Planning Board - Regular Meeting

Please stand for the pledge.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Good morning. Welcome to the August 13, 2006 Planning Board agenda. Before we start tonight's meeting, I just want to make the audience and everyone hear about some fraud that's been happening, not just in this town, not just in this county, but there's emails being sent, and in the case of this one, I'll read a little snippet of it, from the Planning Board town of Carmel. It has an address. That's where you can see it's really not proper, right? But it'll say, you're currently under consideration for the extension of site plan approval before the planning board. Please be advised that an invoice has been issued and attached in this correspondence. Then it goes on and talks about, in order to maintain continuity in the review process for application management, technical review and approval, site inspections and field verification public hearings and so on it really looks pretty legit um it's signed very faithful yours craig paper chairman town of carmel that's a stamp that says carmel town board of new york uh it seems to be talking talking applicants right and this is a an advocate that comes before us periodically fortunately he was a student of to catch it So I know there's only half a dozen or so people in the audience tonight, but I want to make everyone else that's watching tonight. I'm still talking, Joe. I'm still talking. Thank you. I want to make everyone else aware of this. And Joe, do you have anything to add to this?

No, just that it's not something that Carmel is seeing alone. This is happening all over the state. In addition, if you read these letters carefully, any applicant who's got anything pending before the board right now may get something like this. But if you look at the email very carefully, it's not a Town of Carmel email address.

so just be careful with correspondence that you get from the town verifier and don't ever wire money uh with respect to any application to joe's point the return address that this was sent from was planning department abbreviated town of carmel carmel new york dot gov at usa.com it's not at all our address but if you're going through email quickly like some of us do at times you could uh you could fall for this So any doubt, call Rose's office if there's anything due, any application fees due before you write. And this is asking for a wire transfer, so absolutely don't do that. Joe, we can hear you at the microphone. When you're up, you can mention that.

I will. Thank you.

All right, first on the agenda for a public hearing is bonus to use restaurant, 18-clock place. Are you here tonight? Yes. And I believe we had some comments. I have no comment. No. And Rich?

It's time for a public hearing. Whatever minor comments can be addressed in the future.

And Pat the same, right? They received their variances for this, so they're good to go.

Anyone from the public wish to be heard on this applicant? Please step up to your microphone and state your name.

an address please uh yeah it's christian gallardo um at three rich lane may pack i just purchased the property next door at 16 clark place um so i just saw the letter that there was a hearing today but i don't know what's going on i literally just bought the house on friday so i just wanted to see what it is that they want to do next door since it's going to be the restaurant's right next door on the quarter

I'll let the applicant describe it. It's pretty much replacing the restaurant that was there, but you can get into more details and speak clearer on it. Please just give us an overview of what's planned for the restaurant.

Right. I think there was an Italian restaurant before.

You've got to speak loud into the mic.

There's people on TV listening. And address the board. Look at the board to answer it.

Right. The same restaurant, but the different ownership. We just take over the restaurant and then make a new restaurant with the renovation with some extension to the front yard. Pretty much like existing kitchen and all the facilities stay as it is, but some sitting area rearrangement. In front of the restaurant, there's a huge brick oven that we wanna remove, and then we're gonna replace by some sitting area with some siding extension. So I think that's all. Like we just same restaurant with some rearrange of a seating area. The same almost same occupant number of occupant and some sort of change of the parking area but most likely remain as is.

So please, go ahead, ask the one. So the parking in the front that faces Clark, that's gonna stay as is, do not convert it as a seating area, right?

Right, you're talking about the senior avenue, hold on.

Not when you're going up the hill, like the main road part? Right, right, right. So right now where the parking spaces are, kind of by where the ice cream place section was, so that's gonna stay the same? Yes. So you're not gonna put chairs or anything over there on that side? No.

So nothing outside chairs, but we just enclosed, you see the black canopy area? We're gonna enclose that one. So that's only change.

