Historic Preservation Commission - Regular Meeting

isn't on. My TV is not on. How do I turn my TV on? It's blank. Okay. This is the one we've been having trouble with. Oh, signal. Great. I'm sorry. Maybe if you could share with Yep. Yeah, a lot. Well, excuse us this evening. A little technical difficulties here, but I think we're set to go again. Uh, welcome everyone. It's good to see people out in

the gallery and uh we'll look forward to hearing from you later. Um, Robin, may we have roll call, please? Yes, absolutely. Uh, Commissioner Henzik, Chair Stevens, present. Commissioner Slaughter is not with us, Vice Chair Bocker, Commissioner Cordinet, present, Commissioner Berilo, present. Alternate Broyals is not with us. Alternate Larson. Looks like our commission liaison Hellfrey is not with us. Council member leaison Marshall present and our council member leazison Rambo. President, thank you very much. Um, well, here we are. It's almost the close of April. Did you know that next month, May, is known as Historic Preservation Month? The month celebrates our nation's heritage through historic places. But it is not just places. It is also the preservation of items. They may be found in attics, old barns, or wherever. Everywhere we go and look around, there are things to be preserved as well. These items may not be usable in today's environment, but they and their stories help us understand the people and what they overcame. We can better imagine their hardships. Our work in the reconstruction of the Essen Lord Cabin

will be just one way we can relate part of Wildwood's past, just one instance of historic preservation. Actually, we will be peeling back the layers of time. I am so proud of our city and the efforts that they allow to be done in helping to preserve the history in our own backyard. And our efforts are continuing and not just during the month of May. We're 12 months out of the year pre preserving. Uh if you're able to stand for the pledge of allegiance, Kurt, would you lead us this evening? To the flag of the United States of America, to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, liberty and justice. You may be seated. We time for approval of the minutes from the March 27th meeting. Does anyone have any changes or corrections to be made? Hearing none, they will be approved by general consent. Public comment this evening. We have any cards. Robin, Madam Chair, we do have one card. Uh, Mr. Carl Essen would like to speak with you this evening. Hi, Carl. My name is Carl Essen. Um I've been working hard trying to um gather with the shots s h o t and the essen family trees and we successfully had done that and I got point people in both groups that are taking the

responsibility of the essence gatherings cousins um when when it comes around of need and everything. Yeah, thank you. The quest was the fact that Lewis shot is in our graveyard and I didn't kind of know how he got there, but but appears that Lewis shot who died in February 19th, 1858. That is in the Essen Cemetery in Wildwood, Missouri, may be the Lewis that married Kathleen niece. H A TZ on the shot family tree. The Pond Essence family came to Missouri in the year 1853 to build the Essen Law Cabin Pond, Missouri. The Orville Essence family came to Missouri in the year 1860 and lived with the Pond Essence family. The Essen Law Cabin, Orville, Missouri, was built year 1867 by Lewis shots grave in the Essen Cemetery. The grave was on the property of the cabin in Wildwood, Missouri, covering the area of Orville and Pon, Missouri. Appears that the city of Wildwood will be rebuilding the Essen Law Cabin, Orville, Missouri by the Wildwood City Hall in the Village Green Development. The Essen's descendants of the two Wildwood cabins is about 650 names now and growing and the Omaha Essen family started the Essen Cousins gathering in Wildwood three decades ago that the Shock family could be a part of, which they are now a part of for this upcoming October. um 25 event and um um so I think we found the mystery of

why there's a Louisis shot in the grave before um we even came to town. But uh from this we we are now proceeding to find out where Louisis shot came from. And um the um a few hours ago I was talking with u Millie Weber and um she um and I I learned in the picture I I had a Millie uh the singing duo picture of Fran Albbright and Mildred Weber. Her father, William Essen, was one of the seven born in the cabin. So, we now have a quest to identify who the other six people and maybe there's an eighth person who was born in the cabin that sang in the Albbright band and is called the country sweethearts, which all comes together since uh Millie got a pacemaker yesterday. Thank you for all the support to the shots and Essen family. Thank you, Carl. Thank you, John. Uh, news and updates from Wildwood Historical Society. Robin, would you like to address that? And Jill, if you would like to speak, please use the raise hand feature now. Otherwise, I'll go ahead and give these updates.

All right, madame chair, members of the commission, uh I'm going to stand in uh for President Hark Camp this evening and give some updates for the Wildwood Historical Society. Uh one update is that the exterior of the Hen House has been professionally powerwashed and painted. And so you can see those pictures before you. I hear it looks absolutely incredible. Uh they did find a a good company. Uh apparently uh our historic Bethl church had utilized this company and so they got that referral. Um but it's all done now and um and looks great. So there you are. Um however, I do have some sad news for this commission. Uh the reason we don't have uh Linda here with us this evening is she is taking an extended leave uh medical leave uh from the Wildwood Historical Society. Um until she's able to resume her duties, the Wildwood Historical Society board uh will assume them uh for the time being. Uh however, given that she is on an extended medical leave, I thought it would be nice uh if we uh signed a few cards for her uh from this commission. To that end, uh I decided to go with two different cards. And the reason being is that Linda has just been a wonderful addition to our group this year. Um she's really bridged u the commission's work with what the society has done. Um we've partnered together at uh celebrate Wildwood events. Um our two history um tends have have done mutual activities like the Wildwood historic communities map. Um so I feel like an appreciation card is in order. So that's

one. and then ones uh in you're in our thoughts. So, I'm going to pass this around and if you wouldn't mind uh leaving her a nice message, uh that would be wonderful. Thank you. Hey, might be moving on to old business. Uh ready for action number one log cabin update. Thank you, Madam Chair. Madame Chair and members of the commission, the department has prepared for your consideration tonight a memorandum regarding the latest details about the reassembly of the SNL log cabin. As you know, the bidding process was a bit of a surprise. We received a very high bid almost a half a million and a very low bid around $144,000 which is indicative of what we believe is a contractor that may not understand the intricacies and the components of the project. There were two bids that were relatively close around $320,000 and the commission along with city council authorized the department of planning to begin negotiations with those two. to accommodate those negotiations. There was a period of time at the start of this year which concluded just this past April with a process to reallocate funds to overcome the gap between what is budgeted in 2025 for the SM log cabin reassembly and what the bids um regardless of the selection cost. And that was, as I say, accomplished. And we've reallocated funds to make the

project feasible. This past Monday night, the Department of Planning and Parks took to the Planning and Parks Committee of City Council a proposal to select Cherret Creek Excavating. Now, you may wonder why wasn't the historic preservation commission involved? Well, there are some intricacies associated with the other bidder for the Essen Log Cabin, that being Bombshell Construction. Bombshell Construction is the primary general contractor on the Village Green project. And at this particular stage, we're approximately 5 months behind schedule. The fear of the department as explained to the council committee is that if we're behind schedule, hopefully behind schedule on the village green project, adding additional responsibilities didn't seem logical. Also, Shere Creek Excavating has done at least five cabin reassemblies of a very similar nature to the proposal for the Essen log cabin reassembly. The discussion um proceeded from that recommendation. The recommendation um ultimately was not acted upon and the city council deferred action until its May meeting which will be near the end of the month. Part of the reason that there was a delay is just concerns about bombshell construction from the owner of the company that that were expressed at that same meeting and concerns about having two different contractors on the same development site. The department hopes to address all of those concerns at the May meeting. One of the items that came out of the discussion which I think is positive is that the planning and parks committee recognized that with so many projects and so many different approaches to projects and funding not necessarily being as readily available as in past

years that the city needs to do a better job of community outreach. soliciting from our residents in kind services, contributions, whatever the the source may be. And so at that same May meeting, um the planning and parks committee of city council will be discussing how best to implement a program where we can potentially receive items that are necessary, whether it be time, materials, funds that will help us achieve our goals both in historic preservation, parks, trails, and whatever the particular project might be. So, the department does understand if there's frustration about not being able to pick one of the two contractors. Um, I will say with all due respect to Bombshell Construction, I'm sure they're a qualified contractor, but we need to finish the first project first before we start talking about a second project in the opinion of the department. I would say that the committee did not necessarily hold that same opinion, but so no decision was made. Um, if there are any questions or comments about the process that has led us here tonight or what the council committee is thinking about fundraising, um, I'll do my very best to answer them. Thank you. Any comments or questions for us? Yes, Steve. Um with the delay, is there any problem with either bombshell or the what which is the excavating um uh with them holding their their bid prices given the fluctuation in or the question in yes escalation of prices. When Miss Keefe and I met with the owner

of Cherret Creek Excavating, he said he'd be glad to hold the bid price. We understand there's pressures on that, but recognized this process has been a little kind of longer than expected. Michelle made no mention of it at the meeting on Monday, but certainly was eager to proceed forward and basically didn't talk about escalating the price. He had a couple of ideas about decreasing the price. So, I think we're in good shape there, Mr. Well, thank you. Thank you. Okay, moving along to the historic preservation plan update. Madame chair, members of this commission, uh we do have a guest with us this evening and that is Marsha Boils who is our uh project manager from MIG for the historic preservation plan. I'll turn it over to Miss Bole in just a minute. Uh, but I'm just going to touch upon uh some updates uh for you to be aware of and then we'll uh turn it over to um Marsha to delve into those updates with you as well as just introduce yourself. Uh so first of all uh you have been supplied a project schedule within your packets this evening. Um in fact you've got two different versions. You've got a very visual schedule. Um, and then you have a more detailed breakdown with specific dates. Uh, I am asking you to please review the schedule very carefully and make sure to calendar any dates that you may need to be a part of. Uh, if you have a big historic preservation commission binder, uh, you might file it in there and keep it for reference. Uh these scheduling documents do reflect a total project completion deadline of May 8th uh

