Conservation Commission - Regular Meeting

We'll just go around real quick, make sure everyone's looked at them, and then we'll do a motion and take it from there. Travis, any comments or questions?

Have we opened the meeting yet?

Oh, you're so picky, Leah. Like you want to do things by the rules. That would be this, what I have here.

It helps us write the next minutes.

Not a problem. Not a problem. I mean, I even printed it out so I'd be prepared. So, all right, let's kind of rock and roll here since it's 7.02. I'll call the meeting to order. Before we get started, let's introduce everyone in this meeting. I'm Sandy Brock. When I call your name, please confirm that you can hear me by verifying that you are present. We'll start with the commissioners. Travis.

I'm here.

I'm going to leave Amira to last. So Noah.

Present.

Amira.

I'm here.

Thank you. And Emma, is Emma here yet or not?

Yep, I'm here.

Very good. We'll go with staff. Leah.

I'm here.

Jan.

I'm here.

All right, thank you very much. This open meeting of the Conservation Commission is being conducted remotely via Zoom, pursuant to Governor Baker's March 12, 2020 order. As most recently extended on March 28, 2025, access information for public has been provided on the town website. This meeting is being recorded. Please remember to mute your phone and computer when you are not speaking. This is done on a phone by pressing star six. As chair, I will introduce each speaker on the agenda. Please note that you will not have screen sharing pillages, but staff can display any visuals per your queue. During periods of public comment, participants must use the raise hand icon and the Zoom menu bar to indicate they would like to speak. This is done on a phone by pressing star nine, then pressing star six to unmute when you are called on. Participants who raise their hand will be recognized one at a time and will be promoted to speak. Finally, each vote taken will be conducted by roll call vote. As a reminder, the Conservation Commission is concerned with state and town wetlands and stormwater regulations. Concerns outside this purview need to be addressed to the appropriate boards. For example, road conditions must be addressed with the Select Board and traffic concerns must be addressed with the Planning Board. Here we go. All set. So let's start again, or at least let me go back and I'll go forward now. I'll just go around. Since Noah, you happen to be up there, any comments or questions on the meeting minutes?

No, nothing for me.

All right. Amira, any comments or questions on the meeting minutes?

Nothing for me.

Thank you. Emma, any comments or questions on the meeting minutes?

None for me.

And last but not least, Travis, any comments or questions on the... Okay, sounds good. I also have no comments or questions on it. Do I have a motion to approve the meeting minutes of June 23rd?

I'll move to approve the meeting minutes for June 23rd, 2026.

Thank you very much. Do I have a second?

Second.

So Noah has a second. We'll do roll call vote. Travis, you're on the big screen. You get to go first. Yes. Noah?

Yes.

Emma? Yes. Amira?

Yes.

I am also a yes, therefore the motion carries unanimously. Okay. All right, Leah, it's now 7.05. Do we want to start with the RDA for the railroad?

Sure.

Okay, I will read that in. Okay. Pursuant to the Massachusetts Wetlands Protection Act, the Conservation Commission will hold a public hearing to act upon a request for determination of applicability for our resource area delineation for vegetation maintenance along the Providence and Worcester Railroad right away through Grafton. And who's here to speak to that?

Hi, I'm Tom Lewis. Can you hear me okay?

Sure can. If you could just repeat your name and your address or who you're representing.

Sure. Again, I'm Tom Lewis. I'm with Tech Associates. I'm here on behalf of the Providence and Worcester Railroad for their vegetation management.

You have the floor, sir.

Okay, thanks. So just as a quick background, I know we went through this at one of your recent meetings for the Grafton and Upton Railroad. But the railroads in Massachusetts, they manage their vegetation under the Rights of Way regulations, which is administered by the Department of Ag. That is MDAR, Department of Agriculture Resources. As part of that, they have to have a vegetation management plan. And their most recent one was, well, it expired at the end of last year and was just recently renewed. So as part of that process, we have to go to each municipality and obtain a determination of the boundaries of the resource areas. So that was the purpose of my filing. If you would like, I can share.

No, you can't share, but we have very good staff, and they will share just for you. So go for it.

