Planning Commission & Land Use Authority - Regular Meeting

Sorry, Bonnie. Are you ready? Can you hear me? Yes, sir. I am here and ready.

All right. Welcome to planning commission for December 3rd, 2025. Um, we'll start the we'll start off with uh a prayer from Commissioner Anderson and a pledge from Commissioner Davis. Our father in heaven, we're grateful we can be here as residents of Washington City. We're grateful that we can [clears throat] work on projects that impact all of us. Please help us that we can have cool minds and that we can we can think about the issues and and provide a resolution that that works to the the best of everyone. Please help us that we can have the spirit with us. And we say this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen. To the flag of the United States of America and to the stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Uh item one on the agenda is the approval of tonight's agenda. If we've had all had a chance to look at it and approve the way it's designed as

Commissioner Davis moves that we approve tonight's agenda. [clears throat] This is Commissioner Mitchell. I second. I have a first and a second. All in favor? I uh item two is approval of the minutes from the November 19th, 2025 meeting. This is Commissioner Mitchell. I move that we uh approve the minutes from our previous meeting. Commissioner Davis seconds that motion. Have a first and a second. All in favor? I I.

Item three is a declaration of abstensions and conflicts. Does anyone have any tonight? Okay, since there is none, we'll move on. Um, before we start, if you guys have never been to a planning commission before, I know we'll have some public hearings and they'll be uh a chance to get up and voice your concerns to go on the record. Uh, we do have a bunch that have been submitted online. We've read those. They're in our packets. They're in the record as well. So, um, if you have submitted one in writing, we've read it. You're more than welcome to get up and let us and speak with something different. I mean, if we're just reiterating, we're going to be here for a while because we've already read the comments that that have come in to us. So, if we can do that with these uh public hearing portions of this [sighs] item 4 A Z-25-23 is a request to reszone approximately 13.61 acres located at the corner of Buista Boulevard and Turtle Rock Road from the [clears throat] current C3 and R16 zoning to a proposed PUDR zoning. The applicant is Bob Hermanson. [clears throat] And we'll turn this over to Elden. Out of memory.

Thank you, commissioners. This is a location we're looking at here, Tortoise Rock Road and Buenav Vista Boulevard. We'll pull up the site site plan here and dig in to the the details. The requested change is from the current zoning of C3 and R16 to a proposed PUDR zoning designation utilizing the multiple family development standards in the zoning regulations. Proposal includes 134 town home units. This is a 9.8 density unit per acre ratio. The surrounding zoning is C3 to the east, open space to the north and south, and R3 and R16 to the west. The applicant has situated the proposed project next to the C3 zoning in an effort to transition between the single family residential to the west and the future commercial to the east. As shown on the plan, the town home units themselves are not accessed from Tortoise Rock Road. The units are accessed internally from this subdivision within the subdivision and have been set back 25 ft from Tortoise Rock Road to allow a 10-foot trail and landscaping improvements to be done in this area. The trail will improve walkability from the residential areas to the commercial development. The town home units are twotory with a building height of 23 feet 3 in tall. We can pull up those building elevations.

The exterior finishes and incorporated landscaping plan is aesthetically pleasing. Each unit will have a twocar garage and a 20 foot long driveway. Required parking for the project is 344 parking spaces and the applicant is providing 364. Parking is adequate for the project. The proposed amenities include a pool and clubhouse, pickle ball courts, playground, and a recreation area for a total of 37,365 ft, which meets the required amenity area. Staff recommends the planning commission recommend approval of Z-25-23 on to city council based on the findings and conditions stated in staff report. and I'm happy to answer any follow-up questions you may have at this time. This come to us didn't this come to us not too long ago for a zone change to commercial?

I feel like it was in the last year or so. This we did not we we started with the general plan um and have been working towards the residential. It was the general plan because I remember this not too terribly long ago that this portion had come to us and but if we're changing it from a C3 or did we general plan change it to C3? I can't remember what we did. Do you guys remember any of that? Okay. to go back and look um on the the specifics of that. Okay, never mind.

Long term, we've we've got a lot of commercial coming to the east here. Um and wanted to create a buffer transition from the the single family detached into the commercial use there. Um and I I can't remember if it was uh slated commercial in this area or or whatnot. Um, but we've been working towards residential. I just wasn't sure when it was changed to a C3 zone. [clears throat] Your mic's not on.

And [clears throat] this one's not loading either. Elden, if I could just confirm looking at the diagram up there, you did mention that there it the development would not uh have any egress or ingress from Tortois Rock Road. Correct. I'm Am I correct in assuming that those are just gates? That'll be locked in the diagram. There [clears throat] are two access points into the subdivision from Tortoise Rock. Um that that comment was to reference no driveways will be accessed from Tortoise Rock. No driveways. Okay.

A question about the trail. Does that is that trail tying in to any of our other community trails? Yeah. Yes. The master plan trails uh just to the south off of Bueno Vista running east and also will continue north to the parkway there. Okay.

And plan shows trail through there. The developer, he's committed to bringing in two trails both on the the east and west side here. Um, and just really trying to make this a walkable community. And the traffic study remains yet to be done. Right. [clears throat] What's that? Mhm.

If you guys don't have any questions, I'll open this up for the public hearing portion for item 4 A. If anyone here would like to speak to this item, please come up and do so. State your name for the record. Please.

Yes. My name is Paul Amazon. I live in the adjacent community of Perry Landing and uh I think there's quite a few folks here from Perry Landing, but um I wanted to just touch on a few things. um when we all purchased our home that was scheduled to be R16 um that property. So we bought a you know we we knew eventually it' get built. Uh they did build behind me. Now they're building to the side of me. Um I did not receive your notice. I got that through a neighbor and I talked to Bonnie and she said, "Oh, well, you're supposed to be within 300 ft of this and my back of my property is right across um Taurus Rock Road." I mean, I can see it. But, uh, regardless, um, several of us here, I think, are concerned with traffic capacity. That's going to be, um, insane. I mean, if we kept the original plan of having single family detached homes that similar to our neighborhood, it would be a matching uh thing. It would, you know, it' be basically be an extension to our existing neighborhood. Um, another thing is is there's a great big billboard up on Buenav Vista that states water is running out. How we're going to furnish water to 134 town houses, which probably will be 90% rentals. I would I would assume I've seen it happen in other communities. I've been on an HOA before. I am the president of our HOA. Um we had a lot of uh people uh chime in on this and also um we had some

folks uh did a very brave thing yesterday and went door to door with the uh flyers on this to discuss this matter because we find it um I find it atrocious that we're going to slap in right directly behind and I've got friends my next door neighbor has got big windows. He's going to be looking at Stuckco wall two stories high right across the street. That's what they're going to stare at now. Right now I can see Zion from my kitchen. He can see Zion from his kitchen. We can see the mountains. We can see the Dino Cliffs. We can see Grapevine Trail. Uh that's going to be gone. It's a just a darn shame. The other thing is after the water sources, the sewage systems, I don't know if we're built for that. I know we don't our our infrastructure is not capable. They came in and to our neighborhood off of Ruby Place when they built this church. They brought they shut down the the road there. There's another two other accesses at the west end of our property, but that was with the one and only exit. And they shut it down for over two weeks while they came in and tore up the highway, tore up the road, came into our neighborhood, tapped into our sewer lines, and uh broke my water system as they did that to our green belt. Then I had to pay 1,500 bucks to have it fixed. Contractor didn't do that. We got into a big huge battle over it. Uh public safety, fire, police, EMS, we're we're lacking police officers already big time. I see criminals all over this place and it's getting worse by the day. Schools and parks, we don't have a park. We don't have a park that I can see.

There's one up on the hill that they disguise as a park. Uh it's actually the uh power grid for the 2100 homes that's on the other side of uh Washington Parkway. 2100s. That's 2,100 homes. And we're not talking little petty homes. The first build was $9 million. There's one going up there that's three times that size. There's another one that's probably a time and a half of that. There's some big, big, huge, very expensive homes there. We're going to have congestion from that. Where are we going to go shopping? How you going to go down to the Black Bear Diner and have a breakfast on on any given morning when we're packing in this many people? Now, I understand the person that bought that property, the developer and so forth, he has the right to build on it. But my only request is that if we're going to build homes there, let's just stick down and just extend our neighborhood in a similar manner. [clears throat] We have a very nice, quiet neighborhood, very good friends. Everybody's very tight-knit there. We pay attention to each other. We help each other. We got a lot of elderly folks. We don't need this riff raft and all when you start having all these rentals, we start having rift raft. We should have learned from a couple years ago when they built them low-income apartments down there off of Washington Parkway or runs in the Telegraph. Within the first 90 days, there was two shootings there. They've had several st um stabbings. They had Washington City um SWAT shoot a man through the third story um window within 90 days cuz it brings in riff raft. We don't need riff raft. I hope you all don't

have riff raft in your neighborhood. I sure don't want in mine. Uh, like I said about the short-term rental traffic, you know, that's what you're going to get. I don't know people have done it. They're they're going to go in there and they're going to buy them con them town houses. They're going to buy them up and then they're going to turn around and rent them. I'd probably say you're going to have anywhere between 85 and 90% rental. When you bring in renters, they don't give a crap about your property. You don't give a nothing about anybody else around it. And usually they're pretty young folks and I see them drive around here like maniacs. It's insane. And like I said, we don't have the public safety to defend ourselves. So that's what I have to say. I just really find it a shame and I hope you all take it into consideration of just sticking with what we have. Let's just build regular size homes. Continue on just like our neighborhood. Yes, you're going to have some commercial down at the other end. That's their prerogative, too. They're going to slap in two hotels down there. I think just those alone are going to bring in enough traffic and then we go slap in this. Not not feasible as far as I'm concerned. But thank you very much. I appreciate all your time.

