Historic Preservation Commission - Regular Meeting

I would like to welcome everybody to our historic preservation meeting. Right now, we'd like to uh go ahead and do our official roll call. Robin, will you do that for us? Absolutely. Uh, Secretary Henzik is not with us this week. Vice Chair Larson is not with us this week. Uh, Chair Quarter present. Our Commissioner Berllo, Commissioner Berllo, are you with us online? Yes.

Present. Commissioner Shenfeld present. Commissioner Burmel present. Alternate Le Lavas is not with us this week. Alternate chair present. Council member liaison Mabberry present. And it does not look like we have council member liaison Rambo. Our HBC advisor Scott present

and our youth members are not with us this week nor is our Wildwood Historical Society liaison. We do have one, two, three, four, five. Okay. Uh so, uh Commissioner Bertollo, you are going to be with us the entire evening, correct? Yes. We didn't hear you. I'm sorry. Yes.

All right. Thank you. Uh, Chair Cordinet, if you could just acknowledge for the record that alternate chair will be a full-fledged voting member this evening, then we will have met our forum. Thank you. You're on chair.

All right. My apologize for apologies for missing the February meeting, but my husband treated me to a cruise for my birthday. So, sorry that trumped the meeting. Uh hopefully you all have taken a moment to um see the progress of the SM Login. It's been uh long awaiting the reconstruction of this historical structure and uh I think it's great that it's located so close to city hall. Um I believe it'll draw a lot of attention and interest. Thank you to those of you who took the time to do some editing and perusal of the Wildwood Historic Preservation Plan. The final draft is getting its final edits and this is a lengthy yet important part of the historic preservation of our city. So, thanks for being part of that. I'm not privy to all who have decided to join us for the trip to Minneapolis this July for the National Alliance Preservation Commission conference. I think it's great that Wildwood has received a grant from the Historic Preservation Fund to offset most of our expenses for this trip. I look forward to this learning experience and just spending some time traveling with those of you who will be joining us for the conference. Right now, I would like to uh ask our new alternate member to share to do our pledge of allegiance if you don't mind. The legion flag.

Thank you very much. All right. We'd like to uh get the approval of the minutes from the last meeting on February 26th. Mr. Mayberry's making a motion.

All right, looks like we are approved. Is any public comment tonight online or in the audience? Uh, madame chair, uh, it looks like the individual we have online with us is a presenter for one of our uh, items. Is there anyone in the audience at this time who would like to make comment? No. No public comment. All right. Thank you.

And uh are we don't have our representative from the Wildwood Historic Society, so we won't be doing any updates from them. Or do you have something that you would like to cover? Uh, I wasn't given any comments from Jill, uh, but she has been given, uh, the final draft of the historic preservation plan, a full review and sending me her comments via email. Uh, she is absolutely blown away by it and very excited for it. Thanks. Thank you.

Very good. All right. Well, we're going to move on to old business. Um, under ready action, our historic preservation plan update the final version. All right, madame uh chair, members of this commission, uh we are approaching that finish line with this project. We've been working hard on it uh really for two years now if you count all of the pre-engagement efforts. Uh but tonight you have a final adoption draft in your packets. Um and in fact this this one's even more final than the one I shared on Saturday because I didn't realize we were getting an even more polished version. Uh so uh without further ado, I'm going to turn it over uh to Marcia Bole who is here with us uh from MIG this evening uh to walk us through this final draft and some of the changes that have been made and any highlevel discussion that's still left to be had regarding it. Thank you.

Thanks Robin and good to see everybody. I wanted to first echo the thanks that the chair provided at the beginning of the meeting um for all the um review and comments that you provided since our last time together a month ago. Um really appreciate kind of that additional um detailed review to make sure that we get the goals and strategic actions to where they are today. Um and also wanted to thank Robin and Jill. I'm sorry she's not here tonight, but um and Jill for all the photos that they provided for the document. Um, we are still working to source a few things correctly, but I know that the historical society and the city provided so many important photos to make this plan very visually attractive. So, appreciate their effort to do that. Um, I'll go ahead and share my screen with the document. Um, I know it's in your packets as well. And I'm just going to highlight a few kind of key places of change that have happened since the February version. I know a lot has changed since then and you've seen kind of a handful of iterations. um since we last met, but wanted to just highlight a few key things. Obviously, the formatted version is um a lot different than all the narrative versions you've seen. I know you've seen a couple formatted iterations, but this one, like Robin said, is the most complete version um with a lot of graphics trying to pull in photos of um all the historic communities, some different landmarks and places that we know should be highlighted here. Um we would love any comments if there are are things you aren't seeing in here that you'd really like to see. Um but we're hoping that it's looking pretty comprehensive at this point. Um a few key things. So one of the biggest changes that has happened is um on page 27 you can see basically the framework of this document. Um when we met last there were a lot more goals than this and a lot more strategic actions. Um, we also had the goals at that time split between the body of the document and the first appendix. And in

our refinement, in our discussions with um, Robin and Joe and then in comments that you all provided as well, we really wanted to streamline what what you're seeing here. So, the goals have been condensed into eight goals. Now, um, some things have happened like moving um, one of the goals to a vision element. So, I wouldn't say that things have been removed. they've just been incorporated and um streamlined for efficiency. So, same sentiments are still here. They're just reorganized in a way that should be easier to implement and to utilize. Um and then we've also introduced this kind of ongoing strategic action timing um in addition to the short, medium, and long-term just to recognize that there are some things that you're either already doing or ones that are proposed in here that really aren't a checks the box item. there's something you'll start and should continue to do over the years and it may be an annual review of something or just kind of periodic updates but recognizing that there are some some actions that are just ongoing things that you should be doing. Um I wanted to also pull up page 31 if you want to flip to that one too just to show you that kind of um where the goals have landed that they have been condensed just a little bit but we've not lost any of the sentiments. We've tried to streamline kind of where you'll find certain things and also recognize that there are some things out of the control of the historic preservation program and your purview. It's related items and things you might be involved in, but not ones you're controlling directly. And so we've been careful to make sure that the goals and strate strategic actions are really capturing what you all are going to be doing over the next 10 years and not things kind of beyond your control. Um, chapter 3 has changed just a little bit in that it um has some additional information about some of the key opportunity areas. So, those have been enhanced a little bit as you kind of go through that. But, I don't think any of the key content you're seeing in there

has changed in a major way since you saw it last. Um so the only other piece I wanted to note before we can open for discussion is um in chapter 4 the timing for each of the actions is a little bit more um detailed at this point. We've included these different colors that are introduced um both in the introduction to that chapter um as well as repeated at the beginning of each goal. So it's clear, you know, as a reminder, um the shortterm strategic actions are shown first in blue, then the medium-term that are six to 10 years are shown in that kind of rust color. Longterm are 10 plus years. Again, those are outside the scope of the plan timeline, but things that you could consider if that's um kind of comes up in your work program annually. And then those ongoing actions are shown now in just the black text at the end. So we've tried to visually distinguish those um so that very clear as you go through the document what you should be focusing on in the first five years versus second five years and then beyond. So I think with that I'll pause and see um if there are any questions or clarifying uh discussion points. Robin mentioned this is our adoption draft. Um, so the intent is that if things are looking good that this version would move to planning and zoning commission and council in the next couple months. Doesn't look like there's any comments. Marca.

Okay. Things are looking okay. Oh, I'm sorry. Bob maybe has comments.

Sure. Go for it. Well, Miss Bole, the fact that no one else has comments as mandate that I must speak and say something because this thing can't be perfect as close as it is it would seem. Um I want to compliment um all the effort first of all in uh the the in the triage the ordering and the priority of the stressing the the different goals uh as compared to each other. Uh, and I I did note that all activities and and goals and inertia uh have been kicked in the pants and what some goals look like we better hold off and get our ducks in a row the first couple of x years and then attack the outliers later. No, it's it's it's fullcourt press. It's it's a it's a attack um all all fronts. So I I do appreciate that sense of um importance, not urgency, not panic, but just importance that all goals and all means of attaining them are important. Um the one thing I did want to uh ask is um um what what mechanisms or what what's the u what's the plan of attack for um the money that goes behind this effort. This is a this is an initiative that's an all new um player. So instead of bumping out the back and adding a wing to city hall, um how do we how do we bring about a housing for the resources? Where do we get the resources? How do we pay for the

resources that all that um all that um minutia that goes with an effective plan because we don't have we don't have the the people or the place or the things for this monumental um undertaking. Thank you, Joe. I hear your permission. Yeah, go ahead.

So, as you know, we've been under a time frame that's been established by the state historic preservation office to finish this plan sometime around the beginning of this summer. Internally, the department of planning has been working to complete this plan so it's available for our budget process as we start at the end of August, beginning of September. The intent through the summer months is to discuss with the commission members those goals and those strategic actions that are in the short-term range that have dollars and cents associated with it. prioritize those. And then as we begin the budget process with city council and the individual committees, the three committees, administration, public works, planning and parks, and economic development to basically have them help us fund those things. And so having the plan complete is the key to the door so that we can unlock funds internally. And then as always, as Robin has done and others, seek grants to fulfill the larger projects. Thank you

for the for the director.

Um, can we can we float with current the current level of support through fiscal year 26? or do we get to wait three more fiscal quarters before we take up at the end of or the mid middle of this year? We don't want to be doing no darn budgeting at the end of the year like we always do, but have this thing settled so that by kickoff fiscal year 27 um you've already got uh you've already got ads in the paper for new hires. Well, employment decisions go far beyond the department of planning and parks and for the most part are made internally between the city administrator and the city council. Obviously, engaging additional staff has a substantial expense with it. And as you know, the model that the city of Wildwood has had over the past 30 plus years is we engage consultants to fill that role and use the consultants to achieve the goals and then back away and then we start that process again. What I will tell you is is that fortunately couple of our major goals relate to Route 66. And as you know, as a member of city council, the city council was generous and gave in the budget $10,000 toward that just specific event in the operating revenue for the department of planning, not parks per se. The department also set aside about another $20,000 under consultant services and contractual services to basically implement those things that we think we can get to still this year. So, we don't have an overwhelming amount of money relative to what things cost to in today's market, but we have funds to

begin implementation, I believe, in 2026. You're welcome. I have a couple of things that I noticed and um on the maps which I think are great uh there are point they're pointing out uh different like points of interest. So those are numbered and just as someone reviewing and looking at the map I didn't see a key. So, I didn't know if that was on purpose or if it was just, you know, or what. So, um there's a couple of maps throughout this document and I didn't see any keys. So, uh I thought that might be a good thing to have with the permission of the chairman. Miss Shfeld, is that u the map on page 54? Yeah, it's the colorful one that has the Celebrate Wildwood logo in the lower right hand corner.

