Planning & Zoning - Regular Meeting

Good evening everyone. Welcome to the Brian County Planning and Zoning Commission and Board of Adjustments for April. Uh first item on the agenda is our call to order and a few brief chairman's remarks. First, I would like to welcome Michael Saparo. Did I get the last name right? Great. to um our planning and zoning and board of adjustments. Thank you for serving. Thank you. Thank you. And um I just next want to um extend our uh condolences to one of our fellow commissioners, Michelle Guran, at the loss of her um precious husband last month. So, uh we miss you tonight, Michelle, and um we are thinking of you and praying for you. Next um item on the uh what I'll read is just a few brief chairman's remarks. Um so kind of how the meeting works is staff will present a summary um for recommendation. Um the applicant will speak and then we will have public um hearing. So if you have not filled out one of the speaker slips, you can do that um at this time. Um if you wish to speak um and you did not get to fill one out again, you can they just see you, Don, or go to the podium. go to the podium. Depending on the number of speakers, um, we may enact a three minute time rule, but if you need more time, we're we're lenient on that. If you have a large group, maybe designate one or two people if you're going to say the same thing just for time sake, but you are all it's a public hearing, so you are all welcome to speak. That is that is what we're here for is to listen to you. Um after the public hearing we close that meeting then we take a vote for the first part of it for the board of adjustment. This um commission is the final say on that although there is an appeals process if you need to know that after you can speak to staff. The second part of the meeting planning and zoning

is um a recommendation body to the board of commissioners. So with that, we will proceed on to item number two on the agenda, which would be the minutes approval for March 17th. So may I have a motion to approve those minutes? Make a motion to approve. Second. Okay. All in favor? Any opposed? Great. Um, next item on the agenda will open public hearing for board of adjustment. So may I have a motion to open public hearing for this will be variance project 20260136. Motion second. All in favor? Uh we are now in public hearing. Brett, good evening. Good evening.

So this first project uh is a variance on at 215 Willow Lane. The applicant is requesting to reduce the front setback from 50 to 22 feet, the rear setback from 50 to 14 feet, and the right side setback from 35 to 30 feet uh in order for to add an addition to an existing home. So, just a little bit of background. This is on the north side of the county, very close to where Highway 280 and 204 intersect. And you can see a closer up location map here where it's off of Athens Church Road. And the house itself was built in the 1940s. And the lot is only 0.2 acres in size. So, typically with a non-conforming lot like this, if you were to just renovate a house, what was there existing, um, it wouldn't be an issue because it's already non-conforming in nature. The applicant did add an addition onto the house, uh, which you can see from these photos. This addition was without any permits. So, when he came through, um, he needed the variance in order to satisfy county requirements for that addition since the addition is now encroaching further into the side setback. And with working with the applicant, he's actually proposed to move the house slightly forward, which you can see on the concept plan here. The red line shows where he's proposed to move the house. The gray area shows where it's currently at. So, it'll actually make the the house more conforming than what it is now. Um, as it sits now, it's a little bit over the property line. Um, and so with that, staff is recommending approval of the variance, and I can answer any questions that you all may have. No. Thank you for working with that applicant.

Yes. Appreciate that. Any questions for Brett? No. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. And is the applicant here? Yes, I am. Yes. Would you like to speak, sir? Okay. Welcome. Good evening. Good evening. Hi. And just um and everybody, I think I forgot to say this. Um just say your name into the microphone. Sure. Sure. My name is Russell Lee. Good evening. Thank you. Yes. Any questions, comments, or concerns?

No. No. I mean, I would just mention that um you know, as Brad said, the house was built in 1940. There were two houses on the lot, so I took one of the houses down. Um removed that, so that sort of made it a little more conforming. I did add about 6 to 8 ft onto just the side of the house. Um the existing house as it was before the addition, it turned out the back corner of the house had been sort of off the plot line going back to 1940. said this was probably, you know, a family piece of property and they sort of carved out a, you know, small cottage type house for somebody in the family. But, um, the idea is to kind of bring it back to the tax roles. And it sits in a wooded area. So, there was 80 acres just right behind it, which has been subdivided into um I think the minimum lot is like five acres and there's maybe an eight or nine acre lot. And then sort of where my house sits, there are two other non-conforming house lots. Um, so you know, the plan was to sort of make it more conforming, get the house moved back onto the property line, of course. And so essentially what I'm doing is just moving it back closer to the center of the property.

Great. Sounds like a lovely piece of property. It It's really beautiful. It's a small small lot, but it's situated right in the middle of the woods, so it's quite nice. Very nice. Very nice. So, yeah, I hope that you folks will consider um you know, approving it. Sounds great. Any questions for Mr. Lee? No. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. And and just by the way, what what is the process for the approval? Do you um take it under consideration and then So, we'll vote tonight and then um we'll next I'll um open it up to anyone that may be for or against the item and then we'll close public hearing. We'll take a vote and then that's kind of it.

Okay. Yeah. Great. All right. Thanks. So you you'll know tonight. And then also guys, um after your item, you don't have to sit through this long meeting. If you don't want to, you're more than welcome, but if you would just exit out that back door where you came in quietly. Um you don't have to sit through the whole thing. Okay. Great. And and will the results be posted online or would I know? Yes. Yes. Okay. Okay. Yes. You'll you'll know in about three minutes. Oh, good. Good. Oh, good. Okay. Thank you.

Set the timer, Amanda. All right, guys. Um, there were no um speaker slips for this item, but I'll give one last chance for anyone to speak for or against. No, Mr. Lee's happy about that. Then I'll take a motion to close this public hearing. Make a motion to close. Okay. Second. All in favor? Okay. Motion um excuse me, public hearing is now closed. May I please have a motion uh for variance project 20260136? Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Any opposed? So approved. Thank you.

I thought you had said that before. No. No. No. You can dance your way out if you would like to. No. Thank you. All right, guys. Um, next item on the agenda is variance project 2026013. May I have a motion to open public hearing? Motion to open. Okay. Second. All in favor? We're in public hearing. Sarah.

Uh so this is another variance application for 794 Milh Hill Road. Um the applicant is requesting um to reduce the I apologize to to reduce the westside setback from 15 ft to 10 feet in order to place a carport on the property. Um and in these photos you'll see um sort of on the right hand side um where they are looking to do that as well as a little bit closer up on that existing driveway where they're wanting to place it. Um and you can see the proposed location on the site plan as well. In terms of the variance criteria, the there is an existing garage in the house, but this was closed in and finished. Um so it doesn't function as a garage any longer. Um, so the owner would like to construct this carport in order to protect their vehicles as well as expand the existing driveway um, 5T into that 15t side setback. Um, and this permits a carport that's just large enough to cover two cars. Um, without expanding the driveway, the only option for placing the carport would be in front of the house, um, which is not permitted in the ordinance. Uh, there are several factors that create a hardship on this property, uh, including some existing trees as well as the width of the lot narrowing towards the rear. Um, the home is also set back much farther than the required 30-foot front setback. Um, so the large front yard limits the location since they can't place accessory structures like carports there. Um, if it was limited to the area in the setbacks, it would probably not be functional and they wouldn't be able to place it there. Um, staff did find the request to be consistent with the ordinance and so staff is recommending approval of the variance. Um, and I can answer any questions you have.

Questions for Sarah? No. Thank you, ma'am. Do we have the applicant here? Good evening. Good evening. How are you?

Good. I'm Ryan Claus with Five Quarter Architecture. Um, thank you for your review. Thank you staff for your help. Um, it's fairly straightforward and um, you know, the limiting factors were clearly um, expressed. The reality too that I will stress is we're putting this carport directly where the existing um, driveway is. So really we're limiting the impact of anything that would be different simply trying to cover it up. I'll say too we initially explored doing more of a covered structure in terms of like a garage type structure and this has been reduced to much more of a open um heavy timber. Um I say heavy, it's more of just a timber structure. So it's more light, less imposing in general. And of course we did the owner wanted to keep it to the side which is also in keeping with the ordinance to the side of the house. Um so we you know we appreciate the recommendation. We agree. Um we are extending a little bit of the back part of the driveway simply to allow the depth of the cars to fit underneath the carport. So um I think that's all I have.

Okay. Thank you. Any questions? Is this one then a subdivision? It's in the back of Strathy Hall part of No, they're not they're non HOA back in that part. Yeah. Sorry to jump in. Sorry. Yep. Any other questions? Okay. Thank you. All right. We have no speaker slips, but anyone for or against this item that would like to speak? No. Okay. With that, any further questions or comments? No. All right. May I have a motion, please, to close this public hearing? Motion to close. Second. All in favor?

Okay. Public hearing is now closed. May I have a motion for this variance project 20260143? Make a motion to approve. Second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? So that variance passes. Thank you. Uh may I have a motion, please, to open public hearing for variance project 20260157? Motion to open. Second. All in favor? We are now in public hearing.

Uh this variance is request for property that's located at 573 Warell Drive. Um it's in the point at Cape Hardwick neighborhood. Um the applicant is requesting to reduce the rear setback for both a pool and the surrounding ongrade deck around it um in order to construct them behind the house. Um so the requested variances are to reduce the rear setback from 25 ft to 6 feet for the closest point for the pool and to reduce the rear setback for the deck from 5t to 3 feet at the closest point. Um, and in these images, you can see the front of the house, um, as well as the sort of general area where the rear of the property, um, where they're wanting the pool to be located. Uh, in terms of the variance criteria, the applicant did state, um, that without the variance, they couldn't place the pool directly behind the house as they want. Um, and that it is located 25 ft from the DNR jurisdiction line. Um they also indicated that um it's a unique location because they have that water on both sides and staff does acknowledge that that is unusual um as well as the shape of the property. However, it's fairly it's common in the neighborhood so it's not unusual to that specific property. Um staff also understands that the required sebex would preclude locating the pool in the area proposed by the applicant. Um, however, we did not identify this as a hardship as the pool could be located to the side of the house as they have a large sideyard um and meet those setbacks and other requirements. Um, so staff did not find the request to be consistent with the ordinance and did not find a hardship. Um, so staff is recommending denial of the requested variances. Um, and I can answer any questions you may have.

Can you because in the packet it was hard to see the photo. Can you pull it back up where I can see um the sideyard that So I don't have I know what specific image you're talking don't have that specific image, but you can see the front of the house um on the right. It sort of extends past and you'll see on that site plan as well that white area that's where the sideyard is. Okay, thank you. Any addition, guys? Any questions for Sarah?

No. Okay, thank you. Um is the applicant here tonight? Good evening. I'm Julie Secure. I'm John Secure. Hi. Nice to have you. Go ahead. You can say whatever you would like. Okay. Just wanted to mention the um so the the rear setback was a bomb. The DNR came in and said that we had to have a 25 25 set back from their line.

So there's no neighbor obviously on the back. it's the river and there's no neighbor on the front. It's the river. So, the only neighbors are on the light on the left and the right. Both of them are not opposed to us doing the pool in the back. So, the the side property um if you ever been to the point, it's a real unique place back there. If we're to put a pool on the side, comes with a privacy fence and all that stuff which obstructs the view for everybody going back to see, you know, to enjoy the view back there. So, we don't want to mess the side up. Um it is a it is a tight variance. to realize that, but DNR has approved it. I know DNR variance is different than the county difference or the variance, but um anyhow, so we had to build our house back that far because we got to um supply access to our neighbor um with a road. So, in front of that road is a huge live oak. It's 200 years old. We we um kept the live oak, moved the road in closer, which mean moved the house back further on the lot. So, it's just a unique piece of property. It's kind of hard to go by the variances, I guess. But the neighbors have not, you know, gone against us there for it. It's just the the riverside. So, it's a small 10-ft splash pool. It's not a big Olympic size swimming pool. So, we'd appreciate y'all's

It's beautiful piece of property. That's a gorgeous road back there. It is beautiful. And if you could see from the the other picture that did show the front of the house, the road is right on that side property. We we couldn't have without a a privacy style fence and then again that would just block the whole point and the significance of the property. Sure. Yeah. Guys, any questions for the applicants? Michael, go ahead. The uh the pool is it like is it a rectangle? Like what's the it's 10 it's 10 by 25 I think it is. Um it's um it's actually 29 feet off the DNR um high high water mark,

which is also what the county tax map shows. It was just the property marks were set well inside off the bluff that we which of course you go by the when we did the survey, but the actual bluff and the high water mark. We're in compliance with that. The the the county tax um line is another 9 ft past the DNR mark. So that's we're paying the taxes on is almost in the river basically. That's where the tax line is. So the DNR line is this side of the the tax assessor line. Any other questions?