So his variance that he's asking for is for what exactly? Because if he's here, it's to change something on the outside? He's here to review the project for this. So as far as just changing the store from one store to another store?

where he did make some changes in the footprint, right?

He said he's going to close one of the exterior areas.

But on the uphill side.

Oh, and then what about as far as parking? I think you said there's additional parking?

No. The parking will remain as is. But there's only change on the, you see the garbage can area on the right side corner? There's a by handicap law, like ADA code, we apply because it's different level. So at that level, we're going to provide another parking space. That's only change.

Okay, and then as far as I get to look around the restaurant, but as far as your garbage situation, is it on the other side of the road going up somewhere?

If you want something, maybe.

I just don't want to see, especially because I'm planning to take over this property and then most likely probably rent it. I'm not sure yet, but as far as being clean and everything, it's going to remain clean.

Yeah, we're going to make it clean. We're going to cover with some nice fence, maybe green fence, or maybe you can relocate maybe in the back area if you want. Maybe we can discuss that with the owner. I can talk to them.

From previous meetings, the owner of the restaurant is a restaurateur, or at least that's what he said.

i don't remember anything i mean no loud music late at night i'm trying to think of things to help you with the resident yeah right no there's no no no noise or anything okay all right and then i'm assuming um normal business hours like right maybe maybe yeah 10 until 10 will be enough i think for them yeah should be fine yeah because i just purchased the property so i can put my mother-in-law over there so i just want to make sure that she doesn't complain to me then i got to go next door to complain All right. Thank you. Thanks.

Anyone else wish to be heard on this applicant? Do we have a motion to close the public hearing?

Mr. Chairman, is there no further public comment? I'll make a motion to close the public hearing.

I second.

All in favor? Aye. Pat, will you prepare a resolution, please? Yes, sir. Thank you.

Thank you, sir.

Next on the agenda for site plan is SNS Holdings LLC to Dyckman Road. Ed?

The applicant proposes to add an addition to the existing gas station on Dyckman Road and Route 52 in Carmel. Property is in the TC zoning district. Auto service stations are permitted. However, there are 13 conditions that must be met. The floor plans do not include enough information to determine conformity. Elevations do not include any details. Complete the submission showing compliance with 156-36.1 A through M on the site plan. A variance is needed for lot coverage, 50% allowed, 54.3% proposed, 4.3% variance is needed. The variance is not needed for lot area, 20,000 square feet required per section 156.36.1, 20,005 square feet provided. Applicant must put the code requirements of section 156-36.1 on the plat. A variance is required for lot width, 150 feet required, 137 foot 8 inches provided. 12 foot four inch variance is needed. How did you compute the parking? Provide the calculation on the plot. Provide details of the building sign and canopy sign on the plot, third request. provide details of the dumpster enclosure. Third request. The architect has not made any changes to the plot. Information has been added to the narrative, but not to the site plan until all information is submitted. I do not recommend referral to ZBA.

Thank you. Rich. So applicant has noted the comment, uh, to referral to the fire department. the area of disturbance is less than 5,000 they have provided the erosion sediment control details if they're much hemming and hawing the applicant has agreed that the performance bond associated engineering fee for stormwater management practices and landscaping will be required and so he has noted that comment

Thank you. And Pat. So Joel did submit documentation about those 13 criteria. One of those points out that another variance is required for the setback to the gas pumps. So that's yet another variance that gets added to its list. And as you remember, we had some issues with this originally, the back driveway and so forth. So most of the major issues have been addressed with respect to the site planning issues. And it's left to Ed's issues now to resolve. Thanks, Pat.