I'm looking if it is. Yes, there. That was a map we prepared for Celebrate Wildwood events before we did the new points of interest map. So, there was a back page to it that had the key. Okay. So, we can certainly address that. Okay. Um there there's about at least three maps. So, I'm not sure if, you know, roomwise, I don't know if you want to, you know, take up more room with the key and how big are the keys and that kind of thing. Just not sure where to go with that.

Until the new points of interest map, this was probably one of my favorite maps that the department had done in conjunction with Stacy Minkoff, who is one of our graphic design consultants. So, it is a pretty map, but if we end up needing to do something to basically tie location to the image, the icon, we'll certainly work with Miss Bole to get that done. Okay, that's great. Um, one of the other things Oh,

I was just going to ask for Yeah, for a quick uh I was looking through for the other maps, too, and just wondering um the points of interest map that is shown on page 42, I believe. I'm curious. Um, there is a key at the bottom, but it is very small. And so, in that instance, we could also do some tweaking to enlarge the key. It it'll be slightly different than what's currently shown, but it might be more legible. I don't know if that's also something that's kind of encompassed in your comment, but wanting to make sure that the document's accessible and anybody can kind of pick it up and use it and not have to get a magnifying glass to be able to see what the key is. I don't know if one of the ones you looked at

that they're numbered and it just presents the question of oh I wonder what that's for type of thing. Sure. Okay. So, um the other one is on page 39 and that's also got a lot of numbered items. Yeah. Yep. we can we can squeeze in some key information or find ways to kind of alter the layout on that page um just to make sure that the necessary information is there for somebody to navigate and not have to go to a different document. Okay. Um sounds fine. Marsha and members, if I may, um,

there all all of these points of interest maps and even including some of these older versions are available on the historic preservation page. I wonder if we can't just make a note on them and a QR code that leads them directly to the the actual full-fledged uh points of interest map available on that page and then someone can delve into the the more detailed information on them. Sure, that's an excellent idea. Yeah, that sounds good. Yeah,

chair. Just a comment. Um, going back to the resource discussion. So, I guess this is a question for Joe or Robin or even Marca. Um, I thought I read in the plan that um the spreadsheet that's going to be placed in the back with all the strategies. thought we were going to assign cost to those eventually. Did I read that wrong? Well, I'll I'll give you my answer, then I'll defer to the two experts, which is Miss Bole and Miss Keefe. But I don't remember assigning cost. That's a difficult process. And certainly, as soon as you put the cost on paper, it'll change.

Okay.

Yeah. And I'll maybe add too that in in this iteration um we did talk a little bit about the opportunity to do a spreadsheet at the back, not necessarily signing costs like Joe mentioned, but to consolidate all of them and it felt like that was duplicating information and making the plan longer, not for a good reason. And so that piece has been removed. Um, I think too in in the many iterations of the strategic actions we've had through the process, we've tried to be really intentional about making sure the short-term actions are ones that are either things already on your work program or soon to be, you know, already in discussion um or things that are currently ongoing so that you're capturing existing efforts and not saying that every short-term action is going to have a huge dollar amount. um making sure that those are realistic and not requiring a lot of new funding to make that happen. Um we know that obviously the city has taken advantage of shipo grants. Um there's some resources in the back of the document in appendix for other grants to consider, but they're not assigned specifically to individual actions. They're just things to kind of keep in mind as possibilities as you work on implementing.

Yeah. Thank you. Mr. Scott. Yes. Uh, this is a question maybe I we probably should have asked a long time ago, but this is the first time for us, but Marcia, you've got experience in this. What happens next after this is all printed and published? What have you what has happened in other cities with this, both the good and the bad?

Sure. Yeah, that's a great question. Um, I would say the this is just step one. The the fun part and the important part comes in implementation. Um, I will say of all the communities I've worked with, you guys already have a strong kind of path towards implementation with your annual work program, making sure that that's in place and that you're all kind of on board with what's happening. That is that is your kind of annual path to make sure you're taking things from this plan document and bringing them to reality. Um, I think Joe's comments too about budgeting are really important that this is getting finalized before you enter budget season and conversations so that you can advocate for things that are in this document. So, I would say that those are kind of your near-term steps. Um, and then annually making sure you're reviewing the document, updating it as needed. Um maybe not full updates annually, but making sure the document stays relevant because the one kind of um downside thing that can often happen is that things change, priorities shift, and a document like this can become irrelevant really quickly if you don't go back to it, update it as needed, and make sure that it continues to be kind of your guide for the next 10 years. So I would say keep that on your mind so that it's a document everybody can go back to and you guys can be using for the next 10 years and doesn't become irrelevant within a year from now

and madam chair with your permission. Yes sir.

Madam chair and members of the commission council member Mabri and I had a discussion recently about potentially making the historic preservation plan a subset of the master plan. not necessarily just referencing it as a goal objective or strategy but or policy, excuse me, but actually making it a subset. The the correlation is that's what town center plan is. It's actually a component of the conceptual land use categories of the master plan. It's a subset and it carries the same weight. so to speak, as the master plan does relative to changes. Changes are reviewed, changes are updated, things along those lines. So, we've talked about that. That's a discussion that'll follow because I actually think this the historic preservation plan will be completed before the master plan as we're moving through that those final stages. Secondly, I think we'll need to update our 2026 work program. As you know, we adopted it at our last meeting in February. I actually saw it as an interim plan because as we move through and get all of our goals and strategic actions, now we need to kind of see how what we have already fits into what we're saying we want to do. And then finally, the budgeting process. It sounds a long way away, Mr. Scott. But surprisingly, we'll also do a midyear budget adjustment which begins in June and then we move into fiscal year 2027 around the end of August, beginning of September. So, I think we'll keep you busy.

Well, I'm impressed. I have been for several years impressed with the commitment of this uh commission and the staff and the fact that I know this will be followed up here in house but is this going to get out to the public to the businesses what kind of support are we going to get from them and that's why would like to ask Marshion do you see is gaining a lot of support with outside of the actual structure of the government that we have here.

Yeah, that's a great question. Um, I think it should. I think successful plans like this do. Um, the intent of this document is to be public facing. It will be available on the city's website as Joe mentioned, maybe part of the master plan. Um, so the intent and the way it's written is that it's not a technical document. It's something accessible to anybody. Um, I do think with preservation months coming up, um, you have great opportunity to announce the adoption of this. Hopefully in preservation month in May, um, when it'll be hopefully officially adopted by council, that's a great time to announce that and really publicize that so that people start seeing this document and reviewing it. And there's a lot in here about partnerships that are needed to implement these actions. do have a lot already established, but being able to continue those relationships and foster new ones with other organizations so that it's not just those in the room tonight that are implementing will be really crucial. So, yes, I think this should be a document for everybody and making sure that it's out there and there's press about it will be really important.

Yeah. Well, I think we have been very active in outreach and getting our message out, but I think it's important that it be organizations that we reach out to and the local businesses. Um, the families that come through on Celebrate Wildwood are interesting and they walk away and that's it. But I think it's the businesses that are going to make things work around here as well as other organizations.

Yeah, I will add one more thing too that um kind of our last deliverable for this effort is a brochure version of this document. Um we completely understand that it's probably unlikely the average community member is going to read a 100page document about this. Um, and so in the next month or two, we'll be working with Robin and Joe on essentially a condensed version, a short flyer that um, is available at the city office, but also at, you know, the history tent, there could be a flyer available that basically hits the highlights of this document and hopefully inspires people to read a little bit more. Um, so that will be the more accessible, easy to read version in a quick way that I think will be a really advantageous tool for you to use to get the word out a little bit more than just carrying around 100 pages.

Thank you. Uh yes, I was just going to follow up with that same comment. Is that one of the deliverables and and something and some of you are newer members, but when we started uh researching plans across Missouri and had that bigger discussion right at the beginning of this effort, um it was noted by commission members that we wanted to have that really public engaging uh public facing component of the plan. And so we incorporated it right into our initial request for proposals document um that we'd like that. And so uh so I think this brochure um or flyer is just going to be a wonderful tool for us. We can probably send it out to all of our Wildwood businesses and organizations um to our historic building owners um you know things of that uh nature right off the bat. maybe include in some of our resident uh welcome packets, things like that. So, um so we can definitely get the word out about our planning efforts and give them an opportunity if they're really interested um to dive deeper. Thank you.

And Madame Chair, just one more comment. Um to the commission members, I'm sure you've heard about the Route 66 round table that we had recently where we had over 40 represent representatives of different organization, businesses, etc. affiliated with the city of Wildwood. We're having another round table at the end of this month, the 31st. And fortunately, two of our goals talk about enhancing the visitor experience along Route 66 and expand heritage tourism opportunities. So to me, we have the basis already with our Wildwood businesses of Wildwood and the roundt group that has been very enthusiastic and working very closely with Miss Keefe on the pulling together all of the different things that are going to happen starting April uh through the end of this year I assume. But I think from the perspective of the department, we have a natural um segue into at least two of the goals, if not more. So, thank you.

All right. You have anything else for us, Marcia? I don't. And I would say um the one change that I've noted is that QR code for the maps. Um we'll keep kind of a running list of any changes that come out of the additional hearing with um planning and zoning commission and council and then at least right now I think the plan is to do kind of one round of edits at the end to finalize documents. So appreciate the conversation and the comments um and all the effort that's gone into this. Thank you. We have one more response from Mr. Mabry. Oh sure.

Yes. Thanks. I I was going to hold off but I heard the term tenure um update. So the same dennial um style review which is both expected anticipated resource bar it never comes as a surprise with that this is a kickoff. This is a startup. I know that only very few if only one person here can can remember back 30 years to the kickoff of the master plan. Um I'm sure that was brought with growing pains and if this one isn't uh it wouldn't be worth very much. Where is it baked in that we have that pressure relief valve against those who would wonder why are you why are you all secondguessing this plan? We've got 10 years to grow and live with this uh before we start bothering it and pestering it and applying all kinds of resources. Uh we're only a year in. So, with that, I'm just anticipating what have not we thought of yet, and that is um we need we need a one-year uh we need a one-year review. We need a three-year review. Um because not only can we imagine things will change, we can't even imagine what things we can't imagine are going to change or become new priorities or new new goals. Um I I didn't I didn't avoid going to sleep till I found it, but I didn't find it. Um where is the dennial plan? But then there is the 1, three, and fiveyear for the first 10 years plan uh of review and second guessing and recanting and recasting and that the council isn't surprised, staff is not surprised, the mayor is not surprised, whoever they

are. So thank you. Yeah, there is um in appendix A on page 86 um it does not have 1, three and five years and 10 years as as you were talking about, we do have a recommendation to have a halfway point, that fiveyear mark, be a true plan review, update. Um you're right that this should be something reviewed annually. It's something you're doing as part of your work program. Um, and so I don't think you want to open the full document for full edits on an annual basis. That's a big undertaking, but that five-year review will be important because as you noted, priorities change, conditions change, and so that should be reflected. Um, and then I don't think we've mentioned the 10-year kind of full update in here. We're happy to do that and add that in if that's kind of the consensus and desired. we can update this the plan update process language as much as as this commission would like.

