Planning Board - Regular Meeting

don't mind. Right. Great. Thank you. All right. Um All right. I'll call this meeting of the planning board village of Cold Spring to order. Um I don't have any remarks today. Does anyone have any items to add to the agenda? Okay.

Um we've got uh this we've got at least one set of minutes. The 26th Oh, no. We have got we've got uh we've got more than that. We've got I have wrong wrong notes. So, one second. The 26th and the 10th. The 26th is So, the three of you can do that one. Yeah. Me, Ben, Hillary, and the three and three of us can do July. Okay.

Wow. We can get rid of these. Okay, let's say He's not speaking. Uh 26 looks fine to me. Have any other um Hillary or It's just Hillary

and Ben. Oh, Ben. Okay. Also, what look good? Yes. Yes. Yes. Okay. And the 10th looks good. It's good. and brave. Uh yeah, we comments to DBA about that. Yeah.

Okay. All right. Uh we have another referral from the ZBA uh for 51 parrot 55 square. Do we have the do we have the referral information? Okay. All right. Why don't we we'll come back to that. We'll move on to one depot square while we're getting that done. Um all right. So for one square uh at member's request, would the three of you mind introducing yourselves to the board again? Uh Jamie Copeland at Hudson Design. Okay. Thank you.

Gracie McInness also Hudson Design. Boris Copeland with For Scopler Design. Nice. Great. Thank you. Welcome back. Um all right, so things in my recollection that we had uh to cover for today. I um uh relayed the um uh what what uh the plan was for uh water runoff with the two down spouts in the back to the village engineer. Um he suggested so that sounded um fine but suggested that either gravel trench or rain garden at the discharge points just make sure that you know the the runoff is taken care of.

Yeah. Um do you have anything to report to the board on parking? Sure. So um I kind of went through an analysis on that. Um, I looked at the property records for the property, which there are not uh there are some, but you kind of have to piece them together. There's not uh really any one document that explains it. So, what I found was that there's a deed going back to 1882 that establishes uh the right of way that is now known as Debo Square. Okay.

Um it's essentially everything from about where the sidewalk is to where the building is uh across the street, the neighbor's building. Um, and that's in the chain of title. Uh, there's a survey that the current plans we're looking at show the right of way. So, I think it's pretty clear that the the right of way is the whole thing. It's the the street and the parking spaces. Okay. Now, to take that a step further, when we look at the definitions in the code of um parking space, street, can I interrupt you for just one second? When you say that the ride of way includes the um parking spaces. Yes. So

does it say is is is a moving right of way typically defined as I don't I don't understand a ride ofway is is as as I have heard of and read about is a rightway is a moving is it's for moving traffic. Um, it is not. No, that's not necessarily uh the case. So, right ofway is created with a meets and bounds description where it's laid out in the deed where physically the right of way is located. And in this case, it's today where the road is and where the parking spots are. Okay. On either side of the road. And you have a do you have a copy of that? Yes.

Okay, great. Uh so to go back to to where I was. So when you look at the definitions in the code of um parking space, street and off streetet parking. Okay,

let me read them to you here. So uh parking space, comma, motor vehicle is defined as an off- streetet space available for parking of one motor vehicle and having an area of not more than 162 ft exclusives exclusive of passageways, driveways, and providing access to a public street or alley and maneuver. So the key word there is off streetet. Uh we know that um code defines street as a public or private way which affords principal means of access to vooding properties. And the code defines or provides that areas which may be computed as open or enclosed off- streetet parking spaces include any private garage, carport or other area for parking other than a street or driveway. So, I think when you take all of those together, regardless of whether you're calling it's a public street, a private street, a right of way, something else, these are on street parking spaces.

We have a code number on that. Sure. So, it's going to be in various sections uh throughout the code. It's all it's in going to be in the definition section. That'd be wonderful in the park. That'd be really helpful. Sure. It's chapter 134. I don't have the sites right in front of me, but uh you can find them in the code. Great. Really appreciate that. Okay. So then the interpret then basically the the interpretation of that is that none of none of the on right away parking spaces can be counted according to the code.