Joel? Sure. A couple of things that were mentioned are on the drawing here, and they were submitted quite some time ago. All of the signs are shown with the square footages are shown on the drawing. And as Pat said, even though this is preexisting, the pumps, they do not meet the new criteria of this particular zone. So we're adding that variance, too. So there's a total basing of six variances that are required. So we really can't proceed with much longer, so we'd appreciate if we could go to the zoning board and find out if we have a project. Because again, six variances, this is a new ordinance, and we'd like to discuss this with the zoning board and see what they think. Also, as Pat said, we've answered all the questions with regard to the criteria for this particular zone. I think that's been done. We also show all the signage. We show the detail. Ed made a comment about the detail for the for the dumpster, there was a detail here, right here on the drawing that shows the section and it shows all the detail that is required to be put up. And basically, based on my comments, on my discussions with Rich, we took the, and as Pat said, we no longer have that driveway off Dyckman Road, but as Rich said, we have to have a CONSTRUCTION ENTRANCE SO THAT WE'RE GOING TO USE THE EXISTING CONSTRUCTION ENTRANCE. WE'VE EXTENDED THE SILF FENCE ALL AROUND THAT AREA, WHICH WORKS OUT PERFECT BECAUSE THE ADDITION FACES DIAKMAN ROAD, SO THEY BASICALLY CAN COME INTO THIS CONSTRUCTION ENTRANCE OVER HERE, DO ALL THE WORK, AND NOT REALLY INTERFERE WITH THE FUNCTIONING OF THE GAS STATION OR THE CONVENIENCE STORE. SO I THINK WE'VE DONE MOST OF THAT STUFF. I think even at the last meeting, Pat had recommended that we get to the zoning board, and I would appreciate it if we could do that. Otherwise, we're at a standstill.

Ed, I'm concerned about three requests.

I'm sorry.

What's open now? You mentioned signs. You mentioned the enclosure. Did you get the submission from Joel with the enclosure and the signs?

This is all we have right here. And the signs are still missing?

The actual sizes of the signs?

I'm sorry, they are right up here. There's pictures and square footage, it's right there.

Is there actual sizes of the signs?

Yes. The square footage of each sign is shown right here on the drawing.

Any questions from the board here?

No, it's not on there, Joel. I'm sorry. Well, this is the drawing I submitted.

I don't want to argue with you, but you have the wrong drawing because I gave all the copies to Rose weeks ago.

So I tell you what, Rose is on vacation. Right. Very much earned. So what I propose... is we do things in parallel. We need a motion to send this to the zoning board. However, if Ed's comments aren't responded to, it won't go any further.

Fair enough.

Does that meet your requirements?

I don't want to slow things down. Yeah, absolutely. We should meet together in the office. Absolutely. And we'll walk through everything with whatever comments we got here. Board, you guys okay with this?

Do we have a motion to...

I'll make a motion to deny to the ZBA and as Greg described, require resolution of the outstanding comments.

Second.

I just want to make a comment on what you talked about before because I've gotten letters from almost every applicant that I've come before. I contacted the police chief and they did some investigation and believe it or not, there's nothing they can do because all this is from overseas. It's not in the United States. are police forces aware and obviously joe and legal counsel it's a shame that it's happening just interesting one person did fall for it thank god rose got in involved and stopped the check but she did send the check great thank you joel you're welcome joel are you going to present that to be stamped yes

But does that have everything, including what Ed requires?

Yes. As I said, I don't know why he didn't get the right drawing, but I submitted this. The drawing that you see here has the pictures and the square footage of every sign.

All right.

What's the date of your drawing?

Because if it's incomplete, it's going to be problematic. That's all I'm saying. Rich has a good point. What's the date of that drawing?

7-27-2026.

He has the exact same drawing you do. He's saying that that information isn't on there.

Well, here it is. Right there. You're looking in the same spot.

All I can tell you is this drawing was delivered to Rose.

I personally delivered it.

What?

To which he said he doesn't have it. No, not me.

The drawing that Ed and Mike made comments on for that memo are based on the drawing that you're submitting to get denied to the zoning board. I think the right step would be you're gonna meet with Ed, update the drawing accordingly, and after that fact, then the chairman can come in and stamp that drawing for you as long as the board is okay with that and as long as that's okay with Joe.

