Westminster Planning & Zoning Commission - Regular Meeting

Okay. Call this meeting of the planning zoning commission to order. It's uh Thursday, November 20th, 2025. Okay. Um we'll go on to new business. So the first item is a public hearing for ordinance number uh 2025-09 PI plan industrial zone uses and procedures tax amendment. Is there anybody in the audience that wants to make comments on this? I will I just want to make sure that that anybody else besides Miss Miller is going to speak from the audience.

We we're letting staff go first. Yeah. We uh open this public hearing and turn to Mr. Gro to explain the bill. Thank you. Um if somebody is speaking if they could sign in maybe if not now but afterwards. I don't want you to catch up right now but do it. Um I'm happy to jump up now. Will you?

Thank you. Um, on July 28th, 2025, the mayor and county council approved ordinance 202501, automobile use text amendment. Join the planning and zoning commission and mayor and county council public hearings for ordinance 202501. Comments and discussions appear to be primarily related to the process to allow certain retail commercial uses in the PI zone versus the specific use revisions that would be proposed. that was allowing automobile uses throughout the zoning ordinance. Um therefore, as opposed to amending ordinance 202501, which would require us to revertise and reprocess it, the zoning administrator recommended that the public comments related to the TI zone could be better addressed by amending zoning ordinance section 1657 16475D, the process to allow local retail businesses or service shops in the PI zone. And that leads us to ordinance 20250. Generally, the ordinance proposes to add new permitted use hotel in the permitted motor and motors motors motor ends, motel, restaurants, and service station use in the PI industrial zone. increase um the acreage limitation from 15 to 30% for the for section 16475D local retail business and service shop uses in the PI zone and allow the planning and zoning commission to approve the PI zone development plan amendments for local retail businesses or service shop uses in PI plan industrial zone. The zone administrator notes that the ordinance which started this ordinance 202501 amended automobile related uses throughout the city including the PI zone and the ordinance tonight 20250 intends to improve the

process to allow local retail businesses or service shops in the PI zone. However, neither ordinances amend the site development plan regulations in the PI zone of which the zone administrator recommends in the future should be reviewedly amended. Um, with that, it's a fairly uh basic um text amendment again to address the process uh as opposed to going to the mayor and common council for amendments to a development plan in the PI zone. This will allow the planning and zoning commission to review and approve the development plan and eliminating the mayor and common council review. This is for amendments only to an existing approved development plan. And again, an increase of 15 to 30%. Currently, the ordinance allows 15% of the total area to be used for retail uses. The tax increases at 30% of the area for retail uses. certain retail uses listed where 70% still would be allocated to the industrial uses the permitted and special exception uses of the ordinance. Um with that department of community planning development recommends that the planning and zoning commission board a recommendation to approve ordinance 20 20250 to the mayor and common council as introduced by the mayor and common council on October 13, 2025. And I'm available for any questions. any uh question from commission members.

No, I think you know it's fairly simple. I think you know the first item is just adding hotels uh to the definition because it wasn't there before. That's a more common terminology that is used today. Um and then to up the acreage limit uh to 30% is just to give uh you know owners and the PIS more flexibility to have more of those retail uses. Um and then the whole thing about amendments have right now amendments have to go all the way up you have to modify the procedure.

Yes. Exactly. So, um, and there were some of my council colleagues that were not thrilled about the idea of it not pulling up the mayor of common council, but we're talking simply about an amendment that's just allowing, you know, the retail to happen and we had a lot of discussions regarding that. Um, you know, from a council perspective that it just would kind of get rid of a layer of bureaucracy that it would just come here and say council when there's a change or amendment to. So, um I do I I will mention I think that there's probably there's been some discussion, believe it or not, the second ordinance that's kind of related to the PI's. I think there'll probably be a third ordinance uh coming down the track uh to make some other modifications. Um but we're not here tonight to talk about that, but I I think there'll probably be another ordinance that we'll see in a couple months. Is that correct, Mr. Debo? That's correct. That's what I and that's what I meant by um zone administrator recommending a further review of the PI zone for the development regulations associated for the PI zone

height regulations uh size of retail uses certain elements in the PI zone that again provides a little more flexibility. But this ordinance was to address some of the comments that were made with that first automobile use text amendment and solely looked at process. We did not look at some of the development regulations associated with it. But the thought here was this is an immediate fix that increases percentage of retail use. So anybody in the PI zone now can take advantage of at least that element of it. um while we again potentially go to page three I'll call it that we look at the development regulations themselves.

