City Commission - Regular Meeting

Call the meeting to order. We'll begin with the Pledge of Allegiance. I invite you to join us.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Roll call, please.

Kolpak? Here. Pepkorn? Here. Strand?

Here.

Turnburg? Here. Mahoney?

Here. Tonight we have video about the Fargo Name, a garbage truck contest. So we'll start off with that.

My name is Kyle Blanchard. I'm equipment operator two here at City of Fargo Solid Waste. Recently I've been dumping the child care center at Sanford and every day there's kids coming in and coming out and everybody's got to stop and see the garbage truck work. I've never met a kid that doesn't like a garbage truck and it's so much fun. They're either asking us to honk the air horns or wanting to see the truck work and get dumped and it's a lot of fun to see. I think it's really cool for them to give them a sense of community involvement. They're just probably starting to learn about civics and giving back to the community and stuff like that. I think it's nice to see them have the opportunity to give an active role to be a part of what goes on in their community. Especially for the winners, like how cool is that for them to see their name truck come by on their street or by them. It's got to be a pretty cool experience.

So the solid waste department contacted our communications team for help doing this name of garbage truck contest. And from there, it was posted online asking residents to submit their ideas for names of garbage trucks. All those results were forwarded to us at solid waste department. We narrowed it down to 10 names and then it was put out for public vote. And that's how we got to the three names that were selected by the public that you'll see on trucks now. There's actually over 200 submissions for naming a garbage truck, so I feel like it was popular with the residents wanting to participate. Trash Source Racks is fun because it just kind of fits. Changing it from Tyrannosaurus Rex, not much of a change, but really applies to what we're doing here at the solid waste department. Bin Diesel Vin Diesel, we all know the movie. So that was an easy kind of transformation to incorporate garbage or solid waste into that name. And then I would say the top pick is the truck Norris because who doesn't love Chuck Norris? Also his recent passing, we thought it would be a nice way to remember him and incorporate him into our daily operations.

So I thought it was really cool like we're kind of on our own island out here like you said so it's really neat that we I don't know get some fanfare on the social media and seeing you know these trucks rolling around on different videos or news platforms it's pretty neat for us to get recognized because it's outside of cleanup week nobody really knows that we exist the garbage comes and goes and they're happy about that. especially any of the kids that maybe tried to name the truck, especially for the winners, to see the stickers on these trucks. And, oh, there goes Truck Norris right down the road. I seen him in North Fargo yesterday. Now he's in South Fargo. Or now he's at this career fair. I think it'll be a cool thing.

Nicely done. Thank you all. Do we have a motion to approve the order of agenda? So moved. Is there a second?

Second.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Motion carried. Do we have a motion to approve the minutes of the May 11, 2026 meeting? So moved. Is there a second?

Second.

All those in favor say aye. Aye. Motion carried. Is there a motion to approve the consent agenda items one through 23? So moved. Is there a second?

Second.

Roll call vote, please.

Pepkorn?

Aye.

Kolpak?

Aye.

Strand?

Yes.

Turnberg? Aye. Mahoney?

Aye. We move to public hearings. Item 2425 are to be continued till 6-22. Could I have a motion for 24 and 25 to be continued? Move to continue 24 and 25? Is there a second? Second. Roll call vote, please.

Pepkorn?

Aye.

Turnberg? Aye. Kolpak? Aye. Strand? Yes. Mahoney? Aye.

Well, hearing number 26, application by the Fargo HRA Low Income Housing for a payment in lieu of tax exemption pilot for a project located at 1711 25th Avenue South with the applicant has been used for 65 unit low income multi-family residential apartment building. Jim Gilmore to explain.

This is an application from the Fargo Housing Authority along with Blue Line Development. Blue Line Development is a partner in this because they're able to obtain and sell low-income housing tax credits. That is an excellent in financing in one way, and the other is a problem because it makes a portion of the project subject to property taxes. And so that's the reason for the property tax exemption. If you're going to provide low-income housing you can't afford to pay the full property taxes Especially on a project like this that's serving very low-income people. You can see the general location of the project the interchange to the Northwest is 25th Street and I-94 And so if we go to the PowerPoint next, you can kind of see the plan. And then I'll just turn this over to Chris from the Housing Authority to kind of explain what was there before. It was tax exempt before. There's a bunch of town homes that have been demolished, and then this is a new project. Chris?

Mayor and commissioners, thank you for allowing me to be here today. As Jim was saying before, previously on this location, we had a total of 14 duplexes, 28 units, which are two and three bedroom. We receive permission from HUD to demolish these 14 duplexes and come back with 65 unit multi-family. It would be one, two, and three bedroom units. We will be 100% vouchered on these. What I mean by vouchered, each unit will have a project based voucher which will allow people to a maximum income of 50% of the area median income and less. So if you have zero income, you pay zero for your rent. So that's truly a low, deep subsidy income for this unit. I guess I'm open for questions that you may have.

One other thing to add is both the Fargo School Board and Cass County have voted to fully participate in this exemption.

Any questions, Chris?

Mayor.

Mr. Stratton.

Chris, initially, thank you to you and to your staff and to your team and to the Fargo Housing Authority Board. and to Blue Line and for others in the lane in our community, that lane of providing housing in our community. I guess my question is this, how much is ahead of us to still do? for housing. What do you see on the horizon? What's coming our way? What is really the reality that we're facing?

Well, there's such a need for low-income housing. We have, you know, we just opened Lashkowitz Riverfront over here, and we're filling that up right now, and we have over 600 people on the waiting list for a 100-unit building. That's not counting the waiting list for our regular HCV vouchers or any of our other projects. I know Dan Madler's here from beyond shelter, and he could attest that there's never a problem filling any type of low-income housing that we may build. It's only going to increase more demand as we continue to grow as a community. So I think we plan to continue to build more low-income housing, plan to redevelop our Burrell and Colonial site just to the north here. And we're looking at some other locations throughout town also. So we have some other tools that a lot of other low-income developers don't have. We have a Faircloth to RAD conversion where we actually have the maximum number of public housing that we once had in the city of Fargo, which was over 600 units. that's dropped down to under 300. So we have that change at 300 units that we still have the availability to get funding for if we provide the housing. So there's a method through HUD to actually put something new into public housing for a day or instantaneously, then we do a conversion, take it back out. But when we do that, it takes those vouchers along with it so we can continue to add more subsidy back to our community. And that's truly what we need to do.

Any other questions? Does anyone present wish to speak to this low-income housing project? And when President wishes to speak, if not, I'll close the public hearing. Do I have a motion?

I'll make the motion.

Is there a second?

I'll second.

Any further discussion? We'll call the vote, please.

Epcorn? Aye. Kolpak?

Aye.

Strand?

Yes.

Turnburg? Aye. Mahoney?

Aye. Item 27. Thank you, President. Application by Magica Software for property tax exemption for a project located at 201 Fifth Street North, which the applicant will use for technological services in a software development company. Jim Gilmore to explain as well.

This is a software company that's proposing to move into the 14th floor of the Radisson building in downtown Fargo. They're currently located downtown and they'd be moving to this location so they could both add jobs as well as employ people that are no longer in the Fargo metro area or maybe have never been in the Fargo metro area. and bringing them here, very good jobs. What I'm gonna have is Ryan Oshine from EDC, he's been working with this company and he can come up and introduce the owners and they can talk about their vision and what they do and how they hope to expand here in downtown Fargo.

Thanks, Jim. Mayor, members of the Commission. Yeah, this is one of those examples of the great work that we get to do. And there's all these great companies that are operating in our marketplace that are in primary sector nature, adding value to goods and services and using IP to develop software technology companies. And so this was one of the stories. of NJAXA Software, a company that was formed in Las Vegas in 2018, moved here after COVID, going through some expansion and growth within their company. As Jim mentioned, they're located above Halberstadt on Broadway in about 2,800 square feet of space. The company is growing, needs to bring on more team members to capitalize on some of the business opportunities they have in front of them. So they're moving to a, from kind of I'd say semi remote work to everybody back in the office, which includes several people coming and working full time in the Fargo market that aren't currently here. And then with this expansion, they'd be adding two people every year for the next five years. So these are high paying jobs, 81,000 plus average salary. The company is looking at other locations to expand in other marketplaces. And so with me today is Jamie Evenson, one of the founders of Nijax, and I'll let her tell you more about the the project and their expansion.

