Town Council - Regular Meeting

Welcome to the Springdale Town Council work meeting. Today is Wednesday, January 28th, 2026. We are at the Canyon Community Center in Springdale and the time is 10:00 a.m. With us from the town we have Don Breck, Garen Breck, Tom Danzy, Rob Totten, um Brick Wixom, Ryan Gooler, Robert George, and Robin Romero. From council we have Kyla Topam, Randy Eton, Barbara Bruno, Jack Burns, and Pat Campbell. And I would entertain a motion to approve the special meeting agenda.

We move we approve the special meeting agenda. I'll second. Motion by Randy and second by Kyla. I Barbara I. Okay. Are there any general announcements? Seeing none, we will get right into the discussion of the fiscal year 2026 capital priorities list for planning and budgeting. Rick, do you want to kick us off?

I do. Thank you. I was looking for a PowerPoint and I'm not finding it, so we're going to skip that. Um the the reason why we we we start with this and this is this is the start of the of the development of the annual budget for next year. But but this meeting in in particular carries a carries in my mind or should carry a little bit more weight than that because this is the time for the for the council to say here's what our priorities are. Here's where we because the operating budget is is your one-year budget that you're going to spend. You know, you're gonna you're g you're going to estimate revenues, you're going to estimate expenditures, and you're going to to do the work of the town for the next year, right? The capital priorities discussion in that is how do we how do we best take take and let me let me show you. Let me let me start with this. If I can go back to this thing right here. Um, budgeting is is there's there's a lot of methodologies on how you there's there's line item budgets, there's zero based there there's zerobased budgets, there's there's uh percentage increase budgets. what we've what we've latched on to um what what makes sense to me is is the idea of a a priority based budget where where you have this close I don't want to do that do want to go down we have a number of documents a number of planning documents we have the general plan we have the master we have and that's kind of all. So,

[snorts] there are 31 that I know of and I don't know that I have them all from from from the general plan to the to the trails master plan to a tree management plan, a streetscape plan, active transportation plan, water master plan, sewer master plan, etc. Right? All these documents say things like you should do X, you should build Y, you should think about, you should have a program in place to do to do something, you should have a policy to do something. Priority based budgeting means it it's it's a it's a it's a broad concept that that can mean lots of things to lots of people. I went to uh I went to a league uh session several years ago. There were three presenters from three different cities that were all talking about priorities prior priority based budgeting that all did it differently different you you know unique fit the city methodology on how they look at what their community priorities are and then how they spend money to to meet those those priorities. Um, none of them do things exactly like we do. That's fine. But, but the more the the better able we're the the better we're able to tie our our our capital budgets, our operating budget to our to our priorities, the better off we're going to be. [snorts] Um, so as as you as we as we dive into this and what we What we've developed over the last several years is a three-year a year one which is going to be your upcoming budget year, a year two which is the next year and the third year

which is the next year and then an over three year which is not necessarily a list what what we've done. We don't have the link on this, do we, Robin? To the master plan thing. We've we've developed we've taken all of those, well, not all of them, but but a lot of those those 31 different different documents, the you know, the m the general plan, the various master plans, the natural hazards mitigation plan, etc. We've taken those strategies out. We've put them into a spreadsheet where we can we can look at them where it's not necessarily digging through the whole plan. You're just kind of you're looking through here's what the plan says, whether that's a policy, whether it's a project, whether it's a program, which department should be looking at that. We shared that that link with you uh with your pack material. I hope you had a chance to to dig into that. It's a it's a it's a ginormous spreadsheet. Um, lots of line items, lots of tabs. That's that's essentially the three plus year with with some exceptions. That's the three plus list, right? And and the council's job in this is to take all of that information and say, you know what, community, here's what's most important to us. Here's our top priorities. Here's what we want should be working at. the the the one-year list is we're going to try to translate that right into the right into the operating budget. You say, "Here's the stuff that should be on the one-year list. We're expecting to put that right in at when we get to to to April and May and June, we might say, you know what, we can't afford all this, you know, then what do we take out, right? What do we what do we trim to to make it work?" That's fine. We at this point we're not talking about we're not talking about

general fund numbers. We're not talking about what we think the revenues are going to be. We're not talking about what the expenses are. This this process or this this meeting is about priorities and and and and what the priorities are moving forward, what they should be the next year. um in the year two and the year three, you know, you might you might find something that says, "We know we want a a a new building. We know we want a new road. We want a sewer line that's going to have to be upgraded at some point in time. How do these big projects work into the system so that you have you have if there if there's planning that needs to happen, if there's steps that need to be taken, if there's, you know, engineering needs to be done, if there's architecture needs to be done, it's not, oh, gee, you know, we should be applying for money next year. We've thought about it, right? We we've thought about it for several years. Okay, what's what's necessary? What has to happen? What steps are completed? How much is it going to cost? How are we borrowing money if we need to borrow money? Where's the funding coming from? All of those things can be discussed in in an efficient manner. Don't make sense. Questions? Okay. So with that background, the the document is broken down into projects which are buildings and facilities and streets and and and park expansion projects. But that's like projects. There's equipment and other big uh um equipment needs, trucks, vehicles, uh other pieces of equipment. There's personel And there's consultants, wrap, tax, and public art. Those are the pieces of this document all set up in

that same one year, two year, three year that that you're welcome to use as you see fit. Say that again. There's the link to that big document. Thank you. Like I said, this this is your your master plan summary document. All the plans are in the tabs at the bottom. Many of the plans. I don't think we have everything in there, but we have a lot. And and then as you click on the tab, then you have then you have a list of this mouse is backwards in mind. I keep wanting to go up and go down and

[sighs]

Um, the colors on this there's there's Let's see. Let's make this smaller just a little bit. Up at the top. As you're reviewing this, there's there's this color uh bar at the top. Complete, partially complete, ongoing, no longer needed. And then we've as we've updated the the chart, then we've added colors. So, if you as you scroll through here and you look at the things that are dark green or light green that are either complete or partially complete, there's been a bunch of stuff that we can say, you know what, we are doing the things that we're doing for the community. We're we're getting stuff done and that's then that's really what the what the public wants is is for for for tax money, for public money to be spent on benefiting the community. The other thing that that we hear sometimes is, well, we didn't know this was a priority. We didn't know this was a project, you know, we didn't know the council was talking about a medical clinic, a new town hall, a whatever whatever the project is. This is also the best opportunity for the public and we welcome them here if they were here to say council members as you're thinking about priorities this is what's important to us you know because as you go through year three to year two to year 1 there should be time for the public to to to discuss with you how those projects are going to benefit them impact them what their concerns are what their feelings are about It's not a public hearing, but at this point in time, it's much easier to put stuff into the budget than it is in when you have your public hearing, your required public hearing in June when all the work is done. Does that make sense? [snorts] All right. Okay. You've had a chance to go through the through the document. You want to mayor

start with questions? Do you want to start with um how do you want to how do you want to best to proceed through the through the the pages of this?

Well, I I thought about there are a few ways we could proceed. One would be to go by department. I know that Garen has a hard stop at 11 and I don't know how long we'll go. So, we could start with with him and his department or we could just go through this as is. I think the longest my guess is the longest conversation we will have will probably be about the medical clinic. So I think we'll we'll wait for that a little bit. Um obviously we're already funding the design work and we got the go ahead the go grant for that. So uh Garen, do you have any preference on do you want to you want to talk about your department? I think you're just in equipment and vehicle. You don't have any personal personnel additions or anything like that, right?

It's just the the vehicle. So on page four, you've got the Yeah. So every year we replace three, but then you've also got um the emergency preparedness equipment. Do you want to talk a little bit about that? You send us an email, so we probably are pretty clear on that.

Yeah, the email. Yeah, the the idea with the 50,000 that's in the emergency management um bucket is I'd like to have a box trailer with just some things that we may need like water pumps and hoses and a portable generator, smaller one, not big to run a building, but to run stuff like that, tables, chairs, just stuff that we might need in case we need to have a mobile command center or just to start helping residents do mitigation, whatever we need to do or recovery. And the project that's starting next week, is that funded already? Yeah. So, we

Yeah, it's in the current year right now. I think you guys all got the email, but you know, we're starting uh on Monday. There'll be digging Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday, too, for those propane tanks to bury and then uh the power will be out Monday and the tw the second and the 9th at the community center for the first half of the day. and then at town hall the whole day of the 12th. Um and they're hoping to be done by the 13th to have both generators installed community center and town hall which would be a great addition. Then we'll move forward with screening and some of those things. Great. And that was something we identified as a priority for this year. So does anyone have any concerns or questions about that?

Chief, what what what devices will these generators be be supplying? What functions? What are they gonna be tied to? The the ones that we're doing this next week. Yes. What are they tied to as far as what what what power are they supplying? [clears throat] One will supply the entire community center excluding the library. It has its own power grid. So, it would require its own um piece of equipment and then the other one will um power the entire town hall. Yeah. And they're both propane propane fuel generator. How big are the propane tanks? I'm just curious. Uh I think they're thousand gallon.

No, they're big. They're maybe they're 500. I thought they were a thousand. Do you remember? Doesn't matter. I was just curious. It's one on each and they're pretty big. They're they're uh said to be able to run depending on the load between 10 to 14 days. Yeah. Per tank. Power for all that for up to 10 days. That's pretty good. everything. It'll it'll power air conditioning, heating, whatever we need. It'll be like that we're just connected to the grid. And when there's not a power outage, they just don't use any propane or anything, right? They're just there for emergency. They will exercise once a week, I believe. Okay.

Whenever we decide. I think Robbiey's crew has one at the power or at the water plant that does it like 2 in the morning. It's a little farther out of the way, so we may choose a different time. We'll just when we get there, we'll figure that out. We have these little clips that we occasionally have. Are they going to kick on or? Yeah. So, I know we've been here with council meetings when the power's gone out and for a couple hours and whatever. So, yeah, they'll kick on. It'll take up a few seconds to a couple of minutes to transition and turn on and we'll be back to business.

