Liquor Board Agendas/Minutes/Recordings - Regular Meeting

Yeah, okay. What I always have in front of me.

Good morning, everyone. Welcome to the Frederick County Liquor Board hearing this Monday, June 8th. And I will start by calling the meeting to order and asking Commissioner Glass to lead us in the pledge.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, One nation, under God, invincible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thank you. Thank you.

I'd like to have a motion to adopt the hearing minutes from May 11th, if I could.

Madam Chair, I move that the Board adopt the minutes from the May 11th hearing of the Frederick County Liquor Board.

Second.

Thank you. All those in favor?

Aye.

Aye. Aye. Unanimous 3-0. I would like to get consensus on moving the election of board chair to the beginning of the staff meeting, if that's acceptable. Okay, moved. New applications. Application 262549, decision on Elks Haven.

You can come on up to the- Oh, I'm sorry.

Obviously, I'm a minute late on everything this morning. Good morning.

Good morning.

I'll turn it over to Dawn to get sworn in by Ashley and everyone else.

You'll get sworn in as well. Yeah.

Everyone who's prepared to give testimony to the Board of Licensed Commissioners, please raise your right hand and respond with I will following the oath. In the matter of Elk Haven application, do you solemnly declare and affirm under the penalties of perjury. that the testimony you're about to give to the Board of Licensed Commissioners in the matter now pending will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. If so, State, I will follow by your name.

I will, Julian Wilson.

I will, Dawn Sugars.

I will, Flinton Erickson. Thank you.

What the board has for them today is an approval for a new application for the Elks Haven, a class B beer and wine license. The open items that we have is the business license, which I just understood from Ms. Sear here that your wife is on the way to get it at the courthouse right now. So business license will be checked off the list. They already are open and operating under promoter's permit right now. So the other things that we're looking for is zoning, occupancy, And the inspector's report, I'll get the inspector's report, and I'll come back to the zoning occupancy. So if you could, Inspector Harrison.

On May 20, 2026, I performed a new license inspection at Elks Haven, located at 340 East Patrick Street. During my inspection, I met with Bridget Hayden. The establishment is currently running special one-day licenses. The notice of a public hearing sign was posted on the front window of the establishment on May 20, 2026, in accordance with Section 20.1405. No re-inspection will be required before the license can be issued.

Thank you, Inspector Harrison. The zoning and the occupancy, did you guys reapply with the city to switch over the names? Has that occurred? What is the status of that?

We've been trying to get with the fire marshal, and we were trying to use the original plans that they had, and they said that they weren't. because they had like construction stuff on them. Okay. So we're still working on it.

Okay. And you're working with the city permits office at this juncture. Yes. How close do you think you are to resolving that matter and getting your occupancy under your name?

We sent in new schematics and we're just waiting to hear back from them.

When did you send in those schematics?

I think it was Friday.

So it was in the last week. Okay.

Yeah.

Just for timeframe purposes. Right now you have the promoter's permit through what date? Are you through this week or we stopped as of we're finished? Okay. Because conditional approval, that's what the board is going to ask these questions of when you think you might want to have this license activated or switched over if they approve it. And I just want to give kind of a timeframe of what that looks like.

So as soon as we get the, as soon as we get what we need, we'd like to open. Okay. I'm hoping to hear back from them today about whether or not the stuff we sent in works.

Okay. Yeah. The city is usually a little bit quicker on the uptake. So, okay. I'll turn it over to the board for questioning.

Don't wait on them. Call them.

Okay.

Commissioners. So how many employees do you plan on having?

Currently we have two full-time and one part-time. And we're looking for a maximum of maybe five full-time.

And out of that, how many are alcohol awareness trained?

Currently, the two full-time and the part-time are all alcohol.

And so getting to the timeline question, so is that like a worst case scenario, 30 days, 60 days?

A worst case scenario, 30 days.

And I know you've not held a license before. How, you know, running under the promoters, how... you know, have you seen anything, anything challenging, things that would be, you know, that you might need assistance from the staff with or anything? No.

It's been good.

Very good.

I do want to put on the record too for the board that this is the proposal that came in from Steinhardt and them because they are next door to each other that we presented to the board last month regarding their combined consumption area and that it was special approval for that. So this is this application.

Oh, that turned out great, by the way. Everyone's very much liked that.

Okay. That's kind of what I was getting at. Like, since you've been running under the promoter's house, everything working. Yeah.

Yeah. The cross, allowing customers to cross on our patio, everyone has very much enjoyed that.

I have no further questions. Sure, go ahead.

How...

I'm curious, how did it work? How does it work? What are you doing exactly to do the cross-pollination?

Oh, okay. So because we're, we essentially share one giant patio, Steinhardt has one person that regularly is going out to check and Elk Run has, or Elks Haven has someone regularly going out to check. And then it just allows customers to, if, the guy wants to grab a beer from Steinhardt and wants to grab a wine, then they can sit together at the same table.

Gotcha. I'm glad it worked out. And that's only because these spaces are congruent and right beside each other. Because I know there was a push at some point from the city of Frederick about just walking around everywhere on the creek, which... No, we're still at the limits of Steinhardt.

Yes.

You haven't had any issues with anything?

No. Good.

Okay. Um... Alright, no more questions. Are there any public comments on this case?

No public is in attendance virtually.

OK, thank you and no one in the audience. Alright, then we are back up here for further discussion or emotion.

Madam chair, I moved at the board grant conditional approval to. Elks Haven through July 15, 2026. 15. pending the approval of staff of all state, county, and local ordinances, laws, and regulations.

Okay. Second.

Thank you. I'm just going to add, I'm glad you did that because I keep forgetting stuff today. Make sure that you take the time to literally go through the entire regulation book and keep up with Dawn on rules and regulations and always err on the side of staff and asking. You're not going to be penalized if if you do that at all. But it's so important that everyone's trained and our whole purpose is to educate, not to violate. So we're just here for you. Just use us.

I appreciate that.

Thank you. They get a lot that regulation overview before they come before an application in the ABLE training. And again, that is an overview and they do ask a lot of good questions.

I just know that through your ABLE training and through your other courses, I'm astounded at the license holders that have been license holders for 30 years walking out of her classes and saying, I didn't know that. Or, wow, things have really changed. Well, they have changed.

There was one or two things in the ABLE training that I was like, oh, I did not know that.

Yeah. So it's constant. I mean, this group of commissioners right here, we have brought the liquor board into the 21st century. And I'm so proud of all of us that we're not constantly changing things, but we're changing. And most of our changes come from our license holders reaching out to us and saying, What about this? This isn't working. And that's how we get our information and where we go. So I'm not really directing this at you per se, but you're new. So welcome aboard. I'm very proud of you. Thank you. All right. All those in favor, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. 3-0. Best of luck. Welcome to us.

And she will do a summary email to you with everything that just happened and let you know what we're waiting on, what we're not waiting on. And we'll follow up with you on the zoning and occupancy. You are free to go or you're welcome to stay and listen.

All right. Our next application is 262561 True Standard Distilling.

Please join us up front. Good morning. Good morning.

Everyone who's prepared to give testimony to the Board of Licensed Commissioners, please raise your right hand and respond with I will following the oath. In the matter of true standard distilling application, do you solemnly declare and affirm under the penalty of perjury that the testimony you're about to give to the Board of Licensed Commissioners in the matter now pending will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. If so, state I will followed by your name.

I will, Ashley Allen.

I will, Brian Allen.

I will dawn sugars.

I will first person again.

The board has before them today is a new application for true standard distilling for a classic DDS liquor only permit they have been operating under a promoters permit for for quite some time now when we met with the state there were some things that that had to be adjusted and change for them to open their tap room full time and that's where we're headed with this application is they will now be a full time DDS for their alcohol only once this is converted over. The only thing we have open for them, because they already have all their other approvals, is the inspector's report, which I will have Inspector Smith go ahead and give.

20th of May, 2026, I, Christopher Smith, acting capacity of liquor inspector for the Frederick County Court, went to True Standards, still located at 10 North Carroll Street, Frederick County, licensed... Inspection was completed at the establishment.

The applicants are applying for a PLAS DDS license.

The establishment is already open and operating. No re-inspection will be required before the license can be issued. Notice a public hearing sign was posted in a window that allows the public to have full view of it in accordance with 20-1405.

Thank you, Inspector Smith. I also wanted to let the board know, it's noted there, they've never held a license, full-time license, but they have been on a promoter's license for quite some time. Very educated, very well in tune with a lot of things. They ask a lot of great questions, very much so, because they're very creative in the things that they do. So there's lots of questions that go around what they're permitted to do and not permitted to do under this DDS or the promoters. So I just will tell you they're just very in tune with education. Excellent. I'll turn that over to the board.

