City Council - Regular Meeting

Is it on? It's on streaming. Terry, on on the question I asked you earlier, and I'm using this so I don't shout. Um, do you have like a running rate year to date or do you just have an absolute number for the IT? No, for anything for any of the departments in terms of actuals. Yeah, I have year to dates if you need them. Just the whole number, not a percentage of the of the total. No. Okay. I say we should get going because these things run long as it is. I think we're going to go very smooth today.

I just feel it in my bones. Remember last year? Oh, we'll have fights, but there's going to be some fights. Doesn't mean we'll win anything. Yeah, you will. You'll say, "How come? How come we're doing that?" Right. Why are we doing that? Let's put a PRB in.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. It's only $60,000. Why don't we double chip that parking lot? It's not in the budget. Doesn't matter. Let's do it. That's okay. I would say that in front of commissioner I mean councilman Schmidt if he was here. I would too. That's why public meeting. I know. Just remind but thank you for the reminder.

Rean, what do we bring you for your uh retirement party? Do we bring you like roses or uh all the bad emails you received over 35 years or I've never had a retirement party before. That's probably a good thing. That's definitely a good thing for us. He had too. So why not? Some people like it so much they do it again. They come out of work and do it again. I don't think that'll happen.

You don't think that's going to happen? Greg Oster Tag is mayor of Mount Vernon, Texas. Was elected as mayor of where he lives now. Yeah, Greg Oster Utah Jazz. Greg Oster Tag. He is. Oh my goodness. He was elected mayor. He might have been better at that than he was at basketball. He didn't move very fast. Good guy. I'm sure he was a good guy. He's a big guy.

He filled up a big hole. Yeah. Makes a better door. He does a window. Yeah. He took a lot of room in the key.

Oh, for the days of Stockton Malone. I know those were the good devil days. Those were the good old days. Stockton Malone. Stockton Malone. Stockton still. Stockton still holds the assist record, doesn't he? I think by quite a comfortable and quite a quite a comfortable margin, too. He was the best of all time when he was paired with Malone. They just they just read each other well.

Course I don't know if they ever did did Stockton quit before Malone. Malone went to Lakers for a year. Oh, I forget about that Laker year. That was kind of a lost year. Huh. I forgot about that. And they got robbed by the Bulls on that one last charge that they called them. Got to whine about that while we're at it. I'm glad you said got in by the Bulls. Oh, really? What?

The Wi-Fi password in the Delta Center is Jordan pushed off. I'm afraid at least in the foreseeable future that was their only chance at glory.

Okay, they got the number two pick. Single Jazz basketball player today. I don't even know a single one. I don't pay attention to basketball.

Like he was driving. He sounded like he was in his truck. I mean, he said, "I'll be there in a minute." I mean, he's usually the kind of guy that's early to things, so I would think that his time was Oh, he thought it was 12:30.

Not when he's playing in dirt. I'm glad to see that bathroom going up on Cole Creek.

It's nice to see it going up. Walls going up. It's nice to see the road open, too. Yes, it is.

That whole industrial road turned out pretty good. It did.

It is. I don't know if we've acquired any property there, but it is. Yes. and then come down about 56 and then somehow get across get across Highway 56. I don't know how we're going to do that. A giant tunnel. No, that's not him. We're getting excited. Phil was walking.

No, it's just Kenny. So, how heavy is that steer? Hey, do you know for last year, Cedar City came in number three

in the entire state of Utah for the most donations for Reese across America? That's ahead of Salt Lake City was number one, but we beat him last year. Yeah, I sold him. And then I forget. Oh, you sold the C. No, it wasn't Clear Phil. I don't know who it was. Then it was us. Pretty good. Yeah, he might be. He actually might be two months old by now. There he is. Calling all Phils. Calling all Phils. There's a pretty Yeah, he's probably getting it for his

think. Steve, you remember the comment that uh the governor made while we were up north about pushing his agenda on housing and the on the cities and so forth. Well, he says what he's doing is he's going for so uh Pritsker tried to do that in Illinois and everybody's pushing back. All the cities are going, hey, we've got our plan. We've got everything managed within the scope of who we are. So, so it's kind of an interesting kind of dynamic there. Yeah. Literally second came off the trailer. He goes crap. I'm like, what? He goes, that's coming home with me. Hey, Phil.

Okay, you're good. Okay, we got one one more quick second. Tomorrow's is 12:20 is when we start. 12:20. 12:30. 12:20 because I didn't give them 20 minutes each. Yeah. 1220. That's a thick folder you got there, Yeah. That's what I mean. We already did the hard work.

And I might have missed it, but did we ever Did we ever get emailed what their original requests were versus what made this? No, we did not. But I had I'll go through kind of our process um when Phil gets in. But there is there is a summary that talks about like on personnel where you know what was asked and like this one. Would the summary include everything that was asked originally? Personnel and capital. Just personnel. Personnel and captain. Yeah. So, there's a summary with personnel, capital, and operating on the back part of your Yeah.

That includes everything that was asked for and everything that was approved. Okay. That's what I figured. Okay. What you're missing is some of the detailed of the just day-to-day current expense stuff. Operations. There's a summary of what they ask for. They ask departments ask for money in three categories. Operations, capital, and personnel. Right. There's a summary in the back uh in the back 10 pages of your packet that summarizes what they asked for in operations, capital, and personnel. Okay. Yep.

The the process that I went through is was I from what I understood slightly different than uh than the past had. So after everybody came in and did their presentations to us and we we made cuts, you know, obviously we don't have enough money to fund everything and had to figure out how to trim that down. I then had everybody come back in and and discussed with them why we recommended cutting certain things and including others. Um and then I made it clear to them if they disagree, obviously this is the chance to come and to be able to make their case of why. But my hope was that by doing that that they at least had an understanding of the thought process behind why I put things in and and cut other things out that will hopefully min minimize that. Um the other piece um that that uh you'll see is that I I functioned under this idea too. So there's been this ever since I've been coming to the meetings that it was $4 million that didn't get put into a well then it went down to three and a half and now after buying out the armrest contract that's at three million that was kind of not used this year that was available to be able to be used. So with the things that we did take out um there's basically about 1.2 of that that is still there. So, as you listen to and review things that have been taken out, and there may there's even a few things that they that the departments didn't ask for that maybe we still want to include, for example, a master plan or general planning um process again to try to update that and and look at maybe our overall um building code or zoning code. Um that isn't in currently, but something that all of uh most of you mentioned in our five priorities of of uh that we made this council. So, there's some things like that that we want to be thoughtful of and say, "Hey,

there is 1.2. If you change nothing else, we roughly have about 1.2 that you can still add back into the budget um and use up that kind of extra that we had from this last year. And it's un it's unallocated. It's general fund. It could go to anything." Correct. Okay. Okay. So, that's kind of the groundwork of where we're starting from is with that understanding. So now starting with compensation

turn that microphone on and tell us who you are.

I'm Natasha with human resources. Natasha Hershey. I'm going to talk about uh colas and merits and insurance and retirement. So as you're all aware, a compensation study was completed this last year to help us to be more competitive in the market. All of our ranges were updated um based upon what the study recommended. We updated the ranges using a combination of our comparable averages, internal equity, our institutional knowledge of positions and we have a point value system that we use. So we did kind of a combination to get the ranges that we have. Uh today departments updated their job descriptions and the consultant reviewed the descriptions to help us find comparables in our in the market. We compared approximately 20 entities including cities, counties, fire and sewer districts. These uh cities and counties were selected uh by Paul and the mayor um and myself and our consultant to try to find cities that were similar to our size um in budgets, population. um so similar to us and some were used because of their proximity to us. So uh that's how where we what we use to compare. Um we also use some fire and sewer districts just because we have some positions that um those districts are important to help us find comparables. Some ranges shifted significantly, others minimumly minimally. Even though range is shifted, the majority of our employees are within the pay range of their position. Um, do you have any questions about kind of the method we used during the compensation? So, the mayor's budget implements the new pay ranges. Each employee was brought to the minimum of their new range or given a 2 and a half% increase,

whichever was greater. So some employees that range shifted significantly saw a much higher increase. So um whichever was greater. So let's say the two and a half% was great. Well, no, you just said they all got to at least the minimum at least the minimum of two and a half.

So So some positions shifted by maybe 10% that range. So some an employee could have got a 10% increase to get to the minimum of their new range. Some employees were already well within their range. So all those employees were given a 2 and a half%. Others were given a different percentage based upon where they were and they needed to get to their new new range. Um the majority of those are from public safety. Those positions that shifted significantly. And I'll just add my voice to what we went through and tried this is the approach I took with the with as we went through this the study. We need to be paying a competitive wage for any position, right? Um I um had the discussion with rather than just the point values that was built to a degree in a comparison between departments. Um I felt like making sure that that position if that person quit that that were competitively paying to be able to recruit somebody into that position. So a a a sewer worker, right, is not the same as a landscape guy in the parks department. So even if there's point values that are applied to say, hey, these are similar type positions, that was kind of what we used as the starting point, but then we use the averages that came in from the study to make sure that the points value system isn't what held us or tied our hands and making sure that we're paying a competitive wage for each position. And that's what we then brought in the the study piece for the averages from other municipalities. Does that make sense?

Yeah. So just uh a couple of questions. the the uh consultant that we hired uh did we tell them where to go to look for data or did they go based on our makeup size city and so on and so forth get the data themselves.

So our consultant uses a system that's called TechNet which a lot of cities and uh counties fire districts uh participate in throughout the state. So, they have that data. We go in and update our salary information. Um, there was some times where I had to go out and look and try to get comparables on my own. Maybe a city didn't participate. Maybe I just needed to look into the market to get Not every city, even though we're all very similar. Not every city has every single position we have. Or do they use positions exactly like we use them? uh a water worker one in Cedar City might not be the same as a water worker three in St. George. So even though we have similar titles, it doesn't mean that the jobs are exactly the same. So that's why the consultant kind of reviews the job descriptions and we try to make our best comparison. You're not comparing apples to apples, okay?

No matter what. I mean, for example, police officers, a lot of cities don't have a patrol three. They do patrol one and two. Well, we do have one, two, and three. So, where are ours different and how do we balance that? So, we kind of use our point value, which compares uh job knowledge. Um, so our education responsibilities and and that's how we kind of look at the job description and we this is a tool that our consultant developed that we implemented about 10 years ago. So we have these job factors that we compare to kind of give us so we rank our positions based upon uh our four factors and then that like hazard pay. So like the police and fire get a a lot higher hazard pay than I get sitting in the office. So we use this system but then we also went in and looked at uh so let's say a patrol one. We took a patrol one and then we took these cities that we used these 20 cities that the mayor kind of you can maybe give a little background on how you chose

the list that I came up with of which cities we compared to I viewed it in two ways. one geographically, right? Because if someone's living in Cedar City and they get enticed by Paroin or, you know, well, actually, we didn't use Paro because it's too small, Washington City, Hurricane that they're geographically approximate where they could still live here and and drive and commute. Then we included all of those cities so that we made sure we were competitive with our geographic market. Then we looked more at similar city sizes so that we didn't want to compare our bud our city to Salt Lake, right? their budget is significantly larger than ours. So we we tried to identify um similar size cities or ones that were in a county that maybe were the hub like Cedar's the the hub of Iron County, right? So we we looked and said, well, Richfield's kind of the hub for Severe County. So Richfield should be included in that because they have that that geographic um factor for that county. So that that's kind of the the I guess probably three ways in which we came up with that list to try to make it as realistically comparable to us as possible. So statistically then apples to apples

as close as you could get. No, got it. But uh where do we end up in terms of a a range of uh everything we have is at least in the average. in the average. Correct. The before the study everything we had. No, after study our goal was to get all of our ranges to be right. So what is the increase pre to post total? Yes. In terms of percentage because you're using 2 and a.5% to give to everybody that was within the range. Right. So

kind of a merit increase or what kind of adjustment? Let me give you a little bit more information before I before we answer that. Now, every range because we have over a hundred positions in the city, you know, a 100 different pay ranges. So, not every range didn't shift by a certain percentage. Some increased significantly more. And I can give you more dollar amounts. Some a range, a low range could have shifted by 15,000. So, let's say there was a range that was 65. it's now 80, but another range could have been at 50 and only went to 51. So depending on what the market said on the positions is where those ranges shift. And I don't have a percentage for you, but on on every single position,

but we use that two and a half% to move everybody. So everybody well let's let's back up because he's probably curious on because I had to learn the in our policy we talk about that our attempt every year per policy is to try to do what's a cola increase for everybody of 2 and a half%. So that's what this side of the equation was was focused on was trying to make sure we met that policy need by everybody getting at least that 2 and a half% and then those that were out of range or out of market then they they got more. Mhm. And then the second side of the policy talks about a merit increase as well.

Um so so far we're just touching on trying to get that policy increase of at least the two and a half on the side is 2.6% is where is what the cola says that we use what we use to do cola was 2.6. So we adjusted all positions to the minimum or gave them all a two and a half% which is kind of where the cola piece is it comes into place two and a half two and a half ours is two and a half but that's what the cola says is 2.6 this this year and then we have another 2 and a half% merit that we uh shoot to aim for every year. Um and that is the second piece of this. So,

so just before you jump off of the merit, um, not everybody gets a merit, but you're saying your average is 2 and a half. So, that's what the pol our policy says that we will do a cola every year. Yeah. And then we aim for a two and a half at least a two and a half% merit increase. And everybody you that's based upon performance. So you have to have a three or above on your performance evaluation to receive that two and a half. Others would get more and some get nothing.

So the way that we've always applied this in the past has been just you either get it or you don't. It's not this year we're doing something a little different. Let me explain explain that to you. So in the mayor's budget we implemented all the new pay ranges. Some employees might have saw a big increase, some a small anywhere, and then everybody got two and a half percent. And that's just part of what we did as the cola piece of of things. Then the mayor, we went in and we adjust, we gave each department an average of two and a half% of their budget. So they can use that money to do use it for perform performance, compression, whatever. they see they have in their department, they can use this funding to um give pay increases. Now, they have to justify it. So, every department has a spreadsheet of all their employees and then they have their dollar amount. So, let's say they have $10,000. They have to divvy that up between their employees and then they'll have to make a justification of why they what

and who reviews that if I may ask you two guys. Yeah. What is the timeline on that? Okay. For the merit, they're supposed to have those submitted by the end of May. Evaluations are also due by the end of May. So during the month of May, I send out all the evaluation forms to the departments. I've sent them all their uh compensation spreadsheet. They're supposed to have evaluations and their proposals in by the end of May. So, this was going to surprise you. In your time, how many times have you seen an employee not get the merit? Um, less than a handful. I That's why I'm asking.

Yeah. So, so part of part of this idea that that and I made this clear and we when I visited with each department head that merit should be a merit. It is not a because you breathe you get it and use the tool of that annual evaluation to help improve your employees.

Um so that's part of what this will do this year and then we're going to talk about next year how we um make sure that happens. There's another thing that may help in that process if I may just kind of suggest something that we can discuss offline later on if you want. And that is um every every tier within the um pay scale has a number of employees that belong to multiple departments, right? So the way that our pay scale works, it's by position. So everybody has their own pay range. So a police officer one has their own pay range.

Yeah. But all police officer one fall in there. Oh, correct. Yes. And there are equivalent positions in other departments that fall in that range. No, we don't we don't cross departmentalize them. No. So every position this point value system that we use got rid of that. So like hang on, hang on, hang on, hang on. Please finish your thoughts. So maybe you're maybe you're offering some some idea that we can use.

Yeah. So I mean normally when you have pay grade ranges, right, they they have a they have a crossover effect in order to simplify in terms of evaluations, payroll management, benefit management and so on and so forth. So if you have let's say one through five pay ranges, everybody in the city would fall under one of those regardless of the department based on uh education, skills required, time on job, experience, blah blah blah blah blah. That's how you figure out who you can promote. Now, you're not going to promote me to be a a police officer because I wouldn't know what to do with that, right? I mean that's a unique circumstance. The same thing with the fire department but there are other other departments where crossover can can be achieved water to sewage or vice versa. Who knows right? Uh that's one of the one of the thought processes. So there are a certain number of ranges and everybody falls within those ranges one way or another. Right. um in order to facilitate the process and make it more fair and less work for these two guys. Uh the way I've seen it done in a multiplicity of places is that you everybody falls into one category also of employee uh like general employees salary range or management salary or executive salary. And then what would we would do in in other places is there would be a team of the of the people above the

salary ranges that are going to be evaluated that get together and talk about you know why somebody should get a a merit increase. a department manager sells it to the other department managers and then everybody votes and then that summary goes up to the executive board that decides if all of that is going to take place. So it becomes an an a process where um let's say Chief Adams and Chief Phillips and um David Johnson are in that tier that's evaluating the tier below. They're going to use their brain not only to come up with an an a reason to give a merit increase to their people on the on the level below, but they're also going to question things, right? Is performance really performance? Are we, you know, what why are we given that person or not given that person? So, it becomes a little bit more robust kind of filter to come up with.

So, it's other sets of eyes helping evaluate, right? And it helps you guys because these guys will have a conversation. These guys meaning anybody on the actual evaluation process and on the actual accomplishments goals versus actuals uh you know and all of that will filter up so that you know at the end of the day when it's approved it can be done.

So some of some of what we're trying to do this round is very similar to what you're suggesting. Um, the crew being used to evaluate any given department comes from within that department. So Darren didn't just do his by himself. Darren is going to develop how to spend that money in conjunction with Jimmy and and Jr. and Clinton. Uh Kenny is not just going to do it by himself. He's going to bring in his his folks. Same thing with Ryan. Now, where it breaks down for us, frankly, is in some of our smaller departments. Mhm.

Where we simply don't have that diversification of labor. Um, so that might be a little different set of eyeballs and a different challenge. Sure. But the process I work is very similar. Yeah, it is similar. The only thing is you don't have the challenge comes from a crossf functional but it's it's a good thought for us to continue to add as we look towards next year. So this year, because there's some compression issues with with the fact that you had some significant raises within departments, um that that motivated us to try to to say, "Hey, department, you got to fix that issue as well."

And and then so you get to figure out how you break it up within your department to fix it. But I I think moving forward, we want to continue to have these discussions on how do we make merit truly be a merit-based equation, not because you just are still employed, right? The cola is you're still employed. So maybe that's the practice in all government uh entities, but if don't call it merit because it doesn't sound like it's a merit, but we want to try to make it be. So let's let's have those some more of those discussions over the next year.

So we are going to be revamping our compensation policy. Uh the mayor has expressed some desire to see us do some different things and so we will bring that back to you when we uh finalize a policy. So this year, like the mayor said, we're trying to address implementing these new pay ranges, get people in them. If the departments have any problems with compression or anything like that, they've been they're able to kind of fix some of that. Um if everything's okay, they still have the ability to to do some increases above and beyond what was just given of the two and a half%.

Yeah. Just uh one last comment on on my view of this is that it it forces every organization to really come up with a with a good recommendation especially for merit or bonuses or whatever you want to call it because that manager is going to have his peers evaluating whether that performance was really done or not or accomplished or not and they become very robust discussion that filter the the preferential mindset you know to oh I I really like Jimmy and look at how hard he works and by the way he gets my lunch every day I won't say that out loud but you know so anyway so it it challenges the system and puts pressure on it so that we provide a more equitable and a fairer um process for the employee, not necessarily for management.

Yeah, I appreciate that. Does that make sense? Yeah. And we'll suck you in as we work through some of those tweaks. So, thank you. I'm sorry to Well, not I I would be very interested to hear more about that as we work on addressing our compensation policy. So, that kind of gives you a little background about where we're going with Cola and Merit. Are there more questions or Yeah, I have two I have two questions. Um, I just want to make sure I understand. So, let's say that employee A was on the lower range. So, he or she got a 10% increase as part of this process. Does that 10% include the 2 and a half% cola? Cuz they So, yeah, they don't get both. They don't get both.

Okay. All right. That was my question. So what if a person was only at one and a half percent as they would then go into the salary compensation to meet that minimum range. So it would be greater than one and a half%. So they got the 2 and 12%. Okay. All right. Then my other question is the 2 and 12% merit pay that we're talking about that's been distributed to the departments from a citywide. What does that represent? What does that dollar amount represent? Oh, that's a good question. I don't have that. Dr. Yeah, Terry. It's not consolidated. It's throughout the whole throughout the whole I could get that number half million. I have it off the top of my head. I'm pretty sure it's around a half a million dollars.

We we we can get a total for you. Okay. I just want to know what it was.

I have it in a spreadsheet in my office. to to that particular point as we one of the things I missed by going through the entire and I'm sorry to keep when I went through the entire package I I didn't have a summary of the headcount that we have in the city and then to kind of figure out what the average salary and compensation cost it's per head so that I could have an idea of whenever we say, "Hey, we we want to add another headcount and this thing now you know how much money that represents and so forth, but and obviously it varies by level." I understand that. But

do you want do you want that broken down by department or do you want that just broken down citywide? I think at this point I'd be satisfied just with citywide because the department's numbers are all included in each of the pages of the budget. You just have to go through and I didn't I didn't want to start adding all you want it broken down by uh average full-time and average part-time. Definitely simp. Yeah, that that would be more than enough for this conversation this year. But going forward, it would be it'd be good to have it by by salary RANGE BECAUSE THAT'S where

we can have a a conversation which is very practical. I guess if somebody comes in and says, "Hey, I need two two officers level two, right? Well, I know what that's going to cost us, right? Salary, benefit, blah blah blah." And and then we can vehicle, computer, uniform. Yeah. Right. It's all in there, right? I mean, don't forget the car and Yeah, the vehicle. Yeah. Now, the cost, the the employment cost, not the the other stuff, that other stuff. It kind of is for an officer. You employ an officer and they get a car like they have to. So, it actually is

but it's already separated there. I want to know what salary benefit and uh you know all the other stuff that we provide that's that's it's a headcount cost. The other stuff is departmental cost and I don't it's all broken down. So you want the percentage increase o citywide over fulltime for just the salary and benefits. I think he asked for two things. He wants an average uh just an understanding of if we add a new city employee so take all of our full-time what's the average cost to the city for that employee in in its range right in its level

I think there's gentlemen please please understand we do not have level 1 2 3 4 and five we don't have steps we don't have grades yes we can do the big picture one the information you're looking for we cannot provide you in the format you're looking for We don't have these. We don't have the setup that you suggested. The police and fire do, right? But no one else in departments there's different. So every department has a their own range per job because they're all different. Job has their own range.