Perfect. So just a little description on the mapping that we have here. The color coding, if you look at the legend on the right side of the screen, the blue would indicate buffer zone. That is the lighter blue is buffer zone. The darker blue is actually water supply resource areas and yellow indicates no spray areas. In buffer zone, we're allowed to make one application of herbicide per year using low pressure foliar application and only using sensitive area materials that the state lists for use in a buffer zone. In the water supply restricted areas, which you see is the dark blue in those hatched areas, we can only make an application there once every two years. So that's essentially the description of how we map it. And really the two primary no sprays that we have here, one is for, to the left side of the screen, is for the Blackstone River Bridge where we cross And then the other one is actually the two wells that are near Fisherville, I guess is the best way to describe it. I'd be happy to answer any questions on it at this point.

All right. Thank you very much. I'll go around to the commission first to see if they have any questions before we open it up to the public. Travis, any questions? No, nothing for me. All right. Amira, any questions?

No questions.

Noah, any questions?

No, nothing for me.

And Emma, any questions on this?

None for me either.

Yeah, I have no questions. Obviously we've been through this before. We just, you know, and then it gets reviewed and everything. And this is your following kind of standard practice here. I have no other questions here. Leah, did you have any comments or questions on your review?

Just a couple. They're going to get a five-year determination because it is for a vegetation management plan. They're exempt from our bylaw and the data they show here matches the data we have. So I was recommending issuing a positive determination in agreement with their delineation.

All right. Thank you very much. I'll open it up to the public at this time to see if anyone has any comments. Then I'll quickly go back around the commission again to see if they have any questions based on Leah's report. And Jan can keep a watch on the public and I'll go around one more time. Travis, any other questions or comments after Leah's report out? Nothing else. Okay. Thank you very much. Amira?

Nothing. Nothing for me.

Thank you. Noah?

No comments.

And Emma?

No comments.

I also have no follow-up comments. And Jan, anyone from the public?

Nothing from the public.

Nothing from the public. I'll go back to the applicant if you have anything else to add. If not, we will move to do a vote.

No, I think I've covered it.

All right. Thank you very much. Do I have a motion?

I'll move to close the hearing and issue a positive determination in agreement with the delineation that was provided for Providence and Worcester Railroad.

Thank you very much. Do I have a second? Second. We have a motion and a second. Roll call vote. Noah, you're up on the board, so you get to go first.

Yes.

Emma? Yes. Travis? Yes. Amira? Yes. And I am also a yes. The motion carries unanimously. Good luck. Have fun.

Perfect. Thank you.

All right. Thanks.

Have a good night.

You too. All right. Ah, how we moving on to we have a couple of we have one continuation. Do we want to jump there? Do we want to do the continuations? Yeah.

We don't have anyone waiting for those, so you can jump to the one that they are here for tonight. I just wanted to make a note that this one started before Emma was a commissioner, so she can't vote on this one.

All right. I appreciate that. Let me read that one in then. So this is Cooper Hill. Pursuant to Massachusetts Wetlands Protection Act and the Grafton Wetlands Protection Bylaw, Conservation Commission will hold a public hearing. to act upon abbreviated notice of resource area delineation at 104 Creeper Hill Road. Who's here to present this, please?

My name is Brian Nelson from Metro West Engineering.

Ah, you have the floor.

Thank you. We were before you on June 9th. This is for a resource area delineation filing for the property at 104 Creeper Hill Road. And I have screen share materials. I think I had sent Jan, there's probably, I think I sent three sheets, probably sheet number one shows, actually, that's a good one to look at because that shows the area in question. So this is a larger site. It's about a 15-acre site. It extends down off the bottom of the sheet to Creeper Hill Road. And so we are looking basically for resource area delineation for the upper part of the site, which is shown on this plan here. Ecotech, I think, was hired as your peer review consultant. We have a memo from them from June 23rd that Leah had forwarded over. I can go through Ecotech's comments, which were really pretty minor. Comment number one was a reference to a DEP file number, which we now have, which is 164-1084. um comment number two basically uh stated that they were in agreement with the delineated wetlands as shown on the plan uh there is an isolated wetland which is basically almost centered in in the property you can see it on the plan um there was question as to whether um the isolated wetland was um uh considerably and subject to flooding That area is only about a quarter of a foot deep on average. It has an area of about 3,000 square feet, but I do not believe it holds at least 500 feet a cubic feet to an average depth of six inches. The depth of that depression is much smaller. We do have it shown with a 25-foot no-disturb and 100-foot buffer zone around it, regardless on our plans. And The note number three from the Ecotech letter did say that, you know, kind of what I had just mentioned about the entire property being shown on our locust plan, but really this upper portion, so the portion you're looking at, was what was reviewed by Ecotech, and that was basically stated in our narrative. DEP issued a file number. I... I believe that DEP had a question or a comment about some of the delineations, which I believe are shown on the plan in terms of bordering land subject to flooding. We've got that delineated at elevation 359.0. And with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions.