Thank you.

[clears throat]

Hello, my name is Deborah Bobick. I also live in the Perry Landing development at 1158 Lisa Lane. I'm a resident that owns a home that backs up to Tortoise Rock Road. Um Paul covered a lot of what I was going to discuss tonight. Um is it [clears throat] appropriate I've not attended one of these meetings to ask a question for clarification? It's for your opinion. We'll try to answer the questions when we're done if we can.

Okay. All right. Um I think the largest concern for me is the traffic in our community. We have multiple families with many young children, a lot of elderly, and right now it's predominantly safe to walk for the children to ride their bikes. Um but there's a big concern because we don't really have any recreational space in our community. So they do use the open space. Ideally, we would love it to stay open space or for the council to consider some kind of green space, not just condominiums for all the reason or excuse me, town houses as um Paul stated. Um I think my biggest concern is if I understand and that's part of one of the questions, no traffic study has been done with regards to this. It's part of the condition. They'll have to meet and meet the traffic study before it can be approved before [clears throat] anything can be approved.

And is that in conjunction with the 21 2200 homes across the parkway and the hotel traffic? I'm I'm not sure how the traffic study works. I just know they have to have one done by

and another resident literally walked our neighborhood yesterday all afternoon. We spoke with at least 75% of of the community and everyone that we personally spoke to has major concerns about this development, their safety, the traffic that's already going through because the road is wide open between the parkway and Buen a Vista. It's like a freeway. They're going, I'd say, anywhere from 50 to 60 miles an hour down there sometimes. So many children walk and play down in that area and are headed walking dogs or whatever to the open space. The concern is you get this like they said the hotel traffic coming in these homes that aren't even built. I don't even know how you can rate that impact if they're not even done and we're considering this. It's just kind of becoming an urban jungle here. I agree with Paul. I would prefer it to be open space or a park space, something that all of these new homes and ourselves could enjoy. If that's not feasible, my opinion is, I agree with him, single homes that are compatible with the same density and type as what we have so that we're not dealing with this influx of people that are inconsistent. And it's my understanding that these homes don't appreciate the way our homes do. So we're most of us are going to be sacrificing some value which is going to hurt a lot cuz a lot of us bought when the market was a lot higher. We'd like that to be considered too in your decision making. Thank you for your time. Name's Dennis Vance. Um, currently [clears throat] I live uh just west of this project.

Um my concern um that I have is that um I've lived here about 10 years and um [clears throat] this area right here I've been aware of a lot of flooding going through this whole development here and that I guess that's why there's a big hole there on Arm Springs that um that collect a lot of that water that flooding water. So I would like to know what is being done to control, you know, that would control all the flooding. You know, it doesn't happen very often. The MIG retention pond right there at the end of it.

I'm sorry. Where it says extension storm drain, that's what's going to hold all the water that comes from this floods. So is the water going to go right down the streets? And they'll they'll they'll make it work. The engineers will do that. That's where it will run is into that. That's what that big detention pond is for. Okay. Can you show tell me what is north? What just can you North is going to be on the left side of this page. I'm sorry. North is going to be on the left side. So that that image is twisted a little bit. You'll see the detention basin there. Mhm. Yeah. That is on the south end of the project. So So south is on the right side of your screen. North is on the left side of your screen

and I'll I'll answer your question a little further. So So they're going to extend it. Let me answer your question just a little bit more and then you can ask me another one. So how are they going to address the flooding? Part of part of development is developers are required to install things that help the city manage storm waters.

So the development on the north side of the parkway is required to to build and install measures to help with storm storm waters. this developer will have to build curbs and gutters and help and and intakes and collection places. And so you are right that historically there have been washes that have that have collected storm waters and have flooded down through those areas. And so part of the solution is to actually install things and make development install them as they come. You had another question.

No, not another question. just um amen to the traffic um problem and all that and I'll just uh just leave it at that that um concerning our concerns about the traffic and um and the number of my concern is the number of homes that are going into that area. There's a lot of homes going into a very small area and that and that's going to um really add a lot um a lot to traffic and congestion and you know I'd like to see a time when there's not dust in the air. There's always construction going on somewhere. I just like to see sometimes there's no dust. So anyway, thank you.

Thank you. [clears throat]

I am Satie Stone and I just moved here from Haramman about a year ago and I moved into the Perry home area and so I I know what growth is because I lived up in Haramman where it was booming just a few years ago and I saw these higher places go in and the depreciation of our value in Haramman alone and the growth and I see it happening here which is sad because there's so much here and so much beauty. My concern is is the church that was put up behind me um in my backyard, which is great. I'm LDS, so I love having that church there. But if you notice the way it's coming in off of Washington Park Parkway and behind there, if you enter on the one side of the church, it's on a hill. So those people pulling out of that church, mark my words, there will be a death if not a crash there. And then also when you bring up the the tortoise road that will come up in between and they have two more exits, these possibly new community that will go right in there. They will be going on that road too and entering onto Washington Parkway. There is a hill right there. And if any of you ever have the opportunity to go out on that road and go by that church, check out what's going to happen. You're going to put that many homes right there to go on that hill. That is a blind hill. Possibly how many more deaths the road right there. And you know these people, these poor people that are going to pay, you know, 7 to$9 million for those beautiful homes going in. And I don't know about you, but if I spent $900 million on a home and you're looking down on a twostory area that will depreciate the value, especially especially if it becomes rental. And I've noticed down here that

this is a retirement community a lot like Park City. People buy homes and they do Airbnbs. They do all of that stuff. And it brings in a lot of other things. The ebikes of the kids getting out on their on the roads. You guys know about the bikes and all those deaths up in Heramman. We saw it left and right with the growth. My problem is is the traffic is too much in that confined little area. And I feel sorry for like myself who bought a home but was luckily enough to put enough into it to bring down you know the expense of my home but for these people that paid the high market values a long time ago. So, I am just stunned. And so, I am here tonight to represent our place. My views are gone. Okay. I got a dumpster in my backyard now. The church was rearranged after all to sit a different way. I said, "Well, I'd rather have a dumpster and a building in my backyard than headlights." And the noise already reflects off the church from the freeway. So, now I'm getting the noise. So you add that much noise to that area. You add the kids on the ebikes and you know they're not going to take the trails. They're going to be on the road and I can sit in my backyard and down Washington Parkway. There is more cars that race down that road at night and come over that blind hill. And I know the officers. I thought we had a lot because I see them everywhere. I wave at them. And um but that's my concern coming from up north in the Salt Lake area to Heramman, one of the quickest growth areas and watching it and that's why I left there. And so I'm saddened to see this. So um again, I hope you take all that into consideration and you look abroad and I love it down here. It's beautiful. The people are wonderful. Special Olympics is wonderful down here.

So that's my concern. And I do have two special ed daughters that do get out and walk that are visually impaired. So you add more around it that we try to get away from. So thank you. Thank you.

