Health & Human Needs Committee - Regular Meeting

Everybody hear me okay now? All right. Sounds good. So might as well get this thing started right away. Sorry, I apologize I'm late, everybody. We'll call the meeting to order. The Health and Human Needs Committee Opioid Settlement Subcommittee. It is 5.04. Could we please get a roll call?

Sure. Division Administrator Todd Campbell?

Here.

Co-Chair Joe Gailey? Here. Supervisor Berman?

Present.

Jenny Lee? Present. Supervisor Wegleitner? Here. Dr. Elizabeth Salisbury-Offshar?

Here and I am parking and walking in, but I called in for roll call.

Supervisor Barouchak.

Here.

Ariel Smith. Smith here. We have quorum.

Excellent. Thank you. Um, before we get into the minutes, we have election of officers. Um, the next item is that, so beginning with the position of chair. Yeah, go ahead.

Sorry. Can I move or maybe just want to see if there's any objection from the committee on doing a brief round of introductions just because we have some new subcommittee members, Joe?

That is a great idea. Yes, let's do that, please. Thanks. Would you like to start?

I can start, sure. I'm Heidi Weigleiter, and I am on the Health and Human Needs Committee, and I'm the Health and Human Needs Committee representative to this subcommittee, and have not been on this subcommittee the entire time, but for the last... year and a few months. And I'm grateful to be here again. And I've been on the board since 2012 and I chair the Health and Human Needs Committee. I maybe already said that. And represent District 2, which is the near east side of Madison.

Thank you. And Kelsey, might you be able to help me out and just kind of go down the list?

Absolutely.

Thank you.

We'll start around the table and we'll go with Supervisor Fuhrman.

Hi, my name is Keith Fuhrman. I am currently the chair of the Public Protection and Judiciary Committee, and I am a supervisor representing District 10, which is on Madison's west side. Happy to be here.

Hi, I'm Colin Baruchak. I represent District 1 on the County Board. That's the neighborhood surrounding the State Capitol building. and the district we're sitting in right now. So happy to get started.

I'm Todd Campbell. I'm the Behavioral Health Division Administrator for Dane County Human Services. Been on the committee as our director's designee since it was formed. Happy to have you both here.

And I'm Kelsey Goldson, the staff member that just sits quietly and takes notes. So next we'll go to Arielle Smith.

Hi, Kelsey. Also, you might have to tilt your mic a little bit. It's hard for us to hear you. Yep. Okay. Hi, I'm Arielle Smith. I am the Public Health Madison and Dane County designee on behalf of the Board of Health and our health officer. And I have been on the committee similarly to Todd since its inception.

Jenny Lee.

Hi, I'm Jenny Lee. I am a behavioral health therapist, um, and grant coordinator at the UW at UW health, behavioral health, youth, and family, um, working, um, exclusively with adolescents and their families and, um, was, and the teen or the teen, sorry, the youth voice is my role on this committee. I joined last spring.

Co-chair Gailey.

I'm Joe Gailey. I'm co-chair of this and I started since its inception as well. I'm a person with lived and living experience of drug use. I like to do outreach and I guess that's about it.

And finally, we have Dr. Elizabeth Salisbury-Afshar. Can you hear us?

Yeah, and I'm so sorry. I'll be there momentarily. I'm just getting into the building. I am an addiction medicine and public health and family medicine physician. I run a walk-in clinic for people who use substances and also work in the hospital setting and just was in the hospital, which is why I'm running late. So I apologize for that.

And that is all of our subcommittee members. So back to you, Joe.

Joe, would it be all right if we had Felicia Benke-Shaw, the new Opioid Settlement Coordinator person also take a minute to introduce herself?

By all means, please do.

Okay, awesome. Felicia, do you want to come to the table there?

Hi, everyone. I'm Felicia Bengi-Shaw. I am the new opioid settlement coordinator. I come from an outpatient clinic in Waukesha. So a little bit about myself, I consider myself a harm reductionist, and I look forward to meeting with all of you and talking about how I can play a role in this subcommittee. I'm a trained clinical therapist by trade, so that I come from a treatment background as well. So I've been around for a long time and have over 15 years of experience in the behavioral health field. Nice to meet you all.

Welcome. All right. I guess we can get on with the agenda. Next is B, election of officers. And we have chair up. At this time, I will open nominations for chair.

I guess I have a question. That's all right. I think under the prior term, the subcommittee utilized a co-chair model. Is that something that the subcommittee is still open to? Could I make a nomination for Joe Gailey and Jenny Lee to co-chair the subcommittee? Would you find that in order, Chair?

Yes, and then we could go around and see how everybody else feels about that and see if there's any other nominations. If people want to nominate somebody else, that would. But yeah, I would agree that chair and co-chair would be beneficial for the committee.

Okay, I'll make that nomination for the two of them as co-chairs.

We had a second?

Yep, second by Supervisor Furman.

Supervisor Furman seconds.

And then I think you have to ask for, are there any other nominations?

Are there any other nominations for chair and co-chair?

And then you ask two more times.

Two more times, okay.

Or maybe one more time.

Thank you. Are there any other nominations that anybody would like to see? Hearing none, any discussions?

I'll speak to the nomination. I really appreciate the community aspect of membership on this opioid settlement subcommittee, and so I'm really grateful that both of you, I believe, accepted the nomination. You didn't say no yet, but... I just think it's really helpful to have that voice on something that's so important. And for folks who both of you have really worked in this space for a long time and bring a lot of important experience and values and commitment to serve us. So thanks for stepping up and I'm honored to support you. And if, just let me also say that I know it's, government processes can be a little mysterious or challenging. There's different rules and things like that. But know that there are, you know, supervisors here and county board staff and department staff that are here to support you and answer your questions and things like that. So thanks a lot for stepping up.

I just have a question that I'd like to ask, I guess, probably Heidi. Well, anyone can answer this. Is that what are the responsibilities of a co-chair to this committee?

That's a good question. So the chairs approve the agenda. They set the agenda, they approve the agendas for the meetings, and then they chair the meetings. And so I think like last time, I think the co-chairs alternated chairing the meetings. So I think that's the primary responsibility is kind of planning the meeting and chairing the meeting. And I think it's a good practice to to meet with staff, um, ahead of setting that agenda. So you all can be on the same page about what's going to be on that agenda and make sure that the people that, um, you know, the right people are invited to the meeting and know that, you know, and available to attend and those types of things do any sort of follow up with the help of staff to make sure that that meeting is, is planned, um, for success.

Does that help? Yeah, when you say meet with staff, could you define who that staff is?