Thank you, Marca. Joe,

just one last comment relative to uh council member Maybury's statement. When we began developing the master plan in 1995, we engaged a gentleman named Jonathan Barnett, who at the time was the chair of the urban design department at NYU and then went on to be the chair of um the urban design department at Penn University, well-known planner, internationally recognized. And the one thing he told us about a plan is the benefit of a plan is it provides predictability. And to Miss Bole's statement, if we go in every year and start changing things, there's no predictability in the plan. And so from that perspective, I think a five-year update is very, very reasonable. We do that with the master plan at the Plan Zoning Commission. Bless you. and we obviously do the major 10-year update where we basically pull all the parts uh out and start looking at them and then put them back together. So, just remember there's a predictability people that own assets, businesses that are working with the city to do these heritage tourism things. Predictability. Thank you.

Thank you, Joe. All right, that's all of our discussion on that. Do you have anything else for Robin? Yes, actually we're ready. Uh madame chair, members of this commission, uh one of our requests of you this evening, uh if you are ready to proceed um at the commission level and endorse or recommend uh that this draft, uh be ready for adoption uh with the planning and zoning commission, which is where it will go next. Uh then we are requesting a motion from you uh this evening to to do that. um noting that there are still opportunities to make changes. Um MIG will be keeping a running list uh across these adoption hearings um and so that the final draft is something that we can all look at together once it's been adopted. Um but if if what you see before you reflects what all of this um input and all of this engagement has been over the past year and uh you'd like to go ahead and endorse it, we would request that at this time. All right. Do I have a motion on the floor?

What would that just out of curiosity, what would that motion look like? A motion to endorse the plan as it currently exists so that we can move forward. Yes. I so move. Second motion. Chair. I also wanted to note Robin on page nine. I love the addition of the pictures, particularly that one. That's Captain Heg. I live on Captain Heg's farm. And you have visited Captain Heg's grave site. Yes, I have. So, Marcia, thank you for that picture. Was there have a motion in a second? Okay. Wonderful. Chair chair.

I think it is passed by. Is anybody opposed? knowing that we do have the opportunity to make edits along the way still. Correct. Yes. Sure. You want to call it? Are we doing a roll? Yeah. Just doing a voice vote. All right. Everybody want to go to the table? Yes. Approve. Approve. I approve. Approve. Approved. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Uh yes. Uh Commissioner Berllo, do you approve? Approve.

Thank you. All right. Wonderful. So, next up, uh just for your information, uh we'll be submitting to the state historic preservation. Uh Oh, yeah. Thank you, Miss Burllo, for voting. Yes. Oh, yeah. So, I didn't quite hear Angela's vote, but yeah.

Anyway, as I said, this final draft of the preservation plan will be delivered to the state historic preservation office as a next milestone step um prior even prior to its adoption. So, we'll be submitting that in the next couple of weeks or so. And then it will be going to the planning and zoning commission for its adoption hearing on May 4th, uh with an action taken on June 1st. Um and then tenatively starting the city council adoption process on June 8th just so you have an idea of what this timeline is going to look like. Um so we'll go ahead and put the word out uh to the public uh that it will be going through these um adoption hearings. I actually updated the web page today uh with this document and with the list of dates. Um, so I'll send that out to our list of people who have been involved to this point so that they can be involved as we as we go ahead and get through this process.

So, uh, thank you for all of your time and contributions to this very extensive, uh, big effort. Um, there were a lot of new folks for this, which is which is actually great because you're right here at the beginning and now you can start um, seeing it into implementation. But I also know it's a big deal for the people who have been here for some time um to see it to come to completion and have something before us that kind of puts it all together, right? Um and then finally uh yes, thank you Marca uh for everything that you have done um to make this beautiful document uh come to life for us. Uh so thank you. Thank you all. It's been a pleasure. Thank you.

Thank you Marca. All right, our next ready for action item number two, the AfricanAmerican history project at the Marach Chestville levy, the trail update.

All right. Thank you, Madame Chair, members of this commission. I don't have an extensive uh update for our African-American history project. Um, but I did give a little background for those of you who aren't as familiar uh with the history of this project and what what we mean when we say African-American Heritage Trail. There's a really nice write up. Um, I did it for the uh the grant proposal actually with the historic with the state historic preservation office. Um, so please uh have a look at that when you have the time. Um, also I just wanted to note, uh, really just, you know, pat us on the back. We got some very nice glowing letters of support for our grant application that are included in your packets from Great, uh, Rivers Greenway and also a very nice one from Doris Keven Frankie um, singing praises to this commission. Um, and then finally, I would just note that our nomination application for the second uh, Network to Freedom site has now officially been submitted. So, we'll be waiting um to hear back regarding that designation as well. Um so, if you have any questions regarding our efforts towards this trail project, uh please uh the department is available at this time to answer them. Thank you.

Thank you for all that, Robin. Anyone have any comments on that subject before we move on? All right. Our next uh item on the agenda is the historic Route 66 revitalization initiative updates. We're planning for the 100th anniversary and the historic marker.

Uh madame chair, members of this commission, we're also working very hard towards our Route 66 celebration efforts this year. Uh as director Vunich mentioned, our Route 66 roundt event will be held uh this coming Tuesday uh over lunch. I've received a few RSVPs from those in this room uh regarding attendance. So, thank you for that uh for representing the commission. Um hopefully we'll get a little bit further in our discussion uh regarding a big uh citywide Route 66 cruise and celebration. Uh we'll have a few representatives uh from local car groups in the room as well. So, I think that will um give us a lot of a lot of fodder for discussion. Um, our next big Route 66 event is going to be the city's scavenger hunt for the month of April. I am still in the process of finalizing that hunt. Uh, but we do have a special app this time around to help us do it. Uh, so we'll be promoting the heck out of that sometime next week, uh, when it's ready to launch. Um, so I'll make sure to uh send word out when it is and we'll be promoting it in every uh medium that this city has available to it.

Okay. Um, also Robin will also be promoted on the city of Wildwood Facebook page.

Yes, that's why I mean every meeting medium. So, we'll we'll promote it on the e newswsletter, the uh social media networks, and um on the big the Route 66 celebration page, and just every everywhere we can think of that that would help get the word out. Um actually, there might be some regional calendars as well. So, I'll reach out to some of those groups. I know they have community calendars and we can submit events to them. I know the Route 66 Centennial Commission has such a calendar. So, I'll set I'll submit the city's events to them as well, and that might get us some broader reach. And if you have a flyer, that's something that we could also post perhaps at the Y.

Yes. Invest on their community board.

Absolutely. And then we also sent out uh the link to the Route 66 uh web page, events page for the city and I believe a QR code um with the Wildwood Gazette which will be delivered to every household in Wildwood. So that should help get the word out as well. Um speaking of getting the word out, uh we've been in talks with Route 66 uh or I should say leader publications about Route 66 magazine. Uh it turns out that publication was hugely popular. It just flew off the shelves at Red Seedar in in particular. Um and now everyone's clamoring for more. And because all of the cities saw it as such a worthwhile effort, um it's looking like both the cities of Eureka and the cities of Pacific are going to commit to splitting three ways um if the city of Wildwood would also like to do so to do a reprint of the magazine. Uh, so we're currently um in discussion with city leadership to see if that's something we can agree to as well. Um, aside from that, uh, I'm not really too far into it uh, yet, but Commissioner Burmel did give us a very nice lead about a lady who does uh, Route 60. Well, she leads a group that does Route 66 quilts. And it's starting to look like we might be able to do a display here at city hall sometime next year uh for Route 66. It will be displayed for three months actually this year for the celebration at Red Seedar Inn. So if you're interested in the exhibit, please hop on over there. I believe it's there July, August, I want to say September. Don't quote me on that. Um but then we're thinking the next year Wildwood can host it. Uh so we'll give you more information at a future meeting.

And then uh in regards to our Route 66 historic marker, uh this commission endorsed us moving forward with our marker. It went before city council as well and received endorsement. Uh we're just working on the final details of it at this time. Um and may have more information to share with you at a future date. Uh if you have any questions regarding Route 66,

is it going to get Braille on it for council member and council leaison Mr. Rambo had brought that up? I think it was accredited to him. Does that gain traction? Do you know? Uh I don't know that we've gotten too far in those discussions, but that is certainly something that we can propose or talk about at this time. Really? No. Just to know that it's not lost in the shuffle. So it get got captured and it's if if not a not a hell yes, then it's at least not shuffled aside.

It it's certainly a point for consideration and there's still opportunity because it's still in development um to add such a component. Uh, we've also talked about doing QR codes on each of our historic markers, which would also provide another um accessibility option as well, an audio. Yes. Yes. That probably be less expensive than trying to put Braille on the markers possibly. Right. Yeah. Um, on agenda number four, youth member recruitment update. Is that something we can continue with without our youth members here?

Uh well, yes, because this is about recruiting our future youth member. Uh so I don't have a huge out um update for that, assuming we're all done with Route 66. I just wanted to let the commission know that we have received three applications now um from very solid candidates in my opinion after taking a look at them. Uh so I don't think we're going to be lacking since we're just filling one position. I think we're going to have a very solid candidate this year for that position. Uh we still of course have a week left. So I may um a lot of uh youth at that age are are procrastinators. So I wouldn't be surprised if I got a few more applications right before the deadline, which is April 1st. Um but so far we have three very solid candidates.

And will we be losing one or both of our current youth members? Yes, we'll be losing uh Commissioner Boore um due to the fact that she's a senior this year and will be graduating. Uh but Commissioner Raggi Ramen, this commission um has already endorsed him to be reappointed for a third term.