That would be my my legal uh conclusion. And so just from a practical perspective, the right of way like what does that what does that mean about like just trying to just trying to understand the use there? So what like does that mean that those parking spaces could have been included in the village's parking plan for example? Well, I can't answer right now unfortunately. You don't have to to answer it either as the planning board. Um,

no. I I get that. I'm mostly just trying to understand like if if like if a if a if a right of way which defines the street has like like who whose domain is does that does that make that well it's a it's a public right of way so within the village. So so it's the village village's decision to what how how that's how I understand it. Yeah. Okay. So the question Yeah. So um and you're you're saying this right away is it dates back to 1882.

So when uh the previous owner was closing the street down one day of a year and this is in the last and this is just hearsay on my part. Yeah. Um they used to close down the the it down one day away a year. Um which upset you know a number of people and then there was some negotiation that um they would they would stop doing that and that was in the last um Tom R. It's not that long ago. Sure. Sure. Sure.

Yeah. So, um, that's what ended the, uh, legal right of well, that's what started the legal right away from what I understand. Well, the the deed in in 1882 is what created the the right of way. Sounds like maybe it was altered though for the time that you're talking about within the last 30 years. I do know Greg was because Greg was talking about the previous owner that and Greg was a part of it. um for loans. There's a part of it where they would close down the road for a year or day. Oh, I I think that like for the purposes of this application, we can

we can try to be ruthlessly pragmatic about about the scope of the conversation and what it means, right? But like uh from from my perspective like like I laid out before in the end of the day uh the parking requirements are what they are and most properties most business properties in business one district do not meet those requirements and they go through very normal means to relieve that uh by being referred to the village board. uh for a parking waiver. Um I think that would be so that would be a very normal and typical path. So whether it was like two spaces or 20 spaces, I think what what what that leaves for us. So we have two I think we have two main things we need to do today. One, we just need to schedule a public hearing for this because like I don't I don't think we're there no nothing left to discover here. I think we have the site plan mostly where we'd like to see it. Um and uh and if the applicants would like us to refer them to the village board for parking waiverss uh then uh then it's on us to figure out what is our message to the village board along with that like how like what do we want to convey to the village board again they don't have to follow our recommendation but I think given the nature of this particular property and situation we're in that that we would want to include.

Sure. That would that would be great. Um, can we get uh copies of this this um document because when Greg brought the property, there was very little about any of this. Yeah. And he needs to know. Sure. Yeah. I mean, I don't have extra copies with me tonight, but you can reach out to the village clerk. Uh they'll probably want you to submit a pil request. It's all public directive. We would refer to this as um what's the year? Yeah. 1882. 1882. And uh it was a it was a a right of way that was established um point of sale or

as part of the deed that was that the property was sold of. Where did where did you find it? Because we went to the Clark County Clerk and you know

the uh the village got it from somewhere. I don't know. Wow. Okay. Um, the other thing I was going to mention too is with respect to the nine spaces that are currently um restricted to depot only parking, um, I think it it's up to the board to decide and um, well, it is up to the board to decide, but I think uh, you could maybe make the finding that those nine spaces could be counted as off- streetet parking. Um the origin of why those nine spaces are for the depot only and the rest are for public parking is not really clear, but the fact remains uh you know that is the status quo. Sorry, can we can you be more specific about which of the nine you're referring to?

Yeah, I've got it. Oh, okay. It's the ones that are further from Main Street. You're saying be because that was established established one way or another. I'm not sure how, but supposedly there there was an agreement that we've all heard about that no one seems to be able to find that allowed the was it the public parking to exist. Um

I see. So I think so what Jonathan is saying is that the fact that it's all public parking but because the you because there was kind of this established depot only use that it makes sense to continue to treat those as as appro as for the depot. So we've got we've got nine here we've got three three here and then did were you guys able to get um a copy of the of the contract with the MTA? Uh, I don't know if Greg is has gotten it yet, but I know that they they have they have had it and they have and they continue to have it. Yeah, it's kind of an ongoing agreement, I think. But

uh so let's say there's I don't know at least f there's probably at least five spaces back here. They actually park 12. Understood. like you can pack a lot of things into a lot of places. Mostly mostly the parking spaces don't matter because the the the actual there's the dimensions defined in the code.

