Board of Adjustment - Regular Meeting

Faites juste vos engagements et... Et chaque fois que je regarde le pouce, je m'en souviens. Oui, c'est l'une des raisons pour lesquelles j'aime m'asseoir dans cette zone. D'assez. En fait, c'est une grande raison pour laquelle j'aime m'asseoir dans cette... Cellule et les conseils. C'est très bien. Attrapez le coucher de soleil sur le... Profitez-en. C'est agréable d'avoir la porte ouverte. Le train arrive. Jusqu'à ce que le train arrive. Intéressant.

J'aimerais qu'il... Ce document initial, de six pages, il incluait toutes les références à notre code. So about 30 pages.

Oh my God. Well, it's interesting. Not Barry, but I...

Yes.

No, there was a moment when I stopped reading. I came to check and check again to see what was wrong with what... You know, during the public audience, but consider what is presented at that time. It was not really related to the council file. You looked at it, everything appeared. They said that the code is still... Have you had the opportunity to look at the evolution?

I haven't.

For me, it's very complex. It talks about the conditions, but they are buried in all this legal jargon. Is it for the urbanism commission or the council of recourses? It's the urbanism commission. You really know.

I think I'm sorry. I would like to open the meeting of the advisory council

From July 29, 2026, at 6.37 p.m. I would like to start with the nominal penalty, starting with the staff followed by the commissioners.

Jake, third urbanist.

Directeur municipal. Ce soir, Mac B, secrétaire de mairie Juste Calme.

Andy Miller. Bob Ganesi.

De Roco.

Oui, conseil de Roco. Je voulais poser une question. Donc, est-ce que j'en fais partie? Vous êtes, d'accord, vous êtes Brian Serven.

Katie Sols. Margaret Toss.

Hum. Nous avons un ordre du jour pour ce soir. Puis-je avoir une motion pour approuver l'ordre du jour de ce soir?

Je propose d'approuver l'ordre du jour.

Appuyez. Quelqu'un pour appuyer.

Appuyez.

Uh, other discussions before voting on the motion? I'm still confused. You have opened the council, but let's approve the order of the day of the urbanism commission or... No, I'm sorry. We approve the order of the day for the council.

Bob, before making other motions, I think you have to name Brian as a voting member for tonight because we don't have the five voting members present. Very well.

Brian, I would like to appoint you as a voting member tonight for the questions raised by the Council of Reconciliation. All right. Very good. Any other discussion before we move on to the vote on this motion? If not, who is for? Someone is against. Very good. The motion on the order of the day is adopted. All right. Do we have any points to discuss? Well, I would now like a motion to approve the order of the day granted, which includes the verbal trial of Réunion on March 24, 2026. I make the motion. Supported. Any other comments? If not, who is for? Anyone against? The order of the day granted is approved, as well as the verbal trial. I think you forgot the comments from the pub. Non, c'est juste ici. A compris. Ensuite, nous allons passer aux commentaires du public. Si quelqu'un souhaite prendre la parole ce soir lors de la partie réservée aux commentaires du public, veuillez lever la main et venir au pupitre. Pour ceux qui sont en ligne, levez la main électroniquement et nous vous donnerons la parole. Lorsque vous serez invité à parler, veuillez indiquer votre nom. Et si vous habitez dans la ville de Frazier, vous disposerez de trois minutes pour vous exprimer, pour vous exprimer. Sur les sujets ne figurant pas à l'ordre du jour. Très bien. Nous avons une audience publique ce soir concernant la pétition de Frazier Vart pour une dérogation aux exigences de stationnement hors rue du Code municipal de Frazier. Je souhaiterai donc une motion pour ouvrir l'audience publique.

Je fais la motion. Appuyez.

Qui est pour ? Quelqu'un est contre. The public hearing is open. Very good. We therefore examine the petition of Frazier Vallée-Arts for a derogation of the requirements for out-of-city parking of the municipal code of Frazier. And now. Le Conseil de conciliation va se pencher sur l'audience publique concernant la pétition à De Frazier, Valais Arts pour une dérogation aux exigences de stationnement hors rue du chapitre 19 du Code municipal. De Frazier, The Frazier. Nous avons donc déjà ouvert la séance publique. Cette affaire est une procédure quasi judiciaire. La décision du Conseil doit être fondée uniquement sur les preuves admises au dossier. The testimonies presented during this hearing as well as the actual provisions of the municipal code of Frazier and the Colorado law. Council members must refrain from taking into account information obtained outside of this hearing. Before proceeding, I would like to ask if a member of the council has had expert communications regarding this case or if he has a conflict of interest to declare. Not having any, the verbal trial must also reflect that the opinion of this public audience has been published and sent in accordance with the municipal code of Frazier and the law applicable to Colorado. The file written in this case consists of the following documents. A request for interrogation dated July 1, 2026. The justifiable memory of the city dated July 23, 2026. A public publication opinion of July 15, 2026 and a provisional ordinance project dated July 29, 2026. Are there any objections concerning the file of the audience? None. The applicant is present today and represented by Steve Fitzgerald and the city is represented by Jack Seard, the municipal urban planner. Lors de la présentation des parties, chaque partie disposera d'un temps égal pour exposer sa position. Le Conseil pourra poser des questions à la partie qui représente ou qui présente pendant et après l'exposé. Le requérant a la charge de la preuve et aura le droit de faire une réfutation après la présentation des preuves. Following the presentation of the parties, the public will be invited to make comments. The file contains no correspondence from the public expressing a position on the subject to date. This being said, I would like to give the floor to M. Fitzgerald for his presentation.