So for example, the the water worker No, it makes sense actually, Waldo, once you get into it. Like the water worker has specific certifications they have to do that are only specific to them. It's not transferable for us to say that guy can transfer over here to sewer. They're different. Their training's different. Their their um certifications are different.

Um so it's hard to do it the way that that you express. But but we can talk about that again between this year and next year on if there's ways to take it offline. You're talking about like step and grade type systems where everybody has a grade and there's a water worker one might be in a grade one and police officer might be in a grade one and all these different positions fall under that. We used to have that system 10 years ago. We went away from it and went to this point value system which evaluates each job based upon each requirement. Each department has to appeal to the market. like an engineer with an engineering degree has got to be completely different than a than a water worker.

I gota tell you at Ford Motor Company we had 275,000 employees all over the world. We had six ranges. Yeah. So it's worth it's worth a conversation to go back to range was the particular market where you live. So if you're an engineer and you have to go to school to get a PhD and all this kind of stuff, somebody else electrical engineer, the mechanical engineer has to do the same thing. So the sets of skills, education, uh every uh job performance parameters are they're not exactly the same, but they're they're in the same range. Education requirements are the same across the

right. So yeah, we can we can reook at that. Anyway, the last years, we used to have a system like that. We went away from it. Not saying that we can't go back to it. If it's something that we feel like could be beneficial, we can definitely look at it again. We, like I said, we were there. We switched to this other system. It doesn't mean it's perfect or I'm happy to to do what works. I'm just Yeah, it's always good discussion though. Although, Scott, you had a second question and then Robert, I think, had one. No, mine was just uh I'm just interested to know what the merit cost was city-wise and what the pay increase was city-wise. The total cost. Yeah. Yeah. For the two. Okay.

Because he's right. It is all spread across the thing. But just And just to clarify, Natasha, just to clarify, so for example, you mentioned public safety. So I noticed the three new police officer positions were like 340,000. Huh? Oh, I did skip. I apologize. I did. But like but the total increase is 600 and something. So that's because the majority of them were below and they got raises bigger or they received an increase bigger than the two and a half percent. Correct. Correct. Yeah. We had the majority of uh positions that fell out outside of the range were in police and fire. So I saw fire was quite a bit bigger than just the new positions portion. Okay. Sounds good. Okay. Robert, did Julie have

Well, I I think we're going to move on from what my comment was, but it was really it's hard to compare an engineer to a policeman to a fireman to it is water worker when you only have one in each of those, you know, that that anyway that's even comparable. And the other we'll get into it later discussion because I have some thoughts on that too, but anything else? Any other comp or questions about compensation cola's merits? Nope. No. That's very good. Thank you.

I'm going to touch on retirement then. So, we have several different retirement funds as many of you are aware. Uh the tier one employees which are the tier one is hired before July 1st, 2011. Um there are starting to be fewer and fewer of those employees. The public employees and police rates decreased a little bit for the tier one employees. uh the public employees decreased by 1% the police by a half a percent and the fire department remained flat on the tier one tier 2 which is everyone else hired after July 1st 2011 um for public employees that rate increased from 081 to point or to 1.31RS requires employees to pick up that percentage the way that we have done that is we

the employee pays it and we give him an allowance um to offset that increase. We've been doing that for the last three years, I believe it is. Um and the mayor's budget is included to continue to do that again this year. Um public safety, police, and fire, their rate increase from 4.73 to 5.98. URS allows for cities to pick that cost up, so there's no additional allowance there. The mayor's budget also includes that we pick that cost up um to continue paying the full retirement for all employees. Any questions about the retirement

and is their retirement more public safety just because they usually retire with less years than retire? Yeah, they can retire 25 years now. Tier two is 25. Uh tier one for public safety it's 35 for non-public safety. Tier one, it's 20 years and 30 for non-public safety. So, their rate is a lot higher. So, I think they retire sooner. Okay. And then health insurance. You guys approved all of the health insurance a couple weeks ago. So, if you have any questions there, I'll answer them, but other than that, I'm flat across the board. Yeah, that's pretty good. Thank you. Thank you so much.

You should also note that this year there are 27 pay periods in our fiscal year. So we've allowed for that too versus versus 26. Normally it's 26. Every once in a while we have a quirky year where there's 27. Okay. Yeah. So this does skew the numbers making them look a little bigger than they really are. Okay. Fantastic. Police. Well, yeah. No, whatever you got to do. Too much. Good afternoon. Good afternoon,

Mayor Staff. Darren Adams with the police department. I'll have Lieutenant Pollock join me as we start with animal control. I just wanted to express gratitude to to all of you for your support and the mayor especially uh in this budget year. Uh very um positive budget presentation and and meeting with him afterwards to talk about what he funded was was very much appreciated. So thank you and thank you for for all you do for us. So we'll start with animal control. That should be fairly brief. So, I'll ask Lieutenant Pollock to come up and present. So, sorry, real quick. Terry, as we're going through these, now that we're on individual departments, do you recommend we just focus on the summary pages at the end or That's what I'm focusing on.

Okay. The summary pages at the very end, the last 10 pages. Okay. Because really, that's just going to show all the differences. Everything else is the same. The the summary only shows the difference. Control on page n at the very end. The last 10 pages are the summaries. So if any change to last year's budget on there, it will show on just the summary pages. Yeah, it starts on page 30. And so PDF 30 or PDF 30? PDF 30. Uh, no, page 30. There they are. Okay, I think we're good now. Okay. Sorry.

All right. Clint Pollock with the police department. Um, appreciate you guys. This is my first time, so hopefully you're not in for a bubbling mess. Um, so we uh with the animal control budget, um just a few changes which we um got uh some extra money for dog food, food for the animals out there. Um we asked for some money within the building. Um, we had a conversation with the mayor which was good that we'll try to find some money. Uh, we just need to get some updates um with the doors uh for the dog kennels. They're on

What's wrong with the doors? The just the pulleys are given out. Um, some of the doors are getting bent down, but we're going to try and use some of the money that we currently have to try and get those taken care of. Um, we also got a ConX box that we're going to put out there so we can have more storage. We're getting overfilled with some storage stuff. So, they're going to have some extra room with that. So, we appreciate the that falls under So, the ConX box is under is the $10,000 under uh That's under their capital. Capital. Yeah. Yep. So where's that going to go and what's going in that conx?

It's going to be just for storage with the stuff if been out there recently in the store. You mean like food storage or it it will yard tools or what? Yeah, mostly whatever that they don't have room for. She'll rearrange things so it's all orderly and what she decides that she wants to put out there and what she's going to put in the storage room. So just kind of dependent on what her organization is. I don't know exactly how she's going to set that storage room is just packed. Yeah, I'm sure it is. I'm just not a big fan of ConX's because we have a brand new storage facility. Well, brand new. It's what, seven years old now?

Um, industrial area. It is an industrial area with lots of conics as all I know. I know. But it's our city building and I want it to look nice. As opposed to I understand and all the is the 10,000. Uh yeah, it's the the 20 You're buying a 20 footer. Well, it shouldn't cost anywhere near that much hopefully. Then 10,000 10,000 unless you're getting unless you're getting the one that has all the individual doors, but which maybe they are. I don't know. Just don't spend that much. She'll get one for cheap. I 5,000 bucks a piece. Yeah.

Mayor, I just have a a quick question. Every every department I went through on the general budget ins and outs and everything else. I found that janitorial supplies had these massive range changes. Oh, there's a reason for that. Mr. Bman will tell you a year ago. So, um, let's start five years ago. Each I'm sorry to interrupt your presentation, but I just looked at your number and it's also out of whack here. $8,200. Yeah.

So, let's let's look we'll go back five years. Each individual budget included a line item for janitorial supplies and then we would have an employee that would go out and get the janitorial supplies and come and fight with all the departments to get the money to pay for them. and it was tremendously inefficient. So this budget season when we hired BART, we said we're going to change the way we do that. We're going to strip all the janitorial supplies from the individual budgets and consolidate them in a building budget to give him the resources he needs to go out and get the stuff we need to maintain our facilities without having to battle with individuals who are in charge of those budgets. you use more.

So you pulled the budgets out, you consolidated. One person is going to buy all materials, equipment, whatever, and it would be allocated to the departments based on headcount usage and needs based on what the building needs. So for example, in this building, we got what we got two restrooms here. We got a couple restrooms over in the police department, right? Um there's carpet shampooing and window cleaning and all that stuff. Um, do we have one company to do all the maintenance, all the janitorial work throughout?

We do our own janitorial work. We hire our own people to do janitorial work. We hire out window cleaning. We hire out uh maintenance on our HVAC systems. Um, okay, I got it. Okay. But Bart serves as our facilities director, does he not? Yeah. Yeah. That was the idea to consolidate under one person. Perfect. a little more efficient. Okay. Thank you, Terry. I have one question. I'm assuming it's just essentially a an error, a typo, but under animal control, those first two lines, were they just kind of in the operational side of things, they're just left completely blank? Was that just they're the only ones on this whole list? And so, I was just curious that were left blank.

Are you talking on the Yeah, on the summary side of things, that was a mistake. Okay, that's what I thought. I figured that. I just wanted to make sure. So, the I I had a question earlier there, too. the total is completely different than the proposed the 709 compared to the Oh yeah, I'll fix that. Um I was wondering if salaries were embedded in there and then we don't see them or if it's just Yeah, because maybe those salary numbers are included in there and I don't know. Do you know where but the salaries still should be stated if they're increasing? Right. Well, just go back to the page. Yeah, if you go there was there was a small increase in salary, but I think that's just the call $4,820.

If I'm if I understand correctly though, Terry, we will not see if all it is is either the colet or the merit increase, we will not see them in the operational. This is only if they want to increase a position or do something like that. So if it's just the raises, we don't see it in the summary. But so that total it's it's a total of the police and the animal control together because they're under one department. Okay. Okay. So yeah, the the total for animal control really is about 318. Please send the I have a just a comment for you and the chief. Um please look at the flag poles out there.

One of them is leaning and I don't know what's going on there, but we need to get that repaired. I don't know if it means ripping it out and I I don't know what it means, but it's looking pretty sad. We've had come in before and their base is in a sand material. So they they will move in this high wind. Okay. I think over time those flags just pulling it up capital.

I I also have a question on the if you go to the regular budget by by u account we have a reduction of 7384 bucks on social security for temp. uh all the previous years seem to be kind of in line with a little bit of growth and then this year we go down by seven grand. Um is that because we we put somebody in as a permanent employee and but that's a huge drop on social security. You're looking at animal control. Yeah. Count 76. Go to page eight.

1076123. If you go to page eight, it's a account number. Well, a social security temp. Yeah, like you said, 1076123 and it doesn't make sense that that would go down if wages go up unless we have a whole bunch that are over the social security limit. Yeah, I which I don't know that we'd have. It was just a huge number and I didn't know that we were making

that any significant changes in employees other than I think you got one temp goes out and then another one stays permanent. I don't I don't remember. I thought I read that somewhere. Well, even but it doesn't it doesn't square if you're over the social security limit. That would be the only way. Part-time full-time. I'm going to have to um trace that back and find out what happened. Um it could be a disconnection from the compensation page. Yeah, if we look at the plus and minuses, that one and then the janitorial were the big ones. But anyway, I just Hey, you're not You're supposed to question the decreases. That's a good thing. Yeah. Huh?

Supposed to question the decrease. Real do if there's a decrease, I want to know why. I don't want to, you know, talk to us about your full-time shelter assistant that did not get funded. Okay, let me answer Scott's question real quick. So, the ConX box is going to go where the shed is behind the shelter. Okay. Um, and the question about the full-time position. Yeah, you had a full-time shelter assistant that was not funded, it looks like.

Yeah. Um, so we requested a full-time position through um the information um the increase of everything that's going on out there. Um, we when we talked with the mayor, we discussed that we can change operational hours, maximize some of the part-time shelter staff out there for more hours. Um, and probably adjust those hours to be closed more so that she's able to conduct her business without being interrupted. How long can we stave off this or how long can we hold off without getting that position? You think this is the third year in a row they've requested it?

Yeah, that's the question is is she's busy obviously. She's not only maning the front, but she's out developing relationships in the community. She works the best friends. She'll take animals over there constantly. Volunteers will sometimes do that. The part timers are there to clean and they'll also come and and man the front counter as well.

We're just trying to get ahead of of growth. Obviously, you've seen the quarterly stats as they come in and it's just making sure that she has sufficient help if she believes that we have somebody there to man that because again most of the time parts are in the back. So, we'll have to run out. We still have that that counter help. So the the discussion was um you recall gosh one or two years ago um and partly with co we increased the hours of operation and I I don't know about you but I never got a single call from a resident saying hey we wish you were open more. So the question that becomes for council is how how often do you want to be open? If we're only open four hours a day so that she can get her things done, go out and do what she needs to do, come back and we don't have to fill that need. It's probably more cost effective as long as the public is okay with that. And historically they have

Okay. Is that what you're proposing or do you even know what you're talking about in terms of closing two hours earlier a day or four hours every day or want to let Britney in? Yeah. So she can give us that information. Yeah. Will you make sure that we get at least know what you're considering before you go into effect? Great. Yeah. I mean it's not your standard retail store that people expect to be open. I think it's okay to have modified hours for something like that as long as we can receive animals. Mostly that's the problem is if people want to be able to drop off, you know, if they happen to have an animal that was on their front step and they we need to have they need to have a way to drop it off, but they could always call and meet an officer there, couldn't they?

Animal controls on it. If for some reason they're both off our Okay, that would be my only concern is I don't want people not to be able to drop things off if they need to as far as the adoption and stuff that they can work around our hours, I would assume. So, okay. Thank you. Thank you very much. Anything else? So on that $10,000, if you're just getting one 40footer, they're in a range from 4,000 to$7,000. The $7,500 one is a 40footer with with open side doors. Gosh, that allow you to fix the flag poles. Yeah, you've got 10 will 10 is more than enough. We just bought one. I bought a brand new one. Yeah, they're like five grand. So those those come down, do you know? Yeah, they have. Yeah. No, you can get

you could you could go get a one trip you could go get a one trip conx right now from AAA for 5,000 bucks. When we bought uh it's probably been 5 years ago when we bought two of the 40footers for evidence they were about 12 a piece. So geez yeah they've come down significantly. So I would adjust that put you know so does the council want to adjust that total or I mean I mean it doesn't make sense to put 10 on there if you can get them for seven or six. 10,000 is way too much. You buy a 40footer. You can buy a for 7,500 bucks right here. You'd have to drive to Colorado City to get it. But it's it has the side doors, four side compartments on a brand new 40footer. 7500. 40footer. Yeah.

I would say lower it to 7,500. I don't want to make them feel like they have to go bargain. Side door. If you The side door one might be nice. Yeah, I think she wants at least be 7,500 bucks. 7500 will more than cover it. The non-side door ones are in the four and five range. And you're only wanting a 20footer, you said, right? That's what she's okay with. At least for now. Well, let's just say $500 and leave it there and let's move on. Yeah. Get the get a big one. Yeah. Get the side door one and get a 40footer. Then you're not asking for a 20footer in a couple years. Amen. Okay. Great. Any other questions? No. Thank you. Thank you. Police.

Okay. Um, one other thing too that I was just going to mention on the animal control side, the mayor and I had a discussion about uh part-time wages. I know those aren't included. I sent him an email this morning um just talking about uh an increase um there to be more competitive. There was a posting uh earlier this year with the sheriff's office for the same position and it was not significantly higher but a bit higher. And so um I've sent that information to him maybe for your review on bringing those part-time shelter staff up to be more competitive. So um as far as operations go, we have our travel and training in a couple of categories there. As uh as training requirements increase and as uh training costs and travel costs increase, we feel a need for those categories to increase. So travel and training for administration and detectives, uh we appreciate that. As well as for our canines, we have two canines now. Um we've been one and two. And then with the retirement of Badger due to performance issues, uh we have added Bandit, which we hope we can bring him in and let you meet him in the near future. But he is fully certified now with Officer Bowler, and we have two functioning fully dual certified K9s for the community. Um our computer and tech service contracts, 107312, as you can see, increased quite a bit. We've moved some capital requests in the past to more operational which includes our body cam and incar systems lens lock as well as interview rooms.

Oh, I see. You're moving that from a capital outlay kind of thing into equipment.

Correct. It's an annual cost. We're always going to have that cost regardless of the vendor that we're with. Uh flock safety's in there as well as an annual cost and the Axiom gray key for digital forensics. As you probably saw in the budget request, the a law passed this last year that goes into effect in January of next year that requires all police departments to either contract with RCFL, which is the regional crime forensic laboratory uh governed by the FBI in Salt Lake, or to send an officer up to work in their lab to process your own stuff, which doesn't seem very cost-effective, or you have to have your own digital forensics lab. And so over the last three years, we've worked to add uh computers and software to be able to crack computers and phones ourselves. And then whatever we can't do with those two softwares, celebrate is the other one. Sheriff's office has that. The legislation also requires that we enter into anou with another agency to make sure we're complete, which we plan to do with them.

So chief Oh, sorry. I was going to say, Chief, I just have one quick question for Terry. Is that why those three main things are on this year's operational request because they're moving out of capital to operational. So then next year we wouldn't see those. They would just be part of the normal budget. That's true. It's this is actually my preference. Yeah. That's true. It's actually my preference is to move them out of capital and treat them more like a normal. Yeah. Because they're not even

they're reoccurring every Okay, sounds good. So, so there you mentioned a few things uh chief uh other than computer and software. You mentioned um other types of equipment. Why are we bundling those up and computer and uh tech services? Isn't there a separate category we can give that? The the reason I asked this if you go through the entire budget um there's a we're spending a ton of money ton of money on computer and tech services. Just shy of a million dollars a year. Pardon? Just shy of a million dollars a year.

Yeah. So, to me, that's a ton of money, right? And uh there's a good reason for that, but I really would rather look at it on a separate basis. If there's specific equipment that you know like your cameras and and so on and so forth that it is tech but it's not computer related, right? Or it is computer related. Every one of those cameras downloads into a hard drive every single afternoon. Yeah. But you

and every one of those brings with it a storage package and and software costs for their body cameras, their inc car cameras, everything like that. What we've been trying to do, Council Member Golan, not just with the police department, with all of our other departments, is we've had a problem for years where guys would just have an expense and they needed somewhere to charge it and they didn't have money in a certain line item, so they would just charge it to another one.

We're trying to redirect those efforts. We're trying to corral it in so we actually know what we're spending on computer and technical type of things. And we're trying to encourage all of our departments to start running any software program or any technical programs or costs associated with uh computer maintenance or computer purchases all through that same line item. So we have a better idea of how much money we're spending on them. We did a study in February. Mhm.

We asked Lindy to go through and and quantify how much we were spending on computer services. She came back and she told us it was $400,000 and the number seemed awfully low. So, we went and talked to our departments and we discovered that some of these expenses were going to other places. We soon as we consolidated them in, we got a better picture that says we're spending about 975 980 a year on these types of computer. And that includes hardware and software. Hardware and software. And support and technical support. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. SORRY, CHIEF.

THAT'S OKAY. WE WANT TO GET you educated. Thank you. Uh the next category was just a small increase in our major investigation supplies uh to help our detectives. Those don't occur a lot, but sometimes we'll wipe out that budget on one on one call. Hey, Chief. Yes. C can we just back up on the equipment maintenance where we have zero the equipment maintenance? Yeah. Yeah. I had the same question. And I we have a lot of maintenance line items that have gone to zero. And I don't know if that's Yeah. What what are we doing there? What what's what what are we missing here?

So the equipment maintenance that covers all of our vehicle maintenance and unfortunately that al also includes if a vehicle gets wrecked that that falls to us. So who who is taking how are you paying for the maintenance of the vehicles? Does that go to the street department to the shop? Both. So, for example, we have a a vehicle that was involved in a uh a pit maneuver several weeks ago. Um the the shed is wanted to take that on instead of sending it over to Cedar City Motor Company,

which we might normally do, or Premier Auto Body, we get bids to determine the the most uh economical cost to fix. Uh the shed says, "Well, we we can do it at a fraction of the cost." So, it just varies on whether the shed does the work or an auto body. And just to be clear, that's that's a zero increase, but it's a $25,000 budget. Detail, the budget is basically remaining the same. So, they asked for an increase. If you're looking at the summary, they asked for an increase in that line item and we did not grant the increase. Still keeping money there. It's not an increase. They misunderstood what you said. There's no money there. So, equipment maintenance just stayed the same at 1748.

Yeah. So, a lot of those operational ones are they were asking for more money, but if you go back to the top section, then you can see what they currently can use. Good question, Phil. Yeah. So, for the detail, go to page six. It's 28 25,000. Yeah. Right. Okay. What else? Any other questions? I'm sorry, I missed a liquor enforcement 12 grand.