Thanks for giving us a voice. We appreciate it. Uh my name is David Lei and uh I do not live directly adjacent to this property. I live in the Brio uh next door across Main Street. Um my concern uh is that we're getting hit uh or we are being asked to absorb another um highdensity edition uh the one just east of Main Street uh that borders across to the Brio Brio to the west. Um the homes are already going in there. It's a high density uh area. Um and my concern with um as I say, we're getting hit with things. We have commercial coming in. We've got a new Windco. We have the potential for uh development of a strip mall along there. You'll probably hear from from people u pro and con on that. Uh we have the commercial that's already been talked about here. Um we have the development um uh north of uh Washington Parkway. Uh we're being asked to absorb a lot of things. My concern with high density uh use here is that we're not putting in and I apologize the number. I I've forgotten the number 134 units. What is the number of 134 units? It's not 134 individual homes. It's uh the analogy of the aspen trees. Uh they may look like individual trees, but they're all hooked together. They are going to rise and fall together. 10 years from now, we're creating uh a situation where they're all going to depreciate together,

especially if they're in a high use rental situation. Uh so it's not 134 units or whatever the number it is. It's one unit going in and mark my words 10 years from now we're putting in an instant slum today. And uh that's my concern. Um again thank you for listening. My name is Deborah Camp and I live uh in a sundusk off a sundusk in the perry landing and I did put some comments [clears throat] in so I'll keep this short but I've seen where a city council h can make a difference. You don't have to approve this and I've seen it happen several times. So, I appreciated all the people that came to let you know so that you could really feel the impact that this decision is going to have on our community and it will make a huge difference. And so, um, [clears throat] the traffic is huge. I don't know if you've had a chance to drive up and down Tortoise Road. It's not that big. And already we're seeing people cut through because they cut through from a church Washington Parkway down tortoise because it takes, you know, a triangle off of there. They're cutting through. They don't even live there. They don't they're not even there yet. 134 town homes aren't there. But we're getting traffic from Washington Parkway. And as Washington Parkway gets busier and busier, guess who's going to cut through Torres Parkway? You know, just the general public. So, um, we've got a great neighborhood, got great potential here for you to to recognize that we would love single family homes. We would

love um a park. I take my grandkids to Green Springs Park. That's the closest one clear over there. And and so I feel like you're in a position to really make a difference. And this development can go all over in the desert way over there, you know, building south, building east, but our little it's um it doesn't have any place to grow as much. So, this is very important that it's utilized in the best way. So, my question is the traffic study is not done. And so, I think you've heard that's our huge concern. So, if the traffic study's done before approval, will we have a chance to review the traffic study? Who who determines if if a traffic study makes meets the qualifications for its approval?

Engineers do. So, will we be notified of [clears throat] of it? Traffic studies are not subject to p the public vote. It's an engineering determination for a standard for traffic counts for road types and classifications. And so it's a it's a technical detail. So will it be available for us to because already we're feeling that the impact of that road being open. Will we uh have access to that when it's received? It's a record that you could request. Yeah.

Okay. So again, um we appreciate even though we were uh stressed that we just got, you know, one one or two days notice for this meeting, we appreciate being here because I know you can make a difference on this little community that doesn't have a lot of room to grow. Thanks,

[clears throat]

Good evening. My name is T. Thompson and um I reside here in Washington. I'm pretty new here. Um I uh lived in California for many many years and I've been here in Southern Utah for almost 15 years. And um one of the things that we used to see over time is I lived in a small community. We were end being this fastest growing community in the state of California for almost three years. And um our our planning commissioners were very similar to you guys. You know, we were a small community was farming and it was no big deal. Everybody knew your neighbors. You rode your horse down and everybody said hi at 4th of July. Um the city I'm referencing is Marina Valley, California. It's now one of the most violent cities in um in the country actually. Um it's right next to Washington County. One of the things I was looking at is um the crime rate here in um in our region is um um on a national average we are lower than national average but higher than normal. So for every 100,000 people we have 84 violent crimes and we have about um a little higher than that in um in property crimes. One of the problems that happened in Reno Valley was again I used to ride my horses all the way through the town and hitch the horse right before I you know walked into stater brothers was that we put in a lot of um affordable community homes and that's where we run into problem. It may not be in the first 10 years. It's typically after seven to 10 years. HOAs change hands. People don't become as responsible. The property is starts to decline. Nobody wants to come up with the funds. Or if you're like what happened in Cedar City. Um we just had somebody who was arrested and is now doing time for multi-million dollar theft of all the HOAs up there. I don't if you're familiar with that case, but um it's actually pretty pretty big deal up there. So many of our town homes up there no longer have the funds to keep up on their properties because it was um I think it was like $2 point something

million dollars stolen from the HOAs up there. Um that is primarily the big concern. I hear everybody with the traffic. I think that comes with a city growing. Um I definitely hear what is being said about the water. Um, and then the other question I have for you guys is, um, and hopefully you can respond to this, is if you approve this, what stipulation can you place, um, for ownership versus rentals?

So, this is the planning commission. Their decision tonight is to just make a recommendation to the city council. So, there will be no approval or or denial vote tonight on this issue, right? and the city council. So, this board doesn't place any stipulations on ownership or rental. Um, the city council doesn't either. Um, unless there's unless there's there is no law that says a city can can say you can only use your land for renting or you can only use it for owning. One of the property rights in the in this system of the United States law is to own land. Together with that property right is also the right to rent own that you land. And those are those are universal in the United States property and real estate um law. And so the city council doesn't do that either. Occasionally a developer will come to the city council and offer a stipulation of their own. Let's use one for example, we don't see these as much anymore, but there used to be 55 and olders. So this the developer come and say, "Hey, we want to make it so that it's only can be occupied by 55 and older." Well, even those who have had troubles with the law because that's also discriminatory. And so, so as far as stipulations as to how it can be used, the city can stipulate within the zoning designation so that it can't be used as a commercial or as an industrial. They the city will enforce its use as a residential property, but whether it's used residentially by a renter or an owner is not something the city regulates.

And I'm aware of that, but a lot of people are not. So, I appreciate you explaining that. You're welcome. So, um [clears throat] anyway, the other thing, too, is I think he has a um one of the gentlemen, our HOA president has a um point about the sewer. Um when we purchased our home, our our home had been sitting for a couple months and it actually stunk of sewer. It was part of the problem with the house. Um that had to be taken care of when we we first moved in. We had to run the water quite a bit um because there was a strong sewer issue once we purchased once we purchased the property down here. So, um, when do you guys plan on making a decision on this? Again, the planning commission doesn't make a decision tonight. They'll make a recommendation.

The city council is tasked with making a decision on this type of a change. That'll be on December 10th. Elden, will this one make it on the December 10th or will this be in January? Elden, December 10th. And by then, the traffic reports should already have been presented. I don't know. I'm not sure where the engineers are with that. They they have an engineer that can speak to us and give us better clarity on that. Okay. All right. I appreciate your time. Thank you. Thank you.

Good evening. My name is Candy Floquet and I live over in the Brio community. I just want you uh to hear how much of a hit we have taken over the last excuse [clears throat] me approximately five years. When we first moved here we didn't have the exit at Main Street. Obviously you have heard all about the more the developments that are coming in. One has not been mentioned is the one that's going to be at Brio Parkway and Buen a Vista which is also a medical center. So, I just need to to bring that up because we are concerned with obviously what's been brought up tonight about the traffic, but between, you know, uh, Salante and the town homes and then you bring in the Windco, there's going to be a whole strip mall down that vicinity as well. It's all going to move towards Washington Parkway. Along with that comes crime. And we talked to a police officer not too long ago that came out to our community. they're already understaffed tremendously. Now you throw in all these extra developments that aren't even fully housed yet. And so we're very concerned about that. So just if you could ple please keep all of that under the decision making or what you're going to be passing on to your city council, we would appreciate it. Thank you.

Thank you. My name is Abby Fielding. Um, I live on Camel Springs. Uh, the reason why my husband and I moved into this area almost three years ago was because as soon as we pulled up to this home that we were deciding on whether or not we were going to buy, there were unattended children right across the street playing outside. No parents were watching them. It was I just had a great a great feeling that this is probably where we needed to be. And another reason why is that my husband said, "We're moving here cuz there's a lot of great trails right there and nobody can build cuz that's protected." What happened to that? It's It's where Cente is now. That is that was not being built when we moved there and that was not supposed to be built from my understanding. Um, another thing that people have brought up is that obviously they do think that people are going to come in and just buy a whole bunch of those and make them rentals. Somebody in my ward had so many children that they needed to move out of their home and they sold it to somebody from out of town who bought three homes. Two so they could rent and one so they could just live in. This is it's not the first time this has happened. People are moving here and things are becoming rentals. I I really think that's exactly what's going to happen here. Somebody also brought up that the potential for riff raff. I I I'm kind of

I I feel like I everybody already knows the answers to all of the concerns here that statistically. I mean, what is going to happen if all of those things end up being town homes and people are going to buy and rent? Nobody. It's not It's not the same as if it was somebody just buying a home. Um, you said that this was going to be a high density uh project. Is that right? High density. Did somebody say that at the very beginning?

It's medium density.

Oh, medium density. Okay, that that's all that I have to say. Thank you. Hi, my name is Mick Foquet and I also live in Brio. Um, [clears throat] we came from California. I don't want to see California come here. I don't want [clears throat] to see the riversides, the Ontarios, everything that took place over there. Um, I also worked for the prisons when I was over there. So, I saw a lot of the elements that came from those communities. And that thing that impressed us, excuse [clears throat] me, impressed us most about Washington when we came here. We looked in several areas before we ever decided to come here. This had small hometown values. It made us feel good like we were part of something. We help out with the Lions Club and everything. So, we see the events that go on over here at the park and everything and we think every time it's there, it's like, wow, this has got hometown values. When you start bringing in more and more density like this, you're going to lose it. You're going to lose the [clears throat] identity of a beautiful community. Thank you. Okay. If there's no one else who would like to speak, we'll close the public hearing portion of this. Does the developer want [clears throat] to speak?

