Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Okay, you guys uh want to All right. Okay, I'm going to call this uh joint meeting of the Caramel Planning Commission and the Forest and Beach Commission uh together. Uh can we have um roll call, please? Absolutely. I'll start with the planning commission. Go ahead. What? I'll start with the planning commission. Okay. Commissioner Alurn here. Commissioner Allen here. Commissioner Carropov here. Commissioner Lock here. And Chair Leage here. All right. And for the Forest Beach, Commissioner Berling here. Commissioner Bzoski here. Commissioner Ross here. Commissioner Rea here. And Chair Mitchi here.

Thank you.

Okay. All right. I want to welcome you all today. This a little different for us. It's nice to have the two commissions together. Okay. The first item um after the roll call is a public appearances. So at this time um anybody any members of the public can speak to the planning commission or forest and beach on any matters which are not on our agenda today and are of municipal concern. I want to remind you that we are under the uh conditions of the Brown Act and so I um want you to all know that you must abide by that. So at this time I want to invite anybody uh from the public who wants to speak to us about any matters of municipal concern which are not on our agenda today. Any hands up on online?

Yes sir.

Okay. Nobody here in the chambers stepping up. So we will move on to uh the orders of business and today we have a uh report on the Carmel sea level rise draft adaptation pathways report. So can we have the staff report please? Good afternoon. I'm Mary Bilsy, the environmental programs manager and I am basically going to just introduce the consulting team. We have um EMC planning group as well as integral who both um prepared the study and they will do an introduction a little bit of a background and then we will go into the actual adaptation study and um they will break in there for questions and then we can come back and um if there's any additional questions. It's there isn't an action that we're going to be taking. It's just a presentation information and then a discussion. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you.

Good afternoon, chair of the planning commission, chair of Forest and Beach, and members of both uh committees and commissions. I'm Anastasia Aziz with EMC Planning Group. Um I'm a principal and I'm been working with the city on this um long and involved complex project and I've been before you a few times. I also have uh with me Esme Wall, a senior planner with EMC Planning Group who's helping and then we have staff from Integral um Dave Revel uh who's a principal and geomorphologist right and uh Matt Jameson a senior scientist with integral and also Ruben Rugnik a scientist with integral um and they will be presenting the more technical um information. So with that I'll next slide

which is

Oh come it's not showing. Oh wait. Oh there. There we go. Okay. Just briefly the background. I know I've been before I think both of you uh before but um what is a local coastal program? Um just for the record, it's a a the city's planning document that governs development in the coastal zone. And in the case of Carmel, the entire um town city is within the coastal zone. Um not all cities are like that. Some only a portion are in the coastal zone, but in this case, the entire city's governed by this document as well. Um which is um part of the or required by the coastal act. So why a local coastal program update? Um, the coastal commission requires that local coastal programs be updated to consider sea level rise. The city's current, I'll use the acronym LCP or local coastal program does not include sea level rise projections or identify what we're calling adaptation pathways or way to adjust to the changing levels of the um ocean and storm surges um so and the associated erosion with that. So that is what this whole effort is is to do. Um and there was a Senate bill 272 that was passed that requires coastal communities to adopt sea level rise plan by 2034. So Carmel's um you know very well positioned to do this and this whole um effort is grant funded and this just shows where we are in the process. Um there were technical studies, existing conditions done and many of this or all of this is on your website as well, the city's website. Um feasibility studies done, socioeconomic analysis, I think that's the latest one we were before you with. And now we're back before you with adaptation pathway development um to hear your uh comments on that. And you'll see the community

engagement along the bottom. We've had um various uh different in addition to meetings with planning commission and forest and beach. Um, also workshops with the community and most recently a survey that was out that recently closed. Um, and now we're before you with the adaptation pathway development to get your feedback on that before we move into proposing policies for your consideration. And with that, I will pass it off to Dave Rebel.

Thank you. Good afternoon everybody. Uh, David Rebel um with Integral. Um this has been we started working with the the city in 2022 so we're well into the project. Um and what we're going to present is sort of the culmination of all of the science and socioeconomic analysis and sort of come up with a plan on and recommendations on where do we go from here. Um so I am going to cover um I'm going to go through the first part pretty quickly because it's a review. uh if you will um of sort of some of the key findings that are leading us into some of the proposed actions. Um so we've kind of divided the city into the sort of three planning areas on the beach. Sort of the North Beach and North Dunes that includes the Delmare parking lot. Um the Delmare Dunes and Central Beach which is you know sort of that uh access and the 8th Street or 8th Avenue emergency access. um and some really important like a pump station and some other really critical infrastructure. Uh and then the the biggest uh sort of project area is sort of the South Beach and and Scenic Road Corridor. Um and so we have come up with sort of very specific recommendations for each one of those as well as uh following upon the detailed sort of findings. Um we did look at uh future coastal erosion um projected with uh with and without the existing armoring in place. Um we looked at what the beach would how narrow the beach would get over time. Um if the armoring is maintained and as sea level rises we're going to squeeze the beach out uh unless we do something. Um and that doing something is adaptation which we're really trying to get into here

today. Um, we looked at where wave over topping uh and potential [clears throat] erosion risk is going to increase with sea level rise. Right now, when waves hit the the seaw walls, they kind of come up and maybe some salt spray will spray and, you know, cause some small failures in in the softer material above it. With sea level rise, those waves will not just go vertical. they'll start going horizontal and eat into more of the bluffs causing more failures that would affect infrastructure, scenic drive, things like that. Um, and we've kind of done a very specific, very detailed mapping along the entire uh short beach um and and and coastal area um and highlighted some of the key infrastructure. Obviously, accessways, utilities, parking lots, things [clears throat] like that. Um there's uh a lot of detail in here and in the various reports. Um you know this is some of the the key areas uh of risk um in the south uh sort of with just one f foot of sea level rise. Um sort of some water water supply access ways um with two feet. Um there's a bunch more of the uh impacts to scenic road and different accesses. Um, again, this is really a review and I can't we're not going to be able to get into all the detail here. Um, but I just want to kind of show you the thought that we've gotten to to make these recommendations uh to try and avoid and adapt to this so we avoid a lot of these impacts. Um, then we get into with with two feet then with four feet. Um most of the cliff back shoreline um there's 44 homes could potentially be uh impacted um either with flooding or with continuing erosion. A ro you know wave splash and

waves wave flooding and overt topping hitting a building is cleanupable. Eroding the foundation is not cleanup. We're not building more land necessarily. So um different impacts require different types of adaptation. Um and then uh basically all of the small all of the beaches with four feet of sea level rise would likely disappear except for some very small pocket beaches. Um so um I'm going to go through some of the strategies and I know know that's a lot that it is a review of two years and about 3 minutes. So, um, please dig into that more. Uh, and we can answer some of the questions, but we're trying to go what are what's going to happen when we if we do something and what can we do? And we have talked with coastal commission staff and so all of these options that we're presenting today are potentially viable, how they're implemented, the specifics about what's integrated that, you know, is public supportive. All of those will determine, you know, how easy it is to permit. One thing I want to make uh a real clear distinction is the benefit of going through this process and then going through the next two phases of updating the local coastal program is it allows the city to have more discretionary approval of actions in the city and not have to take everything to coastal commission. And so as we chart a path forward and develop some monitoring programs and some other things, technical studies that inform what the city might want to do, it the more we get done and get into the local coastal program, then the city can permit staircase repairs really quickly. And so the frustration that we've heard in the community about when are the stairs getting fixed that can be expedited to some extent once we get some of these

policies set and some of the monitoring plans and things as that we've been working on. So there is a benefit of going through this long process and that's one of them. So everybody who's frustrated the stairs aren't open yet we're working on it. [laughter]

A quick question. Do you want us to wait? Yeah, I'm going to go through a couple uh I'm going to stop before we get into the adaptation. I just want to present what are some of the options that are possible. Okay. And yes, we I will slow down a little bit here, but still go pretty quick and then we'll pause and get everybody questions answered and then dive in deep. Okay. So, within the range of adaptation strategies, there's sort of we can do nothing and that's a choice. we can protect and that can either be coastal armoring, seaw walls, it can also be beach nourishment, nourishment of the sand ramps, um accommodation, uh which is like setbacks of of buildings or elevating is not as applicable here in in Carmel because it's pretty built out already and it's not necessarily lowlying flooding issues that are the problem. So, um, and then there's retreat. And, um, in Marina, it's still well hauled, is a great example. You can see what happens when you armor the coast. Eosion continues, sea level rises, there's no beach there. When it was turned over, uh, by the military to state parks. Um, it and they took the armoring out. It became the beach came back. The erosion was allowed to catch up and the beach came back. So, that was 3 years. That's very different system, high erosion, but manage retreat is great at maintaining natural resources, not as great for maintaining a road that's right behind it. So, um, there are choices to be made. Um, so there's a lot of sort of vegetation, dune, naturalbased approaches that are um, you know, and they kind of go from small to big in on this list. You can do sort of storm BMS that help buffer that big storm. Um, we can start using some of the driftwood in some of dune restoration to sort of to to stabilize things a little more, guide pedestrians