I didn't know there was a formal presentation, so I'm going to do it with... But it's very good because I can tell you that this petition is the result of a collaboration with the city and a deep reflection work between Jack and other people in this room who have, I think, shared Our point of view on the challenge that represents the realization of our common goal, namely to build the Fraser Center for the Creative Arts on the site that was offered to us by the city, which we are grateful for. Because what happened a few years ago, with a proposal submitted to vote for those of you who were not there, there was a proposal to add a field via a land exchange that would have been adjacent to the center, which would have constituted the parking space that we need according to the code to, you know, conform to the regulations. Unfortunately, this proposal was rejected in the ballot boxes about a hundred times. And so today we are faced with a dilemma. We have a plan that is part of the city's global plan to install an art center that would be an economic attraction center for this area. We estimate its economic impact at about 2 million dollars per year. And we have no place to welcome people for the events. There is literally not enough space. I'm going to take a break for a second while we close the door. L'emprise au sol de l'espace, en elle-même, va nécessiter un bâtiment de trois étages. Aujourd'hui, dans notre conception, ce premier étage est presque exclusivement dédié au stationnement, ce qui coûte cher et est très loin du nombre de places exigées par le code EKI. Alors, ce sur quoi nous avons réfléchi avec l'aide de Jack et d'autres, c'est ce que nous pouvons faire pour atteindre l'objectif que nous partageons tous, tout en accueillant les visiteurs qui viennent au centre. Nous pensons que nous allons faire cela en quelques étapes. The first step is this one. We would like to start our design work. And for that, we must be, in a way, free from this requirement. Because if we always have to plan for 50 places in a space that cannot accommodate them, we cannot design buildings. Instead, what Jack proposed, which you saw summarized in his file, with which we agree that there is an intermediate step between now and the moment, where we will come to see you to build the center, which will probably happen next year.

We will find a provisional solution for our events, which means that we would need about 50 seats.

50 seats that would be nearby or on a shuttle itinerary usable during a concert, a play or a comedy show. And you would then have the opportunity to approve or refuse this plan. We could not go ahead if you refused it. We would need your approval. And this provisional solution would be in force until Frasier, Valais Arts and the city reach an agreement on the permanent solution for the Riverwalk neighborhood. These two things could coincide, you know, because even if we start work next year, it will still take 18 months to build the building. So we have time. The general idea is therefore, on the one hand, that we ask for the authorization to design a building that does not have 50 seats on the ground that we currently have, because it cannot welcome them. And secondly, any subsequent step will be subject to your future approval before we can start the work and start this building. Instead, we would have the design. It's a bit complicated. The first step out of two or three in total. Allow me to take a break at this point to see if I have confused everyone or if you understand the request.

So, the request for derogation is a temporary derogation, or is it a permanent derogation?

I corrected my words if I'm wrong, Jack. From what I understand, it's a permanent derogation, because we simply don't have the space on this site, nor now, nor in the future, for as much space. What would be conditional in the future is our solution for the events where we have need additional parking spaces. It could be a close location where people could walk to the center or a place requiring a shuttle, which would then need to be organized.

But would you have this later opportunity to approve it?

J'essaie juste de comprendre d'un point de vue juridique. Si nous nous accordons une dérogation stipulant que ces places ne sont pas requises et qu'ensuite ils soumettent un plan sans prévoir ces places supplémentaires. Si nous avons déjà approuvé les dérogations, ils ne sont pas obligés de les avoir. What is it that allows us to force them to provide these additional places?

That's a good question. Mr. President, Jack Stuart, municipal urban planner for the verbal trial. The way in which the arrest you are examining this evening is structured is that, before this arrest, the derogation becomes definitive. They must come back, the applicant must come back to you with a parking management plan.

You have to approve this management plan and it is only at this point that the suspension of derogation becomes the final decision of the council and enters into force.