Okay. And I didn't do this last time and I should have done it. Please explain to us why we should approve and give you a license.

We have operated in downtown Frederick for about a year now on promoter's license. We are looking to serve the Frederick community a new experience that we don't believe was here before our establishment opened. We are an all in cocktail bar using our own product. We're bringing new experiences via pop up bars. If anybody saw the line at Christmas, it was a two hour wait to get in for about two months. And so we are looking to just bring a new experience to Frederick.

Don mentioned some of your innovative ideas. Can you share a few of those with us?

I think most of the innovation ideas, which I'm sure your entire team knows, we always come up with a creative idea and then we're like, Okay, how does this fit federally? Does it fit the state? Yes. Does it fit the county? Does it fit the city? And then my, okay, the county. Let's ask Don.

I just did what I suggested.

So it's literally the whole workflow of like, okay, well, it fits under federal, it fits under state. County, I think we can do it. Let's just, let's get the team's ideas. And so we've done anywhere from, we wanted to do bottle painting. Well, under a promoter's permit, you can't hold a bottle. of alcohol, but you can hold an empty bottle that's never held alcohol. So we got real creative. We let them paint a labeled bottle, and then they left. We took it back to our distillery side. Under the state permit, we were able to fill the bottles properly. And then we resealed them and had them come pick it up, which was great because they came twice and both doubled the cocktails. There you go.

We do. We think that we get, we try to think outside of the box and they are one of us that one of the, one of them that challenged us to go, Hmm, but it's great because we're not, we always try to find our way to a yes. If we can, if we cannot, we have spent weekends. We've been weeknights after hours, brainstorming like, How can this work by tomorrow?

And we've gotten ourselves into some pickles and we're like, do we have to cancel or can we figure this out? And so like when we first started, so our tasting room has one main entrance, one main exit, and then there's a stairwell with an exit. It's a fire escape. It's right at the front of the building. And so the first weekend we were open, we had someone sitting in the stairwell because that was the exit. Off-premise. That's off of the promoter's premise. Oh, okay. So that they could sell bottles. You could take a bottle from the stairwell. Yeah. So it was... They were just sitting there the entire four days trying to sell bottles as you exited in a stairwell.

It wasn't successful. It didn't work at all.

So then we bought stanchions. We realigned our permit and worked with Dawn to have like a little section by the front door to where anybody can buy a bottle. It's on their check. But when you pick it up, you go around the stanchions off the promoter's permit. Yes. And then out the front door. So we're looking in. It's actually the running joke at the distillery. It's like, okay, you're not going to believe this, but you can buy the bottle here if you're going to go around the ropes, pick it up, and then leave. That's a state thing. It drives us crazy.

It's a state thing. It's in the bottle service, which we don't have.

We've made it anything we can do to make it work. We're looking forward to having a DDS so that it's a little less... chaotic yeah yeah i'm a little bit more structured so but you're doing exactly what i had mentioned earlier is you're bringing new innovative ideas to us we like them or not that's a different story whether we like them or not we're bringing them to you as well so but it's we appreciate all the work that your whole from dawn all the way amazing it's been fantastic i'm sure we've been annoying and i apologize um but no thank y'all for all your questions educate us

So don't even learn from you.

Same can be said.

Wow. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I know the location. This is the one that's right by the post office, right? Oh, yes, I've been in there. So making sure 10 North Carroll where that's us. No, and I do. And I commend you because I have been in and I've observed like, you know, the carding that you were doing on your license and things. So. Just keep that up because you do have a very popular location for the youngers. And so you could also get those who try to test that because it is new happening. And that whole side of town is kind of the new kind of economic zone that they're trying to build there on Patrick Street. So just to kind of be vigilant.

Absolutely.

And I saw you have 10 employees are all 10 trained.

So we have 10, uh, I think seven full times. Okay. The seven full times are all trained. We have another two dozen bartenders. Okay. And, um, being under the promoter, we were a hundred percent compliant. I would say there's indeed. Please correct me if I'm wrong. We've got like four new people that the three of you are trained that we're within 30 days of having a hundred percent. Okay. Excellent.

So you're more than welcome to be. She's all right. Yeah.

she's our director of operations. And so I sometimes don't remember all the numbers.

Now moving from promoters to the DDS potentially, like any changes that you see staffing or otherwise or things that we should be aware of at the board?

No, we've already switched to our distillery being fully run with just our spirit. So That's already been done. So I don't think there's any changes. Will you be doing tours? So we do tours, but they're pre-scheduled. Okay. So you can get them online and then we...

have the tours that's new as of like last week can i ask is there issue with tours no no i was just are you doing the tastings at the tour so like which is permitted under under the state license touring the manufactured side they have their their tap room portion of it but they they're tasting they have different limits as well that does not fall under our tasting permit right because i i know like for example secrets i think is one of the ones who pioneered their tasting room with the doing the shots at the end that the liquor board has all participated in

Remember, that was the one mail-in conference I went to. But just, you know, seeing if you're going to be doing that as well, just making sure you know the differences between what you're doing on this side versus what you can do here, because there are some very distinct roles, making sure it's a little harder for you as DDS than I think some of the other class licenses that you've had. So just making sure, as Joan was mentioning, to do, you know, reading that book, making sure you know, because it's not just us coming in. The state's going to come in and do it.

inspection so you need to make sure you're compliant with both absolutely transitioned very very well they've actually had some planning time to transition to this um because of some of the state things that we asked questions on and the state said gave us a little hairy eyeball and then we're like oops let's uh rethink so you know because there's more than just us coming out for checks that's what we wanted to make sure that you you know just really stay in close contact and because all the federal state county

Yeah, you named them all. Yeah, I'm sure I'm missing somebody. I guarantee it's water. Everybody wants a pizza. I see wastewater more than anybody else. Every quarter. Sorry, my apologies.

No, no, but that there's a lot of interagency slash levels of government you have to deal with when you have a distillery.

So yeah, running your business is probably the least of it.

Yes, that's exactly right.

Um, Also, keep in mind, as Commissioner Burrell just mentioned, we have legislative hearings. We're coming up with something new and exciting, hopefully. I'm not going to announce it now, but it's going to be so cool. We just started talking Friday, so nobody knows yet.

I don't have a clue.

You don't.

We're going to talk about it in the staff meeting.

A few minutes. Keep in mind, we have our forums and our legislative hearings. That's when we need our licensees to give us some feedback, give the delegation some feedback. We can't fight your battles. You need to come and join us and fight battles.

We're going to do a little bit of a different setting because he did come to the last forum. But we're going to do a little bit of a different setting this year. where we're going to make it a little bit more relaxed atmosphere and have some other people in speaking, doing some other things, a little Q and a just a little bit less. It seems so formal, didn't it? And like, and then there weren't any delegation members there, but it's an election year. I have a feeling they'll show up this year. So that's the conversations that we'll have with you. We want to have it like an office, like at the Clarion or somewhere, and we're going to partner with a nonprofit. So it's very, it's very near and dear to us. And, and we're going to, we're going to go from there.

If you need a distillery to have cocktails for the... That may not be a good thing.

Running an event at the Clarion, I can tell you, you can do, under the agricultural rules, you can do tastings at events and conferences that you guys should be marketing, especially to the hotels, because you don't have to use their venue stuff. You can actually bring in under your ag rules.

I planned on picking your brain on something.

And so keep in good touch with Kevin Attucks, too, the Secretary of Ag. He, of course, came from that world. So he definitely is going to be looking to make things easier. So keep in touch with his office as well.

Yeah, that's great advice. Okay, so we are, I'm totally lost at this point. Do we have any public comment on this case? No, we do not. Okay, then we are back up here for a motion, discussion, whatever. Your pleasure. Madam Chair, I moved at the board.

grant approval for true standard distilling effect of today. Okay. Second. For DDS, I should say what it's for.

Yes. Okay. For today and the second is Commissioner Glass. All those in favor, any other discussion? Raise your hand for aye. Aye. 3-0. Welcome aboard full time. Thank you so much.

We'll send an email out with like all the summary of what happened and then we'll touch base with you and pick Picking up the license will be later this afternoon because however long we're in here, it'll be this afternoon. We'll be in touch.

It's printed by y'all to display.

Yes.

Full time. Okay, we're not printing this one.

What's the gold star for?

Oh, he noticed it.

I always notice. I'll explain that.

Okay. Well, he has a star on that we made him put on today. He took our able training because he's so they're innovative questioning and the way they come outside of the box. He always has something that comes up in like wherever we meet or talk. It's something that's like. I'm going to have to check with this. I can't just answer right away because normally I'm used to being like, all right, Brian, hold on. We've got to do some research. And then Chris is listening to the ABLE training. He immediately goes into action, starts researching what minors can and cannot do for bottling. And it's just very innovative questions. I said, you get a gold star for all the innovation. So he's got a gold star. Yes. Thank you.

