Town Council - Regular Meeting

It's the most sign Good evening everybody. Welcome to the uh December

regularly scheduled town council meeting. I'd like everybody to stand for the pledge of allegiance. Pledge of allegiance. United to the republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

So first on the agenda we have the uh public comment which is an opportunity for anyone in the public to come forward and uh let the council have a have an opportunity to speak in front of the council on an issue that isn't on the agenda, but the opportunity is yours. Now, remember the this isn't an issue that's on the agenda. This is an opportunity for uh to speak on a Yes. So, if you want to speak about civil rights and privacy or immigration or flock, that's on the agenda. So that opportunity will be later on in the meeting. This is the public comment period where people have an opportunity to speak on a non-aggenda item. You're still going to Okay. He's coming.

Hi. Yes. And just wanted to

ah just wanted to uh um comment about the uh instance that happened uh on at Veterans Day down on Water Street when um uh some ICE agents came and apprehended a person that worked at Blown Seafood. And um it was a you know um pretty upsetting to see um you know uh paramilitary type people squad of them coming in and zooming up and down the street and grabbing someone and uh and I think that's really concerning. So, I think as as a town really needs to respond to that uh as a community and um and I think that I hope that the council eventually will um enact some an ordinance of of some kind to talk about protecting the civil rights of uh of um of all the people who work and live here in Warren. And um and I know the flock thing is the flock cameras are on the agenda and but I'd urge you to vote not to allow any um uh flock cameras to be installed in order. But thanks.

You're welcome. Speak of the Yeah, these are for non-aggenda items. An opportunity for someone to speak to bring an an issue to our attention that's not on the agenda.

Yeah. Thank you. Okay, next we have a recognition. We have a recognition of a Warren resident, Mr. Christopher Stone. And unfortunately, he couldn't be here this evening because he had a work. He has to work tonight. And he's a very responsible young man. And we know this in his actions. And we know this also because Christopher received the highest rank in scouting. and he's an Eagle Scout. So, we're going to have him come back hopefully next month when he can coordinate his schedule with our schedule and we will publicly recognize him other than this right now opportunity that we're we're giving him. So, next month, Christopher Stone, Eagle Scout, will be here. I also uh should let everybody know I'm not wearing a tie until I can tie one myself. So, for those of you who wonder why I don't have a tie, that's the reason. So, I'm looking disheveled because that's my look.

I don't have a tie either, Joe. Well, you don't look dish. [laughter]

I guess you don't have a shirt on. I very tire. So, we uh lighten the the the mood a little with my Thai comment because as we go about our lives, sometimes our moods can be happy and light and other times they can be dreary and heavy and we drag through the day and our days are miserable and we wish they would just never end because they're not what we want them to be. But tonight we're going to look at look at the side of life that we rarely get an opportunity to look at and that's where someone's declared dead and then through the actions of others brought back to life and it's pretty remarkable and it happened here in Warren. Mr. Ed Woodick, who's sitting right here in the second row, is the uh reason that we're having this uh thank you to our DPW workers as well as our rescue personnel. Ed suffered a heart attack at 9:12. It was what? November 10th. Ed was at sip and dip doing what he usually likes to do. Go and have a coffee, see his former town workers chatted up. And he probably never thought cuz he didn't have any any uh anything happened prior to this. He thought it was going to be a good day. And [clears throat] it was because at 912 he went down no heartbeat dead and Mario Canario, Michael Briggs,

Vincent Arangado, and Victor Reese as well as Jeffrey Mones. They're all here tonight. Why don't you guys come on down? They began CPR. Chief, why don't you come on down, Ed? This is your first opportunity to see these guys.

Thank you, President. So, I want to take this opportunity to thank you guys as well and give the public a rundown the events of that morning. Um, Mr. Woodick, you know, great to see you here and to speak to you a few times since even some of these details were blurry to you. You know, so it starts on November 10th approximately 9:12. As council president said, Warren police and rescue were dispatched to a local coffee staff establishment, Sip and Dip, for report of an unresponsive meal. On arrival, warrant police officers found CPR already in progress being performed by on-site DPW workers. Officers officers immediately assisted and advised dispatch to notify rescue that CPR was in progress. Warren rescue arrived at 9:14 and assumed patient care from police and DPW personnel. And at that time they also per protocol requested additional manpower due to the nature of the incident. On scene was initially was a full ALS crew but with what they were faced with they they wanted more assistance. This request brought additional rescue members and personnel from engine company 5 to the scene. I'd like to also ask to come up at this time the couple additional rescue members that showed up uh that morning. Captain of rescue Jack Kazone and Assistant Chief Pimeiano. both in town that day. Matt was here at work and uh we all responded in. You know, these two individuals jumped right in with their skills um adding to the events that we have before us today. CPR continued along with advanced life support measures including tribulation and the administration of many medications for approximately 20 minutes. At 9:35 the patient regains spontaneous heartbeat and as for a protocol that determines that we stay on scene another

10 minutes continuing that advanced life support. So it was done after that 10 minutes transport to the hospital took place and just to close it out you know by time that crew left the hospital Mr. Woodick was sitting up and talking to him conscious and alert. It's without question that the immediate actions the DPW workers initiating CPR and promptly alerting emergency personnel directly contributed to the successful recovery that we have before us today. So on behalf behalf of myself, I'm grateful for all your response and what you did. But I'm going to turn it back over to council president for the acknowledgement from the town council. This is just a little something to uh let you know physically what you do emotionally to us and for us in recognition of successful life-saving measures performed during a critical incident that occurred in Warren on November 10th. This is for the Warren rescue. and Mario. It reads the same.

Thank you.

And Victor's not here. And Vincent is is where's Vincent? Vincent right here. Michael, thank you.

And Jeff Mon isn't here, so I think we should give them all a standing ovation. Would you Like I've said in the past, we never know what 10 minutes from now bring. So tell the people you love you love them. Hug the people you wish you hugged. You hug them. And when you hear those sirens, there's somebody laying there hoping to God they get there quicker and knowing what they're doing. Eddie wouldn't be with us. This is a miracle and it shows that the dedicated efforts and training as well as our DPW uh saves lives. So, think about that when you're going through your day and feeling bad. Smile because you might not have been here. Thank you. It's a great thing that our men and women do. And next we have presentation. This is on the flock camera. This is my colonel. Is it

Captain? Captain Captain Weaver. No. All right. So, uh, Darnell couldn't be here. All right. [laughter] So, the way that we're going to conduct this meeting is we're going to allow the trooper to give his presentation. We'll have opportunity for people to speak for or against. We'll start with people in favor. We'll end with people against and then the council will take uh an action. Sir, come on down.

President, council men and women, thank you for having me. Uh going to be a little I'm going to make it as fast as possible, but I want all the residents and everyone involved to understand what Flock's about and dispel some of the the rumors. And I'm doing it because I believe truly believe the town of Warren and the residents should have it. But anyway, regarding flock safety cameras, the Rhode Island State Police are committed to enhancing public safety, eliminating crime, and strengthening highway security across multiple jurisdictions throughout the state. Automatic license plate recognition cameras have and will continue to help enable the ability to support modern policing through data-driven resource optimized solutions. Block safety cameras provide automated vehicle recognition, real-time alerts, and advanced analytics. These capabilities significantly aid law enforcement in responding to active threats such as mass shootings, school shootings, etc. Investigating crimes and maintaining situational awareness. [clears throat] These cameras help maximize investigative efficiency and provide real-time alerts such as amber alerts for missing children or kidnapped children, silver alerts for elderly people that are missing, and uh what's soon going to come as purple alerts for missing adults with intellectual disabilities that's coming out soon. Those things would be entered through the NCIC, the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, and other customized hot lists. And if a vehicle that we're looking for specifically goes past the flock camera and there's something in the NCIC nickmeck or customized hot list, it's going to alert to us. It's going to help us find them quicker. Flock safety cameras maximize the ability to collaborate across jurisdictions and respond swiftly to emerging threats. These cameras offer a vital enhancement to our public safety infrastructure, improving situ situational awareness and investigative outcomes. Their deployment aligns with both technological

advancement and operational efficiency while respecting civil liberties through robust privacy protocols. Currently in the state of Rhode Island, Flock Technology is utilized by 14 municipalities, five commercial properties, two Department of Housing and Urban Developmental Communities, one neighborhood association, one town school and district, and one college campus of Rhode Island College. Ethically, there is no facial recognition being found on the cameras. There's no speed tracking, no undiscerning evidence gathered. Flock safety cameras have no public IP and therefore are not able to be remotely accessed. All data collection points are equipped with secure communication protocols to protect data in transit from interception and tampering. All data is encrypted using industry standard algorithms before being transmitted to the servers. There is a 30-day retention period of information gathered that is permanently deleted after that time frame. In addition to being certified by the FBI's Criminal Justice Information Services, they are compliant with the National Defense Authorization Act, the Higher Education Community Vendor Assessment Tool, HIPPA, and Family Educational Rights. They're also aligned with the security protocols established by the National Institute of Standards and Technology, Cyber Security, as well as the Cloud Security Alliances framework. Not only do cameras aid in investigations, but they also assist aid in exonerating suspects. I assure you, the use of the Flock cameras, the goal of law enforcement is not to jump to immediate conclusions, which we do not do. The cameras are there to provide a great investigative lead that can fill many gaps within an investigation. Now, I can there's so many testimonials that we've already seen positively throughout the state. Uh I can go on and on. One, for instance, I don't know if you've seen that murder that happened in Central Falls where those six six to eight people arrested. Block cameras watched them go from Central Falls to Pucket and back to back to Central

Falls. Help that case solved. Unbelievable. Um, the town of Warren is not being asked to sign up with Flock as the contract will be between the Rhode Island State Police and Flock. As Flock encourages his customers to create policies and guidelines, the Rhode Island State Police will be operating on a stringent policy as well as a memorandum of understanding with other agencies who we allow them to share data with. This will include not providing any information related to immigration issues. This project will be moving forward with or without a camera being deployed in this town. However, I feel that the request is denied. You're taking away a great investigative tool from your residents that will be provided at no cost. The state police is covering the cost. It's the town of Warren will pay nothing. Is also the intention of the Rhode Island State Police to provide full access to our statewide camera system to the members of the Warren Police Department to aid them in investigations that crimes are going over town lines. They're going all statewide and it will help everybody. Flock cameras do not provide any personal information and only capture information that is of public knowledge. Similarly, the Rhode Island turnpike and Bridge Authority has transponders in place that record every time a vehicle drives over the bridge. Also, in other cities and towns, the red light and speed cameras are obtaining license plates on a regular basis. A flock camera is not very different than utilizing a closed circuit television camera at a business or other security cameras such as doorbell and residential cameras. The bottom line, I'm trying to to make the state of Rhode Island a safer place and provide its investigators with the necessary tools to successfully do our jobs. The Rhode Island State Police is very driven on accountability to that point based on the projected policy and memorandum understanding. Users will be held accountable for their use of the flat camera system as there is a documented search history. Remember this, as law enforcement tactics and technology advance, so do the criminals. Some of the claims I want to dispel right off the bat is ALPRs do not track

vehicles in the entirety of their movements. Rather, they take a point in time image of the rear of the vehicles on public roadways. Flock cameras are only taking pictures of the back of vehicles. You're getting a license plate, the back of a vehicle, and yes, if you have a bumper sticker or something, it's going to pick it up. Uh, license plates are not private information. Customers control all the data sharing, which means the Rhode Island State Police, uh, we have an onboarding. We just had our first onboarding meeting. We actually have to go. It's going to take a while. This is not happening overnight, but we control who has access to our cameras and what information they can have. And my goal is to only have it in the state of Rhode Island and all the state state agencies in in Rhode Island. That's it. Um, Flock's private customers can never access law enforcement data. So, if you have a Home Depot or Lowe's that has access to Flock, they can never see our cameras, but again, we have to allow anyway, but they private can never see law enforcement. And then federal agencies do not have a backdoor access to uh collaboration with federal agencies falls on the customer's choice which again through ourou we are not going to give information to the federal agencies and flock has never been hacked. So I mean with that being said I I know a lot of comments are going to be said. I just want to know from anyone's opinion why you would not want flock cameras. Thank you.

Well if you could stay for the council questions. Sure. I'm you weren't leaving, but I mean, no, stay at the podium. Uh, council members, any questions? Mr. Hanley, are there any state laws that limit their use or the data sharing at this time? No. There's been legislative proposals that that have been downrange, but I don't know if you know that procedure, whether the House or the Senate decides to listen to them, it hasn't gotten to that.

