Housing and Community Development Committee - Regular Meeting

Good evening. This is the committee for housing and community development and equity committee. I am city councilor at large, Kristen Strasso. Today is Wednesday, 04/15/2026, and it is 06:02PM. We are we are broadcasting this meeting live in person hybrid setting and a late post meeting to order. Alright. This is roll call. Councilor Syed.

Here.

You

very much, madam chair. Sure. I'm gonna go through some of the data that I presented in memorandum that should have gone out last week, but to update you on where things are, with the obstacles stability and the issues that we work on. So first, we just reported some OHS case data. I would note this document the last time we spoke with you to update you.

Data was through September 2025. So this period that I'm talking about now is a five month period from October 2025 to the February '6. And during that five month period, we had 505 new new requests for assistance with 471 unique households, meaning that 25 have been repeated during that fifth that five month period of time that we're looking for assistance with with some kind of positive services. So we have about 94 unique new requests for assistance each month. Some data about this is that 37% of those households or a 186% of the of those referrals were at risk of displacement.

And of those at risk of displacement, 94 had already received a notice of quit or some process complaint, which form the starts of the process. About half of these residents spoke a language other than English, which, as you know, is is proportionate to the populations, and it's in Somerville. So it does tell us that a lot of the housing instability is greatest in our communities. And we also had, in addition to that, about a quarter of the households that we kept services for us, requesting assistance to pay for a And moving on in terms of rental assistance, we had about 27 households that we worked with applications for rental assistance during that time period between all three programs, CAST, the homeless coalition, and RAP, state rental assistance program during this five month period. We paid out $485,000 approximately in rental assistance, both for start up costs, rental assistance for years, and prospective rent on behalf of Somerville residents.

And what I thought I would do is just do a little comparison of this five month period before before last year. I think probably everybody who knows that we are looking at a tough financial situation in the city here. So we've had in the past about $2,100,000 in funding annually for rental assistance. That money is scheduled to be depleted in the fall. I think the mayor and the city council, I hope everybody will do their best to figure out sources of funds to have a robust program going forward.

But in anticipation of this, we have tightened our criteria a little bit. So we're trying to figure out how tightening of criteria may or may not get the number of. So in the period of January 2025 through September 2025, we paid out an average we paid out $259,000 a month for renters. In the last five months, it is now less than half. So it was $97,000 a month, which is, again, a little bit less than half the amount we had been paid.

Might say a couple of things about that. One is that we have tightened criteria. So where there are people that are coming back again and again and again, we look at what the housing stability plans are. We try to look at what we can do to move them into permanent affordable housing, but we've been a little stricter at saying, here are the four things that you're supposed to do, and maybe they did them and maybe they did. So some some changes due to that, the criteria.

Also, there were periods where either CAS or SHT were closed, typically around the hours of the because this yeah. You know, this goes over December or January. So I think some of the reduction in number amount of money paid out was due to staff closures or people closing down intake sort of between, I'd say, the, you know, December in December. We'll see in the next report where we are and how much we're spending month going forward in rental assistance. And as you'll see, it doesn't look yet like this is impacted on the eviction data, but I wanna be honest in saying, well, if we're giving out less rental assistance at some point, it is inevitable that there will be some recent network issues based on that money that's available to folks.

And just turning to the eviction data for a moment, you can see, you know, there were, in this five month period, a 105 summary process cases filed, and nonpayment of rent, 86% of those cases are. So we can show you, again, as I say, directly rental assistance is so clearly linked to the overall number of people that are likely to find themselves with executions for being evicted. In this time period, though, the number of executions were 22, and the rate actually has stayed fairly. In the year in the full year of 2025, we had an average of 4.2 executions. And just for the audience and if anybody doesn't know, an execution is the piece of paper that allows the sheriff to move somebody's stuff out or the constable to move their stuff out.

So it's the very end stages of eviction, but not every case where there's an execution, the people actually lose their housing mostly because of dreadfulnesses. That if we find somebody, even if they didn't get to us all the way until after their court process and after a judgment gets done, sometimes if we can pay a arrear case and the landlord doesn't think the same thing's gonna happen the next month because they just don't have that money, we can sometimes resolve these cases even at that late stage where issue. I did provide you guys with a chart to compare the rates of executions from the different cities and towns that are near us for this five month period. The one I'm really baffled about is Medford because they were have high rate of executions last month. But as you can see, ours in Summerville is our rate of our executions per 1,000 households in poverty.

We didn't wanna we wanted to make sure we were looking at apples to apples as we compare how we're doing to how other cities are doing. So we're looking at the number of executions for evictions for every thousand people. So you can see from this document that we have about a third of rate of evictions or executions as Malden. Medford here is very low, but they were super high last time. So I'm not sure what that reflects. We're very similar to Cambridge about three. We hit three eleven. They hit three zero two. And walk in, you can see it's almost double the rates of, conviction. Again, I'm gonna say execution.

I don't know how many of those folks actually would work through the house with the number of executions. So we're still doing the facts about parallel to Cambridge, which really makes sense because Cambridge also has robust rental assistance programs, legal assistance programs. It's kind of similar to what we are doing here in Somerville. So those numbers and as you can can see, the rates of execution for addiction are way lower than in some of the other neighboring communities. And the only other thing and so, again, at this point, the lower amount of rental assistance, I think it makes sense that lowering amounts of assistance would not catch up to numbers for a while still.

So I think we have to wait at least another quarter or two quarters to see how things shake out in terms of if are we achieving spending out less money for rentals business, but still keeping people at their home, or are we losing this a significant number because we're unable to continue the rentals for as long as needed, focusing housing, until they get into affordable housing. And then the last thing, and then, obviously, love to hear any questions. I did just wanna tell people a little bit about the federal context. I know that that there's just been a lot happening in the housing world. And the first thing just to let you know was that well, first of all, SHA, some of the housing authority is what we call a shortfall, which means they're spending more money than they have on their section eight program.

So the Somerville Housing Authority has already made a decision that they're gonna try to deal with this shortfall through attrition. So they're gonna try not to have to take any section aids away from people because they're overextended, but they won't be reissuing a numb they won't be reissuing these vouchers until their spending is back down where it needs to be. I think you may remember, but the housing authority increased its payment standards a lot because the rents have gone up so much. So now it's easier for folks with section eight vouchers to find a place to live within the rental house, but the rents have gone up so much that it is causing them now to have to not have quite as many vouchers. So there's a real trade off between giving people enough money to allow them to lease Somerville effectively and then using the overall numbers that very few are being given to new families.

