Planning & Zoning - Regular Meeting

here. Miss Driver here. Mr. Minger here. Mr. Patel here. Mr. Reed here. Mr. Underwood here. Mr. Whismann here. Miss White here. Mr. Wood here. Um I'd like Miss White if she would to lead us an invitation.

Join me in prayer, please. Eternal and loving God, on this Easter Monday, we give you thanks for the gift of life and the hope we have in you. We thank you for the opportunity to serve the people of Hoover. Help us to act with character and conviction, to listen with understanding and goodwill, and to speak with charity and restraint. Father, renew us with the strength of your presence and the joy of helping to build a community worthy of your favor. We ask this as your children, confident in your goodness and love. Amen. Amen.

Miss Peace, will you lead us in the pledge of allegiance, please? Ice to the flag of the United States of America and to the stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

We have two cases tonight that's been continued to the May 4th meeting. The first case is the Birch Tree Swimming Racket Club and the second one is the Alabama Merchant Association 900 Concourse Parkway. Both of these will be heard on May the 4th. If you have an interest in this case, you need to be here at six o'clock on May the 4th. These will be heard at that time. No new notices will be sent out. Is there any questions to what I've just said? Okay. We have Oh, yeah. Before I get started, we I need to make a motion to approve the minutes for the March meeting.

So moved. Second. Second. Motion second. All in favor say I. I. Those opposed. Nay. Motion carries. Okay. We have several subdivision cases tonight. Typically, we'll take them at vote on them in a block, but since we have so many comments from staff. I think we're going to take them one at a time tonight. The first case is S92536. It's the Yates addition to Hoover. That's final map approval of the eth edition to Hoover located at 232 Caliente Drive, Martinwood Estates. Staff has some comments on this.

Staff recommends denial of this case. The staff comments were not addressed by the applicant. Okay. Is any is there an applicant in the audience that wants to address this case? Any comments from Indian planning commission? I'll entertain a motion. I'll make a motion to deny based on staff comments. Second. Second. Have a motion and a second. All in favor say I. I. Those post nay.

The motion is denied. I mean, the case is denied. The next case is S102545 Blackidge commercial lots. Preliminary map approval for the Black Ridge commercial lots located the end of the south end of the Black Ridge Parkway. The purpose of this plat is to create two commercial lots and one common area uh from 13.7 acres. Staff has comments on this case.

The staff recommends approval with the following conditions. Establish front setbacks for the commercial lots. Staff recommends a 25- ft front setback with a 15 foot wide tree planting strip on both county road 52 and Black Ridge Parkway frontages. At the time of permitting, the applicant agrees to submit an updated MS4 form and calculations if there have been any changes to the existing drainage basins ponds which tie to this project. The applicant will address the comments from Shelby County for the project and obtain Shelby County's final approval for the project. If any conditions on the Hoover project change due to addressing the Shelby County comments, the applicant will resubmit the needed edits to the city of Hoover.

You got anything you want to add to that as a developer? No. Do you understand what was read to you by staff? I do. You have no problems with that? Would you state your name and address for the record, please? Just so we we don't have any video, we got audio. My name is Bob Easley with Alabama Engineering, 1214 Alford Avenue. I'm fine with the staff comments. Thank you. Any comments from anybody on I meant to bring us Sorry. Um, ingress egress to those C1 and C2 will be as shown on the current driveway cuts or the proposed driveway cuts.

That's correct. On the north end of the lots, there's we've got turn lanes into the commercial lots and um drives on the north end of the lots. Okay. So, just to be really clear, uh, no access from County Road 52.

I wouldn't say forever. So, ve a very brief summary. We need to build that thousand feet of road. And if you look at that plan, on the west side of the road, there's 23,000 yards of dirt. And on the right side of the road, there's a big hole. And so, we're going to sight prep by moving the 23,000 yards of dirt from one side of the road to the other. And sight prep two flat lots. I don't know what those are going to be. They may be further developed. They may end up being one user on either side. We don't we don't have a plan for them. Um, and at some point in the future, we might go back to Shelby County and ask for a ride in, write out or something else on the 52. At this time, we don't have any plans to do that, and the grades don't work great for that, but we we don't we don't have a user yet.

And there's nothing on record from Shelby County as to whether they would outright deny access. We we haven't asked for it. We we told I told David Willingham the same thing I just told you, which is we don't know what's going there. But the the main driver of this is that we need to be able to connect from where Blackidge Parkway ends now to 52 and build those turn lanes. And we just don't want to have to haul 23,000 yards of dirt across a road that's open to the public later. Okay, understood. Thank you. Any other comments? I'll entertain a motion. I'll make a motion to approve with staff comments. Motion. Do I have a second? Second. Motion second. All in favor say I.

I. Those opposed, nay. Motion carries. Good luck to you. All right. Next case is subdivision case S042610. Uh the Plaza Riverchase Reservey. The Plaza River Trade Reservey is the purpose of this request is to create two common two commercial lots. And staff's got some comments on this case.