Okay. Because my my issue is between policy and law. As council members, we can change the policy with a vote. So with a policy that's in place today may you know maybe whoever makes the policy at this the state police can decide to change that policy and then it doesn't come back here. I'm not saying for or against it this time. I'm just saying that's my concern. And the other thing I is who so the only people that would have access to all this information would be the other communities that sign in in Rhode Island and the state post. So, we have to give like if if I want to give it to the chief, the warrant chief, he can pick and choose who he wants to have access to. You're going to have a login, your username and a login. It's going to be tracked. It's not going to go to every police officer in the state of Oregon. That's not the goal. But everyone, every police department, my goal is to have them have access so that we can see over jurisdictional lines.

Okay. Thank you, Mr. Tromley. Thank you. I have several questions. Some may be more appropriate for Chief Borges, some may be more appropriate for you. So, uh, take it as you as you please, I suppose. Does Warren currently have any flock camera in place in any area of the town? Not that I know of. I don't think so. Chief, according to the flock deployment team, there is not. Okay. No, we do not. And if this is approved, how many automatic license plate readers will be installed in War and where would they be located?

At this point in time, it would be one. And it is potentially going to be placed me 136 at Old Market Street southbound. I can show you if you want to see. So that would be the intersection of Child Street and Metaccom. No, I think that's near Liquors. That's near Mal Liquors. I think. Yeah. Would you like to see it? Yeah. Yes. I think it's behind Palmer River Grill. I see. So you can see the way it would be facing that way right there. That's just a big location. Okay. Am I right? Yeah. Uh near uh it's basically near the the mulch place. Yeah.

And again, I'll talk I mean if they pass and whatever, I'm often any change that would that's not that's not in stone. I see. Um so from my research into these types of cameras, my understanding is that they're very helpful mainly in trying to address crime of stolen vehicles, missing persons, and of that nature. So I'm curious for the chief is how many unsolved cases do we have of of those natures in in Warren at this time or this past year? Uh I don't have a number for the unsolved but um in the last two years we had 22 stolen vehicles. Mhm.

As you know we have access we don't have any flat cameras but we do have access to the data of the flat cameras. So, we've been able to use that and uh we have we did recover a vehicle that was stolen from uh Warren in Connecticut. I see. So, we've seen the the good part of it. We've used it in certain cases where we've been successful in solving some of those cases. Thank you. Now, this is about the contract. Is there a fully executed contract right now between Flock Corporation and the Rhode Island State Police? Fully executed and signed. It's signed. Yes,

it's signed. Okay. Um, and now is Warren a party to the contract or does it have any rights under this contract? It's exclusively with the state of it. Um, there was not a copy of the contract in my packet. Was there a reason? It's not public yet. We're still we're still in the onboarding se uh section of this. So, it's going to take time. I see. Would you be willing to provide the council a copy of that contract at the time? Talk to the colonel. Talk to the colonel. Okay. Um, now does Warren have a currentou with the state police as regards to how these cameras are to be used? That's that's in the works. Policy.

Um, so does thatou if it's in the works, does it address to your knowledge who owns the footage, how it can be accessed, and what becomes of it after a period of time? Yes. Okay. It will it will doesn't have it yet. It's it's in in the works and it will have that. And my understanding is that the state police went before Bristol and Portsmith town councils recently and they also asked you about this memorandum of understanding between the town and the state police. That's correct. Is it a differentou between each community? No, it's going to be one. It's going to be the I mean everyone's going to have the same Okay.

Um now my last Sorry, I just had one more question. I apologize. I don't mean to take up the entire time. Go ahead. Um my last question at this point is just how would it be possible for Warren to hold another law enforcement agency accountable for breaches of the memorandum understanding of the look I mean it would be it would be on us ultimately because it's our account but we do have a good insurance policy to apply okay but if uh I I understand the insurance element of it but in terms of if another agency were to use this information in a way that we found unacceptable we would not have any recourse as to that behavior. But how and how what would you consider unacceptable?

Well, um unfortunately I had this is long past in my family, but a cousin who was in a relationship with a police officer. She was a victim of domestic violence and stalking. And I can imagine that in another potential, you know, potentially if if he had had this access to this information, he could have continued his poor behavior. And if I I guess it's a dual-faced question which is how do we know that the policy was being violated? How would we be alerted to that? And two, what could be done about that? Well, to be held accountable. That's why I our policy and it's going to take time. It's going to be stringent

and just like anything else. It's like having access to running license plates. You're running license plates for the wrong reasons. It's going to be known because there's a there's a log of who goes in. And you know, just like anything else, if you're using a license plate, if you're running riots to see something for the wrong reason, it's going to come back and bite you. And it's, you know, I I can't speak to how Warren's going to hold them hold them accountable. Yeah. If I could add to that, the only people are allowed to right now that will continue is the two detectives in the detective division will have access to the Flock camera or the Flock T.

Not every officer. I don't want it. So, it's only going to be those officers who are in the investigative department of division that will use it. And when you use the flat camera, you have to put a case number in there that you're looking for the information based on this case. So, if something does happen, they're going to say, "Okay, well, show me the case that you're working on." And so, I I I've asked a lot of questions in a row, so I'll turn it over to my colleagues. Miss Cronin, [clears throat]

I've heard your um your presentation now two times. I did watch the presentation you did um for the Bristol Council and in theory and in the spirit of why this type of technology was developed, it makes perfect sense. Um, and it feels like the right thing to do for a small town to have access to this type of security and and comfort knowing that, you know, we could find a a a child or a a stolen something. But in 2025, we are living in a world where no matter how you ensure us that, you know, nobody else will have access to this information, it just doesn't feel um uh

I think it's beautiful. Yeah. So,

good perfect timing. It just it doesn't uh seem realistic to expect that the technology isn't going to evolve to a place where people who we don't want knowing our private business will have access to it. And given what has already happened in town, um it just this feels like too much. And um you know I've sort of developed a a position and a perspective over the past month or so becoming aware of of this um coming before us. Um and I'm really curious to hear the questions from the public to see how you're able to to respond to them. And it feels really bad possibly uh saying like this this won't work for us here because uh the overwhelming concern for the the other side of it. Um and it it it just it doesn't feel good denying what was created to do good work. Um but we're at a place right now where the um the negative forces that are out there are really um exploiting and taking advantage of and and doing things that uh we would like to to feel some sense of control over our privacy and our civil liberties. And um I just don't know that this is uh had this been 10 years ago when you came before us, we'd probably been like, "Yep, go ahead, do it." But right now, it just it doesn't feel like uh like a good time to do to do this. So, I don't we'll we'll see what the public says and if if other council members.

Yeah, I have a couple of questions. I'll probably have to come back and ask it. Sometimes I forget. So one of my questions is this is going to be on a state road. Yes. Why are you asking us DOT requires uh from the per I got a lot of emails people concerned and I did a lot of research and you know the question one would ask if you don't if you're not guilty what do you have to worry about and someone in put that in in the email and and the response is because we can't trust government. How do you respond to that? And and let me say this we have bad cops. We have bad at no attorneys. We don't have bad politician. We have bad in every not everything. So how but how do you address that and how do you safeguard that

say what what is the the primary thing? So so I guess the primary thing is if if you know we the concern is that it's it would be misused I guess is the concern. How do we protect ourselves from that? I I just I don't understand how something that's that's your your license plate and your vehicle is public knowledge. So I don't miss even if so you know what I once this came about and I got all these emails. I'm a YouTube junkie and I started looking again so I can hear. So if somebody abuses it, you have a cop that has a girlfriend wants to know where the girlfriend is. That could be very easily abused. Correct. Right. It could tell them that they drove on 136. Right. So how do we safeguard oursel from those abuses?

Accountability. Yeah. Because I think that everything else you mean you can track your credit card, you can track your car. I think you can track everything else. Like the chief said, you have when you you can't just go wild typing in place. You have to put a case number. There's there's you can't just go in and start typing. You have there's and your login is your login and there's a record. There's a record. So now, how many cities and towns have you recruited so far? That's total 22 and 22 of. So even if we voted no and we go to those other 22, we're going to be recorded. Correct. you if you say no, right, then they're going to be all over.

They're still going to be all over. So, it's not like we can stop wherever. Um, so if if we say no and something happens here, it's initiated here, we're at a disadvantage. Correct. Yes. Okay.

I got to tell you, when I was looking at all of this, I I remembered uh 39 years ago was my son. He was two years old at the time and I was doing a project with him with with my father. My son was there and he moved away. It might have been less than a minute and I was so scared. So when I look at this technology, I'm looking at that kid that gets abducted and at that point in time I don't care about my privacy. I just want my son found. So this is where I'm coming from. But I'd like to hear from everyone else. If I may, four years, four and a half years ago when I took this position, I implemented a camera registry program uh for the town of Warren. And I got this from other departments. So basically is any resident of the town of Warren who has a ring camera or any type of residential camera, we ask them to register with the town of with the police department so that if something happens in that area, we can go to our list and say, "Hey, let's go see so and so because he has a ring camera and we've used that to solve um Arlington and and Arlington and uh child has a camera right it's there already. So, and that person is gathering more information than the flat campus. People walking, front plates, people driving. So, it's out there. And we've we've been successful. Um, this is kind of lengthy, but I think it's worth mentioning. In February, we had an 82 year old person come to Toronto Warren and report that she gave $50,000, let's say, in personal in money to a scammer. and they came to the police department and said, "I think I've been scanned and but I have a plate of the vehicle." And we ran it through the flat camera and we found the plate at the border in Buffalo. So, we were able to call that agency and say, "Do you have a picture of this and

do you have the occupants names?" And they said, "Yes, because everybody is IDed when you go through the border, most people." So, through that information, we were able to get names of the occupants of the vehicle. and we currently have an arrest warrant for those subjects. If we didn't have this, we would have just said to that person, thank you very much. But it's no longer United States. We can't find it. Case closed, suspended for whatever reason may be. So, uh, but we've used it for incidents that occurred in town. We had a a road rage where a person was assaulted by another person. Based on the information of the vehicle, we're able to locate that person. Stolen vehicles. Um, we've seen we've seen the the benefits of it. the police department has. And like I said, not everybody's going to have access to this. So,

so if I could um I think that my concern um as well as the the solicitors and we spoke about this and I'm going to let Anthony actually answer so it'll all be correct because we've already spoken. I don't think we're against the good aspects. My concern is the Fourth Amendment. My concern is the legal aspect, the uh lack of uh accountability towards the contract changing down the road. We wouldn't have any say in that. Um so, Mr. Disto, if you could uh just expound on what we discussed earlier, it would be helpful.

Uh yes, I had the uh opportunity to speak to the captain about this also. Uh Chief Wingquist uh who is the uh chief of police in Cranston uh sent out an email through the uh uh Rhode Island uh police chiefs association. The concern being that um this flock information uh is actually subject to APA in some states has not uh been challenged here in Rhode Island, but it could

you can you say what APA is? the access to public records act uh in a sense and and I want to address the fourth amendment. Uh the one thing that I agree with uh Chief Borges on and uh uh uh the captain is that uh you don't when your car is driving down the street and you have a license plate, there's not an expectation of privacy there. That's the basis for having these block cameras. However, that tells against you when it's an access to public records act request because if it's out in the open, then it can be seen as a public record. Apparently, in some states, uh, APPPA has, uh, they they've given APE requests and, uh, the states have said that's public documents. There's a concern then that we're getting to the wrong hands. In fact, there's some type of a uh um website uh have I been flocked.com on this. Now, this is all amorphous. One of the things I'm hearing is that there is right now there is no uh agreement in place between Flock and the State Police. That's still being fleshed out. Correct.

The contract's done. The contract's done. Okay. Cameras are happening. We just it's it's our pol. So as part of the onboarding it is it's a process. We sit down and we go over who we want to get like literally we're going to sit down with a team multiple times and go over like so that the thing that's causing that is a national lookup and we can turn that off easily. Some some states allow that. We don't intend on allowing the national lookup which is what's going through those apps.