Indicated staff indicated you indicated that it was kind of messed up. Is this road in your area heavily traveled just private road? It gohead. Well, it's um first of all, it's I don't know if you're familiar with the point, but it's seven mile bend and so it's a peninsula. The city of Richmond Hill actually uses it for their logo. So, it go the river's on both sides. It's the R.

Yeah, the R. The R for Richmond Hill. Um the road is heavily traveled with deliveries and construction and landscaping. People walking coming through there take in the afternoons their dogs and golf cart rides come to watch the sunset there and it it is very well traveled. Even the Richmond Hill Society his come back there take tours back there sometime. So it's it's it's pretty pretty well viewed

back there. So, we had originally um and um the the the side of the house is um for like a mother-in-law suite anyway. So, that that that property, you can see where that space is is perfect place for my mother-in-law to come build right there. It's basically the yard, our front, the way that the house is situated. And that and the road runs right through it. So, we wouldn't feel comfortable with bathing suits without a privacy fence, which would defeat the point. Guys, any more questions? No. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.

Um, no speaker slips for or against, but anyone in the audience to speak? No. With that, may I have a motion to close this public hearing? Motion. Second. All in favor? I we um public hearing is now closed. May I have a motion please for this variance project 20260157?

I make the motion to approve. I'll second. Okay. All in favor? I Okay. Any opposed? No. So that is approved. Yeah. Thank you guys. Thank you. Uh may I have a motion please to open planning and planning and zoning public hearing uh reszoning project first 20250575.

Somebody make a motion. Did someone make a y'all? Second. All in favor? Okay. We need a energy drink up here. Sarah. Okay. We are now in public hearing.

Um, so this is a reszoning request for three parcels located off of Harvey Road, uh, totaling approximately 9.56 acres. They are currently zoned RR1 Rule Residential, and they are requesting to reszone to I2 General Industrial. Um the proposed use includes a rail spur, loading and unloading of rail cars, storage of materials um and separation of materials in support of the um asphalt plant that's under development across Harvey Road. Um and as I mentioned, this property is located across Harvey Road um from property that's already zoned I2 General Industrial that is being developed for that asphalt plant. Uh as you can see these images, Harvey Road is an unpaved countymaintained road. Uh the surrounding zoning includes rural residential um and general industrial. There are also areas zoned agricultural uh nearby. The rural residential and agricultural properties are either undeveloped or developed for residential purposes. Um the staff found that the proposed resoning is not compatible with these rural residential and agricultural properties. Um though that railroad to the north um does help create a separation between uses. While the property across Harvey Road is zoned industrial, expansion of industrial use across this road um could include create further encroachment of incompatible uses. Um it may also be an impediment to those properties that are zoned rule residential from developing for that residential use and conflicting with that character. Um, in terms of the resoning being compatible with the comprehensive plan, um, these three partials were changed from a rural residential character area to an industrial character area um, by the board of commissioners on March 10th of this year. Um, so they are compatible. The surrounding areas remain in that rural residential area. Um, in terms of a concept plan, um, the concept plan provided by the applicant um, is very general. It just shows the proposed rail spur. Um, so it doesn't really have sufficient information for

staff to do a full analysis of the impacts of the proposed reszoning. Um, the applicant did request a waiver to the requirement for traffic study. Uh, this was denied by the engineering department. Um, the applicant also did indicate that the use of rail would decrease the truck traffic. Um, but again, we didn't receive a study. Um, so aren't able to provide analysis on that. Uh, following the denial for that waiver, the applicant chose to proceed without doing the submit the required traffic study. Um, so we can't provide a detailed assessment of that impact. Um, but staff does have concerns with Harvey Road as an unpaved county road. Um, that's not designed for heavy truck traffic or related industrial traffic. Um, so expanding this use was likely to create more impacts that could also damage the road. Um, and we also don't know what the impact of expanding that railroad across Harvey Road would be. Um, they also didn't provide a detailed site plan or storm water information. So, if approved, um, we would require this information. um be provided via civil plans for review and approval. Um though we do have some concerns about possible runoff from the site and how this will be addressed based on proposed uses including that storage and separation of materials. Um there are also some potential wetlands on the site. Um so any impacts for these would require Army Corps permits. Um, so based on the findings within this report, staff is recommending denial of the requested resoning to IT General Industrial as excuse me as the applicant has not provided sufficient information for staff to fully evaluate potential impacts. Um, it lacks a detailed development plan showing the location of proposed uses and operational logistics. Additionally, it is accessed via Harvey Road, which is an unpaved countymaintained road. Um, and the required traffic impact assessment was not completed. If it is approved, we do have some recommended conditions. Um that a minor plat be submitted, approved, and recorded to combine the three subject lots. Prior to proceeding with any additional permitting, prior to the approval of any land disturbance permits, the applicant shall comply with

section 114-428 traffic impact assessment of the unified development ordinance. Um and then number three, the applicant shall obtain all required clearing, grading, and site development permits to address storm water management, site access, buffers, tree preservation, soil erosion control, etc. prior to commencement of any on-site operations. And the applicant did late this afternoon provide this site plan, which we have not analyzed or looked at. Um but I they did request it be included in the presentation. Um so they may discuss that further, but I can answer any questions you may have.

I have a question, Sarah. Um, was the choice given, I'm sure it was, but was the choice given to defer this to later till we get more of this information like the traffic impact? Yes, we had a lot of discussions about possibilities and they wanted to proceed. They wanted to proceed. Okay. Questions? No. Thank you, Sarah. Um, is the applicant here tonight? Good evening, gentlemen.

Good evening. My name is Jim Gerard. I'm with Oliver Maynor and um representing the petitioners in this case. One being the Harvey family which owns one of the parcels, the middle parcel which is about 6.5 acres and the Southern Metals and they also own uh a little 1 acre piece that's adjacent to the 6.5 acre piece. and Southern Metals actually owns a little 1 acre square right at the southeast quadrant of Harvey Road and 280. If I may, I just wanted you all to um have a copy of the site plan so that you'd understand what we're asking tonight. I approach that

please. And thank you. That's appreciated for our old eyes, not you, Michael. I can I can pass down.

I'll pass down for you. Thank you. As staff pointed out, uh this is a 9.36 acre parcel at the quadrant of Harvey Road and 280. Uh the property that is owned by the Harveys uh is presently under contract uh for purchased by Southern Metals. Southern Metals wants to be the owner of the entire 9.3 acre tract. The property does not have access to 280. The only access to the property is off of Harvey Road. Um the purpose of the resoning is to supplement and support the industrial use of the property to the west which is being developed as an asphalt plant. Um the property I think one of the maps that staff brought up is right there. We're talking about a piece of property that is to the east of 164 acres of I2 property. So one of the criteria of course to reszone a piece of property is that it's a logical extension of the zoning boundary which in this case it is as far as the development of this property as zoned which is rural residential. It's right across the road from an asphalt plant that's being developed. It used to be a salvage yard, I think. And there's a railroad track to the north. And I'm not going to I don't have a real estate um appraisal study or anything like that, but I I don't think it takes that much of imagination to to realize that where you've got a piece of track that's going to parcel that's going to

be exposed to vibration, dust, a railroad to the north and 164 acres to the west that you're going to be able to market it for uh residential purposes. Um, and at the present time there aren't any water and sewer utilities to provide utilities to a residential piece of property. So, and it's not coming any anytime soon. So, if you're expecting and the Harveys are family is here and they'll tell you that they've had this property on the market for some time as rural residential and they haven't even gotten one call because it's just completely unmarketable. Um, as far as an impact study, we did ask for a traffic impact waiver. And the reason is is that our use of the property is going to be internal. We're not going to have trucks coming into the property. The purpose of it is to provide rail transportation to the ASV plant to the west. Cars are going to be coming in and out of the property. They're going to be unloaded on our track just as well as on the asphalt track. We're going to take the materials off the rail cars and separate them and then store them in the aggregate yard which is which is cited in your in the map in front of you in that specific area. So if we're if we're doing anything we are reducing the traffic impact in the area because otherwise there would be trucks coming in and out of the asphalt plant with rock material. So, uh, we're not changing the traffic pattern on Harvey Road. Same entrance. We're not going to be coming off of 280. In fact, there's going to be less impact on Harvey Road

than if things just stayed the same and the as plant was going to operate without being supplemented or supported by our parcel. U, so this is pretty logical. um um uh pattern of things to do. We're trying to take a useless property that's not ever going to be uh part of the tax base. We're going to make it into or fold it into the de the industrial development to the west and it will be productive. It will produce jobs. it. What you need to do always is if you've got an industrial use, put it in the right area. This property is prime for industrial use. It's not prime for anything else. And for staff to come here and and propose that it be used for residential, there's just no basis for it at all. And um as I said, we're just trying to accentuate the industrial features of the west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west west adjacent property which is an asphalt and make it less impactful on the community which I think which you want to do in a in a zoning pattern and I don't know whether Madison wants to say something or not

sure sure so before you speak may I ask one question just so we have the whole can you Let's throw back up the um zoning map just so we can see that I two next to the um residential. Thank you. I actually just want for public to be able to see as you're speaking what this looks like. The um color differentiation, the purple would be that I2, the green, that residential. And go ahead. I'm sorry I interrupted. Sometimes a visual helps. No,

no problem. to to Jim's point that the reason we're trying to get the industrial zoning on the Harvey parcel is to promote the use of the rail. Okay. When I operated the property myself, I ran 5 to 600 trucks in and out of there every month. That's no longer going on there. And nobody had a problem with it when I was doing it. So, I don't understand why it's a problem now. and the uh Apac has offered, we don't have we haven't made this official, but we we were making it official now. Apac at our own expense will pave the entirety of Harvey Road for the county at our own expense and we're willing to do that in exchange for the zoning. Um the

as far as the the civil engineering of it, I mean that's just a matter of getting it done. There's going to be no problem with where you divert rainwater or storm water. There's sufficient property to do exactly what we're attempting to do there. And again, to Jim's point, if you keep going west, there's it's industrial after industrial. And so nobody's going to come in here and ask for their industrial property to be zoned residential. It's not going to happen.

And I know that one of the arguments that I wasn't at the last meeting where you all considered the comprehensive plan change, but it was pointed out that a lot of the properties within the 164 acres of zoned I2 property are not actually being zon used for industrial purposes right now. And that might be true, but that doesn't prevent people from coming in tomorrow and all of a sudden and changing it. They have that right. And those that type of effect would have a negative influence on uh uh this piece of property. It would make it even less marketable. I mean, it's not marketable right now. Um but um but I think the focus should not be on so much the 164 acres of industrially zoned property but this this piece of property right now it can't be used for anything and u that's what I think is the main purpose of the request for change u and all we're trying to do is close the loop on the industrial project on the west to reduce its influence in the community and make sure that it's contained. So the two pieces, the piece that we want to reszone and the asphalt plant will be one and and it will be buffered from the rest of the properties.

Sure. Um would you put this those staff recommendations up again, please? The um the conditions. Yes, Mr. Mr. Jard, I do have one question just I think I heard this. You said there would be no truck traffic. Um everything would be by rail car and the only traffic would be employees to the facility. I don't think that I don't think that's a fair thing to say. What what he's saying is is by granting us the ability to bring the aggregate in by rail, it will eliminate the inbound trucking. Okay. Okay. Which would be significant. somewhere. I mean really significant. Okay. It won't it won't reduce completely the outbound side of it, but it will the inbound side of it.

Okay. So everything's coming in by rail car out by truck and not everything will go out by truck per se. But I would I would say as this road construction continues locally, they're going to support that road construction. So yes, they'll be trucking to those, you know, asphalt to further the the road system in this county. So can you give me just an estimate of what you think the outbound trips for trucks per day would be? Would it be 10? Would it be a 100? I can get you a number for sure. Okay. I I mean I I don't represent Apac, as you know. Okay. I am a property owner. They are my tenant. Okay.

I am speaking on their behalf tonight. um they're in Tennessee, so it's not exactly convenient. I can get you some very specific traffic information, but the reason we ask for the waiver is because essentially what we're doing is is eliminating traffic, not adding to it. So, we don't really understand why because the plant's going to the asphalt plant's going to run with or without this additional 10 acres. So the the traffic situation is already what the traffic situation is. So that's why we don't see the need to get it done. Now, we will gladly get it done if it becomes a point of contention, but I I think we could safely say that every attempt at what we're trying to do here just reduces trucking. What what is your plan for storm water management

as far as issue that that staff brought up? Address storm water management. The runoff buffers. As far as the 10 acre site goes, the 30 acres on the west side of Harvey Road has already been engineered. If you bring up the map, it's shown on the map. Uh let's see those engineered plans. The ones that the site plan I sent you this afternoon.