Yeah, thank you guys. So like Ryan mentioned, Jamie Evenson, founder and CEO of Nutsha Access Software. We're a staffing technology company, so we build staffing solutions, SaaS solutions that we offer to staffing agencies that are roughly 25 million to a billion plus. We operate outside of the state of North Dakota and we operate in Canada as well. So all of our revenue basically comes from out of state. We don't have any customers in the state of North Dakota at this time, Not sure if we will, but mostly we're looking outside of the state. Like you mentioned, we are looking at bringing everybody in house. We just find that we collaborate better and we make better products when everybody's together. So people that live in Minneapolis market, we're having a move here so that we can continue to work with our team. The idea is that we'll bring on two plus a year. Right now the way that it's working out is that that goal is maybe a little

light considering with where we're at right now but at a minimum we'd like to see two people plus per year any other questions or any questions i should note the academic development incentive committee recommended approval based on our scoring criteria it's 178 we need at least 120 to recommend approval so this is a very good score mayor mr strand thank you it's great to have people moving to our city and community i'm just curious jim what type of uh

What type of a look back, claw back topics or inclusions do we have in not just this particular project, but all of them going forward? Will we measure the two per year and will we calculate it? How does that get?

Yeah, we're updating that. Eric Johnson's been working on a new business incentive agreement, which they would be required to sign. There'd be annual reporting until they met their job goals, close to that first five years. If they didn't meet it, it would come back to you to decide, do you want to give more time or do you want to end the incentive, possible clawback? I think it'll be a much better agreement than we've had in the past.

I thought we were on path to already implement those changes. those requirements that you don't just look back, but we actually have that in place up front, what the consequences are if there isn't a meeting of the established goals?

We have those in place. What we're trying to build in is an actual annual reporting and sort of an automatic end that we don't have in place right now.

And the last question, is there a requirement to report? Because in the past we've had entities that don't even give us their reports.

Again, this would be a firmer requirement that they report. I think in the past some of these fell through the cracks and we didn't get signed agreements, and the EDC has been doing a good job now in following up on all the current agreements. Admittedly, we haven't been following up on them as rigorously as we could. I think I thought the assessors were doing it and they thought I was doing it.

Is there anyone present who wishes to speak to this property tax exemption? The President wants to speak. If not, I'll close the public hearing. Do I have a motion? I'll make a motion. Is there a second?

Second.

Any further discussion? Commissioner Kopach.

Thank you. I'm appreciating this is truly international work that you're doing with both Canada and the United States. Can you share a little bit about your experience working with both the city and the EDC throughout this process?

actually I didn't I wasn't aware of the EDAC before this we moved into our place two and a half years ago about and I can't remember if it was you Ryan or if somebody else Joey had reached out and at first I honestly thought it was like a sales pitch for something and I was like I don't know if I want to do this but then he assured us that it was you know, going to be in our best interest to see what we had, what they had to offer. So the process has been quite great. It's been wonderful because a lot of times when you start a company, you don't really know who to go to or the questions that you don't know to ask. And the EDIC process has been exceptional. Very easy to meet with, and of course they're downtown too, so it makes it really easy for us to get together if we need to. So definitely it's been a good experience, and I would recommend it to anybody who's starting a business in Fargo.

Thank you.

Thank you. Any other discussion? Roll call vote, please.

Pepkorn?

Aye.

Kolpak? Aye. Strand?

No.

Turnburg? Aye. Mahoney?

Aye. Item 28, community development block grant and home investment partnership programs, 2026 HUD action and plan and budget and amendments to 2025 action plan and citizen participation plan. Nicole Crutchfield to explain.

Thank you, Mayor and Commissioners. I have just a short presentation just to provide a brief overview. So every year we are in front of you with an annual allocation for HUD for the city has chosen to participate in community development block grant funds and home grant funds. And we are on year two of a five-year consolidated plan. So, every five years, we have a big overarching goal-setting process, and then we follow those goals over the course of the next five years. And so, today in front of you, we have year two of five. And much like last year's presentation and updates, I'll have that for you today here. So just as a reminder, the two grant programs are the Community Development Block Grant Funds, which are primarily used for public facility improvements, property acquisition, community programs, really construction related. And then the other program, Home Investment Partnership Program, that is primarily specific to providing more housing. So the city has chosen to initiate a new program, tenant-based rental assistant program in partnership with CENCA, our local action agency. And then for the community development block grant funds, for a majority of those funds, we have chosen to pivot for internal use for alley paving in our core neighborhoods. And so I have a little bit more about those as well as we move forward. So in the five-year plan, through public outreach, through our comprehensive plans and our core neighborhoods plans, our housing study, et cetera, we have formed these five goals related to affordable housing, ending and preventing homelessness, the public infrastructure, and then fair housing, which is a requirement. And the actual dollar amounts this year, these are set by Congress, and it's a formulaic approach. And so we were notified just about 60 days ago on what these funds are going to be allocated for us. And we've chosen to fit those into the programs we already have going. So that includes $202,000 for administration, $120,000 for public services, $550,000 for capital neighborhood. That's the alley paving project. And then for the housing related to the tenant-based rental assistance. And we always carry a little bit of coverage or contingency if a program needs to be adjusted. We are part of a public hearing tonight. We have a mailing list that we notify people that have signed up. It's also published in the paper and on the website. We are on a 30-day public process right now. I will be back in front of you June 8th. I'd probably be on consent agenda unless there's any concerns or comments that are received looking for approval of this action plan. As part of this plan we also are doing an amendment to the 2025. The first alley paving project that we are starting to queue up with engineering and through the environmental review process is in the Madison neighborhood. So focusing in on the Madison neighborhood related to alley paving projects and we would be back in front of you as we get closer into those details and working with engineering. And then we have a standard requirement through HUD with the citizen participation plan. And this is pretty standard. This is a lot of rudimentary updates where if we make edits to the citizen participation plan, we have to notice the public. So it's a lot of government speak. I apologize on that. But it's really just trying to simplify the process for when we do amendments and updates, which is things about like notices in the paper, notices online. and the verbiage related to that. We had a document based that had been previously advised by our regional director that was some 25 pages long and really probably only needs to be about five pages long and so we've just made that short and it's all available online and to the public. But basically when anything there's an amendment we come back in front of you as part of those amendments and that's the nuts and bolts of it and then we have a public notice standard. I'm here to answer any questions. I know I ran through that really quickly. Glad to talk about any of the programs more directly as you might have questions.

Any questions for Nicole? Mr. Strand.

Thank you. Nicole, when you say it's 1.3 plus million, is that increasing or decreasing the amount of allocation from the federal beds? How is that looking overall?

It's a little bit, I wish I had those numbers right in front of you, but it's about the same overall every year. It varies maybe by 50 to 100 grand every year and it really depends on if other jurisdictions have fallen in or fallen out. So very much as a formula versus anything that's a congressional movement of any point. Thank you.

Anyone present wish to speak in regards to this plan?