Yeah, I think this is really good because you know the the PI zone probably was written back in the mid 80s and it really hasn't undergone what I consider substantial update and change. So as as things change and and move into the future, this is really a good time to do it. Um, if you're trying to attract a hotel, for example, you have to have sites where they can build. It's just logical and they have to have good access. So, some of this stuff is just common sense, very, very practical. But this timing is good. Okay. Any any other comments by the commissioners? Anything [clears throat] else over here? Miss Miller,

thank you. Very briefly, Kelly Schaffer Miller, 73 East Main Street, Westminster, Maryland, 21157. As you all are aware, I represent the owners of the Carol County Commerce Center, which has an approved development plan in the PI zone. We are here to support tax amendment, request a favorable recommendation, and I appreciate Mr. Adipo pointing out that there is likely to be a phase three. Um, I think that some of the adjustments made in this just warrant looking at some of those additional requirements. And so, um, I anticipate that there will be dialogue with staff and such and we expect to likely be back before you, um, sometime in the next few months on that. But tonight, we are requesting approval of this, and we appreciate the, um, the amendment that's been proposed. So, I'm happy to answer any questions if anyone has any, but I think this is pretty straightforward. Thank you.

Any any further comments on this text amendment? All right. hearing none. Um we'll uh close the public hearing at this point in time. Um for the commission's consideration, there's a few draft motions. If the body is to recommend that now, we can do it. Um there's like a normal compliment motions here. So why weight? It's relatively non-controversial. [clears throat]

Which one? I move that the planning and zoning commission for a recommendation to approve ordinance 2025-09 to the mayor and county council as introduced by the mayor and county council on October 13, 2025. Second. Motion been made and second to pass a favorable recommendation on this proposed to the mayor and council. Is there any further discussion questions? All in favor say I.

I know. The eyes have Okay. All right. And next is we have a public hearing for annexation number 89 resolution 258 center park condominium. Okay. So at this point in time we'll open the public hearing for 89 resolution 258. I'll turn to here again to our staff.

Is there anybody in the audience that can speak to this? Yes, sir. I'm Matthew from I represented center plaza and I'm happy to answer any questions the panel has about you. Sorry, happy to sign it as well.

Good evening. Um we're here tonight to talk about the property that's here highlighted in blue. This is the 531 district. Previously earlier this year, we had come together uh for 531 Old Westminster Pike. So this property um was going forward we had two plan uh two building permits that came in for new uses that both required additional water allocation. So that's why uh the annexation is that behind the coke the old coke plant. Yes. Yes. Should you get there through the parking lot? I'm sorry.

So, um, this is a condominium building, so there's tons of different owners that are associated and have in the petition that you'll see up on the dis there's all the attachments. Everyone that is a condominium owner has signed the petition. So 531 or Westminster Pike, excuse me, in the county. It is C2 commercial, medium density coming into the city as the business uh in the water and sewer service area. Uh it came before the mayor and county council for introduction on September 8th. We then forwarded it to the county on September 9th. Um that is also when it went to the state for any review and comments. who had uh went to the planning commission to Carol County on October 21st and they forwarded a favorable recommendation to the board of county commissioners and then on October 23rd they went before uh the county commissioners and they gave a letter uh a comment letter um which did not have any significant comments um as part of it. Our next step is the mayor and county council meeting um or a hearing on uh December 8th. And so we also um this has a graph recommendation as well. Uh opening uh community planning and development recommends that the planning commission for resolution 258 bit center park economy of phase one annexation which station 89 to the to the higher economic council was a favorable recommendation.

I have a question. So this is a developed site now. Yes. So why are they why do they want to enter? They needed additional water for two new condominium units. there was one was a doctor's office and one was an adult daycare and so um both actually needed additional water um and we had worked with the property owners so they had um I believe they also had irrevocable consent to annexation previously and so it was and we welcomed them in this go back up a slide I mean develop site is hardest to sometimes to because particularly when you have multiple properties. So this is a real

this is a real good thing. The the pink color maybe it says in here what that was about. Why is that one area color changing? That's the existing city that so that came into the city um couple months ago as of 535 on Westminster Pike. So the pink is inside the city. So the blue is what's being annexed. So the the uh the city boundary doesn't include the old coke plant. It it comes back and picks that up at the back there. Got it. So this is this is inside the city and that is what's being the the other building to the

Oh is not in the city. Okay. I I would imagine that over time that because what's happening is as people come into the as people need additional water, if they're eligible to annex, they're required to annex in order to get the additional water. And so once that came in viva, you know, kind of stonegate, the proximity of the stone gate, then as others, you know, you'll see that continue to grow over time. Yeah.