2026 uh which is compatible uh with the state's uh deadline as well um and as outlined in our grant agreement. Uh next I wanted to let you know uh the first draft of the historic preservation plan uh will be informed primarily via a survey similar to our master plan update survey. So once again we're going to be asking Wildwood residents, businesses, churches, schools, stakeholders uh to share their thoughts only this time narrowed uh into the theme of historic preservation. uh will be following a similar communications and distribution strategy for the survey. Um and I have a draft survey enclosed in your materials this evening uh which we can uh go into uh in depth if you have questions but we will be looking for an action from you so that we can go forward and administer this survey in uh the month of May over a time frame of about 3 weeks. Uh so with that said uh we'll discuss the stakeholder list I think after um after uh Miss Bole gets a chance to uh talk with you a bit. So at this time I'll turn it over to her. Thank you. Hi everybody and thanks Robin. Are you able to hear me? All right. Yes. Hopefully. Yes we can. Okay great. Um thanks for having me. I wish I could be there in person tonight. um but have stepped out of a different public meeting so I can introduce myself and look forward to meeting you all in person this summer. Um I'm happy to talk through the schedule as Robin noted um or the survey um which is shown as a red line in your packet so you can see how the existing survey uh will be updated online to reflect some more key questions that will lead us to some um

discussion points for the actual plan itself. Um, as way of introduction to, um, Robin noted that I am a planning project manager with MIG. Um, I currently live in the Denver area but grew up in Wildwood. So, I'm very excited to get to work with you all on this project. Um, my parents still live in uh, Lake Chesterfield, so happy to get to see them too in this process. Um, and get to be involved with the city. Um, the process, as Robin noted, will be about a year in length. um will adhere to the grant requirements that the shipo has outlined um and work closely with Robin as we as we do so and they'll be reviewing kind of key milestones throughout the process. Um the schedule that's in front of you reflects those key milestones as well to make sure that we're um abiding by what they have in the grant requirements. Um and I just want to call attention to a couple things in the schedule. So, as we launch right now, um we are working on a draft existing conditions report to kind of summarize the current historic preservation program, the great things you're already doing and start to recognize opportunities for um for new programs or for new or for improvement on existing programs. Um so, we'll be working through that in the next month um and be able to show that to you at next month's meeting. Um and from there in the summer we really enter a period of public participation. Um there will be uh a couple different opportunities to take advantage of the concerts that will be happening. Um a colleague and I will be on site for the July concerts. So late July the 24th and 25th. Um and that will also include some additional meetings um including focus groups and an openhouse to really make sure that we're getting in front of a variety of audiences. Um, and then I will also come back in September for the Celebrate Wildwood event. Um, which Robin and I felt was a great opportunity to um, talk with people that may not be as likely to

come to a historic preservation plan specific event, but might be at that event anyways, and we can catch their ear and get their input on the plan itself. So, those will be our two key um, in-person opportunities. And there will be later virtual engagement um, when drafts are available for review. that'll be um looking towards January of next year. Um and in the meantime, there will be plenty of work on drafting the plan itself and working through kind of a vision for the preservation program um and strategies to support that vision over about the next 10-year period. I think I'll leave it at that for now, but I'm happy to answer any questions that anyone has at this time. Well, I don't think I see any questions, but we certainly appreciate the introduction. Thank you for joining us this Yeah, thanks so much. I look forward to meeting everybody in person this summer. Thank you. All right, so I'll hop hop back up here. Um, as noted, I do need an action from you this evening, uh, adopting our draft uh, survey, which is in your packets. Uh, so hopefully you've had a chance to look through that. Uh, if you do have any feedback, um, if we need to make any adjustments or revisions to it, I'd certainly welcome that at this time and we can incorporate it into any action. Uh, but we will want to move forward with it pretty quickly. uh just given the time frame of uh of drafting that that first part of the plan uh because we'll want that to be informed by public input. Comments at this time. I move the adoption of the plan. Is there a

second? Been seconded by Kurt. Any other comments or questions? Yes. Ed, is I'm sure there is, so I don't want to get pushed the wrong way. Is there a point where you ask too many things that people just don't focus on what you're trying to to get them to look at? Um, I mean, you know the old what kind of ice cream and everybody takes vanilla or chocolate. But when you give people 20 choices, are you expecting them to have knowledge of those 20 or do you think you would just get one or two items? Just curious. Uh, well, I think there were 10 questions in the survey and we didn't want to go beyond that. I I actually had less questions and then uh Miss Bole added a couple that I think were and she had some good reasons for adding them. Um, I agree with you that you don't want to make it too long. Uh, you want it to be a fairly quick survey. Um, but but obviously we need enough meat to to get people um to give us some some real feedback. They're the experts. I just know when somebody says we have a three minute survey, when I'm into it about two minutes, I'm done. I'm not going to sit there and keep going on and on and on because they usually mean that's a 10-minute survey. And I just think that's wrong to do that with people. But it'd be interesting to see. I just I'd be amazed. I'd be anxious to see the results. Well, we don't have to make every question required. So, that's that's a way to make it a quicker survey for some. Uh there are multiplechoice questions um for many of them. There are a few open-ended responses, but uh as we saw from the master plan survey, sometimes people will just put in a sentence, but you'll get an idea from that sentence what they're thinking. So, that's fine. Thank you. Yep. Anyone else? Okay, we have a motion and a second. All those in favor, please raise your

hand. Thank you. Anyone opposed or abstaining? The motion has passed. Thank you. All right. And then finally, under this item, I also had a stakeholder list uh with included in your materials this evening. Uh this stakeholder list is very important because it will guide where I send this survey. It will guide where I send information about our upcoming open houses and focus groups and just generally who I contact regarding this planning effort. Uh so if you would and it doesn't have to be right this minute this evening but if you would take a detailed look at that list and just make sure that we have covered everybody who needs to be included um in this effort uh in that in that list. Um you might be in touch with groups that I'm not as familiar with. um you know there's always someone who knows someone else and that's where having a larger group like this uh really helps with the snowball effect of of building those stakeholder lists. So please do take a look at that and email me over the next week um if you do see any missing uh missing stakeholders. Thank you. Uh finally I just wanted to end with some next steps. Uh so again, we just talked about the survey. Uh that survey, we're aiming to distribute it um and have it live by Friday, May 2nd, and then it will run for 3 weeks until Friday, May 23rd is what we're what we're planning. Um and the hope is that this time frame will be short enough to to but long enough to build the momentum but not exhaust people either. Um the next step from MIG will be to provide a draft existing conditions

report to this commission and that will happen at the next meeting. So we'll have something to discuss at that time. And that's all I have on this item. Do you have any questions for me this evening or for director? Thank you very much. And next item is Bertner Park. Did I say that right, Rob? Oh boy. Park update. Thank you, Madam Chair. Madame Chair and members of the commission, the department will be very brief relative to this particular memorandum. What was included within the memorandum is for all intents and purposes the final draft of the master plan for partner Mark. That plan was finalized at a March meeting of the ad hoc group that has been overseeing the process. Several members of our historic preservation commission participate in that ad hoc group. So my I extend my thanks to them. The most important item probably besides the final draft that you have before you tonight is that the ad hoc group will be hosting a open house regarding the draft plan on Wednesday, May 28th at city hall beginning at 5:00 p.m. and concluding at 7 pm. So if you have an opportunity, please feel free to stop by. There will be the plans available for review. The ad hoc group members will be there. Our park designer U Ken Kaitel will participate. And as always, we'll have some cold drinks and snacks to kind of help the two hours go along as pleasantly as possible. But I do want to extend my thanks to the members of

the commission that participated. We concluded our seventh meeting last night. Looks like we'll get around nine or 10 meetings in which means we've met for approximately seven months. So it was a good commitment on their part and I do not want to let it go unagnowledged. If there are any questions regarding the draft plan or the open house, Miss Keef and I will be glad to try to answer them at this time. Thank you. Any questions for Joe tonight? Thank you again. Thank you. Historic Route 66 or is it Route 66? I've been hearing controversies in social media about how you're supposed to say that tomato tomato. All right, madame chair, members of this commission, uh Route 66 is a topic of discussion this evening uh as we are uh coming up on the 100th anniversary next year. Uh at the last meeting, I let you know that we were in conversations uh with leader publications regarding a Route 66 uh magazine issue for the 100th anniversary for Eureka, Pacific, and Wildwood. Uh we've since had a more in-depth discussion with them and I can uh give you a little bit more detail of of what this project is going to be about. Uh but essentially they're looking to do uh a special edition magazine that really highlights Route 66 in our areas. Um similar uh similar to this magazine from Lle

