Board of Adjustment - Regular Meeting

Okay. Good evening and tonight is our monthly meeting of the board of adjustment. We are committed to a transparent process and encouragement of public comment during our meetings. We will be accepting testimony from all parties. If you wish to testify on any particular petition before using the Zoom platform, please use the raise hand feature. You can raise your hand at any time and we will recognize you at the appropriate time for the presentation of evidence for each case, of which there's only one tonight. Are we doing okay? You're not hearing anything. [Music] Uh, court reporter Courtney, were you able to hear anything just now? I can hear everything. Can you hear me? Okay. I guess the problem is on my end. Apologies for the interruption. No, you're fine. It's good to make sure we got our uh things in order here. Okay. Let's see. Where are we? Okay. So, if you want to make a comment in person, please hand staff a speaker card. Planner Robin Keefe will be moderating the hybrid meeting and will be asked to provide names of those individuals that wish to speak. I would like to call the meeting of the city of Wildwood's board of adjustment to order. The board members present today are Mr. Bob Morris, board member, Mr. Dave Barelino, alternate member, Mr. Michael Lee, board member, Mr. Anthony Reiner, alternate member, and myself, Arie Sprunger, acting chair. The Department of Planning staff present is Mr. Joe Bunich, director of planning, and Miss Robin Keefe, planner. Assistant City Attorney Sarah

Rutherford, and court reporter Courtney Tolman are also present on Zoom. First, I offer into the record the affidavit of publication pertaining to today's meeting, May 15, 2025, and take official notice of the zoning ordinance of City of Wildwood, including chapter 400, article 2, authorizing and establishing the board of adjustments powers and duties. Now, let me explain the hearing procedure. Please be aware the information I'm about to describe is also provided on the board of adjustment public hearing procedure handout which was available online prior and up to tonight's meeting. The hearing is informal in its nature. However, the meeting's proceedings will be recorded by a reporter for future transcription if needed. The petitions are called in order listed on the agenda. As a petition is called, I will ask a Department of Planning staff member to read each request into the record. Thereafter, the Department of Planning will have opening remarks and a brief slide presentation. Then the petitioner or his or her representative will be asked to state their name and address, be sworn in by the court reporter, make a brief presentation to the board explaining the nature of the requested variance, and present such evidence and witness testimony that may evidence the practical difficulties or unnecessary hardship that warrant the variance. The board will only consider the unique character of the property to determine whether they warrant the granting of a variance. The petitioner's presentation shall be limited to 15 minutes total inclusive of any questions posed by the board unless such time is extended by

the chair, myself. Board members may ask questions to clarify the facts of the petitioner's petition uh presentation. When the board is satisfied with the material presented by the petitioner, the chair will ask if there is anyone present or online who would like to speak in favor or opposition to the requested variance. Each speaker will be asked to provide their name, an address, be sworn in, and then provide their evidence or oral testimony. Witness testimony shall be limited to five minutes inclusive of any questions posed by the board unless such time is extended by the chair. Procedurally, the petitioner may request a continuence at any time during the hearing prior to a call for the vote in order to bring in additional evidence or testimony. The board may also continue the proceedings. After the submission of testimony and evidence from all interested parties, the board will ask a staff person to provide the Department of Planning's report on this matter if requested by any member of the board, the petitioner, or any individual that is participating in person or online. Once all witnesses have been heard, I will call for a motion to grant or deny with or without conditions, then the board will vote. At that time, the presentation of evidence relating to the petition is concluded and no further evidence will be permitted. The board may make a decision today. Four members of the board must vote in favor of the variance for it to be approved. If a variance is approved, the petitioner has six months to obtain the necessary permits or establish the use or it will expire. If the board's decision is

unfavorable, the petitioner has the right of appeal to the St. Louis County Circuit Court. This appeal must be done within 30 days of the [Music] decision. Okay. Uh, Miss Keefe, are there any questions at this time? Nothing online. Mr. Chair, I do see one individual online. If that individual would like to ask any questions at this time, please use the raise hand feature. I see no raised hands. No raised hands. Okay. So, since there are no questions at this time, the meeting will proceed. So, if we could uh read the first request into the record, which will be provided by a brief slide presentation. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, the first board of adjustment case tonight is BA 10-25. David Flag, 244 Timber Meadow Drive, Wildwood, Missouri 63011, care of Emily Wayhart, St. Louis Hardscape Solutions, 2763 West Osage Street, Pacific, Missouri 63069. Requests an exception to the minimum yard requirements general for the purpose of constructing a new concrete modular block retaining wall, which will be 8 ft maximum in height and 167 ft in length to be located along the back portions of both sides of the lot and its rear property line of budding Striker Road. upon the property being located at 244 Timber Meadow Drive, locator number 22 U23115, Timber Ridge Estates Plat 1, lot two, which would thereby authorize a front yard setback distance of 0 feet in