from trampoline. Uh, you know, the dune ramps. Vegetation can help stabilize. We could develop sort of a beneficial reuse. If somebody's digging a basement and they have compatible sand, instead of trucking it to the landfill, which it usually happens now, we could put it identify a place to put it so that it gets back to the beach. Um, we can start to, you know, harvest some sand from the beach during key times of the year to help bol buffer from erosion or add more sand uh up higher into the uh dunes. there's a potential for finding sand outside um in larger volumes to nourish the entire beach. Um and all of these have different costs and tradeoffs. We did an initial sand source. Um everybody knows how amazing the sand is here and we heard that very very clearly in the survey. You know, you go around the corner and Carmemell River State Beach is dirty sand and Carmemell by the sea has clean sand. Sorry, state parks. But that's the perception and it is amazing. I mean, we went down there before the meeting today and was just like, "Yes, it's amazing." Um, we looked it all of that sand's coming eroded off of the Monterey Peninsula and has traveled in and takes a long time. Granite doesn't erode very fast, meaning it doesn't make a lot of sand very fast. the but that's the source. So we kind of looked from desktop what is out there. There's some potential deposits. Can we get them? I don't know. It's a marine sanctuary. Is there enough sand to make a difference? I don't know. That is a critical fork in the road for a car mount. Is there sand that is compatible and consistent with the beach? Qual, color, size,

feel, taste, all of it. And can we get it and put it on the beach? Two big questions. Two big question marks. So, um that is one of the studies that we really, you know, needs more work. Um and as a result if we can if there is sand and we can put it there then we have a whole host of adaptation options that are very much more nature-based. If we do not then we have a different set of strategies. So it is a fork in the road that the the community is going to have to investigate. Um there's a lot of engineered infrastructure uh some of the most beautiful seaw walls I've ever seen. um they are still in pretty good shape. They need maintenance. Um and so these are strategies that stop or reduce the erosion. Um and uh but they do require and there's different sort of aspects to it. We can add like at the bottom of this staircase for example, there's a wave deflector. A lot of when the waves come up and pile up, it creates these currents that scour the back of the beach. If we disrupt those currents in different ways, it reduces the erosion and may maintain the beach longer. Um, there's always secondary consequences of any adaptation strategy. Costs, trade-offs, you know, if you hold the line and sea level rises, you lose the beach unless you continue to to nourish. There's an example from Imperial Beach with and without a beach nourishment. Um we looked at you know by 3 feet less than uh you know only 40% of the beach width is is pro projected to be still here in the summertime. Um so there are a couple other strategies and those are very traditional engineering or nature-based approaches. These are some

more innovative ones that were we have also considered and asked the community and the coastal commission to you know if these would be viable. Underlying a lot of the beach especially in the south southern reaches are a bunch of sandstone sort of outcrops that are buried most of the year. When they're not buried then they are also channels for waves to get in to attack the backshore. We could potentially add some uh enhancements either, you know, and these are really detailed engineering crayon shapes as you can see that have um you know, fill some of these gaps and could disrupt that wave energy and velocity and potentially help deposit sand on the backside and retain it from getting sucked back offshore. the low crested structure, the triangle version of the crayons, um could also be something that, you know, adds a little bit of wave tripping and reduces some of that velocity before it slams into the seaw walls. These could would be I would imagine these would be buried under the sand most of the time when it was exposed. They would really help reduce the impact hours on the back of the seaw wall. Um, oops. Uh nearshore reefs uh is another one that's starting to gain some interest in California. Oceanside is looking at a a ree beach program that consists of some offshore reefs to help do this. So you wouldn't be the first one. This is a marine sanctuary. There's already reefs uh out here. They are not in a place that really dissipates a lot of the wave energy in in help retain sand in the current configuration. So potentially we could look at uh a series of offshore reefs or augmenting some of the rock reefs out there to help break the wave energy up before it comes into shore. And that would allow sand to not maybe go as far offshore in the

wintertime and stay closer and have more come back in the summer. Again, that's a you know, there's a lot of may in that. All of these discussion ones that I mention here um are all would all require a lot more investigation, modeling, engineering, design, thumb wrestling with different regulatory agencies. Um and so this is one of the discussion topics that we want to sort of also have. But um before I go into I think yes. So before we get into sort of our recommendations, I want to pause, get a sip of water and have some questions from you guys and have a discussion about, you know, what you guys preferences are and things like that. And I may call on some of the other uh wonderful staff we have here to help.

So you want to take some questions? Please. Please. I'm just going to grab Okay. Um how do you want to do this? Uh, normally what I do is I just call in individuals in order. Okay. I find it works out better. So, I'm just going to go around. Uh, Commissioner [snorts] Ross, you want to start?

I guess my question is, um, from all of [clears throat] these and you said you talked to the Coastal Commission, are they giving you the touchyfey kind of push them this way or they do you think they would be more inclined to go the natural route and very less inclined to do all this engineering? How what's your initial kind of thoughts on that? Um I cannot speak for the coastal commission. However, um having worked with them on a number of projects, whatever it does the best to maintain the natural resources, the access um of and protection of public infrastructure are sort of the big priorities. um they're much more so getting and and sometimes I mean a living shoreline project one of them took 16 years to get permitted down in Ventura. Um it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be any easier because a lot of that's requires innovation but in general the coastal commission is much more ready to permit a nature na a more natural approach um than another engineered structure. Um, with that said, maintaining what you have so you don't have to rebuild it, um, is also really important. And one of the things we're saying is get a monitoring and maintenance plan program certified through the Coastal Commission. So, you can go out and fix the walls when they need it. you can put the replace the concrete in the gr and the grout and the footing so it's not scouring and so those structures will last a lot longer and they provide are integrated with critical coastal access so

okay no other questions m no okay uh commissioner uh Bazinski or I'm going to probably mess some of your names up so I apologize ahead of time

I have um two questions. First, I love the idea of having a monitoring plan set up through this that gives the city more flexibility on on not getting behind on deferred maintenance. That's a great that that in and of itself would be a near-term immediate benefit to the town. Um the two questions I have are first so there was a big difference on that very first slide between 0 2 3 4 feet level sea rise in terms of implications for the beach um and how we might address them. So are you making are will you be making a recommendation as we develop a plan as to what what sea level rise has the greatest probability and what should we be looking

that section will answer a lot of those. So for each of those three planning areas, we go through what we should do now, 1 foot, 2 foot, and what we should be monitoring that says when we hit half of a be, you know, the beach width is narrows by half. We should have already started planning for the next thing. So we're going to go through all of that in some detail and it's in the report in a lot of detail, but we wrote it down because we don't have time to go through it all. Okay. So you're and do you and but what is the overall sense of the timing you know like in how many years would we we be likely to lose 2 feet of

Yeah that's so the scientific projections around sea level rise are a range and it's they kind of fall into a 20-year range um and so a foot could be between 2040 and 2060 um and two feet could be 2060 2080 the sort of the higher levels we could see up to 7 ft by, you know, 6 1/2, 7 ft by 2100. But it doesn't stop there. It's going to keep going. So, we need to understand that long-term we we've set in motion sea level rise is going to be around for 10,000 years if we were to stop greenhouse gas emissions yesterday. So, it's going to keep rising. There's hundreds of feet of sea level rise stored in the ice caps and glaciers. And as warm water expands and comes steaming out of the teapot, that's all going to rise. So the trend is going when it happens is where the uncertainty comes in. And so the way we are looking at it is not at one foot we're going to do this. We're looking at when the beach width or when the sand ramps have eroded back and exposed the sandstone and now there's no beach access and we have a vertical cliff. You know, we want to do something before we get to the vertical cliff. So, what we're what you'll see are these triggers that we've identified that would be further clarified in the monitoring plan. So you led perfectly into that um with your questions. So that that cues us to take the next steps and if we do this in a transparent way with the community that monitoring can include the community and so everybody's watching for this precious resource that we all love and we all have agreed in advance what we're going to do when we get to that point. What's the next study? What's the next plan? Where direction are we going to go?

[clears throat] Okay. And then my last question is on um that you know that the the beach doesn't know what city and what's county out there on the sand when you when you cross that that the beach doesn't know that nature doesn't know that. So are you doing the same work for the county be north that we can't seem to get any this project ever focus on? Is there is there a pebble beach or county project on that portion of the beach or is that just at this point left unattended? um we're not working directly with them. We have in our analysis considered that, you know, it's all a system, but for the most part, you know, the sand does move a little onto Pebble Beach. Um I don't think they're going to be able to do a whole lot different than anything you guys do. So, but being a good neighbor, we should talk to them as we get these plans and preferences. You know, one of the policies that we always put in these uh LCP updates is coordinate with your regional partners and funders because it is, you know, it's going to take a village. We have been talking to COD. Um they have some sea level rise plans and they've given us some ideas on what what could be done if we lose a pump station, how much it might cost. So, there has been some of that that will be ongoing forever. But no, you're not doing any similar project uh on that part of the beach.

Not on that part. No. Okay. Lots of other counties. Okay. Uh Commissioner Berlin, any questions you may have? No, I have no questions right now. Okay. And uh Commissioner Rout. Hi. [snorts] Three questions. Uh the first one's got 16 parts, though. Okay. Just joking. Cool. I better get something to write down. Uh question number one, who's approving this plan? Is this something that our city council approves?