All right, if no more comments on that subject, we're going to move on to the 2026 work program update. All right, Madame Chair, members of this commission, I believe that most of my updates have been discussed. However, um you may have seen on your way into the building uh this evening, and if you didn't see it, you've at least seen photos thanks to Mr. Scott. Um but we actually have a cabin out there. I don't know. I don't know if you saw it on your way in, but it's pretty it's a pretty distinct feature now of our Yes.

of our landscape. So, um, so I don't know. I feel like we should, I don't know, have a round of applause, pat ourselves on the back. Like, I mean, this is a big deal. If if I may just interrupt, of course,

I think we're very fortunate to have Shereet Creek Excavating as they have been very, I think, overly generous. If you'll notice, there are a lot of replacement logs that the old ones were were unusable. They came up with them. They're out there. As far as I know, I I haven't heard of a request for any sort of extra. They've come up with the law. They've come up with good old antique lumber, you know, mill lumber. Uh they've been very I feel generous and very conscientious in what they've been doing there. So, I think we're very lucky to have them and I think we're going to be proud of this uh this cabin. Well, I suppose it's it's right that uh there's a nice big photo spread of uh Mr. Eli McDonald of Sharet Creek excavating in our historic preservation plan at Celebrate Wildwood.

But uh and through their workmanship, go look for a Dutchman patch. See if you can find it. I know where it is. I think you circled it on one of your Well, no. Well, See, see if you can find it. They're they're they're craftsmen. They're not. Yeah, we made made the good choices. Yeah. Wonderful.

All right. Uh so I think I already touched on our submission to the network to freedom. You talked about the Route 66 roundt. We're working on that pre-application for our grant for the African-American history trail. Um we're currently working on the land use element of the master plan um update with the citizen oversight committee and we have officially executed our grant uh for 2026 that will send our three uh commission officers and their historic preservation planner uh to Minneapolis this year for the 2006 uh national alliance of preserv ation commission's uh forum.

Uh so all three officers agreed to go. And who three are they? Oh well that would be you uh madam chair. It would also be our vice chair Larson and Secretary Henzik. Awesome. Yep. Uh so I'll be working on getting those travel arrangements together and we'll be uh providing updates as that as those plans come together and then when when the officers do return uh we'll be expected to uh write a statement for the state historic preservation office but I also uh would anticipate that we would give a presentation or a debrief uh to this commission as well so that we can share what we learn and uh what kind of networks and contacts we make uh from that experience as Well,

right. Um, and as you may remember, uh, we are giving, uh, we are doing a speaker session along with some other, um, entities that have also do done some, uh, youth and preservation planning through college internships. We're we're representing middle school, high school, uh, but, uh, we'll be um, in a session along with some others who have been working with university students on various historic preservation projects as well. Um so we'll get some national um recognition from that uh session as well and then I'll talk about our our nomination a little later in this agenda. Very good. Uh do you have any questions at this time for the department?

All right. Wonderful. Doesn't look like it. So should we move down to new business which there's a number of things not ready for action. Yes, I believe we're ready for new business. So, I'm going to, if it's okay with you, Madam Chair, I'm just going to tackle the first two in tandem. Sure.

Uh, so, as you may recall from our last meeting, uh, we we have received two historic uh, register applications. We're anticipating a third and possibly a fourth um, if we succeed with the JP Connell House. Um, so the first two, the Hortm Hort Stam Log Cabin, um, that one was toured by the commission. It's actually part of a historic homestead off of Fox Creek Road. Um, so there's a few other historic structures that go with it. It was originally um, a log cabin built in the I believe it was the 1870s. Uh, the owner was convinced it might be on the Underground Railroad, but we're a little bit skeptical about that because of the date. Um, however, he um the asset is unique regard irregardless of whether it was on the Underground Railroad or not. And then our second application is a dog trot log cabin that's on the Rosen Bomb farm. Um, and uh that cabin was never used as a dwelling. We don't believe. We think it was used as a crib structure. Um, however, the owner would like to completely restore it. um has been asking the city um for recommendations for consultants and has found some in the area and would like to put it on the historic register to help him with his preservation project. Um so both are very exciting. Um and you'll learn a little bit more about them as we do the deep dive associated with the first step of the historic designation process and schedule which you have before you this evening. Um so the first step of that is that a public hearing will be held at the commission's next meeting in April. Uh that's where the department gives a presentation of the assets history whatever is known um and it gives an opportunity for the public will send out notices um to provide comment about each of these applications. In May, the request will return to the

Historic Preservation Commission where the department will offer a recommendation to it based on the 13 criteria for evaluating um such nominated assets and the commission will then take action upon that recommendation. In June, it will be that information report will be modified into the commission's letter of recommendation um which will go to city council and that will be done in July. Um in July, city council will then hold an additional public hearing for uh both assets. And if um and if it directs, uh legislation will be drafted and uh there will be two readings um and actions that will occur at the subsequent city council meetings. So, all in all, we're looking at two of these applications starting next month with a public hearing and then hopefully um if if all goes well, being designated by September. Uh do you have any questions for me regarding the historic designation process and schedule for both of these assets? Great.

Looks like there's no questions. Certificate of appropriateness review. All right. Madam for an addition on no property.

Yes. Madame chair uh members of this commission. Our next item on our agenda is a pretty uh substantive one. Hopefully, you have an have had an opportunity to look at the certificate of appropriateness uh review package uh that was assembled for you. Uh but we are doing a review of alterations and additions proposed to the Ben Balmer House uh which is listed on the Wildwood Historic Register um and became a designated local landmark in 2011. Um, the applicant is proposing to construct small additions and substantially rehabilitate the exterior envelope of the resource, including the window, door, cladding, and uh, roof. Um, because this property is designated as a historic resource in the city of Wildwood, it does require a certificate of appropriateness from this commission for any proposed exterior alterations as um, reviewed or recommended by you, the commission. um consistent with the Secretary of Interior's standards for rehabilitation. Uh the department did engage a historic consultant given the um substantial nature of these alterations and so that was Carol Quigley of Pattern Ives. Um she has been the architecture or architectural consultant behind the Essen log cabin project as well. uh they also do these types of um historic uh reviews for historic preservation commissions. And so a substantial uh write up from uh her was included in your packets this evening as well. Um at this time I'm going to review the materials that were submitted with you. Um however, I'm going to move over to my laptop because it's going to require me going through quite a few slides. So yep, just one. Oh, and I should say we do have the owners and their architect

uh in the room with us this evening as well. Um and so they'll have an opportunity to present as well.

Yep. Okay. So, Madame Chair, members of the commission, I'd first like to just give you a sense of where this asset is located in the city. Um, so the Ben Bomber House is actually located uh in eastern Wildwood, just um north actually of the uh boundary line between City of Wildwood and Ellisville. Um, so it's just north of Highway 100. It's off Stucker Road. Um, it actually has two addresses um, including its original historic address of 300 Strucker Road. So that gives you a sense of where it's located. Okay. So there are quite a few um changes uh that are being requested of the owners this evening. Um a crawl space is being added to the right side of the home on the lower level. Uh interior stairs in the lower level are being demolished and rebuilt on the first floor. Uh front porch porch on the left side and rear side of the residence are being added. Uh box bays are being added to the front, left and right sides of the

residence. Uh there is a kitchen addition where the existing side porch was located. New interior stairs are being built to the lower level. There's a renovation of the entry hall powder living room, dining room, uh master, uh bedroom, suite closet, and bath. Uh there's a kitchen renovation, renovation to rooms in the rear of the home to accommodate a new pantry, outer and mudroom. And of course, some of these are interior renovations and not subject to this commission's review. Uh the second floor on the second floor there's a second story addition of an office bedroom and laundry over the existing uh master living suite. Uh there's an addition of a roof deck over the existing roof of the snug below. Uh there's renovation of existing bedrooms with a new hall bath and closets in the bedrooms. a renovation of the primary bedroom, including the bath, and a bath and closet addition where the existing side porch was located. In general, there will be new windows and new materials as shown on the exterior elevations and material lists. Now, the owners were very nice uh to put together this informal historic inventory of the Ben Bomber House as it is today. Um, so I don't know if you had an opportunity to look at it. Um, but I think we it's worth going through it. Um, so here are here are pictures of the Ben Bomber House, including its historical appear appearance or at least the most historical appearance that we have um in photo and what it looks like today.

trying to figure out how to get this to Okay, so this is the front front elevation of the Ben Bomber House. Let me see if I can get this full screen. Okay. So, this is the front um exterior of the home. Uh exterior below the gable is vinyl siding. Uh shutters are fashioned on nonfunctional, non-original. The windows are double hun dual pane vinyl windows, world brand trimmed in white aluminum. Those were last updated in 2007. As you can see down below, we have the original stone foundation. Okay. So, here we see the front gable uh detail of the home uh with the original decorative uh pattern shingles. Few are missing or damaged. Uh there's a plan to restore and replace where necessary and repaint to match the new sighting product. Most of the sophets are wood. The fascia has aluminum covering. Okay. Here we see the front porch on the left side and it's noted that there's original half ground porch post attached to the house. Um here on the bottom uh left uh the glass dorm door is shorter than the front door. So they framed with a spacer at the top. The storm door is modern. Um in the middle we have the outer porch post

and it doesn't look like it appears to be original though it's aged. Um, and then on the right side we have the front porch uh with the original half round porch post attached to the house which matches with the left side. Here's another view of the porch. Uh they're getting rid of some of these uh extra cables. Um there are multiple layers of asphalt shingles on the porch roof and uh it looks like there's been some rotting going on uh with some of the um railings along the stairs. Here we have the east elevation of the home uh which will have the same materials as the front or which has the same materials as the front with vinyl siding below the original wood shingle gable. All windows shown are vinyl and the bay window roof appears to be um a painted metal. Here we have the lower porch. The lower porch was reconstructed sometime between 2012 and the 20 and 2020 based on Google Street View and does not retain any original historic details. Um, and it's noted that the only wood window, um, is here to the right of this photo, and it's a single pane with an aluminum storm window on top of it. Here we have the upper porch. Uh, the upper porch appears to have two original posts and one new post. Um the railings and blusters do uh blusters do appear old, but they're secured with metal brackets. Um so they might not be old enough to be the original.

And here we have the south elevation of the home. Again, vinyl siding and vinyl windows. There's a small painted crawl space door that is likely original. And this wall of the foundation is heavily parched. and we hope to repoint it with lime mortar. So, this is where uh where the pool used to be looking at the home. And then this is the south elevation. Um and then this is noted as um a 1970s edition. Here we have the rear wing looking east. And this was the original rear wing with a newer bay window addition in the front right. All vinyl sighting windows. And this is the west elevation. Um so here we see a site plan that kind of shows the original home and all of the newer um additions that are being proposed and some of the additions that are already exist but that were addition um after the original home was built. Uh here we see three photos of the Ben Balmer house. One was taken sometime in the 1970s. Um, this is as it is today in 2023. And then here we have the proposed addition with the porch expansion and highlighted in blue rendering of what it will look like with the with the additions. Um, so this information is in your packets. Um, here we have the first floor and lower level demolition plans and the second demolition plan.