Yeah. If you see on the site plan that we that we submitted this afternoon, the storm water has been dealt with. This this was done by Thomas. So that site is fully engineered. This is the site on the right is a conceptual drawing. If we can make some progress, we will go through and spend the money to go ahead and have it fully engineered to capture the water and handle it properly. Okay, Mr. Go ahead, Mr. Carlo. Okay. When you were uh TV there, could you point that out on so that we can see across? Yes, sir.

Absolutely. This site is already industrial tube. It is fully engineered here locally by Tom Snow with proper storm water retention and drainage system. And this side is just merely conceptual at the moment. And if we can make some progress, we will go through and just spend the money and get properly engineered to handle. And and actually since you can see this from there so well in defense of the Hardies the problem that they have with this parcel also it is it's virtually landlocked they can't access it from this side they can't access it from this side they can't access it from this side I mean it is a very challenging piece of property Michael, did you have a

um Yeah, this hasn't been mentioned or anything, but uh is uh this is kind of like a two-part question. Uh is it going to be running 24 hours a day? No.

Uh and do we have any idea during operational hours like how much sound is going to be when that is starting? Asphalt plants in general are are fairly quiet. Um there is steam that comes off of them. Um asphalt jobs uh do go on at night and during the day. Asphalt production and asphalt application is very weather dependent and temperature dependent. So it they generally can do a lot of work most of the year down here. But the but the work that's going to be done on this property is not going to make that noise. It's the it's the asphalt plant proper. So this the storage of materials and unloading doesn't make any noise. So what's already been approved is approved. The asphalt plan is is the asphalt plan.

And let me let me point this out. If if this doesn't happen, they have plans to put more tracks to do this. And what that does is we have to double and triple handle the rail cars, which this allows us to completely eliminate that extra work. And so that is really the main goal here. That is the main goal. Any other questions for the applicants?

Would you be willing to for me that might want to see it everything give them a view of it? Sure. Okay. And that is that would mean delaying it to next month. I don't think anybody has any problem showing you the actual facility and the plans, you know, thereup. My only concern tonight is just there's so much staff concern um and um unknowns

and a few unknowns. That's right. So would a deferral to the May meeting be something that you would concede to if or do you want to us to go ahead and vote tonight? No, I want you to we want you to feel comfortable with the decision that you make. So if you need more time, by all means, um we want you to have it. And if anything that we can add to what you think you don't have already, we'll be happy to to do that. I certainly don't want there to be any unknowns because there's absolutely no reason there should be a mystery. Every question you're an you you have can be answered. I just am not capable of answering every one of those questions.

Sure. Sure. And and Apac, I assure you, is willing to go through whatever motions are needed to make you feel comfortable.

The reason I asked that qu are you a Harvey family member? Okay, hang time one second. I want to make this comment. I've done this for seven years. This is my my comment to you. The reason I say this is I've seen these situations play out before. At this point in the planning and zoning, we are a recommendation body. We can recommend it'll go before the county commissioners the next month. And what I worry is that if you do not have all the information, they're going to um go with staff recommendation of denial. And so, uh, in my opinion, I think it would behoove you to pause, get those questions answered, come back to staff with a little with all those things presented, and then move on back to us. It'll be a quick meeting. We can um vote on it in May and then go to county commissioners. And that is that will be my only comment to this neighbor to neighbor and commissioner. But go ahead, Miss Harvey.

Hey, I'm Jenna Harvey. So I am the current I'm part of the current owners of the right at 7.86 or whatever.

Um the only thing I will say is that the asphalt plant and what it is doing does not have that has no bearing. It it's not what's being voted on tonight. What we're asking for is for the rail spur and the storage. But the other thing is that the traffic study that they're that staff is asking for this property for many years was a sawmill. Then it was Gan's car crushing who operated a sawmill out of there. So, and then Madison had it as Southern Metals Recycling and he said 5 to 600 trucks. When I tell you when it was GANs and as a sawmill, it probably saw more than 600 trucks in a month. So that traffic study, I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but is not valid because it never would equate to what it was as a sawmill um or GAN's car crushing for that matter because they did operate a sawmill out of Gans's car crushing and they loaded um wood and sent it overseas as blocks. So that operated there for probably 10 plus years as a sawmill on top of GAN's car crushing. Um the other thing is that what we're asking for again I understand all the concern about the asphalt plant but the asphalt plant is already zoned I2 that that doesn't have to be voted on. What we're asking for is the rail spur and the storage on our property.

Yeah, I understand. Can I ask a question? Yes, sir. Why are you guys I mean, why are you so against a traffic study?

Well, one, it's going to be a long drawn out process and it's probably expensive. I haven't inquired about it. I know Mr. Gerard has called several engineers and as far as I know, we don't have a timeline for that. The other part of it is we have been trying to sell this piece of property to Madison and them for two and a half years that I have been working on this. Um we have had it for over 40 years. Um and there have been zero um offers on this piece of property and we are just trying we are trying to reduce our property in our family because there are multiple layers of this for this piece of property. So, a lot of people have to come to an agreement on it. And at this point, after two and a half years, we are just ready to put it all to bed with all the hoops we've had to jump through. But we don't I understand they don't mind the traffic study. It's just going to be a long drawn out process for something that is definitely much more reduced than what it was as a sawmill.

Jana, hang tight one second. Sarah, how long does a typical traffic study last and then how long to get the results back? Hang tight one second. Hang tight one second.

The problem with the traffic study and why it's really and truly not applicable is because the traffic is serving the other side of Harvey Road currently and going forward. Okay.

It's only going to serve that side of the road currently and going forward. And this side of the road that we're here talking about tonight has absolutely nothing to do with trucks. Nothing. It is merely to increase rail traffic. That's all. There is no truck trucking impact whatsoever. It is purely a reduction in traffic because If anything, it's going to bring more material in by rail, which is going to reduce any sort of inbound trucking that's already going to be going on. Okay, point taken.

Point taken. Um, so we have my last offer to you. We have owner and we have buyer. We can take a vote tonight or we can defer. We can make a motion to either I want you two to talk. We're going to take and you come back to me in two minutes and let me know what you want us to do and I will do I will extend that courtesy to you. Yes, please.

Yes. I'll go back to the staff's conditions because the the traffic is a driving factor for the staff. Um, but we did incorporate an option as a condition that get so inclined to recommend approval but tying a condition to that that still says that prior to them starting activity on that site, they still have to comply with the traffic impact assessment requirements of the county.

And we use that traffic impact assessment and the language of that condition because we want to go back to the whole ordinance section which still includes an option for a waiver. It wasn't that the waiver was just outright denied with no option for reconsideration. It's that the waiver that was presented didn't provide the engineering director with the information that was needed to fully evaluate a waiver. And so they may want to come back with more information from Apac in terms of what their actual operational trips are maybe based off of a similar facility, that might be one thing to reconsider. They wanted to continue to pursue a waiver request. Um, but if if what we're hearing from them is is a lot of time, it's perhaps money that they don't want to invest at this stage in their due diligence and negotiations with a condition on any type of recommendation and they can still be held to that, but maybe at a later date. And so I just wanted to explain the staff's condition with that option if that helps um anybody in their decision making this evening.

Okay. I the only thing that I'll say about that is I don't understand how the prevention of land disturbance on the Harvey parcel will have any impact on the trucking going on across Harvey Road. It's already zoned. It's already It's already in progress. It's already done. It's already happening. One doesn't have anything to do with the other. And that's what we put in our waiver. And that's that is really my hang up there. And to Jenna's point, when I started working on this, I had no babies. I have a two and a half year old now. I mean, we've been working on this a long time.

Sure. I I the only thing that guys Let's take a two-minute recess. All right. Thank you. Is that agreeable? Make a motion, please. For make a motion to take a two-minute recess. Second. All in favor?

We're in a two-minut recess. Could somebody start the timer, please? And I know that's not a lot of time, but It was anything towards what the county commissioners said went against our recommendation and approved it. One thing that we

Have a motion, please, to open a public hearing back up for this reasonzoning project 20250575. I make a motion to open. All in favor?

We are back in public hearing and our applicants are not back. So, can you step out and go get them? We'll pause. I'll say this, guys. We are This body um is beholden to county ordinances, but we're also here to listen. So, we do things a little um more lenient than other things, much to staff dismay sometimes. But we um we are your neighbors and we live in this county with you and we want to um make things as easy as we can for business and homeowners

for the next item. Yeah. Thank Thank you guys. I know that wasn't a lot of time, but I wanted to extend that courtesy to give you that option to let us vote and see where the chips lie in the commissioner's meeting or to for us to make a motion to defer. So, I'll let you tell us your recommendation. We'll try to work with you best we can.

I would prefer a vote, but I want you to be able to vote, you know, informatively. So if you want more information and that can be relayed to us through staff, we'd be happy to provide, you know, whatever um we think will help you make that decision. I don't know about the traffic study, but we'll consider uh the information that's requested and at least you'll have more information than you have now to to make a decision on the resoning issue. That was a very attorney answer. So, let's say do you deferral or vote tonight?

Deferral. Deferral till May. Okay. All right. Thank you guys. I just want to be very certain about one thing that everybody in this room, staff included, understands that the traffic impact assessment has no application to this 10 acres. You have made it clear and we have heard it. I say that sincerely. Okay. All right. Thank you. So, um, continue to work with staff over the next 30 days. We'll come back and rendevous in May and make the vote. I would like a a detailed list of each and every question. We'll we'll get it all. Okay.

But I do want to say like we need to know closing out with this deferral in the public meeting what that information is like what what this board is looking for them to provide to come back with. Okay. I would agree with that. So in the motion we need to address those are I I would do a motion to defer. I would be very clear with what your expectation is in terms of the information for them to provide for us to receive. Okay. So can we talk it out now or should we make the motion and then talk it out after the second?

So I think what we need is one we need to continue public and then you can make a mot and then go into discussion. Okay. To clarify this. Okay. Thank you. Okay. All right, guys. Gentlemen, thank you. Thank you. All right. I have no public um speaker slips for this, but is there anyone in the audience for or against?

I love the thumbs up. Okay, put that in the minutes, Don. Thumbs up from the lady on the front row. All right, with that, um, may I have a motion to close this public hearing? Second. All in favor? I Okay, motion. Um, we are now out of public hearing. May I have a motion for this reasonzoning project 20250575? And then once you make the motion, we'll pause, discuss, give recommendations for the motion. I'll go ahead and make a motion to defer. I'll second that motion.

Okay. So for defer when you want to defer to defer to the next meeting, we'll be on your side of town. Um, so what recommendations do you want? Traffic. No, you don't care about traffic. No. Okay. Not not you don't care about it, but yes. Okay. Storm water. Is that definitely storm water? Okay. Storm water. Traffic. You want traffic. Okay. traffic.

Okay. Anything else? Okay. So, who made that motion initially, Scott? You did, Stacey. So, so that we're in or make the motion with these recommendations. Okay. I need to Well, I'll make a motion to amend my motion and with specific items to be addressed to include storm water, road traffic, and rail traffic.

Okay. Would that along with staff recommendations. No, no, no. Just this and Jenna, you can be in touch with staff to get that specific information with Miss Amanda. Okay. So, we have a motion. And do we have a second on that amended emotion? I'll second the amended motion. Okay. All in favor?

Any opposed? So, this will be deferred to the May meeting with those recommendations and applicant can reach out to staff to get those specific items. Ber that's right. That's what you guys just decided. Yep. Yep. I'm sorry. Yep. All right, guys. June, correct? May Mayber do a first reading and a second reading. You do not. So the second though would be in June, correct?

Commissioner June. All right, with that, take a minute. Sorry, I'm a nurse and I've worked all day. my my brain is that it's okay, guys. I'm sorry. I hate to disappoint people. Um, and we want to try to do what's best with all the information. So, with that, may I have a motion, please, to open public hearing for item number two on this planning and zoning commission plan development amendment project 20260054. Motion open. All in favor?

