for a total of 29. those are the only two items changing in this amendment everything else is approved in 2014 under a different applicant we do have the owners here today bishop presley and bishop pelt and they're with the state board of trustees the church of god for state of florida coco office and they'll be happy to answer any questions about the residents of the property and how the camp operates thank you does anyone have questions for the applicant

You say this is for a convenience store. Is that specifically for the folks using this facility or would it be public access as well?

It's neighborhood commercial uses. So anything that falls under your C1 commercial use in the code. So examples, Wawa, 7-Eleven. That's what I was going to carry on. Thank you.

Any other questions for the applicant? Okay. Seeing none, are there any questions for staff? If you don't, if nothing, I would entertain a motion. Move to approve the motion. Is there a second?

Second.

We have a motion and a second. All those in favor, or sorry, is there any need for discussion? All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Opposed, same sign. Motion carries. All right, we'll move on to tab six.

Good morning. For the record, Leslie Reagan, Senior Planner with the Office of Planning and Zoning. I will be presenting tab number six, case number 2025336, otherwise known as the St. Gertrude CFD Amendment. The applicant is requesting to amend their community facility district, ordinance number 2007-24, to revise the approved land use to include seven congregate care units for church clergy and to approve a waiver to the road access requirements pursuant to Appendix A of the Lake County Transportation Planning Design and Construction Standards to allow the proposed development to access the property from Lake Unity Nursery Road, a county maintained clay road. The subject property is located west of Lake Unity Nursery Road in the unincorporated Fruitland Park area and contains approximately 37 acres. The subject property is designated with a rural transition future land use category and currently zoned community facility district governed by ordinance number 2007-24. The subject property is also located within the economic district overlay. The concept plan depicts seven congregate care units with access off Lake Unity Nursery Road. The total impervious surface area for the property would be 17.87%. with that includes these new additions. The applicant is providing 82.13% open space. The congregate care units shall be deed restricted to only occupancy of church clergy and personnel. The proposed units are only for affiliated personnel that are participating in retreat, the religious retreat related activities. The only existing structures on the property now are indicated in the summary of analysis on the staff report. The second thing the applicant is requesting is that waiver to paving Lake Unity Nursery Road which is currently a county maintained clay road at the frontage of the property. They are proposing a concrete driveway to access the congregate care units. finds the rezoned consistent with land development regulations and comprehensive plan. This concludes my presentation. I'll stand for any questions. The property owner is also present to answer any questions specific to operations.

OK. Are there questions for staff before we hear from the public? Okay. We will go ahead and open to public comment. We are going to start. And again, I would just say, please remember to say your name and address for the record. And when you hear that little tone go off, that's your three minutes. And then please wrap up quickly. We're gonna start with David Hardenbrook.

Thank you for giving me a minute to speak today. My name is David Hardenbrook. I live at three five nine Oh seven Lake unity nursery road, Fruitland park, Florida. I live in paradise. It truly is a wonderful place. I've lived there for 27 years. My comments today will be about the amendment that is proposed to give the St. Gertrude an opportunity to grow. And my comments are, I've lived there, and I think it was back in 2007 when this became a CFD to where it could be a church retreat. And the previous church, I believe it was Greenhill, they were very respectful to the neighbors and the whole neighborhood for that fact. And we never had any issues with anything they did because they abided by the rules that had been set for their retreat. And now we have the St. Gertrude. I think they've been there for I don't know how many years, but it has been a difficult transition and it continues to be difficult. And my main complaint is the noise. It's sometimes never ending. I live, Google Maps showed that I live approximately 3,500 feet away and I can clearly hear the music, the drums, the PA, the other things. So I can't imagine it's horrific to the neighbors who are really close. It's unnecessary. And we have called and tried to work things with the Sheriff's Department multiple times to negative results. It just continues. And it will go on sometimes all night long, throughout the night. That's really unnecessary. and nothing is being done. And so my comments are that giving them more opportunity to expand is just like throwing gasoline on a fire that you're trying to put out. This is something that needs to be addressed and it needs to stop because we all love our community. We stick together. I love a lot of the people who are my neighbors. So please help us. Don't let this happen. It's not necessary to be like this. Thank you for your time.