Okay. Hey, can I make a suggestion? If uh the council is in in favor of going forward with this and uh allowing your police department to access these block cameras and have the block cameras uh stationed here in Warren, I think we need to see that ahead of time. The policy in the MOU policy in the MOU. That's I don't I don't think it's something you should vote on without seeing what the parameters are for that. I do have some concerns uh mainly because I haven't seen some of the things that we would need to see before any decisions were made. And the fourth amendment

well um you know your fourth amendment is a privacy right when you're in public and you're driving on a public street there's you don't have a fourth amendment right to the outside of your vehicle. You do have fourth amendment rights to the inside of your vehicle, but not the outside. That includes your license plate.

Mr. President, can I I don't mean to disagree with my brother attorney here, but I will say that is not quite correct because we do have a privacy interest in the totality of our daily movements, our public movements. Which is why any police officer, and of course you guys can testify to this, if you want to put a tracker on someone's vehicle, you have to get a warrant to do that. You can't just go do that. Even though the car is in public and might not be on the inside, it's on the outside. You do have a privacy interest in your movements as a person. As far as I've seen with the APLR, they can track you across states, across the entire country. Basically, the technology is capable of that. Is that correct? Wherever our camera is.

Wherever the camera is. So the problem with that is that the technology has advanced so quickly and I don't think I've seen any courts rule on the exact admissibility or the legality of it. But I would compare it to tracking a car with a with a tracker or with like with your cell phone sell site location information. Well, you disagree, but I I I that's how I feel. And based on my anal that it's very gray area, but my thought thinking is that it's more close to tracking a vehicle with a tracking device rather than just being observed on on a road based on what

as a matter of law, these cameras are not considered to be trackers. Well, there's still there's no court cases that really bear that out, though. That's why I'm saying it's still sort of a new area of law where there hasn't been any decision by a court. You feel the DOT cameras are doing the same thing. What do you feel that the cameras the DOT has up all over the highway is doing the same thing? Are they APLRs like we're saying or ALPRs? No, but it's tracking your movements. Well, that's the point that I'm It's the totality of Okay, that's Yeah.

So, what we what we want to do is speak specifically to the flock because we know there are cameras everywhere. What uh doesn't happen is I see your license plate. I don't know who the registered person is. I don't know the address of that registration. So although the plate is public, the code breaking of it isn't. The code I mean by the information. So all of those other cameras are out there uh but not of this specific use. Just one,

Mr. How long do you keep that information for? 30 days. So, I I uh thank you and we we respect what you're doing. My concern on this comes from the unknown quite frankly and uh the potential abuse. Uh but you're here to do your job and so are we. So, if you could absolutely

if you could have a seat. We're going to let the public uh have the opportunity to speak and uh who's going to be first? Oh, yeah. Everybody who's in favor, we want you to come down first. So if you're in favor, you probably don't have to sit down. Um, so all right. So now that we're done with all of the people in favor, for those in opposition, please come down. State your name and address for the record. And we are going to uh I am going to stop people if they start repeating themselves. So everybody while you're sitting there think about if the person ahead of you has done such a great job explaining that you don't have to come up.

Okay. Thank you. Um my name is Ann Raver. I live on 10 Taylor Street in Warren and um I am opposed to the block camera system for a number of reasons. I have a question and that is where does the funding come from? How are all these flock cameras systems being installed? Is it a federal grant? We could have is it from the customs and border protection? Federal

federal cops grant. And where do they get their money? Okay. Um I I'm a former journalist and so I tend to trust in this era of fake news um a lot of media the the established media which includes AP um the New York Times uh the public radio stations and I also read things put out by the ACLU and I trust their reports. and their reports are very disturbing about what's happening with flock camera systems. And I respect what you're saying about safety and catching violent criminals and little old ladies like me wandering down state highways. But the implications and what we're seeing now in this era of of the of our present administration is is the aspect of surveillance. And these cameras feed into a database. And with AI, even a camera in Warren can be accessed by other police departments. and the federal agents if they wish they can be easily hacked. Um there are various reports of geeks being able to hack into these systems. So they're very insecure and so you are being asked to approve of a system that has no statutory protection. The state legislature has not been able to agree on on regulations for for restricting

their use. Warren could have an agreement with the police or, you know, have some kind of ordinance. It does not. It hasn't had time to really look at this. So now to approve something like this would be, in my opinion, very dangerous. And yes, okay. So of it reads the license plate of anyone going by. It could be um an immigrant who has citizenship rights but looks like somebody that our current administration would like to pick up. Or it could be a person like me who's been seen at, you know, a progressive rally or demonstrating down on Water Street when we saw ICE agents lurking around in their vehicles with tinted windows and getting out with masks. I mean this is I do not want to be tracked or I don't want anyone to be tracked by these cameras which can then be they they not only take license plates they take bumper stickers they can be they follow movements of whoever's driving the car. If somebody wants to follow a particular license plate, they can track the movement of that car but via other cameras and so they can track across state. They can really surveil whoever they're trying to pick up. So, you know, I'm asking, do we want that in our town? I don't see why we really need it. And I think that the negatives um are so weighted in the other in to

say no that that's what I'm hoping you will say. Um I know that Chief Borgus and and these gentlemen have said that that the data the data cannot be shared. only the detectives will have that data. But a lot of reports from established news media and the ACLU are are documenting that this is not the case that police departments and federal agents can get this information. So that to me is the beginning of a police state. So,

thank you. That's my So, for the record, we also have a packet by the Maline McGonagal and she's from the ACLU. It's uh much too thick for me to read into the record, but it's part of uh the public information. Uh next, whoever wants to come down I have a letter that I just very recently wrote. An address, please.

Yeah, I will say that I'm Yma. I live at 54 Washington Street near War and I have a letter. I have a copy that I can give to Yes. and I'll just read it into the record if that's okay. You did.

Uh, thank you for the opportunity to comment on a matter before you tonight that is of great concern to myself and I believe many other citizens. I will be brief because I know the question before you can be framed and articulated very narrowly. Should you tonight approve the request to install a so-called automated license plate reader ALPR in our town? I urge you not to do so. At least not until you both you and we as citizens have a better complete and accurate understanding of what this technology is capable of. How it is already being used or can be used whether it's as advertised, intended, or secret and the possible implications for privacy, security and even liberty in our community. Yes, that may broaden the scope of inquiry and consideration, but only because the scope of possible capabilities and implications of this technology is not narrow at all. Especially when considered in the broader context of what we are experiencing at this time in our country and to some extent already in this community in terms of intelligence gathering and law enforcement. but also in terms of our ability to feel free in our homes, in our workplaces, neighborhoods, state, and country. Not feel intimidated or threatened, especially not by people who do not identify themselves, hide behind masks and tinted windows, and then come out looking like armed bank robbers and assaulting the peace of our communities. This technology is already here and it

is spreading very rapidly in aworked fashion around us. It's not only being used to facilitate regular law enforcement but also to find, detain and deport immigrants, even immigrants who are legally here have a green card or have become citizens. It is not okay to say that mistakes are always being made or mistakes can be made when egregious violations of people's privacy, physical safety, and emotional security have been documented. Whether we are for or against immigration is not the issue. Whether we support or protest certain policies is not the issue at this time. At this time, we need to make sure that law enforcement operations are properly and that is lawfully authorized, necessary, and executed, and that appropriate safeguards are in place to protect our public and private freedoms and the character of the communities we live in. There's plenty of documentation about such safeguards. Please consider that information and require those safeguards before you approve this request and others like it. And I will just add that I would agree with um what has been said about the American Civil Liberties Union. They are not anti- law enforcement. They're not some extremist organization. they do their homework and they're very concerned about this technology especially in the context as I have tried to present that. Thank you.

Thank you. Is there anyone else who would like to speak?

Maline McGunnagal from the ACLU. I'm not a Warren resident. Um, but I love Yep. I went to school in Bristol, so special place in my heart. Um, I'll be very brief. You, the letter I submitted is very long. I have a lot to say about

Yeah, it is. Um, but I just wanted to add a couple things. Um, beyond the letter, um, I will say that in the state of Rhode Island, the smallest state in the country, we already have about 200 municipality owned ALPRs. Seems like a lot already. And so, we would urge you to reject this proposal. Um, additionally for the data sharing and the data retention, um, people before me have said that it's about 30 days retention, that is the standard flock data retention day deadline. Um, other states have changed it. Um, Maine is 21 days. Uh, New Hampshire's 3 minutes. So 30 days is the standard. It can be different. Um, additionally, um, there has been a pattern across the country of municipalities who have flock agreements of cancelling their contracts. The most recent one was Cambridge and Massachusetts last night who decided to stop having their flock contract. And so, I just wanted to add those few things beyond what's in my letter and what the constituents have said. Um, I agree with that wholeheartedly and I'm happy to answer any questions that any of you may have.

There any questions? M. McGonagal, thank you for coming. Uh we've heard from uh the solicitor and if there's a motion to be made, his advice legally is that there isn't enough information for us right now that he feels secure enough to stand behind legally the town warrant. Correct. That would be a vote to approve. You just don't have the information for that. If we were to approve, you wouldn't be asking it for deny. So we can deny You or we could make a motion to continue this until the contract has actually been supplied to the solicitor to review and for the council to review and vote at that time once we actually see what we're voting on.

Yes. I'll make I'll put that in the form of a motion. I'll put a motion that we continue this. Uh do you know about how long it would be to get a contract over? Right now I'm kind of opposed to the contract. That's that's just tells you how many cameras I mean policy. There are people that watch this. if you could come to the microphone. Policy andou I'll get you. If you want to okay postpone this I get it. I'm doing the same thing in Bristol and Portsmith but I'm not giving a draft. So when it's finalized I'll get it to you. Anthony would that be more appropriate the policy and theou more than the contract. Well I'll take what I can get. Okay.

Uh but you know I want to make sure that all the questions I have I I I I've got to tell you that I have concerns uh beyond what just has been discussed tonight. important concerns, but I have other concerns and that goes to liability for the town. So, I'd like to take a look at what I can get. If I have more questions, I'll let you know. I'll second that motion. Uh, one moment. We have the public hearing. It's not a public hearing.

No, you can come on down. Hey, Mark Dobin, 22 Liberty Street. Um, I'm opposed. I'm assuming everybody in the gallery who is typically not at these meetings is opposed, but I think it's important that people put their name and their address and state their opposition. Um, and also to take all the time they want. I won't reiterate the points. I think people made great points. I agree with most of them. Um, I read a bunch of ACLU [snorts] information. I'm sure you guys have that now. So again, I won't belabor that. Um, but I think it's important to take this time and for people if they want to say the same things over and over, that's good, too. Stretch these things out. Make you folks all aware that this is important to us to come out on a week night. Um, and when these things get continued, I feel like the the attendance tends to shrink as people sort of get fatigued. U, but it's important for all of us to make our voices heard that we uh oppose this camera system.

U, thank you. But there's nothing stopping someone from saying something different than the person in front of them. Right. I didn't stop people from talking. No, no, no, no. I'm just encouraging everyone to get up there. And my intention is not to get less of a crowd when we hear this. My intention is to get the information we need. Sure. To vote on this. I'm not thinking of continuing this so less people show up. No, I know. I think that that's just a natural That's what it sounded like you said. No, no, no. It wasn't intended in It wasn't intended in that light. It's more just when these things take months and months, it's hard to it's hard to keep amassing people to come. From my perspective, it gets diffic I'm answering direct. It gets difficult as the night goes on as well to conduct the business and past 11 o'clock, we have to make a motion.

Sure. So, we see the people here. It's not a foreign body. It's us. We know the people that are in this room. Yeah. And I appreciate what you're saying. And he's urging anyone if you have something different than what you've heard, come on down. Thanks, Joe. Can I respond to I think it's important. No, I think it's important. Okay. I don't understand personally what you can say differently. I've been on a council for a year and I was there here 12 years. I don't make my decision on how many people in the room. I make my decision on all the facts because just because you're in a room and you're you think one way doesn't mean there are people that are not in the room that talented that don't show up to the meetings. So So Let's That's all I'm saying. Let's stick to the topic.

That is topic. He said people in the room. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying I'm for or against. I'm just saying I don't do things based on measuring how many people in the room. Sure. But I think in this specific issue, it's it's the citizenry which is being affected by potentially having our license plate scanned every time we drive down the street. So if a large mass of the citizenry citizenry of this town shows up and says we don't want to be surveiled like that I should hope that would have some effect on

and absolutely and and when I spoke I also said that if it's not being uh uh if it's not being done here and I go across the state and it's being done then I'm losing protection in the town and that's what we have to look at. It's not going to go away. Okay, let's not digress on the personal position of just respond and that's all it is. Thank you. Um so Mr. Hanley made a motion and Lewis second it discussion.