We are now in public hearing. Uh so this is an application to amend the Magnolia Hill uh plan development for a 5acre parcel located on Belfast River Road. Uh the 2016 PD approval for and master plan for the Magnolia Hill development um showed this parcel as a 12 single family units. The applicant is requesting an amendment in order to change the use to 32 town homes. Uh and here you'll see some images um from the site. You can see that the 5acre parcel is currently wooded as well as some surrounding images which I'll show again later. Um the surrounding zoning includes R15 single family residential across Belfast River. Um this is a neighborhood directly across from the subject parcel called Simco Lake. Uh to the east is an A5 zone property developed with a single family residence as well as a portion of the planned development property which is proposed to be used as a buffer. Uh to the south and west is the planned development single family residences as well as open space within the planned development. Uh staff did find the proposed use of town homes is compatible with this existing development um as it maintains the residential character of the area while also being located along a heavily traveled arterial road making it appropriate for this more dense development proposed in terms of the character area and consistency with this the comprehensive plan um as well as the purposes of the plan development zoning district. The parcel is located within the suburban character area. Uh this area is suitable for higher density development due to existing infrastructure. Uh both multifamily and plan development zoning are identified as recommended zoning districts for this area. Uh the amendment would also meet the goals of the comprehensive plan and the plan development zoning district by providing uh diverse housing that may be difficult to achieve under conventional

zoning districts. Uh the 2016 um approval approved a total of 296 lots which was a net density of 2.28 units per acre. Um the current buildout of the plan development is 257 lots which is a density of 2.07 units per acre. The proposed amendment would result in 257 single family lots and 32 town home lots, a total of 289 lots um and a net density of 2.23 acres. Um, this does meet the requirement of the plan development zoning district to have a maximum of three units uh per acre and is also slightly less than what was approved for that 2016 plan development. Uh, in terms of services, this development would be served by county water and sewer. Um, the applicant did also complete a traffic design analysis which was approved by our engineering department. The town homes are proposed to have one access on Belfast River Road which will be stop controlled. Uh the amendment is will create an additional 212 trips which would be 106 inbound, 106 outbound. Um at the 2028 buildout staff did determine that the public facilities are adequate for this proposed amendment. Um and in terms of amenities for the development, the applicant is proposing that they utilize the Wexford amenities. Uh while these are adequate for the number of homes being added, uh the only access would be via Belfast River Road and roads internal to Wexford. Uh this would require people to either walk along Belfast River where there's there's no sidewalks for about a mile um or to drive. And so due to this lack of connectivity, we are recommending that they meet current ordinance requirements within the development itself. Um and this would be a total of 4,800 square feet of active amenity area, which is something like a playground or that type of thing. Uh in terms of open space requirements, the existing open space for the plan development exceeds the requirement. Um

it's 69.6 67 acres currently. Um so that will be met. And in terms of the proposed lots, uh they are proposed to be 2,200 square ft, which exceeds the minimum requirement for town homes under conventional zoning. Um the setbacks are reduced from those um under conventional zoning. Uh these proposed setback requirements do permit a development um that maximizes open space um while protecting that existing vegetation. They will also meet the design standards for town homes under our unified development ordinance. Um this includes things like material requirements to ensure consistency with existing development in the area. They are proposing buffers. Um so I'm going to refer to them by numbers and you'll see them numbered on there just for reference. Um buffer one which is along Belfast River. Um that a 60 foot buffer or I apologize. Buffer one is to the um to the side there. A 60-oot buffer is proposed on the east side of the property um which was approved with the 2016 plan development. Um buffer number two, which is along Belfast River, is a 50- foot buffer proposed on the north side um which was also approved with that 2016 planned development um to include plantings as well as a burm. Uh the applicant is proposing to utilize the existing mature vegetation which would preclude the use of a burm. Um and staff finds this solution to be appropriate as mature vegetation provides a substantial buffer and is encouraged to be maintained by the ordinance. And you can see um in that one image the front buffer with the burn that exists currently um in that adjacent plan development Magnolia Hill. Um and then a example of a 50-oot buffer that's across the road that's natural vegetation. Um there is no buffer proposed um where you see the number three to the west. Um, but there are wetlands and open space within the adjacent plan development that buffer those existing lots. Um, and buffer four, you'll see a 45 foot buffer is provo proposed on the

south side of the property which abuts those lots in Magnolia Hill. Under the 2016 approval, no buffer was established in this area, but that was for only 12 units of single family residential. With this change in use, um, staff was recommending that the current ordinance requirements be met. Um, so that would require a 75- ft buffer between those two. Staff does recognize that this change uh and use does impact these properties. So, we are also recommending that that 60ft buffer um along the east side be increased to 75 ft. Um so, Seth is recommending approval of the amendment to permit 32 town homes subject to the following conditions. That the buffers located on the east and south side of the development be increased to 75 ft. The north buffer along Belfast River Road shall remain undisturbed to preserve the existing mature vegetation and that they provide recreational amenities on the site of the townhouse development in accordance with ordinance requirements of 150 square feet of active recreation space per dwelling unit. And I can answer any question that she may have.

Can you repeat what the um TIA uh showed for trips per day? Yes. So that was going to be um 212 trips which is 106 inbound, 106 outbound. So 212 total. Questions for Sarah? Thank you. And do we have the applicant here?

Good evening.

Hi. Good evening. My name is William Cunningham with Coleman Company. Uh we're the engineering firm for this. Um so yes, uh Sarah did a great job describing um this is intended to I guess create a new housing type within the plan development at Magnolia Hill. Um it's you know in agreeance with the comprehensive plan um the character area and just a new you know housing type to introduce to this PD. Um, you know, for the site plan perspective, uh, a key part of the TDA and just the site design in general is lining up with that, um, entrance into the other side of the road. Make sure those are very aligned. Um, that's key because as you can see in the site plan, if you can pull that up, Sarah, um, we have to have a Yeah, you can't really see it in there, but we have essentially a a kind of odd curve that we have to do to get into the site, which kind of limits how we can sight plan it basically. Um so you know that's one thing to consider. Um I'd say about the buffers um that's a thing that's going to really inhibit the site plan. Um we took it from an approach of that it's a zoning buffer. So from PD to PD is 30 feet. So that's plan development abing a plan development district. And then for a plan development abing an A5 district is 50 feet. So, we made the site plan with the idea that we were exceeding both of those um while allowing ourselves enough space to implement a roadway that could circle around, be fire code compliant, and make it accessible. Um again, that um you know, TDA was approved by the county. Um the TDA threshold that requires trips is 200. We are just over it at 212. Um it's a very minor uh development that we're proposing. Um about the town homes, again, we would be um in compliance with all uh Brian County requirements um for

the construction itself. Um the minimum town home for Bryan County, 1600. These are 2200 square feet. Um so 600 square feet above the minimum. Um so not looking to just solely pack it out for capacity, trying to implement a good product um in this in this region. Um and we're also happy to include the 4,800 square feet of play. Um that's something else that might be inhibited. Um if we have to introduce that buffer area, it really makes the site I don't want to say undevelopable but about undevelopable. Um if you have to implement that um also try to have buffer in order to you know separate that from neighbors on the other side because you know if you have the single family then that's just you know no woods in between. Um so trying to incorporate a proper vegetative buffer that is very thick. It is is really thick out there. Um, so it screens it very well. Um, I think that's I think that's all I have for y'all. I would happy to answer any questions that you have. Um,

I I do. Um, yes, ma'am. Can you throw back up the um staff recommendations, please? And I know you said the buffer was a concern for you, but for um the recreational amenities, what are your thoughts on that? Um, so we will be compliant with the UDO and the there's a I think six or seven active recreation components in there um that we would be we would utilize in that space. So we can't determine that right now, but we would absolutely meet the UDO in that questions. No, thank you. Thank you very much.

And we do have two speaker slips. Um, the first uh was number one was Mr. Stephen Burton have more. Okay.

Good evening.

Good evening. Thank you very much. Uh yes, I'm Steven Burton and I'm a resident of Magnolia Hill subdivision. So, I'm here uh to speak to some concerns that we have myself and then others in the neighborhood of Magnolia Hill. Uh the first is just the fact that adding another neighborhood with another third 32 homes would mean that we'd have another entrance and exit off of Belfast River Road where that will then total five entrances and exits in about a little less than a th000 ft which is a lot. I mean, we have we have occasionally have wrecks now with folks coming in and out of um those different neighborhoods that are so closely packed in. So, that's first um concern that um that I have. And uh the second is an issue with flooding. Uh the gentleman from the engineering company did not mention anything about how to deal with water runoff. And uh right now we are being flooded in Magnolia Hill from the water runoff from the neighborhood across the street which is flooding into our neighborhood. And in last August, we had a rain that just simply closed off the neighborhood because people could not enter the neighborhood or exit unless they had a big

from Simco.

Yes. From Simco Simco. And of course, in addition to the um the uh water drainage sto excuse me, storm drainage that we have for our own neighborhood. So, uh, I live in the in three houses in from the entrance, uh, to the neighborhood, and it's an area that collects the water and puts it the first collection point into our storm drainage. So, that's where all the water from the neighborhoods across the street, from the neighborhood across the street comes in. And, uh, that hasn't always been that way. uh they have a real problem with that neighborhood with the lake filling up and it backs up into their yard. It's a bad problem and the county in their attempts to resolve that put in a drainage pipe from that lake out to the road. Then there's a pipe that goes under the road that was had already existed and that drains then into our neighbor. It drains down the other side of the ditch into our neighborhood. So, um, yeah, in August, I had folks from our neighborhood driving through our front yard. Uh, one woman said she just couldn't go through it because she has an electric car and she said when she went in it, it started to go in the water, her her lights started flashing. So, she drove through our front yard. So, we, you know, adding another five acres of water. I didn't if if they drain the water this new development drains it to the back of the property that would drain into I don't see any other way that it could drain but to drain into one of our retention ponds. One of our retention ponds blew out in August and had to be repaired. Um, you know, we we don't object to new new developments, but we do object to not there not being sufficient planning. And when it comes to water, you know, we were uh we were on living

on Belfast Road before we moved into Magnolia Hill. And um you know, we had our own our own lake where the water could drain into, but uh we weren't responsible for draining anybody else's property. But now it seems like that's what's happening. So before this would be approved, I would certainly like to be absolutely sure that this new development has a way of draining that water that's going to come from 5 acres of paved parking and roofing that what they're going to you know what are they going to do with it? And uh it needs to be drained back towards Tivoli where it drains out uh east. And we do own our development does own a 60-foot easement that's part of our commons area. I mean, we're willing I I would think that we're willing to work something out. I don't know, but we definitely don't want it vented into the roadway ditch and then it come down into our neighborhood. So, that that those are my concerns and I I would really be grateful if you all would take those into consideration before you make

I appreciate your comments and information. Um, as you sit down, I have a question for staff. So, um, and I just have a comment for the public, too. And this is not to negate anything that Mr. Burns said, but we see vacant property or we see a buildout and we may not know that something's been approved 10 years ago, right? That was 2016. And so, um, just for clarification on that, again, not to negate anything, and certainly the flooding. I have a friend that lives in Simco, so I know what you're talking about with that pond because he's pumped. He's pumped before out of that area. Um, just because we see empty vacant space, there could have been something a planned development approved as um this example in 2016, just not built out yet. And so tonight, just for clarification for everybody, this is not a new, this is just an amendment taking away, if I'm correct, the single family to these town homes.

12 single family 12 single family to the um town homes. And again, not to negate what you said because I know all of this flooding is a concern, but just to let you know, this is not a new plan development. It's just a um an amendment to something. Yep. Thank you again. Yes. Do you want to respond to what he said? Yes, please. Um, I apologize to you for not bringing that up originally. Sorry about that, sir. Um, but yes, so I just want to reiterate that this is to allow for the use of single family attached and we have to go through a whole different set of reviews for land disturbance permits and that the goal of that is to retain whatever we produce in storm water on site. Okay.

So, I just I just want to make that apparent for y'all um is that this is allowing for the use. we still have to go through civil documents that go that are approved by the county and to make sure that we are accounting for our development properly. Um again this is entitled to be developed. Um just trying to allow for the new type. Okay. So thank you. Appreciate that. Um second speaker slip is Scotty. Is it Huber? Huber. Hey Mr. Huber. Welcome. How y'all doing? Hey. Good evening. Who do who do you know in Simco? I'm sorry. Who do you know in Simco? Uh the Johnson's. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Very good. Right. That back um their back property. Yeah. Goes back to the lake.