Sure. Okay. Thank you. Lee, I want to go through your report.

Sure. Jan, could you pull up the DEP comment sheet when you have a chance? I'd like to walk through that. The only other thing on the Ecotech report is just a recommendation that future projects be required to re-flag the boundaries in the field. So I know this is an ANRAD, but maybe we can just capture that in a condition just so it gets referenced in a future filing. All right, so this was DEP's comment. They say, DEP recommends all wetland flags and boundaries confirmed under this ANRAD be accurately located in the field and verified by the commission. A plan confirmed and approved through an ORAD should not reflect estimates as accurate delineation lines. blsf related to the area labeled zone a and scaled from current fema should have its base flood elevation determined the limit of blsf should be depicted at the corresponding elevation or removed from the scope of review of the anrad can you just further speak to that for the commission sure we have the blsf delineated at elevation 359 and that's shown in a bunch of places on um

the two blow up sheets of the section. We felt that we don't agree with it, but we did show in purple, which is a dotted line. It's basically was for illustrative purposes, the FEMA boundary, which meanders through this part of the site and basically all around Flint's Pond. So we wanted to show it. We don't feel that that's an accurate representation of the line. but it is on published mapping. So we figured that that was something we should show. I do not feel like that's representative of the actual zoning boundary, which again is on the FEMA mapping is not delineated by elevation. So we are looking at elevation 359, which is up on the bank of the pond as it runs around this peninsula as the BLSF elevation.

Did you have, I'm sorry, did you happen to look to see if there's any preliminary mapping done by FEMA at this time?

There is a contemplated map change. I did talk to, I cannot remember his name, Leah put me in touch, a gentleman. from FEMA, and there is a change contemplated in this area. I believe he had mentioned it was most likely coming maybe 2027 or 2028 when FEMA redoes the maps in this area.

And the only reason I'm asking that is sometimes you can get, if they've done a study or something, you can get actually elevation information, even though it hasn't fully been approved. I've heard all sides of whether there's preliminary maps, if towns should be using them or not. I'm not going to go there for this one, that's for sure. But it's, you know, it's just additional information that would back up your elevation. That's all. That's what I was asking about. I also understand And things have changed with FEMA and they kind of change it up a little bit. I was always taught that you use the FEMA map line no matter where it was. And now that has, you know, based on DEP's comments, they're looking to say that you're supposed to be doing your own base flood elevation. It's a little bit different than what FEMA says.

Well, I'm kind of with you on that. You know, my My training, you know, kind of pushes me the same way in that we would hold the FEMA line. And, you know, again, we were, I think, prior to filing, we're asked to basically look at, you know, determining an elevation for the flood zone. And that 359 contour is where we came up with.

Yep. No, I understand that. It's just, yeah, I've never seen that from DEP actually. So a little different. So let me go around and see if anyone else has other questions on this. So I'll start with Noah. Any questions?

No, no questions for me.

All right. Amira, any questions?

No questions for me.

Great. Thank you. Emma, any questions?

No questions.

Oh, actually, I can't ask you that because, correct, you just started before you were on, so I shouldn't be asking you that question. Sorry about that. And then, Travis, any questions as it relates to this?

I don't think so.

Yeah. So, Leah, as far as your recommendations, what are you looking for for that? I know that you're making a recommendation to continue it.

So I don't think we need to continue. We just need to iron out what we're approving here. So do I have it correct that the data shown by FEMA currently, which doesn't follow a contour, is your purple line where it says... And I think that's what DEP is picking up on and taking issue with. But I also see your other labels of approximate BLSF boundary at 359.

That's correct.

And that's not a particular color. It's just one of your contour lines.

That's correct. It's a darker contour, but it's not color correct. It's a little more bold than the other contours.

Okay, so I think for visuals sake and accuracy for the file, and we can have this be a condition, I think, and if the commission's okay with it, I think the purple should either come off or we need to say we're not locking in the purple line, but then I'd like to see the 359 be a distinct color. And it also then needs a no disturb and a buffer zone under our bylaw.