lie of the required 20 ft. This slot has two frontages on Timber Meadow Drive and Stucker Road, thereby having two front yards, though the retaining wall will be at the rear of the dwelling along Stucker Road and a sideyard setback distance of distances, excuse me, of 0 feet in lie of the required 8 ft. This request is contrary to the requirements of chapter 415.140R310,000 foot resident district regulations and planned environment unit PEU amended ordinance 14735 approved by St. Louis County Council in 1989. This particular property is located in Ward 4. And before Miss Keefe begins her presentation of slides, the department would like to enter into the record the following items. Chapter 400, article two of the city of Wildwood Municipal Code, the board of adjustment. Chapter 415 of the same city of Wildwood Municipal Code, the zoning ordinance, the file that has been developed and maintained by the Department of Planning regarding this particular request, and all contents contained therein, including the department's report with recommendation. And then finally, any evidence that is provided as part of tonight's hearing, including but not limited to testimony, maps, plans, plats, photographs, and any other. Thank you, Mr. Chair, members of the board. Our only uh and first case uh this evening involves the construction of a new modular block uh retaining wall which will have a maximum height of 8 ft and which will be 167 ft in length and located in the backside portions of the lot and along the rear property line. Uh the subject property is located within the Timber Ridge Estate

subdivision. Uh it is zoned R3 with a planned environment unit uh approved by St. Louis County also upon it. This dictates uh the yard setback areas and distances which is 20 ft uh distance for front yards or yards that are fronting uh public roadways in this case and 8 ft for the sideyards. Uh the lot is 0.27 acres in size and it's occupied by a single family home that was built in 1985. If you follow that yellow arrow on your screen, uh you will see the location of the subject lot, which is Eastern Wildwood and along Strucker Road, which is north of Highway 100. Uh, as noted, the subject lot does have two frontages uh with the front of the home facing Timber Ridge Drive and with the back of it uh Strucker Road and uh the retaining wall would be built uh to the rear here. Uh Strucker Road is a 40 foot uh city maintained arterial road. It goes uh north and south uh from Highway 100 north. Uh and uh Timber Meadows Drive is a neighborhood road. Um it's 50 ft wide. Uh the lot does have a 60 ft frontage along Timber Meadow Drive and a 96 ft frontage along Striker Road. It is 126 ft of depth. The lot is somewhat sloped. It sits upon

a hill. Uh it slopes 4 feet uh to the front of the property. It descends and then it descends 12 ft uh to the rear of it northeast. Uh the subject lot is covered in grassy turf. Again, the petitioner is proposing to construct 167 linear feet of Rockwood Classic 8 inch modular concrete block retaining wall and uh that is depicted in this orange line here. Uh so the back portions um backside portions of the lot and along the rear property line. Uh along with this wall, uh the petitioner is proposing to install 159 linear feet of black aluminum fencing as well along with some drainage infrastructure uh within the yard to help with the drainage issues. Uh the walls height is going to vary from 1 ft on the sides um to up to 8 ft in the rear yard area. Um and this is going to require a zero zero foot setback distance all around. Um, oops. I should note that according to the petitioner's representative, St. Louis Hardscape Solutions, um, slope the slope of the rear portion of the property is causing ongoing erosion issues, uh, which needs to be stabilized by the wall, hence this variance request. Um I would also like to note uh that the wall is proposed to be placed within utility easements um all on it. Uh so the petitioner has been notified of such and uh they are working on getting the appropriate releases from the uh rights owning

entities. This is the front of the home. Uh this is looking northeast. Uh this gives you a sense of Timber um Meadow Drive and the uh front area of the home in the subdivision. This is looking northeast um at the southern sideyard of the home. And then this is the other sideyard of the home. This is looking w or southwest across Stucker Road at the rear portion of the petitioner's property or the subject lot. Uh this is another perspective of that area looking northwest. Um this is the petitioner's property, the petitioner's fence sidewalk. This is looking southwest uh towards the petitioner's residence which is located on the right here. This is looking northwest along the fence line. Uh this is looking northwest um at the neighboring residents. This is looking southwest at the other neighboring residents. This is looking west. This is looking across Strucker Road from the subject lot. Looking northeast. And this is looking east across Stucker Road as well from the subject lot. And this is looking north. And I think