Okay. I'm I'm Scott Huber. I'm the president of Belfast Lake HOA. Um do have a couple of folks here. He definitely has a point with regard to storm water. We can talk about that a little bit. But we did a community poll because we wanted to get an understanding of how the community felt about it, our community, Belfast Lake. And so we did a poll and we got probably about 90% of the the the residents were able to respond to that. and pretty much everybody opposed it. There were a couple that came back saying they need a little bit more information. I think part of it is like um the information about the approval of the 12 single family homes. I think if that was something that was known up front, I I believe I don't want to speculate right now, but I believe they wouldn't have as much objection to it as then developing 32 town homes. Right. I I I kind of want to debate a little bit about the character comment. I'm kind of curious about how that comes into play as far as the character of the the overall area and meeting that character. I mean, this is a a single family, you know, residential development pretty much all the way up and down Belfast River Road. You know, I don't know of any other apartments, town homes or anything else. I mean, this is, you know, going to stand out like a sore thumb. You know, the other part is our road is directly across, as the gentleman was pointing out, our entrance is directly across. And if we're looking at 212, you know, entrances a day, you know, back and forth, that's a significant increase. You know, we've got small kids, families, all the stuff. They're also definitely, you know, relevant when it comes down to there's been accidents because of turnouts. So many things coming in that short period of time. Absolutely. That's we see that all the time. So just a few other things of concern that I wanted to point out when it came down to just what was given to me as far as it goes based off that impact on property values. I mean everything over here is is larger for the most part. You know single family residences and then we put a huge development of 32 town homes across the

street. Granted 2200 feet is nice. You're probably going to get decent people but again we're concerned about property values. increased traffic 212 daily in and out. Again, that's pretty significant and it's directly across straight from our our our neighborhood. Um the strain on existing infrastructure, it sounds like a lot of this stuff has been taken care of, looked at and concerned. Absolutely 100%. The storm water runoff is something that is concerning for us without question. When we had the hurricane, that was a whole different scenario. But even when this last year when we had significant rain of about 8 in, we had an outflow of about 200 to 300 gallons per minute, you know, that was going out. Okay, that's not very big, but it was absolutely impacted Magnolia. I'd be very interested hearing what their storm water plan looks like because I'll tell you what, it having this lake behind the house and working with the county and the engineers and all that, it it it takes a significant amount of planning, development, and make sure that it is right for it to be right. So, I I've just I'm skeptical that it's all going to be maintained in that property. Um, but that's that's the majority of what we're talking about. Most of it was focused on quality of life and infrastructure, you know, and really kind of looking at it, that's the the consensus from the community for the most part. And I I think again looking at it, I don't believe that it really does fit in or compatible with the scale, the density, you know, or the character of the community or the area here. you know, I don't see any town homes around here. You know, going to an area further up where developed, you you see it here. It doesn't to me, it doesn't feel like it fits that character. If I look at it, that's one of the reasons why we moved to the area, this area particularly, is that it doesn't have that. It doesn't have that type of buildup. the population density when we're looking at the area right here. You know, this would increase the population density for a 5acre spot by up to 20, you know, 20 times the amount

of what's average for for, you know, Richmond Hill, which is about 790, you know, per square mile. Okay. So, it to me I think that's the majority of the concerns that the community has. So, there are a couple other people. I don't know if anybody else. Yep. Okay. Thank Thank you. Um, is are you Miss Wilkerson? No, no, I didn't do a paper. I'm sorry. No, no, you it's fine. I just want to take our turn on who filled it out and then we'll go to interrupt the flow. Thank you. That's all I got though. I appreciate your time. Thank you, Mr. Huber. Yep. I have um Wilkerson, last name. Hey, welcome. Hello.

Um good evening. My name is Shantavis Wilkerson. I live in Mcnolia Hill. And my concern is like um my neighbor Steve said is um that I don't believe that the existing water sewage or the storm system is capable of handling the additional 32 um 32 um town homes are um able to handle that. Um because I stay in a community and I know when it rains heavy and when the storms come, it's flooded. So I understand that they put out some data that said that they built something and it can support it. But me living there, I can tell you that it doesn't. The current storm system, storm water system that we have, it doesn't support that. We get flooded all the time. So, I was just wondering whether there are any kind of like engineering studies that showed that they have any data that showed that the storm um water systems that we have is capable of handling like the additional 32 um town town homes because like I said, I stay in Magnolia Hill and I can tell you it doesn't. We get flooding all the time.

Yeah. So, yeah. every just to answer your question, every time a site um plan is drawn up, the engineering for the county does look at that and that is one of because we live in coastal Georgia, right? I think my house is 7 feet above sea level. So water comes, it's there's nowhere for it to go, right?

There's nowhere. We have no mountains. It's called Richmond Hill. I'm not sure why I haven't found the hill yet, but maybe one of these BMS that they've created, but that is the frustrating part. You know, we take the good with the bad and flooding is always an issue. So, that is always the top priority of engineering because we build our houses, we live here, and then we don't want the flood. But that is a huge problem. But but that h that has been addressed. Yes. But again, we have the zero water table. So, it you know, we get these heavy rains and and things h and things do happen even with best intentions. So, Did that answer your question? It did. It did.

All right. Thank you for your time. Yeah. Thank you. Um and did someone else fill out a speaker slip? Thank you, Miss Garrett. Welcome.

All right. Thank you. Um I guess uh my concern so I live at Sim in Simco Lake and so um my concern is why the developer pivoted um from the 12 single family homes to the town homes. So I would speculate it has something to do with costs. Um and my concern is that once the town the town homes are here, the developer is not left here to deal with the long-term impacts of the town homes instead of the single family homes. Um the town homes are more of a transient type of um dwelling. they have a higher turnover rate traditionally. Um and then the obviously the major concern that we all have is um the excessive flooding that occurs already. So I know us and the gentleman across the here that came up first, we've gotten very well acquainted. We've kind of become close as neighbors because we've had arguments about the pumping because the the lake that we have behind us, it actually takes all the runoff in from everywhere from across the street like anything that's on that side from Wikllo as well. that comes in to us, which has now pretty much cut our property lines in half. And so then we've had to resort to pumping, which the county approved for us to pump. So we literally have a pump team in our community to pump every year trying to coordinate with him. And this poor guy is out here all the time, you know, by himself trying to deal with things in his community. So that way we can kind of coordinate the pumping because there's not enough there to deal with all the runoff already. Um, so I guess that's those are my concerns regarding the town homes coming in and it being much more heavy use of of traffic and personnel in the area and how they plan to mitigate all that stuff because I don't I don't think it could even be fixed according to the county. Like they've told us we can permanently pump is kind of the solution that we've been given. So, like I said, we went out and purchased our own pumps for the community in order to continue to pump. And we've got something scheduled like by like twice a year now, depending on kind of coordinate with him because all

that stuff goes right back over there to Magnolia. So, with another 32 units being put in here, I think it's just going to do just get worse. So, that's all. Thank you, Miss Garrett. Y

I have a question for staff. Amanda, could you address this? Um, so when developments, again, we live in coastal Georgia, we know there's going to be some flooding, but when we have neighborhoods like this, and we've had other neighborhoods that get in these bowls or just because of a lot of development, and they get more flooding than others. Um, can you tell me what the responsibility is for like the neighborhood versus the county just for public um, information? How does that all work?

New developments are required to do their own storm water and Mr. Cunningham the engineer for this application tonight has probably done some type of preliminary look at how this particular development is going to be able to contain their storm water improvements to manage that storm water flow on the property. Um and so whenever a new development comes in is reviewing that new development, making sure that they're meeting the requirements for the storm water improvements for their development so that they're not going to be impacted properties. But there is a point whenever that development is done completed um that the storm water improvements maintained through the community and so that's usually through an HOA and at that point it's not part of the larger county water infrastructure that the countyy's responsible for maintaining then it's the maintain function require measures on it I am not familiar with the specific issues that they're raising about development. So I'm not privy to you know those issues that have been raised or what type of conversations they might have but on a very high level that's typically where it starts county maintained by privateities.

Is that a good explanation for everybody? Amanda is a good educator so I always like for her to explain the the process. So, um, yeah, come come back up. I can't hear you. Got to come to the microphone. Yep. Thank you. Hello. What's your name, sir? My name is Mr. Wilkerson. Hello, Mr. Wilkerson.

Good evening. Uh, no, great explanation. But the cross communication between the issues that we already have in the community. She didn't know that. They wasn't aware of that. So when someone wants to develop projects, they moving forward in what they think they need to do, but they don't know the already the um existing concerns in the community. And so that's the what I think everyone is coming up here trying to speak about

the existing um problems. So yes, these plans that have been put in place from already for years and already been proposed, but today it's like new to us when we talking about these developments. It's new to us. Yes, it might have been put in 10 years ago and already been uh approved, but to us it seems new. So, I think it's it's important that everyone do their due diligence of making sure the cross communication is being done because you said something um very um you say you said a point about it's important for the the project managers to make sure they go out and do their plan, but the most important pe most important piece of that is the people. So, you know, if y'all could just make sure you listen to our voices and understand that, like Steve was talking about earlier, when we out there in the middle of the night trying to throw sandbags, try to protect our homes through the flooding because there's issues that haven't been corrected already in the community.

And so, I think, Mr. And I think what Amanda was trying to convey was after those sites are built out, correct me if I'm wrong, that then that is your private property maintained by the HOA. And that's what I was trying to Yeah. Yeah. Come on, Mr. So, and just to elaborate a little bit on and and that was a spot I've dealt with this now for about four years consistently. Unfortunately, the engineering to begin with was done incorrectly for our property. All right. And so the the drainage pipe that went from the lake itself, and I know you don't know this, but I'm addressing it because we did talk with the engineers. It unfortunately it was built incorrectly. Engineering was done wrong. All right. And so that's and this is this is in sim code. Okay.

And that's when the county did come back and we've been working with Matt, you know, he's one of our neighbors as well back behind us. Great guy. He's been helping us a lot from the the county perspective

to try to work on things to get to where they're at. once they even got it to the point where it was fixed, we still are having these type of problems. And I think that's where part of the the big concern is coming from too as well is to say, hey, we're still having this type of drainage issue, you know, even when now that it's been fixed properly and we're maintaining, you know, our the our responsibilities as the HOA with the ditch and the culbert in our property and then deferring to the county for anything that might be county related based off of that. So, I think that's part of it and want to make sure we talk about that. outside of the fact of I think if it was 12 homes, single family homes, I don't know that we'd have much of a concern versus 32 town homes. So, I wanted to clarify that a little bit.

Yeah. Sure. I have a question. Yeah. Um, have you found how how long have you lived there? Four years. Four years. Yeah. Have you found over time that this has been getting the flooding has been getting worse even with them attempting to make improvements? Yeah, it did. you know, so it the initial the it took about two years before we actually got to a point where we discovered that the engineering um unfortunately was approved incorrectly and that the pipe the drainage pipe the outflow pipe was actually on an incline and it wasn't deep enough. They fixed that. They they fixed that. They were they went as deep as they could possibly go to level out where the drainage ditch was at at Simco at Simo Lake or River Road. Okay. So they went as far down as they possibly could go with that.

Any improvements from that? A little bit. But it still goes up and over and goes into the backyard. And so if it does that, it's an 18inch pipe, right? I mean, about half full and you're pumping 700 gallons a minute out, you know, out of the 18inch pipe. And again, everything from the area surrounding dumps into that. What's your I'm sure you probably know this. What's the prevailing flood zone over there? Um actually it's about I think it's about a mile from where our neighborhood sits. It's about a mile towards like the marshland travoli and some of the other areas back there back behind their neighborhood. So are you ex

where I'm at there is it's not considered to be a flood zone. But that was part of what we were concerned about is that because of the way of the the way that the um storm water basin was developed and the drainage it flooded it flooded our road. it flooded their neighborhood and we were concerned it was actually to have to get reclassified as a potential flood zone which would increase insurance and all that stuff, right? And so that was a huge concern, you know, and you know,

as you can tell, we are very intimate with this situation. And so I think that's why we're trying to express the concern for sure. Again, just to be frank, 12 single family homes is not as bothersome to me at least. I think it fits the aesthetic of the neighborhood. I think it fits the the community and all that stuff. 32, you know, town homes to me just doesn't fit. As well, on top of the concerns about the storm water and all that stuff, he's saying we're going to contain it. Yeah. I I would I would bet a big fat steak dinner at your choice. You let me know you want to go that it's not going to happen.

And I'll just say this, we got the best um bit of advice when we moved here 15 years ago. FEMA may say you're not in a flood zone, right? You live in coastal Georgia, you're in a flood zone and I trust me, I I a lot about flood zones a lot about a lot about this over the course of the last three years. Flood zone. All right. Thank you, Mr. Huber. Yeah, Amanda. Oh, go ahead. Do would you like to speak to the question that was Yes. Thank you. Um, so just really quick, uh, again, I can't speak to surrounding waters that come in. Sure. You're you're

just pertaining to our site. Um, just for the everyone's aware. So for those 12 single family dwellings, how that site plan was laid out in the master plan was an access road that had 12 lots kind of double fronting and an access road and there was no storm water intention on it. This plan has a circular road that ideally will have storm water flow towards the middle.

