City Commission - Regular Meeting

The following program was produced by CTV Community Television. Welcome everyone. This is Monday, May 4th. If you have any questions, concerns, or anything, come up to the podium, give us your name and address. Uh before we take any vote up here once the motions are made, I'll give you a chance to also comment on that. And of course, under public comment number 13, I'll ask you to state a 13 or three minutes on that. Three minutes. Um I'll ask for the roll back, please. Mayor Cedar here. Council member Gotler here. Council member Kufa here. Council member Leaport here. Council member Paul present. [snorts] Council member Boss is absent tonight. Council member Wester here. Motion to excuse.

Mr. [snorts] Favor say I. I. Opposed. Thank you. Consent agenda. A city council minutes of April 20th, 2026. Special and regular meeting recommendation approve. The golf commission minutes of March 16th, 2026 meeting recommendation received. Motion to approve A and B as presented. Motion made questions. All in favor say I. I.

Opposed. Well, it's our lucky night. Was it last year? Yeah. Tonight we have the uh state champ 2026 Division 2 state wrestling champion from Sler High School, Christian Hasslam. I do have a little gift for you here. In recognition by the city of St. Clair and the true spirit of community pride for community and personal achievements dated this day, the 4th of May 2026, special acknowledgement presented to Christian Hassel. CHRISTIAN

[applause] [applause]

GREAT JOB. [applause] That's awesome. Thank you. Congratulations. Congratulations, Christian. Good boy. Congratulations. Congratulations. [snorts] So, I asked Christian if you want to say words, a couple words, and he just said no. [laughter]

So, I'll stay informed. You know, the accomplishment of state champ obviously is just wonderful, amazing. But I talked to him before uh the meeting and I I told him I said that is really an important and amazing achievement. But what I am really proud of when you get somebody like this sitting out here is uh how they got there. the sacrifice, the work, uh not eating what everybody else wants to eat and eats and watching your diet and that's got there's a lot of work and a lot of giving up of uh [snorts] some things that you just may don't want to really give up, but he did it and he's been state champ two years in a row. That right, Jamie? Yes, sir. Yeah. And now he's going to be a chip. Fire up.

Fire up. Anybody Does anybody out here want to say anything? He won't. I know that. just thank you. We appreciate Thank you so much for the recognition. It means a lot. And of course, we we love our community and appreciate how close it is and to honor in a meeting like this means a lot to our family. So, thank you very much. Thank you. And congratulations again. Good luck with M Pleasant. Anybody else want to say something? Nice job. Awesome. [snorts] All right. Um, you're more than welcome to stay. You'd like to go home [laughter] and study for your tests, right? You got 75.

You just got telling me how wonderful it was to be here. Now you're leaving already. [laughter] Thanks, Christian.

Yeah. Go number six. I got a proclamation to read tonight. It's National Police Week and Peace Officers Memorial [snorts] Day. So, I'll ask for your indulgence on this. Whereas the Congress and the President of the United States have designated May 11th to the 16th, 2026 as Community Police Week and May 15th, 2026 as Police Officers Memorial Day. Whereas the members of the city of St. Clair Police Department play an essential role in safeguarding the rights and freedoms of all those residing in or visiting St. Clair. And whereas it is important that all citizens know and understand the duties, responsibilities, hazards, and sacrifices of their law enforcement agency. and that members of the city of Sinclair Police Department recognize their duty to serve the people by safeguarding life and property by protecting them against violence and disorder and by protecting the innocent against deception and the weak against oppressions oppression. Whereas the men and women of the city of Slair Police Department in ceasingly providing vital public service to this community and whereas it is important to always remember police chief John D. McDonald who gave his life in October of 1962 while serving and protecting this community. Now therefore, be it resolved that I, William Cedar Jr., mayor of the city of St. Clair, along with the members of St. Clair City Council, do hereby proclaim the week of May 11th to the 16th as National Police Week. The city of St. Clair in May 15th, 2026 as Peace Officers Memorial Day. Publicly publicly salute the service of law enforcement officers in our community and communities across the nation. Thank you very much. And I thought I saw

Ashley. Hello. Would you like to say a couple words? Um, I'm good. [laughter] Thank you so much. We really appreciate all the support. It's like us.