I mean, that's a long history. We all, you know, some of us know the history better than others, I'm sure you do very well. There was a time where Westminster kept on growing and growing without requiring annexation, which is quite frankly kind of was to the detriment to the city because they should have been annexed all that time, I guess. But that's a whole another story. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And the red tent red, that's the zoning map that represents B business zone. which this property annexed would be the business center because it's C2 right now in the county right and the property that we annex was also C2 at the time it annexed it and became B business

and there's no zoning waiver because it's close enough. Yeah. Yeah. Good. And this has you know probably minor impact on police, minor impact on stools, all that stuff. It's already got water and sewer so it's not going to really Great.

Okay. So, thank you. Uh, so as you're coming into the [clears throat] just for familiarity where it's located, as you come into the parking lot for Carolindor and then players is beyond that, it's in that parking lot. It's a a building that everyone's very familiar with being there. It's an office building. And I just wanted to emphasize for the council for the panel that nothing is changing. Um it's the same operation that's been going on there. There's medical office building that sort in there. Um Mr. Tar touched on it that there was an agreement years ago that annex when it began eligible and now it's eligible because the phase phase phase two annex first and now now we're here at phase one with that. That's where where we're at but we're just following through with what the agreement was years ago. Any any questions of the applicant attorney? Okay. Anybody else wants to speak to this matter? Okay. Hearing uh no further comments. We'll call this hearing close. And here again, what's the emissions move for recommendation to approve the proposal?

Okay. So, you're recommending the city of Westminster planning a zoning forward resolution 258 m center park condominium phase one annexation 89 to the city of Westminster and Mary common council with a federal recommendation. Yes sir. Second. Any questions about commission members? All right. All in favor say I. No. Have it. Your recommendation will go forth.

Thank you. We have a um a site development for the Oh, wow. Okay. So, I'll turn to our staff. Again, this is site development plan S2408 requesting approval of vendors first federal credit union.

Um, so the property itself is located on the eastern side of Baltimore Boulevard and approximately 530 ft south of the Angler Road route 144 intersection and again next to the Goodwill just south of the property is zoned B business and is 1.92 acres in size. The Members First Federal Credit Union is a bank and savings and loan institution which is a permitted use in the B business zone to the site. Um so the site development plan itself with primary access to uh to members first is off of route 144 and 140 I'm sorry I keep saying 140 as well as Clifton Boulevard. Um, when this property was created, it was provided denied access on the 140 and there was an easement that was provided from Clifton to get to this property. Um, but with this plan, the applicant is proposing dual improvements on that access drive from Clifton. Then also improving the entrance on 140 right out uh movement. The parking is the parking requirements for the property requires 12 off streetet parking spaces and they're providing 32 including two ADA spaces. Now the signage on the property um again it's they're allowed up to 150 square ft and that is not really being approved by the planning commission tonight. There's nothing additional beyond what is otherwise allowed. There is a pre-standing sign obviously law signage and that'll be taken care of at the time of sign permit application process. uh one of the uh as far as landscaping, landscape is a veteran site um meet the requirements subject to additional plantings that the staff is still

working with or nothing substantial that would uh keep the project and as far as I hit on anything else here. So one of the unusual elements about this property is that members first the access in is on the goodwill property. So that opens up goodwill to be part of this site plan process. Um they have to sign off in the site plan just as well as members first property and I believe it's the same property owner anyway. But one of the elements of the Goodwill site uh which isn't shown in this plan that we're still working on the applicant with the applicant or or minor improvements to drive aisles access and both pedestrian vehicular. So adding additional sidewalks, um additional access from Clifton pedestrian access to the to the Goodwill building itself and on the front of the building along 140, some minor improvements to the parking spaces and drive aisles. Again, that's uh the goal here is to move members first forward. And as we are, we'll continue working on these minor revisions to the existing Goodwill site. And that's one of the outstanding issues and as and would be a condition of approval architecture.

So the uh so there's a del there's a new del lane being constructed. Is that

the entrance is the entrance is there but it's not you can't come out. It's it's not a two-way entrance. Exactly. One way. So that's the only thing that kind of caught my attention. Yeah. So that traffic coming out of there. Well, there as you can see here, they're doing improvements on the access drive in itself, widening it um for about a two-way movement.

