Planning Commission - Regular Meeting

Commissioner Leva? Here. Commissioner Pham? Commissioner Wu? Here. Vice Chair Benninger? Present. Chair Ramos? Chair Quorum has been reached at 05:34 p.

M. Very good, thank you. Let's stand up and pledge allegiance, we're gonna be led by, Commissioner Wu.

And stand on your heart unless we have circumstantial.

Ready to begin. I pledge allegiance to the flag

of The United States Of America and to the republic

for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, that is to get justice for all. Thank you, Alan. Before we begin, I'd like to remind my fellow commissioners to turn off your your microphones when not speaking. When asked, please place the microphone about four inches away from you. Thank you. Members of the public may attend the Planning Commission meeting either in person or via Zoom. I now invite the Commission Secretary to describe how the public can access and participate in this meeting.

This meeting is being livestreamed via our portal at www.santa.primegov.com/public/portal and on YouTube at www.youtube.com/cityofsenanavideos. If you would like to provide public comment, you may do so in the following ways. Join the meeting via Zoom. Enter the meeting ID number 88524788365. When the item you wish to comment on is being discussed, please select the hand icon to indicate that you would like to speak.

Once called upon, remember to unmute yourself and state your name for the record. You can also join the meeting by calling (669) 900-6833. Enter meeting ID number 88524788365. When the item that you would like to comment on is being discussed, press 9 to let us know you would like to speak. You will be called upon by the last three digits of your phone number.

After you are called upon, you may press 6 to unmute yourself. For those who are attending this meeting in person and would like to provide public comment, please fill out a request to speak form and turn it into the recording secretary. All speakers will have three minutes to speak. I will alert you when your time is up.

Thank you. Moving on to public comments on non agenda or non public hearing items. Secretary, does anyone wish to speak?

If you are attending this meeting in person and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please fill out a request to speak form and turn it into the secretary. If you are participating via Zoom and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please select the hand icon to let us know you would like to comment. If you are calling in and would like to comment on non agenda or non public hearing items, please dial 9 and then 6 to unmute yourself. I will wait a few seconds. Vice Chair Benninger, we have received two e comments before the 03:30 deadline.

They have been distributed to the commission and posted online. And we currently have one speaker in house.

Very good, thank you. Okay. Very good. Just like to note that, we have, commissioner Escamilla here now. Okay. Can I, Gail Olivos, is saying that correct?

Gail Olivos.

Gail Olivos. Okay. Madam, it's your floor for three minutes.

Okay.

Good evening, commissioner, staff. Okay.

So I'm gonna have to keep holding down on the 1 Broadway Plaza. It's clear of my position on this project. In particular, I'm extremely concerned that the city of Santa Ana is not being informed correctly with prompt attention and manner concerning the Sunshine meetings. I think I came across this council a month ago, and it was my understanding when I left this meeting from all of you in front of me that you were gonna do your best, your due process, to make sure that the Sunshine Ordinance meetings were gonna be extended past the 2,000 feet limit. As of today, I see nothing of that nature in city council, and I read everything from top to bottom.

So I'm coming to you again to find out what is the status of that. It is important that this developer informs all of the citizens of Santa Ana. This 37 story tower is going to be a nightmare for my city, and it's only fair that he tells everybody about it. I don't see it broadcasted at all. I did send an e comment today. I did provide the the town hall meeting we're having on Thursday at Saint Peter's Church at 07:00, welcoming the community the community to come out and hear what's going on with this building, and I would least expect this commission to do as well. Thank you.

Thank you for for for the comment. Do we have any others?

Vice chair Benninger, we don't have any more.

Okay. I'd to mark that Commissioner Pham is present. Okay. Moving on to Consent Calendar. Is there a motion to approve items a, minutes from 03/09/2026? Must approve. Item b, excused absences. Go ahead, Alan.

I move item a and b. Second.

Secretary, take a roll, please.

Commissioner Escamilla?

Aye.

Commissioner Leo? Aye. Commissioner Leva? Aye. Commissioner Pham?

Aye.

Commissioner Wu?

Aye.

Vice Chair Benninger?

Present, yes.

Chair Ramos? Motion approved by majority vote with Chair Ramos absent.

Very good, thank you. That concludes the consent calendar. Moving on to the business calendar. We're now I wanna open the public Okay. Opening a public hearing. I will now review the process for the public hearing so that everyone knows what to expect. Staff will provide a presentation, answer questions from the commission. The public hearing will be opened. The applicant will be given opportunity to speak, limited to fifteen minutes. Members of the public will be given opportunity to comment, limit three minutes for each comment.

The applicant will be given the opportunity to respond to comments made by the public, limited to five minutes. Public hearing will be closed. Discussion will return to the commission with formal action taken to approve, deny, or continue the review of the applicant. Please consider the following suggestions when organizing your comments. Please state your name and address, and the address is voluntary.

State whether you support, oppose, or are neutral to the proposal. Your statement should include all pertinent facts within your knowledge. Please note that the decisions of this matter are final unless appealed within ten days of any individual or party. Recommendation on those matters will be forward to the city council at a later date for final determination. The item one item the first item we have to talk about, and this is time and place for conditional use permit number 2026DashO4 for the property located at 1641 East St.

Andrews Place located within specific development SD number 69 Zoning District. Before we begin, do any commissioners have anything to wish to disclose with regard to this item? Okay. Seeing none, I'm going to turn it over to the case planner. Ryan Lund will provide a brief presentation.

Thank you, vice chair. Good evening, chair and planning commission. Tonight's first item is conditional use permit number 2026Dash04 for Spectrum Wine, a wine storage and retail facility located at 1641 East Saint Andrew Place. The request is for approval of a CUP to allow the sale of beer and wine for on premises consumption within a designated tasting room through a type 42 alcoholic beverage control license. Staff's recommendation is to adopt a resolution approving conditional use permit number 2026Dash04 for the sale of beer and wine for on premises consumption as conditioned.

The site's general plan land use designation is industrial, and the zoning district is specific development number 69. Their surrounding land uses on all sides include warehousing and manufacturing uses, and the lot size is 1.32 acres, and the unit size is 41,722 square feet. The subject site was originally developed as part of a multi tenant industrial and business park called Pacific Center in 2004. And on 08/10/2020, the Planning Commission approved CUP number 2020Dash16, allowing Spectrum Wine to obtain ABC license type 14 for public warehousing, type 21 for off sale general retail sales, and a type 86 for an instructional tasting license. The city prepared a letter of public convenience and necessity at that time due to the overconcentration of off sale licenses.

This CUP proposal for a type 42 for on sale beer and wine through a designated tasting center does not expand the business's off sale alcoholic privileges, and the California Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control has not requested a new PCN determination. Therefore, a new PCN is not required. Although they have already obtained a type 86 license for instructional tastings, the type 86 is limited in nature. It allows limited educational tasting events that are structured in nature and focused on product knowledge, including wine history, production methods, flavor profiles, and food pairings. These instructional tastings are limited in duration, sample size, and hours of operation, and would occur within the same tasting room during the business's normal operating hours.