Have a great day. Thank you so much. You bet. only good stuff okay yeah just in case all right it's amazing how loose things are when we don't have violations in front of you okay our next case is oh Application for 262577, Sunset in Maine. Please join us up front here.

How are you?

When I came out, I was walking in. That's one of my slogans, guys.

Screening. No sip in the sauce means you're for learning things right?

Remember, actually, this one who's prepared to give testimony to the Board of Licensed Commissioners. Please raise your right hand and respond with. I will follow move in the matter of sunset and main application. Do you suddenly declare and affirm under the penalties of perjury that the testimony about to give to the Board of Licensed Commissioners in the matter now pending will be the truth. The whole truth and nothing but the truth. If so, state I will followed by your name.

Well.

Well, don't triggers. Oh, I am the person. I was the inspector. Got it. I'm like, which one? What the board has before them today is a request for an approval of a new application and a very similar situation to what you just heard with True Standard. They've held our promoters for a good while. They understand all the regulations. They're already operating. Under the promoters, it is just simply we're transitioning now to a full-time license. The inspector report, which is in the folder here, Ms. Candy, somewhere that I gave you before I went to. Thank you, ma'am. Keeps me straight. All right. I was the inspector. So on May 18th, 2026, I, Dawn Sugars, acting in the capacity of a liquor board inspector for the Frederick County Liquor Board, Went to 6th West Main Street, New Market, Maryland. I met with the hopeful applicant, Dana, on site. This application is for a new Class B beer, wine, and liquor alcohol license, switching from a promoter's. The establishment was preparing for the weekend, opening under a promoter's permit until they could be heard at the hearing today. There will need to be a re-inspection as there were some open items that we wanted to button up to ensure that everything is in place to meet the threshold of this license. The open items discussed with Ms. Briggs is securing the outside area. I'll have her talk about that, adding signage to the exits of no alcohol beyond this point, and ensuring that the 28 seats are inside. A notice of public hearing was posted out on the front porch that allows the public to view in accordance with 20-1405. Again, nothing, she's not held a license besides the promoters. We've had no issues there. I'm going to turn it back over to the board. But again, remember, very similar to what you just heard with True Standard.

Okay. One quick question. Have you reached out to, you're more residential than the last application. Have you reached out to your neighbors?

Well, we have the firehouse on one side and then the alleyway on the other. So lots of communication with the firehouse. And then the woman who has the marketing business on the other side, is rarely available for any chatting. She gets in her car, zooms out, comes back, runs in the house. So I've knocked on the door a couple of times. We've had some packages left on their porch. And with zero luck. Across the street are other businesses, a florist, the derby right there, all of that. So nothing really. I'm going to try it again. And most everybody else has already been in. That's been wonderful. Commissioner Burrell. So how many employees do you have at the location? We have 14, including the two of us. Seven of us are certified.

And did you know we have the 50% requirement? Yes. We encourage trying to get as many trains as possible. Absolutely. How many are all are all seven in the service of alcohol? Like what's the ratio between out of the 14?

So seven of us are certified because they're 18 and older. The rest are part time under 18. Can't be certified.

At least 50%.

Yeah.

Okay. Shift. Gotcha. Usually. I'm always there. Yeah. Okay.

He said the trigger word, per shift. Per shift. Thank you.

And out of the outstanding items, I know Dawn had mentioned, so securing the outside area, the signage, and the seats. So what is the status?

Seats is in, and we're scheduled with our contractor for Thursday to close off that gate. Yes. She said it wasn't absolutely necessary, but it's a thing.

It's a control mechanism. Yeah. For me. We have cameras everywhere, so we've talked about that. Yeah.

Gotcha. I guess on that, like the difference between, you know, same kind of question from before. You were working under a promoter's license. What are the changes that you see moving from promoters if you would get the Class B?

Well, our original promoters was for special events inside the truck. Since we've opened the brick and mortar, we've been using it inside the kitchen. So for us, that's been the biggest difference, getting everything done. organized the way we want it and all of that. The most important thing for me as a mom with young kids, when I, when our daughter was born wineries and brewery and distilleries and breweries were really just starting to pop off. And I thought to myself, gosh, it would be so nice if there was actually a place that was fenced in so that your kids are safe when you're there. And so that's what we've built and, And so transitioning from the promoters to the full license and being able to do that and helping the parents keep their kids in a safe environment was the most important thing. I don't know if I answered your question, but really it's just the difference from going from a sitting truck like Lake Linganore concert events to having the brick and mortar.

Got you. So just because I have not been out to the site, so is this like a bricks and mortar with a big Like I was looking at the schematics yard, figure it out. So is it like a big yard? It's a big yard.

It's like played with games, big connect for sand pits, fire pits. There's none of that. That's not a fire pit up at the top. It's got this table now. Gotcha. So lots of yard games, picnic tables. And that's why we were, cause it's an old Victorian house. So getting the 28 seats was, but I said, it's a must in order to have that liquor portion. It's part of the state law. To have where people could have the seats inside as well. Which is fun, by the way.

Which is something legislatively we could talk about to our delegation as the 28-seat item. Well, because you don't consider the outside seats.

Right. Or at bars and counters. Or that.

Yeah. So it's a battle we've been fighting for years. So how many seats do you have, like, right now? Inside?

28. We walked this thing and squeezed every seat we could.

That was approved by the fire marshal also. Yes, it is.

Anybody living upstairs? No. So just empty bedrooms or use it for storage?

Storage and an office.

She has a picture of it up here.

Cause I'm like, I go, I know where the Derby is. So I was just trying to envision. It's kind of diagonal from it.

Okay.

Oh, gotcha. Okay. You're on a corner.

Okay. Parking just, I mean, it's not really in our purview. I know the parking gets challenging with the Derby.

Both of you have the events. Yeah. So there's 30 spots at town hall, but town hall is moving. They're putting in a huge public parking area. there and then the lot behind us is the firehouse but there are no no parking signs so they've been allowing for the town visitors to park out there okay and a lot of people park at the school they do but right now it you really can't because all of the sports activities are going on all day long so but otherwise it's you know there's been plenty and there's going to be more which is really exciting because the town's just getting more and more walkable with all of our new things popping up.

Well, it is, and that's what makes, I know, one of the other things we do look at, supposedly, is the safety feature, and that does make it challenging, especially if someone's parking across the street. There's no crosswalks, really. Except the town just redid crosswalks within the last...

Mm-hmm.

In three weeks. Okay, because I haven't been out there in the last three weeks. Okay, yeah, because that was a challenge. Like, I was looking at some of the things, even with the Derby, people were, like, playing chicken with cars, getting into their place.

That was actually one of our things, because the schools are right there.

Mm-hmm.

And you guys need a crosswalk right there. Because, honestly, the Derby, they don't really love their middle school traffic after school. And we're all about having the middle school. So I was like, please, let's repaint this, make it bright. Get your crossing guard out there so everybody's safe and then they can cross and have no problems.

Get them right to the house.

You're always pointing this way.

And you are, you know, kind of across the street from the mayor. We're exactly across the street from the mayor. So he's watching you. Yeah. Okay. Anything else? Any public comment? No. Okay. And we are back up here. Do you want to add anything else? I forgot to ask you to justify why we should do this.

Go for it. I think you kind of started when you said like the adaptation from going from the truck. I mean, for four years, we've served our neighborhood of Lake Linganore and surrounding areas and the pools and the schools and high school, middle school dances and stuff. It's been great getting to know these kids. And the the joy of the adaptation is getting out of that truck. Like not just being in the confines of a two hour window where I'm a food truck, but like having people over to the house. And because it is a house by nature, I mean, you know, it's the structure itself was the house and putting that business there feels like we're having, you know, the neighborhood friends over the moms, the dads, it's been awesome seeing what we envisioned happen with, you know, parents being able to sit for a minute, have drink or have dinner. And their kids are running around playing basketball, playing ping pong, playing cornhole, being knuckleheads, running around the backyard. And the parents actually have a minute and you see them talking like without, you know, no, stop interrupting or without plugging the kid into an iPad at Applebee's while they're trying to wrap up, you know, a good conversation. That's been that's been the joy. And and it's been everything we've wanted. which I know like in this day and age of strip malls and they build all these things and it's like $1,100 for a strip mall square and it's only got four seats. You know, no kid can really hang out there and enjoy it. When the school gets out and the middle schoolers come over with eight wrinkled dollars and they want an ice cream or some candy. And it's cool to be able to tell them, yeah, you're welcome here. I built that for you. You go out there and hang out.

And bring your mom and dad because they'll have a good time here too.