Uh Mr. Disto help Oh, somebody else wants to speak. Okay, please. But Miss Flanigan before you start Mr. Disto if someone made a motion a motion on the floor and somebody has another motion does one take precedence over the other. The first motion needs has to be decided first. Thank you.

Jenny Flanigan, 46 Washington Street. I'll just briefly touch on the idea that AI is involved in this. And AI to me is a black box in many ways. We don't know how it's going to be used. Uh we don't know where it's going to go in the future. We don't know how much of the data is being scraped and is going to get used in other ways that by AI that may be beyond human control that comes out in different ways. So, the AI aspect is one of the parts of this that disturbs me profoundly. Thank you. Thank you. Uh, Mr. Hanley, since you made the motion, if there were another motion simply to deny and deal with this if it ever came up again, uh, would you

No, I'm not going to resend my motion. I'm I'll restate it to continue this until we have the policy, theou for the solicitor review because I want I want the information I need to make a decision. That's why I'm continuing not voting to deny or making a motion to approve. I think I need that information to make an informed decision. So, I'm going to leave my motion on the table and I believe Louis is going to second. All right. So, if there was another motion and people wanted to simply deny this, that is a possibility. Have some discussion for this motion. Please.

Um I I'm going to vote no on this motion. Um, I don't think that there's any information that's going to be provided in this memorandum of understanding or other documents from the applicant that's going to make me feel comfortable with this type of surveillance in this town. So, just so you know. Okay. All in favor? I. Nay. Nay. Is there another motion? I make a motion to deny the installation of flock cameras in the town of Warren. Second. All in favor? I. I. All right. Motion carries. The Sorry. You oppose? No. Okay. I didn't have enough information to make the decision.

Well, the information is going to come to us down the road. They're they're I'm sure they're not just going to sit on the uh information as they gather it. It didn't have to be a part of tonight's business, but it's over. Thank you for coming. And I'm sure we will see you in the future.

Next, we have a resolution regarding Victory Day. Uh this was sent out by other communities and we signed on uh to have this uh actually uh read and see how this goes. The town of Warren, Rhode Island resolution preserving the name and significance and observance of the Victory Day holiday. Whereas Victory Day currently pays tribute to the immeasurable servicemen and women who served, sacrificed and died in the Pacific and China, Burma, India theaters of operation during World War II. And whereas our job is not to erase history, but to preserve it and educate our citizens on Victory Day with the impact of World War II upon and within our state. And whereas renaming this day to Peace and Remembrance Day is disrespectful to our military veterans, a disservice to our civilians that contributed to the war effort, and dismissive of their collective memory, sacrifices, efforts, historical lineage, and merited honors. Whereas the town council has concerns relatively to previously proposed House Bill 5887, this bill's potential reintro reintroduct reintroduction of that of its content and intent in any legislative form in the future that such bills are understood to be an act that would change the name of the holiday on the second Monday of August from D victory day to peace. Peace and Remembrance Day. And now, therefore, be it resolved that the Warren Town Council respectfully requests our legislators to oppose the passing of any such future bills as a commitment to preserving the great sacrifices made by our revered veterans and their families to ensure that their honors and histories from memory never fades. Be it resolved that a copy of this resolution be sent to the governor

of the state of Rhode Island, Senator Walter S. Felag, Jr., Representative June Speakman, Representative Jason Knight, and the city and town councils. If passed, this would be December 9th, 2025. Is there a motion to accept this? So, we already passed this at the last one meeting. Neil, there should be one change. We pulled it. No, we voted to we voted to have to draft to have the resolution. So, I think I can add some context to this, president. So, we had endorsed the version that came to us from Westerly and then um Councilman Hanley uh wanted to have one from us specifically. So, that's why we have it on the We pulled it and asked for it.

Last month we pulled it two months ago. We approved having the resolution drawn. Well, if that's the case, let's just follow through again tonight then. I I will just make a friendly amendment if I may to fellow council. Is there a motion? I'll make a motion. Is there a second? What? He's going to tell us what the change is. I'm sorry. This the only you were going to amend something. I apologize. Yes. Um, so my only uh amendment to this, a friendly amendment is to just to put the uh year 2025 in front of the House bill number to indicate which bill it actually is. They typically reuse the number, so just to avoid confusion. It's a very technical amendment, very small, but I'm just uh introducing it for the sake of good housekeeping. Yeah, there may be a typo.

Yeah, I I spoke to Councilman Trombly about it, and it does it specifically will point to this bill in case a new bill has that same last one digit. Right. And we're correcting the typo that's been found. I will second the motion instead of India to to change the bill number to uh represent 2025. Yep. Is there a second? Derek made the motion. I just said. All in favor? I I Okay. Now, is there a motion to accept this and send it? I'll make a motion we accept the resolution and send it to uh our representatives and our senators. Second. All in favor?

I. Next we have the election of town council officers. First is town council president. Is there a nomination? I'll make a motion uh for Joe Deepaswell. We'll second. All in favor? I. Thank you everyone. And we have a motion for the vice president. Um I mean a nomination. Excuse me. I'll nominate Terry Cronin. Second. I'm making the second. All in favor? I thank you everyone. Thank you.

Next we have reappointments and they're lengthy. They're on pages eight and nine. These are reappoints to all of our boards and commissions. Mr. Disto, is it at this time if we were to pull any of those or is that too late? You can you can pull now before the motion is made or if the motion is made and there's a second, you can ask any uh name be pulled from that. Yeah. List. So on the list, is there anyone or I want to I want to pull one out because I have a conflict of interest. One of them is my brother. Okay.

I want to pull the building. Dave, building official, inspector, all printed out. And I do have one other question and it's going to be from the clerk. Have all of these people represented that they would like to remain on the board and attendance has been vetted. Hi. So, it'll be contingent on attendance, but probably everybody's here. So, other than William Hanley, why don't we do it this way? We'll take William Hanley out. Okay. And we'll vote on it all and then we'll vote on Mr. Hanley, your brother. Mr. President, I also have to uh pull the two members for the library trustee. I have a conflict there. Okay. Yeah.

So, why don't we do it this way? We'll do the library and William Hanley now. Okay. It's going to be myself, Miss Cronin, and Mr. Rego. Mr. Rego, could you make a motion? I'll make a motion to reappoint William J. Hanley. William A. Hanley. Second official's office. All in favor? I. And I'll make a motion to appoint Carol Gaffford and John Cheney to the library trustees. I second it. All in favor? Okay. Now we can have a motion in entirety of the council on all others. I'll make a motion in the entirety of all others. Is there a second? I'll second. All in favor?

I. Thank you. Next we have interview. We don't have anyone for the 250th or conservation commission. And we did interview Miss Martins last month for the voluntary historic district committee. And is there a motion? Yeah, I'll make a motion to appoint Lisa Martins. I'll second that. All in favor? I. And public, we still have openings on the 250th commission as well as the conservation commission. So, any of you who would like to serve on those boards, please come on in to the clerk's office. If

I may, Mr. President, quick questions for the clerk's office. I think after tonight there will be some additional vacancies with some resignations uh from from some boards in town. Is that correct? Yes. Yes. Awesome. That's gonna happen a little later. Yes, of course. Next, we have acceptance of the November 12th, 2025 regular scheduled meeting minutes. I didn't see any corrections. Is there a motion to accept? Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Uh, next we have the executive session. They were emailed to us. Did you all get them? Yeah. Uh, I didn't see any corrections. Make a motion to approve. Second. All in favor?

I. Next, we have a consent agenda. Make a motion to approve the consent agenda. Second. Believe it's only one item. All in favor? I.

And now we have an ordinance. Chapter 32-Zoning. Article five, special use permits. Section 3231, standards for specific categories of special use permits. Article 8, zoning district use regulations. Sections 32- 52, service business uses. Article 23, definitions. Sections 32-1 130, definitions, kennels, doggy daycare application. This is the second reading. Good evening. Good evening.

Are there any additional questions or comments to this applicant, Mr. Disto?

Well, this is a second reading, but it's a public hearing because it's for the uh zoning order. There's anyone from the public that wishes to speak. I can answer any questions you may have. This is the second reading. The necessary changes from the uh first reading are contained in this version. Uh some of them have to do with the um sighting of it. The the um uh setback is 100 ft now which the uh applicant has agreed to. Uh there is a pulling of the sale of animals which was actually suggested by the applicant on this matter. There's a definition for what a kennel is in the doggy daycare. I'd be happy to answer any questions you may have.

Are there any questions from the council at this time? No. This looks like it reflects what we wanted to change last time first reading. So, I'll make a motion we approve the second reading. We have to first we have to Anybody from the public would like to uh discuss this issue. Do I need to make a motion to close public hearing? I don't see it as a public hearing, but I guess it is. I'll make a motion to that effect. Second. All in favor? I. Okay. Belts and suspenders. Uh, I will make a motion that we approve the uh zoning change regarding special use permit standards and categories for a dog kennel. I'll second that motion. All in favor? I Does that mean you're not coming back to visit us anymore?

Might be stuck here. Good. O2. Next, we have chapter 3, article 4, kennel licenses, section 4-1, the licenses of kennels doggy daycare application specifically. Second reading. Yeah, this is a companion ordinance. It uh uh authorizes the licensing of the business proposed by the applicant. Again, this is a second uh reading and u I have any uh questions you may have. You'll notice that the fee is $250. Are there any additional questions, Mr. Dgo? Nope. Is that a yes? I will make a motion. One more. Any questions from the public? Comments? Is there a motion to close the public hearing? I'll make that motion.

Second. All in favor? I. Mr. I will make a motion we approve O2 uh kennel licenses. The licensing of second that motion. All in favor? I. Good luck. Yay. Thank you.

Sorry it took so long. No, it wasn't. Thank you though. And uh now the fun begins, I guess, right? Chapter 32, zoning. First reading. Article 8, zoning district use regulations. Sections 32-47, residential uses. Article uh 24, accessory dwelling units. Sections 32 through 131, accessory dwelling units by right. Section 32 132 standards and requirements. Section 32 through 133 occupancy restriction agreement. This is for Mr. Tromley. Mr. Trombly uh brought this to our attention and he's ready to take over. Go right ahead, sir.

Thank you, Mr. President. So, um as many of my council colleagues and many of the people in the public will know, accessory dwelling units um the laws regarding those were amended at the state level se a few years ago and we had yet to uh adjust it's kind of a housekeeping measure. We're adjusting our ordinances to reflect what state law is. Um, accessory dwelling units, for those who do not know, they are simply uh housing units made out of basements, out of sheds, out of garages, out of attics. They're accessory uh um buildings or occupancies that are turned into dwelling units for the purpose of housing. Um usually in typical cases for an in-law or someone with special needs, but also they're becoming more prominent for folks who are looking to downsize and turn over their main property to their children or to some other deise. And it's important that our local law reflects that this practice. It will help I think to streamline this process because as we know we are in a housing crunch. The prices are getting astronomical and people are leaving Warren and our great state because of it. So this will help to do so in a way that I think more fits with the character of of Warren. I tend to find that folks recoil at large building projects um but they are more accepting of uh things that are spread out over a wider area. So this is what I consider to be gentle density. So it increases the density of an area without uh drastically changing the look and feel of a of a neighborhood. So with that being said, if the solicitor has any other comments, I think that we should move this forward.

I have a couple questions. Well, if I if I may just interject and follow up.

Uh, Councilman Traveling is correct. Uh, this uh um ordinance uh mirrors the state laws which is mandated by the state law in title 45 uh chapter 24. Uh so, uh on a legal basis, uh not only isn't the uh ordinance acceptable, but it's also um something that needs uh to be done. the uh local ordinance has to conform to the state enabling act. But uh one thing I do want to mention which I noticed uh Councilman Trombbley put in is section uh 32-13. Uh and this is also something that's lawful. It's the last section in your proposal that has to do with short-term rentals, right? And uh under this ordinance, an accessory dwelling unit cannot be used uh for uh short-term rentals as defined in state law. This is something that other communities have enacted. It has been shown to be lawful. It's just an additional protection so you don't have uh you know too many fraternity brothers showing up uh in a neighborhood uh renting out an ADU every weekend.