Well, so Kelsey, our administrative staff, so Kelsey who will, you know, puts together the agendas and makes sure that they are then loaded, you know, get to the right county clerk staff and loaded into the legislative tracking system. So Kelsey and then hopefully, you know, work with Felicia Becky Shaw as well in her new role that can be supportive of the subcommittee.

Okay. And Joe, I have a question for you. You have been a co-chair for a number of years. So I assume kind of understand how to upload the documents or what kind of format and things like that. Is it pretty standard? Yeah.

I don't do a lot of that stuff. Rick took care of a lot of it, but we have Kelsey to help us out through things and maybe get a little bit of training, hopefully. So I think, I mean, you will do just fine. Thanks, Joe.

Kelsey, the county staff and the county board and county clerk staff, they take care of all the logistical aspects to getting the stuff online and attached and everything like that. So you don't have to worry about that piece.

Okay. Are there any other questions or discussion? Hearing none, is there any abstentions? I am honored to accept the nomination. Jenny, would you like to accept or decline?

I will accept the nomination. Thank you.

All right. This one doesn't need a vote, I don't think, since they're is only us, so I really appreciate the opportunity to be chair with Jenny as co-chair. I'll definitely do my best to keep us on track and stay focused and help keep the work that we do going forward. Anything to say, Jenny?

um yes just that i am looking forward to working with my old friend joe we've presented together in the past a lot of times and done some work together so i think we're a good team um hence making me more comfortable in this role so that's great and yes i'm i'm up for learning any new things i need to learn and um please whenever i do something wrong jump in and remind me the right way to do it. And I'll be very thankful for that. And I take feedback really well, so please give me feedback. Thank you.

All right. I guess we can move on to see approval of the minutes from the previous meeting, which was April 6th, 2026. Can I get a motion to approve the minutes? I'll make a motion. All right. Is there a second?

I'll second.

All right. Any discussions? Abstentions? Which might come first. All right. All those in favor, say aye.

Aye. Aye. Aye.

Any opposed? All right. Motion carries. Next, we have phone transfers. I don't think there is any referrals, resolutions, and ordinance amendments. I don't think we have any. Item F, items requiring committee action. All right, I don't hear any. Oh, we have the comprehensive needs assessment. By Elizabeth Salisbury, she kind of wrote it. The attachment is on the agenda if anybody wants to read it. Um, I guess I can open that for a discussion.

Chair, can I say something?

Yeah, please. Okay.

Thanks. Um, well, I will, I guess. Move that the county that the subcommittee, um. I guess supports pursuing a comprehensive needs assessment as outlined in the proposal developed by Elizabeth.

So we'll second. Second.

And just to speak a bit to the motion.

So we have had this on the agenda in past meetings, but we haven't met in a while. And we haven't actually taken sort of official action on it to say, yes, this is what we want to move forward with as a subcommittee. So I thought it was important when Joe and I were planning the agenda that we put this back on. And also give a little short overview maybe for our new committee members. And I don't know if, was it, you'd be kind of willing to do that? I know you've done it multiple times in the past. I just don't know if they've had a chance to like review those videos or anything yet. And obviously if there's any other feedback or proposed amendments to this, You know now would be the time to to discuss those or move those changes as well, but I think that we've you know have discussed this we've gotten a lot of input from the Community about kind of the need for this and I think. You know. kind of officially saying that we want to do this and we want to incorporate it maybe, you know, into our recommendation that we deliver to the Health and Human Needs Committee would make sense at this time.

I do not have it pulled up and I'm frantically trying to get there. So I'm emailing Kelsey. Can you send it to me? I'm happy to go through it.

Well, maybe Kelsey can pull up. Look at Todd.

I did not open my computer when I got here. Thank you. Thank you so much, Todd, for being better prepared than me with your printed copy. So this should be available. And it's it just kind of walks through comprehensive opioid related needs assessment by category of different potential data sources. And so I don't know, did you want me to read all of it or just categories?

I don't know what's- Just a higher level overview would be sufficient.

The first is just broad epidemiology and data sources that are often already held by the county with specifics around demographics and substance involvement. The next section is on treatment access and capacity, just to understand where we might have existing gaps. And then the next section is on harm reduction and overdose prevention. Again, looking at geographically where certain services are available and what access looks like in different parts of the city and the county. Section four is on recovery support and social determinants. So really understanding sort of what peer supports, recovery housing, employment supports look like. We know those to be really critical for folks with opioid use disorder. The next is criminal legal system and sort of related to what's happening in the jails, drug courts, and access to evidence-based treatment. as well as looking at diversion programs and then coordination across the different sectors. Section six is really more of a, this probably is not data that already exists, but really a proactive in-reach, if you will, to hear from people with lived and living experience, as well as family members and service providers, and really trying to understand again, where gaps are. And the idea would be that this type of comprehensive assessment would give this subcommittee a better sense of where, you know, what's already being funded because we don't want to duplicate anything. Importantly, where gaps are and in ways that align with what settlement funds are allowed to be spent on.

Thank you, Dr. Abshire. Is there any additional comments or questions? Ariel?

You take it off the screen and I think

Yes, I have, I think, more of a functional question, maybe a two-parter, so apologies. If this, if we approve this tonight, it moves forward to HHN, but then what happens and how does this get done? How does the needs assessment get done?

Sure, Gailey, I could maybe suggest something.

Yes, Supervisor Wegleitner.

Well, I mean, to me, it would make some sense to wrap it into our annual recommendation to HHN, which I think should think about what's being sort of currently funded what we we may want to continue as part of the 2027 budget because we're unlikely to have a comprehensive needs assessment completed in time for 2027 budget recommendations or when we should be delivering those. So so I think um at maybe our our next meeting or in further discussion tonight related to some of those um Current allocations, you know, I think it's just maybe a component of that, because I think. The point of the needs assessment right is to inform. Future recommendations, and so, you know, saying that we would want. And and I think maybe. we still need to have some discussion about what implementation looks like. And the subcommittee might want to make some recommendations on that point that aren't necessarily fleshed out in the proposal right now. But I, you know, my motion was kind of to get the conversation rolling and to get us towards moving forward around, you know, this concept. Does that make sense?