Bob Hearnson representing the project tonight. Appreciate you guys' time. Appreciate the discussion as well. Always good to hear from everybody around the project. uh made some notes just just kind of go through and the best I could and just kind of an order of operation from a hierarchy of just from a planning standpoint down through all the way through to the traffic and I'd just like to talk through those items and see if I can help clarify a few things. Um there was some discussion about the general plan if we start on the very top level. Um so we actually did that general plan amendment. Um you are right there was actually uh commercial and residential along that boundary. currently even on the zoning uh the current zone plan is that that boundary that we're talking about not all of it but probably twothirds of it is currently C3. So they could we could technically do C3 commercial which basically allows all commercial uses um to be constructed now. Um but in the general plan we went back through because it with the master plan there's a total of 100 acres in this master plan area all the way from here all the way to the east of the interchange and through that we wanted to b buffer it in a normal planning atmosphere meaning from the density of R16 which is what's existing to slightly higher density to slightly higher intensity in the commercial all the way up to the commercial use over there in the corner and we heard earlier about the hotels that were referred to that's another application that's in process as well um but but that's that is a generally a normal platinum am plat planning atmosphere to transition in those zones. And so we did that with the general plan. We took that commercial, pulled it off, put residential next to residential, so we didn't have this hard line in the sand with a bunch of larger commercial buildings right next to detached lots. And so that was very intentional, which we did probably a year ago. Um so from there um uh that kind of any questions about the the general plan and what what went on there? Okay. So that's why we did that. The next item was um

uh to be very clear, we are not proposing or asking for short-term rentals. That that is not never been part of the discussion. It's not what we're we're we're doing. These will be for sale units. Um, and it's in the open market, right? Whether people choose to live in them or rent them, they can long-term rent those as they see fit, as they can. Any any product in within the city, it's all the same. Um, but we are not looking for short-term rentals. And I know that the city watchdogs that for people that are conflicting with that, right, because we do have people that all over the county, right, that that aren't in that zone. And I know that all the cities watchdog that the best they can. And it it's just it's just the nature of the beast there. Um there was a comment about storm drain um storm drain infrastructure. That was a great point. Um we've noticed as well there's all there's some drainages that that run through the project all the way through that whole area. We will we will um add into the additional existing storm drain facility. Um more detention ponds and uh infrastruct storm drain pipes inlets in the streets um to get that into that infrastructure and underground just like we would any anywhere else. We also did, you know, way back in the day, um, we're talking 23 years ago. I don't want to date myself, but we've I finished Perry Homes and that the Perry landing, that whole project, it looked identical to this. There's no difference. It's all the same. Um, and so just like any other development. So, yeah, we put them in pipes and streets and put in the detention pond and it goes underground and makes its way to the river. Um, traffic study, we have not done a traffic study on the project. Typically, we wouldn't do that until the um to the next step um when once we graduate to the construction drawings. However, um these densities that we're referring to from the general plan, the city does a great job citywide to go through and look at their general plan and then size roads accordingly and through that master plan, which we in this case we have to rock rock, which is a current 66

foot rideaway, which is a larger it is meant to convey traffic. It is a larger road. It hasn't been built. So, it doesn't hasn't felt like that because only, you know, a little bit more than half of the roads been built. And so, [clears throat] it's felt smaller than it really is. And so, as these improvements come in, that road is already dedicated for us. Large scale road now, like not not with the development or not. Um, we have Bua Vista and Washington Parkway on both sides. Obviously, are very large scale roads as well. They are meant to contra uh convey traffic. they've been slow because the the roads fortunately were built ahead of time so that they could be designed and put in place so that we didn't get in a traffic problem in the future with more units. And so those items are in place. One other item I would like to bring up as well is that on the on the top of your screen there, which would be the east side of the project, there will be uh another 60 ft rideway that goes through the commercial area. We're anticipating uh so with this project, the intention is to build this portion of the road, which is about twothirds of it to get to Point of Vista to the north. Once that road's complete, we're anticipating that this traffic on Tortoise will be potentially backed off because they would come in through the rest of the uh it'll be diversified, right? However, there will be use throughout this whole area with more traffic as it all develops um all the way through here. So all of these road networks will eventually at some point per the master plan that the city has be be built as development comes in. Um in addition to that one other item, the last item I have is that we do have on all three sides of the boundary of the project. We do have uh uh two of which uh a master plan trail, a 10-ft trail, one on Bua Vista that's part of the master plan that will eventually connect all the way to uh the new park that that you guys built just recently um up there to access church rocks, which is fantastic, by the way. But this trail will continue up to there. This is just

one segment that will be built. My understanding is that it will probably connect to the south or to the further down towards WCO as well at some level. Um, in addition to that, just communitywise, not specifically for the town homes at all, but along that north side of the strength uh screen, we will also have another uh 10-ft trail because through this commercial full commercial area on uh adjacent to this, we will have a trail network as well. And so we did that in behalf of the master plan community and to help those things in the future. Just again planning ahead so that pedestrians can work their way through that and have plenty of elbow [clears throat] room to do that. And so, um, we just did that on our own and, uh, we [clears throat] just feel like that'll be a better better option for everybody. Um, those were the larger items. Was there anything that you guys would like to discuss or happy to ask answer any questions um, you may have?

Yeah, sure. Uh, Commissioner Davis, just a quick question and this is obviously everything's subject to change with respect to price point and everything else. Yep. But I would, you know, I believe part of the part of the approach here is first-time buyer, you know, affordable housing. Where from a price point are you guys if you got any any thoughts and

market driven, but we're we're anticipating these. So, these are all larger scale units in our opinion. They're all 1,800 square f feet, four bedroomedroom uh two and a half bath on the end units and then the exact same uh unit shape is inside but because of the access they're only three bedrooms. So they have a little great room up upstairs and so pricing wise we're anticipating between 420 and um 450 460 somewhere in that range. It's market driven. Yep. And then uh we feel like we've we've done a we really tried to anchor it with the trails, the pool. Um the clubhouse to be clear is not a full-blown clubhouse. It is a bathroom, showers, the minimum things, right? There's there's for a clubhouse of that scale, we it's not a full-blown space where you rent or utilize that space. Outside space, yes, but not inside the building. And then also we've added the top park for the smaller kids and then also the um uh pickle ball courts as well. And so we feel like we've we've tried to go really really uh high on the amenity side to really make it really nice. And then we've also um you know done the desert modern style and the architectural style to try to really brighten it up to to make it as current and nice as possible.

Yep. I have one other question. I actually really appreciate all that you did there to for the aesthetic and for the additional amenities. I think that makes a big difference in preserving the long-term value. You're not just throwing up stick, you know, town homes that are going to dilapidate and not age well. Um, so I I appreciate that and also the forethought for all the trails and the access. I think that was really great. So I I really appreciate that. Just out of curiosity, do you have a sense for if how how many um homes would be able to fit in that space if the zoning wasn't changed?

Well, it depends on which density. If you went with R16 and it's about 13. I mean we can we can just guess, right? But I mean generally you'd be probably a net of maybe 4 and a half. So let's see 14. So you'd probably be around 75ish. The shape's a little odd. Some you might get 80 maybe, but you're probably in that range. About 2/3 of Yeah, somewhere in there. Yeah, it's it's it we're we're totally spitballing right now, right? Just to be clear. And so, but but yeah, like somewhere in that that's what I would start with. Yeah. So, even if there zone wasn't changed, there'd still be that many homes still coming in and a lot of these same issues would be there even if the zoning wasn't changed.

Well, I would have to change the zone anyways because because um right now it's actually C3. So, I would have to go to commercial C3. Yeah, it's commercial now. Yeah. So, so, so in my my planning strategy here for the whole 100 acres is I'm trying to step down for the R16 and then just one little step little step little step up until the high intensity on the far [clears throat] at the interchange. We don't want C3 which is really intense possibly commercial right next to these folks homes right there which is a lot of what this could do if we don't reszone it. No, that's totally correct. Right now and that's what I was trying not to do. I was trying to buffer them and to transition it. Yep. Yeah. Thank you.

Thanks, Paul. All right. Thank you.