Um this was one way movement. Now it's two-way and you are providing a decelerating the the access into the site. Um we had the site entrance to members first pushed back as far as we could to the property. So you're you're creating this nice gap uh between the access to 140 and access to members first. Uh some of those elements that we're talking about is just minor strengthening improvements more or less. Goodwill is planning to resurface the parking site parking lot to match the new resurfacing or the new surface of March 1st. And with that, we're going to work with them on updating some strife and providing some a sidewalk on Clifton and providing um an access from Clifton down for pedestrian movement. Um again, with the work they're doing already on patching the their site, the the parking lot of Goodwill, that's why we're working with them after the fact, and we'll continue to work with them uh to get those minor adjustments completed. We go to that architecture.

So, can you go back to that for a moment though? Just did you have concerns over the right out there or Okay. 140. Yeah. Couldn't you get you can get out of there now, right? You sure? Is that your Where I've seen people come out. I've seen people come out. It's exit only. You can't enter that this site from that entrance. 140, I believe. Are we talking about the one at 140? There's two along. There's two. There's one before you get to Goodwill and there's one right there in the bank. There's one further up here.

Yeah, exactly. So, what is the one the existing one that that shows the two-way movement right now? Is that only in or is it only in right now? both ways. It's both ways now. Oh, it's both ways now. It's supposed to be both right now. It's intend it's intended as approved be one way movement. It's two ways on the building. And then then so that's the improvement. Exactly. With the with the addition of delane, they're going to widen the entrance to make this two-way movement. You said people I think it is already two. It already is. Yeah.

I'm assuming people operate. it operates that way, but previous approvals um was not intended to be a two-way movement. So again, this this creates a safer situation. People already again, you can't there's no barrier to stop people from going both ways, but this should be an improvement. Second entrance is not on this drawing. No, that's only that kind of like slides in. You can go to the bank here.

That's one of the elements we're going to work with the applicant on to approve that to further define it to write in only. Um there were previous plans to show right in over time. Uh it changed a little bit. So that's one of the improvements we're going to work we're working with on to better visually show that it's a right in only the second entrance further down. I mean, I do think the del lane to help definitely. So, that first entrance that's that's closest to the new bank member first is going to be in and out and then the entrance that's further down is going to stay just in, right? You're not going to be able to come out. Okay.

I mean, better signage, better striping, better visual cues. Again, you're not going to it's not going to stop everybody, but we can do improvements to at least curve some of that some of that movement.

One of the elevation. Well, if we go back real quick, if you look at the plan that we provided, um the applicant initially was showing a sidewalk that ran along 140, came up to the site, and then extend it further to Goodwill. right now that they've eliminated that sidewalk, working with state highway, issues with slopes, issues with um State Highway did not want that sidewalk because there's a sidewalk along the bridge itself, right? That kind of goes nowhere.

It goes nowhere. And then you have this guardrail that they would have to shift back and then steep slopes and movement. It was it's there's not a safe situation to make what they were doing to this point. You just push the sidewalk back. Yeah. So that's a sense. So the there's a sidewalk along the bridge that's now not connecting. But yeah, but because this site was vacant, there was never any proposal to do anything. Yeah, the state highway doesn't want the sidewalk. Exactly. Yeah. Go ahead.

We still have enough space here in the future. If we ever get improvements and work the state highway or 140, uh we certainly have that option that we could provide a sidewalk to get access to. The one thing we are doing this this is what goes back to the Clifton discussion uh providing sidewalks in Clifton and access pedestrian down to Goodwill. The sidewalk on Goodwill comes along the front of the building and that is being connected to the bank. So you will have this pedestrian movement throughout from this site all the way over to Clipton and all the way over to the bank over here to that corner which has a sidewalk. So this section is improving the pedestrian connection and then to the elevations. Um see the proposed elevations. um proposes a grayish concrete masonry block veneer base and an aspen white brick veneer above the areas of um of the with veneer or masonry veneer. The roof light offers variations in height and slope and is covered with asphalt shingles. The elevation facing the good property of Maryland 40 includes several windows and glass features and provides a defined entrance detail. Um, so a lot of these elements, everything I read were requirements of the design preference manual, which staff believes this architecture meets. The only element that um that staff looked at, this is what's facing 140. It's actually the mirror image of what is out there. These these um drive-thrus are actually on this side. So you have to imagine that this is flipped um and throughout this throughout the elevation.