Mayor Mahoney and commissioners, for the record, my name is Dan Madler, and I serve as the CEO of Beyond Shelter. And thank you for the opportunity to comment on the city's 2026 HUD action plan. First, I would like to say I appreciate the work that goes into administering CDBG in-home. These are important federal resources, but they also come with significant compliance requirements and risk for city staff. I also appreciate that tonight is a public hearing and the final action is scheduled for June 8th. Next, I would say I want to be direct. I strongly urge the city to revise this action plan before final adoption and recenter a meaningful portion of its CDBG and home funds on affordable housing development within Fargo. Based on the meeting packet, the city expects to receive a little over $835,000 in CDBG. and a little over $508,000 in home funds. As currently proposed and outlined, $550,000 of CDBG is allocated for public infrastructure and $390,000 in home is allocated for tenant-based rental assistance. And only $70,000 is identified as a total set-aside placeholder with no project identified. So respectfully, that is not a meaningful investment in housing production. It is a plan weighted towards short-term assistance and infrastructure, while the city's most limited federal housing dollars are not being used to create long-term affordable housing assets, something that would serve the city long-term. To be clear, I am not saying the proposed rental assistance program lacks value. It can absolutely serve as a purpose and as a bridge for households in crisis. I am also not dismissing the need for neighborhood infrastructure improvements in the Madison Unicorn Park area. These are real needs. But rental assistance, once it is spent, it is gone. It does not create lasting housing. And infrastructure projects, while they are important, they do not expand the city's affordable housing supply. Housing development does. Housing development creates long-term community assets that can serve Fargo residents for decades. and represents one of the highest long-term strategic investments that the city can make. In response to Commissioner Strand's question earlier in an earlier public hearing, what's coming our way? I can say if you look at North Dakota state demographics, North Dakota is an aging and young state. And I also can say that I am seeing that here in Fargo. And with that, I would say the local demand is clear. Beyond Shelter has developed 406 affordable senior housing units in Fargo. And as of April of 2026 of this year, only three units are vacant. That is a vacancy rate of less than 1%. That is not a soft market. That is a signal of sustained demand and under supply. Also, as of December of 2025, those 406 units were serving 423 residents with an average resident age of 73. Average household income was approximately $22,500 per year. Those are extremely low income tenants and seniors, and they need more options, not fewer. One Fargo resident on Beyond Shelter's wait list, Diana, she's age 76, described rent as maximizing my budget down to pennies, and said she is trying to keep a roof over my head, but it's getting more and more difficult. Those are the voices this plan should answer. I understand timeliness pressures and administrative constraints that come with these funds, but those challenges should not prevent the city from making strategic long-term investments in housing, A predictable housing funding pipeline and partnerships with experienced developers can allow the city to remain compliant while still producing meaningful housing outcomes. And my request is straightforward. Before the June 8th vote, revise the action plan to set clear housing production goals. and dedicate a meaningful share of the CDBG and home funds to affordable housing development in Fargo. Not just a placeholder, but through real projects that will deliver measurable housing outcomes. Fargo needs more housing supply, and these federal funds are one of a few tools the city can use to create it. And Beyond Shelter stands ready to be a partner. And with that, I'd like to thank you for your time and consideration.

Is there anybody else wish to speak? If not, I'll close the public hearing. Nicole, do you want to comment through those comments?

Yes. I think Dan and I have had lots of conversations about this. think the fact of the matter is these funds are increasingly impossible to use for the types of projects that beyond shelter builds these funds this direct allocation for 500 000 in a multi-million dollar construction project for a city staff of basically two people to administrate over 20 years is not a sustainable plan and so we've thought long and hard as we've pivoted The consolidated plan is what I'd like to use as a guide. I'm glad to have an informational meeting and deeper dive on the difficulties. The fact of the matter is we have several projects that are not in compliance with regulations to date, and it's really impossible with these regulations to kind of keep our subrecipients in the line with the regulations, and that's what's making it really hard for these large multi-projects. So the easiest people to find compliance with is internal when we can manage our internal audit and our internal financial systems.

Part of what you're saying is internal audits and what the government recommends or has is made difficult because it takes a lot of time.

This is a nationwide issue. I don't want to just point to Beyond Shelter. It's a nationwide issue nationally. All the local jurisdictions in North Dakota and the state have turned away CDBG funds from using in this regard and then for home funds for using in new construction. It's really impossible with Section 3 and Davis-Bacon laws.

Thank you.

Mr. Strand. Thank you. Nicole, I'm just curious, you know, a few years back, I think we were talking about creating a housing authority board that oversees all of these entities, the Cascade Community Land Trust, Beyond Shelter, Fargo Housing Authority, Habitat, and so on. Is that, did that ever happen?

Honestly, it has not happened. I have a number of reasons why. I think at the metro-wide level, we're having trouble with our joint jurisdictions in picking up the baton with the regional housing study.

What I'm wondering is if it's possible to just convene those members and others in that housing, just to have them know we heard them before the June 8th vote. And maybe they might, I don't know, but I'm sure you all can learn from each other and this whole affordable housing topic is just ripe. Would that be possible to convene them for coffee or something?

I can try. And I'd be happy to join you if I can. Honestly.

It's public notice. They could come. They're very aware of what she has.

I know. I just want more thorough informal conversations.

And I agree completely. We're under tight deadline. Otherwise, we're at risk of these funds being allocated to Fargo.

Mr. Kolpak.

I was going to actually ask for an informational session inviting those partners to share their frustrations because I know it's not just municipalities that are struggling with some of these same challenges and have just a real frank conversation with the public, you know, and let's highlight what are the, where are the challenges and where are the associated opportunities for improvement and I know you've had several independent conversations with those same groups over the years and let's just be really transparent about it, thank you.

There's no action tonight, it's just information, is that correct?

Correct.

Number 29, Applied of Lake Agassiz Addition, 417 and 501 Main Avenue. Approval recommended by the Planning Commission, 5526. Donald Kress to explain.

Good evening, Commissioners. Donald Kress with the Department of Planning and Development. I'll be presenting the next two items. These items include ordinances prepared by the City Attorney's Office. Item 29 is the Lake Agassiz Addition. A plot of a portion of the northeast quarter of Section 7, Township 139 North, Range 48 West, located at 417 and 501 Main Avenue. A little history here for you, commissioners, if this looks familiar to you. A plot of the same property, which was known as the L.J. Lafine Addition, was conditionally approved by your commission on May 3rd, 2021. Subsequent to that conditional approval, the city's relationship with the development partner changed, and that plot was never finalized. It has now been withdrawn. This is an entirely new plat that that original development partner is not involved in. It's a major subdivision because it dedicates right away along Main Avenue. These photos show the site here. You're probably familiar with this. There's a city parking lot there on the west side, and on the east side is Lake Agassiz Regional Development Corporation building. Lower photo here, this actually, we've been walking on it for a long time. This will actually be dedicated as part of this plat as part of Main Avenue. And just a couple other views of the subject property here. on the lake agassi visual development corporation side and then looking along fourth street here the zoning is dmu downtown mixed use and no change is proposed the city did receive one inquiry from a nearby property owner just wondering what was going to be happening there and we responded to that for him the applicant is the city of fargo so we're here tonight myself mr gilmore so if you have any questions for us The plat looks like this. Again, you won't really see any difference, just pretty much divides the property down on the Lake Agassiz and city side there. The planning commission's recommendation is stated in your staff report and shown on the screen. That concludes staff's presentation. Just to recognize we do appreciate the cooperation of the Lake Agassiz Regional Development Corporation in preparing this project. Thank you, commissioners.

Donald, it says existing and proposed, no change, no change, no change. So what is this action doing?

This is basically taking that property, which is still described as township and range property. It's just a meets and bounds description. It's never been formally platted. So it just formally plats these two properties. Not like the regional, Lake Agassiz Regional Development Corporation is gonna be there, same place they are. And then the city will have a platted lot to be able to, I believe our goal is to sell that in the near future. Is that correct, Mr. Gilmore? take that as a yes.

So one time we sold that lot. This allows us to sell it again in the future.

I. Don't know, did we? I'll let Jim answer that question. I was not part of that negotiation, Sir.

Go back to the plan.

This property is unplanted. As you can see in the southwest corner, Main Avenue kind of cuts across this legal description. So when you sell this, we did not want to sell a portion of Main Avenue. So this gives us a clean legal description. So the property, when you decide to sell it, it'll be lot one and it won't be this long description that is difficult to understand. But Jim, this is basically clean up worker cleaning it up so we could see to clean it up cleaners up to so they decide to sell or refinance. It'll be much easier to do it. Most property in Fargo is been plotted. This was owned by the railroad up until 20 years ago and so it was never plotted as a lot in blocks. Thank you.

So I went present wish to speak to this action. Anyone wanting to speak? If not, I'll close the public hearing. Do I have a motion?

I'll make the motion.

Is there a second? Second. Moved and seconded by Commissioner Strand.

Thank you. I'm just curious, Donald, or whomever could answer this. What is the status of that property now? It was sold. It went into litigation potentially. Is that done or resolved?

I defer to Mr. McLean, sir.

That was resolved last August. We own the property now. It's completely done and resolved?

Correct. Thank you.

Any other questions? We'll call the vote, please.