I was I was looking at that because twothirds of it's already C3 and it's right next to these guys like like big big commercial, not not neighborhood commercial, like big commercial. And the portion that that's R16 right now is pretty much the the amenities here. And then the one row of town homes, I mean, I I looked at that if If you kept that R16, it would you're only gaining about 10 11 units total on the whole project. I mean, so if they kept it as existing, you'd have maybe 10 less houses on this little portion. Then you'd have big huge commercial for the rest of it. So, I mean, this is this is for those of you that that don't understand, this is a much better alternative than what it's currently zoned at. Like, you guys would not like what it's currently zoned at if they build it out that way. This was I remember when they came in that's what I was asking about because this is how I thought it should be zoned this way rather than horizontally the other way. So, I like this I like this better this way because it does give the buffer to the east rather than from the south to the north and then the very lane would that like you said the south twothirds of that would have been commercial you know whatever whatever they decided to put there I mean hell [clears throat] Walmart can go there I think

yeah could and and and the houses on these are the same size as as the R16 houses the only difference is they're connected I mean but the house size are the same size as an R16 house, right? There's just no I mean space in between, but they've got more open space than they do in the R16. Yeah, there's more amenities and and I think that there's more put into the aesthetic on these homes. So, they really look like they'll

if they if they were to go all R16, that changes the price point from mid4s to to the sixes, five or sixes. And then and then we're pricing out our kids and everyone else for first time homes. So, I mean I it's a two-story home, but it's not that I mean they're not that tall. They're not that bad cuz R16 they can put twotory homes in. There's you know in C3 they can go up to 65 45. So they'd be even taller if we'd left it the way it is and change it to C3. So,

um, this is Commissioner Mutual 2, and I [clears throat] know we we've explained this before for people that come, you know, with the idea of of buying a home and thinking that, you know, everybody's property is going to remain the same for years to come. Unfortunately, that just doesn't happen. I mean, the development that you actually live in was once open space, right? So, and I think it's for for all of us to to remember in a growing community that we live, you know, people want to come here because it is a great community, but uh everybody has the right to to make changes to that property that they that they own and make make it possible for additional people to come and enjoy the same the same community that we enjoy. If you guys don't have any other questions,

are you talking about the fact that when I was in elementary school at Washington Elementary, we'd walk from the elementary school down to Main Street, go under the underpass where there was no traffic, past Perry Landing and everybody else for our desert.

Yeah, we uh went from Washington all the way to Sienna Hills on open space having BB gun wars. This is Commissioner. I just want to share one other thing. Um, I grew up here as well and I've lived in a home in near our home, a division uh um subdivision very similar to this came in and this was a while ago and I I spoke out against it because of all the reasons that you all have raised. You know, growth is difficult for all of us and we can't control the growth in a lot of ways. We can manage it the best we can and it's difficult and it's a balancing of interests of all these different parties. And one of the things that shifted for me as I've gotten more into it is learning about the need for accessible housing in our community for our kids and our and grandkids and others to be able to have entry point so that they can be owners and not just renters. And it's really hard. And so for me, you know, even after I spoke out about that, I've kind of softened on that. And now I look at this community coming in by mind with a little bit of a different feeling about it because I can see that at that lower price point, it's really creating more options. And really with the the type of town homes that are coming in here, they're likely to preserve their value a lot more than other sections of town homes that have come in the past. Um, and I also think that given the zoning that it's at right now, if it were to stay at that zoning, the options would be worse. You would have you you could potentially have a Walmart right there in in the current way it's zoned. So, we all have to like, you know, it's a balancing of everybody's interests. And

so I I just appreciate the way that the developer has actually put a lot of thought into the trails into the um you know amenities to create a space that will work well for people at a price point that is accessible. So I just wanted to share you know my perspective about that. I've been looking up a little bit of history to help us remember why there was commercial to some of those extents. And I and I believe it's the vestage remainders of the Zion Medical Village concept that was once proposed there where there would be a major medical center surrounded by medical offices and other medical commercial uses. And so I I I believe that the question as to why commercial went and all the way to Tortoise Rock is because that's what was planned in the Zion Medical Village. Um I don't know. I don't there's not a press release that tells us what happened with it, but essentially that's no longer planned at that location. And so part of what we're doing is reszoning for the proposed use that's that's there today. just so the so the audience can kind of have a little bit of perspective here. Just just a month ago, we had a project where someone was putting in a development and they wanted to put in R16 homes just like your homes. And the people all stood up and they said, "We don't want riff ruff like that to us." Now, I don't think that you guys are riff raff, but they said the exact same thing about your homes that you're saying about these homes. And the thing is is that there are lots of different homes that you have to have in a city. Nobody can live in the exact same homes and you have to have homes of different sizes, you know, different zoning and so forth to make a community work. I mean, these homes like here, I all my kids are are are married out of the house, and none of them can afford to buy a home, and they're all living in a town home just like this, and I don't consider them riffraff.

And you have to provide a means for your your own kids to be able to live in a community. Every single person that that came up and said that, you know, they just they moved here from from this place or that place or whatever. Every single person that has moved here has contributed to the growth whether you like it or not. I mean, the people that have lived here, you know, their whole lives and they're hoping that there's somewhere for their families to live. everyone else moving in has driven up the price of everything. And you have to do you have to diversify and do stuff like this so your own kids can have somewhere to live. So building something like this does not cause you know uh the riffraff or the dredges of society or all the other things that that some people had said. I mean people are people and some people are good and some people are are not as good. These are are well-built, you know, units and and and like we said, it's it's it's feathered really really well. So, it helped keep the the commercial further away from you guys. Like, that's done intentionally for your benefit. I mean, some of the questions that that people had asked about, you know, have we looked at at, you know, drainage and ST traffic and this and that. Just so you guys know, and you can see this if you if you look up on the the the documents for each of these things we look at, but every time we look at one of these and we do a recommendation, the thing that the city staff they present to us, I'm just reading right here. One is is does it conform with the city zoning? Yes or no? Like we have to make sure that conforms with the current laws. Two, are there are there utilities available that that can actually support this? You know, is there sewer that that will support the community? Is there power, water, etc. If there's if they don't have those things and then it doesn't get approved like they that's part of the findings right there that they they check first and foremost. Then there's conditions that says, you know, they can't do any development whatsoever

until there's a traffic study that's re that's submitted by an engineer and then it's reviewed by public works and they make sure that it meets city code and that that it works with the master transportation plan. There's drainage studies that engineers do to make sure that all the storm water and everything is taken care of. Um they have to do a geotech study to make sure that all the soil conditions and everything are met. Um another one it says that the elevations have to be built the way that they've shown us here rather than building who knows what. They have to provide a detailed landscape and irrigation plan for review to make sure that it meets city code. They have to make sure they follow the the building code, the fire code. Um they have to have a postmaintenance agreement. So people take care of the community and and and it's not just goes to pot. Uh they have to have lighting that's directed inward, not outward. They have to have signage that meets the city code. They have to have six foot block walls around the community to try and give some privacy. And they have to make sure their amenities are built at the first part of the project rather than at the very very end. And so if we recommend approval, those things are automatically already in the document that says these are things that they have to meet. every single one of these things before they ever can break ground. So, there's a lot of of of work that's already gone into this when they try to to make sure that they're having the the best possible impact on the community that can be had. So, hopefully that a few of your questions.

Thanks, Commissioner Henderson. Elden, do you want to put on the screen there that that medical village This is from the developers website. It's not a city record, but it'll show you what they had previously planned for and sought sought approvals for. I don't know how to make it big enough. There we go. So you'll see there in the the light blue is the parking around a major medical center. Um to the right of it, the red the red buildings are commercial buildings. So there have been commercial on the north and the east of the medical center. And to the left of the medical center is clinic and medical office buildings and parking lots. And then to the left of that is you'll see what look like some single family units and then a larger residential unit right there next to the detention basin. You will notice that there the city has planned roadways through that parcel that whatever development comes has to comply with. In other words, the city will only allow accesses on Bua Vista and the parkway at certain locations with certain distances apart. So this one this one has those. The current applicant is also being required to connect at those at those locations. Um the medical village one, you'll notice there were a lot more roads that that entered on and off of Tortoise Rock than is currently proposed. And so again, part of what we're doing tonight is changing some of the zoning that's been in place because of this proposal and and the progress it made along the way of its idea phase and approval phase. ultimately it was abandoned and didn't didn't come to fruition.

So actually so this commissioner Anderson to looking at this map then based on what they had here the little yellow squares those would be the R16 portion of this and there's 75 houses there smashed into that little bit as opposed to the plan that they're they're proposing right now in that same area. You got 36 town homes plus open space. So it's actually half the density of the residential right there as as what was planned quite a so it's actually a lot less than than what this is plus getting rid of all of the commercial yes

commissioner just for point of clarity basically what we're saying is that this is what could happen under the existing zoning and I think this is a lot I think this is a lot you know worse than if we change the zoning. The other realities of the city's long-term planning is Washington Parkway is Washington City's portion of what everybody calls it something different, but the northern beltway, the northern corridor, Washington City planned and rated and built that roadway as a the city's portion of a northern belt route that would move traffic at higher speeds and at higher quantities. And so the Parkway is not, even though it's been quiet and scenic and very beautiful up there, it it has been planned and rated to be a roadway that moves vehicles across the county. And and so the uses that the city has planned alongside of it reflect that concept as well. And so even though it's even today the Parkway dead ends at the at the desert preserve, um the county, St. George City, the other the other cities and and and agencies are are working very hard all the time to get approval to connect it to the road that Washington City built as its part of contribution to the northern beltway. The the part of that roadway in Washington City was not caught up in the desert preserve conflicts because it wasn't in those boundaries. But the city did exact and and require that development build that those portions as they came along the roadway. And so Sitla and developers would partner with the city to help get that installed and and present as we see it today.