So it's a very similar amount of pvious area between the roads and the lot coverage and the driveways and everything like that. But this one, this plan actually does involve a detention pond. We usually account for 12 to 15% of the pvious area of a site to be accounted for to be held on site. So, I just want to make make that aware. Okay. Mr. Wilkerson, did that answer your question? Okay. Okay. Thank you for addressing that. Yeah. Go ahead. Stephen question, Mr. Huber. Yeah, Mr. Huber. Um, Mr. Saprio has a question for you, please. I guess one quickie. Um, is so you guys live there, you get to watch this thing all day long. Is that particular piece of property where everything's supposed to be built flooding itself?

Yeah. So, what does the retention bond matter? Right. And and and that's part of I'm I'm going to be the retention pond's going to go to a certain point and then it's going to have to go someplace. Okay. We've got a storm water retention pond. It's got to go someplace. Okay. And when we get 8 to 10 inches of water, you know, it it's it's got to go somewhere, you know, and frequently. I've water table is another thing I've looked at. I've looked at this. I think I might have some type of secondary to green and you know the Florida aquifer and flooding in the area. So So we get 8 to 10 inches of water that that piece of property is flooded. Yes, it will be it will it will flood. So by right now it does it flood?

Yeah. Yes.

Any other questions for anyone? Miss Garrett, sorry. So, if you go now and it rains for two days, the area where they're trying to build at, the water comes up over the road already. So, I'm not sure. I guess if they started digging down eventually, like he said, it's the same with ours in the back once it gets to a certain height because it just kind of sits there. It has nowhere to flow to, if that makes sense. So, it just sits there. It's like a bathtub that has like no drain if it overflows. So, it just then it starts to flow over our like into the onto the road and into all of our our yards as well. Like I said, about half of our, if you go look at my yard right now, I've still got paying for fertilizer and whatever else for probably maybe 25 ft of yard that was been underwater until we pumped for I think was it two weeks or something we had to do last year, which then all goes back to him because it's supposed to go over him is what the county told us to do. Go back into these um the drains that they have in their neighborhood and then supposedly go back out back into your guys' community, right? And then flow out Right. And that's not that that's supposed to be just for their houses that they have in their neighborhood, but it's they're taking on essentially ours because we're taking on everything from the road. And so it floods even our road. Like Belfast River Road floods. So I said if if it rains two days this week and you go drive down, there's water all up to the road already if you drive down it. And so it's it's almost like that's a basin like all across Belfast River Road from his neighborhood to ours. the water just kind of sits on Belfast or goes back to him or back to us. And so, you know, when it runs off off the Belfast River Road, it either goes to their neighborhood or to ours. And then we're having to pump to get our yards back or whatever or h our lawn. And then so then he's dealing with all that over there as well. But that's what the county told us to do because she what she said is exactly what we've been doing like with the rules are that's what we're doing, but it's causing issues in between our communities. Like

I said, thankfully we haven't we've been able to get along, but I think initially it wasn't nice initially like we're doing what the county told us to do and he's like, you know, so when she said Yeah. Yeah. just got some rain that same day. I mean, yeah, it's pretty it's pretty intense. I think it would just get worse. I mean, maybe the 12 homes even, but I I personally wouldn't even recommend them building anything else if it were me. Um, but I guess I don't know. They'll figure it out. So, okay, that's all. Thank you, Miss Car. No, sorry. I don't know her name, so I'm just pointing. Ma'am, yes. Yeah. My name is Britney Bond. Um, I'm also a resident in Magnolia Hill. Okay.

Um, that is directly impacted by this projected development. Um, I had a whole speech with all the things that these lovely people have already mentioned. Um, so I won't repeat that. But I do think it's important to note that in 2017, you guys denied unanimously a similar project that was going to be on 15 to 16 acres. So I'm not quite sure how we can fit the same amount of town homes into five acres. Um, and I also want to revisit the 75 foot setback. Um, which I do appreciate keeping the mature vegetation, but with this being like right in your backyard with big town homes in the winter when all those leaves fall, they're going to be staring right into the back of my home. So,

thank you. And Miss Von, you Miss Vaughn. Miss Von Von. Okay. Thank you. Okay, guys. Any questions for anyone else? Applicant? No. Okay. All right. With that, please may we have a motion to close this public hearing? So move. Second. All in favor?

Okay. Public hearing is closed. May I have a motion, please, for this plan development amendment for project 202654. And just a reminder, we do have um staff recommendations.

I I personally think they make a motion to deny. Okay, we have a motion to deny. Do we have a second? I'll make a motion. Uh I'll second that motion. You'll second. All in favor of denial? I Okay. All um all opposed. Did you say yes? You you went you went didn't I? And Mr. Carl, I didn't hear you.

Okay. So, um so that motion um carries for denial of that amendment for um that plan development. So, what will happen next? Because again, we're the recommendation body. We're the talk to you and listen and um get lots of information. You'll go up to a county commissioner meeting next say the same thing again and uh they'll make that final decision there. And Amanda, when is that meeting? The next meeting is going to be I'm sorry. I

That's right. The commissioners with the first reading on this item directed staff to schedule their second reading for the June meeting. So this will be considered by the board of commissioners for a final decision June 9th and we so in June we'll be back here back here because May will be in Pinroke and June will be they meet earlier 5:30. Yeah. But same same room and notices will still go up. We'll have signposted If you're within a certain proximity, you'll get a mail notice. Perfect. Okay. All right. Thank you. Yeah. And I'm gonna um pause for just a second and let all these guys go out.

Yeah. It sucks, doesn't it? Yep. All right, guys. May I have a We'll give them 30 more seconds. Thank you, Brett. Uh, may I have a motion, please, to open public hearing for resoning project 20260154. Motion to open. Second. All in favor? We're in public hearing. Brett, good evening.

Good evening. Yeah, this project is uh located at 3689 Wilma Edwards Road on the north end of Bryan County. The applicant is proposing to reszone from its existing B1 neighborhood commercial to the B2 general commercial in order to continue operating a non-complying heavy automotive repair. Your next item is a related conditional use application for that. So, the property is 7.86 acres in size. You can see its location here on Wilma Edwards at the intersection of Bill Futch Road almost directly across from where Hendricks Park is. And you can see some of the current existing conditions here. They are planning to use the existing facility and you can see they have um some vehicles that are currently stored uh out in their lot that is assumed to be used um for overnight repair. And you can see the current zoning map here. It is B1 and it does abut a B2 general commercial parcel uh to the north northeastish. Um and that is also a uh body auto body shop that y'all considered about two years ago, year and a half ago. And it does fall in that emerging suburban character area which is generally characterized by higher density development where infrastructure exists or mixeduse developments where suitable and existing patterns exist as well. So, the recommending zoning district uh does include both the B1 and the B2 uh commercial zoning districts and the applicant did submit a concept plan here. So, they're not proposing any new structure. They're proposing to use the existing structure that's there on site uh as well as just having an area to keep those stored cars in as well as some additional screening uh perhaps on the Wilma Edwards roadside. You can see on the concept plan, they've kind of highlighted the existing vegetation on the Bill Futch Road side as well as on the adjacent uh property side. Um, and the TDA that they submitted showed that it would only generate a max of 155

daily trips, which was lower than the threshold required to do any sort of comprehensive analysis. Uh and so with all that because of it meeting the comprehensive plan and abuing uh the use to the north staff is recommending approval of the resoning request and I can answer any questions you all may have. Questions recommendations on anything that's not such an not on the resoning. We do have some that'll come on the conditional use. Yeah. Thank you Brett. Thank you. Um, do we have the applicant here tonight? You are busy.

I'm busy. This is my third one today. Actually, I was in Savannah earlier. Um, good evening, William Cunningham with Home Company representing um, Wilma Edwards LLC. Um, yeah, so Brett did a great job describing it. Um, it's pretty plain cut. Um, we're trying to reszone for a conforming use. Um, again, we've made the site plan according with the UDO for what it takes to be a B2 district. Um, and I can go through the conditional stuff now if you'd rather get that out of the way. Um, we'll wait till we get there. Sit sit close.

All right, sounds good. Um, but yes, so we made the site plan according parking, landscape buffer, the buffering was sufficient um on site. So, we're this is, you know, reszoning has become conforming in use and in everything with the property itself. Perfect. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, guys. Any questions? No. Uh, do we have no speaker slips? Don, no. Anyone for or against this item? No. I think most everyone left after the last Corey. And um I'll take a motion now if we have no more questions to close this public hearing. Second. All in favor?

Okay. Uh we are now out of public hearing. May I please have a motion for the resing for this project? 20260154.

Make a motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Any opposed? So this um reszoning? You oppose? One opposed. I'm sorry. Y'all speak up. I'm old. So um so the motion uh does pass for approval. And again, that will move up to um the um commissioner meeting. So now we'll move on to that conditional use permit for the same project. So that's still project 20260154. Again, this is for conditional use. May we have a motion to open that public hearing? Motion. All in favor? We are now in public hearing.

Good evening. Yeah, this is the related conditional use uh for approval to continue operation of that heavy automotive repair shop. And so just to get everyone back, we're back on the same concept plan here. And the ordinance does have some very specific supplements for what should be required uh for a heavy automo heavy automobile repair facility. Excuse me. And I'll go through these very quickly. So uh the first one being all main and accessory structures be set back a minimum of 75 ft from any rule residential, residential, or planned development district. This condition has been met as no abuing property is zoned any of those three. The second one being there shall be a minimum lot frontage of 100 ft on an arterial or collector street. Uh this lot maintains over 1,000 ft of frontage off of Wilma Edwards Road which is an arterial street. A raised curved inches a raised curb of 6 inches in height shall be constructed along the perimeter of all paved and landscaped surfaces. So the building is existing and the change in use does not require more than 10 parking spaces and under section 114-617 subsection F uh developments that do not require 10 spaces are actually not required to pave parking. So this condition um the intent of it has been met as there will be no paved parking areas. Uh D overhead doors shall not face a public road or a rule residential, residential or PD district. Uh there are no overhead doors that directly face a public road that is not screened from it. Um you saw earlier those pictures from the Wilma Edwards side um where you can see the doors but they don't directly face and that's where we'll get into the condition here in a minute. Um where applicable vehicle queuing spaces shall be provided in front of each service bay area. The submitted concept plan that they showed uh meets this requirement. All maintenance repair work shall be conducted completely within an enclosed building. Uh the applicant has indicated that all work

does take place inside. Based on staff analysis of visiting the site, we did not observe any work happening outside of the facility. Uh G, there shall be no outdoor display of vehicle components, parts such as tires, lubricants, materials, etc. Uh this requirement is met. There are not any uh parts for sale that are visible from the street. Uh h storage of wrecked, partially dismanted, dismantled or other derelict vehicles or overnight parking of any space except a tow truck shall be permitted in a designated area for up to 30 days. Such the area is screened from public view in accordance with the screening requirements of section 114-632. Now, as you saw in the pictures, this requirement is currently not met as those vehicles are fairly visible from the road. Um, well, if I can get my PowerPoint right. So, you can see those vehicles pretty visible from Wilma Edwards, but the applicant did indicate in their application that these the vehicles kept overnight and that they would um, you know, comply with the proper screening requirements, including adding some more vegetation along Wilma Edwards and installing a privacy fence as well um, similar to the one maybe on Bill Fletcher Road that the adjacent auto repair auto body shop has. Uh and then lastly uh subsection I if the use includes vehicle painting all applicable state and federal requirements shall be met. This facility uh will not include any vehicle painting. So that is not applicable. So staff is is recommending approval of the conditional use subject to the following conditions. One continued compliance with the specific supplemental conditions that I just read to you. And second, installation of a streetyard buffer and an opaque fence that faces um for the vehicles to be stored behind. and those two items to be completed prior to the county issuing a business license for the location to continue operating. And I know that was a lot. So, if you have any questions,

um responsible for making sure those vehicles looking overnight. Yeah. So, the ordinance, if approved and they installed it correctly, they're allowed to have them up to 30 days as long as they're behind an opaque fence. If they never install a fence or screening, we wouldn't issue them a business license. And uh at that point, it would become a code enforcement issue and and code enforcement would go and get them for um you know, operating a business without a license and not meeting the requirements.