Yeah, I think that makes sense. I think then my second question is for Dr. Elizabeth and sorry to put you on the spot, but I know you and I talked about the needs assessment and I think in our conversation I had mentioned how much I appreciated the outline that you had and also had some other ideas for kind of what I know is maybe missing, but I think we have an opportunity to really gather in a different way. So I'm also just wondering how specific we want to make this recommendation to what you offer, Dr. Elizabeth, or if you have any suggestions for like how

um specific or broad we should leave our recommendation for a needs assessment yeah um it's a good it's a good question i do i mean i think a piece of it comes down to some of it um how it gets carried out so i know there was some conversation at prior meetings about sort of uh what HMDC may have capacity for and also what data sets you may or may not have access to. Treatment data is usually something that doesn't live, I don't think, within public health Madison Dane County. A piece of it is if parts of this may end up being outsourced, I will leave it to others who do more contracting work, but I will say my experience has been being pretty specific with what we want and need to be in that final report is extremely helpful. So I think if there are things that we think are missing or should be adapted, I would say I think it's probably helpful to outline them now. you know, I mean, to the very granular level of like, oh, well, EMS has these like 10 things, like maybe not quite that level is necessary, but I do think if there are broad categories or differences, it probably is helpful. Also, you know, to kind of understand some of this has probably yet to be collected while other data sources definitely exist but exist in a lot of different places so then who would be able to sort of compile all of that so my sense would be if there are things we think are missing we should outline them now at a high level at least i personally think that's a good idea and then um when is the 2027 annual report recommendations due

Is that question for me?

Yeah, I'm sorry.

Yes, I think it's, it's technically July 1st, but I, as I've communicated in the to various people, we know this committee has been under transition and there's been this gap because of county board turned over. So. I think, you know, if the subcommittee can come to Health and Human Needs at some time in July or potentially August, but I think if we can shoot for July, that would be ideal.

Thank you. I kind of agree the sooner the better since this has been taking quite a while. So does anybody else wish to speak? Are there any other questions or comments?

Sure, I have a question. So it's unclear to me who's going to do this. So how does that work? I don't know who can answer that. I think maybe Ariel.

I'm sorry, who delivers the annual report and who's doing the needs assessment?

Who's going to actually do the needs assessment?

So, I think 1 option that has been discussed is that it could like, we could make this committee doesn't get to decide what exactly what the money goes to, but we can make a recommendation that that work be contracted out. I think there have also been conversations about public health Madison Dane county, possibly having capacity for some, or maybe all of I don't want to speak. on behalf of Ariel. So I will defer that part. But so this recommendation was just, these are the pieces of data that would be helpful to allow this subcommittee to make stronger recommendations and set priorities. Without it, it's really hard to know how to prioritize the funds that are available. How we operationalize that I think was part of what has not been decided and whether or not there would need to be settlement funds spent toward this or whether existing county resources would be sufficient.

Thank you. Thank you, Elizabeth. Anything to add? Ariel? No. Okay.

She summarized it beautifully.

Thank you. Any other questions, comments, discussion?

Sure. Yes. I, I have some thoughts about implementation and I wonder if, and I think, I mean, I appreciate the point that, that it's useful to Include changes, or if we want to add another section to this related to implementation, I, I, I like the idea of having. I guess a a 3rd. Party, um, an outside entity, um. Kind of do the needs assessment, but I also don't want. the needs assessment or to have them do things that they don't need to do. You know, like, I think like there's a role for sort of an outside entity to look at things and give us sort of the, that, that look from a more neutral vantage point or something. But obviously, we also have a lot of information and expertise within county government, within PHMDC as well. So I guess my Thinking is like, is there a way that we could. And I'm not that expert to know, like, what we have, what we don't have. And I don't know when, you know, if that could be enumerated tonight, or if that's something like that implementation section is something we need to sort of look at. And think about maybe. before the next meeting or something like that to give us a little more time to maybe draft something. And I think I would like to ask Felicia Benke-Shaw a question. Can you come up here? Is that okay, Chair?

Yes, please.

Okay. Felicia, do you have any ideas about this?

I do. I have a lot of ideas. So part of my role, where I come from, I come from a grant writing and environmental scanning background. So this is right up my alley, and I could do this. With the assistance of working with public health, I have great connections at the state with their data analytics team as well. So I would be able to leverage that to get some of the data pieces that I think you were alluding to and having sat on an OFR, I'm familiar with those data sources as well. So I definitely could put it together working with the partners, you know, in health and human services and with public health. So I have some ideas and I've done focus groups in that before too.

So do you think or does anyone smarter and more knowledgeable than me about these things, think that there would be additional resources that if you were to do it, you would need to access information, buy information. I don't know what this all entails, but I'm just thinking if there is a budgeting component to this or not, we'll want to know that. We'll want to say that we...

so would be comfortable with allocating some to make sure you get all the information or have all the support that you need if we were to go that route yeah um one of the things that i've done in the past with focus groups is i always compensate those that are participating especially if they've lived experience so i'm not sure if that's something that is something that's happened here um you know i'm the new person the new kid so if i'm out of line like that's a Just let me know. But we've always done that. I've always done that when I've held focus groups is incentivizing the people who are providing me that information. So that might be one budget component. I have listened to some of the past meetings. So I probably reach out to some of the aldermen that have referenced that they had individuals that they we could partner together and talk with as well. So I'm Other than buying data sets, most of this would be data requests to the state, our state partner. So Tom Bentley and Caitlin Murphy there hold a lot of this data. So it would be requesting that data from them and getting data from public health.

go go i think just make sure joel can see you it's a little different when it's virtual yeah yeah so again thank you um i guess just a couple things so i think that probably definitely the deaths are at uh like that would be at this date i think some of the other things in here which again maybe they're just not feasible um but things like the percentage of people who have died with ED visits, percentage of people who have been released from jail or prison. I don't think the state doesn't always have that. But I think that, again, like there are ways to cross match it. But again, those are probably slightly less critical. EMS and fire is going to be all counties. So I do think it's a lot of coordination. I'm so grateful that you're ready to jump in. The other thing, so there may be some elements where it is more probably seeing what we can get from the jails and from the partners. I don't think that PHMDC will probably have all of it, nor will the state, but I think definitely we could start asking and figuring out what pieces. The other thing I just, Director Smith, I'm afraid to say, because I don't know what conversations have been had, but I just had a Dane County OFR advisory group meeting. And I know that they've been talking about hosting some very similar focus groups. And so I just want to, I actually recommended they reach out to you, talk to Director Smith and then reach out to you. But that was literally just Friday. So I don't know what conversations have been able to be had. But I just want to make sure that again, they're not trying to do the exact same thing that you're trying to do at the same time. My understanding is they didn't have resources to be able to compensate folks for their time. So I agree with you. I think having a means for compensation for folks coming to share their time and expertise in this way would be really critical.