It should have that on this plan, but we can make the 359. What we've done is we've basically taken kind of the most restrictive of all the boundaries we've got, and we've offset those, the 25 and the 100.

Okay, yeah, I see that.

What I'll do is I'll try and make the 359 contour a different color so it pops out.

Okay. I see what you're saying now about the no disturb and the buffer zone.

And Leah, I would say as far as the purple line, I think it should stay on there just because it's from the FEMA map. I just think it should just have a little bit better description. It does say on it that it's a limit of FEMA flood, a scale location. I mean, this is typical, but I would put, you know, that this is, you know, that this was taken from the mapping from FEMA just so that everyone knows where it came from. I think it should be on the plan just because that is the available information from FEMA. And so I just think for the record, it should be clear that this is where it's from. You can even have a note on it to say that, you know, that the elevation is what's being used and not the actual FEMA line. But that's, I mean, it's very common to have female, you know, no elevation zone lines go through contours. It's, you know, depending upon when it was actually created, the aerial mapping just wasn't very accurate at the point. And if you've got something 30, 40 years old, it's going to be incorrect. So, but it's still part of what FEMA has for documentation. So it's good to show, but we don't need to make a, we just need to make sure it's clear and what it is and the fact that the elevation is what's really being used for the The approximate zone a So, As far as that goes, I'll go around another time to see if anyone has questions, and then we can talk about conditions. And I'm going to skip Emma this time and go to Amira.

I don't have any questions.

All right. Noah?

No questions.

Okay. And Travis?

No, nothing else.

Yeah. Leah, as far as potential, I guess I should at this point, I'll also say if anyone is in the audience that has any comments or questions on this particular application, please raise your hand and we'll be happy to call on you and answer any of those questions. So Leah, as far as like what you were talking about before, it seems like the elevation is what you want and having a condition Basically just saying to identify that it was a 359 elevation is color coded and called out as the estimated base flood elevation.

Yeah, that makes sense to me.

Okay. Any other conditions? I know that you have the other one as far as any future submissions should have the flags, the previous wetland flags should be refreshed in the field.

Yep. And then just the finding that Art suggested that we are just talking about the delineation on this northerly part of the property at this point in time, that would just be another finding.

Yeah. And I would just say we identify that sheet, the sheet that we're looking at. Yep. Okay. That's cool.

Yeah. That's consistent with our narrative too. That was one of the last parts of the narrative that we prepared for this was basically just to focus on this area.

Okay. We'll just, yeah, with the conditions, we'll just clarify it. It's amazing when you look back at something 10 years old. If you don't put everything in it, it doesn't always show up. So let's go around one more time. Travis, any other questions on this?

No, nothing else.

Okay. Noah?

Nothing.

Amira?

Nothing for me.

Thank you very much. And Jan, anything from the public?

Nothing from the public.

Okay. So it looks like we're at the point now we can make a motion that included the conditions that was previously discussed.

Leah, is this an RDA?

So on the state side, it's an ANRAD, and on our bylaw side, it's an RDA. But you can just say you are issuing an order of resource area delineation.

Okay. I move to issue an order of resource delineation for 104 Creeper Hill Road with the conditions as discussed.

Do I have a second?

Second.

We have a motion and second. We'll call vote. Travis? Yes. Amira? Yes. Noah?

Yes.

I am also a yes, and Amira unfortunately cannot vote since she was not on the commission when this was actually submitted. So that means the motion carries.

Thank you.

All right. Good luck. Have a good night. Thank you. Yep. All right, Leah, we've got a couple of continuations.

Correct.

Okay. Let me go to those continuations. Okay, so the first one up is 66 Brigham Hill Road. We'll just read that. Pursuant to the Massachusetts Wildlife Protection Act, Grafton Wildlife Protection By-law, Grafton Conservation Commission will hold a public hearing. To act upon a notice of intent application for Grafton Wetlands bylaw permit for the construction of geothermal trenches for a single family home at 66 Brigham Hill Road. The applicant has requested a continuance to July 28th. Do I have a motion for that continuance?

I'll move to continue the hearing for 66 Brigham Hill Road to July 28th.

Do I have a second?

Second.

We have a motion and a second. Roll call vote. Travis.

Yes.

Amira? Yes. Noah?

Yes.

And can Emma vote on this one?

I don't remember, but it's only to continue at this point.

