Council Meetings - Regular Meeting

live here and and two on their way. So, council, uh you have the agenda in front of you. I uh am going to welcome everyone to our workshop meeting. Today is Wednesday, November 12th, 2025. We are in the council chambers of Washington City Hall for a workshop meeting. This is a meeting where uh we we do not take formal action but we take information and we give direction. Uh we have a hard stop at 5:30 on this meeting. All of our meetings just for those in attendance are streamed live on our website washington.org/meings. They're also archived there. So, if you ever want to go back and look at an agenda or look at a an item that you may have missed, you're you can always um easily find that and click on it and it will show you the actual video um of that section of the meeting. Council, at this time, uh I'll turn to you for a motion uh to approve the agenda as outlined.

So, move. Mayor, I have a motion by Councilman Henderson. Second. Second by Councilman Ivy. All in favor? I.

Any opposed? The agenda is approved unanimously. We have two items on our agenda tonight. The first is an update on the Washington Dome project. The second is a CND landfill update. Uh neither of those are um advertised as uh for open public comment, but we hope that being able to listen as we've been listening to um to you, you'll be able to get a lot of your answers uh a lot of the answers that you're seeking. So to start off here, I am looking for Paul Walker, assistant leisure services director, if you'd come forward and uh and give us an update on Washington Dome. We're excited to look at the progress the committee's been made and and um answer the questions that the council has.

Okay. Thank you. Um Elden, if you could let me get on here. I've got a quick presentation. Um as some of you know, we've been working on this um project for for a while now. We um were awarded a grant from the Utah Division of Outdoor Recreation. They give us a grant of $150,000 to um study Washington Dome and um kind of figure out the best uses for that that land and what what to do with that. Um we've been working with Avenue Consultants on that. Um this is kind of the the schedule. Um we've been meeting with the committee um with a lot of involved parties such as the BLM and city staff and um we've had some really productive meetings. Um we've been doing some outreach. We've met with a lot of um groups, user groups and community groups um that are interested in this. Um so this is just a quick update. The project will wrap up at the end of the year and avenue consultant they'll come give a an in-depth report on the the final report of the Washington Dome project. Um just a history, we'll run through this really quickly. This is the existing trails on Washington Dome. Um, this was just pulled off the All Trails app. This is what people are using right now hiking on on the the Washington Dome. Um, some of those trails are nice trails, some of them aren't as nice or steeper or not not optimal trails. So, um, we kind of the consultants tried to connect some of those, make some some better trails. um looked at talked with some user groups and preliminary got some got some trail ideas. Um as part of the meetings we've had and other meetings um we got feedback from

stakeholders um including the BLM as I mentioned and city staff. Um and then we went over the maps and and decided what's good on the maps, what do we want to keep, um what what would be nice to have. Um, it was really good to get feedback from the BLM. And Paul, can you just clarify? The BLM was part of that committee. They've been at those meetings.

Yeah, the BLM is part of the steering committee. They're at uh regular meetings for this. Um, and they had really good input. They said just um pick the best trails you think you want and then um apply and and and we'll we'll sort it out. They've helped us with um some kind of environmental things, what we need to apply for and what we need to look out for in the Washington Dome in the Washington Dome area. Um some of the ideas we've got is to have a portion of it paved. We like to have a a loop paved around all Washington Dome. Um and that creates access to to all of Washington Dome. Um a lot of the existing trails are user created. They're not the best. um at some point somebody rode a motorcycle straight up the Washington Dome and that became the trail. So um a lot of what we're working towards is is better uses of trails. So some of these the the red line on the right you would follow the same elevation all the way around instead of going straight up or straight down or we may have to add some some switchbacks. So, we kind of laying out the trails wasn't just what's existing, but what would be the best trails on the on the Washington Dome. Um, so I mentioned we looked at two kinds of trails. One would be a pave trail, uh, similar to all the trails we've got existing in our trail system, uh, 10-ft multi-use pave trail system. Um, the other trails would be natural surface unpaved trails. Um but they would also be groomed and designed and laid out and they would be much smaller uh 2 to four foot wide single track trails. Um much cheaper option. Um and for for most of the dome this would be the appropriate trail. Um this this is the final trail planned. Uh the concept that we're showing to the public now and

um a similar uh concept is in your packet. Uh the the green would be the paved trail. Um kind of that loop network around the perimeter and the the unpaved trails. Um this I think we think would be the best options. Hey Paul. Um so along the Southern Parkway they're they're planning to build that paved trail. Would that be the same trail? Because I'd hate to do a pave trail and a paved trail right on the same side. No, the the SR7 trail is on the east side of SR7. is on the east side. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And that's that's part of the Utah Trail Network and that will be from Long Valley down to St. George.

So Paul, if I can jump in. Um [clears throat] this is all BLM, right? Uh the majority of it is BLM. Some of this is private land and this is just a concept. Okay. Some of the trail would be on b I mean I can see a couple points where it comes out of the Washington Dome map where you'd have to get some accesses there but a lot of that's private in inside of that boundary as well. Yeah, the the southernmost section has a lot of private parcels on that. Okay.

But the majority of I think we have 7 to 800 acres of BLM land in the in the study. Assuming you didn't get the accesses across those private parcels, have they looked at a different route or a different different trail map? Uh, yeah. I'll I'll get to it a little bit further on in the slides, but um it's more of a concept plan that we can build towards. So, if we don't have access for those, we would build the other trails. So, so potentially some of those we may never be able to build them if we can't get the access. Um, but this Go ahead.

In future, uh, or at least at some point you show those on on this too or show another map that shows where those are, so we can see where that overlap is. I I can get that to you. This map doesn't show the differentiation between them. I understand that, but I don't think it'd be hard to have them include that in a separate exhibit. Okay. Yeah, we can do that for the for the final report. We can have that in it for sure. Okay, thank you.

Um, as part of the outreach, we did a lot of surveys. There was a a website created by Avenue Consultants and we did a lot of outreach at Cotton Days and we gave things out and had a lot of feedback on the website. So, a lot of this came from surveys um that we received and feedback we received on on the website. So, we asked for amenities and what amenities people wanted to see. Um the biggest one was access and and and parking so people could get to it. So trail heads and um some of the other popular things were benches, scenic overlooks, wayfinding. Um especially with the network of trails, it would be great for people to be able to find their way around and and plan loops and and things in in the trails. So, this is a a map of all the potential amenities where the wayfinding signs would be um good places for benches and access and potentially restrooms. So, um all these are laid together for for the final map.

And Paul, yes. As we transition to the kind of the final proposed map, um I think it's also safe to say part of the the the motive behind the Washington Dome is to preserve some of that natural open space, right, and protect it. I mean I mean I it I remember you know motorcycles and you know all things kind of cutting in those initial trails but but but part of that committee and and I've been a part of that we've we've looked at where is the best trail even if we have to rehab some of that scarring and put where does the best trail make most sense for you know the

the hikers runners walkers those kind of things. Is that accurate? So we would almost as a the Washington Dome uh almost a reserve or a preserve.

Yeah. Some of the goals were to maintain access as development comes around it. We want to maintain the access for the users, but we also want to maintain that open space and that beauty. And we did talk about scar mitigation and and adding trails that wouldn't wouldn't leave scars and would be would be better trails. And then also just as you're as you're preparing for that final presentation to the councils, we're looking at there are a lot of challenges in some of these areas with obviously BLM property but all of the properties there are such slope issues. I mean with those steep grades that that there's not a lot of other options there. So some owners might be motivated to you know work with the city on an overall concept.

Yes. Correct. So th this is the plan of the trails with the amenities on it and as mentioned this is a list of trails and how how long they are. So the idea is they could be built in stages. Um this is almost 12 miles of trail in total. About 5 miles of that are paved and then the additional is natural surface. So this is a large project and we don't intend to do it all at once. This is a plan that we can work towards. So, we'll build projects as as we can and and connect sections as we can. Um, there's on this map there's a a section for motorized in the south. That's kind of a concept to to leave a little bit of area where people could could still use motorized vehicles. Um, some of the feedback we've got is the area is not large enough. People would rather go to larger areas for motorized and and there's other options in the area too. Paul, so one of the questions I have is I see three restroom locations and you call that a vault restroom. So that's kind of like over at Chuck Wall Wall. That's just a hole like it's a big porta potty, right?

Yeah. Um cuz we don't have sewer services there. But I guess my question is it seems like a lot of restrooms even like I mean I don't know it just seems like a lot for that small of an area because every restroom cost I mean even with that type of restroom is still lots of money to put those things in. So I'm just wondering if we reduced down to two one on one the west side and one on the east side or something like that is kind of one of my initial thoughts is it just seems like there's a lot of for that small of an area. Yeah. So that's that's a great point and that's a definitely an option that that we can do

and and maybe on the maps maybe it's just there this these are the three locations but we only plan on constructing one maybe two or something like that that's just more clear in the final. Yeah, I think they're definitely we can prioritize the the restrooms um based on the feedback we get from you and from the public that maybe we just pick pick the two that work the best. I think that's a good option. [clears throat] Uh, Councilman Henderson, Councilman Ivy, additional comments. Councilwoman Caspersonson, do you want to talk about We'll just for information for the [clears throat] public. What's going to be on Saturday?

Yes. So, we are concluding our public outreach this Saturday at uh Shooting Star Park from 2 to 4. We're going to have um some city staff and avenue consultants will be there and we're going to have these maps for the public to look at and to to go over with us and we'll be happy to answer any questions and and receive feedback from people for this. We'll have some trail mix and some stuff there. So, we hope trail mix. Yeah. Well, and thank you to Councilwoman Caspersonson. I know she serves on the trails and out recreation committee and so appreciate your your work and insight on this. So,

so Paul in the motorized area, the croshats section. So, we're still that's open for public comment to kind of determine that. You've kind of left some room for saying you're not exactly sure what that looks like, whether it's big enough, small enough, what it would involve.

And I think that's an important part of our development, our growth that we maintain some of these areas. And uh you I would just like to encourage people to reach out and submit comments on this. the the the dome has always been just one of those landmarks in Washington City. And the effort here is, of course, is to try to preserve that amenity for trails and for outdoor recreational use. And uh hopefully there'll be enough comments come in that we it'll help guide our decisions to be able to know what the residents want in that area and throughout the city. Good feedback. Thank you, Councilman. Councilman Henderson.

Thanks, Paul. That looks great. So that that'll be exciting to spruce that up up there and make it usable for a lot of people. So thank you Councilman Henderson. Any additional comment? Any additional comment? Or Bellison, I'm looking at you and Okay, Councilman Coats Paul give you the final word on this. Anything you'd like to leave us with or just want to say thanks for the support. We're really excited for this project. It's a really great place. The more feedback we get, the more we realize how important this is to the people in the area. And then also, uh, would it be conducive to mountain biking as well?

Yes. Mountain biking, hiking, trail running, walking. Okay. Can I ask really quick? I know we're at the beginning stages of this, but when you start applying with this with a BLM, what is the time turnaround for them? I know sometimes it can take some time for the work.

So, we need to do an environmental study on this area. And that's what this helps with is if we know where the trails are, we know where to do the environmental study. Instead of the whole 800 acres, we can just do the study in the corridors where we want the trails to go. So, I think that's a a process that takes a couple years um at minimum. So, we're applying for grants and working on that. So um this is really helpful for us to continue in the process and um once we get this decided we can put it in our capital facilities plan in the future so we can allocate um funds to it in that way too. Great. Thank you Paul. Appreciate it.

Thank you.

The next item is going to be the CND landfill update. And before I invite our our guests from the state agency to come forward, let me just, you know, welcome uh all of our our friends and neighbors from the uh I I'll call it the country area because I know there are three distinct uh subdivisions, but uh for some of you, this might be your first time at a at a city council meeting and and for some of you, you may have come frequently, but we just want you to know that you're welcome and uh we're we're glad you're here. This is this is your city hall. And uh while it's not a a open for public comment and a public hearing, what I can tell you is that uh uh myself and and my council and staff uh we have heard um we have heard you and we continue to hear you and your comments and we have you know read the emails. We we held the the open uh public comment uh weeks ago and we have uh been working diligently uh behind the scenes to continue to move forward towards uh a solution and um because we have now made progress and also because we promised you as an elected body that we would find answers and report back to you. Um, it's our it's our pleasure to welcome Assistant Director Jayen Kudson of the Division of Waste Management and Radiation Control from the Utah Department of Environmental Quality to present to all of us uh an update and she has brought her associate Brad and she'll have to do the full intro introduction of of of her partner there. But Jay Lynn and Brad, if you come forward and and address the council and and we will be your um your mouthpiece tonight and we'll all be the ears listening to what to what our friends at the state agency have to say. Jaylen,

thank you member and city council members. We appreciate the invitation and look forward to updating you on where we're at on this situation. So I'll let it's Brian actually, but let me let Brian introduce. Look, if I get the right starting letter, we're going to call that a win. Close enough. Brian. Absolutely. That was great. Give us your full name and title. Partly because I want to get it right next time, but also because my recorder will want that for the record. Absolutely. My name is Brian Spear. I'm the manager of the solid waste section at the Division of Waste Management and Radiation Control. Wonderful. Welcome, Brian.