It has to be and uh Anastasia or Esme well anybody on the team can uh correct me if I get this wrong but uh any you know this the council it'll first go to planning commission then it will go to city council and then it would go to coastal commission. Okay. And usually at that stage there's some back and forth about right and then it will come back and then you negotiate and you find common ground or you don't. Okay.

Um and then it would be certified once you know coastal commission says yes then whatever they changed the city either accepts or you go back and forth. So at some point when it [snorts] gets to city council there'll be recommendations and hopefully input from us in terms of what we think are the right options to choose etc.

Yeah. So this will what comes out of these pathways will then you know through these discussions will then go into the policy development and it's the policy development that will allow us to do certain things now while we're investigating what we're going to do later. And then those would require subsequent permits or updates to the local coastal program again. Okay. Second question is I think it was SB272 you said requires the update. Is there a a minimal expectation that the coastal commission is looking for in terms of stuff that we're going to do? Yes. And there is a list with 16 parts. Okay.

Um and uh this work is very much aligned with that. Um, and that was one of the comments they gave us on some of the work is like, hey, if you add, you know, another paragraph, then it's crystal clear that this also does that. The benefit of going through and getting over that 272, it's not it's not an unfunded mandate. There is funds out there, but what happens once you sort of get over that hump, then you're eligible, then you're higher prioritized for funding from the state. Okay, that was my third question, which is tell us about the the hidden stock of money. Yeah, that's available for us to do this work.

It it I mean the the Coastal Commission, Coastal Conservancy, Ocean Protection Council, Strategic Growth Council, there's been a lot of funding to really get California on a good path. Um, and they're still continuing to fund this. Uh, this last one was uh, you know, was funded. Um, and you know, the coast commission is very pleased with the direction. If we get good policy out of it and we need more work, you know, more funding to do technical work, I'm pretty sure they would be happy to fund another round of stuff. So, in terms of us deciding to go search for sand, for example, we can go talk to somebody to say, "How much money can we get from you to actually go do this experiment?"

Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Thank you, Commissioner Richie. Thank you. Hi, David.

Hi. Um, first question is about sand. I know we've talked a lot about sand in the past and about the sand bar which catches our sand and returns our sand that there's a cycle to that and we've looked at past cycles over the past 30, 60, 100 years and the sand always comes back. I know we have more more storms now and sea level rise. How is that going to affect because we're talking now about getting sand where we've naturally in the past been able to just rely on that sandb bar because we're hit with these storms. There's there is erosion then we're hit with another storm. We're never really getting a chance to fully replenish the sand as we did in the past. Is that the biggest reason? Is that one of the reasons? Is sea level rise another factor?

Sea level rise. What's causing the loss of sand that we won't be able I I think there's always been a little bit like I think there's always been a little bit of leakyness to the sand box in Carmel and at time you know and so it's it dwindles a little bit and you can see that there you know at some of the trees up near the volleyball courts there's those you know now the roots are up here and they used to be underground so there's physical evidence that we've been losing sand from the system

um at some point, you know, big storms move the sand farther offshore and sometimes that takes longer to come back. Um, and at some point, sometimes it, you know, might take it off to the south and around to Carmel River. Um, we don't know the full sediment sand balance. It's a lot more secure and stable than most of the other places in California. But that's another that that's the fork in the road um that we need to understand more about the sand volumes that would be needed, where it's going,

looking at that nearshore bar changes over time if we can. Um so there's more technical work in that aspects. Um, but again, Carmel because it's kind of more stable, there's a lot more chance just to add some sand and keep the beach and everything sort of much more as is. Okay. And then two follow-up questions if I may to what two of the force and beach commissioners had asked. The first one was um when we had asked you what the process is from here on out and you mentioned planning commission, city council, does the forest and beach have anything to do with with the approval? You I I know you've been speaking with us, so just

Yeah, I I don't know whether Yeah, I mean the the plan is to go to the LCP will go to the planning commission. The process, you know, that is the process. So technically no. Um I think we decided to have a joint meeting because the the staff the consulting staff only has a set number of meetings that they are um presenting to. Okay. And so we thought it was a good idea to do a joint one so that we're not you know doing to both um commissions but Okay. But yeah the the ideally that's uh where this study goes is is to the planning commission council.

Okay. Thank you. Thanks, Mary. And then just one last question. Um, when Commissioner Brzowski had asked about if any other neighboring cities or counties are also getting involved in this, this is we're working off of a grant from the coastal commission. Yes. No one else on this immediate coast. So, f further north has this sort of a grant that they're working off of with you or city of Monterey has one. not with not I'm not working on this phase in the city of Monterey but um we're working with the embassy in the city of Marina

there's work going on we're working on the county of Santa Cruz um there's a lot of the jurisdictions up and down the state are doing similar work tailored to each uh sort of jurisdictions's unique characteristics so if it's not you then who's working on this are you working in partnership to some extent with these other entities yeah we're taking lessons lessons learned and you know examples of good hazard policies that have been approved. were kind of saying how does that fit maybe here in Carmel or does it um and trying to let you know learn from you know learn from the uh lessons um

I know that that's an important thing because some something that we do could have [snorts] an adverse effect on the coastline down the way but if we build you know a preventment or anything it could have it could push and cause erosion so there has to be some sort of I would imagine group effort to to some extent. I would assume that the coastal commission is the body that would make sure that that there's that the parties are working in unison. But

yeah, there's there are also regional climate collaborative. There's a central coast climate collaborative that's talking amongst the jurisdictions about not just this but wildfire and you know water quality and a whole host of climate things. um you know fortunately 90% of Carmel's coastal issues are in Carmel's jurisdiction. So you guys have uh it easier than say the Santa Barbara literal cell which has like six cities and two counties and um that's that's a fun one. Okay. Thank you David. Yeah, sure. Thank you. Okay. Uh Commissioner Alburn, you want to start?

Yes. Thank you, Chair. Uh two questions. Uh first is really more of a comment. Um, if indeed it there's a choice between us uh losing the Carmel Beach and us matching Carmel's perfect sand, um, I would be leaning towards saving the beach rather than matching the sand. Um, so that's more of a comment. Uh, question, these nearshore reefs, and it's convenient that this is up um to look at. Um, Carmemell is a destination for surfers. Would these nearshore reefs uh affect our surfing population?

Um they so um they could. Um we're working on an artificial surf reef design in Australia and to try and enhance surf. Um there are opportunities for multi-objective reefs like this to have surf amenities, habitat enhancements, erosion protection, sediment retention. So, it really gets into a lot of what are the priorities. Um, as a surfer, I don't want to ever be the one who screwed up the waves. I'd love to try and make them better. Um, but that's definitely a [clears throat] consideration. Um, and that would be something that, you know, there are we're working on some surf quality impact assessments in Malibu right now that look at impacts of projects and how it may affect, you know, a world class break. So, yeah. Um, and that question on your comment is that fork in the road [sighs] that I keep talking about. It's, you know, in the in the surveys, in the public workshops, everyone's like, "This sand or nothing. This is the best sand." That's this generation. The generation that can't go to the beach most of the year might say, "I don't care. Just give me some sand." So again, we're not planning and writing policy for the next hundred years. But we're looking out that far to make sure we don't take actions that are going to, you know, do harm and make it more expensive and harder to keep a beach long term. That's going to be our kids or grandkids problem and discussion in the community. But it is, you know, it I agree with you. I want I want a beach over a color of a beach. But we heard loud and clear it's this beach this color right now. So,

okay, Commissioner Allen, your comments. I don't have any questions at this time. Thank you. Okay. And Commissioner Lock, I don't have any questions either. Thank you. Okay. Commissioner Carov is moving in quick. That's quick. Yeah, absolutely. So, um, Commissioner Berling and I live in the south part of the town, so we are much more interested. Oh, also Commissioner Ross. Okay. Excellent. Three of us live in South Carmel. So we are much more interested on what happens down in the south. Uh that would be Carmel [laughter] Carmel River bias noted.

Yeah. Um so we have some critical infrastructure in that area. We have the water treatment plan [snorts] and we have an elementary school. Right. So I hope that you would cover that area as well because these these are um services and um infrastructure that is very critical to us and also we are making decisions about adding additional infrastructure in the area in the city and around the city like wireless towers and all that. We need to understand if there are any no-go areas like areas where we shouldn't be investing in terms of infrastructure long term. Um I understand that this is a long-term kind of thinking but they are also tsunamis and tsunamis happen quickly and they can flood much faster right so in the case of a tsunami should we expect for example that the water treatment plant would be flooded what are the consequences uh is the evacuation plan for the school what are the consequences so so these are the kind of the more practical questions I have around that

yeah and and there's you know, none of the infrastructure I got a quick nod from that um that none of that infrastructure or facilities are in the hazard zones that we've identified. They're not in the study area that we

Oh, they're not in the study area. So, that would fall Monterey County and part of the wastewater treatment water, you know, Calam sort of water supply. Um and they are doing separate studies um that hopefully are considering some of that. um that is not necess so there's other processes going on and the you know the question about regional coordination is really important um and big infrastructure like that really that's one of the things that drove you know SB272 to be passed was that we need to think far enough ahead that we're not creating bottlenecks

for critical infrastructure that's going to be we're going to depend on we don't want to build something that's going to become an island and everybody else has drowned and we've attracted people to it. Um, so there is that consideration statewide, but that's not part of this project. Um, yeah, go ahead, Commissioner Lock. [snorts] I did think of something. Um, are you aware of any other national marine sanctuaries that are undertaking a similar process right now in California? Yeah, Gulf of the Fereralons is kind of leading the way uh in and are we communicating with them?