Isn't this? Isn't this?

Come on. Let's go to the zoning board. There's so many variances that we need.

They're not prohibiting you from going to the zoning board. They're just making sure that the plans that are going to the zoning board are accurate.

Joe, is there any problem with not stamping anything tonight? Joel honors us out with Ed, and I will come in during the week when they're ready. Fair enough. Thank you very much. Ed, when you're satisfied, call me, and I will come in within a day and sign this. We'll plan tentatively to be on the zoning board, but if this is not resolved, we won't go any further. Thank you. Joe, you okay with that? Absolutely. Okay. Thank you. Thanks, Joel. Thanks, Ed. We want our files for this application and future applications to be, you know, the I's dot and the T's crossed. Absolutely. We need a complete file. Next on the agenda is Putnam County Housing 11-17 Seminole Road Residential Site Plan. Ed.

The applicant proposes to convert the existing Putnam County Housing Corporation offices into three additional accessible dwelling units and relocate the rear access to the building of the housing corporation. The property is in the HMC zoning district. Dwellings in the HMC zone 156-36.13 are permitted. Principal use is allowed by special use permit conditions 156-36.13 A through M must be adhered to. Provide floor plans for the second floor for clarification, second request. Provide lighting plan for existing lighting. Variants are required for the following. Parking width, 10 foot required, 9.5 foot provided, a .5 foot variance is needed. Side yard, 10 foot required, 3.5 foot provided, 6.5 foot variance. Parking space length, 20 foot required, 19 foot provided, one foot variance. Parking spaces, 11 spaces required, nine spaces provided, variance of two spaces. Driving aisle, 24 foot required, 22.5 foot provided, 1.5 foot variance needed. Lot coverage, 65% required, 98% provided, variance of 33%. Recreation area. 2,100 square feet required, zero square foot provided, 2,100 square foot variance is needed.

Rich? No comments on this, as there's no site work being done. The applicant did provide a water and wastewater report.

Thank you. Pat? So there are no planning issues with respect to this. There's no site modifications. All of it's interior, and all of it's subject to those multiple variances that are required.

Board.

Ed, does this require any handicap spots?

However, I might add that we do have a handicapped spot. And all the variances that Ed mentioned have been approved by the zoning board. If you look at the map, it specifically says that and gives the date of visit. Every variance that he called for has been approved.

Pat, the zoning board approved all these variances?

So we'd like to schedule a public hearing.

Can I make a comment? Yeah, please do. I just have a question about the on street parking. Is that what would happen in a snow emerging those two spots on the road? Where would they park?

Well, it's interesting you say that because when we went to the zoning board, they indicated that just what you said, the code does say you're allowed to have parking in your frontage on the main street. So we showed that, but the zoning board, just because of that reason, gave us an extra two car variance so that all of our parking with the variance is on our property.

right and then um with snow removal uh what is the plan there um because the way that is laid out you're going to go push in and you're going to push all your snow to that corner where that one handicapped spot is is there a plan to remove the snow especially after the winter we had that's you would have to remove this snow off the site

Yes, the answer is yes. We've owned the building now for about 42 years, and there are four apartments upstairs, and basically, and we had an office with about 13 people working there, and we've never had a problem with snow removal, and parking in the rear has always been available. but again we have a large staff of both so and we have our own plow so we can plow it out and we have people that can actually shovel like you say when it gets stuck in this in this corner over here we have the access okay thank you so when is individual seven

apartments, how does the snow removal happen then? I understand when you had your business there. No, no.

We own the building. The housing corporation owns the building, and we maintain it.

You'll be responsible to maintain it? 100%.

So, Joe, all the parking will be behind the building or on the side, nothing on the street?

No. If you look over here, this is the entrance from Seminary Hill Road. This is the entrance here. The parking is over here. As I said, the code allows you to park cars in the front, but the zoning board, as this gentleman said, you never know if the town or the county is going to plow it. So they gave us the variance so that we were covered that way. But again, the buildings that we own, we maintain them. We have a staff, we have trucks, we have plows, and they are maintained. And again, the other buildings are mostly seniors, so those are taken care of immaculately.