Yeah, if I can jump in. Yes. Thank you. Yeah, I think right. This is definitely why I've been a champion of the needs assessment from the start. There are a lot of just core functional responsibilities that the health department has around. needs assessments and assessing kind of health status and providing recommendations. And right now with the overdose fatality review grant, that is one of the requirements. So I know I owe an email back to Hannah, but really wanted to hear more in this meeting first before her and I chat about how to meet those grant requirements for and how that could potentially intersect and or help support a potential needs assessment that may come out of this group. But yeah, I have, I do have some concerns. I'm not going to quote that, that there might be some duplicity in that work, but I'm hoping we can minimize it to the best of our ability.

Thank you. I think this is great. if we can leverage OFR, especially if they got grant requirements to fill, I think that would be excellent. Um, working with Hannah, I was on the OFR and I think that's a really good idea about duplicity. I don't think there's any way you can probably get away from a lot of that. And, you know, Madison street medicine does their own needs assessment thing too. So I'm sure it's going to cross over all over the place, but, um, I think this is great. If you're willing to take on the work, um, Yeah, excellent. Is there any other questions or concerns or discussion? Yeah, sure.

I have some questions.

Absolutely.

What do you think a timeline looks like, a realistic timeline looks like for something like this?

I mean, this could take a while. I would say, you know, a good environmental scan, you're looking at six months to a year at least. You can adapt it. You can do shorter focus groups and things like that. But it really depends. Like this, you know, I would say a minimum of six months. potentially even longer depending on because all when the state release releases data or when EMS releases data out of their systems, that has to go to their own data governance. And data governance usually meets only on a monthly sometimes bi monthly, or they're just called in when those data requests happen. So it'll depend on scheduling in that. So getting some of that data is going to take time.

I make a suggestion.

Yes.

I wonder, this is your very first meeting, Felicia. I might suggest that we, you know, or I don't know, again, I'm not sure I'm following Robert's rules properly, but I might suggest that we give Felicia until the next meeting to kind of have some preliminary meetings to be able to outline what maybe even have a few meetings with folks at Public Health Madison Dane County, figure out which data sets are going to be easier to access, de-identified, et cetera, versus what's going to take longer, and then allow you to come back and present that to us, as well as maybe a rough budget for how many focus groups do we think would be needed, or community interviews, and how much money you would need. Because I think that would allow us to put forth a much better recommendation to HHN. I don't know. I don't know how long it takes to get those meetings on the books with all the people you'd need to meet with. I don't know if two weeks is too soon or four weeks, but I do think giving you just a little time to outline it, have a rough timeline for what that would look like and give you a minute to like have some prelim meetings might be helpful. And then figure out too, there might be things in here that just like you're not going to get on a six to 12 month timeline. And then we can know that as a subcommittee. Right.

Thank you, Elizabeth. I think that is a good idea, actually, because we're doing this. I want it to be done right.

I'll postpone this to the next meeting then. Does that make sense?

Yes, it does.

Invited speaker.

Okay. So the motion is to postpone this till the next meeting. Is there a motion? Second.

I got a second.

Yeah, and and Supervisor Bruchac seconded. OK, so we got a second needed it, but we have it.

I'm a little fuzzy on the rules to everybody. So I got a lot of learning to do. I really appreciate everybody being patient with me. But we have a second, so to so moved. Is there any discussion? Alright, let's vote all in favor say I I I.

I, but I have a question. What are we voting for right now? We're going to be next session. We'll be hearing more about proposed budget. And is that what we're voting right now for?

The motion is just to postpone action on this to allow Felicia time to, you know, have some meetings and come back with a little more, um, of a idea around the plan. Um, and then we could potentially incorporate that into our action. Got it.

Perfect. So we got that. Any... Oh, yeah, we got aye. Any opposed? Any abstentions? All right. I guess the motion carries. We will put that on the agenda for our next meeting, which now I got to get back to the agenda, so... All right, we got that. Or we kind of went over this a little bit. So 2027 annual reports and recommendations to HHN. We are going through some changes, so we can hopefully maybe try to get that done in July, if at all possible. That would be great. I don't know how that stuff works, but I'll rely on everybody else to kind of help me out with that one. All right, next we have. Presentations. Do we have any presentations from anybody tonight?

Co-chair?

Yes.

Never mind.

Yes, Kelsey? We good?

That was an error on my part. I'm sorry.

Don't apologize. We're fine. The next would be reports to committee. I don't Think anybody has any reports for us?

There are a couple listed, Joe.

Oh, I just got back to the agenda. I'm sorry. So number eight, reports to committee. All right. The first one is the public health position update. Arielle, would you like to take it away?

I don't have an update on the positions yet. Janelle and I did attend the last HHN meeting. committee meeting, and I believe we're slated to come back in July. But as of right now, I don't have an update, but happy to take questions about this.

Um, Joe, can I, um, Dr. Smith, would you mind just, well, I can give a little background, I guess. Um, so the, after the subcommittee is initial recommendation to create, uh, the very first recommendation to create a harm reduction drop in center. Um, when the supervisors Rose and I were working on trying to. find a way to implement that recommendation. One of the issues came up was kind of the lack of capacity and the limited hours of existing harm reduction services within public health, Madison Dane County. And so public health director Heinrich was like, you know, we really, we could, use some money right now to ramp up staffing because a whole RFP process for harm reduction center, that takes time. And yes, it certainly has. So anyway, but also these positions have been in process a long time and funding was reauthorized. So there was funding allocated by the county board for three and a half public health Positions, but there's been some programming changes because of guidance from the city attorney, particularly impacting the safe smoking program. That is no longer being operated out of public health. And that's been in the news over the last month. So. When this resolution to reauthorize these positions and the funding was going through the county process again, we kind of put that on hold because of how services had kind of contracted a bit and utilization had also decreased. So, yeah. This was referred by the county board to the Health and Human Needs Committee, where it's sitting for until July, until public health has some time to think about what kind of resources are needed, what sort of hours, what capacity, what role these positions play in health. I guess, carrying out the intent of the county board with that allocation for expanding harm reduction services. So anyway, I thought when we were planning this agenda, it was appropriate that this subcommittee be aware of that, like that's going on right now, because it relates to a past recommendation of this subcommittee and one of the areas, you know, harm reduction services. So I don't know, Arielle, you kind of already said you don't have a real update here, but I appreciate you being willing to answer questions of folks from the subcommittee.