Staff recommends approval with the following conditions. Proposed streams will be installed in accordance with the landscape architectural drawings dated March 13, 2026, taking into account the removal of existing vegetation and associated soil preparation. All new trees shall require a one-year warranty. A landscape bond in the amount of $60,000 must be posted with the city of Hoover prior to the plat being recorded. Who's here representing this case? Give us your name and address, please, sir. Bob Easley, 1214 Alford Avenue. Okay.

Um, you've seen this one before. We were here for conditional use. The, uh, closet Riverchase is a close to 40 year old, uh, development. Used to be a Walmart. Now it's where the Hobby Lobby is. Uh, there's been some deferred maintenance on landscaping over the last 40 years. And so there's several uh islands in the middle of the parking lot that either don't have trees in them that should have trees or that have the wrong kind of trees or have dead trees in them. And so um the landscape plan that we've prepared is basically to bring it back up to what it's supposed to be per the riverchase putt. And that's going to require uh some improvements which are digging out the old old dead or or not doing well plants and uh replacing the soil in the planting islands and then planting trees. Um this development did was built without irrigation. So there's no there's no landscape irrigation in there. All of the islands out there are spray spread out all over the parking lot. would be a quite an ordeal to put irrigation in because, you know, there's 50 little islands all over the parking lot. The plan is to provide hand watering and gator bags for these. The other part of the plan is that we're going to wait until October or November uh to replant so that it's not we're we don't want to plant them in June and have them all die over the summer. So, the plan is to wait till uh the weather is better and for for replanting and then give them the winter to acclimate and then we'll keep them alive through the summer with gator bags and hand watering until they're until they're established.

That sounds reasonable to me. But did you get that okay through these guys that you wait to plant? Yes, we did at at city council. We which is brings the reason for the bond. We we had we had and Mac shaking his head but we had city council approved the us waiting until the fall to plant the trees and and and bonding for the improvements. Okay. Any questions I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chair, I move we approve subdivision case S0426-10 with staff comments. Second. Have a motion and a second. All in favor say I.

I. Oppos? Nay. Motion carries. Good luck. Uh the next case tonight is a conditional use case. It's C42607 140 in Corners. It's enterprise car rentals conditional approval to install and operate a twocar metal canopy with trench drain and sand and oil interceptor uh to hand wash cars on property located in Corners shopping center. Staff's got comments on this one.

Yes, sir. Uh we have reviewed the packet that came in for this particular conditional use case. Uh again, as stated in work session, Enterprise Rentar is looking to relocate their office from one end of Inverous Corner shopping center to the other uh to the 280 side. Uh that in of itself would not have prompted the conditional use. However, they are looking to relocate the the car wash associated with the enterprise rental car and that uh and the potential intensity and impacts that came with that is what's prompted the conditional use consideration. Uh staff recommend approval of the this conditional use contingent on the following that any and all remaining technical comments on the plan set are addressed at time of permitting. uh two that the car wash does not operate outside of the business hours for enterprise rental car and three that uh the certificate of occupancy and business license are obtained for the new location. Uh the hours of operation shared with us from enterprise are Monday through Friday 8:00 a.m. to 6:00 p p.m. Saturday 9:00 a.m. to 12:00 p.m. and closed on Sunday. The comprehensive plan supports commercial development in this vicinity.

Okay. Who's here representing this case? You would come down and give us your name and address and tell us any other information that you want to tell us. Ben Watson, Live Oak Engineering, 259, 7th Avenue South, 35233. Um, I think Max said it pretty well, but yes, this is a pressure wash car wash. This is so enterprise can wash their cars on site, but it's just two pressure washers under a canopy so the guys can stay not hot in the winter and not hot in the summer. Um, but each pressure washer is 2.2 gallons. So, it's talking about four gallons a minute for pressure washing. It's just to allow them to wash their cars on site.

You okay with the hours of operation? Yes, sir. Sorry. Okay. Any other questions? I am confused. Um just one question. Where on site is the car wash proposed for? It's when I look at the vicinity map to the aerial of the shopping center. It is the next if you're on 280. Okay.

It is the second building. second business really from 280. Um, it's on the not it's not the corner unit, but it's the next one. I'm sure I'm saying that wrong, but is it going behind It's going behind the business. It's going behind the business. Yes, sir. That's what I want. That's all. Yes, it is very much in the rear. So, it's in the Okay. Thank you. All right. So, it's going back there. Yes. It's That's why I couldn't understand from the drawings. Correct. It wasn't that it's on the screen. It's But yes, in in in the rear. Thank you. That's all in that back corner. Any other questions?

I'll entertain a motion. I'll make a motion to approve as submitted with staff comments. Second. Have a motion. Second. All in favor say I. I. Name.

