Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

I hereby call the planning commission meeting of 02/18/2026 to order. Roll call, please. Commissioner Ladik? Here.

Commissioner Lindy?

Here.

Commissioner Thompson? Here. Commissioner Weimer?

Here.

Busher Coon.

Present. And commissioner Litz. Here.

Hey. Thank you. Are there any announcements or planning commission communications? Any of

us. K.

We're gonna move to the approval of minutes, which we do have. Have the members had a chance to review the draft minutes for the 10/15/2025 meeting?

Yes.

Anybody have anything that they needed to change or comments they need to make? Is there a motion for the draft of the minutes for 10/15/2025 meeting to be approved? So moved. Okay. Everybody say aye or nay? Aye. Okay. Thank you. K. Is there any communication with the public regarding items not on the agenda?

I assume you're here for the agenda. Okay. Perfect. So the first action item on the agenda is a city initiated code amendment pursuant to TDC 32 o one zero two e. The planning commission is being asked to provide a recommendation to the city council on a city initiated code amendment that expands existing regulations for backyard chickens in a low density residential zone RL to include domestic fowl under PTA 26 dash zero zero one.

City staff will now provide a staff report. Okay. Can

everybody hear me online? It looks like we might have one participant in Zoom. Yeah.

Oh, that's up.

Oh, okay. We can hear it.

That's the question.

Well, tonight, we will be discussing a city initiated amendment, which is known as PTA 26 dash zero zero zero one for domestic VAL regulations. Next slide, please. So for tonight's agenda, we'll review the project purpose, look at our code amendments that are proposed. We'll review the approval criteria for this legislative amendment, discuss next steps for city council, and then we'll conclude with discussion and recommendation on the motion. Next slide, please.

So for some background, the origin of our chicken keeping regulations started in 2013 where we passed plan text amendment 13 dash o two to allow chicken keeping in the RL zone through the adoption of ordinance thirteen sixty two dash 13. This ordinance also included some standards in our municipal code. One thing to flag, though, is that the code was strictly limited to chicken keeping and not ducks or other domestic fowls. I think at the time, we didn't anticipate maybe there being a desire for those things. So, now we're back to discuss that desire.

And some of the history behind the desire is in summer of last year, we did receive a code complaint regarding straining strange animals being kept in the RL zone or low density residential zone. And our code officer met with the property owner who explained that his family was keeping ducks. And maybe one thing to note is that our development code generally identifies what uses are allowed or permitted, conditionally permitted, or limited. However, the code does not typically list prohibited uses in residential zones. So by this design, the city cannot anticipate every situation and oh, sorry.

I meant to say that that was by design, and the city can't anticipate every situation. But, ultimately, if a use is not explicitly stated, it is generally not allowed. But because of this, the property owner didn't see a specific prohibition on DUCs. So after the code officer met with the property owner, the property owner then petitioned council to review the the matter and amend the city law to allow for the keeping of ducks in the RL zone. Staff later had a discussion with council at a work session in August, and we were directed to amend the chicken regulations to include domestic Vowel.

And, they also specified that they wanted us to keep our scope fairly limited just to fast track this project. So moving on to the project purpose. We can go to the next slide, please. The purpose of this code is to provide minimum standards for keeping domestic fowl humanely in urban backyards while also safeguarding the health, safety, and welfare of the citizens of Tualatin. So under that charge, staff amended our existing regulations for the keeping of backyard chickens to include domestic fowl.

Public engagement will be limited under this project to meet our legislative process requirement. Is that while the planning commission is typically charged with making recommendations to the development code, There is some intersectionality between the municipal code and the development code under this project. So we have shared the comprehensive suite of amendments to both twelfth and municipal code chapter sixteen fifteen and the development code chapters thirty nine and forty for your consideration tonight. Next slide, please. So under our proposed amendments, we are proposing to define domestic fowl to include chickens, ducks, pheasants, pigeons, quails, partridges, doves, and similar birds for personal use.

Staff arrived at this by looking at other domestic fowl ordinances in the region and kind of saw that there was some inner or some commonalities between these birds. And some of their shared character traits include that they provide a sustainable source of eggs. They provide natural pest control, they typically need minimal space needs, and they are easily adaptable to human activity and environments. And on our next slide, We are proposing some prohibited domestic fowl, which include roosters, geese, guinea fowl, peacocks, and turkeys. Some of the traits that we found these domestic fowl might be negative to, neighboring property owners because they are loud.

They can cause property damage, and they can be aggressive towards people and pets. So on the next slide, this slide is kind of an overview of what we found in our code research. So the green dots mean that we found that certain birds were permitted. I included a green diamond specifying that the code was silent on type, but it did include categories that the birds might fall under. A dash means that we found those specific birds weren't listed in code.

Yellow means that they were permitted on larger lots. I don't know if this would relate to Toowalton since our RL zone doesn't typically allow lots up to 20,000 square feet, and I don't know if we have any existing lots that are that big. And then the red is just not permitted. So I can save us a moment here on this slide so we can all take it in individually. But and and maybe I'll kind of pause if you have any questions about this slide.

Why no on the guinea fowl just out of interest?

So we found that the guinea fowl can be very loud. They're kind of like crutch dogs, and they make, like, a really loud squawking sound kinda like a rusty bed frame.

Sounds good. Not great.

Okay. So That's good. Okay. We're going to maybe not include those guys.

Yeah. That sounds good. K. Any

other questions about this slide? Okay. Let's move on. So the the existing code does have some licensing requirements, which we are keeping and making some light amendments to. But just to highlight, the the regulations require that a license be obtained by a property once it's approved.

We do limit the license to for domestic foul for any lot, and the fowl must be confined to a coop in a fenced backyard or run. And then we also have some requirements for the coop where it must be less than 200 square feet and eight feet in height, so that generally means that we wouldn't require a building permit to review it. We also require that the coop be enclosed on at least three sides, and those three sides must be the sides that face the adjoining properties. It should be located at least 10 feet from property lines and 25 feet from adjoining residences. Although, I don't know if that was necessarily specified in code, and we'll discuss that later.

And we also have a standard that the coops and run must be maintained in good repair and sanitary condition. Next slide, please. So as we work through our legislative process, we will be looking at the Municipal Code six fifteen and then two chapters of the Tualatin Development Code. So in the municipal code, it contains the regulations for keeping the backyard chickens, and then it works with the development code because the development code provides use categories, and then it provides zoning requirements for where certain uses are permitted. Next slide, please.

So public engagement for this process will be, kept at an informed level. Notice will be provided to DLCD, government agency partners, our CIO groups. We'll do a posting in the newspaper, and it has also been posted on the city website. So, in your packet materials, I have included some detailed findings and analysis for PTA 26 dash zero zero one as exhibit one. The findings demonstrate that the proposal complies with the relevant approval criteria in our development code, which is contained in chapter 33.