And being able to expand into a more broader menu with a few more adult options to kind of just extend the experience to the moms and dads so they can be happy and maybe have a little liquid patience. Time to time.

Patience.

To put it, you know, to us, it's it's just been a joy. And we just look forward to doing this for years and creating something not just for us, but I mean, for the city, for the you know, for everybody that lives in.

We both worked corporate. And the reality is now we're just working for smiles.

This is not something necessary to share. Just in general, what's your menu like?

For alcohol or for food? For food. We have pizza. We have tater tots, charcuterie boards. Keep me going here.

Yeah, we're going to roll with chicken tenders and things. We wanted to see how workflow opened. So we started with just limited with the chicken and the tots. I mean, with the pizza and the tots and the charcuterie boards.

They tell me the pizza's great and I can't eat it because I have celiac.

But we'll do some chicken tenders and just kind of kid-centric roller rink concession vibe. I mean, I'm not going for a Zagat review for food, but I want to keep it so that the kids... No, the McIntyre likes her tots. Yeah, you know, we can put it any number of ways.

So I know this is totally digressing, but... If you get a really good chicken tender, like Houston's and Badron's have, that's really light and like very tender inside that are, you know, good. I will tell you, Houston's had people come from hours away for their chicken tenders and they, and they closed the one, they've only got one left down in Montgomery County, but it is just something that, you know, you mentioned chicken tenders. If you put some effort into it, I can tell you that that will be a driving factor for some people. And people go all the way to Canes and Carroll County just to eat their chicken. So it's amazing if you advertise it well. So not friendly tip, sorry. Okay.

We are back up here for motion.

I have one more question. There were two green lighted things here. The name change waiting for a new copy. That's done.

Sales and use. So you did get it updated because they were at sunset and dessert shop and something, something, something. So they had to update the name. So we're good.

So if I'm not missing anything, then they're good to go out of conditional, right? Okay. I'm sure I'm prepared to make a motion. Yes, ma'am. So I move that the board grant approval for sunset in Maine effective today. Second.

All right. Any further discussion? Seeing none. All those in favor, please signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Aye. All right. 3-0. Good luck. Welcome aboard. Never hesitate to call our staff. Well, not always.

It's amazing. And we'll send you an email with all the summary of what happened today. And later this afternoon, we're going to talk about picking up the license.

So we're event, event, end of school. So we're over here this afternoon. Which is fine.

Take your minute and we'll chat.

Thank you. Thank you guys so much.

Have a good day. Those chairs are so hard.

back to my agenda.

It must be the last application. Transfer application at 262566. Fog on? Fog on. Latino Restaurant. Timothy, please join us up front.

Everyone who's prepared to give testimony to the Board of Licensed Commissioners, please raise your right hand and respond with I will following the oath. In the matter of Fogel and Latino restaurant transfer application, do you solemnly declare and affirm under the penalties of perjury that the testimony you're about to give to the Board of Licensed Commissioners in the matter now pending will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? If so, state I will followed by your name.

I will. Timothy James Hill.

I will. Dawn Sugars.

I will. Christopher Smith.

Thank you.

Board has before them as a request for an approval of a transfer application from El Catrachito, and I might be saying that wrong. I don't know. Did I say it right? Okay. On Route 40, they are going to be changing the name to Fog-On Latino Restaurant Class B Beer, Wine, and Liquor. Timothy is new to the process, so you see some of these open items, completed application, which, again, it's more of a landlord thing. He's assuming the lease. Sometimes they're not as always easy to deal with, so that's why the lease indeed is still open. The alcohol awareness, we're working on getting people trained and up to date because of the e-tips that we discovered. And he, again, inherited some of this stuff. So we're working through some of those things, his workers comp, bulk transfer. The contract to sale finalized. The things in blue, we just need finalized. We've got some drafts, but we need to finalize those. Zoning and occupancy. I just want to ask the question here to Ms. Sear. Are we still at the same juncture that the permits department? Where are you at with that?

I've started the application, but I have an obstacle. It's a landlord as well. Yes. But he's back. I believe he's back now. Okay. Swing there this afternoon. Okay. But I need. Approval from him. I need signatures from him.

Yes. That's holding up a lot of these little pieces, which I know you were out of the country for a little while as well. So I know getting back on top of that's going to be really important. There's a tax hold as well.

I'll talk to Jose about that.

Okay. But there are some open items here. So we're going to need to do the time management here. I'm going to have to give you a little bit of time to get this done if the board approves this transfer. And you guys, fully settling. Remember, we talked about that. We had it set for today that you guys were going to fully transition. We may want to extend that. They're under a management agreement as well with the old owner to the new owner. Jose is very involved, the old owner or the old partial owner. So I think that that management agreement will stay in play for a little bit because I have a feeling we're going to take a little bit to tick these boxes.

So conditionally, we'll be proceeding.

I'm going to tell you, I'm going to say 90 days, but it doesn't mean you have to wait 90 days. I would like the board to give you as much time as possible because we do have a six-month period where we can do the management agreement, but 90 days at a minimum because of all the little, it's the landlord being able to tick those boxes. Gotcha. Yeah.

And I believe it could be done in under 30 years. Right.

It doesn't mean you have to wait. That way we don't have to come back before the board. It gives you the most time for any hiccups, but you can always get it earlier if they approve it. Okay. Just so you understand why the length of time doesn't mean you have to wait.

We put the authority in her hands at that point so that she can do it without bringing it to us. Yes. So share with us what you're doing, why we should give you a license, all that good stuff.

So I'll be taking over El Catachito, and it's a Salvadoran-Honduran restaurant, and I think it's a lot of immigrants from El Salvador and Honduras have moved here into Frederick, and I would like to show the community here the culture of El Salvador and Honduras.

Okay. So you're bringing that to our community, the diversity. Yes. Okay. Commissioner Burrell?

So this is the location there off of McHale. um yes the corner yes i see the internet that's why i was like checking to see um and i noticed there's a stage area and i'm assuming you're going to have entertainment and things in there as well okay and i noticed because i didn't know that the current was the current one open till 2 a.m at the same hour okay i just didn't i was not aware me on fridays friday and saturday correct um And then I noticed you talked about the alcohol service a little bit in the, you mentioned earlier about the e-tips. So how many of your staff are, how many staff do you have, first of all? 15. 15?

We have, I believe it's around six or seven, but we're always 50% for shift. And then my e-tips will be Tuesday. I believe the class is.

You coming to see me at the Orioles Nest on Wednesday? Yep.

I'm going to see if I can bring a couple more people as well.

Okay. Just strongly encourage to have as many that are serving alcohol trained. Because it's not just us doing compliance. You get other compliance checks, but we want to make sure that you're... Yes, ma'am.

I'd like to try to get 100% just to be safe.

Gotcha. And then I noticed there's a... Granted, there's a lot of outstanding items. What is the worst-case scenario timeline like? everything goes wrong and can't get things done. Like what?

I really think no more than 60 days, but if we have 90, I would say 90, I guess.

Okay. I'd like to have 90. Okay. Just in general, again, you can always get it earlier. That's the beauty of it is, but just in case, the landlord or Jose, like something doesn't quite go as planned and that we can focus on making sure we get all these things taken care of. Also, I got to, I'm sorry, Chris, I forgot to do the inspector's report. Candy gave me a little point over here. I'll let the inspector give his report as well.

at the Hogan Latino Restaurant located at 1315 West Patrick Street, Frederick, Maryland. An inspection was completed at the establishment. The application is a transfer application. The establishment is already open and operating. There will not need to be a re-inspection. There's nothing operationally that's changing. The notice of public hearing sign was posted in the window that allows the public to have full view of it in accordance with 20-1405. Thank you.

I also want to talk about, too, Timothy, we talked about this, too, when we met because we met with him roundtable with Jose, that this location has had challenges before with after hours, things occurring, some things with alcohol service. And these are things that we worked through with the previous owner. And Timothy is very well aware of those. He's heard the ABLE training and what's expected. So just want to make sure when he transitions this, that he wants to make sure that he cleans up because the employees are transitioning over so that the old habits do not carry over.

Good, good. I personally used to have a restaurant along 40 and it's tough. And I lived there actually for many years. It's going to be a challenge for you. I'm sad to say it's gotten worse, but we're going to lean on you to keep it all within the parameters of the law. So don't hesitate to reach out to us if you're having trouble. Don't hesitate to reach out to the police if you're having trouble. We don't want anything to start on the wrong foot.

Yes, ma'am. Okay. And I do have both of their contacts and we can, they've came before, like I think, early in the morning or something, right? Two in the morning or something.

Because a lot of your folks do walk to your location. So it's not, even if they're not inside, they could be on the property. So I know I've seen some things there. That's why just making sure, just, I know it's a lot of enforcement on you. It makes it a little harder being a licensee than in some of the other areas of the county. So.