Yeah. So that is that is a a grant essentially we get every year that's beer tax money that is run through the department of health and human services and the Utah State Tax Commission. So a person goes in to buy alcohol for off- premise consumption and any convenience or grocery store. Um we get some of that money based on a couple of factors. The number of alcohol-related retail outlets we have in the city,

our population, and then the amount of alcohol-related convictions that we see that we prosecute. And then they come up with a number and that's what they give us. it it traditionally has gone up. So, we're just planning for that going up. If that is less than that $12,000 increase, we'll work with Terry on a budget adjustment to bring that where it needs to be. But, we've historically under under budgeted that and then we get That's a That's a good point. I'm sorry. I'm You just reminded me of something. How do we when do we make adjustments on the budget versus actual running rate? How often do we do that? She does them quarterly. this we I do them quarterly. Quarterly? Yes. Okay, perfect. Thank you.

Yeah, there's a number of grants. If you look at some of the grants aren't in here right now in this budget, but as they come in and we get success, I'm sure she'll bring them back to us as a budget adjustment. Heck, I can't take you anymore. I know. Would somebody get him a seat belt, please? I want to see if he'll pass a fil. Yeah. the alcohol consumption rate. Tell us I'm helping that rate every time I buy wine. What? I think you're there. Anything else you want to share with us, Chief? Not on the operation side. Move to the others unless there's any questions.

No, let's move in the other

um on the on the capital side. So, we we're trying obviously to keep pace and catch up on our vehicles and and the council and the mayor's been great to do that the last couple years. So, we we asked for 10 in the budget. Um we really needed nine. We have purchased a Bronco with some of the beer tax money specifically for alcohol enforcement and that'll be the vehicle that Sergeant Levelvel drives. There'll be some messaging on there for, you know, alcohol resistance and prevention. Um and then and then that's one that we don't have to pay for out of the general fund. And so we really need nine. You gave us seven in the budget, which is is ample. Um we have several hanging around that you probably see either in the parking garage or at the city shed. And many of those are in a stage of trying to strip down and either sell or repurpose to other departments. So this will get us uh to keep pace with where we need to be. So we

So Terry, our our uh summary says vehicles 10760,000. That's actually the number is correct. Number correct. Seven replacements. Three new ones for the three officers. Okay. So, it is a total of 10 new cars. There will be 10 new cars, but only seven that are replacements. Yeah, I should have clarified that. Replacement versus you go in the F-150s again. Is that the plan? So, the last year we bought the police interceptors. They're the Explorers. Oh, yeah. We'll try to keep the trucks in admin and detectives, but the uh the trucks for patrol just they don't work. They don't The turning radius is terrible. turning on a vehicle on a narrow street turn more expensive and yeah so you're going back to the police

interceptors for a while I mean it's supply and demand and for a while certain ones weren't available that's why we went to trucks initially Ford has has brought those interceptors and they they're they've been there for a while they're more robust now marketing those and and this through the state contract yes either that or we'll go to we bought them from Cedar City Motor Company as well depends on who get the best price sure so do you buy them and run them into the ground or do you lease them and turn them back? Uh, we buy them and then we either sell them or let let another department take them. We're not leasing currently. Yeah.

Chief, I have a question for you. What about uh drones? Are you using drone or are you renting drones from somebody else? So, we're very fortunate in that we have a gentleman by the name of Matt Joseph who is a VEIP, a volunteer, and he's a drone instructor for SU, which will actually be moved over to to Southwest Tech where he'll teach that program. He's a he's a great resource and he's available all the time. And so, that's who we use. So, you can use his drones. We have we have access all the time to a drone. Do you pay him a a fee for No, he just volunteers. He

volunteers. It's part of our volunteer program and the and the university has the drone equipment. We did have one a few years back that uh clipped a line during the Fourth of July parade because we've had him fly some of the vents and parades before and and that cost a little bit of money. Um they they took most of that. We contributed a little bit to help fix that which is a small price to pay but let me know next time you want to take him to lunch. I'd like to buy that one. Okay. Okay. But you have access 247. We do. Yeah. unless he's out of town or has something going on, but he is he's he's a disabled veteran and so that that's what I had heard that we were using SU's drone. I was wondering why we didn't have our own.

We haven't gone that way yet. It's certainly something we need to look at. Um there are entities uh that do that a drone as a first responder or DFR it's called. And I would love to implement something like that. That way you can la you can launch those off the top of this building. Dispatch can launch them to a call and then you got eyes on them much sooner. There's a lot of success going on around the country. We just The biggest the biggest reason we don't have our own drones either in police or engineering or public works or recreation or in name your department is the insurance requirements. Yeah. I figured there's a liability there, isn't it? That's that's that's been our biggest hurdle. Okay. I was just checking because that's I'd heard that from SU. Yeah.

I said I was wondering why we don't. But all right. As long as you have because we're smart. We're we're using somebody else's for free. That's why. that as long as you have your access. That's what I said. Er, go I'll buy lunch. Any any other questions on the capital? So, the other items were funded, which we so much appreciate. The tasers, we need to update those. The gas masks, we want to add five more driver feedback signs to put out there. We're up to 11 now, but uh those are just invaluable for um the AEDs for the officers. This will give us enough to put one in each car on shift. So that gets us to full good.

Yeah. Yeah. I can't tell you how often we're out there. Oh, yeah. Had a motorcycle accident just last week. 200 North 300 West. You probably saw in the news and officers got there and did CPR. Um there's a news article about him recovering in the hospital. So they're just there that first response, that initial response is so critical, especially with a heart attack. The defect is is great. So sounds good. I always joke if I ever have a heart attack when my wife calls it in to make sure they send an officer that has an AED in his car, not one without it.

And then as far as personnel, we we asked we tried to really follow Well, we didn't try, we followed the staffing study that we had commissioned um just to make sure we stay pace and that included the detective, traffic enforcement, two patrol and another police services specialist and and the funding was for the detective, traffic, and one patrol officer. Um we know there's a lot of requests and a lot of asks and we are we are happy with that. Um the detective is probably the most critical. The case load is just astronomical and those guys are more than overwhelmed. So that'll greatly help them to shift those cases and share that load more equitably. Really quick, tell me what a traffic enforcement officer versus a patrol officer does. They're paid the same. So what's kind of the difference between the two?

Your full-time traffic. So Gino Perez, who we just lost to Leverkin, that was his job. Just every every shift he's out enforcing traffic, taking accidents. Yep. He was good at it. Skating. He was very good at it. Stopped me twice. YEAH. And you told him I only had one to drink. It was this. Okay. So they So they mostly all they do is traffic. I mean, I guess. Okay. So we just back filled his with Avery Shamway. Okay. Um and and he'll start in June. And then this will select another one. So, we'll have two out there overlapping and then uh covering more during the day to try to address those traffic issues.

Okay. So, more for mayor and and um city manager. So, if you look at the salary and wages permanent blah blah blah, we got an increase of $615,000, right? Budget versus previous budget. Um, I'm assuming that that includes merit increases, additional personnel, 360,000 of that is the three new positions. Okay. Out of the 615, out of the 615, so another 255 is the merit. That right? My math right. My math correct.

Uh, Mrs. her. She told you first of all what we did was we moved the salary ranges according to the study and then if there were people that were outside those ranges we moved them and some of those people on a percentage basis received a higher percentage. The police department was one of the departments that had after we moved the ranges that we had to do a lot of adjusting to get people back into range. So all of that 200,000 is not the merit component. No, I just much of it is getting people to the range market. Okay. Into their market range.

So wi with with that what's our uh our low beginning entry level police officer wage. Now how much 60,000 for brand new no experience? But the better one is the one just above that because we ideally want to hire people that have a little experience and that one Yeah. I thought our hourly rate was I thinking our hourly rate was pretty low. What is it now then? So this would put it at 2930 29. So it went up it went up three or4 dollars an hour. Yeah. But remember that is like we're sending them to post, right? Those are the ones we don't want to necessarily hire. It cost us more. But the next one up went to 68. Yeah. That's and now we're competitive.

That's what we've been getting lately is these lateral certified officers. Okay. That puts that that puts them up at 31 32. So you think your attrition rate is going to fall down uh for because of where you are now, chief? Yes. Good. So you feel better? Absolutely. I mean the data shows this really does get us to where they're not going to the pay is not the reason that they're going to be the primary motivation to leave. Right. They're good. So we're competitive. We're better than about five grand. We're still not Salt Lake City. We're still not Highway Patrol. Highway Patrol. But we're competitive in our market. Well, no, we needed to come up. So, no. Good. Thanks. Yeah. Thank you. Well done.

That's it for personnel. Any other questions on anything? No. Thank you all for you do and um appreciate it very much. Thanks, Chief. You bet. Thank you all. Thank you, Chief. All right, Wreck. Oh, now I got to call back. Hi. Hi. How are you? So good. Good. How are you? Good, thank you. The weather's getting nice. Get kids playing outside. Yeah, it's about that time of the year. Eight minutes, man. Can you give me your name? I'm new here. I'm Kathleen Aatasi. Thank you. Sports and recreation manager. Thank you, Kathleen.

Do you just want to field questions or do you have anything you want to specifically share? Um, I'll take questions and I'll go from there because Okay. I don't know what you're going to hit me with. So, will you go first? I have my my first question. I'm looking at the whole operational area of recreation. Is there's a $10,000 increase in salary wages in Temp. Is that My question is that more people or are we paying those people higher wages? Um, that's more people. So, we're starting a couple new programs and we need funds to start those programs. Um, what are those new programs? tell us. Um, I'm going to run a summer camp. Some of you might think I'm crazy. Well, I do, but that's okay.

Um, but I think it's something that the city could benefit from. Um, so we're going to do a little mini summer camp in the month of July and see the outcome we get for that. My goal is to hopefully next summer be able to offer the camp from once school is out all the way until school gets back in. This just gives parents an option for their kids to go somewhere during the summer, keep them off of screens. Um, we're also going to add a family yoga program um that we think could be beneficial. I'm trying to just add programs that I think our city could benefit from, stuff that we've never had before, things that don't include a gymnasium that don't include a gymnasium. We're going to talk about that. Can you u So, are we having trouble getting uh part-time temporary employees?

Um, no. We're actually pretty competitive with a bunch of other people in town. Okay. a lot of the college kids. Um, SU's pay rates are a lot different than ours, so I'm able to pull a lot from athletes that play at SU. Um, and by word of mouth, they all just bring all of their friends, which is nice. The high school kids sometimes are timid. Um, but I do get a good bunch of them who are brave enough to talk to the parents that get mad about youth sports. So, these are competitive. These are paid uh programs, right? uh families that bring their kids to their summer camp and so do we make any money at the end of the day on these things or we just cover salary and maintenance?

Um right now we haven't had a summer camp but from the math that I've done we should make a pretty good chunk of change. Um I've compared our summer camp price to communities that are about the same size as us Pacin Spanish Fork. Um and so we're going to try it and see. It'll definitely be a trial run because we don't know.

But this this is exciting to me. Like I was so impressed with her in the in the second round of budget because she came in and said, "Hey, I want to be somebody that you look at and say, you're doing a great job because you're making the city money, right?" And and that's what she's trying to do. She's trying to figure out these niches that she can do something without a gymnasium for now. Yeah. um and uh and be able to to help make up some of that that difference in the department. So, thank you. That's wonderful. So, love the attitude now or later. Yeah. Well, now's fine, I think. So, I have an idea slash let's hear it

thought slash and this is as good a time any to bring it up and it it definitely involves a lot of discussion outside of budget meetings. So, Kenny, you're going to want to listen to this probably. But as we're sitting here and I I see that in the past um money has been budgeted towards a gymnasium if I'm understanding this correctly. We have $2 million already. Correct. Yes. I completely understand why it wasn't funded this year. And I mean it's unfortunate. I've always been a supporter of the gymnasium. I know that it's gone through the ringer upside down and inside out 10 times already. But I think um we're at the point where I would like to see us just go ahead and put on a ballot. I would like to see us. Let's just do this thing and let the voters finally decide.

The same thought I did. That's why I didn't put it in. That's I talked to John Whitaker today. Actually, I know the deadline. We obviously have time. We can get it on this November's ballot. And because here's what I'm thinking. If we if the voters vote it down, then I think we actually take the 2 million and we put it towards Fiddler's Park and we finish one project fully completely. I'm not trying to unfund the gymnasium, but it's just going to sit there for how long until And if the voters, if we don't find a way to do it, then I think we need to use that money for something and get another project complete. So, um, yep. Same thought process. And so, that's kind of where I'm at. So, I just now's Yeah. So, I do want to start the process in our normal.

I think the biggest question we have is do how fast do you want to try to get it on the ballot like timing of it? Do you want to try to do it this year? Do you want to really work for it to to prepare for it for next year? because you want to just make sure when you go and ask that that you've got your ducks in a row. Yeah. And I I think what it really comes down to, Terry, and this is your department, is do we have the revenue to qualify for a revenue bond or do we need to go out for a geo bond to pay for it? Which way? I mean, what are our options? You know, the I haven't looked at that. I know. And I wasn't expecting an answer right then. I'm just saying that's those are the discussions we need to be I I think we do the taxpayers a disservice if we don't have something in mind with some pretty solid costs and some solid plans by just putting it out to a vote. It does us all a disservice.

So we have it we have it we have it designed. We have the architecture done on it. We have the uh building designed already. We did that years ago. Do we have the land? One gym, two gym. Yeah, we have the land. We've got it all. We got the land. We have the land. It's attached to the aquatic center. It's going to go off the back side of the aquatic center. Okay. Uh we had it designed twice now. The first time we had it designed was um a little more lavish. It had an upstairs and it had a downstairs and it had a whole bunch of It was really pretty. It really beautiful. Yeah. Had a upstairs walking track and uh it was nice.

Through the years our councils have told us uh go with a simpler option. So, the simpler option is still coming off the back side of the aquatic center. Has three gyms in it. They have uh curtains that come down across the middle to split them up if you need to. They've got some storage area and they got some seating for grandma and grandpa. Um that was the kind of no seating easier version. Great.

To answer your question, mayor, if and to also go off what Councilman Cox said, if we can do it in time, I want it to be super transparent. I want all the information out there. I want it to here's the total estimated cost. Here's how much it's going to be cost per household. So the voters know if I choose to vote for this, my property tax may or is going to increase this much per year. I'm voting for it. Yes or no? I don't want it to be this kind of nebulous. I think you need I think you need to consider a general obligation bond rather than a

revenue bond. If you pledge revenues, you're pledging your sales tax revenues and our sales tax margin is becoming thinner and thinner every year. And that's fine. I there's just a question. So I just want to make sure when we send it out to the public, they have all the knowledge. This is how much it's going to cost. This is what the products are going to get. This is how much it's going to cost per household in taxes. I think the other Sorry, Robert had his hand up. Oh, sorry. I got to turn this way.

So I think that instead of us pushing this, we need residents with some passion coming in and telling us this is what we want and this is what we're bringing to the table. much like the, you know, the crossall events. I'm going to keep going to that, but that was based on citizens passion that there something they wanted. Why are we putting something in front of them when there's no one in here with that same passion, with the same ability to go raise some funds and and help make a facility? And and the second part of it is we have a need for a fire station and and other things. And this is certainly a a want, not a need. And so I'm I'm not really in favor of putting um those kind of wants especially where we're the one that's pushing it on on them uh in front of needs. That's just my opinion.

But if they vote for it, can I answer to that? Sure. There have been people in the community who in years past have come to meetings and expressed their concern for the wants of a gym and they've been shut down and so now they feel what's the point if I just keep getting shut down? What's the point? Were they bringing uh people to the table and money to the table? Well, cowboy money is a lot different than sports people money. That is very wonderful old money. Well, let's get some cowboy back. They're converted. They don't choose to retire in Cedar City. Hate to break it to you, but the cowboys and cowg girls come here and the retired professional athletes get a cart.

So Joe Laour was a cowboy and a coach. So there you go. Well, I wish I could tell him how to use this. One of the things that I think we keep leaving on the table on a lot of what I've seen here is uh grants. There's got to be national state grants that uh support uh an endeavor like this that we are missing because we don't have anybody that can go after these things. Yeah, agreed. Councilman Fox,

I just wanted to say um if we decide to pursue this, and I'm certainly in favor of exploring this, I want to make sure that we look at other entities. Let's make sure that is the does the school have a bond going to be on the ballot this November? Let's look at all the options so we play this the right way. Yeah, agreed. Okay, that's all. The the other thing and and while I'm gonna be, you know, have arrows thrown at me and throw off the other thing is basketball gymnasiums serve a very narrow scope of our population. Oh, I disagree. I disagree, too. Oh, yeah. You can do volleyball, you can dodgeball, there's all kinds. When you look at a swimming pool, all ages use that. Yeah.

There's once you get to a certain age, your knees and stuff won't handle a gymnasium as much. when you when you when you look at parks and trails, all ages can use those much easier than than something like that as well. And so, and I think I'm not opposed to them. I just think it needs to come from the right direction when we have the right funding. And

well, I and the reason my brain kind of went that way, Robert, of of uh pulling it off from a budget standpoint is there in the past there has been a lot of of push to have it and a push against it, right? And so I'm uncomfortable with the five of you and one of me um being the one that determines that we're going to increase the taxes on a want, not a need. But if it goes to a ballot and the citizens say they want it and they're willing to pay for it, I think that's the more appropriate way to to fund that large of a of a capital project on a recreation site. But that's that's why my thought process was to pull the money out of this. So the the other side of this is is the age thing, but the other side is we need to have the the wreck group show us how it's going to bring money to town.

I agree with all that. It needs to we need to show how it's going to bring people here, get them to stay here and eat in our uh stay in our hotels and eat at our restaurants and and so that there's some external benefit um to to the component as well. So there's a whole lot needs to be done before I get on board with it in any way, shape or form. So totally good. Do you want to add to that, Kenny, or do we table this for a future discussion?

Uh, I just want you to think, um, we've we've done all the, as Paul stated, all the bidding, the land, the engineering, we've got a number to it. It was, you know, Carter Brothers has bid it out. It was 5.3. I mean, we've done all the leg work to kind of function that out. Um, Hurricane just put a four gym into their city. just had the ribbon cutting just a month ago. Um, and what you have to look at in a gymnasium is it's revenue based just Yes,

it's probably revenue based more than Scott's Arena because when I start telling you cheerleading camps and uh all the winter volleyball when all that stuff goes on, that's revenue based. The reason we put it in Yeah. is because of revenue based. is not because it serves Huracan's uh community. Uh soon as they were done, they had all these volleyball tournaments coming from all over to show up to Hurricane. And it's just like our softball complexes. It's just like the arena. It's just like those things. Um if you want a gymnasium, it's it's revenue based. It's not for just cats programs.

We would have non-stop. we wouldn't be able to to to fit everybody. I asked my wife who's in the cheerleading world. She says, "If you have three gyms, good luck on trying to keep that from getting reserved." So, it is revenue based and it's just up to the community to decide if Well, show me the money then. And I'm I'm all in favor. That's interesting because my relation with Jean is is 40 years old, but without Gene that arena is not there either. That's right. You're correct. And so the other people donated five and 10,000. That's doable. But there was just one person at the arena that made the arena happen. And it just happens to be the lady that's we're connected to. Yeah. But that doesn't happen for everybody. Yeah.

Thanks. Yep. So we'll take this one and we want to put it on an agenda item. Yeah. Let's get it moving if we can. Let's get it moving through a normal meeting process and let's bring the numbers back up. And Carter, you're in charge. put it on the agenda. Yeah. No, this is me. And let's visit a little bit. It takes a little more work than that. I'll I'll help you out there. Well, yeah. No, I know. That's why. And and let's visit a little bit to determine all the things we want to make sure to Robert's point that we're going to start going down that road. We want to make sure if we can make it by this year's November by the deadline, it's John couldn't remember if it was 65 days or 90 days before the ballot before election day is when it has to be to put a ballot initiative on. So,

we've got time if we can if we get going. because we're gonna if we're going to do that, we're also going to have to double our parking lot. So, we got to make sure we are ready for if we do that, we don't have enough parking for everything. Well, maybe that's part of the package, too, in this process discussion. Yeah, we got to look. Thank you so much. All right. Sounds like we're going to have some more discussions about that, Kenny. Now, now the Cowboys. Now, the ones with the money. How are you guys doing? Great. Good. Glad to be here. Scott Christensen, cross all arenas manager. So for everybody,

will you turn one of those microphones off? I just worry about it causing I wonder if that does anything weird to YouTube having does it two? I don't know. I think it's good. I don't think so. Okay. Do you want to run this kind of the same way, Scott? You just want us to fire questions at you? All right. Fire away. Anything you got for Scott? Well, I got to find his budget. What page is it on? I don't know. I got to find it.

So, his only increases for operational were some equipment and some computers. Um, his capital requests were a tractor lease, coolers, and bleachers. What are coolers? Are you talking like drink coolers or like air conditioner coolers? That's what I figured. I'm like bleachers. I don't Is are the bleachers for the new addition? They are. Well, yeah, they'll be so we can use them wherever we need them. So, you're not going to pour a slab under No. No. Keep them on dirt. Yeah. They'll be they'll be small enough that we can move them to where outdoor or indoor or the warm-up area. Now,

did you get your three-phase electrical squared away? I thought you were looking for more power on the new side. I am, but no, I have not got squared away. Is that in here? No, it's not. Okay. We we didn't ask for it. We are we are going to wrap tax and asking for it there. Gotcha. Do you have any idea how much you're looking at? Uh yeah, I do. It's expensive. Yeah. The first price we'd got to do it like we wanted to do it was about 60,000, but we revamped it so that it would fit within what we needed to do for everybody through wrap tax. And it was

Do you remember Kenny? 45 45 Do you have threephase to the building or is this got to go clear down to the street? No, it it's there. All we got to do is put in a new another new service 200 amp service breaker box, but the the power is all there at the at the arena now. Okay, that was one question I had Terry or Paul. Um on all these requests as we go through parks and wreck and those kinds of departments, if it's something none of this includes anything that would be covered by RAP. So RAP would be things in addition to all these. Correct. That's what I figured. So maybe if something isn't funded this way, then they'll go to RAP. Correct.