And as a next step, we are planning on taking this to a city council hearing for consideration in March 9. So tonight, we're asking the planning commission to forward a recommendation to city council on PTA 26 dash zero zero zero one, and I've included a proposed motion for your consideration. And with that, concludes my staff report.

Hey. So we move on to should we do questions? Or we usually move on to I guess we give other people a chance. So the commission will now hear from any person wishing to speak on this item. Do you wish to speak? Or Yeah. K.

Anybody who's had a conversation about allowing ducks or including ducks and other fowl into the charter? Yes, please. Oh, sure. Of course. My name is my name is Kevin Mulvaney.

I am the homeowner who was found to have strange animals in my backyard, when they were two month old, you know, ducks running around. So, yeah, it was a task to because of the ambiguity that we found in the code that didn't explicitly say we couldn't, we maybe took that to say we could, and we are now in this position. But, I just wanted all the time and effort for something so small. I mean, this is not transportation. It's not a big budget issue.

It's something that's that's very limited to who it's going to benefit, but the benefits are to my family and others like me are huge. I will know clearly what is and isn't allowed. It gives us some peace knowing that it sounds like, at least from the staff report, that it it will pass and go through as, we would be allowed to have them. We've been living since last June in kind of limbo and fear that we'd have to get rid of these birds. They are pets.

We didn't get them for, you know, eggs or meat or or making money. We just got them because we wanted pets. So all the time that staff and council members went through discussions, research, whether you were for or against, I appreciate all of that time. And I just wanted to express that gratitude, to everybody here. So thank you. Thank you.

Does the commission have any questions of staff or any person that provided comments? Do have a question? Yeah. Go, Randy.

Yeah. Erin, appreciate that you sent out this of the over time. Have there been complaints, about chickens? There's nothing always other nuisance type activity or generating rats or anything like that?

Right. So we have received some complaints, and I have worked with our code enforcement officers to gather that data. Maybe I'll I'll preface by saying that records retention law requires that we hold on to complaints for one year. And if there was a citation issue, then we'll hold on to that complaint for three years. But that being said, we did have some employee records that we could mull through, so we have data going back to 2019.

So from 2019 to 2025, we've had a total of eight complaints. And of those eight complaints, three have referenced rats. And then what I found in talking to the code enforcement officer is that when they were on-site to look for rats or evidence of rats, they weren't able to confirm that rats were on-site. So there was no action taken to municipal court on the matter. Thanks. When sorry. When they went to

the sites to investigate that, did they also find that the coops in areas where the chickens were were in good sanitary condition, there wasn't any notation of violation on that accord.

So the data that I did have kinda spoke to maybe the coop was placed in the wrong spot or that maybe a coop was being constructed before a license was obtained. So those items have been remedied, but, I didn't see any notes about a coop being unsanitary or being called out for something like that.

Yeah. Let

me just kind of review.

Yeah. Of the eight complaints, is it, like, the same spot, or is it multiple spots, I guess?

It's it's multiple spots. Multiple spots. Okay. So as an example, the first record happened in 2021 where we received two complaints. There were two separate complaints, but both referenced rats. And then one was a complaint where in a zone where chickens were not allowed. And then the second complaint was about the coop placement. And then we asked that it'd be relocated to a more appropriate location based off of our regulations.

Okay.

And I can provide more details, but that's kind of the flavor of

Okay.

What was shared with me.

Any other questions?

How is the noise issues dealt with?

It's a good question. So we do have standards in our municipal code, not in this particular section talking to domestic file, but it's under, let me make sure that I'm giving you the right citation. In six fourteen subsection 40, which is specific noise disturbances prohibited, bullet two speaks to animals. And under that bullet, it is unlawful to keep or permit the keeping of any animal that barks, cries, whimpers, crows, clucks, or makes any other sound on a frequent or continuous basis for fifteen minutes or longer, and that is plainly audible within a noise sensitive property other than the place where the sound originates. And then in talking to our code enforcement officer, they have had to respond to calls of such violations, but when they've sat to listen to see if it met that fifteen minute threshold, they weren't able to verify that that was being addressed.

Yeah. So we don't have anything that went to municipal court. Okay.

So, basically, the code for the issues that could come up from this or impacts to adjacent properties, there are mechanisms to for somebody to file a complaint and then for the city to address it

Correct.

At some point.

One thing I did notice, I know that several of the domestic fowls we're being considered tonight are kept not only for eggs, but also sometimes for meat. I noticed that in, I think it's section thirty fifteen, that harvesting or butchering of the animals is prohibited. Is that simply is that strictly within city limits, or is the person who has one of these licenses not allowed to, process any of the animals that are covered under the license, outside of city limits or or in in other areas? Is that just saying you can't do that activity in the residential lot, or is that

Yeah. That's a great question. I think the intent was that it meant on-site, so on that residential lot. But like you point out, it's not entirely clear. But I think the intent was that it's just no butchering on-site.

Did you get the rest of

your questions answered, Randy? I know you had a few Oh, no.

We're ready for that. Yeah. Those I just had other questions.

Okay. Okay. Yeah.

No. We're ready to go into that?

Yeah. I think we are. Oh, okay.

Unless somebody else has anything else

who's pressing into okay. Yeah. No.

Erin shared with you an email that I sent to her about, this issue. And the reason I brought it up, happened to live in Eugene. And about the same time the Tualatin code was adopted, Eugene relaxed its standards for urban farming. And as a result of that, all across the city, there was suddenly a rat explosion. And I have some personal experience with that.

I lived in a house for thirty years, and it wasn't until the relaxation of the standards that suddenly I had rats in my woodpile and so did our neighbors. And so this this is kind of a big issue in terms of a public health consideration. And I was really happy to see that the staff looked at other jurisdictions, Salem, Forest Grove, I think it was, Newburgh, and Eugene, to see what standards were in their code. And I simply I'm not pro or con or or advocating for any of these things, but I I think it merits our discussion, about some of the some of the regulations that these other jurisdictions have in place in order to address some of these issues. For example, Zach, you were asking about, is this butchering on-site?

Either Salem or Eugene clarifies. Yeah. It's on-site that they don't allow this. And I appreciate the city council wanted to make this simple and clean and just replace the word chicken with domestic fowl. But I think given the history of some of these other jurisdictions and what's interesting to me also is that in 2025, we had 10 licenses applied for, which kinda is just gonna be a a growing thing.

We now have ducks. And and so I think for us to try to get ahead of it, even though it might complicate what the city council was asking asking for, I think it'd be lose us to do that. And and so I I think if you're willing, we can just go step by step through the analysis that I did with the with the other codes as they apply to to our code and see where we wanna go with it.