Thank you. Okay. Uh, our favorite guy's here again tonight from the community foundation, Michael Curtain. Good evening and thank you for the invitation. Uh I'm here tonight representing the uh city of St. Clair Community Foundation Committee uh which is a group that meets on a regular basis to provide oversight to funds that have been donated by uh residents and former residents of the city for uh activities uh within the city and its surroundings. We met last uh I guess it's been two weeks now and uh reviewed proposals including a proposal for funding for the Fourth of July fireworks and as a committee uh we certainly recognize that that's become uh an iconic event not just for the city of Slair but for all of Slair County and so uh we were delighted without hesitation uh to offer our support. So, tonight I have a check for $5,000 uh from the uh foundation from two groups, one the DSLT uh foundation and the St. Clair City Foundation itself. Uh and we uh we wish you well and we look forward to the 250th celebration fireworks uh display. So, thank you.

Thank you, Mike. Thank you, [snorts] our committee chair. [applause]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Mike, hope to see you soon. [laughter] I want to be liked. Well, on behalf of the council, you are. All right, we'll go to number eight, ordinance of resolution. Resolution A is uh 2613 fiscal year 26 budget amendment. Mr. Duchaine.

Uh Mr. Mayor, members of the council, at the time of adoption, there were items that were anticipated but not projected. So, a final budget wasn't set for fund 661, the capital fleet and equipment expenditures fund, which is an internal service fund. So, it's not exactly budgeted the same as general fund or the proprietary funds, but more similar to a a proprietary fund. In any case, uh we have new information and the state law requires when we see that there's going to be a change in the effect of the actual spending from what was originally adopted, we are the chief administrators responsible bring that to council to properly amend and to recognize what's going to take place financially. So, in this year, what we're in this amendment, what council will be doing is recognizing uh in a prior fiscal year, a truck was ordered, single axle dump truck with various underbody blade, salt box, and equipment for 194,000. Now that it'll be expended this year, uh we are amending the budget to provide for that when that actually when the billing arrives. We are also projecting um the cost of replacement with a trade-in balance on this of the tool cat Bobcat for $40,948. This was an item previously uh obtained and paid for with ARPA funds that has uh we have quite an extensive backup. I won't go through all of it, but this piece of machinery has not had a positive experience here and we'll be able to replace it with this amount. The usual new cost is $75,000. So this is $40,98. We are also based on department request and recommendation. I'm putting forward for you to you the automated valve

operating machine uh which is a powered unit that turns water valves. We are responsible and right now we are behind in the area of turning valves in a preventative nature. uh we're supposed to be doing 25% of them a year and each year. So this will provide a machine that eliminates or reduces physical exertion cost and time of employees uh speeding up the process. In the past when the city did do valve turning, it did it with a rental unit. uh I believe as I understand was obtained by reference from the engineering firm recommending that to the city. This would actually put the uh unit in uh DPW's hands to schedule and to use as part of their annual work program. The other thing I'll mention is that uh now with our new city accountant on board, they were a she was able to catch up with our interest distribution and we are crediting the uh fund 661 fleet and equipment with $17,000 of interest uh that should be there. So in a sense we went from a projected use of fund balance to now a contribution with revenues of 302,562 and expenses of 291093. Um available for questions obviously and recommend a motion that's on the agenda statement. Probably the only questions that I I have is how are we doing on acquiring or looking at more resources to operate equipment equipment's necessary the activities are necessary it seems that we just struggle to find enough time energy whether it's crack sealing or you know all of the preventative maintenance activities always fall to the side against uh

emergency support need things break we fix them. uh preventative maintenance always goes to the site. Um we're buying a lot of equipment which we need should be replaced um based on our schedules and everything that we're doing. It just seems like we're short-handed to be able to do a lot of the things that we need to do and put this equipment deploy it as it should be used. Um that's just my questions are how are we doing on finding more resources?