Motion carries. Good luck to you. Next case is conditional use case C 0426-08-0426-8-3599. Um this is a Deerfield Drive and a group care home. This is conditional use approval to reclassify existing child care operation located at 3595 Deerfield Drive from a daycare home to a group care home. Staff has some comments on this one.

Yes, Mr. Chair. Uh this particular item comes to you uh after the sixmonth dead period uh after conditional use applications are denied by the city council. Uh that six-month time frame has passed since council denial. Therefore, they're eligible to make this application. Once again, uh let's see. This particular request would be to upgrade the existing uh daycare home to a group daycare home which would elevate the number of children from a maximum of six to a maximum capacity of 12 children. This will prompt the need for uh an additional staff member present on the premises at all times. uh bringing that to at least two staff members to operate the facility. Um staff did receive uh some comments from neighbors requesting that the planning commission deny the request. Uh staff is not offering a positive recommendation on this application. However, if the planning commission offers a favorable recommendation to the city council, uh we do recommend the following conditions. Uh one, that all of the upgrades outlined in the application be successfully planned, permitted, completed, and inspected, and a new certificate of occupancy is issued prior to the increase in number of students being allowed to occupy the building. Two, that no pickup or drop off service is provided on Atkins Trim Boulevard. Three, that the group daycare shall serve a maximum of 12 children. Number four, the hours of operation are to be from 6 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. Number five, no

employee parking would be permitted on the street. Number six, business owners shall renew their business license with updated classification prior to new certificate of occupancy being issued. Uh group care homes do require uh conditional use approval to locate in an R1 district uh which is the zoning designation for this site. Comprehensive plan supports suburban neighborhood lowdensity residential development in the vicinity. Who's here representing this case? Come down and give us your name and address and tell us exactly what you got in mind, please. Thank you.

Good evening. My name is Alicia Rouser. Um I'm the owner of First Steps Early Child Care. I have been um at that location almost um three year well almost four years now. I have operated up under um literally nobody really know that I'm there. So I have no um I I would say that I communicate well with the neighbors. Um I'm always open. Um the problem is I have before school and after school kids that comes to the yard, they wait on the bus. The bus stop is right here. Um, I call them up because that is a busy road. So, they wait literally up there in the yard or they play basketball, but on a compliance issue, um, that's not allowed. So, if somebody was to come and I get inspected, um, and they're playing up there or whatnot, waiting on the bus, then that those I basically get a demerit for that. Um, I heard he was saying up to he was saying 12 kids. Based on my square footage, I can only I can only um care for eight kids. I now have five. Well, I was granted six, but I kept five just because of one person. Um, so the last five years I've been oper three years I've been operating with five kids versus six kids. Um, so and then when you say group home, I think our our thought process is going coming a lot of traffic when that's not what it is. All of my parents are staggered. Um, they drop off um between 7, 7:15, 7:30. Three of the kids that's actually um that I have out of the five is in the neighborhood. Um because that's, you know, they get first they

get first serve, first come. So, three of those kids are in the neighborhood. Um, and then the other two, they they don't stay directly in the neighborhood, but they also in the neighborhood. Um, they stay like up on trace crossing. So, um, it they are staggered. Um, it is correct when he said that you will have to have an additional staff because at anything over six is one additional staff. Um, but I have had my additional staff for the last three years. She have been with me and I have had no problem with parking. Um, literally, you don't know that my house is a um a a family child care. I don't have signs. I don't have hangouts. Um, the most I have is in the morning time when the kids play basketball. Um, and yeah, so I'm asking for a conditional use. Right now, I'm based off the square footage. I'm actually um granted eight kids, not 12. Um and literally like they they in and out. I don't have traffic.

Okay. Any questions from planning commission? I got a question. Yes, sir. Um, and I don't I don't know if it's contingent or anything, but do we know why it was denied by the council? Do we have that information? I don't know that we got a full rundown as to why it was denied, but we had the vote uh and it did not garner enough positive votes to pass.

Can I answer you might? Um I think it was the wording. Um I talked to the um Mr. Lada um and he expressed that he just didn't have a lot of understanding what a group home is. When you say group home, I get it. You think of 12 kids, you think of a lot of kids. But per DHR standards, they come out, they measure your house, and they tell you how many kids you could have. Now, the wording say up to 12. If you go back and you look at the wording, it don't say 12 kids. It says up to 12 based on the square footage. The only thing that's correct on what he's saying is yes, if you go anything over six kids, you do have to have a substitute, but I have been running five kids and allowed six for the last three years and have had a substitute for the last three years. Um, so I feel like it just wasn't enough information given um, you know, on on group home. I think it says something new and we just haven't kind of deep dived in it to see exactly what it is and what those terms mean.