Okay. And I have to get into my computer really quick. So, first I thought we'd start out with um a timeline of the events that have happened for a community um in Washington city and then we'll get into where we're at today. And I think I have hopefully a little bit of good news for the community um and talking about our next steps. So, um the Purgatory landfill fire that um happened uh in Washington City uh happened on Hold that mic right in front of you. I know better than that. There you go.

You got it. um happened on June 22nd, 2025. Uh we were made aware of that uh fire uh on July, sorry, I want to get my dates right. Uh July 26th of 2025. Um uh we confirmed that there was a fire and it was put out by the city fire department. After that visit, we had our um our DEEQ engineer go out to the landfill and he confirmed that the fire had been extinguished. Subsequent to that, we received um some environment, what we call an environmental incident report from the community, that they were experiencing odors, significant odors in the evening. Um the first uh odor report came in, I believe, at the end of July. Um and then this multiple uh reports started coming in about August 3rd and the increased intensity of that odor. Um so after that what we did is start to investigate further. Um we had uh members of our division uh well first we talked with the landfill um and there was nothing vision vis visual that showed that there was an ongoing fire. Um, uh, we recruited lots of response agencies including, um, DEEQ, and I'll try not to use acronyms, environmental quality, health and human services, the state fire marshall's office, the environmental protection agency. Um, and then at that point, we had discussions on uh, how to help the community uh, with their health concerns and uh, this odor. Um on August 7th, the fire marshall did a drone fly over um and some VC air monitoring and did not see any heat sources in that drone flyover. Um we shared a report with the community

about August 8th um about the information we gathered to date. On August 8th, we had some of our environmental quality staff do an overnight visit because the odors were significantly uh higher at night. So, we had three of our environmental quality staff um go do an overnight visit and they confirmed that the odor started about 9:00 p.m. and started to dissipate about 7:00 p.m. or 7 a.m.

7 a.m. Thank you. Thank you. Um with that information, um I had multiple discussions with state agencies. Um and we decided to uh reach out to the governor to see if we could activate the 85th civil support team. Uh they're a response agency for hazardous situations like this uh particularly health concerns. Um so I attended the overnight monitoring with them on August 10th. They did a lot of different things that night. I can't speak to all of it because they are the experts. A lot of different equipment was used. They went around the entire area. We went in the landfill um and the report for that did not show any significant readings um of concern. So after that, we started working with the landfill to um potentially there may have been an underground landfill fire, but we weren't sure, right? There wasn't any evidence. So we had them do things such as um watering the landfill. So doing watering all day long to see if there was any leftover uh smoldering that that would maybe help with that. And the community complaints continued. Um I should note we did we did create an online community portal. So if they can tell us when they're experiencing the odors, the time, what type of health effects, things like that, and that is ongoing today. Um, let's see, where am I at? Um, so we asked, we did a couple of compliance advisories. It's an informal process where we send uh requests to the landfill to do a few things. Um, one of them was to do some exploratory investigation to either confirm that there was an underground fire happening or um that there was not. And so we've been working on those and with uh national uh experts, things like that to figure out what might be going on as those odors continued. Um we also had uh

our uh division of air quality out to do a fugitive dust inspection. And just this last week, we had our division of water quality out to do some storm water inspections. Um the landfill began night patrols about September 18th to see if they could see any steam coming off the landfill um during the overnight hours. Um they were unsuccessful in in detecting anything. Um ongoing conversations have happened behind the scenes uh throughout this entire time. And then on, [sighs] let's see what date. Um on October 28th, so just a couple weeks ago, uh the landfill um started digging in the area in an area of the um open phase and uh smoke was detected. Um that was the piece we needed to confirm that there was an underground smoldering fire. So once that happened, um that's the evidence we needed to move forward to order them to do take the next steps. Um, and that's where we're at today. And so, um, and I know the community experienced strong odors. It's kind of a double-edged sword. Um, once they did that, we got what we needed, but because we were unaware they were going to do that, we couldn't, uh, communicate to them that they might experience that. So, with that said, um on Monday, just this past Monday, um on November 10th, we issued a notice of violation and compliance order to the landfill. And these are the next steps that they will take. So, I want to reiterate, we have confirmed there is a subterranean fire at the landfill and um the next steps are them to take action to manage that.

Can you repeat what was issued on Monday? Sure. Violation, a notice of violation. No, not notice of violation in compliance order. Okay. And I'll talk through what um they're required to do because I think that's probably something everybody wants to hear about. So, thank you.

Um so, it lists the violations and it's it's pretty long, so I'm not going to go through the whole thing. I'll summarize it for everyone. Um and Brian's passed out. This is a summary. I will share this with you electronically so you can put it on your website for the community after we're done tonight. Within 30 days, the landfill must submit a written statement to the director detailing violation cause, specific corrective actions with results and dates, proposed future corrective actions with completion dates and milestones, and a prevention plan. Uh, within 30 days of the compliance order signature, they must submit a fire response plan to the director. The fire response plan must detail steps, intervals for periodic reports and deadlines and milestones for investigating extent, depth, size, and characteristic of the fire, monitoring the fire, controlling, suppressing, and extinguishing the fire, preventing reignition, ensuring human health and environmental safety during all fire related activities. And then once we receive that, we'll review it and approve it. And within 7 days of the director approving the fire response plan, they must begin its implementation. And finally, uh they're required to implement and comply with all reporting deadlines and milestones in the director approved fire response plan. So that's the step we're at now. That's uh 30 days from the date it was issued. Um, I know 30 days sounds kind of like a long time, but in order for them to put a really good fire plan together, it's going to take some time. They're going to have to have consultants, experts help them figure that out so that we can manage the fire and get it out completely. So, that's where we're at today. And then one final thing that I wanted to talk through today, because I've heard lots of concerns about this, um,

is what type of materials acceptable at a construction and demolition landfill. So, I've written this down. Again, I'll share it with you to share with the community, but I'll go through that list. Uh construction and demolition waste consists of solid waste from building materials, packaging and rubble resulting from construction, remodeling, repair, abatement, rehabilitation, renovation and demolition operations on pavements, houses, commercial buildings and other structures, including waste from a very small quantity generator of hazardous waste. And it's as defined in a rule. These that may be generated by these operations. And this waste may include concrete rebar contained in concrete, bricks and other masonry materials, excavated materials such as dirt and rock from construction sites, waste asphalt, lumber pallets, tree stumps and other wood products, drywall, metal pipes, hardware and other structural metal, roofing shingles, PVC pipe and tiles and other building materials. And then additionally they can accept yard waste which is vegetative matter uh resulting from landscaping land maintenance land clearing those types of things. And then inert waste which is non-combustible non-hazardous solid waste that retain their physical and chemical structure under expected conditions of disposal. Um including waste that exhibit resistance to biological or chemical change. And I think that's important to understand. um some of these materials, they're it's not meant to be a fire at the landfill, right? But that's likely where those odors are coming from is some of these materials. And so now that we have confirmed that there's the subterranean fire, we'll work with the landfill to get that put out as quickly as we can.

And with that, and I do want to note this isn't a comprehensive uh um summary of our efforts, but uh any questions, I'm happy to. and we appreciate that that update very much, Jaylen. And also want to just u make note that I've been uh copied on a lot of your emails and I appreciate the the prompt and professional response that you've given to to me and to the community. Uh council, uh at this time I'll turn to you for questions. Councilman Belliston, not Henderson. Go ahead. As you were talking, I wrote down a couple of about a handful of questions. So, if you'll indulge me for a minute,

the notice of violation, is that because of negligence or just the fact that there's a smoldering fire and that it, you know, creates a a scenario where you have to issue? Great question. So, the fire itself is not a violation because it's it everything that that we know about the situation, it was not intentional. So, that is not a violation, but there's things surrounding that, how they responded, other things at the landfill that we've looked into because of community concerns. Um, and just in general, uh, uh, us looking at the landfill that are, uh, violations at this point. Okay. Um, I know that there was the original fire, but then at the same point in time, they had a bunch of material coming in from the Pine Valley Fire.

I think fire, we're bringing a lot of that material in. There's no real way except to open and expose it to find out where this smoldering fire is actually coming from. Correct.

Correct. Correct. And let me give you a little more more um, detail of what that might look like. So what happened when we found out that we had the evidence that there is a fire is they just started digging into the working face which gave air to the fire, right? And so um they they'll give us their plan. So I'm not saying this is their plan, but something that they could do is um uh make a plan and drill some bore holes. So find out where those heat that heats um at because it could have gone a couple different ways. Um and then they're going to dig in that area and put the fire out in that area. So that's that's what takes quite a bit of time to put these subterranean fires out. So that kind of brings me to my third question. Okay. Right.

Because we saw we received some stuff that there was um I don't know an email or a letter or something or recommendation that says not to dig up the landfill because of that that you can ex you know give air to it and kind of cause it to expand. Right. Um, I understand they went, you know, they were getting a lot of heat, so they started digging holes to try and figure out what the heck's going on. And that I mean, is that exacerbated the problem or I don't think it I don't think it's made the problem worse. I think what it did was give us the information we needed to create a plan to manage that. In a way, they were they were they were doing things they shouldn't have done, but that actually helped fix the solution.

Yeah, I think they were trying to be helpful, I think, in doing that and trying to, you know, figure out what's going on so they could put the fire out. Um that's not nec I I can't comment if that was the best thing to do because it it happened and they've covered it back up. Um I will say that the um topography in the area, so they're up against a bluff right there, right? And that bluff has a lot of cracks in it. So that is naturally going to bring air flow into the lower part of that landfill. And so even if they hadn't done that, it would have continued. Um them digging in gave us the answer we needed to move forward. So Okay. Okay. And then I just got two other these should be pretty quick ones. Okay. Um when there are smoldering type of a fire in a CND landfill because I know there's other places that have have had them.

Sure. How long do those typically exist? We're going to leave it. Let it kind of burn itself out. Well, we don't recommend anybody ever just leave it. So I I'm not sure. Um there CND landfill fires aren't as common as municipal landfill fires. um which happen multiple times a day because of lithium ion batteries. Um so I couldn't give you a specific timeline. It's based on the area they're in, what's going on, depth, things like that. Um I can tell you um our experience with another CND landfill fire in Utah several years ago. It took them about a year to put out. [clears throat]

Last question. You know, if I go if I go put a wood fire in my fire pit out back, right? You can smell that wood fire, you know, from that that I did, you know, for a period of time, right? Whether it's a week or two or whatever the case may be. How long after a fire gets put out doically [clears throat] persist? I didn't tell you on that. I have no idea.

Um I I will say that one of the things that we we've talked with the landfill about is as they create a plan, we want to make sure that we're able to communicate with our the community right there about what they're doing. So, if it's going to be something um that creates an opening an open area, right, that's going to create odors, we want to make sure that they're aware of it as soon as possible. But also, we require them to do things such as odor mitigation um as they're doing that. So, as they're opening up, they have a solution of how to mitigate those odors. I don't think there's any way to address the problem without creating more odors. But, unfortunately, you know, once we once we tell the community, hey, look, okay, we're pretty confident that it's done. We know that there's going to be a period of time before the odors dissipate, right? So,

correct. Kind of curious if we can there's going to be a way to forecast that. So, can I jump in, Jaylen, because I know we've communicated some really good line of questioning, Councilman. I appreciate that. One of the things that we communicated with a few weeks ago and and and the community has likely seen this, but on our homepage, washington.org, there's an update. So, you can click on that link and any official updates from the agency uh will be on there. So periodically checking that homepage and looking at that you'll be able to get kind of the latest information and then also if there are um situations that might cause additional odor based on the mitigation you'll have uh forewarning based on on on that website.