We have the floor plans. Um here are the elevations um including the front left elevation. Um the rear elevation and right elevation. And here we have the 3D renderings of what is what the home will look like after um uh after the applicants um do their their upgrades. And this will be a phased project. So, not everything is going to happen at once. We just figured um as a department that it would be best if we packaged all of these changes together for one review um versus breaking it up into several reviews. Now, as noted earlier, we did have Carol Quigley of Pattern Ives uh review this project, and I apologize. I wanted to pull out my highlighted version. Um, I would just like to make uh some summary comments. Hopefully you've had an opportunity to read um read her review. Um, but I would just like to note that overall she has said that the presented alterations are sympathetic to the historic resource. They retain or return several details that have been lost over the decades and the current proposal is evocative of the overarching Victorian style of the 1891 era. Um, so all good things. Um, she did say uh that the embellishment of the detail applied to the facades and the porch uh does go further uh than the original modest detailing of the folk Victorian style farmhouse uh which this house was and would be more appropriate with a few reductions in the proposed embellishments. Um and then she uh detailed uh some of her suggestions uh further in her report which I know that the applicants have read um as well. Um

so rather than going over each of her recommendations at this time, I think I'm going to conclude the department's introduction of this application and give this commission an opportunity to hear from the applicants and then ask any questions um as you desire um as part of this review process. Thank you. All right. Would you like to come up speak?

Um, hi everyone. I'm Lauren Zeleleski. Well, Lauren Zilleski Wilggas. This is my husband Michael Gus. And this is our architect Jessica Stole from Corny Plus Architecture. Um, first off, I just want to thank you all for hearing. Uh, I know we we are asking a lot. We did try to uh put it all together as a master plan so we could talk about it cohesively. Um, but I really thank you all for uh hearing about our project and considering it. And particularly we were um pleasantly surprised at the uh presentation or the um fact that you sent it to a historic consultant because the accuracy and doing this with in a sympathetic manner and the appropriateness that's really important to us and um and just kind of poking around the Wildwood site around agendas and things. It seems like there's been I with the the age the age range changing for the amount the houses that are applying for um you know you're going to get a lot a lot more houses and a lot more uh probably added to the registry and a lot more requests for changes and additionally you've had a lot of demolition uh requests. So, we're hoping that this process could maybe be a really great example going into and I know you presented the whole preservation plan, a really good example of how if you have a historic home in Wildwood, maybe um the way that you can uh best make those changes that you know adjusted to your particular family but in keeping the look and feel that was intended with the house. So, again, thank you. We we were really happy to read um Carol Dean Quigley's uh her opinions that we we actually the reason we chose to work with Jessica and for Plus was because they had shown some other examples particularly this really beautiful farmhouse in Labidy that had some renovations done to it. I say some actually it looked it looked like something that would be prepared for demolition and it was just really polished into beautiful jewel of the home. Um so that meant a lot to us. that's why we we chose to work with

them. And so the addition of um the consultants uh knowledge is just a total welcome gift from you all. So thank you for that. Um and I guess um uh I probably should have prepared but um some of the changes that we're we're trying to achieve and I guess I could just provide some rationale for this. Um, one of the main ones is, uh, as you showed, there's there's the 1891 kind of half of the house and then there's the 1970s edition and they're kind of tacked on a little bit awkwardly. So, we were kind of hoping in the design of it to um, add a little bit of work from home office space that also visually marries those two in a more pleasing way. And part of that also entails um rebuilding the front porch which is in this repair really needs it um and expanding that too. We, if you drive by, we sit really close on Strucker Road, like right up on it to the point where we actually the corner of the house sits in the easement. Um, which is something we need to talk to variants board about, but um, uh, using the extension of that porch as a way to like create additional buffer between the street. And I know porches are a really nice way to do that because they're kind of like that handshake between streetscape and home without being like a fence or something. It's like like I think an approachable way to do that. So that's kind of the porch the uh the second story edition and the the So I know I know there's so many things I'm probably overwhelming you with the amount of things but the the kitchen edition where we're infilling proposing to infill the rear doulestory porch. Um, we've found in living at the house now. We've owned it for like 3 years, so we've we've really come to see all the quirks and how the, you know, things we'd like to fix and things that we

love. Um, one of the quirks we don't love so much is how the kitchen wall um is is uh freezes. All of the uh water water because it's in a crawl space, the plumbing there freezes badly. So, um, we were hoping to bump that out to have a more modern, insulated, uh, solution to fix that issue. As well as when we fill the upper part, we have two small girls, a one-year-old and a three-year-old. And those being upstairs bedrooms that have an access to an outdoor space isn't isn't our preferred safety. Um, and those particular bedrooms really should be where they are. So that's one of the reasons why we thought those two things working together do kind of bring a good reason to fill fill that porch and the fact that it was rebuilt using kind of modern deck materials doesn't quite exist but um the consultant had some nice um ideas about how we maintain uh um visually uh with exterior

by adding kind of the vertical trim the way in the front elevation. Um if you could move over to the microphone for the people listening online.

Sure. One of her suggestions was um to take So in the example of the front elevation in the 3D um you see the the gable and then it has the corner trim the volume has the corner trim along the sides. Um she had suggested doing that possibly at the um on the east on the east elevation. um where there's the gable on that side bringing that same vertical trim down just to kind of del to separate you know to separate that this is a separate volume from and then this is the newer edition. Um and then again at the rear where there's at each time where there's a gable we would kind of bring this corner trim down on the sides kind of how the front volume is shown. Um what else did she say? I hope I hope the commission can appreciate what a patchwork this house kind of already is given its many additions. So we we are trying to um I suppose put a nice wrap tied up with a bow all of that because in looking at it it is a little bit difficult I can see without having a lot of and I I don't know maybe where did any of you in first we had the concrete pool demo about two years ago and we had a site visit probably Mr. Scott, you were probably there.

Were you at the pool demolition site visit a few years ago for the Ben Balmer house? Oh, well, we we have an audience member who was Well, that's great. Uh, but it does it does help in person to see kind of because it is with all the varying elevations. I appreciate it's difficult to kind of understand what what all going on in just four views. Um but sorry know yeah I grew up in this area in a home that had multiple additions. So I know where you're coming from on that.

Um the bump out that you're talking about on the kitchen. I guess that bump out is the kitchen to keep that wall from freezing. Is that what that that additionally expand just expand generally the kitchen. So it'll kind of do both things. Yeah. the kitchen really needs renovation and like trying to wrap it all into one thing. And then that putting that second story addition, I'm assuming you've done a bunch of studies to make sure that that old structure is strong enough to support a big second story edition. We have a structural engineer that will, you know, we'll use as we progress the drawings along further. Yeah.

Yeah. Looks great. Any questions? Um, not so much questions but comments. Uh, you spoke very well. Thank you, Miss Welgus. You did a very good job. Uh, I took one look at this and I have to say bravo uh to both of you. Well, to the WGUS and also to the architectural firm for the level of detail. I was blown away by your detail. I appreciate all the information you provided. You use the word several times, Miss Welgus, example. This is an example of what the commission should receive from anybody who is expecting to do renovations along this line. Perhaps not every renovation needs something quite so detailed and this is a bit huge reservation, excuse me, renovation. So perhaps not quite so much this detailed, but definitely more than just a handdrawn map of we intend to put this here. You know, that doesn't work. That's not enough information. Um, I also live in what started out as a one room cabin and now is a big rambling five- bedroomedroom house. That makes no no sense. So, I know exactly what you're talking about with walls that freeze and floors that get so cold in the winter that my legs hurt. Um, I know how that feels and and so I appreciate what you're trying to do here. This house looks like it belongs on Elm Avenue in Webster Groves. It's absolutely beautiful. I can understand why you're doing it in phases, but it's good to have a master plan, something to work towards.

Yeah,

I read Carol's comments. And what you adopt out of that is to me it would be optional. Whether or not you have modern-day gutters or something else doesn't matter. To me, it honestly doesn't matter. I don't think it would attract the historical value. One thing this commission needs to realize is that the Welguses are young stewards of a historic asset. And in order to encourage people to preserve a historic asset, we have to recognize that some these historic assets need to be modernized. They need to grow with growing families. And that's exactly what you're doing. It needs to be made livable. Farmhouses were made for people during that time. They had no closets because people had one dress. They had two pairs of shoes. They didn't need closets. That's changed. And so it needs to be modernized. And that's what you're doing. And I think I talked to a historical architect a couple weeks ago and he said, "The goal of every historical architect is to make the new addition look seamless from the old." And you have achieved that. Bora has architect firm has achieved that

great teamwork and and I I can't I don't have enough good things to say and and that's it's a pleasant way to end my day but thank you very much. Thank you. It looks like Miss Berillo has her raised hand up if she might have a comment on this. Angela, I just wanted to say ditto that was uh very well said and it's beautiful. Angela, did you have I can you hear me now?

You want to try again, Angela? We were turned off from you. I apologize. Can you hear me now? Yes. Okay. I I just want to say ditto. Uh that was very well said by the last commissioner and um it's just beautiful and I'm really excited as she said for an example of um redoing old homes in Wildwood. It's fantastic.

Um Madame Chair, a double ditto. Um, and so thank you for preserving the essence of the of that structure and the thoughtfulness of everything. She said it better than any of us. Um, and also thanks to the city because in two pages here up front, you get an expert view and I the terminology is foreign to me. I'm not an architect, but I knew that your plan was spot on just from reading a few pages. So, uh, thanks to the city for making it easy for the rest of us to understand, um, what a great job you're doing. If I, if I may, yeah, I I I've got to second these those opinions. Um, a house has to change as the years go by. None of us could or would ever want to try to live in the Essen log cabin that we're building now. My house started out that way as a log cabin and it's been made livable over the years. And that's that's what a house is. It grows with the family. And if you just keep each addition in sympathy with what came before it and again modern material, the house I live in originally had wood shingle and then it became a corrugated metal roof and then now it's a standing seam metal roof. So the materials change, but they need to keep in sympathy with what was there before. And I I think this this plan you've got for this house is

does just that. So it looks good to me. Thank you. Thanks, Madam Chair. Uh the package of course um and all the work that goes with it, the illustrations all professionally assembled, everything um apparently well orchestrated. So you lucked out with your architect. Um that's more to your skills than many hers.