County. So, it'll be kind of a a similar theme and content to this magazine here uh but with um a little bit more gloss and heft um such as uh this publication here. These were the examples they gave us. So, I'll pass these around so you can take a look as I discuss this topic. Excellent. Uh so uh so this gives you an idea of what it might look like. Uh generally each of our communities uh is expected to have two or three dedicated pages within the publication where we have a map of our Route 66, some of our area specific um items of interest and landmarks and businesses uh or whatever content uh we would like to zero in on. uh we are asked to sponsor our own dedicated pages. Uh but the primary uh cost of the publication will um uh will be held by by advertisers. They're looking for advertisers to uh to essentially produce the document. Uh I'll put it so this is the general timeline uh that they have given us. uh by June of this year, they're looking for a commitment from the city that we do want to go forward and and do this um with them. Um if we give them that commitment, then by November, they're looking to have gathered all the content necessary to make the magazine a success. And then uh by January, it should be ready for distribution. uh they've asked from the city uh a couple different items. Uh one is to provide that commitment in the form of a

resolution. Uh two, uh again, we're asked to sponsor our own dedicated pages. Uh each of these pages, um if we did three pages, it would be around $4,140. Uh it could be a little extra if we wanted any prime placements in the magazine. Um but ultimately that would be the cost of the city uh for our portion. Uh the we're also asked to provide interesting content uh to the journalists uh about area Route 66 history and any other uh content. I've suggested that potentially we could get Rockwood School District involved and get the students involved and have um kind of a family segment to the magazine. So that might be an opportunity to to add something a little different. Um, and then we're asked to help uh distribute the magazine uh when it's ready. Um, it will be uh free uh to free for anyone who wants one. Um, but we'll be helping to to distribute it. Uh, so with that said, uh, do you have any questions regarding this project and what are your thoughts, Rob? Yeah, Robin, I I didn't hear and didn't see um maybe you said it. Um what's the circulation of this magazine? Do you know that? Is it like how does it happen? Is it I presume it's a periodical and it so or or is this just like a one-off for I believe this is a one-off for the anniversary. They're they're expecting it to be relevant the entire year of 2026. It's something that, you know, people want to pick up because there is a lot of interesting content contained

within it and they can learn a lot about the communities. So, what's the distribution mechanism? Is it just going to be like put it out at central locations and people grab it like the the magazines at at Deerbergs or that's that's my understanding. Uh obviously each of the cities can also get creative about potential distribution channels and then whatever leader publications normally um normally uses will uh I also assist with the distribution. But uh to get to your question, I I think probably one of our leader representatives would need to to answer it unless my recollection from the meeting mentioned that we had with the folks from leader publications. Any of the businesses that advertise in the magazine will then get copies of the magazine to distribute at their place. So then it'll be cities from Chicago all the way out to LA, whoever wants to participate in this. So it'll be um I'm try I'm trying to get at the potential the actual potential for Wildwood versus the cost to participate. And um if it's distributed al all along Highway Route 66 there, there's significant potential to attract uh people to our city. But So, this magazine will focus primarily on our region. So, I I believe it's going to be more regional distribution, though I could certainly ask if if there's any plans to distribute it further uh further along the route. Uh but I didn't get the impression that it would be offered from like in Chicago. Yes. In terms of hard copy, I didn't, as Robin

mentioned, get the impression that it was going to be distributed in that format, but they did mention that they would provide it in an electronic version, which then we could put on our website on that Route 66 page so that if people are coming through the area, they can access it then. Okay. So, it sounds like it's they're generating some content and they're trying to make a few bucks on it and it's going to be uh most local cities in our in our in our area like maybe across Missouri or it'd be nice to know the the distribution and so forth of this. Maybe if you get more information. Uh, I can certainly email and get a little bit more information from them and then offer that to this commission after this meeting. Well, if I'm the only one that's interested, you know, don't Well, it's something good to know for us as we go forward on this project. We're still in the pretty early planning stages. We have another meeting planned in a um in about a month. Okay. Thank you. they they'll know exactly when they go to sell advertising how many they're going to print and then how long it's going to be on the website and what their expected viewers are to do that. So I think that's probably a pretty standard question that they would have would be interesting to know uh because you have 12 months that so you multiply that by the number you're going to give out and then they'd have the viewership. They do have a new thing now on the internet for local stuff Eureka news and and all of that. So I'm sure this that's kind of the beginning of how they'll promote this one as well. Well, they did say that they would make uh 5,000 copies is what they're anticipating. How receptive are the other communities? Uh I Eureka appears to be all in. Um and I I think Pacific's very interested as well. They just weren't at the meeting that we were at. Uh so I think we're all

uh I think all communities will participate in this and uh I I do think it's a great opportunity to heavily promote our historic Route 66 corridor. It's also an opportunity to develop um and further strengthen relationships with Eureka and Pacific uh which could potentially lead to some joint activities. Uh this commission's talked about doing some joint comm uh activities with other other communities for Route 66. Um so I think you know that there's a lot of benefit here aside just from the promotion of the corridor um during a very targeted um time where where we are planning a wealth of events. We're planning um you know we have a lot of businesses to celebrate etc. that could go in this magazine. Um, you know, the way I think about this number, to me, this number is nothing compared to what, you know, we invested in the Wildwood points of interest map or some of the other tourism materials that we've generated, but this will have a much wider reach because we are expanding the boundaries of of the area that we're looking at. We have Eureka and Pacific, which are both Eureka has Route 66 State uh park. Pacific has the Red Cedar in like there's some real points of interest that you know we bring Big Chief Roadhouse um that I think sometimes when you you bring us all together it generates even more interest because there's more there. Um so that's my that's my pitch is I just think it's going to be an incredible u promotion opportunity for us. Madam Chair, if I may. Yes. Mr. Marshall, I would say also that the representatives from the publication

noted that they would like the cities to purchase X amount of pages, but we have whatever option we choose. Regardless, we'll be a part of the the process. So, don't let the number necessarily um at this stage create any concerns. We've made no commitment as the city. We were factf finding and those facts are what we're presenting to you tonight. Thank you. Anyone else? So, do we need a motion this evening? Uh yes, we are. if you are uh supportive of going forward on this project and we are looking for your endorsement before we take it to city council. Is there a motion? I I think at this stage we're committing uh we're committing to working with them on this publication, but we're not necessarily committing to a number of pages or an amount of money uh tonight. We're just committing to going forward with the magazine project as a whole.

So second it's been moved and seconded to go forward with more information. Uh is there any other comment or question? All those in favor please raise your hand. Thank you. Anyone opposed or abstaining? The motion has passed. Thank you. Appreciate it. All right. Our second major topic tonight under this item uh has to do with our Route 66 historic marker. At the last meeting, this commission did adopt uh some specific language for the marker as well as a backside of it u being a Route 66 uh map uh of our original route through Wildwood along with our four historic communities and Big Chief Roadhouse. Uh tonight we'd like to focus on where that historic marker should be located. Uh so I have provided an analysis of five different potential sites. Uh four of which we talked about at the last meeting. Uh we went ahead and added Big Chief Roadhouse um as a fifth site as well. Um so three of the sites are in historic pond area. That's Big Chief Roadhouse, Living Word Church, Pond Hotel site. Uh and then two are more in the historic Grover area. Um those being the Route 66 roadside park site and Wildwood Christian Church. Uh the first site I visited was uh the Big Chief Roadhouse site. Uh the reason we felt it prudent to add this one to the list is well Big Chief Roadhouse is our most famous Route 66 uh landmark. So of course we had to add it. Uh there are two potential locations