Yes. On the topic of orders, what what would be some of the procedures that they would do to mitigate the orders their plan? Like what are some things that you've seen that lands?

That's a great question. Um I I can't point to anything specifically. I know that there's some chemicals that can be used, which I know that word sounds scary, but there are things that are made to uh um mitigate those types of odors. Um I'm not aware of all of the things. This is kind of a new thing for us. We're not fire experts. Um, but we do have a lot of people in my network that I've learned, you know, we we've become close over the last few months. So, I will reach out to them and make sure that the plan is sufficient and protective of the community. Okay. And then when you're doing the test for the air quality, I know you didn't go into specifics with that, but can you talk about some of the the testing that you're doing to ensure the safety of the residents?

Sure. So, we are not actively testing right now. um that but part of the plan will be um that they need to let us know how they're going to protect human health and the environment in that area. Um and we've made some suggestions that would be monitoring the air there. But you have in the past when you've brought you know the 85th civil support team and all the different agencies you've done also numerous of testing to make sure you know

yeah to ensure the safety. So they did a lot of different type of testing um that would be an immediate health to human an immediate threat to human health. So there's a there's I don't have them in front of me and they're pretty technical but there's a a whole list of what that would be. We can share that. I think I've shared it with some people in the community um that have asked but I'm happy to share that with you what they looked for. I like that. Sure. Of course. And then can I just do one more question? So when you talked about the storm water management, I know there there has been some concerns brought up from our community about you know the the runoff from the water and so what does that look like for a landfill for the you know that management plan for the storm water?

Sure. So um this landfill does not have an industrial storm water permit. So that's what our storm water team was going out to check. Uh it's not required of CND landfills and so that's why they don't have one. So that's not unusual. Um, but then we had them go out and check just to make sure that it's managed correctly and we didn't have any concerns. Um, we also had our division of water quality who oversees uh waters of the state, so groundwater, things like that. Um, they looked at the topography in the area, any groundwater. Um, and they're they do not have any concerns of it contaminating any waters in the area. You done, Kim, Councilman Ivy,

thank you. If I could liken this situation to a board game, it would be whack-a-ole because when these the fire happened at the 22nd of June and we started hearing complaints coming in, you'd go out and and you would look around and smell and you'd go, I don't notice anything. But

after a while, you started realizing that obviously if there's smoke, there's fire. And so we go out and we do motorcycle rides and I get in a spot where I can smell it. And so I understand how challenging it's been and I really appreciate you being here tonight. The residents are pleading and asking for help and um I'm sure now that we can we can get to that point and and give them the relief that they deserve. But just some of my thoughts. Um um I think that what you're going to find to help suppress that air is some class A foam or inert gas, some uh some sealing off the face so it can't get the air. But you're right, very much right. The geology out there is challenging. It's an anacline. the rocks are broken and fractured, they're going to be able to suck and dry air and there is enough methane there to provide a a source that that's going to burn. What my concern is, what I would like to talk about mainly is the timeline.

Sure. Um, that's something that that the residents, you know, I I I I'm not going to go into all the details, but the complaints that I've heard in first person and that I've heard testimonials on, it's literally changed their lives, the quality of life, the way they live, has cost money. People have put up homes that to sell them. They've bought I talked to an old friend of mine, baseball player, that bought $3,000 worth of house air purifiers just to be able to be in his house. So, I don't need to go into all those details, but I just want you to know that I appreciate you being here. This is one of the biggest crisis that has happened to our city in our history. And when we came into it, I have to admit, I didn't even realize that the CND was in our city. And that's maybe my fault, but it's been a process to learn and grow together. But I just want to ask you, plead with you to do everything you can every day to give the relief that we need. I think that there's a way to do it, but my experience is that these type of fires, they're going to have to be excavated. They're going to have to be separated. It's going to have to be um actually drawn out, and you can drill in and case to find and try to pump water down to the source. But I think like you said with the open face, it's always going to be able to draw air and burn a different direction. But my my pleading tonight is the timeline and uh and try to do everything we can to suppress the fumes as they escape. Now, the fugitive dust has been a problem from time to time. I know there's a water concern with the water as well, but we we wish no ill on this business. We just need the fire put out. And then as a city, we need to implement some ordinance and some conditional use bits possibly to try to help with your effort to manage going forward so this doesn't happen again. no fault of their own, but maybe just some education and working together to try to make sure that our residents out there don't have to go through this again a

second time.

I appreciate that, Councilman. So, when they provide the management plan for us, and I know 30 days feels like a lot, like I mentioned earlier, um it to give us a good plan, right, that has plan B's if something goes wrong and things like that. they need that amount of time um to provide a good plan and and I don't want to have them go in unprepared and then end up back here again where we're not sure what to do because it's it's made it worse. And so um but once we do have that plan, we'll make sure it's aggressive um while doing it safely to get that put out as quickly as possible. And I know I gave you the year timeline, that doesn't mean that's how long this will take. It's just that's our experience um our only experience with a CND landfill in Utah. So,

so when you get that experience, sorry, just one more followup, mayor. When you get that the report back, do you have an ability to look at that and view its viability and be able to get back right away and say, "This is not exactly what we're thinking this or just have some interaction there so we don't have that timeline start over several times." Absolutely. And we've talked, we were at the landfill before we came here today. We talk through what those requirements will be and I'm asked them to talk to us throughout the next 30 days as they're creating that plan so that hopefully when the plan comes in we've already said yep that's going to be good. Um versus coming at the end and uh having to ask lots more questions. So thank you.

And Councilman Coats I just I might make for the record he's the he's the chair of the executive board of the solid waste but so which is the county land. So he he knows a thing or two. Sure. Yeah. So, and and a lot of people don't realize that it's actually totally separate. The that landfill is a private landfill. The other one's county ran and and we sit on like the mayor said, I'm the chairman of that board, but there's 21 members from all the counties and cities around the valley. But the the question I had is you mentioned a year, you mentioned these time frames. What if their plan comes back and it's hey, I need five years to work on this. Is that something that like where's the exception from you guys of

we're done? like this is the amount of time you have and we always know that plans have to change sometimes, but but I mean understand you said it took a year to figure out that one. It wouldn't surprise me if it took a year to figure this one out, but but I just don't want it to prolong more than it needs to. Like we've all talked about here, like that smell, we got to we got to get it taken care of and and the steps to do it. So, what on your end teeth do you have to to push down that this is the main focus to get this figured out before I mean they're still going to want to run a business and we want them to run a business, but we need some effort into getting this done, not just peck away at it as we find time. So,

yeah, great question. And I will say I sympathize. I've I've smelled the odor. It's terrible. Um, so I've experienced it firsthand and it's distinct. And it's very distinct. Yeah. So, I've experienced firsthand. Um, and it was important me for me to do that because that that makes me have a personal connection to it, right? And knowing what they're experiencing. So, um, the plan that is submitted, we have approval over and so if it's obnoxious, um, for lack of a better word, we'll say no. Um, but that's why, uh, we engaged with them today and we want to work with them as they're creating that so they know what those expectations will be. So, in 30 days, we don't have another 30 days because they didn't meet the mark. Um, it will have to be an aggressive timeline. Um, other than that, I don't know until I see the plan, but we'll work with them.

So, once the plan's finished and approved by you, is that something that or is that just internal and you Yes, it would be a public document. Um, same as the notice of violation, it is a public document. So, um, I can share that with the uh, city. Um, but once that plan is approved, it's it you you're welcome to see what that is and they have to start that plan within seven days of the approval. Good questions. Councilman Henderson, jump in. Ready or not?

Well, we appreciate you coming down here and you know, this is kind of what we've been wanting is to have a meeting with all of us together, elected officials and the community that's affected and just to kind of hear, you know, what's going on and uh what's being done about the issue and we appreciate you being here. So, it sounds like uh

very glad that it was discovered that there was an active fire and now we can take measures to, you know, to do that. And I just as these guys, I I hope it doesn't take five years or even one year. You know, it'd be wonderful if they could get it under control because as Councilman Bellist said, I'm I'm sure even once they do put the fire out, there's going to be a smell for months. You know, it's just kind of how fires are. But I'm I'm glad we're able to pin down what the problem is and move forward. So, thank you for being here. Appreciate your presentation. So,

yeah, thank you for inviting us. And I do want to I don't want to leave without noting that, um, we appreciate the community. They have been very kind, um, very respectful of the process even though it's very frustrating, right, as we're trying to figure out and get the facts that allow us to take this next step. um they've been great to work with and shared so much information with us that we couldn't have gotten um unless we were here 24/7. So, I want to make sure that um I thank the community for that. I agree. Councilman Ivy,

just one followup. Um just out of curiosity, what would the consequences be if there's not a a viable plan submitted or that you just can't really get past that at first look? Do you then show them the plan that they're going to be required to do or just how does that look?

That's that's a really good question. I hope we don't get there. Um that's something we'll be looking at. Uh this is a first for us again. So we're also learning right how we're going to uh figure this out. Um I I may have mentioned earlier we have reached out to experts across the country who have experience in this. So we do have our fingers and our tentacles out to grab people if we need them. Um it's probably something legal. We'll have to figure out resources where we may need to go in and uh do some work on our own. Um and what that looks like, I'm not sure, but um we'll we'll consider that as we get through this next process. Again, thank you for being here.

Can I ask one more question just out of curiosity? It just popped in my mind. Are are they able to continue to take material in as they're working on this and maybe just put it somewhere else? Correct. Correct. Um we will consider that though as part of their plan because we don't want to put fuel in a fire, right? I understand. And so that will be part of um what we look at is is it a completely separate area that we're not concerned about um any smoldering in that portion of the landfill. Um it it would it's really tricky and not necessarily in our best interest if we make them stop accepting waste. Um it's a big property so I'm sure they can

but but that's something we would consider. But if we shut them down, that shuts off their resources to um to manage the fire and then and then unfortunately it would take more time, right? It would just sit there. But we do consider that as part of their plan. So, right on. Thank you. Can you speak to what um if anything is being done to help prevent, you know, future fires from from occurring at at this CND landfill?

Great question. And so, uh, they do have a fire management plan as all landfills do, um, which is put the fire out, right? And which they did. Uh, we will because of this, we will have them do some additional things be because of the topography and things like that that we've discussed. Um, so that it's a more robust plan. Um, but the most fi landfill fire plans are put the fire out. Um, and so that's something that we'll look at. And they're continually monitoring the type of material that they're accepting because most of this should be, you know, borderline non-combustible. Really,

right? Right. Um, yeah. When a fire I mean I mean I I don't want to get into it, but lithium ion batteries are our worst nightmare right now. So, as long as they're not accepting batteries, we'll send them to your landfill council [clears throat] in coast. They they combust and then it's just uh someone throws it away, right? And it gets in this big pile of waste and that's one of our biggest issues right now. Yeah. Okay. Any additional questions, comments, council, with the violation, is there costs associated with that? Like is it is just a violation of compliance letter or is there

So, there could be a penalty at some point. um our we can issue penalties but our director cannot require them to pay. We have to go to court for that. So that's part of the process that we'll get to if if we get there. And and so really along that line, what is their incentive then to quickly resolve the issue? It would be that the penalty carried at some point. Okay. Yeah. This this piece is we needed to get this out the door as quickly as possible because it'll take them time to get a plan. And so that's what we're doing here. Um that will come in the next steps. Okay. So it could be in their best interest then to seek out a consultant that's correct

that has experience in this and that correct start at a higher point. [clears throat] Is that what you expect to happen? I I would assume so. We talked extensively with them about that today. Um so the next step of this type of process is generally what we call a stipulated consent order and that's where um the next steps like what a penalty would look like, how they'll pay it, um these types of things, making sure they're meeting the plan that they submitted, those things will come. The plan includes a timeline based on what they find.