This proposed type 42 license would expand Spectrum Wine's ability to offer regular on-site tastings as an ancillary use, which would complement its existing warehousing, retail, and auction operations. On 11/01/2025, Spectrum Wine acquired Wine Exchange, a premium wine retailer located elsewhere in Santa Ana, and consolidated their retail business into their operation at this subject subject location. And on 02/02/2026, the applicant submitted a CUP application to allow the operation of a type 42 license for the sale of beer and wine for on premises consumption within a designated tasting room. And while Spectrum Wine's headquarters are located in Santa Ana, they also have additional office locations in Newport Beach, Hong Kong, and Minneapolis. Spectrum Wine currently occupies a 41,722 square foot warehouse consisting of a Ground Floor for storage for alcoholic beverages, retail showroom space, and office spaces, as well as a mezzanine level with additional office spaces.

Their primary operations consist of warehousing alcoholic beverages for private and commercial clients, and their ancillary uses include retail sales and online auctions. The applicant is proposing tenant improvements to convert the existing conference room into a three thirty three square foot designated tasting room. I apologize here, there's a minor typo on the slide. The current hours of operations are ten a. M. To six p. M. Daily. And with the Type 42, they are proposing the proposed hours of operations will be ten a. M.

To nine p. Here are the site photos, and on the top photo, it shows the southern elevation with the site entrance area outlined in red. On the right hand side, we just have a close-up picture of that, and the bottom picture shows the western elevation, which is the side of the building. The site here is highlighted in yellow with the red arrow pointing to it. And the yellow highlighted area here shows a tasting room in the context of the entire floor area.

On the right hand side, we have, an enlargement of that to show the details of the tasting room, and we can see 18 designated seats. On this slide, we have a map that shows the regional establishments offering the combined operations of wine storage, retail, and wine tastings. We can see here the boundary of the city of Santa Ana in red, the site location marked by a star, and five different locations within a 40 mile buffer area that also offer the unique combination of wine storage, retail, and wine tasting. The proposed sale of alcoholic beverages for on premises consumption at this location will not be a detriment to the health, safety, or general welfare of the community or surrounding properties. The use will occur within an enclosed premise in accordance with ABC standards.

It's not located within immediate proximity to playgrounds, schools, residences, or religious institutions. The nearest school is approximately thirteen eighty seven feet to the north. The nearest playground is approximately 2,989 feet northwest, and the site is approximately 2,919 feet east of the closest resident residential units, and the closest religious institution is located fourteen ninety seven feet northeast of the project site. The operational standards applicable to an ABC license and conditions of approval, such as a good neighbor policy, as well as the existing property maintenance agreement, will address any potential impacts and will ensure that the use will not negatively affect the surrounding community. The police department has reviewed this request and has no concerns as operational standards applicable to an ABC license and the proposed conditions of approval will mitigate any potential impact.

The requested CUP is also consistent with the general plan land use designation of industrial. It aligns with land use elemental LU two and those policies which aim to provide a balanced mix of land uses that meet the city's diverse needs, provide employment opportunities, capture local spending, encourage reinvestment into the city, and strengthen the city's image as a business friendly regional activity center. The project also aligns with economic prosperity element EP 3.11, which seeks to improve the city's image through the creation of vibrant and engaging public space. The proposed wine tasting room will offer an environment that promotes Santa Ana's identity as a destination for specialty commercial experiences for adults 21 years of age and older. And in accordance with the California Environmental Quality Act and the CEQA guidelines, the project is categorically exempt for further review for section 15,301.

Based on this analysis, a notice of exemption environmental review number twenty twenty six-sixteen will be filed for this project, and there is no fiscal impact associated with this action. Staff's recommendation is to adopt a resolution approving conditional use permit number 2026Dash04 for the sale of beer and wine for on premises consumption as condition. And that concludes staff's presentation. Staff is here, as well as the applicant, Jason Bolan and Vince Fregoso are here as well to answer any questions.

Thank you. I'd like to state for the record that I joined the meeting at 05:44 p. M. And does the commission now have any comments or questions for staff? I'll begin with Commissioner Scamilla.

Thank you, Chair. Yeah, no, for staff, this is actually probably more procedural question. I'm just wondering, as we start looking to kind of reformat or streamline and, again, to the point of being business friendly, was there anything with this particular license type or particular proposal that made it different or maybe staff could have just handled this one, you know, but I know this is probably a pretty common type of CEP for, you know, on-site, beer and wine sales, but because it's already an existing site, is there anything that we're looking at to maybe just kind of, you know, push these along a little bit faster than a potential review from, the planning commission instead? Or are we looking at these types of, CUPs still coming back to us even after we kind of do our more our streamlining effort in the future.

Thank you, Commissioner. As part of the zoning code update, we are looking at ways to streamline CEPs for alcohol sales. The zoning code is still in draft format, but just kind of big picture the way we're looking at it is anything that would allow a member of the public to go in and purchase for takeaway, that would still be a CUP that would be presented before the Planning Commission. Anything that would be like a restaurant where someone goes in to sit down with a meal, order an alcoholic beverage like a beer with their pizza, we're looking at potentially allowing a minor CUP for those types of instances.

Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Escamilla. We have any other commissioners? Commissioner Wu.

When you say sale of alcohol, there are different types of sale. Right? There's a grocery store sale. There's the mom and pop store sale. They're still in the backyard that they sell, but that's illegal because they don't have a CPUC.

So this company, apparently, is largely warehousing wine. And they want a little instead of a showroom, they want to have auctions, and they want to sell tastings so that they could sell what's in the warehouse. Right? So it's a method of sale that we're looking at. And if you look at all the layers of conditional use permits that were done, it was a slow deliberate process and evolutionary to this point of asking the property to be modified.

Am I correct in understanding that? So that it could allow this little tasting room that will be selling alcohol. So you could purchase, you know, 10 cases, one case, one bottle, or 100 cases, right, for your restaurant or Trader Joe's?

That's correct. There are different entitlements that would allow the different sale types as you're describing at the site, and this would be an added conditional use permit that would allow the tasting room to function within the location.

So, following the question that Commissioner Escamilla did, this if we approve this, it would allow this one to do it, the special CPUC for this particular use. If another person comes by, they would have to go through all the process again. Staff have to check everything, and then there would be a CPUC recommendation for that.

That's correct. If there were another location, a different business wanted to have a similar type of use, they would have to apply for a conditional use permit for that location.

So, our approval is not a blanket approval that anyone could convert to this? That's correct. Okay, I just wanted to state for record. Thank you very much.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Vice Chair Benninger.

Okay. Little, concern because usually tasting rooms I've been to, you always could buy a bottle of that wine that you like. So what we're saying is that you simply are gonna taste here, and I don't know whether you're gonna order and have it delivered later, or is there gonna be any bottle sales of of wine at all?

Thank you, vice chair. Could I have you repeat the question one more time? Sure.

Most tasting rooms where you get to taste the wine, and you also have the option of buying a bottle or two of that wine if if you like it. What I'm hearing here is you're gonna be able to taste it, but you won't be able to buy any of that wine in this location. Is that is that correct in my assumption?

I don't believe that's correct. I believe you, the customer can taste the wine at that location, and then if they decide that they want to purchase it, they can also purchase it at that location.