Uh what what uh is not really a concern but a a point is that you'd mentioned that the schedule will be peace meal. Um I'm wondering what is the what is the time frame that you're looking for say a completion um or is it in is it in months years a decade? Honestly, we we've kind of divided it into a phase one and a phase two and made sure that if phase two doesn't happen, it's all still a beautiful kind of in itself can exist until maybe phase two down the road or if not. Um so, um I could outline that clear in a followup um if you'd like to to see but I guess the fa phase one we'd like to begin as soon as we can. Part of it is there's kind of a a a cycle here of we need you need the drawings, but you also have to take and ask permission for what we can do and then I have to then take that packet and get the bids for it. So there's a there's kind of some you know there's not there's not not a financial aspect of it as well. So we have to figure that out. Um so it's kind of uh phase one we'd like to start as soon as we could early next year. What we were thinking is between the this process and the variance process. Um Robin told us they expect like a three to six month uh process. Um so that getting built in and then getting on someone's schedule and um yeah all that to say that we're hoping to begin phase one next year hoping that it's phase one and phase two together. Are you um just really for background viability of the success of the project um are you intending to uh remain resident in the dwelling?

We are going to stay with my very gracious parents. we're gonna take two kids in. So, we're gonna live with them. While while that that that answers my largest concern where wherein I I saw nowhere in this report uh anywhere where you had contract with a marriage counselor. So, that alleviates that pain. Yeah. Really, that's that's all I ever had that I could comment on. And you realize that's not even a serious comment. that moving out keeps it uh expedition and get out of the way.

This was this was packaged quite admirably and and u it it's to uh u Miss Keith's credit that she's attributed a lot of the u output to you as the owners even though it's quite a high quality that we're used to seeing from the uh from staff.

Well, I I have a comment and then I have a a direction. Um, first I would just like to really commend uh the owners and their architect for especially for putting together this informal historic inventory of the home. Uh this is just a wonderful document to have for um you know historic preservation purposes because no matter what happens to the home now going forward, we have this documentation and we kind of know what's happened to it throughout time. So it's just it's just a really wonderful document to have. And so I would just like to thank you so much for um just putting together all these materials and you know making it just such a lovely project to review.

So I should also mention I did reach out to the historical society to see if they had any of really that they had the inventories that were also included on the public site. That was mostly it really that photos all you really had to go on. um not a lot.

Well, we certainly we certainly do appreciate the thought and care that went into that. So, thank you very much um both of you. Um so, at this time, uh the the department would just um like to uh give a little direction to the commission about uh what what it can do this evening in terms of this application. Um so at this time commission members can include or can have an action to approve the plan set and its related components as submitted or if you have any recommendation for certain changes relative to the design items for the city's consultant um you can make that as part of a motion as well. Um but the owners are looking for um you to approve their certificate of appropriateness.

All right. Would you like to make a motion? I would move to approve the plan as submitted and a second. Second. All right. Anybody opposed? Sounds like we are all put. Madam Chair, can you please when you take these votes, can you make sure to ask for the eyes's and the nays? Okay. Y All right, everyone. Uh, say a A if you're if you approve. I I I I no names. No. All right. This approved by mutual consent. Right. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I wasn't expecting that at all. Thank you so much. Really

Well, you put together Jessica, too. And also, congratulations on your preservation plan. Thank you. Yeah. So, thank you. Thank you for Thank you for the And this is just an example of how if you put the work in up front, it pays off in the in the in the long run. That was fun. Thank you, gentlemen.

Madam Chair, I believe that the next item on the agenda that's ready for action relates to an update on the city's moratorum on the demolition of historic assets. As was described to the commission members at the February meeting, the city had received four applications, one of which was for the JP Connell House. The matter was presented to city council at public hearings on March 9th. The city council authorized three of the demolitions to proceed forward. Two of those three had had site visits by the historic preservation commission members and had been authorized. The third, which is on Center Avenue, an out building in association with a single family dwelling, is scheduled for a site visit by the Historic Preservation Commission next week. The authorization is contingent on a favorable action by the Historic Preservation Commission from that site visit. The last being the JP Connell House. The city council did not authorize preparation of legislation. So it is still part of the moratorum. The moratorum will not conclude until final adoption of the historic preservation plan or 12 months from its initial effective date which would be sometime in January of 2027. If there are any questions regarding the four applications or the process that the applications have been through to date, Miss Ke and I'd be glad to try and answer it. Thank you. So, I was uh here for the first presentation on the JP Connell House, but I did not hear what happened last month. I heard there was a lot of changes that be made or concessions or

Well, um that I believe that's the next item. We'll go through the recommendation in terms of an incentive package. So, if you mind just putting a pin in that question, I'll get to your answer. All right. Good.

So, again, are there any questions regarding the demolition? Thank you, Madam Chair. As you've mentioned, you did a great introduction for me. So, thank you. Um, as you know, since the latter part of 2025, the JP Connell House has been a subject of discussion before the planning, excuse me, the historic preservation commission. The property was purchased from St. Albins's properties, the developer of St. Albins's, the residential project in eastern Franklin County by uh Christine and Terry Gruie. Initially, when the department presented the change in ownership, the direction that had been provided related to placing the JP Connell House on the smallest lot possible to reduce property taxes and to reuse the remaining property 13 12 acres or more for pasture related to cattle grazing. Subsequently, um that changed a second option was presented. That option for the most part placed the JP Connell House on an approximately 1acre lot. Um, north of the creek or that tree buffer that is established on the property, there would be three additional 1acre lots or a total of four on approximately four to four and a half acres of the site. The remainder would be and under the request of the property owner would be designated for multiple family use an R6A 4,000 ft² resident district. Thereafter a proposal came from the owners relative to light industrial or commercial and that is the third component. And then

most recently, after Miss Keef and I met with Mr. Guey, a follow-up conversation between him and I, he talked of a drive-thru facility at the location. Obviously, the request keeps being modified, evolved, however you'd like to describe it. And from the perspective of the department, some of the requested incentives relative to land use are not acceptable. Key amongst the discussion at the February meeting of the commission was a suggestion of maybe considering senior housing in the form of attached villas. There seemed to be at least a a medium to better consensus that that might be a workable solution on at least the 10 acre portion of the property. So tonight, the department has modified its recommendation. Um the recommendation still calls for in what I consider the north third of the property that um as shown on the aerial photography provided as part of the report from the tree buffer north to St. Albins's Road. That would be an R1 1 acre resident district. on that 4 acre parcel would be four lots approximately and one of those lots would house the JP Kennel um asset south of the buffer. The remaining 10 plus acres would be R1A halfacre zoning but limited to senior housing of an attached villa type and the units would be limited to singlestory only. The rationale being that um if it is R1A, we're at most talking about 9 to 10

villas in pairs. Obviously, that becomes maybe less feasible from an economic standpoint. And the one acre is to ensure that although a break in traditional land use pattern, it would for the most part have a limited impact relative to visibility and noticeability. If it's not residential, the department continues to advocate for light res light industrial. And one of the items that was discussed at the March 9th meeting with Mr. Guru was that it would not be subdivided. The area could only be leased. Leasing in terms of Mr. Grew's perspective is that after 10 years, no one owns the property but them, Christine and Terry Gruie. and they could conclude the leases and turn the property over to the city. So the idea being is to obtain a return on investment and ultimately once that investment that return is reached on the investment to do something with the property relative to the city of Wildwood. So that is in there. Additionally, the department made a clear statement that for the most part, no drive-through facilities would be allowed. Overall components, a waiver of fees, waiver of TGA. The department did a simple calculation on the TGA. And you think your actions don't have meeting on 24 units, that being the four single family detached dwellings on 1acre lots and the attached villas. the TGA on a minimum calculation is over $75,000 in savings. So, don't think the incentive package doesn't have some um let's say meat to the bone. Overall, if it's a residential project,

it's 24 homes on 14 acres. There's waiverss to many of the fees, permit requirements, etc. If it's in light industrial or commercial, then obviously there are still some protections, but there are still those waiverss to fees, permits, etc. Is it a good recommendation? It's not one I would like to make many times to this commission, but Mr. Mayberry and I had a conversation before the meeting started. If there's a fear that it could be replicated again and again and again and again, I don't think so. Again, there are only a handful of assets that from the department's perspective and I believe from the commission's perspective are worthy of the risk that's associated with it. This is one of them. Mary Cliff was one lost. Lasal Institute is another. There's a couple of others that um that I think have that similar stance in the community and I think we could craft a recommendation relative to the commission input departments reciting that input that would for all intents and purposes make a clear statement that it has to be one of these three or four if we're going to consider it. not all. So saying that the department does have a recommendation before you that includes a set of incentives that's um very different than what is in the general vicinity of the site. But as I mentioned at the February meeting, watching the Mary Cliff residence be demolished, seeing that structure no longer part of

the community, we're going to have to make ourselves uncomfortable at times if we're going to be serious about preserving these assets, these special assets. And so with that, I think I am uncomfortable with the recommendation, but I think it is a residential recommendation first and foremost. And under the scenario of an ind delight industrial, it is a one that basically says you can't subdivide, you can't sell unless it's the single piece of property. And as part of that, I think there is at the the the endgame is some kind of donation or sale to the city which would include the JP Connell House. With that, I'll conclude. Certainly, I'm expecting um comments, but again, I just want to emphasize we lost Mary Cliff. That was a substantial loss. I hate to see JP Connell do house do the same. And certainly, it all points toward Lasal Institute. What are we going to do? We're going to have to step up. Thank you.

Thank you, Joe. Uh so I think one of the unique things we do have uh with JP Connell House uh I was having a discussion uh with Jill von Grubin uh just the other day and the Wildwood Historical Society um has a whole box of artifacts that haven't even been cataloged yet from the JP Connell uh from the Connell family um with old pictures and um other items. uh she's going to bring it uh by city hall so I can go through it and see what's what's there. Um I know they have video interviews from members of the family. We have pictures of the home while it was being constructed. Um so we really have a lot of interpretive items um in the case of this particular structure um in order to tell its story. So I just wanted to um uh to add that information as well. And uh Joe is correct. Uh JP Connell is one of 12 and I and I don't even think it's 12 anymore because some of them are gone like Mary Cliff um properties like in the city that are considered um eligible at the national level for this type of recognition. Um, so there is a pretty substantial um, historical significance to this property and so I just wanted to um, say that as well. Um, it's just nice that we have uh, so much information to um, to be able to interpret it if we are able to preserve it. Thank you.

Thanks, Miss Keefe. So, with his changes and and requests, there's still going to be a a big tree buffer along the road because I know that's going to be a concern for people that there's another area that's getting mowed down and put a bunch of buildings on there. But he did say that he was going to leave a a substantial tree buffer from the view of the road for this project.

Yes. And I actually think our tree preservation and restoration code and most recently efforts of our full-time city arborist will achieve not only that but much more tonight. I probably should said this at the conclusion of the presentation. I don't expect you to say the report's fine. Process it and get it to city council. There's a second step in here. And again, if there is a favorable recommendation, regardless if it follows this or not, it has to come back to you for final action because the any input, it's not fair to basically just keep an eye to basically have to interpret it and put it in writing and assume it's what you said. It's only appropriate that we interpret it, put it in writing, and bring it back for final action.