So it's it's it is what it is, and that's that's the situate an important situation to know, which is very different than four years ago where there were constantly vouchers being issued. And so there's always an, you know, a good path for, let's say, my office to get somebody permanently housed. And two other federal updates I wanted to give. One was that HUD sent a a notice to all the housing authorities saying that there were families with discrepancies between them being in federal housing and the documentation of their eligible immigration status. So they identified had identified 50 families that they said were there was something missing in their documentation that they wanted the housing authority to go back and reverify and recheck everybody's immigration status to see if those 50 families were actually eligible for the housing.

And the good news the bad news and the good news, two things came out of that. There were fortunately one we know of and possibly only two families that were found to be federally ineligible for the program. All of the rest were found to still be eligible, but some additional families and I'm waiting for some data on this from the Somerville Housing Authority. Some families had their rents go up significantly. So you got two immigrant eligible people in a household of four, and they check the verification and they say, oh, no.

Only one person really qualifies and you have three people that aren't really eligible, the rents would go up. So there were about I'm waiting for data still, but maybe about five families that have been impacted impacted in that way, in that once they've rechecked all the verifications, their rates went up significantly. And then that one for now, we we have worked with two families that we were able to get fully reverified and to help through the process of this to make sure their rates did not go up. We'll see some of them. There may be nothing we can do without whatsoever, but some we were able to show that the the data that they had was not accurate.

The bigger issue, which I'm sure you guys have heard about, is is this proposed HUD rule on mixed immigrant status households, which if implemented right? This came out in February. The comment period goes through April 21. If this becomes effective, this rule, what it'll mean is that there's 34 mixed immigrant households in Somerville that are either in SHA federal housing or have section eights. Of those 34 families, what they will each be told is either they have to kick out any person in their family who is not immigration eligible.

That could be a parent. It could be a child, a minor child, which might be some cases. If they did that, either force them to leave or force a child into foster care. They might divide up married couples or couples with permanent long standing relationships, or the whole family loses their housing. So this is the, you know, pretty catastrophic, like, situation that we're in.

I did I think I you all may have received them. I did submit comments to HUD on this, and Jasmine was helpful to me in this, but there is, you know, a movement statewide and nationwide to try to get as many comments in as possible because that actually has to respond to each unique set of comments, which could take them some time, if nothing else. But I think as a city, I'm just putting this on the radar because I think we're really gonna just have to think about whether there's anything housing authority can do anything we can do. Is there just for example, might we look at some of our programs, like our municipal voucher program or inclusionary program and say, we should give a super priority to these families to go to the top of those wait lists because, otherwise, they're gonna be literally, probably either forced back to their home, to to their office wherever they came from or. It's not that we'll have to pay off.

It's something for us to be thinking about, keep our eyes on it. I imagine we won't really know until maybe this summer by the time they responded to all the comments and to see what happens with this. But as a city, I just want keeping our eyes on what happens to this population of folks that are currently in Somerville and would be negatively if that is. So the other thing is as horrible as it is, my hope is if it does happen, maybe they will say they'll only do it prospectively because they've gotten enough comments to talk about the harm for existing families. Obviously, that's for new immigrants coming in, but but, you know, if I I anything that would at least help to keep those families from having to use their housing would be aware at this point.

So that's and then let me see if there's anything else. I think oh, and then I should give you something hopeful. I'm gonna give you guys some of the something hopeful at the end of the program. But the other last thing, fair housing issues is HUD just withdrew a whole lot of their fair housing notices. And so, for example, some of these one of these is there was a notice that did say, if you threatened call INS on a tenant, that can constitute national origins for instance.

That is constantly an issue where we have tenants that are afraid to enforce their rights when they're undocumented or afraid to ask for repairs, etcetera. And there was this good there were some big court cases and this good notice, and, that was withdrawal. We don't know how that would or wouldn't impact courts going forward on whether or not that still would constitute national large discrimination. And I will note that all the HUD withdrawals, there's still state law, and there's still state law discrimination. So I would hope that even if we couldn't pursue things under federal law, that there would still be an avenue for pursuing warehousing violations on the state side.

But all of this, I think, the impact of all of this is also up in the air, and these relate to reasonable accommodation, national law discrimination. They now wanna say criminal records is just the last one, and then I'll stop. I know I'm speaking a lot, but one last one is there's a HUD memo that says an arrest in and of itself can't be grounds for disqualification because of the bias that has been shown in arrests. So the law had said that you don't use people and or open cases, but not arrests as a reason to disqualify some. And that's another one that they.

So the good news is there's great organizing going on around all of these issues. There's a lot of resistance, and none of them are in place right now. So so we aren't we haven't yet seen disastrous impacts from these health changes. And I think, you know, people are are really fighting back in a good way, but just wanted you to be aware of these things that are out there. And that's my update, my joyful yeah. He's so positive. He's so positive. He has something beforehand. But yeah. So that's where things are currently.

I think it was the presentation. I don't that last thing that was said, I couldn't hear it, and it didn't wanna interrupt. Counselor Strezo, when you're speaking, it can also not hear. So if we that thing could be moved, that would be great. Sure.

Your side.

Thank you.

I was the director to a presentation. Thank you, director.

Yeah. That's fine. Maybe when you guys say that. Oh, yeah. No. For sure. Okay. Counselor, you for letting us know. And before the meeting next time we have it, we will make sure we check-in about that. Okay? It's

all good. Just moving that to that side. It's very common when we have meetings in that room. Thank you.

And and you did not catch the last part of what, director said?

The director I heard the whole presentation, but I don't know if you, councilor Strezo, spoke because that from that seat is the part he cannot hear. Okay.

Got it. Alright. Any I before I I close the keep this item in committee, did did you have any thoughts before we, before we move on, counselor?

I do not have any questions. Just wanted to thank the director for providing us with this information. I thank you for all the work you do.

Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Thank you, dear. You're welcome. Alright. Thank you. Alright. We'll keep the. Next item.

Order 260049 that the director of housing reports to this council how many new housing units have been approved for development year by year since adoption of summer vision 2040. And of those numbers, how many are permanently affordable and how the department defines affordability. This agenda item, I put forward, and I put this in the request of some housing advocates that would endorse some data. I'm happy to talk this through. We have Alana, like, and Daphne from the deputy director of housing here to speak on incited.

It and we have a lovely accompanying attachment. Thank you very much. And deputy director, you have to go. Thank you, Christine.