Which then leads me to ask the question, when we say consumption on-site, are we not letting them buy and carry it off-site?

Commissioner, there's an existing type 21 alcohol beverage control license CUP that would allow this business to sell for off-site consumption, so you'd be able to purchase a bottle like you're describing and take that home. This would simply add a tasting room component. So if member of the public wanted to go there, sample something, and they did find a selection that they liked, they'd be able to purchase that bottle. It's already allowed through the type 21 ABC license to take home with them.

Very good. My other question concerns, we saw nothing describing signage. Are there any plans for putting any signage on this building to draw people to the tasting room or because I looked at the pictures we saw, I saw no signage up there on that building at all saying what it was and what it does.

At this time, they have not proposed any signage, but if they did, it would be subject to, the conditions of approval that dictate, the signage and the windows. But at this time, the applicant has not proposed any additional signage along with this.

If he does want to, it has to come through the Planning Commission then again, correct? Or through you guys, I should say.

It would not go through Planning Commission, but it would go through Planning Review.

That's fine. Thank you.

Thank you, Vice Chair Benninger. Do we have any other questions or comments from the Commission for a sec? We'll go back to Commissioner Rowe.

I like Is it permissible that trying to ask the question in a different way to kind of illuminate this particular different type of operation is not your Trader Joe's. It's not your restaurant. But the way a vintners, like the Sonoma County vintners that I worked with before, we would bring together the which is the wine tasters for hotels, restaurants, and all that to come. And they go down there, and then it's from this winery, this winery, and then they they would put in their orders. Now what this is doing different is it takes that venue from people organizing wine tasting to a warehouse with this company having their network of whoever.

So it's a little different than, say, us walking in and want one bottle of Robert Shaw. You know? They probably have vintage wine and and other exotic and international stuff or whatever. I I don't really know the company. I'm not advocating for a company, but I just want to get the idea that we're first looking at the use within a property that's already gone through the other CPU process, and we're only modifying to use it to turn the showcase showroom into a place that can sell the wine that they have on-site already.

So it's not I I doubt that the general public will come unless you have lots of money to buy, to deal with that kind of business. So we have different types of sectors of businesses in the city, luckily. And this one is a little more unique than some of the the mom and pop stores that we have.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. If there are no additional questions or comments for staff at this time, we're gonna go ahead and open the public hearing. The So public hearing is now open. Would the applicant like to speak on the matter?

Hello, my name is Jason Boland. I am the owner of Spectrum Wine. So, thank you so much for getting us up here so quickly. And we've been through this in 2020, first time, as you've mentioned a couple of times in the different stages of the business. So this is the new stage where we're expanding out our retail showroom into a tasting area.

So, to answer a couple of your questions, we do have a retail storefront. So, there's 's everything from $10 bottles of wine up to very expensive wine. So we do showcase those type of wines for the public. Then we have our warehousing component, which is in the back. And then we have our auction component also, which is in the back. So, I'm happy to answer any other questions that you guys had.

Thank you. Are there any questions for the applicant? From any members of the commission? Thank you, I don't see any questions for you at this time.

Thanks.

Recording Secretary, have we received any written communication, or is there a member of the public that would like to comment on this item?

Chair, we have not received any public comments. If you are attending this meeting in person and would like to comment on this item, please fill out a request to speak form and turn it in into the secretary. If you are participating via Zoom and would like to comment on this item, please select the hand icon to indicate that you would like to speak. If you are calling in and would like to comment on this item, please dial 9 and then 6 to unmute yourself. I will wait a few seconds.

Chair, we do not have any speakers.

Thank you. Are there any final questions for the applicant before I close the public hearing? Seeing none, the public hearing is now closed. Is there a motion to approve this matter?

I'd like to move.

We have a motion from Commissioner Wu. Do we have a second?

I will second it.

We have a second from Vice Chair Benninger. Secretary, please call for a roll call vote.

Commissioner Escamilla.

Aye.

Commissioner Leo. Aye. Commissioner Aliba. Aye. Commissioner Pham. Aye. Commissioner Wu.

Aye.

Vice Chair Benninger? Aye. Chair Ramos? Aye. Motion approved unanimously.

I'd just like to add thank you for doing business in Santa Ana. I see this as a good thing. Thank you.

Thank

you. We are now going to go to the work study session. We're gonna take a three minute brief recess. Thank you all. So we're moving we've now concluded the business calendar, and we're now gonna go to the work study session.

The item up is the Warner Avenue Street widening project. Jason Gaber from Public Works will now provide a short presentation.

Good evening, chair, commissioners. Thank you for the opportunity to present this, project to you this evening. I also have with me Sean Thomas from our construction services division as well. The presentation this evening, we're going to gonna do a brief discussion of the historical setting of the project as well as some of the objectives and solutions. We're gonna take a look at the remaining timeline for the projects that are currently under construction and and the second one that's going to be starting construction.

The third item, we'll do an overview of the of the project funding. Also, we'll go through a discussion of the remnant properties created by the property acquisitions and the project footprint. We'll go over the public engagement that's occurred throughout the life of the project, an overview of the project alignment under the visuals, and then we'll take some questions

at the end.

So for the history of this project, this has been a priority project for quite a while. It was actually initiated in the, fiscal year eight, nine, when the environmental process began. The the need for the project, We heard from the community about, concerns in the area about the lack of mobility for pedestrians and bikes, and Santa Ana commissioned a study called the Safe Mobility Santa Ana, SAMHSA, which looked at hotspots for pedestrian and, bike accidents and where those could be mitigated through complete streets type construction or methods. And this project, ultimately prioritizes bike lanes and sidewalks to create safer routes for cyclists and pedestrians. Well, some of the existing conditions that lent to this project, was a lack of mobility for pedestrians and bike riders.

As you can see, here's a couple pictures of folks on bikes who were making do with the current built or the built environment prior to the project. So riding in the street, riding on the sidewalk. Also, you see that that power pole in the middle picture is encroaching on the majority of the sidewalk. ADA is not being, accommodated there. Imagine bikes, peds, all trying to use the that narrow sidewalk was a big challenge.

Additionally, the existing configuration was basically two lanes in each direction with a center double yellow line. No, safe space for left turns. This, lent to a lot of rear end accidents with cars waiting to make that left turn. It also contributed to the overall congestion in the area. And when looking at the 2035 future, this roadway would see a level of service of f.

So some of the objectives of the project, safety, mobility, and livability for all. We're looking at pedestrians, bicyclists, motorists, and transit users, and to reduce overall accidents. Those based on the, some of the improvements that we're gonna talk about in a minute, some of the benefits we see are from safety. We're gonna see wider sidewalks for pedestrians. We're gonna see protected bike lanes for bicyclists and medians to separate motorists. We're also included

in

this project, upgrades to the storm drain system, and with it, some water quality improvements. And the project is consistent with the general plan mobility element and the Orange County master plan of arterial highways. From a mobility perspective, we're ADA compliant across the board, both for pedestrians on the sidewalks as well as transit users on the bus islands with with, bus shelters and access from the sidewalk to those bus islands. Livability, with the increase in the lanes of the project, we're also increasing the air quality, less idling time, a better level of service for the project from a traffic perspective, and we're also enhancing community beautification through the landscaping of both the parkways, the buffers for the bike lanes, as well as the median, and we're also undergrounding the utilities in about half of this project. So to accommodate the bike lanes and the wider sidewalks, existing four lane roadway would not accommodate adding those features without actually widening the roadway.