Well, very uh very accurate questions counselor. The U discussion recently is to extend work days and use overtime with existing crew. Certainly uh the maintenance crew size is limiting as you mentioned. We are and we are trying to [clears throat] catch up with the eagle requirements for water preventive as well as reactive. Uh by the use the judicious use of contracting uh competitive contracting has allowed us to play some catch-up both with street crack filling and sealing. This last year we've now done over 12 storm catch basins by contractor and caught up with that. Uh it is right now what I hope as a strategy is to catch up as much as possible and then to be able to schedule and have a very aggressive preventive maintenance schedule ahead of these things. And as you said the where we lack is when we get uh deep into projects and then we're pulled off for reactionary things like water breaks and things of that nature. Additionally, this year we are rescheduling so that we can have a more of a a parks uh emphasis with seasonal help. And one of the reasons I was talking about additional vehicle or so before was to put seasonal staff in the parks for the non-skilled labor activities, keeping our crew, our five and six member crews to uh the full-timers to the skilled operations where the equipment is operated. So, those are just a couple of things um that I think you always do in business management. First, uh I've had the question about additional personnel. I'm reluctant to jump into it before the next budget discussion with cycle cycle with council because of course one one person does not necessarily result in a big uptick in activities because you are

often in their line of work. two and three people have to do the the crew work for sure.

So, we are kind of, you know, I don't want to say if you're in for one, you're in for two, but to some degree, it's been my experience that pretty much happens. So, uh, good questions. That's kind of where we are. I I certainly understand it with the equipment. That's a really valid question is we buy it, but who operates it? And, uh, that is, uh, pressed, especially at the level of response under our new work order system. we find that we're we're averaging nearly nine work orders a day. Plus, with water services uh on and off and the change out that's been going on, even though we'll be reading fewer meters, we still have several hundred to do and we're in the process of changing those out and doing the copper lead line replacement. I'm happy to report we've done 40 this year and last year we got all of eight done all year. So again, use of subcontractors to assist the crew is um certainly helping us catch up.

Yeah, and I would agree with that. It's a necessary evil having to do some contracting. Um and [snorts] my comments are just to support what our DPW does on a regular basis. We ask them to do a lot, they do a lot. They need the equipment that we're looking at. Um totally agree with that and support that. It's just trying to find more resources to support what they do day in and day out so we can get more done. So thank you. [clears throat] an ongoing challenge. So I got one question. So that belt turning machine will come back in front of us to approve this budget. This is just budget. Okay. We're not approving the purchase of it.

That's correct. You won't have to do anything or do something more. You can make that change later on, but this is to actually meet the requirement that we have a budget for this equipment should you wish to proceed. But that Okay. Is that the same with the truck? No, the truck is uh that's us catching up with the actual order now. It'll the the fund will represent what's actually been the truck was in the budget. It's just slightly different price than what we projected and it's a different budget year. Uh we don't get to we're not the federal government. We don't print money and we don't get to make up budgets. We if it expires in one year, it's got zero again and we start all over.

So this amendment tonight is approving the money to be spent for that truck. Correct. Not the valve turning machine. Are we approving purchase of the Bobcat? Bobcat. Now, that that is a separate item tonight to approve. So, this budget would provide for the action they're recommending to purchase the B. Okay. I'm sorry. So, could we leave that turning machine off that for now? Well, if you do it on just the budget, you don't have to proceed with the uh valve turning machine. The money will be there, but it is not an authorization to purchase. I'll make a motion to approve. I'll support.

All right. The motion may support questions. All right. Call the roll, please. Paul, yes. Wester, yes. Batler, yes. Koopa, yes. Leaport, yes. Cedar, yes. Resolution adopted. All right. Thank you. All right. Let's go to B. Resolution 2614, alcohol prohibition suspension.

I uh I'm catching up and learning a little bit as I go. So my my question and my statement to the council as I understand this past practice, my only question, Mr. Downey resolved to some extent of we had a short time to talk about it and I won't uh go deep into it tonight but my only concern was rights away especially state rights away whether we had control over that limiting uh alcohol consumption on that and he answered that I uh also want to know if there's sign changes necessary. Uh Chief Hennis gave me a little background on that. So obviously it's u it's something I have to learn a little bit more about, but obviously I'm passing it on to council for your consideration and your your private experience.

This [clears throat] looks to be identical to what we've been doing for the past several years. So I will make a motion to approve. Support. All right. The motion is made in support. Any questions? All right. Call the roll, please. Yes. Yes. Hua. Yes. Leaport. Yes. Hall. Yes. Cedar. Yes. Resolution adopted. Thank you. All right. We'll go to number nine. Reports administration. City superintendent. Okay. I have no additional comments tonight except those on the agenda. Questions from Mr. Shane?