So uh so let's I don't know let's say let's say there were five that's eight uh over here and then another nine over here. So um the trick the trick is to basically like without the MTA information it becomes like we don't know which which number to ask for from the in terms of in terms of uh the referral to the village board. So there's a couple things we can do. I honestly I don't think it really matters the the difference between asking for uh let's say we would let's say we ask it was 24 total we need 24 total yeah

24 so yeah so either either 12 or uh seven is still a lot of spaces um I don't think materially it changes the decision for the village board so I think given that we don't have the MTA contract to make a determination right the second I'm tempted to say we we go ahead and ask for the 12 or we suggest that you ask for it it may be less or maybe more so that well I think I think that like the fact that yeah may it may be less but if you get a waiver for 12 then you're you're kind of covered

um can you explain a little more about parking waiver what that is so it's not it's not a variance that's true uh and you don't have you don't have to go to the to the to the ZVA. Basically, in the in the village code, there's a provision that says basically for this kind of scenario where there's a business that whose operation requires the existence of parking given the parking table that the village will accept uh payment in lie of basically payment of a parking waiver fee in lie of having the the spaces. So, forget how much it is. It's like I believe it's $250 per space. you know, that's not

Well, he had the owner basically has to rent back spaces from the town that he already owns. Uh, well, I think that's I mean there's you're you have some baked in assumptions to your statement there that I think are the are the kind of the crux of the of the of the dispute here. I think from a I mean regard I'm just thinking regardless of the the right-of-way agreement does the right of way agreement give ownership to the town of that area that's you know it doesn't give them ownership but it gives them the right to use it what's like where where's the line between what's owned and what's

well think of it like this like like if I if I say that I that I have the right to use some portion of land to like as a right of way. I can't you can't also say you're using it for a different purpose, right? It's it's already kind of its use has been saturated as a right of way. It can't also be used for private parking because it's being used as a right of way. Yeah. Same idea as like if you have, you know, an easement across your property that your neighbor uses to get to their house, you can't build a shed in the middle of the driveway in the east. Absolutely. Same idea. Absolutely. Totally true. 10 years.

So, does does asking for the 12 spaces does that as a part of the referral does that make sense? Sure.

Yeah. Okay. All right. So, for the board, I think we should discuss what we want to say to the to the v to the village board in this case. I think this is a a different a different shape of case than we often uh make referrals to. From my perspective, from a practical, from the kind of the spirit of the code, I think the parking requirements for me are met for the depot. Uh uh and I think the parking waiverss for for 12 should be given. Um but I'm that's my that's my feeling, but um I'd love to hear from everybody else like what what's how are people feeling about it? So their deed is the is the dashed line.

Yes. And but this has been carved out as right away. Yeah. Okay. Okay. And somewhere along the way, they were told that at some point for private use. Well, we don't really know. We don't know. We don't know the origin of this, right? I mean, it's possible that one day somebody just put up nine signs that said depot only and nobody ever said anything about it. But regardless, you know, that's what's there. It's been there for some length of time. Yeah, I think Jonathan's basically saying that

without the in the absence of like an actual legal agreement, yeah, it's been used. So it would be you know it's reasonable for us to say that okay these are these are effectively depot square spaces and the 24 total is because this is a restaurant use restaurant use of a certain size and then we do the yes the square foot is it's spaces per square foot.

Okay. Yeah. I I mean the 12 is well I mean if they have an event there uh they're going to have a lot more people than that anyway they're going to have to go park them somewhere. So it it seems like you know we should satisfy the code but the reality is if if there's an event I don't know how many how many seats here are you planning on extending inside it it it it really varies depending on if there's if they're standing or seated we said max we said max capacity was like a 100 or something

came up came up with that figure and I don't think he really had was putting much thought Okay. And I think to some extent too, you know, just go by the square footage. The square footage because the code presumes. Yeah. I mean, so I mean 12 sounds fine. I mean, that's the number you're suggesting that

I I I suggest that we make a recommendation that they give the 12 and uh and that compared to other similar cases where people have needed parking waiverss, they've had less available parking around them. Yeah. Yeah. We And you might want to include in your recommendation, too, the fact that even though some of the spots behind the building uh don't meet the the size for a parking spot, they can actually park more vehicles back there. So, that helps to alleviate uh some of the parking issues.