Thank you. Thank you, madam chair. I think to start, it's really important to go through the initial language of the order just so we're of the same definitions. I yeah. So we did end up providing this data. The chart shows the number of building permits that were issued per year. So it was stated the how many new housing units have been approved for developments that approved for development refers to building permits for us. In terms of residential new development as well, that is its own classification within our system. So I just wanna make sure I call to that. Beyond that, the year to year since adoption of summer vision, so we defined that particular length of time.

So we said 10/01/2021 through we ended it at 03/31/2026. We just wanted to get that full snapshot. And of those numbers, how many are permanently affordable and how we define affordability? So we do provide a little bit more context in that initial paragraph to to speak to that. Permanently affordable at this point, if there are units that are coming online, they are very likely going to have some means of a deed restriction.

So many of the units, especially if they're all affordable, if we're talking about inclusionary. When we're saying what we define as affordable so, I mean, the definition that we would typically go by is affordable housing is defined as housing units that are designated for households earning below 80% of the area median income. With that said, we're not capturing the entire portfolio, particularly around inclusionary housing if we do that. So we went ahead and we expanded it a little bit to be income restricted. I hope that's alright.

Oh, perfect. So and just noting that we do have an 110% AMI tier when we're talking about the rental side of inclusionary, and we have 110% as well as 140% when we're talking about the homeownership side of inclusionary. So that's just to acclimate us in terms of the actual data and the chart that's there. With that said, I think there are some really important considerations and limitations that come along with the data that I wanna flag. And I think part of what's important is to kind of explain how we get it.

So the data was pulled from a citizen serve report, which includes building permit applications. So I already provided you with kind of the range of dates that we're talking about. It was filtered per year to make sure that we had accurate counts and making sure that when we're comparing for affordability level, there are no fields when we're talking about citizen serve that track affordability, unfortunately. So and there's multiple reasons for that. So one of the it was not originally set up in that way.

So I hope that we're not totally left with the app. Everything has to correspond back to the actual application. So if it's not listed as an application field, it's not gonna appear in a report, which makes sense, but it's one of those things where you're like, I would love to have that data, though. Right? Let's talk through some of those other intricacies. So there there also might be multiple building permit applications issued to the same address and land parcel. Why would that happen? So it really depends on what's currently on the parcel. So is there an existing structure? Does it need to be demolished?

Because there's a demolition permit that would exist. Beyond that, does the foundation need to be added? I assumed, and I hope this was an appropriate assumption when I was going through this order, that we were talking about building permits related to construction. So this is, like, almost that final stage. So let's say there's a structure and it ends up needing to be demolished and a new foundation needs to be added. It could have three building permits if we're getting to the construction one. The construction one is going to have the latest plan set. So the reason why I selected that is it's probably the most up to date project information. Now this kinda brings us into one of the most important considerations when we're talking about this. I might skip around if you're following along in the memo.

I apologize. That bottom piece is we're looking at pipeline information. It's going to change. That is something that we absolutely positively know. So we anticipate that the build a building permit in terms of the units that are being projected, that's a best guess. So it is something where the developer is putting forward the project that they think that they're going to have. Ultimately, it's going to evolve over time. So I wanna make sure that I note that. Beyond that, there is another funny little reason why you might have multiple addresses having a building permit. And this has to do with MBTA communities. This has to do with there has been a bit of

a a little bit of

a boom in terms of adding cottages onto NR parcels, so I wanted to make sure that I noted that. You might get two construction building permits for an address, and it's not a mistake. One of that's why it was important that we went through it line for line. It might be for a triple decker, so you'll see three new residential units, and then you might see a cottage, and it will have the one. So we really, when we pulled this data, went through the descriptions to make sure that we weren't missing anything.

Anything that didn't apply, we removed. Beyond that, if someone's pulling a building permit, they might be doing it as well for, like, renovations. So if we're talking about, like, updating their HVAC system, they would pull a building permit. There would be no new residential units created, so those were also removed. Just letting you know what what didn't end up in this chart because it shouldn't be in that chart according to what the order had requested.

With that, the way that these reports come through is it will let you know how many units are added as well as how many are taken away. So anything that was taking away units so if we're saying that there is a condo conversion, and this isn't necessarily something that we like to see happen, but it is two units and someone is turning it into a single family lot. They've been approved through the condo conversion board, so it's something that that went through the proper channels. Then you will see a negative unit. Those were not included. So this is a gross count. It's not it's it's not a net count. I just wanted to make sure that I clarified that also. Let's see if there's anything else. I'm not sure.

I think, though, I I think it would be interesting to look at some some what we're looking at. Something that I noticed is I mean, most of Summerville is NR, neighborhood residential district. The majority of the permits this didn't make it into the chart. It wasn't necessarily in the scope. It was something I was curious about.

The majority of the permits that are put here so there's 233 total building permits. So you're gonna say that doesn't match with the unit number. It shouldn't because that building permit's gonna have multiple units on it. I would say a 170 out of the two thirty three building permits are for the NR District. Now I think that's a lead worth looking at, and the reason why I'm saying that is, again, I think we're all having this sense that there are there are way more smaller construction projects that are coming up on NR.

Now why might that be? There isn't an affordability requirement anymore. I think that's one piece of something that we might wanna consider. I think if we looked the dates of when we started seeing more of those come online, we might notice after the elimination of the SPOT program, so that's a small per oh my hold on one second. I'm gonna hate myself for this. Small oh, prop thank you. Property additional unit program. So you might be familiar. I believe this was something that councilor McLaughlin worked on, and it it's really about adding neighbors adding an additional unit. They still had to get a building permit when they did that.

I think the intent behind the unit, my understanding of it at least, was that so kind of what MBTA's community is kind of doing now at this point, and that's for neighbors to add additional units to house other neighbors affordably. What ended up happening from SPOP when we had SPOP was there were, I think, five approved units in total out of the entire duration of the program, and only two of those units were actually built, and they were both built by developers. Ultimately, we ended up making this change to be in compliance with MBTA communities. And when we did that, it changed whether or not there was an affordable unit that was required in NR. So I'm only mentioning this because I would be interested to track that Mhmm.

Throughout. I think the other piece that's kind of important too, if you like, a 178 out of 233 of the building permits included three or less new residential units, which, again, it kind of I would venture an argument supports that conclusion of that doesn't trigger an affordability requirement. So in that case, if there's only three units that are being added, maybe those are the types of projects that folks wanna build right now because they feel like they can make the math work. Trying to see if there's anything else that's important. I will say a 102 out of the building permits that we pull that were pulled for this report came from 2025 to 2026.

Mhmm.