Thank you. Greg Williams. I will put you to the back of the staff. Unless everybody else says that, and then you're on deck. Gina Lambert.

Good morning. My name is Gina Lambert. I live at 36054 Lake Unity Nursery Road, Fruitland Park, Florida. My husband and I moved to that street from Gray's Airport because we wanted a more quiet street, more rural. It is very picturesque neighborhood. I have grandkids, I have pets. We have enjoyed life there. We're lifelong Floridians and the Since the retreat opened up, our street has been plagued with a lot of traffic issues, fast cars running through there. We have any number of neighbors that are out there walking with their pets, their kids, and we have to really be careful. I can't let my grandkids out in front of the house without supervision. because it is a hazard to them. We have, we sit out on the front porch and we are a quarter mile from this facility and we can hear the music going on at all hours of the night and the day. So that I believe infringes on my rights as a property owner. And I think we are very respectful as residents to each other, try to be mindful of that, but this property owner has demonstrated time and time again that they have no regard for the residents in this community. The term congregate care, I believe, I'm a former administrator for Waterman Village, so I'm very familiar with what the term congregate care means in that world. I think congregate care means that you're going to care for others who need assistance. Dormitory style living, I think that falls under a different category. Again, you would be the subject matter experts on that. But when you talk about congregate care, you talk about people who need, you're gonna have food trucks, you're gonna have linen trucks, you're gonna have all kinds of equipment trucks coming in. Are they going to access that road from Lake Unity Nursery Route, which is a canopy street? Or are they gonna access it from Eagle's Nest? Both are two-lane road access. You're going to increase that traffic quite a bit with these retreats, as we've already seen. So I would ask the board for a no vote on this. Thank you.

Mark Farner.

Good morning, my name is Mark Farner, reside at 35930 Lake Unity Nursery Road, Fruitland Park. My wife and I have resided there for 25 years. We like it because its location gives the impression that you're living in a rural community, but yet you're five minutes from downtown. This property, formerly a single-family residential property, was rezoned to allow for a church retreat. As Ernie previously described, the new owner at that time was respectful of the property, the surroundings. It abided by the ordinance the way it was laid out. There was never a noise problem. Traffic was minimal. The use of the property was occasional, as you would expect a church retreat to be. That changed with the new owners. They have little regard for the ordinance that was originally laid out. In the application, they refer to families living in the former residence, multiple families living there. If that's the case, that's not in accordance with the original ordinance. They want to build seven 4700 square feet residences on the property that they describe as congregate living in the application, or in the staff presentation anyway, so that the families that now are living in the single-family home can have their own spaces. And it might accommodate other ministers that are coming to the retreat to serve retreat members or retreat attendees. You have to wonder a home or a building 4,700 square feet, how large that is compared to most single family residences here in Lake County. Is this building only to accommodate one family or is there gonna be an alternate use for these buildings? I provided some other information to the board regarding the presentation by St. Gurdjieff Corp as a church, if they are holding religious services currently on the property, where would their house of worship be located? It gives us all the appearance that it is not a legitimate church or a church retreat. Thank you.

Thank you. Polly Watson.