All of that's required. Um when we when we provide you the uh the order, it it it's much more detailed than what I've summarized today. Uh, city manager, do you have anything to add to this conversation? No, I think I appreciate you coming. If you can get me a copy of this, I'll get this up on the website. This is the [clears throat] most update. Yeah. Okay. Absolutely. All the like the testing that you've done and I think that would be helpful to to see too. I know you you've shared it with the community members, but I think it'd be good to to share that as well. Yep. Absolutely. Councilman Ivy. Uh, I have no more questions for these good folks, but I do have some general questions after. Mayor, uh,

Brian, do you have anything to add to this conversation? I really don't. Um, I appreciate the questions and and uh, I appreciate Jaylen being a point of contact at our our department um, and doing such a great job of covering the issue. Great. Well, thank you. Um, stay around for a few minutes. This is the last time I would like to interact with you just a little bit before you. You're staying over. You're not leaving tonight. No, I I will be staying down in this beautiful city for another night. There you go. Thank you. Well said. Thank you, Councilman Abby.

Yes, mayor. Thank you. My my questions are more general just may way of information for the residents that are here and others that may be listening for our city manager, our our fire chief, and for those people that are tasked with with keeping keeping everyone safe and happy and healthy. I heard some reports that um that there was 911 calls that um you were told some of you told to not call 911. I would push back against that. I think you have the right to call anytime you feel like there is a a health a health concern or something like that. I think that we have a way in the city to also submit um uh code enforcement uh concerns to the city so that you can be documented and heard. I think that's important as well. I do see that we have a way forward now and I I ask for your continued patience and and uh and trying to work together in the very calm and respectful way that you've done so far. But I do want to encourage our staff to do everything they can do to stay on top of this minuteby minute and uh and try again to work in conjunction with all the agencies and every effort that we have throughout the county, the state to stay on top of this and get it resolved as quickly as possible. Thank you, Councilman. Anything else? That concludes the agenda for our workshop meeting. I'll call for a motion to adjurnn.

So moved. I have a motion by Councilman Coats, a second by Councilman Bell. All in favor? I We are adjourned. We'll reconvene for our regular meeting at 6

Good evening. Today is Wednesday, November 12th, 2025. We are in the council chambers of Washington City Hall for our regular meeting. Our meetings are streamed live and archived at washingtoncity.org/meings. org/meings and uh we will begin uh our meeting uh the right way and that is uh with the assistance of the interfaith council our friend Reverend Derek Dton Tony Hill of the Shepherd of the Hills United Methodist Church will start our meeting off. Reverend once again thank you uh for allowing us to be a part of of your meetings and to to open with prayer. You know this is such a season of thanksgiving. Yesterday we thanked veterans and folks who have served us in in that capacity. We are anticipating Thanksgiving and just two weeks. Hard to believe. Um we're thankful for opportunities to give especially at this time when so many people are are struggling u for various reasons and in our communities. And u and I want to call out your mayor and mayor Staley. Thank you for last Saturday, a number of people from many congregations in Washington County gathered for crop walk um which was for hunger both locally and worldwide and and Mayor Staley was there and a part of that. We always appreciate that you take time out of your your days to to be part of that. So, thank you. I'd invite us to pray. Gracious Lord, we thank you. We thank you for family, for love, for opportunities to serve. We thank you for uh these folks um here before us who serve you through this city council and uh in various capacities. We thank you for the opportunities we have to um celebrate um the the ways in

which you have given us blessings, blessings of nature and beauty, blessings of u food and uh and uh and family and connections. We lift before you those who are in need. And we lift before you these servants who are uh about making decisions and um and considering uh what might be best for this community. We pray for wisdom for them, for encouragement. We pray for um them to be uh cognizant of of how they indeed are servants and and um and look to to others for uh guidance and and direction. bless them, bless us, watch over, keep our families safe, and and watch over this community. We ask this through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.

Amen. Thank you, Reverend. And I know you have uh other duties to attend to, so we'll excuse you, but thank you for the difference you make in the community. And thank you for praying with us tonight and and for us year round. Thank you. I've asked our city manager, Jeremy Red, to lead us in the pledge of allegiance this evening. Please follow me.

I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for it stands. One nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Before

Before I call for a motion to approve the agenda, I will make note that we do not have need to go into close session this evening. And also with your permission, council, uh the um the uh would like to change the order of 6B and 6 C. So after 6A, we'd like to go to 6 C and then 6B. Um, so I'll call for a motion to approve the agenda. Uh, with that minor modification, make that. Have a motion by Councilman Belliston. Second by Councilman Ivy. All in favor? I.

The agenda is approved. We'll move on to uh announcements. Uh, Veterans Day. Uh, the parade and the program was another uh another great success. appreciate the the community and the staff pulling together to make that happen. Uh if if you're driving along Telegraph, you'll notice that there's a new Veterans Park sign there with it's on a sandstone base with uh you know, red brick that that matches our downtown. And on the back, uh take some time to look at the the collection of portraits of names and and pictures of the 104 uh from Washington that served in World War II. That was nearly 25% of our entire population veteran and council member Bellston.

Well, I just wanted to, you know, say thanks to BA Robinson who donated that sign as well, right? So, yeah, that very much appreciated to them.

Yeah, donated donated labor and you'll you'll find the story interesting if you have a chance just to to to look at the backside and look at those pictures and and read the story. Um, continuing with announcements, there will be an open house for the Washington Dome uh trail system and reserve. Um, the uh committee is continuing to receive uh comment especially from the uh neighbors and uh that that live in that area. So, on uh Saturday, November 15th from 2:00 to 4:00 p.m. at Shooting Star Park, they'll be taking public comments. Uh on a special meeting will be held on Tuesday, November 18th at 4 p.m. for the election canvas. Congratulations to Councilwoman Caspersonson and Councilman Henderson. Um the city offices will be closed on Thursday and Friday, November 27th and 28th for the Thanksgiving holiday. Uh the Christmas in Dixie event will begin uh at dusk or 6 pm on Monday, December 1st right here at Veterans Park. Also, the a new annual tradition is the USS Utah Remembrance Day, which will be held uh on Sunday, December 7th. And because it's on a Sunday, it will be held at 5:00 p. am at the Heritage Hall, the what was once the old gym, but has now been remodeled. The uh a few of us were able to what Washington has been leading out on remembering what's been considered the forgotten ship of World War II. There was a a small smaller ship that was used uh from World War I up until the beginning of World War II that was docked in Pearl Harbor and was the first ship sunk in

that war. And because of where it was sunk and because of that area and size of it, the the the the Arizona and others seem to be more recognized. But the USS Utah uh um was a bit of a forgotten ship until a local resident and it got uh here in Washington took note and and started to get traction with the resolution that went all the way up to the state of Utah. So with the uh new uh USS Utah, which is an 8 billion nuclear sub, uh Washington City has gotten on board as a supporter of that. um of that uh what they call boat. I guess you don't call a submarine a ship. They call it a boat. And they say that everything else is a target. Um but a a few of us, we all had the opportunity, a few of us took that opportunity on our own dime and went back to Graten, Connecticut for the christristening of the of the new USS Utah, a state-of-the-art submarine. And it was our privilege to interact with with um the sailors, a cross-section of of individuals from all across the country and with the uh hard hat and steel towed boot individuals who who fabricated that that submarine. And it was it was uh quite the event for us to be back there. and we uh were part of that Utah contingency and interacted with the the captain and and those that are sacrificing for that. Um as part of that, we just wanted to show at the beginning of this meeting just a few of the pictures of of this event. This is a picture of Senator Mike Lee addressing that uh that group. This is the the group from Washington that that went back um including a member of our Veterans Day committee. This is right outside the uh

uh electric boat where they uh where they build these massive uh almost 400 ft long submarines. It's really pretty back there. Connecticut in the fall. Side note, on a morning run, it was quite the rave run. I saw a little bobcat on that trail. Was kind of fun. And these are Jordan's pictures, so I'm seeing them for the first time with you. There's kind of the uh this was on the that's kind of the middle of the of the nuclear sub there. Uh it's the SSN 801 and it would have been 800, but we said let's just make it the 801 because so much of the state has that as the as the area code. And then you can see that that that's kind of a raptor there with the Pisces and then the kind of the slogan is terror of the deep which is kind of cool. Few more of these I think there David and there's uh Councilman Ivy and myself with a few of the sailors there at the at the christristening event. There's a better there's a better picture of the submarine from um not even half of it back half. And these are the actual uh sponsors of the of the boat. And they couldn't have been more classy and and better than they were. They they both uh Sharon Lee, wife of Senator Mike Lee and um

Mary Kate

Mary Kate Huntsman uh jointly um sponsored the the submarine and their remarks just not only brought a a tear to your eye but just gave you chills and it resonated with everyone in the crowd but in particular the uh the sailors that will be on the boat partly because uh Mary Kate Hudsman has two sons who are naval officers and uh and and Sharon Lee, Senator Lee's wife, could not have been more articulate and more honored. They uh it's really a responsibility for them primarily, but us as supporters to embrace um this submarine for the 40 or 50 years that that nuclear power will keep it running. And so Washington City, we've made that commitment as a community to to be part of that support. Councilman Ivy with the senator and I think that's it. Is that the last picture, David? I believe. And then we just had a special message. John Olsson, if you come forward, please. This is the resident that that started this ball rolling with remembering the forgotten ship. And you might recognize your friend here. This is the captain of the USS Utah. Uh, and I think they actually called him commander. Councilman Ivy, I believe you took this video. What What do you have to say?

You know, John, we were sat saddened that you couldn't join us and knowing that this is your passion. It's so important to you. Um, I had a chance to visit with Commander Horning and uh he offered this. Go ahead and please watch it. Go ahead and run it. Okay. Hey, John. Hope you're enjoying the day back in Utah. We had an awesome day today christristening the ship. The sponsors are incredible. The team that flew out from your town is super supportive and we're having an amazing time. Keep up the good work back in Utah and I'll see you next year. Carry on.

He remembered you. He kne remembered our conversation we had down at uh the George Washington Plaza some time ago. He was inspired by your drive and dedication to a common goal to uh not only bring positive attention to our armed forces, but particularly to the naval, to the Navy, to the submarine, and for all the sailors that man that. But he wanted me to share his personal appreciation for you and everything you've done here in Utah to help promote um the USS Utah.

Thank you. Before you go anywhere, there are a few things that uh Councilman Ivy uh is going to present to you that uh that we brought back um from that event. Councilman Ivy. Well, it it's just an honor to know that the legacy of the USS Utah is in the hands of SSN 801, Commander Horning, and the crew, and the legacy will go forward forever.

John Olsson. Here's a USS Utah SS 801 hat with the Utah Raptor on it. On the back, Terror the D. We hope that fits you. Here's some lanyard for you and your wonderful wife to remember it every day with your keys. We got you a a nice sticker. And um this is a note that the local elementary kids made for all the veterans. and you being a veteran. We brought that for you. Here's a program and something for your Dodge pickup.

Chief, don't pull him over if he puts that on. Okay. Thank you. Appreciate it. Next item of business, uh, council, is there any declaration or abstensions or conflicts? Yeah, mayor. Item 5C, uh, the firm I work for created that map, but I do plan on voting on it.

Okay. Duly noted. Anything else, council? We'll move on to the consent agenda which consists of approval of minutes from the city council meeting of 102215 and the board audit report from October 2025. I'm happy to call for a motion to approve the consent agenda. Mayor, I'll make that motion we approve the consent agenda as outlined. You've heard the motion by Councilman Coats. Second. Second by Councilman Bellison. All in favor? I

consent agenda is reviewed and approved. Item five, resolutions. 5A. Now, as a as a just kind of a matter of protocol, mayors do proclamations, councils make and approve resolutions, which makes this item all the more meaningful as a united body, this council um has drafted and brought this forward. 5A is a consideration to approve a resolution honoring the life of Charlie Kirk. Councilman Kim Cassson, you led this. Is there anything you would like to say?

Well, really, I just want to thank our community members who brought this forward. I think that like this event affected all of us in different ways and I I just appreciate you know our community bringing this forward and wanting to do something for it. So really the credit goes to you know those who in our community who wanted to to do something. So thank you. Um it will be my privilege to read and then sign um this resolution. But first, council, I will turn to you for further discussion and or a motion on this particular item.