This is therefore the first step to allow the applicant to proceed with the design work and to start the dialogue with the stakeholders of the city in order to determine what the management plans of the parking lot will look like in the medium and long term. They will provide a medium-term plan that you can then examine to approve or reject it. It would be your choice whether it is short or medium term. And then they commit, according to the terms of this plan, to participate in a broader discussion on parking in the downtown area and more broadly on parking in the city. And at that time, they would participate in any parking project. Que la ville déciderait, finalement, de mettre en œuvre.

What is the outcome of tonight's derogation? This simply allows them to design the project. Could they not design it without derogation at this stage? Why are we doing it now?

They do not want, and it is understandable, to start design work as long as they do not know the number of parking spaces necessary on this property. The code imposes 50 and we cannot make it hold 50 on this land. This would allow them to continue the design work and reduce the number of parking spaces according to what is proposed in the request. But it will depend on the fact that they come back with a plan indicating where these parking spaces will be located instead, because we don't just want to say you can reduce your parking to six places on this site without knowing where the rest will be.

So it's a two-step process.

This is the first step of the delegation, which leaves them a year to come back to you or ask for an extension with the final project.

Margaret, if I may add, we have just launched an offer for architectural design work. It took us five years to gather the necessary resources to get there.

The design and engineering of this building will cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

and it will probably take six to eight months in total so that we are ready to build next year if we continue our fundraising. If I have to do it twice, I'm wasting literally hundreds of thousands of dollars given to donors for this cause. That's why it's crucial for us not to have to do it twice.

So, concerning the derogation, do we condition this derogation to the fact that it provides the necessary places elsewhere?

It's a conditional derogation.

A conditional derogation.

It would authorize the provision of an out-of-site parking according to the code, but not on site, and would ask them to come back to you for the final approval of the out-of-site parking. Or if it is several out-of-site parking, you would always have the last word on the management plan of these other parking spaces and the rest of the parking lot. It is therefore a conditional derogation.

What happens if they don't do it?

The provisional order that we ask you to adopt tonight will expire in 12 months, unless you choose to extend it. And so if they don't do it, the arrest would expire and we would return to the situation in which we are currently.

Let's say we extend it by 12 additional months.

They finish the building.

Nous ne leur permettrions pas de commencer la construction tant que ce plan de gestion du stationnement est. C'est une question. Nous n'avons aucune intention d'essayer de tenter cela.

Nous ne pouvons pas résoudre le problème de stationnement. Nous ne pouvons pas gérer un centre d'art.

L'une des conditions est que le plan de gestion du stationnement doit être approuvé avant qu'ils puissent demander un permis de construire.

D'accord, cela répond à cette question.

So, the only thing... I'm sorry, was there anything else? Ok, great. So I can make sure this is clear. I understand that it's a bit complicated. We are eager to see a solution for this area which includes parking. But I think it is also a matter of transport and public transport to be part of it. We have no interest, I have several of our donors and major support here tonight, who will take care of me on this subject. We have no interest in trying to get involved in this way without a solution for the entire Riverwalk area, because it will be essential as this area develops. We understand that. We want to be part of it. We are committed to working with you. Jack and Sarah, are you at this end during this intermediate period? We are very optimistic, having had preliminary conversations with some of our neighbors in the Riverwalk area about the fact that they will put space at our disposal. And you know, part of it depends on their own project for the terrain, but we think it is feasible. And finally, we could even consider buying adjacent land and turning it into a parking area. But these are things we need time to investigate. There is a real opportunity for us to start this project seriously in the spring of next year. And we would like to be able to continue the design work, which will allow us to do Don't get it wrong, but it's me here. We are trying to build an art center. You can't build an art center on this property with 50 parking spaces. It's too small.

Thanks. What area of land would you really need if it was just to go buy a 50 parking space? What size is that?

Correct me if I'm wrong, Jacques, but it seems to me that it is about the same size as the land on which we are, which is 436 acres. If you do it really well. But I will also be careful about the fact that doing it only for the center does not solve the problem of the neighborhood. No, I know. I was just curious. And don't forget that there will be a lot of parking space in the street on Clayton Court, which is part of the calculation to which we must conform. And one of the advantages of the art center is that most of the events will take place in the evening. So a large part of the commercial circulation of the day will have disappeared and some of these places will therefore be available. I don't know if you saw it in the report prepared by Jack, but I would like to draw your attention to it. The idea is to have six places on the site, of which two would always be reserved for disabled people, but the evening events, the six would be used at this end. So just a little complement. The last thing I would add is that, as members of our community are well aware of the challenges of this sector and this site, we have a little more than half a million dollars of donor engagement that depends on the resolution of this parking problem. This would not only be very beneficial for us from a logistical point of view for our design work, but it would also have a financial impact for Fraser Valley Arts and the advancement of this cause. We hope to end this year with well over 4 million dollars collected for this effort. Do you have any other questions that I can answer? I will then pass the floor to Jack to read the report he wrote, which was also great.