Good morning. Thank you for giving me the time to speak. Polly Watson. I am at 36219. Lake Unity Nursery Road, and I am right next door to the property. I have several issues. First is the noise issue. I have made several complaints. I have been waiting for the code enforcement notes, which I don't have yet. Paul Hammond has been out there to speak to them. On the application, it does state that they want to build the congregate care, yet when I spoke to Leslie, she said it was a congregate caretaker unit. So which is it? That's not what you have here. Planning and zoning also revoked the 2007-24 ordinance, so there's really no amount of people limited there right now, no more than 40 per day, no more than two per bedroom overnight. They've blown that ordinance out since day one. There are several discrepancies in here. There will be more people if these homes are allowed to be built. We were told back in 2019 by Planning and Zoning only dormitory style buildings would be allowed to be built there. What do you define as clergy? is that the whole entire adult family meaning their ten kids their spouses their children their grandchildren uh... I deal with this every single day. And this is not like, okay, we're just gonna do church services on Sunday or Wednesdays. These services go on all night long. And I have to work. I'm raising two grandchildren. They have to go to school. Why don't they have to go to work? Are they not tired and have to get up in the mornings? Again, 4,700 square feet added to the 9,100. That's a total of 42,000 square feet for a family of how many? They still have family. On June the 26th, I did call Lake County Sheriff's Office. It was 1.38 a.m. and the bells and the horns, everything was going off. And again, ordinances say after 9 p.m., no noise. So it is just, it's very aggravating. And again, it is our community. And... This is, I'm next door. So it's right outside my door. So, but thank you for your time.

Thank you. Nicole Trunzo.

Good morning. I live at 35919 Lake Unity Nursery Road. When Greenhill Presbyterian was on this property, we never had an issue with them. They were excellent neighbors. When St. Gertrude's moved in, they did not They do not abide by ordinance hashtag 2007-24. It states group activities shall not be allowed between 10 p.m. and 7 a.m. There shall not be music played or other group activities outdoors that would cause excessive noise as defined by section 13-834 of Lake County code from 9 p.m. to 8 a.m. When you go home from work and you hear this stuff till late at night, I'm sitting in my living room and I can hear it clear as day across the lake and live just as you're going down this road. Who wants to listen to that when you go home and you want to relax and sit and And I've called the police, and they just continue to carry on. They don't care. They don't care what the police say. The minute the police leave, they just start right back up. We don't want any more of this, because the more housing, the more people, the more noise. And you can hear it clear as day right across the lake. So if you give them a house that's 4,700 square feet, how many bedrooms? How many people are gonna be in those? Because we know there's over 18 adults in the big house on this property. How many kids? It states that there's eight bedrooms in that house. So if they have more people, more activities, more cars, more traffic, it sounds like a family compound to me. If there's one way in, one way out, we know that there's ambulance, there's been police down there, so how much more is this gonna cause? We know that they drive fast up and down the road. I run the neighborhood watch, so I get the complaints from the neighbors, the calls about the noise across the lake. Imagine if you lived there. You can't let your kids go outside because some of the people on this property, they think it's a racetrack. They drive up and down the road fast. I go outside and do yard work. I've walked out there slowly in the middle of the road to try and slow people down that are going fast. This is, like Ernie stated, you're like living in the country, but you're not. You're five minutes from town. We don't need this. We don't want this. This is not what it was meant to be. I don't want to hear that noise. Could you imagine if you were in the neighborhood listening to that?