Be happy to answer any questions you may have. Tony, I have a couple. Jeff, can I go please? So the first one is why did we wipe out in-law apartments? Why why isn't in-law apartments still there? Because there is a distinction between an in-law apartment and accessory unit in apartment you share the entrance. Why was it taken out? State law specifically says that you cannot uh have a category for relatives renting out an ADU. That's considered discriminatory under the enabling act. That's why it was taken out. at the state level doesn't have to make sense. They did it. That's fine. That's what they did. Yeah. Louis with with an ADU, you can still have a shared entry.

Doesn't have to have a separate. Yeah. So, it can be like a like the old Yeah. the old in-law apartment, just an ADU and you get the same thing. Correct. Yes. Yep. Second question. So, they put in a maximum size, but they didn't put a minimum size. Is there a reason for that? The studio or one-bedroom ADU shall have a maximum unit size of at least 900 square feet. But there's no minimum. There's and again I'll ask there's a minimum. There's a minimum in a building code. I'm sorry. That at least should be struck in in the document that in that I believe you're referring to 3213A. Is that right? Standards and uh requirements. Yes. That at least should be struck. I don't know if it is in your copy, but it that should not be in there.

So that's an arrow. Yes. If if it's there, right? Yeah. No, it is it is struck. But I guess I I'm just wondering why they didn't um address minimum size. But I guess if I call it building in the building code, uh a dwelling unit minimum size I believe is 600 square foot and hence the name accessory dwelling unit in my opinion that would also govern the minimum size of an ADU because it is a dwelling unit. That's correct statement. Yes. So I got two more. So again the the egress before you had a shared egress that no longer applies. You can have its own egress. Correct. Okay. And the last one, all street parking space shall not be required more than one per bedroom of ADU.

So, does does that mean that they don't have to have one or they at least have to have at least one? That was going to be one bedroom statute. It's in the statute that you can't require it, but it would be up to us to put it in our statute that we do require it. That was my concern. I want to see at least one parking space required for an ADU and that is not incl. It's been I've been doing it in Pucket for about six months and enforcing it and it makes sense in a community like Warren where we have you know parking on street is a challenge you know. Yeah I think that we would have to put instead of may we would have to shall and I don't know if we want one for each bedroom but I at least want one for each AVU.

It's section shall not be required. Are we making changes? 213 first reading. That's what I mean. So my copy says shall the question was about action. It says shall not be required. Off streetet parking spaces shall not be required more than one per bedroom an ADU. Change that to May. Uh no I want to change that to off shall shall require at least one off streetet parking. Just give it the amount. Shall be required. But I don't I don't know if if we want to go for one for each bedroom or just one for each unit. I'd be comfortable with one for each unit, not one for each bedroom. Yeah.

I mean, we're going to be reducing the number by doing this. So, it'll uh it'll help with the congested areas in town. You don't have the space you can out, right? So, Anthony, you see what I'm talking about? G says it shall not be required, but that doesn't mean they have to. I want to make it that they have to. I've got concerns with the last phrase, more than one bedroom of the ADU. It's so if we strike that it says off streetet parking spaces shall be required more than one bedroom of the ADU parking shall require one because the most you can have is a two-bedroom ADU. So if we just put shall off street parking spaces shall be required for each ADU.

How about at least Sure. Um, one per ADU. Would that be all street parking space shall be required per ADU? Peru. Yeah, instead of I'm good with that. That was really my That was really my own. I think that makes sense. I do think I took the language exactly from the statute, but I think this is actually more clear and I don't think it's in conflict at all. Yep. Correct. Next. Yeah, that's a sausage situation. They were making sausage when this thing passed. stay. That was my only concern with the ordinance. Mr. Yeah, my my one question was about the language on that parking because it I just couldn't understand what it meant, but this makes more sense and it's clearer.

Lawyers never use one word when four will do as they say. Yes. Is there anything else to the May I ask a question of the clerk? Andy, has this gone to the planning board yet? So, okay. Proper motion should be Yes. came from Mr. Trauma. Okay. So, we'll be setting it to the motion should be for two things. Set it down for a public hearing at the January meeting uh with uh proper notice under the statute, which Sandy knows, and also that it be referred to the planning board uh for a determination as to whether it complies with the town's comprehensive plan. Yeah. Is there such a motion? I'll make that motion.

Second. All in favor? I. Thank you. I just have a question. So, if somebody came in front of a um went to the building inspector and there's a 600 square foot minimum for an ADU, Matt, that's what John My interpretation and what I use is I refer back to the building code which requires a 600. It's not a rooming house. It's a se it's a dwelling unit and there is a minimum of 600 square foot for a dwelling unit in the building code. Is that that's what I that's what I've been doing and that's how I informed. I I just that's just a quick question. Is that something the zoning board can offer you? Look at you. Read what it says. It says a minimum of

Yeah. Department official brought it up in the state building if you can please come to the microphone. backro building zoning official for the Tonaw Warren. Um, so what I was saying was that Councilman Hanley is a fellow building official uh and then we were in a state meeting and they presented this to us and he brought up the fact that the law actually says minimum of so if you look at the the it says square footage for an ADU. Do you have that in front of you? Yeah, that's not a maximum. That's a minimum. Minimum. So there is no Yeah. So there's no maximum. The smallest has to be 600.

Cool. My opinion through the building code is yes. Yeah. But but the law in front of you, right, if you read what it says for the minimum, it says it says the minimum amount needs to be I forot. I don't have it in front of me, but there's a square footage. So that's not a maximum. So it's 600. I didn't see it, you know, and I looked through this. Mr. Flanigan is going to help us. Come on down. Matt, I uh I think they changed it. They actually corrected and changed it to maximum here. Mr. That's right. In state law, it's not when before it was not. But this one here, it does say maximum instead of minimum. It says minimum, but it but in but the 600 foot minimum is in the building code because it's

by definition in the building code. It's a dwelling unit and it needs to be 600 foot. If it was a rooming house, there's no requirement. But this is not a rooming house. It's it's an accessory dwelling. State law though. That's this is the ordinance, correct? Yeah. The state law is what the one that we're talking about. All right. So, let's hear what Miss Flanigan has to say.

Uh, Jenny Flanigan in 46 Washington Street. I'm also on the planning board. Um, and at our last meeting, we discussed the fact that there's this ordinance as well as a number of other um enabling acts that got passed specifically around uh comprehensive permits for affordable housing. We discussed a number of issues that all have to be as well as a number of items that came at as a result of our comprehensive plan approval that now need to be incorporated into our ordinances. Um, and the planning board is going to be taking them on as a whole. So, this is one of the issues that we'll be looking at. We would like to be able to address all of these issues collectively. It seems they're going to be pervasive across not just the zoning ordinance, but also land development and subdivision regulations. um planning board um policies, uh tree commission regulations, um you know, just a a a broad range of recommendations that we're going to be making back to the council hopefully in two or three months on all these changes. We would certainly welcome receiving this. Um uh we may request to act on it in concert with all those other changes.

Are you going to be having special meetings? I I'm almost certain we would. Mr. My concern with that is we are subject to the state law right now. So if we don't include that parking requirement right now, anybody that comes in with an ADU legally right now does not have to give us a parking space until we make this change. That's why we're J. You guys got to take this up. You think okay? We got we got a time crunch here and uh a time limit here, but also the the wheels starting to move. So Mr. Traumley wanted to get this in earlier and agendas were full. So, we apologize.

I then had three specific comments that I wanted to just quickly ask. Please do. Um uh item A um on the same law where principal use is a legally established single family dwelling. Does that if So, where does that leave legally nonconforming residences? You know, it's it's legally established. I'll leave that one to the solicitor because I'm not sure myself. I can answer that. Go ahead, Mr. Hanley.

Legally established means it is there. It could be non legal non-conforming. Say for instance, they built the house too close to a side property line, but at the time there wasn't a requirement for the 8oot setback. The zoning ordinance changed to 8 foot, but the house is only 4 foot. That's a legally established. Okay. Well, residence. Okay. So, that answers that question. Thank you. Is that good, Tony? Yeah. Did real good. Said it better myself. That's my [laughter] next uh uh item I don't it's after K um and after K

yeah no proposed ADU that are part of a larger development proposal such as such if they're part of a larger development such ADU shall not be counted towards the density of the proposed project this is from the statute I assume yes it which is really difficult language. Surprise, surprise. Um um I I will tell you that there will be a number of people in in some neighborhoods who will be very unhappy with saying that we can approve well and actually it came up during the settller's green proposal where there are the 12 new house lots and it was pointed out that each of those house lots could add an ADU also which be that as it may it was a recognition that in addition to those 12 house slots, there's an addition the possibility for additional 12 ADUs, as there's an addition of, you know, 5,000 ADUs throughout town for the 5,000 building units that we have around town. I'm just I just wanted to raise that as an awareness and if it's in the statute and we can't deal with it, I wanted to just put out there. I happen to like it, but I'm a really strong affordable housing advocate and uh housing expansion advocate, but I also recognize the frustrations that other that the other side of the argument has and I wanted to put that before the council to be aware

that all that's it. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, Mr. Disto, anything else? No. All right. So, a motion's been taken to send that along. Next we have we did we did we vote on it? I don't even think we didn't even make a motion. Make a motion. I thought we made a motion to extend it to the planning board. Yeah. Okay. All right. We're also making a motion to for the first reading. Pass the first reading. First reading. Well, that's next. Now, right now, is there a motion to pass? No, don't pass the first reading yet. Yeah, this was this was the first reading, right? So, the motion should be set up the set the matter down for a public hearing at the January meeting. That would be the second reading, but also a public hearing.

Yep. Also direct the clerk to um forward it to the planning board. Forward it to the planning board, but also uh advertise in accordance with the statute. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? I thank you. Next. Chapter 2, Article 3, Division One, Town Manager, Section 2-61. This is the budget. First reading. This is in front of you. It's 04. You all see it?

I'm not going to read it all down. Um, you discussed this at your last meeting. I drafted at the request of Councilman Rigo on this. Uh, this would add um a new uh section uh to the uh code of ordinances relating to the uh duties of the town manager. And um it states that in addition to the duties of the town manager set forth in section 4.04 of the town charter. So do I have to read this?

No. But basically what it is is what you discussed at the last meeting in what was on the um agenda at the last meeting. This would uh give some requirements to the town manager to keep the um town council uh informed as to the uh fiscal and budgetary status of the uh town throughout the year. If you have any questions, be happy to answer them. Basically, it's just to keep the budget process consistent on a yearly basis. Are there any questions? There a motion. Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Thank you. So, that means it'll be uh down for a second reading in the January meeting. Do we need to send it or it just automatically happens?

You you've approved the first reading. Thank you. Next we have 05 chapter 13 offenses and miscellaneous provisions article one section 13-1 hunting prohibited exception. The amendment of this ordinance will allow for bow and arrow hunting as well as nuisance permits. This was uh would have been brought by a number of people but Mr. uh Tromley brought it in. So go right ahead, Mr. Charlie.

Thank you, Mr. President. Um, so I will defer a bit to a member of the public who is here to talk uh in more with more experience, but um I've received several communications from folks in the community uh about the deer becoming overpop populated and causing some problems in town in terms of vegetation and specifically our farmers. Um, and it has been brought to my attention that the hunting ordinance we currently have, which prohibits hunting in all forms, um, and does not make exception for nuisance permits, it concerns me that that might not hold up in court if it was challenged because the state is authorizing certain farmers in the community to to practice nuisance permits, which allows uh to to hunt deer to protect their crops. Um, and as you can see, there's an attached photo as well as a video of some of the destruction of the the fields and the and and that has occurred in Warren. Um, and in looking at what Bristol has done, Bristol has allowed, as as I think we all know, some degree of uh of bow and arrow hunting, and they have, I think, been able to address the overpopulation of deer in a humane uh way. Um, and I think that there's really two parts to this. The first part would allow farmers that have the nuisance permits to conduct them in accordance with state law. Under a nuisance permit, you can be granted bow and arrow hunting. You can also be granted shotgun hunting. So, that is a step up from what Bristol would allow. However, what this would also do is allow for hunting with a bow and arrow on properties and mourn where there is at least three acres or more. So it encourages uh I think at least addressing this problem in a with a bow and arrow process before going towards the nuisance permits but also allows us to conform with state law and state

practices. Um and with that I think the video uh which unfortunately I guess the techn technological difficulties that the people online cannot see. Um but uh I I have nothing more. I'll turn it over to I I hope a member who is still here um of the community who can speak to the nuisance permit issue. Ah there he is. Um so thank you Mr. President for your indulgence. I also take any questions from my other council. Just a quick one. So does this ordinance like Bristol allows firearms. Is does this ordinance and warrant would it just allow for archery or also firearms?