Oh, understand because they they someone flipped it the wrong way. Yeah. So this is what's facing Goodwill with a nice uh stone entrance feature. What staff is asking is that this elevates including more this facade to highlight it more in one 140 even though it's not pedestrian access to it but it is the side facing 140 and I think it would be a nicer element instead of a secondary element especially because it's facing 140. So that's the only that's the only uh issue or concern we had or comment we had about the elevations outside of that

was essentially the first submission we didn't they they came in with a very good design and again been great to work with as we're going through this.

Can you go back to that consolidation part? Yeah, Mr. I when I was looking at the material today, I kind of wondered to myself why the building wasn't facing 140, but um I I kind of think probably because of the configuration of what they need to do for the drive-thrus. They just don't have the space to do that. Um is what I assume. And I I think, you know, I assume what they're trying to do there is at least make that elevation that faces 140, you know, look semiattractive. You know what I mean? So it doesn't look as much like a side of a building as as as it typically would. So I don't disagree with your point of maybe highlighting that a little bit just to try to kind of give it a little bit more pizzazz from the 140 direction. Um I think it's probably a good idea. So I I like that comment. um potentially working with them to just to kind of I think it's really good. I think it's a great effort, but just to kind of give it a little bit more pizzazz on the elevation that basis 140.

So, this has um four has two lanes going to the drive-thru and it has so somebody could be at the ATM machine, two lanes and then what I think is really good is like pass through lane. So the the outer lane if somebody gets in there and decide they don't want to wait, they just pull out. So there's actually four lanes. Oh, I see. A through. Okay. Yeah. So yeah, the drive-thru and then there's literally a ATM and two service lanes and then the through lane. Exactly. I think that's really good. Yeah. And I I'm assuming they just couldn't figure out the m the geometry to make it that it would face 140.

And that was one of the first comments death had when that when we reviewed this turn the building to have it face. But you're right with the access in the four lanes bypass the narrowness of the property itself. Turning it. They did they did look into that. It's not they didn't dismiss that, but they did look into that. And also when you turn it, the piping field's over here. It just it just it wouldn't work. If we had a better site, I I I think they would have looked into that and probably that um but with the narrowness of the site access and location, um we were comfortable with that explanation. Yeah, I just think you make the make the the side facing one a little bit nicer. I think your suggestion to it and then you look at the other elevations nice and a nice element of this they wrap the entire building with the elevation and the material. So any sound before it's the same face the same materials the same look. So we always try to get that foresighted architecture and that's what this uh product is proposing and then with that staff would recommend the plan commission consider approval of the proposed sites development plan S28 and the first federal credit union with the following conditions of approval. One depicts all required improvements from the adjacent Goodworld property 215 Boulevard as [clears throat] outlined in the November 20, 2025 staff report for S2408. Address our outstanding city and county comments prior to submission of signature sets. And I want to add a third condition and that is to improve the U entrance elevation

along 140 to be consistent with the other uh other entrance.

I just noticed something and I I apologize because the applicant But the owner is my accountant. So, um, at this point in time, I'm going to, uh,

I apologize. I'm sorry. [laughter] I'm really seriously my apologies for that. Sure. Repeat that third recommendation. So it's if we go back to the elevation, it's essentially to carry the entrance feature facing Goodwill onto the um entry or the feature facing 140. Okay. So can it just give it a little bit more pizzazz? That is facing the uh storing water pond or something. Now that's

No, no, no. This is facing Goodwill. This is what's facing 140. If you go to the next one. Yeah. Look, flip through. This is what you will see facing the stormwater advantage facility. Okay. And then that's what's facing I'm sorry. This is what's facing the storm advancement facility here. This is what's facing the railroad, the steep slope. Um, yeah. So, you requested to make it like the drawing. Yeah. If you go back just just to carry this feature. Oh, yeah. Just really adding this element to try to mimic a little bit more pathetic.