So Steve, I know that we have seen your models of new plans. So, two floors and roadside programs without parking outside of some outdoor locations.

You want to talk about the conceptual design that is there? For this conceptual design, if you remember, the first floor is actually shown almost exclusively for parking. We did it at the time because we didn't want to put the municipal council in a situation where people would ask why you are designing a building without parking. We knew that one day or the other we would get to this evening. So in fact, the current project is on three floors. Once again, this is only conceptual. Devon and DAO Architecture have done this work for us, and they are also one of our main support for REM. We will rethink the entire building if it succeeds, because we will not need all this space for parking. And you know, some of the other things we learned during this intermediate period So it would be a totally new concept. We will put in place periods of public comments and we will present them to you all so that you can express yourself at the appropriate time. Any other questions for Steve?

Thank you Steve.

Do you still consider three floors or would you go to two? I don't know yet. You know what's interesting with three floors? Just for a moment, we worked in close collaboration with Kevin and Greg, who built the Vilstrow houses next door on the roof lines, to be able, if we use it, to make it a place of events, not shows, but weddings, and so on, which will help pay the bills. And the view is magnificent because you can see all the way from the water sharing line, the pass and the barriers in the background. If we did it on two floors, we would lose a good part of it.

So it's something we'll have to study.

But in no case will it be higher than the Stroh building.

Avant de passer la parole à Jack, je voulais attirer votre attention sur deux documents dans votre dossier que vous auriez dû consulter. L'un étant le mémoire justificative dont Jack parlera ensuite. And the other is this provisional ordinance project, which he was beginning to explain to you, Margaret, concerning the conditional approval of the derogation and the way in which they must ensure the follow-up on their part and present a parking plan adapted to the deal. So, on this, I will hand over to Jack, our urban planner, who will present you these documents.

Je vais allumer mon micro pour que vous puissiez m'entendre. Steve, je vous présente mes excuses. J'aurais dû vous dire à l'avance que nous allions vous solliciter. C'est de ma faute. Uh, I'm sorry. I have a lot of things in mind lately. So this one, this one escaped me. As I said earlier, I am Jack Stewart. I am urbanist of the city. We have appreciated working with Steve and his team to realize something that the city wants, but that it could not realize itself. And we think that we have found a solution by assuming that you all agree with this solution, which is mutually beneficial for everyone in the city and which allows us to succeed in what will be a great asset for the community once built. And so, a few elements of context, aren't they? It's located right there, it's the location. I click on the buttons, it appears on my screen before it appears on yours. I'm sorry, but it's the right place in question. It's, you know, right there at the end of Clayton Court, which we talked a lot about. All these funny and exciting things that happen at Clayton Court. I was there today to see the superb sidewalks and urban planning that are installed right now. You know, the plot is 0.4, 3 and a few acres. And so, you know, on a conceptual level, when we think about what this site could become, it's an ideal place for a art center. But the code tells us that when you build a building intended for this type of art center, you need 50 parking spaces. In fact, it takes between 50 and 74, if you want to get into the details of the plan. But I was a conservationist and I got a figure of 50. And that would occupy the entire field and there would be nothing else on this lot. In reality, depending on the place of the fork you are aiming at, you might not even have enough space for that. And so we had to find a different solution for these things. And this conditional derogation allows the art center to be thought about and to engage with the rest of the city, the rest of the community, to determine the best location for this parking lot and then find solutions to bring people, if they can't come by foot, and really accomplish that. And so, you know, if we go back to the history of this process, the city identified and it was before my arrival. Hey, I'm the new one. It's been officially 60 days today that I'm here, so it's nice. We identified the construction of a community art center as a public goal. And then we gave this land to the Frazier Valley Art Center to build this project. So we asked them to do it, didn't we? The city. It's not like they came to see us and said, we want to build something. The city said, we want this project and we want to achieve it. And why is it important? It's because it means that it's not a problem that they created themselves. It's a problem that the city created for them. And so, at least in my opinion, the city has a role to play to help them find a solution. There was an initial project, as Steve mentioned. There had to be an exchange of land. There were a lot of things. There was an electoral initiative that did not succeed. And so now we find a new solution. And so this is what it is about. And so here is the conceptual drawing that we mentioned. And the proposal here provides for the use of six of these places. So currently, the first-floor layout has 12 places. We will let Steve and his team decide which side of the property they want to place. Is it in the red zone? It will be six places. Among these places, two will be accessible to people with reduced mobility. And during events, the six will be accessible to people with limited mobility, so that we can ensure that individuals can access this property. If we come back here to Clayton Court, oh, it didn't go fast enough. Sorry, Clayton Court will also have a good amount of parking space. And then we will be able to use part of Clayton Court's parking space to access the site. Once again, the idea is that when these events take place, it is usually in the evening after the opening hours, so it will not affect the companies. And for the rest, Steve and his team will look for these out-of-site locations to be able to meet the needs. Part of this process will also consist of finding a way to bring people to this site, if the distance is too long, to get there on foot by looking through here. I must also look through here while I speak. And so, that's conceptual conception. I would note that, you know, the act that gave the property to the art center stipulates that this area can be used. They would have given it to Fraser Valley Arts as long as the board of directors determines that it is the best location for an art center. And so it comes back to, you know, saying that it is the best location for an art center. So we have to help them achieve this goal. Here is a bit of legal chatter, amusing for those of us who spend a lot of time reading these things. The parking regulations aim to ensure adequate parking while allowing flexibility thanks to alternative strategies. The code expressly creates this option for out-of-site parking and we do it via the derogation process. And so the way in which the derogation would be required is if it has to be more than 500 feet from the premises. This is where the derogation is necessary.