88 of those are for permits of three units or less. I think that truly does support that trend of Mhmm. We're seeing a lot more development in NR and on small lots. That's something to kind of watch for sure. But this is the data that we ended up pulling. I hope that please let me know if you have any questions. I have some of these, like, other commentary that's kind of that I'm happy to share. Oh, that's sweet. It's perfect. Please.

Thank you.

Oh, of course.

I'm loving these impressions too because it's all about sometimes it's all about just following patterns.

I thank you for saying because you can almost see it. Yeah. So it's like you're and I so I almost wish we had a really great comparison between if we were to pull from 2016 to 2021 and then 2021 to 2026. I think you would see it I mean, when you consider 2016 to 2021 assembly pretty much rose up. Like, you're there were a lot of very large scale projects that came up from that.

And then sort of at the tail end of that period in the beginning of this building permit data, there are a lot of projects from union that were popping up. So that's like the a lot of our higher unit number projects, you'll see in that grouping, and it's towards the beginning. After it it kind of switches. I have a hunch, I think, and I think this is a lot of the buzz in terms of what folks in planning are talking about is there's almost a swap between these types of projects, and we're really not seeing those middle projects. So if we're talking about, like, 10 to 20 units, in terms of development, it's it appears as though they've slowed down.

That's my perception as well. But I'm happy to add that as a supplement if you feel that's helpful. If you have any other questions, please let me know.

We'd love the we'd love the supplement. We'd love to I I love what you're just your interpretation of this as well and how we're following this. I would very much be interested in in talking further about it just within addition to your your perception and your your following the patterns. Would you prefer and we're still having the conversation. We're not looking to just end it right now just for a second.

But going forward or how we plan for this, would you prefer to keep it in committee, or or do you write another order too? Because I would love to talk about it at another meeting with just the trends and and what you're seeing as well. Now that we're done yet. Right. I haven't even asked counselor, I wouldn't wanna shut her out. I just

Whatever you feel is best.

Okay. But yeah. Yeah. This is just it's fascinating. Yeah. With with that, counselor, did you now I was looking to my right with the with the, TV screen. Counselor. Yeah. Yeah. Not always catching up.

Yeah. This is, yeah, definitely still processing this. And

Heard it's a lot.

Yeah. Yeah. You mentioned something you mentioned that because we no longer have the affordability requirement in NR. There's a lot more development in NR on smaller lots. Is that because we took away the affordability the affordability requirement in 2019?

Through the chair. Thank you so much for asking that question. I think there's a piece of this puzzle as well. Again, that intent, I believe, of that program was really to Right. Have homeowners Right. Build units. Right. And there were so many hoops in terms of we we got inquiries. I believe we got between, like, it was a dozen to 20 inquiries of folks who were looking into that program, and they were like, this is too difficult. And they decided against kind of moving forward.

I so I definitely think that that's a piece of it. I think I will say an important consideration with this program as well is what needed to be required was a tier three, depending on whether you were doing rental or a homeownership. So of the two units that we do have built, one is a 110% AMI rental unit, and the other is a 140%. I think it's a two bedroom, and it's a homeownership unit. So in that way and I think the idea with that was construction is expensive. If this is being put on a homeowner, they need to be able to get back on their investment. So they wanted to make it income restricted, but at the same point, even by what we define as affordability, that doesn't quite

Right.

Pencil out. I hope that I answered your question. I'm not sure that I did that you're sorry. Kansu?

Yeah. I think what I'm trying to get to is would, in your opinion, bring him back, like, this is just, you know, scenario, the affordability requirement in NR keep this trend going of more development in NR? Or is the fact that we took that away that is triggering this pattern?

Yeah. Think If I remember correctly, counselor Syed, because I was not yet a counselor, but very following and part of of the push for more affordable housing. And, yeah, I remember when this went into the zoning overhaul. Right? Like, 2017, 2018, 2019, then it was finalized.

And and then but the problem with the snag of it was that just just what deputy director here said that that the developers were were building enough or so we're what the trend seemed to be is that they were building enough to where they they it was, like, three plus one. Right? And and so they were building the three, but that four, the affordable housing option never got built. So a bunch of threes were coming up, but not fours. And so it became such a a a obvious, like, glaring point that I think that the city was just like, alright.

It's not working. And and we stripped down. Remember how it got stripped from that, but that's where, as I recall it, it it happened.

That's correct. May I also add? So I think part of it is so because you were able to develop Bi Rite and NR now because of MBTA communities, it's not as simple as necessarily just putting an affordability requirement back in. Though I've had some interesting conversations with folks about, like, how do we where do we move from here? Is are there incentives? Right. Because I I think that's the path forward. But it's a it's an excellent point. I think in order for us to remain compliant, though, when we're talking about the MBTA communities act, that was something where we we we had to do away with the SPOT program. That was part of it.

And I as I recall, counselor, we were so before the because the MBTA Communities Act came up came with came alongside with Charlie Baker. Mhmm. And that was, like, his last year. And and when it was approved as a recall and and directors, please, if if I'm like, okay. Well, that if if there's a fact but this is how I recalled it in brain my brain.

Right? So that that came about. And when we were and I believe I was in land use at that time when we were trying to implement it as a city. And, of course, we we in Somerville, we're like, well, there's no there's no qualification if because we overqualified with the MBTA Act, including all of our buy rights with ADUs and and backyard cottages and such. And and much to what you were trying to say, deputy director, that was the point of, like, some of the zoning ADU and backyard cottages that incentivizing that ADU production and affordability option of sustainable homeownership.

And that's part of the thing. We won't get into this, but it's another agenda item, but that's what I was trying to do as well and and what some of housing advocates are trying to do with the zoning amendments that are in another in the land use currently, trying to incentivize or what's not working. And and what we've seen with our at least the research or the conversations I've had is that we get we have to get creative with how we incentivize, but it's it's a possibility. But it's been done, but very much, it we have to get creative on what that looks like, and we're ready by writing. So That's right.

Cancer, You I saw your mic go off. So

Yeah. So right now for the community for the MBTA communities with the MBTA communities act, the the those part the parcels that are in that, you know, that are close to the the transit. Right? They're zoned at four stories. Is that like, they can the developers can build up to four. Is that correct?

Through you to or I'm sorry. Deputy director. Did you or are you asking you're asking deputy director? We have Or

Through the chair. I I know that there are I know that there's still a process going on to actively interpret Right. Pieces of this and how it's implemented. Because I think we're seeing that stage at this point of kind of how what requirements you still must adhere to in terms of what is you can't be held to more strict requirements than the least I'm not gonna say this as eloquently as my peers in ISD or PPC, so

I might defer to them.