So that's a great question. So if you have a nuisance permit then it would allow for whatever the state allows. So if the state allows you to use shotguns in in hunting, then you would be allowed to do that. However, if if you are not allowed to do that under state law, then it would be the bow and arrow is what we're authoriz. So a farmer the farmer would just get a nuisance uh permit. Correct. Wait, let me just add one thing because we had discussion at the department meeting. These are two completely separate issues. A nuisance permit is uh separate. So we're taking the hunting now. This isn't gonna uh first there going to be two votes Mr. Dysto as we discussed. Correct. Correct.

Because they're two separate issues. So what Mr. Tromley is bringing up is that there's no hunting allowed in Warren. He's brought in some uh language three acres and uh so right here a land owner in warrant possessing three acres or more uh or the design in accordance with state laws may engage in archery hunting

and that's the first thing that we're discussing because right now in Warren's ordinances that's not allowed. So we're going to do these separately. Uh if anybody wants to speak on this issue, the issue on the floor right now is the hunting with bow and arrow. Miss Flanigan, you're patient to keep hearing from me. I'm on the Warren Land Trust. Uh Land Trust has discussed in the past um the overabundance of deer on our properties and the impacts it has on habitat. Uh we don't have a policy about it yet. Um uh in part because of the ban in Warren, but we have discussed the possibility of doing deer culling because of that. Uh we would always do it with uh bow um contracted licensed bow hunters. Um but um just saying that the land trust would be in favor of being able to use this option um to control the habitat.

Thank you, Anthony. as would would they be allowed as a because it's worded as a land owner the land trust would be allowed to do this through their design obviously because you can't an LLC can't correct yes they would be allowed to do so anyone else from the public want to speak Sean well he he's here on a separate issue if you want to speak on the bow hunting you can but you don't have to Sean um feel free come forward if you are. I mean, if you want to speak, speak. Um, basically, say uh state your name and

I'm Sean Dibido. I live at 79 Long Lane. Um, the deer have just obviously been out of control. I do encourage the hunting. I understand the archery part of it. So, I am pushing for that because I would like to see it because then it allows me to bring in people during the hunting season to then take all, you know, to kind of clean things up and try to make it a little better. Good point. So, that's all I can speak on that. Thank you, Mr. Hanley. I would just like to hear from the police chief his thoughts on this. Any concerns?

Chief Morgis, do you have anything you want to add to this discussion? We discussed this at the department head meeting and uh not against it. Uh I think the spoke to the solicitor. I think it's the the li if there is any liability to the town and by passing this there isn't a liability to the town for passing it. In other words, if something bad were to happen, it doesn't go back to us because we allowed this and then something bad happened. Uh correct. And the other issue it would would there be like a time period of when this could be done the firearms that could be

Oh no this isn't the firearms that's the new this is allowing uh deer hunting which would take uh into account the state hunting season that's what in accordance to state laws so there's two parts to this audience correct okay I was a little confused and and actually just to expand on on what you all just said uh this would authorize hunting in the town of Warren subject to all of the regulations that the state has for hunting and that's actually a very as you know very regulated uh activity through DM so anything that uh happens here in Warren would also have to comply with state law I'm good in other words they would have to follow the state's hunting procedure correct

correct yes and and get a a permit and the tag or whatever process and if anybody has any questions. Mr. Silva, um although he's our hoba master, he understands the laws. I don't mean us. I mean the town, uh people you're here. Um so I guess the best advice would be to call DEM if anybody has any questions about state hunting. So uh is there a motion to approve this first part? I'll make a motion we approve 13-1.1 sections A and B. Second. All in favor? I You go. So that means the first reading is approved and it'll be set down for a second reading at the January meeting.

Correct. Now we're discussing a whole separate issue. This is uh to reduce deer abundance and associated negative impacts. Hunting of deer by land owners or their design upon their property in accordance with state laws provided that such land owners shall have been granted authority by the state or its subsidiaries subsidiaries to conduct such activities shall be permitted. So what's happening here is usually state law supersedes town law. Uh farmers get a nuisance permit. Uh but Warren's ordinance says you can't fire a firearms. Is that correct?

So what the farmers are looking for is a relief from the statute uh would allow the use uh with a state and police inspection as long as they meet the requirements. The uh firearm could be uh used now a shotgun. Anybody want to add anything to that? No, I I do have a question though. Please feel free. Sure. It's probably covered by state law, but the proximity of other houses, is there a certain footage away they have to be covered by the state? Yes. And as a matter of fact, the town manager had asked the um person at DE DEM that's assigned to hunting activities if uh to come down and answer those questions. Unfortunately, they were unable to come.

He's on family leave right now. We'll get you those to the second uh reading. But yes, there are and this probably wouldn't allow um this is this is a farmer's nuisance permit. This isn't hunting, right? It's not something somebody could do on their land unless they're already a designated farmer agricultural use. Would the three acres or more apply as well? No. No. I think most of the farms are in Warren are about 50 acres or so or long or larger. So it's even more of a of a requirement there. The two don't come in together. No. So So what you need to do is Oh god, I'm sorry. I I just So right now a farmer has the right to use a shotgun to shoot there, right?

No. No, they don't. Not with slugs or anything. The town of Warren says you can't shoot a a firearm. He can do it with a bow and arrow. No. Correct. No, because it's all hunting. All hunting is prohibited under the current statute or ordinance, which is why this change. Okay. The nuisance permit does allow a bow. We don't have a nuisance permit order. The state the state permit does allow the nuisance permit. The problem with the nuisance permit is that the state allowed shotgun and the shotgun in Warren isn't allowed per ordinance. So we're asking No, it's not. I belong to the gun club. I know it's not allowed. Well, we shoot there all the time. So I guess you don't shoot nuisance on a farm deer. So thank you. Take care of that. So,

can you eat clay pigeon, Lou? No. You know, it's funny. I was shooting this weekend and they were right in front of us. They They're not afraid. I've been there when it walked right across. Okay. Can I just make a suggestion? Yeah. Uh, and it's very technical in um section 13-1.2 where it says authority by the state or its subsidiaries. Uh, could that subsidiaries be eliminated and changed to uh departments or agencies? Yeah. Yeah. Mr. Charmley, is that a motion? I'll make a motion to that effect. Great technical amendment only corrects really just clarifying that it's the Department of Environmental Management or if that were to change in any future situation that it would still be under whatever appropriate agency.

All in favor? All right. Is there a motion to uh approve this and pass it to the next reading? I will make a motion we approve 13-1.1 No, excuse me. 1.2 for nuisance permits. uh to the second reading. Second. All in favor? I. Thank you. All right. Next, we have ordinance 5, chapter 13, offenses and miscellaneous provisions, article one, section 13, hunted prohibited. Oh, no. Did that. Thank you. We're on to petition. We're on. Do it again.

We're on to habituing license. So, let's see. Where is Diego? Diego, how are you? Good. Come on down. You're here to ask for forgiveness instead of permission because we hear your uh new uh cafe is going along great, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. It's moving right along, isn't it? Yeah. So, just adding another thing to my restaurant. Tell us a little bit about All righty. So, um it's going to be I know it's lately it's been a lot of coffee shops coming to the town. Yeah.

So, this is going to be just a breakfast um vegan vegetarian breakfast place. Even a menu if you guys want to take a look at it. So, good. Put it in the record. And it's right upstairs. Yep. It's floor and the license covers the whole building if you wanted to serve liquor. Yeah. You still have to follow all the laws. And uh there are any questions of the applicant. Huh? What will your hours of operation day Monday through? Uh, no, just Wednesday to Sunday. Wednesday to Sunday. So, yeah, we not um we're not going to open for lunch the um downstairs. So, just going to open um on the second floor from uh 8:00 a.m. to 2 p.m. Awesome. And just dinner time, so you know, tacos and everything. Yeah. Make a motion to approve. What is there a second?

Second. All in favor? I All right. Thank you. All right. See you later. I'll see you for lunch or breakfast. Next, we have a uh request for a class F beverage license. And this is from uh Chief Souza. The date is Sunday, December 13th. No, it should I'm reading my correction. It's uh Saturday, Saturday the 13th, and that's from 4 to 8. And that's at the fire department headquarters. This is for the War and Fire Department's uh 225th anniversary fundraiser. Anything you want to add to that?

Nope. 200 2027 is our 225th year. We're just starting fundraising for that year. Okay. I just want to make sure he clears it with the fire chief before he uh I got to sweep the floors beforehand and then clean up after you make a motion. Is there a second? All in favor? And thank you. Next, we have request for a class F beverage license from Elizabeth Fara. And this is 20 Libby Lane. And this is Saturday, December 20, Sunday. Gee, these corrections are killing me. Sun there and Saturday. Yeah, Saturday. Sunday. It's uh this one is on Sunday. Yes. And this is December 21st and this is at the senior center. Andreo Z Hall. Yes. Hi. Hi.

Tell [clears throat] us a little bit about your event. I'm the senior I'm the president of the uh tenants association. I've been there about five years as president. Um, Mr. Rigo knows, he's seen me in there. Um, every year we have a Christmas party and we have it 5 to 9. We used to have it later, but because they're seniors, they started walking away a lot earlier. Yeah. So, but they're adults. They like to have, you know, glass of wine here with their dinner. You know, it's it I can see that because we get an expensive dinner from um a restaurant in Warren. They come down and they cook the ribeye steaks to order and we have I'd be there but I'm gonna be in the hospital. Yeah,

I'm gonna have my hand fixed. Is there a motion to approve? So moved. Second. All in favor? Apologize for my absence, but have a great time. Merry Christmas. Next we have page five. request permission to relocate pole P6 plus -40 or something. I don't know what's that mean. Plus or minus 40T to the north. Thank you, John. That must be at what a state of That's just that's actually construction, all kinds of stuff. That's when they're not that's when they're not sure

not sure where it's going to go. So, they want to put a pole out on Emery Road. Are there any questions? My only question is this thing was dated a year ago. 10252 24. I don't think it has a matters, but just thought I'd bring it up. Well, uh, yeah, they're finally getting around to actually doing it, I guess. Uh, so is there a motion? Well, we don't we don't know. We don't have a checklist, which we probably should, to make sure police, fire, and DPW have signed off on this. Well, we can do that contingent on police and fire approval. Boston.

Okay. I'll make a motion. We approve the relocation of P6 plus or minus 40T to the north. I'll make a motion. All in favor? I I Okay. Now, I second. Sorry. You second. It's okay. Uh, so now we have correspondence. We already did, but we have C3, C4, C5, C6, C7. So, we have a letter from economic development board member Paul Thomas resigning. Paul Thomas Gordon, excuse me.

Would you I would like to make a motion that the town clerk send out a letter of uh appreciation to all of the people resigning from their positions. uh and also to advertise for the positions that are being vacated. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? I. Thank you. Travis spit that out. Next we have the town manager and this is discussion and action authorization for the town council president to sign an engineer services agreement extension of an on call contract with Hen O'Neal. Good evening, Mr. manager.

Good evening, Mr. President, members of the council. Uh this is uh I received a letter from Fussen O'Neal. Um they are are a town engineer that currently we use. Um and apparently we have continued to contract with them annually. Uh this year uh for some unknown reason it fell through the cracks but from both the town and Fussen O'Neal. And I was informed by uh Brian Courts that uh in October at the end of October requesting that uh this proposal be brought to the council to extend uh the contract for another year which would have gone back to uh July 1st of 25 and go until June of uh 26. Uh Mr. Quartz is here as well. U council has any questions. Is there any increase in the fee or is it continuing the same fee as the previous contract?

That was my question. That was my question. There is a there is a uh the old contract there was a 3% increase in the fee annually. So um the current rate for and I do have the rates here and I apologize for not getting that to you. I think it's when we ask uh them to come here to a council meeting and they sit here all night, are they getting paid? Mhm. As an engineer, $220 an hour. I think so. We should move them to the front of the agenda then.