All right. Emma? Yes. And I'm also a yes. The motion carries and the meeting is continued to July 28th. Next one up. Okay. Pursuant to Massachusetts Wetland Protection Act and Grafton Wetlands Protection By-law, Conservation Commission will hold a public hearing to act upon our notice of intent and application for Grafton Wetlands By-law permit for the construction of a single family house at 21 Meadowbrook Road. The applicant has requested a continuance to July 28th. Do I have a motion?

I'll move to continue the hearing. 21 Meadowbrook Road to July 28.

Thank you. Do I have a second? Second. We have a motion and a second. Roll call vote. Emma, you happen to be on the big screen. You get to go first. Yes. Travis? Yes. Amira? Yes. Noah?

Yes.

I am also a yes. The motion carries unanimously. All right, Leah. Anything else?

I have a few housekeeping items. One is a reminder for you, Sandy, we need you to come in and sign the conservation restriction from a meeting or two ago. If you can coordinate with Jan or I so we can make sure there's a notary available, it would be helpful.

It probably wouldn't be until Friday because I've got site visits tomorrow. I will confirm that, though.

And everyone's favorite conversation, re-appointing our representatives to other committees. Okay. Because we do the new policy of you're the rep for a year. So as of July 1, you're all unofficial.

Yep. So why don't you just quickly go through the other committees and just let the people who actually are on them already, let them kind of give their opinion whether they want to continue or not. And then we have a discussion on it, so.

Well, we can start with CPC, I guess, which currently is you, Sandy.

Yeah, I don't mind staying on it. I finally learned what CPC is about. It only took a few years. At some point, I'll be rolling off of it. It is actually, let me ask this question. Does everyone know what CPC is for and how it works?

Is that the Community Preservation Committee?

Yes, yes, it is.

Yeah, that's all I know.

Okay. So I'll try to make this as short as possible. So several years ago, the town voted to do 1.5% on real estate taxes that that money goes to a fund for the CPC conservation, excuse me, community preservation acts and the community preservation commission applies that money. And generally it is for things that typically don't get funded through the town just because it may be like open space is one of them, recreation and historical restoration. So there's a lot of examples in Grafton of what this money has gone through and been used for. Things like open space that we've bought and we still have some open space that we're still paying for. If you're in North Grafton, the Bridge Street, that little improvement they did to the park that was part of CPC. So this has been a whole bunch of different things that come in front. And then obviously there's some historical things going back to the old town hall and those type of things. So it's used for all different kind of projects. It's actually very interesting. It's a very strict process of what can get funding and what can't. It's just taken me a while to figure that out. It is a good opportunity to get to understand what that is. I've been doing that for several years now. I'm happy to stay on that. That's the CPC. Does anyone have questions on that? I won't be on it forever. Okay. Next one, Leah.

Open Space and Recreation Commission, which is currently Travis.

So we're in the implementation phase of the 2020 open space and rec plan. So going through various parcels, identifying parcels that are maybe owned by the town, but not necessarily protected. Also working with other town committees and town departments on some of the implementation goals, like invasive species. There's some trail-related goals, stuff like that. I think it's fun. Meetings are usually pretty short. I'm happy to stay on it unless somebody else wants to do it.

All right. And the last one, Leah.

Lake Quinn Sigmund Commission, which is currently a MIRA. And thank you very much for that.

Yeah, so Lake Winsigamond, I have a lot of classes on Wednesdays when that meets. So I, if possible, would prefer to not be on that commission anymore. It's in person. It's, I think, once a month. Yeah, it's once a month. And it's at the police department in Shrewsbury. they have like a meeting space there.

Sure. Sure. Happy to open that up. I mean, thank you for, for taking that on. I mean, all of these things we can rotate. It's, you know, I don't want to force anyone and I appreciate you doing it and you probably made more meetings than have we met in the past. So thank you very much for that. So put it up to Noah and Emma, if you are interested in the Quinsigamon project, position or if, and again, it's, you know, it's the timing of it. It's, it's, you know, this is, you know, we volunteer for Concom and then Concom has automatic appointments for three different committees. And we try to fill that and hopefully you can rotate in different things. But.

Sandy, I thought for that one for a while, we were on call.

Yep.

There's a, wetland related issue we can have like someone on call to join and then we kind of don't really join unless there's an issue because I think a lot of it is really not related to our mission.