it's worth mentioning uh that this residence here across Stucker is the Ben Bomber House, which is a historic landmark in Wildwood. Um it was built circa 1891. And this is looking southeast on Strucker Road. Um just to give you a sense of the surrounding area. Uh that concludes my presentation at this time. Uh if you have any questions of the department, director and I are happy to answer them. Thank you. Thank you, Miss Keefe. Uh are there any questions from the board about the presentation or the request? I have one question. the property line um that you had on the your presentation drawing because I think I think the exhibit photos are a little misleading. The fence on the property is up the hill, but if you go to that historic photo, I think the property line goes down to that section where the fence is. So that is correct. So the wall would be all the way down here. That that is correct. The the fence is set back on the property. Right. So in that particular photo, um the property owner, whoever has the the dog, would have they had to get a variance approved for putting their fence in where they did? Uh well they would it is in the front yard. Director Mr. Chair now our code along with St.

Louis counties years ago allows fences up to six feet in height to be placed in the setback areas. That includes front, side, and rear. The only um prohibition is is that if you're on a corner lot, you can't have the fence if it's over 36 in in height in the sight distance triangles. But if you're putting a wall in, that's different. Yeah. Okay. For many years, fences weren't necessarily considered structures. Most recently, the city council did pass new legislation where we do now address fences in the front yard areas as well as on the remainder of the lot, but at the time the the fences were built. Really, there was just that one restriction, no greater than six feet in height. Okay. Thank you for that clarification. So, the wall will go all the way down to the sidewalk. I would note that on one of the exhibits provided by the petitioner, they note that the retaining wall is within one foot of the property line on all three sides. And I think that's critical because when you replace a sidewalk, a public improvement like is shown on the photograph that Miss Keefe's provided, there's an overdiged to get the sidewalk out. So the wall will have to basically be at a 1 foot or preferably a twoft distance from the edge of right away. I'm I failed to catch that when Miss Keef and I talked, but they show one foot. That's sufficient. But as I say, when you're replacing sidewalks, the overdig is necessary. Thank you. Thank you.

At this time, I would like to call the petitioner forward and ask that u he or she, I guess he in this case, um to state your name, address in relation to the property. And then remember, you'll need to be sworn in by the court reporter. I'm Zach Wayhart. Um I'm the contractor hired for the retaining wall project, representative of uh Singles Heartscape Solutions. right hand. Do you do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to give in this cause would be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes. Thank you. Okay. So, um you are to explain the nature of the request and the hardship or practical difficulty necessitating the variance. Yeah. Um you have 15 minutes to present unless you need more time. Yeah. No, I mean it's a pretty pretty So I mean I spoke with Mr. Vunich on the phone at length just about you know they you guys have been out there repairing the erosion that hillside has been creeping onto the sidewalk. You actually see it in the one picture that you showed of the straight shot down the sidewalk where it's creeping over the sidewalk. So that the left side is a little bit more severe slope and more um erosion and stuff going on on that side. That's basically what we're doing is we're building a retain wall to alleviate that pressure because they had street. I think they placed that too a while back, but everything's shifting. So trying to put something in there to where they're not losing their yard. You can kind of see in a couple of the pictures. I mean, it's just there's some great grass and then it's just really steep in some areas. So when they they mentioned the 12ft slope basically from the back the threshold of the back door down to the sidewalk and the majority of that 12t slope is in the last 15t of the the yard. So, um, they did, you guys also talked about they, uh, you gave us the list of the different utilities that were in there. So, we've already reached out to a handful of those different

people. We got approval from Amron and then we still have some phone calls out to make through spire and MSD. And basically the process is they come out and just make sure that nothing's going to be in the way. And if there is, then we're going to have to hydro excavate it. So, it's kind of a, you know, a little bit of a a process. But, um, I think that what we're what we're going to put in there is going to alleviate that. you guys having to do anything in the future of fixing any more erosion stuff and as well as that, you know, that that hillside intact. So, okay. Thank you, sir. Um, are there any questions from the board at this time? No. Okay. Thank you. Okay. Are there any speakers either online or in the audience that would like to weigh in on this particular request? Uh, Mr. Chair, we do have city council member Dodwell here to speak. Okay, M. Dodwell, if you'd like to step forward. And I think you know the drill name, address. Yeah. Katie Dodwell. Um, 1655 Timber Hollow Drive. Um, and do I need to be sworn in or I just You will. And your relationship to the property? I live in the subdivision. I'm the council member for the area. Okay. Perfect. Thank you. All right. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to give in this cause will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Yes, ma'am. Thank you. Um, basically I've just had about 20 different residents within Timber Ridge Estates call with concerns. Not that they want to uh negate the ability to put up a retaining wall, but with a better understanding of what this is