So, does anybody um have any comments? We want to hear from the applicant. I guess that

good evening from land works. Uh Michael Martin's also here from members first. Um I'm not really sure what Lori wanted to add besides what Mark has kind of filled in the commission, but I can kind of touch up on few things. Um one of the uh items we can touch up on is the orientation of the building. If you notice existing storm water pond that's there today is there. So that's kind of the the restricting factor there. So we're already encroaching a little into retaining wall. If we had to turn the building, we would have really had to impact that pond, which we really didn't want to do. So, that kind of addresses that. Uh the sidewalk along 140, you know, we were working with SHA on that. We tried to get it in there. The issue is to get the sidewalk in at the required width would have required either the installation of the sidewalk underneath the guide rail uh because at that point it slopes off like 2 to one sloped down to uh existing grade. So, I mean, we try to get it there. There's utilities, utility poles along that roadway as well. So, uh, basically, we just try to come up with a better kind of mousetrap there to get pedestrians to go. I mean, we understand people are walking along there, but, you know, SHA would prefer not to have anybody walk along there. Uh, it's a busy road, so they would prefer to kind of just direct them elsewhere. Uh, as far as landscaping, uh, I know the plan that you had in front of you probably showed a minimum amount of landscaping. We have definitely increased that amount, um, working with staff and the county, uh, meeting with the requirements. Um, and there will also be some additional landscaping provided on Goodwill uh, site when we uh, provide those additional drawings with the uh, restriping and reconfiguration of some of the driveways. Uh beyond that, it's a pretty straightforward project. Um

Members First is glad to be part of the community and and come in uh to kind of get started working with you guys. So uh Mike, if you want to add anything else to I I think it's all been beautifully said. Um yeah, I mean we're we're we we pinpointed West Mister as a place we would like to be. Um and uh this is a great site to to be on and it's right where uh our research told us we want to be. So So where's your closest location otherwise? Right now? Right now it would be uh probably South Hanover. Uh we have we have uh in Pennsylvania like we don't have any in Maryland yet. Also this is your first location in Maryland?

Yeah, we're working on a site also at Frank County but um you know in here. So we're we have several points the south end of Pennsylvania where Shrewsbury which is uh down what's that 83 and then [clears throat] we're in South Park just a couple miles from the border as well and then we're in Gettysburg so we have you know strategic places that we have a lot of members already in Maryland. So, out of curiosity, just anecdotally, [clears throat] what made you this your first location in Maryland? What is kind of driving you towards like West that first location to be Westminster as opposed to another location?

It's um we look for places that are growing uh that have uh you know, many people as possible. You know, the more uh it is the the better chance we have of getting accounts, right? There's a lot of business associated. There's a lot of people living here and you know it's it's a it's a place that we tap into. Um one one thing that we find a little humorous lately is everywhere we seem to be looking at Chase Bank is also. So we looked at the building right across the street from this that Chase took over as a lease. We decided we didn't want a lease. Next thing we know Chase snapped it up and they're in already. um you know, yeah, we all use the same uh metrics. Uh we probably all use the same company called Vangography that does a lot of research on the demographics of the areas and then they tell you, you know, where's the best regions to be and then pinpoint actual locations and um um Chase is using the same metrics. They pinpoint the truest right on the corner as the ideal location to be. And so Chase is across the street. We're on the other side of the Goodwill from it. It's, you know, a nice community where

So, with your out of curiosity with your credit union, um, can anyone belong to that credit union or it's how how does that work or do you have those? Well, as a federal credit union, there's several ways you can become a member. Um, you have a family member who's already a member, uh, or the the organization you work for, they're what we call SEG, SEG, a sex employer group. Uh, it's free to have a say. uh we will come in and we'll sign up the city of Westminster to be a SEG. So if you work for the city of Westminster then you become a member. It's it's it's really easy. There's there's but you got along too you Yeah. So yeah, that's typical for Okay.

Yeah. It's free just for all of our uh you know SIG employer you know select employer groups to to sign up. It's free for benefit of their employees. basically another option of a financial institution they go to. We get we get a lot of people I get a lot of members through uh indirect lending. So you get a car loan from uh a car dealership, a used car dealership or something. Uh you get a car loan from members first which we have a lot of people in Maryland, a lot of members of Maryland that that way now you're automatically a member of Members First and then everyone in your family can become a member and you're a member. It's kind of how it works. Federal

sir, if you wouldn't mind identifying yourself the record. By the way, Michael Martin members first. Okay. Michael Martin. Yes. Okay. Okay. Anybody else? Any uh

I think it's pretty straightforward. I'll go ahead and uh I move that the planning and zoning commission conditionally approve site development plan S24 00008 pursuant to the city of Westminster zoning ordinance article 25 and based upon the November 20th 2024008 staff report and conditions of approval adding on to uh those conditions of approval. Uh item three, which is the improvement of the route 140 elevation as discussed in the meeting. Um that staff will work directly with the applicant to kind of fine-tune that to make it a little bit more like the entrance feature that's facing the Goodwill. Um and then the other just for the record uh the two other things are dispicting uh depicting uh all required improvements to the adjacent goodwill property at 200 Baltimore Boulevard um as outlined in the November 20th, 2025 staff report and then addressing all outstanding city and county [clears throat] comments prior to submission of signature sent by Walts.