On that almost same topic, just I'm in this world. Um I know there's some things that will probably require to be there longer than 30 days. You know, in the case of, let's say, somebody who hasn't paid a bill and a vehicle is going to end up going through like mechanics lean or something like that. Um, will they be able to kind of, hey, we've got an issue with this car. We can't necessarily move the car, nor can we sell the car or anything. Yeah, I'm sure there's some sort of leniency as long as it's just opaquely screened from the the biggest concern is just the screening of the vehicles and the the visual eyesore. I just want to make sure you can you can run business. Yeah, of course.

And my my question was regarding that letter H. The Do you have a question, Scott? Scott, did you have a question before I started talking? Okay. Um, so I'm sorry that was very teacher of me. I apologize. Okay. Um, letter H, the screening. Um, I know when we redid our ordinances and we cannot have chain length fences with a screening in front. Correct. That is correct. So, it will likely have to be like, in my head, I'm just thinking of a white privacy fence because the adjacent U vehicle auto repair shop I keep referring to, they have a white opaque fence across their frontage, but you know, if they did something like a privacy fence,

it's a solid structure. It has to be a solid structure. And they also are going to have to do like the 25 foot streetyard buffer along Wilma Edwards. Uh we didn't want to touch the other property line sides because it's very visually screened and the site is so big. We didn't want to have them, you know, tear down existing vegetation. Just add some and then add that privacy fence. Thank you. Yes. Um how big are they allowed to It looks like they're going to be doing a U-Haul business there. Is there any specifications on how many U-Haul trucks and trailers and all that that it can fit on that property?

Yes. So staff just recently learned about the U-Haul vehicle rental facilities. So we'll have to investigate that. I believe the ordinance also requires a conditional use to do uh vehicle rental. So we will have to investigate that um and then get back with you. Stacy, I'm good. You're good. Anybody else for Brett? Okay. They're going to put a fence up there because the rec center is right across the road from there. So I think that anybody visiting that do not want to see their property.

Yeah, that and that was uh that was our intent with the staff condition for adding that additional streetard buffer and that opaque fencing. So maybe it could uh even add, you know, the additional street yard we think on top of those oak trees that are next to Wilma Edwards will maybe make it look a little bit nicer than what it maybe did even before. Thank you. There is a church that's not too far from almost almost across the street. Yeah. Anything else for Brett? Thank you. Thank you. Come on back up.

Um yeah, again Brett did a great job describing that. Um so, you know, from a holistic standpoint, it'll you know, look the same. No improvements like to the building, but to everything else. um for what this you know making this a conforming use from a zoning standpoint um fencing that landscape buffer um making sure that everything is in conformance and and required. So perfect. Thank you. Any questions regarding this conditional use for the applicant? Nope. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. No speaker slips on anyone for or against in the audience? And with that I'll take a motion please to close this public hearing. Motion second.

All in favor? Okay. Uh may I have a motion please for uh conditional use permit project 20260154? And again there are reminder there are staff recommendations. I'll throw it out there. I make a motion to approve along with staff recommendations. Okay. So, Commissioner Watson for approval with staff recommendations. Do we have a second? Okay. Second. All in favor? Any opposed?

Can I have 30 seconds? I haven't broken a tie in a long time. So, how do I word that for or against? So, the motion was for approval with the conditions with the recommendations. So, you'll just vote. You can just state whether you're in favor or against the motion. Okay. So for this conditional use permit and the motion was for approval. I um I will go along with the motion. So that approval does carry.

Okay, guys. Um old business. So do we open up a public hearing for the text amendment? No. Thank you. So you held your public hearing last month um and you deferred it to this month. And so um this was not readvertised as a public hearing. This is just to bring you back um some additional information. Um, and so for this I want to start with maybe just a recap um of where we've been with the chickens. Um, especially because we have a new member on the board. Um, so we started this chicken journey back in January.

Um, and that was whenever we first presented this to the planning and zoning commission. Um, this was initiated by the board of commissioners. Um the board of commissioners directed staff to initiate this text amendment to introduce the allowance for chickens within the R15 residential zoning district. And so we started with an allowance for four chickens within the district. And that was just a flat four chickens um for any property within R15, no regard for property size. PNZ recommended approval for that text amendment back in January and we moved that recommendation forward to our board of commissioners at their February meeting. Um it was during their public hearings and consideration that the discussion about um having incremental increases in the number of chickens allowed in the R15 um to be considered um because it was brought up that there are properties within the R15 district that may be larger than the typical R15 property. Um, so with that direction from the board, we went back and we readressed how could we incorporate some incremental increases for R15. And we did that by mirroring what we currently allow within our rural residential zoning districts. And so that was the change that we brought back to this board at your meeting last month in March. Um, we amended that draft ordinance to still consider the base four chickens um for anything under one acre in size in the R-15, but then to incorporate the incremental increase consistent with what we with what we currently allow within our rural residential zoning districts. Um, and I understand from that meeting that there was a lot of discussion and a lot of questions that were raised. And so having gone back and looked at that meeting, um the questions that I found that were raised were questions about what are the existing RR regulations, you know, what are we currently doing

with chickens? Um what is the impact of the proposed changes within the R15 zoning district, which is really what we're talking about with this proposed amendment, and then questions about how these proposed regulations compare to those of other jurisdictions. Um, so what I want to do tonight is go through those questions, bring you back that information, um, and then we can see where you want the discussion to go from there. Um, so to start with that first question, um, I want to talk about what are the current regulations um, in the RR zoning district or where do we currently allow chickens already? And so we already have allowances for the keeping of chickens um, in our A5 agricultural zoning district. These are those zoning districts that are greater typically greater than five acres in size. Um and they're intended for agricultural purposes. And we do not limit the number of chickens. Um agricultural properties that are operating for agricultural uses um aren't regulated by these chicken standards. You know, they're regulated by their own agricultural standards. And so there is no limit, we say, to the number of chickens. They still just have to maintain their property um and you know, provide for, you know, the proper conditions for them. Uh whenever we start looking at our rural residential zoning districts, we have the RR2.5 which requires a minimum lot size of 2 and a half acres. We have the RR1.5 which requires a minimum of 1 and a half acres. And then we have our RR1 zoning district which requires a minimum of 1 acre. Um and currently chickens are already allowed within these districts. And if you have at least one acre and you're in one of these rural residential districts, you start with a base allowance of 20 chickens. You can have 20 chickens on your property um subject to meeting setback um requirements for the coups and the housing and everything. Um but whenever you get

above 2 and a half acres, we start to see that incremental increase. And so if you're above 2 and a half acres, for every half acre you have, you get an additional five chickens. Um, so if you had three acres, you would be allowed to have 25 chickens. Um, and it continues to step up until you get to the maximum cap, which is 50. Um, the idea being if you reach that maximum cap based on your property size, which would put you at about 5 and a half acres, then maybe if you're wanting to do something more intense than that, you might be primed to go into the A5 district and you might want to look at reszoning um because you would have the minimum acreage in order to enter into that zoning district. Um, so this is what we currently allow. Um, and with roosters, um, you will see the roosters are only allowed in the A5 and the RR2.5 districts presumably because those are the larger sized lots. Um, so you have more space and you're able to mitigate the impacts of noise that could be caused by the roosters. Um, so this is what is currently allowed and we are not proposing to make any changes to these existing zoning districts. Um, and so I kind of want to stop with that information and see if there are any questions about that.

No. No. Okay. And I love the graph. Good. Okay. Have a few more for you. Thank you.

Okay. So, now let's talk about the R15 district. And so, the R15 district is the district that is the subject of this text amendment. And the stated purpose of the R15 zoning district in our ordinances is to provide for medium to low density single family and duplex residential development freed from intrusion by incompatible agricultural and commercial uses. Um so these are the districts that typically reflect a more traditional suburban development pattern. um they have the smaller lot sizes, they have smaller setbacks, so homes are spaced more closely together. Um and the the whole tent of these type of residential districts is just as it states, you know, to separate them from the more um agricultural areas or rural areas where we might find more agricultural related uses. And so the majority of the lots that are within the R15 zoning district um range in size from 15,000 square feet to 1 acre. Um and those size lots account for about 82% of the total R15 lots throughout the county, both north and south. And so whenever we're looking at the majority of those lots, we're looking at subdivisions like um in the south end, we have Woodland Trails. Um Strathy Hall would be one. If we're looking in the north end, um I'm thinking like the Black Creek Golf Club community. Um those are our 15 districts. And so the image that you see up at the top right, that's an example. That's Woodland Trails. You can see there's a very defined residential development pattern. Um they're t um typically um you know function as like a major subdivision development with internal streets that they share. usually HOA controlled.

Um the example below it is where we start looking at um the the larger lots on that lower end anywhere from a halfacre to one acre. Um and so a good example of like the halfacre lots would be the Magnolia Creek subdivision in the north end of the county. Um but again you still see that very defined development pattern, that residential nature. Um and so these districts do have again very um smaller setbacks compared to the RR districts. The setbacks in these um the R15 is 15 feet. Um so they only have to be 15 feet from that shared property line. Um now we do have larger lots within the R15 district and so that's what prompted this discussion about allowing for the incremental increase. um but they account for a smaller percentage of the total R15 district. And so if we're looking at the category of R15 lots between one acre and 2 and a half acres in size, that accounts for about 15% of the total R15. Um and this would account for what we would consider like estate style subdivisions. Um so these are still subdivisions with that very clear development pattern. you know, internal streets, maybe HOA controlled, they just sit on larger estate style lots. And so, a great example of this would be the Bluffs community here in the south end of the county in the county. And so, that top right hand picture kind of gives you an idea of what that development pattern looks like. Um, but even still on these larger larger lots, they still get the 15 foot setback. So, they still can be located closer to that shared property line. Um, but then the rarest category in the R15 district are those lots over two and a half acres in size. That only accounts for about 3%, maybe even less of the total R15 district. Um, so these are very rare. Um, where we do see these much larger lots in the R15 district. um they

typically don't follow that residential development pattern and in fact it's almost hard to distinguish them from adjacent A5 and RR districts. Um and so the picture in the the bottom right hand corner is a cluster of um R15 lots that are located off of Highway 80 in the north end of the county. Um and so that's that cluster right there. But you can see if you're looking at the adjacent uses um to the east and the west um which are zoned RR and A5, you can't really distinguish them. And these are much larger lots. They typically are not situated in major subdivisions. They're not HOA controlled. Um and a lot of times it might be a single lot district, meaning it's not part of a cluster. It's just been individually zoned for R15. Um, and so I let me go back um because I wanted to really lay out the context of the R15 and what we're talking about with this amendment um to make sure that it was, you know, very clear to everybody that the majority of the lots that we're looking at in this district are that 15,000 square feet to 1 acre in size and much closer together in development patterns. And so before I move on, are there any questions with that? No, I'm I'm glad to know that we have that breakdown because 82% I mean 15,000 square feet. Sorry, that's just a comment with chickens. I'm glad that you clarified that.

Yeah. And so what we what we always want to do with ordinances is we want to try to draft the ordinance based off of the intent of the district um not necessarily for the exception. And so with these much larger lots, they are the exception in the R15 district. Okay, so moving on. Um comparisons because I know that that question was asked. What are these other communities doing? Um and so we do we we pull from other communities to try to get an idea. Um whenever it comes to chickens, these regulations can vary. We'll say there's not a right or wrong answer. um communities come up with what they think is best for them. Um but for some of the surrounding communities that we looked at, if we take Richmond Hill, Richmond Hill does not permit chickens in their residential districts. Um they allow chickens in their agricultural districts where agricultural uses are allowed. Um so they are not permitted in what would be comparable to what we're looking at, which is our R15. Um in the city of Savannah, Savannah does allow chickens in their residential districts. um they don't start with a base allowance like we do. Um instead they go to the one per 1,000 square feet of high ground. Um however, they do still cap out and so their maximum cap that they establish is 30. Um so at a certain point, regardless of your property size, you're capped at 30. Um and then where roosters are considered, they are only allowed if you have a minimum of two acres. Uh for Bullet County, uh Bullet County does have a base allowance for their residential districts. So they allow eight. Um and then at that point, they don't start an incremental increase until you get to eight acres or more. Um and they they do not cap out beyond that and they do not allow roosters. Effingham County does a base allowance of four, which is what we're looking at starting with for our R15 district. Uh

the only difference is is that they do allow one rooster. Um, so they would have a maximum cap of five chickens, four hens, one rooster allowed. Um, so this is what the other jurisdictions um would allow for. And so then what I wanted to do next was kind of take you through a comparison based off of these different lot size scenarios. How do our regulations measure up to these other jurisdictions taking into account caps and incremental increases? Um so if we start with that uh we'll start with the first scenario a halfacre lot. Um so with our proposed um amend amendment we would allow four chickens on that halfacre lot. Um again Richmond Hill would not allow any. A city of Savannah assuming that all of its high land and they have the one per 1000 they start off very high. They would get 21. Um but Bullet County would start at eight and then Effingham County you have the five, the four hens and the one rooster. Um so our um proposed amendment is on the low end for that halfacre lot size. Um which for us is very intentional taking into account our R15 context and those um reduced setbacks and homes being closer together. Um but whenever we start talking about the incremental increase now let's consider a lot size that's one and a half acres in size. Um so at this point with that incremental increase once we get above one acre that allowance greatly increases for us now you can have 20 chickens. Uh Richmond Hill you still can't have any because regardless of lot size in the residential district they wouldn't allow it. Um city of Savannah assuming that it's all still uplands they would get 30. So they're slightly higher than what we would do.