around Big Chief that we're that we're looking at. Uh one is the public rideway that's actually on the property just to the west of Big Chief. Uh so Big Chief doesn't really have a whole lot of area right in front of it and has a really big sign. Um but we were thinking maybe over here. Um it has some really nice framing as you're driving into that pond area. it it then puts the marker kind of like right at Big Chief without overlapping with the sign. So, I think it would be a nice visual. The other location uh would be across the street in the Wildwood uh middle school property. Uh the city has some um a large area public rightway on that property as well uh where we could potentially install the marker. And the benefit of uh of installing it there is it continues our buyin uh with Rockwood School District and the students um because they feel a certain ownership um around uh Route 66 and the marker. Uh so some real pros to having the marker around Big Chief. Um again that visual association I think really brings a lot to the historic marker itself. it makes people want to stop and read it. Um, it makes it pretty evident what what it's about. Um, also, you're going to get more traffic to the marker because I if you're going to Wildwood for Route 66, you're probably going to go to the Big Chief Roadhouse. And when you're there, you're in the parking lot, you're already stopped. You can go look at the marker um, at that point. And also, I mean, obviously Big Chief Roadhouse would benefit because it would probably generate traffic to Big Chief Roadhouse. Um, it's a good spacing from our other historic markers in the area. Uh, the pond marker being at Old Pond School. Um, obviously the the Grover

markers a little further further down. Um, and then again, if it were located at Wildwood Middle School, I do think the students would feel even more ownership around these projects. Uh the only issue I could really see with installing the marker in this location is potentially the the school pickups and drop offs. Um that traffic might you know during that those times of day it might be difficult to stop and and look at the marker um because of all that activity. The next site I looked at was the Living Word Church site. Uh so I took three photos in this case. Uh the we'll start with the bottom left photo here is frontage looking towards Big Chief Roadhouse to the west. So this is Manchester Road and this is the frontage of Living Word property. Um the other direction is in this top right hand corner. So this is looking east. Um, also, uh, looking at that very nice sidewalk and the frontage of the property. However, a potential problem I do see with this, um, location is that the drive is actually pretty lengthy. Uh, getting back to that parking area, it was actually when I looked at it on, uh, an aerial, it was 450 ft. And I see I I see probably if people were to pull off and look at a marker, they probably park where I where I did with the van, which I'm not sure Living Word would be super thrilled about. Um, so obviously some real positives to this location is again it it is associated with Route 66 history. It was once a stage coach stop on Manchester Road. There's notable landmarks all around it. um and their sidewalk along that front

edge. However, the parking area could prove to be a real challenging component. Um and it would be its own stop versus part of another attraction like the Big Chief Roadhouse um on the previous site visit. Uh my third site visit was to the pond hotel site and as noted at our last meeting uh so it is vacant property and it's private property. Um there is a St. Louis cycling u monument currently uh upon it. It is at a really nice intersection across the street is the current service station which has quite a bit of history to it. Um in fact the owner is really embracing that history. He's apparently painting a timeline uh of the building's history in in the lobby. At least it's a proposed project. So, it does seem like there's some interest um at this intersection of celebrating Route 66 history. Um he's also talked to me in the past about potentially putting bicycle service uh stations out there and and things of that nature. Um so, some real positives again uh to this location. We do have those visual associations, uh, a Route 66 history and some potential partners. Um, the historic marker could potentially have a QR code, uh, that could lead to a picture of the old, uh, the old Pond Hotel before it came down. Um, so we could do some education there. Um, maybe some virtual reality. Um, however, some cons are, again, it is private property. There's not an existing pulloff in this location. There's no sidewalk. Um, so there might be a safety and access issue and the site might be worthy of its own interpretation at a later date just focusing on the pond hotel. So that was another thought. Um, and then

finally, it, you know, there would be some some maintenance and work that would need to be done to the site to make it a an attractive place to visit the marker. So, moving on to our fourth location uh was the Route 66 roadside park site. Uh so, this is a view across Manchester Road at the uh property. This is owned by the city uh for the future park. Uh behind it, as you can see, are a number of modern homes. Um here is the frontage of the property along Manchester Road. So, this is the site here. Uh some real uh some positives here is the city does own the site. Uh obviously we're looking to interpret it uh for Route 66. There is on street parking here available on Manchester Road. Um however, uh some things that we saw as real cons is there's not really any visual association around this site for Route 66. Um, so the backdrop backdrop of the historic marker would essentially be those modern homes until we until which time we built a park here. Um, so so there's that. Um, with the park not being built yet, there's also the danger. Uh, the residents were probably one of the number one concerns of the residents residents was that people would be overutilizing their Grover Crossing Drive like pulling into this circle. And what I could see, similar to the living words situation, is if they can't find like an immediately adjacent on street parking spot, they're probably just going to pull into this circle and park there and put on their pan lights and go look at it and that will um potentially cause bad feelings with the residents and then when we go forward and build a

park. Um so anyway, that's just just something to think about as we as we look at these sites. Um the fifth site is Wildwood Christian Church. Uh this is an interesting site because it was once a roadhouse uh but it is no longer. It is a new building. Um uh but it was once a roadhouse where runners uh participating in the Bunyan Derby which was the transcontinental race from Chicago to LA uh stayed overnight in this area um as they were going through. Uh so it is it is kind of a neat neat spot for history. Uh there's also the Route 66 pavement uh relatively close by on private property. Um so it does have some interesting history to it. However, um you may see from Whoops. You may see from those photos, uh, there is a pretty lengthy retaining wall all along the frontage of this property, which makes it difficult to install a marker there. Uh, the the only real location I think might be this uh more eastern southern corner of the property. Um, however, it's not really as visible as you're going down the road. Um, and there's not a parking area immediately adjacent to it. So, we're running into a similar situation where the parking lot is actually up the state steep hill and anyone pulling in to look at the marker is probably just going to stall in the drive and put on their panic lights. Um, while the Christian church is a wonderful uh community of people, they've partnered with us enthusiastically in the past. Um, so we've got that going, but there are some logistical concerns here. So overall uh the department's

recommendation after visiting the sites uh was generally like we lean towards the the historic pond community sites uh which I presented first largely due to some of the visual uh associations that are located in that community. Um probably our our most preferred site was the Big Chief Roadhouse. Um and I think I think following that was the the pond hotel site though that's again that might that that might be a challenge. Um so that's my presentation to you this evening. I'm uh the department is interested in your feedback u based on this presentation what your thoughts are. Uh the next step uh once this commission does provide some direction would be to do further investigation into access rights and how we would go about um how we would go about installing the marker as well as moving forward with uh some of the fabrication and design uh elements of it as well. Uh so if you have any questions at this time we are happy to answer them. Thank you. So Robin, the timing would work out if we put it at the Rout 66 roadside park. I mean, is that because that's kind of been put on the back burner now, right? Uh, yeah. I mean, the main thing is it could be a few years before we pick up the park project again. So, the historic marker would be by itself in the in the vacant lot. Mhm. Um so that that's the primary concern there. Yeah. But I mean if it is a Route 66 historic marker and that's going to be a park, you know, dedicated for that even if we have to sit on it for a few years, I think to me that would be an ideal place for it. You know, that's my opinion. Okay,

Ed. I think he did an outstanding job. Um really good. I guess it'd be hard for me to picture anybody wanting to tour the U Route 66 and not go to the big chief. So, I guess my concern is if you could and I know sometimes they're not the easiest to work with, but if you could get it right by the big ch even the school, I mean, the kids are going to see it over there, but I think that would be something that would actually draw people uh to to that location. And if that little bit of space out there would work, I just think that the other ones are really nice and historic, but you have to have the history where here they if they're going to do it, they're going to know that and and I think you could play it up. So that's just my one penny worth of comment. Rob, yeah, you did a great job. I agree with everything Ed said. Um, Big Chief number one for there's parking. It's a business. It's historic. It's probably our most historic place and um uh I just think it's the natural spot. I don't know about having it across the road from Big Chief cuz then we'd have the problem of people running across when they're not supposed to. And um the kid pickup and all those kinds of things. So I'd suggest the south side of the highway there. Um, I do see the appeal of the pond hotel, but we'd have to do a lot of work to clean it up and make it nice and there's no parking and so forth. So, that that I I think you you um your priorities were right on Big Chief than the Pond Hotel. That's probably think you probably the most significant structure in wild the best place for it

when I think on the side of Angie would I would reach out to the owner, Stephanie, and I bet she would be thrilled and honored to and place it maybe even in front. Yep. That that would be part of the next step is to explore if we decide to narrow in on Big Chief, we'll explore all possible options around there. Steve, I guess I'm going to side with uh I like the roadside park idea. You're developing a spot specifically to honor Route 66. I know it's going to be a few years. You've got a big nice sidewalk there. Um it's a high pedestrian area. Some of these other like the Pond Hotel, there's no sidewalk. Um you'd have a hard time getting people to even see it. You can't read it while you're driving by. You're going to have to get out of the car, I think, and or pull over. You got a lot of verbiage on the sign. So, the higher pedestrian areas to me makes more sense. Um, I agree with Big Chief's a good location, too. But I like the more central area of of what is that old Grover there. You've got a lot of shops and businesses and um nice big sidewalks on both sides of the street and street parking like you said. So, to me, that seems like a logical place. Yeah. Yeah. My thought would be for the big chief as well, but I have I have another question and that's is there any possibility or is there anything we can do to assist in the development of the hotel or the pavement? To me, those are two outstanding things that that we could do something with maybe, you know, but I realize there are problems with both of them that are historic, but but is there anything that we could ever do to to encourage their development or to make way for for them to be developed?