Yeah, they they're depending on the load. So depending on time of year, what you're running, they can go up from between 10 and 14 days. No, I mean just for as part of routine maintenance of them. Oh, how long does yours It's only like 15 20 minutes. Yeah, it's because is there much of noise generated from that? That's We'll have to look into Well, when we get these Yeah, there'll probably be a little bit of noise, so we may choose a different time rather than two in the morning. Yeah. I'm just curious if we'll get comments from Yeah. There's one up on the hill same same size. Okay.

Yeah. They they both cycle once a week for like 15 20 minutes. And I mean you get your people playing pickle ball that kind of complain about it a little bit. They just have to yell louder, but like it's really not not that bad. It's 20 minutes once a week, so it's not horrible. Karen said you could you could schedule it to where it's not during when you know when there's a meeting at the office or something yoga whatever going on here something like that. So you can schedule it for after hours or whenever you want to. Hotel below me, they have one that cycles on occasionally. I can kind of hear it from my house, but it's not obnoxious and it's not

It's a background noise. Yeah, it's a background noise. It's not a serious issue. And pickle ballers The only comment I had is just email communication to the community about the closures. Uh I plan on getting with Robin this afternoon and we'll get an email blast out. We kind of wanted to wait till we got a little closer. Absolutely. Okay. And uh then if we did it two weeks prior, people might forget. So we wanted to wait till got a little bit closer. So

I I agree with that. Okay. But very exciting. I think that's going to be a nice amenity to have. You know, I hope we never have to use it, but if we ever do, we're prepared. So good work. And so finishing out your department, I see that you've got three vehicles a year for year two and year three as well. And that looks like that's kind of it, huh? Yeah, for now. Usually try we try and trade out three vehicles a year. Okay. Okay. Anything else you want to talk about before we move on?

Right. Any other questions for Garren? Okay. So, Rick, um, do you recommend that we go by year or by department or do you have a recommendation? I would I would I would suggest the council definitely talk through year ones on all the lists

because that is that is those things that you're going to be putting into your budget next year. Um, it might be if we start with like the project list and then go through and talk u I know I know Robert's got several things in there for for streets. There's the parks, some water. Then we could do by department inside that one-year list. So, let's let's do the year one lists for all of the for for projects equipment and just go through it that way. Does that make sense? Yep. We might as well start with clinic.

Okay. So, um, the medical clinic, we've had a lot of conversations within our council and also from the public about the medical clinic. And in my opinion, here's where we are. Rick and I have talked about it. Randy and I have talked about it. We've probably talked with most of you about it. So, um, we we are at a point where the three-year lease on the current building is about to expire. It is time for us to sit down. And when I say us, it'll be Rick and I, probably Randy too, to sit down with Lori Wright, the CEO of Family Healthcare, and first figure out if they are committed to staying in Springdale if we have a medical clinic. We know that the current building is not working for them, and that's part of the reason they're not open more. But, um, you know, we all talked about our concern about having three-year leases that have renewal options. We need to talk to them about what the potential rent would be for the building, whether that's doable for them and also whether they're willing to sign a longerterm lease. So, we know we have work to do right now if we're moving ahead with a medical clinic. Uh we also need to talk about the size of the clinic. Um, when we were designing it, we tried to reduce the size and potentially even add an exercise room that freed up this this space a little bit. And by the time we got the equipment in there and everything that we needed, it was 4,000 ft, which isn't a huge building, but you know, is it possible to reduce it a little bit more? I know there are concerns about a pharmacy. the pharmacy and if you'll just hear me out, I I spend a lot of time on this. So, uh thinking out loud. So, the pharmacy is to support the patients of the clinic and visitors to the town. It is not a retail pharmacy

and Randy mentioned that he knows that there are deliveries of ofarmacies delivered to Spring. Now, they do for now and they do. So family pharmacy in Hurricane, I had an a prescription there. They could bring it up to me in a week. I needed it today. So I went down to get it. So do we want a medical clinic in Springdale? We've had one here for 40 years. It's a very different animal with family healthcare than it was with McMahon's. But do we want a clinic in Springdale? Because if we do, we're probably going to have to have it on public property. I don't see anyone building one on SR9. But do we want a clinic? Do we support that? And if we do, what size is right size? And do we have a long-term commitment from the provider? So that's the philosophical question. Do we want one? And then from there, we can figure out, can we downsize it? And also, what's the funding source? Because there are federal funding sources for what they call rural health care. They've in fact increased them recently, not decreased. And then there's a potential for some money from TRT for the county. I mean, I don't think we need to talk about how to fund it until we talk about whether we philosophically support having one here. We all ran um we all three of us just were reelected and we were all in support of the clinic, but this is the time for us to figure out is this a is this a fish or cut bait? And and that'll involve a conversation with Lori, but let's talk about it here now. Did I miss anything, Rick?

Uh, no. One of the commitments we want from from Lori is an understanding of are they are they okay with So, right now they pay about 11 1150 per square foot of of lease space. Um, given the given the age of that building, that's probably moving into a new building is going to be we have It's it's a it's a it's a office that I some some months ago I gave you a hypothetical that if a new 4,000 foot building that cost 2 and a half million 625 foot I don't know if that's accurate or not that what's in the capital projects is a number about 3.3 which works out $825 a square foot

somewhere in there there's a right number that we'll we'll we'll have to get to. Um and VCBO can help us get there. So again, hypothetically, if you say, well, we're going to borrow money for 20 years, but we're going to expect that the family family healthcare pay that back over over 40 years, which is a good life for that building. That works out to about seven $7,300 a month just just for the bond repayment. We need to know if they're okay with that. We need to know if they're if they're financially committed to that. Say the number

73 a month. 7,300. But that that doesn't include things like maintenance and insurance. And so it's not the it's not the final number. You know, the final number might be closer to 8,000 or 9,000 a month. But put that in perspective. Iceberg is paying7500 for their space. So it's not outrageous. The question is it it is a nonprofit. They get federal funding. They may be able to make that work, but that's something that we would have to discuss with her.

We need to know they can do that. They need to know they can do that. They need to know their their their ongoing [snorts] revenue can support that and and and cover, you know, the things that they want to do. Now, now things could if you say, you know what, we want to reduce the number of exam rooms, we want to reduce the size of the building, we want to that obviously changes all of but not a lot. I mean, a thousand a thousand less square foot of just space isn't that much savings. Now, if you took a bathroom out or bathroom, yeah, there are parts of a building that are expensive and parts that aren't. And a pharmacy would not be an expensive part. It's not it doesn't require plumbing and that kind of thing.

And again, if we're going to have a clinic here, but we have to go down down river to get prescriptions if we don't want to wait a week for them, then that's a miss. So maybe we need to start because you know my my initial support looked at that floor plan it's like wow that's that's a lot. So, what would you take out? I would I would cut it in half. [clears throat] What would you take out?

Well, I would I'd have to have it in front of me, but size. [snorts]

I I think the pharmacy needs to be part of it. Um but yeah, and then they've got behavioral health and they have a contract with Z National Park for that. So, so Randy and I, I know Randy also has concerns about the size of the building, but Randy, Ryan, Tom, Rick, and I have been in the planning and we tried to make it smaller. I mean, if if we want to reduce if we want the clinic, but we want to reduce the size, we need to talk about what we don't want to include in there. Tom, can I but by comp

is that this is my own frustration is that when you say who has been involved in the planning um I feel like sitting at the table hearing for the first time what what some of these issues are with the clinic. I am not part of that conversation, but yet I have to vote on it. And so I've got a lot of frustration with that. I think there's a huge uh room for improvement in the transfer of information. So now whole council is on the same page. Yeah. And but you understand we can't all be in those meetings.

But if we need to set something up and even if if it's public certainly isn't anything we need to hide. Somehow we all hit at the post office, when I'm hit up at the river park on this very conversation and I can't answer questions. So and and I agree with Jack 100% in terms of a full council discussion on this. If you consider the IHC clinic in Hurricane, it's 21,000. Huge part of that is is just a waiting area and they serve the entire community down there plus people up far more patients at 21,000 square feet. This would be 20% of that. Can we say that we would even handle 20% of the of the workload that IHC handles in hurricane? I don't think so. Not not at 30 patients a week. It's just too big. And and the fact of the matter is this. We know how many physicians, four, how many NPs, eight, how many PAs, four, that Family Health has. When you go to McDonald's and you're standing in a line behind eight people trying to get your hamburger and it's five minutes, it's 10 minutes. The last thing you ask yourself, the last thing you say is, "I'll bet I could get that hamburger quicker if this building was bigger." There's only so much you can put down the pipe. And I don't see that family health just from my research has the the employee capacity to do much more to do anything worth 20% of what amount of healthcare is doing. The building is the building is is too huge for what we want it to do.

Yeah. And we can certainly go back to the architects and and Lori if Lori's committed to be in Springdale. Well, we'll keep talking about do we support a medical clinic in Springdale. So what's your bottom line, Pat? Do we support a medical clinic in Springdale?

I I I do, but here's my concern. I support a medical clinic in Springdale, period. No attachments, no addendums, no, again, I know this is a different issue, public use, no pharmacy that's retail, none of that. A medical clinic like we have here, larger, I agree with that. But but when I read uh Rick's document back in February, um and I thought that was an excellent presentation. He laid out exactly how this looks and he he he didn't spare the horses. He said, "Can Family Healthcare support this?" And his phrase was, "I don't know." An honest appraisal didn't know. I think we need to know. And apparently that's that's the direction we're going. So I like what Rick said just just before that that that needs to be vetted. Jack said he supports a clinic but smaller. And I support a clinic. What I don't want to do is build a clinic that doesn't work out. You know, that the building will be built to be a medical clinic. It's not like we could easily pivot to be something else. So, we really need to vet out whether and and the Pyote tribe runs two clinics. I know Jack has concerns about signing any kind of contracts with them. So are we do we agree that it's family healthcare or nobody? Is that something we all feel?