Mr. Chair, I have an additional question. Um, just bruising the zoning ordinance here. Uh, there's a paragraph uh 2.0602 0602 titled limitation of type of home occupation that states in part that a home occupation shall not include a daycare home, group care home, or night care facility home as defined herein. and I don't see that specifically mentioned in the staff report, but I'd just like to clarify uh if that language is applicable uh to the petition that we have before us today. That section of the code is uh referring to daycare family daycare homes and group daycare homes not being classified and defined as home occupations. However, uh there is a separate section of the zoning ordinance that pertains to uh family daycare homes and group care homes uh that um are covered as conditional uses within the single family residential district. Mr. Chair, I do have a question as well um for the staff. Do we have any approved group care homes in Hoover that are in low density residential areas? the ordinance um creating the daycare, family daycare home, and group daycare home designations and classifying those as conditional uses was adopted in 2018.

Uh since that time, we have not had a group daycare home come before us for conditional use consideration other than the one that we're hear about today. That's correct. Let me ask you a question. You said that you were only approved by the state to have eight children. Yes. Based on your heated and cooled square footage in your home. Yes. If you built out part of your home, could you have an additional children in there?

That's with the part that I'm going to turn into a daycare. So, well, so basically, if you look right here, the other part of my garage, um, is just open space. So, when they came out and measured that part, um, I only got the additional three, well, two. Um, so it went from six to eight. But my question is, could you build out part of your basement garage and get up to 12? No, I haven't. No, sir. Could you Could I? Is it Is there

Is it possible? I I mean, it is possible, but for me, um, how I run my business is is pretty much on what I can handle. I can't handle 12. I would want 12. I'm primary here is because I do before drop off and they I do after school drop off which the kids are no is not there no longer than an hour till they mom get there. If I was to get inspected within that hour then I I would get a I would get dame for that. Um, but yes, to answer your question, if I built it out for 12, yes, but that wasn't Yeah, I understand. But then, but you could do it.

It won't be 12. That space isn't big enough for 12. It'll probably be um It's not even for 12. It's got to be like five, six square, like probably three square foot. It's not that. 3,000 square foot is not that. Okay. So based off of DHR measurements of that entire part right there, they determined that I could have eight kids. Are you parking a car in your garage? No, sir. So it's all going to be used for daycare? Yes, sir. And that's what they use to calculate what you could get up to eight children? Yes, sir.

So you'd have to make your house larger in order to accommodate the other four kids. You can't do it with what you've got under roof in your house. Um I think you're So I think we have a misunderstanding. So where I have now in the in the one in the section where the door is to the right, I I could have up to six kids there. Right. That's the little um not the garage. Yes, sir. That part right there. Um I could have up to six kids there. on the other side. That's where she determined if I wanted to put more kids and I wanted to um change that out, then I could add only two more kids. Okay.

Um it's already I don't really have to do a lot of work there. That's just open space. Okay. What about the remainder of the basement? Is it finished? Um it's just like Yeah, it's it's just open space. If I wanted to pull my car in, yes, I can. Um, but I have to do some work. Yes, that's what is that what you're asking? I'm asking you if the if the square footage of your basement area, if you took it all in and and heated and cooled your entire basement, would you be able to put 12 children? No. Only eight. Only eight. Yes, sir. And they can they cannot use any uh calculations for the upstairs? No, that's not part of it. No, sir.

But could it be? No, sir. The U state wouldn't allow you to use that as any calculations.

That's not my that's my house. That's my living area. So, no sir. That question you asked me, can I use upstairs? No sir. My designated area when they come in and they inspect you, they expect the area that you are saying that's a daycare. So, what I'm saying that I'm using as a daycare is my downstairs. That's the area. They don't go upstairs and inspect. They don't do measurements upstairs. Um, if they were to come and and and I was upstairs, I would be shut down. So, that's a compliance issue. And I have somebody from Auburn. If you have any additional more questions like as far as the compliance area go,

can I clarify something? Yeah. You need to get your name and address, please.

Mr. Chair, I had a question. Okay. My name is Jennifer Edelman. Um, my address is 370 Avon Circle, Mount Olive, Alabama. And, um, when she's saying group home, DHR says anything over six is considered a group home. So, I think that's one of the reasons that y'all maybe y'all are getting confused is because anything over six is considered a group. I used to have a daycare in my home and I had 12, but I had the space for it. So, I had a group home with all 12. So, her maximum that she could have is eight, but it's still considered a group home because it's more than six. Anything over six, you have to have two people. You have to have her an assistant.

Right. Okay. But my my question is, could she convert part of her upstairs as part of the daycare facility and get 12 kids in there? If she did, then she would lose part of her house because it's I understand that, but could it be done? I mean, she could, but then I mean it would be Well, that's not her intent, but it might be somebody else's intent if we get the she gets the approval, right, for the That's my only point. Okay. So, I have a question. How do they determine is there a ratio for square footage and amount of kids? What do we know that? I believe it's three it's 3.2 feet per child

per child. So when they come in and they do their measurements um they determine by the center like if you had this center with the um all the furniture in like the tables everything you're going to use they measure the center

um in open space. So, not only is that part of it, my backyard can't even accommodate 12 12 kids, you also have to have the same square footage outside for play area for 12 kids. Um, so it's a lot that go into that number um when they calculating up to 12. So, that's why when they come out and they do their measurements, it's up to 12. So, it may be seven, it may on my half, it's eight. Uh, Mr. Chairman, uh, for staff, I just want to clarify this conditional use will follow this business and this operation only and will not be tied to the lot and the deed so that if a new business decides to come in, they'll have to come back and make this exact same request.