Yeah, if I could just make one clarification, Supervisor Wegleitner, to what you said. They're the positions when they hit the county board a few weeks ago. That wasn't the reauthorization. That was the initial authorization. We've been waiting for for 2 years almost. And again, we've talked about this at this committee. It has to do with how. Things get allocated to public health. And so if we don't follow, like, the specific process, things get lost. And so I just want to name that for everyone that, like, that is the first time it was coming to the county board to give us the position authorization, which is what we need in order to hire those positions. That is the first time it has come there. That is unfortunately how long it has taken us to get it to that step. So I just want to be clear that like that wasn't coming back around a second time because of some of the things that are now happening in the program with the reduction of the smoking supplies. That was its first appearance from the time that we made that decision as a subcommittee. And that was approved then by HHN.

Thanks for that. I do think the funding, there was a funding resolution, funding had been allocated by the county board, but it is really useful to remind this body, and I appreciate you clarifying that fact, that public health is a complicated creature because of its joint nature and the way it is governed by the board, and then the various aspects of the city and county relationship you know, how all that works with the positions and things like that. So thanks for that correction. But something to keep in mind for future as well.

So that it took a really long time, way too long.

But here we are. So does anyone have any questions? I guess is the point.

I have a question. Sure. Yeah. So about the safe smoking program, has the city attorney's opinion been made public? Do we know the reasoning behind that? If anyone knows the answer to my question.

That is a good question. I am not sure if it's made public or the reason behind it. Okay.

I'd find that interesting if we could figure it out. Sure.

Dewey, I guess I could offer a very brief summary. Please. Well, at least as it was reported in the news, the safe smoking supplies, it's the city attorney's opinion that that would violate the paraphernalia prohibition, you know, ordinances, statutes, rather, right? And therefore, you know, it, he advised against continuing it. Is that your understanding? Director Smith or is there something that can be shared?

Yes, my what has been directed to us is that the interpretation from the city attorney's office is that it is considered a risk. related to their interpretation of the paraphernalia laws. And so there are no special provisions or protections to get around that. And so based on their recommendation, which we have to follow, is why we've pivoted away from the smoking supplies program at this point.

Which is disheartening because a lot of people look up to public health and when public health does something, a lot of other people kind of follow suit and, you know, they're not doing it, we shouldn't do it, and now... lot of people that I know that that you know need those supplies there's going to be an increase in overdose deaths there's going to be an increase in infectious diseases so it is really hard and I just don't see how their interpretation of the law after there was like a city ordinance that you know there it's only a you know a dollar city ordinance ticket for paraphernalia so that's just really it's really hard for me to get my head around but that's that's where we're at right now um

Yeah, I will say 1 point of clarification around that for 1, it's, it's Dane County that has that provision, not the city of Madison. And the 2nd point, because that does keep coming up and I've seen it in the media. So, if I can take. A few minutes to clarify that point that is also only for individuals. not institutions or businesses. So just something for us to keep in mind, because I've heard that a lot and I've been trying to do a lot of myth busting around that, that that is decriminalized on an individual level. And it's unclear if or how that transfers to businesses or institutions.

That is also excellent clarification. And now that I know, then I can help educate others around that as well, because I did not know that. Thank you.

I appreciate it.

Thank you. Any other questions?

I have a question. For whoever has the answer to this, is this a new city attorney? I'm just curious why it's happening now, if anyone knows.

So that's me again. Um, it's happening now because of a review of our programs and services. Um, that's something that really should be done on a more regular basis. I think the, I can't speak to what was done prior to 2020 because that's when I started with the department, but I do know COVID has had a lot of effects on our schedules of normally scheduled things. Um, so I, it has to do with just, it was a review of program services, what we offer and we don't offer.

And as far as that review, are the findings, like, is it done? And are the findings disseminated? Is there, okay. And is there any, so is there, I guess this is too vague of a question, but it's what I'm going to ask. Are there any other things that really might drastically threaten or harm or not bode well in a harm reduction world, landscape, right? Like, is it the safe smoking supplies only, or is everything staying the same with syringes, which is also paraphernalia?

Well, syringes have a specific exception under Wisconsin state statute. And so we are following kind of what we can and can't do based on what's outlined there. I can't say with specificity that this is where anything is going to end. I never know, especially with different laws changing at the federal level and kind of having all trickle down effect. feel like I can't give a definitive answer on the state of substance use and substance use prevention, harm reduction at this point on anything. But it's always the intent of our program to provide as much of a service and the best services we possibly can. We still stand by that. Yes, we recognize the effect that this has. And for as long as we can operate a program, we want to. And so we're doing everything that we can within those means and bounds to continue whatever services we can provide. One other thing I just want to clarify, because you asked if the findings were disseminated. I don't know exactly what you meant by that, but I will say- Yeah, usually reviews of program supplies and services, those are usually just internal conversations. So I just wanted to be clear in case you were like looking for something that you're not going to be able to like go and do a Google search and find these things. So just wanted to be clear. Thanks for taking me time. No, thanks.

I appreciate all that you had to inform us there with. Thank you.

No problem.

Excellent. Is there any other discussion, comments, questions on the public health positions update? I'm hearing none, so we will move on.

Sorry, may I ask a clarifying question? Yes, you can. Thank you. And so I guess just to make sure I'm following, so what are the next steps with regard to the position that was approved? I just want to make sure that, I'm sorry, I know it's really complicated and I apologize, Director Smith, because you keep explaining it, but I just want to make sure that I'm following and kind of if there is a timeline for when updates might be available that we all understand.

Yeah, I think, why don't I give like a little bit of a summary, especially since we have new members. So if that's okay with everyone. And then I'll ask Supervisor Wegleitner to maybe jump into like where we are today. So with the package finally going to county board for granting us position authority, my understanding is that Well, I mean, maybe I should back up a little bit further. One of the biggest hangups with why the positions have taken so long is because while the county board, I will use different terminology, had earmarked funds for these positions, no one gave the money to public health. And the reason this is complicated is because the city of Madison is, for all intents and purposes, public health Madison-Dane County's bank account. not Dane County. And so when we tried to ask Employee Relations on the county side to create the positions for us, because we are county employees, they said, that's so wonderful. Where's your money? And we're like, that's we have money. It's earmarked. And they're like, nope, until the city of Madison confirms that you have this money in the bank account, you can't create positions. And so this is something that I think I've talked through. So sorry for those who have heard this a few times. But for newer members who are maybe not familiar with the public health structure and process, sometimes we are viewed as a contractor of the county, not a department. day that Janelle and I would love to talk to anybody about who was willing to take up our cause. But because of that, we were in a back and forth trying to settle on an agreement so that it looks like we're a contract on paper. And that took a very inordinate amount of time, which is different than my lovely colleagues in human services who kind of just get it transferred into their bank accounts. Um, ours is a little bit of a process now. Do I think it has to be as hard of a process as it is? I don't know, but that's not my job, uh, outside of my scope, but that was the challenge. And so that is why we've been in a back and forth for so long, trying to create the agreement, trying to get terms understood. Then it also takes a long time to just get positions in general. So that's how we got to after years of work to the County board meeting. Uh, that would have given the resolution that sits now is to give us the position authority, because now we have the money in the bank account after all of this work. Um, and a lot of advocacy on a lot of, uh, County board supervisors to just move the money to us instead of having to do a contractual agreement. Um, and so now I'm actually unclear about what happens. Which is why I will maybe lean on Supervisor Wegleitner, because I know this is a question the Board of Health has asked at least me, if not Janelle and I, of if the position authorities with the Board of Health, what action is HHN hoping to do or can do? And I'm not super clear on that. So. not to put you on the spot supervisor, but I don't know.