going to look like. Um, several residents have said it sounds to me like it's going to be a castle surrounded by a large wall. Uh, so I have a couple of questions for you guys. Um, number one, um, we have a 4 foot height limit on fences in the sub subdivision itself. So if we grant a variance um, to this petitioner, that's going to go against what the uh, indentures for Timber Ridge Estates has. So, we need to make sure that any fencing that goes around there is going to be 4 ft uh or less. As far as the retaining wall goes, um has anybody in the Timber Ridge Estates um trustees group reviewed this? Has the petitioner gone before the um trustees as is required through the subdivision? So yeah, before you can really answer that question, yeah, we we we'll we'll jot down the question and then after Miss Dodwell is finished, um we'll give you an opportunity to respond to that. That'd be fine. I mean, I'm not trying to cause problems. Just want to make sure we have the answers right. Um, and I was glad to hear that the contractor had indicated that they were dealing with the utility companies for that electrical box there because I was like, how are they going to bury that? That's not going to work. Um, and then lastly, I went out and took a look at the design plans that we have to date, and they're very um I would say somewhat vague design plans as far as um

the the height off of Strucker and the sidewalk there. How tall does that retaining wall get? And then what goes on top of that retaining wall? Um, I haven't seen any details and the information that I've seen through planning and parks or uh through planning and zoning. So, that's why I'm here tonight is to better understand what they're trying to do so that I can better represent um the neighbor who's trying to get this done as well as those residents that are concerned about it. So, um that's all I have to say. I just wanted to make sure that we get a little bit more information than we've seen thus far. Thank you. So, Miss Dodwell, if if I could summarize, um, you had a question about whether the plans were reviewed by the trustees of the subdivision. That was one question that you have. Um, another one is you mentioned that you feel like the design plan is a bit vague. So, you would like a little more clarity or the the neighbors would like a little more clarity on what exactly that wall is going to look like? Yeah, we can see from what's been posted. Here's where the lines are going to go for the wall. But I've got people asking me, what is that wall going to look like from the back? Is the lawn going to come up even with the backside of that wall and then the fence goes around it or is the wall coming up and the grass stays the same as it is on that slope? Um, just how does that work? Okay. Okay. And then I think your last question and you just touched on it again was, you know, how does how's the fencing incorporated into the wall? Is it on the wall? Is it inset from the wall? You know, so some of those things are what you're wanting to have some clarification on. And then by

the time that the retaining wall gets built and then a 4 to 8 foot fence goes on top of that, as a resident is walking by, are they looking at 20 ft that they're going to be walking past with this or is it something in between that where they are now? So, okay. Okay. Very good. Thank you. Okay. Okay, I think it would be appropriate to maybe ask either the department or the petitioner to address the questions that were Mr. Chair, from the department's perspective, if we could start with the petitioner's representative, the actual contractor for the retaining wall construction, and then we can kind of go from there. Very good. Sounds good. Thank you, Mr. Vunage. Okay. if uh either the petitioner or the representative want to come and address these questions. Okay. So, just remember to say who you are and your address and then get sworn in by the court reporter. Okay. Yeah. David Cle Jr. I reside at 244 Timber Meadow Drive Missouri 611 like Wildwood in some cases. Um been there for about 13 years. Okay. We'll get you sworn in and then you can go from there. Raise your right hand. Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to give in this cause would be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. Thank you. Okay. So, you you may remember the questions. If not, I'll just kind of walk us through. The first one was um did the plans that you've developed were they reviewed by the subdivision trustees? Yes. So I believe the HOA has to approve it. I don't think we gave them the full detailed packet but that's probably what the reference is to not

have enough details but we can provide the entire full packet if needed. Okay. because I think in in past cases we would see a copy or a letter from the trustees stating their review and support of the project. Is that is that what you have? I'll pass that. Uh but yeah, I think his last name is Fry. He had been provided the documents and uh basically it was a oh chicken and egg. They wanted us to go to the variance and get variant and they think the varian. Okay. Yeah. Sometimes we get this chicken and egg thing going on. Um a lot of times we like to see that the trustees are in favor of the project before we before we would rule. But but we don't have to do it that way. But it is important if if those really are indentures or rules or whatever that the subdivision has in place, you'll need to have that. Yeah, I heard the one foot um I'm not planning to exceed that this 4 foot fence, but obviously so um and it'll be like right right inside the block, right? That would be get closer to the microphone. You keep cutting out. I'm not sure if you're too far away or that better. That's better. Yep. So, the wall will be built up at the property line like you're seeing and then as the fence is, you know, erected on top of it, it won't be any higher than where the fence is today. It's just basically moving the fence to the wall line. So, I think that's you might think I'm building a wall then putting a fence on top of that wall and it's going to be this, you know, large eyesore, but