If they if they grant 12 um and we need less, how do we approach the board? I mean, if you if you're suggesting that Yeah. I mean, I think that's a good question. I So, you're you're waiting um for a contract from the MTA. Is that Yeah, might affect it because um you know, that back area which um the depot building has been in um which expands the area. Yeah. So I mean if you can get that prior to when the village board takes action on the waiverss then the planning board can just reduce the request.

And also what just I mean moving forward we are going to be working on the the actual and all of the um chicken coops that have been added to the the back of that building. We are going to be consolidating. Um, we're just we're demoing the entire thing. Sure. Sure. Sure. Um, and that will hopefully clean up that whole area and maybe give more space. Um, because I mean,

yeah, I guess I guess what I would suggest just for I want I want to streamline this process as much as possible for you guys. So, so I think like for me the the the like the cleanest path is we picked the we picked the conservative count which is the 12, right? We know we know in the worst case you need 12 uh based on the current read of the code. Uh maybe it ends up being less. I think that getting information about the MTA if we can that that seems like plausible to get enough information about it. Yeah. Where it could reduce the number ultimately reducing

the the the total number that are needed. Um the the the parking waiver wouldn't go the referral wouldn't be made to the to the village board until we had uh adopted the resolution, right? But basically we had a it would be a condition of the of the final approval of the site plan that that the village granted the waiverss. Um, so we've it doesn't really change the timeline. It means that you have between now and whenever we're able to close the public hearing uh or for talking about this this project. So um I would say at least two weeks probably more realistically. Um so does that make sense? Uh so we have at least two weeks to change to recommend changes for that number and show reason show cause.

Yeah. Yeah. To give us some documentation about what the relation what the agreement is with the MTA and and um if you do if you were able to get that it would be I highly recommend you update the site plan to include explicit spaces that meet the the space the dimensional requirements of spaces so that we see them. And you could you've corroborated the se the nine.

Yes. Yeah. And that was from the docu documentation about the nine like from a strictly like document perspective, you're entitled to none of them. But I think from a use from like just an established use like the depot has made exclusive use of those nine for a long time. So it doesn't make sense for us to just like you know say like oh you can't do that you can't you can't do what you've been doing right we like it's been a public right of way. The village hasn't asserted its right to say you can't make this depot only. So that's there's some kind of precedent that's been set.

Right. So I wonder what how how the nine would come up with that.

And just to to be clear on that point, so the planning board is only considering these nine spots to the extent that it's making a recommendation for the parking waiverss, if that makes sense. So, the planning board's not saying, you know, these nine spots are or are not yours to use, but for the purposes of this application for determining parking, the planning board is going to treat them as the depots to use. But the the planning board doesn't have the power to to make any broader findings, any bigger picture findings than that. Yeah, we're Yeah, we don't we don't have an we can't make official statements about correct interpretation of code uh or or property rights or property rights. Yeah,

the planning board's just saying under the circumstances it makes sense to to treat these nine spots as off streetet because they are private and that's not changing.

Mr. think of everything that uh we should be asking. I mean all all of those all of the spaces that are beside the right of way. Well, they're not beside the right way. They're in the right of way. I think that's the that's the the the it sounds like the the original deed like the actual like sighting of the of the site had what is now in where parking is is actually cited as the right of way. So like there at some point somebody put the curb into the right of way and said here are spaces. Yeah. And um

it'll be interesting to see how this right away is. Yeah. They rotated this uh 90 degrees instead of parallel parking like they are across the street. Yeah. Yeah. When you look at when you look at photographs from late 1800s and it's all dirt street and there's not a there's not one they're not hitching a wagon up anywhere. Sure. Um, it'll be interesting to see how in 1882 they determined what the rightway actually was and how it existed and what the boundaries were and

be it because you can't take a whole whole block and say we declared this as a rightaway to be used. Well, I think sure you can I mean it's it's no different than an easement. You can say, "Yeah, but an easement is completely different because you're it's the same idea as far as the chain of titles crossing a piece of property to get to your property, not necessarily. There's different kind There's access easements, there's utility easements, there's all kinds of ements. It's the same principle. Yeah, but you're usually using an easement to to get from one point to another, but not to park your car." I wouldn't say I wouldn't say that's true.