My understanding was, I mean, we wanted to know like what these positions were going to look like. And if you still needed 3.5, because, um, you know, it, When you came to HHN, you indicated that, you know, the service utilization had dropped, but hours are still quite low and people can't, you know, when they get sick or they're, you know, that there's, I think, what, just two people staffing this? In two places, right? Still. Yes. So, I mean, there's it seems to me there's still any for the positions potentially. I mean, but you'd also kind of indicated maybe the. positions might look a little different or something like that. So it's like, I don't really want to, or I wasn't comfortable with the, you know, the reason it was referred to HHN as well, one, because of the opioid settlement subcommittee and, and the role in, in HHN and kind of oversight of these funds. But knowing is this still the right fit for the need to, And, you know, are these the same positions they were really intended with just kind of more, unfortunately, limited service. So that's the information that I think HHN is looking for. before taking action on the authorization resolution. Does that make sense?

Yep, I think that makes sense. And I think the challenge that we are facing as a department is the removal of our smoking supplies program happened in the middle of this. And so our client volume that shaped that original proposal of asking for an additional 3.0 FTE was based on a time when we were seeing at our East Washington location, I would say upwards of 50 to 60 people a day. Whereas right now, and again, it's a little bit of wonky data, so please don't take this totally at face value. But since we've remove smoking supplies at our atrium location, we're averaging, it looks like about maybe six people a day. And at our East Washington location, we're maybe averaging about 15 people a day. And so those are huge drop-offs for us. And so it is hard for me to speak to kind of what capacity I think we're gonna need in the long term now based on this change. And I think to the question that Jenny also had proposed to me of, do I think these are the only changes coming? I don't know. Right. And who's to know what maybe comes in a year or two years? And maybe there will be different determinations that would maybe increase our client volume or maybe we'll learn more, do something different that could increase it. And so it's it's tough for me to say we do or don't need the positions based off of at this point, two months worth of data after a pretty dramatic program shift that we are just trying to work through and haven't had a chance to recover at this point. Um, but I think if I was asked the question today at face value, like, no, I don't think we need 3.0. Additional at this point to manage across our 2 locations, less than 20 people a day.

Sure, can I yes, go ahead please.

I'm wondering if director Smith or any other committee member, maybe you, Joe. No, it's like, where are those people going now?

So nowhere, they're just not being served. When you don't get those supplies, and like I said, I'm a person who uses drugs. I'm out in the community quite a bit meeting people. I'm seeing a lot of people with really short, broken pipes that they're putting in their mouth with sharp glass. A lot of people are isolating and using alone. They're not having that, you know, they go to SSP to see their friends also. You know, they're both picking up supplies. Now a lot of people are scattered. They're just staying in their camps. They're staying in their tent. They're using old supplies. They're stealing from stores now, tire gauges, speaker wire. That's just the reality of it.

Thank you. Yeah, I will say we've heard similar things and we are also aware that we were 1 of the few places offering. Free smoking supplies in the 1st place. So, yes, we understand that there's maybe now. My understanding is that there is a pretty large scarcity now for obtaining those supplies.

There there really is, like I said, people look up to public health. I worked so hard to get safer smoking supplies at Madison Street Medicine when I was working there. I went in there Friday and they no longer have them. So that's another big one. Hopefully the climate and stuff can change eventually because people deserve it. I mean, people are, like I said, going to start dying because of it. All right. Is there anything else for the public health positions update? I'm hearing none. So we will move on to the 2026 opioid settlement funds budgeted. And I think this one is Division Administrator Campbell.

Yes, I can summarize the report that was attached to the agenda. This describes the opioid settlement funds that were part of the county's adopted budget. This year funds are going to the Department of Administration, Department of Human Services, Emergency Management, the Sheriff's Office, and Public Health of Madison and Dane County, which we just heard about. um these are budgeted funds these aren't necessarily spent funds at this point we have to wait till the end of the year to see how much was actually spent and reconcile reconcile that so thank you any questions or comments and we have access to this um

This one here is attached to the agenda?

It is? Okay.

That's correct.

Thank you. I was actually going to ask for something like this. So this is wonderful.

Perfect. Thank you. Is there any other questions, comments?

Sure. Gailey? Yes. I guess I'm wondering about... in terms of, I mean, this is, was budgeted in 2026, but I'm interested in either tonight or maybe at our next meeting, getting more insight as to like the, um, expectations around these funds going forward. I think it would be important for this subcommittee to weigh in on, um, continuation of funding for you know these services or not or you know what that looks like how obviously like we also are very interested in getting a needs assessment that informs our funding decisions but you know it might make sense for i mean certain things um obviously uh they're going to have a more significant impact if they're not included in a 2027 budget so um know the budget you know is certainly under development right now in terms from the from the department's point of view but um anyway that would be useful i think for us to know i also think that's probably a good idea we could probably put this on the next agenda um go through it real quick each line and you know see what we think

Um, anybody else have any comments or. Yeah. Yes.

Um, I think this is a good, that is a good suggestion that there should be a reporting out on how opioid settlement funds have been spent. Uh, and it should go into our thinking as a committee subcommittee about future recommendations. Um, I also think the, the, top line of hiring our opioid coordinator, that would be a great role to provide an annual report out on how funds have been spent and going forward. There is a brief synopsis and I can try and gather information from the other departments and how they intend to use those funds. The synopsis is there and that's um that was presented during the budget adoption process um late last year late in 25 when these amounts were included do we have um a follow-up chair um yeah i guess like kind of

figuring out where implementation is on these things. I mean, we, we know the first one, which is super exciting with Felicia here. Um, but like in terms of, you know, spending in these other areas of all the, you know, these things been, have people been hired, have, have the programs, you know, been, um, you know, using, using this funding, um, anyway i i any help um in the interim i think trying to get additional information on um where where these efforts are at and um what needs are going forward or not um i think it's important i guess i don't recall the history behind the reentry coordinator and if they have a particular role as it relates to opioid use. So I'm just kind of curious in particular about that one. But the other ones all are quite familiar to me. They're somewhat familiar anyway. Yeah.