Hepkorn?

Aye.

Turnburg? Aye. Kolpak? Aye. Strand? Yes. Mahoney?

Aye. Item 30, Lost Creek First Addition. Approval recommended by Planning Commission of 526, 5526, zoning change from AG, agricultural to single dwelling residential, SR5, and multi-dwelling residential with conditional overlay and public institutional. First reading the rezoning ordinance and a plot of the last Greek first edition. Nicole Crutchfield and Donald Crest to explain.

Good evening. Yeah, so just it's a little unique case. So I thought I would do a little intro on some how kind of how we got here. hand it over to Donald as he walks through the normal subdivision process and comments and then I'll come back as part of the recommendations and then as we conclude the public hearing then we would have a lot of staff here if you have questions and such. So just to bring us to a bit of how we got here today we have the review elements related to the planning department staff and as part of that we look at the adherence to the growth plan the future land use plan and utility master plans and serviceability there's a lot of coordination with the finance departments public works public safety the school district that's within your staff report and then today in front of you we actually it was kind of confusing we have three motions for your consideration and that would be including staff's recommendation the planning commission decision which is different than the staff's recommendation and then a continuation of that so your desire so I'll be here to walk through those and I'm going to turn it over to Donald to proceed through

only have the one script between us so going forward here lost creek first edition is a major subdivision and zone change the lost creek first edition is located here this is the city of horace here the top line is 64th avenue south And the east line here is Veterans Boulevard, formerly known as 57th Street South. And so we're just across the street from Horace here. This is Lake Fargo up here. This property is a little different history. This was actually annexed into the city some time ago in 2006. but no development was proposed at the time, no services were ever provided. So this area is in the city, unlike, for example, when we went across the interstate to do Selkirk Place, that we annexed it and then annexed, platted, zoned, annexed, platted, zoned as we worked our way down. This is already in the city, so it's a little different background on this property here. These photos show the site from a few days ago. It's basically an open field. 64th Avenue South is being graveled this year, but not paved. This is Veterans Boulevard. This is the drainage channel that is on the east side of the property that is part of the Lake Fargo system. A little better shot of that drainage property. And this drainage channel is included in the plat as lot 14 of block four. And then this lower one here is facing southerly along Veterans Boulevard. The plat here creates 193 lots, including 181 residential lots. These larger ones are zoned MR3 multi-dwelling residential with a conditional overlay. These three on the west side here are zoned SR5 for townhomes and the rest of these are zoned SR4 for single dwelling residential. This lot over here, lot 14, is the The drainage channel lot, lot 13 down here, is going to be a public park. My plot actually continues on another page here, bringing the panhandle down here. I don't know that they'll call it panhandle park. And a couple of these other lots here that don't have designations are future park and connectivity lots that staff's still working out a couple details on. The zoning here is agricultural. And the proposed zoning, as I just talked about, was SR4, SR5, MR3, and then the publicly owned lots would be zoned PI, public and institutional, which are the appropriate zoning for lots owned by government entities. And then here's that zoning exhibit. Again, these are a little different colors than we use, but the multi-dwelling, the townhome, and the single dwelling, and then the green are the publicly owned lots. THIS LOST CREEK FIRST EDITION IS PART OF A LARGER MASTER PLAN FOR THE ENTIRE WEST HALF OF SECTION 9 OF TOWNSHIP 138 NORTH RANGE 49 WEST, WHICH IS 320 ACRES. IT'S THE ENTIRE WEST HALF. AS YOU SEE, IT STRETCHES FROM 64th AVENUE SOUTH TO 76th AVENUE SOUTH AND SOUTH SIDE. It's across the street from Horace here. As you know, as you saw in the photographs there, Veterans Boulevard is not yet developed. It's a minimum maintenance road. I did, my truck does have four-wheel drive, so I got out there okay. And we are working, the city of Horace and the city of Fargo are working on a memorandum of understanding for all of Veterans Boulevard down to 100th Avenue South, that whole corridor. And that is in process for that MOU to become effective. As you commissioners probably know, that has to be approved both by the Horace City Council and the City of Fargo, your commission here. This property is located within the West Fargo School District. And at the Planning Commission hearing, as summarized in your staff report, Mr. Mark Lemire of the West Fargo Public Schools came and addressed the West Fargo Public Schools situation for this. And we've also had cooperation with the Fargo Park District and their investments and their trail planning for this as well. Commissioners, our 2024 growth plan uses this grid system to prioritize development, prioritize orderly development in the city's undeveloped areas. And the subject property is located, this actually doesn't have the panhandle on it, but subject property is located in Supergrid A, see the A back here, Supergrid A in section four. When you look at grid 4 in detail, grid 4 down here, in relation to the development in the other grids in that supergrid A, you see that grid 1 here is about 50% developed. a sports center, Fargo Park Sports Center, our landmark Walmart here. There's residential development. There actually is a new multifamily development here, commercial development, multifamily development here, the new hospice. So that's about 50% developed just based on area developed. Grid 2, other than Lake Fargo, is undeveloped. This actually is outside of the city. This east half of this section is outside the city. 3 is Capstone Academy and North Dakota State College of Science is there now. There is some pending development. Cubby Ranch 3rd Edition has been to the Planning Commission. Recently, Back 40 Edition, which would develop this over here, uh... had was submitted for a future planning commission probably in july but even uh... if when those do come online that'll be about fifty percent developed and then the subject properties located over here so as you see there is a considerable distance from development here uh... this is forty fifth street south sixty four thousand south there is a distance from development there and uh so there there is that undeveloped gap which again is partly the way this was annexed this was annexed before all the stuff from the interstate over was annexed so that creates a situation which we don't have very often in terms of uh of uh the this orderly development you know usually annex adjacent to the city and then plat and zone at the same time So that's the growth plan background on this. At this time, commissioners, I'm going to turn it back to Nicole to take on the options for the motions. Thank you.

So one of the reasons we're here today with you in front of, so this came to the Planning Commission and, you know, they were balancing between the need for housing. We know we need housing. We develop over 300 lots a year, and it's part of the economic development of growth of the region. And we know it's a really important part. And what's unique to us is when we routed this plan, we started receiving review comments about the timing of this development. And so it's not necessarily that this is the wrong development being proposed in this location. It's more about the pace and timing. And as we are receiving review comments from some of our peer agencies, including the school district, public works, we started having more meetings about the funding and the financial plans in relation to as we look out five, 10 years in the future. And so it's about this investment costs, the immediate connection to the 27 budget. And normally we would have these policy discussions as part of a brown bag, as part of an informational meeting. in lieu of coming to you in front of you with a denial recommendation. And so staff's not here necessarily recommend denial that this is like a bad idea. It's really about trying to create pause in how do we have these policy discussions while we have a live application. With the live application, through Century Code, through zoning ordinance, we have legal responsibilities to act within so many days. And so that's why it's so important to have the public hearing today. While there might need time for a continuation or a recommendation for denial or accept our approval with conditions we can do that and so it's trying to balance those recommendations so i'll walk through those a little bit real quick if the city commission were to choose for recommendation to to support the Planning Commission to take their recommendation, we would ask for conditions related to working with engineering for review of the infrastructure design, the amenities plan, the special assessment and funding allocation plan, the 2027 budget with the finance department, and most importantly, the MOU with the City of Horace because we're along the western edge with Veterans Boulevard and sharing those costs with the city of Horace. Normally we would have time to work through these levels but the developer is on a timeline and a deadline and so that's why we're in front of you today as part of that but we know these are all steps that need to happen anyway so we just want to make sure that's clear and that the city commission is part of those processes as we move forward if you were to I think staff's recommendation is pretty straightforward really it's a timing thing and trying to fit in how we have those policy discussions within a review process And then three, the continuation, if the city commission were to choose and want to hear the discussion today, we could always continue the item for discussion in June 22nd or in July, depending on how you want to tease this up for your body or knowing obviously we're on the heels of an election process. So with that, we have three different options. I don't like bringing different options to you. And so with that, we would be here for questions or I would encourage, I'm sure the developer has elements or the public have elements that they want to discuss.