really right now when you're looking up the hill and seeing my fence, it's just bringing that fence back another 12 ft at the height it's at. So, both the neighbors yards that I'm building a wall into, um, my fence is not going to be above their fence. uh maybe the part that goes back towards the the sidewalk, but uh where the wall meets my fence will be no larger than there. So, only four foot tall. Okay. So, you're going to build you're going to build the wall or you'd like to build the wall. You're going to back fill that with soil or whatever, right? So, it's basically level to the top of the top of the wall. And then your fence is going to go just on the inside of the of the wall. It's not going to be mounted to the wall itself, obviously. Yeah, it'll be mounted just inside. And your plans are to keep it 4 feet or less. Correct. 4 foot. I've already acquired the fence due to prices. Okay. I think that Okay, great. I think that may even address the question about the design plan. Um, I don't know how we confirm that, but I think we have a better understanding now what you're planning to do. So, you're going to build the wall, back, fill it with soil, put the fence just inside of the wall, no more than 4 ft high. Correct. Okay. All right. I think that answers the question. There was one more. The electrical box. Um, I'm pretty keen on where everything's been, just living there for over a decade and and having work done and watching work. That one box that's in the backyard is charters. It's not electrical. It's charter copper uh communication cable. Okay. So I know that uh spire, water, um electric is all in the front as well as AT&T communication. So the one that would concern me is charter.

Okay, thank you for that clarification. Other questions? Yeah, I was hearing something about 8 foot earlier. What were you What's that referring to? That the 8 foot tall? Yeah. So, um, if the best photo is the one that you took a picture of where when you're standing on the sidewalk, you actually cannot see my house for the most part because the slope goes up that 12t drop they're talking about. It goes up about 12t to the front of the house and less than 15 ft. So, right there at that center point of my yard would be 8 foot, but then it tapers off to not, you know, be 8 foot all the way across. It follows the slope of my backyard kind of like a drape. So you're talking you're talking the wall. Yeah. Yes. So in in certain places in in one place. So it'll be 8 foot and then it falls off on both sides. Okay. Uh yeah. So that you can see the tree stump in the middle in this photo. That is where the 8ft section would be. And then this where she's standing in the corner here taking this photo that would I think five foot five and a half foot wall. And then on the other end very corner 3 and 1/2 4t wall in the very far very deep corner of the yard. And and how close to the sidewalk is this wall going to be? We were planning a foot. Um, I I can understand I've worked in concrete, so if more than a foot's needed or or you know, whatever is necessary, but I mean, ideally on the sidewalk, but I understand there needs to be some some space for work. Uh, right here in this photo, you can actually see where Wildwood has come out to repair um erosion and water. I think some neighbors had slipping problems walking right there. Uh they put some aggregate in there and they're out there

a couple times digging out. One foot is pretty close. Yep. Pretty close. Okay. Any other questions? Yeah. I have a question. Have you discussed this with your neighbors on each side? They have approval. All right. Um I have approval from the neighbor on the uh oh east or west the one with the electrical box. This will be on the u the right side. The left side I've discussed with them. They haven't um main concerns were water. They don't want any more water pushed onto their property. Um I made it clear that my fence would not exceed their their uh low point of their fence when it's built. and uh they didn't express any major concerns. Uh the person on the right side, I've had many walkounds with them and and he's happy and content. Thank you. Uh any other questions for the petitioner? Okay. Thank you, sir. Miss Dodwell, did we answer your questions? Okay, she is shaking her head. Yes. So, that's a good thing. Okay. Uh, at this time, uh, would anyone like to hear an oral presentation of the department's report? Nope. Okay. At this time, uh, would the, uh, Mr. Chair department like to make any final comments? Before Miss Keefe gives the department's recommendation, working from the diagram

that was provided as part of the application, it indicates an 8ft wall will be constructed from what is the southern point of the rear yard area as it as it abuts Striker Road. So that corner, southern corner at Strucker Road and the rear property line is 8 feet. It continues 8 feet to the center of the lot, then begins to decline in height to 6 feet to the northernmost corner and then on both sides of the lot, it goes from either 8t to 1 foot or six feet to one foot. And so just making sure that what we been provided is what is being discussed. Secondly, um we did as part of the recommendation require the utility companies provide either encroachment agreements or releases if they have no facilities. And then from the department's perspective, uh it's a little unclear on the fence because the engineering report on the wall shows it, I believe, as a component of the the component of the wall and it's referenced as a detail. So I just want to make sure that we were clear on that as well. It's page three of the first engineering report, but it defines it as others at a 42 inch height. So again, just a little bit more information would be beneficial. Okay. So, so maybe we do need a little