Thanks guys. Let's get let's get a motion on this, please. This is Commissioner Anderson. I'll move to recommend approval of Z-25-23, a request to reszone approximately 13.61 acres located at the corner of Buenav Vista Boulevard and Tortois Rock Road from the current C3 and R16 zoning to a proposed PUDR zoning designation with the findings and conditions outlined by staff. This is Commissioner Mitchell. I second. I have it first by Commissioner Anderson, a second by Commissioner Mitchell. Individual voting. Commissioner Davis, I. Commissioner Anderson, I. Commissioner Mitchell, I. Commissioner Tupo, I.

I'm Commissioner Bulock. I'm an I as well. Well, this will go to city council on December 10th with the recommendation of approval from us. The next item 4B G-25-05, a request to amend the general planned land use map from low density to the proposed neighborhood commercial located at 400 West of Merill Road. Applicant is Strata Homes. And we will turn this over to Elden. The entire parcel here covers approximately 14.05 05 acres. And as shown in the exhibit, the applicant is proposing to change approximately 11.77 acres from low density residential to neighborhood commercial. The remaining 2.28 acres is proposed to stay lowdensity residential. Just to make a comment there, you can see Leaf Lane continues north. This area is proposed to stay low density. Um the the project engineer has made their intentions known that that road would continue east over to 240 west and there would be no interconnectivity between this residential unit and and that proposed commercial project. The surrounding general plan land use designations are low density to the norththeast south and St. George city boundary being directly to the west which is being developed as commercial development. Staff has reviewed the requested change and is comfortable with the proposal. Staff recommends the planning commission recommend approval of G-25-05

onto the city council as outlined above and as shown in the exhibit. That concludes staff report. Um, happy to answer any questions you may have at this time. What is the neighborhood commercial? What what what what's the type of stuff that can go in there? So if if we turn to our city [clears throat] uh ordinance 9-9-1 um is the administrative and professional zone would be an allowed use in the neighborhood commercial along with the C1 use uh which is the the lightest commercial use that you can have. Uh the purpose for the administrative and professional zone is to provide appropriate locations for professional offices uh banking and other financial institutions, general research um [clears throat] and and uh executive office space. Turning to the C1 uses U as found in 9-10A-1 is to provide appropriate locations uh for community retail and service activities. uh intended to conveniently serve area residences and uses in this realm involve restaurants, retail operations of cleaning, laundry, cosmetic and repair services, retail sales and/or rental of goods, merchandise and equipment conducted wholly within an enclosed building and also um the uses included

in the AP area. Two recent projects that uh have been developed under the ENCOM are just to the west on the corner of Merrill and Sandia, that three-story office building that has a general plan of ENCOM. And then also looking southeast to Hayfield Drive, um the development called the Junction, also on the corner. That's a neighborhood commercial project. So this would fall somewhere in line with with those two developments.

So the distinctions between C1 C2 neighborhood commercial are less about for example size. You'll notice the the three-story office building. So the so the the levels of stories is not so much a regulation but the natures of uses, the sounds, the the smells, the the the uh fumes, those are essentially the lines that our city code tries to draw between the various categories of uses. And so a lot of the retail/commercial spaces that we visit throughout our, you know, our month, many of those would fit within a neighborhood commercial category. you're not going to get buildings. So, your big box needs a little dip.

But, but any of your smaller places that you'll go for for shopping or or food or or you know, pharmaceutical type stuff would fall within that category. My my I mean my only concern is it's backing up to that. There is no feathering on this one. We go from low density to neighborhood commercial. That's my only my only issue with this is that it puts that right next to the low density. Not I mean obviously not knowing what's going in there. So, one of the reasons why this one came about was as as it was learned what St. George City's permitting to the west, full commercial places like a bowling center and fat cats and different type of and and so the the question was in light of what'll be to the west of it, are we also just requiring low density next to commercial? And so there was there was some discussion and analysis of what's what's perhaps the better planning concept if we're trying to look at what our neighbors also planning right next door. If if it come in as a PUDC instead of neighborhood commercial, we'd have more say to keep it a neighborhood commercial. But like do something close to those existing homes or the lots. Correct. I mean if it was PUDC I just want to reiterate this is you know general plan here. Alo very very high level thinking um this this neighborhood commercial um

could include PUDC but help help refine the process as to as a step off. Okay. Yeah, it's a general plan. Sorry, that was I was step off a step ahead like you always are. Sorry. Sorry. Yeah, that I was that's what I was worried about. Okay,

this is Commissioner [clears throat] Year. I just have a question. You know, one of the public comments that was shared asked that the um the strip of it that is still for housing be extended all the way down. You know, it's sort of like just that corner that is remaining um residential. They made the point and you know, as I was driving down there and looking at it, it did seem like that would make sense. to create more of a buffer, you know, depending on what kind of housing is put in there. Um, between those those are big homes just I mean a stones throw right from this line. It's like a pretty stark difference. And so I was wondering, you know, in your conversations with the sponsor, was there any conversation about that extending that strip all the way down to it's there's no road there right now, but I don't know what it be called. Do you do you understand my question?

Yeah, those are great comments. I I I think that's a great comment for the applicant to touch on. I'm sorry, Elen. What was your response to that? I didn't quite get it. We'll let the engineer uh the let the answer that discuss that. I just didn't want to put words in in their mouth. So, this is a public hearing and we'll open this up to the public if anyone would like to speak to this.

Good evening, commissioners and staff. And I want to say thank you to Bonnie and Elden for their um their help as always. Um my name is Derek Hoffman. Uh my family is the owner of Oakrove Meadows Lot One, which on the screen is just south of that open space just um along Leaf Lane and Aurela Drive at the corner there. Uh Washington City is a beautiful place. Uh great people, great energy. There's a reason why people are coming here. It's a reason why we've chosen to make it our home as well. So, I appreciate some of the things I've heard this evening about, you know, the importance of growth and managing growth and and making it workable for everyone. [snorts] Uh, my family was here earlier. You might have seen them step out. They had to get to basketball practices this evening. Um, I did send a letter to you this uh today. I think I see heads nodding. So, I and I heard some comments would suggest to me that you did read it. I appreciate that. Thank you for your attention uh to some of those details there. Just to echo a few points there and highlight a few things. Um when we when we bought our lot, we we thought we'd have a beautiful Strata Homes development. They build beautiful homes. Um we were excited about that. Um we understand that, you know, things can change. Um and so if if the commission is going to continue to recommend approval, then I would ask that you consider um some of the balancing of interest that you mentioned earlier, which is really what my letter is about. Um, and the first thing we'd ask is that you consider extending to the west that uh retain what I call the retained low district area. We appreciate the developer obviously gave some thought to this by retaining some of that area as low density. We appreciate that. That's that's acknowledged. But if it could extend a little further to the west, perhaps to align with at least that open space in our neighborhood where that catch basin is, that would create a more consistent view corridor, particularly for my lot, which is right on the corner across the street. Um, second, and I did depict that on

exhibit 8 of my letter. The second item, and this is especially important to us, is that we want to, you know, preserve the safety of the streets. And like everybody does, right? We all want to have our kids be able to go out and ride their bikes and and be safe outside. We'd like to make sure that Leaf Lane does not become a through street to the commercial zone. Um, Leaf Lane, of course, as you see it on the screen, runs north and south. Um, we don't have site design yet. We don't know. My I just don't know. So, I'm just asking that you please ensure going forward that Leaf Lane doesn't become an interconnector to the commercial area both for pedestrian traffic or vehicle traffic. I think I heard a comment earlier about the road maybe turning and banking up to 240 West Alen. Maybe I heard you make a comment there. But um I personally would prefer to see a cold sack or a terminus of Leaf Lane. I think that would really help preserve and kind of insulate this neighborhood, the Oakrove Meadows neighborhood from that commercial, you know, higher density area. Um the comment earlier about these nice big homes that are being built and I hope to be one of them uh will abut this very more intense commercial area at the stark contrast is notable. So again leaf lane terminus culac that would be ideal. And then the last uh point I'll make is um just as you're going forward we know this is a general plan amendment. It's not a zone change yet. It's not a site design yet. But as you go forward with the project, please consider ways to minimize lights, uh, noise and, uh, view impacts on that corridor. Um, please keep it in mind. Um, I know earlier comments were made about, um, there are lots of restrictions that apply within each code, with within each zone. It's naturally part of the code. So, we know that you'll you'll consider those things, but again, please don't block our views too much and and please find ways to minimize the light and the noise. Um, I do have a few letters from neighbors that were I don't we just had our first neighborhood meeting last night. So, we're just getting to know

each other. Um, I'll leave the letters from our neighbors here with with Elden. Um, I've got three letters from neighbors in the neighborhood. And there were a couple others who asked me to just convey to you that though they didn't sign the letter because they didn't have time, they do share the views that I'm expressing to you this evening. So, you have those as well. Um, I'll close by just saying again, thank you for your for your work. I know that this is not an easy job that you do. Um you're managing a lot of growth. We just ask that you balance the interests uh for this particular project. Um and if you would, I would ask you to consider conditioning the approval to accommodate those items that I discussed this evening, which would be extend the low density to the west. Number two, ensure Leaf Lane does not become a terminus or does not become a through street and might instead be a terminus. And number three, of course, going forward that you um minimize impacts on the Oak Road Meadows neighborhood. Thank you for your time. Appreciate it.