No. No. I don't why we haven't opened up conversations with IHC and you know they're expanding dramatically in hurricane. Why does it only have to be family healthcare? And maybe it doesn't have to be IHC. I think the service could be provided by a number of providers. Maybe some of which don't even exist yet. I and there can I jump in?

Yeah. because there are some differences in the providers. Family Family Healthcare and the Pyute Tribe and and other providers are are community health organizations, which means they're while while they are nonprofits and IHC is technically a nonprofit and other big hospitals are nonprofits, a community health organization is a different kind of of thing that that is IHC will if you show up at the ER and you say, "I don't have any they will treat you right. That's part of their mission is is to is to is to treat people who can't pay for service. That that treatment ends up being paid for other ways, right? A community health organization, one of their first and foremost missions is to treat people regardless of their ability to pay and to structure their rates based on somebody's ability to pay. So when you think about affordable housing, it's it's easy to talk about. It's really hard to do, right? And and oftentimes requires the government to be in the midst of that someplace either either covering the gap financially, providing land, providing, you know, other other infrastructure to make that that work. This is sort of the same sort of animal. We we we could probably negotiate with IHA and say, "Come up and do this." I I don't I don't I don't I think that's that's that's probably a good option. I don't think it's the best option for our community. When you think about what the community needs, we have we have a lot of of of underinsured or non-insured, you know, seasonal workforce that that doesn't have benefits with their jobs. We need to to remain focused on what's the best

provider for the community in all aspects, not just medical care. And I do completely agree with that. But I feel also if it's it's not a family healthcare or nothing either. Sure. Some health care would be better. So So Rick, are you saying that that we should consider whether we want to subsidize this if we are subsidizing but but to to a greater degree? No. No. But our but our subsidy we we own the land. That's not part of the the uh the arrangement. We're not thinking about the cost of the land in the lease.

I mean, it's it's we are we are already heavily subsidizing and have been for 40 years. But if Family Health comes around and says, you know what, um, we do have these seasonal workers that can't pay and the variety of of examples you gave, are we willing to say, okay, we will financially support you to keep this clinic open. Is that something we're willing not something we've talked about? And I want to go back to Kyla. Kyla, we do have a lease with family healthcare. We can't just pull. So, if they choose to renew the lease, I guess we still have the option not to, but we we went down this path with family healthcare and I think we need to keep talking with them for now. Absolutely.

And they are they do have a contract with Z National Park for behavioral health, which I think is not nothing. Exactly. And I'm I the question I heard was is it family health care or nothing? And to me that is absolutely no. It's family healthcare. Or if they say we can't swing that number or we maybe we can but we're only willing to sign a four-year lease. And I mean four years is going to come and go if it's a blink, right? I think we want to ask for a longer lease. That's that's something we talk about, but

as a town need to be open to changing [clears throat] that if it comes to the idea that it's nobody in the building. So, if we if they say no, we can't make this work and we're not going to sign another lease, we could go out to we could go out with an RFP or something that that says we're we're willing to build this medical clinic, you know, give us your proposal for coming and operating it and we'd be having the same conversations with them that we're going to have family healthcare. How long can you commit to? Here's what the the rent will be. So that is an option you know if we want to go ahead with the medical

and I think a medical clinic with our population um and you know being an aging population along with a transient population I think a medical clinic is necessary. I like most people, I'm not sold that it currently needs to be 4,000 square feet, but I also see [clears throat] that we're in a position now where we never thought we would be in the buildings we have. And I talked about this at the last council meeting. We don't have a crystal ball. So, that's not what I'm anticipating like saying we need to plan for a future that's we don't know. But I also think looking back, we did learn that we could potentially maybe find a way to build more than we think we currently need and be creative about how it's currently used so that things can expand because maybe eventually 4,000 square feet of medical clinic is going to be like, well, now that we've built it at 2,000 square feet and we have clientele, actually we're finding that this service is growing and we need to expand into this multi-purpose room that we've put alongside or something. I don't know how that I'm not on the the committee that works on that so I don't know if that's actually feasible but that's what I would like to see is that we are building something that is going to last us longer right now [laughter]

which is why it was designed the way it was but um but not so big that it sinks the ship. Yeah. I mean, we can't build it so big that Family Medical is like we it's not working. So, so just this room and these two rooms together is 4,000 square ft without the library. Without the library, without the hallway, without the hallway,

the hallway, without the offices, these two rooms and this room. So make sure you're when you think oh for that that's crazy that's that's you know we have many many houses bigger than this this this room that you're in is almost the same size as the clinic. What's the square? 780 ft 790 ft of the reading room. No of the the old the old Oh the clinic now. So, I [clears throat] think that the the design the one we designed has three exam rooms, right? Well, there's three exam rooms and a procedure room, whatever that means.

So, we could we could probably ask them to go with two two exam rooms. You kind of need two because you've got the person taking blood pressure and doing all that while the other person's seen by the PA. But I mean there are things we can we can do, but it's not going to be substantial in

instead of trying to redesign it here. I would I would because because Randy and and the mayor are on that committee and working with VCBO and I understand that that the rest of the council might feel like you're out of the loop. I apologize. We can we can we can figure out better ways that we can we can communicate that. But but if you you say, "Okay, we think it's too big. We are not sure about the pharmacy. We think that number of procedures might be wrong. Let's let's get um feedback and then go back to VCBO and say here's what we heard

and and let them 1600 square feet. 4,000 sounds really big. You're here, but I have [cough] Yeah. So, it really puts it in perspective that my house would fit a couple times in here. My house in Salt Lake was 5,000 square feet. My turn. Get to you. Okay, Randy. Can I go now? Sure.

I do support a medical clinic number one. So, I think that makes it unanimous. Uh, I have been on these [clears throat] discussions and I just cornered the mayor and Rick outside and was talking about I'm I'm starting to have real concerns about the size and the cost and um because of just looking at what's going on, looking at uh input from our community, um thinking about the future and what future growth we're going to have. And I um 4,000 square feet seems like a huge amount. And I live in a house that's 15 little little over 1500 square feet. I have a garage workshop which adds another thousand square feet. 2500 ft square feet. I have a lot of stuff in there. And yeah, I when we sat down with Lori, we kind of said, "Okay, what do you want?" And she gave us this this great w wish list. And I think we um we tried to accommodate that wish list, but I I do think we need to sit down with her again. I think the um absolutely we need some kind of commitment from them. We need to give them uh what we think the price is going to be and see what they come back with. Uh, but I'm 4,000 square feet and 3.3 million seems exorbitant to me

and and I have a hard time and I know Rick has said and uh I agree there is going to be some growth but if you look at Springdale right now there's not much room for growth in Springdale. So there's not going to be a lot of new people moving in here. Now there is going to be I agree with Rick that some people if we have a new clinic they're going to be more likely to come up here instead of going down canyon and instead of going to this little clinic if there's a new clinic there. So we might get some new growth from that. I don't see the park increasing to five million exorbitantly where that will add a lot of new growth or activity with the clinic. So, I'm I'm really think we need to go back and have some serious conversations with Lori and [clears throat] see what she can reduce in the clinic size and and and then, you know, and then also have some real substantive conversation about what they can afford and how long they're willing to commit. Right now, I'm not u you know, originally I thought 4,000 and and the more I think about it and the more I hear from other people, the more I think that's that's too much.

Randy, do you think in that conversation, would you be willing to ask also what Family Health thinks in terms of how they'd staff it? Absolutely. Yeah. No. And right now, do they plan on increasing their staff? They have 15 now and five clinics. And you know, at at 200 hours a week, at 40 hours a week, there's no way they could staff it full-time. There's just no way even even halfime they couldn't do it. Yeah. So, include that in the discussion.

No, absolutely. And I think that's a that's a good point, Pat. We need to bring that up. But uh you know with the with what they're seeing right now and with what my adult brain can come up with with future growth just have a hard time seeing that the need for a 4,000 square foot clinic. So, uh, but we need to have those conversations with Lori and and and we need I agree we need to keep the rest of the council uh updated on those and what we're what we're talking about and what we're um uh what we're hearing from them.

Well, and we need to be all on the same page too of what our expectation is of um family health care or any provider and starting with hours of operation. when are they available for our residents? And those are, you know, really the small details that make a that are highly important because that's what meets the needs of the residents. That's what purpose why they're there. And so anyway, those are the things that we also need answers to.

Yeah. And you know, it's it's a chicken and egg thing. I don't know if they're open so little because they don't patients or if they are open. So, you know, we need to talk about that because um has to be more predictable than it is now. Right now, they're saying call for hours. So, so what I'm hearing just to to wrap this up, what I'm hearing is that we all support a medical clinic on on the on the town property. We want to know if family healthcare is still committed. Um we would want a long-term lease. We would want to know that they could afford what the rent will most likely be. And if they are whether Okay. So if they are are committed, we want to talk about downsizing the building. And if they're not committed, do we want to then look for another provider and go ahead with the building or is that or does that kill the building? [cough] [clears throat] I know [snorts] what Kylo feels. What about the rest of you? Kylo Kyla wants to go ahead with another provider if they're not going to step up. So

I think we should go off with an Yeah, I agree. We can also say don't renew. You know that because we've got a Okay.

Sorry. And and the reason I think this is a a pertinent conversation is we do have a meeting coming up with our architect and we need to have some of these questions discussed and we need to slow them down on what they're doing because we might be doing a redesign of the floor plan, building square footage and everything. So this is a this is an appropriate time to have this conversation and And it's appropriate to bring up when we meet with the architect uh with him with Lori there. We need to start getting some answers to some of these questions.

I think our meeting with the architect is to to talk about town hall just uh talk about the buildings. We could still are we are we doing a final on the clinic too or is this all it's just

it was it was more town hall. I think we need to talk to family healthcare before we ask BCBO to do any work on downsizing the building because if it's if it's off, why spend more money on the design? I think we do have some money left for the from the grant for the design for them to tweak it. the the the the grant was intended to cover everything from from from go through construction drawings knowing that that the development of construction drawings would be after we had secured financing and we were really going ahead. So when when there's $300,000 in your in your capital, that's that's only going to be spent if you get all the way through the process. And and at that point in time, by the time we're getting construction drawings, we will know the building. We will have financing arranged. We will know who our bond who's buying the B. I mean, that's that's at the end of the process, not before we get

Okay. So guess somebody's phone buzzing. Is that a It's a mic thing. I don't know whose mic is.