Um, do we have an update on the pickup trucks that we tabled? uh in hearing the council's concerns last time, we have taken a different direction. I've not brought them back um to council because I think that after we have resorted the vehicles, I I think there's still some question there and I do think that we need one serviceable like crew cabsiz truck, especially the new way that we're trying to address personnel in the summer parks. But I didn't bring those back because I don't think we need the two full vehicles that we brought before. I would ask council consideration for like an allowance for uh perhaps used vehicle that we can find that would be serviceable uh for the seasonal use.

Very nice. Thank you. [clears throat] So you'll be bringing that to us when what we when we find something. Okay. Okay. Um, Mr. Bounty, nothing this evening, your honor. Uh, any city departments? Yes.

A few quick things to share with everybody. Just a reminder of be a tourist in your own town, which is typically held the third Saturday in May, but we're extending it to Sunday with the amount of events we have. So, the purpose of be a tourist in your own town is to um emphasize sinclair onthe river.com. you can go [clears throat] there and you can find out everything going on in the city at any time, but also to recognize the amenities that we have here every day. So, we have a golf course, library, harbor, museum, parks, retail, restaurant, trails, um the art association. So, all of those are available at any time, but on this weekend, sometimes there are special events and there's quite a few this year. So, Kletcher Park Community Day and Parade, which is the biggest thing and new to us with the renovation over at Kletcher Park and the new splash pad. Um, there's a nostalgic parade happening starting at the Voyager and taking the old route down to Kletcher Park. So, that's pretty neat. Council member Wester will probably speak on that a little bit more later. Um, the Marble Eye Fishing Tournament happening Friday through Sunday. Council member Gotler will probably speak about that a little bit. The library is having their used book sale which they have all the time 9:00 to 5:00. Um the Sinclair Art Association is having a special art exhibit uh from 2 to 4. And then on Sunday, again, this is the extension. On Sunday, there is a cemetery walk presented by the Slair County Genealogy and History Society of notable Sinclair citizens who helped shape our nation. That is at 1:00 on Sunday, May 17th. And on that same day, May 17th at 4 o'clock, is the class of 2026 senior cruise. So you can get go outside and and congratulate them on their achievements there. So sinclair on the river.com will have more details on all of this. Again, be a tourist in your own town daywe of this year. And also another reminder

that there is no election here in the city of St. Clair tomorrow. Um although there are elections held throughout Michigan, there are no races or proposals applicable. So there's no election for City of St. Clair registered voters tomorrow. And last but not least, I want to again um thank the community foundation for the donation towards the fireworks. Our committee is doing pretty well, but we are still open and um thankful for any donations we receive. We are making it bigger and better this year as the 250th celebration of our nation. So, um, donations continue to be accepted up to the date of the event, which is on the 4th of July. So, hope to see everybody there. Thank you.

Thank you. Any other departments?

I I do got one more question for Steve. Do you know what's going on with the the property with the broker that we hired? What the next step is on that? I haven't heard anything. I know we came up with numbers, but I haven't heard anything since then. We are uh obtaining property descriptions now. So that's taking a little bit. We're finding out we have an offer on a couple properties there. And uh as soon as we get those described, I'll get those back to Mr. Downey who's waiting on those to be able to complete his work up for sale so that we can bring that back to you. Uh we have some inquiries on other properties that haven't been formalized yet. All right, we'll go to D of authorities, commission, committees, chairman, council reps. Anybody want to talk about some of the things that they're involved with? Uh

yeah, so we have the the marble eye is the 15th of May is the first day. Uh it's Friday, goes to the 17th uh Sunday. So 400 p.m. Friday to noon on Sunday. and it is a roundthe-clock uh event. There will be uh volunteers manning the scales at all times at the boat harbor. Uh tickets are currently on sale at several locations in the area. Uh for $10, it gets you in the fishing tournament. We are we're already collecting all the fantastic prizes that we've collected the last few years. Uh from televisions to tools and gift certificates, all kinds of stuff. and you can enter the raffle ticket without fishing. Uh, you know, so you can still get a ticket to support it, have a chance at winning a great prize. So, if you get a chance to pick up a ticket, you can do that. And we draw those right after the tournament at noon on Sunday. We award the the prizes for the winning fish and do all the raffle prizes then. Um, if you have any questions, look look me up on Facebook or give me a call.