Okay. I just been I have a property in Milbrook that has a 130 year old easement that the the elementary school has decided doesn't exist. And so it's been this like sevenyear battle with them saying we yeah we've had this for a long time. So we've been doing a lot of

Yeah. I think on like one of the reasons I want to keep us focused here is that there there are these kind of like twists and turns in the the in the history of of of property law and navigating that. So I'm I'm that's one reason why I'm I think that like focusing on the 12 if we can get if we get an updated agreement for the MDA and we get those added then when we go actually go to the public hearing we can make we can amend that to whatever a new amount but I agree with you in total that that it it keeps us moving forward. Yeah. So otherwise we're we're stuck in a no man's land right and going nowhere.

Yeah. I mean the at the end of the day like if there's nothing more to add to the application we will go we'll we'll you know go ahead and go to public hearing we'll have the conversation about it. We'll um uh you know the if you want if you want us to refer you to the to the village board for the parking waiverss we'll do it and we'll include a recommendation from our board about how they should be thinking about it and we'll make it a condition of an approval assuming we get to that. I think everything else about the application feels, you know, straightforward. Yeah, I totally agree. I think for the for for now, this is where it's a good place to move forward. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Just just to be clear,

Yeah. worst case scenario for these folks, 12 waivers. Yes. 250 bucks a piece. Yes. Three grand. Yep. Okay. I have to say that I sort I feel for them that is there is it unreasonable just hear me out that there's some sort of discount for the the waiver. I I don't think the planning board definitely doesn't have that power but we can make recommendations. I don't think the village board has it's in the code. of the

because I I'm putting my my my myself in the place of the owner. Um, and just as Grace said, why why am I having to pay for space on property I already own? Well, because I understand I understand. But as as the owner, I'd be ruffled. There's there's an emotional dimension to this that I think, you know, anyone who experiences an easement, you know, encounters, right? I can and um I mean they'll all come out

they'll uh your recommendations and observations you know matter. So uh would uh that you had you know this just remind that that uh yeah at some point in time he you know small one.

Yeah. No I think I think we're we're happy to include all the context in in any kind of recommendation. And I think Jonathan's Jonathan's point is important though that like it wouldn't it would be misleading to make a recommendation that they change a number like per a cost per space that they they literally can't do, right? It would give you it would give you false impression that that was an option when they when it's like not even a decision that they have the power to make themselves without a literally amending the code. So that's the that's the main thing there. And again, don't quote me on that 250. I think that's what it is. If it's something different or if it says the village board has the power to set it, then they can do that. But, um, I believe it is. Yeah, I thought the village board had some

just they have it for for the park. There's like a park require a recreation requirement for some for some modifications in Santa Fe, New Mexico where I I I worked for probably 15 years which has it's the same situation in Santa Fe that is here where you want to somebody wants to build a hotel, they want to build a bigger restaurant.

It's the same thing. But um they always call them IUS which um that $250 you talk about is an IU that never gets paid. Like no one ever collects on it and it just it just keeps right on your own. Yeah. I mean keep in mind the ZBA is an option too. You could seek the the variances and you know there's an application fee but variances don't cost any money. So that's you know that's your prerogative. Uh Right. Yeah. And you could say, you know, you want go to the CBA. The waiver right now is the best way to go. We're happy with it. We're not.

Yeah. And I think like, you know, like I said, we don't we don't have to decide exactly what the path is for it until we get to all the way through the public hearing. So, um, let's let's focus on that. Let's schedule um a public hearing. Um, so our next meeting is yeah, the 14th. On the 14th. And then there's a question about whether I think because we're on the month gap, we have enough time, Abigail, to get something in the if we wanted to try to do it on the 14th, we have enough time to get it get the notice. The notice has to be up two weeks. No, 10 days. 10 days prior to the

No, you got three weeks. Three weeks, not two weeks. Because of the because of the month boundary, it could go in on the 1st of August. Um, sure. Yeah, that's Friday. Yeah. Next Friday. Next Friday. Yeah. And the um the date the hearing date the hearing would be for the 14th. Don't we have a public hearing for is this the same would it be included in the same hearing of No. No. That's going to be like a week later. Okay. Because that's another that's on the 26th. Another session went to VA.