If you look at this site, you can't build a parking lot less than 500 feet from this one.

Hence the need for derogation. So you have to determine tonight if we have presented to Steve and myself enough evidence to support the derogation criteria contained in the DAFMA section marked 3030. The next logical question is therefore, what are these derogation criteria? It's a good question and for which I have to move on to another part of my screen so that you can see them.

Where do you come from? It's 50 to 75. Go ahead.

There is a formula in the code.

Do you want to see that?

I just say no. But there is a fairly large beach over there.

And it's because we don't know the design yet. Since there is no final design plan, I can't give you a precise answer because if there is one floor, it's a number. If there are two floors, it's another number. If there are three floors, it brings us to 74 because it is based on the surface.

Can I just add a point of fact? Is it okay? If you remember the first floor plan that Jack showed, which had all these parking spaces on the side, One of the consequences of this reduced demand, in all likelihood, would be the possibility of moving the space dedicated to the arts of the show, which is the largest, to the ground floor, which would present two advantages. 1. A much better access in terms of ADA standards. And two, to answer this question, it could define the ultimate capacity of this space, allowing us to slightly increase it to reach maybe 300 people. In this case, it also has an impact on the number of necessary places. We will therefore have time to define all this.

There are four criteria for derogation. The first is that the difficulty must be proper to the property and not have been created by the owner himself. Elle n'est pas autodéterminée car la ville a imposé ses règles et a demandé à Fray Valley Arts de construire cet ouvrage à cet endroit précis. Fridge Valley Arts, tout à leur honneur, a pris des initiatives. Il y a eu une mesure soumise au vote. Un travail a été accompli pour tenter de parvenir à ce résultat. Ces mesures ont échoué. Le critère suivant est que la dérogation doit être le minimum nécessaire. We do not say, it is the minimum solution required, which means that by advancing in the elaboration of their requirements, they must be, you know, strict and prudent, right? They do not ask for the removal of the requirement for parking. They will still have parking spaces on the site. They will simply have fewer parking spaces on the site. They will locate it outside the site. The third criterion is that derogation must not harm public well-being. Nous veillons très attentivement à ce que l'accessibilité soit maintenue pour ceux qui ont besoin de ces accès adaptés pour se rendre sur place. Et puis, le dernier critère est que le pétitionnaire doit proposer une mesure d'atténuation substantielle volontaire. Qu'est-ce que cela signifie? Il s'agit de tout ce dont Steve to know that they are working on this project in a collaborative way. And they must be an integral part of this process. They volunteer to find an event parking lot nearby, to collaborate with neighboring owners, to set up a shuttle system if necessary, to submit a detailed parking plan before construction, and finally, after all this, to work with the city to establish a permanent parking solution in the city center, including the examination of a compensation or a similar parking program. I'll be right back. This leads me to my recommendation, namely these six parking spots on site, two places according to ADA standards, with the six places reserved for ADA parking during these events. We will permanently record the parking agreements outside the site. Then, of course, we will ask the Board of Directors to give their opinion to ensure that they agree with it. But the petitioner will have to come back to you all with this event management plan before this derogation is definitive.

Why tonight?

We ask you to consider a provisional ordinance by telling them to come back to us before a maximum period of 12 months. and to see what our final plan is.

They need more time. They will certainly be able to examine this demand at that time.

They also agree to participate in whatever our long-term solution is, because we don't know this solution yet. It's an interesting project to work with you all to find this long-term solution, but we haven't really addressed the subject yet. We have a few ideas running through our heads. So, what does this provisional ordinance do? Well, the law of the state requires that the Adjustment Commission establishes conclusions of facts and legal conclusions and orders the applicable leasing. That's why you hear the term ordinance, because the law specifically stipulates that you must order the leasing. I'm not a lawyer, I just do what they tell me to do. So you're going to adopt a final ordinance at some point, but tonight you're going to proceed with a provisional ordinance. And so, the ordinance project is submitted to this final decision of the council, then to your subsequent issuance of the final ordinance.