Right. But I believe there's still an there's ongoing conversations about how we're best interpreting that.

Right. And as as I yeah. And and and I avoid that everything that, right, that I've heard is is pretty much the same about or that they're so like, our ours is a unique case because we were ahead of the curve on this as of of the advocates in this room. So our our our struggle with that is is it's not a struggle. It's different than a lot of other communities.

Luckily, we're not like we don't have to convince anyone that this is a value of us, and that brings me there's a shot silver lining to say that we're not actually trying to actively encourage our community that this is important, that we need more housing, and that we need more. We need to make sure our neighbors can stay in our community, especially our our lowest income residents. This is a value that we hold dear, and that that means a lot. Because, yeah, there are absolutely when I talk to other advocates throughout the state, that is not always the case or or the message of of communication being like, well, I know that if the community saw or saw what we understood the what we're trying to say here, that they feel like, yeah. Of course, we need that.

But then people it's a a lot of people need to there there's still a lot of information campaigns and communication that needs to happen in some communities. So we have a lot of good bones to our structure, I guess. I'll stop. But thank you. Thank you for your thoughts on that. Counselor, are you are you good, or do you

Yeah. I I think I'm good. I think it's probably I think this would probably come up in land use soon because in my ward, they have developers that are building four store three stories in parcels that are zoned for four. And it's just, yeah, just avoiding that making for building that fourth unit because that fourth unit will trigger the affordability requirement. Yeah.

And we are thinking creatively about it as we are looking into potentially up zoning the those parts. Yeah. Like, the lots that are within the communities, the MBTA Communities Act. So, yeah, I think, yeah, this is just the beginning of that conversation. Thank you. I have no further questions.

Thank you very much, Pastor. And just to to be clear, the the three plus one doesn't it's not on the books anymore far as the we we took that off. Like, so that fourth affordability. Correct? That affordability option is it's it's null at this point in Somerville.

And then the qualifications for the MBT Communities Act, that's a whole separate bucket, full of lots of nutritious things. And, yeah, counselor, you have a lot going on in your board. A lot of activity over there. But the the three plus one is is not there or not collectively in Somerville at this very second. Okay.

Thank you very much for this information. And, yeah, I I will like, I'm happy to follow-up with you with you and I on just how how to best proceed on on having having this talking further about this. And I'm not sure if I should because this is this is really great, but I don't want would you prefer we that I just we could talk further offline. I'm I'm just wondering if I should keep it in committee. You did some well, let's let's we'll put this as mark work work complete, and then we can submit.

Alright. We can talk further about the additional data and information again and how to get it back on the agenda and talk because that's that's all really good stuff. Thank you. Of course. Thank you. Thank you. Alright. We'll mark this one more completely. Okay. Thank you.

And thanks for for coming out on this lovely April spring day in in person. Alright. Last on the agenda. Okay. Last on the agenda is an officer's communication item 260,141, Fair Housing Commission conveying the FY 2024 annual report pursuant to section seven seventeen seven of the Clothing Abortances. I know what you're saying. 2024. Yes. Okay. Yeah.

It's all it's it's not passe. Uh-uh. We this is how the first off. Okay. So then there was a hole last year. Right? And and and the submitting of that, and it went through. And then, of course, we had the change of the 2025 to 2026. This was submitted. It carried over to this this year and and was submitted submitted in 2026. Yeah. We could have just been like, alright. We're done with this, but I thought it was good to just talk about it, review it, because a lot of work under this also. Yeah. Yeah.

That the Fair Housing Commission does is it's a lot of afterthought on this and calculating and thinking of the data, which brings us to this present moment of April 2026. And thank you very much. We have our Fair Housing specialist and inclusionary support, Shannon Lawler, here tonight. Thank you for being here in person and with me. Thank you. You have a floor. I'm gonna step off for one second next door. I'm here by just getting a bit of water.

Thank you. So, yes, we you should be receiving the f y twenty five report soon, but wanted to get this through first, to see if there was any feedback or anything that, might need to be reflected in the f y twenty five report. Too. So

I'll start

by saying that this is for FY twenty four. I was not the fair housing specialist during that year. I started in July 2025. So I've been the fair housing specialist for the entire almost the entirety of or August 2025. So almost the entirety of f y twenty five and f y twenty six.

So if you have questions, I most likely will be able to answer them. But if you have questions about, like, how things have been going since then, I'm definitely happy to answer that. So, yes, to start with the background, this is as of FY twenty four. So the affirmatively furthering fair housing rule, it was issued under the Obama administration in 2015, and it was terminated in 2020. And it called for municipalities to foster inclusive communities by addressing persistent segregation and housing discrimination.

And then the city submitted an assessment of fair housing, which will be referenced later on in the report. The Biden administration proposed a simplified version of the AFFH rule, but no final rule was issued by the end of f y twenty four. And then just adding this in, it was not issued by the end of the Biden administration and has been taken away since then. So that's some background on

the federal

context. State context, the state legislature increased the appropriation for MCAD for the Massachusetts Commission Against Discrimination so that the agency was no longer reliant on federal funding in f y twenty three. So that was good and good to know going into, new federal administration. And MCAD received 439 housing related complaints. This is over the whole state of Massachusetts in f y twenty four.

So that can give a little more context to the number of complaints that were submitted from Summerville to MCAD as well. And then for the local context, the Anti Displacement Task Force submitted a home rule petition to city council to allow rent stabilization in Summerville. This was unanimously passed by city council and referred to state legislature joint committee on housing. And I'll talk a little bit more about that as well later on. Okay.

So going into enforcement, in FY '24, the Fair Housing Commission continued from FY '23 exploring the idea of becoming a substantially equivalent agency to HUD in order to enforce fair housing law and address long wait time issues for complaints submitted to MCAD. So the next line here says becoming substantially equivalent agency was determined not to be feasible as it would require a home roll petition. This isn't the full picture. I'm actually gonna read from the Anti Displacement Task Force, residential displacement committee's report, just to provide a little bit more context. So the law department concluded the city could expand the investigatory and fact finding duties to cases within the jurisdiction of MCAD without first needing approval from state legislature.

However, in their opinion, the only penalties that could be issued, for failure to comply with local fair housing ordinance without new home rule authority would be those fines permissible under mass general law, chapter 40, section 21 about enforcing ordinances with a maximum of $300 per day per violation. And all parties concluded that it would be difficult for inspectional services department to enforce this ordinance because it depends on individuals individuals to file complaints in cases relying on verbal evidence, which can be difficult to prove for inspectional services. So that's a little bit of more context and background. And if you have a question, we can

Hold the bone. What? That's amaze That's really exciting. Hold on. Alrighty.