And if it gets rowdy and you need to close early, just call them and let them know you're closing early because of such and such. And they'll support you.

Okay. Also, there's security there, too, which I feel very confident with the security that's there. They're armed.

Yeah.

Usually. So, but it's definitely something that I would like him to just awareness of. He hasn't done anything wrong. He hasn't, you know, you know what I mean? But knowing what he's coming into and understanding, you know, things that he wants to keep under control and make sure he has good management in there because he may not be there all the time. But we've had these conversations very openly.

No, and we're not judging at all. We're just, it's all precautionary. That's all. Okay. Lessons learned, so to speak, so that we can have best success.

Because at the end of the day, We hold the licensee accountable from the board. I know that servers and other things, if they're serving, they can get cited, but also we bring the licensee in. So there's a lot of responsibility on you. And even though it's the same location and you're probably going to have a lot of the same patrons, they don't necessarily know the rules have changed. And so it's going to be a little bit, at least at first, on you to be the onus to make sure your customers know this is not the same operation. Exactly.

And they do have ZBA approval within the city limits. I just wanted to check my ZBA list. So he does have approval for entertainment as well.

The entertainment, you mentioned Friday and Saturday, but you've got listed Thursday as well, and you're open until midnight. Are you planning on doing entertainment on a Thursday night?

Not necessarily entertainment, like karaoke, but nothing. I don't believe we didn't need approval for like a karaoke night, right?

No, you're fine. They're approved Thursday through Saturday with the ZBA.

Yeah, my caution is on a Thursday night till midnight. I mean, it's the neighborhood. Do you have neighbors?

I mean, people use Route 40, right? That does old Fredericktown Mall corner.

Yeah, so he doesn't have, it's not directly adjacent, no.

Okay, so you don't have folks in your shot. Okay, I retract it because that can cause real things.

So now there's lots of hangout space, unfortunately, at the mall.

Yeah, I mean, it's the same issue, the warehouse cinemas, others all have the similar areas in that area.

So okay, any further questions, commissioners? Any public comment, Ashley? No. Right, then we are back up here for further discussion or a motion. Madam Chair, I'm prepared to make a motion.

that the board can't grant conditional approval through September 30, 2026 for a Class B Fogan Latino restaurant pending the approval from the staff of all state, county, local ordinances, laws, and regulations. Second.

Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor, please signify by saying aye. Aye. Welcome aboard. Best of luck. We didn't mean to scare you with all the precautions, but better

Better, you know, yes, he's very well aware.

OK, thank you very much.

I want to send you an email with a summary and all that stuff later this afternoon. OK, thank you.

Now I will ask very quickly, because I know the answer. Any general comments from anyone? No, there isn't. All right, thank you. We will move directly into our staff meeting. And I will quickly say, I'll begin the staff meeting by saying that I was reappointed and that will hold the board elections till the last item on the staff meeting. And then I will turn it over to Dawn.

All right, staff meeting.

Actually, I want to turn it over to Ashley for a final update of the last two pending items that we had for renewals. I'm going to go ahead and turn that over to you for all the extensions that you guys have provided.

So we had the special renewal hearing with three applicants. One of the applicants did actually get their license, I think, that afternoon or the next day. And that was a CK to CK. Then we had the 20 day extension for Lorenzio's and poor decisions. Lorenzo is here on the 20th day with and we got the tax release for that license to be issued. And then poor decisions had made a determination to close Memorial Day weekend as they did not think they were going to get it. But they actually got it two days later on May 22nd. So they got their license, already gave their employees off for the holiday, and then they reopened the Wednesday following Memorial Day as as normal. OK, thank you, Ashley.

You're welcome. Thank you. We met out on site last Thursday with the Mexican rodeo crew just to make some adjustments and changes to where the beer garden is located. We decided that the egress and the flow of things were not conducive to the environment that lands them on the track with the egress. So we decided to go out, meet with them. Alex drove from New York five hours, got there late. So I said, We ain't waiting on you. So we met with Israel, who is the other licensee, who is actually the promoter anyway. He's the one who runs the Pro Max. And we met with them, gave them our expectations, which were very detailed. Okay. We are going to be on site only at the setup. They've already done a preliminary setup and felt you guys chime in anytime because they were with me on site that we want one primary entry and exit from here on out. Instead of trying to crowd people, we want lines formed. We want signage. We want color-coded wristbands that are effective. We're going to see if this works. And we told them, this is your opportunity, again, to prove that you can make this work. They're always right there on the cusp of making it work. It's just such a large event that we don't... We don't deal with this every day, all day. All of our other events or one day events are not this large. We don't typically have this large of an event. When you get that much, that many people gathered, each band, each type, each personality type, each event could be different. So sometimes it goes okay. And then other times it goes off the rails with the younger crowd. So we have expectations. We met with security out there and we've laid out. We have the fire marshal involved. We even have the health department. Finally, people are going to show up other agencies besides us on Sunday. We will still be there, but we won't stay there the entire day. We're going to go look at the setup, make sure our licensed area is covered. We're going to step off for a little bit, but we're coming back. Will you come back as a whole or will you come back individually? I'm not going to tell them that. No, that's what I'm hoping.

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

You're just going to pop in and out on your schedule. To see how they're doing. Gotcha. To see how they're doing. So we cut off the alcohol at 7.30, hard stop. I told them do not ask a question to extend it. 7.30 is it. Their band plays until 8, I think they said. Doesn't matter. 7.30, we're keeping the alcohol under control at 7.30. are off limits. And if at any time the board had already given us authority the last hearing, that if there is a situation that does not meet any one of these thresholds, any one of them, that they can say alcohol sales cease, your event can go on. And if the fire marshal wants to deal with egress and overcrowding, that's on them. They want to deal with the parking lot, we don't license the parking lot, that's on them. We're pulling strictly into just what's in our lane. We're just going to zero in on it and go from there. But that'll be this Sunday. We'll be out in effect there. Because I do think our presence is still needed there, but we're not going to spend the entire day there.

Well, you were offering, our staff was offering the security and the oversight for their event when they should have been doing it. Yep.

So we're hopeful. We're hopeful to come back with a good report next month. Or if you need an updated report after, but we're hopeful.

Do you have faith that this might work?

I think usually after you have a rough event, the following one usually goes pretty well, but then you back up. That's usually how it goes.

It does seem that way. Yes. So we anticipate this next one will be a little like right in line. Okay.

So we're massaging it. I mean, I am so proud of the way you've tried over and over again to educate. Any continued pushback from other agencies at all?

We just tell them, that's your issue, not ours. We want to deal with Patrick Street. Traffic is not our issue. But they all talked about it while we were there to say, hey, we want to keep traffic flowing. We want to do this. They want to do certain things. And I basically had to tell them, your traffic crew that you hired are lame. Bottom line. But you got to deal with that. That's not us. That's the city of Frederick and you.

It took me 15, 20. That's not our lane. 20 minutes just to get down past the fairgrounds and the traffic.

When they have some of their larger events. So the flow of it is just not. But they'll have to deal with that.

Yeah, even for the fair, I never had that kind of trouble. Okay, next one.

Chain store update. They did surrender their license. They ended up. Gecko did surrender after all the conversations of chain store, what we would be questioning, what we would be asking. They still had every right to come before the board to present their case because ultimately it's a board decision. Jen and I had conversation regarding, you know, let them just bring their whatever they may want to do. They decided to totally back out of it and surrender their license.

Do you mind if I clarify that just a little bit? I know you and I had an issue. I know that it doesn't really matter at this point, but just so you understand some of the context, when the establishment was sold, there would have been, the new owner would have been qualified to apply regardless, even if it was considered a chain store, there is a provision in state law that would have enabled them to apply for a transfer. And essentially it'd be a grandfather type situation. The issue that they were running up against was a timing issue because renewals were due and they really needed to effectuate that transfer before the renewal period expired because otherwise their license would expire. And then they would be in a situation where they would need to reapply. And if that were the case, they would no longer have the ability to transfer and be grandfathered in. They would have to apply as a brand new licensee. And the analysis would have to take place at that point as to whether or not they were a chain store. So it was just kind of a tricky situation from the timing perspective. But it sounds like if they do come back at some point, then it will be as a new licensee and there will be. Right.

And just to touch a little bit more on the timing, that's why we launch early. We have been talking to them even before renewals or January 15th. So we're talking timing, but they just let it go, let it go. They just couldn't figure it all out and get it all put together by the time renewals came through. And they had over six months, over six months.

So we felt comfortable. The biggest issue for them, as I understand it, with the transfer was not Really, whether or not they were a chain, that was kind of a red herring, but it was that they were not getting. Could not get to people. Could not get the threshold together. Yeah. Mid-transportation. Yes. So just a little update on that.