Thank you. That was good. You know, a comment to piggy back on that. Something that most people don't know. At our Slair Library, the our branch, you can [snorts] rent a fishing rod and a tackle box if you have a library card. Make $500 that weekend. Real easy. [laughter] That's a big one. But caught the big one last year, wasn't it? Yeah. But yeah. Okay. Uh, anybody else? We have no unfinished business. We'll go to new business number 11. Purchase, excuse me, approve purchase a Bobcat UW56 utility work machine. Mr.

Mr. Mayor, members of council, uh, previously we did a little discussion and we now, you know, have a budget for this. I think that in the background just for the public, this has been a very hard work machine, very critical to the uh, maintenance crew activities. had a number of pieces of equipment that go with it. It was originally purchased and paid for with the ARPA funds. Uh it has had a bad track record here of service life for a number of reasons. Uh took a lot of time to look at the um cost involved and the the the the damage to it or the failings of it. talked to other suppliers and other users and um I guess categorically I don't I I don't know what the term means exactly but I guess we got kind of a lemon here. So the replacement of it with the dealership with the additional years two years warranty take it to 5 years. This is wherever I've been this has been one of the most utilized types of work machines for public works. So, I recommend that you approve of this replacement with a new unit at the cost of the $40,000 $40,989 [clears throat] because it is critical to [snorts] the work of the department.

I'll make that motion. All right, the motion may supported. There are questions. All right, call the roll, please. Wester, yes. Yes. A yes. Leaport, yes. Paul, yes. Cedar, yes. Motion carries. Thank you. Number 12, claims of accounts, April 22nd, 2026. I got one one question on that one. And that's on the fence at the golf course for 10,400. [snorts] So, we're going to get that addressed. So, that'll go out next time to be about the bid.

Yes. Yes. I wrote a short report on it and that's uh yes that will be taken care of in the future. Then one more question on that. So I see there's like fence post for this uh street signs. Last month there was 6,000 now 5,000. I mean can we get them at one time? Do we know we were going to buy that many or we we did well we have a we have a bid for that. So but we didn't buy them all at once and stack them up. So you you'll probably see some other chunks come out because we are waiting on delivery two and I think there's going to be a third delivery. Sir

nothing else. I'll make a motion to approve. Any questions? All in favor say I. I opposed. Item number 13 public comment may have been non agenda. last three minutes if you would please.

State your name and address if you would please.

Yep. Bob Grave, 1951. Karen, thanks for your time. Um, want to say first all big deal. Uh, thanks for the city and specifically Mr. Coochmeister over there for starting the PSV and pri prioritizing safety in town. uh loop my interest in. I've had always had a stake in the town for safety, whether you talk to the parks department or just see me out there telling people to slow down. But uh realistically, even if it's something as small as supplying AEDs or drinking water for events, we've always had a presence. My whole family has uh one of the items that's getting some concern lately has um has been [clears throat] some speeds around town, specifically in the evening. Um, granted I notice it more because I'm not at work. So, if I'm out and about, that means I'm noticing people are booking around. Um, with the the new signage is going up for all the street marking. That's great and it draws the eye. Everybody's paying attention. Uh, but what it also does is it makes me realize how horribly faded the rest of the signage is around the town for roads and for traffic. Um whether it be on Carney, which gets a lot of attention, or even on M29, it's M29 is one of the only areas that actually has signage that is reflective. Uh we have more reflective nature in our signage that's on the Bridge to Bay Trail than we do on Carney, Vine, Clinton, etc. Um, calling back to what Chris said about preventive maintenance, some of this stuff is is I mean I'd rather have people know what the speed is at night instead of saying being able to claim that they didn't know what the speed was because they didn't they literally can't see the sign. And there might be some people that may have recognized me driving around town and having my brights on because I was trying to see how if any of the signs would light up and shockingly like 75% of them do not

at all um have any reflective nature. Um I will say that just a cursory look at uh the state's page um it looks like there might even be some possibility for some funding matches uh for replacement of the signage due to uh changes in reflective standards. So there's there's opportunities there. Um with that with everyone, you know, being setting a priority with the safety of the people that live here, let alone the people are passing through. I hope that they can that the city council can see that there's value in continuing that and maybe putting a little of that money back into some of the road signage. Thank you.

Thank you, Bob.