Uh, I I think potentially we could learn a lot by going to the Missouri Historic Preservation Symposium next Thursday just themed around economic development. She knows I'm already going. Yep. Um because, you know, I do think there's uh I think I do think there are strategies uh that we could potentially take and I think that um that might give us some ideas. think we should invest in that and in in in either or both of those where whatever we can to make that happen to me that would be more valuable than anything else we could do. It's good feedback. Thank you, Steve. If I may, uh I'm going to go on Scott. I I think the location should be the future park location. It is as you leave St. Louis as a tourist. It's sort of at the start of our corridor. It's close to the beginning. It's in Grover, which gives It's got the shops. It's got the Funks. Was that Funks Grove? Mhm. It's got the uh the store, the store across the street. It's got Larry's Tavern. It's got uh the Sinclair station. It's got bungalows which are representative of the highway at that time. So I do think it's got some historical ambiance about it. And I do think it it that would be my vote. I don't think it's a problem with parking. This sign is not going to draw in droves of people. If you're gonna get one or two cars stop to read it, they're going to read it, look at it, get in their car, and drive on to

the big ch or who are the rest of 66. So that that'd be my vote for uh our future park. And I did notice uh coming here both yesterday and today that that little tiny structure next to Alders's uh store is looking really nice. Really? Oh yes. It's got windows, brand new windows and siding. That little tiny one. Yes. That uh we were very distressed over because of its condition, but it's totally different looking now. And that's right there in the Grover area. That That's exciting. [Laughter] Wasn't a very big class, was it? Oh, any other comments, questions? This is really exciting for me because I think it's the first time I've seen this commission like pretty much divided over an issue. Well, I I think it I think that's fine. I think we can narrow it down to these two locations and do those further investigations um and come back to you with with some additional information and insight. Okay. So, we don't need the motion tonight. If you'd like to make one, you can or or we can just we can take your direction and we'll bring back more. Um, I will make that motion, but I have a suggestion. Um, spend some time thinking about the potential traffic. I think it's mostly going to be east to west, which means folks will be if they need to use Arn Street parking, they're going to be parking on the across the

traffic lanes from either of these two places. And so parking is important. the Grover Crossing the the the Grover Crossing resident concerns seem legitimate to me and my feeling when I looked at that site it's just not exciting because I would love to have our park there so that we could put the monument there but right now it's just a field with a bunch of modern homes around it and there's I don't see a lot of foot traffic to be honest in that area of Manchester Road and so um I'm not sure that we'd be um uh that it would be as attractive to people as um as uh the Big Chief location. And so, but it's the it it would really come down to what kind of traffic flow do we think and maybe get a few more um get a few more photographs of both locations and you know, we can uh better assess the ambiance from you know, sitting up here than than we can right now with just these two. I have a question. Is there a possibility that once the park is developed that a historic sign could be moved and placed in it? Joe's got a smile and shaking his head. Yes, certainly. It's not a complicated installation. So, it can when it generally goes in very easy and it can come out and be reinstalled elsewhere. That just something to think about. So, okay. So, I made I I intended to make the motion. I never get around to it. I move that we um uh ask you to narrow down to the two locations and do further study. Sounds good. Is there a second? Kurt has seconded the motion. Any other comments or questions? This is

the time to bring them up, Steve. Okay. What are the two location? Just Big Chief and uh the his route 66 park. Okay. Okay. Good. Okay. All those in favor of the motion raise your hand. Thank you. Anyone opposed or abstaining? The motion has passed. Thank you. A little more work for you to do. Okay. The work program. Madame chair, members of this commission, uh, I believe we are touching on most of of the things that do have updates to them this evening. Uh, there are just a couple things I guess I will I will touch on. One is the master plan effort. Uh just so you know, uh the master plan group uh that's working uh working towards its update uh will be meeting on Tuesday, May 13th. Um and we'll be focusing on the environmental element of the plan at that time. at their last meeting. Uh the survey results generated a great deal of discussion. Uh good discussion I think um that will hopefully drive and put forth a lot of energy as we go into some of the the meat and bones of updating that plan uh for the next 10 years. Uh secondly, uh we have been uh meeting on a weekly basis with the Wildwood Property Sanctuary. Uh so uh as you may recall, the Wildwood Property Sanctuary is now uh the city's nonprofit partner for saving historic

buildings in Wildwood. Um and the primary focus of it right now so that the Wildwood Property Sanctuary is housed in the Fabricators Foundation um which uh is what uh John Phillips and Carl Essen are are involved in. So those are our partners when I'm talking about that. Uh anyway, their primary focus right now is on the JP Connell House and uh they're still u making offers on the property at this time. So things are still in discussion at the time at this time. Uh other than that, I think at this time I'll just open it up to any questions you might have for the department. Anyone have any questions on this? Okay. Is that your hand? Okay. You don't like that? You got to keep those hands down. Yes. Okay. Then we'll move on. Thank you. Um the next item is uh new business. Um youth member presentation. All right, Madame Chair, uh this is no longer my presentation. I will turn over the baton to Commissioner Raggy Ramen.

Good evening everyone. I'm really excited to present my 2025 to 2026 project. The development of a mobile app designed to bring Wildwood's rich history to life. The goal is simple yet impactful to create an engaging digital platform that showcases the city's historic sites through interactive maps, vivid photos, detailed historical descriptions, and immersive features. Our vision is to connect people, especially the younger generation, to the stories and landmarks that shaped Wildwood, turning local history into a living, interactive experience. Whether you're a resident, a student, or a curious visitor, this app is designed to make exploring Wildwood's heritage both informative and fun. Now, let's divide let's dive into some of our key features. You can use the app to view historic site images. For example, you can see the Hyman Scott House. So, I'm not sure if the image on the slide is right though, but that's besides the point. You can view a description of the site. For example, like it says on our slide, you can see that the historic site is known as the Hyman Scott House. Its name being reflective of Erns Thyman, the 1878 owner of the 18 section the original log cabin was built on, and Steven Scott, the present owner of the historic home as it stands today. Like this, you can observe and learn more about vast historic sites with small descriptions like these. You can also see the historic preservation calendar which will include meetings, site visits, concert events, symposiums, and many other important events. In our calendar, you can currently see that the HPC meeting date is set on the 12th and a site visit is scheduled on the 13th. There will also be a description of the event or any other important information in the calendar. For example, under the site visit like on the screen, there will be a description like the HBC is visiting the JP Connell House for for historic determination, something like that. With this calendar, I would also

like to add a not notification feature to remind commissioners and Wildwood residents to about important historic events, symposiums, and visits. Another significant feature of the app would be an interactive city of Wildwood map that highlights different regions such as Hond, Box Creek, and Grover while providing important historical information about them. Finally, I would like to bring in interactive features for a younger age group such as quizzes, word searches, and such more activities like that. Together, through innovation, we have the opportunity to preserve Wildwood's past while inspiring future generations to explore, appreciate, and protect the history that surrounds them. Thank you. Thank you. Any comments or questions for A this evening? No, I think that's a great idea. Yeah. How h how can we help? Just uh Okay. any ideas would be recommended on like any features we could bring into the app like more features would be recommended because like I've I've come up with some like a calendar and a map and some site images and descriptions but obviously more features the better the app will be. So any will be recommended from what's your target date for I mean it's probably open-ended it's never going to be completed right but um when do you expect to have it sort of up and running? Uh probably at the end of the next next year, like the school year eventually, by the end of the next year. Oh, okay. Yeah, that will give me some time to develop the app through some software as well as get in a lot of features. Keep us posted. Thanks. Thank you. Anyone else? Debbie, thank you so much, Ed. So, I'm pretty sure you could do this. So when you have um the history of a site or something

and you put it on a medallion, so for example, the whole um the old hotel, I know the technology is there that you could have a medallion made that has the history, the pictures of that type stuff. Then you could place it on another monument somewhere or then you could drive up, you could go over and scan it. Could you not do the same with the history on this? Okay. Yeah, that would be a great feature to bring in. Uh, sorry, what do you mean by a medallion? So, for example, in cemeteries um or you know, soldiers or whatever, they have the whole history um of that individual and it's just it looks like a little round button that goes on on the cemetery itself and it's got all the information on it. Be something like that. Oh, okay. Okay. So, and I know they make different types um that then you can walk through that cemetery and oh, there's a veteran from this and you can go over and look at it and it brings up a picture, the history, the family and all that type of stuff. I know that that technology was developed like 20 years ago, but I'm just wondering if it wouldn't be an easy way to take some of the history of these sites that don't exist anymore and then maybe go back and look at something. It's not wrong, but almost like you could put a piece of granite there and then put that medallion on it and then people could look at that medallion and and actually see what that site used to be or how it looked. And I'm just wondering, it's almost the same as putting the history there. Okay. So, like some type of a scanning feature that like once you scan it, it'll show all the information on the app. Yeah. Okay. That would be great. That would be great. Way past my level, but I just thought it's kind of cool. Yeah. I'll try to the best of my ability. You're way ahead of the rest of us, Obby. Your technology skills. That's wonderful. Thank you. Any more questions?