It has more to do with the boating and other watercrafts going on Lake Presidium. So put it out to Noah and to Emma if you have any desires just kind of learn a little bit more or get involved in that.

You know what time those meetings are typically? And actually what is, is this specifically for Lake Quinsigamon? Like it's just a commission for the lakes?

So in the reason why Grafton's involved is simply where does Lake Quinsigamon goes? It goes down the Quinsigamon river and guess where it comes to, to Grafton. And guess what the biggest issues that we have. And we usually only get involved when there's like issues because of invasive plants, aquatic plants, those types of things. Cause there's, it flows downhill and we're downhill. So, so yeah, but there's also, know you know what travis was talking about there's a lot of like boating things and and so they're pretty good so we do from a commission standpoint we do sometimes contribute um money and so forth uh so that they can do aquatic invasive removal and things like that because if it's in lake consignment it's going to come down to grafton so that's it and then as travis said what we've kind of done in the past is go ahead and go to one or two meetings get a flavor for it, and then after that we can check in. Leah, who runs that? Is the same person still running it after all these years?

I think they had a change recently in who was chair. I can't quite remember.

I think it's Bill Nelson.

Yeah, I think he's chair now. It used to be Peter Collins. Is that correct?

Okay. So, so the whole idea is we don't want to make it a heavy lift for you and we want to, you know, but it's just another thing to kind of, um, uh, we commit to China, you know, making certain meetings just simply because it impacts grafted, but many meetings don't. So we don't want to make it onerous and so forth. So, um,

and uh do amira do you know what time it is on wednesdays i i think it's um i think it's at seven i think it's seven o'clock um in person in shrewsbury which is yeah it's in person in shrewsbury um the other thing is they don't send out the agenda a few days before i think it's like literally like the night before so you probably want to like go on the Shrewsbury or Lake, oh my God, Lake Commission website and add the event to your calendar so that you know when it's coming up. But yeah. It's mostly not Grafton-related stuff. Right.

We don't want you to waste your time. I mean, be my guest. Get as involved as you want. But really, it's kind of what we're representing and stuff.

Yeah, I'm happy to jump on that and relieve Amira of that post.

And if you run into a conflict, we'll figure it out. Yeah. All right, Leah, other things that will allow the housekeeping?

I do think we need a motion for those reps, as awkward as it is, because it involves all you guys. Okay.

So do I have a motion for who's representing each one of those three committees so we can do a vote on it?

I'll move to appoint Sandy for CPC and Emma for Lake Consigamon.

And yourself for?

And myself for open space and rec.

Sounds good. Do I have a second?

Second.

A motion, a second. We'll do a roll call vote. Noah, you're up on the big screen, so you get to go first. Yes. Travis? Yes. Amira?

Yes.

Emma? Yes. And thank you. And I'm also a yes to motion carries. Leah, do we want to talk a little bit about the commission makeup and talk about... That was my last thing, yeah.

And last time we started talking about maybe a vice chair, just so you have a backup. If people want to go in that direction.

Yeah, so there's a lot of different ways to handle this. Travis has run the meeting several times. Amara pitched in last minute. did a great job, which was not too fair to her, but yeah, I appreciate that. Um, so, I mean, there's a couple of things where we can have a vice chair, um, And trust me, if someone really wants to be chair, just, you know, say, yeah, I'd like to do that. I'm not, I don't have a problem stepping aside at all. The other thing that we can do, which is to give people an opportunity, is to have them run meetings, depending upon, you know, if it's a depending upon the meeting, is to run a meeting or two and kind of rotate that just so that when you get asked to do it because of the configuration of the commission on that night or if someone has to recuse themselves, you don't get thrown into doing it without any notification other than, uh-oh, Mayor, will you do it? So yeah, so we have a little bit of flexibility. I guess what I'm doing is it would be great to have a vice chair It would be great just to take turns so everyone's exposed to it just so that there's options. It's a good experience. So I don't know what people.

Yep. I'd be happy to be vice chair if that's the logical progression.