We have also developed this provisional ordinance so that it is very specific to this situation, recognizing that this is a particular circumstance.

We take care not to create a precedent to prevent anyone in town from saying, well, the art center did it, so I can do it too.

We recognize, and this is why it is 11 pages long, that we want to be very detailed on the fact that it is a unique circumstance that therefore requires a unique solution. Thus, if someone else is in a unique circumstance, he is completely willing to come and talk to us, but we do not guarantee that this type of solution will be implemented in the future.

I hope you had the opportunity to examine it. You know, Mr. President, if we want to review and make changes to this proposal of the ordinance or this proposal of the ordinance, I have created a loophole for you.

But it is ultimately your ordinance, so it is you.

Do you have any questions?

Well, I would simply say this, Jack. I went through these 11 pages of the provisional ordinance and I had the impression of obtaining... I had the impression of obtaining my law degree after finishing it. Non, je trouve qu'elle était bien structurée avec la terminologie juridique et tout le reste... Donc, nous sommes libres d'approfondir n'importe laquelle de ces 11 pages si les commissaires veulent plus de détails. Mais Jack a en quelque sorte résumé les points essentiels.

J'ai juste deux questions.

Et si les gens veulent approfondir, n'hésitez pas. But if we design the building and the requirement goes from 50 to 74 places, 6 places PMR, are they enough for events? Because I don't want to put them in a position where suddenly they need 7 and there's nothing left. 6 places would be, given the surface, that's why I advanced this number.

Unless they build a fourth floor, which, according to what I hear, would not be allowed by zoning in this place. These six places would be the maximum necessary considering the surface.

Okay, that's good.

And there will be parking on Clayton Court. One of the things we discussed is perhaps even to convert several parking places in the street near the center into additional PMR places, even if it is only for events, but cheers. Yes, I mean, we see that in Denver and elsewhere, so it makes sense.

Another question related to this conversation. Does anyone know how much space the parking structure of Cooper Creek has? I'm just curious to know the size and if a parking structure had to be built at some point. I'm looking, Sarah. I'm sorry.

Is it noted that, I suppose, this indicates that it is an organization 500 1C3, a public establishment, isn't it? That is to say, this is what motivated my decision. We know that it is an organization. It ends up being a public establishment using a public parking lot for that.

If it ends up being a private installation, sorry, a private public installation, At the end of this act, the property would return to the city. This is no longer of interest. We know that we are essentially talking about using a public parking lot to serve this establishment. But this is a public establishment.

So someone would have to meet this high level of requirement to come and use this as an example.

And I, you know,

All this discussion about parking, I mean, you suffer Steve and the group suffers from it since the beginning because you have to find a solution for everyone. Come on, I will continue to put pressure on a Breckenridge-type solution where we would ideally have an accessible parking lot, by Navette, quite close to the city, without sacrificing our pedestrian and cyclable neighborhoods for floor-to-ceiling parking.

We may say it's the solution, but we talked about density, we talked about the most rational use for accessibility and cost.

I hope we can hold on to it for a while.

Yes, absolutely. Did you have a question?

No, I just wanted to confirm.

I'll make sure we don't get in trouble.

No, just confirm. Yes, sorry, it's okay. For the CREBOT cutter, it has the number of 300 places in mind, but don't quote me on that. I think they were attributed to the different shops.

So I have a question. Vous comptez sur l'existence d'un parking public qui ne gênera pas les entreprises car ce sera la nuit, mais nous espérons avoir des bars et des restaurants qui seront très fréquentés le soir. Alors, comment déterminez-vous quelle part de la location peut être, vous savez, dédiée à ces places publiques alors que nous ne connaissons pas encore les futurs usages

C'est une question très pertinente et la réponse courte est que nous n'avons pas encore trouvé la solution. Et ce texte permet à Steve, Sarah et moi-même de nous réunir pour trouver une solution, car je n'ai pas de réponse à cette question pour l'instant.

Mais en général, si les places de stationnement bordent la propriété, elles comptent dans leur propre quota de stationnement.

Et si elles sont à moins de 60 mètres ? Est-ce qu'elles sont à moins de 150 mètres ?

So even if they are not in front of their own building, you know, it depends on the way I interpret the code. So I think we can defend both points of view. And when we talk about the disposition of the code later, we may have a discussion there on the management of parking because this disposition of the code is a bit ambiguous. So, to go back to Margaret, my comment is that I don't have the solution yet. So we have to sit down to define this. Maybe you won't like it and you'll tell us to try again. But we're not there yet. What comes first, the hen or the place to park?