So we had to look at acquiring properties primarily on the north side of the street, and that allowed for expanding the roadway from four to six lanes and including all the multimodal features that we've been talking about. The sidewalks, you can see in the the exhibit on the bottom, we have a a buffered sidewalk, a buffered bike lane, outside of all of the travel lanes. And as we mentioned, additional improvements include the landscaping in the parkways, the raised medians, where we added a storm drain, we added sound walls, new street lights, traffic signals, and, again, I mentioned undergrounding overhead utilities for about half the project. The project also will improve access to nearby commercial areas, schools, recreation, and transit facilities for all users. Looking at the project timeline for what's remaining, Warner Phase 1, which is between Maine and Oak, we're about 90% complete.

We have ongoing utility work to remove the remaining overhead utilities and the poles, and then ongoing median and street construction, and that's expected to be completed in the this summer twenty twenty six. Werner Phase 2, we are we've bid the project out. We have an a low bidder, and we're looking to award that contract at the April. And the anticipated construction duration for that phase is from July through December 2027. Being at the funding sources for the project, it's a combination of local funding as well as grant funding.

One of the challenges with the grant funding that we use for this project is with OCTA is the size and scope of the projects. As you can see, phase one was a total of 16,000,000. Phase two is almost double that longer segment. But with constraints due to the available funding source and the pots of money that they release on a yearly basis, we had to split this project into phases. Some of the various funding that we utilized were Measure M, again, from OCTA.

We have congestion mitigation and air quality funds. We have flood management protection and risk awareness funds for the storm drain, and then we're utilizing a component of the city's gas tax called Senate Bill one road maintenance and rehabilitation account funds for the remainder. One of the consequences of the project is that, as I mentioned, we had to acquire properties along the north side of the street primarily, although there were some along the south as well. And with this generated remnant properties, we didn't utilize all of the property acquired to, implement the roadway. What that does include is, behind the back of walk.

In a lot of cases, we're adding additional landscaping between the back of walk and the sound walls. The other piece is that we will have in some cases, we'll see all the locations on the next slide, but when we're done with construction, there will be some opportunities to sell properties. One option is that our our parks department could purchase those as, pocket parks. Another option is to make them available for residential development, and I I believe at least in one case, it's a commercial property. So that'll be or two cases that'll be commercial properties.

So the yellow properties here here at Main Street all the way to standard are where the remnants are left. There's the leftover gas station, and then there's several, residential properties along the North Side, one on the South Side, and then this is another commercial property that will be made available. Our public engagement, we've been going to the community throughout the project all the way back since inception in 08/00/2009, we've included it as part of some of the discussions about general plan, circulation element, bikeway master plan. We've done extensive mail in notices to residents and businesses. We've conducted a number of outreach events, throughout the years, also neighborhood meetings.

We've presented project at council meetings and public hearings. We have a website that is available that gives updates on the project and the overall scope. And the environmental was approved on 09/01/2015, and here is a sample of some of the outreach that was done since 2015 as part of that environmental process, and then continuous updates throughout the years, as the project is being implemented. Couple visuals, just to give you an overall sense of the project. The overall right of way width is a 110 feet from back of walk to back of walk.

I mentioned, we have the raised medians throughout. We have the buffered bike lanes along the outsides. Are upgrading the crossing at the railroad crossing just east of Standard, completing the project at Grand Avenue. That concludes my presentation. I'm happy to take any questions you may have.

Thank you. Are there any questions from members of the commission at this time? Do you wanna start us off? Commissioner Scamilla?

I can go last because I'll be pretty negative.

Okay, I'll start. Can we please go back to the slide that shows the remnant parcels? I'd like to see, okay, how many are they? Is that a total of eight?

Yes.

Okay, of these parcels, do we know the, you shared that some are commercial, that one was a gas station, and were all of the other single family homes to your knowledge?

The ones on the North Side and this one on the South Side were single family homes. This one was also residential, but it's zoned commercial.

Okay. So my question was gonna be, do you know the zoning designation for each of those? So of those eight, how many are commercial, how many are residential?

The one here at Main Street is commercial. This one here between Wells Fargo and the Strip Mall is also commercial. All the rest are residential.

So two commercial and six residential. Okay. And the city will have to comply with their surplus lands, is that correct once, these parcels are, okay. Has the city considered any, right of first refusal practices when selling, so a right of first refusal would allow any of the previous homeowners to purchase, that parcel. Obviously, after we've gone through the Surplus Lands Act, which would require the city to build affordable housing if it's feasible, or to build the park if it's feasible, but if it's not feasible, then it can be sold to anyone.

So wondering if the city has considered any, doing a right of first refusal, and if not, I would encourage and ask that we do. I personally have been approached by residents of the Doha neighborhood association, who did lose their home to the widening and do have an interest in purchasing whatever remnant areas may be left.

We have not formulated a final plan because this is still under construction and being utilized as a part of the construction zone, but, we will take that under advisement.

Thank you, and that's my first round of questions and comments. I'll see if anyone else has any. Commissioner Wu.

That triggers some thought, two thoughts. The gas station, will we have to go through a a grounds process to allow the lead from the gasoline leach out or it can be sold so it'll be, fenced off property for a while. Right?

So when we acquired that property, it had already gone through a cleanup process. So we essentially purchased a clean, so it is available. Actually, because it is not a 15,000 square foot lot, this this one's already gone through the surplus lands act process. It's an exempt surplus land because it's small, and our only main avenue is to sell it to the adjacent property owner. But we're engaged in that process right now.

Can you remind us what was the impetus for focusing on this little strip of land, Warner, besides the accidents and the deaths and death?

That's primarily was the focus was.

But why was that chosen and not some other area?

As as other streets in the city?

Yeah.

It was identified as a safety one of our safety priorities.

Oh, so so there was one of the public hearings or attorney general

The Safe Mobility Santa Ana plan had this as a high priority location. Did because it was four lanes with just that center double left or double yellow line, there was no refuge for the left turn movement, so there's a lot of accidents that do occur on the segment.

I'm gonna go out on limb following a question that our chair brought up. Is it possible that instead of doing a piecemeal that a nonprofit developer, if there is one around, could take that whole remnant property and and work with the residents in term of developing a development plan that include both open space and affordable housing. And and maybe as a result of getting a park like environment, could be a higher density housing there to provide more affordable home, especially low low income. It seemed to me if you have piecemeal kind of thing, you can have townhome here, you have this, and, you know, we go over and over. But if if you could work with, you know, the neighborhood as a co developer, you know, to go through a process, you know.