So it is a little complex, but I do think there's a couple things that have to figure it out. There's a budget question of adding staff to public works. Ben Dow's made clear on some of the things he cannot do. There's ideas of where we're leapfrogging, or it's a short leapfrog, or what do we have to do for infrastructure? There's a question on specials, which Commissioner Pepkorn has brought up and talked about before. Do we do it different for this development? It appears all the ducks aren't really in order quite yet for that, but it might be better to have a continuous so we can talk about it. But, Mayor Pipcorn, you had a question?

So I just wanna talk about the city's timeline as well. And so the diversion is gonna be done this fall, which we're all gonna celebrate that, but then it has to be certified. And so once it's certified, that will impact flood insurance, but also will impact the construction. They will no longer have to use as much fill and things like that. And then the other timeline we have is land development code, which is also, I believe that has to be completed before we do this. So the developers have a timeline, but the city has a timeline as well. And the other thing that's happening If you look at that proposed development, do you know what there's not out there? A tree. And so if you have multiple blizzards and you have blowing snow, you're gonna have blocked roads. Like on 1984 19th Avenue North, we had deaths on 19th Avenue because of blowing snow. People were killed. And so that could happen because what happens is the blizzards come, but then even if it's a snowy day and the wind blows, the roads get blocked. And if the roads get blocked, then police and fire can't get there. So to me, our priorities take priority over the developer's priorities. And I mean, obviously we know it's gonna develop and that's great, but we have to be prudent and cautious at this point. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Any questions, Nicole? I have to do a public hearing. Any questions for a particular person?

Thank you, Nicole. And I'm just curious from the balcony view, what are the pros and cons of us holding off just a few weeks to have a brown bag or an informal discussion or to listen more to each other? Are there immediate deadlines we just will miss or the developers will miss?

I'm sure the developer might have some opinion on that. I think in all fairness, the developer might be seeing the continuation recommendation for the first time tonight. And so probably just like you are. And so in terms of staff deadlines, our main concern is just having the public hearing because we have a live application.

Mr. Kolbeck.

Yeah, if we could, Mr. Chair, I would like to hear from the developers next, and then I have some comments after watching the Planning Commission meeting a couple times, but there was a number of arguments that were brought forward. I thought it was a thoughtful discussion, but it's your call, Mr. Chair.

We're now open for public hearing. Do we have anybody who would like to speak on this?

Yeah, thank you, Donald and Nicole. Mayor, commissioners, John Eunice with Eagle Ridge Development. Taking a step back, we've been talking about this project for a number of months. This isn't something that we've just rushed and gotten in front of you without any real discourse with city staff and talking through some of the hurdles. And I do appreciate the time that city staff spent on this, and they've been very upfront about their position from the get-go. Some of the things that, the reason why we feel it's important for this to move forward now is that, frankly, there is a single-family lot shortage in the city of Fargo. At the time of Planning Commission, we went, had someone drive around and counted. There was 125 single-family vacant lots that were available for construction. Since then there's been about 25 starts. So we're really sitting at about a hundred single-family lots that are available City of Fargo's average 360 single-family starts every single year It's going to take time to build through the deficit that we currently have it's not going to happen overnight This project is going to take time. We're just at step one of the of this entire development Getting the entitlements approved is the first piece that happens. Then we have to work with city staff on the design. Then we have to go through the bidding and construction process. And then eventually it gets to the point where there's single family homes that Public Works is then out there having to service the roads and those types of things. We're talking two years away from these lots being able to be really delivered to where you can get single family homes. That's two years where there really isn't any additional single family lot inventory that's going to be brought on to the city of Fargo. You think of the financial impact that new construction has on the economy as a whole. That's 300 less starts that are happening in the city of Fargo, which means less sales tax. It means less residents. There's a cascading impact. It's everything down to the Amazon purchases that go to these single family homes when they're built and people are living in there. The next thing I want to talk about is the investment that the city of Fargo has already made in this area. Just like a month ago, you guys approved the 64th Avenue interchange. Having pavement stop less than a mile from the on and off ramps and hitting a gravel road, to me, the reason the discussion came up between 64th and 76th was a lot of the connectivity issues. We know 64th has to get paved. It's paved to the west of us, and it's paved to the east of us. There's a stretch that needs to be paved in the middle that our development front's on. There's been almost $80 million of investment that the city of Fargo's made in this area between the new interchange that's going in, Lake Fargo, the extension of all the infrastructure down 45th and 64th Avenue. There's a new fire station that's under two miles away from this property. Then the other thing I wanna talk about is the housing study. It was brought up earlier. That housing study says that there needs to be somewhere around 7,500 to 8,000 single family homes built between now and 2032. Without lots, available lots, it's impossible to get to those numbers. And what impact is that gonna have on housing affordability for our region? So with that, I'll open up any questions you guys have.

Usually it's just you get to speak to what you need to, unless there's a question the commissioner has. Commissioner Turnberg?

Can you let us know what the price ranges of these homes would be? Are they starter homes, mid-level, high-end, or what are we looking at?

Yeah, so these lots range in sizes. So we have some lots that are 50 feet wide, and they go all the way up to 70 foot wide. I'm expecting home prices to be in the $350,000 to $650,000 price point, depending on the lots. The smaller the lot, the less special assessments. Generally, you can get a more affordable home on them.

Go back.

Yeah, it was after, as I've said, watching the Planning Commission meeting, and I thought it was a very thorough, good debate between the Commission members and the staff. And for additional information on kind of impact of this kind of process, I would recommend others taking a look at that if you haven't seen it. And I was prepared to come in and support the recommendation of the Planning Commission, which did go against, which is very rare, the staffing The other thing you didn't mention is the $250 million of new value that this development brings to the city in taxable revenues. And in addition to the 140 other homes you're gonna be adding in the next year in other development, to your point, we still need about 360 homes a year just to keep up with pace, which housing is a workforce issue as well, which we know very well we have a shortage here. I'm hesitating here now on the recommendation. By the way, this is a half mile away from the existing sewer infrastructure. The other point that was made by staff, which I thought was really important to Ben Dow's point was we're talking about the addition of two additional staff for snow removal. That recommendation has been brought forward as part of budgeting process to staff and leadership over the last five or six years that with a growing city, we need the staffing to support that growth and making sure we can provide the services. And so, you know, unfortunately I'll say it this way. I have complete confidence that the entire cabinet leadership team with the directors of every department can in the next two years find a solution to add two more staff to Public Works to manage this growth for general services. And when you add the investment already made to date, the need for housing, To me, the Planning Commission recommendation to approve this really made a lot of sense. So that's my comment. And I'm happy to make a motion here in a second. My question is, but is 3 continuing the application to provide more time to come back with some of these questions that remained open at that discussion before in a date certain time by the end of June for consideration, an acceptable remedy for now that would work with the development and the work that's been done to date over these last several months. I don't know if that's an appropriate question for the development and the staff. I just want to put all the cards on the table there.

Well, I'll jump in real quick. And you did bring up a good point on the new value. And that was just for this one phase, the $250 million. This is phase one of a four phase and ten year project. In total, we're talking about over a billion dollars of additional property value in this area. So it's not a this isn't an inconsequential amount of construction that's going to happen here. It's going to be focused growth for a long period of time. In terms of the continuation, we've had these same discussions with city staff. A lot of the issues, we think that the issues they bring up, while they may be valid, they're a little disconnected from what we're actually asking for right now. All we're looking for is approval and zoning. There's no infrastructure request in front of you. Eventually we'll get to that, but that's a step down the road. um you know i feel like there's plenty of time between now and then for for staff to keep working um and come up with their uh their needs for this this new growth area is your company prepared if need be to pay for the specials of the project itself not the not the roads but the entire internal what's your housing uh we'd have to have we'd have to have continued discussions with city staff that would have to be a discussion yeah i i would say that um

Changing from the norm is is would be I think there would be a lot of policy related Changes that the city would have to go through and I don't think that those are something that would happen just from our Discussion with with city staff just doesn't land develop a code There's been some discussion of perhaps a developer and said are we going a hundred percent as perhaps the developer takes 25 or 40 percent and City takes 60 percent just in a way to keep our bonding down, but that's to me. That's a discussion point That's something that would have to be discussed on the infrastructure costs. I

Yeah, and I think we can have those discussions. Right now, it's hypotheticals because we don't have a project that can actually move forward.