Okay. And then under personnel, did he have any increase in personnel? Yeah, there's a new person. Y Oh, and what's that tractor lease? Are you just getting a new tractor? I I've got to have another one. Yeah, this is the Yeah, so it'll be just like the one we do now. Uh we debated whether the lease was a better option or buying one but page 30 decided to go this way and which I think it's a better way to go unless the lease goes away and then we're in in a problem. Oh, you're looking for a whole So you're looking for a full-time maintenance worker. Yes. And then what's this Scott's comp time? What's that? I had the same question.

We're moving to an exempt status as an employee. In order to do that, when your employees earn comp time when they're not exempt, that's that's a that's something they've earned and they own and we owe them. Gotcha. So, as long as they're working for us, if they would be kind enough to take time off, they could use it that way. However, since we're moving him and and uh Scott doesn't know how to take time off, we owe him money. Why are why full-time salaried employees uh comped exemp I mean why aren't they already are full-time

most of our full-time uh salary managerial employees are exempt okay we do have some that are not still one of them this is a proposal to move him to exempt status so why don't we change our policy so we only acrew x amount which forces them to take vacation which is actually healthy for their department for them. We do have caps on it. It does. He just maxes it out. He just maxes it out. We need to Wow. We we do need to look at our policy and lower those maximums. Yeah. And most of the managerial position should be exempt. I mean, that's just that's the part of the job. And are those maximums out number of hours or amount of money?

It's a maximum of number of hours. Okay. So that's why they're different. They're different between between their all hourly rate or their salary rate. No, they're different. The maximum number of hours differs for police and fire and everybody else. Gotcha. Okay. Police and fire can accumulate more. I have a question back on the bleachers just for a moment. How many sets are we looking to buy? Four. Okay. Four. They're only five rolls high, 21 foot long. Something that we can actually manage to move around. Can they move outside as well? Okay. So if you had a concert outside or something, you can move them around there. Outside, we can move them into the indoor or the warm up is Yeah. Okay.

And are you going to promise to get rid of your unsafe bleachers? Yes, sure. Is that a pinky swear? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, it is. What are you talking about? 30 40 guys grab those every year and move them wherever you want them. That's right. They just disappear and then they reappear. Yeah. During our inspection, they're gone and then Yeah. Really? I had my grandkids there the other day and they was up on them. I'm like, "Oh, now there's my kids." I Are these the tall ones we're talking about? Without a back on them. Yeah. Just need to move them against a wall. So, um, this maintenance worker, this will be a new position, correct? Yeah. And you'll still maintain your part-time positions that you have. Yes. Yeah. You You're getting quite a complex out there. And it in order for it to stay looking good, you need help.

Need help. No doubt. The amount of hours it's running now, too, right? It's not sitting very many days without How's your truck holding up? Oh, I need a new one. I was going to say you're getting close on I work in a project right across from where you live and so I hear that thing fire up every day and I'm like, it's about time for him to get a new truck. It's a Chevy. He has No, it's a Dodge in it. It's got the old Dodge Hemmy. Tick tick tick tick. We're kind of like our department's kind of like the hammy down. We're like excited when the That's right. Police department get new ones. That's how it works. Do you have any questions for us or comments for us?

Uh, no. just appreciate you guys and all you do and the service you guys do and uh Cedar City is a fantastic uh community and area. Love it here. And uh people that come to the facility, they absolutely love Cedar City and what we're doing out there. We get compliments all the time, not just on the facility, but on the people here, the community as a whole. And so we appreciate you guys and all you do. I know your jobs aren't easy. All the way from trunky on the way down, trunky.

I uh I hope you have a new phone line going in for all the people when they move into those apartments, they're going to call and complain about the lights being on and the smell. I hope I hope you guys do, too. I will just simply say it was there before you live with it. No uh no electronic billboard in the budget this year, huh? Smells like money and it's green. No, we don't we don't have that. So, it's we I've got a want list. It's a I can't tell you how many I get that from people actually quite a bit. I bet once a month I get somebody will be like, "How come we can't ever know what's going on at the arena and why don't you guys kind of point, you know, I didn't put him up to that. I didn't say a word." I know, but

Well, you know, we were here the we not very long ago and we wanted to know what was going on at the Shakespearean Festival and we drove all around town. We couldn't find a dank sign anywhere. Terrible going on. Terrible. Good point. Good point. So I do think it's electronic just like the Shakespearean festival. You log on look at their calendar. They he has a calendar that there is there just we've got such a still a long list of things we need to do and places we need to go with. Every time I get a call I tell them to walk in and see and buy a burger while they're in there.

I just can't see putting the money. I I still need stalls. I need more RVs. I need more ground for parking. We need, you know, more equipment. We're going to be needing a water truck shortly. We're going to need a new Bobcat. We just go through them all the time. Uh, and we need asphalt down there. And we need lights in our parking lot. We need we need an RV dump. Bad. I mean, that's one of the very things we need. We have We could pull 10 or 12 more people off the road every almost every day in the spring and fall if we had an RV dump.

Well, and you could charge for it, too. I mean, the Loves on the North End charges $10 to use their RV dump. It'd pay for itself. So there's just such the list is so long and I'm going to present present it to my committee. We have a committee and I'm going to present it to them with a list of our priority list and let them see where they want that sign and where it was on. If they want to move it up, then hey, let let's do it. But I kind of feel like there's there's other places that people if they really wanted that sign could go and generate some money uh and help help us get that, you know, and get some cowboy money after. Yeah, get some cowboy money. So, she wasn't listening. She was

that's going to be that's going to be like a staple comment now. That was go find the hot pick on the Cowboys. Got it, buddy. We got a new one for Wednesday. Great. Well, Scott, thank you so much for all that you do. We really appreciate you. Appreciate you guys and you dude as well. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, golf. We are now ahead. No. Aquatic Center. Oh, I skipped aquatic center. Aquatic Center. Seven minutes. Let's party at the pool. We are on July the 6th. Party in the pool. Remember? You sure we want to do that? America 250. I don't know. Hey, Marcy. Aquatic Center. Yes, we're going to do that. And color pictures and hang up banners. Yep.

Whatever you say. Yep. Okay. Questions for aquatic. Oh my gosh. We got to find them. They just page 33. I'm right there. And page Oh, travel and training. Are chemicals just going up in price? Is that why they've gone up for four years and we've continued to pay it, but probably a good idea to move it. Okay. So now that So that's why that is uniform sundry. Everything's pretty benign there other than uniforms going up. I mean it costs more money. Yeah. No, I mean they're all I mean a thousand here, thousand there. The chemicals is the big one. It is. And then does she have any capital requests? I don't know where you are. I'm still trying to find I'm on the uh

Oh, acoustic sound panels for leisure pool. What's that? Broken down by That one did not get approved. It did not. Mhm. So that was just stuff to go on the walls to try and quiet it down in there. Yes. Okay. Yeah. I mean that's be nice but not nec there's probably some other necessities first unfortunately. True. So it does get loud in there. I was there last weekend with my family and it it does. It gets rip and roaring in there pretty good. Terry, do you don't have any summary by like aquatic center and event center and all that that shows their revenue projections and their expenses. It's just all lumped with recreation. You can go to the You can go to the actual budget and and see that.

Oh, the detail the So, are you talking about the Oh, but the revenues aren't in there. I'm sorry. It doesn't have revenues because I would like to see if we're budgeting for increases there as well. That's I mean that's part of the of the equation as well. Person. And you have no personnel changes? No requests. No. Okay. Yeah. Is there anything you need Robert? As we as we go on like swimming lessons for example this year. So we did Tuesday, Thursday night swimming lessons. They filled up. Now we've added Monday, Wednesday lessons. So as they increase and we filled the spots that we have, we do increase by adding more programs. Tumbling, we went from 15 kids two years ago, 15 kids in the four hour span to 15 a class up to six classes now. So

what are you doing in those little activity rooms? Uhuh. Yeah. And does that build into the revenue line item budget? I mean because to to me that's that's important. I mean into Yeah, they have a I think there's a line item in there that covers lessons and programs. Programs. Yeah, I misspoke. You can I misspoke. You can see the revenues in the Yeah, the general page 14, right? Who runs Do we run our own concessions or do you lease out the space? And we run it ourselves. We run it. Okay. And is that I mean that was something I noticed. I was shocked at how many people were using the concessions, but I just when I went and used I just wasn't quite sure if we're I don't know if I have the answer right now on how to how to how to better that or make

it a better experience. I think we do good where we're at. And it also includes the Lake of the Hills, all the baseball, too. So, our concessions includes that one down there, too. Okay. Terry, what goes under Sundry? There's 2500 for the last two years. It's all the laundry, isn't it? Isn't that what Sunundry stands for? No, not laundry. Sunundry. Sunundry is what I use for parties, feeding the kids, um sort of employee recognition. That's what I do for those things. And still got some revenue that come. No, I'm talking revenue. The revenue Well, they rent a party room or they pay to have balances out on both sides. I don't know what the sun revenue is because we've never I don't even know what even goes into it. It's always been You don't charge for the parties?

Yes. But that goes into pro that goes into our programming money. what she does with her kids as a um employee gratitude. Like I don't know where the money ever went into Sunundry. So I'm not sure what the income would be on that line item either. I can get you an explanation for that of which one's due. So it's consistent with last year the the previous year was just a a few hundred 540 right but it stayed at 2500 this last two budgets. Yeah. So I just curious. Let me look and see what it is running this so far this year. Yeah, it's not a big deal. But

so, so back to my original point, there's not a single increase in a budget line item for revenue on this. And that concerns me to be completely honest. If we we need to be bringing more revenue in somehow developing programs, we just have it the same as last year all the way down. And if you have more programs, why haven't we budgeted that in? But we have been. We've brought in new programs ever since. So, I'm not sure why it's not showing it. and is being budgeted conservatively and then we'll do a budget adjustment later on. Well, but it's showing actuals and that they're flat,

right? The the actuals have been about what so the last four years have been about the same as what our tenative budget is, WHICH A COUPLE THOUSAND DOLLARS, which which um tells me that revenue is not increasing. Page 14 on the very top. And so we this is one of those that I get a lot of comments about how much money we lose at that place. Sure. Um and and I'm not saying it has to make money, right? We're some government entities don't. But um my concern is are we doing everything we can to increase the revenue? And maybe it's just where it's going. Well, the program revenue has gone up still. Our programs 25, 45, 63, 72. I mean, the programs are going up. Well, it went it went down. It went down.

Well, the budget is we budget lower for some reason. We budget conservatively. And that's that's what I'm saying is uh yeah there's something that should be reflected as a either an up or a down but still flat based on programs what we're doing and what's going on. I'll look at with Terry where it's actually going two years ago we didn't even have swimming lessons so it's definitely increasing maybe it's just going into a different place or we're just not budgeting for it. So far so far to the end of April um you have 60,000 in your fees and programs actuals. So 2022

1.5 in gross revenues 2023 1.6 2024 1.5 2526 is looking to be 1.5 as of the end of April that line already. So that's not including May and June. So it will go up. I don't know what it will be. It might be close to what it was last year at 71. I'm thinking Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Oh programs. No, that's a different just a one. But if it does end up being 71, then we ought to increase the budget line item. Agreed. To to match what reality is looking back. I agree. That's I mean it makes sense. I agree.

Your your admissions on for the fees right now at the end of April was 310,000 and we have May and June is all that to add to that. So if we annualize that, it's going to be less. It'll be less. Yeah. Well, May and June are admissions. They're your two biggest months. They are, but even if you skew it a little bit, it's And that's not programs, that's just admissions. How many people are coming in, right? That's correct. But that's your biggest line item, too. So, is it a capacity issue? I mean, no matter how much you No, no, it's not.

I don't limit capacity. I know. Um, a couple years ago, we raised our admission fees and we did see a little bit an increase and then a little bit less. But this year, like we're adding, we added the zipline, the climbing wall. We're doing a wibbit this year to hopefully bring in some more kids. Where are we at so far this year, Terry? 310. Yeah. 310. That's going to be a far cry for That's 310 just for admissions. Yeah. Admissions. Yeah, just for admissions. We won't make 430 at that level through the end of April. Well, unless May and June really are two biggest months, I guess. Yeah.

But the point I think is the numbers, right? Sorry. Is it something that as we look at the budgets um having us really focus in these areas where we actually do charge and create income just to be thoughtful about how we're looking at that and year to year how can we get the cowboys to start swimming then we so I think that's all that Robert's trying to watch those revenue sites and try to start predicting where we think we're or even what our goal is to get to right and make sure that's part of the conversation. Yeah. Okay. Any other questions for also? Well, I do have one question. Do we really charge the school district less this year than we have in the past? Why are we charging them less? Just do they use it less than they used to?

It looks like it's just we've collected less. I don't think we charge less. It increases every year by a thousand. Well, just Okay. It's just last year you collect in the last actual budget you collected 138 and we only show 133 as budgeted. So that's why I'm like Yeah. And that's my point too. But that's not 36 37 38 but we budget 133. You've got 139,000 at the end of a of April. And that matches the trend and so the budget ought to be up to 139. Okay. Do you want me to change that? Yes, please. Absolutely. I mean, if that's if that's reality. In fact, it might be 140 because it increases,000 every year. Nothing. The projected revenues from the school district.

Oh, we want it to where the projected is a few thousand less than what the actual already is. So, we're just having them change it to match. I turn that mic on, Kenny. There you go. You you also have to consider this year we had the mine shaft in the lapo for months and months and months. Yes, we did. That big hole in the in the bottom. Yeah, that's true. That hurt revenues. I'm sure that hurt that hurt. And you had your hot tub closed for a while. And so the lap pool being closed for four months and we lost a lot of memberships to see you that are just starting to come. That reflects a lot in the budget. Yes. No, that's a good point. That's fair. Marcy, thank you for everything you do. Thank you. Thank you. Really do. All right. Now we'll go to golf.

Before he gets in there, I want to vote for a $500,000 increase to whatever he's got there. Hey, hey, hey, that's going to the Heritage Theater. We all have our pet projects. I don't care if you think I'm biased. We need to get the new one started. I'm ready on me. Okay. Cowboys playing golf. Questions for Well, let's look here. operational salaries. So, you requested a 20,000 increase that was not recommended. What was that? What were you hoping? Yeah. So, um that's reflective of just where we've been the last couple years. The mayor I'm not there yet. I don't know where we are. Page 30 number if you know where it is. No, I want the that breakdown. Where is it? Um

I'm staying on the summary. You guys are staying on the actual more of a story. I'll wait. Yeah. Give me a second. Terry, they want to know what page golf Oh, I got you. All right. She's just following the summary, too. Oh, did you find the golf? Yeah, I did. Page uh 17 and 18 on the 178. Detail budgetation. 17. You're on page 16. I saw golf course right there. There you go.

Oh, so you're looking at bottom page number, not PDF page number. It's page 17. agent. Yeah, there's a difference of one page. We're ready to answer your question, Councilman Wilkkey. Um, yeah, when the mayor met with us and told us what he was going to propose and and not propose, the conversation was, you know, the last two years we really have been open all winter. Um, hopefully going forward we get some snow and and can shut down. Um, and if not, we, as you all remember, we came and talked about maybe potentially doing some closings during the winter. So, his suggestion was to leave it there. Um, I'm good with that. I will just let everybody know when you look at that number, and Natasha, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the golf course has the lowest part-time wages of any department.

They have the best benefits. That's probably why. But, um, but yeah, we we for we're fortunate that at least on my side, Steve probably has it a little tougher on his side, but people want to work there, want to work with us, and we're able to pay them a little bit less. And so I mean our on the golf side, my uh part-time employee, my highest paid one's $12 an hour. That's not good. No, I know. And so we need So that that what number would go up if we actually caught up as well. So and we're sneaking it up. I mean, three years ago, I was still paying my car kids 725 an hour. So, and I could and I was full.

But I but I'd say that differently, Scott. If you can't hire somebody, then it's not good. that if you got a waiting list of people, then it's market and it's fair. And I would say the golf for the I would say this is the first year that it's really um just because you can do it doesn't mean you should. And I would say this is the first year it's become a little bit of an issue that maybe we haven't got the quality because they can go other places and and then just pay, you know, for golf or whatever. So just just to keep in mind, but I I I agree with the mayor's assessment there. Let's let's give it a couple a year or so and see see where we're at. But just to be clear, if that comes to where you can't hire people, then totally different. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I agree.

So equipment maintenance was fine. Golf cart maintenance, you didn't get that. I mean, are we going to be okay? Are Let him tell you why.

Yeah. So golf carts is a is a big discussion. And then just just a quick followup, mayor. I think, you know, I came from the privately owned side and the municipality side, so I do look at it like a business and I think that's my fiduciary to the city. And so if I can hire them and get quality people, I should. So, um, golf carts will probably be the biggest topic. So, I'll just start. Um, those two line items. So, there's, um, golf carts, which is further down, which is 36,000, and then golf cart maintenance, which is 5,000. Those two numbers have been the same since 2014 when I arrived here. Um, back then the thought was for 36,000 we could buy about eight golf carts. At the time we only had 60 we could flip. So about every five years we were turning over the fleet. Um obviously 2014 to 2026 36,000 now buys us about three and a half golf carts. And over the years we've increased our fleet because our business has increased so much that we now have 80 golf carts. So um we have golf carts in our fleet that are 2013s.

When you say buy, you mean lease though, correct? Because don't you lease them? We've been No, we've been purchasing but we are we the prop the new proposal is so if if those those numbers reflect

um where we should be to get back to the the where the plan was to BUY MORE GOLF CART newer um Steve and I have spent and JJ our mechanic a lot of time this off season um with our golf cart distributor um he's given us a lease proposal he's going to buy out all 80 of our current golf carts although We're going to hold a few back for other places in the city. Um and then we're going to do five well the proposal is to do 5-year lease. Um that that number comes in basically at a wash to where we are if we were to get these increases. However, we'll have 80 brand new golf carts that we can flip every 5 years as opposed to golf carts. We have golf carts now that range from 2013s to 2025s. So, um it our golf carts it it's needed. We're we're a big boy golf course now and um I mean we have ripped seats. We have it's just and it's a lot of maintenance as the golfers. So you guys Yeah.

But I enjoy the occasional golf cart that doesn't have the limiter on it or the limiters, you know. You're the one that takes them off. So So that's the that's the golf cart. So neither of those two were funded because the of the proposal to switch to the lease. Well, it shows that the one was the 20,000 increase was funded, which gets you to the 56,000 to Yeah, that gets us to the 56 57. We're going to come in right around Yeah. So, yeah. So, the golf cart maintenance doesn't need to be done because you're going to trade in the whole fleet and right uh did we uh we will still have some small equipment m or golf cart maintenance, but not not Yeah. to the extent. Did we um uh do the numbers on keeping the older carts to send to the water treatment and plants?

That's what you're talking about. So, we're going to hold back some of them. No, I understand that. But is that still the right thing to do? I mean, some of these carts even if you there's only so many ways you can perfume that pig. I can tell you that right now. Even the newer ones are still in bad shape. Right. So, did we do the the math? Is it really the t I mean, are we doing this now and then next time we flip over, we just do the whole thing as opposed to having the whole city's requirement go under this lease program?

Yeah. The use in other facilities I don't think fit the same lease program. Like if you got a cart that's only used periodically, um it's just running around like at the sewer plant for example and they just need to get from one place to another that that that's not going to need to be turned over in five years on a lease. Like you can get 15 years out of a cart with that much less use. So that's why we have kind of just stuck with just these on the lease program and keeping some of the 80 back to do this. Does that affect our overall lease program?

It will, but you know, not I mean, we haven't run those numbers yet, but I'm guessing we'll keep golf carts back that are in the $1,500 range. So, if we keep five of them, you know, I'm just throwing out five. I think that's about a number I'm hearing. Um, you know, you're talking six or 7,000. And I think the net the the offer, if I'm not mistaken, was 180 maybe for the the buyback. Um I might have to follow up on that, but so yeah, it'll affect it a little bit. Uh but not it'll square off. Yeah. Yeah.

And we've done that before. Like the aquatic center um has a cart for probably the last 5 years or so and every once in a while Ken and Marcy need a new tire or something like that. But it it does the job that they need. That's so the lease amount of the 56,000 for the next 5 years. Part of the reason it is that amount is because we're giving in the 80 cards. So what happens five years from now? What does our lease go up to then? Uh roughly the numbers we were given I think went up to about 80 going forward. But yeah, I mean everything's going up by then too. Green fees will be up. Cart cart revenue will be up, you know. I mean Okay. So it will go up in five years. That is Yes. Yeah. For sure. Do you want to tell them about the advertising?

Yeah. Then that's on the GPS. So that's that's different. I mean the hope is um that we So, this is just for golf carts, but we want to add the GPS to these new golf carts. Um, cart rentals, you know, which you've all seen if you've played golf courses. It's great for the map and the yardages and all that. Honestly, for me, it's we can go in and geoence our golfers and keep them out of the mountains and the deserts and and close to the greens and close to the TE's and that will save Steve a lot of heartburn and us a lot of wear and tear on. Sorry. Did you say you're getting the GPS's?