I mean, I think of the Strolls' houses, right at the 40, the lounge buildings, and we allowed them to include parking in the street, but it was only what bordered their buildings.

It was nothing more than that.

So, I simply assumed that it was, in a way, the rule.

It's our practice to this day.

And I ask this question, of course, because this property in particular, located at an angle, has, I mean, has practically nothing in terms of parking on the street in front of the building, because it is just in this strange place, which is regrettable.

But it looks like we can discuss it. Do we have any other questions for Steve or Jack before opening the public comment session?

Yes, you are part of the adjustment committee. This brings me to a quick question before closing the comments to the public. We have two additional members of the urbanism commission who have arrived.

Cela signifie-t-il que nous conservons le maire comme membre votant du comité des ajustements ?

C'est au comité des ajustements, Bob.

Écoutez-le.

Nous vous laisserons voter. Bob, pouvons-nous aussi dire que Brian et Peggy sont des membres sans droit de vote, mais qu'ils sont autorisés à participer à la discussion ?

Bien sûr.

Ils ne sont simplement pas autorisés à voter.

Je pose la question du vote pour le moment venu.

Je n'étais pas sûre qu'elle puisse faire des commentaires.

So Brian can always vote, that's what I understand.

She's a member of the office, so she could participate.

Well, she's free to make comments or ask questions. Peggy, ask your question.

So I see this process stretched over several years and we get a design, we get a permit to build.

No one else has got a design that allows you to build on Clayton Court.

We arrive and say, okay, well, we'll give them 10 seats on this side of the street. 15 on the other side of the street.

Is it permanent? And if a restaurant, a hotel or other, settles down, next year or two years later, the seats of the parking lot...

Revenons-nous sur notre décision pour réévaluer ou est-ce que c'est permanent jusqu'à la fin de la période ?

Dommage que nous n'ayons pas d'hôtel ou de restaurant.

Donc, vos options sont... Il n'y a pas de bonne réponse. You could decide, if you wish, to re-evaluate any final order at a certain frequency. Votre ordonnance finale pourrait stipuler que ce plan de gestion du stationnement est soumis à une réautorisation à intervalles réguliers. Vous pourriez dire qu'en ce qui concerne uniquement les places de stationnement sur la voie publique, la Ville se réserve le droit de les réattribuer.

Vous, vous pourriez avoir beaucoup, il existe de nombreuses options différentes que vous pourriez envisager au moment de l'ordonnance finale. But that would not mean, the final word of the ordinance simply means that you have made a decision, it does not mean that everything is engraved in the marble. I think, however, from the point of view of the art center, that they would like a certain...

We could certainly balance our different options and recognize that this is the first of a long series of developments, hopefully on Clayton Street. And it's, as I said, the short and medium-term solution.

It is committed to being part of the long-term solution, which could involve changes to this initial plan. And correct me if I'm wrong, Steve.

It's just that once we have built a building, we will no longer be able to put parking spaces in it, because it will be a building. The other thing I would suggest in the context of this conversation is the center that, remember, Fraser Valley Arts exists because the city asked us to do it. Literally, the mayor and the municipal director of the time came to see us and asked us if we could do that. Are there serious research suggesting that an art center like ours attracts visitors? And we are talking about 75 to 100 events per year, which generally cost about 40 dollars each outside the price of their ticket in the surrounding community. If they come from outside the county, this figure is close to 80 dollars because it includes hotels and other expenses. So yes, these are concerns concerning the capacity of parking and future businesses. I would say that if people go out for dinner and see a show, they probably park in this sector for both activities. This also benefits these other businesses. And then, important point, there will be an advantage in terms of sales tax for this city which is, I think, quite significant. in a community that really has difficulties at this level compared to other cities in the area.

And I don't think we should forget it.

Does that answer your question? Just so that we are aware that in the end... Another option to bounce back on this would be to say that when you develop your management plan, you will not be able to use the places Le long de Clayton Court, dans ses calculs, vous devez prévoir suffisamment de place.

Vous pourriez certainement le faire. Je ne pense pas que je le recommanderais cependant.

Mais nous n'en sommes pas encore là.

Donc je pense que la question qui vous est posée en ce moment est simplement sur le plan conceptuel. Pensez-vous que c'est une bonne approche et que cela vaut la peine que nous travaillons sur ce plan de gestion du stationnement ? Then we will present it to you so that we can examine it in detail. And I want you to criticize it to tell us what you like or don't like, so that we can find a solution that suits you. This is the first of many conversations of this kind, or maybe you don't like it. And you can say no, it's also your right. But my next question would be, well, what would you like instead? Because it's better than that. Steve and I could have imagined, so you know, but the decision is yours.