clarification here about where exactly is this fence going to be. Yes, sir. Please approach And while the gentleman approaches, I think there may be a building code issue as well, given the height of the wall, there may be a requirement that the fence be a component of the wall. So, I'll let Hardscape Solutions define that. They're better. They do this more often than not. Thank you. Two different details. So, they have it where you can core drill. So, it's just two different details in there. So, it shows the one where it has the 50s something pages long. So, we didn't bore you with all the the math. I don't even know what the math means really, but you know, I just know how to build it. But see how you see right here, the bottom one here's behind it, but then there's also detail where it shows it a lot of you can do it either way. It's basically. And so, okay. So, what I'm hearing you say is there are options. You can either put it Yeah. on the wall. Literally on the wall. Correct. Or or you can keep it off the wall. Just Yeah. Our engineer, the way that he draws it. So, I mean, there's there's three ways really. You could surface mount it to the top, which is just not safe because if you push on it, you can wrench it and break it off, right? Or you can core drill into the top through the the top of the block into the segmental wall system and then fill that with concrete and that basically acts as a pier and it's not going to move. I don't like that way because I still feel like that's not super safe. So the way that we have it I showed Joe in the detail. It's actually about a foot and a half to the center of the post off the back of the wall. So okay, there's three there, sorry, two different options in the drawing, but there's three different ways you can do it, but our engineer only approves those

one of those two ways. And we always do it in the the ladder where we put um sonnet tubes back there and then install the fence post behind it. So also the retaining wall too that's from the top of the wall down to the bottom. So we're going to have that wall is going to be pretty much level all the way across but we're going to have embedment all the way down. So that way that that locks that retaining wall in place. So it's not just 8 foot sitting on top of it. I mean that's including the embedded section as well. There per engineer specifications. It has to be embedded at a certain depth just to to hold structural stability on that slope. Okay. So then from from a clarification perspective, even though there are options on where you put the fence, Mhm. how you mount it. What you're testifying now is that you're going to put it off of the wall behind the wall. Correct. And mount that in concrete peers. I'm assuming that's what you're doing. Yeah. Yeah. There's just I mean there's a there's a bunch of different detail in there too like with just different geog grid and stuff too. I mean the way the way that Joe Strain draws this stuff up. I mean there's because sometimes you run into an issue like where you're in the field and you start digging and there's different soils and stuff like that and what happens in in the event of plastic soil or if we hit bedrock and how we chisel that off and make that smooth enough to where it can accept the the wall on top of it or build a keyway or something like that. So there's there's a ton of different detail in there. So basically if something happens we're we're in the field and something happens like hey we can't put the fence back here because the house is too close or whatever we can do this option instead. So it kind of gives us some some wiggle room if we have to make a field change and we're still going to be covered for that in that packet. So okay and as you dig down I mean this is engineering stuff I suppose but when you put the peers in for the uh for the fence Mhm. I don't know if you're using geog grid or what you're using, but Okay. So, you're gonna have to penetrate through that. Yeah. So, what we do is I mean we actually as we're building up once we

get to the the bottom the subgrade of that pier, we set our sauna tubes and then basically straighten those, make them all perfect. And sometimes we'll actually use PVC just so that it doesn't if we get rain on it, it won't collapse on itself. But then we set that in our our back fill and our reinforced section which is all has to be at least 96% compact in order to, you know, hold that wall system in place. So then that pier is just compacted all the way up until once we get our finish grade, then we install our fence when we're done and then finish grade and work our way out of there. Okay. Um I think that answers that question. I was going to say too is if we need to um talk to Sorry. Um we can we can make a 3D rendering to to show the the neighborhood too if we need to. I mean, we already file in our in our software, but since this isn't a project where typically when we're doing big outdoor kitchens and fireplaces and all that kind of stuff, showing lighting and all that stuff, we'll do a big 3D rendering of the project. But this one, you know, it's just a retaining wall, so an aerial drawing. And then this giant packet of numbers and squiggly lines and stuff like that suffices at the county level. So, um, we can do a 3D rendering if they want to see like actually what it would look like from the street. I mean, not opposed to doing that. So, and then also with the uh the HOA stuff. So, like when we when we apply through St. Louis County and I know it's in at the at the Wildwood level, it's kind of weird because like when we were here the last time with Windrest, they didn't want to give us approval until we got approval here. And it's like what do we do? So, St. Louis County, like when we're going for permitting and stuff like that, they'll ask us like, "Hey, did you let the HOA know that you guys are going to be doing this project?" And the answer is yes, we did do that. So, we did our due diligence on that on that point. But, you know, some people are just they don't want to give, you know, the nod until, you know, you guys do. So, it's just uh, you know, again, chicken and