Mayor, I'd make a motion to approve a resolution honoring the life of Charlie Kirk. I have a motion second by Councilman Kurt Ivy and a second by [clears throat] Councilwoman Kim Caspersonson. All in favor? I I

The resolution is passed unanimously. I'll go ahead and read this for the record. Resolution R 20225-30 honoring the life and legacy of Charles Charlie James Kirk. Whereas our community mourns the passing of Charlie Kirk whose life and work touched many regardless of differing views. And whereas the celebration of death, whether of a public figure or any person, harms the dignity of our community and diminishes the humanity we share. And whereas labels and stereotypes when used to divide or dehumanize fuel cycles of hostility that have no place where charity and respect are at the core of our community. And whereas the misuse of authority, whether through government, institutions, or social influences to silence or punish based on beliefs, undermines the very principles of liberty and self-governance. And whereas our homes and public institutions hold the responsibility to cultivate an environment of mutual respect where disagreements are resolved through dialogue. not the vision. Now, therefore, be it resolved that we affirm the following commitments. Honor the dignity of life. We recognize the passing of Charlie Kirk with respect and reject any celebration of harm or death toward others, regardless of their beliefs.

End the weaponization of labels. No person or community member shall be attacked or diminished based on political, cultural, racial, religious or personal identifiers and the weaponization of authority. The powers entrusted to schools, governments, political institutions, and community leaders shall not be used to silence lawful speech, encourage violence, or glorify hostility. Promote civil discourse. Opposing ideas can be shared respectfully, disagreements addressed constructively, and empathy cultivated alongside critical thought. Model self-governance. We commit to lead by example, demonstrating that peace, dignity, and freedom can be preserved even in the face of deep differences. Be it further resolved that this proclamation honors the life of Charlie Kirk and affirms our responsibility to reject violence, division, and dehumanization instead fostering a culture of respect, unity, and peaceful coexistence. passed and approved on the 12th day of November, 2025. Tara, I'm going to sign this now and hand the pro or the resolution off to you.

Item 5B, consideration to approve a compensation resolution for Utah Local Government's Trust. Uh, it's a formality. You see that in your packet. If there's no discussion on this item, I'm happy to entertain a motion. Mayor, I'll make a motion we approve the compensation resolution for Utah Local Government Trust. I have a motion by Councilman Coats. Second by Councilman Henderson. All in favor?

Any opposed? That resolution is approved unanimously. Item 5C. Uh, Councilman Coats has noted, but we'll be voting. This is consideration to approve a resolution accepting an annexation petition known as the Washington City annexation. City Recorder Terrapence. Good evening, mayor and council. Um, we received the um notice of annexation petition and part of the process is within 14 days of the notification, we bring it to council for your acceptance. So, the petition is for 4,294 acres. It's all BLM land. It is within our annexation policy plan. Uh, part of this um approval, this does not approve the annexation. It just starts the process for me to begin the notification and going through the um affected entities process.

Okay. So, if you have any questions there, it is a kind of a lengthy process and I'm working with that on it because state law changed again, but we I think we've got a good handle on where we need to go next, but might not be back to you until January. Thad, what would you add before we open it to the council?

Terra's done a good job. Um the only thing I would add is this is the beginning of this process. The statutory process is intentionally structured with a lot of public opportunity to comment. Um because annexations can traditionally be be something that gets really debated. Um the process tonight would be the council's decision if they so choose to accept the petition which is really the beginning of the process. Um, if you accept it, you will have a subsequent meeting where you would make a decision on whether to ratify an annexation. Councilman Coast, do you have question comment? Any questions? Comments from the council.

You can make a motion if you're ready for a motion. I'll make a motion to approve a resolution accepting an annexation petition known as the Washington City East annexation. You've heard the motion by Councilman Caspersonson. Is there a second? Second. Second by Councilman Coats. All in favor? Any opposed?

That is approved unanimously. Uh thank you Tara, thank you Thaad. And thank you Jordan Hess. I know you did uh the bulk of that work behind the scenes. So the ball is now rolling. We'll move on to the next section of the agenda, which is public hearings. I will make note that uh the city council received no electronic public hearing uh public comment on any of the items noticed for public hearing. Item 6A is a public hearing and consideration to approve an ordinance for a road abandonment vacation located at 840 South and 100 East. Council, I'm sure you looked at the map and can see why this is being done. John Hinky, that doesn't get you out of presenting to the council. Assistant public works director. Nice to see you.

What's that? Did I give you a promotion? Yeah, I'll take it. Talk to Jeremy later about the the commensurate raise. I I'll see you tomorrow. Tell me your exact title. I always thought I was assistant director. That's Lester and Andy. Uhhuh. Okay. Yeah. What is your new development manager? That's pretty good. Pretty good still.

Um, all right. Back to the item at hand. Uh, if you've seen your exhibit, we're uh as part of the development there at 84100 East, uh, storage unit complex that's slated to go in. Uh, we need to vacate right away. That would have been clear back when the extension of Main Street. Um, as well as a, um, sanitary sewer ement. Currently, our sanitary sewers are running through there. Um, as part of the project, it will be relocated, at which time they'll provide us with a new easement for the relocation of that sanitary sewer main. So, happy to answer any questions that you have. This is mainly just to facilitate the storage unit complex project uh to get going.

John, is this an easement or is an actual dedicated property that the city owns? because when I looked on the county map, it didn't look like it was like an easement because I couldn't find it on the the property maps. Come on up and if you'll just state your name and I'm Tyler Hughes with Rosenberg Associates. Get right in there at the mic, my friend. I keep my I'm Tyler Hughes with Rosenberg Associates. There you go. We should get a taller mic for guys like you. That's all good. No. So that if you look on the county side, it doesn't show up, but when we started digging through it, it basically said that the city owned it or it was dedicated to the city at some point. So we're trying to get rid of the rideway doesn't really affect anything.

Yeah, I just Okay, that's good to know. I just some of those questions just as we move forward some of these do they make sense that if the city owns it, do we get compensated for it process? You know, so that's why I was asking if it's an easement that's an old prescriptive easement that's been there forever. I just think it's different than if you actually own it. But it I mean based on the county, it doesn't really look like we owned it, but did own it. Some technical some

So this is one that comes from a historical uh town pladding document and those did convey ownership to the history that followed didn't always look and feel like it was public ownership. So in the south block of the city south of Telegraph and in some of it north, but more so in the south because they spent more platting time down north, there's roadways and things like this that are there that as as uses come along, we're going to have to

That makes total sense. I just it's more of just a general note like usually these things if they aren't like this if it's along a roadway and we're we're given up property usually there should be compensation to the city to help fund some of the improvements that need on these type of roads. So but this one makes sense. It's a field that no one's used and

yeah good comments. Thank you council. Any additional uh questions or comments on this before I open the public hearing? Thank you, gentlemen. Uh, this is a public hearing, so anyone who would like to speak to item 6A, this is your opportunity to come and express your opinion on the abandonment of this property andor easement. Seeing no one come forward, I will close the public hearing and turn to the council for further discussion and or a motion. Mayor, I'll make a motion we approve the abandonment/vacation located at 840 South and 100 East. You've heard the motion by Councilman Coat. Is there a second? Second. Second by Councilman Belliston. All in favor?

I. Any opposed? That is approved unanimously. 5 to zero. Um, as was approved with this agenda, we're going to now move to item 6 C and then we'll come back to 6B. Thad, 6B and 6 C are eminent domain items for the same project. Uh, there is attorney P, Mr. James Purcell here. He's got a 7:00 volunteer commitment. if you wouldn't mind letting him speak on behalf of his client maybe before the staff report. You bet. Yeah, that's just fine. Um, also I think both of these could be held called during the same openurren. Yeah. Council with your permission will run 6B and 6 C concurrently.

Yes. Motion be concurrent as well. Noticing both both uh just move to open them both and then move to close them both. Council, I'm going to call for a motion to run items 6B and 6 C concurrently. Second. I have a motion and a second. All in favor? I. Any opposed? We'll run these concurrently. We'll start prior to staff report. We'll invite Mr. James Purscell. It's nice to see you again. Uh we'll let you present first, then we'll then we'll circle back to staff. Go ahead, James.

Thank you for accommodating council. You're all probably familiar with this piece of property, and if not, I'm hopefully you'll be able to um visualize what we're talking about. Um I represent um my clients uh Bernie and Kathy Burus and they are the owners of parcel W5236118 and it's my understanding the city is looking to do um take through eminent domain a sliver of their property on the west side and it's um a sliver that borders I shouldn't say sliver I mean it's an acre but it goes down the entire length of the property um and they're taking it and it's right up against the BLM property. Um my client's main concerns and he wanted me to at least articulate to the to the city council so you could be aware of them and obviously um make a decision accordingly is um number one we have a a concern on valuation. And I think the city's done a valuation for the property. Um we view it as being um low. And then the other concern which is maybe even just as if not more important than the valuation is their concern is that by taking that section um he loses access or loses his uh direct abuing up to uh the BLM property which he thinks has has value. Um I've reached out to THAAD. We're following the process. We've actually reached out to the property rights and budsman up in Salt Lake Jordan. Uh we started the mediation process pursuant to Utah code. We're getting a second appraiser. Uh we hope to expedite that process because I know you guys are um trying to move [clears throat] quickly as well. So from our perspective, we're trying to go as quick as we can. We're going to get that second appraisal. We're going to have mediation hopefully in the very near future. So um my request hopefully for the city council is they table a vote on eminent domain just yet so we can run through the mediation process and avoid litigation. Obviously, if the eminent domain goes forward, it's just going to start a lawsuit. Um, whereas we believe that we can try to resolve this through mediation, which we're actively pursuing right now. The second and last thing I wanted to get on the council's radar is perhaps the idea of instead of an

eminent domain proceeding that you consider an easement. I think my client would be open to that idea and I'm not exactly sure on all the particulars as to what you want the area for. It's my understanding you're going to be running a pipe underneath my client's property. That's the main purpose for this long narrow strip that you're getting. If that's the case, um, without making any formal commitment, but I do know my client indicated he would be open to discussions whereby he sells an easement um, to the city, obviously run with the land in perpetuity, so we you have it forever. Um, or vice versa, if you were to do eminent domain and take the property that we could maybe get an easement across the property. Once again, one of his main objectives is to be able to uh eventually put, you know, whether it's five or 25 years down the road, develop and or improve the property and having access to the BLM land he views as paramount or very important to him. So, I just wanted to relay all of that to you if you have any questions. Um, but the hope is number one, you table the vote and number two, at least consider the idea of an easement as I believe that might be an amicable resolution.

So, I'll stay here. I'll address those and we'll still get you to your appointment on time. The first thing I can uh to your first point, I can promise we're not going to vote on it tonight because it's only a public hearing.

And to your second point, we would love to be able to come to a resolution that works well for both parties. So, continue to work with our legal counsel. We have a great relationship with you. We want we really all we're trying to do here is we're trying to provide water for residents in a growing area of the city. And so, uh, sometimes in order to get those, uh, negotiations to the table, the council has to, this is not what we want to do. We want to be able to have fair exchange of value for property. So, yeah, we're not going to vote on it tonight, but I'm going to open up the public hearing in a little bit and then it sounds like you're going to continue working with our staff to find a resolution and at some point it'll come back to this council for that vote

or for or for approval for a you know a disposition of the property. Awesome. Thank you. I'll stick around for five more minutes and I'll take off. But thank you again for your time.

Sounds good. Okay. I'm not going to open the public hearing just yet. I'm going to read items 6B and 6 C and then I am going to uh turn it over to our real assistant public works director Lester Dalton who I often refer to as our resident rockstar but it's just you know I just don't want him to get too humble on us. Um but 6B is a public hearing to discuss eminent domain of certain property along with all associated rights in that property known as Washington County tax partial IDW-5-2-36-11. Which property location is is approximately west of Southern Parkway and north of George Washington Boulevard, Washington, Utah 84780. Item 6 C, public hearing to discuss an eminent domain of certain property along with all associated rights in that property known as Washington County tax partial IDW-5-2-36-118. Which property location is approximately west of Southern Parkway and north of George Washington Boulevard, Washington 8478. Uh Lester, come on up and um present to the council. Mayor, as Lester's making his way up, the way we've planned this is in an in an effort to give the most public notice and public chance for the council to interact with the land owners. We're having just a public hearing tonight, not asking for a vote, giving the opportunity to receive feedback so the council and staff can digest that as it may be. And then we would need a subsequent public hearing, a subsequent uh notice period before the council could make a decision or pass a resolution authorizing the filing of an eminent domain lawsuit.

And I see the other property owner here as well. We we'll definitely give you an opportunity to speak after Lester. Okay. Go ahead, Lester.