Of course, it's a stupid idea maybe from this standpoint that today's generation will say this and want this as a priority Twenty, thirty years down the line, other people might might think, who thought of this idea? But in the meanwhile, there might be a way to have a a good nonprofit that can do the organizing and the discussion so that you could get both in that it will be something that they could agree on that will be lasting. So my question again is, would it be possible to bundle up the, I don't know, for sale or or transfer into a master plan to develop? Should there be a nonprofit with the money? That's the other thing is how you're gonna finance this thing.

Right. And I guess it's easier for the city to sell it off unless someone else worry about where to get the money and and all that.

So great comments. We could take that again under advisement. One thing to note is that these properties were purchased with, grant funds, and one of the conditions of that grant fund is that the granting agency ultimately gets made whole from the sale of the property. So we need to be sensitive to that as a component, but if we can make it all work and send it to transaction, then then we can consider

that could be incorporated into the bidding process, right, or the resale. Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Commissioner Pham?

The chart about the funding, is that the funding source or is that the construction or the overall budget for this project? The total 16,000,000?

The 16,000,000, I apologize. That 16,000,000 is just the construction phase. So there's also 19.8 was for the right of way acquisition and 640,000 was for design of phase one. And

we don't anticipate cost overruns given the kind of duration of this project?

There are, at this point, 16.1 is the available funding for the project. If there was additional funding required, we would need to go back to council. We're not anticipating that at this time. And

then I look at the, you know, the chair brought up the potential use of residential for these pockets that are left over. My concern is it looks like we are going to be doing quite a bit of work improving the public right of way, creating curves and dividers. If it was to be developed as a residential lot, you know, if we look at the map, most of the residential homes have access via side streets. These isolated pockets, it almost seems a bit of a waste of funds to do the full sidewalk. And then if there is a commercial or residential project, a building, then you end up tearing up the just built street improvements to do curb cuts, utilities, things like that.

So, you know, from the most cost effective perspective, I would say a use that wouldn't disturb the construction that's already been laid down.

Yes. So of these residential properties, there's several scenarios that could play out. These this this lot actually is made up of three lots that used to be perpendicular to the street, so they took access directly off of Warner. You're correct. It's not ideal to go in and and, you know, create that as a new lot and provide access directly to Warner. We're trying to mitigate mitigate the left turn movements

Right.

As much as possible. This one would likely if this property owner and this property owner are interested, the lots just to the north are split right here. So, theoretically, you could sell piece and a piece to those property owners and make them all similar to their adjacent lots. Similar scenario here, but these lots could easily be developed, in the scenario you described, which is take access on the side streets, and, we're going to be constructing walls along the boundary of these so that effectively those lots would be ideal for, residential development.

That's all for me. Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Pham. Vice Chair Benninger.

Right now, is the product on timeline or are we behind on a timeline?

Depends on the phase. Phase one definitely had its has its challenges. We

we awarded

yep. Well, we awarded a construction contract for phase one in March 2021. Since that time, going through COVID and, you know, supply chain issues, we also had a contractor that ultimately defaulted. I don't wanna get into more details about kind of the current status, but we've had to pick up the pieces from that contractor and try to try to complete that construction. For phase two, we're looking to award construction contract next month, so that one's on time.

That contractor went by, if he didn't have insurance to protect the city?

Well, actually what happened is we ended up a contractor. So, we started, as Jason mentioned, in '21, and it was supposed to take a couple of years, but we got the unfortunate luck of the low bidder being the contractor that we got. As you guys probably know, we don't have the luxury of really choosing our contractors or developers. We're kind of beholden to the lowest bid, and usually it works out okay. Sometimes we get good contractors.

Sometimes we get bad contractors, and in this case, we got a really bad contractor, unfortunately. It was just a perfect storm with the utilities that were on-site. As Jason mentioned, COVID, so COVID, utilities, constant price escalation requests, which we granted a bunch whenever it was fair, and then it's just that the timing with all the utilities, the contractor could not perform. So, we had to terminate this contractor, and we ended up terminating the contractor in March '5, and we're picking up the pieces internally, getting the project completed as much as possible. So, that's kind of where we're at.

We're anticipating to be completed with this phase now in the summer of this year, right when we're about to start phase two. Soon, hopefully, we'll see it very similar to Bristol where Bristol, between Civic Center and, Washington, it was a similar situation. It's kind of the difference between a good contractor and a bad. They kind of had a lot of the same challenges with the poles being in the way, but they didn't make excuses about the poles. They just did everything they could with, oh, with the poles in the way.

Right? So we are able to pretty much complete the project. The only thing left is for the utility companies that are not in our control to remove those poles, and then we can just put the final coat of asphalt on, and we're done. This

contractor that we

had for phase one unfortunately wasn't able to do that. The contractor that we have that we're going to propose awarding to for phase two is that contractor that did Bristol, so we're very confident that we're not going to run into those same issues. There's also the we're not undergrounding in utilities in this segment. They have to just relocate the poles, it's a lot more of a simpler utility operation.

I sympathize with moving poles. That's why my neighborhood association was formed because we battled Edison. Street was blocked for almost six months because of Edison, and we're able to reduce that down quite a bit. Okay. As you mentioned, these properties right now are city owned. Our city title is on them. So we could identify one for a park. I I don't know if a park is in the area. I certainly enjoy it. My other comment is if we build bike lanes in the city, and unfortunately I see no one on them.

I would really like to see the city, after this project's done, do something to encourage riding of bikes. I know the hard decision is because we made our children ride bikes to middle school, but and even schools have done, they've done away with all their bike parking area, So it's very hard for, even right now, if they wanted to ride a bike to school, secure it during the day. That's one thing I think we should work with the schools to get bike racks back in place so the kids are encouraged to end up riding the bikes there on it. One thing I didn't understand, made my simple mind, you talked about on the grants requires to be made whole. Could you explain what that is?

If I was a homeowner or sold my house to a city for, let's just say, a number of 400,000, So how am I

made whole afterwards? What's I don't understand that. So when we when we acquire properties with grant funding, especially from OCTA, they expect that we have a disposition plan, that we're we have a process for selling the properties that we, that we're now in possession of. And the proceeds of that sale is a $100,000. We have a grant match.

So in the case of OCTA, we tend tend to provide 25% match, and they fund 75%. So if we if we sold that property for a $100,000, uh-huh, they get $75,000 back. We they expect to receive that. So it's, we we can't, like, sell property for, like, a dollar to make, you know, like, affordable housing or some scenario. Even internally, if we wanted to turn any of those into park space, we'd have to appraise it, and then we'd we'd the city would have to purchase it from ourselves, basically purchasing from the grant, and those proceeds would go back to the the granting agency.

Gotcha. So if we want to donate some of this land to save Habitat for Humanities to build affordable housing on, we'd have to purchase the land and go through that.

That's correct.

Thank you.

Thank you. Vice Chair Benninger. Commissioner Oliva.

A third of the project has been close to completion, but we still have the remaining portion of this, you said mile long stretch?

Yes.

Can you go back to the proposed budget? Can you walk us through what the second phase numbers mean? Because the jump is not, I can't compute it. If you could walk us through it, that would be great.

So this stretch is effectively twice as long, and also, some of the right of way that was acquired is is, industrial or commercial, which is appraised at per square foot basis is much more expensive than residential. And so in this case, the, the right of way acquisition was much higher. We also have, a number to make this second phase work, we actually have, like, three projects. Each one had was designed independently. There's actually federal money in this phase along with OCTA grants along with local dollars.