Okay. Just for the board's clarification, the section of the zoning ordinance governing daycare homes and group care homes, section 2.04.02 under the conditional use provisions of the zoning ordinance. And uh subsection D uh talking about transfer of use permitted says there will be no transfer of such permitted conditional use to another address. If the holder moves to another neighborhood, the holder would be required to reapply for the conditional use with the planning and zoning commission. Um, so there would be no transfer from this address to another. Um, however, it does not mention change of ownership at this location.

Well, I'm not questioning change of ownership. I'm qu It would be tied to the business. So it's it's tied to this business license. That's correct. Not to this if you if you sold the business then that if the she gets the approval that approval goes to the business, right? Not to the individual. It it comes to an end and I think that business owner, the new business owner would have to reapply. Correct. That's right. That's why I wanted to clarify for Yeah, I understand. Yeah. Any other questions? And this and one last one for staff also.

This was held this was heard by the previous council. This this has not been heard by our current sitting council. That's correct. It was the previous city council. Okay. Thank you. Um two questions for the applicant. Um so you brought up a point about having the equal space for play area which will be outside. Yes sir. is are you within or is there anything uh uh preventing you to expand that?

So I I'm in the guidelines of eight. Um right now I so my I don't know if y'all familiar with Deerfield but it's hilly so we can't go up because it's so many trees. Um so the space that they have laid out is is only allowed eight. So you are confined by the topography of your backyard that you do more than that. Yes sir. Is it your desire to go to to eight total? Eight. I mean eight because I see that you you you have five holding off on the six, right? Is it your intent to go to?

No. So I probably do my six. Um, I'd like to keep my idea is to keep that open room for the kids that at the bus stop. Um, and the the two kids that drop off and wait on their parents. Um, and it's just simply because that's easier for me. Um, so yeah. No, it's it's I'm I'm really going to stay where I am. Miss Rouseer. Um, in the application package, there's a list of it's numbered one to 16 of items about the property. And in the list, there are several things that appear to be improvements that are, I guess, required by the group home designation.

Yes, ma'am. Are you prepared to make all of those improvements in order to gain two additional children? Yes, ma'am. Any other questions? Yes, sir. Mr. Chair, one question for the petitioner. Um, just as a matter of clarification, um, is this your primary residence? I know you were listed as the applicant, not the owner, but operator. Yes. Yes, sir. And this is your place of residence? Yes, sir. Thank you,

Mr. Chair. I do have one follow-up question, just a clarification. Mr. Rouser, you said something a few minutes ago about if if an inspector came, you would be out of compliance. Can you can you explain what you mean by that? What what circumstance you're talking about?

Yes, ma'am. So, uh we go by ratios. Um that's any daycare period. So for every um like um license for six um so six one staff right? So if somebody was to pop up um usually they pop up in the morning or they pop up in the afternoon we have no control over when the kids everything that's on your premises that's you're in control of that. So if they're up there playing basketball, waiting on the bus, sometime the bus run late. Uh we had instances where they ain't been there an hour or two because the buses are behind and if I get inspected, they are part of my ratio. I have none of their information on file. I'm just like and and they all from the neighborhood. So I wouldn't dare say you need to stand down there at the bus stop. I wouldn't to be honest I wouldn't say stand on Aken trim period because that's a busy road. So I'm they they're safe in the yard. They're safe playing basketball there. They're doing what children do. But when you go from a DHR standpoint, you're out of compliance.

So you don't currently have the the license from DHR to have the eight children. Is that right? So how it works, I have to go through you guys first. um they come out, you tell them, you know, hey, I'm looking to um go to a different status because you up in your numbers or you go into a group home status and they give they they give you your measurements and tell you how many you allowed. Um but you can't do anything other than that until you get the approval and bring the letter saying you have the approval for that. And there are times right now when you are operating out of compliance because

in the morning times you see the little kids out there playing basketball, they're waiting on the bus. Um they come and they wait in the yard and wait on their moms after school. And that's something that they have been doing for years. I've been doing I've been in my house 14 years. They I have been watching that bus stop for literally 14 years way before I had kids. If you notice it's cameras all the way around my house. the polices that get called muttering and speeding. That's me. Okay? So, those are my babies that's on that bus stop and I have looked out for them way before I had my own kids. Um, so I take it personal. Um, one of the parents that went I walked the neighborhood and one of the things um that was brought to my attention they said you making that your responsibility. Um, I am making that my responsibility because if anything happens to them kids, I'm on the end corner and if don't nobody know, I feel like I should know. Okay. Um, so only thing I'm trying to do is being compliant with what I'm doing. That's it. Because I don't want to say, "Hey, DHR here. Y'all need to go down on the street and and and wait down there." That's a dangerous street. I don't know if y'all didn't pass through there. That is a dangerous end corner right there where the bus is. I ain't even talked about them trying to move it up some and turn. Um I I you know I went to the board on that because that's they speed right there. That's the speeding zone where they just take off. Um so I guess I'm the the police control too. I don't know.