appreciate your time thank you thank you okay greg williams name's greg williams i live at three six zero zero zero lake unity nursery road um open this up I want to read something because I was, as a young kid, 10 years old or so. Oh no, how do I start this thing? It's my daughter's, I don't know how to use the damn thing. Anyhow, what I was getting to is, and I heard the name mentioned a little while ago, Jim Jones. Well, I was born in Ukiah, California, and I was raised in Redwood Valley, California, less than a mile up Road B. I lived with my grandparents when I was a year old. We lived in an army surplus tent until we built the house. They got it in 55. 1983, got running water. I was approximately a mile up, but a quarter mile up was my friend Dickie Abshire. And out there, we had nothing but to do a roam around the countryside. Well, in 1965, Jim Jones brought in the People's Temple in there. And of course, as we were kids, we were wondering what's going on. We'd never seen something like this before. So we'd go down the creek bed, wind around. Dickie and I would go down there and climb up on the bank, and we'd watch them. They were doing all kinds of weird things. And what we would do is we'd get in their garden, because we didn't have much to eat, and we'd take us a watermelon, a tomato, a cucumber, go back down, go back under the East Road Bridge, sit there and eat it, and go back and watch them. Because it was something we had never seen before. And as you all might know, Google Jim Jones, Redwood Valley, California, and read about it. Well, I thought I could bring it up on here, but I don't know how to use them. Anyhow, what I'm getting to is that all this noise that we hear all night long in our peaceful little road there, it gets annoying. Fast cars, we have that. And I can't imagine 7,4700 square foot buildings needed for what use is those needed for? I don't believe it's consistent with our way of life out there. Like they've said, we're five minutes from town, and it's a quiet neighborhood. And I just started having flashbacks of when I grew up, when I started hearing about what's going on down there. And that's why I brought up the Jim Jones thing, because I actually got to witness that as a 10-year-old kid. And like I say, I was less than a mile away. We'd go down to watch it just for entertainment.

You can just wrap up, please.

And OK, well, thank you. And I don't want to see it down there. I don't want to die.

Thank you. OK. Is the applicant present? OK, would you like to come forward? Is there anything you'd like to state or provide information on?

You could come forward and speak to the microphone.

Thank you.

My name is Deborah Abedin. I'm the CEO of St. Goatwood, also the bishop. My name is Susan McNeil. Wow. I have to say wow. Because first of all, We are not, I'm going to address first, we are not building no 400 square feet houses. That's first of all. Secondly, we are building the houses for inside ministers, clergy and ministers. We are a church that came from New York and the church has been around for 35 years. I'm the bishop. I have two bishops, three reverends, a deaconess, and a deacon. And we moved from New York because we wanted to have the same living that they have. I've been hearing words that really shocked me because when we landed in 2021, Our first thing that we did, church-wise, we had our first conference together and our first Thanksgiving, what we called it. And we share baskets to everyone to show them our appreciation coming to the village. For one, we don't have no young kids driving up and down. There is no complaint, the police never come and give us no citation. They came because we had, we used to have the service on Friday nights, that's our Sabbath. We had instance where we went way over, the police came by, they stand up at the gate, Our gate is like quarter mile to our home. Where these people live is like way over. We have to come through the page road, the pay road, then come to the gravel road. We only have two neighbors, the neighbor from the back of- Ma'am, if you could please talk to us, sorry. Oh, yes. I went to her. She told us about the light when the police came in 2022. We change our service from Friday night to Saturday morning from 11 to 3. We do have some fasting on the weekday when we cut it off at 9.30, 10 o'clock. We don't have service every day. We have service once a week, which is Saturday morning, because... The police came twice to us. They stand with us until we finish. We do not be outside. We inside of the building. The noise that they hear, someone open the door, and if they open the door when they come out to use the bathroom, you will hear the horn and you will hear the bell. When the police came, they start to say, at the gate, which is quarter mile outside, say, do you hear anything? They says, no, but we have to come because the neighbors seeing the hearing, the noise. So we are willing to comply with anything that the town give us. They give us the time, this is what we're going to do. But we are God-fearing people. We're not here to come to change anything. We come because we want our kids also to grow up and have a standard in life.

Thank you. Let me just clarify. It's not an expansion. Everyone that resides on the property will continue to reside there. There's no additional members or anyone else that will be coming. The retreat, the activity that occurs is based on the retreat events that we have occasionally throughout the year and that depends on when we keep retreat activities. Our standard service is Saturday at 11 a.m. and that's once per week. We do try to have community events where we have the kids from other supporting congregations come. We have that once a year. It's like a family fun day. That's not something that we traditionally have. We are making adjustments for the sounds. We're soundproofing our interiors because it was brought to our attention. Because when we're on the property, we're not aware of the amplification because of the lake. If you look at the site map, we're not aware of how the sound transcends. We acknowledge in the past that after 10 o'clock, the noise did transcend. That's no longer happening on the property. And as Ms. Aberdeen mentioned, we are willing to comply with whatever ordinances are set in place to ensure that our neighbors, because we also want to be very comfortable, this is why we selected this property, and we want to make sure that it's amicable for everybody. I don't know if you had any questions for us.