I'm [laughter] not. I'm glad you said something. I've been very distracted. You start over. [laughter] So, so you're you're asking you're asking for a consensus and you went through several items. Could you just guess go through those again because Yeah, I think one or two of them might I'm I'm absolutely 100% behind you on most of what you said, but some of it I might notice, but I want to know specifically what you're asking consensus on.

I I want to verify that we're all supportive of a medical clinic on that property. Period. From there, we talked to Family Healthcare about their their appetite for a longer lease, their appetite for the rent that it's likely to be charged, that kind of thing. See if they plan to go ahead and ask them for a longer lease. Is that premature though? We're going to Are we going to give them worst case scenario? Can you afford the rent on a 4,000 foot building?

I think I think more of a of a general, you know, Lori, we're hearing concerns from our from our community that this is too big, too expensive. What is, you know, if if your rent was 8,000 a month, is that doable?

We don't know that that's what it is necessarily, but if it was, you know, we could share the same hypothetical. We could walk through that and say, you know, if if the rent was this much on on the building, is is that doable for family healthcare? And if she says, maybe not, then maybe we have a different conversation at that point in time. You know, it it is if our patient load doubles, right? Well, that might happen. It might not happen. That's that's some of the questions that the community and the council is asking is Well, and pay attention to what Pat just said about IHC down in Hurricane, what they're how they're operating with their within their square footage.

But there is a there is a minimum size that you need to to do business at all. I I'm not sure that's the right comparison. There's there's things that are not in the current building that for sure Randy Randy says, "Well, you know, they're asking for the moon or they're asking for for a lot." You know, that's true. I mean, there is no lab space in that current building. There is I mean let's keep in mind

okay and just let's just kind of try and keep all that in perspect but it's not about it's not about the size of the building. I mean, it is, but it's also about what they what we need them to do there. And they need the rooms to do what we need them to do there or we shouldn't build it. And if and if we're building a building, should we be under underbuilding, underdesigning? I'm just saying if if if a medical provider came in and said, you know what, I'm happy to work here. I need the following kinds of spaces so I can effectively do my work. Is not the same thing that we've had for 40 years. guaranteed.

Yeah. And and when we're talking about the IHC and hurricane, those are all hard and fast numbers, but none of us work in that building as far as I know. None of us. Nobody has nobody works in that building. Unless we're having meetings with those people to say, you know, we we see these numbers. Is this working? For us to make that I feel like we're basing a judgment on something that we actually have no comprehension on if it's working for them.

Well, maybe so, but I I like underbuilding is exactly what I don't want to do. But I I completely agree that that's the cost of this building is really difficult to get behind. Um, but I think we're doing ourselves and our future generations a disservice by underbuilding I think I think that that categorizing it as underbuilding maybe we call it scalable construct something that's scalable that

that is that and that's the part of the conversation that I would like to see that committee continue if this is built what's the growth plan because this build build to scale build something that can be expanded I don't know that that's possible that's best world like that's designing something in the perfect world and if it's if it's actually doable. Well, the good news is the VCBO architects has done thousands of of medical clinics and healthc care facilities and they will be able to walk us through what's what's what's a basic clinic in a small town and you know they designed what we talked through what what you know with Lor's wish list and and our space we had and everything they will be able to design a smaller building but there will be some minimum size beyond which it's not worth building a building and it's not based on IHC and hurricane. It's based on what they need to accomplish, what they need space for, what kinds of rooms they need to even have a clinic and be effective. So, so let's let's for the next step, let's let's have the conversation with family healthcare. Let's go back to BCBO. If Lori's in, if they're in, it's not just Lori. The whole board of family healthcare voted on it. And then um we'll we'll talk to BCBO. We'll rightsize the building. We'll keep the council informed throughout. Let's assume the building let's assume we kill the building. We have 2 acres of property over here that we got for public use. What's our next priority? And I'll just I'll go first by saying my next priority would be town hall and council chambers. We're busting at the seams at town hall. We we use this room for council. Um they when they're designing, so this is

an interesting thing. When they were looking at the potential, they're doing a master plan and when they're looking at town hall, the building they thought we needed was bigger than we could build in Springdale. So now we're talking about having a separate building for town council and that's what we're going to look at at the call with VCBO and then another building for employees for town hall. So is that would be my next priority that I would want to move ahead on if we're not going to build a medical clinic first. So let's hear from others because this is the place to talk about this, right? The our priority.

This is this is the time to be talking about what you want in and and and a time frame on what you want to accomplish it. So, we have we have a town hall project design in year three that is as a as a placeholder. Um, and if the council says yes, that that is that is important to us, we'll we'll continue to work that direction. If the council says, you know what, no, town hall, not necessary, we'll strike that off and we'll go a different direction. So, what we talked about building over there in the master plan that we have is the um not pulling the language out, the emergency preparedness, the resiliency hub. Resiliency hub.

Oh, I like that word.

Yeah, that's a good word. Uh we talked about a post office. And it's it's really obvious to me that a lot of a lot of communities, a lot of municipalities have a post office that the town owns, that the town or city owns. Sometimes they charge rent and sometimes they don't. We would expect that the owner would build a building and so we would lease the land to them or something like that. But that was we talked about that and I did have a conversation with him in the last three days. And then um we tal so we talked about a medical clinic, a post office, and a town hall. And the town hall would have included council chambers. So that may now be a separate building and the resiliency hub. And that was all we were planning to put on that two acres. Doesn't mean we couldn't pivot and look at a rec center over there if we're not doing a medical clinic or something like that, but we just need to talk about what our next priority is if it's not a medical clinic. Does that make sense? Do we, and this is probably part of your conversation um with the architects, do we and do we know about what size we would be looking at for council chambers?

No, it's smaller. We're going to look at that. That's our next meeting because they were trying to fit it all into a two-story town hall. and we ran into problems with size and and height of the building. They have 1,700 square feet right now, at least additionally identified as council chambers. 1,700 ft. And I think that's a that's a room with the podium like they typically have for councils, which is smaller than the room you're in.

Yeah. And that's okay. And then they have some some offices, shared offices for for us if we want to go do some work or that kind of thing.

Actual building is right now about 15,000 square feet. And they they originally were looking at three levels, a basement, a main floor, and a and a second story. Now, now because because we don't know that we can meet the height for to to get all of that into 26 ft. Now it's well, do we need to separate and make two buildings, two one-story buildings rather than one twotory building. [clears throat] So, I don't know. I don't know where we're going, but that's what the that's what the square footage was. um that that had a ba basement that was that was could be could be you know for future proofing that was mostly unused but could be built into at some point in time.

Was there a space study done on on this a space study? Yeah. Did we Yes. Yeah. They did a bubble who who how did we do that? Did did we do the space study? We say for instance Dawn needs more room or community development needs more room by so much. I mean did was that this committee talked through the positions that we have and and yeah we the this is what the architects do. This is what architects all do. They they do these space studies. So so they examine our current use and what the need is and then

and then a little bit of feed for growth. Yeah. So, so let's say someday we want an assistant to come in in the work product that the committee is is looking at there. There's a a spreadsheet that has here's this here's the spaces that we've identified as being needed. So, it's based on our current employee, our current positions that we have. And then there were a couple of like what if we got an HR person? What if we got an assistant town manager? But it was pretty much looking at the staff that we have and doing the the necessary minimum space. Something you said to us.

I sent the bubble diagram to you that had that had the same that had the spaces and it wasn't in a table. It was in a in a See the table if if that's a So, did we answer the question? Well, no. I the question is what's your next priority if we don't build a medical clinic, you know, now what would the next thing you'd want to look at? We or if you are building medical clinic. Yeah. What's the that that in my mind that's the question. What what is we are building also needs to be I think we've all said we want what's the next we thing we look at and in my mind it is the town hall looking at a potential town hall there

I mean that makes sense to me so real quickly though what's the status of the post office

yeah so I I talked to the owner a few days ago um when I was there before the end of the year there was a guy on the roof and when he came down and he had he was in a Sedexo truck. When he came down, I asked him what he was doing. He was he said that the post office had hired had hired Sedexo to inspect all of their lease buildings throughout the United States and give them feedback on the status of the buildings. He said that his recommendation was that this building is at the end, it's past the end of its useful life, needs a lot of work, it's unsafe. So, that was a recommendation he was going to go back to the postal service with. When I talked to the owner a few days ago, I had told him I'd follow up with him after the in after the first year. He had not yet heard that through the postal service, but he is definitely willing to do what we talked about, which is to build a new building on our property, freeze him up to sell the land that he has or do whatever he wants with it. But he said it's very difficult to move a post office. You have to have It doesn't sound difficult. It sounds like something that most postal employees aren't interested in having to do like public meetings and that kind of thing. So, he has given me the name of a guy who owns hundreds of post office buildings. He's in Scottsdale and he can talk me through he's going to talk to to me about what the process would be and whether it's probably doable or not. And I have not yet called him. I I have his number in front of me on my desk at home because I just haven't had a chance to call him. but he said if anybody can help us get a post office moved it's this guy. So just that's where we are. Um I'm going to be in Hildell for a Washington County Mayor's Association meeting next week. I'm going to go see their post office because I think I know they have Kyla was just there. Kyla they

have a passport office. It's beautiful. It's maybe more I don't know if it's Colorado City or Hilldale. It's over by the Common Grounds thrift store area. If anybody knows where that um past Utah Avenue, probably Colorado City.