Yeah. I think in in protecting that JP Connell house whatever they do with the extra property that should be like a whole separate entity like keeping the trees around it or you know not be like here's the house and then here's all this new development you know so lack of a better way to describe it you have a basically the core components of the incentive if you were to adopt a recommended incentive or group of incentives is what the department would ultimately do is come back with the recommendation that says here's the first things you've got to do before the incentive package becomes effective that is the stabilize the house the $50,000 that Mr. Ruies mentioned while the process proceeds forward um basically address any of the the tree components ensuring that any of the items that need to be done to the trees to ensure their health is addressed. Again there are things that we could add based upon your representations that would be first steps, second steps and then final steps. Anyway, um, one of the concerns I have is, you know, these we're talking about putting in new housing, 1acre lot housing around a very historic home. And so kind of going with the look of things and then also these um the senior living the villas, you know, I think in the email with uh Steve, we had talked about, you know, can we can we make the look of these, you know, so that it all kind of works together, you know, in terms of what is being built. Because if you have three houses and they're all very modern and

then you have a very historic home there, it it seems kind of odd. I suppose. Yeah. Yeah.

I think there's two components to your statement, Miss Shfeld. First, how that AP Connell House is is addressed by the additional lots. That's something probably that far exceeds what I can be capable of. I think that comes from someone like MissWigley, an ar historic preservationist, an an architect with great deal of experience in historic preservation. I would suggest that we would bring her on if we get to that stage. Help us understand how do we protect this house if we have three other houses. And as part of your package of incentives, you can say those houses can't be modern McMansions. They can't be this, they can't be that. They have to basically complement however you however that is best worded. I don't know right now, but certainly you could do that as the commission as part of the incentive package.

Okay. So that would be something I think would be pretty important. um particularly if it's I mean eventually it's going to be shown to or presented to the people who live in the area and I mean it's not threeacre lot no I mean I and you're going to have a lot of I would think you're going to have a lot of people saying this is this is not what we want. Well, and I certainly understand that and the the only the reason that the Department of Planning is standing before you is because of the JP Connell House.

If this was if that house had been demolished already, there wouldn't even be a discussion. Obviously, it'd be it'd be on 14 acres, it'd be four lots. Yeah. But again,

and is that something that we have to as a commission like work on figuring out how we're going to present that to the public or is that something that um our process has a lot of what I would call guard rails so as public input is garnered but it also has protections for the property owner so that it isn't a ongoing year after year after year. So what I will tell you is certainly there'll be I think incumbent on all of us the commission and city staff to basically describe why we're doing this and the benefits of the incentive package whatever that is or none and then I think on the flip side if JP Connell House is demolished we need to explain why it was just too much to accommodate what we thought was necessary. area.

Yeah. Angela, Angela, would you like comment? Yes, please. Can you hear me? Okay. Yes.

Okay. Um, I some of the commissioners may be upset with what I might propose, but has there been any thought to perhaps a 1 acre zoning for a CVS or an urgent care and maybe the remaining parcels be 3 acre lots or a park donation or something like that? I know that area there with St. Albin's down the road and you know there's no nothing for an emergency like an urgent care um or getting your pharmaceuticals. Um but I know I may get some people upset with me for even mentioning it but um I just wanted to throw that out there. There is a component under the commercial industrial incentive approach that says that a commercial utilization of the property could be considered. So is it is it service, is it retail, is it restaurant or is it something much less or much more? Again, um that's the information we need from the commission members so we can whittle or hone down this incentive package to something that's reasonable for the community. And you represent the community right now for all intents and purposes. a question. Um, just to make sure I understand this under a there. So would be the JP Connell House on no less than one acre plus three potential home sites on one acre lot. Is that correct?

Yes. And then item B is the senior living. Okay. Yes. That's the residential package that you just described. Um, could you repeat that because I'm actually on the the senior living would be halfacre density. Yeah. Yeah, I get that. Um, and then so so I'm clearing that. Another question. Has anyone been in that house? Do we know what shape it's in?

It's been what, three years? Two years. It's been over two years since we did the tour, Mr. Sher. Um, and we've had Mr. Guries to describe some deteriorating conditions. Um, part of what I think we're doing next week is we do have the accommodation to the gate and we intended to visit the property which he had authorized. And is he paying for the restoration?

Yes. the city would not do anything other than give these zoning incentives and waiverss of certain fees. Again, all contingent on you recommending it and then ultimately the city council passing legislation to accommodate it. Um,

yes, thank you. Yes, thank you, Chair. Um, I'd like to belabor the point and mention as u as as having been u my past is sullied as a St. County Planning and Zoning Commissioner for 4 and a half years. Coincidentally, at the same time that uh director was either planner, senior planner. Um so we worked closely at that time decades ago. And my greatest fear, my prevailing greatest fear, which nothing has changed until couple of discussions and reading over again what I hadn't read correctly. this this magic thing that the city has come up with called historic category. It really intensely satisfies my fear with blockbusting. And at the county level when this was all uninccorporated, Wild and Willy West, um developers had a legal obligation to their craft to use President uh of this reszoning practice to shovel in developments that we've seen up around here uh that have caused the erosion um tragedies that we have. It has caused the what's frankly overdevelopment in this karst region, the foothills of the Ozarks. And it's only been the repeat explanations that it's finally sunk in that u if it's possible to provide for anything other than 3 acre lot density. That doesn't mean that every lot has to be three acres, but 3acre lot density for this 14 acres. if it can be accomplished and only by the fact that it remains

non- urbanzoned property. So having developers eyeing that R1 magic and that R1A gold magic, that's that's their that's their duty in life to come after us, come after the city for reszoning the entire area that's deemed 3acre zoning density outside of Town Center and outside of the area that's just barely outside of Town Center, which I think is called near suburban or something. Um then with all that uh if we can if we can successfully get the owner of record to uh weather that non-urban zoning density and then make exceptions to that in the actual lot size uh without having to weather all developers except those 14 properties in the city that remain that they know they've got hands Uh there's no there's no blockbusting. There's no um there's no even entertainment of reszoning in any areas outside of the properties that have a historic property. That goes a great deal um along the way of protecting the city and the protection. The city needs protection against well-meaning um fully obligated to their trade developers to keep from harassing and heranging and um invading the planning and parks department for reasonzoning properties outside of that area. So, it's a lot of preaching. what I would recommend or what I would be proposing if it was my choice of of having the most viable project would be um by golly a 3acre lot that surrounds the Connell House and whatever area that is compatible with

water with the creek line running right through the uh property at 4acre line whatever one or two additional homes could be put in that remaining area. Wonderful. The the area south of that creek delineating line. Um I hadn't heard before about a CVS or an ancillary use, but that's that's a an outlying area. You've got a you've got a gas station in a Cookie Mart of Sarts down at whatever that is, Highway O. Um that doesn't offend me when I drive by it each time. Uh it's actually a convenience for an awful awful lot of people and it wouldn't upset the um it wouldn't upset the the uh com the complexion of that entire area from what it is as an outlying area of the city. But it does um re back in uh the lots from uh minimum one acre everywhere that developers eyeing as a as an enticement. um a use of smaller unit uh I I see really high quality looking developments of real these real small efficiencies homes that were built up uh early on through the city that would be compatible with the area if they are screened. That is the biggest single criteria. It's good knowing we've got someone like like Mike uh full-time in our court. Um, and if he's got the teeth to be able to put into uh earmarking the easement setbacks from both 100 for people driving up and down 100 and for people that live on Manchester on the other side of the triangle, if if those safeguards and all

under the guise of this magic that the city possesses called historic category, this can be made a viable project that gives a return to this developer. Um, but it takes I I made a remark before the meeting that this this thing that you see on this half a page called historic it needs to be about four pages long. It needs to say the 300 things that the developers cannot do. Not that what it allows the city to do, but what developers cannot do. Um so that the city is automatically and perpetually protected um by having gone through and made these concessions to this developer for u this use. And they they all need to be an asset for the betterment of the residents of Wildwood more than they need to be uh assets or the betterment or the anything for a developer. That's a pretty strong opinion, but that's exactly what that master plan that u that we're supposed to be adhering to. Not just trying to figure out ways we can make exclusions to all the time, but figure out ways that we default to adhering to the plan. These are mandates in that master plan. They're not just uh casual would nice to bees or on a perfect day, let's hope it can be. They need to be adhered to. Um, so I've spoken more than well enough. Yeah, a retirement whatever empty neester efficiencies as Windsor Place or others south of Manchester Road that that you see, those are fine. They need to be screened adequately. I'll close by saying that director Vunich may remember that when the case came before planning and zoning back in the early 90s to uh build a post office

um at its current location at the dead end of or not the dead end but the end of uh Old Manchester Road at 100 there were people with pitchforks and torches going to going to take us all out. And uh you see what's what's there today. You're going why would there ever be a hubbhub and a ruckus about building the uh I guess it's called the the Grover Post Office. Gleno.

Gleno. Thank you. Gleno. I don't get down south here enough from way up north where I live. But uh u the planning and zoning commission recommended approval and um yes, we were hated by many for a long time. But when you look at what's there today, you're going, "Who in the world would have ever uh thought in a million years to protest the post office. I mean, there's there's no concerts coming out of it there. They're never there at night on weekends. So, it'd be about the best neighbor you could ever hope for in your life. you could actually do a lot worse than having a not a retirement community per se, but for efficiencies, uh, small empty neester types, single professionals. Um, then you'd give a place for the teachers and the first responders to live. Um, which is a big argument that I made at planning and zoning commission. I said, you got teachers, you've got police, you've got fire, but now you don't want to have a place where they can afford to live. So they got to drive a half an hour just to get home and then to drive to work the next day. You're not giving them a house that they can live in as a single professional. Um so a lot of this makes perfect sense when you have the hidden protection or not the hidden but you have the magic protection of historic category and you can still retain non-urban zoning. you're still not giving away um this reasonzoning categories um that um really are are violating they're in violation of this of the master plan.

Yeah, I'm I'm done. Thank you, Councilman. Madam Chair, if I may, are there any other properties within Wildwood where the city has granted a variance for special use with the understanding with an agreement, a signed contract that at the end of a certain term, the owner would turn it over to the city? No, ma'am. This will be the first of its kind.