That's really exciting. Okay. Yeah.

So that's that's a little bit of background on enforcement and why enforcement isn't happening right now. And just to add to that, I think that and that yeah. A big piece of that is the staff capacity, you know, given that the fair housing specialist position right now is only half time with fair housing, and then also ISD based on at least based on the Somerville residential displacement committee. Okay. If if

if because each director and every presenter had their own style. So if I'm interrupting you during the presentation, I will keep my mouth shuttling way better. Go ahead. But if in your brain, if it's way better, if I like we're here. Mhmm. Let's talk about this. Okay. Yes. Full point. We talk about this. Yeah. Whatever works with okay. We explored this with with the Fair Housing Commission and the fact that and and okay. I have all these word bubbles in front of my head. There's so much.

Okay. Number one. Yeah. We were told that the only way we could really do this is through a home rule petition, and and we have a bucket of of home rule petitions in Somerville, and this is not okay. So that's very exciting to hear this new information. Okay. With ISD, I'm in my fourth term now. I love my ISD. However, it's always been a a matter of staffing and priorities of what gets prioritized with this. Mhmm.

And on the fact the point of on the point of of so of of verbal responses. Yeah. Okay. That's that's complicated when it comes to fair housing discrimination. However, there was a time in history that I remember living through free smartphone where we had to rely on verbal evidence for stuff. So ever the optimist, We lived in a time of history where this is possible. I'm not saying, like, stop everything and

proceed forward, but this is really interesting information. Yeah. If I could add a little bit to it as well, and this is not on the Mhmm. Report, so is that alright? But there is the protected class of family or relationship structure in Summerville, which is not protected by the state or federal law because this is something that we've added to our fair housing ordinance.

Up to this point, we haven't received any complaints with that as the protected class. But if we were to receive complaints with that as a protected class, we would probably need to go through ISD for enforcement if there were to be an enforcement process because the state won't be able to enforce it. So if that adds a little bit of, you know, somewhere where ISD should be able to enforce it, like, a little bit of context there. I think also within the anti displacement task force residential committee report, It does talk a little bit about what Cambridge does. Cambridge human rights Human rights commission.

Their human rights commission is not just housing, but they are a substantially equivalent agency.

And as I recall I'm sorry. Go ahead. No. Go ahead. Because I recall with the Human Rights Commission in Cambridge, they received the ability to do that, like, in the nineties when no one was thinking of it like this.

Yes. And Ellen, I think, is the person who so we have we have the expert in the room. Of course.

I'm not surprised. It's amazing, and thank you. Because I remember feeling, like, when when we've explored this with the Fair Housing Commission and always hitting that wall of, like, well, that was done in the nineties. This is 2020 x. That that like, by state permission now because we would need a home rule petition to get that permission from to make our own investigative abilities in Summerville. But that would that's where we would get lumped in all the HRPs begging and pleading with the state that maybe to give us permission to do that.

Yeah. Holy crowbar. Their investigator is a licensed attorney, and it's an investigator position. So that's another piece of context there with the Cambridge Human Rights Commission, in terms of, like, what staffing might look like if we were to start enforcing. Yeah.

Let me see if I have anything else. As of January 2024, there were only four backlogged housing complaints from Summerville with MCAD. And, yeah, that is the information that I have on enforcement right now. I know it has been an ongoing conversation with, you know, this committee and also within the Fair Housing Commission has talked a little bit about what would we do if there were any additional protected classes that are not covered by the state or not covered by federal law in addition to the family and relationship structure, and we got complaints about them. So, yeah, that's the background and enforcement.

If I may really Mhmm. What is so the addition set of protected class that is special to the Summerville ordinance in a in a state, you said it was family structure. Is that correct?

It's family or relationship structure.

Family or relationship structure. So and that's that's good too because but but also does that include, like, pre filtering, like, realtors or brokers of, like, the lead paint?

Well, that would be protected under family status, so including children, and that is protected under state and federal law. I think that this is I think the the wording of family or relationship structure, I think it was made specific or not specifically, but to include, like, polyamorous Yeah. Yeah, people. So I think that that is, like, the group that wouldn't be covered by the family status and structure in the way that the state does it or sexual orientation the way that the state.

Right.

But, yeah, up to this point, we haven't received any complaints about that. But, you know, it's definitely something that could come up and that we should be ready for when it does.

In in my opinion, if I may Mhmm. I think because I've I've heard of incidences, and it's, of course, not okay. Mhmm. I think and this is something I've talked about with several of the commissioners too is I I think the information of still having to get out there that people don't know. Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. They may say to their friends that this happened and it is wrong Mhmm. But not know where to go from there. And then, of course, aside from that is the, well, do they wanna take the additional step of actually going through the threshold reporting? Because then, of course, it changes the climate.

Yeah. Yeah. But that is a good segue into what the commission is trying to focus on, which is that education and prevention piece. So with education for fiscal '24, the main event, I guess, or two events was during fair housing month, which is in April of every year. In FY twenty four, the Fair Housing Commission had two events.

One was a screening of the short film segregated by design, which basically summarizes the book, the color of law. That was held in person at the central branch of the library. The film is in English, but it had Spanish subtitles, and there was also a Spanish interpreter at the event. And then the second event for fair housing month in FY twenty four was hybrid. It was also held at the central branch and over Zoom.

And attorney Todd Kaplan, works for Cambridge and Somerville legal services, shared information for best practices for tenant screening screening, and he focused on a case that he was working on with the use of credit score and households that have vouchers or varying source of income. Because source of income discrimination is something that we do see a lot of the commission sees a lot of, which I'll talk more about in the next section. And then also for online outreach, the chair of the commission posts a question of the week and a news article related to fair housing each week on the Facebook page. You can go to the next slide. The Fair Housing Commission also started tabling.

So this has continued since f y twenty four, but their first tabling event was at Civic Day in 2024. And they had a fair housing fact sheet and also an activity that participants, you know, of Civic Day could come up and point out discriminatory language in an advertisement and then discuss examples of what constitutes fair housing discrimination, and then talk more about it based on whether they were a renter, an owner, a landlord, that sort of thing. And then first time homebuyer courses. Somerville Community Corporation has first time homebuyer courses at that point on a bimonthly basis. Now it's on a monthly basis.