Um I can't speak to, you know, the city's involvement with some of the other ones. I mean, I certainly have colleagues and friends. There's um the Gulf of the Fair has done a lot around regional sediment management and getting regulatory agencies to sort of lay out a path for looking at beach nourishment and how would it get permitted.

That's all of those kinds of questions. There has been a rewriting of some of the sanctuary regulations in I think it was 2002 or three recently enough since the study started um that allows beneficial reuse to be a part of for reducing erosion to be a part of some of within the sanctuaries that used to be no. So they've been they've been using that at uh Pillar Point Harbor that that's filled with sand and they took the sand out and put it on the beach that was eroding right next door. But that took 18 years and rewriting sanctuary rules. But that part's done now. So there's opportunities, but you know, it hasn't been thoroughly vetted and you know what's how much is too much taking it from somewhere. There's a lot of questions still.

Okay. Um [snorts] I had a question basically just you know what we have is that the the coastal uh property in California is the most desirable and the most expensive and it has attracted a lot of development and so there's going to be a huge uh amount of pressure to protect that property and so um it seems to me that uh sand replenishment and burns are kind of near-term solutions. So really the emphasis is going to be put on on types of hardening or offshore reefs. And I guess what I'm curious about, it doesn't sound like there's been are there any operating artificial offshore reefs along the coast that you know of? I mean, you mentioned you mentioned something in uh southern was it was it

uh so there's no artificial reefs that have been developed for erosion protection and adaptation. There are some artificial, you know, fish habitat restoration reefs. Um fish and wildl you uh department California Department of Fish and Wildlife is working on an artificial reef program update right now. Um but that's habitat oriented. I mean that's

focus but there's nothing. Yeah, there's been nothing. The ree beach program in Oceanside is sort of the biggest initiative uh active in the state right now. Um but there are reef projects around the globe that have been you know had various levels of effectiveness. Um it's still it's hard to build in the surf zone um and not screw things up. Um so there's there's been u governmental obstacles there's or just government obstacles, funding obstacles, logistical and construction obstacles. there's it's difficult to build in the surf zone. Um

and Okay. And then my second question was just can you speak a little bit more to the effects of hardening just in one area? You showed an example of the old Stillwell Hall, what happened there. Um I remember that building was there and I was just wondering what what are the known erosion consequences of of reetments? Uh I've seen in Santa Cruz they they're they're reinforcing and spraying concrete onto the bluffs uh particularly in the Pleasure Point Opal uh cliffs area. They've done that.

So I'm just kind of I'm just wondering what you know what kind of historical erosion information have we been able to collect or see from those types where we were where they've done those types of applications.

Yeah. So this is an you know this this figure here sort of captures what happens over time. It's it's a phenomenon known as coastal squeeze. There's sort of two impacts of engineering structures that protect that harden the backshore and stop or reduce erosion. The first is uh placement loss or the footprint of the structure. If you have a vertical wall, it's you know maybe takes up 10 ft of beach. If you have a a revetment, which is the the rock pile types, that's usually a 2 to1 slope. So if you go up 40t, you're out 80 feet. you know, some of the beaches in Santa Cruz are 60 feet and so you have no more beach and that's very common along West Cliff. So that is the the the placement of the structure takes up a footprint. That's one impact. Um the other one is called passive erosion or squeeze where you know beaches have been maintained for eons by eroding and kind of moving up and in as sea levels rise. And then when it goes down, you get more wind building sand dunes because it's got more uh area of to blow over the sand. When this sea level goes and this doesn't, you just drown the beach. And so over time, you'll lose the beach unless you nourish it and keep it out. [snorts] Once it gets close to where it interacts with the wall, there's more active effects that sometimes prohibit the sand from coming back because it's always turbulent in the back of the beach. So those are the three biggest ones. Um you know there's engineering courses for a week if you want to take and get into the weeds but generally those are and you know in Santa Cruz you know the but that and that was part of the reason we did the economics. The value of the beach in Carmel is substantial. The value of we you know the value of surfing in Santa Cruz was almost 200 million a year. So

these are not inconsequential economic values and the goal here is to try and strike the right balance. You know, the access that's used along Scenic Drive has a lot of value. You know, so what's the community's priorities today and what's it going to be tomorrow? And those are things that were, you know, will unfold over time. But, you know, we have considered sort of the full suite of options. Um, and that's what I was going to go into next. Okay. Thank you. Uhuh. Ask another question. Yeah. Go ahead. One more.

I just remembered something. Um, as far as I remember, back in 1982, there was a big storm that hit Carmel and that's when Scenic became a one-way street. Before that, it was two-way street, right? What happened then? What was the reason for that? Have you investigated? uh the 198283 El Nino January 27th. It's one of the highest at almost every tide gauge in California. That was the highest recorded water level.

Um storms came from a more southerntherly direction than normal kind of like the 2023 storm was really southshifted and it got into places with and it occurred at high tide. So it's high tide, big waves, bad direction or good direction depending upon your perspective. Um that that's the conditions. So basically the roads crumbled or the the sand under the road was washed away or what happened? It it probably it much of the armoring came in after that event in California honestly. Um and so there was cliff erosion. the waves got up into the softer bluff material and probably undermined the road. There's

study. Yeah, matters. From what I heard, like there was storms that came in December that scoured a lot of the beach already. So then when the big storm came in January, there was very well protected beach in front of it. So it really hit that back shore really hard and created a ton of erosion. We saw like 20 30 feet of like bluff material loss in a lot of places. Yeah. So that's some of the anecdote is Yeah. There's I remember one of the Johnson reports was you know talked about in places there's 20 to 40 feet of cliffer tree and that's in the softer bluff material not the sandstone but that's what everything's built on the top so so so is there a scenario in which we have a storm like that and then we lose the other part of

so that's sort of what I was talking about where right now when the waves hit the the seaw wall it goes vertical and maybe sprays in because of the wind but over time that wave runup dynamic ICS will have more horizontal momentum and velocity and be start to create bigger erosion chunks and failures. And when we build when we approve houses with basements on Synynic, are we working against nature? Are we undermining the stability of the cliff?

Um, that is a new tech question about this the the the effect on the cliff stability. We're definitely screwing with nature, but that's a different question. Um, I don't it's a geotech question and would have to be sort of assessed based on the underlying geology. Okay. I think it's good if we allow the presenter kind of move on. Thank you.

Okay. So, um, all of that work that we were talked about very high level. Now, we're going to go into your neighborhood and your neighborhood and um everybody's sort of into those three planning areas we talked about and this is had feedback from Forest and Beach Commission already included the community responses to the surveys and economics um and then sort of our experience. So an adaptation pathway is sort of a flexible stepbystep approach to move through time um that guides taking different actions based on observed changes and those changes can be monitored and become triggers. And so a trigger is basically something that says, "Hey, we've been doing this one thing, say keeping the seaw walls in one place and now we're starting to see that waves come up and over and start to erode more." Okay? And we saw it happen once 5 years ago. Now it's happening every year. We need to start planning so it doesn't happen every high tide. And so it takes away that uncertainty of do we do it at one foot or two foot of sea level rise. Well, I don't know when that's going to happen. We need to know when it starts happening more frequently. We need to get something starting that planning process so we have time to plan, argue, implement, argue, debate, fund, finance, design, construct before we hit the worst case scenarios and emergencies happen. So, it's kind of going, what do we want to do? How long is it going to take to get planned? And we start planning backwards. And then we go, okay, well, it's going to take 20 years to do that. So, we need something that's going to give us to tell us, hey, you got 20 years left in the hourglass before we

need that. And that's how this pathway is developed. And it ties into the monitoring so we know what to look for in advance before we you know have nowhere to put anything you know because land is eroded. Um so within the report um there are a series of these big um elaborate uh visuals um and in this green box are the triggers and these triggers are measurable observable things that need that signal when we're going to start planning the next action or strategy. some of that some of these strategies, you know, hey, we're doing a sacrificial uh, you know, winter berm. Okay, that one got eroded. Okay, here's a storm. We got [clears throat] 24 hours. That's all we need to do to do that. We're going to plan for relocating the wastewater main under scenic. That's going to take a little bit longer. So, we need to know those times. Um and uh but they should be, you know, pretty observable, measurable because then we can get the the community involved in monitoring. Um it can be integrated into public works maintenance activities. Okay, you had to go clean up the sand at the Delmare parking lot. How many wheelbarrows did you have? How many cubic yards did you have to, you know, move? So we can start seeing those changes over time. So we need, you know, sort of what are we monitoring? where do we store it so we can see over time how it's changing? Um, and the way we look at these, um, and you'll see a bunch of these figures. So, I'm going to try and orient everybody. You see on the top left, slanted on the side, there's a a dark green, a light green, a yellow, and a red. Those are the current situation. What should we be