I will say, Chair, the reentry coordinator, that was also in last year's budget. There was a more complete description there. I believe the focus is on for, it's not everyone that they're working with who has an opioid disorder reentering from the jail, but This money is intended to focus on just those with who are using opioids. So it represents a portion of folks that they are working with. As I understand it.

Yeah, I think that's how I understood it as well. And I think there might be something in one of the presentations. I'm going to start from a while ago. It'd be nice to know like how they're doing or what progress they made or how many people they have, you know, been able to. Okay, um, clarification question. Yes.

So, I guess it would be helpful for me just to understand, is there a standard. Expectation around, like, is the idea that this subcommittee makes a recommendation. to HHN to say we recommend all of these go forward, none of these go forward into 2027 funding? Because my understanding from last year is that there are several different mechanisms by which settlement funds can be spent. One was during the budget process itself, I think, if I understood properly. And so I guess I just don't know that I fully understand what the process should be. I agree. I think it would be good for us to know how dollars are being spent and what expectations are. But then is the goal that this subcommittee makes a recommendation to HHN that we think, you know, X, Y, Z of these things get the same level of funding next year?

Yeah, I mean, so the settlement dollars, as we know, are $1 billion. Time funds. Right. Um, and so I think and and. The county budget process is an annual budget process. So every year the county board and, you know, makes a decision about what that funding looks like. So, um. you know, I think this is the importance and the value of this committee and having the new coordinator is helping to track that and inform that. Obviously, like when you're paying for program, when you're paying for people, like that's an ongoing expense. And I think, you know, that's why we want to be really thoughtful about those types of allocations because they're going to need, you know, going to want to sustain those sorts of things. So, um and and obviously like there's things in here that um certain members would have to uh recuse from discussion on um because of their own uh role in it um but i think i think as an certainly it's appropriate i mean it's up to the subcommittee what the subcommittee wants to make in that recommendation but i think seeing like okay you know is all this it doesn't make sense to continue funding all this stuff, especially knowing that we have a comprehensive needs assessment coming. Are there some things that maybe are underspending right now that could be reduced or what does that puzzle look like? And it can be general too. I mean, it's really, it's up to the subcommittee and it's just advisory because, you know, the budget processes is involved and, you know, there's a lot of meetings in the fall and more opportunities for public input and everything.

I mean, that would be my recommendation as well to kind of go through them and see what's going where and if it's appropriate to continue that. All right. Is there any other questions, comments, discussion on the opioid settlement funds budgeted?

I would just say, oh, sorry.

I don't know. Tell me if this is the right time to ask this or not. But I'm going to ask the question. And to anyone who may have any information for me, that could be helpful. And I think this is coming up even more. because of thinking about hearing about public health and where they are at with staffing and not being able to provide safe smoking supplies and very few people accessing their two locations currently and discussion on where they go going now and also thinking back to our harm reduction center. And I I'm still confused about, it was approved. HHN approved funds to be spent on a harm reduction center with an amount. And then there was the RFP process, which at the end of that process awarded no one funds. And then as far as I understand, but please someone correct me if I'm wrong. A harm reduction center is suspended in like a decreation or a new RFP process to find a home for a harm reduction center that was going to be funded through opiate settlement dollars is now suspended indefinitely. And I'm just going to, I'm going to ask, so, so what, what, um, is there a pos, I mean, is there a possibility of prioritizing trying again to get an RFP going for the harm reduction center or, or are we not, um, focusing any attention on that? So yeah, anyone who wants to give me any feedback back, I would appreciate it. Chair Gailey.

Yes, or I would just respond to say that, um. There's still money that that hasn't been spent and I think. If this subcommittee should. discuss whether the harm reduction should be, the center should still be a top priority right away, right now, be re-RFP'd, or if we're suggesting that wait until the needs assessment is completed. I mean, I think that is a important discussion point. I mean, that money hasn't been reallocated to any other use. It's still available for that purpose. I don't get the sense that public health is is Moving on anything immediately, I think there's sort of a pause on this, and I don't think the county board has provided any additional direction or the department. So I think it could be useful time as part of the annual report to HHN to say what does the subcommittee think should happen with the Harm Reduction Center and the timing of that. how important those services are right now. Does it make sense to move ahead with such a big initiative ahead of, you know, when we're also considering a comprehensive needs assessment? I mean, I think that's a point, a decision point potentially for this subcommittee.

Yeah. Or is there a way for us to get some safe smoking supplies out to somebody who can give it to these people who aren't getting it in our counties? you know, like, it seems like this could be a, it seems like a real crisis. And I just want to, you know, think that this is a pretty good place to talk about it, considering that we have funds. And again, I'm not as, you know, timelines and all this, I'm I'm still confused by and I haven't ever since I've been on this board seen money really be spent. Oh no, now we have our new administrative hire, which is going to be great. So money was spent. But yeah, I'm just wondering if anyone else has thoughts about how we could maybe be helping the smoking community right now through funds that we, well, we can make recommendations for.

Anyone? Yeah, that's a tough one with city's attorneys and stuff like that. I mean, grassroots, until I get arrested, I'm out there, you know, using my supplies and stuff, getting safer, smoking supplies and stuff out to people, which I'm on record saying that, but oh well, people deserve to live. So I don't know if there's any other options that we have or any other organizations that that could chip in to do that. That's really a tough one. Chair? Yes, Todd.

I would recommend that might be a discussion point for if we put the 2027 recommendations to HHN back on a future agenda.

I think that is a great idea. Any objections to that? Perfect.

One more question I have real quick is it's the city attorney, the county. I mean, if I, am I understanding this right? That the city attorney has made this lawyer. Yes. Attorney has said that it's too big of a liability to have the safe smoking supplies at public health because public health is city and county.

We are governed both by city and county attorney. Yes.

So the Dane County, maybe the supervisors from Dane could, This decision does not affect Dane County.

We are governed both by the city and the county's attorney's office.

I understand, but I guess I'm talking about, so HHN, but HHN is a Dane County committee. I guess maybe I just don't understand it. Maybe I'm not understanding it. Like I'm hearing about like public, you're on public health and I get that, but public health is not the HHN committee and other agencies. So that's what I was trying to understand, but maybe.

Sure, Kaylee, can I?

Yes, I don't have an answer to that one.