the egg type thing. So, right. Does the HOA have to grant approval before you can do this? Um, I mean, once we have approval from you guys, I mean, we just have to in in the eyes of St. Louis County, all we have to do is let them know. So now there's different ones like like when we work in Eureka and the Legends and stuff that's all through a property management company. So we have to go through there and get that signed off. But as much of a pain in the butt as it sounds like it's actually easier because they're, you know, they're not they don't live in the neighborhood. They don't really, you know, they just kind of sign off. You know, they let somebody know the project's going on. Hey, it's not it's not pink shutters. They're not painting the sophet and fascia yellow. Like you're good, you know. So, but in this case, I mean, I could understand why, you know, they might want to see it. So, and we can definitely do a drawing or make that a condition rendering of it. So, yeah, I I just maybe the department knows I I'm not familiar with HOAs and how they work fortunately, but um is there a requirement? Does anyone know if the HOA has to approve this or is it truly just notifying them? In the zoning ordinance, there's a provision that requires the department to have verification of notification before we release a authorization for building permits. According to the city attorney, we are not allowed to enforce private restrictions, which are the indentures. So, we can't as the department say you need homeowner associations approval through their trustees, but we do require verification that they've been notified. We also stamp all the plans that advises the contractor or the

property owner or both that approval from the city does not negate compliance to the indentures of the subdivision. So the city takes it to the point of ensuring that the the HOA is notified of the project. What happens after that is a different matter altogether. As I mentioned, according to the city attorney, push comes to shove. If they comply with the requirements of the zoning district and the zoning ordinance, we're obliged to release it. But we've given the homeowners association, its representatives, the trustees, the opportunity to basically know what's happening to comment. And certainly we take into account the comments. may not be that we're applying their restrictions, but we certainly can have that conversation with the property owner or the contractor. They're asking for this. Why can't that happen? Hey, thank you, Mr. Gunich. I have one more question for the gentleman. So, am I wrong to assume that you'll be adding pretty substantial amount of fill between the wall and where it meets grade by the rear of the house? There will be a little bit, but all that cut that you can kind of see right there. So, we're going to have to cut all that out for a reinforced section. So, really all that fill is going to come out and all we're going to be adding is our reinforced section with the angular aggregate that we have to use there to stabilize the the reinforced section. So, I mean, you're going to have about 6 foot to 6 to 8t of grid depending on the the elevation of the wall. So, I would say you're going to be adding probably somewhere around

140 160 ton of uh 3/4 inch clean, which kind of equates to about 100 100 cubic yards. Okay. And then all the cut that's going to come out of there is going to be placed back on top of it for new grass turf growth or restoration. Thank you. So, do those plans, you know, what they backfill with, how much they backfill with, does that have to be reviewed and approved by the department? Well, certainly because unless they go between the budding houses on either side to the north or south, they'll be working off the rightway, I assume, to bring in that much fill that Mhm. but maybe they are going to work between homes. I don't know. Our plan was to actually use the rightway and then get a permit to use the rightway and then if we have to replace any of that sidewalk. I mean obviously it's it's in our contract that we're you know obviously we'll replace it at the homeowner's expense but I mean that's really the only way to get back there to fix that. So I mean it's just kind of a it's a looked at this hillside for many years when I used to mow the grass across the street. So I I know it very well. Okay. Um, any other questions from the board? I have one question for Joe or Robin. The variances for a zero um feet instead of the 20 ft. And this is just for the wall. But if we grant a zero foot um setback, could they come back and do

another improvement up to that zero foot setback above the lawn surface? Uh no sir, Mr. Lee, Miss Keefe is very careful to advertise what's being proposed. In this case, a retaining wall. Anything else that would want to be placed in that setback area would have to come back to the board. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, sir. I think that answered those questions. Now, I know Miss Dodd had raised her hand. If you'd like to approach and u I just wanted to let you all know that I haven't received any inquiries from the trustees of the subdivision on this particular issue. So, I'm not sure that there's any problem with it from their perspective, but okay. Um, thank you for that. At this time, if the board would like to make any final comments and recommendations, we would love to hear it. Morning. A question for the department on the recommendation that to approve it. It's mentioned in there about the you have the the option of the the type of brick and the color. Is that anything? Yes, that's correct. Uh we're looking to given given the sizable impact that this wall will have on the surrounding area. Uh the department is recommending uh that we um have a condition in there that the department must approve the type and color of the block to be used for the walls construction to ensure that it matches with some of the surrounding features. Thank you.