On the 26th we were supposed to have a public hearing on Tuesday and there was an issue with it never got published in the paper. So, it's pushed to next month later than that. I believe 26. So, it all goes on the same sign, right? I'll bring that sign back to you and get it checked off. Yeah. Yeah. That's why I was bringing it up like um I'm not quite sure what the reasoning for the last This isn't completely relevant zoning. It didn't post. I'm not quite sure if that will happen again for Planning Forge. Okay. Yeah. Um, I can double check, but I can't. Is that something we can like, can you call the PCNR afterwards to see if they got it or is or No, I can certainly do that. Okay.

Yeah, this All right. What What did Eric say the reason was for? I know he sent out an email about that, but he said it was something that he could find out in advance for the next time or something. Noting we posted it early. I think it was communication between quick ad creator and the actual paper prints in. So, I'm not quite sure. Abigail's fault. Yeah, I must have run that. All right. Well, I think it we have some time to work the kinks and it sounds like we have to do it for the the zoning hearing anyway. So, uh we'll get that worked out. In terms of attendance, we need to make sure we have Cororum.

I should be here. I'm good. Ben is questionable or unquestionable. Okay. From Kevin. Um for the 14th of the 14th. Yeah. August. August. August 14th. Yeah. Uh does that sound workable for everyone, Don? Oh, yeah. I won't be here the 14th, but um I can have John come or we'll figure it out ahead of time. But so that one

I think given Yeah. And you know uh I'm just making sure he's up to speed on some of the things you were able to find. Um okay, then let's schedule for the 14th. Um, Abigail will provide you with a list of addresses um that you'll need to um make a posting to uh through certified mail. Probably the same ones from probably the same ones from this one. Um and uh you'll need to post you'll do you provide the sign to post same.

Same sign. Yeah.

Get it remarked. remark. Um I think in terms of updates to the documentation that you have um so the you can think about like all the things we've been doing so far have just been workshop sessions. So the the the public hearing that's the main event that's when we will represent all the material that you've presented to the public. Um we'll get comment from the public. Uh and so having uh up-to-date materials submitted well in advance for the public hearing would be appreciated. Um updates to the site plan. Uh if you do end up finding documentation for the MTA, go ahead and please include the spaces marked uh and um if you wanted to make note of the of the drainage in the back, that would be helpful, too.

Sure. Anything else people would like to see for the hearing? No, I'd just like to um echo what Hillary said. I'm very sympathetic to the parking situation. I'm normally by, by the way, I'm one of the hardest about parking. Like I'm famous for being hard about parking.

I'm like really sympathetic to this situation because you've got like a lush amount of parking and you've been really good sports about it and um you know, Jonathan's done an amazing job in finding finding these these these legacy documents and interpreting them, which you know, well done. Um but um so I really want to give credit to Jonathan but but in terms of like the practicality I just feel like um it's almost like you guys can't cop a break around it. So I would like to um if if I if I had a solution um I just don't I don't sort of I guess understand the technicalities perfectly about what what other sort of creative solutions there are to um to waiverss or or or forgive that's the spirit of what I appreciate that the liability alone having that space, his property. Um, and he and he does maintain it. He's a clean his house on it.

Sorry. His taxes on it. Yeah. Bas. Yeah. I I appreciate the sentiment. I I'm um I just want to make sure we do right by um by Greg. He he bought it not realizing all of the implications of that. We can't even find the the documents, right? Yeah. So, um yeah, we're not trying to be difficult, but this is Yeah, this does seem a little unfair. Uh so many businesses uh have no is the master and and and he maintains.

Yeah. Is that does that resonate with you? said res. Yeah.

Yeah. Sure. Would you mind doing that real quick? Well, it's interesting in in that with the and again this is by no means am I like creating anything um that there was an agreement with the some of the original owners with the village on what is now parking that is being used by the village. And there was an agreement between the village and and the previous owners that the previous owners would allow the village to use those. Right.

Yeah. So then with that being the case, that would not be then considered as part of the right of way because if you if you had an agreement that you could use them, then the the agreement would be that those actually did belong to one depot. either ways otherwise there's probably my guess is there's a lot there's a lot of pass through that particular meer partly because of the question of like was the agreement depot squares to make to begin with no you know like

marked and if we do we have documentation of the agreement having like what were the details did it expire after some amount of time there's just like a lot unfortunately like without like something concrete to work from there's not there's not a lot that we can do to kind of react to to kind of people's experience of it unfortunately.