Thank you. Is there anyone here else would like to speak to this? Okay, I'll close the public hearing portion of this. Um, is the developer here? I'm sorry. Did you want to speak to this? you looked like he wanted to get up and Oh, okay.

He's a troublemaker. So, uh Bob Hermanson again here with you. Appreciate your time and all the comments. Um so, just a a little different situation than the previous item. Um and Elden just to start off, Elden went through that and and depictked that. Well, we were we attended a city council work meeting that, you know, looked at some potential areas that could be some future commercial areas. This was one of them. And so that's what kind of uh drove us to what you're seeing this application that came right from that work meeting which was about I don't know six weeks ago or something something like that. Um, in this specific case, the reason that the yellow is the shape that it is, that seemed to be the most prominent comment is, uh, we were trying to have consistent lot sizes with the existing subdivision to the south and not have a dramatic residential change in in sizing and and feathering like I I explained explained uh, on the previous item because there just really isn't enough room to do that in in this scenario. And so what we did is we thought we would be better off to have um roughly we have about five lots that are basically the same size as the subdivision to the south to just stay the same consistency rather than dropping in R16 lots or something like that. Then you'd have like eight R16. We felt like that was really out of place next to these really nice larger homes that are clearly a step above, you know, that. And so just being consistent with the size that it was and then connecting um the road through. Now our intent would would is definitely not to connect uh the city is obviously would this is we're talking about a future conversation right and a future application but we would fully agree that we would not want this road to continue through the commercial area. I think that would be a complete conflict of intensity of use, but we would be considering going up doing a knuckle and immediately turning right and going to 240 just as

another access point just given the shape of the parcel. Otherwise, you couldn't physically it'd be difficult to get to all the property. Um, and so that's that's the thought process. In addition to that, the reason that um that I didn't push that west boundary that we were talking about further over is because the intent was to keep the lot sizes consistent with what's to the south. And right now, that line is depicting in our application, consistency with what's to the south. If we bump that over another probably 75 or 80 ft, those lots will now be generally almost double the size of the ones to the south. And there will be only two oddball lots like that. And so um and now you've got a you know two larger potentially not halfacre lots but probably really close um that are now abuing commercial. So now I end up with another conflict there with another product type that's that's even more odd. And so um there was strategy to the drawing of the simple line and why it's there was try to maintain consistency with the south adjoining subdivision. Um, all of the points that were brought up are great. They all make sense, but the next step of the thought process is that on the design side is that that's how I re I ended up at this position in this application was those other items. Um, did I miss anything? Is there any other items you'd like to discuss or ask me? I'm good. I don't have any for you guys.

I do. They're probably dumb, but let me ask a couple questions. Those, you know, six lots or one, two, three. Yeah, six lots west of the storm basin. West of the storm. Yes. Smaller, right, than the ones across the street and in the neighborhood. So, just to be clear, sorry. Yeah. Which one are you referring to? Everything else up on the other side of Ora. No, on the uh to the east. East. Yeah. East. No, east. Just like Sorry.

Directly south of them. Those Yes, those right there. Those those are bigger, right? Than these are similar in size. They're slightly bigger. These are these are larger. Yeah, when I drove by those seemed quite a bit bigger and I wondered about the reason I'm asking is I just wondered about doing another row of that size above that to buffer all the way down and have a long yeah a long row of that size right there. So a couple is access. [clears throat] I see.

I see. Any other options on one side of it doesn't work very well. Bob, can you speak in the microphone? Sorry. I need a mouse over here. Sorry. And a pointer. What we need is [clears throat] a mic on the monitor. Yeah. What's that? Yeah.

Mic on the monitor over there. And so by coincidence that road as we as we go to the north into that knuckle and then turn to the right or east is that um those two lots face the other two directions east and west. And so that's a sideyard. So we're not double fronting, right? We're just it's a sideyard. So so it feels like a normal block end, right? And that's just [clears throat] luck. That's just the way that works out. And so those were the reasons that we didn't do those other things. Um which we explored to be clear. We we probably have I don't know six or seven layouts of this trying to sort through this and and this was the happy medium of all of those things. Yeah.

And then just one other question. What are your thoughts about this? Commissioner, if I may, just to add to that, the land to the left or to the west is some of that old church farmland that both cities thought that they would annex at one point and, you know, a few decades have gone by and the municipal line is right there. And and Washington City has tried to accomplish agreement on where roads would connect in those areas. And you'll see on the drawing there's already, you know, the success is probably varied, but you'll see right there, uh, there's not connecting roads. And and so part of the challenge with that little blue blue colored road is even if the city mandated it to the west, it doesn't have anywhere to go because the neighbor neighboring landowner and the neighboring city aren't planning a road to connect there.

That's actually really helpful. I wondered what was going on over there. Yeah, there's there's going to be big box big lot type commercial there and so they don't want a road to spill out at that location. Even if we mandated it and did another row of housing, um it's it's essentially a dead end deadend type road because of the municipal boundary problem and the just lining of roads between the two that didn't work very good at that location. Actually really helpful. Thank you. And then what were your thoughts about moving that line just a little to the left? I I think you were mentioning that it would increase the size of those other lots too much.

Well, it ends up being th those lots would be substantially bigger than any of the lots to the south by far. And so so it would essentially increase the size of um without walking back over there. So the the lots that are directly adjacent to us, those first six, yeah, that's currently the size of those. There's five lots that we have planned in there that are generally the same. There's five or six. I think there's only five.

Okay. Um, and if we add that extra space, and you can see the distance from the road to where the red line goes north and south, goes vertical right there. You can see that that's the width we're talking about. And then, and if you notice to the edge of that that um detention pond, it's more than that distance. So, you would double the depth of the lots. So, the the thought is is that now you have an inconsistency between even a larger lot and commercial. So there our our transition is really only there the way that it is presented to be consistent with what's already existing to the south. And you couldn't sneak one more in and then dilute them all a little bit. No, because we don't have road frontage because my road turned. That's what I Yeah. Okay. Thanks.

Yeah, commissioner. I'm looking here. All the lots that exist, they're all about 6 plus or minus acres um to the south existing right there. And if you if you take the spot above the above that retention basin, it's about the same as is. If you make it bigger, it's going to be over an acre. It Yeah, I don't know the exact number, but they're very large. They're looking every lot right here.

Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Um, not to not to say to be clear though that um, in the actual design process with the with the the zone change and we work our way through that that we can't squeak that line over as far as it reasonably makes makes sense. I think we're totally up for that. No question. I'm just I'm just hesitant to commit to the entire section because I think it would create two really odd lots because I don't have the frontage to do a third lot. Mhm. But um when we come back through if they if we can move that whatever 10, 15, 20 feet, you know what I mean? To help that out and preserve some of that. For sure. Yeah, that makes perfect sense. No question. So that's a future.

Yeah. Yeah. With a future application. But uh I try to vet it out the best that I can and then guess what everybody's going to think and got [clears throat] to go through the process. Thanks. Thanks, Bob. Elder, are you able to scroll down on that map? Um, just to show the other annexation portion of the land where this where the cities are kind of working on road. That's just an image, isn't it? Okay. You're not able to. That's all right. It was just an ancillary discussion. Unless you could you show your other screen, the map that you've got on your other screen. There we go. [cough] [clears throat]

So, a little farther to the south is another municipal boundary line. If you can pan to the south there, you'll see that really nice green field. And then to the right, Washington City has built out and entitled homes to the right. And again, they're big, beautiful lots with with roads that actually stub right to the edge. Are you able to zoom into that a little bit, Elden? You'll see that. And and one of the challenges we've had is the neighboring land owner as well as the city don't view those as roads that they are planning to connect into. And it's really a difficult thing because if you look at how those roads feed out, there's not a lot of egress roads to that as well, right? And so that's one where the our elected folks and and different city representatives have spent a lot of time trying to get a discussion and get some agreement on helping there be connectivity even though there's a municipal boundary. And so I'm not I'm just sharing that so you see that there's more than just one area in this area of our city where where the municipal boundary is also creating planning hurdles that we're trying to advocate for the Washington city's viewpoint but also trying to just make sure we connect. That's also one where the the feathering concepts are in great peril because the neighbor is not very interested in feathering homes of that size on the on the St. towards city side.