Thank you. I have another question. Is that area two-hour parking? Because I know part of that road is two-hour parking. So is there a special variance for the 24-hour parking there?

Say again?

I know parts of that road there have two-hour parking only. Was there a special variance given for those two spots for 24-hour parking?

No, as I mentioned, because, just because of that reason, not knowing, number one, if they would remove that two-hour parking, and number two, would it be plowed? We know, we have a staff that, we know that our area would be totally plowed, so that the answer is that, the zoning board said, let's forget about those two spots on the street, because it's, like you said, it's unknown whether it's gonna be maintained all winter.

More of my question is, are they allowed to park there 24 hours in those two spots?

Well, let's put it this way. There's a multifamily building right across the street from us, and their cars are parked there 24-7. And so far, they haven't been ticketed.

What Byron mentioned is it's labeled two-hour parking.

at those spaces yes are they how are you going to comply with the two hour but the variance you know we got the very so we don't need those we don't need those spaces anymore he's gotten new variants that assumes no parking on the street so he does they are not going to use those

well that's what he's trying to that's what i'm trying to explain okay okay that's what i wanted to say that if he had special signs that they're allowed to park there for you know 24 hours it it's as if there is no requirement that he have on street parking

okay that's what the variance that's the variance that he received no the zoning board was concerned just as you were but we can't predict number one if the roads will be plowed properly and as i said the apartment building across the street from us they haven't they have no site so they have no parking so all their residents park on the streets and how they get there at 24 hours i have no idea okay thank you you're welcome so

And for the record, that's an entrance into the town of Cornwall, obviously. Very nice building right across from the reservoir. I don't want to allow... barbecue and chairs. It's a real nice place to sit outside of the building looking out towards the reservoir. There's going to be seven families there, I assume. We certainly don't want five barbecues out there. Close to the road and people in lounge chairs. I'm exaggerating a little bit, but I think the record should stay It's just not safe for people to sit there. I understand why people would want to Hang out there cook. They're getting some sunshine and look at the beautiful lake first of all, but I think their applications should state That that's not allowed

Just to add to that, Chairman, that's part of our regulations. Anyone who rents an apartment there is not allowed to barbecue or do anything like that, so that's part of the regulations.

We're very much in sync. I mean, it would be a beautiful place to sit. No, no, I agree with you. But it's just not safe, and I just don't want to see that image driving into town.

And Mr. Chairman, it's it's not a residential zone. It's a mixed use zone. So the theory is there will be commercial space down below. So turning it into the perception of a residential zone is not what the zoning calls for. So prohibiting that stuff in the front yard is is the right way to do it. Correct.

And we have no problem. As I said, our leases state that they can't do it. But why don't we make that part of the resolution? So there's no question about.

Oh, I think Pat or someone mentioned the last meeting. What if someone builds up, buys a building ten years from now? And so

it should be part of the record that's all no i'm sorry i think at the last meeting we discussed that and we have no problem uh putting something in the resolution that if for some reason we sell it it still has to be maintained as a handicap accessible any other comments from the board if not we uh we need to motion schedule public here i'll make a motion to schedule a public hearing i second all in favor all right thank you thank you and we can have a resolution at the next meeting i'd appreciate it

We'll see how the public hearing goes, yeah. Okay, thank you. Next on the agenda is 161 East Lake Boulevard and 728 Route 6. Good evening, Jill.

applicant purchased a piece of land from the town of carmel he now wishes to merge this with 76.22-1-60 by proposing a lot lot line adjustment to transfer 147.16 square feet from 76.22-154 to 76.22-1 and merge 76.22-1-55 to make one large lot. Minimal change to 76.22-1-59. The required lot area for the HMZ zone is only 10,000 square feet. No variance required for the lot area for either of the lots have no objection to the lot line adjustment. It is important that the lot line adjustment gets fully approved before the site plan is approved. Uh, site plan comments. The project is 100 feet from Lake may pack and is it is noted on the plan provide lot depth and lot with lines on the plan. The lot depth lines exist and re-enters the property. A variance is required. The PE asks for clarification. The lot depth line clearly exits and re-enters the lot. Provide copies of any easements between the two properties for review by council. They now submitted three iterations of the design for your review. Um, variances are acquired for the project, regardless of the number of units.