And there's a there's a, storm drain grant in there as well. So all that effort was more the first phase was all one consultant doing everything. So because it's three projects, the level of complexity is larger. That's why there's a higher design cost. And then as you can imagine from the time when the first project, which was beginning of COVID till now, with all the inflation and supply chain, construction costs have gone through the roof. So that's why it's substantially more.

Thank you for clarifying. And for the right of way acquisition, are any of the remnant parcels in any of the pockets that were commercial?

So, basically, all the yellow properties are the the remnants. Everything from Standard to the East, who I'm not really showing here because they're all partial acquisitions. Because they're such large lots, we're just acquiring a small sliver off the front of the lots there. But of the two that are commercial, there's this one here and this one.

Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Oliva. Commissioner Leo.

Couple questions. Could you explain, because this is all over the city, it's not just Warner, could you talk to us about the process of undergrounding utilities and how much leeway does the utility company have? Because in my own mind is there's been other parts of this city where they were supposed to underground and they never did. Here we're tearing up a road, taking people's homes, and the first phase, we're not even undergrounding. Right?

The first phase, we are underground.

We're undergrounding. It's the next phase we're not? Correct. Why? And and and and it's not meant at you, but I'm like, this makes no sense to me. We're tearing up this full road to lower to clean the road up, and they're still gonna have their lines? Can we press upon them to underground it? I mean, the and because it goes back to it wasn't Sandpoint that had the issue. They they thought they were gonna have funds to underground. It was never undergrounded. This is this round and round with these utility companies, and I'm sorry. I have solar, and I've seen my bill go up. Where's all my money going? Why where you guys are making this a nice street. The polls need to come down.

So somebody call Edison when when this comes back, and we'll talk to Edison. That this is ridiculous. These people who live in this neighborhood, they've had this forever. This is the Delhi neighborhood, one of the oldest neighborhoods in the city. Just take the poles down. You guys are doing your best to widen the road. Take the poles down. So I don't know how we communicate that to Edison, but if it's not communicated from here, I will talk to the person that appointed me and she will communicate that to Edison. This is ridiculous. My second phase my second question is is about speed in this pit in this in this area because there's lots of people that use Delhi Park.

There's a lot of families that go there, and there's kids all over the place. Speeds in this area, we're gonna try to slow them down to a certain amount. We're gonna try to make it as safe as possible. Because you go to Irvine, and I can zip through Irvine at 55, 60 miles an hour. There's a lot of people in this area. Right? Then we got the armory that's there that's I don't know if it's used as a winter place. I don't you know? But I'm just thinking about we've we've improved some walkway. We've got a bike lane, but yet we still have a lot of people who live here.

So how do we make it nice for them and safe enough for them to be able to cross the streets and not worry about their kids? I'm trying to figure out, like, we've it looks like we're doing enough, but I just wanna know kinda, like, from a speed perspective what you guys are envisioning for speed. Is it like 40 or 45 or

Well, it's always it's based on the, eighty fifth percentile of traffic, but the the feature that here that would affect speed is the width of the lanes. We are, in this case, we have 11 ten and eleven foot lanes. The intent there is by making it Narrow. Constrained it makes it comfort level, driving slower, driving fast, it doesn't feel as safe. So that's that's, intentional

Okay.

To try and bring down the the speed of the

Those are my two questions. I didn't understand tearing up the road and not putting the poles underground and the speed in the space. Appreciate it. Thanks.

Thank you, Commissioner Leo. Commissioner Scamilla.

Alright. I guess I'll just start off with, you know, by my calculations here, we've spent about $47,000,000 to remove 30 families from their homes in the effort to provide safety. The, I guess, overall vision is, according to the presentation based off of the SAMHSA data, that data shows roughly 17 collisions during the entire, sorry, 17 pedestrian and bicycle collisions based off of the data from the 2022 study. Only one of those was actually kind of in the segment that's being widened, and it looked like it was a cluster around the area that lacked a crosswalk between the corner of Delhi and the kind of northern area, so we're doing all this project in the name of safety. We know statistically speaking that widening roads will increase the average speed of traffic, so that 85 percentile will probably go up based on just the sheer number of lanes.

The SAMHSA proposal itself actually envisions a four lane, reduction, in this particular segment, so we're being told that this is being done because of SAMHSA. The SAMHSA proposal is to leave it at four lanes and essentially narrow down the area, oh my gosh, into a four lane arterial roadway with some buffering for bicycles on the side. So can you explain to me how we go from the safety proposal saying four lanes to now we have six lanes both ways, lots of takings?

So as I mentioned before, with the existing configuration, the existing road was four lanes with a yellow line down the middle. There's no no space within that to accommodate bike lanes at all. So, immediately, we're already we need to widen the road to accommodate those features. The other component is that if we are gonna pursue grant funding for this segment, then we have to comply with Miles per hour to be successful, the master plan of arterial highways to be successful in a come in obtaining those grant funds. So the funds to acquire the properties, the funds to actually construct the improvements, require the additional lane through lane in each direction, and that's the only way that we can get the bike lanes and the buffers for the sidewalks as well.

Okay. No. That's actually a perfect tee up, because it was an MPA related, acquisition. Right? So, you know, for my fellow commissioners here, essentially OCTA tells us that, you know, certain lanes have to be and roads have to be a certain width in order for us to get our M $2 back, but I feel that in situations like this, we literally have removed people from their homes in order to meet regional transportation needs and actually creating a less safe environment.

So, yeah, not to say that that's the intention of this project, but even the way that we have this designed, we have relatively, shallow roadway geometries for our right hand turns so that those protected buffers do not extend immediately into the area where those bicyclists are supposed to be using. We still have a fairly wide angle when it comes to that intersection. I'm not sure if we have any kind of intersection details available here. Yeah. So if any of those would work.

So what we've been seeing on most of our roadways is bulb outs trying to lower speeds. We've had a lot of success in Park neighborhood kind of creating these narrow roadways or these narrow entryways in order to slow down those right hand turns. Right here, we're introducing, again, additional lanes. There's gonna be that lack of cement protection and buffered protection for the last four feet, which is where those individuals are most likely to be hit with a bicycle, with a pedestrian crossing, and the, again, dollars 47,000,000, and we're doing things that don't even meet what I would expect our basic standard of public safety is for roadway configuration and design. So that's what concerns me, right?

We're spending all this money. You took these homes. We're losing the property taxes from these homes, so I don't even know what our property tax losses are from, again, removing 30 parcels over the course of, you know, lifetime and then adding this additional maintenance requirement from the city. So this is just, to me, the type of thing that I just don't wanna see in the future, but this is probably way too far gone for that. So, again, just a lot of things that I'm still concerned about here, and really do hope that this is the last time we see a widening project in the city because we are a built out urban city, and we should not be following MPOD to destroy people's homes in order to meet regional transportation demands.

We should be doing that either through transit, bike accessibility, or just building things closer to where people live and work. So, yeah, again, the road widening and the MPAD honeypot that's out there is I think is overall damaging to the long term financial health of the city.

Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Scamilla. I will take a second round of comments and questions from, the commission. I'm gonna go ahead and start, and then I'll go to Commissioner Wu. So thank you for the work study session. I requested this work study session after attending a Delhaghai Neighborhood Association meeting where they had a lot of questions and just weren't sure of what was happening, and again, that's where residents approached me expressing interest to buy back some of their land. I wish that some of them could be here today. I know that they weren't aware it was happening. I did invite some last minute, but they couldn't be here, but many of them may be watching at

home.

Have they received this presentation, or is this the first time this is being presented in this way because it was prepared for tonight?

This is specific for this evening. A lot of the information has been extracted from other presentations that we've made to the neighborhood.

Thank you. I have found this to be very informative, and I think it would be great if the city could also go and present this as is to the Dahlheim Neighborhood Association. I think some of their leadership are those that are interested in buying back some of their land. And, yeah, I'm just wondering, is there a timeline in place for the city to go through its surplus lands acts process? I share a lot of the same sentiment as Commissioner Escamilla, and we also saw the same thing with Bristol where there were remnant parcels just throughout the throughout Bristol, and at some point, the city had over 90, just parcels throughout the city, including these along Warner.

So I'm just, I'm wondering what what the what the yeah. What the timeline is for these parcels that remain, these eight, six that we know are currently zoned for residential but could be zoned for something else. What is the process to go through that surplus lands act process to see whether or not it can become affordable housing or open space, and then if not, for them to be able to be purchased, and again, I would hope that there is a right of first refusal where those that had to sell their homes to the city are the first to get the opportunity to buy back that land if they so wish?

So for the the two commercial pro well, for a lot of these properties, we've already gone through the Surplus Lands Act process.

Okay. For how many of them?

So, these three are the ones that have not. All of these have been included in a Surplus Lands Act process, which is, effectively to designate it as, subject to the Surplus Lands Act or exempt from it. I believe all of these are exempt from the Surplus Lines Act due to their size and their land use. So we don't have to go through the whole state process of reaching out to affordable housing concerns. Typically, our next step would be to determine, how we wanna market these.

For the two commercial properties, those are included in an RFP that is being released to the community already, for developers to propose what they want to. Actually, this one, we're negotiating with the adjacent property owner. I apologize. This one has been released in the RFP. These were still, this is a big question mark about what we're gonna do there.

We're not releasing those yet. So we're working on what scenario we want to pursue. We'll include what you proposed as as options in the mix to see what, what makes sense. These three, because this phase hasn't even started yet, we don't want to release those. We're building walls on the on the properties. While we don't like our contractors to stage immediately adjacent to residential, there might be scenarios where on a very short term basis, these lots are beneficial to the contractor to have the ability to do his work within this segment.

Thank you. So, I'm hearing that the five remnant parcels between Main Street and Monroe Elementary, have all gone through the process already, and basically the city's in the stage, with the exception of the one with the gas station, the city is in the stage of figuring out what to do with them.

Well, one is included in an RFP.

Okay, so two of the five are in an RFP.

So there

are three. So I think this is a perfect moment to, again, present this to the neighborhood. I think that they do have a lot of thoughts on what they would like to see in their neighborhood and what they wouldn't like to see in their neighborhood, so it would be great to see the city take feedback from the community now, see what needs there may be as well that could be addressed with these remnant parcels, and then that could also help shape future RFPs or just help you all, as you go through that. And those are all my comments for now. Thank you. Commissioner Wu.

I want to thank you for asking the questions I was gonna ask. And to clarify that this is an existing project that's already ongoing, yet the first phase, second phase, and that you're giving us an update. And that's all we're doing. We're not approving a new project. We're not approving a new plan. But, a question that's been raised as to coordination of the surplus with the neighborhood to see if there could be some and I'd like to see more of that kind of discussion for future development as well.

Thank you, Commissioner Will. Are there any other comments or questions from the Commission? Commissioner Vice Chairwember? Commissioner Scamilla, go ahead.

Yeah, it's alright. Was just, again going based off of the info in the SAMHSA report. They were proposing a 70 foot right of way proposal that included four lanes, two bike lanes and a buffered area with maybe some minor takings on-site. So again, there were other design opportunities, I think, available, and if the main source of collision does appear to be the left hand turn or uncontrolled left hand turn, we've solved that problem, I think, in other parts of the city through right hand only or right turn access only into certain neighborhoods. So the same thing we see on both sides of flower where you can't make that left hand turn into either of the, you know, our neighborhoods to either side.

I think that would have been probably the more cost effective solution to stop the left hand turns that do appear to have been a majority of the issues. So again, that's probably for a past deliberation that we're way past the point of, but did want to at least make that point of there are alternatives to widenings out there.

Thank you, Commissioner Scamilla. If there are no additional questions or comments for staff, that concludes the WorkCity session. Thank you so much for coming today to present us.

Thank you.

With that, we are now moving on to staff comments.

Thank you, Chair. Just one comment tonight. Just wanted to say thank you again to Jason, Gabriel, and Sean for joining us for a work study session tonight and bringing this informational item before the Commission.

Thank you. Does the Commission have any closing comments or questions for staff? Commissioner Escamilla.

Sorry, I was just gonna say thank you to public work. Sorry about that, but it was just a project that I, you know, it wasn't you, was just a project, but I appreciate the information. I just wanted to say that before they left the room.

Thank you. Commissioner Wu.

I wanna thank Allie and, the staff that we saw at the, Planning Commission, Academy. It was a very, great academy. We learned a lot. One thing that we learned, a lot of, lot of focus was on the, state, mandates in terms of, housing and what planning commissions can do and cannot do, and what they must do. And in that line, Commissioner Benninger and I kinda went, oh.

And it's nice to know that other cities look to us because we have great staff and they enjoyed your presentation. And they were wondering, how did you approve so many affordable housing? How did you exceed Arena? What are you doing that we're not doing? And one of the things was, as I hear speaker as a speaker that got to the microphone about problems in their city, one of the things was they were finding reasons to not approve housing.

And the reason they were not approved housing, that they get in trouble legally with the state, is that they were using subjective design criticism instead of objective design comments. And, it took a while to kinda get that in my head. What is the difference between subjective and objective? So, then I started thinking, God, I wonder if the neighborhood associations that Carl and I was with, knew that sometime as residents were articulating their need, we'd probably sit here and agree. Yeah, it's shadow casting on my property and all that.

But is that a subjective or, you know, objective design? So, the more that we look into objective reasons, you know, for whether to approve or not, the better. I think we can help staff negotiate those density bonuses or whatever they have to do because they do a good job in terms of checking the boxes, dotting the I and crossing the t. But I think the element is missing, as some of the questions that our chair brought up, is that residents don't know how to ask, well, if you're gonna do that and it's gonna improve and we can't do nothing about it, then what can I get out of this deal? You know?

Can the developer build us a park? Can the developer build us a community center? Can the developer hang himself? You know, I don't know. I was being facetious.