doing right now? Near-term is, you know, what do we do in the next 10, 15 years or, you know, zero to 15 years maybe. Midterm is sort of, you know, 15 to 30 and after 30. Okay. Um, the reason there's no time is because we don't know what a half a foot, one foot, two foot, 4 foot of sea level rise is actually going to occur. We can we're monitoring that, but we don't know for sure. So then we have in the green boxes the triggers and some of the examples of triggers. Let me just see what I have the next slide real quick. Okay. So some of the examples here are you know what's the condition of the coastal armoring? Has the revetment kind of failed and gone all over the beach? Is it over steepen and unsafe for kids to climb on? Um you know how often is waves over topping the seaw walls now? Um how wide is the beach? How often is the bedrock in the south part of the of the of the city exposed? You know, does it is it gone by early March or does it stay till May? You know, those are some of the things that we can easily observe and monitor and see how it changes over time. What's the depth of sand on the sand ramp before you start stubbing your toe on the sandstone underneath it? Um, so we have a series of those over time and you'll notice that they're redundant as we go down because we want to be monitoring the same things so we can see the long-term changes. So the depth of the sand on the sand ramp is what we were talking about before the meeting. Um, what are the r how much how frequently do we have to repair 8th uh you know 8th Avenue emergency access? Um, you know once a decade. Okay. once a year, maybe you want to do something else. So, some of those are kind of the monitoring and triggers and they're these are examples that have some

detail, but it's not the final ones we need to sort of develop. And so, if you go outside the box to the right, well, the top is um sort of what those triggers are. Right now, we're present. And I use sea level rise elevations on the top. That could be time. That could be beachwidth. That could be how much money did the city pay to clean up the parking lot or replace any one of those triggers could be substituted on that horizontal axis on the pathway visualization. Okay. Then underneath those red lines that are horizontal are a series of plans and studies that kind of need to be done in that time period to inform the next steps and help determine the the priority selection best alternative community preferences. Um those red lines horizontal there's sort of the u the dashed part that's the planning, permitting, designing, arguing, visioning, construction. And then the red line that extends to the is how long it's effective or our projection for how long it's effective because if you maintain them maintain something, it works a lot better than if you don't. Um and then that square at the end is sort of when it sort of stop we estimate it stops being effective altogether and we want to have already gotten to the next path before we move on. [sighs] Any questions on that? Okay. Um so to look at the we're going to start in the north and work south. Okay. The primary hazards in the north are really around the sand ramp deflation. Um, a lot of that's just from overloving our beaches and walking down and dragging the sand on our feet back into our car

into the showers at home. Um, so there's uh some of that can be mitigated um in many different ways. Um, and so helping reduce dune erosion. Um there is some storm water related scour especially near that Fourth Avenue outfall and there's increasing wave exposure as sea levels come up. Um the adaptation priorities that we've identified are really maintaining the beach access and dune stability through some sand management and that could take any number of forms. Monitoring so we know when we need to add sand to the top or over the sand ramps. Um really looking at maybe some pedestrian guides so that we're not trampling everywhere, but we have some vegetation that helps to stabilize some of the sand. Um and you know provide some guided guides to visual cues or whatever to sort of reduce some of that. Um and eventually you know thinking about infrastructure relocation or retrofits and um I think is the Fourth Avenue. Yeah. So here's some of the pieces. This is the current uh um sort of recommendations. Right now, the city's looking at this fourth uh 4th Avenue uh storm drain and what to do with it. And I want to give a great example of why adaptation pathways is important. One of it is like it's not functioning, it's ugly, let's do something different. Okay. Well, it is providing some service of retaining some of the sand and habitat on the dunes up above. So if we repair or replace instead of just doing it and going all done, band-aids fixed, same. What if we engineer it so that when those sand dunes start to disappear and we're looking now at a sandstone cliff, we can easily add in a a vertical staircase. So

it's engineered into the design today and we take the step later. or if we're rebuilding a seaw wall now, make sure it's got the stability that we can add another 5T on top later. Building in that ahead of time instead of here's the lowest cost estimate today to you know with a metal pipe that's going to rest into a pile of rocks on the beach that people are going to stumble on. Okay, so there's an upfront investment that could save a lot of money later. Um but some of the key studies that need to be done. So we have some triggers there that are recommended. How, you know, often does the bedrock get exposed? You know, how how far is the the the first root on the tree from the bottom of the sand, you know, from the sand levels. Um, those are some very simple ones. Um, but then there's sort of some management plans. Um, you know, integrating some naturebased, maybe some driftwood at the base of the sand dunes to kind of help reduce some of the velocity and absorb some of the wave energy before it scarps it. Um we've had some projects in Santa Cruz and around the country that are have looked at some have been successful at helping some of that. Um and then knowing what's there. So the green dot green arrows are sort of some of the key vulnerable aspects. So the beach viewing platform is getting closer and closer. You know, one of the threats is also the vegetation growing in front of it too, but that's a different uh issue. Um, then as we go into the near term, again, starting to look for other sources of sand. You know, the next basement that gets built on Scenic Drive, you know, let's take that sand, test it, and then if it's compatible and clean, let's put it, you know, where it's going to erode down onto the beach instead of end up in the landfill. Um, let's start to reconnect some of those. Looking at trapping sand, harvesting sand when those wind events come or blowing sand into the volleyball courts. Let's

capture that with some vegetation or, you know, really sort of take a let's align the vegetation so it maximizes that upward transport that we don't have to pay for.

Um, so there's some things like that. Um, and then really starting to look at that fork in the road of are we going to do find another source of sand to augment and maintain the beaches um or not. And Matt, I'm going fast, so if there's things, please. [snorts] Um, this is the fork in the road here. And in the midterm right now in all of these different area pathways, we have sort of A, B, or C, at least A and B. One is and and this one is the only one that has retreat because there's really not a lot in that area that is really at risk. It's a lot of dune habitat and things like that that are natural resources. Um, and so retreat in this area is probably the most feasible and easiest than anywhere else in the city,

except for you lose that's the main public access point to the beach. Yes.

But if we protect it, then we lose the access too unless we build stairs. So depending upon what we do, we could squeeze out the access too. So, we only highlight that it is an option that is much more feasible here than moving Scenic Road and the beautiful homes or the sewer pump station right now. Um, this is the place that it could happen. Um, and again, this is a community discussion. This is midterm, so we're talking, you know, 2050 after. Okay. Um, but the fork of the road is beach nourishment. If we nourish the beach or find a source of sand where we can keep the sand at the top of the ramps and then as it tramples and erodess it transported to the beach and fills the leaky sand bucket on the beach then that might be enough. Maintain the seaw walls and structures that we have and bring in sand. That might solve it for a long time. If no, then we have to start looking at these engineering ones and solutions. And it might be nearshore reefs. It might be additional armoring. It might be vertical seaw walls with access way stairs. Um, and that's where some of these other more engineering uh pieces would have to be uh investigated. Not saying let's go design a network of artificial surf reefs right now. probably be fun to do for me, but um that is not what I would say is money well spent. Let's see if we can find sand and if we can get permission to put it on the beach is sort of the highest priority. And so, and then long-term depends on the fork in the road and the community's willingness to accept more, you know, brown ugly sand or, you know, or think outside the box and put in reefs or something like that or move.

So, to be forthright. Uh-huh. How much money [snorts] do you need to go prove? How much money it's going to cost to get the sand and how long does that take?

So, that is one of the things and we were talking to the city that that's a really high priority and hopefully we can help scope that to go look for funding to really do that investigation. We have lots of tools. There's a good report that these guys put together on sort of what we know about what's out there right now. And so we have some ideas of where to go look here, but then there's the rest of the world to look too. So that is a great question. I don't have a precise answer, but we will hopefully get you a better answer. So, you know, if that can become an action that maybe the city takes in the near term. Uh it's certainly one of the highest priority questions and would inform the policy development and a lot of other things. Um, so great question. So that's sort of the north. Okay, I'm going to go I think the next one is yes, central. Okay, so this area is primarily sort of the um the erosion at scour the 8th Avenue access. There's Dune Retreat on uh one of the dune ramps uh the Delmare uh dune ramp and um and so and then there's the wastewater pump station right next to the AAB access. So this one we're really focused again similarly on maintaining the emergency access and and dunes in the near term and then evaluating nourishment and sort of looking at infrastructure relocation potentially if we can't um nourish or integrating armoring into protections. So an example here um again we have very similar sand management options, dune management uh act guiding access to reduce trampling similar measures in the dune ramp area.