Um, as director Vunich noted, in addition to that, uh, we suggested a or we were recommending a condition, um, that releases be submitted for all rights holders of the affected easements. Uh, but generally we are supporting the law um, uh, at least in spirit. Uh, there is a practical difficulty here and that there is an erosion issue on this hillside. um it is affecting uh both the owner's property and the public right ofway and it could potentially have some future impacts as well. Uh it to to build a wall in a location further back uh would render a portion of the subject property unusable in terms of the yard for the petitioner. [Music] Um potentially if if done done right and done in an aesthet a aesthetically pleasing manner, the wall could potentially improve the appearance of this area. Right now you're looking at tree stumps and eroded land and you know some of those uh aspects. So potentially this could clean up the appearance um if if done correctly or done right. maintains the sidewalk. The city The city does. Yes. Having one foot to work with from the edge of the sidewalk to the wall. Can the city maintain the sidewalk properly with that much room? I would defer to director. Mr. Stronger, we do it elsewhere. It's always not the best case scenario, but what Miss Keef and I have tried to do is balance the needs of the property owner against the needs of the

rideway. And before you request a motion, I would like to have a floor for just a minute. Okay. I didn't want to stop any questions or comments. So on the report itself with your permission, Mr. Chair, um I know this is going to frustrate the property owner as well as the contractor, but the department would respectfully request the postponement. The reason it's requesting the postponement is I think it's in the best interest of the city as well as the property owner to have more information from the utility companies regarding the releases. If it's just charter, hopefully we can help him with that since we have a relationship with charter. I also think it's imperative we get verification from the homeowners association relative to the review. And as mentioned by the property owner, if the neighbors are willing, we would appreciate seeing letters of support or no contest, so to speak. And then finally, I think we need to see a better drawing relative to a rendering so that the neighborhood can see what is being proposed and also a better depiction of where the fence will be relative to the construction of the wall. And then finally, I believe there needs to be some separation between the edge of rightway and the proposed wall. And I would leave that up to the contractor who does this for a living and is very good at it to basically make that determination what the minimum amount is relative to where it achieves the goal of the wall but also obviously gives us working room for the sidewalk and the remainder of the rideway. Right. Okay. And I can provide all of that to the contractor and the property owner

tomorrow in an email. Okay. If the board is supportive. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Vunich. I know there have been a lot of questions and uh u I think we have to decide whether it's in the best interest to u to flesh some of this out a little bit more. And I I I understand and agree it may be a little frustrating for the uh the homeowner and contractor, but yet, you know, one more month is uh maybe not going to, you know, be that big of an issue in the grand scheme of things. But I'll leave that I mean to the board. We can decide whether we want to go ahead and and uh make a motion or we can I mean to either approve or deny or or we can make a motion to postpone. Guess it's kind of uh what we feel is in the best interest. Any comments? Any thoughts on that? Arie, I'll I'll make a motion that we postpone for the request from uh director of uh parks and planning till the next meeting. Okay. All right. So, we have a motion to postpone uh till the next meeting. Uh do I have a second on that? Bob, you'll I'll second it. Okay. So, we have a second. Uh why don't we go ahead and uh vote? Mr. Morris, how do you vote? Approve. Mr. Barolino, approve. Mr. Lee, approve. Mr. Ryder, approve. And I also approve postponing uh the decision. Okay, thank you very much for bearing with us and uh I trust we'll come out still with a good

outcome. Okay, that uh takes care of our first and only case for the night. We do have one other issue that we have to uh to deal with and that is the approval of the uh minutes from the April 17th board meeting. Okay. Would anyone like to make a motion to approve those minutes? Okay. Thank you, Mr. Morris. Do I have a second? Second. Thank you, Mr. Riner. Mr. Riner, how do you vote? Mr. Morris, approve. Mr. Bernolino, approve. Mr. Lee, approve. And I also approve. The minutes are approved. And finally, uh, I'd like to get a motion to postpone. I mean, not postpone, but to conclude our meeting tonight. Would someone like to make a motion to adjurnn? I'll make a motion to adjurnn. A second. Second. Thank you. Mr. Burino, how you vote? Yes. Mr. Morris. Mr. Lee? Yes. Mr. Riner? Yes. I also vote yes. So, that concludes our meeting tonight.