Sounds does everybody sound good with that?

Mhmm.

Okay. Well, okay. You're a cooperative bunch, Tim.

We are. It's a happy subject. We're all happy. Yeah.

Okay. I've gotta find out where we are here. Well Okay. Just to begin and this these are all in the municipal code, not not in any of our development codes. So, first off is in section o three o subsection two.

It talks about a maximum here, but I watched the Friends TV show, and I don't know if any of you do, but these two guys live in an apartment. They have a duck and a chicken. And I think just for clarifying, we need to say a maximum combined for domestic fowl so that we don't get somebody coming up and say, well, I've got four pigeons and four pheasants. You can have two of each. And so that's my first suggestion is just clarifying that particular aspect.

Yeah.

Right. So that's really just an added word. Right?

Yes. It is. That's all. Yeah. Yep. K.

Any domestic follow-up or combined domestic follow-up? I think I

think combined. It would Yeah. I think combined.

Yeah. And I think for some added context too, because we define what domestic foul is in, it becomes apparent that it's like an umbrella term. I think the intent was that anything under that umbrella would be considered a domestic file, and you

Oh, okay. So that's how okay.

I it's always good to clarify things too.

And I would understand it that way too, but the guys in France might not.

Yeah. I think there's a couple ways we could wordsmith it, I think, combined, I think, of any type. Oh, yeah. Permitted type. Nice.

Yeah.

I like that. But I think we hear you that Yeah. It might be an opportunity for ad clarity right there.

Okay. Okay. On the next point, section o one o defines domestic fall by naming several specific birds, but you also the code also then gives itself some leeway by the words and similar birds. And when we get down into o three zero three where we're prohibiting certain birds, I'm suggesting that what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Did he get too confused?

I I couldn't help myself.

It's all

it's all a foul joke. And we're I was expecting a groan for herself. We're all in

at this point. Just to provide the staff leeway on the prohibited section as well, I would recommend that that same words be added there unless for some reason.

For the ones that are not Not The ones that are banned. The ones, say, or similar birds.

Yeah. Just saying any birds that meet the criteria of being loud, aggressive.

Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah.

Would be banned. That way, we don't have someone coming and saying, well, you didn't mention emu.

And, specifically, Salem or Eugene includes emus and ostriches. And just for clarity, I put them in there.

I'd like to think no one would do that, but you never know.

Yeah. My reflection is the allowed birds and and similar birds because all the birds that we have put on our domestic fowl definition are smaller. It was my hope that maybe an emo or an ostrich wouldn't be considered as similar. I know. But, again, it's great to clarify that that would be prohibited.

My one reflection about maybe adding and similar birds to their prohibited list is that it could become a slippery slope for code enforcement if it's not well defined what and similar bird would be, it kind of leaves some room for interpretation of what would be prohibited for code enforcement. And I don't know if you have thoughts around that matter, but just maybe consideration.

Does that work in reverse then too for the birds that are allowed?

Yeah. So I think for context, we added the or similar in in response to what we heard from counsel is that, like, they they kind of felt that perhaps when we did this first pass through that maybe we weren't, as broad thinking as we should have been by just saying chickens. And so they they were pretty clear, at least what I heard in the tape, was that they didn't wanna come back and incrementally add one more and one more. Right? So, so that's why we put that in there.

I am not an expert on bowel of any type, but I would suggest perhaps to think about if there's certain ones. I think you meant you forwarded a couple in your in your email that you think would be good to add to the prohibited list that are concerns. I do think that might be a way to get at it, if there's a couple we should add. Like, I think you had the ostrich on there. The emu.

Emu. I think there's no harm, no foul. It's just adding a few I didn't mean to do that. Adding a few to the prohibited list, I do think it gets a bit murky of a I can see your point. It works both ways, but it would work both ways, from a he said, she said neighbor kind of perspective too. You're similar, my similar. I just I don't know that it's good to put that language in both places.

Okay. It's I I doubt that this would happen. But for example, if somebody and I doubt this would happen because it's a tropical bird, but a cassowary is like a large emu, only very aggressive and mean. Mhmm.

Yeah. That that that's a dinosaur, not a bird.

It's just kinda like that. I know. I know.

I've seen them there.

Yeah. So that yeah. See, and that's the problem. So, you know, if if I come to you and say, Erin, you know, I wanna put a cassowary in my backyard.

But I don't think the cassowary is gonna be considered domestic fowl. It's a tropical bird.

That would be an exotic.

Yeah. Are ostriches and emus?

Those would be exotic.

Oh. But maybe we could spell out

the emu and ostrich just to be safe. Okay. Just in case. And then how do you feel about not doing the similar birds on the

I mean, it does make me a

little nervous. Somebody could come in with something and be like, well, it's something similar. We don't know all the birds, obviously.

Might

But I see what the city council's getting at. We can't do this every time. Right?

My other concern with the or similar birds is somebody doing, like, something like a turkin. Oh, let's have chicken.

Yeah. That's right. You said it was real mean too. Yeah. They are mean.

They're half turkeys. So oh.

Oh, that's true.

You could end with blended birds. Yeah.

That would be turkey.

But Mhmm.

I just learned something. They're not fun.

But that was the direction.

Prohibit turkeys. I guess my answer to that would be we prohibit turkeys. Right?

We do. Okay. So even half turkeys are also prohibited?

Yes. Okay.

Yeah. That would be my answer is that that, like, while the code didn't contemplate every, possible combination of That's true. It's but, you know, I think half of it falls into something that's prohibited. I think I would feel comfortable saying that that is also prohibited.

Yeah. That sounds good. Okay.

So Asking that 10 had it removed to say other similar, and that 30 had it added to say

No. I

was typing it in.

She just he

just wanted to add it.

Wanna add it.

Yeah. Same thing.

Yeah. And now we're agreeing not to add it in the prohibited section.

But then to be feel okay about adding the emus and the ostrich is a no just to be safe?

Just to get it.

I think that that's fine.

My neighbor too.

Doesn't hurt. Right? And definitely don't want it. So yeah. Okay.

Okay. This this may be revealing my ignorance again. I am also not an expert in keeping fowl. I've never owned a bird. This is only going to be covering you mentioned that you keep yours as pets, not for their eggs, not for their meat. This would not apply to birds that are, like, domestic fowl, but are purely indoor birds, like parakeets, parrots, finches, other ones that are are

The ones that

are Indoor. Household. Yeah. That this this wouldn't cover

those. Separate.

Right? I would think that'd be different. Right? That's just like a

I'm just not sure how broad, you know, the the category of domestic fowl actually is. You know, when you say and similar.