There second. All in favor? I I Yes. You what? Noted for the record that you I repeated myself if I was the owner of my account. Thank you very much.

Good luck to you all. Don't know yet. Get through all these last Under old business, we were going to take up recommendation because the city attorney had some personal issues in her family. That decision is not ready. So, we're going to defer to that recommendation this see. So the next item is laser on the court. What's happening in lots of stuff now, right?

We're going to defer a lot of things, right? Well, yeah. Yeah, we have there's a lot of um

Oh, I think you're taking Okay, sir. You're taking my jacket. Oh, okay. Oh, that was [laughter] I thought it was [laughter] I said you wouldn't forget it.

It's like zero degrees. Find a guy that had my phone. Yeah, I know it was going to happen. Sorry. [laughter] All right.

Okay, we'll start here. Um, the county conducted an audit and made updates to Carol Connect uh website to ensure subscribers are receiving appropriate and timely information. Under the topic planning and land management, users of Carol Connect can subscribe to Carol County Planning Updates, Carol County Investor Plan 2035 and Down to Earth, which is a quarterly newsletter. Uh, Carol Connect is, are you familiar with Carol Connect? Great. Um, oh, laser updates. So on November 13th, the board of county commissioners approved with the Carol County Department of Public Works make adjustments in the existing Trailblazer Purple and Black routes. Purple route has combined the stops in Stone Avenue and Carol Hospital. Official stop is now the Stone Avenue Medical Complex. Any writers needing to stop at the hospital can inform the driver and they will do so as a deviation at no extra charge. The black route has eliminated the city of Westminster city hall stop. Any writers requiring this stop can request the driver to do so. Um changes in the routes will be advertised in the buses. These changes go into effect January 1st, 2026. Um deferrals Commissioner Krebs is concerned that the county code does not address the welfare of citizens freedom area with respect to divisions governing retirement villages and retirement homes, poster subdivisions, planned commercial

centers, qualified projects, and self storage. The deferrals will allow the planning and zoning commission to study the zoning code and suggest possible modifications to address these concerns. On November 6th, the board of county commissioners considered a proposal to impose a series of deferrals on the submittal, acceptance, review, processing, application for approval, or decision of any pending site plan, zoning certificates, development plan, or application for any of the following projects defined in chapter 158 of the county code for the area subject to the freedom community comprehensive plan. That's retirement villages and retirement homes six months cluster subdivisions months land commercial centers eight months and self storage three months. On November 13th, the board of county commissioners voted three to two to send the above mentioned to public hear.

When does it go to public hear? How's that then? Hey,

I don't have that written. Can you email and it's not that it impacts us because we're not the freedom area but yeah I'd be curious when that goes to public here. So this is this just free not the rest of it's just the freedom area. There's a feeling like you were reading different land use that there's too much of that. Yeah.

Is that they don't I understand like I say it's there's been a lot of senior centers built down there. There's the new business center that was built out by Please Mill Road. A lot of people were upset by that down there anyway. They don't want it. So, they're looking at it. So, can I ask you a question just out of curiosity about how this deferral? Um, so if I were doing a project down there right now, like in the Freedom area, and I was literally a month from recording it, I would be deferred. Is that correct? Because if [clears throat] I haven't recorded, I'm deferred. Yeah. Yeah. I believe so. I believe so.

Because you don't have that because you have trouble on the ground. Correct. So I'm a month. So I'm a month from recording. I've gone through all I'm a month. Make a change to do everything to your best. That's right. So I can be a month from recording. No, no, no. I just I I just want to make sure I can be a month from recording. Yes. And I'm going to be deferred for nine months and then they may not get approved. And then and then you're going to change the rules on me. Yep. They could when I'm a month from being recorded. Yep. They Wow. Okay. In fact, they could do that whether they had to defer or not. They could put it for the

Yeah, they could. But I mean, well, tell any of these people that they're welcome to come to West. Wow. I mean there's no questions like you're asking all mean there's a lot of stuff happening you could do this with like grand something like this reasonable grandfathering but if you're all the way almost through the pro project you spend hundreds hundreds of thousands of dollars plans down there in the gallery. Okay. Okay. Anyway, it's not us. So, but all right.