I would also suggest that part of this parking plan includes a study.

In an ideal world, we have a train. We are trying to encourage people to come here without their car. employees who live in the city, inhabitants who walk on bikes or buses.

You know, a study will help us understand how many customers really come by car. So maybe the needs for parking are not as high.

They will remain, hopefully less important than we anticipate. And so this is a first step that allows us to do it. We actually have access, via the Compté de Grand, to information about precise georeferencing on the cars that enter our county, thanks to the data of mobile phones that we could use at this end. By the way, you know, I am one of the creators of the mural painting festival. Think of the number of people who go there in a few weeks. There are thousands of people who cross our community. They park, but they also come by bike, they also come by bus, and they come in groups. There is therefore certainly a problem of parking. Sometimes I think we make it a more important problem than it really is, once we have the opportunity to really think together.

It's just my opinion. If there are no other questions from the commissioners, we will open the public comment session. We will start with everyone present in the room who wants to make a public comment. Please introduce yourself. On the podium, indicate your name and you will have three minutes. We will move on to the online people in a moment.

Good evening everyone. I'm Don Mlambe, I'm not the president of the city of Fraser. I live on the side of the county after the border.

But I am here tonight as a member of Derouarchitecture and have worked with Fraser Valley Arts on several concepts for various locations in the city. We would simply like to briefly express our support to this derogation. authorizing some creative alternatives to parking problems will simply offer much more flexibility in design to meet, I think, the needs of Fraser Valley Arts and the expectations of the community in a way that will integrate much better with urban fabric than the simple fact of painting a half-acre in the middle of the neighborhood of Riberon. I would simply like to express this in our name and I thank you for your attention.

Je m'appelle John Church. Je suis également impliqué dans Fraser Valley Arts au sein du conseil d'administration. Je réfléchissais justement au fait qu'il y a un problème de stationnement ici à Fraser.

C'est vraiment une opportunité de s'y attaquer concrètement et de le résoudre. And so I see this as an excellent opportunity to launch the movement.

In a year, we will be examining permanent solutions and what needs to be done to support the various companies here who have expressed their concerns about parking at this council and the board of directors and how to manage it in the future.

So thank you.

And I am actually a resident of the county of Grande, but not from the city of Frazier.

J'habite à Winter Park Ranch, qui est en dehors des lignes de... Merci, John. Quelqu'un d'autre ? Sinon, pouvons-nous savoir s'il y a quelqu'un en ligne qui souhaite prendre la parole ?

S'il y a quelqu'un en ligne qui souhaite parler, veuillez lever la main.

Personne. Merci.

N'ayant plus d'offre de parole du public, je vais demander au commissaire. Y a-t-il d'autres discussions ou questions que vous pourriez avoir ?

Sinon, j'aimerais recevoir une proposition. Je verrai.

Je pense que nous devons clôturer l'audience. Can I have a proposal for closure? The public audience concerning the addition of Fraisier Valley Arts or the derogation of the parking requirements outside the municipal code of Fraisier.

I propose to close the public audience.

All those who are for. Against. The proposal is adopted. The public audience is closed. Now. We can receive a proposal.

I would like to receive a proposal to approve Resolution No. 2027701, a resolution approving a provisional ordinance concerning the petition of Frazier-Valet Arts for a derogation to the requirements of stationing outside the municipal code of Frazier.

Other discussions?

Just a quick clarification, you said to receive a proposal, but you could make a proposal, right?

Okay, I'll make a proposal. Okay.

It's not receiving a...

It's a very entertaining proposal. I want to make a proposal. Thank you.

No one.

Does it come with a little dance too? I'm good at dancing. I'm a very good dancer. Okay. Note. Yeah, the arts of the show... Good point. D'accord. Nous avons donc une proposition et un appui. Tous ceux qui sont pour. Contre. La proposition est adoptée. Très bien. Nous n'avons rien d'autre à l'ordre du jour ce soir. Donc je recevrai une proposition pour lever la séance. Ceci lève la séance. Juste pour être clair. Ceci lève la séance du conseil d'ajustement. Je suis désolé. La motion pour lever la séance du comité d'ajustement.

Adopté.

Press all those who are for. For. No opposition. The meeting of the adjustment committee is up at 7 o'clock. 32.34. I think this clock is moving. At 7.32. I don't have anyone on me. 7.32 then. Thank you all. We're going to have to take a break of 5 to 10 minutes because Antoinette has to turn everything off and then restart everything. So we'll be back here, let's say, in 10 minutes.

Thank you.

Thank you, Steve.

In fact, there are only 9 pages, not 11. I just had to read 11.

It seemed to be 11 when you said 11. I don't have, I don't have the spirit.