So uh one more question. So to be clear, your only intent for this is so you won't get dinged for what you currently have in place. Yes, sir.

Matt, can she make a request to only have eight instead of the 12? Michigan she making a request to only have two in the afternoons when those buses are running or in the morning when the buses are running. Is that going to be too hard to for us to um monitor? I'm not real sure how we monitor that. The problem I have is it just seems like a lot of kids. If I live next door to you, I don't think I would want 12 kids playing and and the noise. I understand what you're doing is probably needed,

but I think it probably disturbs your neighbors is what I'm trying to think of too. You know, obviously you got to think about the children. So, it's a hard one for me because, you know, one of them, you know, your neighbors have some of them have already written letters to the fact they didn't want you to add. So obviously this the five are bothering them. So no, can I comment on that? I'm sorry. Can I make a comment? Sure.

The letters that was written I have actually kept their kids. Um I have walked. They have told me their their concerns. Um they're up the hill. Literally they're up the hill. They don't come down. Their kids go to private school. I was watching their kids in after school care. Um they don't ride the bikes down the hill. They they're at the top. My neighbors are okay with it because I have walked and I have gotten confirmation. Only thing that they that I was told is the tree right there. If I can keep it cut down because it's a blind spot. Um when it when it blooms up, it become a blind a blind spot for them coming down. Um and yes, that's you know, I'm happy to know that they can't see around, you know, cuz I had no idea that that was a blind spot. Um, but I have walked I'm like I'm I'm I'm very much community involved. Um, if I felt like it was a a problem, I wouldn't be here.

Um, the kids the kids on my street, they in these last three years, they have been at my door. I have watched them. Um, now they're going to middle school. So, I don't I I I don't understand that part. Um, but yeah, I agree with you. Atkins is a busy, fast driving road. I see a lot of people driving too fast on it. I'm just wondering if you might want to consider continuing this and going and getting letters from your neighbors that says that you're you have no objection to to you having additional children. I

I will I walk again. I have no problem. Then then what you could do is you could for continuence, okay? And and go get some go to your neighbors and show us on the map. Yeah, this is A B C D and they have no problem we doing what we're talking about doing. Okay.

And that's my concern. I'm just take from my I don't know what their concerns are. My concern is if you had these children and they are already a problem and you're adding to them, then that's going to be a bigger problem for your neighbors. So, you know, you might want to consider asking for a continuence to come back next month with some letters from your neighbors that or maybe some support from your neighbors that would even come in here and say we're in favor of it because it's, you know, it's a good she does a good job.

Is that what you It's not, you know, it's certainly a a choice you can make. Oh, you went on me. Um, I mean, I can do that if if that's what you guys would like me to do. That's my opinion. So, we can put it to a vote if you want to put it to a vote.

I I would say that my that's my biggest concern too is it's a lot of kids, you know. we each have to think about would we want to live next to that? And so having some clarity on how your neighbors feel beyond the one letter that was received I think would be helpful to me. Um I do I do want to say that I think we'd have a better world if everybody cared for their neighbors the way you seem to be caring for these children in your neighborhood. and I salute you for your concern for their safety.

Yes, ma'am. Thank you. So, it's it's a hard one. In the meantime, if if she chooses to do that, can we check into seeing if we can limit it to the eight children and that's all she said she can accommodate? Because that that also makes a difference between eight and 12. For me, I think it's part of the conditional use. uh you can add that as a condition a limitation to the eight. I don't know how we monitor it but

so you'll put it on they basically like you presented me the letter um you presented me the letter on how many kids was allowed. So on your zoning letter you you basically say up to eight. So when they put on the licenses that's the number that they go by is the number that zoning um recommended. Well, the way the ordinance is written, you are allowed up to 12, but in this particular case, since you're not going to you don't have the space for it, you only want eight. I would think that we as a body could say if we approve it, we approve it with only eight kids, you can't have the 12. Yes, sir.

I still think you you would be wise to go to your neighbors, even get them to come if you can to support you. Yes, sir. Okay. That' be my recommendation to you. Yes, sir. I could do that. say, but let me ask, is there anybody here in the audience that wants to make any comments about this case? Yeah. Okay. Let's hear what they got to say. Yes, sir.