Looking forward to Thank you so much. Thank you for your time. Thank you. If you would, could you please make a a motion to endorse the project? Thank you. I didn't hear you. I so move. Been moved and seconded. But I don't know what the motion has to to endorse. Okay. To endorse the obvious project. I'm sorry. Uh any other questions before we take a vote? All those in favor raise your right hand. Thank you. Anyone opposed or abstaining? Abby, you have the go-ahad. Thank you so much. Okay. Uh discussion regarding the age threshold used to determine qualifications as historic Right, Madame Chair, members of this commission, uh, we've had an item hanging out on our agendas for a very, very long time. Actually, as long as I have been with the city, I have seen on not ready for action, the discussion regarding the age threshold used to determine qualification as historic. Uh so given that we're moving forward with our historic preservation plan effort this year and given that our uh wonderful chair is about to retire and has been advocating for the department not to lose sight of these not ready foraction items for um just as long. Uh I figured tonight was the night to talk about it.

Uh so without further ado, I'm going to give you uh some background on Wildwood's uh current age threshold and uh what some uh similar programs use as criterion um across uh county uh state and federal levels. Um and then we'll go into uh some considerations that the department had some thoughts and uh and then I'll open it up to feedback from this commission and we'll have that discussion. Uh so since its adoption in 1999, our historic preservation ordinance has identified 75 years as the eligibility threshold for defining a uh building structure or element within city boundaries as historic. So that's our baseline. Uh this threshold is important uh because it determines the building structure or elements eligibility for listing on the Wildwood Historic Register. So you can't be listed as local landmark unless you have reached that 75 years. Uh it also determines uh what we survey and include in the Wildwood Historic Building Inventory. Uh, so we look for properties that have reached that 75-year threshold and that's when we add them. And by adding them to our Wildwood historic building inventory, that triggers the added review process of when there is a demolition or there is a great alteration. Um, that's when those properties then come before the Historic Preservation Commission so that we can at least issue a response or have a conversation, give some constructive feedback um, as part of that process whether it's listed as a registered landmark or not. Um, so being just just being 75 years or older um, actually, you know, gives this commission uh, quite a bit of authority to to make

remarks. So that's that's why our 75-year threshold is important. So how does this compare to other programs? So as noted, we have our 75-year eligibility requirement for the Wildwood Historic Register. However, the St. Louis County Landmarks program has no age requirement whatsoever for uh for it. um instead uh their requirements are based on other criteria generally having to do with a property's historic significance. And I've listed some of those criterion in your reports this evening. At the uh federal level, uh the National Register of Historic Places, uh they have a 50-year eligibility requirement, and they also have language, I noticed, that allows for more recent buildings if they are especially significant to the nation's history. Um so, so they have a little bit of room, wiggle room, I I guess, built into their language. Um, so this is interesting because we are a certified local government working in a local, state, federal partnership. Yet at all these different levels, we all have different eligibility requirements and uh, you know, different um, different criteria kind of ruling the day as to whether something's historic or not. Uh, this has at times come into conflict uh, for the city. Um, particularly I remember having discussions with architectural historians um with the state historic preservation office about the Route 66. We keep talking about potentially making that a national um historic district. Well, when I had those conversations, it just kept coming up like we're we're surveying properties at the 75 year threshold, but they want to see all the properties, you know, up to the 50 year

old uh 50-year threshold. So there's um so it's like we're speaking different languages and sometimes that gets in the way of us moving forward on a certain project. Um, additionally, uh, the 50-year eligibility requirement at the federal level triggers, uh, section 106 review, um, which requires any federally funded or, you know, anything that the federal government touches basically that has reached that 50-year threshold, um, triggers that section 106 review of anything, uh, that might be architecturally, archaeologically significant. And so that opens up um a process for that. And uh recently we encountered some issues when uh we received a grant for the city's village green project and the city had already taken care of some buildings on the property that were all around that 50 years. Um but since they're not 75 years, the city didn't view them as historic. So that's an example of how sometimes we're speaking different languages u from the local level to the federal level. Uh so the department when thinking about this this discussion uh generally uh given some of the experiences um we've had and and some of the analysis we did uh we generally are leaning towards a more lenient eligibility requirement and um and one part of that case uh for reconsideration is more recent landmarks. So in the city of Wildwood, we actually have a pretty significant period of history that's relatively recent for us. We incorporated in 1995, just 30 years ago. So that's well below even the 50-year threshold. And that essentially means

that in the life of the city of Wildwood, some of our most his uh most significant and frankly historically significant buildings and treasures are some of our newer buildings that are in our Wildwood Town Center. Uh we we incorporated and then we we largely built this town center from scratch. We worked with world um frankly worldrenowned uh architects and planners on some of these um on some of these plans. Um and so there's quite a bit of of significance just associated with our own town center even though it's very new. Uh so under the county landmark program, you know, potentially, you know, the Wildwood Hotel and buildings like that could be considered, but presently under our 75- year threshold, they cannot. However, they are historically significant to wildwood. So that was one consideration or thought that we had uh when going into this discussion. Uh the other one is that we do have historic landmarks in Wildwood that don't necessarily meet our eligibility threshold because once upon a time, you know, a building burned down or met some other tragedy. So we have buildings like our United Baptist Church and our Westland Acres community that technically don't meet our eligibility threshold, but are highly significant in the history of this community. Um, so some of these structures, uh, Stoville is actually another example because that building burned down in the 50s and we're just now getting into the 50s, uh, when we're considering, uh, buildings that are 75 years or older. Now, I think STOs is accounted for because it's a local landmark that we have it surveyed and it's it's part of our stuff, but it's an example of how we

run into cases like that. And, you know, the St. Louisis County Assessor's Office is going to date them, you know, from when the new building was constructed. And that's generally how we pull our list of properties that we then survey. So, so this is another thing to think about as we have this discussion. So, I had a few different thoughts of how we might go forward if we did want to maybe reconsider how we do things presently. Uh, one is we could maintain our 75 year threshold. And actually, I'm going to back up because here's the main consideration. Um, if we do open the can of worms and we open our our threshold or lower it significantly, um, then potentially we're creating a lot of work for ourselves because we do survey all of those properties and that's a lot of work. So we'd be basically going back to square one in 2015 when we did a really giant survey and we'd have to do that again only we would have you know World War II type development uh which means we'd have a lot more buildings um to account for. So so when thinking about that balanced with some of the prior discussion here are the options I I came up with. Uh the city could maintain its 75-year threshold for survey work and review requirements, but we could potentially just remove this criterion for the while with historic register. So that would allow any a property of any age to become a local landmark um if someone wanted to pursue that designation. Um but it wouldn't create a lot of extra survey and review work for this commission. Um secondly, uh the city could maintain its 75-year threshold for survey work

and review requirements, but per perhaps add some exceptions for properties meeting exceptional criteria um such as having known significance and interest to the uh the community. And we would have to be really tight about what that criteria is. Um because frankly qualitative criteria is just harder in terms of legal um legal weight than than quantitative. Like it's much easier to say all buildings 75 years old versus well this building's more important than this building because of qualitative criteria. um we could remove the age eligibility criterion for being on the Wildwood Historic Register. So again, um pursuing uh opening that up. So that's option B. Again, the the main the main issue with option B is it might be hard to legally defend. Uh the main issue with option A is simply opening up that eligibility criterion doesn't mean owners of recent buildings are necessarily going to want to list their property. Okay. So option C, the city could survey all properties reaching that 50year threshold consistent with the federal level criteria. So that might help us in terms of some of our projects with Shipo. uh but only review properties that meet additional defined criteria. So rather than having to review every single demolition um of every building meeting that 50-year threshold, maybe we only review as a commission buildings that meet that 50-year threshold and have historic significance which would be documented in the survey work. Does that make sense? And then finally, option D, uh we could survey all properties reaching a 50-year