When I talked to Mark Thielen, he had said that you guys would be willing to do that, so I think there has to be a discussion. So, Mr. Pipkin.

So, Mr. Chair, the developer said it's two years away. And so we have time and that's why I would support option number three to continue this, to get more of this clarified, all these things. And then on top of that, you might think that's not that big of a deal, but having it certified to be flood protected, that's a big deal. The other thing is in two years, the land development code hopefully will be completed by then. And so all those things would make it much more clear what's expected. Then on top of that, hopefully we'll have reforms of the specials. And so I do think that's another thing that will have a very big impact on everybody, the developers and the city. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Strand.

Thank you. Wow, that's an amazing investment. Those numbers are hard to comprehend sometimes. I guess, as I'm seeing the discussion, it's boiling down to smart growth versus focused growth, and where's the middle? What could that look like? Nicole, maybe you might remember, and I think I have a sense of it, but this reminds me of the Davies expansion discussion when they moved the high school way down beyond any development. And people are going, that's never going to fill up. How long did that take, do you know, to fill up?

It reminds me of that, exactly, as well as the Osgoode area. And, you know, so anytime you're, you know, venturing into uncharted greenfield territory, what we've seen is, you know, fills up within 10 years. So the demand is there, you know, and it's really about the financial implications and the carrying costs and the services that go with that. Our number one concern, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation, I'll just have to call it out, but in the Planning Commission discussion that came out is with the 3% infrastructure cap. And so when we don't know where that funding source is coming from to support general fund operations, which includes public works, that is part of our major questions. And so you're really, just for the city commission to understand, and I'm stepping out of my lane here, but it's really tying your hands as a commissioner to the July to the 2027 budget process. And there is time, as John mentioned, you know, whether it's the 27 budget, 28 budget, or 29 budget, but just to know that's a question that now gets funneled in. And to John's point, everything about this application is unique and different than how we've been doing business for the last 30 years. And so staff is, this is new territory for all of us. And so to have these deep, discussions on how our systems are gonna have to change to accommodate the 3% is part of it.

Mr. Chair, are you done? I am done. Mr. Chair. Mr. Turnbull.

What are the ramifications of delaying this? Would you consider moving to a different city to develop there? Would you move to Horace or West Fargo or Moorhead and then Fargo would lose out on all of this development?

Yeah, great question. It takes a lot of effort to get these developments moving on the front end. And delaying, ultimately, a delay right now ends up delaying when that infrastructure gets designed and when it gets constructed. It's going to take time for city staff to work through these designs. I mean, there's sewer that has to be brought from 45th Street over. There's about a half a mile of extra road. But they're big projects that take some time to design. We do have projects in the area and I hesitate to say that we're gonna focus all of our efforts there. I mean, we're Fargo developers and we've made it our business to continue to provide housing options for people in this community and we're gonna keep trying to do that.

So Mr. Chair, what we all know is once the diversion is done, we now have a finite boundary and we all know that's eventually going to fill in. So we should be in no rush and we certainly shouldn't, if they start threatening us, act because of threats. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Strand.

John, I'm just curious with this development. Tell me again, how many single-family housing units?

There's about 180 in this phase.

And in your modeling, are you anticipating a two-year tax exemption for new homes?

We didn't model any of that into the budgeting on the home side. Would that be on the homeowner side? That would be on the homeowner side. So we work to provide lots to the builders and then the builders sell to the homeowners who then apply for that.

Because I know there's discussions, people want that gone, those incentives, those exemptions, but thank you.

Just because it's a public hearing, John, I have to ask if anybody else wants to speak.

Good afternoon. Thank you for allowing me the time to speak. I'm Don Dabber, President of Dabber Custom Homes and President of Lost Creek. In conjunction with Lost Creek, we're also developing Colby Ranch, which is a mile to the east. So a lot of these have some parallel discussions, points that are very similar between all of them. Some of the things that I guess John had commented on whether or not we can go somewhere or not that's really kind of beside the point because we're Fargo Fargo builders Fargo developers we want to be here and obviously it's more of a need for housing in the Metro and I addressed the Planning Commission that I remember quite some years ago. Mr. Gilmore and I would always look at the number of lots. We'd have a map and there was usually a healthy inventory was two to three years. We're probably two weeks to two months worth of inventory right now. And we're definitely seeing that because there's a number of people that we are meeting with on a continual basis that say we have to they have to go somewhere else because there is no. There's just no lots available in Fargo, so they have to make the choice between a West Fargo or horse or something else for that. And again, with the school districts and everything that they want to be there, so we definitely want to have it there, but. I think what's important is that whether it's too delayed today by four weeks or even two months, it's a much bigger question that we have to solve and a problem that isn't going to be solve in the next four weeks or even two months because to some of the questions about specials and how will we maybe come up with a hybrid of some financing that we don't yet know and what will that look like? But that's all stuff that has to happen. I can tell you we're also developing stuff in Horace, which is on the other side of 57th, which has been going on this proposed MOU for about five years. So my confidence that anything is going to happen with the MOU, any time soon, I'm hopeful. Hey, you know, there's always a chance. So my point is that I think we have to have a catalyst. And by at least accepting this to go forward to the next step, we're not ordering pipe. We're not putting anything in the ground yet. It's still a very, very long process before we can actually begin construction and then actually start building homes out there. But be able to have something in the pipeline to be able to show where we're at, to have somebody to be able to plan accordingly for that, I think is what's so important. A lot of good points brought up about the diversion and everything else, when that will be certified, construction will be done, certification a number of years out yet. But we're just looking to be good stewards of not only just the resources of the city, but to be good partners in the community. And I think it does go a long way to help this get started. Deer Creek, Davies, I mean, Osgoode, I can tell you all of them. I probably could go back and look at my testimony from all of those, and it's probably going to be very similar. And they've all been successful developments. So thank you. Open to any questions or comments.

Thank you, Don. Anybody else want to speak? Those in public hearing. A couple things could be managed by the delay. I'm meeting with the horse mayor next week. We have a sewer project we've talked about for five years now, and that will decrease the cost of the infrastructure if we have a deal with horse to help pay for that project, which would help in the construction of the road. There is a discussion on specials that we're taking up, which I don't know to delay until the new commission is seated or to have the discussion now, but whether developers take part of the cost of the specials has been part of the discussion. The other issue that we got into is the budget, and I don't know if Mike can reveal in the budget if we're talking about two people in Ben's department and or a new grader. That's a considerable cost. But Nicole hit it on the bucket is that 3% cap has really made it very difficult for us, in a sense, to grow. And the community has grown by 20% in 10 years. We've had the biggest growth in the Midwest area. We're in the growing cities. The difficulty is we've never stopped construction before. We've never slowed down in development. Last year, we had 200 new homes. We normally run 400 to 500 homes a year. Last year, 200 homes. This year, we'll be lucky if we even come close to that. West Fargo has 50 lots. We're down to 100. I mean, we used to have 500 lots available at any time. You could drive around Fargo and figure out where you wanted to live, north side, east side, wherever you wanted to live, you'd find something that you could at least look at. I don't think there's anything gained by rushing this. If we at least have some discussions June by June, at least have an open meeting in which the commissioners can become aware. But when I talk to Tom Nachmus, he says, where is he going to put his CIP? Where is he going to put the money that we do on a yearly basis? Where are we going to put our growth? Is it going to be on 64th and a concrete road or 64th and a paved road? What are the things we're going to put in there? And I think the commissioners have to weigh in. I don't think it's something that's lightly made. Not wanting to slow down growth and development, it is time for a pause and have a discussion. So I would favor the third option so the staff could have more discussions and the developer could be in the room and have an honest answer to what they think they can afford as well. So I'm looking for a motion.

I'll make the motion for option number three, Mr. Chair. Is there a second?

Did you say option three? Yes. Second. Nicole, what did you want?

is it possible to select a date june 22nd or july 20th mr peckhorn mr chair i'd recommend july 20th just because even if it just everything takes time i guess well that's all right your new commissioners have to weigh in too they've been talking about specials well and that's what i i do think you have it's going to take time to let everybody participate as well so i i think the i would recommend the july 20th if that's acceptable to everybody else

John, you'll be there. I would prefer the 22nd of June, because we're still sitting here, even though it may continue. But I just want to know where this group's thinking is prior to a passing of the baton leadership-wise. That's just my thoughts.