Come down, please, and give us your name and address, please. I'm Joan Stelski. We've lived on Deerfield Drive for about 37 years and three kids. I've walked down that hill. I've walked up that hill picking up kids from the bus stop, etc. Um, what I've also helped out neighbors on very rainy days and picked up kids in in the last couple of years and have been at that corner just beyond the dead sign. And it is a problem when there are people on the road who I think are your helpers. Somebody that there people that do park on the road that come and help during the day and Well, the cars are there and um I'm still confused as far as how many kids are there just in the morning and just in the afternoon.

Well, I have they're there all day, but the kids that be outside in the morning, they're just in the morning, you know, getting on the bus waiting on the bus. So, when you guys see kids, you know, out there in the morning come at 6:50. Um 6:50 we run late sometimes. So 6:50 to 7 is Simmons and then 7:30 is um No, that's Trace. That's Trace Crossing. 650 to 7 Cross. And then 7:30 is Simmons. And then um 8:00 you got some you got your high school kids, right?

Um but I only have the elementary kids. the kids from our street that you know that wait right there and then I have the um two middle school students that get on the bus right there. So the five are there during those seven or eight hours. Only five. Yes, ma'am. Okay. Because I have seen them, you know,

we all have to go past her house in order to go so we know what's going in going on. And I applaud you for that because you are right. We didn't, you know, have any problems. But the thing is that on those certain times it does get crowded and I know a few drivers who don't make that turn on our street as nicely as they should and it does become a problem. So um I have concerns but I'm you know glad that it's only going to be eight and I think you're worth the shot. I think we need to continue this to to find out what's going on. Okay. And I think there are a few others that are here with me.

Okay. Anybody else want to speak?

Hey, I'm Holly Laney. I'm at 3559 Deerfield Drive. And um I am actually I have two little boys that ride that bus that actually hang out at her house and play basketball in the mornings. Those are my children. Um, and my concern, and I've already I've already talked to Alicia about this, is the lack of sidewalks. We don't have sidewalks. So, my house is way up the street, and my little boys walk down the street and walk up the street. Um, with cars on the street, they're having to walk around those cars to get to the stop. Um, and so my concern is the extra traffic. It's not easy to turn around right there. So, we have a lot of extra traffic that come up the road to turn around and it's a quiet dead-end street for the most part. Um, but because cars can't turn around right there, they are going up the street. So, um, she has actually helped me out with my ch children, she has kept them before. So, she is wonderful and I she is definitely um a godsend, but that is my concern as a mom. Um, is that the lack of sidewalks and my children walking up and down the street. So,

I'm a little confused. I'm not sure you for or against this. That's your decision. Well, okay. Yes. Anybody else? Mr. Chair, I do have a question for that young lady. Miss Holly, is that that your name? Just a quick question.

The the times that Miss Rouseer has helped with your children, did you compensate for that? um the first year that my children were at that school, yes, it was after school and she did keep them um for about an hour, but now my two are just involved in the other 10 that are playing basketball in the mornings and she is right. The bus has been late and she has kept them um and there's a group message that goes out. I mean, she is she is correct with that. Um but she only did that for one year. Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Did you want to speak? I had a question. I had a question. Yeah.

So, was there 10 kids or who's how many are allowed at one time? I know one of the issues was if DHR shows up and there's more than six. They just out there sometimes they play basketball and they wait on the bus. Okay. So, I don't go out there and just count.

No, no, I get it. But, but just wanted to make sure. Okay. Yes, good evening. This is Lewis. I'm Lewis Kuruba at uh 3578 Deerfield Drive. Um and I just want to kind of piggy back off of what Holly said, the traffic, it's a deadend street. I have two young children as well and they play up and down the street. I don't allow my kids to come over the hill towards Atkins Trim just because of what we've been discussing, the speed and the amount of traffic on Atkins Trim, but also the additional cars. I mean, we're going from I don't remember the number, four or five that she's taken care of now to eight with the possibility of 12. So, that's 16 cars, additional cars up and down our dead end street every day. Um, I live at the intersection of I guess that would be Deerfield and Deerfield, the first culde-sac. And I can see on my camera cars turning around at the intersection or using my driveway to turn around if my vehicle's not there. Um, and that's her pickup times can be after my kids get home from school, which is when they're outside playing, when they're going up up the street to the lany's house. And it just it's a concern for me. you know, we live on a dead-end street, low traffic count. Um, I feel comfort and at ease allowing my kids to play and not be eye- hawking them, watching for vehicles. Um, so that that that's my concern.

Okay. Thank you, sir. Thank you.