Yeah. I I guess my response to that would be because the regulations live in a chapter of the municipal code called general offenses and nuisances, that I think that that speaks more broadly to maybe, like, public realm or backyards. Yeah. Not necessarily what happens inside of the house.

Sure. And then it says n double o five. Yeah.

And I'd go back to kind of the order. Oh,

yeah. Comes with the.

Okay.

And then, Theresa, our planning manager, made a great point that if you look at the purpose statement of the domestic foul regulations, it does link it to the backyard.

Yeah. Okay. Oh, which is nice too, because that's not the front yard. Right?

Right.

Yeah. Okay. Good.

If someone had a bird indoors that was constantly making noise

That could be could be in the joining buildings. Yeah. That'd be a whole different issue.

The municipal code would apply, but this is different.

Okay. Okay, Randy. What's your next one?

Okay. O three o subsection four prohibits harvesting and butchering. And I know, as I recall, the preamble of the code says no commercial use. This is just words for personal consumption. But the current code says harvesting or butchering, and I and I understand harvesting deer hunting now is referred to as harvesting so forth.

But as I play this through, if people are raising fowl for eggs, you're gonna prevent preclude them from harvesting eggs? I mean, I don't know. So I would suggest that we're just silent on harvesting, but I do see a distinction between slaughtering and butchering. And I would suggest that those both those words be included in the code. And, Erin, back to that point, this is on-site slaughtering and butchering of a domestic fowl is prohibited so that we don't have guts and feathers flying all over the backyards.

And and I think those are good clarifications that we could

add in. Does everybody feel okay about that? Yeah. That that sounds

good harvesting so that it doesn't Affect eggs. We've had slaughtering and butchering.

Yeah. Okay.

They're interchangeable.

I'm gonna say I'm not sure I know the difference, but, again, haven't done it. So They're interchangeable, Janelle.

But still, you can talk

It makes it very clear. Makes it very clear. Okay. Yeah.

That's true. Deep feathering it. Yeah. Okay. Then skipping down o three zero six, this was just a fine distinction. That diagram Erin Lee had, we required domestic foul facilities to be 25 feet from all residences. And I think Salem says from adjacent residences, but only three feet from your own. And now that we're going with more density with townhouses and multiplexes and even even on smaller single family lots. If somebody wanted to make an issue with that 25 feet from all residences, again, this is just simply clarifying language. And I don't know if three feet is the right number or not. But

Is that's kinda what you meant with the three sided is that they're up abutting their own structure. Right?

Side doors. Yeah. Right. So at least there would be a mitigated enclosure on the sides that abut the residential properties. But I do see your point about building in some clarity around the 25 foot setback.

Yeah.

I think that makes sense. Because these aren't subject to building code permitting or a site inspection. I don't know if we have, research best practices about how far back they should be set from the on-site residents. Yeah. So we might have to look into that a little deeper if they wanted to look at that.

Salem Salem might have some logic for I think it was Salem that had that.

Three foot? Yeah. I think three foot's pretty common for a lot of things. Three foot. Did, yeah, code out in county. Here it is. Three foot separation for animal pens and stuff like that was pretty common.

It's probably like a fire code thing. Right?

Yeah. Getting around, and there's a three foot for separation yet, but the fire code is a lot.

I mean, three foot would also is also for a lot of accessory structures. A lot of municipalities have that as well. This, again, would wouldn't change the way we permit them. So they we they still would not get a building permit, but we would operate as we normally do on complaint. If someone said, I think their coop is a foot from their house, then we could enforce that. But we wouldn't be reviewing the the coops as they come in for those standards anyway. But Yeah.

I was thinking more the person who reads that and says, hey. That needs to be 25 feet from their house too.

Yeah. That's how I would have probably read that.

Does it does it still need the three foot distance from the existing house on-site in your mind if we change it to 25 feet from abutting residences?

Or from from structure

I don't know. Adjacent.

Mean, I guess it's a fire code issue. But Yeah.

Bring your adjacent

From the surrounding the

Yeah. Yeah.

Some qualifier there to clarify that it's not a house on-site.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And that's that's specifically what part of Salem does is 25 feet from adjacent residences.

No. No. Adjacent's going. K.

Oh, yeah. Okay. Are we ready to go on to the

Yeah. Seven.

We have this maximum 200 square feet for a coop and or run. It just seems to me if we're talking about in the preamble treating these domestic fowls humanely, we might wanna write in some minimum standard for the coop and the run so that people aren't squeezing in things that that makes the birds unhealthy. And, again, it just one of these Salem requires they have some square footage requirements that they they recommend. So I would suggest some consideration be given to minimum square footages for these birds.

Does Washington County have their own regulations?

They may. I didn't necessarily delve into that. But, in response to your question, I did do some research around recommendations from the US Department of Agriculture. Oh, no. And they provide guidelines that recommend three to four square feet per chicken and five square feet per duck with at least 10 square feet per file of outdoor run area. So that could be a consideration. And then Oregon State University provides recommendations related to chickens at three square feet per bird with access to a run or outdoor area or eight to 10 square feet per bird with no outdoor access.

That's the same. That's acceptable.

Yeah. Hang your head on somebody you can point your finger at, I guess. Yeah.

And there's never more than four of any kind of bird, right, whether it's big or not. So four big birds still. It's only would have been decided there? 40 feet. Right? So we're good.

I don't mind it.

Is three the consistent?

So if I think what I found in my research is that different sized birds have different requirements. And since ducks maybe are on the bigger side, five square feet could maybe be a good measure to hang our hat on based off the US Department of Agriculture.

Cool. Yeah. Like it.

That seems reasonable. Yeah. Five times it was Yeah. We're still okay with that as a minimum. Yeah.

I I do know enough. Like, you don't need that much space for, for instance, quail, though. So, like, requiring someone who's going to, you know, be keeping quail or something else that doesn't actually

That's true.

Like, usually come out into a run area because they're very shy and small. And it was like, we don't wanna force someone who's keeping four quail to build a 40 foot square foot, you know, covered space.

And and Salem does distinguish between small birds and larger birds. Yeah. And they, for small birds, it's one square foot of coop space per bird.

But what do they designate as a small bird?

Yeah. Well They have to.

I I think we have that distinction, the, partridge and dove and some of those other and, again

Now that language would have

to be

We we may need to do some research between definitions for a small bird and a large bird. I haven't really found, I guess, good examples of what that could be or a best practice for the distinction between small and large.

Maybe you leave it with ducks and chickens if that's what the agriculture department's concerned about.

Yeah. And then for small ones.

About somebody who is choosing to own up to four birds in their backyard in town not treating their birds, right, and trying to protect birds. Yeah. I guess I feel like that kind of a protection is more necessary in a bigger scope of 20 chickens in the yard or something.