Thank you, mayor. Good evening, council. Um hopefully everybody had an opportunity to read the staff report. A little bit of background on this um this project that we're working on, we've referred to it as the Majestic Tank Farms and the pipeline uh to accommodate them tanks once they are constructed. Uh location of these facilities is is crucial um not only from a geographical location but also elevation. Um, the reason we've we've chosen this site, we've actually been out, we've visited the site. Um, we walked the site, we know that it's it's it's workable from an elevation perspective, um, and constructable. And then, uh, just geographically, it's able to serve the area that we needed to serve. Um, these tanks are are intended to serve the entire southern end of the of Washington Fields as a whole. um all the way from our existing development there, you know, kind of along George Washington Boulevard, um the remainder of the city property all the way to the south um everything that's incorporated within the city. Um it'll they'll also supplement our existing facilities and just just accommodate the growth that we're having um in Washington fields as a whole. Um like I said, the elevation on these at this location is critical. um water tanks. It's a direct derivative of of the pressure that we need to have. Um these tanks would actually match elevation of two existing tanks that we already have um serving this area.

And and Lester, for for for those here that aren't in, you know, the retail water service, you just talk about that pressure is elevation gravity fed primarily. Yes, it is all gravity fed. It's it's 100% gravity fed out of these tanks and that's where that elevation comes into play. These tanks have to match uh the elevation of the other tanks in order for the system to operate properly. Prevent one tank from draining while the others remain full. I mean it's it's it's a complete balancing act. Science to it.

Yes. Um and there's there's a lot that goes into to sighting tanks. Um, this will be the first situation in Washington where we have multiple tanks within a single location. We could actually do it with one very large tank, but operationally that presents all kinds of problems. Um this is more of a phased approach um that we put in place here um by looking at it as three tanks but part of that approach also brings in the necessity we have to have the room for them when they do come in in the future. So, this kind of takes us to the endg game of buildout in Washington fields and um by getting to where we are where we [clears throat] are currently with the current proposal that would get us there. Um with the land acquisition, we would not build all of the tanks at this time. Initially, we'd start with a single tank, a single pipeline, [clears throat] and that would be followed up by the additional tanks and a larger diameter pipeline in the future.

So, council me. Yeah. Why would you do a smaller pipeline and then come back and add a bigger pipeline later? Why not just put a bigger pipeline in for capacity? And I mean, I can see building the tanks as you need them.

Um, very similar situation as well with with with that environment depending upon how the future plays out with the source water that's going to come for these tanks. It's looking like we're going to end up with another pump, which at that point, that second pipeline would be carrying source water. Right now, these tanks would just kind of float online with our existing source um and provide us with the storage that we need. But the uh additional tanks are going to require additional source water to come in. And at that time, that's when the second pipeline will come in into play. [clears throat]

We could potentially I'm asking [clears throat] a whole lot cheaper tomorrow, right? Um, but at the same time, we don't have the funding to try and put in a a 36 inch diameter pipeline at this time, not knowing for sure um how this system's going to operate in the future with source versus use. Um, what do you mean? Cost.

Cost. Yeah, we're currently we're looking at a 16inch line that would go in today and potentially a 24 or 30 in the future depending upon where everything comes in. And a lot of it is is cost as well. Water quality too. Having two separate lines and feeding one versus another. The water can get stagnant on those bigger lines, right? It's also good to have two pipes. So just in case [clears throat] something happens to one, you still have the the other pipe that is

Yes. From a redundancy perspective, um it also gives us some latitude as well to be able to perform work on one um if something goes wrong and have the other one there as a backup. Um we may not be able to fully serve, [clears throat] but we can keep water coming out of the tops in that environment. So you really don't know when you might need those other tanks. You have to get a source. They has to be funed. It has to be growth, right? Growth has to be Yeah, we can look to the to the capital facilities plan um and the remaining source falls out in that 10 to 20 year window

um as well as the the additional tanks. But um [clears throat] from a today's perspective, the decisions that we're making today are kind of sealing the deal for the future. Um there's not any other elevation that's available out there. Um we had to search long and hard to find the elevation here um that wasn't just unbelievably cost prohibitive from a distance perspective.

Lester, let me ask you a question. Um why didn't you recommend taking this this access road further to the north and placing the tanks further to the north, higher up on Washington Dome? Well, once again, we're elevation driven. The elevation, the elevation actually skirts, the elevation that we need skirts down to the southwest and kind of skirts around um in several of them parcels. If you can if you kind of look at the topography and how that lays in there, um it would impact numerous different parcels in the south accommodate the same the same elevation that we need

or we would be dramatically farther distance-wise um on the BLM property. And I think timing wise uh with BLM and the federal government uh if if they're if they're even open to the concept. Last conversations that we had with BLM is that getting rightways from BLM for infrastructure is getting to be very very difficult. Council, additional questions with for Lester before I invite the uh applicant on 6B to come forward. So Lester, this is you've done your homework and this is the location that we need. Yes.

There's not really anywhere else. This is what we have to have to make it work. Right. We look, like I said, we looked at nu numerous parcels up there. Um some of the impacts to the south um just geographically and topographically. I mean, this is some really steep, tough terrain out there to be able to get um, you know, to get these all to work and function the way that they need to and not have dramatic impacts um on additional properties. And you've acquired property for access and pipe road to the to the south.

Yes. So, we already have easement. We do not have ownership fee title fee title ownership back to George Washington Boulevard. We have an easement that carries us north to the beginning of the impacts of this particular project.

Um, and that's, you know, that that's something that we'll we'll continue to look at. We may end up uh approaching them for feat title ownership in the area that we currently have easement. That easement will allow us the ability to get the pipelines in and to use it for access for our purposes. um it will not provide for public open access or or anything like that. So um you know long term things may change um but for today we're looking for a pipeline and tanks. Yep. Um that's that's the infrastructure that we need to get in place.

Thanks Lester. Don't go too far. Uh I see uh I met Terry here with the applicant on item 6P. if you'll come forward and introduce yourself and speak to this item, please. Thank you for making the drive up from Las Vegas. Yes, thank you. Yeah, thank you for right there into the mic there, Terry. I'm Terry Cipher. I'm the co-own co-owner of the property. Pull that right in so they can hear your Say say it one more time. Hi, I'm Terry Cipher. I'm the co-owner of the property. And this is Robert Wagner, my co-owner. Okay. Um, I have some prepared notes, but if I could respond to some of Lester's comments. Time is yours. Yes.

Um, you know, he indicates that the tanks are necessary because of the elevation of the property, but the way the Washington Dome is structured, our property is not anywhere near the top of that of the Washington Dome. And so the BLM property that is the is in the entire north of our property as well as east of our property. Um there's all kinds of higher elevations. So I can maybe explain that elev the the water. Yeah. When you're in a tank, you need the right elevation so that the pressures aren't too high down here. If you go higher, they'll be too high and they won't work.

And then it's also filling the tank meets the same elevation as our current tanks. So it so the system will push the water into the tank without it. Changing the elevation, you can't just go uphill or downhill. It affects the pressure zones of the system. Yes. So that's why the elevation where it's at is so critical.

Okay. The bordering property of the BLM property is really close. I I would say almost exactly the elevation of our property. If not, it's maybe even a little bit lower. So if you move farther up the hill, it does increase in elevation. So there's all kinds of options there that I believe you could get the same elevations from in a very very close distance. It's not I know it was mentioned about the cost of the pipeline, but um you wouldn't have to move the tanks that far. And this this part was a little distressing to me because I've been dealing with Tanya with uh Avenue Consultants. Um and I've you know questioned her because it was this property has been in our family for 60 years. Um and we really wanted to hold on to it. Um but I asked her why BLM wasn't being considered and she told me that uh the BLM is very difficult to work with. um that they would only offer a land lease um and so that this was I mean in essence an e just an easier route for the city to take and that's you know as long as we've held that property that's really upsetting to hear. Um so that's definitely one of my concerns.

What what else and Mr. Wagner if you have anything to add to the time is both of yours. He's got a a statement that he wants to read. Sure. and we're happy to keep a copy of that for the record as well if you'd like.

Okay. Um, I have been talking with a consultant that was hired by the city and have been told there are plans for the construction of one water tank with two more potentially being constructed in the future. I have looked on the city's website and it only mentions the construction of one Majestic tank. There is no mention of other tanks. I have asked for clarification on this and only received a document showing all three tanks. So, I still don't understand, you know, and it was clarified by Lester today that really it's a phased approach. It sounds like that you're only building one tank, but you're trying to condemn property for all three tanks. And I think Lester even mentioned it's going to depend on what happens in with the city as to when or even if those get built. So, so I mean that's what I had been asking for a long time. Um, and so I would be, you know, I understand that the city needs needs, it has its needs, and I don't want to be an impediment to that, but you know, also right now where you're only building one tank, I feel like it's a lot fairer to only take the property that is for immediate construction, not something that could potentially happen down the road because maybe it won't. Um, so I because of all this and I mean me and Bob are non- attorneys. It just all seemed very complicated. We did talk to an attorney. Um, the so this is the comments from my attorney. Utah law prohibits condemning property for which there is no immediate public need. Land banking property for future construction projects is not permitted. In fact, Utah law allows condemnation actions to be reversed for projects which are not constructed and completed within a reasonable time frame. The condemnation here is purported to be for three tanks, but my understanding is the city only plans to start construction for one of those tanks. The city cannot condemn land for

three tanks when it only intends to build one now. Land banking land for future tanks violates Utah law. It is excessive and not limited to what is need for an existing public use. Um to go on, our property is 10 acres. The city seeks approximately 7 acres. Uh but again, to my understanding, the property is not needed for current construction plans. Therefore, the taking is excessive and not permitted because there's no existing public use of three tanks, only one tank. Um if the city authorizes the taking for full for the full seven acres, it will be challenged in court and we believe the im imminent domain action will be dismissed. Um and then an access regarding the access road. Um because there was some discussion about the way the access road comes into our property and the way they want to take the seven acres is that unless we have access to that road, it would cut me off from access accessing my remaining property. Um so again a concern. Um the city does not need this is the attorney. The city does not need to condemn the access road and fee simple unless it intends to make it a public road. The city could simply condemn an access easement for the road if all it is using for is accessing the tank. Utah law requires that the project be constructed with the least private injury. Condemning a large swath of our property for a road is not necessary and does not cause the least amount of private injury. Uh regardless if the city condemns the property and fees simple or an easement for the access road, we request that the city council uh confirm that we have the right to use the access uh the use the road to access our remaining property. Um otherwise you'll be leaving our property landlocked. Um the city has offered no compensation for leaving the property landlocked. Um so we're assuming that we would have the right to access that on the on the uh on

that road. Um, can I ask you a quick question? Yes. So, is this the only parcel you own in the area? Yes. [clears throat] Aren't you currently landlocked? Uh, no. Because we have access through BLM. How do you have access through BLM? And the road that goes and just share that mic there, Robert. Thank you. The road that that uh you was just pointing out goes right to the the southeast corner of our property. I I was on it a week ago. Yeah. and it goes within five feet of the stake that stakes the

but there's a legal access easement that goes across that or is it just a dirt road? Again, I'm not an attorney, but I've read and my understanding through the through the other adjacent property owner is that he has confirmed multiple times with the BLM that if the BLM land borders your property and there's existing roads there, the BLM will honor th those roads, those existing roads. I'm just asking what what type of access you

have or don't have. I just know there's a bunch of properties in here that are kind of landlocked as well. Exactly. And that's what I mean ours is a little bit differentiated because we do have access to from the BLM site is my understanding. Again, you know, I'm not an attorney. I appreciate that. Um, and I think as mentioned by the attorney, Mr. PCEL earlier, you know, we also have concerns with the appraisal that was that was done. Um, the appraiser said he had a very difficult time finding comparable properties. One of the comparables was in a flood zone in a wash over in Bloomington. Um, and the others were questionable as well. So, and four years old.