Either way, it's beautiful. I mean, it's very it's clean, right? And the people there are super friendly and there was space and just Yeah, we got our passports done for the kids and um very jealous. They had all kinds of large parcel pickup area just and I think she told me they have like five quite a bit more than we would need. I think they've got the post office that we should have community like this with the park and and all the businesses and everything. And again, this owner is is willing if we can make it happen. So, I'll talk with this guy who successfully moved the Scottsdale post office and see what the process is. And we're still talking with Senator Lee's office and Congresswoman Malloyy's office. Um, the last thing that I and the other two um Canyon mayors did was go meet with Caneravville's mayor because they successfully got a post office back after they lost it. And what they did is they they provide the building and they just asked the post office to fund people to man it and that kind of thing. So there are lots of ways that this can look but um yeah that so so that's still alive but that's not I mean that would involve him building the building and not us. So that's not something that we're going to have to fund which is a real plus right? So, but that would be that's something that we've got a spaceholder for over on that master plan as well. But the town hall would be something we would definitely fund in the council chambers. And we yeah, we we could do those at the same time or at different times. Um, this room certainly

I mean even Brian had the little town at the ski resort has a real council chamber. It's It's unusual that a town like this doesn't have one, but um you know, we could talk about whether that's a priority or town hall. I'd like to get the police department out of the basement. My mind is town hall, but but we could do both at the same time or whatever. I mean, those are all those are all options. I would really encourage us to think about one-story buildings, not two. Town Hall will not be able to be one story. I mean it's in the early design stage if you can't

that was what I understood from I I wasn't at that meeting but that's what I understood was there was difficulty meeting the the the height of the floor necessary for the council chambers and the height of the main floor inside 26 ft. Is that not right? Well, just to just Yeah, but we have maximum size footprint. So, just to fit the people that we have into a building that is one story, it would be a huge footprint. But if not, then we put people back in the basement. Tom, you you have some insight on this. You were there. And maybe we don't need to figure that out.

We don't need to figure any of this out. We just need to say what our priority is right now so so that we can move on. Never mind.

Um I will say that to me council chambers are important in the sense that they give the community their space back. If it's dedicated council chambers that really makes no difference to me. But I know um in several committees that I'm in and just in dealing with activities for the community, it is really hard to get into this room in the evening. Um and I would like to see that if building a council chamber frees up this room for actual activities. Um like for example today if somebody wanted to be in here doing art or whatever fancied them, but we're in here talking about stuff that nobody wants to listen to because nobody's here. Um,

so you're saying a council chamber is your next priority? I I think so. And or if that's with um a town hall, then that's fine. I don't think we will have much public support for a town hall. Uh but I think that in the long run it gives the people back what what we are you know using a vast majority of the time and we did talk about that when we when we talked about having it be a separate building that there might be more community support for a council chamber first versus a town hall. So that's

yeah that's a conversation we had. One thing I want to just throw in here is a historical perspective on community. When when we first when the town first talked about building this community center, there were a lot of people in town that said, "This is an extravagance. We'll never use it. Uh it's it is ridiculous. I will if you build it, I will never go in there. some people said and here we are saying this is not enough you know we're we're taking up uh so so we need to kind of keep that in mind when we're talking about everything there is right now um back then it didn't seem like that was a a great idea but it was and so really need to think about the future that's what we're doing. But I just want to remind you there is a very this is a prime example of of future thinking that worked and now we're even not only is it not being used, but we're we're growing out of it. We we've got too much in this now. So,

and it's very much like if you build it, they will come. Yeah. Right. You don't know that they can come until you've built it. And and that's a little bit of the same story with the medical clinic. Are people people aren't coming because it's a trailer. I don't know. They're not providing the services that are needed. And if they were to have a building where they could provide services, would they? And that's a really good point. I agree with that. And I'm just Yeah. Still I I still think going back to that, we need to have another conversation with Lord. Yeah. And there are no perfect answers. We don't have a crystal ball. We do know that this room is used regularly and the reading room.

This building, this building is used. This building is very well loved. Maybe you've answered a question for me as to why we always see the same people and never see others. Maybe they still are holding steadfast to that I'll never go declaration 20 years ago. [laughter] Um that but I I do honestly believe that this area should be used for community purposes and if we can get out and get into our other space and if that space had the potential for multi-unction if we could hold our other town type um functions

and you know I often when I go to to meetings Um, the meetings are held in the council chamber. It's not like it would be 100% council space that couldn't be used for anything else. It is a meeting room, too. So, I think it would get lots of use both during council meetings and planning commission meetings and also outside of those. But, um, Jack Pap, well, I guess I was just going to and I've got a little bit of a different perspective on this. You know, it's like I I personally I have never had anyone say we want our building back. You know, I' I'm not aware from an operational standpoint what a challenge that might be to

say what we want uh our residents saying we want our community center back. You know, we don't want you guys meeting in our building.

Well, that's not the sentiment. We don't want you meeting or discuss scheduling at the night. I don't I don't I'm not aware of this conflict between our need for this space and our residents. I'm just not aware of that. Never heard a word about it. Um in one way for me keeping us here is what ingrains us in our community versus segregating us into a whole separate building. So it's kind of a a perspective perception thing for me. um you know, unless there was an absolute compelling reason that we've got residents standing up saying, you know, we can't use this building because of you guys, then that might be something. I've never I've never heard that ever. U never heard and again from a scheduling standpoint, that's where the the real issue may be. I have a little bit of concern of the, you know, the appearance of us that we need our own space. We need our own council chamber to do town business versus be part of this building. And by its very So anyway, that's just a thought of mine. Um I have a little bit of concern about that. I uh you know, we are hearing more and more for lack of a better word and and I'm not saying it's it's all warranted and it's you know I think perception

and you know I get that Jack I but again I I I go back to what I heard heard about this building or we ever built this. The same thing with the shuttle. Everyone hated the shuttle. Yeah. No. And it's there there are people out there and by God they will stick to that position until that thing is there and then they go, "Wow, that was a good idea." Yeah.

And and I I just, you know, I I think you would be challenged to find anybody in this community right now who would say, you know, you shouldn't have built that community center because it it was it was the right thing to do. And you know, and I have to defer. I'm not as involved as maybe Kylie is and others are on what goes on in this or Ryan certainly of what's going on and what the um the use requests are for this particular space. But uh I could see we are taking this space up um for for considered time. And I think, you know, the other thing that I that I really like that we just sort of heard not too long ago was just this idea of, you know, when we're building these buildings, uh, we're not paying for that building. And the residents that are here right now are not paying for that building right now. It's they're paying a little bit and the future residents are picking up and going and paying cost. So, it's not just um the people who are here right now. I mean, they have a voice and it's important to listen to them, but there's future people and we need to think about they're going to be paying some of the cost of this, too.

For me, more than anything, it's perception. I don't want you know even you know we've heard too the idea of the potential to and I'll just kind of leave it at that. I have a little bit of concern about the perception of a council chamber. I I don't know. I Well, think of it as a as a meeting space because this is this is a it is. Yeah.

Community center. There are classes, art classes, there are yoga classes, that kind of thing. The other space we could just we can call it what we want, but it's maybe we just think about calling it something else. Yeah. Because it isn't just for us. It's for the planning commission for all sorts of meetings. Yeah.

Potentially for any town outreach meeting potentially. would be coming out to the public for smart travel or highway um designation or any of the little community development not little any of the significant community development activities that we do um we are in this room uh and the most popular time to schedule something to my understanding and maybe Ryan can tell us more is evenings and when are we in there in the evenings. So, alternatively, we this building is really hard to schedule.

And alternatively, all of our planning commission maybe it's every Wednesday planning commission council maybe we should start moving those up to the daytime when this building isn't needed so much.

Yeah. No, I think but I think it's I think one way to solve this uh elitist council thing is just a branding change. It I think a a a town meeting building is is a much better branding and it's it'll take some of the the air out of that particular argument and maybe that's a better way to to approach it. And you know I I think I think we need to not I'm trying to say this carefully. We have a small vocal group of people in the community that don't speak for the whole community and yet have a lot to say I think you know St. George just built a new city building and it's got a beautiful council chamber. I mean, we are a community that we're a nice community and we should have what other communities have. I don't want a building like St. George, nor do we need a building like St. George. But we do need to free up this building. It's very hard to book. I can tell you, you know, when we're trying to schedule ZRC workshops and everything we try to schedule, it's it's all this building drives the date instead of the date drive the convenience driving the date. Exactly right, Barbara. We plan our dates for this building.

Yeah. So, this community meeting space, and I like Ry's idea about that, come up with something different so it doesn't sound so snoody. Um, so you would use that that space for the things we do here now, council planning, but would you also have like some of the community events that Ryan puts on, you know, those players you put up when you're trying to find out what people want about the river park. Would you schedule those there also? Well, and when you say you, I assume you, you know, it's going to be after we're potentially all gone from from this council, but yeah, we could do anything in there that

just so it were available for council and planning commission on the dates that they are scheduled. You could do anything. There' be two spaces to do that kind of thing. Council and planning would be for sure there. And the things that Kyler references in terms of there being no space, both those spaces could accommodate all of that. In other words, it would be two build two spaces that that accommodate community events that could accommodate community. Typically, it would be set up more as a podium, but then with a room with chairs. So, you could you I mean, it would be somewhat flexible, but that's what you would design it to be flex as flexible as you want it to be. yoga there.

You could, but that's not what other communities do. No, I wouldn't do yoga there, but Rick, but having a So, so we book this room hours in advance of your meetings, so we we can set it up, right? There's a lot of time that goes into getting the tables out, getting the chairs out, getting the computers out, getting the sound equipment. Um, all of that takes time that is taking away from other things that could be in here. That's

Yeah. So, it's set up. It's always set up. And if you're having a a a town hall meeting, if you're having a a staff training, if you're having a planning commission meeting or whatever, you just roll right in. Then that frees up this room hours of the day. That could be yoga classes, it could be kids things, it could be other community uses to go in here. You know, we have we have the night sky events in here. We have I mean because this is the only room that fits, right? It's the only room that fits our entire staff in to have a staff activity. You know, it's it's it is well used, but but we are definitely impacting the amount of time this room has for the public. Can I

Yes, please. Sorry. Real quick.