The only concern, Ursula, again, is with townhouses and and multiplex units on small lots.

So as long as your lot's big enough in whatever arrangement it is, that it's 25 feet from all neighbors, three feet from your house, however many creatures you have fit in your yard that also has to have a fence. I mean, I can't fathom Yeah. That there's even at the townhouses at Autumn Sunrise, that the yards back there are a concern for that. I'm trying to think of one. Tell help me think of one.

Well, you're writing a code for going forward to the future, so the yards that exist today won't be the yards fifty years from now.

Yeah. Yeah. Fences.

Or even two years from now. Yeah. Yeah.

I I don't think people who are choosing to put the investment into getting the permit or purchasing the power. All of the work that goes into maintaining them and the cost of keeping them healthy are really going to be squishing them and not having a good habitat for them.

We we would hope not.

I, yeah, I I would disagree on that. Because, I mean, animal control and and everything out there, there's plenty of people that get all different kinds of pets that are just, like, random. Like, I I wanna get a pet. So and and the same with ducks. My ex wife had ducks because her dad for Easter was like, I get ducks and bring them home and nowhere to keep them. I mean, just somebody that should not have ducks. So it's you don't need a permit or a license to get the animals, and so sometimes having rules and regulations out there to protect people from their own whims is is kinda beneficial.

K. So what do we feel like? Do we wanna pursue a minimum? That's what we're we're discussing. Right? Do we wanna pursue a minimum, or do we there is also the case you guys put in the language. I forgot what it says exactly, but it does say helpful and safe manner or something in there. Correct?

Would it maybe just be possible to find rather than re rehashing everything within our code

Mhmm.

If, you know, USDA or Washington County already has this, we could simply say

Point.

Yeah. In keeping with, you know, and then cite the the regular

Oh, yeah. Follow best practices or something.

And then have a citation there. And that way, we don't have to we don't have to define it. We don't have to reproduce it. We can simply say we are adopting this this recommendation by this body.

That'd be possible.

I think I think that's I like where you're going with that. What I was just thinking, I think there's some other items that you're gonna discuss. When you get into the realm of, like, whether there's animal abuse or, you know, something's not being cared for, that is in the realm of the county or police. Mhmm. Depending on how the the ORS is written and the statutes fall.

I'm guessing there's some, perhaps, some metrics there that we might be able to mine a little bit to see if it's like if someone calls in and says, I think these are being kept in really small enclosures that's not meeting, you know, the humane laws of you know? Maybe there's something we can find there. I do think it gets a little messy if we just pick a number. Yeah. And not that we're just picking.

There's some good data for, like, maybe a duck. But then to your point, we're allowing a a a broad menu of types of domestic phalsoma, which are very small. And I I don't wanna make someone overbuild a site, for that reason either. So I think, you know, if you guys are comfortable, we can put that we feel like we wanna you want us to make sure whether there's something already we can point to and or explore some other controls to ensure that a minimum safe space is provided for the domestic. No.

I think about when I go, like, for the state fairs, pigeons and all kinds of other small birds, either the OSU Extension Service or maybe the Future Farmers of America or somebody like that even has some kind of guidelines that we've been leaning on.

Okay.

Everybody feel good about that?

Mhmm.

K.

Okay. O three year old 10, barcode currently lists, quote, obnoxious smells and substances. Salem addresses, quote, odors and noise that create a nuisance, and Eugene goes further by describing a noise disturbance a little bit more than that. And but, Erin, you already read that we have a noise ordinance or nuisances.

Yeah. That feels pretty strict to me.

Oh, right. Yeah.

Goes Yeah.

Or makes other disturbing noises for a period of greater than fifteen minutes. Yeah.

Yeah. I was in 06:14 forty. And then, if we're addressing odor, we do have some regulations in six four fifty, which is nuisances affecting public health. So we have two sections that I can highlight. Two is debris, which is the accumulation of debris, rubbish, manure, or other refuse that are not removed within a reasonable time and that affect the health of the city. And then six speaks to odor, premises which are in such a state or condition as to cause an offensive odor or which are in an unsanitary condition.

Okay. Yeah. I feel like that covers that too. Yeah. Yeah.

Yes.

Yeah. Okay. Alright. K. Keep going, Randy.

Okay. O three zero eleven. This this is the wrap problem, and this is the one that, I think really deserves some attention. Section 11 specifies how feed is to be stored. And I don't have the wording, but I think it's in a metal container with a cover or something.

That's feed. And that rats do go after that. But this issue about animal manure manure that you talked about and bedding, when people clean out chicken coops and the manure and the old straw or whatever is there and they pile it in a compost pile and it's open, if that's not disposed of, I that's what's creating the attraction in rats. And it was I think it was Eugene's lesson that it says compost piles that contain manure and bedding must be located at least five feet from all property lines and confined within a container or bin enclosed on all sides and covered to deter vermin. And there I I like Justin said, you know, some folks understand what kind of hard work this can be to keep things clean, but after a while, the chicks grow up and everybody gets tired of them.

And pretty soon things go to pot, and that attracts the rats. And that's an issue that I think we wanna be real careful of. So I, for one, don't think it would be overregulation to include this requirement requirement to keep this stuff within a container or bin enclosed on all sides and covered to deter vermin.

So trash can would meet that.

Right? Can would meet that. Yeah. K. Yeah.

But that doesn't allow for the difference between putting the animal manure in the trash can and putting it in somewhere open that it can compost creates the anaerobic versus aerobic Yeah. I guess is my first thought where I'm like, that sounds punctured.

Yeah. And that's Yeah. Not something It can't degrade.

It can't degrade because it's in You you detain. Not

that I'm a great Do you have restrictions on composting in town?

Do we have I

don't even know.

But when I you started talking about that, that's my thought, but I I will admit I don't know.

Yeah. So I think the best we have is under nuisances affecting public health bullet two, debris, and that's the accumulation of debris, rubbish, manure, other refuse that are not removed within a reasonable time that affect the health of the city. Potentially, compost could be considered debris.

Yeah.

I mean, you said manure in there. You said yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

It's already in there.

So I think having that broad, requirement and then also when we look at our domestic fowl requirements, we do have a bullet which speaks to the domestic fowl facility must be maintained in good repair in a clean and sanitary condition, free of vermin, and obnoxious smells and substances that create a nuisance for adjoining property. So I guess my question to the planning commission is, do those two broad statements kind of encompass what we're talking about, or do we need another clarification?

The other broad statement the overall one, I think, is not a enforceable code in any way because it says for the health of the city, that's way too open and needs to be defined or anything like that. I mean, that's so much interpretation on that. And you're talking about health of the city as opposed to how it impacts an adjacent property. That I think is nonfunctional. But the one that you have in there that talks about a noxious odors or anything like that to adjacent properties is effective, then it's just determining what is the odor threshold and what is noxious or not.