One of the main triggers is looking at how much maintenance costs are around the ETH access uh repair that we're you know that's kind of ongoing right now to see how long that's going to last. And uh one of the opportunities here um is you know and that includes understanding where the sand where the sandstone is that's underneath the sand ramps so we know when how much erosion before we start stop being able to use the sand ramps as access is a is a major uh trigger and monitoring need. Um, and this is sort of one of the things that could be considered if the nourishment isn't there. We could look at realigning this 8th uh 8th Avenue access um and potentially integrating uh you know some coastal protection and a new seaw wall uh around that pump station. So that could remain um and still provide more of a ADA driving access ramp. Um, and we have a couple configurations potential for, you know, in that case we could potentially remove some of the revetment that's buried in the sand that would be exposed and, you know, buy back some of the beach because we'd be removing that placement loss. Um, and then looking at some dunes or some other kind of creative ways to um, you know, keep the areas that do have more width and aren't critically eroding um, you know, blend that into the landscape. So that's another sort of strategy that could be looked at.

Can I ask a question now because [snorts] it's kind of pertinent to this? Sure. Um we talked in your report about planting native species and things like that that that's helping. This is full of ice plant and so my question is kind of is is ice plant our friend or should should that also be something we're kind of working on is to get out this invasive species. Is there a better native plant selection that would help or is ice plant from a adaptation point of view fine?

I'm not a biologist so take this with a grain of salt. I think ice plants really bad except for stopping cigarette from starting fires on freeways. Um uh it it doesn't really provide habitat and the root system. It's really heavy. So when it's dangling over it almost pulls when especially when it's rained it gets even heavier and it pulls part of the cliffs or dunes down. Um native vegetation has much better roots. Actually the old dune management plan uh the existing dune management plan has a great planning pallet. Um, and it, you know, that's part of what implementing some of those in the access of those dune ramps would, I would, you know, kind of use what the city's been investing in and sort of get it, you know, sort of built or or in and a lot of that again very active citizenry that could be engaged to help do that. Um, you know, we've had great success at Surfers Point Venture where citizen planting, citizen weeding has made this beautiful dune system. Um, so there's a lot of ways to do these things and it doesn't have to be huge high cost. It can be community building vision, you know. So, um, native plants are better for poison oaks. Really good at holding, uh, [laughter] really really good at holding hill slopes together. Yeah. [laughter] Hey, walk off at your own risk. [laughter] Um, so and then again long, you know, then there's the fork in the road. Nourish, no nourish. Um, and you know, we sort of have some ideas of what could be done, you know, with that. And then long term, you know, it's how how long do you want to fight the ocean? You know, we're never going to win that battle, but at some but that's not a decision we have to make today. But we have to make sure

that we don't start fighting it earlier than we need to to what is the square footage of the beach? Do you know how big it is? Tell me what day.

Like today. Yeah, that is, you know, that's we have lots and lots um we have a whole sort of study on the beach dynamics and so I couldn't give you you know off the top of my head it wouldn't take too much. I think the question that we need to answer is what's the volume of sand today and what's the volume of sand maybe in the past for the volume. Yeah, that's that's what I want to figure out is if it's like I don't know 10,000 square feet. It's not 10,000 square feet, like 10 million square feet. Uh if we want to raise it one foot, we need 10 million, you know, cubic feet of of sand. What is the most efficient way to bring 10 million cubic feet of sand to Carmel?

That is exactly go through highway one. You have to put them on a ship and bring them in the bay. Right. So this is very practical kind of Yes, you are a very practical. That's exactly what this fork in the road sand source sand beach nourishment investigation feasibility study would answer all those questions and Matt told me Dave this is not nurse scope I want to do that right now. [laughter] So we definitely want to continue to work to answer these questions because that's what ultimately is going to help you guys choose a a course that's going to be the most sustainable long term. Okay,

great questions. Um, okay. And then move. When you guys move, somebody's going to have to make some really hard decisions and have some hard conversations, but um, the ocean is going to win. We've all built sand castles. Um, and moving down to the south, um, right now the beaches get narrower in the winter in particular. So monitoring winter beach widths, monitoring the exposure of the sandstone underneath, mapping the sandstone underneath so we know where they it is and how much and how frequently. Um that's kind of the monitoring pieces. But we do get a lot more frequent wave runup reaching the back of the seaw walls. Over topping, you know, is gets pretty high. You have some really nasty currents during storm events right there that we could try and disrupt. Um, so maintaining access, let's get the access stairs repaired and let's get uh, you know, some plans in place so that we can do it quickly next time they get damaged. Um and then trying to protect the critical infrastructure, scenic road, all that in the near term, evaluating nourishment, and then from there determining whether we need to upgrade coastal armoring, look at realignment or retreat or elevating uh the seaw walls more. Those are sort of the engineering. Um and so I can walk through those pretty quickly. This is sort of the uh my very highly detailed engineering drawings of some of these augmentations that we could do. Um, you know, this staircase here could be turned into one of the rock walls that have a more armoring protection, wave deflectors, uh, to break up some of the currents. Um, you know, the beach nourishment question. Um and then looking at some of these protections of elevating uh the

the crest of the structures or you know wave tripping devices or nearshore reefs and those sort of farther off alternatives to be determined after we decide which fork we're going to go down. So should we pause for questions? I need [clears throat] [laughter] you. Are there any quick questions? Because I think this next step's going to go pretty quick.

Before we uh before we get questions from the commissioners, uh last time we I didn't allow the public any questions. Anybody in the public that has any questions for the presenter? Okay. I just wanted to make sure uh that we got the public in on this discussion. So, just go ahead. Anybody want any questions? Just jump in. I'm not going to call you individually.

Yeah. Um okay. Um I there's a few more and then there's backups and backups if we need to, but I let's get through this and then we can really have a discussion with everyone. So, uh triggers we've talked about a lot of the triggers kind of fall in these categories. Beach widths. Um you know, if we want to have a summer beach width and we see the winter beach width disappear, then there's not going to be a very wide summer beach. So, we need to monitor winter beaches. um too, uh erosion distances, you know, obviously how close is the road to the bluff edge, um the depth of sand in places on the dune rams, vegetation cover, if we're doing a big restoration to try and control or guide access, all of a sudden it all disappears. We want to make sure we're maintaining that. um wave exposure, over topping frequency, um and sort of and public access and infrastructure performance. Um you know, if the closed days of access stairs, um something like that. Um and then monitoring um and we just had a nice conversation with the with city staff on some monitoring. Um, Surf Line does, uh, has, you know, a immense camera network. They're now using that to do science. So, we can look at, they're working, we're working with them on the north shore of Aahu looking at, uh, beach monitoring um, to sort of help develop a beach and dune management plan. Um, they can count the number of people on the beach. they can't, you know, say when when uh commissioner is out surfing, we can't do facial recognition with it, but we can count people in the water, people on the beach, and that feeds into that economic analysis and growth that we kind of already presented previously. Um, and then looking at wave quality, if we're going to look at, you know, nearshore reefs, it can help with some

of that. So, um, that's a a great automated tool. There's, uh, Coast Snap is another technique where there's just a stand. Anybody in the public can come in, snap a photo, hit the QR code, the photo goes, gets uploaded. Algorithm says shoreline's here. And so we can start to monitor that over time and everybody who goes to the beach who wants to participate can. Um, so, uh, there's also things we can do with, um, you know, how the city assigns public works, you know, tasks, maintenance tasks, you know, okay, you had to go clean up the parking lot, how much sand, what, you know, stuff like that that can be just embedded into the daily workflows. Um, that will help start to count and track. Um and so these are sort of so um that's something that is also I think a really important nearshore near-term action um in the immediately um we should probably in the north beach really look at reducing the sand ramp deflation um and guiding beach access you know continue with the to think about the 4th Avenue outfall and seaw wall and options um but not just fix it now but what can it perform later for us and how will it still be there

[snorts]

um and and benefiting start monitoring. Um then sort of again regrade some of the emergency access and and accesses particularly uh the seaw walls and revetments developing a monitoring and maintenance program. So that can get permitted by the you know certified by the coastal commission permitted um integrated into the LCP and then the city controls the monitoring and maintenance and you know themselves in a much more uh transparent and approved fashion. Um and then stairway enhancements looking maybe at adding some wave energy deflectors or altering those along the back of the seaw walls. Um and then um sort of restoring some of the bluff vegetation. I understand there was some small failures from this last storm. You know, let's get some not ice plant vegetation in there, poison oak maybe. Um and you know, start to you know, take care of what we have at before it disappears. Um and then studies beach nourishment feasibility. You know, I've said that plenty. I think everybody's going, "Uh-huh. We get it. We get it." But um can't underpin that. Let's get um you know and these second ones really those are sort of after but um you know developing that monitoring plan and the sediment beach nourishment plan um and then understanding sort of maybe evolving the dune management plan which is largely around vegetation types and and and species to use into some you know some designs on how we want to guide and steer the use of the dune ramps. Um, [sighs and gasps] yeah, I'm curious if the rip currents stay in the same place or not. I have lots of other science nerdy questions, too. But, um,

these are sort of some of the plans I've mentioned. Um, you know, really there's [clears throat] also the infrastructure. So, working with COD, working with Pebble Beach, um working with Calam, making sure that their upgrades, improvements, and plans into the future include and coexist with the city's plan. Um, and then monitoring some of these uh other aspects. [sighs] Yes. [laughter]

Thank you.