And that's the one that's there at 40 by Red Horse, right? Yes.

Yes. Yes. We did have a breakthrough this past month, thanks to Commissioner Burrell. The comptroller's office will be in attendance in our mail calls now. And July, I think, is going to be their first one. They attended last month, and it was very eye-opening. There were conversations that occurred with people, and it just helped us connect the dots, connect with people, connect with, hey, this is our challenges. And they got to hear from other locations. That particular call, we normally have a good handful of counties that are on that particular one, it was us Montgomery. I don't even know if there was, it was one of the rarest ones where we have the least amount. And I'm like, of course. So of course, when we had those conversations, Benny's like, it's understandable, you know, but they're going to come back in July and they're going to try to attend. They they're on the invitation list now for one representative from their office to attend now. And especially right before renewals to be able to hear from each County. So it was huge. It was huge. It was a huge breakthrough. Thank you. Huge breakthrough.

You also, just to close the loop on that, I know Mayla has a conference.

They haven't had one for years.

Well, if you do, it would be, I think, important to invite the comptroller to speak so once she then also sees it. But she did take immediate action when we said, and I nicely reminded her that all hearings are publicly recorded and the comptroller's name is getting flown up the flagpole because of the, just the problems in the office. So I'm glad she took immediate action.

So, yeah, I mean, and it was, and the conversations were, it was good for us to see their side of it as well. The employees themselves, their challenges with even their own stuff, their own systems, their own challenges. It was nice to hear the human interaction instead of trying to get through and getting hung up on. And, It was nice to have that. And they said they sent out a letter in December to all the tax holds.

Yes. We weren't aware of. Right. She's like, we learned new things. Brooke was telling me, she goes, we sent out a letter to all the tax holds in December that this is coming and they need to start working with us. And we had no idea. Yes.

So it worked out too well. We did have a few phone calls when they received the letter. We did, but we didn't know what it was. We didn't know, but it was nice to put all those pieces. And then when we had people that were having challenging situations, they were actually calling them. We didn't know that. Oh, amazing. They did make the effort to call them.

Now, Debbie, very much thanks for connecting all those dots there.

It was fortuitous that Brooke gave me a call, and I took the opportunity while she was on the phone with me. That was excellent.

Before we get into the board chair stuff, I just want to quickly review with you our violation monthly report. You can see it's a little bit more extensive. It's got a few months on there. You'll see infusions are a hot item, not purchasing from retailers, a hot item. We did hold two conferences with poor decisions. We had found some empty alcohol bottles in their manager's office that they had confiscated from someone, but they needed to tell us the story on it before we obviously bringing any charges forward. We did also have Bellas' sports bar come in for a conference. They were very upset about the infusion law or law regulation, whatever it is. And they actually took it to Ken Kerr on the delegation because they were so upset about the outcome of our conference because we told her she could not mix her coffee and her Kahlua and set it in her walk-in for two weeks. It's not permitted. They consider that rectifying. They try to explain all these things to a licensee. They still went to Ken Kerr. Ken Kerr, thankfully, came back to us and said, hey, explain this law to me. Explain what we need to do. Explain how we could change this if we can. May not be able to. So those conferences were held. And I'm still not sure that they're not settled with that part of it over at Bellis' but she'll have to take that up with Ken. And if they want a delegation issue to be brought up, They'll have to bring that up. And I welcome all of these people to always come before the board. If you've got a question or you want to challenge something because they wanted to challenge their warning, you can bring these things before the board. If you're not happy with our answer, there are always avenues to have these discussions. So I just want to make sure that that's out there and that they know they can have. The buck doesn't stop with us in the office, that they can continue past that, which clearly then she went straight to delegation, which is fine. She has every right to challenge and question why the state is doing the five-day rule. So if we hear any more about it, we'll keep you updated. But it's a little bit more extensive this time with no AAs and infusions and tampering the bottles. We are finding the bottles out there. So just keeping the board aware that we do have some things going on out in the field. We're trying to finalize our next round of short inspections, which short means checking the licensing, your AA, popping in, seeing how you're doing, things like that. And then they'll go back into full swing, full inspections in the fall. But compliance checks are also going to start back up as well. We're getting ready to start those back up. So keeping you updated on the inspections. And last month, Mr. So you might have brought it up, Commissioner Burrell, on our net meeting. What is our net meeting? We meet with the local city. networking. It's the nighttime economy task force. And it's the city police, the city permits, the city NAC groups, things like that. The Banyan was brought up. This is a common knowledge, the Banyan and Lima soul. We were looking at what the ZBA, the zoning board of appeals, because there are complaints coming in on the music and the, how loud it is in the neighborhood already. With that being said, we had educated them on getting ZBA approval. You guys had asked it at the hearing, and they did not get it. They were scheduled for the June 23rd hearing with the city to get approval, Lima, Seoul, and Banyan. And Banyan decided to, at this juncture, we've heard that they've canceled. because they want to try to mitigate the sound themselves first before they go to the ZBA hearing to try to get late night music approval. Our understanding is the rooftop was to be acoustic only, no loud DJ, no loud music, no loud, but now we're hearing differently. So this is just awareness for the board. You've questioned it. You've asked questions. We took what you said, listened, shared, got information. And it, it, We're watching it. It's on the radar for city police. City police have, they were going to charge them with a noise ordinance charge because it was over 67 decibels from 100 feet. And why were? Were because there was a conversation that the officer believed that they were ZBA approved in a business district and they are not. So NET flushed that out. So we're working through it. We're working through it.

Thankfully, Debbie brought that, what she found out out. I've gotten a couple side comments about the behavior and the loudness.

Okay. And there's only so many things we can do within our purview. We have to involve, thankfully we have this task force where we have partners and these partners, the new police chief, um, this, the, uh, The captains, we've built relationships with them specifically over a lot of our late night walkarounds. They were with us. They were boots on the ground with us. So we actually have those relationships building, continuing to build after Kirk Hanaberry retired. And we really are connecting the dots with them and keeping everyone informed. So to make sure that if we do have to mitigate something, does it affect the alcohol license or does it affect just it's really an ordinance for the city? Yeah. That's nice that you guess. So those things are happening. Just want to bring the board up to date that there are conversations. There are conversations with them so that you're up to date on that. Some other exciting news. And again, this wasn't really on our radar, but I wanted to share it because it just unfolded after we posted the agenda that we're very excited about. I met with a. young man who runs a nonprofit called Safe Ride. He's been around for a long time. Wayne Dorsey's been around for about 10 years. And he does a lot of the nonprofit drinking and driving where he has a unique setup where he's like an Uber and he brings drivers to you to drive your car home. So you don't have to get in the Uber and leave your car. He brings drivers here and he does a lot with the downtown community, but he will go to county. So it's all over Frederick. It's not just You know, but he gets a lot of downtown business through Alive at Five, things like that. So he came in and said, you know, how could we get some touch points with the liquor board? How could we expand a little bit more? And we started brainstorming. Our brain started lighting up and we're like, you know, Carroll County does a seminar where they invite the retailers in and they talk about legislation. They talk about what's passed and they're getting ready to have it in a week. And some of our folks are attending it. They invite us as well, local liquor boards. And they have delegation members. They have all kinds of people there. And then they have vendors there, you know, drinking and driving, like other vendors that would affect alcohol. Like a conference. Isn't that Ben Furr who started that? Yes. He was a city police officer. Yes. Working for Roscoe. So we did like the setup of it. We thought we've always wanted to do something like that because our form has dropped off. Our form attendance has dropped off. And I feel like things we talked about last month where we have challenges with certain things in the delegation. What has caused it to drop off? There's just no interest. Right. So we thought, hmm, this year's an election year. Hmm. This year is something that we could partner with a nonprofit. We could have, you know, SureScan come in with scanners. We could have Marty come in and again, very short. And then we can have a Q&A instead of calling it like the forum where it seems so at Winchester Hall, it's so formal, more relaxed, like a Q&A with staff, a Q&A with board. And that's what they do at Carroll County. It's a very relaxed. You bring in your local law enforcement and you have like a morning seminar. And I say seminar. Ashley actually came up with Raising the Bar 2026. And we just talk about a few things and we allow people to express themselves. True standard in a different setting. But we hopefully have the ears of others that we can maybe improve the attendance of our forum, because I really feel like it's dropped off. More delegation members we have, the less we see them. Well, we have 15 now. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. We thought about a complimentary continental breakfast. We're looking at budget things, which I'll share with you here in a minute. Wayne and I were talking about, or his Wilhelm, his person, like a free BAC meter. People love those things. And then we talked about with our board chair, like what we could afford out of our budget to maybe give them if you attend. $50 off your renewal if you attend, a $50 credit. Because those are not fees that are in law. Those are fees that are our administrative fees. So you would get like a license filing, not a license fee reduction, but if you attend, you would get a $50 credit towards your renewal. So kind of something to draw them in and like, I'm going to get that $50 credit, you know?