So in speaking to our code enforcement officer, the way he defines that is by using reasonableness standards of what a reasonable person would find obnoxious or odor that affects property.

Yeah.

And our city attorney kinda chimed in and said that that has been working for the city. We haven't really taken anything to municipal court over an odor based off of the the reasonableness metric. But I don't know if you have anything you'd like to add.

No. I mean, I think you summarized it well. I mean, we know that anything with odor is a hard thing to enforce.

Yes.

But I think one thing and if you think we need to add some language here and you would recommend that, then please. But, just keep in mind, have it's kinda layering. So we have the the odor. We have the, a lot of regulations to say, like, if we're seeing rat issues, we can go out as as we talked about at the beginning. So that would also feed into that.

So there's there's a couple of different things that get added. So whether or not you you think that, perhaps there needs to be, you had referenced a setback for compost. If there's a reason for that setback versus it being five versus it being three, I would say if if there's a reason for that, we'd explore that. I just I'm not I think we need to be careful what we add that whether or not that plays well with the other areas of the municipal code that govern those sorts of things. Yep. So, wherever you go with that.

My my issue is not how far back from the adjacent fence sub the compost pile should be nor does it go to the odor issue. This can create a problem before the odor issue arises. And and that's the part where you have old bedding mixed with manure, lying in a heap, not necessarily to be used in a compost for a compost basis, attracting the rats. And that's that's what caused the problem in Eugene.

I I feel like that is already addressed, though, since it's covered by manure or other debris that is not removed, and we have the the the regulation here that they it has to has to be a vermin free enclosure. Like, we are already we are already covering that concern, I feel.

Free. But, also, I'm wondering, is there any, like, statistical evidence showing that the compost was causing a problem with the rats?

The The letter the article that I referenced in my email, I've given the full article, the Oregonian article to Erin. And it's it was the consensus of several rat exterminators in Eugene that it was the chicken coops, the compost piles, and the backyard gardens.

Okay. But that's three different

Yeah. Things.

Yeah. But but if I could finish, it was the chicken coops that in 2013 I was on the planning commission at the time, and I think, as I recall, we went from two or three chickens to allowing six chickens and six rabbits. We relaxed the farming standards. And that's when the when the problem happened, was the the composting. Eugene is famous for composting.

I mean, it every anyway, a lot of that a lot of people have the backyard gardens. It was when 2013 was about the time when urban microfarming and having chickens in your backyard and fresh eggs to eat in the morning was kind of a popular thing to do. And that's when this problem happened, and the exterminators and I talked to the guy, I said, why now all of a sudden? He says, it's the chicken coops. And there was a chicken coop a few houses down from mine.

So that's that's where I have a real problem with this issue and and relying on somebody to to make a complaint that, hey. Somebody's not cleaning out their compost pile soon enough. We take care. We specify that feed has to be covered and protected from rats. And I'm just thinking that these compost piles associated at least with chicken coops domestic fowl coops, probably ought to be contained as well. A lot of people might not be using them for compost or actual compost piles.

Is it perhaps worth noting, Randy, that, this is not actually increasing the number of domestic fowl that anyone can keep, that they are already permitted to keep up to four chickens, and that the current regulations thus far, at least apparently, have not resulted in any issues that have caused a vermin issue here in Tualatin. This is just expanding the diversity of fowl that can be capped.

That's what I was that issue. I was hoping that Aaron's statistics would would point that out. And and maybe it's an anomaly, but suddenly we go from an average of four or five licenses per year to twenty twenty five, ten folks.

I think that might have something to do with the economy as well.

Well, sure. Whatever the reason is. You know? And we have we have a gentleman who who wants to to do raise duck or have ducks. I've got no problem with this. It's the issue that they cause that I'm suggesting we need to get ahead on. And that to me is

So you're talking manure. You're looking for containment of the cleaning out.

Yep. But it sounds like the city already has a well rounded regulation in containment of manure and other disposable.

They throw it on the ground and require people to clean it up. And if it's not cleaned up and if it doesn't smell, it still can attract the rats.

So the proposal says that they have to have a clean sanitary Free of burning. Free of noxious smells and substances. Obnoxious smells and substances space. That's already in the proposal.

Yeah. And I'm suggesting that it needs to be we need to include a container or bin enclosed on all sides and covered to deter worm.

In there?

Specifically to contain any used bedding or or droppings. Yes.

I don't know. But tell someone how to keep their stuff clean. I don't know.

I will say most I I I have really appreciated most of the point. This one, I I do feel like is is well covered. I feel like we're we're probably getting into too much this this feels like maybe a step too far to me.

K. Yep.

Well, this was a lesson learned on my part several years ago. So just for the record

You've had experience with that.

My question would be the complaints that we've already received have been regarding rats come into adjacent properties, which could be from a million different items. Dealing with it in Multnomah County in Portland, there's so many different things that cause rats to go from all over the place. So how effective is we do our own rat enforcement in the city in to Walton? So code guy.

What I understand is if we get a call that a rat was spotted related to the keeping of backyard chickens, our code enforcement officer would schedule to go on-site, observe what's happening. Out of our eight complaints since 2019, we've had three records of rats on-site, and he has not confirmed those records. Not to say that they're not there. I'm sure it's

Yep.

Hard to determine that. I could ask him some follow-up questions about maybe if he has notes about observations on-site, like if he did notice manure or compost or feed that wasn't properly kept. But he he didn't really share those details with me, so I don't really know if there was any commonalities between those instances that might relate to what we're discussing.

Mhmm. I think what would be maybe effective is is talking to them, find out if there's anything that they would recommend change or amend to the code to just give them some more teeth to address these issues to say, like, okay. I need something in here that says it's creating a rat harborage or what their threshold is. So

It's true.

Pretty low in Multnomah County for them to go out and do it, and they're just can they cover all of Portland for us.

The odds of seeing a rat are very low.

Super low. So what they're actually looking for is they're not looking for the rats because it's almost impossible to find them. They're just looking for the Drawbings. Droppings, all the stuff. I mean, the same thing that that pest control does. And maybe, if our code enforcement guy, yes, is not trained on that, maybe it's something that it's like we can contract out for animal control or whatever to do it. Or or or he can just go get a class on, like, how to do that or work with Multnom County and say, how do you guys detect, like, the rats. I don't I don't know all the terms for it.

The rat, how do you Vermin. What is that?

A rat or a rat?

I I think we call it vermin in the code.

Vermin. Yeah. That is called vermin. Yes.

Vermin tracker.