Anyone else? Anyone else in OP or I know who you're for, but anybody else in the back there? Okay. Come on down. Come on down. Hello, my name is Sahe Blackshaw. That's actually was my residence. I will say most of the time y'all probably seen my car there. So, I'm sorry that's I'm guilty of that. And I'm also guilty of driving up. I I will say I do park right there. If you see where the mailbox is, I try to allow most of the parents to get in and drop their kids off so there's not kind of in the driveway. But if you see how big that driveway is, it really does permit for a lot more cars there. So, I would say if we were to use as a conditional use, maybe we shouldn't or I guess I shouldn't be parking. See, that's that's a pretty big space. And it looks better. I pressure washed it. So, uh yeah, don't don't those are old. We need to update that. Um but if you turn kind of to the what is that to the left? I think is that the area you guys are speaking of where cars are parked right there? Yeah, that that's me. That's that's all me. And I actually have a kid of my own, so I've kind of moved off from staying there all the time. So, I think maybe one of the conditions that we could to compromise for everybody could be no parking on Deerfield if maybe that would be more of a solution for everybody. Um, yeah, that's my car actually there too. See, I'm not doing it this time. Um, but you see it right next to that 4ERunner. But I do think we had positive reviews from everybody and in this day and age, I mean, we'd rather have kids playing outside than stuck on an iPad all day. So, if we could provide that safe haven for the kids, I'm for it.

Okay, that's all I had to say. I'm sorry for parking there, guys. I won't do it no more. Anybody else in the audience have anything to say?

Yes, sir. Yes, my name is Naz Muhammed. I own that property and Alisha and the kids have been living there for 15 years. We have had no problem. No problem. No accidents, no complaint from anybody since she opened the daycare three or four years ago which I gave her a permission to do it. She's done everything in right. She has kept it clean. She make sure the streets are not kind of blocked or congested. The people who drop their kids, they they don't they don't all come at one time. They are few minutes far apart though that parking lot driveway is not full all the time or there is no obstruction in any way and I think she's done a good job and I do think being an owner I haven't had a single complaint in 15 years. Thank you.

Thank you. Anyone else? Mr. Rouser, can you come back down here so we can talk back with you? It would be my suggestion for you to ask for a continuence

so that you could go back and get as many um neighbors to come or to write letters and show us exactly which neighbor you got that is not going to oppose it. I also think it would be wise on your part to try since you can't have more than eight. We, you know, you would make the recommendation, you'd ask for the recommendation to only have eight. And if you can do anything else, if it helps you to say that the extra children are there for the bus, okay, that may even help you. Anything that would reduce the amount of children that you're asking for. Okay. I would use if I were you in my argument. Yes, sir.

If that's what you want to do. But again, it is your choice. We will vote on it tonight. If you do not want to continue it, I'll do a continuance. Okay. All right. We'll continue this to next month. Anybody that has an interest in this case, they need to be here next month at May the 4th at 6:00. No new notices will go out. This is continued from this month's meeting. So, we're not going to notify anybody, but we will have a meeting. And this is uh would probably be on the agenda. Y'all understand that? You might want to spread the word to all your neighbors.

We don't have to have a motion to continue this, do we? I would do that just to be on the safe side. That's I'll make a motion to continue the case. Second. Motion second. All in favor say I. I. Those nay. Motion carries. Good luck to you. Yes, sir. Thank you. Okay,

last case tonight is zoning KZ Z42605 2333 Farley Place changes zoning from an R1 single family residential to an legacy single family residential. Staff has a few comments.

Yes, Mr. Chair. Um, this particular application comes before us in order that the property owner at the subject address 2333 Farley Place uh is able to remodel their home with the addition of a u covered unenced front porch extending off of the front of the existing house. Uh the legacy single family residential district will accommodate uh this addition uh allowing for the proper encroachment of the covered unenclosed front porch on the existing home. Uh staff recommends approval and uh the comprehensive plan supports lowdensity residential development in the vicinity. Okay. Who's here representing this case? Come on down and give us your name and address. Hi, I'm Dana Cole, 2333 Farley Place.

Tell us what you're going to do, please.

Um, I have a ranch style home and uh I want to just add a front porch. We're going to make it um so my garage is on this side and then I have the door picture window and then two bedroom windows. So, it will go from it's going to be about 20 ft long going from just before the garage and then past the picture window. And then we're going to bring it about 8 feet deep. And then there will be, you know, just front stairs a little bit, you know, coming off of that 8 ft. Um, and then A-frame, um, you know, white and gray. My house is, you know, white and gray. So, what else do you need to know?

Any questions? I used to be your paper boy when I was 12 years old. What's that? I was your paper boy when I was 12 years old. I don't think you were there. I'm not sure if I No, I was not there. I'm I'm not sure if I was born yet. I may be, though. It's quite possible. No, I'm just kidding. I'm sure I was. Um, yeah. No, I did not mean that that way. I very much. Um, I'll entertain the denial then. Um, I was I was doing really well, wasn't I? Until I until I said that. Um, Mr. Chairman, I'll make a motion to approve as submitted. Second. Got a motion second. All in favor say I. I. Thank you so much.

All those opposed? Nay. Motion carries. Good luck to you. Thank you. We're journal. She's black when