Okay. Um I I've never received a bill for that, Mr. President. whatever everybody's uh everybody's got. So there's been a 3% gradually every year, right? From the day we started. Okay. That and I had called them this morning and asked that question. It's on it goes it's it's in here. Lis if you look current I mean past language. So are there uh any other questions on the bus O'Neal? No. Make a motion to approve. Second. Okay. All in favor? I

I. Next, we have discussion and action from the town council to approve uh what the manager has done in regards to hiring Mary Hunt as the interimm deputy director for public works. And this will be from January 5th, 2026 or until about April 1st, 2027. Miss Hunt's here if to come on down. Miss Hunt's a town resident and uh why don't you tell us a little about a little bit about uh your hopes and desires here as you come in?

Mr. President, can I Yeah. So, uh as you said, I'm looking for the support to bring uh uh Miss Hunt on as the interim uh deputy public works director. Um, as you all know, and the the I'm not sure if the public knows that uh our current public works director, Mr. Wheeler, um is going to be deploying with the Red Island National Guard um on a mission uh to Africa. Uh that deployment takes place in April of 26 and uh it lasts for one year until April of uh 27. Um and although um Mary is new to municipal public's work, she is she does have experience in managing uh large marinas. Uh she brings strong leadership skills with her. Uh she has the ability to work collaboratively with uh both administrative customers and employees. uh she has a vast knowledge in emergency management and emergency medical uh she's emergency medical technician so she's ability to think and act uh in stressful situations um in my conversations that I've had with Mary um she understands that she's been willing that she'll be be willing sorry be working with legacy employees people who have specialized skills and knowledge and um she knows she has to take advantage of those individuals uh to be successful both uh for her and the town to be successful. Um and as you said, I'm looking to have Mary start uh January 26th uh January 5th, excuse me, 2026. Um and and it may appear to be a little bit early because when you say Mr. Wheel is leaving in April. So, um, but he does

have other, um, obligations to the military between January 1st and April. Uh, he'll be out of the country, um, January, this the last two weeks of January. Um, uh, there'll be some other training uh, dates that I'm sure that he's going to have to attend to. Um, and I want to be able to give uh, a continuity of of operations uh, with Mr. Wheeler and uh Mary so that uh she has a full grasp and knowledge and understanding of of what needs to be done and what needs to take take place at the public works department.

Sounds good. Miss Hunt, would you like to introduce yourself? Sure.

Mary Hunt, 50 Wheaten Street. Uh I am honored to be approached to take on this role. Uh I look forward to working with Mr. Sullivan, with Mr. Wheeler. We've had positive discussions so far. Uh, I know the town. I love the town. Uh, it is a good time for me to move into something uh municipal. Uh, it's a it's a it's a different world, but one that I look forward to to getting to work in. Um, I am looking to hold down the fort while Mr. Wheeler uh completes his service uh and working uh with the council as well to uh to meet any needs that that come up. Uh, I'm I'm used to managing large crews. I'm used to heavy equipment. I'm used to the elements uh all the things that are required uh of this role. So uh I appreciate I appreciate your consideration.

Any questions or uh welcome aboard. What my question is and I and I think I know the answer to this, but I just want to get it out to the public. So where is the funding for this going to come? Uh we're not going to be paying Mr. Wheeler while he's gone. Just want to get that into the record, Joe. So when I get a phone call saying you're adding another position, how are you paying for it? At least now I I don't have to get that phone call. Hopefully they have it. And uh there's also some uh funding that's available uh in the employment uh line, salary line. Uh well, welcome aboard and we're going to support you as best we can. Yep. And uh see you at work. All right. Thank you so much.

Thank you. You're welcome. So is there a motion? I make a motion that we support the uh manager's appointment of Mary Hunt as the interim deputy public works director. There a second. Second. All in favor? I. Thank you. Next we have discussion and action and consent from the town council. Uh no, sorry. discussion and action regarding a memorandum of understanding and with single point of contact concerning an upgrade to the code red alert warning system with REMA Rhode Island Emergency Management Agency.

Yes, Mr. President. This uh as you mentioned it uh is an upgrade to the current code red system that the town has already um implemented and using. uh Rhode Island may is is uh going to a uh a more robust program. Um but in order for us to participate with that, we have to sign a memorandum of understanding and uh we also have to point uh assign someone as a point of contact and that would be uh the EMA director and fire chief chief Suzu. Mr. Disto, did you uh read this language and approve its legality? I did. Yes. Is there a motion to accept? Motion second. All in favor? I I

Thank you. Next we have update the town council directives to the town manager. What I was uh hoping we could do with this uh Mr. Disto correct my language if I'm wrong. So every month we get the managers uh I mean every week we get the weekly report. What I was hoping is that we could uh also include this in the weekly report so that the council would know what our directives were, what's been checked off, where it's going. Is that okay, Mr. Uh, hi Cisco. Yes, we got the You can speak. Sure. I kind of like having this communication on a monthly basis just to make sure things happening.

And what I didn't like was the grilling last month. Well, if I that was not my intention. I understand it. A lot of times it's no one's intentional things off, but I I think if we get to the report and you want to pull something every week, you'd have weekly you'd look at weekly this report instead of every month and then when the council meeting were to come, if there's a reason to have a council action on an item, you could put it on the agenda. Um, I kind of like having a two-minute conversation. That way everyone knows what's happening. Okay.

Um, a lot of these things take up a lot of time putting it on the agenda, talking about it and all of a sudden we forget about it and I don't really want to forget about it then because if we do then I just wasting my time and nothing happens. Um, so if you don't mind, Brian, huh? I don't mind. Two seconds. So the first thing we can even take off of there and that's for the uh maint maintenance easements for Market Street because we are working with the flood and drainage committee and so when we're ready for those easements then we'll bring them up again.

Right. And I could just let you know uh that the public works director has come up with a a beginning list of properties. He's reached out to the solicitor and they've had conversation. Uh the solicitor want would like a little bit more uh detail in order to get those easements going, but we have been working on that. Good. Good. Uh as far as the land post, we did meet last uh last week and spoke to them. So that's we're moving along in that

and and we did get uh I believe we got a uh a quote back from Mr. O'Brien and I believe it's $1,400 for for fixing the the the top of the lamp post um and not taking the whole lamp post apart wherever post like I'll sit down with you one of these days and we can go over it. Um as far as the state roads uh trial street came out beautiful still concerned about uh Madam Avenue and and Market Street. Um as far as the annual um performance is that something that we're still working on which uh

so I have met with the department heads I gave them a draft proposal of the evaluation um uh I've asked them to give me some feedback on that and uh this Thursday five uh myself and five department head members are going to be going to the trust. The trust is going to be having a uh training on performance of appraisals and understanding uh the supervisor's role and the rating system and and uh um how to turn appraisals into a a positive uh and growing experience for for everyone involved.

That's great. Uh the next one, discussion action time manage obtain cost for time management. That's something we're going to be talking about next, right? with the uh yes with the with the um and then this last one is discussion action regarding replacement repair sidewalks on medical avenue kick road mark street with uh 88 compliance and that's something that Joe actually brought up and that's something that you did send a letter to uh do and we're still working on trying to get a meeting together between the town and them correct

that's correct we got a an email back and I I believe I shared the email with everyone from um someone at DOT. I responded back to her asking for a follow-up uh meeting and I have not received any. I guess Joe, again, you put that on the agenda a couple of months ago, so maybe you and I can work on getting our representatives. We'll try. Push that. That's it. Thank you so much, Ryan. Thank you. Next we have uh we have the update on no discussion and action regarding a resolution number five.

Oh five that's still there. Oh yeah I thought that was the remaind update on American Rescue Plan act monies for the financial management system.

It yes Mr. President, if uh you recall last meeting we had uh the council approved us going with Edmond's technology for our financial software and at the time um we the council uh requested that we look into and research how much money we would need to not just implement the software but also equipment and other things that would training and those things that would go along with or would need to come go along with implement implementation of this new software. Um, and you have before you a memo that I' I've sat down with the finance director and the budget committee and uh we discussed that um in total we would need $88,200 to implement that software in an appropriate way. But that would include uh 3 years of implementation of the software. Um some equipment that would be needed for scanners and uh uh uh a new uh desktop for the finance director. Um one of the most important things I think is training from staff. I think we found that um there was a lack of training on both sides that needs to be make sure that we do that properly and um at times we may have to train staff at overtime, right? Because we it couldn't be done during the day, right? When we're open

um professional development for uh the finance director. Um and then we talked about implementing the paperless time management system and bringing that uh into line with this new financial software. Um and then uh a consultant to assist with the transition, make sure we have SOPs in place. Um one would be make sure that you know training is is proper, right? We make sure that, you know, somebody that's coming on board, they get the proper training and and not um just, you know, sit next to her and and have her train you and she might not be doing the right thing. So, sometimes that's that's how that happens.

The the consultant, would that be an Edwards employee? Uh Edmonds, excuse me. I I I don't believe it wouldn't be an Edmonds employee. It would be Yeah. And the other question I have is up on the top, the 36,000, is that part of the contract? We voted last month to to go with Edmonds. Is that that 36 comes out of that? Correct. Is that part of it? Yes. The 36 would be three years of contract, but we already approved the 36. So, technically we're down to like 50 50 more than we we voted on last. I don't I don't recall if we voted on any uh set of Hold on. Hold on.

We agreed to go I think. Yeah, I thought I thought we did approve going with admins on the bid and but we did put an up too. Okay, you're Yeah. So now this is the whole thing. So it would include that. Yeah. It's important to know that I think we had from our money like $200,000. Correct. Correct. Oh, I I think the next step also is to try to figure out what we're going to do with the difference and come up with some suggestions. Well, what what what I think they're going to do is look at all of the completed projects and costs and then give us a list of where the um over what the surplus may be. Mhm. And so that's going to be next. U Mr. Marshall, you have anything you want to add to this?

No. Um if you reconcile I'm reconciling the um to figure out exactly what's there, right? I mean, do you have anything you want to say about the Edmonds? Um, no. I think we covered it for everything's good. All right. Is there a motion to approve the 88,000? Do we need It says update. Do we need a motion? I don't know. I think we do. I don't think I' I'd recommended you. Okay. I'll make a motion to approve 88,200. Is there a second? And the form is set forth in the memo. In this and the form is set forth in the memo. Thank you, Tony. I'll second that. All in favor? I.

Thank you. Next, we have discussion and action regarding a resolution for nonrestoring line of credit to facilitate the payment of project cost Virginia's park restoration pumping project.

Thanks, Mr. President. Um, this actually has come from um the Rhode Island Infrastructure Bank. If you uh recall back in October, we talked about getting a line of credit from the infrastructure bank to cover uh the grants for J's Park uh that we would have to normally put money up for and get reimbured for. But the infrastructure bank um has is going [clears throat] to allow us to have a line of credit 250,000 to withdraw from that uh draw down from that to pay off the um those grants and then reimburse it when we get when we get reimbursed by the grants. Mr. Rego has a couple of questions

again. Um the the I don't have a problem with this. I just don't know if we're going to need to utilize it. So, if we vote on this doesn't necessarily mean we're going to utilize it. Correct. Well, we're it's correct, but the way it's been laid out to us, although it's the funding is coming from the same agency that's giving us the loan, they don't look at it like I I it must not be called coming out of the same room. Yeah. So, the all of the accountants over there. So, uh they're giving us the grant and it's a reimbursement grant. So then we're going to get a reimbursement. Then we're going to get this $250,000 line of credit. We're going to stop the process.

First bill's going to come in and we're going to be able to reimburse. From what I understand, we're going to be able to pay it and then they will reimburse us. What I understand 1.3% interest. So what? Well, for that No, it's only a one and a half% upfront cost. 1.3. Yeah. But anyways, the way I understand it, there's three parts to this project. Is we're going to get a 100% grant from Municipal Resilience Program awarded to the Rhode Island Infrastructure Bank. Correct. That's 100%. We don't need any.

But that's reimbursible grant means they would have we would have to pay for it when it's done because of our budget crisis. That's why we're doing this. So if we have so we if we need to do this before we get reimbursed. It's not like pay as you go. It's a reimbursement covering us. We would have to expend all that money before we got it. But just hold on. So I thought the 1.2 was not that was 100%. Yeah. The the 1.2 from the infrastructure bank, they'll just pay that out. We don't have to pay that upfront. So the concern is with the Rhode Island uh DEM grant and the SNAP, I think it's SNAP grant that those are the reimburseable ones where we would have to pay out of pocket first.