Um but Bulock County is still capped at eight. So this is where we s surpassed that Bullet County regulation. Um Bulock County is still capped. You can have more in Brian County if you're at one and a half acres. Um and same with Effingham County. Effingham County still caps you at five. Um so our regulations are um more permissive um than what those other communities would allow. Amanda, can I ask a quick question before you move on? When you say Savannah, is that Savannah, proper city of Savannah, city limits, or are you talking Chattam County uninccorporated? No, this is city city city limits of Savannah. Wow. Yeah. Okay. Okay. And then this is just based off of the reading of their ordinance. Um that that is what they say.

Thank you for that clarification. Another question about this thing. Um do we actually know if that's really being practiced in city? That that I don't know. That's why I wanted to preface that with it's based off of the ordinance reading. Got it. Got it. Thank you.

Um and so then moving up now we're getting to three and a half acres. And again, this is the very rare scenario for us in Brian County. This is less than 3% of the R15 lots. This is what they would be allowed to do. Um but with our incremental increases at three and a half acres, you could get 30 chickens. Um, this is where we start to even out and we're on par then with the city of Savannah because remember City of Savannah is going to cap at 30. Um, so at three and a half acres, we're the same as the city of Savannah. Bullet County though is still capped at eight. Effingham County is still capped at five. So you can see we're much more permissive than what those communities would allow. Um, and then this is where we become more permissive than all of them. Um, if you get into a category are the five and a half acres because we still do the incremental increase with a cap of 50 chickens. If you have five and a half acres, you hit that cap, you can get for 50 chickens. Um, so now we're more permissive than Savannah who has capped at 30. Um, and we're still more permissive than Bulock County and Effingham County. Um, and then I would argue that if you are at the point where that is not enough and you are at five and a half acres in the R15 district, um, it may be time to start talking about reszoning to that A5 category. Um, so we were intending to just try to mirror the regulations that we already have in place. Um because if you have more than an acre with our current regulations in the RR districts, this is what you would be allowed to have. Um and so I guess the question that's put forth before you tonight is do you agree with that? Um and you know with that information and hopefully answering those questions, um the options that you can look at this evening are you can recommend approval of the ordinance as it stands. If you

think the RR regulations that are currently in place are a good model to follow with incorporating chickens into the R15 district, knowing that it's those um limited number of properties that are going to exceed the acreage to get that incremental increase, um then you can recommend approval of the way that it's drafted. Um another option is you can recommend approval with modifications. If you think the um you know 20 chickens over an acre is too much or if you think the maximum cap at 50 is too much, you can consider reducing that number. Um conversely, if you don't think it's enough, you can make a recommendation to increase that number. However, looking at the other jurisdictions, seeing how much more permissive we already are, um that would not be the staff's recommendation. Um, and then if you think that this consideration for incremental increases in the R15 district is just not appropriate, um, you can recommend denial this evening.

So, staff would recommend what you just staff's recommendation, I think, at this point is to remain consistent with the RR district. Um, we feel like that's what we've heard. Uh, we feel like that the consideration that the board wanted to consider should be based off of lot size. Um so this is what's comparable to the other lot sizes. Yeah. Um another question. HOAs subdivisions do the HOA making covenants and restrictions will that supersede this?

So HOA covenant restrictions would supersede it. And what I would say is if there is a community that is zoned R15 that is concerned about the introduction of chickens um within that zoning district. if your covenants do not address it, then that might be a conversation for your community. Um, but yes, HOA covenants and rules um would supersede our regulations. However, it's on the HOA to enforce it. The county will not enforce those. So, is there a mechanism to alert HOAs that this might be going on?

Um, so we do I mean we do all of our public noticing. Um, we we do our advertisements in the paper. uh we hold these public meetings to talk about it and get it out into the public. Um so anybody who is concerned or interested in this, I would say word of mouth is the best way to get that conversation started so that they're aware. And when would this be effective? So ordinances typically become effective um whenever they're adopted. And so, um, if you make a recommendation to move this board to forward to the board of commissioners this evening, we will take it to them at their May meeting. Um,

yeah, this one will go to their May meeting and then if they make a decision that evening, it would become effective whenever. Yeah. My only concern is that HOAs may not have enough time for action in order to amend

their bylaws and covenants and all that kind of stuff. Well, and that's that's valid. And I think that you could, you know, as this board, if you were wanting to move forward with a recommendation this evening, you could also move forward with the recommendation that there might be a delay in that effectiveness. Um, unless it's otherwise specified with a future effective date, they become effective when adopted. Um, but that doesn't mean that it can't be delayed. And so you might could make a recommendation, you know, for approval subject to like a a one-mon delay in it becoming effective. Most of I'm sorry. Oh, I'm sorry. No, no, go ahead. Um, just to give time if that's, you know, something that you're concerned about.

Most HOAs, if they only have an annual meeting, usually meet in May or um around this time of year. So, this would and it's also tough for a lot of the HOAs to get quums too, right? So, if they're going to get a quorum, it would usually be at the annual meeting. So, that's something to consider. Um, is it possible to make a recommendation that I mean, I don't know if they have all, you know, all the people to communicate with, but can we re like recommend that we send something to the existing? Do we

um I think knowing whether or not there's a defined list of contacts across the county. I mean, we can do a public media noticing and things like that. Um but it's that good contact list that gets it directly to the HOAs versus just our standard public noticing requirements.

And that does fall back on HOAs, too. I mean, all of this is online on your count. Every county has that. So, that really falls to me falls back. That's their due diligence to do that. not putting that on staff to notify. I have a question about the R15 to the was it A5 reszoning. So they would really just come in and say we want to reszone and reason would be to have more chickens and that would be a valid

they could um and typically as long as they're not whenever we see those very large R15 lots of that size. They are typically not within a major subdivision. It's usually a standalone lot somewhere. Um, and assuming that it's still in a rural context, yeah, I think just coming forward and saying, "I really don't meet the character of the existing R15, I want to be considered for A5." Just want to peck out all these details.

Yeah, it is still an application and it is still a process, but um, if if that's what you're wanting to do with your very large property, um, it's important to be able to look at the the zoning district and the allowances for it. large properties. The way that I feel is that especially if it's a subdivision, it should be capped out at 20 instead of 50 if you have the larger because uh in my particular case is that uh my subdivision is five acre tracks. Could you imagine every one of them? Can you go back to that

that just so we can get that sme already bad enough? Okay. All right. Questions for Amanda? I've got one more. Um, so I'm looking looking at this a little bit differently. You know, somebody is living on a property that happens to be five acres. I recognize this is a very small fraction in the three and a half as well. But like when you've got a family living on there, I don't know how many eggs chickens make individually regular, but I know it's a decent amount. But at what point does it become a business? Well, it becomes a business at the point that you're advertising and selling.

Well, I know people that have four chickens that are doing this. Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. The proving the commercial operation because people do they they have backyard chickens and they might sell half a dozen to somebody at church. Um it's it's tracking down and you know confirming commercial operations and sales and I feel like the number 50 is kind of already telling you that you're producing a lot of eggs awful lot probably more so than what you can Yeah. How many code just code enforcement officers do we have in the county? We have one coat of That's what I thought. I want to make that Tiffany, right? I just want to make that known. This

I appreciate all the work that was done in that was put into this and I know this has been a huge thing in the community, but we have one code enforcement officer and she is busy. And so this we need to dial in very well to this as not to run her ragged when people start the complaints. So, I'm thinking of her. Great lady. Questions for Amanda? Nope. Mr. Carwell.

I would for the larger subdivision as long as it's in a subdivision. I my personal opinion is a cap at 20 the max. All right, guys. I'd like to include something about communication, too. I mean, if we're here for the the entire community, I think this is important that there needs to be actual communication and notification that this is about to happen. You know, my HOA board meets the annual meetings in January. We do this now. I hate my neighbor, you know, you do have people, you know,

to start having chickens, you know what I mean? So, that's my that's my biggest concern. is the communication and notification with it happening so quickly. You know, HOAs and subdivisions might not have time to act because to your point that quorum I mean that would land on your HOA board to go around if you're not have a meeting. They would either have to call a meeting or go around to each individual house and get signatures to amend that. Um, so that's a possibility to say a delay even as far for enacting any recommendation. I mean, it's only April, so

well, so I I think we might get into um a little bit of question about how much of a delay is appropriate. Um, you know, typically if we're looking at an effective date for an ordinance, we might say, okay, effective maybe one month out or something like that. if we were looking to have, you know, something occur within that interim time. If what you're thinking is delay until next year, um I think there's a lot of things that could, you know, change within the community between now and then. Um where um is a 60-day unreasonable? I don't think recommending a 60-day is unreasonable. Okay. Yeah. And again, it's just a recommendation. It'll be on the board to make Yeah. to make that decision.

All right. So we make the motion with any as it stands um either for as it stands with the R15 ordinance now with the step as the graph shows or with the step with any changes that we would like to recommend to the commission. Correct. Along with anything about deferral. Yeah. Okay. Got it. Repeat that again. But you didn't mention subdivisions. You But then

well, can you go back to the um so for that step? So we either have we have choices of keeping it the same as it is now, no change, just what the ordinance says now or what this graph says or option number three with um recommendations to change this. So you would have to look at the acreage size, the property size, not necessarily a subdivision, a HOA or not. Would look at look at that property size.

Yeah. There is other I mean in our area there will be other subdivisions that I think there's two that's proposed from when I hear might be u custom build homes and the five acre tracks under R15 and so they would fall under that last that last category of 50 max chickens. Then you'd have to change the 3.5 because if you're going to reduce the 55 to 20, you can't have three and a half acres with 30. No, but this is true. I said the max.

All right, that's the max. And so maybe it will let me back up to

So looking at what we So under the current ordinance, the way that it's proposed, less than an acre, you can have four chickens. More than an acre, you get 20. And then above two and a half you get an additional five chickens per half acre. And so you could reduce the if you're under an acre keep it at four above an acre between one acre and two and a half acres. Do you think 20 is appropriate? Are we good with 20 or is that a number that we want to reduce? Just 20. So, you just want the cap to be 20

for any subdivision. For any subdivision. Yeah. Because as it as it is is that and my neighbor before he sold his house, he had chickens and they came all over my yard too. And the one crossed the streets there, they uh you can hear uh the rooster crowing at 5:00 in the morning.

Okay. I'm being lenient because I'm against chickens. Um, another thing that you could consider, and I'm just throwing it out there, is changing the structure a little bit for the R15 and say four chickens up to an acre and then maybe removing that big jump to 20 if you're at one acre or more. And maybe just keeping it at the, you know, four for your first acre and then plus five for every half acre beyond that. Up to 20. up to 20. Okay, now that that's

good with that, Ronald. Yeah, I'm good with that. Write that down, Scott. Make the motion. Say it again, Amanda. So, please four four chickens up to one acre. And then we incorporate that step increase of plus five chickens for every half acre beyond that one acre. And then doing the maximum cap at 20 instead of 50. Put that on paper. Yeah, sounds great. Jewel in your crown tonight, Amanda. Um, any other questions for Amanda?

Deferred for 60 days for the notification purposes and good and a recommendation to defer. Okay. All right. So, now we just need that memorialized into a motion. Okay. May I have a motion, please, for this text amendment to section 114-511? I make a motion that for we'll have four chickens for every one acre and then uh plus five more chickens per acre with a max of 20 per half acre

per half acre. max out at 20 chickens and we're going to defer it for 60 days for proper notification for everybody as far as defer from the final board's action with that. Okay. Do we have a second? All all in favor? I Any opposed? Thank you. All right. And I just want to thank um Mr. Puffer for that. That was beautiful. Thank you. Good job. Thank you guys for this staff. I appreciate it. Um, anything else? May I have a motion for adjournment, please? I make a motion to adjourn this meeting. Second.

All in favor? We are so adjourned. Thank you guys.