Thanks to that rich. So the applicant has noted the permits, uh, and the, um, referrals, the need for connection and, you know, Putnam County health department, water connection into the main PAC sewer plant with DEP, um, stormwater pollution prevention plan was provided. Um, so in essence, they've noted that they would be a need for, public improvements and performance fund engineering fee, light spill plan will be provided in the future. I mean, this is all being driven by what is going to be selected as the final and then maybe additional site plan comments will be provided after the lot line has been approved and we pick whatever one is picked, right? But for the most part, they've identified the need for the things that we have identified, site plan issues that we've talked about.

Thanks, Rich and Pat. So the alternatives that they've submitted to alternatives, really, there's one there, an eight unit alternative and a nine unit alternative. The primary modification is based on your board's concerns, which is they push the building back. So now it's set back 20 feet from that front property line. They provided documentation about the adjacent properties, all of which are set back about 20 feet. So the board's instinct about the setback was appropriate. The applicants made that change. um the configuration within the building is either eight or nine units the distinction is the number of bedrooms in the units so the eight bed the eight unit has more bigger twos and the nine has more ones so that's the the alternative but in both instances the footprint of the building remains the same it's all internal modifications so i think the applicant's been responsive to that primary concern by shifting the building back And that's where we are. So ordinarily it's not your position to choose alternatives. We should see if the applicant has a preference and then you should make a determination.

Joe, thanks for the work you did on this. I know we had a few phone calls over this, and I think they were helpful. Thanks for responding, as Pat mentioned so well. Let me open up this board, and I'll ask you for the updates. Questions for the applicant?

I have a few clarifying questions. And again, I also appreciate the effort in giving the alternatives. So when I looked at the documentation, I'll call them an 8, a 9, and there was also a 10, which was, I guess, the original Yes?

I'm sorry, but I can't hear you well. Okay. Is this better?

Yes. Okay. There's an 8, a 9, and there's also a 10 diagram. The 10 is the footprint of the 8, the 9, and the 10 all identical?

Yes, so the overall footprint of the building is the same. The variation is as we reduce the number of units, more three bedroom units are, it's available for more three bedroom units versus the two bedroom units. So as we get to, The nine unit building, we have four three bedroom units and five two bedroom units. As we get to the eight unit building, it's six three bedroom units and two two bedrooms.

And do the garage spaces vary?

The garage spaces will be the same size.

So when I looked at the 8 and the 9 diagram, you very clearly marked the distance from the road, 21 or 20 something feet. When I looked at the 10 diagram, there is no marking. Is it supposed to be the same?

Yeah, it's supposed to be the same. Okay. It's the exact, the positioning of everything on all three site plans is identical.

Okay.

Okay. And maybe give a once over to the rest of that diagram on number 10 to see that it's picked up all the other distances that are on the other two.

You mean this diagram?

That's the bird's eye view, no.

I'm sorry, sir.

so when you look at the diagram the the that page but for the 10 unit it's missing the distance from the road and there may be some other distances that need to be brought in from the other diagram as well okay just just do a once over of course yeah yeah on the board members all right I have so just to be clear that this is in line of sight as the other buildings on the road correct

It meets the setback, correct.

Well, I'm saying does it line up with the building below that?

Correct, so it lines up with the building at 149 East Lake.

Joe, show that other. Sure.