Request reimbursement. I guess the question is with the time frame and all of that. So I think we could probably financially, but again I have no problem voting on this. What I my concern is that this was done three years ago. This goes back to 2023. Did we get a price back in 23 23 or do we have to go out for bidding and and start the whole process? I guess uh Mr. Wheeler uh

please come on down. Uh the problem is at the time that this was applied for probably four years ago and when we received the grant we had a planner and we were just in our uh crisis. So we tabled it. Now it's come around where we've gotten uh the help from the committee, help from yourself, know where we are fiscally as well as asking for this uh bridge loan and uh we're now starting back again on the project.

Yeah. So O'Neal has actually been working on this project. they submitted with our help through um for approvals through GM and then I believe the goal is to go out for a bid in the spring. Oh, we have somebody here. Oh, come on down. He didn't stay for nothing. You know, you're getting paid by the owl. We probably Now he is. So, please tell us who you are and and uh my name is Brian Courts. I'm a vice president with Finanium. big needs.

So my concern, Brian, is as you know, I I don't know where we're at with this project. It was three years ago, so I don't even know if these numbers going to align. Are we going to have enough? So I And I don't even know who is going to even run this project. Would it be you or would it be the highway director?

So currently we are under contract as the engineer for the project. Um all the permits have been submitted. They're being reviewed right now by DEM uh CRMC. Um, so the engineering part is ongoing right now. The anticipation is once we get permits about springtime, we'll go out to construction to get bids. So we've secured grants up to $2 million a couple years ago. Um, and that was the anticipation at the time. That's what the construction would be. Um, but of course we'll know when we get actual hard bids. So those those uh grants are still available, correct? Yes. they were just extended a few more years to to allow us to finish the construction.

So why don't we Is there a reason why we wouldn't go off for RFP now so we know more or less what it's going to cost? Um and typically it's better once you have your permits in hand so you know exactly what they need to build. There's typically a lot of comments back and forth with the permitting agencies that could change the design. Um, so we prefer when we can to wait. So we have a our a hard set of plans to tell the contractors what to what to build. So once we have all that, are you the person in charge or would it be a town person who who pretty much takes the charge and just to make sure it happens?

We would assist the town in putting the bids out, administering the bids, reviewing the bids, but the RFP comes from the town. So we would work with town manager and DPW director on So you understand where I'm coming from. I think we need all that information before we start worrying about the financial aspect of it. Well, we have the fighting. We need the money and we have the money and we're he's in process, right? Again, that's my point. You say you have the money, but three years ago, whatever the money you assumed would be, I'm sure there's a big difference. So, we just got to get our ducks in a row. That's all. He's gonna we're going to do it.

The grants are secured. The amount of money is secured. Um, so that's that that's a hard number of what the grants are have given the town. Okay. And uh this will be a big job for Miss Hunt. We got to write on and uh that's who's going to be dealing with us. So uh what do we need from us? A motion to approve the resolution. Thank you. I didn't know you were here all night. You will when you get the bill. Yeah. Uh so motion to approve a resolution for nonrestoring line of credit to facilitate the payment of project costs for Jills Park Restoration Capping Project. I'll make a motion. Is there a second?

Second. All in favor? Thank you. Thank you. Okay, you can go. Yeah. [laughter] You really don't have to stay. Thank you. And and of course we go back to the hour, right? If we go we go back. So that Well, we'll find out if we're paying him by the hour and he doesn't leave. Well, no, but it goes back to the last hour. The last 15 minutes don't count, then they're going to change where we are. We find humor in small places. It's not personal. Next, we have the solicitor discussion and action regarding statutory notice claim for damages filed by Diane Mariani. Is there a motion to deny and send to the trust? I'll make a motion we deny and refer it to the trust. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? I. All right.

Thank you.

Next, we have the finance director, Mr. Marshall. We have fiscal year 2526, revenues and expenditures. Everybody get that? Um so just to go over it quickly um the only issue I see is um on the finance department the outside services and um under shared ser services the um audit line item they're both creeping over. Um this is due to us needing the outside help to get ready for the to complete the audit. the one that we just finished and the new one now. Um, I wouldn't do anything with it right now. I'd like to get a better sense of what we're going to need and where where we can get it from before I'll ask you to move something around. So,

okay. Thank you for being on top of that. On the um the cash balance sheet um we have um as of as of the end of November, we had almost four $4 million. That's a comfortable place to be in. that'll comfortably get us to the next collection cycle. Um we also um we had the um the money from the um me now. Um the the lawsuit money um we had $2 million in a um 12 month CD.

I removed it came due November 20th. I removed a million dollars that's going to come into this year's budget. Um, and I renewed the other million for another 12 months. The million I removed, I put into a um a one-mon CD, so we'll get a little bit of interest. We It doesn't look like we're going to need it for a little while. So, right. Maybe we'll do that for a couple of times until it looks like we need it. Sure. So, but yep. Other than that, everything's Any questions, Mr. Marshall? Yeah. So, Gary, you're working with the opera funds, correct? Yes. I guess that's all I have for you. Good work. Thank you. Thank you.

Next, we have the tax assessor. We have additions to the 25 tax roll in the amount of 2,888,34. This was new construction and a new lot. Hello. I Anything else you want to add to that? No. Is there a motion to uh approve these addition? Motion. Second. All in favor? Thank you. Thank you. Next we have Well, you look nice. Next we have I don't look nice normally. I thought I was just checking. He never learns. Yeah, he was just checking. He never learns. Known you long enough to walk into the left hand, my right hand. Go ahead.

I was prepared. Yep. Next, we have discussion and action regarding an increase in summer camp fees. Yes. So, um I am we haven't increased in a while. Um and so I'm following we kind of follow what Bristol does. So Okay. And you don't think this will be a hardship or it's a resident in the United No, we have uh financial assistance for residents. So if uh there are Yes. And if there are any uh families that need it, we we would never turn a family away. Great. Is there a motion to approve this schedule? Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? Thank you. And next we have beach fees.

So the beach fees uh this goes along with the states um new requirement for sales tax and um sales tax what? On parking. Oh, right. Yes.

7% on short-term parking. So this does not affect uh if a person gets a beach pass. So, if a person purchases a purchases a beach pass, they are not responsible for the 7%. But for short-term parking, which is one day that we are responsible for paying the 7%. But at the beach, we deal with um cash. So, I don't really want the staff working in pennies and dimes and dollars. So, um I'm kind of I've spoke with the other East Bay communities. Um, and so this is kind of the same um, pattern that they're following. Very clever. Any questions?

No. I'm just I'm just wondering if next year the state's going to tax us on the sunshine at the beach. So, it it was intentional. The intention of it was to tax short-term parking in Providence, but then uh, someone had the idea that let's just spread it around the state. And even DEM who was unaware that this was go like they had no idea they they did not even tell DEM that they were going to be doing this and they they have to follow this also. This is right up there like we're charging $15 for a fire chief for a one day liquor license. It's right up there. We don't have a motion to approve. So move to approve. Second. All in favor?

Just one quick terra. Are there other fees that you charge in the uh Yes, we charge fees for the the pavilion. We charge fees for uh events at Bur Hill. Um we charge fees for the use of Mary V Park. Um we have Yeah, we we charge a bunch of fees. So, at budget time, we'd like to look at all of those for that time. Sounds good. Thank you. Thank you. Next, we have the town clerk request approval for the 2026 town council meeting schedule. Anybody see any reason why those dates would be unacceptable? Dane Jane has her hand up. Sorry, Jane.

Hello. Are you uh waving to us or you leaving? They think that Jane, they think that you're Did you want to speak? Oh, sorry. I missed it. I thought you were putting your coat on. [clears throat] I It's undone. In regard to beach and the parking fees, I'm not objecting to the parking fees, whatever the decide that they should. Please come on down. And

Jane McDougall, 500 Water Street. I live on the corner of Water and Hail Street across from the north end of the beach. And I just wanted to say that I think the beach parking has more to do with the surrounding area than it does just the beach fees. And I think if you're going to increase beach fees or have them at all that you need to take into account how they affect the neighborhood and the fact that you're missing out on a lot of fees because people park mainly on I see mostly on uh Hail Street. In the summer we're sitting out on our porch. Cars come down the street. They stop at Hail Street. look up the street. If they can see an empty space, turn right up there, and five minutes later, we see them coming down with all their stuff and going to the beach. They're not paying the fees. This can be a car from Massachusetts that would be paying now what, $20 to come to the beach, and you're missing out on those things. And I have often thought that I know in Newport they uh and other towns where they have beach areas and the people live near the beach. They've restricted at least put up signs restricting the parking for residents only and not for beach use. Uh that's one thing. Another thing on Hail Street particularly because we have small lots on Hail Street and many of the uh houses only have a driveway that's one car wide. They may have two cars in the driveway, but then they have to shuffle them all the time. So, somebody will often park in the street in front of their house because it's

inconvenient. And the street on on a Sunday in the summer is packed with cars, packed, you know. And uh I think there needs to be some other attention paid to the fact that maybe some signs that at least discourage beach parking from being on the street. Same thing at the top of uh Bridge Street. They get a lot of traffic too because everybody's trying to avoid paying to go to the beach. And have you ever considered uh something like a pay and display type of machine at the parking lot? Because not everyone who comes to the beach wants to stay for the whole day or pay $20 to be there for two hours or three hours or have lunch there and then leave. And yet they would have to pay if they came when the beach is open and they were collecting fees.

Well, we hope people buy the season pass. Well, how many do can tell us a lot? That's the biggest number. Please, if and we're not holding you to it, but um this is this appropriate discussion. Well, you're actually trending past the open meetings act because this was just about charging the fees really a separate uh issue of whether or not it should be expanded.

So, Mr. McD put this on the agenda for discussion uh and Miss Nibbido will be prepared and we can kind of look at this next season. Uh, I mean, I'm not not familiar with what you're talking about and it happens like my neighborhood with restaurants. Monday night, Monday, there's plenty of parking Thursday. Um, Right. plan your day, right? But you're not charging the people at the restaurants. So, you're you're not losing money either. Okay. So, we could take a a look at this and you'll know and hopefully you can come to the meeting. Okay. If not January, February, we'll try to get this on. Yeah. and uh look at a parking policy for the Yeah, I think it would be an easy fit. You probably should look at something before next season. Yeah.

Yeah. And the other thing is uh I've I've talked to Mr. Wheeler in the also about putting lines on Hail Street and probably Bridge Street too. So that you use past the opening. Don't get into it. I know. Okay. Future meeting. Okay. So, thank you and we'll we'll put this on the agenda for either next month or February. Needs to be more talk about it. Thank you. Thank you. Um, sorry I missed you back there. Discussion and action authorizing the town council president to sign a memorandum of understanding between the Rhode Island Department. I think we're still on dates. We're on the what? Oh, the dates still. That's right.

Yeah. The dates. Which one? Even though I did put them on because I wasn't statements. They did have some consent aboutation about maybe having a primary in August, but I don't hear anything. So, it's September 8th primary. So, I'd like to change it to September 14th. Um, I cannot do it on the Tuesdays because I have over that date and I've already bumped that November. So, I don't understand. So I ask that the council change. And with that change, is there a motion to approve? I'll I'll motion that.

I'll second that. And I also want to note it that I really don't care what when the meeting is in December because the three of us will not be sitting here. The December meeting. Yeah. Actually, isn't it? Um, no, that's what September, not December. No, September. We are term limited out. We will not be sitting at the rost room on the December meeting. Well, I think No, we will. We're going to be here. The weird thing is I'm going to sit here until uh the middle of the meeting and then the president actually gets picked. You got to We're all here for the middle of the meeting in December. This notion, you always. No, but I mean what John's talking about come December. The December meeting when the new council gets sworn in,

right? And then and then as the meeting goes on, the presidency hasn't even been picked. are. It's going to be interesting. No, but we're not going to be here. We're not going to be sitting here in December. We're going to be in the audience if we're here. Let's close the meeting. Is there a motion to approve? With the correction of September 14th. Second. All in favor? Thank you. And maybe we won't be here. Discussion and action authorization of the town county town council president to sign a memorandum of understanding by between the Rhode Island Department of State and the town of Warren. And this is uh what is this? Trade names. It used to be done at the local level. State law changed. Now it's done at the secretary of state level. Basic. It's very simple, but we just have to approve it.

You have to approve. It's already been shipped up. This is a memorandum of understanding where the secretary of state is going to take over a function formally formally done by the town clerk. Thank you, Mr. Charle. Sorry. Motion to approve. Is there a second? Second. All in favor? All right.