Um I'll get the date for that public hearing. I'll send it to um the both of you. Yeah. Yeah. You'll send that to us, please. Just out of curiosity. Okay. Um text amendments. uh board of county commissioners sent a zoning text amendment for off use off the premises signs to the planning and zoning commission for their review and recommendation. The text amendment was introduced to the planning and zoning commission on October 1st and is tenatively set for continue discussion on December 18th. Do

you know do you know briefly what that amendment is? So I um So I I can't I can't remember the details of it right now. I I don't have a note of it. I can um I can also send you that. Is that okay? Sure. Great. Appreciate it.

Yeah, no problem. Master plan updates. Um, master plan. Sorry.

Yeah. Master Plan workg group reports on housing, economy, and agriculture were shared with the planning and zoning commission on November 5th. Um, in upcoming meetings, the planning and zoning commission will consider them as part of a broader effort to review, update, and recommend changes to the county master plan. There will be many opportunities for the public to give feedback throughout this process, which is expected to continue through 2026. a master plan joint work session between the board of county commissioners and planning and zoning commission um scheduled and held at on November 18th at 1 p.m. Um the staff provided an update of master plan progress to date and there was a discussion between board of county commissioners and planning and zoning commission on um the next steps of county commissioner work sessions on October 23rd. the board of county commissioners begin holding work sessions on planning related matters. Um the work sessions have are livereamed and recorded and can be accessed through the county's meeting portal and YouTube channel. Um on October 23rd there was a meeting on clustering. On October 30th there was a meeting on DRA. Um there was a meeting on age restricted housing on November 20th. Are these sorry the work sessions are these just informative in nature or they

I think these are related to the deferral or the changes that they want to make as part of the deferral. Okay. Is my understanding. Correct me if I'm wrong. So they are um they're public but they're um they're like I guess not closed sessions but they're work sessions. So taken or anything? What? They can't vote on anything. Yeah. I was just wondering if it was um just staff informing them or is this like direction the next that they're okay? It's discussion and it's um like working through different issues, people expressing their concerns on the board of commissioners and then um getting information from staff. But

it sounds like it's related to these deferral information related to the Thanks.

Um, water resource element um updates. A completed draft of the WRE was sent to the state on November 12th for the review. Um, the planning and land management department will accept public comment on behalf of all nine planning commissions concurrent to the state review period. Planning and land management staff will collect state and public comments, host a public information meeting, and facilitate a joint public hearing of all nine planning commissions. The relevant dates are as follows. November 15th begin open period. January 14th, 2026, tentatively there is a public information meeting. January 15, 2026 is a 60-day review period closing. Um, February 4th, the planning commission's public hearing is tentatively scheduled.

Would that real quickly? I'm sorry. We we're not going to join the counties everybody do it on the same day because it's not on a day in which you guys have a regularly scheduled meeting but um they did give you the option if to have it between a certain time period so we can have it as our January at our January meeting and what is this going to be

it's for the our our portion of the water resources element so everybody has to have a we had it a public hearing to send it to 60-day review we not a hearing we voted to do that. It's now past the 60-day review period in January will be over. Um most likely they will hear very little comment regarding our section or really probably many sections. And at that point um we're going to be part of the countywide planning commission's having a um a public hearing to send it to the county commissioners for adoption.

But so because we were part of the sending it 60day, we have to have public hearing. But they were trying to have one giant essentially virtual meeting on February 4th where you had to have a quorum there. And because that's not a regularly scheduled meeting, I didn't think that it was appropriate to ask the C the plane commission to do that, especially when we had the opportunity to do it on a day when we were already meeting. Okay.

Oh, thank you. Um, last update, water and sewer. Uh, spring 2025 amendment includes Hamstead, Tonytown, Union Bridge, and New Windsor. A letter of Maryland Department Environment approval was sent to the Board of County Commissioners on October 21st. Um the fall 2025 amendment includes Mount Ary, Tony Town, and Freedom and is scheduled for uh certification by county planning zoning commission on November 18th. Um and I haven't gotten word on how that went. So I can I can follow up with you. Anybody have any questions?

Thank you very much. Any plan commission member comments on any topic? Really talkative tonight, guys. Okay. Um, hearing none, we'll entertain a motion to adjurnn. Make a motion to adjurnn. Second. Motion been made and seconded to adjurnn. All in favor say I. I. Oppos? No. Eyes have it.