threshold, uh consistent with the federal level. Um but we could remove the age eligibility criterion altogether for being nominated to the Wildwood Historic Register. Um so option C, we would maintain that 50-year threshold throughout. Option D, we would do that for survey work, but remove it for the historic register so we can capture those more recent landmarks. So, those are four potential pathways. We're not looking for an action from this commission tonight. I just wanted to get kind of you thinking about this um about our eligibility threshold, especially as we move into our historic preservation plan effort because this is our opportunity to potentially guide those types of policies. It doesn't mean that if we put in the plan that we might change the eligible eligibility threshold. It would happen overnight. There would then be a regulatory process to update it in legislation etc. Um so this would be a much longer discussion and it certainly wouldn't happen in one evening. Um but this starts the discussion. So at this time I would like to open it up to you if you have any questions. If I can clarify anything that I presented this evening, um, I'm happy to do it. Thank you. So, yeah, I, uh, I like where we're at with the 75 year. I wouldn't be too opposed to, uh, option C, but when I'm thinking about historic buildings in Wildwood, I'm not thinking about the movie theater or the hotel. To me, I'm like, that doesn't seem historic. Yeah, they might have been here for 20 years or something, but you're talking about a historic area that have has things that are hundreds of years old. So, putting that I don't even think anything on that list really would make me think history, you know, on that short list you have there. So, I

would my vote would be to stay with the 75 or possibly go with the with option C um and then have the federal level criteria in there as well. But to not have any kind of age requirement and you're calling it histo you know history that doesn't make any sense to me a uh I would honestly like option B I feel like it maintains the 75 year threshold but also like removes the age eligibility for the start register also just additional thing uh sorry I have some I have some like test tomorrow with the goodbye. Thank you so much for Thank you for your presentation. It was wonderful. Anyone else? Ed really dumb question. Do we know how old the houses are? Like between how many are there at 50 up to that 75? This year what we did we added another group to the 75. Right. Yes. And how many were that? So So presently we So the group that we just added so that was three more years worth was 48 properties. Um and presently we're at about 450 maybe 460 properties total um since we started the survey work. So, that's all properties that have reached that 75-year threshold. Um, I did try very earnestly uh to uh get you a number that would get us the number of properties we'd have to survey to get to 50. I apologize. Um, every time I came back with a a number, it didn't make sense to me. So, I need to get together with our GIS guru with the department and come

back to you with that number. Um, but I do want to get you that number because I think it's it's very relevant to this discussion. My only thought would be is that is a big project. Yes, but at the same time having it's hard enough to explain to somebody what the national records are versus what ours are versus what the state or county would be. But maybe the way you could look at it is to say in the next 5 years, we want to move down to that 50 level instead of doing it now. And then, you know, exponentially it's going to get bigger. But maybe at that point with technology and other ways to do it, you could kind of grow into that and use one of the ones ones where you don't have to use the actual years. But I just think it's another way to kind of look at it. It's pretty interesting. Thanks, Rob. Can you give us any idea of the effort and expense to survey um additional homes or additional properties that that are at the 50 level as opposed to the 75-year level? Well, our latest survey effort was 48 properties and that was $5,000. Okay. So, it really depends on Again, I wanted to get you that number tonight. um unfortunately it didn't work out but um but it really depends kind of on how many properties we're talking about and then we could probably use that as a rule of thumb to figure out but we paid for that and we we had those one pagers that had the photo of the property and the description of the of the historical significance and so on and so forth but a number of them probably wouldn't meet any particular criterion is in terms of uh being historic Right. And so is there a way for you I was after reading this I was prepared to advocate for the um the

county landmark program and um uh but your explanation was really helpful. I think like C or D is good because um I I do think there's a it's hard to separate in my mind um a historic property from a from a significant uh a um architecturally significant property and Town Center. We've we we do have some and yeah, they haven't reached 75 years, but they're still it's it's worthwhile for us to, you know, kind of track them and try to intervene if somebody wants to tear them down and and those kinds of things. And so I guess I'd suggest that um that uh um well, what are you looking for from us? So, are you looking for us to pick one of these or this evening was really about I think generating some initial feedback and discussion in response to what I just presented. I don't see this as something that we need to come to any sort of conclusion on tonight um at all. I I think this is a longer conversation. Um, however, we did again we wanted to dust off our not ready for action item and we wanted to have this larger conversation in preparation for the historic preservation plan effort because this might be folded into some of that. Yeah, this is an important discussion to ha to have. I think um um it probably the most important thing for staff is to rationalize and break down as many of the barriers as you can between the way we designate historic properties, the way the federal government designates it and the way the county does it and so on and so forth and try to, you know, do your best job of melding those together in a way that

works for us. But I like the idea of having a less restrictive um uh age. You know, 50 minimum is better than 75 minimum, but I like the verb just having reference to verbiage if it's historically significant in some way. Um I I would I would think that would be enough, but um um I'm excited to see what you come up with uh next. Great. Thank you, Steve. Uh the 50 year we the 50y year would be the criteria where it would come under our review for remodeling addition demolition and that type of thing that we could do but it would doesn't have to be surveyed to do that. We could keep our survey at 75 years and not pay for more survey. that interesting for the older houses. And in fact, we could change it to 80 years. But as long as anything under over 50 years, we would need to approve of any modification, we'd go look at it and make our judgment. Is this historically significant? Be it by history or by architecture or something else, we need to save it. or you know it could go. Can I ask can I ask an related question? Um is there a way like we have sometimes we have trouble making a quorum on these road trips to look at a a crappy old house that's fallen down and nobody wants to walk into it and so on and so forth. And so it seems like a it's a it's a lot of churn. Is there a way to make like a um um sort of an ad hoc review committee? takes three people to show up and oh by the way you have three volunteers from the commission that are willing to go out on that particular day

and so you don't have to chase us all around and try to find a quorum and so forth. Is there is there a provision in the in our uh legal structure for something like that to occur? Maybe Joe's a better person to answer that. Dr. Remember, what I would do is respond to your question by saying with the planning and zoning commission as part of their bylaws, they have two com subcommittees. One, for example, is the site plan subcommittee. In the bylaws, it just says four of them, and that forms the subcommittee that can hold meetings, visit properties, and then they make a recommendation to the full planning and zoning commission. So, I'm assuming we could do something very similar with our historic preservation commission. So, and it doesn't say doesn't specify by name. Just any four that any four. Yes, that. So, as long as we give four, we have our site plan subcommittee in place. Great. Okay. Thank you, madam chair. Could I just make a couple Oh, my apologies. I have one more thing. I I do think though that we could have an additional criteria for historical events that happen or say that have a historical district like downtown town center here being significant even though it's not se 50 75 years old but uh so I I I would have I would have that add that qualification our to our uh being placed on the Wildwood Historical Register. Joe, thank you. M Thank you, Madam Chair. Just some background. When the original historic preservation and

restoration code was developed, we depended greatly on a representative from the state historic preservation office, a woman named Joanne Radatik. So, just so you know, she is the one that kind of advocated for the 75-year threshold. It wasn't something that the group of volunteers, including the Department of Planning, thought was appropriate. We depended on her greatly. So, that's kind of the origin. The concern I have with the 50-year threshold, and I mentioned this to Robin when we went through the discussion of her memorandum, is the Evergreen subdivision and West Glenn Farms. That's approximately 900 households, all of which are rapidly approaching that 50-year threshold. And 900 households, suburban track housing, which obviously does have some historic context, but I certainly don't want to be sending you information that we need to go look at a deck replacement or an outdoor fireplace or a sidewalk or a patio. So, be cautious. when you make your thoughts about this 50-year threshold, because I can frankly tell you, we're not going to basically go out and review people's decks on a 50-year-old house. I will fight that every step of the way at city council. Uh yes, that's that's actually why in one of my review criteria, if you don't mind me just piggybacking on that one comment, it's actually why I suggested that we only review properties that meet additional defined criteria. Um because it is a lot of time and effort actually to organize each of these HPC field trips to go out and review a property and um you know sometimes when there's a you know a substantial alteration, it's certainly worth it. there's significance to the property, it's certainly worth it. Uh when you know there's a