So I like that. Talk to the guy, see if he has any suggestions, if it needs more teeth or if he just needs Yeah. Like, some more training or what it is that just to make sure that it doesn't balloon out of control.

Yeah. Well or Ray and Ursula might be right. We might talk to Eugene and see if this was overkill, so to speak, for them that they had this billing thing implemented, if that made any difference. How do you keep your stuff?

So we clear the box directly in the green waste bin.

Yep. And our Yeah. See.

There you go.

Yeah. See, that feels like that totally meets.

So we keep the our our extra bales of straw in the garage

Right.

With the feed container that's closed. Feed. We try to buy chicken loz when we

Yeah.

Put dust. But so we we do we don't leave it out. I mean, bits and pieces, but bits and pieces

Yeah.

Birds are.

You're not composting for your backyard garden. We don't compost.

Yeah. Yeah.

And we wouldn't compost the amount of straw and my bedding. Would compost. Yeah. Yeah.

And so

the the bedding you wouldn't Yeah.

Yeah. I almost feel like that's more of a composting regulation question. You know what I mean? Because I know that there are people that are composting in town, and probably they're bananas or drawing all kinds of stuff in. Yeah. But but it is a good point. So I I like I like what Justin said just to have you guys look at maybe with the guy if he needs some more teeth versus just, like, physically seeing a rat. Because I just feel like Right. Yeah. He's not gonna see a rat. No. But, yeah, if it needs a little more teeth so that I mean, if a neighbor's seeing tons of rats, that's an issue. They should get a little more help than just hoping that the guy sees it. So Yeah.

Yeah. And almost rather see it not in the animal code, actually, just its own vector code that's just there so they can deal with it for all others. Yeah. You can on the compost. You

name it.

Oh, yeah. Everything. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I have a neighbor that feeds squirrels. Yep. Sister did too. She's also Yeah.

With her bird feeders. They're like squirrels. Yep.

Totally not. No. So it's just squirrel feeder.

Okay. How do you feel about that, Randy?

I'm okay.

You're okay with that? Everybody else okay with that?

Just for the record. I think they're

Leaving it as it is, and then

they're gonna discuss it with the guy to sort of the the regulator. Okay.

Alright. So we'll we'll go we'll go back to our code enforcement folks, see if there's any opportunity to suggest adding some more teeth or anything that could support them in their enforcement efforts for calls for rats. And to your point, Justin, that would probably be something that would be a broad application, not just to domestic fowl.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Alright.

K. And there were some points that weren't addressed in our code, so I'll just be general about them. Forest Grove, for some reason, in their definition of domestic fowl, they add an age definition of three months of age or older. And the only thing I can think happened is that somebody started having chicks, and somebody said, well, you can only have four or six chickens, and now you've got half a dozen more wandering around. So I don't know if that makes any difference to talk about age on these birds, adult birds.

I feel like leaving it as it is broad prevents us from having an issue of someone saying, well, we bought two dozen two dozen chicks, which weren't covered by the code, that have now grown into chickens. I I think leaving it where it's just broadly

I think yeah. That hopefully gets resolved by a couple months of the aging bird. Right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay. I wonder what they were went out with almond. Yeah. Yeah. That was the only one I got plucked out of forest people.

You should have been keeping a numb a count of how many.

Yeah.

This one was curious to me, and and this is right on for you. Salem requires that ducks must have a clean supply of water in a pond, and I noticed the picture that you had up there had a duck in a pond. A wading pool, a tub, or other container large enough for the duck to fit its entire body and deep enough for it to submerge its head. So I googled, do ducks need to be by water? And Google came up and said, apparently, they needed they cleaned their heads underwater and flapped their wings in water. And so Salem requires the gut keepers to have a body of water.

So but then you'd have to call it out for all the birds, or you'd have to specify ducks.

Okay. We do. Or we were also told, when we took them to the vet,

they asked about water supply and make sure that the the pool wasn't so big to attract another. We have flight as ducks. So we

don't, but other ducks fly mainly.

Oh, yeah.

But they actually. They have a

small kiddie pool that they splash around

the house.

Yeah. So there you go.

They do ducks specifically.

If you get ducks, you know that. If you get chickens, you know they don't get water.

So hopefully they've figured that out. Yeah. The

guys on Friends have a canoe in their apartment. Okay.

Tragically, I've Yeah. I've never seen the great ornithological work that is friends apparently. But I I think that this brain. Yeah. This is maybe another example where referencing another extant guide, you know, again, wouldn't require us to go through and reproduce the guide for ducks and quail and pheasants, etcetera, and all the different things they may need within our code. But pointing pointing to another organization or agency that's already done that legwork.

So, like, if you go FDA here That we talked about.

That that would probably cover that too.

Yeah. If it's going over what size of container they need, and it also includes for guys that they need water.

The need of the bird

Yeah.

Without us needing to to to create it ourselves. Yeah. Because none of us yeah. It's a it's a good stone to bird ratio that we wanted to do here.

I mean, I would just add, I think that's a good point because we're speaking in terms of ducks, and it's kind of obvious that ducks need water. But I honestly don't know if there's special needs for quail. I mean, I don't know enough so to to put one additional standard while it's for the good, it's then also not diving into all the other things that the other types of domestic fowl might need. So

usfishandwildlifeservice.gov has a waterfowl habitat management handbook. We can just be, like, deferred to rules of existence of people who manage birds that aren't us, which I guess wouldn't be US fish and wildlife. It would be you know?

I I kept referencing quail

just because Yeah. Or whatever.

I've done research on, like, homesteading and quail peeping. So, like, I know that you wanna keep them in a space where there's not enough space that they're going to panic and jump and hit their heads, and they want to stay like they tend to walk. Like, they all all these birds have different, like, specific needs for them to thrive and be healthy and happy, and we don't want to try and cram all of that Yeah. Into our domestic talent.

We can manage everything. Healthy people are caring for their pet. I mean, there's we don't have dog regulations. You know what I mean?

But the code, the preamble says humane treatment.

Yeah. It does. Sure. Which is where you can reference another group that You could maybe call somebody out and say, look. These people don't have a duck. The duck's wandering around with no

Water.

Water. Is inhumane. Although there is a neighbor not too not in Tualatin, but I run by their house, and they just had to put a sprinkler out for their ducks. I don't know. But I was like, okay. Maybe they know what they're doing. But they

Yeah. To your point, Teresa, I can't I can't pin it down, but it seems like the current code references veterinary standards or something. I think it's already in there somewhere.

That's what I was just looking for. If we can find a a either an existing or maybe think a little bit deeper of a of just a blanket, like you know? You How we can do welfare of Yeah. Was obviously his vet says.

You know? Like, if you interact with anybody with your pet, hopefully, it would say what the helpful way to care for it is.