And then the course is open to anyone who would like to learn about home buying process. The fair housing specialist did and still does present information on fair housing rights and responsibilities for tenants, purchasers, sellers in Somerville. Just to add a little bit to this, I think the goal is so that, you know, not only do people know when they're searching for housing, whether it's rental or homeownership after taking the course, what are their rights and what happens if what they can do if someone discriminates them in that search. But, also, if they do end up buying a multifamily home, you know, what are other people's fair housing rights when they're looking to rent from them? And, yeah, that oh, the the first time homebuyer course also covers the inclusionary program and the closing cost assistance program as part of that presentation.

The anti displacement task force, a member of the Fair Housing Commission served on the anti displacement task force residential displacement committee, that was around a fishman. And then Hanalei Steinhardt, who was the fair housing specialist, was also, on the committee. And then just going back to that home rule petition for rent stabilization and the task force continuing to identify and address housing needs in the city of Summerville with one of the priorities being addressing fair housing discrimination and enforcing fair housing law, which they did a great job on collecting that information. It's been really helpful to me in moving forward with that residential displacement committee report. And then for language access, the commission continued to facilitate use of the language access plan by providing educational materials and languages commonly spoken by Somerville residents.

So for instance, with the Fair Housing Month events, having the Spanish interpreter, also at tabling events, having translations of the discriminatory language and flyers so that people can see in their language what's allowed and not allowed. And also continuing to collaborate with the office of immigrant affairs in terms of, like, referrals from the Office of Immigrant Affairs to the Fair Housing Commission. If they notice that, you know, one of their clients seems to have something that happened to them that might be fair housing discrimination, they'll refer them over. And, yeah, we can move on to assessment of fair housing priorities. So, again, this is going all the way back to 2017, but these were what from the AFFH and then this Summerville's assessment of fair housing, what the priorities were listed as, and we wanna make sure that we're still sticking by those.

So ensuring that the commission is fully seated and staffed, increasing outreach to constituents, specifically tenants and landlords, and exploring collaboration with local fair housing agencies in the region. So in terms of ensuring the commission is fully seated and staffed, the commission was not fully staffed or seated in twenty f y twenty four. There were four members who were on the commission for the entire fiscal year. That's Patrice Faulkner, Dennis Fishman, Rona Fishman, and Janine Lotti. There the former commissioner, Fadia D'Andrade, stepped down in July 2023, and Kaye Mammo, who replaced her, was not approved until April 2024 and actually didn't end up starting until early twenty twenty five.

So that's a little bit of background on the seating. There was not an issue with making quorum with four members. But, yeah, it did take a little bit of time from July 2023 to April 2024 to get someone approved for the commission. In terms of increasing outreach to tenants and landlords on fair housing issues, Again, there is outreach conducted both virtually and in person. The virtual was over the Facebook page and the hybrid event on fair housing month.

And then there was also in person at Civic Day and the other fair or both fair housing month events were held at the library. The commission meet met and still meets virtually, and meeting information is, of course, added to the city councilor to allow and encourage public to join monthly meetings. And then in terms of exploring regional collaborations on with local fair housing agencies, The collaboration the main one is with in FY 2024 was with SCC with the first time homebuyers courses Mhmm. With the fair housing presentations. And then also, the specialist would refer and still does refer complaints to the relevant agency, whether it's MCAD or HUD or both if someone has a complaint.

And then there are also connections with the Office of Housing Stability and Cambridge and Somerville Legal Services. And I would just add that since then in the past two years, I think that there's been a lot more collaboration with community partners, and regional agencies, including CHAPA and MAPC. So you can look out for that on the FY twenty five report. And now we can go to complaints. So reporting on complaints in f y twenty four, there were 17 Fair Housing related reports of discrimination received between 07/01/2023 and 06/30/2024.

And, of course, this doesn't include reports that were submitted directly to MCAT or to HUD without first contacting the FHC, the Fair Housing Commission, because they wouldn't know about them. But reports of discrimination can be made in several ways. So they can be made through the online referral form, over the phone, to the staff liaison's email. They can be referred from other city departments or divisions, like Office of Housing Stability, SOIA, and also people can come in person with a complaint. And then the fair housing specialist assists constituents with filing complaints with relevant enforcement agencies.

When a complaint for discrimination is covered by state and federal jurisdiction, it can be submitted to both MCAD and HUD. The only thing that I'll add on this is as the browsing specialist, I can help people submit a complaint to HUD through their online referral form for MCAD, and this might be changing soon because there are some proposed changes. But right now, the way that people need to file a complaint is, for the most part, going in person to their downtown office in Boston or sending the complaint via mail. They have some limited online intake, but it's very limited. And, yeah, that is that's a little bit of the background on MCAG complaints.

I think the the reasoning behind that is so that they have their intake specialists there to help people file the complaint and make sure that it's not rejected for any missing information or anything. But in my opinion, this can somewhat create a barrier to filing a complaint because I have heard people say, oh, I have to go all the way downtown during business hours.

I don't even know when that can happen. Yeah. What if they're disabled and can't it's not just

They can make an accommodation, definitely, if someone is disabled, but it again, like, I do think that it can create more of a barrier than Right. I'm again, they they have their reasons for doing it, and they have these proposed changes right now, which we'll see if they go into place, but would have an online portal for people to submit and would limit the number of or the the way that people could submit to mostly being online, which in that case, I could help them submit the complaint the way that I would with a HUD complaint. We'll see where that goes in the upcoming year. And then just to dive a little bit deeper into the complaints that were received, most of the protected classes were represented in these complaints. You can see them there.

But the highest number of complaints were based on the protected class of disability with eight, followed by sex or gender, and race. And this is a little bit different, I think, from what we've seen with other years where source of income is a really high like, has a higher number of complaints. But for this, those are for this year, those are the top three.

And

then most complaints received were from Wards 3 And 6. And then, going over to the other side, eight of the complaints were submitted to MCAD. Five were referred to OHS. Four were referred to legal aid services. Two were resolved between the tenant and landlord, and eight were left unresolved due to lack of response from the person who submitted the complaint. And, again, some complaints were referred to more than one organization or service, so that's why there's more than the 17 total there. And that is all that I have. Open to questions.

Incredible. Really quick question. So you'll you'll have the 20 the the twenty twenty five? Yes.

The draft is done. But, yeah, I wanted to see if there's anything that you wanted added.

Or And and with where are we on MCAD catching up with backlog?