Very little adjustment for what's happened in the price. Yeah. With the prices. Uh, so in summary, [laughter] we request that you limit the resolution to condemning only what is currently necessary for the city's funded tank construction project. The city should also only condemn an easement rather than a road in fe simple. Uh we also request that the city confirm that we will have the right to use the access road in the future to accessing the remaining property. So, we really appreciate it. And like I said,

there there's one other thing, too, and that is we're not we're not anxious to have this the city have to go we're not anxious to have the city have to go through uh the condemnation process. We would prefer to to deal with the city and and uh and make everybody happy. Um but uh we have to look at our concerns as well. And so, uh, the consider the consideration of the what we call a very low appraisal. Um, Mr. Burus's attorney has comps according to or Mr. Burus told us that he has comps that are very, very different, but because Utah is a is a state that doesn't require all sales to be public, we didn't have access to those. So, we we needed some time to access those other comps to see uh uh what he's talking about because the the numbers are polarized. Like, you couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe it when he told me what he's saying his propertyy's worth. I I couldn't believe it. Um but so anyway, we'd like to work with the city and we'd like to come to a to an agreement with the city and we're not this the the idea of litigation is a last resort. It's not our it's not our primary concern.

Um my grandmother's not buried on that property, so I'm not that worried about it, but [laughter] but [clears throat] uh uh we would we would prefer to deal with the city uh than to not deal with the city. Whose grandmother is buried there? Nobody [laughter] know. To the best of my knowledge, nobody's unless it's some Indian back in the before we v owned it. Yeah. So, um that's all I wanted to add is is it it sounded like we we want to go to court. We don't want to go to court.

We would prefer to to settle. Um but but you know, we've been told, you know, a lot of different things that didn't work out to be the same. And they were talking about easements. And I talked to somebody here and they told me if we signed the easement to be able to access the property, we gave up none of our rights. Then the easement came to us and we read it. And and it said you give up 100% of your rights. All you can do is negotiate the price. And so I'm going, well, why did you tell us we gave up none of our rights, so we didn't sign the easement. But if the ement would have said what they said it said, we would have signed it immediately. So then we went to the arms budsman and the honest budman said you if once you sign that paper you have no right to the land. All you can do is argue about uh the price you're being paid for it.

I'll just clarif clarify council. It was the occupancy agreement. It wasn't an easement document. It was the occupancy agreement. Okay. Whatever they told us if we'd signed it we gave up none of our rights. And both the arms budsman and our attorney said don't sign this. You give up 100% of your rights. Yeah. And right our point is we don't have a problem letting him go on the land and use it. Yeah. Cuz I think you they wanted to go in and start sampling and and testing and we were totally fine with that. We want you know we do want to work with the city but when we saw we gave up all our rights we didn't you know we weren't willing to sign that.

Well really appreciate your your remarks and your feedback. This is this is very helpful. Appreciate um your prepared comments and and the comments you you made tonight. Is there anything else that you'd like to say? No. Okay. Thank you, Terry. Robert, appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you.

Um, Lester or Thad, is there anything you'd like to say before we open the public hearing and then uh we'll or or Blake and and really again tonight it's public hearing. We're not taking it we're not taking a vote. We're just this the the pro the as that explained earlier this is just the first step. uh in the process fad and then and then Blake it looks like

mayor I won't say much more but I I do want to emphasize that this city and its legal department embrace the public's right to be involved with an imminent domain decision if that's what the council decides to do. Um I also want to just make sure that it's clearly stated this is a project where there is not a current road. So a road needs to be built and constructed both for access for construction and for perennial maintenance thereafter. And within that road rightway there needs to be the placement of permanent structures of pipelines and service elements that go with that. And then at the top of it there needs to be the placement of permanent water tanks and the structures that go with that. And so for that reason, the public works department prefers the concept of an acquisition and fee because the city's going to be needing it to cross to drive across to to dig and install within to dig and repair within. Um, we might be able to work and and I'll I'll commit to do this on behalf of the council. I'll work with the public works department and see if there's solutions to how that road could be used by others or whether that others can cross that road to get to the BLM because those are those are interesting issues and probably issues that we haven't looked at close enough until again we get the commentary in a public hearing and that's why we do these. Um and so we'll we'll work on some of those things. Um in eminent domain the hardest points always the battle of appraisals. um the city didn't go farm their favorite appraiser. We just used the reputable appraiser in town and state law allows the land owners to go get their appraiser. And so we support that. We embrace that. And um if if if they'll obtain those, that'll give us the chance to to talk in the direction of both appraisals and the amounts that they show.

Thank you, Blake. and we know you but for the record. Yeah. Uh yeah. Blake FSC, public works director. Um I just wanted to as as there was talk about the tanks and the tank farm. Um the reason that we have set this up, one of the reasons is the fact that we we see this demand happening. And in our master plan, we actually had these three tanks in they weren't all in this location, but we had this is the only place we could find where we could maximize our So there were three tanks, but not necessarily in the same location.

Correct. And and as we looked at sites, some of those we had looked at at one down in the BLM kind of uh east of the airport. Um but they that's when they kind of told us that no we're not really interested in doing any more um water tank and that's where all the elevation was. And so so we got this idea to put this all together. Um but the way this is going to work is we're already behind for the first tank because of the length of time we've had just in trading in terms of demand

in demand and in in being able to construct it. um we haven't even been able to design yet because we can't get on the property to do that. And so so we have the design and and uh testing of the first one, but then the way our capital facilities plan is put out, we will probably by the time that first one's done, we'll be designing and and preparing to do the next one soon after that. We we really over the next five to seven years um we'll be doing three. We actually have four tanks. There's one other tank that's uh that we have planned in further out, but but these will be the three critical ones with all the growth in Aura and and those areas down there. This is critical to get these moving and otherwise we run into issues with fire flow and other things like that. So, so it's a critical thing and it won't Yeah, we're not building it all at the same time, but it will be like one right after another after another um is what the plan is. When you say that fourth tank is further out, is that further out in time or further out in location?

It's further out in time. So, but it would be it would still be at the same location. So, no, the fourth tank will be somewhere else. Okay. So, time and location. Yeah. Okay. Never [clears throat] mind. Yeah, you're right. So anyway, I just want to make that clear that we're we're in a I mean storage is everything when you're talking about the large commercial projects that are going in industrial projects and that um and fireflow is is what we need. And so in those senses, we're we're doing this to really keep that going and and it's growing so fast out there that we're we're scrambling as it is. that. So, we won't be sitting around with an empty space for very long. So,

Oh, understood. Thank you, Blake. Thanks. Thank you.

Appreciate [clears throat] it. At this time, uh, I am going to officially open the public hearing for items 6B and 6 C in regards to, uh, eminent domain of certain property along with all associated rights in that property known as Washington County tax partial ID W-5-2-36-11 and W-5-2-36-118. Is there anyone from the public who would like to speak to these items? Seeing none, I will close the public hearing for both items 6B and 6 C and we will move on in the agenda to uh item number seven. additional actually you know that's right additional uh comment or discussion amongst the council I apologize about that council I should have thought that

go ahead councilman Ivy so that I'm just wondering um the land owners specifically said that imminent domain for one tank as a pair opposed to three is there a difference or is it a distinction without a difference or help me understand

so so the the city's not allowed to take by imminent domain power a piece of land that they hope to use someday. In this case, the city has identified the elevations, identified the quantity of gallons of water that need to be stored at that elevation, identified the route for the pipelines and how that'll connect to the system and service all the area around it. And so um the city feels that there is a pretty good basis for an eminent domain taking even though one3 or 2/3 of the tanks may not be built for a year year or two or three or four or five because all of those end up working in a system together

and the first tank needs the road just as much as three tanks need the road. So specifically that what I what I want to know is we can do them in a domain for one tank same as three tanks only we're just we need one now and possibly three in the future. So the the the challenge becomes where on their 10acre parcel do you want to place the one tank, right? And a point that would get debated as well, right? They would probably ask you to take it on the farthest corner so that you don't touch anything else and then you'd be coming back in two years or whatever to take the next tank and take the next one. um the city's preference and the city thinks the fairest part would be to let them know early and often, you know, how much how much acreage the city's going to want to take and and and deal with that upfront. But do I think the council could parcel it out to one at a time? I think you could if you wanted. I I know that works is planning more than one at a time.

That's the thing there's a significant cost if we do that top of just the land. you you're back out this whole process again and then the additional grading cost and building the tank like it's just ads and ads and ads and and you also have to then protect that property from from development which makes it somewhat useless for the property owner because we we don't want anything else to happen there because we need to try to save it for a future tank. this does that and accomplishes all this and it and it makes sense that was

yeah the site if acquired would be graded and it' be cuts and fills of slopes and so it would be you know just prepared with whatever and different elements for a for a site for three for a tank farm not just for a single tank and then one tank or three the road and it are all going same access need. Do you know about the access from the BLM? Are they do you know about that?

I'm aware of a lot of trails out through there and and it makes sense to me that the owners are aware of which one gets to their land. I do believe the BLM has a policy of saying you yourself can access your land with that, but I don't believe the BLM would allow them to subdivide into 50 lots and invite 50 new owners to access. Um I don't think the BLM would allow them to and pave it like the city would require support a a development for example. And so um the city putting a road through there is is a value for these land owners if if it's road that is determined that they can use and again we haven't had thatation. That's a request that's come up today. But

I do believe there is a road to the land today that they believe they're being candid with the city and when they say that I don't believe the BLM would agree that that road could be split into 50 lots and serve 50 driveways for 50 houses on that land though all the utilities as well. Right. Correct. They across for any sort of subdivision sort of development of a residence or any other structure up there. they would need to have a much more diff different process through the BLM than just the dirt road that gets them across the surface today.

So, so mayor, I more have just a a statement is that I mean I don't I don't take this and I know the council doesn't take eminent domain lightly. Like there's been a process to understand appraisals have been out, offers have been made. I know that we've even talked about doing more than the appraised value to help kind of make it better. I just felt like we came to an impass where we couldn't [clears throat] the value they wanted was way too much compared to what the appraisal came back and and I think we want to resolve it either. None of us want to go through eminent domain but at the crit the critical aspect of this is we have to get going and and if we can work it out in the meantime before we have to make that decision I'm all about it. I just it's critical that we get these water tanks going and but I mean this is the first time I've had to do this in six years on council and I don't want to I don't want to do it. I'd rather just work it out and make an agreement. We just have to agree on what what makes sense for the public and and the property owners who own the property who have value. We just got to come to an agreement. So if we can just figure that out in the next couple weeks, then we need to move forward. Terry, Robert, and I'm not inviting you back up, but just looking for a nod. Um I I assume you're happy to continue those conversations with staff here and and and you probably have similar um motiv motivation to find a

Okay,

gentlemen, have you been with the budsman's representatives long enough to to have assistance to get a second appraisal? Are you aware that state law will require that the city pay for that appraisal? Because I think that might help if you could work through the embudsman to identify the appraiser and then that what the way it works is that unbudsman will essentially send the appraisers's invoice to the city. Um and then the city would pay for that and that would get us another appraisal to help with with those discussions on value. the other kind of sticking point. Come on back up

after I promise you, but this is helpful. So I'm I really appreciate everybody's time. Um so so the other uh sticking point was you know giving the whole seven acres right now because even tonight there has been discussion about you know how far down the road will you need all three tanks versus one and you know we could get a a deal done really I think really quickly if the parcel that you're looking for was smaller Um, but that would really, you know, help us out because the way

So, let me let me I'm gonna just gonna I'm not trying to cut you off. I just I think what we're trying to say is we need all seven acres out of and and you might not think that, but we feel like we do need it to fit the three tanks, which we're going to build back to back to back, right? So my question to you is your sticking point that you don't want to be left with only three acres based on the valuation that we're receiving because Utah is a non-disclosure state and it's very difficult to find comparables are the valuation came in what I would say is very very low. No I'm not asking valuation I'm asking acres.

Yes. Are you because one of the thoughts that went through my head through this process is okay if I own 10 acres trying to buy seven they should just buy all 10. We don't need 10. So we them 10 but well yes I mean the city offered to buy all 10 as well. Well I understand that because we said we would buy all 10 if that was the situation based on appraise value. Yes.

And we have an appraiser and that's the value and and we don't need to get into all the details. We can differently with you can work that with staff. My question to you is are you opposed to the seven acres because you have three remaining or are you opposed to the seven acres? I I just don't understand why you're opposed to the seven but you're okay with the smaller. I guess that's where I'm trying to understand why. because the valuation is so low and just kind of as you mentioned um over time the value there'll be more sales in the area which I think will give us a more accurate representation of what that land is really worth and so I mean you kind of mentioned that before is that you'd like to get it all now at this price because the price is going to continue to go up because of this price

you mentioned that I thought if I did I misspoke I'm what I'm saying is that we need the land now so we can construct what we need to constru construct because we have to build the site, the roadway, the water lines and the pads for the three tanks. Tanks might not build because of the cost that it takes to build. Now, does that make sense? Is that It does make sense what you're saying, but I didn't I mean, I didn't It sounded like you could get away with one tank now and that the city only needed one tank. But so, I'm just going to run a scenario, right? Because this is how I think. Say we needed one tank today. We're saying in the next year or two we need the second tank too. Yeah. I've heard anything from two to five years though on when you need the tank.