I have a question. Yes.

I have a question as to the right-of-way access to the property. Because Lake Unity and University Road, as stated in the staff report, it traverses through private property. So if you're looking at the parcel on the north side, it looks like maybe there might have been previously access. But do you have a right-of-way to your property? You do.

I don't understand what you mean.

On your access to the property, it is otherwise landlocked because you would have to go through, there is a requirement to pave the road for which a waiver has been submitted. I think it said 20.

That road is now owned by the county. It was previously deeded to the county many years ago prior to us. So that's a county-maintained road. There's two access to 36319. You can access it from Eagle Neck or you can access it from Lake Unity Nursery Road.

Okay, so in the report on page 10, section 5, it says on the report, A waiver request has been submitted regarding the requirement to pave approximately 2430 linear feet of Lake Unity Nursery Road as the impact does not justify the scope. But further on in the report, it states that there is question as to the private ownership of that road, how it goes through private properties.

I think that's our neighbor next door. She once told me that they had owned the road and they gave it to the county. So I think now the county is taking care of that road. We only have one neighbor right opposite us and the neighbor to the back. I don't think they have anything to do with that, but the neighbor opposite us.

That road goes through two other parcels. That's private property. Yes.

We are private property. Hold on. I'm sorry, y'all. Is staff present? Can they speak on whether Lake Unity Road is a public county-maintained right-of-way? So we can just resolve this real quick. Thank you.

Seth Lynch, Public Works Department. It is a county-maintained clay road. When you come off Lake Unity Road, which is County Road 466B, it is paved. Then it turns to clay. We maintain the clay road as it continues north up to Eagle's Nest. Portions of it have deeded right away. Some of it's by maintenance, which is the clay surface.

Okay.

But all of this is... publicly held right of way, correct?

Some of it's by maintenance, some of the clay road is by maintenance, but it is public road because we are maintaining all of Lake Unity Nursery Road, the paved portion and the clay portion.

Okay, so there's no question of whether that's open to public use. Like anyone can traverse that road, is that correct?

Thanks, Melanie. So I'm actually looking at the GIS aerial right now. Majority of the road does have deeded right-of-way. There are portions of the road that do not have deeded right-of-way, and I think that's what Seth is saying is that we could claim it by maintenance. We have not filed a maintenance map, so there's nothing of record that says we maintain it. My understanding is that as of today's date, nobody has challenged it, but there are portions of the road where there is no deeded public right of way.

From the paved portion to this property where it's, where it's clay road, is all of that in right of way? Or are portions of it coming off the paved portion of Lake Unity up through this clay portion where their property is subject to that?

The deed, there is a gap there, you could say, from the paved portion to the southern boundary of this property. Along the frontage of this property, there is deeded right of way. But when you go south of this property's south corner to the paved road, it is not deeded right away.

So it's that chunk between the paved and the south corner of the property, which traverses how many parcels? Is that like five?

One, two, three, four. And then there's a piece that we don't have.

But then there's a piece to the north also. So the same situation would be for the folks across the street from this property. There's one, two, three, four, five parcels that are either across the right-of-way or adjacent to this that also have to traverse through that section that we do not have deeded rights to, but that we have by maintenance. Other people are accessing their private properties through this maintained area as well, correct? They're not the only ones.

Yeah, there's five properties that are directly on the east side of this, accessing from the County Clay Road, which is a public road.

So the waiver requesting that they don't pave the road to keep it clay Even if we required them to pave the road, would we even be able to do that given that we don't have?