demolition to consider, it's certainly worth it. But um but again, piggybacking off off of what Director Vunage just told you, um we got to think carefully about how we balance u our considerations on this. Rob. Yeah, that line of thinking is why I was hoping to get away completely from an a, you know, an age criterion and make it more, you know, other um um more subjective criteria. I I think that makes sense for us and and you know, you can go off and figure out the best way to do that. But yeah, nobody wants to make the department um have to spend every minute of every day reviewing decks in a in a subdivision. So, well, Dr. that already the thing is three or four of you come along with us and help us make a decision about a deck that a couple wants on their house. So, Kurt just make comment about that like here's I can imagine the uproar of people well we really got to like look at this house for you to add a deck or something on the back of it like you know when they put in the the light dimming the people are saying, "Oh, we're not going to have Christmas lights anymore." It's true. And it adds about a month delay to their to the process every time we involve the HBC. Sometimes several months delay. So, um, we don't want to take that that lightly. I don't think

appreciate the feedback. Yes, Steve, I guess I have another qu maybe a dumb question and I know I'm new here, so my own ignorance, but the 75 year threshold, that's a that's a rolling target. Um, wonder why just pick a pick a year and say anything built before this year, 1950 for example, because what happens in 2075? Are you going to consider houses built in the year 2000 as I mean that keeps moving every year. So at some point shouldn't there be more sense to have a date anything preceding that date then it's never a moving target but but maybe I just don't understand McBride Helms will be historic in 1995 still standing 1995 75 years was 1920 um 2030 it's 1955 but like you said it's moving yes well if I may Um, I I think it really comes down to how you define historic. Is historic something really really old? Cuz I think in many instances we've gone out and we've looked at something really really old and we've determined this doesn't have any historic significance whatsoever. Or does historic mean it has profound significance to Wildwood or you know preceding communities history in some way to the development of this area. And that's why I was making the case for Town Center because even though Town Center is not that old, it's highly significant in the development of this area. And so that's why, you know, that's why it's worth noting, not not because it's old, but because it's significant to the community. Determine historic and significant. Yeah, that I guess that would be something to consider too. But I do

consider historic honestly I consider historic as being more associated with significance than I do age from my perspective. But other than St. Louis County, age is a component of the determination. So that's why it's in our code. What I would suggest is I think Miss Keef and I have a lot to chew on, so we'll be back with something to let you kind of know what we're thinking. Ed, so the eligibility criterion is probably the most important regardless of the age. I mean to be specific about what you would consider these things to be whether it something is not significant as a torch but something else it would be more so I I kind of think that's a the area that would help sort that out some if you're able to say these are the things that are going to make it significant um and maybe work off something like that. You got a lot of work ahead but it's interesting. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, moving on. Uh the next item is appointment of a nominating committee and uh appointment that means I name it. Uh it's a a committee of three. Uh I am uh appointing Allan to be the chairman, Kurt and Debbie to be the other two on the committee and they will work together with Robin and uh I can be called into it if needed. Uh but uh we need this list at the next meeting because that will be the election and the change of officers. So I do think everybody was here when we made that vote to move our

election to midyear this this time around. Um so so that's why we're doing the nomination committee this evening. So um do we need to approve my nominating committee or No, I believe it's within your power as chair to appoint the nomination committee. Uh the department will be reaching out to you and uh organizing uh our generally 15minute discussion um around it. So thank you and we usually do it via Zoom too. So it should be a relatively easy meeting, right? Thank you so much. Okay. point of information. Will these officers then serve for a year and a half or they are they just six months? Well, I I think that's actually I was thinking the same thing and I think that's something for this commission to to consider and make a motion on. Okay. You want us as a committee to consider that and bring that might be a great idea and then you can propose something to the commission next month as part of the elections process. Thank you, Alan. Okay. Um, other matters, update on federal level actions. Yes. Uh, madame chair, members of this commission. Uh, as you all are probably well aware, uh, a lot is changing uh, in the federal landscape at this moment and some of those changes are affecting historic preservation activities and, uh, some of our work here in Wildwood. So, the department just felt it uh prudent to update you on some of those changes and some of those impacts. Um, just so as we go along and make decisions in our work, we know what's happening. Uh right now the two major updates we would like to make to you um that are in some way tied to our work here in

Wildwood is uh that recently 65% of employees and more than 1,000 grants have been cut from the National Endowment for Humanities. Uh the reason this is significant is actually this was the source of funding, creative funding uh we were eyeing for for some time on the Route 66 roadside park. So, that's why it's significant to us. It's also significant because our partnering organization, uh, the Missouri Humanities Council, which is the state's local National Endowment for the Humanities, um, council that funds cultural institutions and humanities programming in this area, lost $2.7 million of its funding on April 3rd of this year. Um, so that means there's less money that the Missouri Council for Humanities is giving out to um, municipalities and other organizations uh, around history and humanities projects. Um, so we just wanted to bring you up to speed on that. At this time uh, we have received word that cuts have not been made to the National Park Services Historic Preservation Fund grant which is currently funding our preservation planning work. And uh so far cuts have not been made to research grants received for the city's uh network to freedom projects. So we're still we're still safe on our currently funded projects. Um and we'll let you know if that changes. Uh so if you have any questions at this time, we'll do our best to answer them. Uh but those are our updates. Hey, anyone have any questions on this? I guess there's no questions. We'll just have to keep on top of things. Okay. Uh the next item is the Hamilton family land grant brick dedication and uh that is this coming

Tuesday at 4:00 at Old Pond School. Uh there are four major land grant that we we'll be talking about. And uh then um that's the men of the and I don't want to sound sexist on this. That's the men of the Hamilton family. Uh the interesting thing is that each one of Nenny and Bell Hamilton's daughters married a fellow who had a land grant in what became Wildwood. So their entire family was involved with land grants. Uh the sad thing is there's not that many in the area uh still from those families because uh many of them died early in the early 1830s and then a lot of them moved on uh I guess they had heard about that that let's go west young man but some of them went south more than west but many of them moved on to Franklin County and so there's still a lot of people in that area there will people at the dedication who are descendants of some of the u um land grant people besides my daughter and myself. But um so that will be nice to be able to uh acknowledge them and Joe has uh offered the city to give us some hot dogs uh after the dedication and there'll be some sweet things to go along with that as well. So, uh, we hope that some of you can make it to the dedication at four o'clock. Uh, it's rain or shine. If it rains, which it sounds a little stormy for next Tuesday, but things can change before then. Um, that we will be inside Old Pond School for it. And there will be displays. Uh I

have uh maps showing the land grants superimposed on top of local current maps so that you can see what roads does this entail for various land grants. To me that was very interesting. Uh our daughter had uh come up with those. So uh Julie and I will be uh conducting it and uh as I said I hope that more of you there. There'll be displays. There'll be some handouts. So, come one, come all. Yes, Rob. Robin, you're the um recorder of these sorts of things. Could you take photos of those overlays and just send them to us or make them available to us somehow? Because I'm not going to be able to be there. I'm going to be out of town and I' I'd really like to see those maps. So, um, if you wouldn't mind if you're I I guess you're going to be there, aren't you? Yes, absolutely. And in fact, that was exactly the role uh our chair gave me was to be the official photographer and recorder of the event. So, nothing new about that. I will I will certainly share that information with you. Thank you. Anyone else? Okay. The last item is exciting news from Joe Bond Rubin. Yes. Uh madame chair, members of this commission, I thought we would end the evening on a very positive note. Uh our Wildwood Historical Society uh society archavist uh Jill von Grubin has been very active as also a historian of the World War II 324th Infantry Regiment Veterans Group. Her father was affiliated with this group and so she's very dedicated to it. And so recently, in anticipation of the group's closing,

she approached the uh National World War II Museum in New Orleans and asked if they would like to accept all of the group's artifacts and personal stories as a donation to it. And ultimately they said, "Well, yes, since you organized it so nicely for us, we will accept about 99% of the donation." So, uh, so that will be on display at the museum, uh, this coming September. So, very exciting for Jill. Um, but also, um, because, uh, as you know, Jill is also the primary author of the Wildwood history book, uh, she put a bug in someone's ear about that, too. And because there's a significant World War II section in the book, uh they decided it was worth having in their uh research library as well at the museum. So the Wildwood uh history book uh is now uh at the national level in terms of being at this museum's library in New Orleans. Uh so I thought that was a a fun bit of news and certainly thank you to all who have been involved in that work. um this is this is pretty great for our city that word is getting out about what we have here um locally in Wildwood. So congratulations. My husband just made a trip down there to see that museum. So it was very impressive. So I he would highly recommend it. Anybody wants to take a road trip or you can go on the train. Just wait till September. Just wait till December. Okay. Are there uh any other items that anyone needs to bring up this evening? Well, just remember the work that we do, we being the Wildwood Historic Preservation Commission, not

only includes that preservation, rehabilitation, restoration, and reconstruction. Our work includes the stories of the past of our city even before we were an incorporated city. It's up to us to work toward recording what took place before this area was the state of Missouri all the way up to today. And that's what the uh brick uh is helping to do. Uh are there any objections to closing the meeting? A general consent. The meeting is closed. Good night everybody. Have safe travels home.