This Commissioner Anderson,

two parts. One to uh Mr. Hoffman. I one thing I would just hopefully he answered your question about about the road through there um that he they wouldn't ever connect through to through the commercial. So hopefully that kind of answers your question, but it's also this is not the stage in the game where we would put conditions on that sort of thing anyways. That would be in the future, but it wouldn't be in their interest anyways to run that road through the commercial. But if if it were ever to be something in condition, it'd be at a later stage in the game. But and my my only statement to you, Bob, is just I would just make sure that lot whatever however far back it because it's going to be really really wide and so the square footage is going to be big, but I would just make sure it's deep enough that you can actually fit a house on and not really wide and short. That's all.

And you're just to be clear, you're referring to the one right adjacent to the detention pond. Yeah, that's all because it's going to be super wide and so that makes your square footage really big. But I would just make sure as a builder, just make sure it's deep enough you can actually fit a house on. That's all. Yeah, that's a great point. And and so we'll vet that out and uh luckily, you know, Strat Homes does a great job and they build really nice houses in there. So, we'll make sure that they do a fitment in there for the house. It's fine. Yeah, good call. Yeah, make I just seen a lot of lots where it's like, well, it's really a lot of square footage, so let's shrink it down. And then you get there and you're like, I can't fit in on there. You can't get there. Yeah. So, it's silly. It's too deep and not wide enough. Yeah.

Okay, great. Thank you. This is also one. We've got a city council member who's assigned a committee assignment to be here. He's he's observing and then all of this is recorded on YouTube and I know our our city council members watch that. You're also welcome to attend their meeting and also ask if you can speak with them at that meeting. This is Commissioner Davis Elden. a question and kind of flipping it a little bit here and going to what would be potentially the frontage for the ret for the commercial along Mel Road. And this may be a a question for John just kind of what the timing is and the expansion and would the applicant ultimately be responsible for finishing that off. And so

yeah, they would when it when it comes to that point, they'll have to

So our our requirement is certainly within their boundaries that they do all of what we call the developer improvements, which are usually things like curb, gutter, sidewalk, and any other landscaping exactions. And so that would include driveways and entryways and such all along there. As you know, to the east there's another farm field and and The hard part of growing in farming areas is you might have a much narrower and rougher road until that one comes. And so we wouldn't be able to exact that that portion of the roadway from them. But yeah, everything within the boundaries of their property we would require come in with developments just here.

Yeah, this is Commissioner Anderson. Another thing I just just as a matter of point, I don't particularly like spot changes to the general plan. I never have. Um, and this is a particular area we as a planning commission have met with city council more than once about this whole road through Marrow Road, how it it will likely eventually all become neighborhood commercial through there or a decent chunk of it. And I I still think that it's so for you Brett to take better city guns. I still think that rather than doing a little bit here and a little bit there where it just becomes patchwork, it's going to be a lot cleaner and a lot less upsetting for for people that buy and build homes in there if it's more clear as to what that's going to be. Like I I think that whole corridor through there should be general plan with discussion with city council and kind of figure that out. So that way in the future people already know what what they're getting rather than I always get heartburn over little spot, you know, general amendment things here. I mean, because it's it's different than asking for a zone change where you've already got, you know, certain entitlements in the land and stuff. This is, you know, this is different. So,

I think it's a good idea because I think this is what it all will eventually go to. I just think it'd be better if city council would general plan that whole area and clean it up. So,

if you look at the image on the screen right now, you'll see those eight culde-sacs that aren't related to this project, but there's a reason why those happened, when they happened, how they happened, and that was related to unannexed land, right? The city didn't have a there was nowhere for those roads to connect to. And so, in today's climate, the city would not favor eight publicly owned culde-sacs of that nature, right? they would they would they would need to be fewer that would connect and cross at planned intersection points. And so those are really nice neighborhoods. The people that live there love it and and it happened because of the the atmosphere in which that neighborhood was planned at the time it was planned. But today today the and the planning concept concepts that we have, we want connectivity. We want roads that are public to be moving traffic in in in directions that are meaningful to get out to other traffic moving areas. And so, um, we learn as we go and I I imagine in 20 years we'll look back and think, what were they doing in 2025 because we'll have learned things then, too. But, but yeah, it's it's tough to grow into farming areas. There's there's issues that are just hurdles that are impossible to to to avoid. If you guys don't have any other questions or comments, let's look for a motion on this. Commissioner Davis, I'll make a motion for approval of G25-05 uh to be forwarded on to city council the request to amend the general plan land use map from low density on the proposed NCO located at 400 West Merrell Road.

Commissioner Tupo, I second that. I have first from Commissioner Davis, the second one from Commissioner Tupo. Individual voting. Commissioner Davis. I. Commissioner Anderson. Commissioner Mitchell. I. Commissioner Tupo. I. Commissioner Bulock. I'm an I as well. This will go to city council with the recommendation for approval. Item 4 C. Uh, who is this? Oh, Sebastian. It doesn't say nothing. It just says 4C on here. [clears throat] No, it gives me nothing. It's just in 2022 state bill 110.

We got more for you than just nothing. Yeah, go ahead. Thank you, [clears throat] commissioners. Uh this will be just a very brief introduction in the uh water element which is required. So, in a 2022, state bill 110 was enacted, which requires municipalities in Utah. Can you can you move that mic up to you a little bit more?

Which in 2022, state bill 110 was enacted, which requires municipalities in Utah to incorporate a water use and preservation element by the end of this year in the general plan. As staff and I work through this process, we actually learned that our city is leading the way in water conservation as we recently adopted the joint regional water conservation plan. Uh, additionally, we have a proactive landscaping and water conservation ordinance along with advanced metering infrastructure or AMI. Um, AMI essentially is like a digital device which uh digitally tracks water usage and then relays the information back to the economy database which the city operates. Those are just a few examples and the uh the water use and preservation element is broken into six sections and includes the following listed on the staff report. I'm happy to answer any questions you have and that's that's my introduction. [clears throat] I might add just a little to Sebastian's introduction. The way the Utah law on zoning works is cities which are political subdivisions of the state which is most of them some of the earliest oldest cities that it incorporated prior to the Utah Constitution are technically not political subdivisions. They're they're essentially agencies in parallel to the state. But Washington City is a political subdivision and which means a lot of what we do is at the blessing of the legislature and so the legislature has a land use law that says that cities may enact zoning on the condition that they have a general plan. So the main reason why we do a general plan is so we can meet the state's requirements so we can have zoning and try and plan our cities with some local some local preference. Well, you know, 50 years after the state

adopted that law, one of the ways that they're still trying to kind of regulate us is by requiring by state law things that must go into our general plan. And so that's what the state bill is that Sebastian references is as the state has prioritized water planning and conservation planning, they've added a law that says cities must in their general plan, which again, which originally we had to do so we could have zone zone districts, is making us now add conservation elements to it. And so I'm not saying that to say that I disagree with it. I I do think that probably a statewide requirement for conservation makes a lot of sense in our region, but but it is interesting in how our relationship and the state relationship es and flows if we don't do this. One of the threats they made to our departments is that they might, you know, essentially tell us that we have to stop stop imposing our zoning requirements, right? And so so we're interested in our leaders are interested in complying with with this mandate from the state. And so that's why Sebastian's here tonight.

What What do we do with this? I'm I'm I'm Yeah, I believe the the purpose presentation okay because I've reviewed it for example and this is this is new language proposed to be added to our general plan to comply with the state law you're asking us to make a recommendation okay I was I I was confused by hoping you have recommended approval sheet in front of me because we'd like to keep our zoning districts well here's a question so we we already put this stuff in the city code as code. You're just saying we're adding it to the general plan. It's already in the code. You told them that and they said, "Yeah, but it needs to be in your general plan, too." Oh. So, it's just

fundamentally an outline. Okay. We're already doing it. We just need to say it's in our general plan. They need it in the right place. Yeah. Yeah. I found the wording. I'll pull it up on the screen and include this wording in your motion here. Um this item 4 C want to recommend on to city council there the water use and preservation element is what we're adding to the general plan. All right motion. Yeah.

This is Commissioner Mitchell. I make a motion that we we this is going to city council or we're approving it. recommend approval to the city council for item U-25-06 adding the water use and preservation element to our general plan. Uh the second the motion. I have first from Commissioner Mitchell, second from Commissioner Davis. Individual voting. Commissioner Tupo. I. Commissioner Mitchell I. Commissioner Anderson. I Commissioner Davis. I'm Commissioner Bulock. I'm an I as well. Item five, we'll look for an adjournment. I move to adjourn. I second. I'm first and second. All in favor?

I I meeting is adjourned.

for December 3rd, 2025. We'll start with the approval of the agenda. So, I make a motion to approve the agenda. [clears throat] Richard Davis second. I have first and second. All in favor? I. Item two is approval of the minutes from November 19th, 2025. This is Commissioner Mitchell. I move that we approve the minutes from our previous meeting, November 19th. Commissioner Tupo, I second that. I have a first and second. All in favor? I. Item three is adjournment. Commissioner Davis, make a motion to adjurnn. I second. I have a first and second. All in favor? I I. Meeting is adjourned.