Okay, so in this diagram here is our site. Here is 149, is this one. This one is 141. This one is set back a little bit further. And this is 156, which is, I'm not sure what that distance is, but it looks like it's approximately the same thing. Yeah.

So, Byron, specifically, I knew this was a problem for us last time, was how close the road and parking is contained. Joe, correct me if I'm wrong, parking is contained on your site.

Correct. We have all the parking. Yes, correct.

I did meet Michael at the location. We stood at the front entrance, and I stood parallel to the building, if you're looking at it, to the right. and we agree that you can't go any further out than that it would have been a line it would have been it could have been dangerous from the line of sight you know pulling a driveway right um issues that i think we've resolved is the parking's contained it's the same footprint And it's, Joe, 20 feet off the road, correct? Correct. Whereas I think the last meeting, we were really close to the road. We were 10 feet.

Originally, we were asking for a 10-foot variance.

But not anymore?

Not anymore. Okay. The fixed location now in the building is at least at the 20-foot setback line.

20 feet, 4 inches. 20 feet, 4 inches. Nick, did you have a question?

Yeah, have we been provided updated architecturals or renderings? I know we had some concerns about, like, that blank wall along East Lake.

Yeah, we did that at the last meeting. We presented a new version of that.

Embellishments on the facing side of the building.

Joe, Michael, without getting too specific, is there an economic... variable between 8, 9, 10 units. We know from our discussions earlier, the sixth unit wasn't economically feasible, right? So we put that aside. Now that you've done this work, is there one that works lack of better words, better for you.

Well, you know, Michael would like 10 units. That really makes the project a worthwhile project. As we get less in the number of units, you have a diminishing rate of return. The construction costs are relative. And even though he's getting more three-bedroom units, the amount of it rent that he's getting in return doesn't make up for that additional cost. So clearly his preference of course would be 10 units. I think eight units he feels is really very tight from him from a financial point of view and whether or not it makes it a real feasible project.

Are these going to be market rate? What are you planning for these units?

These are all going to be market rate rental units.

What's the square footage of the three bedroom or the two bedroom?

I don't know that offhand. Yeah.

So. If the 8, 9, and 10, I do believe, I think Bob mentioned, I do believe you need to update your drawing on the 10 units. Show us, document to us that you're going to be 20 feet off the road. Yeah, easy enough. That the parking's going to be contained.

Just to give my own view of this, When we asked for the building to be moved further in off the road, at least the way I was thinking of it was that reducing the footprint would be a necessary consequence of that. and that therefore a lower number of units would be needed. But what you've shown us are three diagrams with the same footprint all off the road appropriately. The parking is contained, so for me personally, I don't have a problem with the 10 unit size.

I think it goes back to what Pat says. I don't think it's our responsibility to pick eight, nine, or 10 units. I think you come back and propose the 10 units with everything you said, document it, and we'll kick the tires on it again. Does that sound reasonable? Okay. You okay with that? Yeah, absolutely. And if we don't, when we see the 10, the submission, if we have a problem with it, then we'll look at the nine. until we're satisfied with your drawing. But we need for our records, and I mentioned before, the previous applicant crossed out T's and dot and I's. We need to see the dot. It needs to be on the file. You did a good job of the eight drawing and the nine drawing, but you never updated the 10 to be 20 feet off the road.

Well, it is, but it's not dimensioned. Yeah, yeah. It's not dimensioned.

Yeah. Okay. We can't vote on that unless it's on the plat.

Okay. But you're not really voting, right? Don't we want to get to the zoning board?

I think we could. Look, I like doing things in parallel because it speeds up the process. And I know it's not an easy process. And we want to be pro-development and get things moving. I'm okay.

I would suggest, Mr. Chairman, you do the same thing you did for the prior application. Submit the plan. Craig can sign the plan.

So we can do things in parallel. As long as you keep your chair, we'll... possibly make a motion to go to the ZBA. However, we need that drawing updated.

That's greatly appreciated. We'll do that right away.