Yeah. So, kind of Rick touched on, you know, several years ago, we did the town hall remodel with the new community development space. Prior to that, we had two meeting spaces. We had this room and then we had what was over at town hall. A lot of what gets pushed off to the side is I mean, we have a hard time scheduling things for staff in this room because we've got our our wreck programming. The library is doing a lot more programming than they've ever done. We've got private rentals. We've got outside people who want we've got the police who want to come in and use it. And it's tough because this is the only space that can accommodate more than, you know, 12 people.

Yeah. And so, um, yeah, we're trying to do it all in here. And so, it's we're turning a lot of people away. We get people calling in who maybe want to rent it, maybe someone has a reception in in town, and we just we don't have that because, as Kyla mentioned, it's just schedule's tight. So, okay. I'm Let's just [snorts and laughter] Okay. So, our sounds like our priority [clears throat] is medical clinic followed by uh meeting space. Uh town meeting space and town hall might be our third priority.

Well, I guess And they could be done at once because I mean if if we want to rank them equally and say we want them done at the same time. That's that's an option. That's that's what we're here to talk about. retail pharmacy.

Kyla couldn't hear what you're saying. So now we make the best use of what we have, right? I agree. Town Hall medical clinic there. I'm still a little shaky on that. But then to attach the retail pharmacy to it, that that's it's not a retail pharmacy. It's it's a pharmacy for it's not a Walgreens. It's a pharmacy for people to get the prescriptions that are prescribed by the doctors there. So if I come with a prescription from St. George, I can walk incription.

No. So you go to the doctor, you go to NHC and they say, "What pharmacy would you like to send to? You said, "I'd like to send to the family healthcare pharmacy in Springdale." I imagine they could probably do that.

Well, they they don't do that. They they only fill because I'm a patient of family healthcare. They only fill prescriptions that their doctors write. I can't have another prescription sent to them from an outside doctor. But what you could do is is someone who's here visiting and forgot their meds could go into the clinic and meet with a doctor and that doctor could verify I mean could could get them that prescription. But yeah, they only fill prescriptions written by their own physician. Pat, I mean, help me understand why is that retail

and So, so with you though then the conflict is how the ordinance is written, not the activity itself. I don't I don't know what you mean by Well, if the public use zone says it does not allow for retail, right? So then what if the ordinance is rewritten to So let me give you an example. The ordinance is rewritten that we're going to allow retail. I mean then I think you open up a can of worms.

Well, yeah. So let me let me just throw this out. So like in the park, you go through an exercise. Here's what you can sell. And if we have a pharmacy, let's say So just just to put it in perspective. Okay. So I'm a patient of family healthcare.

Well, what would happen with an arm sling is the doctor, they would have one and they would send it home with you. They would give it to you. When you go in the Hurricane family pharmacy in family healthcare clinic, there is a small window, a small pharmacy, and outside of the pharmacy is a maybe a three like a bookcase, a three-level bookcase that has aspirin and cold syrup and stuff like that. They don't sell slings. They don't sell. So, that's the only retail component and it's for people who are coming in to get prescriptions. So, someone who lives in Springdale and wants to buy a bottle of aspirin, yeah, they could they could probably go in there and buy it, even if they didn't have an appointment there, but the prescriptions are only for their patients. I can't I can't have my cardiologist send my heart med to family healthcare. I have to have family healthcare prescribe it.

So, that that's what they do. I've been going to them for years. I expect to get it right there. So, I don't have a problem. Yeah. My issue is knuckleheads and walks into pharmacy.

Yeah. He couldn't do that because they wouldn't sell that out there. But also, it's it's tied to their hours. It's only when they're open because it's coming through the front door. And yeah, I mean, it's it's not it's not a Walgreens. It's anything. It's far removed from that. And what Lori said, in fact, when we met, you might remember, was that they wouldn't even fill the prescriptions up here. They would dispense them here, but they would be filled at one of their otheries because they don't have that much space here, and they can't justify a full-time pharmacist.

I guess my concept This would be dispensing drugs for their diabetes and we don't I'm driving all the way down the hill to get this. They should be able to get it here. That that was the example that was given to justify the pharmacy in the medical clinic. And now I'm hearing something different though. So it's not that.

What is that? So if it sounds like we need to clarify what that is. Yeah. Blood pressure medicine. And I'm a knucklehead and I forgot it. Right. And I'm here in the middle of nowhere and I walk into this pharmacy. Um and they say, "Yeah, we can prescribe it, but you got to see one of our doctors first." You can't that's that's different than hey doctor whoever back in California can you can you send my my prescription to this pharmacy so I can pick it up exactly or having the pharmacy contact their pharmacy you know my prescription is at is at Walgreens in Costa Mesa can you call them and and get that transferred over and fill it for me

you would have to see one of their physician assistants that would prescribe the yeah they only fill prescriptions that their doctors Right. As long as as long as it's clarified. Wasn't clear to me at the last meeting that that's what the expectations. We need to clarify exactly what the pharmacy does. If you say, you know what, we just don't want a shelf of anything being sold, then you take the little shelf out. I mean, it's only one little tiny bookshelf that that even has over the counter stuff. And we only thought that they could have that as a convenience to our residents. Remember, it wasn't because they need that. It's because it would be a convenience to our residents. But you but you could go to Soul Foods and get get Tylenol.

Yeah. I like the idea that I need something.

Yes. See, and I I don't share your concern about that. I don't know why that's a problem, but but that's not what they do. So, we'll clarify that with clarify it.

Okay. Well, we figured the biggest part of this. Yeah, I think we can move on now unless somebody has [laughter] You might. So, are we good to move on?

I would like to talk about roads next. Um, and and Robert's here and he can talk about all of the roads in in detail. I want to talk about financing roads. You've got the in the project sheet recogn You need to take care of it. That's 50092,000. You're eventually going to have to rev it, reconstru itself is essentially just a chip seal. It It needs additional work. It needs

essentially big Paradise Road crosses onto the to the private property and it's the one next to the wash by Pizza Noodle. Oh, I thought that was when that that is a Oh, Paradise goes up to the cemetery. Okay.

Okay. Yeah, I know. I thought you were saying parish. So, paradise. I know that one. public road that's going through a piece of private property to access the highway. You know, UDOT's not terribly interested in in dealing with it. You got the wash right there. Improvements to that intersection would be many many millions of dollars. Right. When you look through here, there's there's several million dollars worth of of of road work that still needs to be done. Um when when we reconstruct a road, it's good for a long time. you know, we we we do regular maintenance. We seal coat them. We we do the the ongoing stuff, but roads have to be reworked on a on a on a fairly predictable, you know, and we've done nearly all of the other ones, all of the other ones. We we spent millions of dollars upgrading roads. Um, and we've been able to use our general fund balances to do that. We've been, you know, we over over years and years and years of of of being responsible with money has has let us not have to borrow and and we're using, you know, general fund money general fund funds that we've been we've been able to transfer capital projects.

Some time ago, I sent you a a a discussion about using adopting a state has a number of transportation taxes. One of those can be used for um it's a it's a.3 uh percent tax that it's in uh the state code 59-12-22-2212.2 59-12-2212.2 2212.2 to um it's it's a local option tax that comes 100% to the community has to be used for roads um class class B road class C road class D road traffic and pedestrian safety features including sidewalks curb and gutters safety fig safety features traffic signs streets alleys roads highways or thorough affairs of any kind um

and it's a sales tax a sales tax So, it's paid for by the people that are coming here and and residents who spend money here. Yeah. Which which I don't have a problem with. There are roads, but yeah, it's something I think the council ought to consider, especially when you're thinking about how much road improvements we we we still need to do. And when you get to back to a point in time where the roads we just reconstructed are are need an overlay, it's it's money that could be that could be overtime build up. so that we're not we're not, you know, just using general fund general fund money to do that.

And most most mayors that I've talked to are putting that into place. Most most communities, their mayors have told me they're putting it into place. So, what's involved in doing that? It's process. It's like the other taxes that we've imposed. You you you draft or you have the the town manager with the town attorney. You you draft the ordinance, you you follow the process that's outlined in the state code on adopting them and and you you roll forward. So, does the state collect it and then allocate it back like collects it and sends it back to us.

We get 100% of it back. all same thing that your local option sales tax resort tax is uh is applied against same it's 600,000 a year is that what you said okay what our what our 1% sales taxes

based on what the resort tax generates trying to calculate the two you know it's like well this we do have one of the highest taxes in the state here that's because of the resort tax and everything but I don't know if that bothers us or not it bothers some people 13.37%

it definitely bothers you know depending on what your uh what your what your anxiety level is about [laughter] about taxes. It uh it bothers them. So, we're 14.37. Uh this this summer in in 2026 when the county's 4.5 goes into effect, it'll go up. If you did the local option transportation, you would take you to with the county's change happening this summer, you would end up at 14.92. sales

that's that's so transient lodging that's the biggest so somebody coming in staying in hotel room will be would be taxed at 14.92 general sales will be taxed at 8.35 uh restaurant food at 9 general sales 8.35 under under that hypothetical where you adopted a new tax well that's not that bad that's that's lower than some well I mean that's it's easy to think that but you know like if and again it's not that we should get wrapped up on it, but if you book a room in Springdale, you're a te on that already overly priced room, you're adding another 14.37%.

And and you're not paying that in in Liver because they don't Yeah. So, I mean, I guess it's it's just kind of Yeah, I won't say anything more about it, but I you know, it's it's kind of that slow incremental creep. I remember when we were we were there was there was There was a time when when when the council when the visitor bureau was was really fearful about going over 12%. Not ter long ago. I remember those conversations. So Anyway, Robert, you want to dive into streets, please? Y do you guys have

I have a question about this Red Hawk thing. What what's going on with the Redhawk Road that it needs so much work?