Else Yes, sir. 1374 South Riverside. We just paid $10,400 for a fence, $40,000 for a piece of equipment, and $11,000 for um street sign post. Could somebody explain to me [snorts] the process of spending over $10,000 of city money? How does it work? How's it How's it How do you spend it? What's the process of spending over $10,000 on city property? [snorts] address, Mr. Duchain.

Well, I mentioned the street signs and based on the councilman's question, they were bid and that's been under a bid uh I think four or five months ago on that. As far as the fence post, it it did bounce over the 10,400 because of the presentation of the workers to take down a fence and then the what the contractor cost would be and we've corrected that moving ahead. Um, other than that, it's 10,000 requires competitive [snorts] bidding. The superintendent may make exceptions where there's u does not appear to be a value or it would benefit the city if competitive bidding were used with a response and note to the council and a report pursuant to the charter. And then under 10,000 obviously we get multiple quotes for that. My question. [snorts]

That's normal practice. I understand what you're saying though. That that is normal practice and I do understand what you're saying. And then I know that he has practice is what the charter state. Right. Right. Right. What's the charter reading over it? says purchasing [snorts] only 10,000. Yeah. Competitive bids. You read that to me right now? No.

It says competitive bid a bid opening advertising can wave. But [snorts] how how do you know if he's doing it right? If it's if he's making a decision don't know how much stuff cost but I'm just curious why the comes out. All swore, you all stood up last [snorts] January and put your hand up and said you would uphold the charter. So my question is, somebody give me tell me how are you supposed to spend $10,000 purchasing under the city charter. Don't sit there and tell me you don't know. You know, not supposed to be at the mic. Why is it never come [snorts] up here, Bill, so people can hear you? Okay. What's the process to spend a th00and $10,000? Tell me how what how it's supposed to work and why is it never charged and why why we never follow that procedure. There you go. There there you go. I come up and ask you

my I don't know how many times I stated that the that is the intent and that is the process that we have bid out more since I've been here than the city had done in some time and uh under finance section 601 uh you can follow down to the

all excuse me Steve but also says the bid opening will be posted. It's never posted when the bid opening is. The general public doesn't know when the bid openings are when you spend this money. Tell me when the bid opening was on the fence, the Bobcat, and the fence post. There is no bid on the Bobcat because that was a already a conversation that was this is not that was a settlement of a claim and a loss to the other equipment. So that com that $75,000 piece of equipment was a partial trade in of our existing equipment, but it was a settlement of that. So we didn't go out and buy a new one and then replace it. Was only the work with the dealer on that. So they could do that. That that was waveable and that made sense because the city financially benefits from that. Um the fence post were quotes that were supposed to be no more than 10,000 and obviously error was made and the department was covered and I reported that to council that we're $400 over on that one. The other ones um and I can think back to the reconstruction of the public works department. Um that was bid that was noticed. It was we put things on our website as far as bid notices as far as when bids are done they're done here obviously awarded here at the council meeting but the that's on the website the landscaping was on the website of course all the major construction projects are on the website and the best of our abilities I reframe that for the departments if it's going to cost more than $10,000 and we use bidding for that process. So that is exactly what the charter says with with some as you mentioned and recognized there are some

exceptions to emergency appropriations and other purchasing practices um that are there under 607 and 608. So but that that is the practice and supposed to be the practice of the city following it. Well, again, it's not not always the answer has been there have been mistakes made. They're not there's sometimes marginal mistakes, but there have been mistakes.

All right. Thank you, Bill. Anybody else? All right. Let's go to number 14 then. Anybody on council have anything? Motion to adjurnn? Oh, one more announcement about Oh, sorry. Flesh Park Community Day. [laughter] You got that.

All right. Just a couple details about the day on Saturday, May 16th. Again, I mentioned the parade. It starts at 9:15. If you want to participate, please um go to the Voyager parking lot. Again, that's walking over the bridge down to Kletcher Park. It is the Splash Pad Grand opening that day. So, let's hope for nice warm weather. Um there will be little league games. alumni will be there. Uh some giveaways, um free food, music, and more. So, um please join us on Saturday, May 16th for Clutch Park Community Day and Parade. Thank you. When you're done with that, you can go fishing. Come fishing with us.

Okay. Motion to adjourn. All in favor say I. I. Have a good night, everyone. Thank you for coming. Trying to give you your moment, Billy.

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