So, that's the next project. Um, a company we've talked to, there's a way you can do some advertising. So, we're going to take it on our on our hands to try to go find that. Um, Councilman Schmidt's already said, you know, Schmidt excavating is going to be on there. No, I'm just kidding. So, u, but he's not cowboy money. What can I say? Just as long as you got the the foldable uh front windscreen. That would be Oh, those are a nightmare. Oh my god. Those are those are a nightmare for maintenance. They break, they crack, they spot, they um I know they're nice for about a year, but they then by year three or four that they're ugly and horrible.

Yeah. So, you just have to be cold golfing in the morning. No, you just can buy your own golf cart there, Calman, and bring it with you. Buy your own and bring it with you. The numbers don't square. Okay. I I do have a um comment more than a question. Sure. Um I would urge I've I've said this before, but I would urge us to look at maybe some wrap tax funding down the road because I would like to see us increase and incorporate more of the golf cart paths throughout our cemetery, our golf course, so we don't have all the problems we've had sometimes in the winter and and refurbishing and all the work that has to go into that.

Yeah, totally agree. Um, and once again, I promise you, Steve Carter would be very much on board with that. We did have a a local contractor, Larry Pendleton, um, who donated some cart paths at the end of last year for us. Came in and did board some stuff and in some areas that were needed and just so um, so yeah, but more cart paths only help. They are expensive, but well, the geo fencing will will help. That will help too. Yeah. Yeah. So, we we're waiting to make sure the cart lease proposal happens and gets done and then we'll then we'll take the next step of working on GPS and and trying to raise some funds. Still want another flag pole.

I know the men is actually right now working on a project the for those of you aware the little the little tiny putting green that was never in very good. It had irrigation issues that we abandoned right outside the golf shop. We are landscaping that area. Oh, nice. And um some plans been put together. It's going to look really nice. So, and that's that's men's league donations. I do have one thing on hole number. It's the one that you go up and then it takes a hard right seven right beside that on the on the west side. Looks like that's where they've been storing all their junk dirt and junk piles. We go and get that cleaned up. So, we we burn it once a year. Yeah. I mean, every golf course

has to have a place to put their stuff, you know, and so um we've talked about maybe looking at some alterior Oh, just just clean it. Just Chief Phillips comes in and burns it and then, you know, do you have a fence or something we could put around it? Yeah. I mean, you want to talk about that? Because I hear about it every year, too. It just it's just a bunch of dirt, but I just have the city uh I could just volunteer. Eric, go ahead and turn on the mic.

Have the city come and get it. Haul it off once in a while. So, Steve Carter, I'm with the golf course as well. Um, we actually have talked with somebody out there who just in recently in the past few days that was maybe wanting to do some trade for some golf pass possibly with cleaning that up. And we had it scheduled to be cleaned up last year, but I think with the weather, the part or the the street department wasn't able to come in and get that done.

So, that's the reason that it's still there. It was on schedule to be cleaned up. But, um, I don't think they could have got any of that equipment back there to do it. Part of the problem is is that that prairie dog fence now kind of has blocked off all the access to that spot for anything big. If they drive through the parking lot of our maintenance shop, um, it's already kind of buckled up the asphalt in there and it would just continue to ruin that. So, we've got to figure out a way to get somebody in when it's cold and when it's frozen to do that. So, the winter time is obviously the best time, but this the last two winters, we just haven't had much luck with that. Doesn't get cold enough to freeze. Yeah.

Before Before you trade it away, we have a tremendous amount of dirt we need on the north end of town. So, we probably need it for our own purposes. Yeah. It's not So, there's there's not a lot of good stuff in that. It's like tree. You don't want Oh, okay. It's garbage. You have to You'd have to screen it. It's not It's not good stuff. No. Um I I'll get with you later and talk to you about that. Okay. Oh, that'd be great. Get that out of there. Any other questions for golf? Well, we haven't gotten to the other things yet. So, we're putting Is it a new bathroom on hole number five?

Yeah. So, that bathroom was built in 1962. Um desperately needed. This uh current repair that's needed is another $20,000 repair. That would be over 60,000 we've dumped into that bathroom since I've since I've been here. Okay. Um we did get 25,000 from the restaurant tax. So that's I I'm guessing the mayor just put 100,000 because it's going So we went and got the restaurant tax to give us 25. It still shows 125. So can we lower it to 100? Yep. Sweet. unless we're putting that 25,000 into the budget. So, golf has sinking money.

So, if you budget it at 125 and they come in shy, it goes back into golf. Yeah, that's fine. So, it doesn't go anywhere else. You might as well just leave it there. Okay. So, that's uh that's to take it down to the ground and start over. New bathroom. Perfect. Okay. Is that hooked on to the sewer line? It is. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't until 8, seven, eight years ago. And we're good from from our property line to the sewer. We're good. It's it's the bathroom itself and then the the clay pipe going from there to the property line. That's Yeah, if it's clay pipe, it needs to be changed. Yeah. So, and no personnel changes. No personnel changes. No. Okay. Your team is awesome, by the way.

Thank you. I uh Yeah. I mean, if if if just to wrap up, I was just going to say um in my 30 years in in the business, I've never worked with a greater group of people. So, thanks and and thanks to all of you for all you do for the city and and um it's a great flagship for the city and people love it. It really is. It really is. And I and I do I say this every year as well in in my business. Um there's one job in my hometown and I feel blessed to have it. So, um I don't take it for granted at all. I can't go. I hope you feel that way when that traffic starts going through on 900. Yeah. Only thing I need, Jared, is another one. We um start pushing that.

We desperately we desperately need another golf course. Yes, we do. And you know it since we've gone to tea times, it's been phenomenal. And as you've seen revenues and everything's increased and everything's been great, but we turn away I I'll tell you on Friday, Saturday, Sunday, we turn away 100 players a day. Oh, I know. that call and just we're just full. Sounds like private need exists. Yeah, private. No, mayor. Get that going. However it is. Yeah. So, thank you. Thank you. Okay. Leisure. No. Parks. Oh, I keep skipping people. I I do like you, Anthony. So, we'll let you we'll let you go. Thank you. Uh Anthony with the parks department. Um,

so just to start, I believe the uh will you wait a minute till we find you? Just takes just a second to find. No problem. It's on it's on PDF 18. PDF 18 and probably revenues up top or summary's on 30.

Thank you. We're budgeting impact fees to go up $300,000. Yeah, because there's a transfer. You'll see it there when you Okay, now you're good. You all make it. Okay. Y

um for my operations budget, we're looking at uh our urban forestry program going up uh $10,000. Um, currently we're doing kind of uh re, excuse me, sorry, reactive instead of proactive approach on these trees and we're getting so many older trees that uh they're getting hollow branches and all of that. And I'd really like to keep these older trees around as long as we can till we have some of these newer ones we're planting to uh to catch up in the height. I'd hate to take out some 60ft trees and only have 15 foot trees left. Um, but we don't want to kill anybody either.

Yeah. And that that's another one is is uh we've had some branches that have fallen in in uh in the past and we just want to make sure that the trees we do have that are still in decent health are trimmed up and healthy. Um tree work is it seems to get more and more expensive. We do as much as we can inhouse. Um but some of the larger stuff we have to hire out and use the blanket contract. So, uh, hopefully with that 10,000, we can start focusing on some of those mature trees that have been neglected for quite a while and get them get them to hold for

hopefully, you know, couple more decades if possible. Um, but as they stand right now, I don't even think they have 10 years left in most of them. You have quite a few I was looking at that the other day in the parks and the cemetery. You have quite a few trees that really just the point of being taken out. Yeah, there's there's there's a handful that need to be either slimmed up or or taken out. And I just don't want to have some bare parks or cemeteries or anything. Make sure I'd really like to hold on to those mature trees as long as we can. Let's see. Are there any questions about that?

Nope. Okay. And then onto capital. So almost everything you wanted

for equipment. We're looking at just a couple mowers. We have a a fleet of medium-sized mowers that are six foot wide decks that we are used five sometimes six days a week depending on what's going on. Um and we've been having a lot of issues with them. uh blowing clutches a couple times a year and those are $1,100 plus dollars to just to replace. And so it'd be nice to add a new one to the fleet and uh keep the fleet going. Not to mention some of the newer areas we've got. Um those mowers run constantly. And it would be nice if we have maintenance to not get held up uh just because we have to do some oil changes or tire changes and stuff like that. We can keep going with the schedule and not get behind. Um, one of those is also a small collection mower for the cemetery. Um, we get some areas that are hard to get into or they have long grass. Uh, that's consistent and so the collection mower is a a pretty large need. Um, the ones we have in there are currently 2009 and they no longer manufacture parts for them. So, we actually our mechanic is manufacturing them

himself essentially taking some and modifying them. And so, uh, that's how much we already have. It would be, it would be great to just have a new one that we can send out and still get parts for. And, uh, we'll hold on to the other ones as long as we can. I like to drive things till the wheels fall off. So, um, but when there's a need, there's definitely a need. So, um, that's that's where we're at with equipment. Is there any questions on those? I would say on on equipment, there's twofold. You can buy them work the upper half or you can buy the lower half and pay twice as much to run it. Yeah. So I I would seriously consider working on the upper half. It might cost a little bit but it's cheaper.

Mhm. And then trade them off. Okay. I am not a fan of running. You talking about the mowers council sending sending some out to Yeah. If they're you lose efficiency and your maintenance costs go way high. I think the hardest hardest thing lately is we're getting new areas and so those older mowers we just have to keep them running to make sure that we stay on track. So so that's kind of where trade them get some new ones cuz don't run on the bottom end. Yeah. Okay. Sounds good. Not any good. Cemetery.

Yeah. Cemetery. So we're running for renovation uh number four this year. It will be the south south center ascent essentially right uh in front of the cemetery offices. There's two sections. Some of our largest trees are in that section. Uh most of them will be taken out. I know. Um I have gone through with the arborist to look at some that we can hold on to because uh that's part of my prerogative as well as keep some of those as many as we can in there. But most of them are going to have to come out. Does this project include replacing the ones that we're taking out?

Yeah, there's always replacement. Yep. Uh whether that's in whether that's inside the section, which is something we started doing, um and then putting it somewhere we can along the roadside. Okay. Now, if if on on the trees, you know, and and I like trees and I don't like trees, but uh the best way to break the sidewalk and the best way to break the road is put a tree right by it. Yeah. And so if we could put them back a ways so the roots don't come up through the road. And and with this with what we're doing now in some of those planters, we're putting uh we're putting root guard so they drop down. Uh just planning planting better than than it was 80 years ago.

Yeah. Just so just the roots come up. It's terrible. Yeah. And we have we have quite a bit of that going on. Yeah, you do. So the number includes um is there another design study that needs to be done for phase four or that was already in um the design the designs uh has pretty much happened. We're doing all of the the design inhouse this year. Um and so we should it should be the carryover that we have from this last year. We have a little bit of carryover and that should pay for it and as well as some of the tree removal. Okay.

Yep. And so this this would be most of the contracted work essentially the contracted work maybe next year's design and uh and then some of the tree work and that's that's it. So this design of phase four is that what we discussed about a month ago? Correct. Okay. Yep. Fiddler Fiddler's Park. Um I believe we we asked for 1.7 and we were approved for 850. Um what what's that going to get us?

So it is out for bid right now. So we are hoping um to get those bids. I think they're due back next week. Um the city has done quite a bit of work over there. And I think that'll get us close because our costs are a little bit different than what the initial um quote quote from the engineering company was. So, we have all the quotes for a lot of the wreck stuff, but we're just waiting for the bids for the contractors to come in. So, we'll be at about we'll be at about 3.2 we'll be at 3.2 million after that. I'm hopeful that we're going to we're going to be close to that. Honestly, we might have to, you know,

postpone a dynamic areas or something for a year, but I think we we should. Yeah, but I'd really like to get phase one done. I So we'll I'd like to have some further discussion about that. Is there going to be a wrap tax request for Fiddler's Canyon this year? You think? Okay. Um Kenny's shaking his head. So was that a I didn't see that. He said no. That was a resounding no. Mayor, is there some uh because I I this is a place where I I would like us to try and get this first phase completed. Is is do we still have 2.332 million we're carrying over or is some of that been expended or is that's what's left? You might have spent a little bit but not a lot. That's pretty close to what's left.

But that's pretty close to what's left. Okay. Like Anthony said, the bids will be the bids will be here in a week. So by the time you even adopt your tenative budget, we'll be able to adjust it. You'll know what the bids are. It is. So actually the bids are today. Is it today? Yeah, it's the 11th for phase one. Yeah, right. Phase one and two. But but we did that number based on reasonable estimates that we should be able to Okay. So, we'll just see where they come in at.

Is there some uh and there's some grants, too, or some neighborhood, you know, just to me this is a lot of money to pay for a park and I'd like to see us go after some grants. I'd like to see some private money, get the people involved a little bit. You know, if they want a park, they can help pay for it. We did put in for uh some federal grant money this year and it was apparently so competitive that they denied it. They funded a lot of stuff for water and uh Kenny don't go wheels parks and stuff like that like skate parks and stuff but um well let I know there's more than one so let's let's see if we can't Yeah, absolutely.

So go after some more. So, the the state of Utah, the Utah Outdoor Recreation Grant Program, Councilman Schmid, one thing to know about is up until this year, they've never allowed park parts. They don't do parks. They do recreation. They do skate parks. They do trails. They But this year, they did start doing Have we applied for any with Yeah, we we put one in for through the Utah,000. Yep. 200,000 and it was denied. Okay. So, I mean I obviously it's going to be competitive because you have every city in the state now is going for a brand new grant program. And then we also did a million for Iron West that was also denied. Okay. So, we did we did hear today that we got some for some trail renovation. So, that's a

don't don't stop trying. Yeah. No, it'll it'll be a consistent thing every year it seems now. So, okay. Well, and then uh Iron West uh ask for 562 and uh approved 281. Um I don't believe that this would get us across the finish line for play. Um not that I don't think the fields will be ready, but uh we have some road road construction and uh improvements that are on our end that that part of this is is supposed to help fund. So, was the 562 requested? What was that for? That was for park park parking lot, uh, sidewalk and road road improvements.

Restrooms. Uh, restrooms has already been funded and it has. Okay. Does this include the city building up the parking lot where the hole is? Uh, I I I mean, Eric I know Eric's I know I believe I believe engineering did talk to Eric about raising that parking lot up and so I believe that was part of it and I know he's he's getting ready to start moving dirt over there soon. He was saying this he's going to have a budget for that and this one or is this se does this include him? No, his would come out of his operational funds to just Oh, it's a different budget. Yeah. So, mayor, would you explain to us your reasoning in cutting this down to 28?

Paul and I were just looking at each other. Actually, I don't remember that we cut this one down or why that's we would explain to you, but we can't remember. Yeah, because this is pretty important. If we're going to do play, you got to have a parking lot and you got to have a road to the parking lot. So, it's like it's like funding a police officer and then not giving him a vehicle. Okay. Well, we'll we'll Yeah. So, that one's we need to look at because I honestly don't remember why. Yeah, this is one that needs to definitely be looked at. I I would think the parking lot would fall more under the uh street department than the park wreck. So, I I would think I I'm just uh I believe I I just come in asking for the facility as a whole. So, between

I don't care what department lands in as long as we have the funding. I'm asking for the facility as a whole and what's included in So, we just need to see where all the money's at then from you between you and Eric. Yeah. because I'm not sure if he has money for the for the street improvements or not, but so there's $1.1 million in impact fees that we have to allocate between this park and Fiddler's Canyon and which other one. That's it. There's still some left. Okay. Out west, isn't there?

Between these two parks, we're we're now budgeting the 1.1. So the discrepancy is we didn't want to overbudget those impact fees and go 1.5. We we the hope is Fiddler's Park comes in a little bit cheaper and then you can move some of that money over to Iron West. Okay. So none of the uh Yeah. But if not So no general fund is going to either of those then. So that's why it was just trying to use impact fees instead of general fund money. You can use you you could use general fund money but this is just covering this is just the proposal is impact fees. Okay. Okay. So so with the park I know where the parking area is.

Are we responsible to bring the road to that parking area too? So I believe uh the way I understand it is that we are responsible for some of the road improvements uh past where they're working on all that right now. Yeah. So they're bringing it to the development west to what is it 5400 west? I can't remember. So it'll they'll bring it all to that intersection. We're responsible from that intersection over to the parking lot. I believe if if we wanted to get to get play going Well, we got to have a way for parents to get and that's and that's what it is. If we want to use it, we're going to have to to step in and do it.

Yeah. I think their commitment only goes as far as their development. I think they should pay for the road. Would you go talk to him, councilman? No, you go talk to Joe. Um, and then personnel, you're increasing one full-time person, but you're decreasing a part-time person.

So, yeah, we what we've had is is a individual that works 40 hours a week year round. Um, we've been told to to stop that because uh that's more for emergencies and whatnot. And so their wages will be transferred to the full-time and then any of the extra would be had have to be budgeted. Does that make sense? So so their wage would be come out of my part-time wages to the full-time and then uh and then anything extra would would you have a part-time employee who's been working full-time essentially? Yeah. Need to stop that. I So yeah,

I want to go back to uh your uh outlay your your cap out here. Okay. So uh we have 347,000 carryover for the cross hollow osaural trail connection. 53,000 is not a lot of money to if that will complete it. But is there a reason that we're not completing that now because of Levit development or I mean is there a reason that we're holding thought process there is yes because of the Levit development that they likely are going to be putting in a light there.

Okay. And I think it's discussion to say let's wait and that may be better to just have the light be the crossover rather than the expensive redoing of the tunnel underneath. Okay. But it will still go and connect up with the swirl trail behind plan the Dr. Horton. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. So back back to personnel. Um was there any questions about that with with some of the new parks requested and bringing in? It would be great to have another person. You got to have them. So, like you're probably the the you need more prayle than you probably need more than one, but yeah, I'm sure you do. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Thanks, Anthony. Okay.

Now, leisure. Don't skip ahead there, Mayor. Let's just skip Kenny. Go right. Oh, Kent left. So, I guess we'll go ahead and let you go. So, uh I'm kind of filling in for Bart also. He's in Missouri. So, this is also facility services who He reports to me. He reports to me. So, because it was new, he's not usually on the schedule we've do have done every year. So, um that'll be coming forward. But now, why does he report to Leisure? Just because he has more facilities than he has the most bathroom. Had to put it somewhere. So, that's where his office is. There's no good fit for it anywhere. If you start with that premise, here's how it got to leisure.

Okay. Leisures had somebody's got to take him. Leisures had uh the space to house that position. Gotcha. And frankly, Leisure probably gets a benefit of it because they're very in tune of that building and the pool and everything else. So, there's a little bit of benefit to them as well. We're the most we're the most needy. So, there's not a lot of mechanical brakes down here, but there is our joint. So his budget is facilities services.

So we've moved Terry's moved all the janitorial that you guys have talked about earlier to BART. Uh we've done the numbers. We think that's in the ballpark. So he's just um taking care of or making those orders and or Anthony makes them for the parks and then Bart pays. So it's just all under one umbrella. So, um, that that's done as janitorial. He and then the others are just basic needs. He has employees at each building that are part-time. Um, I don't think there's anything unusual in his budget. He has no capital ass. Do we do we have any kind of a syncing fund for roofs and parking lots and these big massive things that I mean, I say we, you know, building improvements and pavements. We're putting 5,000 from each one, but do we have a a larger sinking fund for some of these big buildings when we have to do a, you know, 30 40 $50,000 roof every 20 or 30 years?

Probably 400,000. The answer to that uh depends on the building. Okay. There is some money for the aquatic center. However, it's probably woefully inefficient given the nature of the stuff they have. For just an example, when we built the place, uh, we harvested the some of the heating equipment for the water from the old pool and took it up and put it in there. So, that equipment's got 20 years on the hill plus whatever it had with the school district. Wow.

That's pretty expensive. So, there's a sinking fund up there. The library has some money. Uh this building would rely on the general fund as did most of the renovations out of public works although the uh enterprise funds chipped in out there quite a bit. Okay. So the short answer is not really. Not really. No. Okay. I don't think there's any questions on his budget. No, he he's doing well. Um, is he is it has it made things more efficient? He's been here what, a year and a half? Yeah, roughly. He's been here a year. Year.

He started when I did. Better. He He has, you know, several buildings that he goes to and takes care of and but it's all under one. So, I think that's more efficient on that way. That way the building managers or the department heads are not trying to overstep their bounds and do things that he should be doing and controlling and right I think it's better just the budgeting process is much better budget process is cleaner way it he he's able to keep track of if he hires an employee and puts them in a certain building he doesn't have to have seven signatures from different people to

to put them at certain places and it's just more efficient. Yeah. And then leisure itself, you don't have any. I spend all their money. So Okay. Um is one of the fastest meetings. Yeah.