Um, if you'll recall a couple years ago, well, let's see, 20 I think 2018 2019, we we reconstructed Red Hawk and then a couple years ago, I started noticing the asphalt was unraveling, which means it's separating. And um, so talked to Rick, talked to you guys. We got some money to investigate it. We had geotechnical look at it and also our engineering firm and um there were some issues with the clay underneath uh 3 to four feet with the original project but it wasn't enough they're thinking now and so going back and looking at it they want to add um geo grid to the road to stiffen it up more to help solidify um what's happening with it now. And so that's what this reconstruct would be is take out the 18 inches or whatever, put in the geo grid and some other stuff to firm it up to not have the same issue.

So this is strictly fixing what's there. It's not adding those spurs that they're talking about. No, not at all. Okay. Thanks. trees.

Um, so, uh, Ryan created a tree board and, um, take care of the rightway trees on SR9. And there's a couple trees that we identified at Mimi's. on corner uh the curb radius um about there's another mberry there that's starting to trees are pretty met with the tree board showed them the pictures had a discussion and it was determined that we probably remove those trees for safety reasons

or from an actual bid. Yeah. And and uh so that bid is remove well the bid is removal, stump grinding and replanting new trees. And part of the reason that the bid is so high is we are right over SR9. And so we have to be very cautious [clears throat] and not have it fall on SR9 with traffic and everything else. So was that a competitive bid? Um, no. That's just getting bids just to get numbers for this. I will go through that once we determine if that's what we're doing.

Yeah. When we start going through actual bid numbers, I make lots of phone calls, but for this, I only call two people. I will say amount of trees uh removed. It is in uh what's the word I want? Unbelievably expensive. It's Yeah. When especially if you have to bring in a crane. Yeah. It's adds up really fast. it just

so [snorts] um also shown in year one the bus turnaround asphalt. Yeah. So, um, the Sunrans as of now turns around up at the Benny's, which is road base. Um, what's happening is when we [cough] have our rain events with the buses coming and turning around, it's starting to affect the asphalt because we're getting all that rock and grime from the tires tracked onto the road. And then we've got maintenance cost on top of that because we're having to constantly go clean up the mud from those rain events. And so one of the solutions for now is to do asphalt where the bus turns around to not have them tracking that all back onto Lion Boulevard.

When they originally came in, we talked about them going up to the circle at the top below the gate and turning around, but I've noticed they don't do that. I've even seen them turn around down in the Hudas parking lot. So, um, could we get any money from Centr from the U DOT grant that that created that route to support that, too? Have you checked into that? I have not checked into that. And I know it's it's Utah Tech land, right? But it's it's so Robert, it's replacing concrete with asphalt. No, it's roadbased right now.

Yeah. And so, after a rain event, because it makes ruts in the road base and stuff, we're having to bring in new road base. for having to sweep and broom off Lion Boulevard up there and just so spending this saves you a lot of other inconvenience and cost. Okay. And you know, we have people that drive up that way and it doesn't look good when you have all that debris coming down for Yeah. It's a mess, too. I've seen the ruts in there.

Mayor, just at just another point on that. Um, as you mentioned, when we first met with with Sunrans, we investigated a number of different turnaround options. The folks at Suntrans we met with at that time are no longer with Sentrans. And you've met Chris Pearson, who's the new transit director in Centr, and is um very community-minded. So, I have a meeting scheduled with him um later this week to talk about if we can revisit some of those options. And if we could, then that would that would be a solution that would not require these improvements. So there is there is that potential as well. So, any other questions about year one streets? Should we move on to your

let's go down as I jump down it's in the three years there's a list of as I mentioned there's Paradise Road Lion Boulevard the Mono subdivision cemetery I mean it's it's just we don't and and this is I got discussed timing on on all of these things there. There are things the council ought to be aware of that is coming. We just don't have it's going to be this year. It's next year. Robert, is there anything else you want to talk to us about?

Um, no, not particularly. Um, one thing just to let you guys know, the concrete uh year one for the moto use path. Let me get back to it. Sorry. uh multi-use trail root repair in concrete. Um we've done that in the past on the multi-use trail where roots have started upheaving the asphalt and we put concrete and the idea behind that was if the tree roots still pushed on it, it would lift the concrete and we could grind down those services and get more life out of it. Um we're going to have to do the same thing behind the Hyatt. Um last year I identified about 60 80 feet that that's happening um between the back of the Hyatt and um Canyon Springs Road. Um I tried to mitigate it last year, but it ended up being more than what I could um give money to and so that's why it's in this one now. Um we need to get it done. If we don't, I'm going to have to either rip out the asphalt um or close that section of the trail down until we mitigate it somehow.

When you say behind the Hyatt, I didn't know we had a trail behind the Hyatt. Yeah, we um so as you come down the bike lane or the sidewalk uh right by EV lane, there is the trail that goes behind the Hyatt that then crosses um Canyon Springs and then um the asphalt trail or whatever you want to call it in front of the Spring Hill Suites that goes over to um uh Big Springs that is owned by or that's ours. Oh, I thought it was the hotels. Yeah, I thought it belong to the Okay,

I do have one streets question. It falls under more [clears throat] equipment vehicle needs, but you have uh in the under that in the streets the one year you have UD do sweeping contract.

Yeah. So, UD do's been slow to say the least with this. I've been uh trying to get a new contract with them for the sweeping on SR9. Um we had a seven-year contract that was up last December. So I've been trying to work with uh you do DOT to renew that contract. Um so you know they're paying us to clean that where before we just hit it when we hit it. Okay. What what's All right. So, this $50,000 is actually you do paying us.

Yeah, that would be U DOT paying us. And then those are options of what we could potentially do with that that money. Um it sounds like, and I can't confirm for sure, but um we've been negotiating back and forth. They're they were kind of like, "Hey, we gave you guys the $50,000 to buy the street street sweeper originally. we don't know that that we're comfortable with um doing that agreement again at that amount. So, I sent them our costs and stuff I got from Dawn and it's way over $50,000 in a seven-year period. And so, I think they're just trying to justify it on their their end to to to make that work. Robert, the new crosswalks um and the way they're painted, is that less upkeep for you?

Is that what less upkeep for you? Are you happy with the the new arrangement?

I'm very happy with the new arrangement. I know it added a lot to the department for maintenance wise, but um the visibility and everything else um I think if we paint it every couple years, I mean I'll have to look at it on a yearly basis, but I think um we cut down on having to do the pressure washing of all the symbols and all the crosswalks. We were spending 24 hours a month cleaning those. We haven't had to do that. The paint's holding up better. It's more noticeable. So, I think in the long run, yes, it's going to add more, but it's going to even out because we're not having to tackle it every month of trying to clean something. It'll be, okay, year three, we need to paint this portion out and, you know, make it look new again.

Okay. So, the painting is going to be work that you weren't doing, but you're not pressure washing. Okay. That's the trade-off. Okay. Okay. Okay, we're good. We're good with you. Okay. Um, so we've got community development. Um, we've got invasive species removal. We know about that. That's that three-year contract, right, that you've gotten grants for. Just a quick question. Are we going to get any kind of progress report on that? Um, yes. That's a Yes, I can give you a progress report. Good.

Uh would that in also include Trees Ranch? The So the Yes, the project includes both the uh Virgin River and tributaries in Springdale as well as the East Fork in Trees Ranch. Yep. So that was the year one for community development and I'm seeing in year two then the invasive species which is the same thing and and then renovation and interpretation of historic gel.

Correct. Yeah. So that as you mentioned mayor that invasive species removal project is a three-year project. So that's why we put it there. And then the um historic jail as the council knows was recently listed on the national register of historic places. And so, um, the Historic Preservation Commission has been putting together a plan on how we can kind of interpret that. Um, so that's that's what that money is for. The the intent is is not to like highlight this as a visitor attraction, but to provide some interpretation for those that are interested and and proactively seek it out, not necessarily to kind of turn it into a a destination. Kind of like the granary. Exactly.

Okay. Any questions for Tom on on year two of community element? Is that aligning with what's happening on

the 2acre parcel? Yeah. A big part of of the charge west project is to help us um uh plan what the mayor referred to referenced earlier the resiliency hub. Um and so as the plans on that two acre parcel evolve and change, Charge West project will help us understand what we can do and what the opportunities are to develop that resiliency hub. And as we do that master plan for that two acres we've been including that. Tom, what else do we need to know? You're the one we always cut when we have to cut something.

I just did that proactively or or preemptively for you. [laughter] Not much in there. Well, the lights are yours though, right? The adaptive controls. They are, but they're under streets. Okay. They're under pro streets equipment year one in streets. Um, what is that?

So, our um our international dark sky community designation comes with it an obligation for all publicowned lighting, including street lights, to meet certain standards. And one of the standards for street lights is that there are what are called adaptive controls. And what that means is that the brightness of the the illumination of the street lights adapt to the to the to the need and the conditions. Right? So from uh at this time of year when it gets dark around six o'clock and there's a lot of activity out on the road, there's lots of traffic, maybe there's a lot of pedestrians, the street lights are at their brightest. And then as the night goes on and as you get, you know, into the wee hours of the morning, you don't need that level of illumination because there's not as many vehicles or pedestrians and maybe that illumination is is decreased. So that's what those adaptive controls do. Right now our our street lights are just on a photo cell, so they're either on or off. This will provide a little bit more um nuance with the level of illumination based on the need. um you have listed down in like um professional services like a community survey.

One survey in mind in particular or is that just a general?

So our general plan was adopted um in July of 2022 and we typically like to update that about every five years. um which means that um in order to have that updated by July of 2027, we would need to start working on that the later part of this year. The general plan is always needs to be based on community feedback, community input on the the the vision of the community, right? That's what the general plan is is is saying, hey, what does the community need? What does it want? What's the vision we need that we want to go? One of the ways to do that, there are a number of of things that we will do to get that that public involvement and that community engagement. One of the ways that we want to do that is through a community survey. So, this would be a townwide general survey that would help inform the next update of the general plan.

Yeah. So, we have done it inhouse in the past and um we've found that typically that are done um with an outside consultant tend to have greater credibility with the community than those that are done in-house.