So I'm not quite sure. I did reach out to MCAD several months ago before writing this. They report their backlog for nonhousing complaints, but on their annual report, they don't report their housing complaint backlog. So I don't have that. And then I also asked them for the number of complaints from Somerville, but I didn't get clear data answers on that either.

So I'll try to reach back out again for the f y twenty five report. But, yeah, it it's unclear from their the data that they publish. The only thing that I will say is that I've had people who have come to me with a complaint and have said, oh, you know, I was looking to schedule an appointment, and it was just booked out as far as I could tell. So I didn't do it. And now, you know, the three hundred days that you have to file a complaint with MCAT is almost up, and I'm not sure what to do.

So I I think that, you know, regardless of the information that I have, it seems like there is still they do still seem to be swamped by complaints and intakes. Wow. Wow.

Thank you, Counselor, do you have any thoughts or questions? Or

No questions, counselor. Thank you.

Okay. Thank you. This is fantastic. And here we are mid April. How's Fair Housing Month turning up this year, and I didn't even get a chance to celebrate.

It's going well. Tomorrow is the second event. The first event was last Friday. It was with the council on aging. So it was geared towards older landlords who own small properties to teach them about, like, rights and responsibilities with fair housing law, but, also, we invited Russell Cody from the home improvement program to talk about, you know, if they want to do involve like, participate in the home improvement program and do fixes to their house.

And, also, Penny from OHS came and presented on OHS's resources for landlords. So I think it was all around a good event and great of the Council on Aging to host. That was the first time that the commission has done a collaborative event with the Council on Aging, so it was really fun. And then, yeah, the one tomorrow is at 06:30 at the library, and it's also it's gonna be like a book discussion, book club kind of thing. So looking forward to that.

Wonderful. And and for anyone that may wanna come at 06:30 at the central library? Yes.

At the Central Library Auditorium, just the first room downstairs.

Got it. Thank you very much. And I see. Has her hands up? Hand up?

Yeah. Through you, Yeah. Thank you for, you know, mentioning, reminding us of the meeting, except the meeting tomorrow. Question for folks who are will be watching this. Where are these resources somewhere on website? Where else can landlords, whether oh, you know, any landlord here in Somerville can find these resources if there's a website you can provide or, please, if you could add that. Thank you.

Yeah. Through the chairs. So for the home improvement program, they have their own website. And if you just reach out to housing division, I have that number off the top of my head. I think it's 617656600 and then extension 2577.

Really quick. Can you repeat that?

Yes. (617) 625-6600 extension 2577. That would be the extension to reach housing division and office of housing stability. So if anyone has questions for either division, then they should call there, and then our admin assistant will direct them to the right place, whether it's home improvement program, Fair Housing Commission, Office of Housing Stability, any questions that they have about resources for landlords or anything like that. And probably the only other thing I can think of is the office of sustainability in the environment. I know it has a lot of resources that can help homeowners and landlords as well.

That's it.

Yeah. Through you, Thank you. Thank you for adding that. So just, again, back to my question. So the best way is to just to reach out to this number, and then they will connect you with the right the appropriate staff or department. Is this is not because you mentioned that there was a presentation last night. So I'm just thinking, like, are these resource do they live somewhere in website? Yes or no?

Through the chair. That's a good question and also a good suggestion. I think that we probably will publish the presentation on, the Fair Housing Commission's website. Yeah.

Wonderful. And I would yeah.

Go ahead,

Yeah. Through the chair. Yeah. Thank you. I think that would be really awesome. It is something in my board that, you know, people reach out to me about, and I usually direct them to this the city. But I think if this is something that can anyone can access, the Just Diveson website, that would be great. Thank you.

Yeah. Super noted. That's great, though. And looking forward to see I mean, lukewarmly because, hopefully, there's positive progress with less reports of fair housing discrimination, but I know that there's a lot of we're all here to hopefully do a lot of great positive changes in the world. So, realistically, the the fair housing compliance continue on, but at least I hope that people are using the resources and are equipped with the knowledge to know they can at the very least.

Mhmm. And I hope that that MCAD does. Everyone else is on Zoom as well, additionally, or Zoom meeting or or something. So Mhmm. I hope that that is taken into account, and I'm happy to talk further about that because that's kind of discouraging that that is absolutely a barrier.

That is that you have to put on at the office. I assume work hours Monday through Friday Yeah. Which if you're working one or two jobs or have kids or whatnot, there are numerous barriers to why that may or may not be possible. And at least if someone could do, like, a hybrid meeting over Zoom or even just a Zoom meeting or a Zoom table, not over lunch break, if they do have a nine to five office job or just that would probably change a lot of possibilities. Mhmm. Jeremy, could I add one thing to this? Just for resources, just to let people know,

is that we also do have a contract with legal services with De Novo Legal Services. And in that contract, they have agreed for cases that would need injunctive relief, really fast action, typically for things like I have a section eight voucher, and they won't rent to me, but I need that apartment.

We do have some capacity because complaints that

are filed at

MCAD don't generally have that.

We go into court right away, and we get this apartment held for you, and we get you to move in. So we do have a backup system in case there are people that really do wanna follow-up on the we want this apartment. They said no section eights. Just to know that there are some additional enforcement resources, legal resources through de novo that we might be able to also use to address Fair Housing, you know, discrimination. So did just wanna note that as an another possible resource regarding enforcement.

Wonderful. That that is all very helpful. Thank you. Thank you very much. I'll add one more

thing too. That and Suffolk Law's housing discrimination testing program.

Are they doing are they doing

it again? They still have it. Yes. So I have referred people there in the past year Mhmm. And that they have gotten in contact with them. So that's just another resource in case, you know, since MCAD you know, we we wanna have as many resources as possible.

Right. Cool. That's very helpful. Thank you. Thank you very much. Pastor Sayyid, you good? You good?

And no further questions? Thank you, counselor.

Alright. Super. Okay. Well, thank you very much, sir, for your information and for being here tonight. I look forward to the FY '25 that we are and talking further with you on. Thank you. Good. So with that, I will mark this for for approval to be approved, and and we've got a meeting. We ran out of agenda items. With that, I moved to for looking for word.

I'm I'm Thank you so much. And then we need to adjourn So on yes. Yes. By voting to adjourn, can will that also trigger the ability to vote yes on the meeting minutes? Yep. So approval of the minutes. That's items number one and two, and then we're marking items four and five were complete as well as adjournment. Councilor Saeed?

Yes.

Councilor Lang? Chair Strezo. Yes. Alright. That is 07/27, and

we are adjourned. Thank you very much, and thank

you all for showing up tonight and for all your hard work, counselor. A good night.