Mr. Chair, but Commissioner Strand, but we have to include everybody, the builders, the developers, the public, and that just takes time. But if we can get it done, I totally get what you're saying there, too. Do you get what I'm saying?

He would go with the 22nd with the knowledge that it could continue and may well continue to the next commission. I'm all for it, for seconding that.

So... 22nd of June.

yes with the option to continue it if if necessary can you make that part of the motion please yeah i think the motion is is it's option three which would with june 22nd with staff having discretion to move it to july july 20th if need be okay thank you any other discussion

with that i'm sorry mr chair with with it being june 22nd i'll support this knowing there's a finite window here but i respect that this i i was going to vote number one but i'll support it with that date any other discussion last thing i'll say mayor this is amazing this type of a of a scale of a development of housing i mean i i just can't be in you know it's a it's bigger than a lot of cities in the state

you know, 160 homes. So, you know, and I just think it behooves us to do everything we can with our staff and their expertise and their guidance to do everything we can to help this city grow smartly.

Mike, I see you at the table. Do you want to say something?

I was just going to address the question, a mayor that you would pose just about the 27 budget process. And that is that we are just getting that underway, but I just want to support our staff and note that that 3% property tax cap piece on revenue constriction is real. It is something that we're going to have to think about longterm. And it is something that we just need to really be really thoughtful about how we grow, how we develop. And I just want to support our planning department, support the public works department, And also the implementation, the proper implementation of our LDC to really make sure we're listening to that, we're being thoughtful and comprehensive. So that's all I wanted to share. But certainly with your motion tonight, I will look forward to the conversation with the commission. We'll definitely support that over the next month and look forward to those follow-up visits on this topic. So thank you.

Thank you.

Just one more clarifying point. Just to clarify, the growth plan is not meant to be linear by grid. It's focusing on an entire grid and what's there and what investment makes sense with that kind of discretion. It's very important. Stilling had smart, intentional growth, but that intention was never completely linear and black and white. And so I thought that was an important discussion point as well. I'll stop talking now.

Any other discussions? Good discussion, thank you. Roll call, please.

Papcorn?

Aye.

Strand?

Yes.

Kolpak? Aye. Turnburg? Aye. Mahoney?

Aye. Item 31, receive due diligent report for the top two finalists.

Pretty thorough in all that we did, and as Ian pointed out, all of the developers involved in this, beginning with the nine.

We don't know what can go. I believe something totally unbelievable can go there. The Science Center, I think that can fit lots of places. So would you talk a little bit about that, Ryan, the certified sites? Would that be a potential? And would we have to pay you to do that?

Well, I can talk a little bit about the certified sites. Ryan Oss, I'm with the Greater Fargamore EDC, by the way. So we have, for a number of years, invested in building out a certified site program called Document Ready Sites. Really where it starts is willing landowner that wants to enroll a site into this program and really collect data on the site. So where all the utilities are, geotechnical studies, environmental phase one, phase two, wetland delineation, obviously floodplain and flood zones are really important to it. And for the purpose of attracting investment from either national and international projects, usually industrial in nature, but could be commercial or could be some other projects. And so this is really kind of a speed-to-market tool and an ability to reach a market that we might not otherwise in terms of site selectors or developers that are looking at investing in a marketplace. So, I mean, we really usually start with a couple things. One, do we have a willing landowner? And two, are they willing to put a price on a site? There's some things that make sites more or less attractive access to infrastructure, to interstates, to rail, other things. And so I don't want to say we're not choosy because we are choosy. But really, that would be where the where the conversation would start is willing landowner enterprise.

But Ryan, you haven't necessarily had anybody that's shopping at that site. We've had this sitting now for four or five years. We have some environmental issues. EPA is going to kind of help us out with that as well. So it would take some steps before it'd be ready for commercial use.

yeah i i mean i i think there's a lot of upfront costs just to even understand the viability of a project now if someone came along and did all of that pre-work it makes that site i would say more marketable and you could go out to and i always think about it if we've got if we're competing with 10 other places and all things being equal, there's a blank spot on one of our sites because we don't understand all of the maybe the potential, you know, ground impacts the environmental impacts. Then we're going to be taken off that list because there is a question marker or maybe a uncertainty about that location.

We have one speaker, Rocky Schneider. We're in a couple hats tonight, huh, Rocky?

You know, we could have picked a better day to all be here when it's not 90 outside, right? But this is another exciting project, and I want to make a couple points on this. I had the joy of being involved with the diversion project, working on flood protection in this, and also acquiring this site. I also had the joy of working with Chris, previous speaker, on the housing authority project at the Lashkowitz High Rise, getting an EPA brownfield grant. i appreciate commissioner popcorn's comments because i think they're all right on except for the fact that this site's different because it's not a desirable site right now it won't be until you go through the effort to find federal funding to clean it up it's not a feasible site as the mayor said it's been years and no one's expressed interest in it and in order to get a brownfield grant as i know i've been through this process with the city previously you need to have an end result in mind It helps get through that process. It makes you more competitive. And so I just encourage the city to go quickly down that Brownfield grant route, especially while Senator Hoeven is motivated by it. You saw him ask a question at EPA hearing last week or two weeks ago on it. But that's with an end goal in mind. And so the city needs to figure out an end goal more than it needs to RFP. And so if it's not a science museum, it does need to have an end goal. And I think right now it hasn't necessarily been a huge priority for the city to find that end goal. And this is one that happened to come to the city. And so I think the motion isn't to give away land or anything like that. It's to start working down toward that process so that there's an end goal in mind is what you need to get EPA funding. and without epa funding the city does not have the funding to clean up this site to get it back to a marketable property and so i think that's just the consideration if you're going to seek federal funding you need to have that end goal in mind i did get up here to say that it is very much congruent with the downtown and focus plan which you may have heard about But I you know spent years develop you know developing that so that we could look at these properties and have end goals in mind and I believe the city's also done some public and input in on this as well and I think people want a public use of some sort or a community use versus an industrial site as Ryan mentioned is one possibility there I think when that was bought out the whole purpose was to try to figure out how it could be a community-based It is, I have the picture up in my office of like 1870 Fargo and this is where our community started is right on that property. It's cool to think of all the ideas that could come in to then science museum fits that and narrative in my opinion. Thank you.

Okay. Any other public discussion? We have a motion.

I will advance the motion and then I'll call on the science folks if they could tell us about their project.

Okay. Is there a second?

The motion is I move to authorize city staff and the city attorney's office to initiate and engage in discussions with the FM Science Museum on the potential siting of the Science Museum on the Mid-America Steel Site at 92 and 106 N.P. Avenue North.

I second that motion.

admission is it okay if we have absolutely everybody's okay with the mayor commissioners appreciate your time i'm reed madison board chair uh what i want to encourage you to do is just think about this as a discussion this is a starting point we're not here to ask for anything right now and one more thing i will just challenge you on is to when we think about the value of this site i want to just I want you to expand a little bit about what is value. Value can be the dollar amount that we can get on a sale of it, but it can be so many more things. It could be about a potential asset to the community that draws people into downtown, that drives them here for tourism, that impacts the quality of life for the residents here as well. So something just to keep in mind as we think about what this could potentially be and where we could potentially go. And with that, I'll turn it over to Jesse maybe just to speak a little bit about the museum.

Thank you. I just would like a few minutes just to sort of introduce you to the scale of the project. We're calling it a science museum, not a science center. And we're anticipating a quarter million people for the first two years and stabilizing in year three at probably 200,000. It's about 60,000 square foot, 23,000 square feet of exhibit space. But I think what I really want to say is that it's a community project. We have so many voices and so many lenses in this. We met with scientists and we asked them about what content should be in here. We asked the STEM companies what technical skills gaps and workforce needs were. We asked teachers what standards they're struggling to fulfill. And we asked children and teens and adults and everyone what they're proud of in the region and what we should build. And we've had museum planning professionals help us find the right size. We're the largest city center in the region. feel like i could i know we're kind of tight on time but i would love an opportunity to show you the scale of the project and what we're building because we really are imagining a destination science museum on par with any major city and we deserve this and we have tremendous support and we have so much to be proud of so much innovation so many things that put us on the global map and we need a place to illuminate that we need a place for families to go indoors in the winter We need the 70% of North Dakota tourists to want to stay overnight and they're asking for attractions like this So I'll stop there, but I just I would love an opportunity to show you what we're building We'll make appointments with the commissioners so they can see your presentation.