Yeah. So uh I just wanted to say uh thank you for all your support uh for your budgeting um options with with leisure. We we are getting busier and busier um in all the areas. Obviously, golf is and Scott is and uh parks are busier and cat's got more kids and everything is just continuing to grow and uh those guys really needed help in in Scott's world and in Anony's world and um and the budgetary things that we asked for. It's it's not really a Christmas list. It's needs. And we surely appreciate all that you guys do and all the mayor and and Mr. Bitman does to help us out in leisure. And uh just to give a couple updates, uh both the poring places are in at West Canyon and Discovery. So Discovery will open on Wednesday. Um so that'll that park will reopen. Um the I I told Mr. Phillips that I would bring this up. Uh the pivot at West Canyon is going to go away. Uh that Rotary put in. Uh we're coming up with a new design from Big T that's going to be a different water feature. Um one that can last more than a weekend. And and so uh we're in the process of of he's designing that. Um and that will be a great opportunity for the little kids to go up on that splash area and that soft surface and uh kind of pull away from the ditch a little bit. So um just wanted to give you an update on those. um the wrap tax which is due this week. I know Carter asked about that. He serves he's serving on the committee. Um kind of our ask for that is uh we get to kind of backfill some of the things that

didn't get funded. So we're asking for um the aquatic sound panels. We think that's a good uh place to ask for that. We're asking for um Scott needs the electrical for the spider boxes and those things. So, we're using that avenue to ask for those things that are still important for our operations. Um, there's 30,000 that we need to ask for to resurface the Cross Hollow Trail. We got a grant to cover the rest. Our matching part is 30,000 to do the trail from oh, Walmart to the silo more or less. So, that trails uh that trail's used a lot. Used a lot

and it's at its day. So, every year we're going to try to apply for a grant to resurface a trail. So, we're just going to keep moving that around till we get them all done and completed. Um, the other wrap tax that we have to ask for, it's a huge ask is uh why it's not going to fiddlers is we need to replace the uh play structure of the aquatic center. So, Irma's tagged the inside one. The inside one, the bucket, the slides. Uh so Irma's tagged that because it's rusting at the bottom.

So it's it's out outstretched its life expectancy. So obviously you know sitting in water and chemical uh it'll have a timetable on it and ours is reached. So instead of asking for a capital fund for that uh we think it's a good ask for wrap tax. So um that that'll be one of the big asks for for that. Okay. K, you guys you guys have a lot to do u in this town and everything you do, the public sees it. Do you are you adequately staffed to where we can keep these places looking sharp or do you need do you need some more help? Be honest with me.

Uh we will be in the arena. We we are in golf and it'll probably just be Anthony that might be still short like all the baseball fields and everything else and especially if these other if uh so it's a big deal. It's a big deal for for Anthony to get this position because our our our parks, one of our parks two positions, he takes care of the three complexes of of fields, right? So, you got the Hills, you got Bsentennial, you got little league. That's 15 fields for one guy. That's a lot. That's too much. So, that's why I'm saying you you you didn't really add a new person. Well, we did. Tra Well, you just went fulltime.

Yes, you added half. So yeah, I'm I'm I'm saying if you need to because everything you do is very visible to the public really on paper because we were already and so I don't I'm looking at this and I'm saying I to me you need a little bit more help. Well especially if Fiddlers comes online right online I don't think there's a question and Iron West when it's online and Iron West comes online to work right so it's running daily and Fiddlers is a park and so yeah that that that's a lot for those. So, do we need though? Do we need another person to help Anthony or in these fields today? Where you at, Anthony? Probably. But I mean, are you going to you going to cover it? He's going to say yes.

Actually, he won't. He'll only say it if he needs it. Um, more help's always great. Uh I think I think uh when when we see a lot of stuff online and in the public talking is in between a span of April when programming starts to the end of May when we have very limited seasonal help. By the end of May we're stock staffed up with college kids, high school kids and all that. There are there is a six-w week span where we're we're running. Um, do I I think we do okay at it right now. Would another, you know, another guy will be great. Um, essentially, but we are just absorbing somebody that's been around.

Um, help would be good, but I also feel like, um, we understand where the priorities are, and so we we just try and make sure we hit those priorities before anything else. Um, I think we can make it work for another year or two and see what these other parks do. Um, I have uh quite a quite a lot of faith and uh belief in in the guys that we have in our department and everybody's willing to help each other. Um, do we miss things occasionally? Yeah, there there's there's things that happen and it's generally within this six week uh area. So, um, as of right now with this position coming on, I think we'll be okay because this person will absorb some of the other guys areas because as of right now, they don't they don't have the areas. They're just helping where they can. And so, it'll relieve um some areas from other people to free up some time to help the ball fields if needed and whatnot.

But Anthony, aren't we really We're only making a full-time position on paper essentially. He's already working full-time, right? But he's he's he's bouncing around essentially at this point. Now he'll have an assignment. Yep. He'll have assigned areas which will pull away from some of the full-time guys um their areas and so more people will be able to help in the spring when needed. So let me let me ask the question a different way. When Fiddlers and the other park are done, what's the timeline on that? So we're looking at Fiddlers hopefully if we're funded that it'll be open next spring.

Next spring. And I think I think this position will be that coming in this year um would be able to still take that take that on or somebody else take that on and we'd still be pretty efficient. Um when Iron West is fully done, uh we might have to revisit that in in a year or two. Um I generally like to see how um how the guys do, how we can divide things up, people's strengths and weaknesses, and uh see how we can handle ourselves. and and I don't want to come in with an ask if if we don't actually need it essentially. Anthony, I don't think it comes as a surprise to me to say this, but that is one concern I do hear quite a bit from constituents when we talk about wreck is they say, "Why build it if we're not going to take care of it?" Yeah.

Right. And that's not I mean, at the end of the day, we can only stretch you so thin. That is not a that is not a dig on any person or anything in your department. It's just we can only expect so much from certain people. And so please if it gets to that point like if we get to the point where you feel like we're not doing our citizens, you know, and our parks the justice that they need, we just need to know about it. And absolutely. And uh I do I do feel confident that with for if with this new position, we'll be able to divide things up appropriately for at least the next year or two years. And then at that point, we'll we'll know for sure, hey, I actually need two two full-time guys now or something like that. But just don't be afraid to ask for one. All right. Okay. I appreciate it.

I definitely think when Iron West comes on, there's no question you're going to need additional help. Oh, yeah. It's massive. Yeah. So, okay. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thanks for the question, Councilman. Yeah. And some that is a great question because the community also doesn't realize that since when we get into tournaments and all that kind of world, 15 fields are going six days a week. Oh, yeah. We know that. That's why we're asking. That's why we're asking. I keep People are like, "Well, you only play on tournaments are on the weekend." Yeah, but our citizens use it Monday through Thursday. So, it it's it's running six days a week. Scott's running seven. Jared's running seven.

Well, let me make one thing clear. When I hear that from citizens, it's not the citizens saying, "Why don't they do a better job?" It's the citizens saying to us, "Why don't you guys give them more people so they can have the manpower to do the better job?" That's really what it is. It's not that's not a dig on them. And that's a dig on the funding to get them the fuel they need. Softball is in the air. It's up to you to hit it. That's what we're saying. We can't lay this out any more clear than what we have. It's pretty teed up here. You want to go golf? We'll talk about teeing it up. Sure. And that that's the thing is is is we can't expect one guy to cover 15 fields. So, you're right. We do need another person for those kind of things. Okay. All right. Thanks for all you do.

Thank you. Thank Thank you, Kenny. And uh we appreciate it. No, thank you. Should we take five? Need a break. All right. Bathroom break. Go. Yes. You're 28 minutes ahead of schedule. So, yeah. Let me hear. Sorry. I agree. like 40,000. Okay. I think maybe before we're all done

or even another part.

We cheated up. He's got to hit the He's got to take a swing. Yeah, he does. I get a phone call.

I seen it. I think we can distribute Are you in this week? I am Thursday, Friday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. Thursday, Friday, and then Monday. I don't know. That's the next fight.

Today, tomorrow and Wednesdays are

so We do two meetings a month or five months and there is a Everything that actually Okay.

I know. When you always the f com. You're out there walking around treating everybody.

Kent,

it was the 68 that got in. anybody because Sorry.

I don't know. I trying to certain god.

Don't have a budget. So now it's just Congratulations. suit all the crap. What would

You can take one random another party.

All right, y'all went to the bathroom, so let's get settled back in. Let's keep this show on the road. We got everybody else here that needs to be for the day. Well, I guess unless building comes down too. Yeah, let's get this done early. They might be. I know. Well, if they are, we got the other guys here, so we'll just pump them. Yeah, we'll just bump them. Oh, my wife decided she wanted a stainless steel three sink for our garage so she wash. Okay. So, you can stay up, Kent. You're first.

Do you know, Kent, is Lester going to come or are you covering both of his? He's planning. Okay. If he's not here when you're done, we'll just shuffle fire and move him to when he gets here. So, okay. Do you want to uh field questions or do you got specifics you want to go over? Um, see if this picking me up. Yeah, it is. Sound like it when you're standing right here. Yep, you're good. Weird. Fix.

Okay. Couple things I just wanted to to mention. Um in uh right now the we did most of the things that uh we felt like we needed um in the budget uh we were able to get and that in the mayor's proposed budget to you which we're very grateful for. Um, just uh to let you know, um, one thing that we that was not included, as near as I can tell, and Paul can correct me if I'm wrong, but as near as I can tell, we did not get uh money that we had requested for developing an access management plan. Right now, there is about $6,500 in the budget that is available to carry over. That's not nearly enough to hire a consultant to come in and do the study and help us develop our access management guidelines.

Access you explain that. Yeah, that's cool. Okay. All right. Let's back up just a little bit. So, u we're talking about on the various classification types of roadways, the different functional classifications of roadways, what policies should be in place for where accesses to those roadways can be. Now, obviously a local subdivision street, you know, you can have almost unlimited accesses and it doesn't really impact the the function of the roadway, right? Okay.

When you get on to higher classifications of roadway, then that becomes uh much more problematic. There are safety issues and efficiency issues for the traffic that are associated with getting accesses either too frequently or in the wrong places. Right. Does that include existing roads or just new roads?

Well, I'm saying the act well the act the policy would apply to everything. Now, obviously on an existing roadway there are existing accesses. One of the things we would look at if we had um better access management policies is that when property redevelops, if there are multiple accesses that maybe could be consolidated, we would be pushing to have those consolidated.

New development, we would be pushing to meet the standards to the extent that it's feasible to do so. You know, sometimes because of what is developed around some something, it's not possible to meet the letter of a of a policy. But what right now we we are very weak in our access management policies. And so this is intended to get us to where we have um uh good policies that will help us to develop efficient, safe uh uh roadways in as we continue to grow. How long does a study like that take? It would a few months maybe maybe three to four months probably

and we don't we don't possess the skills to make that determination. So there are there are a couple things to consider on that. Um this is something I have experience with. So I have the expertise to work with you know staff to to run this through. The question becomes um you know in-house resource availability is one point. The other is um sometimes those uh proposed policies are better received when we have the benefit of outside um input. So wi with with

with that this would help us as a city then instead of like these problems where one subdivision won't allow another subdivision to tie across from one to the other. Something like this would help that situation. Is that where you're kind of going with this?

It certainly it certainly can. That's not the primary reason for it. Primary reason is is all about um traffic safety and traffic operations, right? But when you do limit the number of driveways, that kind of forces things to happen. you know, when you limit access points to major roadways, that forces some of that interconnectivity, some of those shared accesses between commercial uses, a lot of those kinds of things. And I and I apologize, Ken, now that I look back through here, we didn't talk about this in our follow-up meeting. No, I forgot to bring

and I Well, I apologize, too. I didn't have that one highlighted. I I do have notes on there that I'll I apologize. I'm doing it here instead of just with you personally like my goal was with with everything. But the note I had down on on my notes of why I didn't put it in was kind of to Scott's Phillips question of um we we do have a guy that I trust is as good as anybody that we would hire to be able to do it. And I'm comfortable with taking the heat with people come in and say you didn't hire a consultant. Well, we've got the best guy already on staff that can tell us what we need to do there. That's why I had it in my notes of not not funding that. I think you're competent to do that. mayor that works really well if the resources that we have in house including his time and the and the let's say the next level management and operations people also have time. I mean this is a this is a quite a uh I imagine a very detailed uh statistical you know kind of observational blah blah blah type of study that is it's going to require a certain amount of hours to do right

a lot of a lot of the uh um more um what what's the word I'm looking for statistical type analysis is things that have already been done over and over again across the study. So, a lot of it on the research side is more literature review. Okay. And and looking at, you know, trying to find information about what the results of of different policies have been to make sure that we're getting the the best current guidance um from what's being been learned in the industry. And so it really would be we wouldn't be looking at doing a lot of data collection and analysis. It would be more literature review.

Okay. And where I don't see this in the summary, Terry, what he's talking about. And so which one would it have fallen under? And what was the what was the total ask? So the uh the the amount that's currently in the in the the budget is in under the transportation impact fees and it was about 6,500 and something if I remember correct 6,484 is when you had a carryover. So it's under the impact fees not engineering. Correct. And we had we had requested to add 40,000 40,000 to it.

Yeah. So now to to mayor's point, this is something that we could do inhouse and if that's if that's the way that we should go, we're happy to do that. We're, you know, that that that's not a problem. We thought there would be some advantages to having enough money to get the the consultants on it. One thing we could do is with the money we have, we could have a uh a consultant just do a a brief peer review for us uh to look at what we come up with and see if they see anything that that raises any concern for them that we could look into further. That is something we could do with the money that we have budgeted.

Just just so that I know where the number is. So it's it's at that 60,000 and professional. Oh, it's not on the shelf. It's not there at all. Yeah, it got me. So, I have it in my original binder of his request, but it didn't make it into the spreadsheet, and I had notes from when I reviewed it originally, but we missed it on the spreadsheet, so I didn't have the follow-up conversation. So, so I just wanted to to bring that up to you now so that you knew about it, and then as we work with the with the mayor and Paul and and Terry that if they were able to work that in, we just wanted to make sure that uh that you knew what that was. Yeah. So just really quick, Kent, so the 60,000 for studies that did make it into the budget for transportation master or transportation impact fees, that must be for other studies you're wanting to do.

That's correct. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Do you want to walk us through real quick the capital or the Well, I I actually want to have a follow-up question with Ken since we didn't talk about it and it's it's okay for you to argue that this is something you'd rather have a consultant do. What What's your bandwidth do you feel like to be able to do this inhouse? if if we're okay to take the political pressure of people saying you did it in house, you hire somebody, what what's the bandwidth? Um, I think it's it's something we could do. I I would obviously need uh, you know, uh, one of our project engineers to help do some of the heavy lifting just from a from a time standpoint, but but I can certainly dedicate the time I need to to it.

So, it should be doable. It should be doable. Okay. Thank you. famous famous last words there by the way. Yeah. Okay. So, the question was to walk you through Well, yeah. Front office furniture expansion. Well, operation there really wasn't there was nothing on operations to talk about. It was all actual decreases for you. Thank goodness. Yeah. That I'm sure that's just us moving money moving accounts. So, yeah. So, going through the capital improvements. Yeah. So, and so on that uh I'm I'm assuming looking at the PDF page 39. Yes. Okay. Yeah. So, so we did uh um you know get what we were looking for there with uh you know with the um

Yeah. Well, it wouldn't have shown up here because it was on the other one. So, yeah, we did. The only thing we didn't get there was the front office expansion and there's good reasons for that. And as we talked to the mayor about it, um we're we certainly understand that. And tell us the good reason so we understand. You want me to share my thought? Yeah. I I feel like we've got to figure out facilities space in general between police and engineering on a bigger level. It seems and so this to me was a bandaid. Yeah. Something that we if I my commitment is to work towards that solution this year and try to figure out something else that we can Was this do you do I'm sorry. I was just going to ask was this the expansion trying to bump out the entrance to Yeah.

engineering to that spot somewhere out there? Yep. Correct. Okay. Yes. And create some security stuff with it was part of Yeah. It would create some security and also allow with moving the front office operations out, we could create some additional office space there for for I just think um from a councilman standpoint, there's real no place in this building for us to meet constituents. That's right. And it's hard. I mean, we try and get the administrative conference room and it's been very good. I mean, I'm not People have been great, but it would be so helpful if they could put a glass wall or something upstairs around one of those tables just so we could have a place to meet with constituents. It's hard. I'll just say that.

That's a good thought. We'll figure that in as we look to how it overall do our expansion. I appreciate. Yeah. And and out in that space that we were planning on um expanding into, there is, you know, the one table we have there and and there are meetings there from time to time. It's not private though, right? Yeah. So that would be helpful. So mayor, in your opinion, this is something that would take long enough that we wouldn't want to put a placeholder in this budget, but actually punt it until the next budget year. Yeah, that's my thought. I I think we by the end of this next year, I think we need to have a better solution for our overall space between multiple departments. So good call.

And and we'll make it work in the meantime. Okay. So, as we go down Kent, um the the street widening, I guess I have two questions. Why does that fall under engineering and not streets? It's just that uh engineering has has to kind of manage that with the the transportation impact fee projects.

Okay. And then why does that fall under don't we have a budget line item for street widening every year or is it just because that number changes every year so that's why it falls under capital instead of you do a you do an allocation every year for street widening. You do an allocation every year for lineup sizing and water and sewer. You do an allocation every year for storm drain. Okay. And they all sizing as well. We set a number in there. Um, depending on the pace of development, sometimes we're a little short, sometimes we need to come back and ask for more. I guess I'm just curious why it falls under capital and not under just an operational thing if we do it every year. But it's easy for me to keep track of that way.

Beautiful. Enough an answer for me. And and so some of the other projects that are already in there that are just moving forward aren't listed here, but we do have the the one project that's added and that's that work out of 1600 North and Lond Highway for the Yeah, I was kind widening so we can get the left turn bay in there. Perfect.

The uh the other thing I wanted to mention looking at that u sheet there on the development review software, the 62,000 that's including there included there is what I requested. um as we've talked to more companies um that provide the type of software that we need and have talked about, you know, potential costs on that. We're finding that uh depending on which option we go with, we might be higher than 62. We're thinking possibly as high as 75. Um and so that kind of brings up a question. We want to make sure we get something that's going to work well, right? We don't want to spend any more than we need to spend, but we want to make sure we get something that's going to do the job for us.

So, as we end up evaluating, you know, proposals from different firms with their cost, with their features and everything they can do, you know, if if our you brought it up, if our best value is something that isn't the cheapest one, then we may be looking for more money. And so whether we try to get that added into the budget now or whether that's something we look at when we come back with a selection, I just wanted to make sure that you main thing is we don't want you to be hamstrung with the budget amount and pass over the right software because it was five grand more than what we budgeted. Yeah. Yeah, that's correct.

I I I think that depending on the timing, but I certainly think that there's no problem coming back with a budget revision if we need to do that because I agree with you. We've got to get the right program that's going to work for the department or there's no sense doing it. We would love it if that also h happens to be the least expensive, but it may not be. So, so then my last question is this new employee project engineer. Where are you going to put him? Oh, wait. Where are we? So, what what the plan is that's his first project. He needs to engineer that. He needs to re-engineer his own office to find a spot for it.

So, personnel request. No, we're we uh we'll we'll make some creative use of the space we have. Uh um Tom Coulison, our public works inspector, his office is really the cab of his truck. Um his space allocated to him is a place to plug his laptop in to connect to the network every once in a while. Um we can hook up there's no window. We can hook up his docking station and a monitor somewhere else where he can just come in and and do that. Um, but yeah, that space may end up needing to be our project engineers office until we come up with a better solution.

So, I would move move the rest of the file cabinets out of there to give them a little more elbow room. And that's going to probably have to be it temporarily.

Hey, this might this I can't find it. Tom's having a I mean there's there's so many things going on and and mayor I don't know if you saw the picture that Matt had the other day of the water line going through the ditch for a service and then it goes up and over a rock and back down and ends up only being like 6 8 inches deep. Uh if if if we really want to keep control of of what's going on and know what's going on, we need another inspector. We've got Tom doing so many things. He He doesn't get to every job. He doesn't have time to get to every job.

Most places and in fact in all other cities that I've worked, every project has had a person that's there basically watching what's going on. And we only have one and there's so many things going on here that there's just things that they just don't see. And that and that's okay if you got quality people, but but we only have one. We we got a lot of new people, too. So, I'm I'm concerned on I don't see asking for any more inspectors and I'm a little concerned about the so many things going on and nobody looking at it. Yeah. Um so,

we we felt like we can we really can't I don't think the budget could support us asking for multiple new people um this year, nor do we have a place to put them, but I guess that's another issue. But but the uh um what we have been looking at as we move forward and we're looking at getting additional personnel. We know that we're going to need right now we we even in our five-year projection, we don't have another inspector, but we are looking at this project engineer being able to help absorb some of the workload from Lisa on the development reviews as well as absorb some of the inspection workload. that that that's that's needed. At least got too many things on

that's that's what we want to do. We want to have someone I mean and actually depending on who we get, especially if we end up getting a a young engineer with without a lot of experience. Um throwing them out in the field is going to help them be a better reviewer uh to be an important part of their development. So, I think that works well to have them do spend some of their time um helping Tom and then and then spend the rest of their time doing reviews. So, that's what we're trying to accomplish with this new position this year. This is kind of a dumb question from a sales bozo to an actual engineer, but um uh are we are we convinced that our process is robust enough to to reduce let's say waste and I don't mean that in a derogatory way. I mean, you know, kind of too many hours spent because we don't have a a process that's um you know, lineal and one two three four five sequential type stuff. We're just kind of peacemeal as we go along. Um, is there software that can help us to rein in all of these tasks and make them a little bit more streamlined so that every, you know, we not only follow uh the sequential but also time um and uh and resources spent.