There's further review needed, their title search and stuff and all to figure out what, if there's any right-of-way there, any by plats or anything out there. But there is some concerns there with paving that.

Okay. There could also be private easements in those chain of title that would allow individual property owners to pave it, but without doing extensive research, we don't have that answer today.

Okay. All right. Thank you. Did you have other questions for the applicant, or was that?

No, that was it. Sorry. Oh, wow.

That was just the only one. Anybody else? Questions for the applicant? So I have a question. So I see that these are called congregate care units. I need to understand what that is. Okay.

As it says, we all live in the same building. So we have three families, but we have seven families that we want to live separately because we want to be comfortable also. The house is houses, but there's no 400,000 square foot houses if you look at it. There's only three bedrooms, two bathrooms. How big are these houses? One is 195 square feet. The biggest one is 200. I'm sorry, you're going to put three bedrooms? 2,000 square feet. Oh, I'm like, wow, that's going to be tight. No, no, no. They're all like 200 square feet. There's nothing.

But they're all like 2,000 square feet. Yes, yes. Kind of the standard size of a typical.

Standard size, three bedrooms, two bathrooms. Standard size. Standard size, yes. And it's for the people that live in there now. We have no other people coming in. And for the neighbors, they've been having this problem since you were there, according to other neighbors. Because we've been making so many reports, so people going back and forth.

So just to clarify, the housing is to support the clergy so we can support the retreat.

So the folks that are going to live in these houses are going to live in them permanently? Yes. Okay. That's not consistent with the ordinance, which says the seven units are not generally residential in nature. That's what it says. So these are residential in nature. You are going to be permanent residents of these structures. They're not hotel spaces that you're going to use coming and going. No, no. So that's because it says they are restricted exclusively to support the operations of the religious retreat by providing site accommodations for clergy and affiliated personnel. participating in retreat activities? That is correct. OK. But you're going to live there all the time? To support the retreat. OK. What's going to happen to the existing home that you're all living in?

That is a retreat.

So you're all living in the building that you hold the retreats in? Yes. So are the retreats going to get bigger? No. So what's going to happen to all that extra space?

We're still using the retreat site, but it's very difficult to have the retreats because, remember, we were zoned to have only 40 people, and we're going to maintain that restriction. We do not want to expand that.

So you're going to hold to the 40-person standard because they didn't add that back in the ordinance. It did.

It's in the original.

Right, but the ordinance we have in front of us is replacing the old one, and the 40-person maximum is not in here.

So we want to maintain the current.

OK. So then the retreat activities would take place in the building. Yes. And then that would mean the families that are currently permanently residing in the building would move into these seven homes that are being constructed. Correct. OK. Now I have a better understanding. I was very, I was like, whoa, this is, I was all over the place. Anyone else have questions for the applicant?

Madam chair, I do. Yes. Um, just so I'm clear, the people who reside there now will always reside there as a permanent resident.

As long as they're clergy in St. Gertrude, they will reside there. If they're no longer a part of the clergy, they will not reside there.

Okay. But they're all there right now.

Yes.

So how often do you have a retreat?

We have not been able to have one. We've had one maybe once or twice. We've had one per year.

Okay. Last question. Your services, religious services, are they going to be held in the space where you now live and is going to serve as the retreat space?

As the retreat space, we have a place where we have the service.

So you have a separate space for the service?

Yes.

Okay. All right, thank you. You're welcome.

Just out of curiosity, not including the proposed seven residences and the occupants thereof, approximately how many members of your congregation are there?

Right, 39.

How many?

39.

But you all reside on the property?

No. And that includes the clergy. That's including plus the clergy, yes. We would have the seven closures.

Yes. So you have 39 plus seven more people. No, no. Every clothing is including. So 39 is the total. Yes.

You haven't hit your maximum of 40. Yes. The max. Yes. They haven't gotten there yet. How many families are living there now? How many people live there now year round?