Yes. Thank you, Dave. That was great. Give you a break. Um, Anastasia, I'm back just to close it out. Um, so these are just some of the potential policy actions that could be considered for the local coastal program. I think that previous slide with the recommended studies could also be in the local coastal program that might help the city be positioned for grants to help fund them as well. Um, but like Dave was saying, the beach is sort of divided into the north, central, and south because there's very differing issues. So, we would, I think, be looking at, you know, framing it that way. But again, we'd like to hear how what your thoughts on that. will also talk to coastal commission and I think it's wide open right now because all these cities are are doing their own studies. So it it's up to this city what they want to do, how they want to frame the policies. But some examples are you can um encourage proactive adaptation through policy incentives and streamline permitting like if someone you know I don't know if the city has some particular idea of what they would like to to see. Someone comes in on private property for example and if they do ABC then they don't have to go to a public hearing. things like that to incentivize incentivize the direction that the city would like to see the development take. Um establish inloo fees or dedicate funding streams for beach access, dunes, and sand management. So those are essentially creating um separate funds within the city budget that would just fund this dedicated work. So it wouldn't get mixed up in other funding sources. There'd be dedicated funds. Um adopting a coastal hazard overlay zone. So establishing just sort of an area along the coastline that is most at risk um based on sea level rise and hazard mapping and there could be additional requirements if there's development in that area. um develop coastal hazard real estate disclosure disclosure requirements. Um if you know a

transaction for private property happens and there there needs to be a disclosure of um there is a sea level rise um study it's expect there you you may have expectations of you know um erosion on your property you know for your information um because it does affect insurance it does affect whether or not you can get permits there's a lot of things it affects um continue just the existing armoring policies under the coastal act And like Dave was saying, um we are watching the coastal commission and they they do um they are emphasizing access and um also critical infrastructure. Um those are the two main priorities and obviously the critical infrastructure is very costly like the um cod or wastewater district all of the the pipes that go along scenic drive that's costly costly to to move. So it it seems like the coastal commission is recognizing that and saying okay let's protect it for now till we get um retreat in place um link permit renewals and redevelopment approve approvals to updated hazard assessments and triggers. So for example, if someone again on private property comes in, they want to, you know, demolish something and build something a lot larger on a an area say in this coastal hazard overlay zone, it's um it may not be possible. And again, that's a policy decision for the city, the planning commission to recommend or the the council to recommend. um and then update the local coastal program to formally integrate some of these triggers um and monitoring that Dave was saying um to ultimately I think have managed retreat policies sometime in the future um and building codes uh to reflect future coastal hazards and resilience and building codes are updated I think every 3 years it's on a cycle and right now a lot of the emphasis is on um uh fire and hardening um but it could be in the

future um some of these along the the coastal edges to be updated to um reflect some of the coastal hazards. And then some of you did ask earlier in the presentation like what are the next steps and what's the sort of regulatory um path for these changes. So right now we want to hear what you have to say and uh about policy development and we can draft some policies based on what we hear based on what's in the um uh adaptation report um and then bring those back for um draft policies for um input and consideration. And then once we have some draft policies um ready the the legislative uh process for a local coastal program amendment is the planning commission. a recommendation needs to be made by the planning commission. Then it goes to council and we're we're these are tentative um dates. So planning commission summer fall of this year um and planning commission would make a recommendation to city council um fall or winter 2026. Council would adopt the the plan and then it would get submitted to the coastal commission. Um and the coastal commission I don't think I've seen one plan where they haven't made some edits. So, it's likely they would make some edits um and adopt it based on those edits and then like Dave was saying, because it wasn't exactly what the city adopted, it would get sent back to the city council for adoption or for back and forth um discussion again. So, that's sort of the the uh pathway forward. Um and then in the meantime too, what Dave was also um saying is identifying there are many states and federal coastal resilience grants at this time to help fund some of these studies and monitoring um and then exploring more funding financing mechanisms for this particular city like different funding sources and put them in funds for near-term adaptation

monitoring um and maintenance actions. And I think with that um that concludes our presentation for today. Like Dave was saying, there's lots of other slides for particular questions if those come up. Um, but we're um I'm interested in hearing what your your thoughts are and I do understand [snorts and clears throat] there's a lot of information, but hopefully we've been parsing it out over the last couple years that um can have a good conversation. So, thank you. Uh, are there any questions for I got Go ahead. Go ahead. So, from a timing perspective, I know and I wish our director of public works was here. We're in the design phase or the end of the design phase for two the beach stairs

and it'd be great to understand if that's going to meet the requirements that was being talked about in this plan. It'd be a shame if we went through this design and it didn't meet it and then we had to go rebuild them. So, that's kind of the first I don't know if it's a question or statement. You know, Mary, it sounds like you want to comment on it. [clears throat] Um, [clears throat] so Ken, I understand, is online as well. And so, um, if there's something that I can't answer, I think he's there. [clears throat] And we also have our project manager on the on the staircase. Um, sorry, she's here as well that can answer anything. Um, the stairs that we are in the process of building are just a complete replace of the existing stairs. So, it's not any changes. Um it's it's I believe it's going under an emergency permit or we're that's what we've been discussing. Um and so it's just replacing the parts of the stairs and

and um the foundation of it. So unfortunately we may have to do something else if it turns out that we want to improve have a longer term longer term. Yeah. Longer term would require more permitting and more design. Okay, fair enough. Yeah. And again, I think the only other question I had was um [clears throat] if one of the priorities and it sounds like it was about finding out about the sand, I'd love to know the cost. You know, the sooner the better cuz I was looking at these times. You know, this is like a year and a half out to get through the whole process. And it'd be great if we had, you know, some estimates of how to do some of this stuff sooner rather than later. And and great information. Thank you.

You have a question, Commissioner Ross? Yeah, it's it's kind of a question and a comment. So, there's a a lot of monitoring that's as part of this plan. And I guess my question is for us, who's going to do that and who's going to coordinate it within the city? Because it's nice to talk about groups doing it and stuff like that, but I know I'm not qualified to tell you what the leng the width of the beach is and you know, so sand depth. So, so who who does the monitoring and who in the city kind of puts this all together to say here's when we hit a trip wire cuz right now I don't know we have the in infrastructure with people to do that.

Yeah, we we've just met about that before and I think that'll be probably be one we just got a a sort of on call contract with the city so that'll probably be one of our first task orders especially if you guys all nod and say yes please. Um so try and help to do that so it it becomes something that's more seamlessly implemented. Um you know there'll probably be discussion of cameras on the beach and things like that. Um it's been had all over the you know all over the world where there's a surf camera. Um, so, uh, you know, we can get presentations, but we'll we'll put together some thoughts on where what some of the key needs are and how we can implement them. It's sort of quickly at somewhat of a low cost because, you know, I mean, there's some consultants who say, "Yeah, I'll do that for a quarter million dollars every year. You know, I'll walk the beach." And there's lots of ways to do that automated, bringing the community in. And so, we'll try and find the right path there and lay out some steps. There might be some bigger investments with all the sand scoured. We want to get out and do a really detailed survey of all the sandstone outcrops or something like that or all the commments. [clears throat] But, you know, for the most part, I think we're just going to try and get some stuff set up so that this is another plan that the city's written that says you need to do beach monitoring and it hasn't been done since the '9s. So, we'll we'll try and get something.

David, can I ask you a question? Certainly. Sorry. That's okay. [laughter] Um, when do you anticipate finishing up all of your research and giving us all of your recommendations?

So, we're going to take feedback here. Uh, it went to Coastal Commission. Um, so we're waiting to get their feedback. Um, we've had really good discussions with staff about this project in particular. We've done some really innovative approaches and modeling that they're kind of looking at as sort of state of the science and state of the practice. Um, so we, you know, they they're giving it a really detailed look, but we should get those back probably end of February, I'm guessing. And so hopefully, you know, spring, you know, hopefully end of March. April Fool's Day is one of my favorite days of the year. So that would give us and if you're looking at end of March and planning commission is looking to start to act on this in summer or fall that's giving them us 3 to 6 months at at most.

Yeah. I don't think there's anything dramatic that's going to change in terms of the content. There might be some add some stuff or I don't know if we you know that can go but most of the findings are pretty concrete. I don't think there's going to be any ma I don't anticipate any major changes. Um we've had a couple reports go to the coastal commission and they're like that's cool. Can you fix there's a spelling error on page seven or something like that. So again it we don't know but I don't anticipate major changes. Certainly enough pieces here and some policy recommendations in there that we can start drafting policies. So, it's my understanding then that you'll be coming back to us with your recommendations. We'll consider what what those recommendations are and we'll make decisions on what how we think we should go go forward, what path that we should take.

Yeah, I think there's how much of the pathway and recommendations and sort of you know we've presented a lot of steps. what steps do we take first and that would be guidance that you know you guys I don't know how you guys give to them they give to council council says go forth so um I think those next steps and where do we you know when how we fund the nourishment study for example if that you know monitoring you know we're going to start getting on that so some of these things will you know will just have to be determined that way um and then again once some of the results of those then you know if anybody's like we really don't like any of that I don't know what we do then [laughter]

okay I'm just trying to look at the the timing part of it so it it depends you getting it to us first us looking at it reviewing it deciding a path it's on the website now yeah can I just ask a quick question on this following this so when you're coming back to the planning commission you're projecting uh this next presentation in the summer fall. Is that just going to be regarding the the adaptation part or that's not going to be the policy part? Policies. It's going to be the policies. So, what is going to is there you're working on the policies now. So, what is the process for input on the policies from the commissions? I mean, are we expected to do that at this meeting? Yes.