So I I will say that the the new software we're talking about getting is going to help us in that regard. One of the things that that hurts us in our efficiency now is trying to battle the software as we're trying to get where we need to go because the software only has so many capabilities. Um, and we're we're working with two different software packages and we have one one on the building permit side which also addresses a lot of the commercial site, you know, public improvements and the other more for the subdivisions and PUDs and zone changes and annexations and that type of thing. And so we're we're constantly having our people bouncing back and forth between two software packages because one can't do both

of the software that we currently have. So part of our objective with the new software is to have one software that does just a total enterprise type. Yeah. So so that you know our our people can just be in that software all day regardless of what project they're working on. Also a software that is better designed to to meet our needs is going to help help us as we're trying to do our work to actually just guide us through the process instead of us fighting it to get through the process. So, I think that it's going to help us. Is there is the software you're looking at does it include all of those modules and um provide you with that?

Yeah, we we've uh we've looked at uh software from several different uh um outfits so far and they all have the the ability to to do that what we need. Now, they all have different features that some of those features that one may have that another doesn't have are pretty nice. Whether they're going to be worth the price tag or not is something we'll be looking at as we go on.

I've always found that total enterprise type software always requires a little bit of breaking and unplugging and replplugging no matter how complete they are. So you need to just look for what's the the one that covers the broader spectrum of everything we do and then work with the software manufacturer to you know get rid of the stuff we don't need and plug in what we do need. Yeah. Exactly. Are you are you are you and Lester talking on this?

Yes. Yeah. Lester's been in on on some of the presentations we've had as well. Well, and uh Drew previously on some of the early presentations and Lesser's been involved with some of that as well. So, yeah, this is something that will be very much a uh a joint evaluation of all the proposals we get with myself and Lester and Don and Lisa. There'll be a number of us that'll be involved in that. Okay. Just I just uh Lester, just make sure that this new software does not say failed that it says pending. You know, you know what I'm talking about.

I just think that the the the quicker we get into this, the the easier and more streamline things are going to be. And and I'm also considering a lot the the the customer interface, right? We have a lot of people that are their level of frustration is just increasing and increasing. And I tell them, you know, you got to be patient. We're working as fast as we can, but um it it's to a point where we need to do it better.

Yeah. The the software we're currently using for the building permits has a pretty decent uh co customer portal. They can log in and see their projects. What we're using on the other side does not. Yeah. And that that's what we we get more complaints about that, I think, than just about anything else. Yeah. So, this will help us to solve that. Well, just let us know what you need and we'll help. Yeah. Don't let the 62 be the limiting factor. Yeah. Okay. Good. Thanks. I think those were the only things I wanted to point out. So, I don't know what questions you may have for me. Robert, I just have to hear question.

Um, so the permitting revenue, it goes in the general fund. Is there a way to even if as a note somehow put the revenue next to the department cuz they're generating impact or or uh permitting revenue and other type of revenue, right? But it's but it's put elsewhere and I I it just to me it's nice to see are we increasing decreasing do we have a budget because or like the capital um inlays there in the detail it's just there but I don't know you can't tell where it's going to or where it's coming from. I mean I it'll just be nice to see a little bit more on the revenue side the detail. Sure. Sure. I can I can

of inflows outflows. Do we have a budget increase? Well, if if revenues are increased by 200,000 and and it's from the capital projects fund, well, that's a whole different story than if it's earned revenue or permitting revenue or whatever. Yeah, you can see that in the overall um budget. And I will tell you, looking at the year-to-ate numbers, we're already half a million over what we expected our budget to be for building inspections this year. Mean permits. Permits. But I don't see that. That's a good thing. That's a good thing. But that's a good number. But where would I see that in the in this in this budget proposal? You wouldn't. You'd see that in the the quarterly. Yeah. You'd see that in the quarterly um that I send you. Correct. Correct.

Well, you've seen the building permits up here, right? In the in the revenue. Yeah. So, it's just it's not but it's under the general fund. It says building permits. You want to see it if even if it's in the general fund, just kind of put it there. This department is generating this. And here's just as a as a side note, the revenue that's in within this department. Okay. I mean, then you don't have to go three different places to find all the information. I have one one question. Is uh is Lisa going to be here till next year? As far as I know. Okay. But if if we're on borrowed time with her because she could retire she could have retired years ago.

Oh, I know. In the event that she she does retire, she could be replaced. I mean, with where we're at now. Yeah. So, one of one of our objectives with getting a new project engineer now is so that they can get up to speed while Lisa is still here. Y and then uh when she does decide that she's ready to retire, then they can take over as the primary reviewer and we'd have and we then would bring someone else along behind. Yeah. Okay. See, thank you very much, Kent. Thank you, Ken. Thanks. Thank thank the team also for everything they do. I know that

every time I go up there I'm embarrassed to interrupt because they're fully engaged. So there's no sitting around happening. No, they're not. So thanks. It doesn't mean we don't joke around and visit every once in a while, but yes, they're busy. Okay. Building. Good afternoon. I actually brought the information that you were just asking for, Robert. Oh, thank you. Oh, look at this. Pass that out. You're all over it. Some of you get color. Some of you don't. Thank you, Lester. Thank you so much.

Yeah, it happens. Well, it's not a big deal, but if you you'll clear up the general fund to see what the revenue increase is, then you know what excess we have and what can be spent. So that's

and what's the other permit? So holy cow. Yeah, that's just a that's just a snapshot of year to date of where the building department's at. Um I do this report monthly. Most of the time I don't add the u numbers on there, but I thought you guys might like to know that. And then it had the totals for last year on it as well. Really quick here. Um, so I guess a plan review is different than a than the building permit obviously. So people might get a plan review, but they don't get a building permit. Walk me through.

Okay. So every project gets a plan review, a building permit fee. That's the basic fee we charge for every single permit. Um, currently, um, I I call them a plan check fee because, um, currently we're using three different, um, fees to figure out. We use a plumbing a mechanical fee, plumbing fee, and electrical fee. So, some permits don't get a plan review fee, which they all should be getting a plan review fee. So, but pretty much any home, commercial project, all those will have some type of plan check fee that associated with them. Yeah, it's never been. So, okay. So, year-to-ate building permits.

I guess I'm just curious like why would residential there say 196 but then year-to- date plan review would say 205. Okay. What's the difference on that is the top category those are permits that have been issued. Okay. The one the one the second one those are permits that we have re um that we are in the process we have reviewed or in the process of reviewing. So, if you minus those two numbers out that's the potential. Okay. So you have nine more permits. Yeah. Somebody could walk in and we could have nine more permits today. Okay. So the numbers below the plan review number will either be equal to or higher than the number above all. Yeah. Nor. Yeah. That that number should always be higher. Okay. Because they haven't been issued yet. It just kind of gives you a snap snapshot of saying, "Oh, this is what we've reviewed that hasn't been issued."

Now, when somebody when you say a town home, for example, 22 permits for a town home, that could be an entire five or six plex, one permit. Town homes that are that's per door. per door. That's per door. It's multif family. That is um it have to be an apartment. Yeah, multif family those. So only 22 town homes have been permitted and so Ann Clark if you're listening that's 11% of total permits issued and the rest are single family. So just I just want to put that out there. That's 11%. I already did the math. Is that too much? I don't know. Well, uh a twin home or you could fall under twin home does fall under presidential. Last year it was 25%. Yeah. Yeah. Is that true? Yeah. So town homes is anything a three peek

and your year today. Is it the same year today or fiscal year or do you go off? Uh this is a calendar year. That's what I thought. And I'm like I tried to like it. No, that's fine. I can do a fiscal year. It's just a lot harder. Okay. Well, that but that helps explain it for me that I know it's a calendar year. Yeah. Because I was like, "Wow, those numbers are really low." But yeah, that's Yeah. So no one we've done since July. apartments came last year. So all that Henley apartment is that permit is last year's. Yeah, that's all on last year. Why do you do a calendar year? It's actually how my permit smear wart runs. Yeah, because your budget is fiscal year. Everything is just That's weird. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

It's just a Everyone else thinks in a calendar year. Yeah. When I go to do presentations and I share this data, then they all want to see it as calendar year. Yeah. Most people I show it to, they want the calendar year. They don't care about our fiscal year. So, so the average home price or the average construction, I'm just sitting here looking at the the valuation. So, if I take the valuation number and divide it by the number of homes. Yeah. So, we'll let you guys take that data and digest it all. Now, let's talk about the budget. Thanks for bringing that though, Lester. Okay. Any question? Anything else you wanted to hit on budget-wise or just want questions or

No, the only reason I I I kind of have that is because, you know, part of my budget I didn't um have requested to change my uh permit uh my permit fees um from I know uh going from the three different ones where essentially for hope to figure out a permit currently, she has to actually go through each individual permit and work through it. Count the number of bathrooms. Who's she? Hope. Okay. Thank you.

Yeah. Hope has to go through each individual permit and count the number of bedrooms and bathrooms and everything to come up with a PL uh uh plan check free. Most municipalities and jurisdictions, they use a flat percentage. And that's actually how the state set up for us to use a percentage. And that's actually, you know, part of my um was one of my requests and all my permit or my fee changes to go to a flat permit. um essentially it's 35% of whatever the building fee is we charge 35% and the rest of those fees just get that was all part of that consolidated fees we talked at last week. Yeah. So you going to be able to get by one more year without your pickup.

There was a Ford Ranger that was requested that got that didn't make it. Yeah. Um the vehicle in question is currently getting a new engine put into it. So that was it blew an engine last week. So, that one's going to be good for a good couple years. So, now the other one should be be fine for another year or so. Okay. Okay. Any other questions for Lester? I'm catching up. Sorry. You're good. That's why the summary is so great. I like to look at the details. I know.

Yeah. Oh, and then you were asking for a building inspector, but that also it was it was the same situation. You were going to be giving up a part-time person and going to a full-time. Yeah, because we currently have a part-time permit tech and a part-time um inspector and I was asking for a full-time, but I feel working with the mayor, we feel that, you know, we might want to hold off on a little bit on that that position. Um, I can tell you right now it's going to be tight. But the question I would have on that, are we causing delays to the contractors or the people there? Are we are we inspecting in a timely fashion or are we are we behind?

We are inspecting in a timely fashion. Um, where we run into issues like sensely just like the last three weeks where you know we lost an inspector. You know, my guys are running 45 plus hours a week. How many do we have? We have two full-time inspectors right now, and we normally have three full-time inspectors plus myself. So, if we lost one, can't we replace that one? Yeah, where we replace them. I have a new one that will be starting with us in two weeks. This would be to add even additional.

It just takes a minute. What happens is I'm everything runs smooth in the office when I'm fully staffed, but as soon as somebody wants to take a well-deserved vacation day, then we struggle. So, and that, you know, and it's fine. We can, you know, we'll make we'll make it work. It's So, how much are you asking for for another uh $96,75? I'll add a little more color to my thoughts on that one. So, twofold. Um there is been a slowdown in the industry. Um and so we often react to how things have been and not look to what the data is showing moving forward.

Um second part is he's functioned a lot of this year without a guy, right? Because you had one that you hired, had to take him through training, um then he starts and quits uh a week later. Uh yeah, we we we've been a person down almost all year.

Yeah. So So my thought was let's get the guy hired that's the vacance position. See how we really go there. Um continue to use the the the retired guys that'll come in every now and then and help, right? that we can contract with and then potentially even look at at uh ways in which the potentially give options of of builders privatizing that inspection and allowing them to hire somebody is another route to explore before we just add another person um to the payroll. So that's that's the thought processes of way

to your point mayor um if I took last year's total permits and divided it annualized it and then multiplied 5 months that which is not even all the way would be all the way through May we we would be at 460 permits and currently we're at 196. So, I think the proof's in the pudding of things are not quite as they were. And and we year to date, we are actually about on par for where we were last year, but I actually kind of agree with the mayor. We will probably not hit our thousand permits like we did last year. I think we'll probably be in the 900 range again. I I think what he's getting at is there's probably it's like what we talked about with the swimming pool. There's just certain times of the year where

you get a little bit more pick up more in the summer and you get off. For sure. It's one of those where I can go I can come in tomorrow and all a sudden I have a 100 permits. You just never know. But if that if that was was the case, I'd be coming back and begging. All I have for 25 is the total and I have the year to date on if you average them. Hey Carter, do we have um didn't the state pass something where we have to give the private or we have to they have to have an option to be able to go out and hire it privately? If we don't get to it within 3 days. So yeah, we have three business days to get it and then if um then they have the option of using someone from our approved list. Our current approved list is Iron County, Enix City and Brian Head, I believe.

So it's only the other municipalities. They can't go to a We don't have any private ones really that we've approved except for special. Yeah, we have some special inspections that um people use. Um there are some Sunrise doesn't provide a service and uh they don't have anything. They don't have any um inspectors down here. Sunrise actually does. Yeah. Um we don't have them because they haven't opened up that option in our there's not a market for it to Well, we have the option. Well, we have the option if we don't do it within three days, but we do it within 3 days. So,

yeah, we do it within three days. Honestly, every um inspection that we do, we will do with uh within a 24-hour request. We have not very rarely and if we if we can't make it the next day there is a phone call to that individual asking them and saying hey we are just booked is it is it anywhere possible for us to move you to the next day and so we're not leaving anybody high and dry we're not pushing them off because we you know yeah I haven't heard that complaint from No neither have I was just curious that was my next question we try to provide where we actually run we start running long is actually in our plan review is that true Mr. All red. I'm not on plan. No, he meant

I'm on dayto day. No, I meant in terms of Oh, really? Okay. Mine Mine's totally different. Mine's a concrete's a different animal. Okay. Yeah, that's all And you can't wait for mud to be poured. So you Yeah. Yeah. So how how we make up our day is the honestly concrete gets priority because it's the one thing that kind of is time sensitive. It's time sensitive and then uh groundwork plumbings and then everything else kind of works in. Okay. Yeah, they do a good job. They got a good system.

Yeah, we we work on I have I have an amazing team. So and they're it's just trying to keep them not not trying to burn them out in the process of trying to get done. Correct. Correct. Okay. Well, that's good. No, I've seen a huge change in that as well over the past year or so. Yeah. So, thank you. Yeah. And some of that comes down to, you know, we have good software and like I said when we've been looking with what Kent said, it's like it's one of those it's like before I switch my software, we're going to make sure that that whatever software they're working at works well because Yes. When I switch my When I switch my software, I can guarantee you guys are going to get phone calls. Yeah.

And a lot because they're all used to it and it overall works decent. Yeah. However, we do need to fix the software between you just because you got one fail because I my system doesn't let me to do do partial passes. Yeah, it's a pass fail. I'm still on the curve. Only failed I ever had in my life. Thank you, Lester. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. Okay, thank you Lester. Fire. Now stuff gets expensive. This past has failed because they haven't got report back. We're looking right now. Just give us a sec here. Pissed I am.

I know you're right at the front of the budget somewhere. I'm there. I'm on the summary. I like the other one. Find the summary page. I'm almost When you get there, tell me where I'll get aquatic center. You start at fire department. Wow. Depends on what page you want to look at. Yep. I told you it was 500. Look how fat that folder is. Go past it. Copy it twice. He just helps us with lots of pictures when he submits his budget proposal so he can understand what he's talking about. He's uh PDF8 right after the police. There we go. Come on. That would make sense. Okay, good everybody. Yep. Yeah. Okay.

Okay. Mike Phillips with the fire department. Good afternoon, mayor, council, and staff. Um, thank you for your support over this uh last year and the proposal for this year for the raises and for the equipment and the operating budget. Um, I just have a few notable items from this past year for your discussion. So, first of all, I've met with our interlocal partners. Two of them are here. Commissioner Blake is, I think, in Hawaii on vacation. So, he's in a better place than us. And, uh, this is their opportunity to address concerns about the budget. Um, as I met with them, they felt like the the budget was, uh, very conservative and and justified, the budget that was submitted to the mayor. Um, our partners were grateful for the increase last year with the three additional people. We've been able to staff both the north and west stations on an alternating schedule. So, two days they're at the north, two days that they're the west. they just go back and forth. It's made it really nice for our charter flights when they're in the middle of the night. Crew just goes and spends the night at the fire station and they're already there for those um charter flights. Um however, our partners did ask for an increase in full-time personnel that wasn't uh put in the budget and um understand the mayor's concern. We don't have another station to put them in and so and our partners are are fine with that too. Um, just as a note, currently our interlocal partners cover 40% of the fire department's operating budget. They pay into an equipment preservation fund. Um, the number switched just a teeny bit this year. Iron County went down 1.1% to 29. We picked that up just because we had more growth than them, I guess. Um, Eno at 10%, Canaryville at 1%. And just for a side note, the department protects over 11.4 4 billion dollars of property valuation in our response area. So my interlocal partners, if you'd like to come up, Tyler and Ryan,

you're never for a lack of words, Tyler. Yeah, I always wonder. That's the description. I know. And they're usually pretty colorful. So yeah.

Uh yeah, we're all good with the uh budget if you guys are good with it. disappointed in not getting three more people, but we understand. I'd rather see another inspector to be honest with you. But hold on, let's take this hat off. But, uh, yeah, we're good at everything and thanks for everything you guys do. And Phillips here, he really takes care of the county. I mean, when we have our, uh, Iron County Fire Chief's meetings, we are all over the place helping everybody and we're all a great big group and make this count. We're one of the luckiest counties in the state to have Phillips to lead us all. So, thanks. Now, Ryan's a new guy, so he's not jaded yet. So, let's hear

I grew up in a pair, so speak slow, too. So, that's No, just just over in I'm sorry. Tell us your name. Ryan Robinson. I'm the new Enix city manager. So, um, yeah, over just just the same as, uh, Mayor Al was saying, we're just very appreciative of of all the services that you guys provide and we're working on getting a fire station put in in ENIC so we can we can staff more folks over there. So, uh, but again, just just thankful for Chief Phillips and all that he did and thank you guys for for your support. Thanks, R. Were you with Jones and where do I remember you from? Jones and Mill. Jones and Mill. Yep. We did your general plan. That's what I thought. If you like it, if not, it wasn't you. Our general plan. We just fine-tune it all the time. Yeah. Good. Good. As you should. As you should. Now, last time I was in the room with you, Carter, I think you gave my boss co. So, I appreciate

Oh, great. this time. So, no. Yeah, I was at Jones and Mill Engineering. That's what I thought. So, yep. Well, welcome to Glad to have you there. Thank you guys. Just on a side note, I really scared him the other day when I sent him my budget and he looked at the bottom line. He figured out his 10% and he goes, "We don't have the money." And then when I explained how it all works and you didn't pay for everything, I told him, "Terry would love for you to pay that amount." But yeah, there you go. Just uh some other additional things. We're just getting ready to graduate another recruit class with eight people in it. So, we're adding some more volunteers to our organization, which is great.

How many do we lose? And we started with what about 40? We we hover right around that 40 to 50 that kind of go back forth. We do recruit class. We lose some. We just It goes eight to 12 graduates. Yep. So, they'll be coming here probably in a month or so to see you guys. Giving them pagers on Tuesday, Thursday. So, that's a great thing. Um, for the calendar year so far, we've been to Texas twice on two deployments in Georgia, which was the furthest we've ever been. They were almost Atlantic Ocean where they were at. And, uh, they weren't there very long. They were there for it took them two days to drive there. Two and a half days. Two and a half days back and like eight days there on the fire. It rained. It rained.

Yeah, they got cut short though because of the rain. Yeah, the rain. They're like go home. Chief Orby, if you wanted he wanted to come up and address you guys about the volunteer side of things. Retired Mr. Warby, but not retired from our police. Just tired over and over. Huh?

Warby from the Cedar Fire Department. But uh yeah, we've had a couple of late night fires and I've got a daughter in Japan and she calls in the middle of the night. So, I haven't had much sleep this week. It's been great. And uh we do appreciate all the all that you do. And uh the full-time people are are very very important, but uh you know, volunteers are also very critical uh in our in our community. And the nice thing about these volunteers is they put a lot of hundreds of hours into certification. They get the same certification that our full-time guys get. There's no difference. The tests are the same. The skill tests are all the same. Everything is exactly the same. And it's it's so important because we have one engine crew basically that can come and respond to a fire. uh that will not a working fire that will not put that fire out. It's it's it's just too much too much work to be done. Uh and so we need additional resources, additional engines, we need our ladder. Uh we need all those things and we depend on our volunteers and when they come they have the certification, the skills, the training to come in and pitch right in and and take care of of those needed services. So, uh, I'm really appreciative of these volunteers. And what's amazing to me is I, you know, how busy, uh, I'm sure you look, some of you that are probably my age, you have kids that are, uh, involved in school and have kids growing up and how busy they are. These kids take time out of that and and study and work and and get these certifications and then they come to training and keep those certifications. It is quite a sacrifice for them to do

that. And I'm I'm just very appreciative of them and and all that they do. So, uh we need to keep a focus too on on our volunteers. uh it's going to be some time before Cedar City is going to be able to go to full-time. Uh and so we're we're going to need that resource coming down the road. I guess one other thing that I've uh that has happened recently and I really appreciate the mayor uh looking for the need of an administrative assistant and I I did send all of you an email on that. But uh it is so important because uh I' I've had in the last uh about two or three months I have had two calls from widows in my ward who have uh had needed tried to call the firehouse because their smoke alarms or their uh uh carbon monoxide detectors are going off. And these ladies don't feel comfortable calling 911. They don't they don't they just, you know, they don't see smoke. They don't they're they're not comfortable doing that. They and they try to call the firehouse and and it's not that the crew is not doing anything. If you look at the call volume that we have, they're out doing inspections. They're out doing uh all you know when I was 40 years ago when I started very few homes in Cedar even had smoke alarms. Uh now almost every and none of the businesses were alarmed. So we didn't need people to go out and take care of all of these alarms. The other thing that's happened is on these smoke detectors and the carbon monoxide detectors, they have an end of life and they start going off at the end of life. And so that's increased our call volume and that's that's what the one was actually a

carbon monoxide that she was getting carbon in her home. Wow. So I am really glad that that she did call me. Uh but uh it, you know, it's so going to be so nice to have somebody there during business hours so that when somebody calls the firehouse, they're going to get somebody. They're going to have we're going to be like a business. Can you imagine the city office if somebody tried to call the city office and nobody answered the phone? It happens once in a while right there. Okay. Got to see So, uh, we appreciate all you do. And I think this is going to make a big difference because one thing, too,

is that, uh, I go down there a lot of times late at night and chief's in there with his door shut and he's in there working. uh we we've got to offload some of the things uh all the things that that are on his plate and he's got to be willing to do it, but we we've got to we got to be able to to get those administrative duties done. So, can I ask you a question? We've all had the same conversation, I think, with Chief. He has a Jonathan syndrome.