It's a nice presentation Any other discussion? Mr. Kolpat.

Mr. Chair, so I certainly support this entire idea of a science museum in our metro. I just, this is a confusing motion for me because I don't want to limit those conversations to what other possibilities are out there. If this is just a beginning conversation with the city and it becomes what it becomes with no expectation or limitation, fine, right? I mean, I totally support that. I just, it just seems,

Mr. Stern. We have an empty slate ahead of us. And Commissioner Papkorn, your conversation, that's exactly the type of things we need to vet. Are there other requirements or guidelines or guardrails that would... And they need to be present in this whole conversation going forward if there's any partnership that would unfold. Are there RFPs required? Is there values and purchase... I don't know. I just think that it's up to us to decide if we would like to open the door and see where it could conceivably go. Now, I'll say one last thing and... I'm not a dinosaur expert guy, okay? And maybe Jesse can help me understand, but if I understand, if I remember correctly, the biggest dinosaur maybe found in North America or something like that is Bob from Western North Dakota. And I believe this artifact was sold to some billionaire in Dubai. then it has come back out into the public uh wouldn't be in my mind wouldn't it be great if bob was in his home state at some pla at some point in time that the music this dinosaur is am i correct on that jesse tell me about bob just in a quick second oh my goodness okay you're correct in parts uh one of the most complete uh triceratops found and it went up for auction uh

to the residents of North Dakota first for 1.2 million, and there was nowhere to put it. The Heritage Center already had Triceratops, so it went to market. It sold, I can't remember, in the teens of millions, and it was going to be a waiting room spectacle in a dentist's office, I think, and then something went wrong. It's in a good place, and it's traveling in children's museums right now, so at the moment, it landed in a good place, but yeah, it would be good to get home.

Roll call vote, please.

Strand?

Yes.

Turnburg? Aye. Kolpak? Aye. Epcorn? Aye. Mahoney?

Aye. Ladies on reports, Commissioner Strand.

Thank you, Mayor. I should have written the details down, but in a nutshell, the Recovery Resource Center's ribbon cutting is the 28th at 2 p.m. And this has been a long time coming, the transition of this public health service from downtown in the former police station over to the location over across from Buhalla in that vicinity near the police station. So I believe, Jen, am I right, is it 2 o'clock on Thursday? And it's a public event, and it gives you a chance to tour the facility, see what it looks like, and see it the first day it's open.

Mr. Kolpak?

Yeah, I have. Four slides today, two of them related to solid waste. So let's start there. We just finished up the spring cleanup week. And thank you to everyone who participated and worked and contributed, the crews for another successful cleanup week. We hauled 1,200 loads of unwanted items from our neighborhoods. and 1.572 tons of debris. I also want to share my appreciation to all residents for helping keep our community clean. And anyone who missed cleanup, we can still dispose of large items year round at the residential transfer station located at the landfill. And then as part of that, I did a ride along, next slide please, had the opportunity to ride along and actually participate in Spring Cleanup Week. That's me on the right. And then there I am with Truck Norris. We saw that great video at the beginning of the meeting. So I know the staff is really excited and that definitely is their favorite name. The third slide. The Fire Department had an opportunity to participate in a pinning and a graduation. So the pinning was last Friday for six newly promoted captains. It was the first kind of a pinning ceremony experience that we tried and I thought it went very well. And then following that was the graduation for nine recruits who completed the Metro Fire Academy, which is a reminder, a collaboration of Fargo, West Fargo and Moorhead. And even though this year there weren't West Fargo graduates in this class, they were still here and helping us celebrate and elevate all of the work of the academy. Five of the recruits, as I said, joined the Fargo Fire Department and four are with Moorhead. And we wish everyone the best, including the new promotees. In the last slide this morning, we had a very touching ceremony, an academy graduation for seven recruits who completed the Fargo Police Academy, but also very poignantly as those new officers were sworn in, our new Chief of Police, Travis Stefanowicz, was also sworn in along with the class. And there was a really touching video. If you have time, go take a look at Chief Stefanowicz's career and beginnings and some of the comments he made and his own experience getting through the academy and the training. His family was here. He had a lot of supporters here and it was just a really touching ceremony. So congratulations, Chief, and congratulations to all of our new officers. Those are my updates.

Well, I didn't have any slides. I was just gonna have the chief stand up and give him a round of applause because he was sworn in today. What was fun about your video is we saw you when you started as a police officer, and it was fun to see you at that time of your life with a little more hair and a little bit different face features. But we had a lot of recruits from all over the country. People are coming from all over with all sorts of backgrounds. And it was really fun when we swore in the young officers just what type of candidates we are attracting in this community. And, Chief, you changed it up a little bit today when you gave your statement as you took in the new role you have, and humility came out of that, and humility and wanting to serve our community. And I think you gave a different message to the core group of officers of what's your expectation, and it's what can we do better for the community. And I think that will resonate around the community, and I appreciate that. Mr. Turnbull?

No update.

Mr. Pepkorn? We have three speakers. Dylan Hanson is first. Over there, yeah. And the rules, Dylan, are up on the guidelines up there that you can see.

All right. Do you need me to state my name? Your name Dylan Hanson put in a request to speak about the Animals disturbing the peace ordinance the way the ordinance is written and Does not allow the police to accept like video footage proving that this is occurring and that's a non-emergency call to get the police out there to look at this. This was just last Thursday, and at the advice of the officer, he told me to bring this to your guys' attention. It was 44 minutes from the time I called to the time they arrived on scene, which, it's a non-emergency, obviously, it's gonna take longer. The dog has then since quit being a nuisance So there's essentially nothing they can do with the way the ordinance is written. I guess I'm asking for you guys to relook at that ordinance and see if you can provide a different route about it. That's all I got for that.

So Ian can look into that. If you have your contact information, we can get back to that, Dylan. Yep. Okay. Scott Brekke.

Yes, Scott Brickey, resident of Fargo. I just have a couple comments about special assessments. Recently, I was going through my own property, and I was looking at my specials. I have eight specials, and I'm paying about $1,000 in interest annually. I went ahead and called in and paid off two of those to reduce my specials, but then a couple days later, I was listening to the meeting about the convention center, excuse me, And I heard the same proposal about the $500,000 for 2224 Street, the old police station, valued at $500,000. So I quickly went online and looked to see what it was valued at, which was at $2.3 million. But the one thing I noticed, it had $25,000 in specials. So I thought that was odd that the owner of the building is the city of Fargo, but it also has specials at an interest rate. So then I typed in the address of the Civic Center. The Civic Center has 467,000 in specials and pays over 20,000 a year in interest. Then I typed in this address, which has two parcels that totals about 1.5 million in specials and 80,000 in interest. So I guess my I know this is not a Q&A but my question I did not know that the city of Fargo also either pays half of their own infrastructure and then takes a loan out for their other half and at an interest rate. I don't know if there's a way to get the total amount of city-owned property on how much the city owns in specials, how much they're paying in interest, and what the process, are we using bonds to offset that interest cost? are how that kind of works. So I guess I would be curious, I don't know also on the budget line for the Civic Center, not to just poll at the Civic Center, but the Civic Center has a budget of 229,000, but 63,000 a year is getting paid on specials. Is that 229,000, is 63,000 of that budget? Going on there or where is that 63,000 coming from? So I guess as far as you know we use the word a lot about transparency I'm just going through and looking at how I can see to kind of do the math and see where it all works up So sorry for being nervous.

I'm 97 degrees outside and I'm fat We could look into that that's a question I could probably answer after the meeting the Jamie Carlson I Jamie's not here. Susan, could you answer the question on the specials or Tom on the Civic Center? Does somebody have it?

Oh, they'll follow.

Okay, thank you. Meeting's adjourned.