We have one, two, three families. that you live in the big house.

And that's like two persons per family or more?

No, one family. Every family has two, except in the big house we have one family is five, but they all are college students. We have little kids, so...

So you've only got like 10 people year-round living in the main property right now? Yes, main property. And we have the elderly.

So we have a multi-generational family. So we have elderly on the property. We have married couples. We have children that attend college. So it's three families, but it's multi-generational. So you have a span of ages.

But you're comfortable sticking to your maximum of 40 people being allowed on the property, which was previously in your, because that's on a daily basis. You can't have more than 40 people on property.

We don't have anything on a daily basis. We have regular lives on the weekends.

But when you have your retreats, they're going to be bigger. And when your congregation comes in, that's going to be bigger. If it got above 40. Yes.

No, no. I'm sorry. I'm trying to follow. Yes. There's 39 total members of the church, but they do not attend service, every service. So we are international. We are from New York. We have members that come in for the retreats, but they will not be present on the property on a daily basis, over 40 people.

How many people would come to the retreats?

Based on whatever number that you pick, because we can't go above the maximum. So you'd still be limited to 40? We have been limited to 40.

Okay.

We have acknowledged that. We have never gone above that.

Got it. All right. Anyone else? Questions for the applicant before? We may ask you all for more clarification, but I think we're good at the moment. That's fine. Thank you. You're welcome. Is staff? Yes. I have a question now. Anyone else? Questions for staff? Go ahead. Go first.

I'm just one big question. I'm just going to sit back and listen.

I feel the same, by the way. And the same question in both.

No. No.

OK. I need to understand why we're calling these congregate care residents in the ordinance and why we're saying they're not residential in nature, because they're saying they're going to live in them year round.

So what the applicant was proposing is kind of what's already there. They already are allowed to have a caretaker's residence on the property. It limits the number of people per bedroom to two per bedroom. I believe the current residents, the existing residents on the house has something like nine or ten bedrooms. So that already covers it. They're asking for the same thing. They're asking for that development right to be extended to these these seven congregate care units to separate that group into their own comfortable spaces. If the board wishes, we could add a definition to clergy to make you feel more comfortable. This will all, again, be one parcel of land. This is not gonna be individually allotted. They also will be deed restricted to the church clergy and personnel only.

So maybe Melanie, maybe you can help me understand this then. So how does this not become a residential use? I understand a caretaker's residence when we do like, um, storage facilities. I understand that there needs to be a caretaker residents there because they need someone to supervise the property, you know, all the time. And somebody is going to be there to rent out the units and let people in and out. But we're talking about seven caretaker residences. is how does this not become residential in nature?

I'm not really sure I have a great answer for you. I'm going to ask Mike to come up and expound on that a little bit more. I mean, we do have facilities where people come and go. This is the first I've heard that this is like Permanent same people versus people again coming and going so I'm not sure whether staff had that information before today Good morning for the record Mike Fitzgerald.

I'm the office of planning and zoning director My recommendation for section B number two would be sentenced to to say the seven units are restricted exclusively to support operations of the religious retreat. So we would delete the are not generally residential in nature. And I think that would solve the problem.

But they're not really retreating. They're always there. Yeah, that's where I'm stuck. These are fixed residential units.

It would say on-site accommodations for clergy. So this is, so then it, it removes the residential and nature statement and says that the seven units are for onsite accommodations for clergy.

But they're not all members of the clergy. These are, as they said, these are multi-generational families. Some of these are children that are off at college. Some of these are elderly. Some of these are, you know, spouses, all these things. I'm very confused as to this.

So we would, we would have to say the clergy and their family then. And that's my understanding was the statement was the, the, the units were specifically for the clergy members. And then they expanded on that saying that it's for their multi-generational family for the clergy members.

My confusion comes where they say residential and that they stay there. They don't come and do something and then go away. They permanently live there. So that's, that's where I have confusion.