We did look at the budget superficially and it's covered.

I mean, we're still self-sustaining at that point. it's free for them to attend it we would have an early fall um we want to talk to you guys about some dates that might because i know fall for you you guys get a little you know school starting back up uh as far as the colleges and then then you're you have like some kind of my conference is in september this year uh week of the it's the 16 17 18 is that the why you think no no this is uh

This is the smart proc that we run. We just had to move it to September this year because of going into a continuing resolution. This fall, they won't be able to attend, so they need to do it during the fiscal year.

So we wanted to make it more educational, networking, things like that, as part of the forum to try to partner with this SafeRide and some other partners. We thought about distributors. We thought about inviting all the challenges that people are having with getting things from distributors. So we've definitely got our brain going on how to have the forum, but enhance it. I can see Jen over there. Are you thinking like any, you thinking of something that could be conflicting or?

Not offhand.

No, just something.

It's new. It's a continuing conversation that we should have.

Okay. Okay. And obviously, you know, if legal counsel wants to be there, but it's really our alcohol forum, but enhanced a little bit to get our retailers there. And this is something that other counties, Garrett just did their first one, like it, because they like what Carroll County does. When's Carroll County's? Next Wednesday, the 17th.

Oh, shoot. Okay. Because I was going to say I'd like to attend.

That's their legislative forum? That's their forum where they just invite their retailers in and Jeff Kelly comes to speak. Tom Akers comes to speak. Yeah, so it's really an informative forum. No one's making decisions. It's really to listen to concerns of their retailers and to tell them what new laws have passed in their county or to go over statewide legislation that affects alcohol as well. So they come and share, the sheriff shares that's very active with their board is there, shares some things that they're thinking about in regulations. So it's really just a sharing educational networking type of event. But I felt like it's an opportunity for us to also then try to get the delegation members there to listen to some of the concerns. We don't have a lot of concerns. I don't anticipate us being there for four hours. We would set it for like 8.30, be done before 12. You know what I mean? It wouldn't be this lengthy type of thing, but to kind of partnering with Wayne to come in and Marty and Mark and other people that could speak on different things. And that's what the other agencies do as well. So I felt like it was an exciting thing. where we could definitely expand our form where it's not so, you know, just informal, I should say, and try to get people there because our attendance has dropped way off. Now, another reason it's dropped way off, we don't have a lot of issues. We deal with issues before they get here. We try to mitigate as much as we can what's permissible within our purview. We've come a long way. We've come a long way. There's not a lot of complaints here. because they're now dealing with people... What did one person say that came to your training? Just the trust. The trust has been rebuilt that they do know they have the opportunity and that if they're not happy with... what I've said, or an inspector has said, that they have these chains that they could go through. They have the opportunity to present themselves before the board. There is no blockade, per se, to say, like, don't take that to the board. Like, we'll settle it at this level. You know, there's always this open invitation to share, right? Because we're being transparent.

Which is so great, especially with our long-term license holders, because They're getting a whole different perspective. Eyes are getting opened again.

We really don't have a lot of issues.

Debbie probably knows this, but Ken Kerr is now the chairman of the Alcohol Committee on ECM. So that's a feather in our hat, too.

He did let me know that. And he is more level-headed. He is. We talk a lot. Yes. He did say to me, he goes, we really missed working with you this year. There was no interaction, like nothing. And I said, yeah. Yeah. Just if I do not have to bring it before the delegation. Avoid it. And he said, you know, we don't want that. We want the connection. I said, well, you know, then we need to have something that would be a little bit more inviting. That would be a little bit more that we can feel like that we're being heard or that the delegation is also able to articulate that through the committees as well. So just trying to make it a little bit more inviting to transparent.

Yes. Yes. So that was several. We're very happy to hear that anything we present will go to all of them now. Yeah, no, that's good. Yeah. I understand there was a choke point.

Yes. Yes. So with that being said, I don't have any staff, anything else that I missed that we didn't bring up now.

I do need to bring up something as looking at the schedule. October 12th, I will be out of country. Okay.

As long as we have a quorum, and Jen will say that as well, I'm sure. I just want to make sure, Chris, you're here on the 12th? Yeah. Okay. On the 12th of October. We're good. Right, Jen? Yes.

Okay.

All right.

So Debbie is out for the October 12th hearing. All right. It stays on that day. Yes. That will be seven hours, I guess, ahead of you all.

Oh, goodness. No bathroom conferences. Anything special?

Yeah, we're doing a European trip. For you. So, Budapest, Germany, Italy.

So, with that being said, if we did want to do a fall date, I know September and October, is that not an ideal? Vacation month, isn't it? What is a better month? You don't get one anymore? Oh, no. What is a better time frame? What is a better, is a Monday better? Like, what works well for you guys?

Mondays are what's in my plan.

Yeah.

So Mondays were good for me for the new form type keeps me out of DC.

Okay. Cause I was looking at Monday, September 28th. Does that look like it's doable? Like kind of throw it out there, put it on the calendar, let you guys check. And again, it would be a morning session. It would be like a hearing. We do have a hearing on the 14th, but the 28th, I was going to try to plan it for either September 28th or potentially, I would say October 19th or 26th.

So I'll still be out of the country on the 19th. Okay.

So it works back to 26. So either September 28th or October 26th, what works for you guys? If you want to, I mean, obviously you're welcome to attend.

I will tell you, I will be out the 26th, but if, if that's the October, that's the date that works the best for everybody.

You're talking about for the conference forum, whatever. Yes. Okay. So how does that affect our,

Normal hearing? It doesn't. It doesn't. Okay. Our normal hearing is October 12th and September 14th. Oh, no.

I'm thinking we're having a meeting because I have a standing meeting.

Whatever Monday works best for you guys. Do we want September?

Probably September 28th is the best. Okay. I'm good with that. I do.

But there's your quorum right there. Okay, so I'll check September.

Which we wouldn't be voting on anything. It would be conversational. We would record it if there's something we need you to know. You know what I mean?

Just to distinguish between the two, if this is purely a listening session, a quorum isn't necessary for the transaction of business. But if a quorum will be present, then it needs to be an open meeting and advertised in accordance with the... Which it would be advertised. Right.

That's the distinction. Yes. Okay. I thought those same things. So, okay. So we'll shoot for the 28th. And then if there's any conflicts, we can deal with those as they come. Okay. And that was my only other exciting news about trying to change that alcohol quorum to to bring in more licensee participation and more delegation participation. So other than that, board chair.

I have one question. Sure. Go back to the, just for my education, the monthly violation report, you know, so white rabbit infusion, five days, no contest letter, a hundred dollar fine, you know, and then training. The cellar door infusions past five days, reusing alcohol bottles, tampering. So that was a no contest letter of 500. The difference between White Rabbit and cellar door is because they had multiple violations. And so you gave them the $500. Yes. Okay.

Yes. I just wanted to make sure. It's an escalated charge for cellar door because they got caught more than once. They got twice. Okay.

And was it the third one you bring them before the board?

Okay. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Thanks. I just wanted to make sure I was sectioning it.

And we can make those notes on there too for the future. Like second, you can see that it's escalated.

I figured all the others weren't. They, you know, it's their first ones, but I just wanted to make sure I was tracking. Thank you. You're welcome. See, I do read them.

Of course you do. Even though you're advancing in age.

Very much so. Ready to retire. 40 years. I'm ready. It's just astounding to me. I'm pretty now, actually.

OK, so nominations for chair. Anybody?

I mean, are you you're you're back on the board, you got your.

Yeah.

So is that something you would like? Yes and no.

I don't. I have no like. Eat your humble pie. You were good. It is a yes.

I would say yes.

Thank you, Chris. I guess I got my back. So far, we have another follow up and finish up the regulations and all that. So, yes, for next year.

Don, I nominate you.

I'll second.

All in favor?

Aye. Aye. Aye. To vote. No, I don't.

I'm kidding.

So Madam Chair maintains her seat. Yes, because we are getting ready to start to jump into our rules of procedure, our chair training. Well, actually, our board training book for a new board member as they come on board, what we would like to do in the future. So we do have some new initiatives that we're working on. I laid them all out to her. One last share that I before we close out is we did touch on budget. We did deposit. You wanted me to share and I just remembered it. into the general fund over $627,000. What? Deposited into the general fund from our agency. 627,000, that's a rough number, $627,000 we deposit back into. Our total budget for the year is about 619 to fund everything if we use all the money. We do not use all of our money and we're tracking right now at about 430. So we leave money on the table every year. We give a budget update and we let you guys know that basically we're handling the budget responsibly.