Yeah. And in talking with the some of the previous owners, their their understanding was always that it was an agreement that had been brought had been put together by the village and and the village has the doesn't have the agree you it hasn't been found. No agreement has been found. Greg and the mayor have been talking about this and she Yes. Uh she said that she would send it and maybe Yeah. She just couldn't find it. I mean, she's never as far as I know. I had just a two minute conversation. She said no, she didn't find it.

Do we know how much a variance would cost? A variance doesn't cost anything. I mean, there's an an application. Yeah. But but yeah, to apply for it. Do we know? Uh Abigail would know the answer to that. Yeah, that really gets into a whole another it's more complicated than well the soft cost involved. I think

yeah it gets really complicated and and the waiver is the best way for us to at this point be able to really move forward. Um getting a variance you'd have to like really get into ownership of the property. uh what the meats and bounds are getting into the right way and all that kind of stuff and we don't want to get into it right now. We appreciate y'all. Yeah. To I think it's a good it's a good way to move forward and if we found something that would reduce the number to discount what you're saying. Yeah. Yeah. Path of least resistance. Okay. And that'll be determined at the public hearing. Yeah.

Yeah. So basically what the the way this will will happen, we'll basically we'll we'll present the all the material you have or rather you will present all the material you have to the to the public. Uh we'll open uh the floor to the public for comment. Um we'll hear what they have to say. We'll if new stuff gets brought up, we'll have a conversation about it. We'll ask questions. Eventually we'll feel like we've heard everything we're going to hear from the public. We'll close the public hearing part of it. we'll move on to discuss you know what have we learned what do we think um we'll include all the information we have updated site plans and all the other stuff and then assuming uh we get to some set of parameters that make an acceptable you know that we feel like we can approve uh the application um we'll make a motion uh to adopt a resolution that in its condition says that this will be this will this is approved conditional on, you know, the village granting x number of waiverss, right? Whatever whatever that happens to be.

A question because I'm I'm fairly new here. I believe I've been here since 2015. Um, and I've been to public hearings, Beacon, um, a number of of them and I've never seen more than three people come to a public hearing. Uh, it varies. We've had a whole we've had a whole block show up the public hearing. Yeah. Typically for for commercial applications for business that is on Main Street, the the turnout is pretty low. Yeah, it's pretty well. Pretty low. Pretty low. Yeah. Pretty low. Yeah. Unless Unless there's some use that's new and

right, you know. Oh, yeah. Yeah. We've seen uh all of us have have only been doing this for a couple years, so we not we haven't seen the full breadth of things that come through. All right. So the off street parking fee and loo on the fee schedule is Jonathan is correct 250. So

all right. Um so I think uh any questions about about the public hearing or um you're looking for new a new package submitted or just uh for us to present the most updated information before then? I mean, you're looking for six copies of updates compiling everything so far or Well, I guess just to have any updates between now and then. So, like if you So, make sure that Yeah. Abigail gets the updates as just if anything changes as as soon as possible.

Got it. And um if anything dramatic changes, you know, give us at least a few days before the public hearing a heads up so the public can, you know, one of the challenges is if if we get new information on the day of, we we may feel like the public hasn't had a chance to react to to it and we may they may delay things. So the earlier you can get it to us, the better. Um so yeah, just Yeah. Um, so the public sits here and Yeah, we'll sit up there in our special elevated chairs. Um, and they can and they can call in. And they call in. Yeah. Yeah, they can call in now, but no one ever does. What? Yeah, I need the number. What was that? I need the number to call in.

Just call in. Yeah. Um, it is um it's always posted on the on the on Yeah. How's it going? Yeah, it's always posted on the on the um on the agenda. So, um feel free to stop in anytime. Um all right, I hope that's it. Thank you. Thank you. Great. Appreciate you guys. Do we need to make a motion for the public the public hearing? Uh yeah, you should to schedule it. Okay. Someone like to make a motion to schedule public. You know what? I think I'd like to make a motion that that we have a public uh meeting for uh One Depot Square and that would be for August

the 14th at 7 p.m. Yes. Second. All in favor? I think we also need to approve the minutes officially. We Well, and we also have um the referral here too. Yes. Yes. I just didn't want to forget that. Thank you. Okay. Bye. Thank you. Thanks, guys. Thank you. in a few weeks. Great. Okay. I have two of these. So, somebody's going to have been like sh I thought it was fuzziness. Maybe organic.