Anything else, Tom, you want to talk about? Okay, so let's move on to year one. Ryan, parks and recreation. Um see the river park expansion. We all know what that is and that's funded. Let's see what else we've got. So Ryan, the restoration work um on the bank stabilization portion, is that a separate fund? The vegetation restoration. Yeah. Do you have a separate fund source for that?

Oh, great. I will add, sorry, in year two, you'll notice that there's nothing in parks and recreation for there's a concrete drive in patio here. Okay.

Shade structures and playground equipment listed. Are you talking shade structures on playgrounds? Are they Can you talk to me more about that?

Yeah. So, we have our for we have now decid It's going to be money. So long. So it's on the list right now.

It is It is and there are quite often in the get healthy Utah newsletter playground grants a cycle just came out. Um but I was asking because we did have a shade structure over the swings and we had to take that out. Okay. So we would just do it we would just do it different. Okay. and potentially shade the whole thing maybe like what the school has done. That's the idea.

Okay. I just Yeah. was curious like are we going to try to do the same thing we've already done or we you're talking about a whole new Yeah. Okay. Thank you. Then I see you have in year one a new employee vehicle. I think that's self-explanatory. Um personnel needs were showing that parks maintenance supervisor that we've been talking about for several years. Um what about $60,000? What about your $60,000 car? Uh, that's going for I'm ready for a truck.

Truck utility truck at this point. Sorry. We're getting a new Tesla. I was gonna say, how about a Rubian? So, are you are you actively pursuing are you actively pursuing a person to start in July? Uh, I remember that. tough, you know, getting someone to work 20 hours a week at 15 bucks an hour. It's hard to get people to come

drive up here. Yeah. No, they're not actively pursuing this yet and won't until we get later in the budget year. Okay.

Okay. So, we're just getting this on our radar essentially right now. Again, again, like you said, this has been several years these two positions we've talked about have not been able to be funded due to other other other pressures. You made a comment at the start that this year in particular was going to be difficult uh to fund everything. Why is that?

Every year is difficult. you know, when when I get the budget request from the from the staff and and we're we're a million bucks over what our revenues are expected to be, that that typically happens. So, it's it every year is hard and and I don't think this year is going to be any different. So, it's not like this year is particularly bad. It's every year is bad. We we we we a lot of people look at spring, oh my gosh, you got so many visitors and you got so much tourism and you got so many restaurants and you got parking fees and you must just be doing, you know, no problems with money. No, that's not the case. Officers, yeah,

everything costs

and and it's just it's just what it is, you know. you you're always making decisions on on what what can be done, what what should be done, you know, what's what what can be balanced, what can be deferred, what can be I mean it's all part of the all part of the process. So comparing um comparing not not a fiscal year comparing a calendar year 2024 to 2025 January to December TRT is flat no change. The other two sales tax and resort tax are up four or five% and But yeah, TRT for that that time frame that we we've looked at.

Say that time frame again. Calendar year January December 2024. The calendar year January 2025 TRT is the same. So that doesn't point I mean it was like a 1% difference. So it wouldn't be accounted for with the hotels being down. The few hotels that were down for a while. No, it's fairly and and everything and And I would have expected TRT to be up slightly in 2025 because we had at least that but that's only half of the year and it's in its and it's it's the collections. So I would have expected that to be slightly higher than it turned out to be

and that could be an impact of of of other of other options of of you know people saying well we want to go to Zion but we're we're willing to to to to drive in and pay the parking fees rather than then pay the room costs. And um Ryan, this first year, Gazebo Park restroom improvements. What are you doing with those?

And they're open year round, aren't they? Already. Okay. Of our app tax. So we when we redid the wrap tax policy, town town things that are in wrap tax will just be in your budget identified that way. Okay.

Yeah. 10,000. That's cool. Um Rob, we got water fund. Let's see. Water line from Balance Rock Road to Lane Boulevard. Does anyone have questions about that? What's the water use flow meter from tanks?

That'll be part of that that same project, but it's a metering station that'll require by the state. It's just a number that um it [clears throat] meters the water coming out of our storage tanks at any given time. But it is connected with this same project that's on here.

Okay. And then we've got a Big Springs well replacement. That's year three though. So I don't know if we need to even talk about that if it's that far out.

We're working on engineering. We're working on one of the one of the issues that we've uh we don't want to anything we do with the springs to impact the pond. Of course, I mean that that seems reasonable, right? We are not currently taking any water out. We've got pump issues that we're we're working to at least replace the the pump itself so that we can we can draw water out of the out of the the spring. But we we're we're not taking our full water right and we don't know if we can take our full water right. And the last pump study we did it was it was when that when that well I want to say well ahead but that's not the right but yeah you get the idea right when that station was built alpha engineering did a did a a study on it and we can't find that data and they can't find that data and we need to redo that data so that we we can we can verify what our you know we know what our water right is. Can we take our water out without negatively affecting the pond? We don't want to we don't want to move ahead with any any project before we know that. And that's taken some time to get put together. And I don't see storm water master plan update. I guess that's pretty straightforward. Or does anyone have any questions for Rob about

Yeah, the sewer master plan consulting one year $50,000 or what do we Yeah, this the sewer master plan is is due um to be updated this year. Um the main uh the main thing that's going to be looked at is upsizing the main sewer line.

Okay. approximately um looking into replacing that section of line obviously, but that there's going to be easements involved and where the line can actually go um physically in the ground. A lot of stuff's been built since 1989 or whenever the thing went in. So um there's going to be a lot involved as far as or the the consultant.

Okay, got it. Yeah, I see that the the land size or upsize project is we think three million. Yeah, this would be a lot of preliminary stuff. the consultant. Yeah. Okay. One of those things is timing,

you know, when when are we going to be at capacity, you know, with with the with the expansion in the in the park. They're adding more flow to the to the to the system. That's going to change, but this study will help to try to narrow that that time frame.

Master plan will be in the next budget year. And they'll that'll be one of the things that we we've talked with with Sunrise about is looking very specifically at that at that pipe size. Do you have anything you want to talk about? Okay. [laughter] Oh, come on. I'm not seeing anything else that we need to cover. Does anybody have anything I missed?

When we get down, I'm sorry. When we get down to the three-year, let me see if I can find this here. This would be projects, equipment. I'm sorry, streets. And then we go water fund, sewer fund, irrigation fund. Um that that's just a list, but not and I thought I read somewhere in your introduction that we should probably talk about priorities there. All of these things are things you need to be aware of that are going to come and get us at but this list is not like this is the order we're going to do this. No. Okay.

No. This is a list of projects that we've identified that so so the sewer line is is is a timing issue. At what point does the flow be more than than the pipe can can could be bumped from three years out to next week or

it's it's in the over three years list. the sewer line is potentially in 2032, might be 2035, might be 2037. That's what the master plan is going to help identify. So at as we get closer there's going to be you know we we need to look at like Rob said like easements the engineering the so that will eventually when when we when we if it is 2035 say maybe in 2030 on your on your your your capital planning is engineering for the sewer line that that you've identified a a mount for that then that will will lead into the project You may want to look at an impact fee study because part of that sewer line will be impact fee eligible. You'll want to do that prior to doing a lot of the engineering work. So that might be in 2028 or 2029 that you say, "Okay, Sunrise, we need an impact fee study." All of these pieces are going to lead into that upsized pipe at whatever whatever timing works, right? So it's more it's it's And that's that's not necessarily something that that the council would say this is not a high priority for us. It's definitely a priority and we're definitely going to do it and we're we're working towards a timing. The when we talk about priorities, you say, you know what, how much of a priority is Paradise Road and that weird intersection versus because it's not a real priority to you do for a number of reasons. you know, when they look at at traffic counts on the highway, even if it is a weird intersection, that doesn't seem to bother them. The bridge is not yet a problem. When the bridge becomes a problem, it'll be a priority for you do. And that might be the right time for the town to say that's that's when it's a priority for us, too. You know,

so the other ones and and I thought that Robert made a good case for Paradise, by the way. the other streets, Paradise, Lion, Moabi, and that that's that's just out there, but not not necessarily we're going to do this first, that first thing.

Yeah, that's that's so when I talk about prioritization, it's um like you talked about the medical clinic town hall, you know, when you say we have these big needs that we know are coming from from the council's point of view, what is what is first, what is second? if something has to to to give to make your next year's budget work, what are UK dropping off? What are you you know, you say no, we must have this this year. That's the stuff we want to know.

So, a question, maybe a scenario. Um, the town hall was built, the post office is built, the medical center gets built there. Wouldn't line Boulevard reconstruction kind of bump to the top of the list that that's more, and Robert can chime in here, that's that's more deterioration, what the asphalt condition is, it's going to be driven by condition.

One other thing, it also is dependent on if you want to update the storm water system for this area. So, right now, most everything goes down to the end of Lion Boulevard. With doing the reconstruct of Lion, there's options there coupled with the reconstruction of the parking lot here. We could then take water to the wash closer and do a bunch of things that we haven't been able to do because of how everything was built out. So, it's not disjointed to do these things separately. it wouldn't be wise to do them all at once or or maybe um in

there there's options to do phased things like you know you can plan ahead and be like okay we want

the parking lot you can have it phased in to where that's ready to go so then you just pick up on the next project got it okay good

um perfect example is the water line um that we were talking about going through balanced rock. Um we got it moved down SR9 with the um uh 17 project and then last year with the reconstructing that road we finished taking the water line up to the top and then this would be phase three bringing it over to Lion Boulevard and Wonderland. As the council has reviewed the big list of master plan strategies, are there things that are not on this list that you say, you know, I really think we need to be doing this.

Okay. entertain a motion to adjourn. So, we will we will use this as as our as our guide. We'll keep to these. We'll keep what we what we talked about, you know, the medical clinic, that's an ongoing conversation, but but as we as we work on building department budgets, we'll we'll utilize this as as our um starting point. and the budget discussions in June. The departments will get it in February and you'll have your work meeting in April like we like we've done before unless something changes. Tenative budget approval will be in May and final budget and public. Okay.

Motion by Jack and second by Pat Kyla. I bar. Okay.