I think so. I think that does make a lot of sense. Everybody else is excited to do it. But I'm also like a big one, like we can have, you know, have an acting chair that runs that meeting just as an experience type of thing. And there's plenty of people that have been on this and obviously staff with Leah and Jan can help out. You can see how many times I ask them questions. I'm not shy of doing that. And just to give people the experience so that if there's a circumstance where someone needs to step up, that someone's done it before. And there's lots. There's a good session with MACC. And I believe it used to be called how to get home before midnight. It's basically how to run a meeting. And it's just really about, you know, just the process of doing it. There's always things that come up that hell, I don't even know what's. you know, certain things are and stuff. There's some different types of things that are a little bit unusual that may come up when you, you know. But typically, it's fairly straightforward. It's the process of opening the meeting, doing a certain process, understanding that. If it's a new hearing, then it's a time certain. Staff, Leah and Jan are very good about manipulating times, which we all appreciate tremendously. And then anything that's continued, we switched a few years ago that anything that's continued is at the, you know, basically based on who happens to be here and we just take them in order. Or if someone happens to be in the audience, we might go bring them first and so forth. Um, so put it out there. Does anyone have any, anyone have kind of, um, you know, a desire to like maybe run a meeting or two just to get used to it? It's a, it's great. It's a great experience.

I think I'd be down to run a meeting or two. I think it would depend on the meeting. Like if I could look at the agenda first.

I think it would be fair to do that. Like tonight's meeting.

That would have been fine. But maybe like a different one. Maybe not. Yeah.

yeah tonight's meeting would have been a good introduction for that and and and also if you're not comfortable doing it then don't do it okay it's great that you're volunteering and you're a member but again it's just looking to kind of give people the opportunity and so forth so um noah emma any kind of take on that or i would oh sorry go ahead noah

Oh, please. I agree. I think it would be a great idea because I saw Amira run that meeting and she did great. And I'm not sure that I would have been able to pick it up quite as smoothly. So I think more experience would be great.

That's fabulous. Emma? Yeah, I mean, I would be interested in running a meeting. I think I personally would like to attend a few more meetings as a member before I do that.

That's okay. Okay. Now, do you get opportunities to present in front of commissions a lot, or is that not in your?

Yeah, I've presented in front of commissions, but I've also worked for boards and commissions before. Okay. I've seen it done. I've never been the person doing it, so I think I would like to do that. I'm totally different.

It is different. It is different. Just, you know, how many times do I make mistakes when I'm talking, right? How many times do I forget? I have the piece of paper in my hand. I'm an old fart now. The piece of paper in my hand, I forgot to read it. Okay. That's what staff is there so good at doing it because they have to pick up our pieces and do all the meeting minutes and things like that. So it's fine. You're never going to do anything perfectly. And we're here as a commission so we can all help each other and stuff. So Leah, how do you think, how does that sound?

That sounds great. I just think we need another motion for I mean, I don't I don't know if you staying as chair really needs a motion, but we could wrap it in if we're adding Travis as vice chair, just so we have a vote on the annual conversation.

OK, so that would be great. So do I do I have a motion for chair and vice chair?

I move to appoint Sandy or reappoint Sandy to chair of the commission and appoint Travis as vice chair of the commission.

Thank you very much.

Second.

Motion is second. We'll do a roll call vote. Amira, you're on the big screen, so you get to go first. Yes. Noah.

Yes.

Emma. Yes. Travis. Yes. And I'm also a yes. Emotion carries unanimously. So, and again, I am more than happy to share things around. I am very happy.

It's not fair.

Well, when we first did, when we first did remote in the first few meetings, oh my God, I think I spoke for two and a half, three hours. I was just, someone please help me. It was just like, cause everything, I think we've gotten, it's a little bit better now. It's not so, You know, it's not as intensive as it was during COVID and stuff. That was a little intense.

We've taken as many words as we can out of the sheet.

It's so funny. Every single time I read it, I go, they're missing another word. But I appreciate that and so forth. And then and again, we do things still remotely because this has to do. And just and again, I don't do not know what people's what their preference is. I'm pretty flexible. I don't mind going back in person, but it has to do with trying to, you know, be able to do not just in person, but I think me personally, my opinion is nice to have the remote. aspect of it, the virtual aspect of it, because it allows more people to attend. Not that we get a bunch more people attending, but it's available. And I believe it's still just a select board that has everything all set up for doing a hybrid, right?

They've been working on the room that we used to meet in. I don't know if it's officially done, and Jan and I would want to run some practice on it first. But if those things are in order, I can put together another... We did a doodle poll last time, so folks could give their thoughts anonymously. In case there's child care issues or whatever. I don't need to put anybody on the spot, but... We did one a little while ago and the votes came in that folks wanted to stay remote. So we have. But, you know, commissioners have changed and we can test that out again.