I wasn't suggesting that. But the question is that what is the things that we can do to help, since we're mandated to create affordable housing, what is it we can do to make it work, you know, for everyone, especially those that would have to live with the development in the neighborhood? So, for me, that was a eye opener. And the other one was that other commissioners want to meet with us, and then they kind of realized that you've got to make sure the staff dots the I and cross the T and do the background, and I like the new format where you go back to the history of of the past CPUC, and that does help us to to understand the history a little more to facilitate discussion. I also asked Ali Ali to look into the possibility of coming out with some objective design elements so that we can have a common knowledge of those kinds of designs so that we don't keep going over and over them during the hearing.

And so, I don't know if Carl has something else to add to that, but I found it enjoyable and I'm glad he was there.

Thank you, Commissioner Wu. Vice Chair Benninger?

Yeah. Just to follow-up, I want to thank the city for setting us there. Two and a half days, and again, met a number of people throughout the state, so very much enjoyed it. And both Ali and Pedro did an excellent job in their presentations across, so enjoyed that. I was taken like Alan with how much the state has taken away from us.

And the sad point is even though they demo it, the number of new home permits in the state has not increased. So, I was starting to get the idea that maybe they didn't do the right thing. With that then, of course, we got into discussion of state laws and those that are being proposed. It is a scary time out there, what's being proposed. The League of Cities is doing a good job trying to defend the cities and talk about this area.

I do encourage my fellow commissioners, the next meeting will be in Monterey Bay in 2027. Not only be in this area, it is a very learning experience. So I'll bring that up. I don't know whether Alan and I can volunteer for that one right now, assuming we've been in this one. Also, I'd like to add to it too, and I'd to propose this, and I'd like to put this out to see if my other commissioners would agree.

But we are voting on buildings that are going up. We are building we have approved buildings that are gonna be 20 stories, eight, what have you. And I have a lot of respect for the Orange County Fire Authority. What they did in January 7 here in Orange County is amenable, especially when you look at LA and all their problems. And we had fires that day, but because of their response, they kept them small.

But we're asking them to look at these buildings and we come and we talk and we say, yes, they approved it. I'd like them to come and have a work study session with us to talk about what they're doing or what they have done in order to prepare for these high rise buildings all through Orange County, basically. Because they do represent through Orange County. So I guess if there's four of us commissioners that say we'd like to hear that presentation, then I guess our procedure then allows us to go ahead and proceed to have that. And seeing that Phil DeCerre, one of our council members, our chair of the fire authority, I'm sure we could have captain Henry give a very nice presentation.

So I'd like to make that motion that we ask the the, Orange County Fire Authority to come to this planning commission. We have a work study of how we're preparing for these high rise buildings. All those in favor? Second? I have okay. Thank you. Second, we need to take a vote.

Thank you, Vice Chair Benninger. I just if we we, as far as I understand, during staff and commission comments, we cannot take action, correct? We can

You should not take action, and matters that are not on the agenda, you wouldn't be taking action. But what I would suggest is that, and this has happened before, is that during comments, you make suggestions to staff, and staff evaluates that, and they can determine if something is appropriate. If they have questions, they can certainly ask you. But so I I would take that as a suggestion that you'd like to see, something that would be like an informational session for the Planning Commission, and then staff will respond at the next meeting and let you know if that can happen or not happen. So that's what

I would I will follow legal's advice and make that suggestion to and as you can see, there's other people that I think support that suggestion, so. Thank

you, Vice Chair, for your recommendation to staff. Are there any other commission comments? Great, I'll make one. Well, one, thank you to staff for the work study session. It was very informative.

Everybody here was very engaged. I also saw that we received some public comment on non agenda items, specifically related to 1 Broadway Plaza. I believe there were some questions on an upcoming Sunshine Ordinance meeting. Just wanted to ask staff if we are aware of when the next meeting might be, and I believe at prior meetings, there were a few requests made from the Commission, including myself, to provide additional information on the project on the project website, and to look at what it would look like to expand the noticing range, so I wanted to see if there were updates from staff on that as well.

Sure, thank you, Chair. So at this stage, the applicant has not scheduled a second Sunshine meeting and they have not submitted or resubmitted their project for city staff review. So, it's really in the applicant's court at this point, so there's no updates to share as far as status of the project. However, the project webpage has been continuously updated, so any members of the public that are joining us tonight via the web can jump on the website and see exactly where this project is. In addition to the standard project webpage, this project has a little bit more robust project website that captures the entire history of the project.

So for those interested, Commissioner Escamilla in the history of Santa Ana, history of projects can delve into that, look at all the resolutions and past actions at this site that have, been done and gotten us to this point where we're at today.

Thank you for that. And then I I believe I asked this in the past or requested or asked if it could be done, but in the future, once we do have a date set for that Sunshine Ordinance Meeting, which I understand is dependent on the applicant, can the city use its social media to also let the general public know that that Sunshine Ordinance meeting will be happening?

Yes. So the noticing that's required in the Sunshine Ordinance, we wouldn't be able to change that, but the city can use, social media as well as newsletters to publicize any future meetings for this project.

Thank you. So thank you for clarifying that that action can be done without, the City Council having to amend the Sunshine Ordinance and its requirements. Commissioner Stirleo.

Yeah. Along those lines, besides one one Broadway Plaza, we have the 3rd Street parking structure, and we have the YMCA with the same company. They have deadlines to meet. This city's been more than amenable to the developer. At some point, we need to call the question, and we're getting close to we were promised something at the end of, like, 2027, a boutique hotel, if I remember correctly. Not gonna happen. Not it doesn't have entitlement. It doesn't have anything. It's garbage. And so I don't know how you get this lady comes to every planning commission.

We get emails about 1 Broadway Plaza. That's not even the worst of it. He's got two other projects that are on a much shorter timeline. At some point, we have to call the question, and I don't know, maybe we drag them in here. Hey, let's what do you wanna do? Because we gotta move on. This is Santa Ana. We approve projects. We gotta move on. So I appreciate the one Broadway Plaza, but there's more that we as a city have given him, the the developer, and in return, I hate to say it, not very much, to be honest with you.

Not very much. The one building that was redone, the the Masonic temple, he sold it, and he sold it to Scientology. It's now closed to the public. So original mics, we know what the problems are. It constantly goes like this. Same developer. He lives off government contracts, but yet the community suffers with a big mound of dirt and other things that don't get done. So I'm expressing not only my frustration, but, like, at some point, why can we do Bristol related? Why can we do Mainplace? Why can we do all these other projects, but this can't get done?

To me, it's the developer. It's not the city, and at this point, we gotta call the question, and so I'm just expressing my frustration, but I'm also like, how do we get them in here? How do we get their attention? Because I don't want her to waste every other Monday coming here. For what purpose? Because he's not gonna move. He's afraid. Move. Do something. I'll say with all due respect, higher quality people come deal with us. Let's get going. So I wanna express that because I think that's all of us up here. We're like, hey. Come on. So thank you for indulging me.

Thank you, commissioner Leo. Are we allowed to sign? Commissioner Escamilla? No more comments?

Oh. Yeah, no comments. I'll have an announcement probably next month.

Okay. Well, yes, thank you to the members of the audience that are joining us today and joining us every meeting. With that, our meeting is adjourned at 07:05 p. M. Thank you.