Yes, ma'am. But I think it's entirely reasonable if, as was described to Miss Keith and I, his intent is to get a return on investment and at some point make a donation to Waldo. And what is that investment that he's trying to get a return on? Just the purchase of the property or the renovation of the house, which I would think he would get from the sale of the house itself. The purchase of the property, we've pretty much already established, although speculation, that it was pennies on the dollar. Someone who could not do anything with it and he came along and purchased it to graze cattle. You don't pay top dollar to graze cattle. Yes.

So, what is the return on investment?

I think there's actually three components. Uh the first is to recoup the cost of the purchase which include the JP Connell House and the 14 acres. Uh secondly, uh the renovation of the JP Carmel house and then thirdly something that as a commercial developer some return on investment that will make this to him a success and I don't know what that number is but I think there is a third component otherwise we probably be talking about a much less and extensive incentive package. It has been noted that the property hasn't been entered in three years. Is it necessary that we move to make any action tonight other than to perhaps delay this discussion until after we have an opportunity to see the house?

What I was going to recommend is no formal action tonight. Um, I would ask the commission, I think council member Mayberry has suggested that any incentive package now be inclusive of a 3acre lot for the JP Connell House and one other on the north side of the buffer strip. I was going to revise the recommendation to reflect that at the very least. And then from that point forward, I think a site visit as you s suggested, Mr. for is entirely appropriate. We may be talking about something that is so far gone. Is it realistic? So, so if there are other comments, not heard from Mr. Scott, our adviser, um, Miss Quarterneck as chair, if there's other comments, I can I can start pulling the parts together and maybe get closer to something that is not so uncomfortable for all of us. To make clear, what makes me uncomfortable as well is having sat through the candidate forum just a few weeks ago, having watched uh Mayor Joe comment on a recent council meeting where he said the 3acre minimum will be retained. Uh and he assured the public and all the comments coming in on Facebook said, "Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for retaining the 3 acre the 3acre minimum. Uh that this is not going to go over well at all. Asset or not, it's not going to go over well. So some kind of happy medium, which is why I had suggested senior village because we're all looking at retirement someday and all of us I would think would like to remain in Wildwood. Um, and I thought that might be acceptable, but as we keep adding to it, we get further and further

removed from that. And I and I fear a public outcry. I can withstand public outcry. I've, you know, I have no problem with that. It's just that the push back we're running in place. We got to start from a place where we know it will be accepted by at least some part of the public. So again, I think the first step to keep us kind of in a better position is a 3acre lot for the JP Connell House and one other lot on the 4 acres. That's two. Is the R1A density too great? I think Mr. Mayberry had said yes. He's still leaning toward the 1acre density. Is the commercial component completely unreasonable? Miss Bertlo doesn't think so. Maybe there's others. We could just make a single incentive package. Threeacre lot for JP Connell, one other lot north of the buffer and R1A south, which would mean maybe nine homes, nine additional homes. They could be villa types, they could be senior housing. They could be one story. Again, um but I think your point's well taken. Maybe let's see what we've got on Monday. Get a little ring. Let's see what we've got on Monday and maybe then we can regroup. As I mentioned in the other agenda item, this is the application the city council did not authorize legislation for. So, it's on hold. We have time. And I think it's only fair that when Robin, Miss Keep, and I talked to Mr. Ruy, it's like it's a it's not a simple it doesn't happen overnight cuz I think your points are well taken. No matter how sincere we are and how far along we can get with Mr. Guru, I think the community isn't going to understand

if I Yeah. I think this whole question is really out of our purview. We want to save the house but of whether it's 1 acres, 3 acres, whatever is going on there, that's planning and it should be done by a planner. It and it should be if we can work in council with the uh the planning department and the planning and zoning commission, I think they're the ones who really need to do this. I I I think it's really beyond us. And if we can just somehow we let them know we want to save this house. How can we plan using proper planning principles around this house to save it? Because there's too many other questions. I mean traffic generated uh utilities, sewage, water, power that that's not historical. That's really not our job here. So, I would put this more on the planning and zoning department and tell them we want to help them. That's my feeling.

And while I agree with you, Mr. Scott, we are being asked to do more than that and that's why we're having this discussion. Yeah. So, if I could move today to preserve the house and then punt to planning, I would. But that's not what we're being asked to do.

Yeah. But I think we could screw something up. planning wise to save the house that wouldn't that could well maybe it would increase traffic problems on Manchester Road or something like that that we really don't have the capability to properly judge. That's my feeling. But we do what we can to save the house.

Yes sir. So, if if I may, uh under the historic res uh preservation and restoration code, um one of the uh powers of this commission is to have a joint meeting with the planning and zoning commission. So, we're wondering if there might be an opportunity to bring these two entities together so you can have that historic preservation conversation with a room full of planners. And Angela has her name hand up again. Angela,

kind of off topic, but do we have any idea what the property sold for and if there might be anyone else interested in purchasing it from him as it is.

Miss Blo, I've occasionally checked on the county's website. The assessor requires a certificate of value with the sale. kind of been waiting to see as it processes on through. Obviously, um, County Executive Paige noted that they may be closing on Fridays so they can catch up on their workload. Some of the departments are five months behind. So, we keep track of it. Mr. Gri's not been willing to share that amount. And certainly, it's not a question I feel comfortable asking either. But first and foremost, I think the motion tonight is to postpone any further discussion or action. And if there is a desire, I think having the joint session, as Miss Keefe, uh suggested is probably would be, I think, welcomed. And the good news, Miss M. Bermile, is that Mr. Veritano serves on the planning and zoning commission.

Very good. Is it possible to then also invite them to join us 31st? to see. We can certainly make the offer. It be out of context, I'd prefer probably to have us visit it. Um, and then if if it is still an asset worth preserving, then we could probably arrange another site visit. I mean, Mr. Grew, he's been very accommodating about that. He gave us the key code to the lock. So, so tonight without further discussion, the department would respectfully request postponement and we'll see what we can do in terms of scheduling a joint session.

So, I would move that we postpone any decision on the Grey House this evening. Move and second. Second. We have a second. I I everybody agree with postponing it. Say agree. I All right. Do we also need a motion at this time to request a joint? Okay. I move that we also request a joint meeting with planning commission to discuss the JP panel house preservation.

Is that date and already set in stone when the next meeting would be? scheduled to consulting commission on April 6th. I'll ask them about their availability. Um it probably will be on a separate night given our agendas are pretty full. Both that that commission, this commission, we probably ought to do it at just a single item on an agenda. Yeah. Well, I have a motion on the table to join with the uh planning zoning. All right. Yes. I move to have a joint meeting with the uh planning and zoning commission to discuss the JP

with the date to be determined related to the date to be determined. Yes. I second. I second. Angela, do you have a comment? I just said I second. Sorry. Okay, that's okay. So, uh, everyone agree to that? I I I All right, we'll wait for that date. Robin,

uh, Madame Chair, members of this commission, uh, the department felt like it would be appropriate to go out on a really good note this evening. Uh, so I'd like to read to you from an email I received from our state historic preservation office. We at the Shipo would like to nominate Wildwood's commission for a commission of the year award. The honor recognizes commissions that demonstrate commitment to outstanding achievement and our forwardthinking efforts that uphold best practices and serve as a model to apply to other commissions. We think that your efforts to memor memor memorialize sorry Route 66 particularly the student Route 66 task force are a model that other commissions could emulate. It would also give Wildwood nationwide exposure. And so this award is bestowed upon commissions by the National Alliance of Preservation Commissions. And if we were to receive it, now keep in mind this is a nomination, but if we were to receive it, we would be awarded it at the uh national uh conference uh that our officers will be in attendance for. Uh so um I just wanted to spread that good news because it is certainly an honor to be nominated by another entity, outside entity looking at what we're doing um and recognizing it.

I think it's really impressive. Yeah. Congratulations on the nice nomination. Congratulations, Robin. Will you also be in attendance at the at the national convention in the event that it's awarded? You'll be there to I will be there. Very good. Very good. All right. Thank you. All right. Looks like we have a site ven visit planned for March 30th. Is there a time for that visit? It was on the upcoming meetings. 4:30, wasn't it?

I apologize. Oh, so our site visit on Monday, March 30th is at 4:30. Um, the lunchon on Tuesday, March 31st for the Route 66 round table is from uh noon to 1:30, but don't forget I do need an RSVP because we are ordering lunches. And then our next regular meeting will be Thursday, April 23rd at our usual time. How long do we propose the site visit to take on that Monday?

I'm anticipating it will take uh approximately an hour, maybe a little over that. Um I think the first visit will be relatively short. That'll be right in town center. Then we'll head over to the JP Connell House. It sounds like we have access to the gate, but not necessarily inside. Is that correct, Joe? Okay. Okay. Then I I would plan until 6 just to be safe and then we might we might adjourn earlier than that but I would plan from 4:30 to 6.

Where do we start? Uh, we'll go ahead and trying to think of I think it would be easier since we have two site visits if we could meet at city hall, send an email out tomorrow morning. Let me just think through those logistics a little more. Um, but typically we do offer a carpool option and it is we we do encourage it where it is um especially since we're starting in town center anyway. uh it just lessens the impact of having all these vehicles trying to park in the same place and trail after one another. If you do need to drive separately, that's fine. I do believe there will be ample place for you to pull over at both sites. Um it just means you'll need to keep up with us, but I'll send an email out tomorrow to the commission uh once we post the agenda and um give you instructions from there.

Very good. All right. If anybody has any closing comments on anything we've discussed tonight, I'd like to go ahead and uh turn our meeting. Oh, if may I mean I would just like to thank both you Robin and Joe. I mean, it's the work that the department has done to get these nominations and to get the recognition that uh the city and this commission has has received. It's up to it really been been your work that has done this. So, I want to thank thank you very much for that.

Yes. Thank you. Oh, well, I I've I actually would disagree with you, Mr. Scott, because you were one of the three, including Oh, Chair Steven, former chair Stevens already left us.

Um, who went to all of our student Route 66 task force events in addition to all of the historic preservation commission meetings, the site visits, the events, in fact, this whole commission, all hands on deck. Whenever I ask you to review a plan, whenever we are um facing with the public and doing all of those events, um you this group really goes above and beyond. Um and I and there is no way you can engage a community and build the type of momentum we are building with projects if you didn't have this big engaged group of people without your ideas and you're willing to follow up on them.

We're good to say that. like that. Thank you. I like that. Uh but thank you, Mr. Scott. I do appreciate it and I thank all of you for your just tremendous work. You are a wonderful group. Um and and we do so much together. So, go team. And madam chair, just Mr. Scott, that was kind of you to include me. Um but I'll give credit where credit is due. Most of it is Robin, not me. So, thank you. That's right. All right, until uh Monday for those of you that can make it or uh uh got other things on the agenda. We'll see you then.

Thank you all. All right.

Good night, Angela. Good