Well, I would just say that, you know, there to my knowledge the county's attorneys have not um written an opinion or weighed in on this question um public health has made a decision based on the advice they've received from the city attorneys so um and it's a it's a question of risk is that wrong or did you also receive an opinion from the county attorneys that i wasn't aware of sorry

I don't know how to best answer this except for that. We are governed both by county and city attorneys.

My question isn't really about that. It's about, can't we, if we gave money to someone besides public health to buy safe smoking supplies, that's what, that's what I'm asking. Like, are there other legal issues? I mean, not us. If we made a prop, you know, if HHN gave money to an organization, that could supply safe smoking, why couldn't that happen? Maybe there's some big fundamental thing I don't understand about public health in this committee.

And maybe I'm asking for that quick. So a couple of things. One, to my knowledge, opioid settlement dollars have to be used for things specific to opioids. So if we were to fund smoking supplies, the smoking supplies funded would need to be opioid specific. So... Not all smoking supplies are used for opioids. Many are used for methamphetamine and crack cocaine. So I think that is one critical piece. If these are settlement dollars, opioid settlement dollars have to be used on opioid specific. Now, whether or not there are other jurisdictions that have had a more liberal interpretation of polysubstance use, but that is something we would need to seriously look at. It would be a problem for this specific funding stream as I understand it. The second thing is that I spent time last week talking to public health lawyers just to make sure, at a national level, to make sure that I understood the Wisconsin law. I am not a lawyer, so I'm even cautious. That's why I've been so quiet to say anything. But the Wisconsin law is... like people would really be at risk. I think if as an organization, there's potential risk because the law very explicitly calls out syringes and materials specific for injection. And I don't think there's much of a legal argument that a pipe is used for injecting drugs. And so I do think, you know, whether it's a question of, is there an organization out there that would be willing to take that risk? I don't know. Maybe there is to purchase and then put them out into the community. The $1 fine is specific for the county, but anybody in Madison could get bigger fines. And just talking to my own patients, we know that that happens. People do get fined for the supplies. So I'm not saying it's a reason not to do it, but I do think that the risk is there. You know, the main takeaway from the lawyers is if we want this to be different, we should change the law. Not that we in this room have the ability to change the state law, but that it would need to have more protections as many other state laws across the country do. So again, I'm not a lawyer. I'm repeating back what I was saying. told by two very smart lawyers that I spoke with last week. But I do think it's worth a conversation. But I think one piece is, can settlement funds be used to buy crack and methamphetamine pipes? And then the second piece is, would there be an entity out there, if the answer is yes, because of polysubstance use, then the second piece is, is there an entity out there that would even be comfortable receiving such funds to do that purchase? And what are the risks to them, but also the risk, you know, to the people that are receiving them? And I think those are all important points and how do we make sure that everybody's, you know, going in eyes wide open with a good understanding of the potential risks. I am not arguing that there are risks of not offering them. I absolutely agree that there are.

And for, can I provide clarification for my question? I was really just more concerned about the intertwining of public health with this. That was it. I'm not trying to be argumentative or I, but I don't, I'm not, I'm still not understanding, right. How, if we, that, that was what I was really trying to understand. I think like more than, you know, the actual using of the funds, although, you know, as we're hearing, this is a community that's in jeopardy right now, but okay. I'm done, I think, talking.

Chair Gailey, can I go back to something with a question or maybe a suggestion, something that Todd said? Yes. I really like the, again, her first meeting, but I really like the idea of, I don't know if a month would be enough time, but sort of asking if in her role it's appropriate to compile something to go back through everybody that's received funds and have a brief report to this subcommittee. Again, maybe a month is too short. She just started. But to give some time and make sure that we have that on the books at a future meeting, I think would be super helpful. So I don't know if that's, again, motion. I don't know what the right process of order is here, but I do think that would be super helpful for us.

I do as well. I am definitely not familiar with the right way to go about that or motion that. Definitely have to hear from Felicia if that's something she's able to accomplish. And then we can work on getting it on an agenda if that is something. Any ideas?

Yeah, chair, you set the agenda, so you can do that.

Perfect. Perfect. I will probably like to talk to Felicia, see what the capacity is and see how to structure that and get that on an agenda, which we'll get to here in a second. Is there any other questions for the funds budgeted? Hearing none, Jenny will try to get you an answer to your question somehow. So then we can kind of move on to I, future meeting items and dates. We're going to have a, I know we're kind of, getting there so discussion of future meeting dates oh yeah we were going to do the dates i was just kind of going to comment too i'd like to make comment that you know as a committee we didn't do this a lot before but you know i think it would be beneficial to as well you know see what everybody else thinks about the agenda see if there's anything specifically that they would want on there want to discuss want to talk about um there could have been lots of stuff that you know I was missing, so I think that'd be a good idea. But is there any discussion on the future meeting dates? Does these times still work for everybody? Is there anything better? Or we'll open it up.

Chair, I believe we're meeting every other Monday at 5 o'clock. Is that right? Correct.

And I know we kind of got some new people here, so I don't know everybody else's schedule. I just thought it'd be worth a discussion.

Sure. I would just say that I think until the recommendations are sort of formalized and delivered, that it's a good idea to keep that frequency. But then once, you know, the budget process is underway and, you know, and that report is delivered, I would think by August, then the frequency could reduce forever. for a bit and slow down if and then, you know, Felicia will be maybe doing a needs assessment or something like that. So there would be maybe a little more natural relaxation of frequency. But That's just kind of my suggestion. I know you have three supervisors on this committee who are going to have a lot of meetings in September and October. So we would appreciate a little relaxation during that time. But obviously, we have a lot to dig into and catch up on over the next six weeks or so. So I do think keeping up that frequency right now while we try to hash through these recommendations is probably wise.

I think it's actually very wise and appropriate. We got some new people, got good energy, something different. So I don't see why there's any reason, unless anybody has one, that we couldn't keep that same candidates on that and see what it looks like further down the line once we have some of that other information and see if we can back it off to once every three weeks, once every month. Any other discussion on that one? Suggestions? Hearing none. Alright, we can move on to Jay public comment on items not on the agenda.

We have no registrants.

Thank you, Kelsey. Appreciate it. No represents for tonight, so I will go on to such other business as allowed by law. Do we have any other business? All right. Hearing none. So what's the last one we got here? Adjournment, I think, right? All right. Move adjournment. Second. Got a second.

Who seconded?

Jenny Lee. Thank you. Jenny seconded. All right. All those in favor?

Aye.

Any opposed? I didn't think so. So our meeting is adjourned for tonight. Thank you everybody for bearing with me and yeah, that's about it.

Thanks.