On the table?

Right now, I have about $188,000 on the table that we do not spend. Doesn't benefit us. About $188,000. I got to look at June's report. It'll go down a little bit because we were approved for a 6% increase, three merit, three COLA. So that'll affect some of the numbers as well.

When will that go into effect?

July 1st, but we won't see it until July 23rd paycheck. July 23rd paycheck, I think. Was that this budget or the next budget? That's what I'm wondering when it's going to hit. Number-wise, it may be the next one. But we leave... We are self-sustaining, and we want to continue to be self-sustaining. Yeah. Self-sustaining agencies.

I guess the only reason why I bring that up is, so are we still leaving money on the table, you know, without, like, giving raises? Isn't there room there to go beyond the COLA?

We don't have any control over.

Mm-hmm.

It's your county HR does that. We had that long battle through it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

These two have been through it with me. Yeah, no, I remember.

Yeah, yeah. The COLA and the merit increase does not increase the board's salary, just so you know.

No.

Yeah, it's irrelevant there, but I'm talking about you all. So we do manage. We are fiscally responsible, very responsible. We're not the typical government agency. And sometimes at the end of the year, we're kind of like, oh, we'll spend 50% of this. You know what I mean? Because I come from the private sector of watching dollars. Well, go ahead and get this. You know, it's very... more of that we are self-sustaining. We are, we do pay back to the, which I felt like Jessica was very, when I showed her our deposits and then Dan confirmed them, her person that worked in the treasury, that yes, these are deposits. She's like, these are deposits that actually go into the general fund. And she was just shocked because it's not recorded to the public anywhere. It's not recorded to the public anywhere that we're self-sustaining. We look like we could possibly cost the county money. So all our deposits are not recorded publicly on the budget line.

And Jessica hadn't even been aware of it.

Yeah. So we do keep our own sheet. Government entity in the black.

Amazing. Yes. And Jan knew it. I'm sure Jan knew that we were giving back. So we needed to deal with it.

And I know the challenges that the board has faced before, again, you guys, before the previous person. Trust was a really important thing. Budget, different things that weren't kept in line. This is really just to notify you that we are keeping it in line very much so. And I keep her up to date a lot on the budget stuff.

So did anyone, I hope, get raises beyond a COLA?

It would be countywide. The countywide county employees this year are getting a 3% COLA and a 3% merit. Okay. For all six.

Yes. Okay. Even though we're a state organization. Right.

I know where you are, right?

Yeah. Worst thing, your county. Kinda.

Yeah.

Hybrid. Call ourselves hybrid. Or state board that's paid by the county you serve in. Exactly.

Right, right, right. Yeah. And I know that irksome, which delights me, so. Sorry. Sorry, Jen. That slipped out. I'm saying things publicly, but that's why I didn't make Admiral either, so.

For the record, you are meeting with the fire marshals to talk about liability possibly this week on the Mexican Radio. So if that overflows to anything that we need to be aware of as far as liability, I figure you'll let us know.

Yeah, and I was actually going to ask you if you could just send me your sheet that you put together just for context.

And then I can share some of the, well, they'll share their fire marshal stuff with you too because there was some egress concerns. Okay.

Oh, thanks, Jen.

That's perfect timing. And when we do that, I mean, they reached out. Yeah, to her. And they said, oh, Jen, Kiefer's going to meet with us. I'm like, oh. When do you plan to do the boardroom? It's the fairgrounds. It's Mexican. They want to know what their liability is.

We're actually working on it right now.

I'm sorry.

The board trading and things. Because there are some points I would like to bring up of concerns I've heard from county officials around board members, use of social media, things like that is not in keeping with that. So I just want to make sure that we're at the forum to share that back.

I know that I received, you actually sent me a pamphlet about the PIA request. Um, I have reached out to Miranda Ducey, who is, I guess she's housed in the executive's office, but she has been brought on board within the last couple of years to oversee boards and commissions. Yes. And they have worked on creating standardized trainings for all of the- They didn't include us. Commission, well, so- I reached out to her to ask the director's meeting, but that's, you know, if that because there are certain aspects of training to serve on this board as a public body that really should be. that should be, should be trained consistently. Yes. County. Yes. Um, and then there are some that will be, you know, service, um, knowledge, how to, how to have off the meeting. Yeah. OMA that's rules, all of those things. Um, so I have reached out to her on my end. Okay.

Okay.

Once I received Ashley's email to see about getting that, um, aspect of, of training, um,

taken care of and then there there will certainly be substantive knowledge that needs to be put into a binder that's specific excuse me since we're building that yeah yeah and that will be they asked me like what training i had you know and it was like i was really bizarre questioning and then they're like like you know they mentioned about what is the board's policy on social media use i'm like i don't have social media i don't know from the county leadership and state leadership From the delegation.

Okay. But not the ethics commission or something?

No.

Okay.

No. But they just asked what trainings we got. So I guess they're looking at something. That's why they asked.

We want to develop something a little bit more formal that we can say the board member's been through this training.

Does the county have that through the ethics commission, which is where it should be coming from? Well, you guys do state ethics.

We do state ethics.

Oh, yeah. We do state. I'm talking about the county.

Yeah. There is... There is board and Commission training as as far as it being standardized across county boards and commissions it it's been kind of I guess rolled out over the last couple of years so it's it's fairly new. And I am guessing that because maybe because the Liquor Board is considered a state agency, it hasn't been. And we're considered an independent agency from the county.

And there's only three of us, elections, us, and social services.

Does the county do any, you know, ethics training at all apart from, I mean, I brought this up. I believe they do. Eight years ago on the ethics commission, the county's going to get sued because there was absolutely zero training on even the sexual harassment. I was shocked. I even brought it in. I even brought professional trainers in. This is what the county needs to do. Even the Ethics Commission just didn't listen. And I was sitting with a whole bunch of lawyers, with all due respect, a whole bunch of lawyers sitting with me too. It's like they're all from the Ethics Commission. I'm sitting there, guys, gals, aren't you paying attention to this? I don't think the county ever did anything.

They might be doing something because I know they're asking questions. They are asking a lot of questions. And I said, well, when I started the board, Kathy sat me down with a binder and went through everything. I said, that was my training. And I said, I can't tell you on the social media side because I don't have it. So outside of LinkedIn. And you can go check my LinkedIn if you got it. I wouldn't know. So, yeah, you don't know. But I just, anyway, so they asked all these questions. And I'm like, I don't know. You need to call Dawn. So if you get a call, that's where it came from. Who should I point them to? Like, do I point them to you?

Because I mean, we are building for a training and we would do something like this. Once we get it all together, we would sit down administratively together and go through like your quasi, I carry that thing with me everywhere. I carry your, you know, the quasi judicial, what we do, but this would be more in tune with the actual members and what's expected of them.

So there may, I mean, I am of the opinion that this board should be included in in the county board and commission training. And my understanding is that would cover how to conduct a meeting, Public Information Act, Open Meetings Act, parliamentary procedure, Robert's Rules of Order. I don't know whether that training covers, and that's sort of like every public body has to deal with those issues. If you're a quasi-judicial body, then there's kind of another threshold that needs to um of education that you need to have and we end up in education i don't know whether that would be a board i'm not sure whether the the board and commission trainings go into that at all because not every board and commission is quasi-traditional which we could take that self-love you could still at least get the standard i don't we can still you know put together a training and then um of course there's going to be substantive um knowledge that is completely unique to liquor board, like our regulation state law.

alcoholic beverage article yes and this is something that we've been talking about for a while but until we knew if she was reappointed or not what are we going to expand this book and really actually sit down with a new board member when they come in here's the required trainings and here's what we want you to do to come into the office maybe once a month and we'll go through the alcoholic beverage article and what that looks like and those we want to go a little deeper on internal processes so this is something that we're building on

And moving to change so so I do know the open meetings public meeting laws are all just are all in the state and you have to test before you can go through. You have to answer the questions correctly.

So yeah, I just redid mine, so I don't know. We don't really have a social media. We do. County has a social media policy, but I don't know if that and we don't have a presence for that same reason. It is just too volatile. It causes too many issues. We don't answer. I mean, my name gets tagged a million times. I do not reply. I do not respond. I do not. It just gets messy. So we adhere to our own policy and say no answers, no Facebook postings about anything that has to do with any licensees. We definitely hold a strong line on it of not answering anything on social media.

And Debbie, please, if anybody hits you with a question, share it with Dawn. Yeah. And who asked you?

With that. I'm up.

We look for Chris. Unless anybody else has anything else.

I make a motion we adjourn.

All right. All those in favor, aye.

I should make that just permanent, right? All of the policy that I close it out between.