Yeah, it's, you know, and CPC sometimes does hybrid. It gets a little funky, but it does give people flexibility. I mean, I've called in from Florida to CPC before because I happen to be on vacation. So that having that both virtual and in-person is helpful. But again, it's people's personalities and what they want to do. There's certain advantages, I think, to both of them.

The meetings are going to be like what they've been the last, what, six months to a year. They're not bad, but Was it two years ago?

All those big projects, they were tough. They were tough. That was like, that was the, yeah. And I mean, UPS was the biggest project we ever had come in front of us. It's still probably the biggest project that's ever come in Grafton. I mean, that sucker, as soon as I saw it, I was like, wow, this is big. This is really big.

I found out on my site visit recently, the building itself is half a mile long.

Oh yeah, no, no, it's huge. And when I saw the, and I've done like campuses before and I'm like, and that's with like huge athletic buildings and all this kind of stuff. And I'm looking at this going like, holy cow, this is like not even close. This is like acres in 40 to 60 foot retaining walls. And, and it drops down 40, 50 feet to a wetlands and all this other stuff. So that was a pretty intensive things. Thankfully the application and the the contractor has been really good. So good for that. So, okay. So that's cool. Yeah. And again, The more people want to do, that's fine by me. I don't mind taking a sidestep and still be on the commission, but let someone else kind of run it when, you know, do it either rotating it or some point I, you know, someone can take my position. I'm not going to be on here forever. So that's,

We can, we can, um, Jan and I can start flagging, like maybe when we send out the quorum email, we can flag in it. If we think it's a nice short light one for someone to step up that evening, we can stick that in that email so people can give it some thought.

That would be great. I think it's just kind of great experience for everyone. So.

Okay.

Sounds good. Anyone have anything else to add?

Yeah, I have one thing. So I am going on my honeymoon in August. So I will be missing the two meetings that we have.

Hopefully you're going someplace far away and really good.

Yeah, we're going to Scotland and then we're going to Ireland.

Have you ever been before?

No, we're going to go for 11 weeks. So I'm a little nervous. I've not been away from home for that long.

Yeah. I've been to both. I've been to Ireland several times. Did two weeks in Scotland. You'll love it. Some of the nicest people, the most polite people in the world, the Scots are just nuts. Have fun. You know, just enjoy yourself. Yeah, that's great.

Thank you. Yeah, I'm looking forward because I really like how beautiful and green and lush everything is over there. So I'm really looking forward to that.

Yep. And everyone is super nice. Everyone's so damn polite. It's like, where am I? This is weird, you know? And they are truly, I mean, you go through Scotland and you go through the little villages and the roadways are 10 feet wide and everyone stops and pulls over and waves you through. So you stop and pull over and wave people through. Yeah, it's sickening as far as how polite everyone is, but it's lovely. You'll take a big decompression and stuff after that. Enjoy the beauty of it. Enjoy the people.

Thanks.

Sounds good.

Jan, I will come in tomorrow to get the sign.

Sure. Did you want one or three?

What time did you sign? I think three o'clock is probably going to be better.

Does anyone have to do the ethics thing? I just did mine. They changed it. Yeah, they changed it. Much easier this time. No questions.

Really? No questions?

You had to read through everything. Before, it used to be questions. It was so funny because you could not fail. I always try to fail because I thought it was really funny because it doesn't let you fail. It just lets you keep answering.

I was afraid that it would track the fact that I got things wrong and then later be like, This idiot.

You know what? Don't be because I always am more conservative than what the ethics laws are. I'm like, well, that you shouldn't do that. And it's like, no, you can do this. I'm like, that seems like a conflict. But that's my my perspective and so forth.

But it's not enough of a conflict.

Right. Oh, it's true. It's, it's, and again, it's all based on finance and who profits and who benefits. And there are times when you don't benefit. And I just think I've just been taught through my, where I worked was if it looks like one or smells like a conflict, it's a conflict. That's not what the law says. So, but that's fine. So, all right, Leah, anything else? Are we all taken care of for tonight?

All set.

Sounds good. Thank you, everyone. And we have one motion left.

Motion to adjourn.

Do I have a second?

Second.

Roll call vote. Travis.

Yes.

Emma. Yes. Amira.

Amira. I mean, yes.

Noah.

Yes.

Okay. And I'm a yes. Unanimous. We have closed the hearing.