And I might again go back to when we do our other research for the other item back to, like, the county, when they they enforce, like, any sort of, you know, animal cruelty Yeah. Things like that. I think there's probably something already in there that we can mine or say that someone can call in and the county animal control will come out and make sure you're

you know, you have water.

The Humane Society may have guidelines on a number of things.

We can we can Okay. But

that one just I'm glad to hear that ducks really do need water. Yeah. As a beaver, I'm usually not compassionate towards ducks.

That's true.

Alright. This one's probably minor, but Eugene requires we we talk about, you know, fenced yard. And again, I'm just Eugene requires fencing that must be designed and constructed to confine the animals on-site. And I don't know what our fencing requirement is or how this is gonna pertain to townhouse lots or whatever now, but just seems like some consideration maybe ought to be given into the way that we define fencing for animals.

I feel like

it's actually already covered in here, because, yeah, it it it define it says that they have to be, here we are. Must be confined at all times within a domestic file facility, unless roaming under the direct supervision Oh, yeah. Licensing. Uh-huh.

Yeah.

I know. Like so I think that I think is already covered in in that six fifteen o 30 part five.

Okay. So that's contained. I mean, you can't get any more specific than that. Right?

That chicken I ran across, I don't know if it was gonna cross the road not.

Love these.

I'm pretty sure that part 10 prevents us from assisting them to the other side.

Okay. Oh, yeah. That's very right. And and then finally, and I think, Erin, you brought it up. We have already somewhere in the code about treating animals not cruelly or subjecting them to neglect and so forth. That's taken care.

So with animal cruelty, we go by the state regulatory standards and estrogen. Okay. Enforce either this department or Washington County or the county. Holy cow.

Thanks for your patience, folks.

That's what that is. No. That's great. No. Thanks for delving into it, Randy. I think it is all I think there's a lot of

fair points in there that Well, it just it opens up a whole lot of stuff. It's not just as simple as changing from chickens to domestic fowl.

And I appreciate the research that you provided.

It was kinda fun. Yeah.

He likes to get into it. I think that's great, because you never know too if once at least like you said, it'll go in the newspaper. If all some people get really excited and it's almost Easter and by every everybody gets a baby duck, it will go. Yeah. Yes. Because you can. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Not everybody's ready to take care of it as a pet. Right? No.

I had a friend in high school, and then that's what he did. He bought two little baby chickens to

give us They're really cute. Cute.

We live in the suburbs.

I was like, I don't Yeah. Like

Okay. Anybody have any other comments, concerns? Okay. So we need to make do we need to make a motion? Yes. We do. Okay. Let's see. Okay. So we need make a motion, but we have all those things within it. Correct? So

analytic including well, there was four. I didn't write them down. I think we agreed on all of them, but for

K. We agreed on the combination of the types. Correct? Combines for a bee. Four. Combines for a bird. Four. We agreed on the or similar birds for the birds they can have, but and then adding the emu and ostrich Two specific pose.

Admission.

The 25 foot adjacent residences. And what was the fourth one? This one.

If I could stop I would just interject. We we clarified butchering and slaughter.

Butchering and slaughtering.

That's what

it is. Butchering and sting.

Sting and put and slaughter.

Okay. But we got rid of butchering and put in no. We're butchering and slaughtering.

We got rid of harvesting and and slaughtering

K.

And butchering. Right. Okay. And then was there anything else that we agreed to on that? And then you guys are just, as a practice, gonna go talk to the code enforcement. Mhmm.

Right. We're gonna talk to see if there's anything we can do with code enforcement relative to, giving them some more teeth to enforce the issues around vermin. And explore, we can go with that. And then I think we were gonna look at, the minimum standards for size and see if we can find any best practices and anything like that.

And then am I forgiving anything else?

We also discussed finding guidelines from an accredited source that we can

Yeah. Reference.

Provide to

or Just to define the humane

Yeah.

Keeping of the animals.

That might hopefully include something about their space needs, water needs, creatures.

All of those under that umbrella. Yeah. Whatnot.

That's true. That might be kinda useful too if somebody's trying to do it, and they're like, what does that mean to be humanely carrying it? They could say, here's a good reference for you or something. Right? Okay.

I forgot that. So

we need to do a motion including that. So let me think I'm gonna do this. The first time adding all this in. Okay. So we would entertain a motion to recommend that citycouncil.pt a 26 dash 0001 to amend the 12 to municipal code and development code to expand backyard chicken regulations to include domestic fowl with the addition of total four combined types of domestic fowl.

Remove or make emus and ostrich exit not possible. Clarify 25 feet of adjacent residences. Remove

Was it Harvesting.

Harvesting to butchering and slaughtering. And then we're gonna suggest that you guys talk to code enforcement, threading more teeth, or maintaining, things against vermin, and minimum sand standard size of coops for a minimum size to see if there's something, and then look for some guidelines to reference for humane care. K. Do people okay. Does anybody second that?

Second. Second.

K. Say aye if you agree.

Aye.

K. No nays? K. There you go. Hopefully is that enough? Okay. Perfect. Okay. Okay. Okay. So that takes us to are there any communications from city staff?

Oh, meeting

Yeah. Sorry?

Meeting next month.

Is there something on the agenda next month?

I thought we had.

Maybe you don't know yet.

I don't I don't know. Okay.

Yes. Okay. No. That's great.

Unless you know.

Let me see if I can find something on our

I'm still really slow on our

I apologize.

Or if there's anything forthcoming down the way that we need to be aware of. Works too.

Now because they graduate in June. So tell me now.

Would I how how about this so that we're not keeping you and so that we're giving the best data if I follow tomorrow with an email to everyone of these are the things coming up that we know of at this point?

That's great. And if you saw Teresa's, just a reminder, don't reply all, of course. Yeah. Yeah. I think you replied to Randy's. But yeah. But, I

mean, for something like that, you know, you can reply all. Thank you. There's nothing there. But if we're gonna just test me. But, yeah, I'll follow with an email coming up. I will say under the umbrella of communications, we are shooting, I am shooting for, a March potentially to do some legal training that you do, like, every year. So, a little more to come on that, but that's the plan right now.

That's great. Great.

Okay. We'll likely do that combined with, ARB.

Okay. That's With Yeah. Yeah. K. Anybody else have anything they need to bring up? K. I would take a motion to adjourn.

So moved.

K. We're adjourned. Thank you.

Well, did you know?

Yeah. Yeah. Enjoy your ducks. Yeah.

No. Do you have a question?

And they found it. Yeah. The only thing we had slated was the legal training

that you

Thank you. And send them

Yeah.

Send him an email just to confirm.

Thank you. You're really a great pet owner.