What uh what is your pay to your volunteers? How do you pay them? It it's it's uh based on the percentage of drill attendance they come to and the fires that they come to. And so we have a scale as they come to those fires. Uh then their pay scale goes up. If they if they don't they don't come to any fires, they get paid almost nothing. Uh and but so if they're attending a fire, what do they get? There's no set I can't give you a fixed number. There's no hourly wage or anything. No hourly wage because that's against the law. It's per call, isn't it? It's a No, it's not per call. It's It's just an average pay. Turn on your mic. Uh Chief,

can you give me an idea of what we're looking at? So, your average firefighter at the end of the year, we're paying them between um probably $7,000 annually per firefighter. And as they go up is a a captain's probably making about um 20 some odd thousand dollars a year. So it's not a ton of money. That's the part time. It's it's way cheaper than uh staffing them full time. It's a it's a huge

It's a huge benefit to the city. So, like right now with our our volunteer workforce, when we're filling those extra shifts, those stations on the weekends now, we're using two to four volunteers every Saturday, Sunday, and then when we do holidays like Memorial Day, I've got six people scheduled to work 24-hour shifts over that weekend. So, we have good coverage at the stations. And then they get paid to work their shift at the station, too. So, they can make like 275 bucks for working a Saturday over a holiday. So, I think what it does is it I mean it saves us a great deal of money, but we're also doing all the training and getting them all fit. And then if we don't have full-time employment, they go somewhere else because they're looking for full-time work. And I can't blame them.

No. How many How many volunteer firefighters are there? 40. 40. 401 maybe. Yeah. We're gonna add eight more on. So we'll be back up to almost 50 and then we'll So the quick math is so last year it was budgeted $711,000 for temps and there's 40 of them so that's $17,000. If you're up to 50 though it'll be their budget proposal will be about 14. I mean that's that's rough math. What kind of average hour would that would that person be working? They're going to be up 50. We don't track hours. I have no idea. We track fires.

So the percentage of fires. So, if we have um 100 fires in the six-month period, because we pay them every six months, and they come to 50 of them, they've met their goal of 50%, they'll get a 100% pay of their classification they're in. And it'd be hard to do because they have train, we have training every week and then a lot of times we have training on like we've been having training every Thursday night, technical rescue. It's part of that formula. And and then and then Saturday we were out with the doing a bunch of training. So we went from 8 to like one o'clock. So uh there's quite a few hours of training that uh

Yeah, but they get paid more than twice a year, don't they? Well, we pay them twice a year on their run check. So every fire call, their nights on the house come every six months. If they work an extended night, so they work like a a Monday night and they come in, they guarantee they'll be there at five o'clock is what we call it. They only get a hundred bucks for that night. We pay that every two weeks. Okay. And then their weekends or Saturdays and Sundays, we pay those every two weeks. What's your underlying question, Phil? Like what are you getting? Just doesn't seem like very much. It's not.

I had a I had quite a few of them talk to me the other day. We was out there and they basically said, you know, he said, "We're getting 11 bucks an hour for doing all this." I that just for you it doesn't seem like very much money now. It's great that you're getting all these volunteers. I I I would hope maybe we could take better care of them, offer them something and insurance or something so that they stick around, but it doesn't seem like much for what they do. So FLSA is really what's holding us back. And to keep their volunteer status, they have to make less than 20% of what a full-time equivalent does. And so if we raise them up to a point where they hit that 20%,

then Natasha's going to get a letter from the federal government says now you have to provide them all with benefits and everything and then that gets really expensive. So there's a lot of things that are factors in there about how we pay them and stuff. Chief, what's your turnover rate on on full-time? Um, almost nothing. Almost nothing. Say full time. John's going to retire in November. Really? He is. Yes, that's what he told me. Yeah, he'll be on for a month and he'll be So, I I guess he'll be a volunteer. So, we we don't have much turnover in our full-time staff at all. So, the volunteers really don't have a a chance of hooking up full-time.

There's not a big career ladder for them. So, they're applying everywhere. So, they go to St. George and and they get their foot in the door here and go wherever they can. all the trainings, all the certifications they need and then they go work somewhere else. But just to be clear, we're still Yeah. It's just going to happen. So you add three more positions helps it a little bit more people have the part-time salary than to have the full Yep. But we do have we do have some that that just come and train. I mean, and they have outside employment. They're just like I was. Uh and they're just volunteers. They they keep coming and and we get a few one or two of those out of every class and that's really important to to keep people like that. Sure.

There that are going to be stable and be here in the community in the future. Well, most your volunteers have other jobs outside of They all do. They all do, right? They all have to have other jobs. That's what I thought. They can't make it off of what we do. Yeah. But some of them are going down. They're they're they're doing full-time firefighting in other communities. Oh, so they're a full-time firefighter somewhere else and volunteer here. That's okay. Keeps them well trained. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Anyway, so thanks. We we've started the fire math um with our how we pay and uh the mayor knows that 1 plus 1 plus one equals one. Now, correct,

Terry? Yeah. We were talking about personnel. You have to three people equal one position. So, that was a a fun discussion. Anyway, um, is there any questions on the, uh, budget as proposed by the mayor? I have one question. Pay out to retirement under his personnel request. What's that about? So, that's paying out John's um, comp time and vacation time as it sits. Oh, so that way I can hire another person in the day he leaves. If you don't, if I don't get that, then I have to wait four or five months to um, fill those positions. Oh, because you'd have to Is he still on as a full-time?

He'd be full-time sitting at home. His wages would hold up a spot. So, that's what that's for. Okay. Just on capital investment. You you um obviously put the kabos on the uh on the new building on the southwest. Um what uh what is your thought on that, Mayor? We got to figure out a different way to fund it than through a general fund. The general fund. There's just no way it ever happens. So, we've got to figure out a different way to So, what could we Well, we'll talk about that later. Well, I mean, just really quick, we need to That by no means is me saying we don't need the station, right? But it's how it's how we got to figure out a different way to fund it.

I have met with both I mean, briefly, I've met with both Senator Vickers and uh Representative Ship, and they've both agreed. We just got to try and figure out a calendar date for myself, one other council member if they want the chief and the mayor to all go sit down and really talk about some sales tax options or something and see if we can get something going for next year's legislative session. So, I mean, at this point, that's really the only It's either that or you bond for it. That or you bond for it. So, those are the two options we pretty much have. So, we just need to schedule a meeting and really start hammering out some Who's uh who's going to take lead on that? you or chief or well one of us but we'll we'll get it scheduled. They were close last session but well they actually passed it but just not in the way that we thought it would. So yeah, we need to

benefited one county. Yeah, it benefited one city of one county. Yeah, I have a question on the uh operational requests and it may just be the way the budget laid out here. The uniform allowance for 8950 was not recommended. Was that $8950 additional dollars because you still have uniform requests? Yeah, it was additional additional dollars just because the cost of uniforms have gone up. And the same thing with the protective clothing and then and when we talked with the mayor, we felt we could look at those next year and see if they still are continuing on, which you have to have. You have to have you have to have that protective clothing.

My protective clothing this year, I think I've overspent by $14,000 because it's weird that um you have gear as it expires. There's no set time at 10 years and you replace it. So I have a whole bunch of gear. It's not like an annual kind of es and flow. Well, how do you know that it's no longer good? 10. So the gear is has a date stamp. Oh, I see. And so it says it's like this year we got to replace a whole bunch of our SCBA mass. They're 550 bucks a piece times. Well, then is this a wise decision to cut this 23? It's not cut. It's just not increased.

Yeah, it's not increased. Okay. And again, just looking back over the average, it's just that eb and flow one. So, it's just one we talked about that maybe that one's okay to leave where it's at and just see how it goes. And but it's also one of those that at the end of the day, if he has to have if he has to do it, you're going to end up doing it. So, so like this year, I I cut off some uniform expenses because I way over spent the PPE line item, which then means next year I'll spend. So, can you can you use uh the money that you get when you're sending people out to different places? Can you use that money to help on this? We could. That's not how we've done in the past. No, it just says I thought it was just for equipment. Had to be used for that's how we have used it. Well, that's how the business plan that's laid out. It's not

But but it is available if we if you guys decided to do it that way. Yes, we can spend that wherever we want. We just have typically tied it to the larger. Okay. Yeah, we put it towards those capital vehicles, right? One other question. the the the increase to the legal claims that was not given. I'm assuming is that just like Irma repayments? Um we should have some skin in the game for the stupid stuff we do. Okay. So that was So it's not that there is something that was just a starting to put money away for

No, that's the most eloquent uh Irma analysis I think I've ever heard. And it is to pass it to the departments. If you keep wrecking stuff, it's going to take a bite out of your budget to pay it back. Well, so that's why I'm surprised that it wasn't recommended to make it into the budget. Like, is that Well, that's because we're wanting them to have to fill the paint a little bit and figure out how to cover IT A DIFFERENT WAY BECAUSE THEY'RE THE ONES. OKAY, I get what you're doing now. You should need some skin in the game for the stupid stuff. Now, I got it. Quoted on that, huh? Now I get what we're doing. Okay. Any other questions on operational? No. Go there. Anything on capital? Capital?

No. It sounds like you're the things that you didn't get was because we still have the money left over this year. So, you're going to fund it already anyways, right? Fun operation. We're working on that. So, is there an option if we can go out and find a private person to build the firehouse and lease it back? Is that something we could look at? Sure. There's lots of ways we can be creative to figure it out. All right, Chief. They can build it a lot less expensively privately. Yeah. All right, Chief. You got open doors. Go get it. Get Find Oh, jeez. Yeah, he just makes it so easy. Go, go get it. And then personnel,

thank you for that executive assistant. That's going to be a a great asset. And and I guarantee I told the mayor, I says, "My concern is is that we hire this individual. I'm going have to meter the work we give that person so we don't run them off like 85." Yeah. Like they did with building it. Yeah, I guess. Will they? No, I'm worried you're not going to delegate them enough work. Will this person be out front then at that area? probably put them in the office between me and Chief Shirts. Oh, probably the best place to put that individual assistant. So, okay. Take a lot of those things off of my plate. Yeah, be good. Good. Thank you. Good for you. Thank you. Well, you did, Chief. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks, Chief. Okay,

Randall, you have five minutes. Just kidding. What do you mean? Oh, I was trying to get out. Oh, you got me a VO pie when I So, I got to get out of here. Would you get a what? Want to get a ve? Just got so much to it. So, yeah, mine has so much to it. It's pretty simple. Actually, any questions for Randall? Actually, there was I thought I was going to have I got one. Go for it. And I know we probably have to do that on on close session, but have we made headway on some of the things we talked about earlier? Is that budget related? Huh? Is it budget related? It's or is that just Oh, I don't know. It's uh it's it's on the the stuff we use we talked about in close session or we

I don't know if that'd be part of the budget money or not. Is that what is the for me? What is the $6,000 requested in overtime? Overtime. So that is for Carrie um at least for this first year as we continue to get our new assistant attorney ramped up to speed. Um, she's still doing a little extra work to make sure we don't fall further behind after after hours, you mean? Or Yeah, she's just It's up to her. I leave it to her. She sometimes takes a half an hour lunch, comes in a half an hour early, whatever works with her schedule. Okay.

Um, just to allow us to get that little extra work done. Um, we've actually had her doing probably close to double what I'm asking for over the last few months. Um, but we assume that number should be able to go down fairly easily once we hit July. Um, and then by next year, I'll let you know. What's the $5 increase in social security? Just kidding. Um I'm getting older. Computer and tech services downtown. Is that was that kind of related to the conversation we had before that? That was the parking stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Oh,

so if you guys remember, Councilman Meling had it put in the budget a couple years ago that he had an idea to get some sort of software and have SU students do uh parking enforcement with this software and it never really got implemented. So, we're just taking it back out of the budget. I was happy to spend it on cool tech toys, but they wouldn't let me. Okay. So, that's the professional and tech and the computer and tech. That is the reduction in the budget. Uh, professional tech was the public defender contract got decreased. We didn't have to pay as much. Yeah. Correct. Yeah. He did it for less. You're welcome. That's good. Which is good. Now that he's heard this meeting though, we'll see what happens next year.

Yeah. That's that's the problem is now I'm going to get credit this year and then next year I didn't think I'm not going to go cheaper. Yeah. So, you get credit for one year. Oh, well, we'll take it. That's it. Memories are short. Memories are very short. Okay. Okay. Anything else for Randall? This was easy. This is the easiest of all. Thank you, my good man. It's gota be nice. I like this kind of Okay. Well, there's one coming up that's maybe related to you. I have no idea. Under this area, the admin and finance. Okay. Let's start. Let's go there.

Sure. So um on the finance um operating the the line items except for the professional and technical are all just um evening up the experience that we're having being split away from administration. Um this is our first year being separate from them. What do you mean? Yeah. Up until last year's budget, finance was the financial u department. Their budget ran through admin.

Oh, that it goes back to Jayce Bunting used to be your finance director and his uh the quote attributed to him, I don't know if it's accurate or not, was I'm doing the budget for the whole damn city. I'm not going to do one for my individual department. You do it. So, that's how finance was under admin for a long, long time. I see. Just got along, right? Wow. I didn't know I could talk like that. Is that pretty close? That's pretty close. I'll bet you can talk like that. You're just too much of a lady.

Thank you. Um, so on the professional and technical, um, what I wanted to bring before council is a user fee study, the possibility of doing that. And what that is is um uh hiring a contractor that would come in and look at all of our fees except for impact fees and the rates of the utilities. Those are those are different. Um so it would be you know um the aquatic center um administration all of all of the

house hollows heritage theater all of those cemetery. Um the reason I want to do that is because um from what I understand it's never been done here before but we have also not been challenged on providing data for our fees. So challenged by who? Terry anyone. By just by just by anyone um because legally you're supposed to be able to just cover cost. you can't charge above above that. Um if you do, it's it's um considered a tax, not a not a fee,

and you have to go through taxation and all of that other stuff. So, um I just wanted to bring this and to be clear, I'm fairly confident all of those fees are not covering costs. So, that's why we're not getting challenged, but we should look at it as how would we get closer to actually covering costs. Yeah. on some of them close but not quite.

So, so what the contractor will do will come in and tell you, okay, this is exactly how much it costs to provide this service. And then the council gets to decide whether they're going to charge that cost at full full uh amount or if they want to um supplement with with the fund balance um like your social programs. I mean, do you want to charge, you know, $20 a pop for a head to go to the aquatic center or are you going to are you willing to to take less than that? Yep. I think that's great.

So, um, so it's in my budget and it's also in u the airport's budget and the enterprise budgets and they're Oh, it's also in all the enterprises. Yes. So, the total cost would be uh around 50,000 is what I estimated. Mhm. And so the general fund is only handling 20 20,000. I will review the enterprise fund fees as well. I thought they were already being reviewed. Um there's other fees like um so you're talking about connection fees. Connection fees

as opposed to go look pull open the website and pull open the fee schedule. It's virtually everything on the fee schedule except for your user rates for sewer, water, garbage, storm drain and your impact fees. It's everything else on there, excuse me. Which ones are we doing now? We have an impact fee study outstanding and a user rate study outstanding. Water fees and sewer fees. User rates are water, sewer, storm drain, uh, garbage. So this that's the one that's outstanding. Yeah. So this would this this is the new one that we this would do everything else. That's great. That's good done. So you're picking up 20 out of the 50.

Yes. Is that right? And everything else is spread through airport. What else? Through the airport and the enterprise fund. So water, sewer, you'll see them all like kick in five grand. Yeah, they're they're all kicking in five 5,000. Okay. Okay. And when are you kicking this off? Um as soon as you give me permission. Soon as we almost have a in my opinion, as soon as we have the preliminary one approved, I'd say go get the thing started. Like, let's not wait. Sounds good. Just get the RFP out. Yep. Okay. That's it. Administ admin's budget decreased. So, are we getting rid of the newsletter? No.

Why is it going down 19,000 bucks? Because Terry's been paying it out of finance all year to do the newsletter. Yep. Oh, the the the arm of our operation. Oh, because it comes with the bill. It comes with your water bill. So, it's considered coming through there. They pay for all the mail for that for the They don't produce it. I mean, it doesn't it come out of the economic development office? Yeah. But you're But it's paid for with the cost to mail out water bills. How many how many water bills are we paying anymore? Because I get mine online. Are we still mailing a lot? I don't know how many we're mailing. Huh? What's executive discretion?

That's a fund that's typically used by the mayor or myself and and I have a note on that. Things I have a note on that. It needs to be increased to do things that come up throughout the year. Merrick Green used it for four years to fund a holiday contri or he would give everybody in the city 50 bucks part-time full-time everybody. Mayor Wilson used it for different. So it's going from what to what I'm only looking at the increase. 3,000 increase from what? 30 to 33. From 30 to 33. Oh. Um and there could be like little random things like there have been a couple already that like gifts to South Korea.

Yeah. gifts. Um sometimes negotiating something hard and having a little place to be able to say, "Hey, we'll add an extra water connection on this road so that we just get rid of the fight, right?" Like there can be places where there there's just some it's nice to have a little ability to resolve issues. No, you got to have some wiggle room. Yeah, you do. U this uh half a million increase on legal claims. That was my question. That's for your Which one are you looking at? That's the ar That's the ar that money going to the armbest. Oh, it's under legal. Yeah,

it's in it's in admin's budget under legal claims. But that's where the money is goest Wednesday, right? Yeah, but the payment's going to be scheduled. So, it comes under the new budget. Payment should be all finalized Wednesday. Sure. What where does that fall under I don't see that in the summary. Maybe we just added it. It came in late. Yeah, it came in because news from the arm Bruce that they accepted late. That's a good deal. So, the housing authority grants, those were just passed through and approved by elected bodies. So, they come up as they do and we amend the budget.

Yeah. So, Heidi's operation needs a governmental entity to receive the money from the state and then pass it to her entity pass through. We've acted in that capacity for a long time. We don't know when they come. She just rings and we amend the budget. Yeah. If she gets one, she'll bring it to us and that'll be one of those quarterly amendments. That's it. Mayor, I would move that we adjourn this. Uh oh. Oh, is there more? We have an objection prior to a second. So, Councilman Glan,

just uh just a question. Um, this is this is just me and you guys can laugh me off the bench and I'll go home. But, uh, you know, we're getting into some pretty big negotiations on an ongoing basis now with uh different people coming in looking at our what we do. Um, I've been a little embarrassed when we've hosted some of these people in our office where we can't even offer them a bottle of water. I would like to have some discretionary money that uh the mayor controls to entertain quote unquote uh some of the people that we do business with. I was uh with project Lucy for instance um uh which is turning out to be American antimony thing that we're going to be participating in. I guess the governor is coming and

right anyway um one of their consultants just kind of asked for a break and got up and said I I got to go find some caffeine somewhere you know and he went off to buy I don't know what he bought a couple of Dr. Peppers is as close as he got but it it just it just strikes me that we ought to be a little bit more more of a host Historically, we have people like that coming in. Historically, that's been taken care of through economic development.

Well, historically, since I've been here, which hasn't been more than five and a half months, nobody has taken over. So, I'll make sure that I bring it up and that we be a little bit more I agree with you, Councilman. That's important. Yeah. So, I think Well, going to his point, I think it also depends on what it is. I mean, if it's, you know, if it's a dignitary coming from another from South Korea, for example, or we're hosting something, why would economic development do that? That would be admin or the mayor's office that would do that. So, I think to say that I mean, in that case, yes, economic might have been the right one, but there's other situations where economic would probably have nothing to do with it.

I looked at the economic development budget. I didn't see anything in there that says we're going to, you know, buy these guys. Uh you not that I would but I will a cup of coffee you know so that they can feel comfortable in our in our Yeah. You want them to feel comfortable in our environment. Yeah. And um you want to feel actually you want to be a little more comfortable. You want to make them feel special. Yeah. These people are I mean in some cases they're already putting their money where their mouths have been and we haven't been very welcoming. So anyway, just my thought on that. Okay, great. Now you can make a

and I don't think it has to be a lot of money. It could come. No, it's usually I mean yeah, you buy a couple of donuts and Yeah, couple thousand dollars would probably do it. So maybe it goes and in general kind of likeotions. What's that? Sorry, I No, I would just said maybe it goes under admin or maybe it goes under community promotions or something. Yeah, something. And I'll I'll try to send I didn't send it out because the whole shared dock thing um that that constitutes a meeting, but I've got a list of things that aren't in the budget that I think we ought to consider in the final discussion. And so keep those kinds of things too, but I'm waiting to hear the rest.

Yeah. To hear the rest of it and then those let's compare lists and and decide from there. So now I'll entertain that motion to adjurnn. Second. Carter made the motion. I motion to adjurnn this budget. Robert a second. All in favor? I I Can I just say I appreciate your effort so far. It's got a great great staff. You know, it's going okay so far. Get the good. Take the good with the bad. There you go. That's where the pizza was coming. Next thing.