I know. All right. This is one copy of 51 parent. One copy of 51 parent. Okay. I think that's all we need, right? Yeah. A third just in case. All right. So, all right. This is for a new garage side setback.

Why do we have it? It's We always get Yeah, we always get referrals from the time court. Um, so parrot. Oh, this is the this is the deed. Then that's just the bigger thing of the deed. Are they out of and then this must be the actual proposal. Do they encroach anywhere? Um, it says the sideyard is uh encroachable.

Usually they have a table, right? Okay. Is this you rock? I don't know. It's on here. Oh, it's on here. Okay. So, no steel. No ste. All right. So, all right. Let me This is the street. This is the driveway that we're looking at.

This is con so concrete pad. concrete pad. I guess the rest of this is all this building yard and then really and then there's a shed on that location which originally be removed. There's something at this point. Yeah, I don't I haven't seen anything else that has information about the the sighting of the new structure. So, it's a single car garage. The twostory frame dwelling. Is that it?

Yeah. Or Oh, it could be too. So, they're taking the shed out. They're moving the shed. and then putting in a garage. Yeah. So, 17 ft. So, you figure [Laughter] uh all right. So, their their problem is that they are they want to put it three feet three feet from the from the side, but they need five. So, basically, I wonder why they wonder why they can't move it over. How do they get to this?

Well, there there's the asphalt driveway there. I guess doesn't seem to be Oh, that's an asphalt driveway. Yep. It says that. I'm going to have to do it this way cuz it Okay, that's fine. Oh, I have all the printing. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Um I I don't have any particular comment here. I think you know the lot is big. It has looks like a lot of permeable space. So I guess they wanted three feet so that they don't have to like scoot over with the car to get into the garage. They want they want it straight in.

Yeah. And I guess the other neighbors have a shed on the other side of their property that's also very close. Yeah. Yeah. I mean that's that's only that's only a one 1.7 feet out. Yeah. So that so the other people's shed is very close to the fence. Yeah. And it's a stockade fence.

So what's the stockade fence? I I would assume it's like a picket fence but dollar. Okay. So why are these people not here? Well, they don't come. But this is this is us. The zoning board. They're they're not before our board. They are before the zoning board. The zoning board says, "Hey, as a matter of the code, we are refer you to refer to you any application that goes to public hearing." You guys don't have to make any decisions on this. You're just recommending for or against or taking.

And the So, the zoning board would be the ones giving the variance on on ignoring the offer setback and going for three. Yeah. Exactly. That's that's out of our Exactly. Yeah. Right. Okay. Good. I'm good with it. So yeah, I'm fine with it. Yeah, I mean there's a shed opposite and and that thing's pretty close to the fence anyway, so doesn't seem like a big deal. Uh do folks want me to say we don't have comment or were they do they want like you know notional positive comment like what's what's the mood here? Notional positive.

Notional positive. Okay. All right. I'm fine with that. I don't I I don't I mean there's not a big not a big difference between the two. So yeah. Uh do we need to we uh I'll make a motion that the board authorize the chair to um send a memorandum to the zoning board uh with notional approval of 51 parrot uh variance for uh garage. Seconded. All in favor? I I Okay, great. I'll do that. Um, and I think we need to approve the minutes.

I'd like to make a motion to approve the minutes of June 26, 2025. I'll second it. All in favor? I I I'd like to make a motion to approve the minutes of July 10th, 2025. Favor. Second. First second. Okay. All in favor? I Okay. Great. I didn't vote on the second one. And I didn't vote on the first one. Okay. Uh, unless anyone has anything else, I think we're done. Okay.

I'd like to make a motion to start. Do guys, did you guys look at the agenda, the draft? Sorry. I think we approved it last time, didn't we? Yeah, we I did make a a modification. I just added the um uh affidavit of uh mailing. I think we approved a condition on that. Okay. Um Okay. Make the motion to attend. Second. All in favor? I. Okay, everybody. Thank you. Are we all we all? No. Yeah, she's kind of looking at his plane for this teleport over