I mean, I I'm not I don't know about anybody else. It's a lot of information to digest and I'm certainly not ready to give any policy. So, our consulting team is um they're working on the draft policies and once they have um the policies in place that are presentable, they'll bring it to the the planning commission and so so at the the meeting here in the center that would be the opportunity for input from the commission on the policies. Yeah.

Okay. I mean if you have any guidance you know or information the this report won't be finished and you know for a couple of months and so if there's some information that you want to provide um we will post the final um adaptation pop um on the website it's um it's through the public works department environmental programs is where all of the different documents are placed. Um but I don't believe we have another um presentation of these strategies, the actual strategies. Well, I would make a suggestion that we have another joint meeting when they when you bring the policies back because there's been a lot of a lot of good comments here and from these people and uh I think that you know that would be a better opportunity to repeat this kind of a a forum to uh put input on the policies that are presented.

Okay. So, that's that's what I'm going to push for. Okay. Go ahead, Kelly. A question on could you go back a few slides? It was like your immediate next steps or your immediate suggestions. I think it said immediate on the title. I think as you're working on uh this one recommended recommended studies. Okay.

So, [snorts] uh I recall a couple years ago we did a walk along the beach and we saw this um fourth area looked like this a few years ago, right? a lot of we could see the rebetments were had some deferred maintenance etc. And I think it would be really it was interesting we've learned and we've had some conversations about this at Forest and Beach that as a city we used to do proactive work in the wintertime to help shore up or before winter to help try and protect the beach to mitigate the leaky the sand loss. And I'm not sure when that stopped but it was 2015.

Okay. 2015. So it's it's been gone for for a while now, a decade, right? And so we in Forest and Beach had asked to have just a review of what did we used to do and how was that helpful? And I don't know if any of the things we used to do would be helpful today. But uh I heard the reason all of that stopped was that we didn't have budget for it. So the beach has deferred maintenance all over our town, but the beach definitely has some deferred maintenance. And so it would be really helpful when you talk about these immediate actions. Some of these are immediate because like our seaw wall on the south end of the beach now like we had storms two years ago where the water was all the way at the top of the wall. So we're already experiencing in Carmel what you had in some of those pictures is like future scenarios. Yeah.

Are here. So, I think if there's any way to um highlight where we have deferred maintenance, what the immediiacy of some of those needs might be and estimates of rough estimates of what they could cost. You know, when we walked on the beach a few years ago, the team said, "Oh, we'd have to have another study to tell you how much it would cost." Right? But I think for for people who are just as a practical matter, some range of cost would be useful because what I seem to recall is it was tens upon tens of millions of dollars to go in and address these.

So, [sighs] phase one, task two report, I think there was we we did when we first started the one of the first tasks was every inch of armoring condition, right? and sort of that really highlighted where immediate action was recommended and that some of that I believe may have ended up in this current contract to do some coastal engineering around. Um I'm not sure all of those details yet. Um we're going to kind of be helping the city navigate that and some geotech so we can start to get some of these answers. Um

but I don't think we've done [snorts] done anything yet, right? And so I think just making sure that highlighting what's immediate and needs attention and rough costs could really help us within the community become advocates and take action because when it's it's like oh this would be nice to do it it doesn't have the same impact that's all. So some kind of plan around yeah I don't would be helpful to embro it used to cost them to do that sort of movement of sand around and so we have some of that document.

Yeah. Okay. We can maybe get a couple pull a couple pieces together and you know let staff present some of that that we have readily that we've kind of already done in this in our workflows. Um, and the cost estimating, you know, I think it all of it probably costs $10 million, but you know, maybe 20% really needs to be done in the next 5 years. Um, and so how do you phase that? Let me give you an example. This is not very complicated to do that. You can do it on a mountain, right? Yeah.

So, you take the size of the beach, right? And I I'm a little concerned that you don't know the size of the beach, but let's say it's a mile long and it's about 300 ft wide in average. I did the numbers. We need about 60,000 tons of sand to raise it 1 foot. Now you saying that the erosion is 3 ft or whatever for the tree that you were mentioning, right? 3 ft is 180,000 tons of sand. Now you look it up and there's a standard capsiz vessel that you can rent that will bring you 180,000 ton of whatever to the bay. My understanding is that you only need to dump it and then the nature will take care of distributing the sand. So the cost of bringing a ship with 200 with 180,000 tons into the bay and dumping it is shouldn't be that high. It shouldn't be 10 million. It should be more like a less than a million, maybe half a million. There there's a range of other costs in there. And if there was no regulatory considerations, mitigation requirements, then just doing it wouldn't be, you know, I I'd say probably 3 to 5 million is probably a better ballpark rough estimate without doing a lot of that. There's all kinds of unknowns about regulatory viability, permits, impacts,

all of that. So I love the pract pragmatic approach there. [laughter] Um and you know some places the sand is needs five feet some places it needs 10 ft and so it's variable but but the waves distribute the sand. My understanding is that it over the year it will be distributed. Yeah, it definitely sorts it, but um you know, we want to put it on the back of the beach so you can't just dump it because it doesn't get to the back of the beach as quickly.

We want it on top up on the sand ramps so that we're maintaining a lot of volume of sand for a longer period of time as it slowly trickles down. Um, and that also reduces a lot of the impacts to the beach and ecosystem and habitats that often drive mitigation costs and and extra fees up. So, there's a lot of other considerations. Um, and then what it's going to take to get the sand. Cuz if we're going offshore in a marine environment, that's a lot more than or if we're barging it down from British Columbia or, you know, there's there's all a lot of other I won't say hidden cost, but it's it the the volume, you know, and [snorts] availability, and I'm impressed you got that far in that short of time. Um there's some very back of the envelope stuff.

No, but it's important to understand the impact on the community because when you tell people we're going to bring a new beach, they're thinking of trucks blocking Highway One. They're thinking about all the traffic congestions and parking issues and it's nothing like that. If we bring it over the ocean, there will be no traffic impact at all. Right. Right. So,

right. But we're we're kind of getting the cart in front of the horse because we have a there's going to be a long review process here. there's going to be capital improvement studies and once we get down to a specific problem as you as you've mentioned there's a lot of regulatory uh oversight that that goes on. So uh but I but I I really want to commend you the amount of work that you've done and presented to us. This is is really amazing work. So uh I'm I'm very impressed. I'm sure everybody is. At any rate, unless there's Yeah, we got a couple of questions and let's kind of wrap it up. Yes, please. Thank you

for comments too. Uh I have a a question and thank you for your presentation and also all your studies and and work. Um you you mentioned a coastal hazard overlay zone and uh Carmel we have uh a beach and repairarian overlay zone. Could you please explain the difference between the two? Um I'm not as familiar with the the beach overlay zone as much. I haven't been working on the policy stuff too deeply yet. um the coastal hazard overlay zone. Um I'll kind of use the example you used of of a basement. If you had a coastal hazard overlay, you know, that can often trigger additional reporting requirements. And

forgive me. No, I I understand. I what I was interested in is how it differs from what we already have. And are there other municipalities that are doing this? Yes, there's quite a few um that I've worked with. I think Ventura County, um, Marina, um, great. So, we have some others that have overlays and it's usually additional reporting requirements if you're in there, like if you're going to dig a basement, how's it going to affect cliff stability, answering some of those. Um, and then, uh, also sort of some of the hazard disclosures,

of course. Thank you. Thank you. And and I also and I had a request actually for Miss Bilsy um as we're going forward um and your um your staff report. U I love a summary with four bullet points. I think that's awesome. [laughter]

And [snorts] [gasps] there are quite a few recommendations in uh the report today about immediate actions and near-term actions, you know, broken up in the three zones. Um I think that um at least for me as a planning commissioner, it would be extraordinarily helpful if there was a summary um just of of those uh actions the immediate and and near-term especially those you know for instance part of the report says um you know in the near term the city must and that's a rather strong word right must you know commit to to long-term monitoring and maintain existing armoring and so on and so on. So I think what the next time we review this um I think it would be very very helpful to have a city specific summary.

Sure. Uh that will uh we can refer then to this larger report but that may help focus us on what to to address. So thank you. Thank you. Okay. I'm going to just uh ask the public if they have any questions one last time. And you have a question. Commissioner Allen. Go ahead.

I don't have a question. And I just have a comment on the cameras um and your reference to monitoring the beaches. Um I think in this community you're going to get a ton of push back for that. So I love the um coast snap option of where somebody can take a picture and submit it versus um cameras monitoring the beaches. Um I don't I wouldn't go with that. Okay. Um yes, point noted. Um we'll bring sort of a options and you guys can

discuss. We're good. Okay. Um I want to thank everybody for their presentation and I think we are adjourned. So Tamara, I didn't quite understand what you were