Right, so that's where my recommendation of deleting the words are not generally residential in nature from sentence number two. So it would read the seven units are restricted exclusively to support the operations of the religious retreat by providing onsite accommodations for clergy and affiliated personnel. So we would have to expand on that saying clergy and their family.

Yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm really stuck with how this isn't just a residential subdivision with a community facility building that they're using for community purposes.

That's what it is.

That's where I'm stuck. It it's done. I mean, other than the fact that it's owned by a religious organization and that religious organization is the one that's holding those community activities. I'm really trying to understand how this isn't just a residential subdivision. And I can't, I need to, I need somebody to help me bridge the gap. There is no gap.

I just, I'm going to make this real simple. I want to make a motion to deny.

Thank you.

Okay. We have a motion and a second. We can move into discussion. So And I have, okay, the existing ordinance, the 07 ordinance, is it voided or is it still in effect?

No, it will stay in effect.

So they can still operate as they're operating?

Correct.

Because there was a comment from someone that said that the 07 ordinance had been voided.

I think very simply there's too many inconsistencies with some of the things that I'm hearing, that I'm hearing about the noise. I mean, my motion is to deny.

Okay. Do we maybe want to ask the applicant if they want to try to refine this and bring it back as opposed to moving forward with a denial? That way it doesn't have to go in front of commission yet. We can put it back to them to maybe... I don't have a problem with that.

No, you don't have a problem.

Because maybe they just need to refine their concept better and get some language clarity and work with staff a little bit to try to bridge that gap from residential subdivisions.

I have no problem with that. I think part of it, I mean, we could be here all afternoon trying to figure this out. Trying to unwind this, yeah. And we don't need to unwind it today.

No. Yep. Melanie, is that something we can do?

Sure. You can withdraw the motion to deny, and then you can do a motion to table.

We'll put a motion on the table to give.

Well, let's ask the applicant what they prefer. Do they prefer to go forward to county commission with a recommendation of denial, or do you prefer to work with staff and try to refine your concept more to be clearer about what you're trying to do and how this continues to be a CFD activity?

I'm so confused because all we're trying to do is build a home. be on compliance with anything. The noise has nothing to do with our home.

Ma'am, all we're asking you right now is, so we've made a motion to deny. It's been motioned and it's been seconded, which means we're about to move into a vote for that. Okay. So our question is, do you want us to make that vote, which may end up with you taking a denial recommendation from us forward to the Board of County Commissioners, Or do you want us to make a motion to table this to a future meeting? And then you can work with staff and the legal team for the county and all these folks to try to resolve what it is that this is and how you can get it to either fit within the community facility district zoning that you have, or if that's not possible, to then come back with a rezoning request, which would be to rezone it to some sort of residential use to allow a subdivision-type activity. Do you want to work with them, or would you like us to vote?

No, we want to work with them.

Okay. motion to table hang on so you made a motion there it was seconded would you withdraw your motion to deny and convert that motion to table to a future date to be determined that's you you made the first motion say that again would you would you like to withdraw your motion to deny and change it to a motion to table to a future date

motion to withdraw, the motion to deny, and allow them to amend it to a future date.

Thank you. Madam Chairman, if I can make a suggestion that you include a future date of November 4th, and then that way they don't have to pay for re-advertising. If they're not ready by the 4th, then we can... We'll have to re-advertise anyway.

Right. Can we go to a date certain of November 4th? Do you all feel like that would work for you? Okay. Are you comfortable amending your motion to November 4th? Yes. Okay, we have a motion. Who made the second? Second. You seconded. Any further discussion? All right, seeing none, all in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

All opposed, same sign. Motion carries. Okay, that is the last item on our agenda for today.

The end of the cleanse.

Is there any other business? There is no other business. Thank you. And our next meeting is on September 2nd. Wonderful. Thank you, Janie.

Thank you.

through our world, and that's on you.