Two to two to five years. But the way I'm looking at it is it's more when we look at the public funds and how we spend it. It would cost so much more to build that site at one anchor one because you have common space between it all. So it's more costefficient for the city to build the site now as we build the tanks in progression. Right. So, I think that's why we're saying that's why I'm asking you want it smaller so you can get more money in a year or two is what we just want a fair we just want a fair price. And if you saw the appraisal and the other comparables,

I looked at them. I know what they were. Um, and it sounds like if we get a second appraisal and we'll just have to keep evaluating because if you go through this process, correct me if I'm wrong with that, they go off appraise value. It's not like you're not getting compensated for your land. they go the judge will decide. Yes. But that the appraised value um is is a huge spectrum now. And like you said, the there there may potentially be some other comparables already that are way higher and

and and if I know anything, appraisers, they can be all over the place. I don't know. Right. I'm just telling you, it's not like we picked the we just use one that's been used that around the area. I guess all I'm saying is that It's just the I understand you value your property as a much higher than what the appraiser, but that's what we have to work off is what the appraiser gave us. Yeah, I understand that. And like you said, we can see what the next appraiser says because all we really want Well, I mean, we'd like to hold on to the property, but under the circumstances, it doesn't seem like that's an option. So, right. So, what we're really what I would say we're focused on is a fair price for the property. Just to give you

Robert, speaking to the mic there, we want to hear you.

Just to give you some spectrum. Okay. 15 years ago, I bought 20% of this property for $60,000 an acre. 15 years ago, prices here are much greater than they were 15 years ago. And the city's appraisal came in at $40,000 an acre. And when I talked to Mr. Burus, he said to me that he Oh, anyway. Well, I can't not now. He said that he has had interest at $400,000 an acre. And that is just such a that's not even reasonable. But, you know, that leads me to believe that maybe somewhere even down to the lower side of the middle is possible. And so we're we're hoping that it that in the very near future we get some comps that that uh that show what the propertyy's worth, you know, and that's all we want is what it's worth. And and I can't believe and and the appraisal that we got appraised it according to a piece of land that was in a flood zone that sold four years ago. Uh, and no adjustment for what's happened to land, almost no adjustment, like 5% or something for what's happened to land in Washington in the last uh uh four years. And if any of you guys are in the land business, land in Washington has gone up more than 4% in the last four or five years. And so, we had an objection or a disappointment with the appraisal. And then we've tried to to talk to other appraisers who come back with the same thing. There's no land anywhere in public record that that gives us an estimate. All I want to know is what it's worth. I don't believe it's

worth 400,000 an acre. I don't believe it's worth 40,000 an acre. And it's in a unique place where none is sold that we can get information. Not even the the stuff that the city's bought. They won't disclose the information for what they've bought. So that's kind of what's forcing us is all we want. It's a a fair price. I'm not asking for $400,000 an acre. I I think we're all saying the same thing. I mean, it sounds like it's coming down to price for you. Oh, yeah.

We We can't wait two years foration. So, I think the process is to get a second appraisal, which you get and the city pays for, and that's the process that we go off of. I totally understand that you you want it to be more. Everybody wants the maximum value, right? We want it to be less. I I I'm not I'm not arguing with you. We want it as low as we can get it. You want it as high. But there is a process and we do have to do that process and move on. And at some point, if we if we can't, then this is the process that happens, right? And I think we're all understanding of that.

The legislature has dictated that the price be fair. State law says that the city must pay a fair price and state law says that the fair price is determined by appraisers licensed by the state. And so, and so the challenge we have is when the appraisers are looking for comps, if you take like a residential lot, there's a lot of comparative comparables. This is a piece of land that is too high. Today, you couldn't run water service to this land from any Washington city tank. Even if you had the money to build it all there, there's not enough pressure to run water to this tank site. When the tanks are built, there won't be enough pressure to run water to this tank site. And so one of the reasons why a a uh piece of land in a flood plane was used is because it also didn't have utility services. And so I don't disagree with your effort. I think you're entitled to seek a fair fair price. But the challenge with the science of appraising is there's not like a residential lot where you have hundreds and hundreds of those around the area. There's not a lot of parcels like this out there that have been bought and sold because the parcels being bought and sold are the ones that have been accessible for development. And so so that's the challenge. Um if if you don't settle it in in just negotiations, eventually both sides bring their appraiser to a court of law and a judge hears them give their opinions. Then a judge tries to find the fair price between those two appraisers. And so the the legislaturator is ma making it be fair, but it's making it be fair through the science of appraising, which in some pieces of property types, the science is not quite as deep as it is on on others. And so so that's the challenge on this one.

So, but we're thinking that we we should have access to some other comps shortly. Um the the the person that that has the other comps had basically said to us that he felt like the person said to me that he felt like if he made an an agreement with the city, the city would require that he doesn't share those comps with anybody else. And I didn't I didn't believe that that was necessarily true. Um but [clears throat]

the city doesn't go farm up comps. The city hires appraisers licensed by the state. This appraisers licensed by the state go do their their science as to comps and then they issue their professional opinion as to an appraisal. City couldn't wouldn't prevent him from sharing his comps with someone [clears throat] else. Don't get involved with comps. We we hire appraisers and we lean on what appraisers say the value is. Yeah. So anyway, that's all I had to say. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, gentlemen. Any further discussion amongst council ask who the appraiser was that did this one Lester do you remember the name Lester? I can pull it up from documents but

we'll get it. We don't we're good. We'll get it to you.

No worries. Well, uh, I think what we've accomplished tonight, we've held the first public hearings and we've opened up the conversation and we're happy to continue that conversation with amongst the staff and the property owners. Next item of business is item seven, conditional use permit. 7A is a consideration to approve conditional use permit C-25-12. Update the facade for a retail business located at 720 West Telegraph Street. Community Development Director Elden Gibb. Thank you, Mayor Council. This is an existing building. Joann's used to be in there. You can see up in the upper leftand corner is what it what it looks like today. And the bigger photo there is what they're proposing. The new exterior finishes are located on the front of the building and include a flat roof line adding lighter stucco to the entrance way as shown on the exhibit. Staff has reviewed the proposed project and finds that it meets the requirements of the C2 use regulations as found in the zoning ordinance. Staff has no concerns with the proposal. Commission reviewed this request on November 5th, 2025 and unanimously recommended approval with the findings and conditions as outlined below. That concludes staff report. I'm happy to answer any questions at this time.

Questions for staff? If not, I'll entertain them. Further discussion andor a motion to approve. Mayor, I can make a I can make a motion to approve. Um before before I do that though, I'd just like to make one quick comment. Um, I think this is just another great uh project in our city to help with our tax base and good work to Rusty and everyone that may be. Make a motion to approve a conditional use permit C-25-12. Update the facade for a retail business located at 720 West Telegraph Street. I have a motion by Councilman Ivy. Second. Second by Councilman Colts. Roll call beginning with Council Member Bellon. Henderson. Colts. I. Ivy Casperson.

I is approved. Five to zero. Next item, report of officers from assigned committee. We'll start on my left with Councilman Bellaston. Councilman Henderson. I don't have anything, Mayor. Thank you. Councilman Coats. Uh I don't have anything with my committee. More of just uh thanks to public works on the you'll see the landfill roads starting to be paved. Um so I appreciate their hard work getting that through. Um, and as far as it's oneway traffic, so it might be a little frustrating to people, but just because of the nature of the having to go one certain way.

Um, looks like they're almost done with one side and they'll be able to flop to the other side and get the through on that BMP, Mr. now some kind of membrane. And then

one of one of the things that cost savings, right, is instead of ripping up the whole road, putting in new base, and adding a super thick layer of asphalt, uh Andy and Public Works, uh they'd use this. It's like a grid membrane to help uh protect it. Like I said, it's not a full rebuild of the road. It's more of a a patch, a large patch. And so it's a geo fabric that goes down, it sticks, and then they pave over the top to help kind of so that the old cracks in the old asphalt don't come up through. So it's more of a temporary solution that gets us hopefully over the next 10 years why we saved to redo the road in 10 years. Something something we want to test, see how it might work in other areas. So this is a good really good test because nowhere else has the big trucks running on it. If it works well here, it might work well in other applications. I'm I'm super excited. Like that whole area is going to be a real nice area here shortly. And we got those new homes from Cole West going in and I just think it's going to it's not going to feel like a landfill road. It's feel like a country here in a minute. So [clears throat]

that's that's all I have to report. Well said. Thank you, Councilman. Councilman Ivy.

Mayor, I'm going to use time just to talk about something we mentioned in the council meeting a couple of weeks ago where we had talked a little bit about identifying commercial properties within the within the city. uh our current general plan is 2017 and I think there's been some exposures from you know maybe uh areas of the city that have now developed or other development has now presented um commercial properties and so just had a good conversation with Rusty Elden just wanted to tell the rest of the council I think that's a a good effort for us to look at um in an effort also I think there's some code to update streamlining processes which is all part of our regulatory reform and then mayor when they report back um I would ask that maybe we could have a a work meeting in the blue sky room just to discuss this going forward. I think it's key and important for our city that we identify these commercial parcels so that we can be out in the head of development and be ready when when people come and want to build businesses in our city. But uh great conversation with those two and look forward to having that conversation going forward with your approval. Thank you, Councilman Ivy. Councilwoman Caspersonson.

Yeah, I just want to report that the historic canal trail is 90% complete. That's exciting. I went on a walk on it and it's, you know, really nice. It's not open yet. I had to observe, make sure everything was It's not open yet. It's our committee assignment. I'll get you a life or a safety vest to walk down it so you looked official. I um will not answer that question. Hat just saying hat got to keep it safe and you're you're telling us you're the problem. Commitment to my assignment. Next time I'll give you a tour. [laughter]

Okay. Yeah. And then um there's some workshops coming up for the Washington City Arts Council. One this Saturday, November November 15th, there's an ornament workshop. And then December 6th, there's a water color holiday card workshop. And Jeremy would like to attend that, he just said. And then also, I just want to say thank you to everyone that was part of the Veterans Day celebration. That was just such an amazing day to be part of and to live in the this community and just appreciate everyone's, you know, the involvement to make it such a wonderful day. Well said. Thank you, Councilwoman. Uh the uh city council was awarded the uh a certificate for being hack approved, which stands for the housing action coalition and uh it's our commitment to uh helping individuals attain housing within our community. It was our uh privilege to host the uh annual uh housing action coalition symposium uh last week at Heritage Hall. We had a great turnout from among the community. uh many of our staff and our council were there and participated in uh in looking for solutions for uh more attainable housing ownership options for uh in particular uh the rising generation within our community. Uh I'll also uh just make note that uh we do have the uh just a reminder that we'll have a special meeting on November 18th at 4 p.m. for the canvasing of the election. That should be quick, but that will be here. Uh, if we have close session items, we might stay for just a little bit afterwards. That's going to be on a Tuesday,

November 18th at 4 p.m. And the recorder will get that on your calendars. And then, uh, also, um, with the Thanksgiving holiday, we only and the Christmas holiday, we only have one more, uh, workshop and regular meeting scheduled. That's going to be on Wednesday, December 10th. So, I just wanted you to kind of be aware aware of that. And we will look for a uh probably a a day trip for our uh retreat sometime in January and with the with the water district trip. I'll I'm waiting for more information on that. So, mayor, we not having council on the 26th. Is that what you said?

That's right. We only have uh one more uh regular scheduled meeting uh and that's going to be on December 10th. All right. Thank you. That's [clears throat] a question I'll have to ask. Uh, probably. Yeah. Yeah. I'll get with the with the district over there and try to work through some of those logistics. That's awesome. ever. Me and her are going to have a good time. We're going to talk all about water.

The next item of business is a city manager report. Jeremy Red, I I cannot follow that. Mayor, I don't have anything to add. We do not have need for a close session tonight. So, I'll call for a motion to adjurnn. So moved. I have a motion by Councilman Coat, second by Council Bellson. All in favor? I. We are adjourned until the 18th.