All right. Does that sound reasonable to the board? Yes. I think it's a win-win, honestly.

Yeah, I'm good with that.

Do we have a motion to send to the ZBA?

I'll make a motion to deny to the ZBA.

Second. All in favor? Aye. And I'm not going to stamp that because, like Joe said previously, when you get it ready, I will come into town and sign it.

very good thanks for working on this thanks very much last on the agenda is uh fray subdivision 79 c core road

So extension of file, uh, subdivision that, Oh, I have no comments.

No comments and rich.

So no comments to, uh, or objection to the extension. However, I did ask Jack and so Willie, please pass this along to him. I will to provide me a list of permits that have been approved and granted and their due dates, because it's important that we have that as a record. And Jack was like, huh? So please allow, please let Jack go. Give me the permits, please, so we have it for record. He definitely has Putnam County, and he definitely has some sort of stormwater.

Yes, he said to me that he's still waiting on the health department.

The documentation for the file is there. I'll tell that. We just want to make sure.

Okay. When does this extension due by? I have a problem right now. Approve an extension of something. You don't need the...

No, the extension was fine. We already approved this once before. I just like to keep that record of permits. It shouldn't impact us doing the extension at all. But he needs to provide it so when he goes to Ed and tries to get a building permit, Ed goes, oh my, you don't have a Putnam County DOH permit any longer because it expired. So then Ed won't move on it. So as long as we have a list of that going on, we should be fine.

Willie, you got to make sure we get that.

I'll talk to him.

Pat, comments? Slap him around.

No, the delay was, as Willie said, health department and DEP, not unusual.

This is for a six-month extension? Yes.

Do we have a motion to approve it?

Willie, when's this going to close out? What's going to happen?

I have no idea. This was thrown at me last minute. Jack had a situation he could not get out of. And he said, Willie, can you please go? I said, all right, I'll go. I'm going to look like a fool over there if you ask me many questions. So he came to the office early and briefly explained to me what has to be done. And I said, okay, that seems like a walk in the park, and I hope it is.

I love hearing the truth.

So, you know, Mr. Chairman, I have a different question. Oh, sure, sure. So, and this is another application I think Based on Willie's testimony, and based on Rich looking for permits, we should document this. Six months comes really fast. We should make sure that.

I think he's pretty close to the approvals. These three under the bus tonight coming here. I know. I'm used to it.

Let's document. I usually throw myself under the bus. If Ed doesn't get what he needs, the permits, and what's gonna go on with this property, we won't approve it next time. Okay. That sound reasonable, Ed?

Sounds fair.

Okay. Do we have a motion to extend?

I'll make a motion to extend for six months. Second.

All in favor?

Aye. Thanks, Willie. Just off the subject, I did receive emails, so don't feel lonely in that you getting scammed only the town of Carmel. If you are the town, the city of Beacon, I have an application up there. I received something on that. I received the one in Kent on my own subdivision, my own property. I received something on that. So it is... becoming common. As a matter of fact, my property in Kent and my property over here in Sugarbush, they were listed with the real estate for sale by people from overseas. I had to fight with the real estate people. It's like, guys, they said, if you want to withdraw the listing, you have to show me ID. I said, did you ask the other guy for an ID? He said, overseas. I said, well, go after him. They listed our property. They put it on the market, both properties. That would have been interesting if someone sold your properties. You know what, it wouldn't be so they go on contract with the people buying, they keep the check and then they disappear. There's no way on earth it could change hands. That would not work. But they get the deposit check and whoever fell for that, you know. It's out of money. It's this big scam with real estate stuff. Wow. Thank you everybody and have a great day. Take care. See you at the next meeting on the other side. Thank you.

Thank you. Rose distributed minutes of June 24th, 2026.

I did read the minutes, made a couple very minor comments. I recommend approving the minutes subject to those comments. Second subject.

All in favor? Aye. We have a motion to adjourn. So moved.

Featured. Second.

Thanks, everybody. Good night. Good night.